Latest / Why I Knit / Knitting for creative expression with Dana Williams-Johnson

Transcript

Knitting for creative expression with Dana Williams-Johnson · Why I Knit

0:03
Mia Hobbs: Hello, and welcome to the why I knit podcast. My name
0:06
is Dr. Mia Hobbs, and I'm a clinical psychologist who's
0:09
passionate about knitting and its benefits for our mental
0:11
health. Each week on the podcast, I interview a different
0:14
knitter about why they knit and how it benefits their well
0:17
being. This is the last episode of Series one, and I'm very
0:22
lucky to be joined by Dana Williams Johnson or DW J, who is
0:26
a Professor of Marketing and a passionate knitter of sweaters
0:30
for humans and very small dogs. You can find out more about Dana
0:34
by reading her blog at www dot yards of happiness.com. She's
0:38
also on Instagram at call me DW J. You can find a link to Dana's
0:43
blog, and any of the yarns and patterns we discussed in the
0:46
show notes.
0:49
Hi, Dana, welcome to the podcast.
0:51
DWJ: Hello, hello.
0:53
Mia Hobbs: So I always start with asking about where your
0:55
story with knitting began.
0:58
DWJ: Um, so I learned it's only been about 11 years I think. I,
1:07
I've always been crafty. And but never I've never done anything
1:13
really with yarn before I can sew, a big papercraft person, I
1:20
paint place for a long time. And, but I didn't know anybody
1:26
who knit that or crochet. In fact, actually, I didn't know
1:32
someone crochet but she never crochet in front of me. And so I
1:34
just never my best friend I find out later on crochet. Like,
1:38
what, um, so I started this new job. And I kind of needed I was
1:48
at that phase in my life where I hadn't figured out 100% still
1:52
what I really wanted to do, I think I was, I'm a late bloomer,
1:57
in terms of career, I'm good at lots of things. But there was
2:00
nothing that like my husband is an engineer has always known and
2:04
wanted to be an engineer and absolutely loves his job, and I
2:06
never had that in my life. Until I started teaching. And so I was
2:12
like, Well, I'm doing this job. And it's pay is great. hours are
2:16
easy, like, I'm learning some new stuff, but I need something
2:20
really creative. So I got one of those Groupon deals were like,
2:26
discounted to get. And it was for Knitting Lessons in a
2:29
knitting shop in DC that doesn't exist anymore. And I said to my
2:35
mom, like, I think I'm gonna take Knitting Lessons. And I
2:37
always tell the story, because she said to me, you don't need
2:41
another craft. You don't need to learn nothing. You don't need to
2:43
spend money, on anything. I was like rude. And then, like a week
2:50
after I said that, she was like, Can You knit me this hat? You
2:53
literally just said to me, like, I assume you ignore me like
2:57
always. Okay. So I signed up for lessons.
3:03
And it took a little bit for me to kind of get it. But once I
3:08
got it, I was hooked. And that was kind of it for me. And I had
3:14
a teacher who really like, like, I was an intro knitting class,
3:17
but it learned very quickly how to do cables and knitting in the
3:21
round. Like, she was kind of really aggressive.
3:26
But I think it kind of helped give me a little bit of
3:29
confidence, because you just kind of go into like, well, I
3:32
guess I can do this, like, I can do anything. Um, but I also took
3:37
it upon myself to like, usually once a year, I take class
3:42
because of that. So every year for the last year, usually at my
3:45
local yarn shop, I sign up for some type of class, to learn
3:48
some new skills, some new thing, or if I want, like when I wanted
3:52
to get into sweater knitting, I took a intro sweater knitting
3:55
class, I can ask all the questions.
3:59
And so for because I'm realised I'm nerdy in that way. And then
4:02
I love education. I mean, um, and so if that's what knitting
4:07
is, for me, it's there's a, like, before you started
4:11
recording we were talking about, there's always something that
4:13
you can learn. So I don't feel bad when I'm like, Oh, I haven't
4:16
learned that yet. Because I'm like, I'll get there. Like I've
4:18
been saying forever. I really want to do something with
4:20
intarsia it hasn't happened yet, will it? Yeah.
4:25
I think it would just be I have to find the right project that
4:27
has excited me to say
4:29
Mia Hobbs: it's such a great idea to do a class of something
4:32
new once a year. So is it always knitting related? Or could it be
4:35
something completely random that you've never done before? Like,
4:39
ceramics or
4:39
DWJ: For me it's always been knitting, okay. Like when I took
4:44
a class a year, but I am also one of those people who
4:48
encourages people to take classes. So like
5:00
be away from me for four to six hours. So he was like, learn to
5:03
play golf with me. So I signed up into Clemson. So I play golf.
5:08
Um, so anytime there's something we're like, Hmm, I love Creole
5:14
food. I love to cook. So when we travelled to New Orleans, I take
5:19
cooking lessons.
5:21
It's the thing of, I don't know how to do it. But there's
5:25
usually somebody out there who can teach me Yeah.
5:28
Mia Hobbs: So you love to learn.
5:30
DWJ: I love to learn. So like, lets take advantage of that.
5:32
Like if somebody is willing, someone, I'm not the best Sewer.
5:39
And I have a follower who is in the area, an older woman who I
5:44
see all the time and help her out with stuff. And she's an
5:47
amazing Sewer. And I happen to say one day on Instagram, like,
5:51
I would love to make a quilted coat. Like, I wish my skills are
5:55
up to par. And she was like, I have a long arm quilting machine
5:58
at my house. So it's just like, I'm 100% can make that with you.
6:03
She's like, I can help you. So I'm all about like, Oh, if
6:07
you're willing to teach me. I'm all for it.
6:10
Mia Hobbs: Yeah. Oh, that's great. And was there something
6:13
special about knitting that this? I mean, I don't know if it
6:16
is your main craft now. But was there something particular that
6:21
you think that hooked you in to it?
6:24
DWJ: I think I am a person who I enjoy being alone. And I can do
6:35
it my by myself. And I don't, you can literally just be me in
6:40
a ball yarn and needles, and I can take it anywhere.
6:45
And so for me, I think that was the thing that hasn't made it my
6:49
main craft that I always have some knitting with me. Yeah. And
6:55
I can whip out a hat or cowl. Or maybe I'm working on a sweater
7:01
or you know, like, so it's constantly with me, my students
7:05
know when I'm proctoring exams, I walk around the room while I'm
7:08
knitting. And it's, it's soothing for me, it calms
7:15
nerves, it helps.
