Latest / NO FILTER / Trump_s pardon talk is _an appalling effort to normalize political violence__ says legal analyst(MP3_160K)

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Trump_s pardon talk is _an appalling effort to normalize political violence__ says legal analyst(MP3_160K) · NO FILTER

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  Speaker 1: Meanwhile, the president continues to issue these controversial pardons and commutation.
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  Speaker 1: The list includes a former New York congressman who pleaded
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  Speaker 1: guilty to felony tax evasion, a former Connecticut governor found
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  Speaker 1: guilty of obstruction justice, a rapper known as NBA Young
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  Speaker 1: Boy who pleaded guilty to possessing weapons as a felon,
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  Speaker 1: and former Chicago gang leader Larry Hoover. Hoover, considered one
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  Speaker 1: of the most notorious criminals in Illinois history, has been
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  Speaker 1: serving multiple life sentences since the nineteen seventies. The move
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  Speaker 1: is not expected, though, to set him free. He has
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  Speaker 1: more than one hundred years left to serve on state
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  Speaker 1: murder charges in Illinois that presidential clemency cannot erase. Let's
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  Speaker 1: bring an NBC News National Law enforcement and Intelligence correspondent
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  Speaker 1: Tom winter Time. Good morning, So so much to talk about,
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  Speaker 1: so many names here, but let's start with Larry Hoover.
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  Speaker 1: You've been doing some reporting on this part of a
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  Speaker 1: campaign by Kanye West in part to get him out
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  Speaker 1: of jail, also from Chicago, to get Larry Hoover out
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  Speaker 1: of jail. Why the focus on this guy, and just
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  Speaker 1: for the benefit of our viewers who he is and
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  Speaker 1: why he is so notorious.
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  Speaker 2: Well, I think you know, just the fact that you
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  Speaker 2: mentioned that he's been referred to in federal court is
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  Speaker 2: one of the most notorious criminals in Illinois history. I
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  Speaker 2: am duty bound to remind you that al Capone once
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  Speaker 2: ran the Chicago outfit. So that's the level of criminality
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  Speaker 2: that we've seen in Illinois over the years. This individual
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  Speaker 2: has been called by federal prosecutors the leader of the
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  Speaker 2: gangster disciples. He's referred to as the chairman of the board,
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  Speaker 2: as the king, and he's somebody who led this gang
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  Speaker 2: which they have alleged and have convicted on the fact
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  Speaker 2: that they ran the drug trade in Chicago from the
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  Speaker 2: early nineteen seventies until his indictment in federal court in
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  Speaker 2: nineteen ninety five, making one hundred million dollars of profit
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  Speaker 2: per year. Most of that went to him and his family.
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  Speaker 2: They say, by the way he ran a significant portion
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  Speaker 2: of this time period when he was running this gang
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  Speaker 2: was while he was in state prison on that murder
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  Speaker 2: charge that you just referenced there, the same one that
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  Speaker 2: he's going to go back to state prison. And now
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  Speaker 2: they said he's the heralded leader still of the gangster
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  Speaker 2: disciples while he's been in a federal jail known as
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  Speaker 2: Florence Ady X. That's the most secured jail facility in
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  Speaker 2: the United States, if not the world. That's where the
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  Speaker 2: us n's Joharsarnaev, Richard Reid, the shoebomber l Choppo is there.
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  Speaker 2: Just to give you a sense of the security measures
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  Speaker 2: that take place. And yet he's still somebody who they
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  Speaker 2: say remains the heralded leader of this community. And so
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  Speaker 2: what's going to happen now when he goes back to
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  Speaker 2: state prison, this name Saint Prison where they say he
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  Speaker 2: ran the drug trade. Now, he might not do anything criminal,
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  Speaker 2: but they do note that according to the Bureau of
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  Speaker 2: Prisons Intelligence, he has not renounced his ties to the gang.
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  Speaker 2: He's not renounced his gang affiliation. And that's something that
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  Speaker 2: they typically look for when considering these types of things.
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  Speaker 2: As far as you know, is this somebody who's given
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  Speaker 2: up that life, given up that code And they're saying
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  Speaker 2: in their filings federal prosecutors that that's not the case.
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  Speaker 2: There's an impact here, Willie right and there So there's
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  Speaker 2: an impact obviously on Hoover, but there's an impact on
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  Speaker 2: the victims of these crimes, and they're not alleged crimes
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  Speaker 2: that were convicted by a jury in court. So what
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  Speaker 2: does this mean to the black community. Justice Department is
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  Speaker 2: currently trying to charge Eugene Henley big You out of
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  Speaker 2: Los Angeles on a forty three count RICO indictment. Murder
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  Speaker 2: is alleged there, all sorts of racketeering is alleged there.
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  Speaker 2: We know from the indictment, from our own reporting that
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  Speaker 2: there are very high profile members of the hip hop
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  Speaker 2: and athletic community, the NBA community specifically in that case,
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  Speaker 2: there were victims of his crime. Those individuals we have
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  Speaker 2: tried to talk to for the last several months.
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  Speaker 3: I never do this.
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  Speaker 2: I never talked about the type of reporting that we're
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  Speaker 2: doing before we actually are ready with it. They are
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  Speaker 2: scared to talk. So when you look at the Hoover case,
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  Speaker 2: what type of message is that sending when you're saying,
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  Speaker 2: this is somebody who led this criminal gain for approximately
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  Speaker 2: twenty five years, made all this money, charged with all
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  Speaker 2: these crimes, going back to state prison for murder, and
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  Speaker 2: yet he gets a look from the White House and
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  Speaker 2: they're paying attention to Kanye West, who first started talking
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  Speaker 2: about this infamous Oval office appearance in twenty eighteen.
