Latest / Finding God at Work / 13: Anxiety

Transcript

13: Anxiety · Finding God at Work

0:06
(Transcribed by TurboScribe.ai. Go Unlimited to remove this message.) Hi, I'm Chris.
0:07
This is Finding God at Work.
0:14
Just a reminder that Finding God at Work
0:16
isn't just a podcast, it's also an online
0:18
course.
0:19
Check it out at FindingGodAtWork.org.
0:27
Our current series is wholehearted, becoming healthier Christians
0:32
at work.
0:33
And in this part of the series, we're
0:34
looking at various mental health challenges that we
0:37
can face in the workplace.
0:39
So I remember a time, it was an
0:41
October afternoon, I was at work, this was
0:45
at the mortgage company, and looking out the
0:47
window of my office through the window of
0:49
the cubicle area outside and seeing that kind
0:52
of 4.30pm afternoon sunlight, not really sunset,
0:56
but definitely feeling like oh it's getting towards
0:57
the end of the day, glanced at the
0:59
clock, and just felt this wave of anxiety
1:02
wash over me.
1:04
I had this very unwieldy Excel spreadsheet open
1:07
in front of me.
1:08
I had recently been promoted and was in
1:11
charge of a certain aspect of internet marketing
1:13
for that company, specifically trying to figure out
1:16
how to generate or acquire new leads of
1:18
customers who would be interested in our services.
1:21
And so I was looking at budget details
1:23
and conversion rates and staffing details and trying
1:27
to plug it all together in this one
1:28
Excel spreadsheet that could be used by my
1:30
boss and his boss for decision making.
1:33
And some of the formulas were just not
1:36
working.
1:36
And I was like, is this a formula
1:38
problem?
1:39
Is this a budget problem?
1:40
I don't want to tell them that this
1:42
budget trade-off isn't going to work.
1:43
And when it was really just an Excel
1:44
problem, you know, so I'm like digging into
1:46
this and I'm so anxious.
1:48
And the sun just keeps getting lower in
1:50
the sky.
1:51
And it's like as the sun descends, my
1:53
anxiety intensifies.
1:54
And I'm like, I just have to figure
1:55
this out.
1:55
I just have to make this thing work.
1:57
And it just ramped up and it ramped
1:59
up and it ramped up.
2:01
Katie was working a nursing shift.
2:02
So I knew like, she's not going to
2:04
miss me if I don't go home.
2:05
So I just kept working on that spreadsheet.
2:08
Finally, I wrapped it up like around 9
2:09
.45 PM.
2:11
It kind of made more sense.
2:12
I was able to explain some of the
2:13
trade-offs to my boss.
2:14
They were able to make the decisions they
2:15
needed to.
2:16
But I was not in a great place
2:19
in terms of my mental health in the
2:21
workplace that week.
2:23
I did not feel especially healthy.
2:26
I did not feel like my life with
2:28
God was giving me a profound peace to
2:30
face the challenges of my workday in an
2:33
appropriate manner.
2:35
And I'm sure that many of you can
2:37
think of similar situations where you've been facing
2:40
a challenge at work and you just feel
2:43
anxious about it.
2:45
And we approach anxiety in different ways based
2:47
on our personality, based on our brain chemistry,
2:50
based on our experiences.
2:52
For me, anxiety often is associated with a
2:55
kind of manic productivity.
2:57
Not necessarily actual productivity, like doing what is
3:00
most productive and most valuable, but just like
3:02
continuing to work on something, whether or not
3:05
it's adding value.
3:06
For different people, a response to anxiety might
3:09
be avoiding work.
3:10
Maybe distracting yourself and doing something completely unrelated
3:14
to work while in the back of your
3:15
mind that procrastination just builds and builds and
3:17
builds like, you know, something that's going to
3:19
fall and crash onto you once the deadline
3:22
actually arrives.
3:24
So all of us experience anxiety differently.
3:27
And because we spent the past few episodes
3:29
looking at depression and even speaking about clinical
3:31
depression, I do want to, again, just go
3:33
to the wisdom of the Mayo Clinic and
3:36
read their description of anxiety versus anxiety disorders
3:39
because this is different for different people.
3:41
So I'm just going to read from the
3:42
Mayo website to kind of center us, give
3:44
us some boundaries for this conversation, and then
3:46
we'll talk about, okay, how does the teaching
3:48
of Jesus relate to anxiety?