7:18
I think I've always had anxiety since I was a kid. So I think
7:22
for me, it can also be um and a good way to kind of relieve some
7:27
of my anxiety.
7:30
I talked once about how when my dad died I was knitting
7:34
something, when you know, people come to your house and like pay
7:39
their respects and all that. And instead of asking the obvious
7:42
questions about how are you feeling and loss when you know
7:45
you feel horrible. So they asked me about what I was knitting.
7:48
And it made it a little bit easier to have conversations and
7:53
to be present with people instead of focusing on that
7:57
thing that was kind of weighing you down.
8:02
Mia Hobbs: Yeah. And does it matter what you knit? Like, is
8:05
all knitting equal? Or does it make a difference? What it is?
8:12
DWJ: I don't think it matters. I mean, I have an affinity for
8:14
sweaters.
8:17
Like thats My you know, I mean, I tell you, every knitter has a
8:21
thing. I don't get people who knit socks like that. Just, I
8:25
have absolutely zero.
8:30
But what is
8:31
Mia Hobbs: it about socks? Is it the process or the end result?
8:35
DWJ: I love and here's the thing I love a knit sock? Yeah. And I
8:39
have friends who knit me thought and I'm giving it five gifts. I
8:43
have absolutely zero desire to knit a sock for myself. I just
8:49
don't. And as much as I knit and make. I think it's the tiny
8:54
needles and the tiny yarn.
8:58
It's not appealing. I would buy a sock machine before I would
9:02
knit.
9:02
Mia Hobbs: Okay, that's interesting. So is a bit about
9:05
the process?
9:07
DWJ: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I would totally like I've looked at
9:11
whenever I see somebody was really gorgeous sock knitting
9:14
machines I wanna do that. She's like well, my not gonna knit a
9:19
sock. Okay. fortunately, I have a really good girlfriend who has
9:23
given me like a couple pairs of socks. Yeah, like, as long as I
9:28
have good friends. It's fine.
9:30
Mia Hobbs: dYeah, you don't need to knit them yourself. Yeah, so
9:33
sweaters are your main love. Would you say
9:37
DWJ: sweaters are my main love? Yeah. And I associate you with
9:41
some with some bright coloured like combinations of colours
9:46
like
9:47
it. I think it's that colour is such a mood booster and so like
9:56
this is the audio podcast but you can see me in . You can See
10:00
my house? And there's a lot of artwork, um, and growing up, my
10:07
parents always encouraged that in me, because I always would
10:11
draw and paint. And, you know, I remember being a kid and getting
10:15
to pick the paint colours and the carpet colours for the wall.
10:18
My mom was like, I hate it. And my dad was like, but it's her
10:22
room
10:23
Mia Hobbs: so they encourages that form of self expression for
10:27
you.
10:28
DWJ: Yeah. He was always like, but it's her room. It's her one
10:33
little space. And it really makes her happy. So let us just
10:38
let her have that. Um, and I know, my mom. Never. It was
10:43
always just a minor I parent and it's funny because I grew up in
10:45
a house. I think my parents have really great taste, but it's
10:48
very classic and very, like neutral than me. I'm like, I
10:53
want to paint this wall teal. Yeah. And my ceilings are mint
10:58
and it's, um, fortunately, my husband kind of just goes with
11:03
it like, sure. Dana loves colour. Um, but I think wearing
11:10
all black, like, when I wear all black to work people have asked,
11:14
Are you okay, whats wrong.
11:17
Because it is so rare. I went years not owning a pair of black
11:22
pants,
11:48
I can't get through this. Um, and I just think it makes you
11:52
your wardrobe way happier. I am sometimes envious of like people
11:56
who have like, a colour palette and are like, I wear like these
12:01
five colours, because my wardrobe is essentially a
12:04
rainbow. I'm always like, I'll figure out some combos today.
12:08
But I just think it makes me way happier to knit things.
12:13
Especially rainbows. Like I love a good rainbow. So to knit
12:16
things that have so much kind of joy and levity to them.
12:19
Mia Hobbs: So it sounds like that affects your mood while
12:21
you're making the garment. But also when you then get to wear
12:26
it.
12:26
DWJ: Yeah yarn is beautiful, I think Yeah. Especially indie
12:31
dyed skeins are like little works of art. And I got recently
12:40
I bought myself a sweater quantity for Christmas of the La
12:43
Bien Aimee confetti yarn that
12:45
Mia Hobbs: yeah.
12:45
DWJ: Whoa, a little bit. Yeah. And I, I asked people for like
12:52
suggestions for patterns and stuff online. I know when I
12:55
think about it in the day, like, I just want something that's
12:58
gonna showcase how beautiful that yarn is. And and that you
13:02
can see all the little flecks and I don't want that to get
13:04
lost.
13:05
Mia Hobbs: Yeah. Did you decide on a pattern?
13:09
DWJ: I'm not 100% I'm also like, I have so much yarn and so many
13:13
patterns and projects that I'm considering or thinking about
13:17
and my hand is a little academic life in all my typing is not
13:22
helping
13:22
Mia Hobbs: Oh, okay.
13:24
DWJ: So I'm trying to get my hand a little bit of rest, as
13:26
I'm like halfway through a sweater from my husband. I just
13:31
want to make this the body on this sweater but my hand like no
13:34
mam, we're not doing it
13:36
Mia Hobbs: That must be quite difficult, then if you can't
13:39
knit as much as you'd like to.
13:41
DWJ: I think there's well this year I have knit the least in
13:45
that and learn and a lot of it was I've been I've been ill. And
13:51
then because I'd had illness. And I had I had multiple
13:56
pulmonary embolisms, um, and because of that, I, I have
14:02
insane fatigue sometimes. And so I literally will get through the
14:06
day. And it's like, I'm just glad that I made it home and I'm
14:10
still standing. And then I tell my husband like I'm just a
14:13
potato on the couch like I can't do anything because I haven't
14:17
knit as much. I had a bit of a brief moment in November where I
14:21
felt super like knitting energised. And then once
14:26
Thanksgiving hit. And I had multiple papers. And then I just
14:30
finished comps so much typing and I know every year all the
14:34
typing affects my joints and all that so I have to be mindful of
14:40
that because I tell people like it isn't necessarily about being
14:43
an academic writing. I want to be able to knit.
14:45
Mia Hobbs: Yeah, yeah, does it. I mean, I feel like I would find
14:50
it difficult to not be able to do the, the thing that like you
14:56
said, kind of gives me joy and makes me feel calmer. If I'm
14:59
stressed Maybe you're more used to managing that.
