Latest / 12 Months to Marathon / Episode 105 – Two-Day London Marathon, Marathon Majors & Why You Shouldn't Wait

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Episode 105 – Two-Day London Marathon, Marathon Majors & Why You Shouldn't Wait · 12 Months to Marathon

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Hello and welcome to the 12 Months Marathon Podcast with me, John Hill, the Running Podcast for the Ever 35s with Marathon Dreams, episode 105, the two-day London Marathon and the future of the Marathon Majors.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: I've had a couple of people on recently I've interviewed, so it's been a while for me to kind of talk about this particular thing.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_00: Because I've noticed there's quite a bit of discontent, I would say, on social media regarding the marathon majors, particularly the London Marathon ballot, of course.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because if you don't know, 1.3 million people entered the London Marathon ballot this year.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I first did the London Marathon in 2014, and the year after that I entered the ballot, and I think the statistics then was something like 140,000 people entered the ballot in 2015, and that's gone up 10x since then, uh, to this year being 1.3 million.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_00: And in terms of the stats, it turned out that I think something only like 7% 7% of the people that entered the ballot got into the marathon.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: So there was a little so obviously on my social media feed on Instagram, that 12 months to marathon, there was a lot of people who got rejected.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: There were some people, of course, who got accepted because there are quite a few people that do, but there's more obviously people that don't, like 90% plus people don't get in through the ballot.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: So there's a lot of disappointment, and then obviously, once once the disappointment kicks in, we then get frustration and resentment and a bit of anger, particularly around the situations um with the marathon majors and London in particular.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I wanted to do this today for a couple of reasons, really.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: Firstly, to talk about that, and secondly, to give you some options, because a few people ask me on Instagram, you know, do you know any other marathons, particularly that you've done uh in the UK and beyond, that you would recommend as alternatives?
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: Because I did a short video on this on Instagram and I wanted to do a bit of a longer version because I think even though London's two days, and what they've clearly said is it's only going to be for next year, and what I think they've done there is they're going to test it out because on that sort of side note with London, the two-day event, I don't think that you can close some of the biggest cities of the in the world down for two days at a time, which is in essence what you're doing with a lot of the big marathons.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_00: Because whilst I've only done London as a major, um, I've also done Paris, which I know isn't a major, but he's sort of in the centre of Paris, you're literally closing down a massive city because it goes around the centre of that city.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm not I'm not sure the logistics of increasing the the number of days, the number of participants across the board to then um accommodate more people because of course then you've got logistical problems with the the cities themselves, which could be an issue.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm not sure how that particular element will play out.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: So the second side to it is I think I've got a sense of humour and I like to make jokes and stuff about how it works.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: And it's good, you know, a lot of people saying it's interesting how the same people surprisingly keep getting in every year.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: And there was the other joke where you know the London Marathon kept putting a random ballot, random ballot, random ballot on everything, you know, just to hammer home the point that this is a random ballot, nudge nudge, wink, wink.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and we can all come up with theories and we can all say these things and get angry.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: I think what I want to say is the truth is that this is just the way it is, and it's is it fair?
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: No, I don't think it's completely straight down the middle.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, not accusing anything, anybody of anything here, but I don't think it's down the middle.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: Like a you know, a running- I've got I know I see running influence online who miraculously get into all the majors, yeah, without charity splaces and whatever else.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: So these things do happen.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: This is the world in which we live in, and we have to accept that.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: We can get angry about it, we can shout, we can walk in the street and shake our fist at the sky, but the truth is this is just the way, just the way it is, and we've got to deal with it.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the first thing I would say as a recommendation from my point of view.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_00: Let's just accept this is the way that it is.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: That's the first thing.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: The second thing to say is if you are going for the London Marathon or you have gone for the London Marathon, because a lot of people that listen to this are based in the UK or have access to that particular marathon, if you didn't get in, don't let that sort of damage your opinion of marathon running, okay?
