Latest / Books4Guys / Joe Pardavila - Good Listen | Forbes Books Director of Podcast

Transcript

Joe Pardavila - Good Listen | Forbes Books Director of Podcast · Books4Guys

• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: And uh I I was telling him about books for guys, and he was so nice.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: He tagged in some of the Forbes, I guess, marketing people there.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: And next thing I know, they were sending me some books, and and I met a couple, Brendan Keegan, uh a few others, and I've been they've been great people to talk to.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so he kind of was like, Hey, let me get a couple people to if you want to talk to them.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's uh then I started watching your podcast.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: Cool.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I appreciate that.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_01: You talking with all the authors and man, I Joe, it's just it's been cool, man.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: I I love I I started learning about your background as I was watching some of your podcasts, and uh, I was like, man, Joe's really good at this.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_01: You know, what can I uh what can I take away to to ask questions or or how to interact?
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: And then I saw your book, Good Listen, which is essentially how to have better communication at work and things, and I was like, Well, he's a pro at this.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: And so, but man, I would love for you just to talk a little bit about your background to our audience who who hasn't maybe seen your podcast.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Obviously, you were in radio for a long time, and uh, I can only imagine some of the people you've talked to, but um man, just start there.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_01: What how did you get into to radio and then and then picking up podcasts, you know, from there?
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I grew up a kid of immigrants.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: My mom was a Cuban refugee, my dad was uh immigrant from Spain, they met here, started a family, and I grew up in the East as sort of like a pop culture nerd.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, my heroes growing up were like David Letterman and Johnny Carson.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: And so, whereas all my friends had posters of like Don Mattingley and, you know, uh Joe Montana, I had like posters of like TV hosts and stuff like that on my wall.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: I was I was the ultimate nerd.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: So I knew I wanted to get into that, but because of my background, not really knowing anything about like how to get in the business, I was growing up in the suburbs of New Jersey, right outside of Manhattan.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: I always lived and like kind of born and raised within 10 miles of Manhattan.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: So New York was there, like the shadow of like the big city, the biggest city on the planet, the greatest city in the world, whatever you ever want to call it, was there.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_00: So I was like, I mean, I gotta get there if I gotta start this career.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: So uh when I was in college, I decided to go get an internship at a radio station in New York.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: And at the time, I was probably 19 years old.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: I was a scared little kid like going into the city.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: Like we would our our extent of going to New York was like go in there for the tree lighting or go in there for, you know, to check out the holiday lights and stuff like that.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: We never, my family and I weren't like, let's go to the city every weekend.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: And not that I was afraid of it, it was just one of those things where I wasn't used to.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_00: So this radio station that I had applied to, Chris, it was located above Penn Station.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: So it was literally like a train ride from where I lived in the suburbs of Jersey into Manhattan, like 15, 20 minutes.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: So I was like, great, I'm gonna do this.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's gonna be an easy ride in.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: I don't have to worry about getting on the subway, afraid of getting mugged or stabbed, what have you.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know, as as people who think who don't know what New York City is really about think about New York.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I go there, I apply for this internship, and because of my fear as a just of like of a very small person, I ended up spending the next 24 years at that radio station.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: So I started as an intern, worked my way up into uh working full-time in promotions, to then producing the night show, to then where I spent the bulk of my career uh producing the morning show, first as an assistant producer, working my way up to EP and co-host by the end of it.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: So, in because of that scared little boy's uh decision, I stumbled into a 24-year career in radio.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_01: Man, that's amazing.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sitting here laughing because Joe, I'm thinking what you experienced, I experienced New York as well.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: I used to travel for work and I'm from the South, man.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_01: I'm from Arkansas.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: I lived in Texas, Georgia, Tennessee.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: But for some reason, the company had a bright idea to make me their New York person.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_01: So three weeks a month, I was there.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: But I remember my first trip, I had to get a rental car.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, who gets a rental car here?
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: I don't where do I park it?
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: What do I do?
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like, where do I eat?
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_01: I've got to pay how much to drive to New Jersey?