15:04
DWJ: Um, I'll say that. So this year has changed my perspective
15:10
on a lot of things. I mean, I'm fairly young, I'm 43. And you
15:16
don't expect to have a major life event at 43.
15:20
Mia Hobbs: mmmm
15:22
DWJ: And, I mean, I was essentially told, what I came in
15:25
with is what most people die from. When you find out we hear
15:28
people die from pulmonary embolism, and disability because
15:31
of the level of embolisms, that I had had a massive one,
15:36
restricting blood flow right out of my heart, so my body wasn't
15:40
getting enough oxygen. And then my lungs were riddled with clots
15:44
like, riddled. So for me to have made it as far as I had before
15:50
being hospitalised was kind of miraculous. And so I'd say about
15:56
two weeks before I went to hospital,
15:59
I'd stopped knitting. And I also stopped talking as much which is
16:05
hard to do when you're a professor but I talked only when
16:09
I had to, and found ways to really engage students in my
16:14
classroom to do the talking so that I wouldn't have to. And so
16:18
I kind of switched over a little bit and had started working in
16:21
polymer clay.
16:23
And which is a medium that I worked on before. But I had seen
16:27
some fun things on Instagram, I wanted to make like jewellery
16:29
and things like that. So I kind of switched over, because I
16:32
realised, now I did not have enough oxygen in my body. So I
16:36
did not have the brainpower to read a knitting pattern.
16:41
Which I couldn't, I didn't know that at the time. Um, and
16:45
Polymer Clay don't follow patterns, or you don't, I could
16:48
just sit down at the table and make whatever. And so when you
16:54
realise after going through all that, like when I was in
16:57
hospital, I legit was just trying to survive, and, and
17:02
you're just kind of there. And, you know, people are like, Oh,
17:06
I'm terrified of needles, and I hate all that. You, when you
17:10
have someone slice into your neck artery while you're awake,
17:14
anything is possible.
17:17
And you stop being afraid of certain things. And so I had to
17:22
I had to come to the realisation when I came out of hospital, how
17:27
sick I was, and how long the recovery I had had. So they give
17:32
you about a year before you are expected to feel normal. And I
17:38
spent three months of the summer, essentially waiting for
17:42
my heart to go back to normal, which meant a lot of rest. A lot
17:48
of naps. And so my husband I think was the person who noted
17:52
like, a couple weeks out of the hospital, I finally picked
17:56
Polymer clear. And so I saw him like grinning, and I'm like what
18:00
he goes, you're just being creative. And I'm happy about
18:02
that. Like, I haven't seen this in weeks. he's like, so this is
18:06
positive. And I would look at my knitting and I would want to do
18:11
it.
18:29
Your blood oxygen levels aren't still normal. So clearly, you're
18:35
not. And like if people were like, how are you in grad school
18:38
and teaching? And I was like, Well, things, I stopped doing
18:41
certain things because I couldn't, I wasn't functioning.
18:44
So I think this year, I realised like, I have to have patience
18:48
with myself. Yeah, i'm a fairly patient person. But I'm also
18:52
very efficient and like I do things for myself. So learning
18:55
to be more patient with myself has been something that I've
18:58
dealt with this year. And now I'm getting frustrated when I
19:01
can't do the things I want to do, because there's so many
19:04
things that I can do now that I couldn't do six months ago.
19:07
Mia Hobbs: Yeah. So you're really focusing on the process
19:10
of recovery and trying to give yourself time for that.
19:13
DWJ: And sometimes you have to remind yourself of that, like,
19:15
Yeah, we had to travel and do things and I was exhausted. But
19:19
I was like, but you know what, two months ago, I would not have
19:23
been able to walk up that hill.
19:24
Mia Hobbs: Hmm.
19:25
DWJ: And so let's be happy that I walked up that hill today.
19:29
And, and me and my husband is great at reminding me of those
19:33
little things and being like, Oh, you've done so much better
19:36
like, because I think he knows me so intimately and has seen me
19:41
at the absolute lowest in the hospital. So he knows like, this
19:45
is progress. So eventually, like I was hospitalised early May. I
19:50
think I started knitting again. About six weeks out so mid June
19:58
into July. So that was, that was a while.
20:02
Mia Hobbs: Yeah.
20:24
DWJ: I was like, okay, yeah, do it. And then I will go. Let me
20:27
read the instructions. Let me just read it through. And now
20:31
still doesn't make sense yet. So me give myself time. So it's
20:35
about it's been about patience for me.
20:37
Mia Hobbs: Yeah. And I guess one of the things that when we talk
20:43
about therapeutic knitting one of the I think the reasons we
20:46
think knitting is helpful is because you can break it down
20:49
into quite small steps. And it kind of makes it more
20:53
accessible, I think, in some ways. So for example, if
20:56
someone's feeling really low, or like you, when you were
20:58
struggling to get back in, that you could do a teeny tiny
21:01
amount, I suppose. Unlike other, it might be hard to start, I
21:05
don't know much about painting, but to start painting and only
21:08
paint a tiny piece of a canvas or something. Whereas knitting,
21:12
like if you're doing a couple of stitches, or like winding a ball
21:15
of yarn, you are still making progress towards the end thing,
21:18
even if it's in a very small increment of what you can manage
21:21
in a given day, I suppose.
21:23
DWJ: Yeah, I mean, even for me, when I wasn't on pre embolisms.
21:31
Even if I could just do a row at night, I will be like, I feel
21:36
accomplished. Like I got at least I got in a couple stitches
21:40
tonight. Before I went to bed, like it was a long day, I just
21:43
want to let something go. Let me just get a couple rows in and
21:45
then I'll feel a little bit better. Yeah. So I do think that
21:48
is part of the beauty of it is that you kind of constantly
21:51
working on this thing. And to me, I think it's all still like,
21:55
it's all a little bit of being an artist and a work of art. I
22:00
definitely think of knitting is an art form. And
22:02
Mia Hobbs: I was gonna ask you about that as somebody who has
22:05
an art kind of background about whether knitting is an art form
22:09
for you, because I never quite know for myself?
22:12
DWJ: No, I think it is I think we all you and I can pick the
22:16
exact same pattern.
22:17
Mia Hobbs: Yeah.
