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Business as Discipleship with Mark Rowan · Christian Business Growth Podcast

• 0:00
  Hello and welcome to Christian Business Growth Podcast.
• 0:03
  Today I'm here with Mark Rowan.
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  So Mark, how did God get you into business?
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  Yeah, so it all started as an idea in twenty eighteen when uh I had this thought, how can we help authors transform their books into an online resource?
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  And so that's where it kind of started rolling around in my head and uh had some conversations with folks that I had written books and I like, Hey, what do think about
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  this?
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  And and I didn't have necessarily a platform or technology at the time that I was like, Hey, let's do this, but I I knew it was
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  possible, right?
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  I'd spent a lot of years helping people in the online space and so I knew that side of it very well.
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  And so that's where it got started and eventually in twenty twenty two.
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  That's when sheep feast became uh what it is and I always like to tell people, uh the sheep feast there is a connection point.
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  Actually my background picture right here, it's a little faded.
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  That's the farm that I grew up in in West Virginia.
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  It was a sheep farm and my parents started a camp called Psalm Twenty Three Camp and then
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  Lord led me to John twenty one, seventeen, where you talk about feed my sheep.
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  And so it was this idea that we're helping the feast the sheep have a feast in the g you know, in the body of Christ, uh, through what we're doing.
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  That's interesting.
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  And why'd you choose book as your kind of pinnacle point there?
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  Yeah, that's where it all started, right?
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  And it was the idea that we all read books for the most part.
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  I mean, some people don't want to read books, but like I for mi for instance, I read a lot of books um spiritual development otherwise, and I I realized there's a certain amount of
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  that that I don't actually retain beyond like the the core idea.
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  So I was like, Hey, how can we help people integrate these things even greater through, you know, an online course or this different
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  community element some things of that nature.
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  So that's why, you know, at first it was it was the book.
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  And then, you know, now we talk about just your message.
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  Everybody has a message.
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  Everybody has a story.
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  And especially if you're in the business space, you know, there's like how do you get that message out effectively?
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  So you don't have to have a book, but maybe part of this the journey is you may want to write a book.
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  Exactly.
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  And and that's the funny thing about it.
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  People that do write a book, they write the book and they just expect the book to go out there and ever a million people buy it.
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  I had an author recently tell me that.
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  I'm gonna write this book and a million people's gonna buy it.
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  I'm like, where are they gonna buy it?
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  Well, on my website.
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  What website?
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  Well, I don't have it yet.
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  And so they go through that process.
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  And it's interesting that you take that as a concept.
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  But you went from a book concept to feed my sheep.
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  What's the transition there?
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  Tell us about that.
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  Yeah, by the time we got to twenty twenty two, I really felt a call to be in the discipleship space.
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  I felt like that was, you know, you're talking about feeding the sheep, right?
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  You're getting people fed uh spiritually.
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  And so, you know, while a book is a part of that, you know, we were like, How do we do this process of helping people, you know, take their message and whether it's a
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  discipleship focused or not?
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  And in the business world, you may not think of it that way, but
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  You know, when Jesus says to go make disciples of all nations, he didn't say he didn't qualify that as pastors and teachers only.
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  Like we're all involved in that.
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  And so as business people, as entrepreneurs, we have a role to play in that.
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  And while that may not be like the first thing we talk about when we get up and and go about our business, at the same time, I think inherently it's it's part of who we are as
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  believers.
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  I agree.
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  We've talked a lot on our podcast, you know, business is ministry, but I don't think anybody's communicated that business is ministry of discipleship.
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  How does that discipleship translate into business?
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  Yeah, so the way I look at it is, you know, the way that we walk out our day, how we lead our businesses, these are all signals or just w uh people ways for people to follow uh how
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  we reflect Jesus in our business.
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  So, you know, whether it's customer service or, you know, how we perform and bring excellence to the table in what we do, uh, these all speak different things.
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  And so
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  Like you may not have a Bible study, not that you can't do that, but how you purport yourself in the business world and lead your teams or you know, it doesn't matter if
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  you're the the owner or you're just a part of it, you can still be uh in that discipleship journey.
