Latest / Crosstabs / Rep. Paul Evans - Vets, Prep and Limits

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Rep. Paul Evans - Vets, Prep and Limits · Crosstabs

0:16
SPEAKER_02: I'm ready when you're ready.
0:17
SPEAKER_02: You ready?
0:18
SPEAKER_02: I'm ready.
0:19
SPEAKER_02: We have new mics, so this is the second round of mics.
0:21
SPEAKER_02: I think the last mics went pretty well.
0:23
SPEAKER_02: I think so, too.
0:24
SPEAKER_00: We're here.
0:25
SPEAKER_00: The real question is, Representative Paul Evans, why are you still here?
0:28
SPEAKER_00: You've been in the legislature a few years, right?
0:30
SPEAKER_01: I've been in the legislature since 2015.
0:31
SPEAKER_01: 2015.
0:31
SPEAKER_01: So this is your 11th year now.
0:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
0:37
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
0:38
SPEAKER_00: It only feels like 100.
0:40
SPEAKER_02: What did you do before?
0:41
SPEAKER_02: You were in the Navy, Army?
0:44
SPEAKER_02: Air Force.
0:44
SPEAKER_02: Sorry, Air Force.
0:45
SPEAKER_02: That's right.
0:46
SPEAKER_02: I was in the Army.
0:47
SPEAKER_02: That's all right.
0:48
So everybody's giving each other loves today on Ways and Means,
0:50
and I was texting Vicki.
0:52
SPEAKER_02: I said, what, nothing for your husband?
0:54
SPEAKER_02: You know, a little help?
0:56
SPEAKER_02: Nothing.
0:57
SPEAKER_01: She put it in the text ring.
0:59
SPEAKER_01: What did you do in the Air Force?
1:02
SPEAKER_01: I was an air weapons controller, mission crew commander.
1:05
SPEAKER_01: Oh, nice.
1:06
SPEAKER_01: My last overseas assignment, I was the...
1:12
SPEAKER_01: in theater mission crew commander that I answered to a one star,
1:15
SPEAKER_01: the Joint Forces Air Component Commander,
1:18
SPEAKER_01: everything that flew in that theater worked for me.
1:21
SPEAKER_01: So I had a surveillance section,
1:23
SPEAKER_01: ID section,
1:24
SPEAKER_01: weapon section,
1:25
SPEAKER_01: air defense section,
1:26
SPEAKER_01: and my job was to make sure that
1:29
SPEAKER_01: Time-sensitive targets were prosecuted.
1:32
SPEAKER_01: Troops in contact were serviced,
1:34
SPEAKER_01: making sure aircraft got refueling,
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and making sure that my team of 20 actually were able to put
1:41
fire wherever we
1:42
SPEAKER_01: needed to to protect our kids.
1:44
SPEAKER_01: Best job I ever had.
1:45
SPEAKER_01: That was in theaters, so where was that?
1:47
SPEAKER_01: The last one was in Afghanistan.
1:49
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
1:49
SPEAKER_02: Oh, wait, wow.
1:51
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
1:51
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for that.
1:54
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for your service.
1:55
SPEAKER_02: I was in Germany.
1:56
SPEAKER_02: But I never, I got the Bosnia.
1:57
From what I've heard,
1:58
there's some places in Germany that can be kind of tough.
2:01
SPEAKER_02: I went to Bosnia, so I was there during that time, kind of in the 90s.
2:04
SPEAKER_02: The First World War or the Second one?
2:06
SPEAKER_00: Sorry, sorry.
2:07
SPEAKER_00: I'm not that old, but you're a jerk.
2:09
SPEAKER_00: I need a question about my wars.
2:10
SPEAKER_01: I was in Bosnia.
2:11
SPEAKER_01: I was actually in Italy in support of the Bosnian campaign in 1995.
2:15
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
2:18
SPEAKER_01: In 1998, we had a warm-up for the Kosovo campaign.
2:21
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
2:21
SPEAKER_02: Back in Italy.
2:23
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that was in 95 I was there.
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But yeah,
2:26
I was outside of Würzburg in Germany is where I stationed first
2:29
ID outside of there.
2:30
SPEAKER_02: It was fun.
2:32
SPEAKER_02: I enjoyed it.
2:32
SPEAKER_02: I enjoyed being in Europe.
2:33
SPEAKER_02: That part was kind of fun.
2:34
SPEAKER_02: That time of the 90s,
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SPEAKER_02: it was still kind of hard when it went east,
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SPEAKER_02: but it was still fun traveling.
2:43
Every weekend I'd take the $29 bus trip to northern Italy or
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Switzerland or
2:48
SPEAKER_02: something,
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SPEAKER_02: and it would be 48 hours.
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SPEAKER_02: It was so much fun.
2:51
SPEAKER_02: It was a blast.
2:53
SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's great.
2:54
SPEAKER_00: Would you say that's how public transportation should work, Brian?
2:58
SPEAKER_02: Well,
2:58
SPEAKER_02: I don't believe in public transportation,
3:00
but I think in Europe it worked really well because we built a
3:03
really good grid
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SPEAKER_02: after we destroyed it.
3:05
SPEAKER_02: So if we destroyed everything and we could probably start over,
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SPEAKER_02: I bet we'd build a really better transportation grid.
3:13
SPEAKER_02: And you might even get your bridge to West Salem.
3:15
SPEAKER_02: Someday.
3:16
SPEAKER_02: Someday.
3:16
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
3:17
SPEAKER_00: Well, I'm looking at just a top secret document, Brian.
3:21
SPEAKER_00: So this is,
3:22
SPEAKER_00: I think,
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one of the great things about being able to go across the aisle
3:25
is you can share
3:25
SPEAKER_00: information.
3:26
SPEAKER_00: And here I'm looking at the secret plan to defeat the Republicans.
3:30
SPEAKER_00: And I know there are very many,
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SPEAKER_00: especially,
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SPEAKER_00: I think,
3:32
SPEAKER_00: House Republicans who know that this existed.
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SPEAKER_00: They believed it existed, but they've never seen it.
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SPEAKER_00: And you should take a picture of this.
3:41
SPEAKER_00: It's a blank page.
3:43
SPEAKER_00: So I don't know if he redacted everything.
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SPEAKER_00: I'll put it on the cover, Reagan.
3:46
SPEAKER_00: No, it's not redacted.
3:47
SPEAKER_00: It's not redacted.
3:48
SPEAKER_00: It just doesn't exist.
3:49
SPEAKER_00: There's nothing on it.
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It's just that sometimes we say we have a plan,
3:52
and the plan is to have a plan.
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SPEAKER_00: The plan is to have a plan, yes.
3:55
SPEAKER_00: And listen, I mean, we probably have a plan to defeat the Democrats.
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SPEAKER_00: It's very similar.
4:01
uh and we'll we'll put whatever on it needs to go on it i guess
4:03
but it's just you
4:04
know i just thought you guys might want to actually know
4:06
transparency is important
4:07
to me yeah i appreciate that we have no plan i appreciate well
4:11
yeah i don't know
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what our plan is i don't i'm not doing leadership stuff this
4:15
time so it's funny i'm
4:16
not either yeah yeah that's right you uh quietly retired yeah
4:20
yeah from leadership
4:21
SPEAKER_01: yes yes
4:24
SPEAKER_01: Shortest leadership stint, I think, in Oregon history.
4:27
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
4:28
SPEAKER_01: How long?
4:29
SPEAKER_01: Four months, I think.
4:30
SPEAKER_02: Four months?
4:30
SPEAKER_02: Oh, wow.
4:31
SPEAKER_02: Well,
4:31
SPEAKER_02: so Rep Chudson was saying,
4:33
so it was basically you and two other ones that were doing the
4:35
campaign side.
4:37
SPEAKER_02: Well, politics.
4:38
SPEAKER_02: Or the politics side.
4:39
SPEAKER_02: And then he was kind of doing the policy side.
4:41
SPEAKER_02: Because we asked him kind of how they did it.
4:43
SPEAKER_02: That's what we let him think.
4:46
SPEAKER_02: He's young.
4:46
SPEAKER_02: He is young.
4:47
SPEAKER_01: We want him to be excited.
4:48
SPEAKER_02: Yes, he is a rookie, so that part's good.
4:52
SPEAKER_02: That was fun.
4:52
We had a good conversation with him,
4:54
and he seems to enjoy the policy stuff.
4:56
He's not quite there on the politics stuff yet,
4:58
but you learn that over time.
5:00
SPEAKER_01: I believe,
5:03
whether you're Republican or Democrat or Pirate Party or
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whatever you want to call
5:07
SPEAKER_01: yourself,
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If you have a heart and a head and can figure a balance,
5:12
we need you here.
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SPEAKER_01: And he's got a big heart and a big head.
5:15
SPEAKER_01: And I think he's going to be a great legislator over time.
5:19
SPEAKER_01: My job as an old guy is to sometimes give a bad time to him.
5:22
SPEAKER_01: as the old school approach of beating him into the job a little bit.
5:27
SPEAKER_01: He's far brighter than I ever was and he's got,
5:30
SPEAKER_01: I think,
5:31
a once in a class or once in a group of folks mind for
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understanding the third or
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SPEAKER_01: fourth level of a problem.
5:41
SPEAKER_02: That's a good point.
5:42
SPEAKER_00: So when you got here,
5:43
SPEAKER_00: let's take that,
5:44
SPEAKER_00: when you got here as a freshman,
5:45
SPEAKER_00: who were some of those people for you?
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Who were some of your mentors or some of the people who kind of
5:50
took you under
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SPEAKER_00: their wing in this process?
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SPEAKER_01: When I first got here in 2015, I wasn't supposed to be here.
5:55
I won a seat that a particular political consultant we won't
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name had guaranteed
6:01
SPEAKER_01: would not be lost.
6:03
SPEAKER_01: And surprise, I got here by 744 votes in America.
6:06
SPEAKER_01: And, um,
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SPEAKER_01: I had lots of mentors.
6:12
SPEAKER_01: Some I didn't really see as mentors, but they saw me as somebody to mold.
6:18
SPEAKER_01: Val Hoyle did her best every day to remind me that I was not...
6:22
SPEAKER_01: She was your majority leader then?
6:23
SPEAKER_01: She was the majority leader.
6:24
She was very good at reminding me every day that I shouldn't be
6:27
asking questions
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SPEAKER_01: and my vote really didn't matter and that I should shut up and call her.
