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Buckeye Banter With Former Ohio State WR Dane Sanzenbacher · Buckeyes TomOrrow Morning

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Buckeyes Tomorrow morning for Wednesday, May seventh, I'm
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: your host, Tom Or the Texas game in one hundred
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  Speaker 1: and fifteen days, the game against Michigan in two hundred
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  Speaker 1: and six days. If you're planning your next event, make
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  Speaker 1: it unforgettable with Grateful Griddle, Columbus's favorite food truck serving
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  Speaker 1: up smashburgers, gourmet sandwiches, and good vibes. Book you're catering
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  Speaker 1: today at Gratefulgriddle oh dot com. All right, so this
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: is a show I've been meaning to get to for
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: more than a week. This is an episode of the
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: Buckeye Banter podcast hosted by Seth Schener. Seth actually has
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: dropped a whole other episode since this one dropped. The
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: newest one is about Jamar Butler, the former Ohio State
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: point guard. But this one, this is a great one
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: about a former Ohio State fan favorite wide receiver, Dane Sanzenbacher.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: If you're old enough, you will remember him being a
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: wildly popular player sort of towards the end of the
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: Jim Tressel era at Ohio State. This is a great episode.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: Starts with some stuff about some more modern Ohio State receivers,
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: including some guys on the current team. Also a great
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: story about Ted. Again, this is a really, really good episode.
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: You guys are gonna enjoy this one a lot, and
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: when you do, make sure you subscribe to the Buckeye
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: Banter podcast. You can find that wherever you find Buck
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: guyes tomorrow morning. You can also find it on our
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: YouTube channel at YouTube dot com slash Buckeye Huddle.
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: Hello and welcome to another edition of Buckeye Banter. Well
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: retell the stories of Ohio State athletes and folks who
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: work around Ohio State athletics, and today I'm so excited
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: to bring in a four year lettermanute Ohio State at
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: receiver Dane Sonzenbacher. Dane, thanks so much for taking some time.
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: Yeah, thanks for having me on. It'll be fun.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: I got two things before we tell your story. Number one,
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  Speaker 2: did you see the John Gruden video of him on
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  Speaker 2: earthing all these stuff Ohio States?
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, so I don't have Twitter, but my wife
• 1:50
  Speaker 3: sent me the link, and then over the past couple
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: of days, multiple people have sent it to me, like
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: check out the one forty mark of this video.
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: I don't even listen all the state greats and boom
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: and he was so excited because he's like because knowing
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  Speaker 2: I don't know Mike Turrico, but I know, like I
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: went to broadcast school, so I know a guy like
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: him is so focused on annunciation and things like that,
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  Speaker 2: and so and so Gruden was basically mocking Turrico's pronunciation
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: your name.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what everybody sent it to me. I was like, wow,
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  Speaker 3: he really he threw me on a heck of a
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  Speaker 3: list there, just random his Ohio state knowledge. He's always
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: been a big fan for whatever reason. You know. He
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: did something very similar back in twenty eleven during his
• 2:37
  Speaker 3: like quarterback camp when he had Terrell on. Okay, and
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: he just he gave he made half of the whole
• 2:44
  Speaker 3: show about me. And I'm sitting home, I'm watching it
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  Speaker 3: live on Sports Center just by myself in my apartment,
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: just eating breakfast. Yeah, like, what is going on here?
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: I've never met him, but yeah, he's brought me up
• 2:59
  Speaker 3: a couple of time. I'ms in the media. I actually
• 3:03
  Speaker 3: played for well, his brother Jay was the offensive coordinator
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: in Cincinnati when I was there. Yeah, so, and he
• 3:09
  Speaker 3: called a couple of our games. But I've just I've
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  Speaker 3: never met him I've never met him in person, but
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  Speaker 3: I appreciate every once in a while, seems like now
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: every ten years he h throws me a shout out
• 3:19
  Speaker 3: and some media bit.
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: Well, he went real deep in that video. I mean
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  Speaker 2: the knowledge of all the players, certainly, I mean he's
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: from Ohio, you played at University of Dayton. But the
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: knowledge of all the players, and then the fight song
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  Speaker 2: and the tradition and the coaches. I mean that. I
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  Speaker 2: think if I'm Ohio State, I put that on recruiting loops,
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  Speaker 2: you know throughout the hoody Hayes.
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  Speaker 3: I mean that was based on the views that thing saw.
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  Speaker 3: Last I checked, it was like in the hundreds thousands.
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  Speaker 3: I think it's on its own recruiting loop right now.
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  Speaker 2: And I got to tell you if I could get
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  Speaker 2: even a few items out of that box, I mean
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  Speaker 2: that was some really good stuff. The Hire States said.
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  Speaker 3: It's all part of the recruiting. You send the box
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  Speaker 3: to the He's an influence. I mean, he's a football influencer.
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  Speaker 3: He is he is to open that stuff is really cool.
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  Speaker 2: Well, you mentioned being listed among some greats Chris Carter,
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  Speaker 2: David Boston, He talked about, even talked about more recent guys.
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  Speaker 3: But if you don't put me on that list, what
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  Speaker 3: are you saying?
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  Speaker 2: Oh, I'm getting that. I'm getting to it. Man. So
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  Speaker 2: when you you play in NFL, so you you belong
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  Speaker 2: on that list absolutely, But I wanted your take a
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  Speaker 2: little bit on kind of this last x amount of
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: years since coach Hartline, whom was on the there when
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  Speaker 2: you you joined the Ohio State's roster. What are your
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: thoughts on this, this run of receivers of higha state
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  Speaker 2: and kind of what's your take on you know, that
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  Speaker 2: side of it overall?
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's been an unreal what decade now?
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  Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
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  Speaker 3: Maybe maybe a little bit more. I think it's, you know,
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  Speaker 3: on some level, the richer getting richer because once you
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  Speaker 3: have that stable and you've seen, you've shown guys can
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  Speaker 3: go first round, first round. Back to the you know,
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: Garrett Wilson, Chris Alave was, things were really starting to
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  Speaker 3: ramp up to this being like, oh, there's an expectation
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  Speaker 3: now for the receivers at Ohio State to be first rounders,
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  Speaker 3: and then it makes recruiting a whole lot easier to
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  Speaker 3: get those guys in. So I think that's part of it.
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  Speaker 3: I think part of it is the stability that the
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  Speaker 3: coaching staff's had. I think that you've had Heartline there
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  Speaker 3: for so long. Coach Day has done a great job
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  Speaker 3: of bringing guys former guys on staff. You've had Laura
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  Speaker 3: and iis there, and even Coach Day has been there
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  Speaker 3: for a while now. So I think in the recruiting game,
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  Speaker 3: and especially now in college football, that consistency goes a
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  Speaker 3: long way if you can say, like, here are these
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  Speaker 3: same coaches, the same guys that got X, Y and
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  Speaker 3: Z receivers to the NFL, and are you know stars
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  Speaker 3: on some level in the NFL if you're a top
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  Speaker 3: recruit at that position. I mean, if you're a top recruit,
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  Speaker 3: top wide receiver recruit right now, Ohio State has to
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  Speaker 3: be on your short list.
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  Speaker 2: It does.
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  Speaker 3: You might not get them all. Sure, your goal is
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  Speaker 3: probably go to the NFL, and you've seen a proven
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  Speaker 3: formula that they can get there, and I mean it's
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  Speaker 3: not changing anytime soon. We've still got We've got another
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  Speaker 3: couple guys in the pipeline still that are could have
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  Speaker 3: been first rounders this year. I mean Jeremiah could have gone.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, maybe one or two overall as a freshman.
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  Speaker 2: You know, I see Chris Olave that kind of a
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  Speaker 2: three star recruit. The story is awesome how Coach Day
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  Speaker 2: was out there looking at a quarterback and all of
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  Speaker 2: a sudden he kind of stumbled on the Lave and
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  Speaker 2: brought him, brought him in, and he's almost like the
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  Speaker 2: proof is in the putting, as you were saying, because
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  Speaker 2: you get a three star guy like Kim, he turns
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  Speaker 2: into this great All American type receiver and then all
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  Speaker 2: of a sudden, you're bringing in five stars. Do you
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  Speaker 2: have a favorite receiver of the last decade or so?
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  Speaker 3: I was always a Garrett Wilson guy and that like
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  Speaker 3: in sync Backstreet Boys competition, that was a Lave and
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  Speaker 3: Garrett Wilson that said, I probably identify more with with
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  Speaker 3: Chris Lave. And what I hope is that like that,
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  Speaker 3: every everybody loves that story and I do too. I mean,
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  Speaker 3: I was a three star guy, and I mean he
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  Speaker 3: played special teams like it kind of worked his way
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  Speaker 3: into them being this threat and then first round pick
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  Speaker 3: and then shows he can do it at the next level.
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  Speaker 3: I hope that doesn't go away because it seems like
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  Speaker 3: as we get more specialized and there's that expectation there's
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  Speaker 3: less of an incentive for coaches to take a shot
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  Speaker 3: on three star guys that might be either culture guys
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  Speaker 3: or fit what you're trying to do right, because there's
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  Speaker 3: no knock on them. There's so much pressure to have
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  Speaker 3: the top recruiting class, and those times have changed. I mean,
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  Speaker 3: if you look at the Ohio State class now, it's
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  Speaker 3: like you, it's among the top top recruits in the nation.