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  And, you know, that's that's how I look at it as far as, you know, being a making disciples in business.
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  It's it's not always gonna be uh like a a Sunday school atmosphere, right?
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  But how how we do our day in and day out really goes a long way.
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  Yeah, people can tell when you're Christians.
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  It's like we talk about everything is marketing, but everything is also representing Jesus in our business.
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  If people know you're a Christian, they're gonna pay attention to that.
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  Whether they're a Christian or not, when you slack on your integrity or you make those questionable decisions, people pay attention to those things.
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  And being a disciple is you growing, not being perfect.
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  Yeah, a hundred percent.
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  So tell me, what's God doing in your business right now?
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  Yeah, so the latest thing is what we started out with.
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  So the when I first started, I was talking about metamorphos.
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  So that's a Greek word for transformation.
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  So it was transform your books, transform your life.
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  That was kind of where we were living with that.
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  And then um through the years, we refined who we were.
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  We got our message uh more in line with what we felt we we were supposed to be doing and who we were supposed to serve.
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  So then
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  You know, we were we were thinking about churches and ministries.
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  That's like that's where the discipleship happens, right?
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  We're gonna go there and help them.
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  That didn't those doors didn't really open and then we really felt like the Lord was leading like business first.
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  That those are our people, that's our audience.
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  And then once uh we kind of worked on that for a a good solid year, just kinda developing that messaging and understanding that's who we're serving, then even more so that we're
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  dialed into people that carry a message.
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  So
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  Whether that's is an author or a speaker, a coach, some kind of leader with they understand that they have a message to to bring uh to forward to the front of the audience
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  that they're called to serve.
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  And so and that brought us back to Metamorphoo and what we call the metamorphoo method.
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  And that's based off of Habakkuk two two, where the prophet talks about write the vision, make it plain on tablets so those that read it can run with it.
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  So for us it's a five step
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  process of understanding where you are with getting your message out to the people that can receive it.
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  And so you can you have a picture worth a thousand words, right?
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  Uh now you can see that in your own head, but have you actually captured that and put it down?
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  Have you clarified it?
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  Like once you kind of know it for yourself, can you clarify it for others so that they can understand it?
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  And the writing it on tablets for us is this process of beginning to create assets.
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  So whether it is a book or you know, you may need that website you talked about earlier, all these different types of things that carry the message.
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  And then finally those last two steps are uh what we call build the pathway, or those that read it.
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  Um so there's a way for um for us to and we come in with our software solution and say, hey, if you're ready for that, then you can build begin to build all these things and
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  integrate them all together so that it has
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  more effective and and efficient way of doing it.
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  And finally, they run with it, right?
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  That's the multiplication where you may need to start looking at, hey, all these things are in place.
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  Now I need to have some advertising or maybe I need to have some, you know, different kind of coaching that's related to sales.
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  Or that's where you you've kind of locked in on all that all what you're what you're trying to say and who you're saying it to.
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  And now you're ready to put the gas on the fire as it were.
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  That makes sense.
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  Okay, recap what are the five steps again?
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  So we have capture the vision and then make it plain and then create the assets, build the pathway, and then multiply the impact.
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  So that just follows the pattern of Havoccook two two if you read that.
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  Great.
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  Thanks.
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  I love that you're basing it on a biblical principle.
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  Because so often we try to make our make up our own stuff, but God's got all the stuff already laid out for us.
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  Amen.
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  He's got a whole lot of wisdom we can get into.
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  Exactly.
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  Yeah.
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  Donald was Donald Miller, he said, uh, you know, make it caveman proof.
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  If a caveman looked at it, would he know what you do?
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  So make it super simple that everybody understands.
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  All right, so let's talk about business growth.
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  What are some business growth tips you have for us today?
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  Yeah, one of the things I often say is just because you're good at that particular thing doesn't mean you should be doing that at that moment.
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  I tie it to my background of what I like to do and a lot of times that's like, Hey, let's come up with a business name, let's create a logo, website, and and you're like, just my I
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  can spin those kind of things up super easy and then you can get stuck stuck there sometimes, right?
