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Female Firsts: Eunice Foote · Stuff Mom Never Told You

0:05
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to stuff
0:07
Speaker 1: I Never told you production of I Heart Radio. And
0:19
Speaker 1: today we are doing another female first, which means we
0:22
Speaker 1: are once again joined by our good friend, the fabulous,
0:25
Speaker 1: the Magnificent Eve's welcome Eves. Hey everyone, Yeah, thanks, Yeah,
0:30
Speaker 1: I'm welcoming you now because I'm taking this show over.
0:33
Speaker 1: You are welcome to I've been waiting you are never
0:40
Speaker 1: welcoming to us all along to just comment this space.
0:46
Speaker 1: I love it. It came out of you. Just you
0:49
Speaker 1: give off a welcoming vibe, to be honest, you, so
0:53
Speaker 1: we're happy to give it to you. And we're you know,
0:58
Speaker 1: we were just having a very fun conversation about because
1:01
Speaker 1: we're having some technological woes. We're talking about science today, um,
1:07
Speaker 1: and some old school technologies and things that we used
1:12
Speaker 1: to do around like old like iPods and old phones
1:17
Speaker 1: and like mity ring tones and all that stuff. That
1:19
Speaker 1: is one of my very favorite things, honestly to talk about.
1:23
Speaker 1: Like I love the sort of obscure technology that is
1:27
Speaker 1: useless now but at one time was the coolest thing. Yeah,
1:32
Speaker 1: and how cumbersome and just inefficient some of those things were. Yeah,
1:36
Speaker 1: I was going back through a bin of a lot
1:38
Speaker 1: of my old stuff and just running down memory lane
1:41
Speaker 1: and thinking about all this, the rhyme stone stickers that
1:44
Speaker 1: I put things that were just completely unnecessary and truly
1:47
Speaker 1: got in the way more so than did anything for aesthetics.
1:52
Speaker 1: I feel like a lot of a lot of the
1:54
Speaker 1: stuff from that time, you've summed it up very well,
1:58
Speaker 1: was cumbersome. But we liked it. Yes, yes, that is
2:04
Speaker 1: one of my very favorite things. I was telling them,
2:07
Speaker 1: as samanthony Us before this, that I I had like
2:11
Speaker 1: a song for everybody who would call me, and then
2:14
Speaker 1: I had a very long answering message, like a voicemail
2:18
Speaker 1: message that I purchased with my money in high school.
2:22
Speaker 1: And it was a mission impossible, themes like, it was
2:25
Speaker 1: way too long. It was embarrassing, but you know, I
2:28
Speaker 1: liked it. Yeah, wasn't it. I don't know if I'm
2:32
Speaker 1: remembering this incorrectly or not, but weren't you also able
2:35
Speaker 1: to make songs ring tones of the dial tone when
2:40
Speaker 1: somebody call you, you would hear the song that that
2:42
Speaker 1: person on the other the receiving in what wants you
2:44
Speaker 1: to hear? Was that a thing? Yeah? Yeah, oh, it
2:49
Speaker 1: was a thing, And It was always started with this
2:52
Speaker 1: song is brought to you by whomever, the company they
2:55
Speaker 1: bought it from. Oh yes, so overnoxious. It was not.
3:00
Speaker 1: It's also making a lot of assumptions about what people
3:03
Speaker 1: on the other side want to hear, like that's true,
3:07
Speaker 1: that's true. It's kind of a thought exercise at that point,
3:11
Speaker 1: too much. I got into it. Mine was It was
3:14
Speaker 1: a very short snippet from a song Homecoming on the
3:19
Speaker 1: American Idiot album by Green Day, and it was nobody
3:22
Speaker 1: likes you, Nobody wants to hang out with you. That
3:26
Speaker 1: was my song. So people were sending very overt messages
3:29
Speaker 1: to the people that I'm like, wait, are you mad
3:35
Speaker 1: at me? Or should I be concerned for you? Like?