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because yes, it's a fantastic experience, yes, it's an amazing spectacle.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: I've been fortunate to do it twice, but I wouldn't want to hang my hat on that every year because even though you know I've got a okay platform, it's nowhere near some of the people on social media.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there's no certainly no guarantee of me getting in every year unless I get a good frayage.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: So the two the two times that I've done it, the first one was a charity, and that was in 2014, and that was before the running boom, because you've got to be in mind the running booms kicked in over the last sort of five or five years or so, really kicked in.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: So it wasn't too difficult for me to get in with a charity, but I still had to raise, I think it was 2,000 uh back in 2014 to do it.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: And then in 2024, when I did it, that was a good for age, and that was speculative.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: That was because I got a really good marathon time in 2023, and I just thought, oh, let's speculatively see if I can get into the Linda Marathon, which I did.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: And the funny thing about that was I was doing Hyrocks in Manchester, and I think the it was 12 weeks after that when I had to do the marathon, so I had to sort of shoehorn a marathon training planning after I'd got ready for high rocks, because that of course takes a lot of effort itself.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I've been fortunate to do it in those two in those two formats, in those two ways of getting into these events, but I certainly wouldn't let it deter you from entering other marathons because whilst yes, that's a spectacle, and in my opinion, I think if you are going to do a one and done, for example, then you perhaps want to do one of the bigger ones to experience it.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_00: But there are other alternatives.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_00: So, from my point of view of being in and around marathons for the last you know, 12 years, over 12 years since I did my first one and 16 marathons down, it's yes, it's great, yes, it's fantastic, but don't hang your hat on that particular one, particularly through the traditional methods.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because you know, you know, I had some replies to some posts that I made, um, obviously some jokey posts that I made in Instagram as well.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: And some people like, yeah, I've been I've been rejected 17 times in the ballot, and you just think, well, that's gonna create a little bit of a mental scar.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: So we need to be a little bit careful that we don't just completely hang our hat on that particular one.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the first thing I would say.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: The second thing I would say is there are lots of different marathons out there that are just as good.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: Now, what you've got to do, I think, firstly, is establish what your actual goal is.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: Because if your goal is spectacle and experience, primarily, then yes, of course, a bigger marathon like a London, like any other majors, like for example, Manchester here in the UK, or a Paris, or something like that, where there is a big spectacle, um, then of course pursue that dream.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: If your goal is time related, as in improving a performance, then the majors necessarily aren't the runs for that.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: What you've got to bear in mind about, I'll I'll focus more on the London marathon here, because that's the one that I've done, and I'm here in the UK.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm assuming this will be the same with with the other big majors as well, is there's a lot of pressure with London because big crowd, big expectation, big day.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: If you're doing it for a charity as well, you've got that expectation.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: So for the average runner, trying to do any sort of time can be quite challenging on those particular races because of what comes with it.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I'll give you the other end of the scale.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: So the last marathon I did in Boston, Lincolnshire here in the UK, there was no spectacle, there was no crowd, you were literally running most of it through fields.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_00: Now, whilst it was a very flat course and barring the wind, we've talked about that.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_00: A potential PB course, I think it's the UK's flattest marathon.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: You ain't getting a spectacle there, that's about performance.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: So if you said to yourself, I want to go and run a personal best, then something like that one or the other one that I did in 25, which was the Great Welsh Marathon, which again is down the coast, beautiful routes, but again, not much crowd, are the type of races that, in my opinion, are more designed for times because you can just focus on the running bit.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: Now, do crowds help you around the final bit when you're in the pain locker, whatever you want to call it, you know, in that little bit.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, of course they do, but they can also add pressure as well.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a kind of it's a little bit of a paradox.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: What I'm saying is really is don't hang your hat on the majors, don't hang your hat on any big marathon.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to do a marathon, go and do one, try and find one that suits your needs, and go and do one.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: So, in terms of recommendations from my point of view, the first one here in the UK is Manchester.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_00: Now, Manchester you can still get into in a mass participation way, you can still just pay and enter if you're quick enough.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: It does sell out quite quickly because what a lot of people do is they use that as their secondary one for London.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: I've done Manchester four times.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: I did my first one in 2017.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_00: Now I did my last one in 2023.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: So up until that point, across those, where are we, six years, it was quite it was relatively easy to get into.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: It's very well supported, it's very well organised, and it's a fantastic city as well.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: So if you have got the opportunity to do Manchester here in the UK, I would recommend that as a secondary one to London, because again, it's got the support, it's got the city, it's got all the stuff alongside it, but it's not as it's not as big a deal as London, if that makes sense.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_00: So Manchester's the first one, and that's from a spectacle, and necessarily a time point of view as well, because it's a good course, and you're more likely to get the weather.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: They had an unfortunate one in 2025 when it was really hot, but usually in Manchester, you are going to get the weather.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the first one I would recommend.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_00: If you want the big, big city experience, then I have done Paris.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, Paris is a good one again, lovely city, one of my favourite cities in the world.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: Recommend that one for experience again, spectacles, well supported.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, a lot of it is running through sort of suburban Paris, so you do see the sites, but a lot of it is through suburban Paris.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: So as long as you're okay with that, it is a very, very good marathon as well.