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what in the I don't belong here.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's so Chris, I'm getting flashbacks because so I used to have to drive to work.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: So I worked in the morning show.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: So I had to used to get up at three o'clock in the morning, be in the city by like 4 30, and I would park in a parking garage right across from where we worked.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: And like I mentioned, we were right above Penn Station, which if folks not really familiar with Denmark was right above Madison Square Garden.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_00: So it was like the the hub of everything for people coming in and out of town.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you wouldn't find many like New Yorkers there.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_00: It was mostly like transients and tourists and stuff like that.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I remember every time I would park in my garage, I would leave.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: And if there was like an event for the city, people would never read like the prices of like what it cost to park.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_00: So I would be on my way home on my way leaving the office to the to the parking garage, and all I would hear like this, I would hear this almost like on a daily basis.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_00: I was only here for 20 minutes and it cost me 40 nap.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, and I would just laugh every time because it's like it, it's it's ridiculous parking in New York City.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I get it, but I was also I also got a lot of entertainment from the people not realizing how expensive it was to park in New York City.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: No, I remember it, man.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_01: It I thankfully didn't last long for me.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'll I was like, I I don't I think I need to find somebody else for this market.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_01: But as you were saying that, I was getting flashbacks too.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, oh boy, I know about this.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: But Joe, did you envision obviously 24 years?
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_01: You probably didn't envision that, but like, did you have a goal or a dream or some sort of vision of what your career was gonna look like?
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm kind of asking, like, have you always been outgoing?
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_01: Have you always been able to communicate with people?
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_01: And did that kind of help transition to where where your career led to?
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_01: But like, what was when you started, what did you think was gonna happen?
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, absolutely no.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's a great question, Chris.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: And the thing is, like, I was very limited in my skill set as a kid.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I was a terrible athlete, but I knew how to like put on a show.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like I was that annoying kid who put on magic shows at birthday parties and stuff like that.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: So I always was always outgoing.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: I was always the quote unquote class clown.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: So it was never, I was never afraid to be public or or just be able to entertain to try to, well, I don't want to say entertaining, but to try to entertain people.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I always had that had that as my base level.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: And and in terms of like what I wanted to do as a career, like I just want to do that.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: I wanted to find a job or a career that I could just uh make people feel better and inform them.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so uh me with you know, applying for this radio station position was kind of like my in.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: It was like, I don't know how else I could do this as a job, but you know what?
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_00: If I get this, this could be what I do.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: And so I did have that like, you know, the base skills of being a, I wouldn't say a good communicator early on, because when you're a kid, you're a terrible communicator.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: You only care about yourself.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_00: But I had the skill set of, you know, being curious, uh, being interested in other people.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: Because I think that's the thing.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, with the curiosity piece is one of the things that's always driven me.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like I've always wanted to know more about other people and what they do.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_00: So it just so happened that I made a career out of it.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: It was, I don't know if it was like chicken and the egg or if that's what my job was, or I had that, but I I always do love the idea of like connecting with people, finding out what they're all about, their background.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_00: My my wife always says I'm I'm the nosiest person around because you know, we could be in a restaurant and just like strike up a conversation and have like a deep conversation with a complete stranger, you know, within seconds of knowing them and not being afraid to ask questions that most people would be afraid to ask.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: So that's that was always the thing, like what can you know?
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: This is what I I think I can do.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: How can I make a living out of this?
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's a struggle for a lot of people that don't have like a hard skill.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: I think if you're one of these people that have are like loaded with soft skills, the point the the work, the the tricky part is the find the key to that hole.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, oh, how do I take all these soft skills and make it a hard skill?