3:51
So this is from Mayo.
3:53
Experiencing occasional anxiety is a normal part of
3:55
life.
3:56
However, people with anxiety disorders frequently have intense,
3:59
excessive, and persistent worry and fear about everyday
4:02
situations.
4:04
Often anxiety disorders involve repeated episodes of sudden
4:06
feelings of intense anxiety and fear or terror
4:10
that reaches a peak within minutes, also known
4:12
as panic attacks.
4:14
These feelings of anxiety and panic interfere with
4:16
daily activities, are difficult to control, are out
4:19
of proportion to the actual danger, and can
4:21
last a long time.
4:23
Okay, that was a lot.
4:25
What I appreciate about that description from the
4:28
Mayo Clinic website is that it says there's
4:31
a universal aspect to anxiety, right?
4:33
Experiencing occasional anxiety is a normal part of
4:35
life.
4:36
Anxiety is part of human experience.
4:39
Full stop.
4:40
At the same time, some people experience intense
4:44
or persistent anxiety in such a way that
4:47
in our current cultural context with the language
4:49
that we have, it might be appropriate to
4:51
call it an anxiety disorder.
4:54
I personally have never been diagnosed with an
4:56
anxiety disorder.
4:58
I have been diagnosed with depression, and depression
5:00
and anxiety sometimes go hand in hand.
5:02
That's not unusual.
5:04
But I've also talked with friends and family
5:06
and others who really have experienced this more
5:08
intense level of anxiety.
5:11
So bearing that in mind, as we turn
5:13
to the teaching of Jesus, we might ask
5:15
the question, well, what kind of anxiety is
5:18
Jesus addressing?
5:19
Is he addressing this run of the mill,
5:21
more universal anxiety, or is his teaching somehow
5:24
also relevant to those who might experience anxiety
5:26
disorders?
5:27
And the answer is yes.
5:30
Jesus' teaching on anxiety is very fruitful for
5:34
those of us who might have a more,
5:36
quote unquote, normative experience of anxiety.
5:39
But it's also incredibly fruitful, even for those
5:41
with a more pronounced form of anxiety.
5:44
And I know that from personal experience and
5:46
how Jesus' teachings have met me.
5:48
And I know this from the testimony of
5:50
many others who have experienced officially diagnosed anxiety
5:53
disorders and still met the mercy of Jesus
5:55
there.
5:57
The reason that Jesus' teaching works either way
6:01
is that what Jesus is primarily teaching about
6:04
when he teaches us about anxiety is our
6:06
vision of God.
6:09
Jesus is saying, when you have a certain
6:11
vision of God, that shifts things for you
6:13
in terms of anxiety.
6:15
And that can be true for all of
6:16
us.
6:17
So I want to go straight to that
6:18
teaching.
6:19
This is from Matthew, chapter six.
6:22
And I'm reading from the ESV, which uses
6:23
the word anxious.
6:25
Other translations sometimes use the word worry, obviously
6:27
worrying and having anxiety synonyms or different ways
6:31
of describing the same thing.
6:32
So this is starting in verse 25.
6:35
Therefore I tell you, do not be anxious
6:38
about your life, what you will eat or
6:40
what you will drink, nor about your body
6:43
or what you will put on.
6:44
Is not life more than food and the
6:46
body more than clothing?
6:48
Look at the birds of the air.
6:50
They neither sow nor reap nor gather into
6:52
barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them.
6:55
Are you not of much more value than
6:57
they?
6:58
And which of you, by being anxious, can
7:00
add a single hour to his span of
7:02
life?
7:03
And why are you anxious about clothing?
7:05
Consider the lilies of the field, how they
7:07
grow.
7:08
They neither toil nor spin.
7:10
Yet I tell you, even Solomon in all
7:12
his glory was not arrayed like one of
7:14
these.
7:15
But if God so clothes the grass of
7:17
the field, which today is alive, and tomorrow
7:19
was thrown into the oven, will he not
7:21
much more clothe you, O you of little
7:23
faith?
7:23
Therefore do not be anxious, saying, What shall
7:27
we eat, or what shall we drink, or
7:29
what shall we wear?
7:30
For the Gentiles seek after all these things,
7:32
and your heavenly Father knows that you need
7:34
them all.
7:35
But seek first the kingdom of God and
7:38
his righteousness, and all these things will be
7:41
added to you.