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  And you're like, I'm gonna make more changes and refine and do all this kind of stuff and
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  Think about that in your own world.
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  Like what is the thing that you're you tend to, you know, gravitate to as far as how much time you put into?
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  But is it the thing you need to do today or in this season of your business?
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  Because while you're really comfortable in a certain area, it doesn't mean that you're always gonna be doing that, especially as a business leader, a business person, um, you
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  know, ultimately we wanna do what we're good at, but there's a season for everything and that's in the Bible too.
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  Yeah, exactly.
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  It's funny you said comfortable because I think that's the problem is we do what's comfortable for us.
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  It's the stuff that's uncomfortable we just keep putting apart and putting aside.
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  I think we talked about accounting, you know.
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  If you're not comfortable with accounting, you're gonna set that aside and you're gonna forget that there are bills to pay and there's money to do.
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  But on the other side of it, if you love accounting, you're spending all your time there and nobody's hearing about what you have to say.
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  So tell us what helps you to break through that comfortable and into the uncomfortable to structure your business better?
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  Yeah, and it's not always about doing it yourself, right?
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  You know, there's a time when you're if you're bootstrapping and just getting started, you kinda have carry everything.
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  But when you can bring other people that are good at certain things, that's a great way to partner up.
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  And you know, I'm not an accounting guy, so I have someone that helps with that, right?
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  And so you might have to start out like, I'm gonna do the basics and all that sort of thing, but um once you get to a certain place, you know, it's always great to uh rely on
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  expertise of others, right?
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  'cause as the Bible says, once again, every joint supplies, you know, we're like Paul talks about like we all can't be the eye or the hand or whatever.
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  And he God made it that way so that we can, you know, all bring our, you know, talents to the table and see his kingdom expand.
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  Uh so now while I said you can't always um, you know, focus on what you're good at, but it's the idea that, you know,
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  y ultimately you wanna be doing what you're good at more than you're not, right?
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  But if you only focus on that and don't have these other pieces come into place, uh that's where you can have trouble.
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  Exactly.
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  Yeah, I I wear a hat and I have a bunch of hats on my wall here.
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  I say I'm a man of many hats, but as a business owner, like you said, if you're bootstrapped, you're just getting started, you're wearing all the hats.
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  You eventually got to start separating those hats out.
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  Uh one of the things I suggest people doing is making a list of all the things you're currently doing and circle the things you like doing.
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  And then the ones that you don't like doing, start looking for people.
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  Start praying for God to put people in your life and in your path.
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  So that those people can come alongside you and help you.
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  It may be somebody you can partner with, it may be somebody you can pay depending on where you're at in your process and everything.
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  But you know, whether you're talking about finance, marketing, sales, your systems, your fulfillment, your customers support, you've got all these hats and I can't even list them
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  all for your business, but that's what AI is helpful for.
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  Go in there and say, what do I need to think about in my business?
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  What areas do I need to?
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  What hats am I wearing?
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  You could even say that.
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  I think it would do it.
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  so your hat is marketing.
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  So if somebody's new and they're like, I just need to get out there and tell people about it, what would you tell
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  Yeah, so with uh to start out if you're talking about the messaging of, you know, your business, right?
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  It it's it is b getting clear on what it is and what it is that you do and who you do it for.
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  Uh those are the two big steps that that you need to take in the marketing is like, am I super confident in what I am providing for people?
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  And do people understand that in a in a quick way?
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  I don't have to like
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  talk about it for a half an hour before they get what I'm trying to help them with, right?
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  And so that then that will roll out through what you do in your marketing, right?
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  That will, you know, dictate how you create socials or what socials you need to be on.
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  what kind of content or you know, all the different options that are out there today.
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  Like if if you have those things in mind and understand those better, that's gonna help you uh figure out what you need to do and where you need to do it.
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  Exactly.
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  And what I would warn people, if people said, everybody needs my business.
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  Well, that's great that everybody needs your business, but you still gotta focus in on a market and a target, or you're not gonna be able to reach more people.