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so that was that was I was very fortunate.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: Trust me, I'm not one of those people like, yeah, I was really good.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: So that's why I lasted 24 years.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, yeah, I I mean, I think I did a good job, but uh honestly it was because of the fact that I was able to do all these things.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, so so what I was trying to do is like try to find where my skills would work, and it just so happened that it did.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, yeah, no, I think it's it's one of those things for a lot of people like to make that work, and I was very fortunate.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: And so what happened to me uh after those 24 years, Chris, my radio station was sold to a Christian broadcasting company.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_00: So I was fired by Jesus and I was out, I was out trying to find what to do next.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_00: And this is around the time that podcasting was blowing up.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_00: This is 2019, this is when you were getting all these like celebrities signing up to do podcasts.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_00: You saw all these companies spend millions and maybe billions in podcasting.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, I was already starting to like dabble.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like I was doing a podcast while I was working on on the air, like on the side for fun, because I knew that's where the future was going.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I ended up working with this company in Charleston, South Carolina, called Advantage Media, where I help entrepreneurs and CEOs kind of tell their story through podcasting.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they come through the door as authors and they write books with us, and then I help them create a podcast around, you know, the extending the narrative of the book.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_00: I, you know, one of my running jokes is like the book is your Bible, but the podcast is your Sunday sermon.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's your ability to continue the conversation well past the book's publication date.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, so that's what I'm doing now.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's my day job.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: But like with that, I'm able to, you know, again, use all those skills that I was talking about, the curiosity part, the the entertaining part, the, you know, finding out what makes people tick, all that stuff kind of fits into what I do uh, you know, in my day job and just been very fortunate during the course of my career to do that.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_01: Well, your podcast and your conversations are awesome.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I it's really cool.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: You hit on something that I'm a big fan of.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I I see this not just in like podcasting or or in jobs where communication happens a lot, but just people who genuinely are nice to people or and want to spotlight them and make them feel important and you're genuinely interested and you said curious to know more about them.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_01: You know, just being liked, you know, can take you so many places, and not being like faked like.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: Genuinely just being a good person.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: And uh I love seeing people be successful, especially the people who are nice and they treat people the right way and they ask questions and they want to get to know you.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, I noticed that in your podcast as you're talking to these authors, because not all of them, you know, have been, you know, they they don't do that every day.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_01: Just on a podcast to share their story or whatnot.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: Writing a book, you know, is one thing, but then speaking about it's different.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: I know that's a goal for a lot of them, but you do a really good job of kind of guiding them and getting them to relax and have a great conversation.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's a skill that's that's hard to do.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: You know, a lot of people don't know how to get the person in front of them to do that, especially.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciate it, Chris.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, it's it's and trust me, I sometimes take it for granted what I do because I think, oh, like anybody can do it.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: And that's sort of like what led me to the book, Chris.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: So I was never one of these people that like, you know, I would say there's two types of people in the world, the people who who want to write a book and people that don't.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: I was in the Dome Camp.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: Like I never thought I would be an author.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_00: And as I was working with these entrepreneurs when I made the career pivot from working on morning radio to working with these entrepreneurs, I was like originally when I first did that transition, I was like, oh, okay, I'm just gonna do the same thing I was doing before.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_00: But what I didn't realize was what I was doing before, I was working with like literally Hall of Fame broadcasters.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: Like one of my mentors and hosts on my show is in the Rock Roll Hall of Fame.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_00: And so I was like, I'm I'll just do that.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: And then I realized, like, no, not all the people that I'm going to work with on a daily basis as entrepreneurs, don't have that skill set, don't have all that experience, don't have those miles that they put in into the work of becoming better communicators.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so as I was working with these entrepreneurs and training them how to do podcasts, I would use like stories from my career to be like, oh, this happened to me.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: So you can learn from this.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_00: And then as I kept doing that and doing that, I went to my bosses at Advanced Media.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, is this a thing?
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know how comedians talk, like, is this a bit?
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: Is this a thing?
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: Is this funny?
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: And they said, Oh, yeah, yeah, that's a thing.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: So essentially the book kind of wrote itself, Chris, where I was essentially just using the stories that I had accumulated over the course of those 24 years and are applicable to people today.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_00: So there's a bunch of stories with celebrities and stuff like that.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't use them just for name dropping, but it's almost like what I learned from those experiences.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I mean, I'm I'm really lucky to be able to do what I do because, you know, I, you know, I started this conversation telling you that like my parents were immigrants and they worked with their hands and they sweat out.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so one thing that my parents always set up for me, and I'm sure a parent listening to this and parents before them was like, I want to make my kids' life easier than I had it.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so my mom and is gave me one job when it was, when I was growing up.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: She's like, find a career where you're gonna be happy and you're gonna be nice to people.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: And so she didn't want me to, you she didn't espouse me to be a doctor or a lawyer or do or even do like a trade.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_00: She's like, find something that's gonna, you know, fulfill you.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so that it did.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: And luckily, now I I have the ability after all these years of doing it, is like just helping people not only tell their stories, but also helping them tell other people's stories as well.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm sure your parents are extremely proud.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: And they probably see conversations you've had and they're like, our son gets to talk to this person.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how cool is that?
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the radio days were fun.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like, it was it was actually great being because my mom was actually a listener of the show that I ended up joining on.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: So she was like a fan to begin with.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: So the fact that I was working on a show that she was listening to was like the coolest thing.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember getting her tickets into like all these concerts and shows and stuff and meet celebrities and stuff like that.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_00: It was always really cool.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_00: And and that was one of the great parts of of having that kind of job is just being able to like help the people around you who like wouldn't have that opportunity to go to a show or meet someone that they've always wanted to meet.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it was I was always very it was very gratifying to me that not only could I enjoy the the the spoils of my job, but of my family could as well.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's amazing.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: I can again I can only imagine just how proud and the feelings.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: As a son, too, you know, you want nothing more than to like do something awesome for your mom and dad to where they're just so excited.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, that's the best feeling ever.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_01: But more into your book, Joe, good listen.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: What are some things that I don't know, like some core principles to it when you're talking about communication in the workplace or these entrepreneurs that you're working with?