6:32
She'd never served in the military,
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but her approach certainly represented it.
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SPEAKER_01: And then my mentors were really Brian Clem,
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SPEAKER_01: because we'd been friends for 30 years,
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SPEAKER_01: Jeff Parker,
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SPEAKER_01: Greg Matthews.
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I had worked in the governor's office from 2007 to 2010 and
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then went into private
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SPEAKER_01: sector and then went back into teaching.
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When I had been in the governor's office,
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Greg Matthews was a new legislator.
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SPEAKER_01: I got here in 2015 just as he was leaving.
7:03
SPEAKER_01: But that first term, I called him a lot, asking for advice.
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SPEAKER_01: Vicki Berger, who had the seat before me, is still a mentor.
7:10
SPEAKER_01: I call her and ask her for advice.
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SPEAKER_01: But Jeff Barker was my assigned mentor.
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SPEAKER_01: Margaret Doherty was basically my second Irish mother,
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SPEAKER_01: who would also tell me every day how his...
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SPEAKER_01: making mistakes.
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But we had actually,
7:29
I think,
7:29
a pretty crew back then that were centrists.
7:33
SPEAKER_01: I don't know if they call themselves mods, but I'm a vet.
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SPEAKER_01: I have 35 firearms, I believe, the second method.
7:41
SPEAKER_01: I used to go to a church until I got kicked out over a gun.
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SPEAKER_01: So I'm not exactly the lefty part of our caucus, but I still believe in
7:52
universal access to education and healthcare,
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I just believe you should work for it.
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SPEAKER_01: So there was a space there at that point.
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Do you really think the party,
8:03
because you still have those same core beliefs,
8:05
right?
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SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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SPEAKER_02: Those still exist today.
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So where do you think the Democratic Party as a whole then is,
8:11
I mean,
8:11
is it true?
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Do you believe it's shifted left of where it wholly believed 10
8:17
years ago?
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SPEAKER_01: I do.
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SPEAKER_01: I do.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: How do I put this?
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SPEAKER_01: Someone once said that politics is show business for ugly people.
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SPEAKER_01: And as a guy who was a face for radio, I firmly welcome that example.
8:36
SPEAKER_01: Politics is a show.
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There are certain things that people do because they think that
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it's going to help
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SPEAKER_01: them and their image.
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SPEAKER_01: I still believe 50 to 60 to 70 percent of the folks that are here
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If you did a Venn diagram,
8:53
what we want are probably somewhere in the same shape.
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SPEAKER_01: How we describe it, how we view it, everything else will be different.
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SPEAKER_01: What's changed is,
9:01
SPEAKER_01: in my opinion,
9:03
the extremes of both parties now are kind of not just satisfied
9:08
with you believing
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SPEAKER_01: in the cause...
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SPEAKER_01: but they want you to fight Pyrrhic victories that are divisive,
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SPEAKER_01: purposefully divisive,
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and they want you to fight for Pyrrhic victories that 100% is
9:22
the beginning of the
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SPEAKER_01: negotiation.
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SPEAKER_01: They think there's a 200% somehow.
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SPEAKER_01: And I think in our party in particular,
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SPEAKER_01: we try to be a party of a big tent,
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SPEAKER_01: but when you start standing for everything,
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SPEAKER_01: you really don't stand for much of anything.
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SPEAKER_01: So I'm trying to say, look,
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SPEAKER_01: As a guy who spent 20 years in the military,
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SPEAKER_01: who believes in a multicultural society,
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SPEAKER_01: who respects different faiths and different ethnic traditions,
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SPEAKER_01: everybody is part of the melting pot.
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SPEAKER_01: At the same time, perhaps maybe identity politics isn't
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the best way we can move forward maybe perhaps we can focus on
10:01
little things like
10:02
civics like making our schools work like making sure that small
10:06
business and
10:07
working families and big business owners have an infrastructure
10:10
grid that functions
10:11
like let's get back to the governance side and unfortunately in
10:15
my party especially
10:18
with social media and just some of the ways that communication
10:21
happens now
10:23
People pick fights to get clicks to do things that then have
10:27
consequences they
10:28
SPEAKER_01: don't think about,
10:29
SPEAKER_01: and that affects relationships,
10:30
SPEAKER_01: because this building is built on relationships.
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SPEAKER_01: So I think we've not only moved left,
10:35
but I think the type of legislature that we're getting now from
10:38
the left and the
10:38
SPEAKER_01: right,
10:39
SPEAKER_01: partially because of COVID,
10:41
SPEAKER_01: partially because of the construction,
10:43
SPEAKER_01: they're not used to actually dealing with people
10:46
SPEAKER_01: In their face, they're not really used to criticism.
10:48
SPEAKER_01: They're kind of in a bubble.
10:51
SPEAKER_01: And a lot of folks have never governed before.
10:52
SPEAKER_01: They come out of the advocacy world.
10:55
SPEAKER_01: And,
10:55
SPEAKER_01: you know,
10:56
SPEAKER_01: the reason that Rick Lewis and I,
10:58
SPEAKER_01: literally,
10:59
SPEAKER_01: on a committee that I never had a majority on,
11:01
SPEAKER_01: I always had equal numbers,
11:02
SPEAKER_01: Democrat,
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SPEAKER_01: Republican,
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SPEAKER_01: when I ran the committee,
11:05
SPEAKER_01: the reason and the way we put 29-27 together,
11:08
SPEAKER_01: the restructured emergency management,
11:09
SPEAKER_01: was we put the partisan stuff out and we said,
11:12
SPEAKER_01: If it's good policy, it's in.
11:14
SPEAKER_01: If it's shitty policy, it's out.
11:16
How do we actually make sure that these agencies are freed and
11:19
simple enough to
11:20
SPEAKER_01: function,
11:21
SPEAKER_01: and yet at the same time they don't run like kittens across the stage?
11:24
SPEAKER_01: So he was local government.
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SPEAKER_01: I was a former local government guy.
11:28
And that takes us into kind of what you guys are doing in the
11:31
short session,
11:31
SPEAKER_00: which is your veterans omnibus bill.
11:34
SPEAKER_00: Can you talk us through,
11:35
SPEAKER_00: because there's some discussion,
11:37
SPEAKER_00: a little bit in Ways and Means,
11:38
SPEAKER_00: but not a ton,
11:38
SPEAKER_00: about what you guys are doing with the omnibus,
11:41
SPEAKER_00: because I was reading it,
11:42
SPEAKER_00: and I was reading it last night,
11:43
SPEAKER_00: because I'm a bad chief of staff that doesn't prep until the last minute.
11:46
SPEAKER_00: This is true.
11:47
SPEAKER_00: This is true.
11:48
SPEAKER_00: So...
11:49
Walk me through why set that threshold that you did at the 10
11:52
million funding index
11:54
SPEAKER_00: to inflation back from 2015 when you got here,
11:56
SPEAKER_00: right?
11:57
SPEAKER_00: With some of the things that you're doing in 2017.
11:58
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
11:59
SPEAKER_01: So here's what happened.
12:00
SPEAKER_01: In 2015, I got elected.
12:03
SPEAKER_01: 2016, I wasn't supposed to be able to win re-election.
12:08
SPEAKER_01: And the speaker,
12:09
SPEAKER_01: this is now the governor,
12:11
SPEAKER_01: said,
12:11
SPEAKER_01: look,
12:12
SPEAKER_01: it was a miracle you got here the first time.
12:14
SPEAKER_01: We're not really planning on you being here.
12:16
What's the one thing that you actually would like to accomplish
12:18
if you're a one-term person?
12:20
SPEAKER_01: And I said,
12:20
the only thing I want to accomplish is finish the work of
12:25
funding the programs that
12:27
we laid out in the 2008 Task Force on Veteran Services that I'd
12:30
led when I was for
12:31
SPEAKER_01: Kungoski.
12:32
SPEAKER_01: We had 36 bills and 14 different executive orders,
12:37
SPEAKER_01: but because of the recession,
12:38
SPEAKER_01: we were never able to fund it.
12:39
SPEAKER_01: We were never able to do a lot of that work.
12:42
SPEAKER_01: So I said,
12:42
SPEAKER_01: what I want is what Julie Parrish wants,
12:45
SPEAKER_01: which not surprisingly got a surprise on her face,
12:48
SPEAKER_01: but I said,
12:48
SPEAKER_01: I want a part of the lottery.
12:50
Give me 2% or 3% of the lottery,
12:53
and you won't ever need to give general fund again.
12:56
SPEAKER_01: And she said, we can get you at 2%.
13:01
SPEAKER_01: And to her credit...
13:03
SPEAKER_01: And a lot of people have a lot of views about the governor,
13:05
but the reason I endorsed her in a primary where I had two
13:09
friends running,
13:10
SPEAKER_01: and the reason I've stood up for her is when she gave me her word,
13:15
SPEAKER_01: We got it out of the House at 2%.
13:18
SPEAKER_01: It got into the Senate.
13:20
SPEAKER_01: And a couple of senators,
13:21
SPEAKER_01: not to name names,
13:22
SPEAKER_01: Peter Courtney,
13:24
SPEAKER_01: tried to kill it because they didn't want lottery money going.
13:28
SPEAKER_01: And she went to bat when no one else would.
13:30
And basically the building was going to burn down before we
13:32
left without at least getting 1.5%.
13:33
SPEAKER_01: And why that's important is
13:37
SPEAKER_01: They wanted to take it to 1%,
13:38
which basically would have just taken away the 10 million that
13:41
we'd finally gotten
13:41
SPEAKER_01: for general fund for veterans.
13:43
SPEAKER_01: It would have been a swap.
13:44
SPEAKER_01: I said, it doesn't get us anything.
13:46
SPEAKER_01: And plus it lies to the voters.
13:47
SPEAKER_01: Voters are thinking there's going to be an increase in F2.
13:50
SPEAKER_01: So we got to 1.5%.
13:53
SPEAKER_01: That was the deal.
13:54
SPEAKER_01: No more, no less.
13:55
SPEAKER_01: 1.5.
13:55
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
13:57
SPEAKER_01: We win the election.
13:58
SPEAKER_01: The election happens.
13:59
SPEAKER_01: Ballot measure 96 passes by historical, I think, 87, 88% margin.