3:37
Speaker 1: Where are we today? It was loved you questioning. Oh gosh,
3:44
Speaker 1: I could talk about this forever, but we do have
3:47
Speaker 1: a lot to discuss today. This is a fascinating story
3:50
Speaker 1: and a fascinating person you've brought to as eaves um,
3:53
Speaker 1: So who are we talking about today? Today? We're talking
3:56
Speaker 1: about Unice Foot and her first was that she was
3:59
Speaker 1: as person to link carbon dioxide to atmospheric warming, which
4:04
Speaker 1: is related to a lot of the things we talked
4:06
Speaker 1: about today because it's related to climate change, even though
4:10
Speaker 1: her and a lot of other people who were working
4:12
Speaker 1: in physics at the time weren't quite as concerned as
4:15
Speaker 1: we are today with climate change and the effects that
4:18
Speaker 1: it can have. But they were looking at the history, um,
4:21
Speaker 1: and the present and a little bit of the future
4:23
Speaker 1: of what it meant for the climate to be different
4:27
Speaker 1: at different points in time and how that affected the
4:29
Speaker 1: populations on Earth. And this was one of those ones
4:32
Speaker 1: where it was striking to me that, uh, this conversation
4:37
Speaker 1: had gone back further than I realized, and we're still
4:40
Speaker 1: having it very like urgent matter today. Just that it
4:47
Speaker 1: they were talking about it back then and steadying it
4:49
Speaker 1: back then. Um, it just really stuck with me. Yeah,
4:54
Speaker 1: I know, yeah, because this well, Unice, she was born
4:57
Speaker 1: in eighteen nineteen, so this kind station was happening all
5:01
Speaker 1: the way back in the eighteen hundreds, And of course
5:04
Speaker 1: there was their understanding of climate science was a lot
5:07
Speaker 1: different than it is today, and they didn't use a
5:10
Speaker 1: lot of the same terminology that we used today, and
5:11
Speaker 1: they didn't have because they didn't have the same understanding.
5:14
Speaker 1: But she was part of this foundation. She was part
5:17
Speaker 1: of the pioneering group of people, albeit her contributions weren't
5:21
Speaker 1: as weighty or significant, or maybe wady is the wrong word.
5:25
Speaker 1: She just didn't go as deep into UM the research
5:28
Speaker 1: around these things as some of the other UM scientists
5:31
Speaker 1: who were working in the field did. But she was
5:34
Speaker 1: a significant part of this history. So we can start
5:39
Speaker 1: when she was born. So she was born on July seventeen,
5:42
Speaker 1: eighteen nineteen and Goshen, Connecticut. Her name was Eunice Newton
5:47
Speaker 1: UM and she was one of eleven children. Her parents
5:50
Speaker 1: did have twelve children, but one of her sisters had
5:52
Speaker 1: died as a young child, and her parents were Tears
5:55
Speaker 1: of Newton. That was spelled t h I r Z
5:59
Speaker 1: A not exactly sure how to put out SEP, but
6:00
Speaker 1: tears and Newton will say and Isaac Newton Jr. Was
6:04
Speaker 1: her father's name. Reportedly he was a distant relative of
6:07
Speaker 1: Isaac Newton. And she went to Troy Female Seminary, which
6:13
Speaker 1: was a school in New York which is now called
6:15
Speaker 1: Emma Willard School, and through her experience here she was
6:19
Speaker 1: able to attend science lectures at a nearby school, so
6:23
Speaker 1: early on she did have some study and training in science.
6:28
Speaker 1: Though UM she didn't go that deeply into her scientific
6:32
Speaker 1: training in academia, but she spent most of her earlier
6:36
Speaker 1: years in New York, and she did read scientific journals
6:39
Speaker 1: and she conducted her own experiments, so she was doing
6:42
Speaker 1: her She had her own personal interests in philosophy and science,
6:46
Speaker 1: and she chose to pursue those things in her personal life.
6:49
Speaker 1: But at the time, as we know we talked about
6:53
Speaker 1: UM in recent episodes when we spoke a little bit
6:55
Speaker 1: about astronomy in a previous episode in women's role in
6:58
Speaker 1: science in that few old but in general, scientific fields
7:03
Speaker 1: were dominated by men at the time for various reasons,
7:06
Speaker 1: and women's access to studying, researching, and publishing in science
7:11
Speaker 1: was restricted. Plus, physics research and interests in the US
7:15
Speaker 1: kind of pilled in comparison to what was happening in Europe.