7:43
Therefore do not be anxious about tomorrow, for
7:45
tomorrow will be anxious for itself.
7:47
Sufficient for the day is its own trouble.
7:51
Now, in case you missed it, Jesus is
7:53
giving a teaching about work and a teaching
7:56
about time in this passage.
8:00
And which of you, by being anxious, can
8:01
add a single hour to his span of
8:04
life?
8:05
So Jesus is saying, it's when you're worrying,
8:07
when you're being anxious, it's like you need
8:08
more time, but anxiety doesn't actually give you
8:11
more time.
8:13
And then at the very end, he sums
8:15
it up with another time metaphor.
8:16
He says, Therefore do not be anxious about
8:19
tomorrow, for tomorrow will be anxious for itself.
8:23
Anxiety tends to have a future orientation.
8:27
Jesus is saying, when we have this internal
8:29
monologue of worry and anxiety, it's a monologue
8:32
that's running in the future tense.
8:34
Anxiety is future oriented.
8:36
There's a technology worker named Matthew Martin, who
8:40
speaks as part of the sanctuary course, which
8:41
we'll share more about later in this series.
8:44
But he just speaks of his own experience
8:46
of clinical anxiety and depression.
8:48
And he says, anxiety is the fear of
8:50
terrible things that are going to happen in
8:52
the future.
8:53
And depression is the feeling that those terrible
8:55
things are already here, they've already arrived, it's
8:58
done.
8:59
So I just really appreciate Matthew Martin's kind
9:01
of distinction there that anxiety and depression are
9:03
related, but out of the two, anxiety is
9:06
the more future oriented one.
9:07
We're looking ahead and we're imagining the future
9:09
in a certain way.
9:11
We're imagining that terrible things are going to
9:12
happen to us, not necessarily right now, but
9:15
tomorrow.
9:18
Okay, so I think that's the first thing
9:20
we take away is that anxiety has a
9:21
future orientation.
9:23
The second thing that Jesus is saying is
9:25
that anxiety complicates our sense of work responsibility.
9:31
Anxiety complicates our sense of work responsibility.
9:35
Now, this is kind of implicit in what
9:37
Jesus is saying, because he says, don't worry.
9:40
And then he says, look at the birds,
9:41
look at the lilies, right?
9:43
But what's he saying about the birds and
9:44
the lilies, he's saying, they don't work.
9:47
In other words, when we're anxious, often we
9:50
are anxious, and we think that working is
9:53
the appropriate response to anxiety.
9:54
And specifically, working anxiously, anxiety complicates our sense
9:59
of work responsibility.
10:00
So we have a sense of responsibility about
10:02
our future.
10:04
We need to do things, we need to
10:05
do work to take care of our future.
10:08
And therefore, we are anxious while we do
10:10
that work.
10:11
So there's a relationship between anxiety and our
10:14
sense of responsibility.
10:16
It's almost as though anxiety is telling you,
10:18
you know, as long as you worry about
10:20
things enough, it'll be okay.
10:21
But actually, anxiety does not give you more
10:24
time, anxiety does not improve the outcomes, anxiety
10:26
does not help.
10:29
Okay, so anxiety is oriented towards the future.
10:33
And anxiety complicates our sense of responsibility, specifically
10:37
related to work.
10:38
So far, so helpful.
10:40
For me at least, this is exactly how
10:42
I experience anxiety.
10:44
Why was I staying late at work as
10:46
the sun was setting, as the Midwestern night
10:48
descended over my Excel spreadsheet, and that the
10:50
glow of my screen was the only thing
10:52
illuminating my tired eyes?
10:54
Why was I doing that?
10:55
I was doing that because I had an
10:57
orientation toward the future, a sense that my
10:59
boss is going to review this spreadsheet tomorrow
11:01
or the next day sometime soon.
11:03
And I had a sense of responsibility.
11:05
I am the one who's responsible for this
11:07
spreadsheet, so I've got to get it done.
11:09
And I was anxiously engaging that work as
11:11
a response.
11:12
Okay, so this is how anxiety works, this
11:15
makes sense.
11:16
But then what's the alternative?
11:18
Because if you're like me, it seems like
11:21
that's just what being responsible means, like to
11:23
be responsible is to worry about something.
11:27
And we even have that embedded in our
11:28
language.