14:05
SPEAKER_01: Comes in,
14:06
SPEAKER_01: the governor's budget,
14:07
SPEAKER_01: Kate Brown's governor,
14:09
took the full $10 million out and tried to supplant it with the
14:15
lottery money.
14:17
SPEAKER_01: And I told her before the session,
14:19
SPEAKER_01: I told her at the beginning of the session,
14:21
SPEAKER_01: I said,
14:21
SPEAKER_01: please don't do this.
14:23
SPEAKER_01: Because we made a promise.
14:24
And as much as you are a governor of my party,
14:27
my loyalty is with veterans before anybody else.
14:30
SPEAKER_01: So there was a budget officer who I won't name,
14:35
SPEAKER_01: who evidently scoffed and said,
14:37
SPEAKER_01: well,
14:37
SPEAKER_01: what is the House really going to do about this?
14:40
SPEAKER_01: Thanks to David Gomberg and Betsy Johnson and some of the others,
14:45
SPEAKER_01: I made the case and said,
14:46
SPEAKER_01: look,
14:47
SPEAKER_01: Every dollar,
14:48
SPEAKER_01: and I want this as an important thing for the whole show here,
14:51
SPEAKER_01: every dollar we invest in state money,
14:53
SPEAKER_01: every dollar,
14:54
SPEAKER_01: state money,
14:56
SPEAKER_01: brings back in direct assistance $251.
15:02
SPEAKER_01: In indirect,
15:05
SPEAKER_01: so direct means compensation and benefits,
15:07
SPEAKER_01: getting people into the system,
15:09
SPEAKER_01: because in America you have to make a claim,
15:10
SPEAKER_01: as you know,
15:11
SPEAKER_01: before you can get rated.
15:12
SPEAKER_01: $251 in direct.
15:16
SPEAKER_01: indirect GI bill, home loans, those types of things, 501.
15:20
And if you actually get them into the VA health care system,
15:23
it's a $1 in for $1,011 return.
15:27
SPEAKER_01: So I said, look, we have 350,000 veterans.
15:31
SPEAKER_01: The Vietnam era is starting to pass on.
15:33
SPEAKER_01: If they don't get their benefits, they never will.
15:36
SPEAKER_01: Their families don't get them.
15:38
SPEAKER_01: So we pushed really hard, and we got back 8.5 million of the 10 million
15:43
SPEAKER_01: in addition to the other programs.
15:45
SPEAKER_01: And I was supposed to be okay with that.
15:47
SPEAKER_01: I never had been okay with it.
15:48
SPEAKER_01: It was supposed to be $10 million.
15:50
SPEAKER_01: So in the bill, I had a statement for aspirational.
15:53
SPEAKER_01: Didn't commit the government,
15:54
SPEAKER_01: but it's reminding them,
15:56
SPEAKER_01: because in this building,
15:57
SPEAKER_01: memories fade fast.
15:59
SPEAKER_01: $10 million was the base before you messed around with it.
16:01
SPEAKER_01: I wanted to go back to $10 million plus interest.
16:03
SPEAKER_01: It gets you about $13 million.
16:05
SPEAKER_00: Amnesia.
16:06
SPEAKER_00: So it's a political amnesia.
16:08
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
16:09
SPEAKER_00: Oh, we have a lot of that in this building.
16:10
SPEAKER_02: Political amnesia.
16:13
SPEAKER_02: That was a legislator intent.
16:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
16:16
SPEAKER_01: So the bill does several things.
16:19
SPEAKER_01: We wrote it big,
16:21
SPEAKER_01: knowing that we probably wouldn't get it,
16:22
SPEAKER_01: but I wrote in the past,
16:27
the administration has had issues with the agency trying to
16:32
grow just because of
16:34
SPEAKER_01: lots of other things.
16:36
SPEAKER_01: I've tried it for three or four years before this governor got in.
16:42
SPEAKER_01: With this governor,
16:43
SPEAKER_01: and again under priorities that I understand,
16:48
have not been able to grow the staff that I think we need for
16:51
the specific needs of
16:52
SPEAKER_01: this current era of veterans.
16:54
SPEAKER_01: They need some different coordinators to go after and get them.
16:57
SPEAKER_01: So I've tried it through the agency.
16:59
SPEAKER_01: That didn't work.
17:00
SPEAKER_01: Tried it in ones and twos through the budget process.
17:02
SPEAKER_01: That didn't work.
17:03
SPEAKER_01: So this time I basically,
17:04
SPEAKER_01: with a stakeholder group,
17:06
SPEAKER_01: we named 12 positions we wanted to add,
17:09
SPEAKER_01: but we added them at 28,
17:11
SPEAKER_01: 30,
17:11
SPEAKER_01: and 32 so that we had time to basically get there.
17:15
SPEAKER_01: God bless the co-chairs.
17:16
SPEAKER_01: They're like, yeah, we're not going to put that into statute.
17:18
SPEAKER_01: But you got our attention.
17:19
SPEAKER_01: What are you trying to do?
17:20
SPEAKER_01: And I said, look, we need these positions.
17:23
SPEAKER_01: An agency is afraid to ask for them and to ask.
17:26
SPEAKER_01: And by the time you get through the process, it's never really added.
17:30
SPEAKER_01: We add a whole lot of people to DHS.
17:31
SPEAKER_01: We add a whole lot of people to other places.
17:33
SPEAKER_01: The veterans just never gets there.
17:35
SPEAKER_01: So by God, I'm going to put a fire on it, and I want the conversation.
17:39
SPEAKER_01: And to their credit,
17:40
SPEAKER_01: they're like,
17:41
SPEAKER_01: look,
17:41
SPEAKER_01: we're not going to fund it now,
17:42
SPEAKER_01: but we'll have the conversation,
17:44
SPEAKER_01: which is what I want.
17:45
The other things the bill does is it allows a little more
17:47
flexibility for the
17:49
SPEAKER_01: education grant fund.
17:50
SPEAKER_01: It goes from $5,000 to $10,000 because the cost of education has gone up.
17:54
SPEAKER_01: We create a new suicide prevention program,
17:56
SPEAKER_01: which is really going to be cool because it will actually be
17:59
SPEAKER_01: Programs that are out there and they're struggling and they basically,
18:02
SPEAKER_01: I look at it as a third of the funding type thing.
18:04
If they've got two-thirds but they need that last bill a bit to
18:07
make it work,
18:07
they can apply.
18:09
We're now protecting for the Vietnam-era guys who were told
18:12
when they were getting
18:13
SPEAKER_01: out,
18:14
SPEAKER_01: send your DD Form 214 to the county clerk.
18:17
SPEAKER_01: Well,
18:17
SPEAKER_01: what happened is because of new laws on public information,
18:21
some of these Vietnam vets are having their DD Form 214s caught
18:25
up in public
18:25
SPEAKER_01: information requests.
18:27
SPEAKER_01: So their social's out, their history's out.
18:30
SPEAKER_01: So we're trying to fix that.
18:31
SPEAKER_01: It's a lot of little things.
18:33
SPEAKER_01: But overall, it's the biggest vets package we've had since 2017.
18:36
SPEAKER_01: So I'm grateful that everybody came together.
18:39
SPEAKER_01: We had wonderful stakeholders.
18:41
SPEAKER_01: AOC is still a little nervous about one part of the section,
18:45
but I think at the end of the day they're going to be happy
18:48
because what we're
18:49
trying to do is every year some counties end up not spending
18:53
the money for veteran
18:54
SPEAKER_01: services through the VSO program.
18:58
And some counties are really doing a lot of work and they need
19:01
more money,
19:01
SPEAKER_01: but we don't have it to give.
19:03
SPEAKER_01: What this does is in the last quarter,
19:05
SPEAKER_01: so only the last quarter of the biennium,
19:09
SPEAKER_01: it says,
19:09
SPEAKER_01: all right,
19:09
SPEAKER_01: if monies aren't expended,
19:11
we're going to be able to reallocate them to the folks that
19:13
actually have a plan to
19:14
SPEAKER_01: use it to help more vets.
19:16
SPEAKER_01: So, again, I think it's a good bill.
19:19
SPEAKER_00: Does that make sense?
19:21
SPEAKER_02: So Oregon kind of sucks when it comes to veterans.
19:24
SPEAKER_02: We're number 45 out of vets.
19:26
SPEAKER_02: That's what Senator Manning said in Ways and Means today.
19:28
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we're pretty horrible in that.
19:30
And I just have to assume maybe it's more of a cultural thing
19:34
we don't have.
19:36
SPEAKER_02: A base, right?
19:37
SPEAKER_02: We don't have kind of like, so you don't really have a voting block.
19:40
You don't really have like somebody who represents a base or
19:43
has a portion of a base.
19:46
SPEAKER_02: I mean,
19:46
do you think that's kind of really more where that culture
19:48
comes from of why it's
19:49
SPEAKER_02: just so difficult to...
19:53
SPEAKER_01: I think so.
19:53
SPEAKER_01: I mean...
19:56
SPEAKER_01: I think that the points you illustrate are absolutely true.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: I also think there's a libertarian streak in Oregon that is there.
20:07
The reason we lost our base in Portland was because a governor
20:11
got into a contest
20:12
SPEAKER_01: with a president,
20:13
SPEAKER_01: both by the way of the same party,
20:14
SPEAKER_01: Republican to Republican.
20:16
SPEAKER_01: And one president,
20:19
SPEAKER_01: Nixon,
20:20
SPEAKER_01: told another governor,
20:21
SPEAKER_01: you either do this or else,
20:23
SPEAKER_01: and then the base went away.
20:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:26
SPEAKER_01: So it isn't a partisan thing.
20:30
SPEAKER_01: I think it is a cultural thing in that we just don't have the military,
20:33
SPEAKER_01: at least active duty,
20:34
SPEAKER_01: as a big part of our state.
20:35
SPEAKER_01: That said,
20:37
SPEAKER_01: proportionately,
20:37
we're actually one of the bigger guard states in terms of
20:40
number of guard per
20:40
SPEAKER_01: population.
20:41
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
20:42
SPEAKER_01: And our mission state,
20:43
because of Kay Falls with the training base and then the active
20:47
birds out of
20:47
SPEAKER_01: Portland,
20:49
SPEAKER_01: our reach and our importance in the National Guards,
20:51
SPEAKER_01: we punch above our weight.
20:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:54
SPEAKER_01: I think people want to support veterans, they just are unfamiliar.