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  Speaker 3: Where As even when I was there, which seems like
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  Speaker 3: a long time ago now but relatively not that long,
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  Speaker 3: it was always a sprinkle of guys like you had
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  Speaker 3: Ohio guys that were, you know, three stars, guys that
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  Speaker 3: were going to be you were trying to build this
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  Speaker 3: mix of guys. Of course, we had a couple that
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  Speaker 3: were like this guy's one of the top recruits in
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  Speaker 3: the country, the Beanie Wells of the world and Teddy
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  Speaker 3: and but you know, some of the other guys were
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  Speaker 3: just guys. I mean, Troy Smith, I don't think was
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  Speaker 3: like a number one recruit. I mean a lot of
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  Speaker 3: those really good players, they were just kind of made
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  Speaker 3: their way in. So I think, yeah, Chris Alave stands
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  Speaker 3: out in that sense that might not have been on
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  Speaker 3: your radar in the freshman recruiting class and kind of
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: made his way through. So I've been a fan of
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  Speaker 3: a lot of them. I'm not it's tough to pick favorites.
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  Speaker 3: They're all incredibly impressive. But yeah, that's one thing I
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  Speaker 3: hope that is able to hang on, at least on
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  Speaker 3: some level, among all of the changes that are happening,
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  Speaker 3: that there still is space for coaches to say, you
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  Speaker 3: know what, I like that guy. I like that guy,
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  Speaker 3: and I'm gonna take him because I like him, not
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  Speaker 3: because the recruiting service said he is X, Y or
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  Speaker 3: Z or this many stars.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah. I remember the story of like coach Fickle standing
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: on a table for Darren Lee. Right, I mean, you know,
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  Speaker 2: Undersize hadn't really played linebacker before, but he became a
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  Speaker 2: key cog. Well, let's tell your story. You were born
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: October thirteenth, nineteen eighty eight and Mammy Ohio. Right, so
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: you go to Toledo.
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: I don't know, Yeah, I don't know where. Well it's
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  Speaker 3: very close to mommy, Okay, but no, I was. I
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  Speaker 3: grew up and lived in Toledo. You know where. I
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  Speaker 3: think that started back in the day when NCAA football.
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  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, was.
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  Speaker 3: Still making their game but had to like kind of
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: make it squint, so you didn't quite you were quite
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: exactly that person because they couldn't pay your didn't want
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: to pay you. Everybody's hometown was like slightly off because
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: one town over. So I think that's why mine became
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: like Mammy Ohio. And then I saw it popping up.
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: I was like, I never lived or was born in mommy.
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: I was born in Saint Vincent, so it was just
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: downtown Toledo and lived in Toledo until college.
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: Let's get that right. Then I interviewed Kent Mercury. He's
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: a Dublin native. Pitched in the Major League s through
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: no hitter for the Braves pitch for the Reds. His
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: Baseball Reference says that he attended Otterbne and when I
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: asked him, I was like, I don't remember you attending Otterbine.
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: Did what's that all about? And he's like, I have
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: no idea. He's like, I heard somebody put that on there,
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: trying to get some attention for the school in the
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: baseball program there. He's like, but I never I never
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: went there. So yeah, you know, you can't believe everything
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: on the Internet, so Wikipedia you got me there. You
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: did attend Central Catholic High School. In fact, tell me
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: a little bit about growing up up there in Northwest
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: Ohio though, and then and then we'll get into your
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: career there at Central Catholic.
• 11:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's I can only look back at it now,
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: obviously from the shoes I'm in and especially from like
• 11:10
  Speaker 3: now living in Columbus through the lens of like where
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: Ohio State fit into that. But this was like a
• 11:19
  Speaker 3: you know, Northwest Ohio even at the time, was not
• 11:24
  Speaker 3: like a sports hub or mecca for like talent to
• 11:30
  Speaker 3: come out. And we had some guys, but you knew
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: who the guys were, like Jimmy Jackson was out of
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: the like there was there was a few guys that
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: were like world beaters, but I don't know, it was
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: just a very normal, you know Ohio growing up childhood.
• 11:49
  Speaker 3: I mean, I didn't have it. There was not a
• 11:52
  Speaker 3: big emphasis on sports in my life. There was just
• 11:56
  Speaker 3: the normal you play on your your middle school team,
• 11:59
  Speaker 3: you go on and you try to make the high
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: school team. But yeah, I grew up in South Toledo,
• 12:07
  Speaker 3: played casual sports with my friends, never did like really
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: specializing in one or the other, or travel or anything
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: like that, which I guessed that kind of childhood. It
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: was more of the norm back then for guys that
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: make it to this level. But it did make the
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: ride from then until now, or at least through my
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: playing career all the mo or crazy. Yeah, like, oh,
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  Speaker 3: this wasn't in the cards or even anybody I know
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: much less related to. But anybody I know has had
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: an experience like this.
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  Speaker 2: You mentioned it, you were you know, Toledo is in Ohio.
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  Speaker 2: We understand that. Did you grow up enjoying Ohio State football?
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  Speaker 2: Is that kind of a thing that you looked at
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: or was it you know a little more out of side,
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: out of mind.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: With you casually? Yeah, I wasn't like I didn't know
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: the roster. I don't. Yeah, I don't know as many
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: players as John Gruden does, and there's I knew it,
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: but it was probably I would see a couple of
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: games a year, one being the Michigan game because that's
• 13:09
  Speaker 3: it wasn't is all but a holiday in Toledo. Sure,
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: when I was growing up, it was like you didn't
• 13:15
  Speaker 3: have to be a fan of one or the other,
• 13:17
  Speaker 3: but you had to pick one or the other. So
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: like in my picking, I was an Ohio State person,
• 13:22
  Speaker 3: not a Michigan person, but that I mean most years
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: growing up, that was probably the only game I watched,
• 13:28
  Speaker 3: and for most people, that was the one that mattered.
• 13:33
  Speaker 3: So that was most of my exposure to Ohio State.
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: But it was, like I said, that was something in
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: a far away land, like Ohio State football was as
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: big as anything else in Michigan. But you know, yeah,
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: that was something that happened in this gigantic looking stadium that,
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: just like you, was beyond the belief. I had never gone, Like,
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: I had never been to a game until I was
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: a recruit my junior year of high school, so I
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: didn't really know what it was, what it was like
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: in person. But yeah, it's always been, Uh, it's always
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: been in the periphery of my life until it was
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: in the forefront.
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, hey, at Central Catholic, he played for Greg
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: Dempsey and uh, we'll get to this in a minute,
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: but I've talked to him to consecutive years as I've
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: helped call the state championship games against Waterson, and I'll
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: tell you talking to him, a he represents the school
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: really well, but be he's he's as nice as could be. Like,
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: you know, he's one of the hectic, most hectic weeks
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: of his career. The week he's about the coach of
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: state championship game, and he's given me a lot of time.
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: He's in the playoffs every years. He got five state titles,
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: including one with you and O five. Tell me a
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: little bit about playing for him and playing at the
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: school there.
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so my I guess my junior year or sophomore year,
• 14:59
  Speaker 3: I played a little bit it. Coach Dempsey was only
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: I think on his third year at Central Catholic. I
• 15:04
  Speaker 3: can't remember when he started, but it had to have
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: been maybe year two.
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: Thousand, I think it's right. I looked it up.
• 15:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, So I got to Central Catholic in two
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: thousand and three, so he was a pretty young coach
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: in Central was by no means like a powerhouse football program.
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: Not I mean, by some measures, not even all that successful.
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: You know, they I think won four games or so
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: is for a year. It wasn't It wasn't there. So
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: we were progressively getting better. Made the playoffs my sophomore
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: year when I was playing a little bit, and then
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: my junior year happened and we made this you know,
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: state playoff run and won the state title in for
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: at that time, it was out of nowhere. You know,
• 15:51
  Speaker 3: you look back at it now and what they've done
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: over the past you know, decade and more has been
• 15:58
  Speaker 3: very impressive in building that to now you don't think
• 16:01
  Speaker 3: about it, but at the time that was a Saint
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: Francis did it once a few years prior for Northwest
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: Ohio School, but it didn't happen often. So I think
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: that was the turning point. And I think, you know,
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: what he's done well aside from just being a great guy.
• 16:20
  Speaker 3: He's a central guy himself, but he's you know, similar
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: to what makes the current Ohio state program strong is stability.
• 16:31
  Speaker 3: I mean he's been there and kept his core guys
• 16:35
  Speaker 3: and staff around him. Like some of his staff I
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: played with, like guys there and come back in so
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: they get it. And when you have that and now
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: you have guy, it's a lot easier to get players
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: to believe. You know, It's like you can see like, okay,
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: now you have this expectation of making it to making
• 16:53
  Speaker 3: a run in the state playoffs, which holds its own pressures.
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: But as far as like a program, getting guys to
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: buy in is a whole lot easier you get that
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: ball rolling, and I mean, so yeah, I think, uh,
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: him being there for that long and having that crew
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: around him helps build that winning culture there. But it's unreal.
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: I mean you and I'm sure you've asked him. You
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: could have asked him. There's no way he would have
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: foreseen this coming if you had asked him in two thousand, like, hey,
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: what do you think? This looks like the success that
• 17:28
  Speaker 3: that he's been able to have there, So it's cool
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: for me. I told him recently. I was like, I'm
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: in well, actually I saw him at the state championship
• 17:35
  Speaker 3: this past one, which we won't talk about that one
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: we'll talk to we'll.