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  So if I have, let's say my target market's fifty, sixty, seventy year old women, I'm probably not gonna be hanging out on TikTok because that's not where they hang out.
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  And if you say, Well, I could do sixty year old women and twenty year old women, well then you're gonna have to start focusing.
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  Which one's gonna bring more into your bucket, which one's gonna provide for your business, which one's God leading you to?
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  'Cause sometimes we forget to put prayer in the process, you know, how does God lead us?
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  God, who do you want me to help?
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  How do you want me to help them?
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  And sometimes that may not be exactly the way we had originally thought about our business.
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  Yeah.
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  That you s interesting that you said that because that's a core value for us.
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  we call it our the podcast we host is called a two thousand cubit rule and it's from Joshua three four and the people of Israel are going into the promised land, they've never
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  been there before and they don't know where they're going.
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  And the instruction was to stay two thousand cubits back from the Ark of the Covenant so they could know which way to go.
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  And so we translate that as making room for God to move.
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  And so that's a like you said, being in prayer.
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  understanding his wisdom and and and that sort of thing.
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  And so yeah, that's a huge part of it.
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  I mentioned the metamorphum method.
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  We build that in as a part of our kind of our free assessment.
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  the people can download that right and fill it out to understand where they are.
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  But uh follow up thing is what we call the two thousand cubit rule session where we literally look over that stuff and pray together and see what God will instruct or reveal
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  in the even in that moment of just, you know
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  and trusting that he wants to guide us and lead us into all truth for our business.
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  That's lovely.
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  I I try to I call it a headlight faith.
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  As you move forward, your headlight moves forward with you.
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  I love the qubit aspect though, because if you stand still, God keeps moving and you're gonna get left behind.
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  And if you're not paying attention, if you're not moving forward, you may not be going where God wants you to go.
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  So I love that concept of following the altar and keeping God.
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  too, uh, about the 2000 cubits.
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  I was talking about that for a long time before I realized how how much that was, because I was thinking, it's like, you know, a few hundred yards.
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  It's like over a half a mile.
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  And then I realized the reason why it was so far, like 'cause I was picturing mine much closer, was that you had all of the people of Israel had to be able to see the Ark of the
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  Covenant.
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  So it there is this idea that it's not just us.
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  There isn't there's a group of people around us that, you know, you have to have the perspective of not just me, myself and I, but you know, in the body of Christ and who
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  you're serving and all that.
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  So as you're following God, uh yes, he's leading us one on one, but he's not just thinking about us.
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  He's thinking about how can we serve others, how can we partner with others, all those kind of things.
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  That's a great idea because we that's that's the point.
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  We focus on self so much we forget that there are people behind us that also need to recognize God's in front of us.
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  That's cool.
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  So tell us what we're gonna leave us with one little bit of wisdom and tell us how we can get talk in touch with you.
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  Yeah, a little bit of wisdom.
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  It's it's basically what I was talking about.
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  I wanna reinforce that idea, like making room for God to move.
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  It's not just about your business, it's every part of our life, it's a holistic thing, right?
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  So I could say like how can we get Jesus as much as possible into what we're doing?
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  Now on one hand, Jesus is with us, right?
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  It's the promise, right?
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  He never leaves us, never forsakes us.
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  But it's this idea of abiding in Christ, right?
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  This is the
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  the call to how do we, you know, live out of Jesus and his wisdom in every part of our life and, you know, that will really inform how we run business, how we, you know, have
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  relationships with others, how we're in the community and the church and all those kind of things.
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  So my bit of wisdom is get with Jesus early and often.
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  I love that.
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  And how can we get in touch with you?
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  Yeah, check us out at Sheepfeast.com.
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  If you go there, there's all of our socials or you can find them in the footer.
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  Pretty much if you search Sheepfeast and that's one word, you're gonna find us.
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  That's one of the fun things about that particular brand is when that popped into my mind, no one talks about that.
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  So it's pretty easy to find us if you Google us.
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  Good.
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  Well thanks for being with us, Mark.
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  I appreciate your story.
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  Thank you for having me.