20:58
SPEAKER_01: And so it's not a priority.
20:59
SPEAKER_02: Yeah,
20:59
SPEAKER_02: because I talk to some of them,
21:01
and of course they hate the fact that they have to pay income
21:04
taxes on their
21:05
SPEAKER_02: federal money.
21:06
SPEAKER_02: I mean, that's a big one that drops us down the list, right?
21:10
SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
21:12
And so then we're also not attracting those people to our state
21:15
because they're not
21:15
SPEAKER_02: going to go if they're going to pay 9% on their...
21:18
SPEAKER_01: And we're not helping them on property tax.
21:19
SPEAKER_01: No, we don't help them on anything, really.
21:21
SPEAKER_01: And on education...
21:23
SPEAKER_01: We haven't made some of the,
21:24
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
21:25
SPEAKER_01: because of the veterans lottery,
21:27
SPEAKER_01: we've put campus veteran service officer programs out there.
21:29
But some states really have put programs that recruit students
21:35
so that maybe they
21:36
SPEAKER_01: might stay afterwards.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: We've never been able to have the resources to do that.
21:41
SPEAKER_02: I think,
21:42
SPEAKER_02: like,
21:43
SPEAKER_02: if I were to put my tinfoil hat on,
21:45
SPEAKER_02: part of the desire is veterans,
21:48
SPEAKER_02: for the most part,
21:50
SPEAKER_02: tend to vote center-right.
21:52
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
21:53
SPEAKER_02: of the number,
21:54
and so I think states like Oregon don't actually want to cater
21:57
to those voters over
22:01
SPEAKER_02: time,
22:02
SPEAKER_02: right?
22:02
SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's not like, oh, they make this
22:04
SPEAKER_02: you know,
22:05
SPEAKER_02: very hard and fast rule,
22:06
SPEAKER_02: but I think there's something to like,
22:08
SPEAKER_02: well,
22:09
SPEAKER_02: they just say they put it off.
22:11
SPEAKER_02: We don't have a base.
22:11
SPEAKER_02: We don't really have that many people,
22:12
SPEAKER_02: but I think,
22:14
SPEAKER_02: you know,
22:14
SPEAKER_02: especially if you wanted to retire,
22:16
SPEAKER_02: I mean,
22:16
SPEAKER_02: our coastline is an incredible place to retire.
22:19
SPEAKER_02: You know,
22:20
SPEAKER_02: we should be going after those,
22:21
SPEAKER_02: those veterans and like the stuff you're doing,
22:23
SPEAKER_02: the services,
22:24
SPEAKER_02: um,
22:25
are incredible because that's an attractant as people,
22:27
especially the younger ones,
22:29
right?
22:29
SPEAKER_02: The education bonuses and stuff.
22:31
We kind of want those people who are the people that usually
22:34
don't mind taking
22:35
SPEAKER_02: risks,
22:36
SPEAKER_02: starting small businesses,
22:38
SPEAKER_02: doing all the things.
22:39
So I feel like we should attract those people to the state
22:41
because isn't that what
22:42
SPEAKER_02: we're supposed to be doing,
22:43
SPEAKER_02: some prosperity?
22:44
SPEAKER_01: I'm glad you actually said that because...
22:48
SPEAKER_01: The next plan in the book for veterans,
22:52
SPEAKER_01: I don't have one for Republicans or Democrats,
22:54
SPEAKER_01: but I have one for veterans,
22:56
SPEAKER_01: is we're going to try to put together a specific program,
22:59
SPEAKER_01: and Angstrom and I tried to do this a while back for concrete folks,
23:04
but targeted industries where vets may want to become not just
23:10
a worker or a
23:12
SPEAKER_01: contract worker,
23:13
but actually an owner of a company and try to find ways to
23:16
basically support both
23:19
The industry is to help hire more vets and then also to train
23:22
them to be small business owners.
23:25
SPEAKER_01: Because what Oregon can do,
23:28
SPEAKER_01: we don't have enough money to be able to replicate what the feds do,
23:31
SPEAKER_01: but we have the money to unlock federal money.
23:35
SPEAKER_01: And Congress has done a lot for vets, but it's hard for vets to find it.
23:39
So,
23:39
like for example,
23:40
there are specific loans specifically for veteran businesses.
23:45
SPEAKER_01: But going through the Byzantine effort to find them is a problem.
23:50
SPEAKER_01: So my hope is we can actually take program A,
23:55
SPEAKER_01: put money with a navigator,
23:57
SPEAKER_01: and say,
23:58
SPEAKER_01: all right,
23:58
SPEAKER_01: this year we're going to focus on truck drivers,
24:01
SPEAKER_01: for example.
24:02
Next year,
24:02
we're going to focus on something else,
24:04
but very clear,
24:06
very crisp.
24:07
And we can't do everything but focus on a sector or a
24:09
particular job and try to
24:11
SPEAKER_01: build the ecosystem of owners and operators.
24:14
SPEAKER_01: And I think that that can bring some stability.
24:20
SPEAKER_01: And if we're smart about it,
24:22
SPEAKER_01: a lot of vets,
24:22
SPEAKER_01: they want,
24:23
SPEAKER_01: especially after you've been overseas or been in for a bit,
24:27
Going back to being a clerk at Walmart just doesn't quite have
24:30
the same zing as
24:31
SPEAKER_01: leading the fire team through the bush.
24:34
SPEAKER_01: So you want a little bit more responsibility.
24:36
SPEAKER_01: You want a little bit more of that.
24:37
SPEAKER_01: So I think that that's our next step.
24:39
SPEAKER_02: I agree,
24:39
SPEAKER_02: because I think that's where,
24:40
SPEAKER_02: because vets have that mentality of wanting,
24:43
SPEAKER_02: they're kind of risk takers just in general.
24:46
SPEAKER_02: So that idea,
24:46
SPEAKER_02: you need to have a little bit of the risk taking to start a business,
24:49
SPEAKER_02: to go to a small town in Oregon and say,
24:52
SPEAKER_02: yeah,
24:52
I'm going to start a rock crushing pit and I'm going to throw
24:54
everything on the
24:55
SPEAKER_02: line and mortgage my house and see if I can make this thing do it.
24:58
SPEAKER_02: But they're going to put in 90 hours a week trying to make it happen.
25:01
SPEAKER_02: Right.
25:02
SPEAKER_02: And hire other people.
25:03
SPEAKER_02: And I just think that that's really,
25:06
SPEAKER_02: instead of maybe going after the targeted,
25:08
SPEAKER_02: we just want the income taxes taken away.
25:11
Maybe going after this idea,
25:12
how do we attract them to become economic surpluses to our
25:17
state?
25:17
SPEAKER_02: And I applaud that.
25:19
SPEAKER_02: That's a great idea.
25:20
SPEAKER_02: Well, I'll be talking to your wife about getting some help for that.
25:22
SPEAKER_02: She would.
25:23
SPEAKER_02: She's got a few.
25:24
SPEAKER_02: She's got a couple of allowed ones in our district.
25:26
SPEAKER_02: Mostly me.
25:27
SPEAKER_02: But especially on the right to start stuff,
25:30
because I really think our state needs to figure out a way to
25:34
help people,
25:35
SPEAKER_02: to your point,
25:37
SPEAKER_02: navigate how to just start a business.
25:39
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
25:39
SPEAKER_02: Like you said, they may be great at...
25:42
SPEAKER_02: you know,
25:43
SPEAKER_02: crushing rock,
25:44
SPEAKER_02: like we're talking about,
25:45
SPEAKER_02: just that industry,
25:45
SPEAKER_02: but they don't know accounting.
25:47
SPEAKER_02: Like, I've got to figure out that piece.
25:49
SPEAKER_02: I've got to figure out how to HR and payroll.
25:52
And it's getting a little better with stuff out there,
25:54
but it seems very daunting.
25:56
SPEAKER_01: It does.
25:56
SPEAKER_02: You know, and then the banking side of it.
25:58
SPEAKER_02: How do I get a loan and what sort of services are out there?
26:01
SPEAKER_01: That's where I actually believe the state of North Dakota,
26:04
SPEAKER_01: that great liberal bastion,
26:06
SPEAKER_01: gives us the best idea for a state bank.
26:10
SPEAKER_01: It's specifically for businesses.
26:14
SPEAKER_01: It's not a checking account.
26:16
SPEAKER_01: It's not a savings account,
26:17
but basically money that can be used to leverage and support
26:21
startups or businesses
26:23
SPEAKER_01: that are in niche industries that if we didn't have,
26:25
SPEAKER_01: we'd lose others.
26:27
SPEAKER_01: And again,
26:28
SPEAKER_01: if I trusted Business Oregon more,
26:30
SPEAKER_01: I'd suggest it there,
26:30
SPEAKER_01: but I don't,
26:31
SPEAKER_01: and they know it.
26:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
26:32
SPEAKER_01: So...
26:33
SPEAKER_02: Well, I think, who was it?
26:36
SPEAKER_02: Was it you who said it Ways and Means this morning?
26:38
SPEAKER_02: You know, rep Smith said they just kind of keep re-changing OBD.
26:43
SPEAKER_02: You know, it's just shuffling the decks on the Titanic, right?
26:46
SPEAKER_02: And it's really,
26:47
SPEAKER_02: because they're just giving so many different roles to do,
26:50
SPEAKER_02: except for help people just start businesses.
26:53
SPEAKER_02: Can you just do that?
26:54
SPEAKER_02: I've seen some proposals in Missouri.
26:56
SPEAKER_02: There was a really good one where the states set aside
26:59
a percentage of all of their contracts had to go to small
27:03
businesses that started
27:04
SPEAKER_02: in the last five years.
27:06
SPEAKER_02: I like that.
27:06
So it kind of required the state to kind of help people as
27:10
they're starting there.
27:12
SPEAKER_02: And they give preference points to vets.
27:14
SPEAKER_02: And they gave a couple preference points to those.
27:16
SPEAKER_02: And you can do that,
27:17
SPEAKER_02: I mean,
27:17
SPEAKER_02: without getting into the identity politics too much that we talked about,
27:20
SPEAKER_02: but you can do that a little bit by just saying,
27:23
SPEAKER_02: hey,
27:24
SPEAKER_02: let's just set aside,
27:25
SPEAKER_02: to your point,
27:25
SPEAKER_02: this pot of money or this pot of contracts,
27:29
To help people,
27:29
because that's the hardest thing is the getting off the ground.