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: What are some things that you know, I'm thinking if nothing else, if if if someone reads your book and it's like the one thing they pick up on, what is it that you hope they do pick up on, or what are some key points that you like to to, I don't know, use as your kind of foundation when you're working with people?
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, Chris.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: One of the things I always talk about, and I think this is like the core to not even be not just being like a great leader, great podcaster, great human being, is self-awareness.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_00: Self-awareness is one of those things that many people just don't think about.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: And people that are into self-awareness are overly aware about it.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: And and and to just share, one of the stories I use in the book is there was this there was speech giving at a college commencement, and it was it was a story about two fish.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: They were swimming along in the sea, and then all of a sudden uh another fish swims up to them and he goes, Hey, fellas, how's the water?
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_00: And the the fish look at each other and they're like, What water?
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_00: You know, because fish don't know what water is, they just know that they live in it.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: And so that that story resonates with me because it's a lot of times we're so busy in our own thing.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like we all think we're the star of our own movie.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: We all think that the the world revolves around us, and it really doesn't.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we're just a small piece of this little blue dot in the in the universe.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: So being aware of like not only people's feelings and and and what's going on in their life, I think is super important.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: And being able to like follow that vibe.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like one of the things that I always talk about is like, and I always I'll try to catch myself, is you know, sometimes you'll you'll be driving down the road and you'll get cut off with someone with a big truck.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: And you'll be like, why is that idiot driving that truck?
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: He can't, he doesn't know how to drive that thing.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: If if you don't have self-awareness, that's the first thing you think.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_00: If you have self-awareness, you think, why is that person driving that truck?
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: Is it because A, maybe they had a car accident and they feel uncomfortable in a smaller vehicle?
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: Two, they have a large family and they the only way they can get around is with a large truck.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: And so that self-awareness piece, if you carry that with you everywhere in terms of like when people someone says something to you cross, instead of being like, is that about me?
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, oh no, no.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe there's something going on in that person's life that may that's making them do that and making them aware of, like, hey, by the way, I don't know what's going on in your life, but that, you know, that was uncomfortable what you said, or that, you know, that hurt my feelings, what you said.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_00: And then the person will be like, oh shit, well, just so you know, yeah, I have I've had a really bad day.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_00: My boss was an asshole, all that stuff.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: So the self-awareness part, I think, is incredibly important for not just if you want to do, and again, my book is not a that's what the subtitle is how to create a memorable moments in in business and life.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's because I want people to take away that the person at work should be the similar to the person at home and vice versa, because sometimes people change their personality when they're at work.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: You know, maybe they're nice when they're at work, but then they go home, they're raging a-holes, or vice versa.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: So being aware of who you are and those people around you, that's I think that's a great start in terms of being a better communicator.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_01: Man, that's good stuff.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_01: Because I I was talking to someone actually earlier today on an earlier uh podcast.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_01: We were talking about kind of similar personal accountability, changing the way you think, you know, in a situation, and and just man, it's so powerful when you can flip the switch and kind of think of the other side instead of yeah, taking it personal, but maybe thinking in in their shoes for a quick second, just how much that'll, if nothing else, like calm you down, maybe center things, think of things a little bit differently, and it just just changes, it just makes you feel better, brings the stress levels down, but it's hard.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's hard to practice that.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's totally hard.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I trust me, there are times where I will do it and I'll like literally, you know, do the share moonstruck thing where like snap out of it, or I'll catch myself, like, oh no, no, come on, idiot.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_00: This is what you're this is what you're all about.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I and again, we all are emotional human beings, so we are gonna react to certain things.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna have pet peeves that drive you crazy.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like I have a neighbor who, when the garbage in our neighborhood, we have an HOA, you're supposed to put your garbage cage in right after the garbage is collected.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_00: The garbage can sits out there for days sometimes, and it drives me freaking crazy, Chris.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_00: But I'm like, she's a single mom, she's got a couple kids.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: She probably the last thing she's probably thinking about is that stupid garbage can, which is driving me crazy.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I sometimes have to pull away, but like, you know what?