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: Talk about we're going to talk about it.
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: But so I and I told him there. I was like,
• 17:44
  Speaker 3: It's it's funny now because I'm I'm living in Columbus
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: and you know, you're in Central Ohio and be like, oh,
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: where'd you go to school? Toledo Central Cathoic. They're like,
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: oh man, you guys are a powerhouse. Like that's the
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: perception now. It's like got statewide respect when at the
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: time that nobody had heard about Central Catholic Toledo Central
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: Catholic in Columbus, No.
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: And I remember I was a sports writer covering high
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: school sports from one to twenty twelve full time. And
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: I remember, you know, like you said, Saint Francis, what's
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: the other one? There's another?
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: Is it Saint John's?
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: Saint John's. Yeah, I remember talking about them a lot,
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: and you know, the local Catholic schools will go up
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: and play them sometimes as well. And didn't know much
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: about you guys, but listen, you didn't just play in
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: a state title game. From what I could tell, you
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: have three touchdown catches in a state title game to
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: win the game, right, I mean, that's that's a great game.
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: As a junior.
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that whole season was. It was just one of
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: those weird ones. I mean all most of my career
• 18:45
  Speaker 3: was like I couldn't. I don't know if I would
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: have seen that coming. That was the very first year
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: of like what is going on here? Because I mean
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: I played. I played a little bit as a sophomore,
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: but my junior year it like kind of the the
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: lid came off. Yeah, it wasn't any for any particular reason.
• 19:08
  Speaker 3: I don't. It just to me at the time, plays
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: just started to happen, like things were just happening, and
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: then all of a sudden, you get to late in
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: the season you're like, oh, okay, I guess I'm one
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: of the leaders of this team. Okay, And then you
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: go in the playoff and I think I had I
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: had a heck of a playoff run. I think I'm
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: removed enough now that it doesn't sound like bragging. I
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: think I can just like speak about you frankly.
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: Off of that run.
• 19:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it was our team. We had a
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: really good group of guys and we were all like close,
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: so I think that helped as a whole. And for
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: whatever reason, like the individual plays came to me. I
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: think I had like eleven interceptions and I don't know
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: that the touchdown numbers.
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: That would be eleven receptions in your career, I think
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: I've got you down as twight career receiving yards and
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: one hundred and fifty one overall receptions.
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: So in high school, yeah, oh right, now, I believe you.
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: Yes, but you're also all state in a four hundred,
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: so that means you're fast as well. The four hundred
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: I high school track coach once told me, and not
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: to be sexist, but he said, that's a man's race.
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: That's a four hundreds of big, big, serious race, isn't it.
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's funny. I when I first got to Ohio State,
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: butch Reynolds was on staff, as our speak, and I
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: was a track guy. So it's like I didn't play
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: baseball in the spring. I was a track guy, and
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: you got it. There's like it's a it's a certain
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: kind of people that are that are track people. And
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: then once you will do the sport and you run
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: it like you you like to chat with other people
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: about it. So I was like, I'm a four hundred guy.
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: Here's one of the best I ever do it, probably
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: a world record holder for a time. But I always
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: found like, uh comfort in talking to him or what
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: he said to me. He's liked there was never a
• 21:00
  Speaker 3: time that I woke up I felt like running a
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: four hundred. It's like there was not. There was not.
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: It's just a painful, painful race. I mean there's no
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: way getting around the Uh you just can't sprint for
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: that long, but you have to try so that and
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: really that became I worked my way down to that.
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: I actually ran like eight hundred and mile my freshman year,
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: so like I was not quite sprinter fast, believe it
• 21:30
  Speaker 3: or not. For being like an NFL wide receiver like
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: I did. I ran hundreds and two hundreds, but that
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: wasn't going to be that like explosive off the blocks,
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: wasn't going to be nothing. I could sustain long enough
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: and was fast enough. So yeah, I had some success before.
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: I really loved Track. I still do. I coached Tracked
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: for a little bit when I'm playing.
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: Well, tell me about your recruitment. You committed to Ohio
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: State in July of oh six, so that's right for
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: your senior season you were. I saw two different services.
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: One of them said you were the number twelve rank
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: prospect in Ohio at the time. What was getting recruited
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: by Ohio State like at that time and coach Trestl
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: being chief among that, Well.
• 22:13
  Speaker 3: I think some of those recruiting services too, I think
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: they like will retroactively do their I think after I
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: was committed to Ohio State, Yeah, a bunch of.
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: Numbers that happened. That does happen.
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: It wasn't before because I wasn't really being recruited by
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: Ohio State, to be honest, coach Tressell's brothers. Dick was
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: back when he did recruiting areas. I don't think they
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: do it as much anymore because it's so national. But
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: he was responsible for Northwest Ohio and he had stopped
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: by the high school and all but told like, I
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: you know, like we know he's all state and blah
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: blah blah, but we don't I don't see an offer
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: happening here, just so you know. So it was not
• 22:54
  Speaker 3: on my radar whatsoever. How it came about is the
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: story I've told before. I'll keep it as brief as
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: I can.
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: But.
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: So yeah, in between my junior and senior year, coach
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: Ginn Teddy's dad, who had all the pole in the
• 23:15
  Speaker 3: world at this time in Ohio, right, he had his
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: bus tour. I don't know if you remember or heard
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: about this. I don't think he still does it, but
• 23:23
  Speaker 3: essentially he would charter a bus with most like the
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: best players in Cleveland. Let's say, a lot of Glennville kids,
• 23:33
  Speaker 3: but there was other some Stead's kids and like all
• 23:35
  Speaker 3: the best players in the Cleveland area, and because he
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: had so much cachet at the time, would tour around
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: to about for two weeks to about twelve colleges and
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: do like showcase camps. Like basically, he's like, here's the
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: talent that we have. I am going to take them
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: to you so you don't have an excuse not to
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: see these guys. Sure so, and he had the access
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: because he had the name in Ohio. So through a
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: connection in Toledo, I randomly was able to get on
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: the bus. I don't know, I don't know how the
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: friendship happened. It was actually a friend coach Ginn was
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: friends with somebody that was a coach at another school.
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: They reached out to me. Long story short, we met
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: them at like the turnpike stop. The bus stopped and
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: I just got on there and was on it for
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: two weeks with nobody. I knew. I had a bag
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: of clothes and we're like, okay, we're going to do this.
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: So anyways, we went to about twelve that two weeks,
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: we went to twelve or thirteen camps.
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: Essentially what other schools was it?
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: Oh, we went to I mean it was every mac
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: in Big ten school within like three states.
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: I feel okay.
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: We was bowling green Ball, State, Marshall. We went, We
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: drove all the way out to Iowa. Wow, gosh, Illinois,
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: Notre Dame, just like everything that was. We might have
• 24:59
  Speaker 3: gone to Indiana, we went to Cincinnati. It was just
• 25:04
  Speaker 3: a we would just get on the bus half the time,
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: sleep there, stop at a motel. But anyway, so like
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: we did this whole tour and throughout I think Coach
• 25:14
  Speaker 3: gint kind of took a liking to me. I was
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: doing pretty well, but like he kind of took me
• 25:22
  Speaker 3: under his wing. Yeah, And so we ended up at
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: Iowa and that was the first big ten offer I had.
• 25:28
  Speaker 3: Kirk Ferents like offered me on the spot there, which
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: that was shocked to me. I had no big offers.
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: I had a couple mac offers. I think Ball State
• 25:37
  Speaker 3: was like my best offer at the time. So I
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: was like blown away by that. I was like, Okay,
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: I guess I'm going to Iowa. How far is that?
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: It's some hours? All right, whatever this is going to
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: be as this is unreal. Our last stop was at
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: Ohio State. We did a little like mini camp, which
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: was barely anything. I mean, Coach Hazel worked us out,
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: but it was not much of a workout at all,
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: certainly nothing you can make any decisions off of so
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: I was like, okay, truthfully, it's been two weeks, like
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: I'm ready to go home. Yeah, this is the last
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: camp and my dad was picking me up from there.
• 26:08
  Speaker 3: So ended up after that camp. My coach called me
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: and said, you got invited back to a senior day
• 26:15
  Speaker 3: camp two days later at Ohio State. I'm like, okay,
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: great opportunity. I just got off of two. I was
• 26:24
  Speaker 3: just on bus for two weeks doing camps. But I'm like, okay,
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: well this you got invited back to do this one.
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: You should probably take every opportunity you get. So again,
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: went back to this camp two days later down in Columbus.
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: It was more, there was more work out there, there
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: was one on ones and everything, but didn't talk to
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: anybody really directly, you know. I was just like I
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: think I did okay, but it felt standard to me.
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: And was in the car on my way back home
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: to Toledo and got a text from somebody saying they
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: were coach Trestle. I didn't have his number, yeah on
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: my flip phone. Texts were like relatively early, I feel
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: like saying like hey Dan, great having you at camp.
• 27:11
  Speaker 3: We have a scholarship for you. Hope you give us
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: a great look, Coach Tress. And I was like, I
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: still remember like the little like rest stop we were
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: at when I got it. Yeah, I'm like, look at
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: my dad. I was like, you're not going to believe this.
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: At that point, I only had Iowa and I just
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: gotten a couple of days before and before that it
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: was Ball State and that was it.
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: Sure So I'm like.