11:29
Like if somebody says, hey, what about points
11:31
two and three on this document, and their
11:32
boss says, oh, don't worry about it.
11:34
What does their boss mean?
11:35
Their boss says, that's not one of your
11:37
responsibilities.
11:39
You do not need to take responsibility for
11:40
points two and three.
11:42
Don't worry about it.
11:43
In other words, the alternative is you are
11:45
responsible for it, ergo, you worry about it.
11:47
To worry about something is to be responsible
11:49
for something.
11:50
To be responsible for something is to worry
11:52
about something.
11:53
That's how it works.
11:58
That's and Jesus's first line in this section
12:01
of teaching is, do not be anxious about
12:04
your life.
12:06
Okay, is Jesus like Timon and Pumbaa from
12:09
the Lion King here?
12:10
Is he just like Hakuna Matata?
12:11
It means no worries for the rest of
12:13
our days.
12:14
Because like, what was Timon and Pumbaa's point
12:17
in that story, right?
12:18
Simba the lion, he's fled from home, he
12:20
encounters the warthog and the, what's it called,
12:23
meerkat in the wild, and they tell him,
12:27
just ignore your responsibilities.
12:28
You don't need to go be king of
12:30
the lions.
12:31
You can just hang out with us and
12:32
eat grubs.
12:32
It'll be great, right?
12:34
They're saying abandon responsibilities.
12:36
That's what Hakuna Matata means.
12:37
That's what no worries means for the rest
12:39
of our days.
12:40
And if you're like me and you're somebody
12:42
who tends to be conscientious, you look at
12:44
Hakuna Matata people and you're like, well, they're
12:46
just freeloading off all of us conscientious people
12:47
because we're the ones who forces your anxiety.
12:52
Okay, so Jesus can't mean abandoning responsibility, right?
12:57
Jesus is the one who saved the world.
12:59
Jesus is the one who went to the
13:00
cross.
13:01
Jesus is the one who makes no bones
13:03
about people taking up their cross and following
13:05
him.
13:06
He invites people into deep responsibility.
13:09
And so somehow, what Jesus must be saying
13:12
here is that it is possible to engage
13:16
your responsibilities, including your work responsibilities, without anxiety.
13:23
It's possible to engage your work responsibilities without
13:26
anxiety.
13:27
Now, that may feel like foreign territory.
13:30
We feel like we're responsible for things and
13:32
so we have to anxiously do the work.
13:34
There's this false promise and anxiety.
13:36
That's a feeling.
13:37
But then there's a thought behind that feeling.
13:38
Again, our thoughts and our feelings are meant
13:40
to work together.
13:41
So what is the thought behind that feeling?
13:45
Well, the thought is not just what we're
13:47
responsible for, but who we're responsible to.
13:53
Say that again.
13:54
The thought is not just what we're responsible
13:56
for, but who we're responsible to.
14:02
Who is our ultimate master if we're followers
14:04
of Jesus?
14:06
It's not our boss.
14:07
It's not even ourselves.
14:09
It's our father.
14:11
Our father is our ultimate authority if we're
14:13
followers of Jesus.
14:15
And that's part of why Jesus appeals to
14:18
the care of our father in this passage,
14:20
is that ultimately our efforts at work are
14:24
responsibilities to our father.
14:28
So what kind of father is he?
14:31
And as we bear in mind that future
14:33
orientation of anxiety, one way we could ask
14:36
the question is this.
14:37
Is there enough time to do everything that
14:41
God expects you to do?
14:45
I want you to seriously think about that
14:46
question for a moment.
14:49
Is there enough time to do everything that
14:52
God expects you to do?
14:58
Bearing that question in mind, let's look at
15:00
the portrait of the father that Jesus gives
15:02
us in this passage.
15:04
So he mentioned the air and he says
15:06
they neither sow nor reap nor he doesn't
15:10
mention the air.
15:10
He mentions the birds of the air.
15:12
I mean, I guess, I guess God takes
15:13
care of the air too.
15:14
You know, he created it and stuff, but
15:16
he mentions the birds and he says they
15:19
neither sow nor reap nor gather into barns.
15:22
And yet your heavenly father feeds them.
15:26
Okay, stop there.
15:27
So the first thing about the father Jesus
15:29
says in this passage is that he feeds
15:32
the birds.
15:34
God feeds those who are in need.
15:37
God provides.
15:38
That's the vision of God here.