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: She's just, she's got a lot of shit going on in her life, and the garbage can't the last thing on her mind.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: So just giving yourself that it's it's almost like giving yourself that break too.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, don't be so hard on yourself, too.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: Be like, oh shit, there's a reason you, you, you maybe snapped at that person.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's because something else happened.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_00: But again, if it always returns that back to that self-awareness thing, you you'll you're more less likely to piss somebody off, or someone else is going to really hurt your feelings because you can be like, oh, there's got to be a reason for that happening just now.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_01: Man, the trash can thing hits home for me too.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_01: Not to pat myself on the back, but there's a couple of times I've actually taken their trash can and put it up for them.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: It feels pretty good, you know?
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like it feels pretty good.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_00: Listen, Chris, I know, and people have said this to me too.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_00: But the one thing is I I don't one of my Pepsi peeves is being taken for granted.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I know if I start to do that, she'll be like, okay, cool, he's gonna take in my garbage can every day.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm I'm almost like neurotic about respecting everyone and living by the golden rule.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you know, treat others as you want to be treated.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: So the last thing I want to do is be taken advantage of.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's one of those things that's just like, it I'm just not gonna allow it to happen.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, so I get you, Chris.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: I would do it.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: And if and if there's some days when she goes away or something like that, and I know she's not gonna be around for a few days, I'm gonna go ahead and put it away because I I get it that she's not here to do it.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, no, I there's there's certain things that I still have to like snap out of it and be like, hey, Joe, uh remember you're talking about self-awareness?
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: Well, here, it's time to be self-aware right now.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I do it like once every two months.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: I make sure they don't get comfortable with it.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'm not doing it every week, but come out here, they'll they'll say thank you.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, okay, you know, this one time, you know, this is your one time in once a quarter right here.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_01: Uh Joe, what just a couple more questions for you.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you've interviewed so many people via radio or podcast.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, this is kind of more just for for me personally, or or I know there's other people that have podcasts that have been online.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_01: When you, I'm sure you've been in a situation to where you're having to pull information or or get somebody to talk back to you, you know, and it's but when you're just like, come on, give me something.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_01: What are some tricks that you personally, or what are some questions that you've learned can open that door a little bit to kind of get that conversation flowing a little bit smoother, maybe make them feel a little more comfortable to share and give you more details in their answers.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_01: But what are some things you do in those situations?
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_00: So one of the hacks that I have always done, and it was so funny, I've done this for years.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_00: And then I I read a book uh about from this author who who does keynotes, and like he literally does this thing that I'm about to tell you.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, oh, I guess I'm not, I guess I'm not the only smart person who thinks of this.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: But the best way to get people to share is to share first.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_00: So when I open up a podcast, you know, I I don't do the big preamble open with a person.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_00: I'll usually say, Hey, Chris, welcome to the show.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: And then I'll do like the opens later in post because I don't want to bore people.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want people sitting there.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: But what I usually do is be like, hey, Chris, welcome to the show.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_00: And then I'll have them say their thing.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: And what I'll immediately launch into is an anecdote that connects me to that person.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: So for example, I'm just gonna use a terrible one here, but I see that you were glasses.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so I would I would tell you that, you know, Chris, I see that you know you're wearing glasses where, you know, 20 years ago, I got LASIK surgery and that changed my life.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: But guess what?