27:32
I'll give you one more,
27:33
and I think your dad,
27:35
if he's listening,
27:36
might like this.
27:39
It's time to amend the law to allow Business Oregon to hire
27:43
people that can work on commission.
27:48
you want people to actually be effective in trade overseas,
27:52
you give them a piece of the pie.
27:55
SPEAKER_01: Instead of it being an X job with XY benefits and everything else,
28:01
you get them off their ass and into the fight by giving them an
28:05
extra 2% or 3% if
28:06
SPEAKER_01: they're able to land things because incentives in the market do work.
28:10
SPEAKER_01: Sales.
28:11
SPEAKER_01: It's sales.
28:11
SPEAKER_01: And the thing is, the public, in my opinion,
28:15
Things that are the public's business are generally the things
28:17
that the private
28:18
SPEAKER_01: sector couldn't do or shouldn't do.
28:21
SPEAKER_01: In areas where the state is trying to help business,
28:24
SPEAKER_01: instead of trying to make it more state and government,
28:26
SPEAKER_01: it should be more because that's the realm it's in.
28:29
SPEAKER_01: So what motivates private sector is incentives.
28:32
SPEAKER_01: Let's actually give them the ability to do that.
28:35
SPEAKER_01: Most other countries, most other states,
28:39
SPEAKER_01: do it that way.
28:40
SPEAKER_01: But for some reason, we haven't really picked that up yet.
28:44
SPEAKER_00: You mentioned the Titanic.
28:46
SPEAKER_00: And the Titanic was a pretty big disaster.
28:49
SPEAKER_00: And speaking of disasters, we've got to prepare for them.
28:51
SPEAKER_00: Yes, we do.
28:52
SPEAKER_00: And that's what Spartacus does, I think.
28:54
SPEAKER_00: Spartacus.
28:56
SPEAKER_00: So tell me about Spartacus.
28:58
SPEAKER_00: Is it an acronym?
28:59
SPEAKER_00: Does it have a meaning?
29:01
SPEAKER_00: Do you need to pull up the acronym?
29:03
SPEAKER_00: It's long.
29:04
SPEAKER_00: It is long.
29:05
SPEAKER_02: He's got to get his glasses out to full of the acronym.
29:08
SPEAKER_00: So the whole idea is there's some sort of,
29:12
SPEAKER_00: the main one being the Cascadia earthquake event,
29:15
SPEAKER_00: the 100,
29:16
SPEAKER_00: is it the 100-year earthquake event that people are anticipating?
29:18
SPEAKER_00: 300 years.
29:19
The 300-year event,
29:20
and people are anticipating is going to hit at some point.
29:23
SPEAKER_00: We have to be ready for it, right?
29:24
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
29:25
SPEAKER_00: And I would say among things that get deprioritized in the building,
29:29
SPEAKER_00: we've already talked about veterans.
29:31
SPEAKER_00: Right.
29:31
We could go to higher education and then we could talk about
29:34
emergency preparedness.
29:35
Those are the things that just like if you're on the list,
29:37
like,
29:37
man,
29:38
you are at the bottom.
29:39
SPEAKER_00: Just so happens the three things I care most about.
29:41
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
29:43
SPEAKER_01: Good job picking topics.
29:43
SPEAKER_00: That's why you've had to be here longer.
29:45
SPEAKER_00: It just takes longer to get it done.
29:46
SPEAKER_00: So tell us about Spartacus.
29:47
SPEAKER_01: All right.
29:48
SPEAKER_01: So the acronym.
29:49
SPEAKER_01: You ready?
29:51
SPEAKER_01: The Oregon Statewide Preparedness Authority for Response Training in
29:55
SPEAKER_01: Intergovernmental Continuity of Imperative Services.
29:59
SPEAKER_00: Spartacus.
30:01
SPEAKER_00: And it's an I-S at the end, not U-S.
30:02
SPEAKER_00: I had it spelled wrong.
30:03
SPEAKER_00: Thank God you have an acronym.
30:04
SPEAKER_00: Spartacus.
30:07
So the reason we called it Spartacus is because for three years
30:10
I was trying to
30:11
SPEAKER_01: push the same thing and no one heard about it,
30:13
SPEAKER_01: no one remembered.
30:13
SPEAKER_01: Now they damn well remember it.
30:15
SPEAKER_00: It's an acronym.
30:16
SPEAKER_00: I like it.
30:16
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
30:17
SPEAKER_00: I remember hearing about it last session.
30:18
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
30:19
SPEAKER_00: So what are you trying to accomplish through it?
30:21
SPEAKER_00: What would be some of the high priority things?
30:23
SPEAKER_00: Like you said, big omnibuses, right?
30:25
SPEAKER_00: Right.
30:25
They start out as big and expensive as you can make them and
30:28
you pare them down to
30:29
SPEAKER_00: get through the process.
30:30
What's kind of,
30:32
where did you start or even just like what's the top couple of
30:35
things you need?
30:35
SPEAKER_00: Right.
30:36
SPEAKER_01: So the Spartacus Bill this year is really two parts.
30:41
SPEAKER_01: Part A we've cut out, but I'll get to that in a minute.
30:46
Part B is a series of policies we need in place because of the
30:52
dynamic nature of FEMA right now.
30:54
SPEAKER_01: FEMA is undergoing a reform.
30:56
SPEAKER_01: They've gotten rid of a lot of the lawyers.
30:58
SPEAKER_01: They can't give the money out like they used to.
31:01
SPEAKER_01: So what I suspect will happen is,
31:04
SPEAKER_01: as they're trying to figure out how to make the Stafford Act different,
31:07
SPEAKER_01: there'll be a disaster.
31:08
SPEAKER_01: Congress will want to do something.
31:10
SPEAKER_01: FEMA won't be able to because of authorities,
31:12
and they're going to go back to the days of just sending a
31:14
block grant to the
31:15
SPEAKER_01: state.
31:16
SPEAKER_01: But a block grant can't be distributed per block.
31:19
SPEAKER_01: There has to be a process.
31:21
So what the rest of the bill does is it stands up a mirror of
31:25
existing policies for
31:26
SPEAKER_01: public assistance,
31:27
SPEAKER_01: which goes to local governments,
31:29
SPEAKER_01: et cetera,
31:29
SPEAKER_01: for reimbursements,
31:30
SPEAKER_01: individual assistance.
31:32
It sets up within legal authority,
31:34
something called the Disaster Recovery Authority.
31:37
SPEAKER_01: So as soon as the response is over and we're pivoting to recovery,
31:41
SPEAKER_01: communities can learn to expect who they're supposed to contact,
31:45
SPEAKER_01: what they can ask for,
31:46
SPEAKER_01: for that immediate help.
31:47
SPEAKER_03: Mm-hmm.
31:48
SPEAKER_01: and it does a couple other things,
31:49
SPEAKER_01: gives county commissioners a little more authority during food disasters,
31:53
SPEAKER_01: and a couple other things.
31:55
SPEAKER_01: The first part,
31:57
SPEAKER_01: the Spartacus part,
31:58
SPEAKER_01: quite frankly,
32:00
is trying to keep faith with the promise that was made to the
32:02
state of Oregon in
32:04
SPEAKER_01: 2001.
32:05
SPEAKER_01: When I was mayor of Monmouth back in 2000,
32:09
SPEAKER_01: The Oregon government,
32:12
SPEAKER_01: for a lot of reasons,
32:13
SPEAKER_01: none of them really responsible,
32:15
decided to move the Public Safety Academy from Monmouth to
32:19
where it is in Salem.
32:21
SPEAKER_01: And the promise was,
32:22
SPEAKER_01: we're going to build this facility that is state-of-the-art,
32:25
SPEAKER_01: but we don't want everybody to have to come to Salem.
32:28
We're going to build it,
32:29
and we're going to build five satellite campuses.
32:32
Well,
32:34
as they built the fortress,
32:37
they kind of forgot about the other five.
32:39
SPEAKER_03: What?
32:39
SPEAKER_01: So what they did was,
32:41
SPEAKER_01: instead of that,
32:42
they bought a pickup truck and a trailer and a series of
32:47
equipment that they drive
32:49
SPEAKER_01: around the state as part of their distributed learning.
32:52
SPEAKER_01: Now, the learning is good.
32:54
SPEAKER_01: The props they try to do something with.
32:57
SPEAKER_01: But we are in a place now where...
33:01
We have about 5,000 firefighters in the state of Oregon that
33:04
are volunteer.
33:06
SPEAKER_01: We have at least that many that are involved in the EMS system.
33:09
SPEAKER_01: Most of them in the rural areas volunteer.
33:12
In large-scale disasters,
33:13
you have what I call first and second responders.
33:17
The first responders are the ones that you think of,
33:19
cops,
33:19
firefighters,
33:20
EMS,
33:20
etc.
33:21
SPEAKER_01: Second responders are the community emergency response teams,
33:25
SPEAKER_01: the CERT,
33:25
SPEAKER_01: the amateur radio guys and gals,
33:27
SPEAKER_01: the Red Cross,
33:28
SPEAKER_01: those folks.
33:30
SPEAKER_01: We need places that are standardized for the kind of...
33:36
SPEAKER_01: interdisciplinary training necessary for people to keep their skills up.
33:40
SPEAKER_01: And right now, two things are happening in rural Oregon.
33:44
Volunteers are having to respond more often to bigger fires for
33:48
a longer amount of
33:48
SPEAKER_01: time,
33:49
SPEAKER_01: longer amount of time,
33:50
SPEAKER_01: and the full-time departments that they augment as volunteers,
33:54
SPEAKER_01: they're strapped.
33:55
So the days of the fire guys and gals on shift being able to
34:00
train the volunteers
34:01
SPEAKER_01: because they got some extra time,
34:02
SPEAKER_01: they don't got the extra time anymore,
34:03
SPEAKER_01: so the volunteers aren't getting the training.
34:05
SPEAKER_00: And the volunteerism is going down.
34:07
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
34:07
SPEAKER_00: I've talked to local fire districts,
34:08
and they've said part of their funding problem is that they
34:11
don't have volunteer
34:11
SPEAKER_00: firefighters.
34:12
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
34:12
SPEAKER_00: And that hurts rural and small districts the most,
34:15
SPEAKER_00: but it'll hurt in urban districts eventually or is already.