15:40
That God is a good father who is
15:42
eager to provide even for creatures that can't
15:44
provide for themselves.
15:47
And then Jesus asks, are you not of
15:49
more value than they?
15:51
So he's saying, okay, if God cares enough
15:53
about the birds to feed them, of course
15:56
he's going to care about you.
15:58
You're more valuable than a bird is.
16:00
Dallas Willard used this as one of Jesus's
16:02
jokes.
16:04
And I tend to agree with him that
16:05
Jesus is inviting us to ask something kind
16:07
of absurd.
16:08
How much does a human being matter versus
16:11
how much does a bird matter?
16:13
So Dallas kind of paraphrases like this.
16:16
Have you ever tried to price someone in
16:18
terms of birds, perhaps five sparrows, a hawk,
16:21
two cockatoos and a bald eagle?
16:23
That's from Dallas's book, The Divine Conspiracy.
16:27
Okay, so the ethical claims of people who
16:29
would say that species aside, right?
16:32
We just have this intuition that yes, of
16:34
course, human beings deeply, deeply, deeply matter.
16:37
And that's grounded in the Hebrew prophetic witness
16:40
that every human being, no matter how vulnerable
16:42
or small, matters immensely to God.
16:44
It's rooted in the Torah narrative of human
16:46
beings being created in the image of God.
16:49
Jesus is fully affirming that prophetic tradition here
16:52
and calling out what that says is something
16:54
about who God is.
16:56
What that says is God is a God
16:58
who provides.
16:59
God is a God who looks out for
17:01
us.
17:03
Then he continues the same thing when he's
17:04
talking about the lilies of the field.
17:06
He says, but if God so closed the
17:08
grass of the field, which today is alive
17:10
and tomorrow was thrown into the oven, will
17:12
he not much more clothe you, O you
17:15
of little faith?
17:17
Okay, so we see this character of God.
17:20
God is a God who loves human beings
17:22
so much, he will do more for them
17:24
than he does also for animals and even
17:26
plants.
17:28
God is a God who provides over and
17:30
above our needs.
17:32
And so bear in mind our question.
17:35
Is there enough time to do what God
17:37
expects you to do?
17:39
Given Jesus's portrait of the Father and our
17:41
knowledge that the Father is our ultimate authority,
17:44
would the Father assign us responsibilities that are
17:47
completely impossible for us to accomplish?
17:50
I don't think he would.
17:52
I don't think he would.
17:54
So the way I would put what I
17:56
view as, if not the main point of
17:58
this passage, the main point of this passage
18:00
as it applies to work efforts, that's this.
18:03
There is nothing God expects you to do
18:05
that he will not empower you by his
18:08
grace to accomplish.
18:10
There is nothing that God expects you to
18:12
do that he will not empower you by
18:14
his grace to accomplish.
18:17
Okay, now that is a thought.
18:19
That is an idea to hold on to.
18:21
But as you hold on to that idea
18:23
and you let it seep down into your
18:25
heart and into your body and into your
18:27
nervous system, it will bear fruit in your
18:32
emotional life as well.
18:34
Okay, now that doesn't mean that an idea
18:36
is enough by itself.
18:38
If you have an anxiety disorder, you may
18:40
need additional forms of treatment like we've talked
18:42
about.
18:43
Medication in case brain chemistry is part of
18:45
it.
18:46
Therapy, seeking out healing prayer in the church
18:48
can also be a great way of letting
18:50
that presence of God seep more deeply into
18:53
your total experience.
18:55
But the idea is essential.
18:57
That's why Jesus came as a teacher, right?
18:59
He came as a healer and he came
19:00
as a teacher.
19:01
Those are the main things he spent his
19:02
time doing once he was no longer in
19:04
the carpentry shop.
19:06
We need the idea.
19:07
We need the idea that there is nothing
19:09
God expects you to do that he will
19:11
not empower you by his grace to accomplish.
19:16
So now how would that reshape those moments
19:19
of anxiety at work?
19:21
Well, I have had some unwieldy Excel spreadsheets
19:23
since that sun setting day in October of
19:26
2021.
19:28
And on my better days, when I remember
19:31
this idea, and as God has worked it
19:32
into my heart and my body through his
19:35
grace through various experiences, I sometimes look at
19:38
the spreadsheet and I can take a deep
19:40
breath and I'll even say to myself, there's
19:43
nothing God expects you to do that he
19:45
will not empower you by his grace to
19:48
accomplish.