22:18
DWJ: And interpret in so many different ways. From the yarn
22:21
choices to maybe you make your sweater with long sleeves, and
22:25
I'm going to go short, maybe you decided you want to in some
22:28
waist shaping, or some bust darts. Or I'm like now I want to
22:32
make it oversized, or you're like I want this to be really
22:35
fitted. I think
22:37
it is such an individual thing. And we each get to put our own
22:43
spin on it. Like I love I love because people always like oh,
22:46
do you should design patterns? No, I love other people writing
22:50
patterns and their designs and the vision in the ideas that
22:53
they have. And then how I get to interpret that from
22:56
Mia Hobbs: Yeah. And without doing the maths.
23:01
DWJ: Without doing all that I don't want to do grading one of
23:03
my girlfriends to do that. And I'm like no, and I'm and we made
23:06
her make us design a pattern for us for Rhinebeck with you. Like
23:12
make us a sweater. Thank you. And she did all the work.
23:15
Mia Hobbs: Yeah, the closest I've ever got was actually this
23:19
sweater that I'm wearing now, which is a like, you know, Tin
23:22
Can knits Strange Brew.
23:24
DWJ: Oh, yeah,
23:25
Mia Hobbs: but I just added these kind of like snowflakes to
23:28
make it a bit more, you know,
23:30
DWJ: I like it though
23:30
Mia Hobbs: Christmassy, thank you. But there was quite a lot
23:33
of maths involved. And that was a sense of achievement. I got a
23:36
bit different than the way I normally get a sense of
23:39
achievement from knitting. But that was probably enough as it
23:42
happened. For me.
23:43
DWJ: I have some books and some formulas. So sometimes I will. I
23:46
love saddle, shoulders. Okay. Yeah. Not a bunch of people make
23:51
patterns like that. So I will often do that for myself. And
23:57
like I have kind of a standard pattern and again, and so people
24:00
are like, oh, you should and I'm like I'm going off of bits and
24:04
pieces from a book and slicing things together. Yeah. I'm not
24:08
designing this. Like I can make anything from my bust size.
24:13
Yeah. You want to ask me to make it for somebody else? No, but
24:17
it's my bust size. I got you.
24:19
Mia Hobbs: Yeah. Yeah. Fair enough. I'm interested in the
24:24
thing you said about patience. Because I think I certainly I
24:27
don't know whether you do people, lots of people say
24:29
you're you're much more patient than I am. I couldn't wouldn't
24:32
ever have the patience for knitting, and associate patience
24:35
with knitting. And it sounds like you've felt like you've had
24:37
to use a lot of patience in your recovery. I wonder whether you
24:41
feel like patience is something knitters have, did you get more
24:45
patient through knitting or is that just something people say?
24:48
DWJ: Something people say because I think if you want
24:51
something you will be patient for it. A lot of things that you
24:56
want or need don't aren't instantaneous. I also think and
24:59
because I deal with students that we're in a culture right
25:03
now, instant gratification and immediacy, you know, students
25:07
are always asking like, Well, how did you all do such as that
25:10
for you and your undergrad? I'm like, well, first of all, we
25:12
didn't have Ubers. I couldn't call a con man, like, I had to
25:15
make a plan. We had to figure these things out. We didn't all
25:19
have cell phones. Um, so I think I am patient in that respect.
25:25
I've always kind of been a patient person when it comes to
25:27
things that I want. And so I think when people see other
25:33
knitters and are, like, oh, I can never do it. I think people
25:36
are just intimidated. It seems like it's this really complex
25:40
thing, because I remember seeing it for the first time, like, how
25:43
long do people get it to do that, and it become this thing,
25:47
but, um, I mean, it just takes a little bit of practice. And then
25:52
I'll have to tell my students that do. I wasn't a sweater
25:55
knitter on day one, everybody makes a crappy potholder or a
25:59
scarf with really big holes in it. Yeah. And you have to accept
26:05
that, um, and especially like, I'm, I am a person that's very
26:09
much a perfectionist. I can be a little bit anal about things.
26:15
And so I had to let that go in knitting,
26:18
Mia Hobbs: okay.
26:20
DWJ: And that that took a little bit for me, but to realise like,
26:26
the perfection is in the practice. And then I'm better
26:30
now. Because I know how I have more confidence, I can fix a
26:34
dropped stitch, I can see my mistakes and frog back. And I
26:40
think the beauty in it is that if I really really mess it up, I
26:44
just unravel it. Yeah. And sometimes I think it's people
26:49
like, it's just such a waste of time. But it isn't, if you learn
26:52
from it and like, again, I go back to like, I like learning.
26:57
Yeah. And so as long as I'm learning and getting something
27:02
out of it, then there's joy to be had at that. And I think we
27:06
missed that. Sometimes I have a class that I teach students, and
27:11
I'm like, the goal is for you to make mistakes, and learn from
27:15
the mistake that you make. Because it's the problem solving
27:19
class so I'm, like, you all are so afraid that you're gonna give
27:23
me the wrong answer that you just don't do it. Like you won't
27:27
show me the work you want. And the goal is, I want to see
27:31
multiple tries, I want to see how you attempted to do it the
27:35
first time to then figure out where you went wrong. And if you
27:39
don't make the mistake, I can't help you like I can't. And so I
27:45
often have to, and I had a really good semester with them
27:47
this year, because I really kept pressing like, no, no, I want to
27:50
see the mistakes. Like I want to see the mistakes, I need to see
27:54
all the work. But I think that's the really hard part for people
27:59
that to kind of get to them mistakes or how we learn like
28:02
it's okay, you don't have to be perfect. And because we're in
28:06
such a social media perfection, ultra filtered world. Um, it
28:13
makes it hard for people to understand or process that and
28:16
I'm like, that's how you grow. It's ok.
28:20
Mia Hobbs: And I think certainly, that's something that
28:21
knitting has helped me with. And I think in the therapeutic
28:24
knitting groups I've been running we have been focusing on
28:28
like, the worst thing that can happen, but you still got unless
28:31
you get the scissors out, you still got what you started with,
28:34
which is a ball of yarn and the needles. And, and that is a kind
28:38
of, in a way, a place for making safe mistakes. Like because how
28:42
wrong can it possibly go with knitting?