34:18
SPEAKER_01: It will.
34:19
SPEAKER_01: And when I was Wildfire Recovery Chair,
34:22
SPEAKER_01: we did a survey of 800 firefighters,
34:25
SPEAKER_01: all volunteers,
34:26
because at the time there was a conversation coming out of
34:29
Senator Finley's office
34:30
SPEAKER_01: of like,
34:30
SPEAKER_01: hey,
34:30
SPEAKER_01: let's have a new classification for no-entry firefighters.
34:35
SPEAKER_01: meaning that they respond to fires,
34:37
SPEAKER_01: but they just don't go in,
34:38
SPEAKER_01: they're kind of backup and auxiliary.
34:40
SPEAKER_01: The problem with that is,
34:41
SPEAKER_01: number one,
34:41
SPEAKER_01: insurance companies only recognize firefighter one training,
34:44
SPEAKER_01: so it wouldn't count.
34:46
SPEAKER_01: And the second is, just as...
34:48
truth in advertising anybody who's crazy enough and I used to
34:52
be a volunteer
34:52
firefighter for seven years crazy enough to want to run in a
34:55
fire isn't going to
34:56
care about certification if they hear a baby crying or a woman
34:58
in distress they're
34:59
going to go through the door so that was a non-starter as far
35:03
as a lower credit so
35:04
the answer was what the volunteers told us is they don't want
35:07
lower standards they
35:07
SPEAKER_01: just want more opportunities to train so the vision is
35:12
SPEAKER_01: We build Spartacus.
35:14
SPEAKER_01: What that means is $60 million in the first trunch.
35:18
SPEAKER_01: First trunch, $40 million going over to DPSST.
35:23
We're going to build a 911 training center there as well as a
35:25
911 operation center
35:27
in addition to $20 million in upgrades they need for their
35:30
police and other things.
35:32
SPEAKER_01: $20 million for Core 3 to support that.
35:35
SPEAKER_01: That's the first phase.
35:37
SPEAKER_01: And the deal has been nothing for Salem that doesn't.
35:40
SPEAKER_01: Bend also get, and Bend is making sure it's Salem.
35:42
SPEAKER_01: So it's an agreement.
35:44
Second and third phase written into the statute is we don't
35:47
know where they need to go.
35:49
SPEAKER_01: We have ideas,
35:50
SPEAKER_01: and we divide it into geographic areas,
35:52
but what we need is a request for proposal because whoever
35:56
wants these things,
35:57
SPEAKER_01: it isn't just building it,
35:58
SPEAKER_01: it's who's going to actually be using it,
36:00
SPEAKER_01: and maybe they have some ideas over governance.
36:03
SPEAKER_01: So the goal is...
36:05
SPEAKER_01: The first tranche is 60 million.
36:08
SPEAKER_01: The second tranche would be 40 million.
36:11
SPEAKER_01: And then a third tranche would be 40 million.
36:13
And the two that apply in tranche two and the two that get it
36:17
in tranche three,
36:18
SPEAKER_01: all of those would be in rural areas around the state.
36:21
But they get to basically put in the best package for what they
36:24
would use it,
36:25
SPEAKER_01: who the partners would be,
36:26
SPEAKER_01: how it would run.
36:27
SPEAKER_01: And the bottom line is, by the time we build these out,
36:31
SPEAKER_01: My goal is by that time to have funding through DPSST to say, look,
36:36
If it's in a particular place where they just don't have the
36:39
ability to run it,
36:40
SPEAKER_01: like Core 3 plans on running it.
36:42
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
36:43
But if it's maybe in Rogue Siskiyou,
36:44
they've got a plan to maybe half fund it.
36:48
SPEAKER_01: Well, maybe DPSST can forward deploy people.
36:50
And the goal would be for the volunteers that are out there on
36:54
any given weekend or
36:55
SPEAKER_01: any given week of the month,
36:57
you'd have options to go get your training boxes squared so you
37:01
don't have to worry
37:01
SPEAKER_01: about
37:03
If you missed a Wednesday night or a Thursday night or that
37:05
type of stuff.
37:06
SPEAKER_01: It's aligned with what the strategy has been forever.
37:08
SPEAKER_01: It's just people have forgot it.
37:10
SPEAKER_01: And I'm old and I'm cranky and I've only got so many years left.
37:13
So I'm getting louder and louder about making sure we keep our
37:15
promises to rural Oregon.
37:19
SPEAKER_02: It's almost like Rule 27 training.
37:21
I really feel like they should create more opportunity to make
37:25
sure that I get my
37:26
SPEAKER_02: Rule 27 training.
37:27
SPEAKER_02: I don't know that that would help, honestly.
37:29
SPEAKER_02: I want a regional training.
37:30
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
37:31
SPEAKER_02: I'm not sure that's going to be a priority of those facilities.
37:35
SPEAKER_02: Sorry, I make a joke.
37:36
I think you're spot on with the...
37:38
We're obviously familiar with the Core 3 stuff.
37:40
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I think having...
37:42
SPEAKER_02: regional facilities, regional training facilities.
37:46
SPEAKER_02: It's kind of important.
37:46
SPEAKER_02: Everybody benefits.
37:48
All of your EMS people benefit because you now have this
37:51
facility that you can use to train.
37:52
And the vision is that it would be a training facility with
37:55
also lodging so that
37:57
SPEAKER_01: during a major event we'd have a safe place to evacuate people.
38:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
38:01
SPEAKER_02: I mean, the reality is the shit will hit the fan.
38:04
SPEAKER_02: We just don't know...
38:06
SPEAKER_02: Where the wind's blowing and when the fan's going to turn on.
38:10
SPEAKER_01: We're 325 years past.
38:11
SPEAKER_01: 300.
38:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
38:12
SPEAKER_01: So any minute, basically.
38:15
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
38:16
SPEAKER_00: Hopefully not in session.
38:18
SPEAKER_00: The last thing,
38:19
SPEAKER_00: we were talking about this,
38:20
SPEAKER_00: something that can move at any minute,
38:22
SPEAKER_00: like an earthquake,
38:23
SPEAKER_00: would be bill limits.
38:24
SPEAKER_00: House bill, oh, so wait, before we move on.
38:26
SPEAKER_00: What's the bill number on Spartacus so people can check out that?
38:29
SPEAKER_01: 4121.
38:30
SPEAKER_00: 4121.
38:30
SPEAKER_00: Where is it right now?
38:32
SPEAKER_01: It is in ways and means.
38:34
SPEAKER_01: And I've been begging them to try to move the non-cost portion now.
38:39
Because if FEMA can't help people,
38:45
we don't have the authority to help people.
38:47
SPEAKER_01: And an emergency board can send money, but they can't legislate.
38:51
SPEAKER_00: So you need the policy.
38:52
SPEAKER_00: I need the policy.
38:54
SPEAKER_02: Co-chair Sanchez.
38:55
SPEAKER_00: There we go.
38:56
SPEAKER_00: I'm sure she's listening.
38:57
SPEAKER_00: She's got abundant free time.
39:00
SPEAKER_00: So 4,002 is the bill limits,
39:01
SPEAKER_00: and the conversation has really picked up at the end of last session.
39:07
SPEAKER_00: And I think kind of maybe two of the unfortunate,
39:12
SPEAKER_00: maybe,
39:13
SPEAKER_00: you become the poster child of it,
39:14
SPEAKER_00: along with Senator David Brock-Smith.
39:16
SPEAKER_00: So talk to me about,
39:18
SPEAKER_00: first of all,
39:19
SPEAKER_00: I think,
39:20
are people misrepresenting the bill limits thing or are they
39:24
misrepresenting how
39:25
SPEAKER_00: you're using your bills,
39:27
SPEAKER_00: do you feel?
39:27
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
39:28
SPEAKER_00: Okay, so talk to me about that part first.
39:31
SPEAKER_01: So I can't speak for Brother DBS.
39:33
SPEAKER_01: Brother.
39:35
Although if I was in the minority,
39:38
I would probably be doing the same thing as him.
39:40
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
39:41
Which is an important point because I don't think a majority
39:44
party should ever put
39:45
SPEAKER_01: something into effect that permanently disadvantages the minority party.
39:49
SPEAKER_01: I don't think it's right.
39:50
So people have made quite a story about the fact that last
40:00
session I introduced
40:01
SPEAKER_01: somewhere around 317 bills.
40:01
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
40:04
SPEAKER_01: Here's the fact that is sometimes lost.
40:07
SPEAKER_01: Number one, 70 of those bills were at the request of lobbyists.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: They weren't my ideas.
40:13
SPEAKER_01: Right.
40:14
They were things that advocacy groups needed a bill to be able
40:18
to do things.
40:19
SPEAKER_01: Number two,
40:21
SPEAKER_01: the state of Oregon is,
40:23
SPEAKER_01: in the House and the Senate,
40:25
SPEAKER_01: two chambers out of six in the country.
40:29
SPEAKER_01: Two of six...
40:31
Out of 99 chambers,
40:33
because one's unicameral,
40:34
that does not allow amendments on the floor.
40:38
SPEAKER_01: Why that's important is the following.
40:41
SPEAKER_01: I have a lot of, I've spent my entire life studying government.
40:44
SPEAKER_01: I have three to four policy areas I'm passionate about.
40:47
And in a district that's also a swing district,
40:51
there's lots of different ideas.
40:52
SPEAKER_01: There's not one prevailing culture.
40:55
So I have standing offers that if a citizen wants to bring
40:57
something forward and
40:58
SPEAKER_01: they want to work the bill,
40:59
SPEAKER_01: I'll introduce it.
41:00
SPEAKER_01: I don't have to agree with it.
41:02
SPEAKER_01: My job is to be their voice.
41:03
SPEAKER_01: I will help them as much as I can.
41:05
SPEAKER_01: If I agree with it, I'll probably help them more.
41:07
SPEAKER_01: But either way, I'm not going to be the block.
41:08
SPEAKER_00: Which I think most legislators wouldn't do.
41:11
SPEAKER_00: Right.
41:11
SPEAKER_00: That's not a common policy.
41:13
SPEAKER_00: Right.
41:14
SPEAKER_01: Not common.