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: After 20 years, that LASIK surgery has worn off.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_00: So now I need to wear glasses when I go driving.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that's again a silly example, but but you opening up yourself to the guest does a couple things.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_00: One, it shows uh common ground, it shows, oh shoot, that person is just like.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Me and it doesn't have to be a physical thing, it doesn't have to be it could be a geographic thing, it could be a personal thing, it could be a family thing, a work thing.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_00: So it starts there, it starts you on common ground.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_00: But two, it gives the guests like 30 seconds to do nothing.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: The guests can just literally like sit, like it's the pressure of being on a show, having a camera in their face when they're not normally used to doing it, uh, it gives them a moment to be like, oh, cool, I could just kind of sit here, get my like my butt's gonna be nice and comfy in this chair.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: I'll listen.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_00: And then all of a sudden you hear this story and they're like, oh yeah.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_00: And then they can go on.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think for most people, when when an inner with the interviewer shares something, or this could be something at work or it could be something in life, if you share something, more more and more and more likely that other person is gonna share something too.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: Because they'll be like, oh, funny, you should just say that because that happened to me too.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's a great way to start.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: When it comes to the actual conversation, Chris, I'm a huge fan of momentum.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm one of these people that I like the a conversation to feel like you're riding a bicycle where like you need both wheels to go for it to keep going.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: So if that person is slow to respond or maybe has short answers, that means I need faster questions.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's I mean, I it you hate to make it so brutally kind of like transactional, but like if that person has is has quick, quick answers, have quick questions.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: Like get ready, like be ready to kind of start launching.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe, you know, where you you probably went going in thinking, oh, maybe I'll ask five or six questions.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_00: You might end up having asked 15 questions because that's this, that's the way it is.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm a big fan of keeping that momentum going, but starting with that fact that the person is comfortable and ready to share, I think that in a way will prevent any of that stuff from happening down the road.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_00: Because then all of a sudden you have something to circle back to.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like that thing you mentioned earlier.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_00: You know how we're talking about earlier.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: So anytime you could do that at the beginning of any kind of conversation, it's a great way to put you on the right path to make sure that that podcast, conversation, chat, whatever, what have you, is going to be a good one.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's good.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and one of the things, and I'm sure you do this too, I've found is it goes back to your just being curious part.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_01: I've I've learned early on, trying to study up and know everything.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: It kind of prevents you from being able to ask certain questions because you you kind of already know the answer.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_01: But if you come into it with just genuine curiosity and wanting to learn more, and you really, I think sometimes you think you're gonna sound dumb by asking certain questions, but really it's not.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I think most guests appreciate the question being able to share something that I don't know and that they feel that they're adding value to me and listeners.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: So I found, again, you mentioned it earlier, just to add that curiosity piece has really done wonders for me to just ask questions and not be afraid to ask them.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_01: And they love that, it seems.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and be honest about it, Chris.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like, if you think you have a dumb question, say it.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I the not too long ago, I had I was like with my job, I'm very fortunate where I'm literally speaking to all sorts of people in all sorts of works.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: I talked to a breast cancer doctor.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't know anything about breast cancer, don't know anything about breast cancer.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_00: I don't have breasts, I'm not a doctor.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I would be like, hey, I know this is a stupid question, but like, when is more likely when when do women get breast cancer?
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: What's the, you know, or like, you know, what happens after like say frame it with like, hey, I know this could be a stupid question, and that all of a sudden, like, softens it to the other person, be like, oh, okay, and then and then what usually happens is like, oh no, it's not a stupid question.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's a great question kind of thing.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: So being honest about like, you know, it possibly being a stupid question is just like, just frame it that way.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: Just like, hey, I know this might sound silly, but like I need to ask this thing.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: So having that using that kind of framing is a great way to like ask a question where you might be afraid to ask it, but in a way it could be like, hey, man, I don't know much about this, but like, is this a thing like this?
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and then all of a sudden they're like, oh, yeah, yeah, no, you know, we get this question all the time because there's a pretty good chance, Chris, that that dumb question has been asked of that person many a time before that moment in in in in your life.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, no, I think it's it's I mean, one of the things I love about my job is I'm just dangerous enough about most subjects that I could have a conversation with everyone.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_00: And my wife always teases me that I could talk to someone who's eight years old or 80 years old because I could, I could find like a thing to gravitate to.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I'm not an expert in pretty much anything, but I just know enough about like what's going on in the world, what's good, what could be going on with this guest.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I famously, you know, for my podcast, I don't prepare a single question for any of my guests.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like sometimes a guest will be like, hey, can you send a list of questions?
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I could send them, but uh, that's I'm probably not gonna ask it because I'm a I'm a big believer in you know, listening and react.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, and like you said, if you study up on a person, you don't need to write questions.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, there could be like one or two, like, oh shoot, I gotta make sure I ask Joe about this question kind of thing.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: But like outside of that, just be having an a having enough knowledge of the guest is all you need to have a conversation.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_00: And this, again, goes for business and life.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_00: Like if you're having a a coworker, if it's it's a potential client, just knowing enough about that person's background, that's all you need to get going.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_01: Two more questions for you, Joe.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_01: And one's gonna be uh uh funny, and I'm genuinely, genuinely, uh I don't know if you have or not.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_01: I think I saw something, but um, have you ever interviewed Taylor Swift?