28:45
DWJ: My husband is really good. Because he knows me and I'm
28:49
anxious and I will be like, when we first got a dog, and like
28:54
we'd be late or stuck in traffic, and he'll be like,
28:57
Okay, what is what's the worst thing that can happen? Now, like
29:02
what should poop in the house? And he goes, Okay, so how do we
29:07
how do you fix them? Like, why me? I would just clean it up
29:09
like that. Okay, so let that go. And understand that. If we're
29:15
late, she might have accident, but we have the tools and means
29:19
to clean it up. Yeah, and she'll still be fine. Like, she's not
29:23
gonna starve to death. We're 30 minutes late coming home. Um,
29:27
he's like, she'll probably be even more excited when you walk
29:30
in the door. So he, he is very good at refocusing me and saying
29:36
like, Okay, tell me the worst thing that can happen. And how
29:41
then, do you have how do you overcome that hurdle once you
29:45
get there, which is one of the things I did do a lot with, like
29:48
before school started after having kind of been out of the
29:52
game for three months. He was like, tell me all the things
29:55
that you're afraid of. And then let's figure out how we resolve
30:00
Those fears. Um, and that was a great exercise for him to sit
30:05
down and be like, well, these are the things that make me
30:07
nervous. Okay. Think about solutions and how we make it
30:11
better. Or maybe only the practice if he things before
30:14
school starts. So you feel more comfortable like that. And so I
30:17
think that's how I feel to a knitting is that. Alright, this
30:21
cable looks insane. And I'm a little nervous. Let me practice.
30:26
Yeah, let me let me try this out. You know, that's what I
30:29
tell people too with swatches like, that's why swatches are
30:32
helpful. Yeah, give you a chance to see how something's gonna
30:36
react or respond. And then you can figure out if thats the
30:39
right needle, if that's the right technique, or maybe it's
30:42
not the project for you at that time.
30:44
Mia Hobbs: Yeah. And do you have more than one thing on the go at
30:47
once if you got projects for different?
30:48
DWJ: Always!
30:50
Mia Hobbs: And are they different, for different I don't
30:52
know, moods or different situations in your life where
30:55
you need a different type of project.
30:57
DWJ: I'm usually I have multiple sweaters going on at once.
31:04
Because they require different things at different times. So I
31:08
like a sweater will have like, a lot of stockinette in the body
31:12
where I don't have to really look that great for just some
31:15
mindless knitting. Whereas if I'm just starting a sweater,
31:19
maybe I have to pay a little bit more attention to my increases,
31:23
I'm building out the yoke. Two colour brioche when I'm really
31:29
stressed, because it makes me take my mind off of whatever it
31:33
is that I was thinking about and makes me focus on the project at
31:36
hand.
31:38
Mia Hobbs: So you'll gravitate towards something more
31:40
complicated if you're really stressed, and you need to kind
31:42
of Yeah, same
31:46
DWJ: yeah, it helps me recenter and say like, I need to not
31:53
think about this for 30 minutes. Let me pick this up. Because
31:56
then I'm gonna have to really look at this because I don't
31:58
want to mess this up. Yeah.
32:00
Mia Hobbs: Yeah. It's kind of a bit of an escape from stress.
32:04
DWJ: Yeah, and then just have stuff like I get. I get in the
32:09
mood. I'm like, I just really wanted to knit a colourwork
32:11
sweater. Yeah. Or I just really want to use the yarn. Um, and
32:18
I've had moments where like, yarn will arrive and I'm like,
32:21
well, casting on something else immediately. Um, I actually got
32:25
some, some boucle yarn yesterday. And I'm like, Well,
32:28
I'm gonna make a hat.it's cold,
32:30
Mia Hobbs: yeah. Yeah. I always ask about a significant knitting
32:37
project.
32:39
DWJ: Um, I always love. I always love for my mom
32:44
Mia Hobbs: for your mom.
32:46
DWJ: She always, always always gets excited. No, it can be a
32:52
wrap can be a sweater, it doesn't matter.
32:56
Mia Hobbs: She's not a knitter.
32:57
DWJ: No, no, no one else in my family is, um, so anytime I make
33:03
her something, there is this level of joy and excitement from
33:09
my mother that is so genuine and so. So pure. And it's that it's
33:17
that thing where you're like, This is why you make something
33:19
for other people because they genuinely like get it and love
33:22
it. And she wants to tell everyone that her daughter made
33:27
it for her. So I made her a sweater called a. simmetrie that
33:32
I love. That was a little bit complex for me. And she wore it
33:38
the first time she had to travel out of town after my dad passed
33:41
away. And a woman she was sitting eating in a hotel bar by
33:46
herself. And a woman came up to her and asked her if she had
33:50
knit that sweater. And she said no but my daughter did. And
33:55
turns out the woman was like a knitting instructor and Blah
33:57
blah and she ended up sitting down having lunch with my mom
34:00
and my mom made a friend. And it was just one of those things
34:04
where it's like something that you knit that brings my mom
34:07
comfort and excitement but then also found find a way to like,
34:12
connect her to other people. Um, she's also notorious for talking
34:17
to people in public when she sees other people knitting like,
34:20
well my daughter knits and then I'll get like Instagram message
34:24
like I met your mom today. Um, and so that that 100% Makes me
34:33
feel incredibly special and that I understand that she
34:37
appreciates what I make her so she's probably my favourite
34:43
person to knit for and she's hilarious because like I'll wear
34:46
a sweater I was FaceTiming her the other day. And I had on a
34:50
new sweater that I made for myself. And like we're in the
34:52
middle of talking about something else and she goes. And
34:54
that sweater you're wearing is real cute.
34:57
Mia Hobbs: is that her way of placing an order
35:00
DWJ: That was her hint so I too would like that sweater w'm
35:03
like, What do I have? in my stash As can I make this exact
35:07
sweater But yeah, so anything for my mom, I think is my actual
35:12
favourite thing. And then I have a former grad student who's
35:16
like a little brother to me, who, whenever he helps me out,
35:20
he always askes me for this very specific hat, asked for in a
35:25
different colour. Hmm. Um, and apparently, like, everybody
35:29
always tries to take this hat. Everybody loves his hat. His dad
35:33
was like, I mean, I've never heard that said like, can she
35:37
make me one of these? Like, no, you don't know her. And she has,
35:42
like, you have no relationship like, this is my special thing.