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: Okay, So I let it sit for like a couple
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: of days, and I ended up calling him to confirm
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: this was actually you. Yeah, like you're this is this
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: is a real thing, right, And sure enough he's like, yep, yep,
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: we really like we see blah blah blah, would love
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: to have you. I all but committed right there. I
• 27:53
  Speaker 3: mean I didn't because I was like, okay, you're supposed
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: to weigh your option, but I was from that point.
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: I was there. I said I was gonna make the
• 28:01
  Speaker 3: story short. It's gotten pretty much how it ended. I
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: didn't find out till years later, until I was done
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: at Ohio State, Coach Tressel told me what had happened.
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: They weren't really recruiting me. They had decided like, okay,
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: we got this room full of this and we're recruiting X,
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: Y and Z guys. The bus had stopped there, Coach
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: gin had talked to Coach Trussell, and Coach Trust essentially
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: said who do I need? Because that's the gravitas that
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: coach Ginn had it And Coach gin said him. And
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: I'm sure Coach Trest was like, huh, like the little
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: guy over there and he was like yep, and that
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: was all it took.
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: I mean it's like, I don't think I did anything
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: great at the camps per se. I think they did
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: go back and watch the film and everything, and I
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: had really good tape. But the blessing from Coach gin
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: was I don't want to say the soul, but definitely
• 28:59
  Speaker 3: been number one reason I even ended up at Ohio
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: State because that the recruiting side was kind of not happening.
• 29:06
  Speaker 3: I was here in the Black School.
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: If not for that, you always heard the stories and
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: you know, as a fan or somebody that even as
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: a reporter, we covered some of coach Ginn's games and
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: things like Ted Ginn and they played against Pictor in Citrol.
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: I remember a friend of mine on the staff at
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: the paper as with you know, covered it and came
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: back just raving about them. What do you recall any
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: other players on that bus.
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Nate Oliver was on the guys that ended up
• 29:29
  Speaker 3: in my class. Nate Oliver was at Saint Ed's. Jamaal
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: Hines was on it from Glenville. Gosh, handful of Glenville
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: guys that didn't end up at Ohio State but went
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: to a couple other places. Kyle Jefferson, who was a
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: wide receiver at Wisconsin. He was one of the top
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: receivers in the state at that time. Glenville kid had
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: a really good career at Wisconsin. There's a couple quarterbacks
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: I can't remember where they ended up, but a lot
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: of really good talent. I mean it was it was
• 30:06
  Speaker 3: intimidating getting on yeah us and like randomly compete there.
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: But it was two weeks that changed the trajectory of
• 30:17
  Speaker 3: my life. I mean, I wouldn't if you had to
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: see a turning point where like things weren't even going
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: this direction at all. It was it was that experience.
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: It was that, Yeah, let's fast forward. You you end
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: up going to college, you're at Ohio State. You catch
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: your first college pass is a touchdown from Todd Beckman,
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: what was the transition, Like you mentioned earlier that maybe
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: you know with not playing the travel sports and things
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: like that, but you hit the ground running, you were
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: you played right away. What was it like to transition
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: to be in an Ohio state book?
• 30:48
  Speaker 3: Eye that that whole all I just described through my
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: senior high school and through freshman year. Really like things
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: didn't slow down, Yeah, because it was you know, you're
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: done with high school, and at that time it was
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: just starting to become pretty common for guys to enroll
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: in the summer. So I mean I was on campus
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: a week after graduation something like that. Most guys were
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: in that class. I was in really good shape coming
• 31:18
  Speaker 3: off track and I got I think I put myself
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: in a pretty good position as a freshman to play
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: to the point where I really played in that opening
• 31:32
  Speaker 3: game because I think Ray Small or somebody was hurt.
• 31:35
  Speaker 3: So I stepped in and I was the number three
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: guy because heartline were bisky, were the starters, and it
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: was maybe the second play I ever played. The first
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: play was a play before we were down on the
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: five yard line and for whatever reason, we're throwing the
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: ball and yeah, I run my route and before I
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: knew it, the ball was in the air, I had
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: caught it and scored and that was just like a
• 32:00
  Speaker 3: further of this whirlwind, like what just happened. He wasn't
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: even supposed to play and that was the first touchdown
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: of the season. There was the first touchdown I had
• 32:07
  Speaker 3: seen in Ohio Stadium live, and it was like my
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: mind just exploded. I'm like, how did that? Like what
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: are we doing here? So yeah, that was how it started.
• 32:17
  Speaker 3: I got to play here and there my freshman year
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: enough to you know, put my name out there as
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: like a guy that would be a number three or
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: four at that time at Ohio State. Yeah, things didn't
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: slow down until probably my sophomore year is when I
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: hit kind of like a not sophomore slump, I would say,
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: but more of like a steadying rhythm. And then junior
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: year on it felt like, Okay, I'm a guy or
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: I need to play like a guy. I need you
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: need to take ownership of this position and become like
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: a leader here if I'm going to be a starter
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: here or win a starting job and then keep it.
• 32:55
  Speaker 3: So yeah, that it had a wild start to it
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: slowed down and then ramped up in senior year.
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: Well, listen, we were talking about earlier about the current
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: receiver crop and even going back to the last eight
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: to ten years. But you're in a situation where you
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: come in with you mentioned Heartline and Rubisky. They kind
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: of tutored under Gin and Gonzales and Holmes, right and
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: all these guys, I guess take me through kind of
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: coming in behind them and kind of boom, I'm out
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: there right away with these guys.
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, surreal, it was all It was all. Uh, you
• 33:31
  Speaker 3: try to just take in as much and learn as
• 33:33
  Speaker 3: much as you can. I think I was lucky in
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: that aspect of when I came in was that how
• 33:41
  Speaker 3: it seemed to work at that time was like you
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: always knew who the who your top two guys were,
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: Like it was you know, from Santonio on. Then it
• 33:51
  Speaker 3: was like Teddy and Anthony Gonzalez and Roy Hall was
• 33:56
  Speaker 3: on the outside and they kind of made that work.
• 33:59
  Speaker 3: I came in like the first year of it being
• 34:01
  Speaker 3: Heartline and Ribisky show. This was right off the six season,
• 34:07
  Speaker 3: you know, the one verse two game. We just lost
• 34:08
  Speaker 3: a national championship to Florida. But you know it was
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: going to be a new quarterback Todd. Todd's first year,
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: Troy was gone, Teddy was gone, Gonzo was gone. Roy
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: was gone. So that was like heartline Ribisky's year to
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: step in, and I could then be there to supplement
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: that because they were brand new to that role. They
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: weren't starters before that. They made plays, but they weren't
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: the guys. So I think I was fortunate to have
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: that to come in and say, like, Okay, I can
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: learn from these guys, but it's their show. Nobody's expecting
• 34:38
  Speaker 3: me to come to be the leader. And was able
• 34:42
  Speaker 3: to have two years of that. So I had both
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: of those guys in front of me for two years
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: knowing like, Okay, I know my role. I know what
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: my role is. They're not expecting me to go be
• 34:51
  Speaker 3: an outside threat or be a number one or two guy.
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: I'll play in the slot, you know, learn this craft
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: from this position. And I think that really set me
• 35:02
  Speaker 3: up for when they both left for the NFL. You know,
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: having enough knowledge of the position to be able to
• 35:07
  Speaker 3: step in, it's like Okay, now it's now it's your turn.
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: You were talking a little bit about eight and your
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: sophomore season and the idea that like you said, maybe
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: not a sophomore slump, but the whole team kind of
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: had this effect because you go out, Beanie gets hurt,
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: You go out to USC, that's a tough game. You
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: come back. Coach Tressel makes a transition from Beckman and Beckman,
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: I mean he did a thing earlier, like he was older,
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: he gray shirted. I mean, he was in the program
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: a long time and here he was his last season
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: in eight and and they make the move to this
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: this amazing talent and Traill Prior that you know, the
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: coach Trestle had won the recruiting war over him the
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: previous spring. And and I guess tell me a little
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: bit about dealing with that because even like I know,
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: Rubisky and Heartland at the time, they were used to
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: running routes for this pro style quarterback and now you're switching.
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: And that was obviously the scuttle butt around town like,
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: oh my goodness, or these receivers are upset because now
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: Prior is running so much and he's not quite as
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: refined as a passer.
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean talk, these were these were opposite playing styles,
• 36:10
  Speaker 3: these two guys, Yeah, Todd and Trell. Yeah, maybe that's why,
• 36:13
  Speaker 3: you know, Statistically, it probably wasn't like a slump for me.
• 36:16
  Speaker 3: It was probably on par, if not better than my
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: freshman year. But maybe it felt like that because it
• 36:21
  Speaker 3: was a transition year. It felt like, okay, like once
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: the decision was made, we knew once Trell was in
• 36:27
  Speaker 3: the building, like this is this is a big recruit
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: and he's gonna have a big opportunity to be next.
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: And we won a ton of games that I mean,
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: we were we were competitive still. I mean it's not
• 36:40
  Speaker 3: like it was a good we were still a really
• 36:43
  Speaker 3: good team. But it did feel like after that USC game,
• 36:47
  Speaker 3: you know, this was the time when like national championship
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: was on your radar, but it wasn't like number one
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: goal because only two people got to do it and
• 36:57
  Speaker 3: you kind of lucked into it if you got in
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: the game.
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: Even know seven, Yeah, Illinois.