19:50
And that helps me step out of that
19:52
cycle of anxiety and maybe do something that's
19:55
a little bit more truly productive, like, okay,
19:58
I'm going to leave the Excel spreadsheet here
19:59
today and just be honest with my boss
20:01
tomorrow, then I am having trouble with it
20:03
and see if there's a more experienced Excel
20:04
person who can help me out or fill
20:06
in the blank, whatever it is.
20:08
Again, that false promise of anxiety.
20:10
Usually there is some sort of practical solution
20:13
that can help us if we're willing to
20:15
step out of the cycle of anxiety and
20:18
look at things differently.
20:20
Okay, so how do we live that out?
20:22
How do we take that deep breath?
20:23
Well, one is, I encourage you just to
20:26
memorize that statement.
20:28
There is nothing God expects you to do
20:29
that he will not empower you by his
20:31
grace to accomplish.
20:34
Or you can memorize even more importantly, one
20:36
of the statements of Jesus here.
20:38
So at the conclusion of the passage, but
20:42
seek first the kingdom of God and his
20:44
righteousness and all these things will be added
20:47
to you.
20:48
Say that verse when you're anxious.
20:50
Okay, if I seek the Lord here, God
20:52
is going to be present here in some
20:53
way where whatever I'm responsible for will become
20:56
possible by his grace and I'm going to
20:59
have everything I need.
21:01
Okay, okay.
21:03
Seek first his kingdom and his righteousness and
21:05
all these things will be added to you.
21:09
So that's one thing, just carry a sentence
21:11
with you, whether it's my phrase or more
21:13
importantly, Jesus's phrase, carry a phrase with you
21:16
to say in those moments of anxiety.
21:19
Two, given the future orientation of anxiety and
21:24
the fact that anxiety does not actually add
21:26
hours to our life, one thing that you're
21:29
going to come up against is your limits,
21:30
your limits of time often in the workplace.
21:33
There can also be other limits, limits of
21:34
money, limits of personal strength, limits of giftedness.
21:37
But one of the most practical ones is
21:38
just that sense of, I am running out
21:39
of time.
21:39
I do not have time to do everything
21:41
that I'm responsible for.
21:43
And so what that means is one of
21:44
the ways that we live out Jesus's teaching
21:46
on anxiety is by choosing what to do
21:50
and letting go what is left undone.
21:55
Choosing what to do and letting go of
21:58
what is left undone.
22:00
Because the fact is you're never going to
22:01
have enough time to do it all, to
22:04
do all of it as well as it
22:05
could possibly done.
22:06
There's always going to be more you could
22:07
do.
22:09
And so you have to choose, you have
22:11
to embrace your limits and say this is
22:12
what I can do right now.
22:13
This is what I will do right now.
22:15
And I'm going to let go of the
22:17
things that are left undone.
22:20
Again, that only becomes possible if we believe
22:24
God is a good father who's watching out
22:27
for me.
22:27
God cares more about me than two cockatoos
22:29
and a bald eagle.
22:31
God will empower me by his grace to
22:32
accomplish the things that he expects me to
22:34
do.
22:35
And he won't be mad at me that
22:36
I can't do everything.
22:39
We have that vision of God as a
22:41
good father.
22:42
We really come to believe there is nothing
22:44
God expects you to do that he will
22:46
not empower you by his grace to accomplish.
22:52
Lord Jesus, thank you for showing us your
22:54
father and how he really is.
22:57
Deep in our conviction of that goodness, deep
22:59
in our confidence in your father's love and
23:02
his provision for us and help us to
23:04
do everything that you do want us to
23:06
do by your grace.
23:07
Do your work in us as we do
23:09
our work with you.
23:10
Amen.
23:15
Thanks for listening.
23:17
Finding God at Work is a production of
23:19
Mission Central, a ministry based in Aurora, Illinois,
23:22
dedicated to forming Christians for mission in everyday
23:24
life.
23:25
You can subscribe to the podcast wherever you
23:27
listen to this episode to get 10 minutes
23:29
of teaching on faith and work every Tuesday
23:31
and Thursday.
23:32
To get resources to go deeper with each
23:34
podcast series, read our blog, and get info
23:37
about upcoming courses on faith in the workplace,
23:39
go to our website, missioncentral.church.