35:46
But it's this special moment. I think any knit is special, you
35:50
give it away, and then you see it in use. Like, I've seen him
35:55
post pictures, and it's winter time he forever has on one of
35:59
the hats. And for that, that always makes me happy to hear
36:03
that, like, you see a baby wearing something made, or a
36:07
blanket that you made like that, to know that it's being used in
36:11
love that makes me happy
36:13
Mia Hobbs: yeah, that actually happened to me. Last weekend, I
36:16
met up with my best friend who lives a few hours away. And she
36:21
was wearing the do you know, the scout shawl. And so I had knit
36:26
that when my dog was quite a small puppy and had like, so
36:29
it's intarsia and colour works that have like six balls of yarn
36:33
at once and I made it for my best friend's 40th. And we met
36:37
up in a different town and she was wearing it with this like
36:41
new yellow coat that just matched the which since she said
36:44
she hadn't bought especially because it matched the scarf,
36:46
but it looked great. And I happened to be wearing a
36:49
cardigan in the same yellow yarn that I'd used in her shawl. We
36:53
were like, looked like we were on a weird hen do or something
36:56
but it was. But it was so special to see her wearing that
36:59
I'd made her for her 40th which was in July. She's not a knitter
37:02
so, it was a slightly random gift. You know, you never quite,
37:06
I'm never quite sure if somebody who's not a knitter is gonna
37:10
appreciate you know, appreciate it.
37:12
DWJ: I know. Yeah, I don't knit for everybody. And sometimes
37:15
I've been like pressured and i'm, like, just make it and then
37:17
And I've probably got to be what you feel like making at that
37:20
I'm like, I didn't need to make this person this because I will
37:24
never ever see evidence of this thing ever again. Um, well, my
37:28
knitting circle is incredibly small. And, and I do that so
37:32
that I can make whatever I want whenever I want. I don't
37:36
necessarily want people to put demands on what I choose to create.
37:45
particular time? Like what floats your boat just then.
37:49
Yeah, like sometimes I'm like, I like I have a friend who I know
37:53
really wants a sweater from me. And I know what sweater I want
37:56
to make him. But I have no interest in making this sweater
37:59
right now. Yeah, like January will hit and and i'll be like
38:02
now's the time lets make this sweater? Yeah. But um, and
38:07
that's I tell people you might get a sweater from me in July.
38:11
You might get a sweater from me in February. Like it just
38:15
depends on what the mood is and how I feel at the time.
38:18
Mia Hobbs: Yeah, and it's difficult to know how long these
38:20
things take. Also, people are saying how long does it take to
38:22
knit a sweater? I don't know.
38:25
DWJ: I'm like It depends. Like especially now um, I was
38:30
supposed to knit. I'm usually a fast knitter but I'm not this
38:35
year. And I'm my best friend comes with me to all yarn
38:39
related events. And she was coming to Rhinebeck and so I
38:41
knit her Rhinebeck sweater before. And I didn't have it in
38:46
me. I barely got through making mine in time for Rhinebeck but
38:50
my girlfriends in my little knitting group. Were like we'll
38:55
knit it for her because they love her too. And so I think for
38:59
me, that has also been like, one of the best things this year is
39:02
that I have a really good small circle of girlfriends who, when
39:06
I couldn't knit did stuff for me. And when I haven't had the
39:11
energy or the enthusiasm, they be like that, don't worry, we'll
39:15
handle it. Um, and so like they knit it, but then I ended up her
39:19
sleeves need to be a little bit longer. So I frogged back her
39:22
cuffs and made it a little bit longer for her so that there was
39:26
still a little bit of me in there. Yeah. But yeah, I just I
39:31
you know, I tell people like you get one when I feel like it
39:34
there have been some sweaters where I've loved the process.
39:37
And so I'll just spend a little bit of time and and put it away.
39:41
And so, I've had a sweater that took me like three months where
39:45
I'm like, Yeah, I'm probably gonna sat down and done this a
39:47
couple weeks, but I enjoyed it. So I would savour it and be
39:51
like, I'll come back to this. Like, I'll pick this back up
39:54
later.
39:56
Mia Hobbs: Yeah, so it's a lot about the process for you than
39:59
the end result Oh, And you've mentioned the idea of knitting,
40:03
making you feel calmer, and you've mentioned the kind of joy
40:07
and the colour, are there any other ways you think knitting
40:10
kind of helps you in terms of your well being, or
40:15
DWJ: I think I have met amazing people. Um, and so like I, you
40:22
know, I'd said before and 2020, when the pandemic started, if I
40:26
didn't have my, the group of five of us, I didn't have those
40:31
four women in my life, I don't know how I would have made it
40:34
through 2020. And I really don't know how I would have made it
40:37
through this year after getting sick and, and what connects us
40:43
is yarn. And it, you know, we incurred Look, we all bought
40:48
yarn, advent calendars this year. So that we could all open.
40:53
And so like, when I log off with you, I'm sure my text messages
40:57
will be full of pictures of what was in each person advent,
41:01
because we all got different ones,
41:02
Mia Hobbs: you know, go get different ones, okay.
41:03
DWJ: And so that we talked about and ooh and ahh over what each
41:07
person got, and, you know, we encourage our own purchases and
41:13
get excited and ooh and ahh over what each other's making and do
41:19
knit alongs amongst ourselves. So I think for me, knitting has
41:24
also brought amazing relationships into my life. And
41:27
even at my old job, like, I have a friend who I worked with, and
41:31
we had the same birthday, but years apart. And it turns out,
41:36
she was in there too. And so that was a way we kind of bonded
41:38
at work. Like she was a person where I probably we she and I,
41:43
we didn't really have anything in common. And then when
41:45
someone's like, oh, you know, this person knits and so does
41:47
Dana. And then we started talking and then created, had a
41:52
friendship, like and would bring yarn and pass stuff back and
41:55
forth at work. So I think knitting has also brought me
41:59
some amazing people into my life which i am thankful for.
42:06
Mia Hobbs: That's amazing. Has knitting ever been unhelpful? Do
42:09
you think?
42:13
No, um, I mean, you get tired of people being like, make me this.
42:19
Yeah, they don't understand what all goes into it. You know, when
42:27
my dad was sick, my dad had cancer. And I was at the
42:33
hospital a lot. I knit a lot at the hospital. And the nurses
42:37
would come and talk to me about stuff or bring their projects
42:40
and show me things that they were working on. Now I think it
42:46
I think it is only brought good things into my life, and good
42:51
things and memories and things.
42:54
And I was interested you said when you're talking about your
42:56
mum wearing a sweater, that when she went out for the first time
43:01
after your dad had died, and it was like her wearing, I don't
43:05
know, superpower or like an added confidence when she wore
43:08
that sweater. I don't know whether you feel that
43:11
relationship with your sweaters that you or other garments that
43:14
you make when you wear them.
43:17
DWJ: What I remember, like the first time I did this sweater,
43:20
and it was it was done in like a Hemp yarn so I could wear it in
43:23
the summer because I did it in like May. Yeah, the very first
43:26
time I was like, please don't let this whole for some reason.