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  Speaker 1: So let's remember this president in this term began by
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  Speaker 1: emptying the jails of January six convicts, letting them out.
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  Speaker 1: But that was because he believed they're out there defending
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  Speaker 1: him on January sixth. What is the benefit to the
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  Speaker 1: president to let Larry Hoover have his sentence commuted again,
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  Speaker 1: He'll still be in jail. But why why would the
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  Speaker 1: president do this?
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  Speaker 2: I think that's the big question this morning. And I
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  Speaker 2: think you know, is this because of Kanye West and
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  Speaker 2: his the influence that he's had the fact that he
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  Speaker 2: came out speaking on behalf of Trump? Is this something
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  Speaker 2: that he has some sort of sway? Is as part
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  Speaker 2: of a larger thing in the hip hop community. There
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  Speaker 2: was a benefit concert that was held for Larry Hoover
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  Speaker 2: involving Drake j.
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  Speaker 4: Prince.
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  Speaker 2: James Prince, a founder of Rap a Lot Records out
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  Speaker 2: of Houston, Texas. Again another big time individual, not somebody
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  Speaker 2: who's been charged federally, but somebody who in that community
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  Speaker 2: is quite well known. And so what are the involvement
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  Speaker 2: of all of these hip hop stars for somebody who
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  Speaker 2: has such a documented history. We're not talking about somebody
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  Speaker 2: who's grabbed jumping over a turnstile with a small bag
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  Speaker 2: of drugs. We're not talking about a low level offender.
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  Speaker 2: This is somebody who again they've called the quote chairman
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  Speaker 2: of the board. That's how he's referenced in a gang
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  Speaker 2: that's still very much as active in federal prisons. And
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  Speaker 2: the question is will this continue in just overall the
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  Speaker 2: message that you're sending to the victims in this community.
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  Speaker 1: In some ways, I'm just going to get to give
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  Speaker 1: you this sound by John and you can take it
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  Speaker 1: to Barbara. Also, the President talking yesterday about Governor Gretchen
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  Speaker 1: Whitmer and the men who are convicted of attempting to
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  Speaker 1: kidnap her, floating the idea that he might grant them
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  Speaker 1: pardons too.
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  Speaker 3: I'm going to look at it. I will take a
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  Speaker 3: look at it. It's been brought to my attention. I
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  Speaker 3: did watch the trial. It looked to me like somewhat
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  Speaker 3: of a railroad job. I'll be honest with you. It
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  Speaker 3: looked to me like some people said some stupid things.
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  Speaker 3: You know, they were drinking, and I think they said
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  Speaker 3: stupid things. But I'll take a look at that, and
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  Speaker 3: a lot of people are asking me that question from
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  Speaker 3: both sides. Actually, people think they got railroaded. A lot
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  Speaker 3: of people think they got railroaded.
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  Speaker 5: So, Barbara McQuaid, we see now a pattern, of course
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  Speaker 5: from President Trump that he's inclined to use the pardoner
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  Speaker 5: commutation powers for those who have been supportive and helpful
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  Speaker 5: to him. That includes former Congressman Michael Grimm here in
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  Speaker 5: New York. And now we have this moment in your
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  Speaker 5: home state in Michigan, where these men were threatened to
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  Speaker 5: tie up kidnap the governor of Michigan, the sitting governor,
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  Speaker 5: and Trump is now suggesting that people on both sides
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  Speaker 5: of the aisle, I think we can cast some doubt
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  Speaker 5: on that are suggesting that this was unfair and this
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  Speaker 5: was a miscarriage of justice. You akin to someone said
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  Speaker 5: to me yesterday some of the January sixth rioters who
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  Speaker 5: again also were committing acts of violence in Trump's name.
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  Speaker 5: What is your reaction to him floating this possibility that
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  Speaker 5: to using his powers to help those who are convicted
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  Speaker 5: of trying to kidnap the governor of the state of Michigan.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's an appalling effort to normalize political violence.
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  Speaker 4: Some things to know about that comment. Number one, he
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  Speaker 4: said he watched the trial. He most certainly didn't watch
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  Speaker 4: the trial because federal court trials are not televised, so
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  Speaker 4: perhaps he watched some coverage of the trial. Some additional facts.
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  Speaker 4: He said that they said some stupid things. Maybe so.
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  Speaker 4: But in addition, there was evidence presented in that case
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  Speaker 4: that they created a fake shoot house that they trained
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  Speaker 4: on extricating the governor from her shootouse and separating her
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  Speaker 4: from her security detail. And they surveiled the underside of
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  Speaker 4: a bridge that connects her home with the police department
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  Speaker 4: in an effort to avoid capture. So those additional facts
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  Speaker 4: were not known. The other thing that I think is
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  Speaker 4: important to remember here is the reason the motive that
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  Speaker 4: these men had that was presented a trial was that
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  Speaker 4: they wanted to retaliate against her for her COVID shutdown orders.
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  Speaker 4: During that time, you may recall, Governor Whitmer was in
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  Speaker 4: a very public feud with President Trump, who posted online
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  Speaker 4: Liberate Michigan. And so these men, like those January sixth defendants,
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  Speaker 4: were acting in support of Donald Trump's political cause. And
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  Speaker 4: so the idea that they would be pardoned or have
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  Speaker 4: their sentences commuted really is a part with the January
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  Speaker 4: sixth defendants and seems like another effort to normalize political
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  Speaker 4: violence so long as you are on the side of
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  Speaker 4: President Trump.
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  Speaker 6: And again with one of the few Democratic leaders who
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  Speaker 6: has stood beside President Trump at public ceremonies, certainly would
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  Speaker 6: be again not only disturbing for legal reasons, but for
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  Speaker 6: political reasons. Very curious.