41:15
SPEAKER_01: Second thing is, I will offer sometimes a bill
41:19
SPEAKER_01: Try to think 2,
41:22
SPEAKER_01: 4,
41:33
SPEAKER_01: 6,
41:34
SPEAKER_01: 8,
41:34
10 years out,
41:23
and sometimes I'll offer bills on ideas that I have maybe a 70%
41:28
idea of it,
41:28
but I want to throw it out there to see who sticks their head
41:31
up and they're
41:31
SPEAKER_01: interested,
41:32
SPEAKER_01: so we start working things.
41:33
Because in this building,
41:34
unless it's written down,
41:35
no one really thinks it's real.
41:37
SPEAKER_01: The other thing is,
41:38
SPEAKER_01: in some committees,
41:40
SPEAKER_01: if you don't have a bill,
41:41
SPEAKER_01: you're not invited to the discussion.
41:44
So I want a bill so I get invited to the damn discussion
41:48
because some of these
41:48
SPEAKER_01: things,
41:49
I've watched them go round and round and round for years and
41:51
common sense just
41:52
SPEAKER_01: keeps eluding them.
41:54
SPEAKER_01: And in some other cases,
41:55
SPEAKER_01: LC,
41:57
SPEAKER_01: Legislative Council,
41:59
is a little bit detailed about how they write their measures so
42:03
I sometimes will
42:04
have something written in two or three different ways so we can
42:08
angle around to
42:09
SPEAKER_01: make sure that what people are thinking is actually reflected.
42:11
SPEAKER_01: So
42:13
SPEAKER_01: I look at legislation as the tools of our craft.
42:18
The reason I introduced surrender 17 was because of COVID and
42:22
the construction process.
42:24
SPEAKER_01: A number of the bills that I had introduced over the years,
42:27
SPEAKER_01: people weren't actually able to participate in.
42:30
SPEAKER_01: So I said to myself, hey, we're opening up pretty soon.
42:33
SPEAKER_01: And it was a little more open last session.
42:36
I brought all the bills that I thought were either somebody had
42:40
asked me to
42:40
SPEAKER_01: introduce or I thought were worthy of a conversation forward.
42:44
I put study bills out so that I had vehicles that I could play
42:48
in those particular
42:49
SPEAKER_01: committees on issues just in case.
42:52
SPEAKER_01: And I'm not planning on introducing 300 bills again,
42:55
SPEAKER_01: but I felt that at least they should have been given an opportunity.
42:59
SPEAKER_01: Those that didn't get picked up, I'm probably not gonna really move on.
43:03
But to me,
43:05
the reason I am here as a legislator is my job is to give voice
43:10
to 78,000 people.
43:11
SPEAKER_01: The only way I know how to do that is through the tools of our craft.
43:15
SPEAKER_01: Now, here's the thing.
43:17
SPEAKER_01: I'm not opposed to bill limits if
43:21
SPEAKER_01: we have amendment on the floor potential.
43:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because otherwise you have to track every committee.
43:26
Every committee,
43:27
and you have to have a vehicle in every committee to make it
43:29
work.
43:30
SPEAKER_01: If,
43:30
SPEAKER_01: and again,
43:30
SPEAKER_01: I've offered rule changes,
43:32
SPEAKER_01: so I think people in this building know I'm loud and sometimes grumpy,
43:37
SPEAKER_01: but I'm pretty consistent.
43:39
I introduced a House rule proposal that would allow for
43:42
amendments on the floor.
43:44
SPEAKER_01: I've introduced one that would,
43:47
SPEAKER_01: in fact,
43:47
SPEAKER_01: an amendment to 4002 that would say,
43:49
SPEAKER_01: all right,
43:49
SPEAKER_01: if you want bill limits,
43:51
SPEAKER_01: Legislators only.
43:53
SPEAKER_01: Governor doesn't get any.
43:54
SPEAKER_01: Which I agree with.
43:55
SPEAKER_00: I'm going to be honest.
43:55
SPEAKER_00: I think, like you said, this is a legislative process.
43:58
SPEAKER_00: We have 90 legislators.
44:00
If you can't convince one of them that your idea is good
44:02
enough,
44:03
it sucks.
44:03
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
44:04
SPEAKER_01: No question.
44:05
SPEAKER_01: No question.
44:07
SPEAKER_01: And you want to cut 1,000 bills out of the process?
44:10
SPEAKER_01: No agency bills, no judicial.
44:12
SPEAKER_01: 100%.
44:13
SPEAKER_00: Or agencies need to go through the committee bill process.
44:16
SPEAKER_00: There you go.
44:16
SPEAKER_00: And one of the things I noticed that I don't necessarily agree with,
44:19
SPEAKER_00: the speaker has in her presentation on bill limits,
44:22
SPEAKER_00: I pulled it up on OLS,
44:23
you can introduce extra committee bills if the chair and a
44:27
member of the minority
44:28
SPEAKER_00: party agree.
44:29
SPEAKER_00: And I said, wait, that doesn't say vice chair.
44:31
SPEAKER_00: Hold on a second.
44:32
SPEAKER_00: No.
44:32
maybe the vice chair doesn't want to but one of their members
44:35
wants to go rogue and
44:36
so now they can go rogue and introduce a bill and i was like oh
44:38
that's sneaky but
44:39
yeah i think and so so what if you could set the limit do you
44:43
have a rough idea of
44:44
where you think the limit is flexible enough is it a hundred or
44:47
is it so my
44:49
granddaddy who had an eighth grade education taught me never to
44:52
negotiate against
44:53
SPEAKER_01: myself there you go
44:54
SPEAKER_01: Very good.
44:55
SPEAKER_00: Eighth grade, that's the reading flesh test.
44:58
SPEAKER_02: I think that if you cut out some of those other things,
45:01
you would probably get rid of probably half of those agency
45:05
bills and governor
45:06
SPEAKER_02: bills,
45:06
SPEAKER_02: and then you would have...
45:08
SPEAKER_02: And then other people,
45:09
SPEAKER_02: I think other representatives,
45:10
SPEAKER_02: if they took a governor's bill and they wanted to go work it,
45:13
SPEAKER_02: they're going to drop three or four other bills,
45:16
SPEAKER_02: pet projects or something,
45:17
SPEAKER_02: because...
45:18
SPEAKER_02: They're going to go work a governor's bill.
45:19
SPEAKER_02: So I think the process would work itself out.
45:22
I think the bills would come down because you would give
45:25
legislators something to
45:26
SPEAKER_02: do,
45:27
SPEAKER_02: which is to go pass an agency bill or go pass the governor's bill.
45:31
SPEAKER_02: Because that's part of the problem is you've got to have...
45:35
SPEAKER_02: something to do in this building as a legislator.
45:38
SPEAKER_02: You've been here a long time,
45:39
SPEAKER_02: so you know how to pass a bill,
45:40
SPEAKER_02: so you know the techniques that it takes to do that.
45:44
SPEAKER_02: A lot of the new people are learning those things.
45:47
SPEAKER_02: You're really talking more fix the process,
45:49
SPEAKER_02: not just take the low-hanging fruit by just putting bill limits.
45:53
SPEAKER_01: Here's another thing.
45:55
SPEAKER_01: We don't need bill limits if committee chairs actually say no.
45:59
SPEAKER_01: Of the 317 bills,
46:00
SPEAKER_01: I want to be very clear,
46:02
I was very specific and even sent an email to all of the
46:05
committee chairs because I
46:06
SPEAKER_01: said,
46:06
SPEAKER_01: look,
46:06
SPEAKER_01: I'm introducing this many,
46:07
SPEAKER_01: here's why.
46:09
SPEAKER_01: I'm not asking for a hearing unless I'm asking for a hearing.
46:13
SPEAKER_01: Just because it's in your committee doesn't mean,
46:15
SPEAKER_01: like some of this stuff,
46:16
SPEAKER_01: if an individual from my district wants to work it,
46:19
SPEAKER_01: they can ask.
46:20
SPEAKER_01: Some of this other stuff, it's there in case a conversation is possible.
46:24
SPEAKER_01: If it's not, I'm not going to move it.
46:27
SPEAKER_01: But I talked to a committee chair,
46:29
SPEAKER_01: a dear friend of mine,
46:30
SPEAKER_01: and I'm like,
46:30
SPEAKER_01: he's on the edge about this bill.
46:32
SPEAKER_01: And he's like,
46:33
SPEAKER_01: you know,
46:34
SPEAKER_01: yeah,
46:34
SPEAKER_01: I just,
46:35
SPEAKER_01: and I said,
46:35
SPEAKER_01: well,
46:36
SPEAKER_01: all right,
46:37
SPEAKER_01: how many times did you say no to people?
46:39
SPEAKER_01: He's like, well, I never say no to having hearings.
46:42
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, well, maybe that's why you had to go to two minutes up.
46:46
SPEAKER_01: Pick and choose which you're going to actually hear.
46:48
SPEAKER_01: He's like, what do you mean?
46:49
SPEAKER_01: I said, I only ask for a hearing.
46:51
SPEAKER_01: for things I want a hearing on.
46:54
SPEAKER_01: I never expect a hearing on things I haven't asked for.
46:56
SPEAKER_01: There's a process in this building, but it goes back to what you said.
46:59
SPEAKER_01: A lot of folks are still learning that they don't want to be the bad guy.
47:02
SPEAKER_01: Well, I can't fix that.
47:04
What I can fix is if there's a problem and we need process and
47:08
you want to reduce
47:08
SPEAKER_01: the number of bills,
47:09
SPEAKER_01: fine.
47:10
SPEAKER_01: We are the legislative branch.
47:11
SPEAKER_01: We're supposed to be lawmakers.
47:13
SPEAKER_01: Let's start there.
47:15
SPEAKER_00: And you do,
47:15
SPEAKER_00: as a chair,
47:16
SPEAKER_00: I think,
47:17
SPEAKER_00: especially a lot of the newer chairs,
47:18
SPEAKER_00: they don't realize they have limited time.
47:20
SPEAKER_00: They just kind of think of it as infinite, and they'll jam new stuff in.
47:23
But if you're going to properly work a bill,
47:25
you're going to do your public hearings.
47:27
SPEAKER_00: I appreciate Chair Marshall a lot in housing during long session.
47:30
SPEAKER_00: If there were substantive amendments,
47:32
we were back for another public hearing on the substantive
47:34
amendments first.
47:35
SPEAKER_00: As it should be.
47:36
And then we would wait another meeting before we would even
47:39
consider working the bill.
47:40
SPEAKER_00: And I think that's like the ideal process.