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: We probably didn't deserve to be in it, but I
• 37:10
  Speaker 3: mean I should say deserve. We won the game we
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: were supposed to win and had a good enough record,
• 37:14
  Speaker 3: but yeah, it wasn't like the system wasn't refined enough
• 37:17
  Speaker 3: for that to be like, Okay, we just need to
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: do this. You needed to catch them breaks. So it
• 37:21
  Speaker 3: felt like once we went out and played USC and
• 37:24
  Speaker 3: lost pretty handily. It was like that was a litmus
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: test to like where we're at, where we're at as
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: a program right now amongst the best the national brands
• 37:37
  Speaker 3: of football, and USC was really really good that year.
• 37:41
  Speaker 3: So yeah, they made I remember we made the switch.
• 37:43
  Speaker 3: I remember we just kind of rolled with it. The
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: coaches did not make a big announcement. From what I
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: remember or heard through the grapevine, it was just like
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: they went into the quarterback room, told them this is
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: what we're doing, and everybody kind of moved on. And
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: that was kind of It was weird the first couple games,
• 38:02
  Speaker 3: but I don't remember there being you know, there were
• 38:04
  Speaker 3: some grumblings with the older guys, but there wasn't like
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: a revolt. I think we kind of knew, like we've
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: got jobs to do. These guys are making their decisions.
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: I know we had to adjust as a receiving corps.
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: I mean, I know that was a discussion was like, hey,
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: you need to be ready for him to run. This
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: might be like he's going to read once and then
• 38:25
  Speaker 3: he's going to try to make a play, So make
• 38:27
  Speaker 3: yourself available, which I think on some level you heartline
• 38:30
  Speaker 3: or Risky benefited from They helped him out a ton.
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: But once you got used to that style, both of
• 38:38
  Speaker 3: those guys were really good at playing that game, you know,
• 38:40
  Speaker 3: playing that like get back, open, make a play. So yeah,
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: it was a huge transition for everybody. We still ended
• 38:47
  Speaker 3: up in a BCS game. We lost to Texas in
• 38:49
  Speaker 3: the festival, but still a really good team. Grew a lot,
• 38:53
  Speaker 3: and I think, like, yeah, that that next year we
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: were a very very good team. And I think that's
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: probably hardly because like Drell had the experience the year
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: before to actually get into the fire, and while he
• 39:10
  Speaker 3: was not perfect, ran a ton. He made a ton
• 39:13
  Speaker 3: of plays too. I mean he grew a lot as
• 39:15
  Speaker 3: a quarterback.
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: Can you describe him as an athlete even as a freshman,
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: like what because I mean even the Penn State game
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: in Oaight, he kind of had the ball punched out
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: there on a bit of an option type play and
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: that kind of that sealed the loss. But but just
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: a play every time he touched the ball felt like
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: it could happen, Like he could make a lot of plays.
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: What was it? Like, what right when he walked in
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: the building as an athlete.
• 39:41
  Speaker 3: Well, we kind of watched the circus too, because we
• 39:43
  Speaker 3: were we were all there already for the recruiting stuff.
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: So I mean, the big news to us was like, Okay,
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: this guy is the first guy to kind of blow
• 39:51
  Speaker 3: through the recruiting deadline and say like, no, that doesn't
• 39:53
  Speaker 3: work for me. I'm going to go a little bit later.
• 39:56
  Speaker 3: And so, like we were seeing it all on ESPN,
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: we're like and then we found it. We out and
• 40:00
  Speaker 3: we're like, okay, all right, cool. And then he gets
• 40:02
  Speaker 3: there and you're like, he's like, he's enormous and runs
• 40:09
  Speaker 3: a four to four. I mean, he's one of the
• 40:11
  Speaker 3: best athletes on the team every year he was on
• 40:14
  Speaker 3: our team, like without question, and goes on to be
• 40:19
  Speaker 3: a better receiver in the NFL. Sure, then a lot
• 40:24
  Speaker 3: then a lot of the guys that were receivers for
• 40:26
  Speaker 3: him in college, that's true, including maybe me. I mean
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: you look at the NF he was he ended up
• 40:32
  Speaker 3: being my quarterback, was probably a better receiver than me
• 40:34
  Speaker 3: in the NFL at the NFL level. So freak athlete,
• 40:39
  Speaker 3: and I think those early mistakes and you still see
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: this with quarterbacks that have a huge playmaking upside. You
• 40:46
  Speaker 3: make so many plays that you know as he as
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: a teammate and or as a fan, he end up
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: giving more grace to the mistakes like the ball getting
• 40:56
  Speaker 3: punched out at Penn State. Like yeah, we're like, that's
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: like a young mistake, that's a freshman deal. I think
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: it was a quarterback sneak and he just tried to
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: go around the outside and wasn't taking care of it. Yeah,
• 41:09
  Speaker 3: and so it's like, yeah, you don't want to see that,
• 41:13
  Speaker 3: but you're like, man, some of the other stuff that
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: you've pulled off, you get a lot of You get
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: a lot of grace. I feel like when you have
• 41:23
  Speaker 3: that much upside.
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because some of the players weren't going to be
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: made and if Beanie Wells is hurt and things like that,
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: and I mean he made those plays. I was. I
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: talked to Brian Roll for the last episode and we
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: talked about I just was always amazed Terrell had the
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: long legs and he would go to the outside so much.
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: And then when Braxton came in, probably almost as fasts
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: if not, you know, right at there speed wise. Braxton though,
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: ran up the middle more like it just was always
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: fascinating to watch Terrell run around that corner and you'd
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: see defensive backs think I got him, and nope, you can't.
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: He turned the corner on him so easily, wouldn't he.
• 41:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, No, that's probably just a comfort level some I think,
• 42:03
  Speaker 3: you know, those guys naturally just took different paths. I
• 42:06
  Speaker 3: think Braxton was always like comfortable being all surrounded by people,
• 42:11
  Speaker 3: like with like the spin moves or whatever. It was
• 42:13
  Speaker 3: felt more comfortable in there, whereas Terrell's like, you know,
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: he knew he had you know, gazelle speed if he
• 42:21
  Speaker 3: got to the outside, and so it was just more
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: comfortable out running everybody. But yeah, that was the start
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: of a run of like, you know, that style of
• 42:34
  Speaker 3: quarterback in Ohio state, because I think that was even
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: different than I mean, Troy was not the same as Turell.
• 42:40
  Speaker 3: I mean Troy could could, was more, he made plays,
• 42:44
  Speaker 3: but was more of a pocket passer than than Terrell was.
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: And then Braxton became and then like kind of how
• 42:50
  Speaker 3: how things progressed, But yeah, it was I think I
• 42:56
  Speaker 3: benefited greatly from having a guy like Terrell at quarterback.
• 43:02
  Speaker 3: Well thin it would have been fine, and you know,
• 43:04
  Speaker 3: just as.
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: What's up, Oh I'm sorry you broke up just a
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: little bit and oh nine. You had thirty six catches
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: for five hundred and seventy yards. That's you know that.
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: I have a step forward. You had a long touchdown
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: catch against Navy. I saw you caught a touchdown pass
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: from Devere Posey. Was that right? Was there a kind
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: of a trick play there against New Mexico State, Yeah.
• 43:26
  Speaker 3: We ran a reverse pass. Yeah. Every once in a
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: while Trust would throw one in there. It was usually
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: not in high stakes games. I mean, this was New Mexico, So,
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: I mean I think the trick there was that Devere's
• 43:42
  Speaker 3: a lefty and you might not know that as a
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: rever so, and you could throw the ball really well.
• 43:49
  Speaker 3: So when you see it reverse coming to that side,
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: your first thought is not this guy's gonna throw it
• 43:56
  Speaker 3: if you don't know he's a lefty. You know, like
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: it's coming back to the left. This is clearly not
• 44:00
  Speaker 3: a reverse pass. So I think that was the idea.
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: In practice it was covered or in in reality in
• 44:07
  Speaker 3: the game they did not bite at all. It was covered,
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: but to veer through it anyway, and we just I
• 44:13
  Speaker 3: just made the play in the end zone. Awesome. So yeah,
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: I do have one. I do have one. Reception from him.
• 44:24
  Speaker 3: That was a that was a rarity that we did
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: stuff like that, but it was a fun one memorable.
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: Well, you make the Rose Bull that year, and I believe,
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: I mean, that has to be a career highlight for
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: you to be able to play in the Rose Bowl
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: first of all, born and raise in Big ten country. Yeah,
• 44:39
  Speaker 2: nine catches for sixty four yards though, that was quite
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: a game against Oregon.
• 44:46
  Speaker 3: That was another one of those slightly I wouldn't even
• 44:51
  Speaker 3: say uncharacteristic. I feel like coach Trusk gets or that
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: era of football gets pegged as the trestle era that
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: we It was just like very conservative and we would
• 44:59
  Speaker 3: just you know, run the ball, run the ball, then
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: throw it. I think as a whole. Yeah, he played
• 45:06
  Speaker 3: to win games and didn't need to win by a
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: huge margin. So that was frustrating. But when the time came,
• 45:13
  Speaker 3: like I think we threw the ball in that game
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: the first thirteen plays or something. I mean, I think
• 45:20
  Speaker 3: when the time called for it and they saw something
• 45:24
  Speaker 3: on film, they committed to it and they're like, we're
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: not gonna we don't need to stick to our run
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: on first down, run on second, try to throw for
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: it on third. I mean, they we came out and
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: I don't even know if that was the game plan
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: all week. We knew we had we had a mix
• 45:40
  Speaker 3: of things in, but the coaches just when it came
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: to game time, every play that was getting called in
• 45:46
  Speaker 3: was it pass play. So I don't think it had
• 45:48
  Speaker 3: huge yardage, but I think they must have seen there's
• 45:51
  Speaker 3: a lot of opportunity for short stuff underneath. I think
• 45:54
  Speaker 3: it caught like four or five slants, and I think
• 45:58
  Speaker 3: that was probably the most number of catch wise, the
• 46:03
  Speaker 3: most I had in the game. But yeah, rose Ball,
• 46:06
  Speaker 3: unreal experience. I would still put that up there as
• 46:09
  Speaker 3: like my most memorable game just because of what the
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: place means and looks like and feels like. And yeah
• 46:19
  Speaker 3: that and that also was probably the first time that
• 46:24
  Speaker 3: year we had focused on the passing game as heavily
• 46:28
  Speaker 3: it was in our bowl game, and so Devere and
• 46:31
  Speaker 3: I that was kind of our springboard into the next year.