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: I have, yes.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, I thought I saw that.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a huge Swifty, and it and all my friends picked on me for I'm I'm a day one though, like 2006.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: Oh wow, okay.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like uh Tim McGraw uh day.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: My friends used to get me her calendar every year as like a joke.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_01: But for me, I was like, this is great.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like you guys, I'm actually gonna use this calendar.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: I I have like 2007, 8, 9, 10.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: But I think I saw something where you had interviewed her and I was like, dream, dream conversation, you know.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_00: So I wish I had a happy story to tell you about that, Chris.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_00: But so this one was, and I, you know, I talk about this in the book, and and I use this as an example of, you know, when you have a conversation, whether it's a podcast or at work or with your family, is like making sure you're creating an environment that's welcoming and gives people the opportunity to be open and forthcoming.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: So in this case with uh Taylor Swift, the day before she was going to come into our radio studio to promote this the promoting the 1989 album.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: Favorite album, by the way.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, shake it off, I'm sure.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm sure a big fan of that.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_00: So she's she comes in and then the but the day before, um, her her label tells us, hey, by the way, you can only video record the first five minutes of the conversation.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: And this is around the time when radio stations were starting to post like their videos on YouTube and on their website and stuff like that.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_00: So this is a big driver for the company.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like, let's let's get more activity with our video content.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: And so we were we were like, okay, so that means we can only post five minutes of the video.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: And they're like, oh no, no, no, no.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_00: You can only record the first five minutes.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, well, that's really stupid because usually the first, and Chris, you know this, maybe the first five minutes of this conversation were terrible.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_00: But most first five minutes of a conversation are not great.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's usually people getting to know each other.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's a lot of back and forth of like, how's the weather, all that crap?
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I was pissed off.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, this is really stupid.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so lo and behold, Taylor Swift comes in the next day.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: I'm standing next to our videographer.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Taylor Swift's on the other side of my desk.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_00: And um the PR person does a beeline straight to the videographer and says, Hey, by the way, I'm gonna be standing next to you when it gets to the five minute mark.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just gonna tap you on the shoulder and I want you to lower the camera.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: Not turn it off.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_00: They didn't even trust us to turn off the camera, lower the camera.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_00: And so this is I've been stewing on this for like 24 hours.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I said, Oh, just a quick question about that.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_00: If we have a follow-up question to that answer at the five-minute mark, are we able to keep recording?
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: And the person was like, Yeah, yeah, you know, we'll see what we can do.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's not, you know, it's not like a strict five minutes.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, okay, great, great, great.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I go, one more thing.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_00: What if we have a follow-up question to that follow-up question from the question that came before the five minute mark?
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_00: Would we still be able to record?
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_00: And the person was like, Yeah, yeah, I mean, I'm sure it'd be fine.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_00: Well, one more thing.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_00: What if we had a follow-up question to the second follow-up question that connects to the first follow-up question that started right before the five minute mark?
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_00: Would we still be able to keep recording?
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: At this point, the PR person was like flummox.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_00: She had no idea what I was even talking about.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_00: Just leave it on.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_00: And then on the other side of the room, I hear, well, someone woke up feeling saucy this morning.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_00: And it was Taylor Swift who would listen to this entire interaction between me and her PR representative.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, shit, the room went completely silent.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_00: It was as if like you could hear a pin drop in the room.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: And then I was like, you know, I just tried to laugh it off.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_00: But then during the entire conversation, she looked at me with dagger eyes, thinking that I was gonna ask her a question that was gonna be offensive, cross the line, uh, not be respectful.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_00: And she was guarded the whole time.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_00: Like her walls were up the entire time.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: She was giving the stand, you know, you know, when these stars go on on these press tours, they're giving the they're asked the same 10 questions.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: So they have the patented 10 answers.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: And so it was one of those things where it was just a very kind of like question to answer, question to answer, boring podcast.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it wasn't, well, we turned it into a podcast, but boring like radio interview.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: And from that moment on, I realized that, you know, first of all, I made it about me, which when you're doing any kind of conversation, hosting a conversation, it's not about you.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's not it's never about you.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_00: And second, if you're gonna do that, like you want people to feel comfortable.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I say you want people to feel comfortable enough where they will walk into your, you know, hey, how you have that friend who's gonna walk into your house and then go grab the last beer in your fridge without even worrying about it, like without even with no regrets.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_00: You want guests to be like that.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: You want guests to be willing to go to your fridge and take that last beer without telling you.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_00: And so I didn't create that environment.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_00: So because I was an asshole about the whole video recording thing, which again, in this grand scheme of things, probably nobody cares, but I did at the moment.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: And it set it it set the tone for a really awkward conversation.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's one of the one of the stories I use.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's in the book.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: I but I tell these, I tell this to my clients and people I work with all the time when I'm consulting about podcasts.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: You got to start by making people feel comfortable.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, starting a podcast with a really, really hard question or something hard-hitting or a gotcha question, it's it's it only goes downhill from there.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like it will it will not end well for you.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, so creating that environment is is the start to any great conversation.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I did not do that with uh uh with T Swifty there, Swifty.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_01: It will hey learn you learned a lesson, you're able to share it and use it moving forward, and and who knows, I'll have to go listen to some more songs, or maybe a song written specifically about you.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_00: No, I doubt it.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_00: I highly this was not like a bad boyfriend situation.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sure she forgot it as soon as she left the studio because she's like, oh, just another a-hole on my on this interviewer tour.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_00: So it is what it is.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_01: But no, Joe, last question for you.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: Good listen, obviously.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_01: Book we want to recommend to everybody, and we've got it on the Books for Guys website now, and we'll spotlight that.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: But just I I ask everybody the same question.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'm always curious for you personally, what's a book or two that has meant a lot to you professionally or personally?