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, Edinburgh, here in the UK, another you know, UK capital city, lovely city, uh, Edinburgh, fantastic place.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, good course as well down the coast, fairly flat.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: Again, you're likely to get the weather because it's in May.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_00: When I did it, it was very windy, but it was it was still a good course.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: Again, it is, I would say Edinburgh's potentially a PB course if you get the weather right and you get off.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that's another good one.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's a lovely city to do it into Edinburgh as well.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, if you are doing it from a sort of scenic point of view, or stay in Scotland, Loch Ness, Loch Ness is in September, fantastic.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you basically just run down the side of the loch.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: The scenery is incredible.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: So, again, it's not a spectacle course from a supporter point of view, but it's a spectacle course, certainly from a scenic point of view.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: So, you basically start when I did it, they they you get on this bus where we were staying in in Scotland, they drive you to this place that you start from in the middle of these like fields and rolling hills.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: You start on this like quite flat road, you do a little bit, and then you just hit the side of the lock.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: You run down the lock, there's quite a bit of a hill at 18, and then you go over that hill and you go down into Inverness to finish.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_00: So, Lotness is another good one that I've done in this country.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I've done Florence in Italy.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: It's okay.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you again it Florence itself, the city's amazing.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so if you want to go for a city break and see a fantastic city, yes, I don't remember a lot about the marathon, I remember it being quite flat.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's a decent-ish course uh around Florence, a lot of cobbled streets and things like that.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: But again, you're in a lovely city.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's November as well, so again, it was quite cold when I did it.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_00: So you you've got potential there to do a decent time.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Chester here in the UK, uh, fantastic one, really well organised.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's a small event, but it's a fantastic um event because they they're really good at they're really on it with their organization, and plus it's a good course, it's flat.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you get the weather usually because it's October.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, again, it's very rural, it goes to a lot of um sort of countryside, but it's it's a good course, it's very scenic, it's it's quite a nice part of the world, it's quite different.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: That's another good one that I've done.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I've mentioned Boston here in the UK.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: PB course, there's no there's no you're running through open fields, so you've got to be prepared for that.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: It is flat, but there's no support.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_00: So if you are going for a PB and you're not bothered around all the other stuff that comes around it, that would be the one.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: The Great Welsh is very similar.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: That's a really good one, actually.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, the scenery again is fantastic if you get the right day.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: You start off in Pembury Country Park and just run down the coast uh to the Netherlandian back.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's brilliant, really nice.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: Highly recommend that one as well.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: If again, if you're looking for a uh personal best, and I'm gonna try and think now which other ones that I have done.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: Uh let me think.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, I think those are the main ones uh that I would recommend.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_00: I've did I have done a couple of smaller ones that I wouldn't uh necessarily um recommend to you.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: So my picks for the UK would be Manchester, Edinburgh, Chester, uh for for just organisation and good races.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: Great Welsh and Boston, more for just racing necessarily, versus any spectacle or anything like that.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and then again, if you can get to Paris, Paris is a good one to do.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: You're in a wonderful city, and it's a nice place to go and run a marathon as is Florence.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: But again, there's some travel involved here, particularly if you're listening to one in the UK.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: And again, I've heard varying different ones all over the world that are pretty decent as well.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: So do your research actually and just see.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, just type into say Google or AI, whatever you might use, and just say, give me the top 10 marathons in the world that aren't majors, and you'll find a lot to do.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: But those are the ones that I've done, the ones I've recommended.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: So the key message though I want to give you today is not to let any experience of trying to get into a major upset you or stop you from thinking that a marathon's possible, because it is, and you never know what might happen if you get if you start running regularly and doing marathons regularly and you start getting a bit quicker, performing a little bit better, whatever the language you want to use, you might get a good forge time, and then again, then can open doors for the major marathons.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: So hopefully that's been useful.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_00: Just remember the things are the way they are, and we have to accept those.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: And there's no need to get angry or bitter or resentful and all those things because that this is just the world that we live in and we have to deal with that.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: But um, yeah, that's my view on the majors, and we'll have to see what goes on.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the running boom is going to continue, so this is probably gonna be the way it's gonna be for a while.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, certainly do your research and um never let a bad experience with a London Marathon ballot or any ballot for any or lottery or whatever language you want to use for any of the major deter you from taking on the marathon because there are good alternatives out there, so there you go.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you very much for listening as always.
• 14:19
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• 14:19
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• 14:23
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• 14:24
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• 14:28
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• 14:30
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• 14:34
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• 14:38
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• 14:45
  SPEAKER_00: So, thanks everybody for listening as always.
• 14:46
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