• 46:35
  Speaker 3: You know, that was like a really good way to
• 46:36
  Speaker 3: end that year, before we knew we were both going
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: to be there next year as the one two guys,
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: So like that was a nice like cap to that
• 46:44
  Speaker 3: one that kind of kicked off the next year for US,
• 46:47
  Speaker 3: but all time memorable game. That's one that you know,
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: all these years later when asked, that's that I always
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: point to that one as probably my most memorable game.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: And coach Tressel had a way about him too, like
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: it felt like whenever the buck guys came up against
• 47:05
  Speaker 2: the flashy new thing, like I remember the five the
• 47:09
  Speaker 2: Notre Dame game, Charlie Weiss was the focal point and
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: coach Tressel brought it to him. You guys go against Oregon,
• 47:15
  Speaker 2: a flashy newer style of offense and things like that,
• 47:18
  Speaker 2: and then you throw it, like you said, maybe the
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: first thirteen times your your roommate Brandon Saying, had a
• 47:23
  Speaker 2: huge was that a wheel route or something like that
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: there on the sideline in that game. Just a beautiful
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: play as well, very memorable Jake Ballard with the huge
• 47:30
  Speaker 2: catch right with the sunset behind him. So, yeah, your
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: career at that point, you've been in three BCS Bowls
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: and you're kind of in the national title pictures you said,
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: maybe knocked out of a little bit by USC, But
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: it kind of makes you wonder, what would what would
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: a playoff have looked like in those three or four
• 47:50
  Speaker 2: years right, I mean might have been something.
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I'm sure everybody was on those teams
• 47:56
  Speaker 3: thinks about that now because every one of them we
• 47:59
  Speaker 3: would have been in the hunt. You know, we needs
• 48:00
  Speaker 3: to have a chance, right, And so I think, like,
• 48:08
  Speaker 3: you don't know, and that's I think that the system
• 48:12
  Speaker 3: is getting better and better and more to getting like
• 48:14
  Speaker 3: giving those teams that are getting hot late a real chance.
• 48:19
  Speaker 3: But like I said, even at that time, it's the
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: Rose Bowl was a gem. It's not I don't think
• 48:26
  Speaker 3: anybody felt like, well, because we're not in the national
• 48:28
  Speaker 3: championship game. This season was like not a success. So
• 48:32
  Speaker 3: what you gain with the playoff, yes, they're but you're
• 48:36
  Speaker 3: you're gonna have to lose your last game if you're
• 48:38
  Speaker 3: in it. Only wanting first team gets to like win
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: their last one, which is the nature of playoffs in
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: most sports and what college basketball has. But there, yeah,
• 48:49
  Speaker 3: there's also that's a bigger shift to what the focus
• 48:53
  Speaker 3: of programs are because we would have seen that. As
• 48:56
  Speaker 3: you know, I think we lost one game that year.
• 48:59
  Speaker 3: We went to the Rose Bowl and won the Rose Bowl,
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: and that was like a huge celebration.
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 49:07
  Speaker 3: It's like we felt like we had. So yeah, and
• 49:10
  Speaker 3: in this year, in this world, like I should say
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: we will probably we probably enjoyed that Rose Bull more
• 49:16
  Speaker 3: than this past years team did wow, because you can't well, yeah,
• 49:23
  Speaker 3: you saw the postgame interviews, that's what they were supposed
• 49:25
  Speaker 3: to do. It's it's just like, we won that game.
• 49:27
  Speaker 3: It's great, but we've got three more. You can't fully
• 49:30
  Speaker 3: take in and enjoy and celebrate something like that if
• 49:33
  Speaker 3: you've got a game after it. You know, that's the
• 49:36
  Speaker 3: nature of bowl games. Bowl games are always that's a
• 49:39
  Speaker 3: bowl it's the last game. You're going to celebrate the
• 49:41
  Speaker 3: bowl game. But now you have like four bowl games
• 49:44
  Speaker 3: if you're going to win the national championship. So it's
• 49:47
  Speaker 3: hard you can't like embrace them all. Now they got
• 49:52
  Speaker 3: they got the best one, so I mean, like, you
• 49:55
  Speaker 3: go win the national championship. Obviously that's the one you want.
• 49:58
  Speaker 3: So I'm sure they're not worried about like man and
• 50:00
  Speaker 3: when she would have loved that joy. But it's just
• 50:05
  Speaker 3: a change. But yeah, at that that that will always
• 50:07
  Speaker 3: be top there on my my memories. But then you know, again,
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: the next year we had a really good team. I
• 50:19
  Speaker 3: mean that probably yeah.
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: Let me frame that because if we could erase our
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: memories of what happened at the end of December beginning
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: of January with the news that came out and all
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: the the distractions that you did to go ahead and
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: win the game against Arkansas. We'll get to that, But
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: going into that year, what what were your thoughts of
• 50:37
  Speaker 2: how good the team could be, because, as it turned out,
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: your only loss was at Wisconsin. You're right, it's just
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: we're so clouded by the story, right that happened at
• 50:48
  Speaker 2: the end. That we'll get to. But but going into
• 50:51
  Speaker 2: it and as you go through it up until that
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: Wisconsin game, where were you guys as.
• 50:55
  Speaker 3: A team that that was probably the best team? I
• 51:00
  Speaker 3: felt like I was on like that was we knew
• 51:03
  Speaker 3: going into that year because we had just come off
• 51:05
  Speaker 3: winning winning the Rose Bowl, beaten a good Orgon team
• 51:09
  Speaker 3: who was among the top programs, and we had everybody
• 51:12
  Speaker 3: coming back, I mean everybody that for the most part,
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: that contributed in that game would be back the next year.
• 51:20
  Speaker 3: There were some key pieces that wouldn't some guys on
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: defense of course, that you had to fill those spots.
• 51:25
  Speaker 3: But I don't know what our preseason ranking was we
• 51:27
  Speaker 3: were I mean you're so laser focused that I don't
• 51:30
  Speaker 3: remember thinking about it all that much. But we knew
• 51:34
  Speaker 3: we were we were going to be good, and even
• 51:37
  Speaker 3: I think at Wisconsin we had just gotten the number
• 51:40
  Speaker 3: one ranking that week before you lost that game, notoriously
• 51:46
  Speaker 3: tough place to play. I always blamed myself on that
• 51:49
  Speaker 3: one because I lost the coin toss and they ran
• 51:51
  Speaker 3: the opening kickoff back for a touchdown and set the tone. Yeah,
• 51:57
  Speaker 3: I was terrible at coin tosses. I don't even know
• 52:00
  Speaker 3: if I want thee but yeah, that was one of
• 52:03
  Speaker 3: the better teams. That's one of those you lost a
• 52:07
  Speaker 3: game at Wisconsin in a really hard environment and that
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: was the only game you lost, and then went down
• 52:12
  Speaker 3: and you know, the game score wise ended up closer
• 52:16
  Speaker 3: than it should have been. Against Arkansas, I mean we
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: dominated that first half and it wasn't even close and
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: kind of let them back in to a point that
• 52:23
  Speaker 3: was like scary and we had to save ourselves. But yeah,
• 52:28
  Speaker 3: that was a very very good team. Obviously the year. Yeah,
• 52:32
  Speaker 3: I got clouded with all the outside stuff, but even
• 52:37
  Speaker 3: in a four team era, I think we would have
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: had a really good shot, and I think we were,
• 52:44
  Speaker 3: if not the best among I don't even remember who
• 52:46
  Speaker 3: ended up with me, but among the best teams in
• 52:51
  Speaker 3: the country.
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm blinking on it as well. But listen, tell
• 52:57
  Speaker 2: me a little bit about the evolution of Trail prior
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: from freshman to that year, because the real shame you
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: you mentioned him playing receiver in the NFL. The real
• 53:05
  Speaker 2: shame is he didn't get a fourth year as a
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: quarterback to really continue that process. But where was he
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: by the by your senior year?
• 53:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, And if I remember, he was going to
• 53:18
  Speaker 3: come back, right, I mean I think that was the Yeah,
• 53:22
  Speaker 3: I think that was the plan. He was a junior,
• 53:24
  Speaker 3: he was going to come back for a senior year.
• 53:28
  Speaker 3: He had consistently gotten he had gotten better and better.