43:29
I was like, please don't let this whole thing like unravel.
43:33
And just be naked at work.
43:35
Mia Hobbs: Did it stay together?
43:36
DWJ: It stayed together?I don't know why I thought but like, in
43:40
my head. I was like, this whole thing might just collapse. I
43:44
don't know what's gonna happen. Um, but I do feel better. When I
43:48
wear my own stuff. And then people like, Oh, what did you
43:51
make? And I'm like, yeah, yes, I did. Um,
43:55
Mia Hobbs: I always say I feel 20% happier when I'm wearing
43:57
something I made. And I used to also I don't know, i This
44:01
probably has happened to you as well. But once you're an
44:03
established, you know, have a reputation as a knitter, you
44:06
know, in your place of work or whatever. Then whatever you
44:10
wear, people say, oh, did you knit that? And then it's so
44:12
annoying. If you wear something that you bought in a shop and
44:16
you're like, No, I totally could have made this it would be so
44:18
easy. But I didn't
44:20
DWJ: I haven't bought a sweater. I bought Actually no, I bought a
44:24
sweater for the first time in the store the other day. And I
44:29
told my husband the only reason I bought it because it's in some
44:31
neutral colours that I would not. I wouldn't find joy in
44:35
knitting this for myself. So I'm just going to buy this because I
44:37
know I would be like, No, I'm not knitting this and I would
44:40
change it but I needed like a neutral to go with something
44:44
else. But I my students get the most excited about it. And I had
44:48
a student every day would come in. I will walk in and he's like
44:53
professor. Did you make it and I say Nate? I tell you every week
44:57
Yep. Yes, I made that like he was. So it is especially the
45:04
young man he was so like, amazed that I could make clothes.
45:12
Because they see me knitting. And so my students probably
45:15
asked me the most like, thing and you'll see the look on their
45:19
face might come in and like what's going on with them? Like,
45:23
did you make that one I'm Like, yeah, I made this one. Yeah. all
45:27
my sweaters I make all of them.
45:29
Mia Hobbs: I have one from when the dog was in the terrible like
45:32
shark teeth phase or if the kids are sick and you don't want them
45:37
to vomit on a handknit jumper that I keep in the back of the
45:41
wardrobe, but the others are all handmade now. Yeah, I was going
45:48
to ask about knitting high end and knitting low. If you've got
45:51
any in mind.
45:55
DWJ: Knitting High. Probably the first time I figured out how to
45:59
adapt a sweater for Jelly Bean's size.
46:02
Mia Hobbs: Oh, yeah. And can you remember what that was.
46:04
DWJ: Uh huh. It was an Angelina pullover. Um, and I knit it for
46:09
myself first. And she was an had been a new rescue. And so we
46:16
hadn't had her for long. But the whole time I've been knitting
46:20
mine, she had been using the ball of yarn as a pillow. And
46:26
she's so little, because she's just five pounds. And sometimes
46:29
you buy some of the store bought stuff. It's a little too big.
46:33
And I was like, You know what? I bought her stuff. And I paid too
46:37
much money for things. I need you to sit down. I've already
46:41
knit this. So I just need to do the math to shrink it down. And
46:45
I did it. And it was the most adorable, ridiculous thing I
46:49
ever knit.
46:50
Mia Hobbs: and she loves wearing them.
46:52
She loves I mean, she wears clothes every day. Because yeah,
46:55
they're cold. Yeah. And it just was one of those things where
46:59
you know, cuz, like, why would you do that? Or that? Cuz it
47:03
made me happy. Like, that's literally the reason. um so that
47:11
is a really good high, can you think of a low? Oh, I can tell
47:15
you low, I really there was just beautiful cardigan that I really
47:19
wanted to make. And I got halfway through it. But it was
47:22
fishermen's rib and it was killing my hands. Okay, and it
47:26
took me a year and a half to Frog it.
47:28
Oh!
47:30
I finally like I have to let you go. Because I'm never gonna
47:35
finish you. Because every time I pick you up, like I feel the
47:38
ache in my hand. And it wasn't even small yarn. It was just the
47:42
stitch and the positioning of the hand. Like it just was too
47:45
much. Um, and someone else saw it was like You're like halfway
47:49
through. And I was like, Yeah, but I'm never there. I can't, I
47:53
can't do that was sad. But in frogging it. I ended up using
47:57
the yarn and making something with an amazing rainbow. Like
48:01
something else. I'm not too sad anymore. Like, yeah, it had a
48:05
better life. So I think probably the low would be in realising
48:09
like what those limitations are. And I think this year, I've not
48:12
knit as much as I would love to. Yeah. Okay. I've still made some
48:20
really great things that I'm excited about. Just in my head
48:23
has all these things that I want to make sure. And I always end
48:28
need to be an octopus with multiple arms. Yeah, and knit
48:31
way more than I do.
48:33
Yeah. Yeah. So you're full of ideas. And is that part of the
48:36
joy of the knitting? Like the planning the next project and
48:39
what colours or yarn you're going to use? And?
48:41
DWJ: 100% 100% Yeah, yeah, I love like, especially if I'm
48:45
knitting for someone else. I love that moment. When I know
48:49
the person I figure out the yarn and the pattern, it all clicks,
48:53
and it's so perfect. And you're like, like, my husband wanted
48:58
some sweater and I realised I knit this version of this
49:02
sweater for my sister the year before. And I realised I had the
49:05
perfect combination of yarn to make it for him a colourwork
49:10
sweater. And he never pays attention. So like I've been
49:14
knitting it. And then finally I was like, Okay, I need to try
49:16
this on. He's like, why? And I was like, I've been knitting a
49:19
sweater. Right? Like that's for me. I'm I guess, I mean,
49:27
Mia Hobbs: I saw someone on Instagram. do you know. I think
49:30
drunk knitter I think is their Instagram and she was had a, she
49:34
was knitting next to her husband. And then she got him to
49:37
take a picture of her knitting something for him. And I was
49:41
thinking, I so could do that.
49:45
DWJ: My husband, we went, we went to New Orleans on a trip
49:49
one year, and we're in a store and he held up a scarf and he
49:52
was like, if you could make me something like this, I would
49:54
love it. So while we're there, I took him into the yarn shop like
49:59
we'll pick the Colour yarn you want. So he knew the yarn. And
50:03
we used to commute together in the car, and I knit that scarf
50:06
for him in the car in front of him for Christmas. And he never
50:10
noticed. He never noticed I pulled that scarf out every
50:16
morning and every evening in our commute, and I made it in the
50:19
car in front of that man. And he never noticed. So I realised if
50:23
I don't talk about what it is that I'm making. Yeah, he pays
50:27
absolutely
50:28
Mia Hobbs: screened it out.