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_01: And what's a book you like to recommend to others?
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_00: Hmm, yeah.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so I I will say the first book that I always talk about, the power of books, is uh Le Miserab, which I know this is a super random aside here, but back in high school, I was one of those typical kids who never read books.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_00: And so that we got this, we got Les Miserables as an English assignment.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_00: And for folks not familiar with the the with Le Mis, it basically is two parts.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's like tells a story about this guy who stole bread and being chased by a cop and then the life he leads after he escapes.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_00: And so when I was reading the book, I had no idea about twists, twists like plot twists.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_00: And so I read the the the first the first part of the book ends with the this prisoner escaping, and then it starts like X number of years later, where there's this man who who's who lives an esteemed life in Paris, and he's like this, he's this man about town.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_00: And it took me a minute, Chris, because how dumb I was as high school.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, duh, that's the guy that escaped in the first part of the book.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I didn't realize that as I'm reading the book.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, wait a minute, so it's a new book now, and now it's just telling the different story.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that's one of the things I love about books is like it catches you in your tracks and it teaches you something about the way like storytelling works, where it doesn't always have to be linear.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_00: It could have time jumps and stuff like that.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it's funny that you that you asked me about that because when people say about like your experiences with books, it's the first one I think about because it showed me the power of like how a good book can just be like, what the F?
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_00: Did that just I mean, it's it's it's it's one of those things, like, man, it's yeah, it's funny.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: But for books, uh uh a more current book, something that someone's more likely to read now as opposed to going see the Broadway musical.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's called the The Library Book by Susan Orlean.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and it tells a story of the greatest fire in the history of of the Los Angeles library.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_00: In the in the early 1980s, their their main library burnt to the ground.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_00: And this book is a love letter to libraries, to books and storytellings.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_00: And uh there's this line in the book where they say, you know, in Senegal, when someone dies, they say, your library has burned.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_00: And so that like stuck with me and this whole idea of like we are all walking libraries.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_00: Like we our our souls are filled with these amazing stories.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_00: And if you choose to tell your story and you put it in a book, your library will never burn.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_00: So my library is out there in Good Listen, where I tell a bunch of stupid stories from my radio days and the stuff I learned from them.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: But I think the library book by Susan Orlean is a really powerful book for people that love books, love the idea of storytelling with a little like cool little like a side story of like a forgotten a thing in American history.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, it's it's it's it's a really good one that I I can't I I highly suggest to anyone that loves just the power of storytelling.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm it sounds like one I would love to read.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I I'm in agreement with you, Joe.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone, I I said this a while back, everyone has a story to tell.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone's got something that could, if whether they choose to write a book or not, but everyone's got a story and highly recommend that you do uh either journal or write a book, uh, you know, whatever.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_01: Do some sort of writing about your life because we all have we all have so many different experiences and stories to share that others can find either a lesson in or enjoyment in or a laugh in or a cry in, you know, anything.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so uh I love that you said that.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_01: But Joe, man, this has been awesome, man.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for taking the time to do this.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_01: As like I said, I was so excited to talk to you.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_01: I know you talk to so many cool people, and I wanted to give you a chance to share your story on our podcast and just talk about all the cool things that you've done in your book in particular.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_01: And so, man, I'll be following you.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_01: I'll be watching your podcast, and I know a lot of the people who follow this show, I'm sure, will start watching yours and hopefully get your book as well.
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_01: And so, man, keep doing what you're doing because it's it's awesome stuff.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Chris.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciate the time.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Joe.