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: I think like the tape and the stats would would
• 53:37
  Speaker 3: play that out. But he got more and more comfortable
• 53:41
  Speaker 3: with the offense. Well, I think two things happened. He
• 53:43
  Speaker 3: got more comfortable, and the coaches understood who he was
• 53:45
  Speaker 3: as a player more so I think they could then
• 53:49
  Speaker 3: build and create things that worked well for him and
• 53:53
  Speaker 3: build the offense around him. So yeah, I think that
• 53:59
  Speaker 3: over those year years kind of was was peaking. Now
• 54:03
  Speaker 3: you would have had like there was gonna a lot
• 54:05
  Speaker 3: of our senior class was leaving, so there was a
• 54:08
  Speaker 3: lot to replace that next year. You know that Ultimately
• 54:13
  Speaker 3: coach Fickle had to figure out and make his way through,
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: especially when Terrell Hell was going to be a crucial
• 54:18
  Speaker 3: piece to that. But yeah, I mean, I guess you
• 54:23
  Speaker 3: never know. Yeah, I think it was his His junior
• 54:27
  Speaker 3: year was his best year. Senior year could have been
• 54:29
  Speaker 3: in line with that, but so many other things were happening.
• 54:33
  Speaker 3: They would have had to. You know, there was a
• 54:35
  Speaker 3: younger croper receivers coming in there. There was gonna be
• 54:38
  Speaker 3: new running backs coming in. Like our senior class was
• 54:40
  Speaker 3: a lot made up the bulk of that team, you know,
• 54:45
  Speaker 3: Brian Roll, Cam Hayward, those guys. But yeah, I guess
• 54:50
  Speaker 3: we'll I guess we'll never know. That was a weird situation,
• 54:53
  Speaker 3: and one seems in hindsight, has a whole new color
• 54:57
  Speaker 3: to it in today's world.
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: But uh, but tell me a little bit about what
• 55:03
  Speaker 2: was it like to go through it leading up to
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: the bowl game, because there was the whole like, oh,
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: they're not going to be eligible, and then there's the
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: no I mean, they already had the banner with Trail's
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: picture on it with Mitch much Stain and all that,
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: and it's like the boll It sounded like the Sugar
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: Bowl basically said no, we need these players, you know
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: that kind of thing. And that was the Cam Newton
• 55:21
  Speaker 2: here by the way. They Auburn won it, so he
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: was dealing with his own Yeah.
• 55:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we stayed out of it for the most part.
• 55:33
  Speaker 3: I mean, I remember looking back and now I'm shocked
• 55:36
  Speaker 3: at how little I knew or paid attention to the situation. Yeah,
• 55:43
  Speaker 3: there was, there was. It was a weird one. It
• 55:47
  Speaker 3: was a different era in college football. The other players
• 55:50
  Speaker 3: we were kept relatively in the dark. I didn't really
• 55:54
  Speaker 3: know what was going on. I knew those guys there
• 55:56
  Speaker 3: was question about whether they'd be eligible or not, and
• 56:03
  Speaker 3: who knows the shenanigans behind closed doors of whether they
• 56:06
  Speaker 3: should or not. The sugar Balls like no, you're not
• 56:08
  Speaker 3: going to suspend the whole team, and like we're going
• 56:09
  Speaker 3: to have a bad product out here. I'm sure there
• 56:12
  Speaker 3: was pressure there. Yeah, and then like basically saying no,
• 56:18
  Speaker 3: it doesn't count till next year. These guys can't play.
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: It doesn't make any sense. It's kind of a mess.
• 56:26
  Speaker 3: I think the whole thing was kind of handled in
• 56:28
  Speaker 3: a messy way. I don't I know we internally we
• 56:34
  Speaker 3: had a senior meeting too, where it was like posed
• 56:37
  Speaker 3: and not that I don't even know if they would
• 56:39
  Speaker 3: have coaches would have even given it any weight, but like,
• 56:41
  Speaker 3: should these guys play, Like do you think they should?
• 56:44
  Speaker 3: Were like, yeah, yeah you do. I don't think we
• 56:49
  Speaker 3: should play Arkansas without them, if that's what you're asking. So,
• 56:54
  Speaker 3: I mean, ultimately they did it. It didn't feel like
• 56:57
  Speaker 3: as big of a distraction as you would think, and
• 57:00
  Speaker 3: I think we played as such. I mean we came
• 57:03
  Speaker 3: out firing in that first half. Like I said, we
• 57:06
  Speaker 3: ran away with it to a point where like we
• 57:08
  Speaker 3: almost relaxed too much. Yeah, so yeah, we stayed into
• 57:14
  Speaker 3: this day.
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 57:15
  Speaker 3: It's funny how little I still know about the situation.
• 57:18
  Speaker 3: And I'm good friends with and host a radio show
• 57:22
  Speaker 3: with Devere and it's just like, I it's I don't
• 57:26
  Speaker 3: know the specifics. I never asked. It didn't even really
• 57:29
  Speaker 3: seem like my business, and I don't I don't know.
• 57:35
  Speaker 3: We just kind of let it play out as it was,
• 57:37
  Speaker 3: and the media probably knew more about it than we did.
• 57:40
  Speaker 3: We're just like, okay, are they playing. Are they not?
• 57:42
  Speaker 3: I mean, it didn't hurt anybody, Like, there's no really
• 57:45
  Speaker 3: we need to look at them sideways. Yeah, they probably
• 57:48
  Speaker 3: shouldn't have done any of that because they knew it
• 57:50
  Speaker 3: was legal at the illegal at the time. Yeah, you
• 57:53
  Speaker 3: shouldn't have. But then again, like these are I mean
• 57:58
  Speaker 3: that they're like your brothers at that time. These are
• 58:00
  Speaker 3: your buddies. And he's like, okay, then are you in trouble?
• 58:03
  Speaker 3: Are you grounded? Are you did you get detention? Like
• 58:06
  Speaker 3: it's something similar to that. It's like, we're not going
• 58:09
  Speaker 3: to like stress about it too much. There, everybody's healthy,
• 58:13
  Speaker 3: and so yeah, it was. It was a media distraction
• 58:17
  Speaker 3: obviously cost Trestle this job and Terrell a bunch of
• 58:21
  Speaker 3: money and some of those other guys that would have
• 58:22
  Speaker 3: had the opportunity to actually go in the normal draft. Yeah,
• 58:27
  Speaker 3: so there was a huge amount of fallout, but it
• 58:29
  Speaker 3: was kind of in it felt for me personally, like
• 58:32
  Speaker 3: in my wake because I was already I was a senior.
• 58:36
  Speaker 3: So we did our Sugar Bowl and I was on
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: to you know, combine training, draft, what's next, and just
• 58:45
  Speaker 3: kind of would catch glimpses of what was going on
• 58:48
  Speaker 3: behind me. Every now and then like well they fired him,
• 58:50
  Speaker 3: no way, Like no, oh.
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: They Yeah you were in this point. Yeah, at that
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: point you had other focuses.
• 58:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah I was, I was, I was out of there.
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: Listen, we're going on on here. I'm really enjoying it.
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: I'm going to keep you for just a few more moments.
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: You went four and OHO against that team up north,
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: you blew them out thirty seven to seven your senior year.
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: In fact, you've you got the first touchdown of that game.
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: Talk about the rivalry and becoming more a part of
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: it than than you had been as a kid growing up,
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: and then also being from where you're from, how important
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: that was to you.
• 59:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it was. It was as big as anything for
• 59:29
  Speaker 3: me and for those those teams. And I think it
• 59:34
  Speaker 3: is a different time now than it was then because
• 59:37
  Speaker 3: the incentives are different across college football. I think at
• 59:42
  Speaker 3: that time, like I said, there was not an intense
• 59:46
  Speaker 3: emphasis on winning a national championship across the board for
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: every team. Now that pressure is always on Ohio State
• 59:52
  Speaker 3: and it's going to be there. But the traditions held
• 59:55
  Speaker 3: up as much weight as as the oh championships did,
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 3: so you know, it was always it was a big game.
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 3: It was a huge like marker for any one of
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 3: those years or through my career. You know, it's like
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 3: you knew like this was going to be what happened
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 3: that year? Okay, did you We ended up winning them all,
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 3: so it was like you had those but like those
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 3: were like your hahollmark, You're always going to remember that one,
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 3: and being from Toledo where it is, there's a huge
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 3: emphasis on it up there still even stranger. I mean,
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 3: it was wild the first the first time I was
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 3: ever in that game wearing the uniforms and like seeing
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 3: it with my own eyes, like on the field, it
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 3: takes a minute, like you got to get used to it.
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 3: If you if you meant it, you're like, well, this
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 3: is like I watched this every year as a kid,
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 3: watching what was going to be the outcome, and now
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 3: I have an impact on whatever that outcome is. So
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 3: they weren't very good in those years. Frankly, they if
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 3: you looked like they're read. There was a couple of
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 3: years that they won three four games, so we didn't
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 3: have the one two matchup like the six team did.
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 3: They were definitely in transition. We knew they would eventually
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 3: be good. Again, that's just what happens. But yeah, that'll
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 3: always be a big piece of my college experience was
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 3: the you know, being a part of that rivalry because
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 3: of the status that the game held and on some
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 3: level still holds in Ohio and in ohioan's lives, especially
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 3: in Northwest Ohio lives. It's like, yeah, I'll always be
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 3: like proud of being a part of that, and it
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 3: almost on some level lives in its own space in
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 3: my Ohio State career. It's like what you did at
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 3: Ohio State and then Ohio State machine games. They're obviously intertwined,
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 3: but they almost live in their own silos just because
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 3: it was a it's a special game it was. It
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 3: was just different. It feel like an in season game.