50:30
DWJ: Because I'm always knitting. Yeah, why would he
50:33
think it's for him? Yeah. So it wasn't until I said them the
50:36
other day, like, you know, this what it is for you? He's like,
50:40
what?
50:42
Mia Hobbs: I was wondering whether you could get him a
50:43
surprise. Clearly you can. Yeah, yeah.
50:47
DWJ: All the time. And then I'm like, he's, like, yes, yes. paid
50:52
zero attention.
50:55
Mia Hobbs: But he's delighted for the outcome.
50:56
Oh, no, he's not. I know. It's like, there's certain certain
51:00
things that make like there are hats. I haven't even gotten to
51:02
block because as soon as I show him, like, I just finished your
51:05
hat. And the next day, I'm like, where did it go? And then he
51:09
comes home, and it's on his head. The process not over it
51:13
needs to be blocked. Um, so there's something that he
51:16
absolutely like. And he is very, He's usually very specific. He
51:21
is very specific in his request, and will like, show you a
51:25
picture or give you an example and then tell you what colour
51:29
okay. And he usually only asked for one thing a year, and I
51:33
can't so I always make it for him. So I made him a sweater
51:37
this year because I wanted to. But he has asked for a scarf and
51:42
a specific yarn, which I got for him. So I'll be working on that
51:47
mindlessly, for him garter stitch scarf, it's really more
51:53
about the yarn. He thought. He saw a speckled yarn in a sweater
51:57
that I made. He's like, I want yarn like that. But it like
52:02
blue, red and white. And so like, oh, he just wants
52:05
speckles. Okay.
52:08
He didn't know he wanted speckles,
52:10
DWJ: he didn't know. He kept looking at my sweater. I like I
52:14
like, like this effect. And so i'm like, you like the yarn?
52:19
Okay. That's what you're telling me is you'd like the speckled
52:22
yarn. Got it? I got it.
52:24
Mia Hobbs: So you just have to translate that. Yeah. For him.
52:27
It
52:27
DWJ: He usually gives me the visuals are enough thing. Yeah.
52:30
Where I can figure out and I'll ask questions like, Is it the
52:33
texture? Or is it the colour or how it's arranged? And he'll be
52:38
like, no, no, it's this and I'm like, oh, that I can do.
52:42
Mia Hobbs: Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And I always end the podcast with
52:47
asking, what's the greatest gift that knitting has given you for
52:50
the rest of your life?
52:52
DWJ: Creative expression, probably. I've always been a
52:58
really creative, artistic person. And I think it has
53:04
helped me find ways to express myself even like, embroidering
53:09
on my knits now. Hmm. So like, as I go through some quotes and
53:13
things I pull in grad school, and I was like, You know what, I
53:17
just need to start embroidering some of these things onto like
53:20
simple sweaters because these are like things that I live by
53:24
are things that are kind of what guide me in my research and my
53:27
academic work or like, things that I love. And so it has given
53:33
me another way to kind of have a creative outlet and express
53:36
myself, which I'm very thankful for. And isn't necessarily
53:41
something that we get all the time or, you know, I was raised,
53:46
where my parents really encouraged my creativity and for
53:50
me to express myself in those kinds of ways. So to find a way
53:55
as an adult to have an outlet, I think so often we get caught up
54:01
in work. Yeah, allow that to take over our lives and my dad
54:04
was always like, I do not live to work I work so that I can
54:07
live the life that I want to live and so I always tried to
54:11
find a balance and to find moments of joy for myself and
54:16
things that like that come outside of work when I leave my
54:19
my when I used to leave with nine to five job, I had other
54:22
things I wanted to do and enjoy and I told my students like it's
54:25
a little different for me as a professor, but like, I told him,
54:29
you know, my, my winter break is about Yes, I have some research
54:33
work I had to do, but also I'm gonna knit and I'm gonna play
54:36
video games. And I'm gonna give myself that mental break that I
54:40
need. Because I also think it rejuvenates me and it makes me a
54:47
better educator, a better person because I have creativity and
54:52
things that are exciting outside of just doing every day.
54:56
Mia Hobbs: That's great. I often like I often see young people
54:59
for therapy Who are in exam years and I find, they often end
55:03
up giving up their hobbies for those exam years, because
55:06
they're trying to focus on passing exams. And I'm like, No,
55:08
this is the time you need those things even more.
55:12
DWJ: This is when you need it. And I for me, you know, I just
55:16
sat for comps, so two days, for 12 hours total of writing. And I
55:23
just my in between hours and my in between days, I was knitting
55:27
as a way to say, I have all this stuff that I've stored in my
55:31
brain. So I need to just give myself a moment to not just
55:36
focus on what it is that I've been writing and working on
55:39
thinking about theories and methodology and, like, let's
55:42
work on this hat. Because
55:45
Mia Hobbs: I find sometimes that the ideas percolate a bit when
55:48
I'm knitting, like, I'm not trying to access thinking about
55:53
work or having ideas about things, but somehow they arrive.
55:57
When I'm knitting.
55:58
DWJ: Sometimes I have that verse. And so I scribble notes
56:02
on my patterns. Okay. Um, and then also for me, because a lot
56:08
of my research goes into the knitting community. Sometimes it
56:14
makes me think about or see things in different ways. So I
56:17
have time to kind of process that information. Yeah. No, I
56:22
always make my my best friend has a really stressful job. And
56:25
I'm like, You need to pick up crocheting or weaving. Because
56:30
they are stressing you out. And I want you to find a way to
56:34
disconnect and reconnect with yourself so that they don't pull
56:38
all of the creativity out of you just for this job that you get
56:41
to save a little bit for yourself.
56:45
Mia Hobbs: Dana, thank you so much for agreeing to be on the
56:47
podcast. It's been an absolute pleasure hearing your
56:50
experiences and all your ideas.
56:52
DWJ: Thank you for having me.
56:59
Mia Hobbs: Thank you so much for listening to series, one of the
57:02
why I knit podcast. I've really enjoyed having these
57:04
conversations and sharing them with you. If you've enjoyed the
57:07
podcast, please subscribe so that you're notified when series
57:10
two begins at the beginning of March. Thank you