47:42
SPEAKER_00: And so if you do that, you realize you have X number of minutes.
47:46
SPEAKER_00: You've got an hour and a half twice a week.
47:50
And you've got that for a certain number of weeks until your
47:52
first chamber.
47:53
SPEAKER_00: And then you lose a ton of stuff.
47:55
SPEAKER_00: And then you work your second chamber stuff.
47:57
And so you kind of actually got to do some math and figure out,
48:01
well,
48:01
how much actual time?
48:02
SPEAKER_00: bills could I work if you did three public hearings,
48:05
SPEAKER_00: maybe,
48:05
SPEAKER_00: and then maybe you end up having extra time and you can adjust it.
48:08
SPEAKER_00: But ultimately, that's your limit.
48:10
SPEAKER_00: Your limit is your committee time, I suppose.
48:12
SPEAKER_00: And so that would probably be the counter-argument to limits on bills.
48:17
It's a lot harder on the House because you've got twice as many
48:21
members than you
48:22
SPEAKER_02: have on the Senate.
48:23
SPEAKER_02: So on the Senate side, our chair and vice chair, I think that's also...
48:28
SPEAKER_02: They should be working together more and they should be saying,
48:32
SPEAKER_02: no,
48:33
SPEAKER_02: does your,
48:33
SPEAKER_02: does your Republicans need that vice chair?
48:37
SPEAKER_02: Do they need a hearing?
48:38
SPEAKER_02: What do they need on this bill?
48:39
So that way it's not the Democrat telling the Republican,
48:42
we're not going to hear you bill.
48:43
SPEAKER_02: It's like,
48:44
SPEAKER_02: it's the vice chair going to their colleague and saying,
48:47
SPEAKER_02: Hey,
48:48
SPEAKER_02: are you really looking for a hearing on this?
48:49
SPEAKER_02: Or what's the right?
48:51
SPEAKER_01: Go back to leadership and communication.
48:52
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, we were not really training our chairs in my opinion.
48:57
SPEAKER_01: We're not really training our chairs to do the facilitator role,
49:01
SPEAKER_01: where not just you tell your folks in the committee,
49:04
SPEAKER_01: this is what we're doing,
49:07
SPEAKER_01: but you ask.
49:08
SPEAKER_01: When I was chair,
49:10
SPEAKER_01: again,
49:10
SPEAKER_01: of a committee that never had a majority,
49:12
SPEAKER_01: I would meet with my two vice chairs and I'd say,
49:14
SPEAKER_01: look,
49:15
SPEAKER_01: give me a scale,
49:16
SPEAKER_01: the stuff we want to talk about,
49:18
SPEAKER_01: the stuff we don't want to talk about,
49:20
SPEAKER_01: and then and only then will we do the courtesy hearings.
49:24
SPEAKER_01: What's important for you guys?
49:25
SPEAKER_01: What's important for you guys?
49:26
SPEAKER_01: What's important for your people?
49:28
SPEAKER_01: What about your district?
49:30
SPEAKER_01: And then you come together as a team.
49:33
SPEAKER_01: And I don't understand why some committees don't do that.
49:38
SPEAKER_01: And I know some committees are huge in their jurisdiction.
49:41
And yet,
49:42
you really kind of know which bills are probably going to move
49:45
and not move.
49:46
SPEAKER_01: So I don't think bill limits is the all...
49:51
SPEAKER_01: knowing answer,
49:53
SPEAKER_01: and in our system where we don't have floor amendments,
49:56
SPEAKER_01: where a speaker picks the committee chair,
49:59
SPEAKER_01: the committee membership,
50:01
SPEAKER_01: and now would potentially limit the number of bills,
50:05
SPEAKER_01: I don't think that gives the minority the ability to express their voice,
50:08
and I don't think it allows legislators to do our due diligence
50:11
as lawmakers.
50:13
SPEAKER_02: Well,
50:13
SPEAKER_02: and even if you're not in leadership,
50:16
SPEAKER_02: but you're in the majority party,
50:17
SPEAKER_02: you're still kind of in the minority.
50:20
SPEAKER_02: So unless you're a committee,
50:21
SPEAKER_02: because if you're just on a committee,
50:22
SPEAKER_02: you're just a member on that committee.
50:24
And it's probably just as hard as you to work a bill as it is
50:28
to be somebody in the
50:29
SPEAKER_02: minority party in that committee.
50:30
SPEAKER_02: So it's not easy to pass a bill already.
50:34
And I think you're right with I liked how you laid out how you
50:37
do your 300 bills
50:38
SPEAKER_02: because it makes sense.
50:40
SPEAKER_02: Because a lot of times if you're working out a bill,
50:42
SPEAKER_02: you'll say,
50:42
SPEAKER_02: no,
50:42
SPEAKER_02: I don't need it before the first chamber deadline.
50:45
SPEAKER_02: I do want a hearing in April after the first.
50:48
SPEAKER_02: Give me a courtesy hearing when you have a lull.
50:50
SPEAKER_02: Right.
50:50
SPEAKER_02: Because I kind of want to work this process out.
50:52
SPEAKER_02: And like you said, hit the bushes and see who kind of flushes out.
50:56
SPEAKER_02: Right.
50:57
You know,
50:57
because that's how you can find like we did the prevailing wage
51:02
on affordable housing.
51:03
SPEAKER_02: in the Senate,
51:04
SPEAKER_02: and we kind of flushed it out earlier,
51:06
SPEAKER_02: but we really wanted to flush it out in the short session,
51:09
SPEAKER_02: and we found partners where we didn't think we had partners.
51:12
It didn't pass because we know the unions are going to beat up
51:16
against it,
51:16
SPEAKER_02: but I think we found a spot.
51:20
where we can go we found also where the really hinge points are
51:23
the pinch points
51:24
and so now that's helpful yeah so now we want to go back and
51:27
say okay we know you
51:29
guys really hate that right and then why and then but that's
51:32
just process so we got
51:34
to introduce now probably because it was one bill we go after
51:37
the whole enchilada
51:39
now we're probably going to introduce four bills right because
51:41
i'm going to put
51:42
SPEAKER_02: them in parts
51:43
SPEAKER_02: That's right.
51:43
SPEAKER_02: Right.
51:43
And you're going to work the long session to try to figure out
51:46
what which bill can
51:47
SPEAKER_02: get some legs.
51:48
SPEAKER_02: Maybe this one can't because of whatever.
51:50
SPEAKER_02: Right.
51:51
SPEAKER_02: And this one does.
51:51
SPEAKER_02: So I get your point,
51:52
SPEAKER_02: because if you 25 just seemed low to me,
51:56
SPEAKER_02: if you are on Senator Anderson's on four different committees.
52:01
SPEAKER_02: And wait, so finance and revenue is new to them, and that's a lot.
52:04
SPEAKER_02: I mean,
52:04
there's a lot of work we've got to do with our income tax and
52:07
our tax and spend
52:08
SPEAKER_02: policies in the state.
52:09
SPEAKER_02: I mean, that's a lot of work.
52:11
So you're there housing,
52:13
early childhood,
52:14
behavioral health,
52:15
25 bills doesn't cut it.
52:16
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
52:17
SPEAKER_02: So I'm with you.
52:18
SPEAKER_02: I don't know if it's 300.
52:19
SPEAKER_02: I don't know if a limit is necessary.
52:21
SPEAKER_02: I think if we just change the process a little bit,
52:23
I really believe you that I think in our conversation that
52:26
that'll kind of fix
52:27
SPEAKER_02: itself.
52:28
SPEAKER_01: I think you're right.
52:29
SPEAKER_01: And again, I...
52:31
SPEAKER_01: I respect the speaker.
52:33
SPEAKER_01: I think she is approaching a problem that she sees.
52:36
SPEAKER_01: And I'm not going to argue the symptoms.
52:40
SPEAKER_01: I just assess the problem differently.
52:42
SPEAKER_01: I think the problem is...
52:44
Committee chairs need to be a little more decisive and
52:47
recognize that they need to
52:49
SPEAKER_01: make choices,
52:50
SPEAKER_01: and we probably should narrow the number of non-legislator bills.
52:55
SPEAKER_01: Fine with that.
52:56
SPEAKER_01: They weren't elected a legislator.
52:57
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's true.
52:59
I think we're approaching this problem like they're kind of
53:02
approaching campaign finance.
53:04
SPEAKER_02: where it's just really,
53:05
SPEAKER_02: you know,
53:06
SPEAKER_02: oh,
53:06
SPEAKER_02: oh,
53:07
SPEAKER_02: there's a problem,
53:08
and then they're just trying to whack their problem with the
53:10
easiest solution,
53:12
SPEAKER_02: and like,
53:12
SPEAKER_02: oh,
53:12
SPEAKER_02: just put limits on campaign finance.
53:14
SPEAKER_02: And it's like, well, now the money just goes into the dark holes.
53:19
SPEAKER_02: So I just don't think that's the right way to approach it.
53:23
SPEAKER_02: You know, I think the same thing with the bill limits.
53:25
SPEAKER_02: It's really more process, shedding a light on it, and making it happen.
53:30
SPEAKER_02: Well, we lost Reagan.
53:31
SPEAKER_02: He had a meeting, so I guess we're done.
53:33
SPEAKER_02: Well...
53:34
thank you for the opportunity it was great yeah and uh let me
53:37
know if you ever want
53:38
to walk through the conversations on other things well and when
53:41
we go through some
53:42
more vet stuff i think we need to make sure that that committee
53:45
and also the bills
53:46
that we do i would love to work with you on that sounds great
53:49
let me know so i just
53:50
SPEAKER_01: want a big shout out to uh rick lewis is um yeah he's a rock star
53:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we're losing to Jim.
53:59
SPEAKER_01: He's retiring this year, and it's such a bummer to lose Rick.
54:02
SPEAKER_01: I've already tried to beg him twice, but I just appreciate him.
54:06
SPEAKER_01: And I understand that your boss may be looking to run for another thing,
54:11
SPEAKER_01: and even though I'm not supposed to say such things,
54:14
SPEAKER_01: I'm wishing him good luck.
54:15
SPEAKER_01: Oh, thanks.
54:16
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I appreciate that.
54:17
SPEAKER_03: I think that... Cut, cut, cut.
54:21
SPEAKER_01: I think Bowley would do well with some leadership.
54:24
SPEAKER_01: I appreciate that.