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 3: It felt like something outside of the rest of them.
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 3: So yeah, it'll always be to me. The you know,
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 3: those are I'm I'm plenty happy that they were rebuilding
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 3: at the time and we were really hot at the
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 3: time because those weren't all that competitive games, but they
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 3: were just as sweet. And you know, you get to
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 3: take that with you now that I'm in my mid
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 3: thirties that okay, well, those are those are definitely cherished experiences.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 2: Aw, well, real quickly, take me through kind of what
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: draft day was like and then going undrafted and then
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 2: going to you sign with the Bears. I was wondering
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: about that because I'm sure you hope to be drafted, right,
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: I mean everyone wants too, but.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you get your draft grades and I was grade
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 3: it's somewhere like third to sixth round or third to seventh.
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 3: So yeah, I expected to be drafted. I agreed to
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 3: do this thing at the time too. The Big Ten
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 3: network was having this path to the pros, you know,
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 3: they would follow you around. So they had four guys
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 3: in the Big Ten that they were following through this
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 3: process in all levels of it. So like JJ Watt
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 3: was the one who's like, Okay, he's gonna be a
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 3: first rounder, and then it was me and a couple
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 3: other guys, a guy from Penn State. So anyways, Yeah,
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 3: on Draft Day, I had this camera crew at my house.
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 3: So I'm like, it was just two days of it
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 3: because it was like the whole second day, I'm like,
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 3: we're going through It's like okay, probably not necessarily gets
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 3: to the end. And then the whole third day I
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 3: was like, okay, certainly this is the day, and then
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 3: you get to the end and then it was the lockout.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 3: Like the lockout happened at the end, so it's right,
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 3: you went back into that and you still didn't know
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 3: where you were going. So it was a bit. Yeah,
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 3: it was a little like it's motivating on some level,
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 3: but it was a shock to the system because it
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 3: was like, man, that was a starting all over and
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 3: then you got to go do it all again. It
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 3: did make making the team in Chicago and then having
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 3: a four year career all that sweeter, I will say,
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 3: And uh, yeah, it was just that that process was
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 3: was tough. But I mean, I it is what it is.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 3: I get it. If you're going to take a shot
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 3: in late rounds, if I'm a GM. Typically how NFL
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 3: teams tend to do it is like who's got the
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 3: highest highest upside, basically, who's the best athlete we can
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 3: get sure, And I think people knew what they were
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 3: going to get.
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 2: With me.
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 3: It was like a number three wide receiver. Maybe do
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 3: a little bit on special teams, but probably not a
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 3: whole lot. It's pretty specialized. So at this point, my
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 3: older me now can look back and not harbor that much,
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 3: but It was a stressful experience, but I think I
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 3: made the most out of it when I was in
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 3: the you know, when I finally got to Chicago and
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 3: got to have a four year career, which I would
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 3: have never thought would have been a thing again growing up,
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 3: not really having any of this on my radar.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, and you caught twenty seven pass or twenty
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 2: seven passes for two hundred and seventy six yards three
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: touchdowns as a rookie, and then your second year you
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 2: go through the year with Chicago. But then it was
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 2: kind of weird, right because they they let you go
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 2: right after Christmas, and all of a sudden, boom, you're
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 2: with the Bengals, which that's my favorite team by the way,
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 2: so we were excited to have you.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I was happy that somebody picked me up. Yeah,
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 3: I got cut on Christmas Eve or day. Yeah, and
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 3: then was in Cincinnati the next day. I drove down
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 3: because they wanted me to beat like some orm that
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 3: was coming in and was practicing the next day. That
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 3: was like my first real welcome to like you want
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 3: this to be your career, this is how it works.
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 3: But I really loved being in back in Ohio too.
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 3: Like I liked. It was a good shift to I
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 3: liked a lot of the guys I played with there,
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 3: made some really good friends in Cincinnati. Yeah, it was
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 3: just it was a different point in my career where
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 3: I kind of knew where I settled into, like my
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 3: role on an NFL roster. But yeah, I got really
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 3: I was able to play a lot as a rookie,
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 3: which again was in the right place, and some injuries
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 3: happened and put myself in a position. Yeah, it was weird.
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 3: The whole NFL experience. It was a whirlwind. It was
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 3: you know, it's awesome, crazy, cool, stressful, all those things. Yeah,
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 3: I don't know, looking back on it, I would have
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 3: never been able to do at the time. But I
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 3: wish the draft and all that puts such a bad
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 3: taste in your mouth when really it's like, I don't
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 3: think I ever took time to like really like enjoy
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 3: what college was, what Ohio State was, what playing there was,
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 3: or even after I was done, like looking back on
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 3: like thig reflecting on it, there just wasn't time because
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 3: you're always thinking about, even my senior year, where does
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 3: this put me in the draft? Where does this put
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 3: me in the next step. You have to have that mindset.
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 3: But NFL as a whole, it was. It was great.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 3: It's a cool experience. People are impressed by it. I'm
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 3: glad it's on my resume, but it was relatively hollow
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 3: compared to what Ohio State was. You know, it's it's
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 3: it's it's pro and there's not It's very much a business.
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 3: It's just not the same thing. It's not the same
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 3: thing at all as what like that experience at Ohio
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 3: State was. And it I had to get all the
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 3: way out of the NFL and have years of distance
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 3: to be able to look back and I'll move back
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 3: to Columbus and understand and appreciate what that thing was.
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 3: Sure reconnect and still have friends from the college group.
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 3: And what Ohio State provided that an NFL team will
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 3: it will never give you or provide. So it's I
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 3: get to cherish it now. But yeah, that's why I
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 3: think I talk about the NFL in that way. Now.
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 3: It's just like it feels like Ohio State was the thing,
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 3: and then the NFL was just like a series of like,
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 3: yeah it was cool, made these plays, Yeah it was fine.
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 3: Went to this team that was school, made some money. Okay,
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 3: was done? And then you know, did I lose yet? Okay? Yeah,
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 3: and then you get back to back to real world,
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 3: real life, you see what things actually had an impact
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 3: on your life.
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 2: Let me get you, let me get you out of
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 2: here on this because, as I said, I've kept you
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 2: way longer. And I said, I'm sorry, but who are
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 2: some of your closest teammates of the Higher State, Like,
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 2: you know, your best friends. I know off air, you
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 2: talked about rooming with Brandon, saying, tell me a little
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 2: bit about a couple of one or two or three
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 2: of your best friends from high State.
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah. So Brandon Sam was my college roommate freshman year.
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 3: We were roomed together. We lived together for the rest
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 3: of our college, even off campus. I was the best
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 3: man in his wedding. He was in mind. I'm godfather
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 3: of his oldest child. We still I mean, he lives
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 3: in Wisconsin. He's still one of my best friends. You know,
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 3: I still keep in touch. I mean, Divere and I
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 3: work together on some level on a on a radio show. Yeah,
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 3: Kirk Coleman, I'm still very close with when he comes
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 3: back in town. There's like all of them, like Cam Hayward.
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 3: I haven't seen him in years and years, but we'd
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 3: be right back at it if he was in town
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 3: and I ran into him. And that's just how it works.
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 3: Chimney check Well, Brian Browning, Dexter Layermore, all these guys
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 3: that still live in Columbus. I mean, shoot, didn't even
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 3: mention I work with. I work with one of my
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 3: really good friends and former teammates now, So yeah, that's
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 3: the family. I guess that's just like what it that's
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 3: what it brings, and I hope that that can somehow
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 3: be retained in the new world of college football.
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I hope so too.
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 3: Obviously I understand the moving around, and I do think
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 3: you should try to maximize whatever benefit you can get
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 3: from college football. But yeah, there's that piece that you're
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 3: going to have to give up. And that's the one that,
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 3: like you only get when you hang your hat on
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 3: one place, Micha, ohiose call ever. It's the only school
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 3: I'll ever call home, you know, It's that's that's the one.
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 3: And I think as a whole I've been my life
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 3: has been very much benefited and enriched by that.
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 2: Well, I'll tell you this as I'll let you go
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 2: the the time. Was a Buckeye fan for me throughout
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: my years. I've always had and it's never been like
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 2: one to the next, but it's like, hey, identify that
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 2: as one of my favorite players. You you were my
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 2: wife and my my guy back then, so we're really
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 2: excited with the Bengals. My wife would get it very
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 2: excited when you caught up pass. Uh, that's a lot
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 2: of she'd scream out your name because she enjoyed saying
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 2: your name so much. So well, thank you, but a
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 2: lot of good memories watching you play football. And in
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 2: this hour plus, I've really enjoyed get to know you
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 2: a little bit. Thanks so much for taking some time.
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I appreciate it anytime I can. It's uh,
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 3: it's been one of the cool parts of being back
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 3: in Columbus too. It's humbling whenever people like recognize me
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 3: or John Green gives a shout out or yeah, or
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 3: even I run into people who like yourself and they
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 3: say like, oh, yeah, you were one of my favorite
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 3: Like it's I have to like remember, oh, yeah, I
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 3: did do that. That is uh, that's great. I made
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 3: a move back somewhere. So no, I appreciate you having
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 3: me man.
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 2: Well, thanks for turning into Buckeye Banter. Everyone hit the
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 2: like and subscribe buttons for Buckeye Huddle and all the
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 2: content there on the site. And until next time, thanks
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 2: for tuning in.