7:17
Speaker 1: So there was a lot more chatter and a lot
7:20
Speaker 1: more research and interest in research from scientists in the
7:23
Speaker 1: general population in the physics field in Europe, but there
7:26
Speaker 1: was still some in the US. It just wasn't happening
7:29
Speaker 1: at the same scale. UM. In eighteen forty one, she
7:32
Speaker 1: married Alicia Foote, who was a judge, amateur scientist, an
7:37
Speaker 1: inventor and a mathematician, and at one point he served
7:42
Speaker 1: as commissioner of the U. S. Patent Office. The two
7:45
Speaker 1: of them had two daughters, which was married in eighteen
7:48
Speaker 1: forty two and Augusta in eighteen forty four. UM. And
7:54
Speaker 1: it's noted that in eighteen forty eight she signed the
7:56
Speaker 1: Declaration of Sentiments UM, which I'm sure a lot of
7:59
Speaker 1: your dance would be familiar with, since y'all talk about
8:02
Speaker 1: feminist history a lot that happened at the Seneca Falls
8:05
Speaker 1: Convention in New York. Her husband also signed the declaration,
8:08
Speaker 1: and that document advocated for women's rights, and she ended
8:13
Speaker 1: up doing There's there's not a ton of history written
8:16
Speaker 1: about her early life and her education, UM, and some
8:21
Speaker 1: of the things that she did around her role in
8:23
Speaker 1: advocacy for women's rights. But she was in New York
8:27
Speaker 1: and was moving in the same fields as other feminists
8:30
Speaker 1: and other abolitionists and a lot of people who were
8:32
Speaker 1: activists at the time in spaces like that. Moving on
8:47
Speaker 1: to her scientific work, she did do an experiment that
8:51
Speaker 1: could have been a response to theories that she had
8:54
Speaker 1: read in Scientific American about how the sun heats Earth.
8:58
Speaker 1: And as I said, her husband was also an amateur scientist.
9:01
Speaker 1: He was an inventor, and she was also an inventor,
9:04
Speaker 1: but her husband was also doing studies on solar radiation
9:07
Speaker 1: at the time. He became a member of the American
9:10
Speaker 1: Association for the Advancement of Science in eighteen fifty six. So,
9:14
Speaker 1: in Unite's experiment, she used thermometer. She used two glass cylinders,
9:22
Speaker 1: and she used an air pump and her work and
9:25
Speaker 1: she put a thermometer in each of those tubes to
9:27
Speaker 1: measure its temperature. She exposed these cylinders to the sun,
9:31
Speaker 1: and she used the pump to draw air from one
9:34
Speaker 1: and compress it in the other. And she found that
9:37
Speaker 1: the cylinder with compressed air heated faster. She also found
9:41
Speaker 1: that the moist air heated faster than the dry air.
9:45
Speaker 1: And she found that the cylinder with what she called
9:48
Speaker 1: carbonic acid gas also known as carbon dioxide got much
9:52
Speaker 1: hotter than the cylinder that was full of what she
9:55
Speaker 1: called common air. And so here's a quote from what
9:59
Speaker 1: she's said in her study. The receiver containing the gas
10:04
Speaker 1: became itself much heated, very sensibly more so than the other,
10:08
Speaker 1: and on being removed, it was many times as long
10:11
Speaker 1: and cooling an atmosphere of that gas would give to
10:15
Speaker 1: our earth a high temperature. And if, as some suppose,
10:19
Speaker 1: at one period of its history the air had mixed
10:21
Speaker 1: with it a larger proportion than at present, an increased
10:25
Speaker 1: temperature from its own action as well as from increased weight,
10:29
Speaker 1: must have necessarily resulted. So she also in that experiment
10:34
Speaker 1: tested cylinders that contain hydrogen and oxygen. So there have
10:39
Speaker 1: been recently in recent years people who have written about
10:44
Speaker 1: her work kind of a resurgence of interest in her
10:46
Speaker 1: work after it was dug back up from the archives.
10:49
Speaker 1: According to a paper that was written by Joseph d
10:53
Speaker 1: Ortiz and Roland Jackson, Unice aimed to and she did,
10:57
Speaker 1: answer the following three questions with her experiment, And those questions,
11:01
Speaker 1: as they stated in the paper, were does the concentration
11:05
Speaker 1: of gas in the atmosphere affect is warming response to
11:07
Speaker 1: the Sun's rays? The other question was does the composition
11:11
Speaker 1: of the gas in the atmosphere affect is warming response
11:14
Speaker 1: to the sun rays? And the last question was can
11:17
Speaker 1: the effect of different gases on the warming response of
11:20
Speaker 1: the sun rays be ranked? But there were, of course
11:24
Speaker 1: these limitations to her work. She did, I mean as
11:28
Speaker 1: we spoke about earlier, like we didn't have the same understanding.
11:32
Speaker 1: This was still the beginning stages of our understanding about
11:35
Speaker 1: the greenhouse effect and greenhouse gases and how those things
11:39
Speaker 1: affected climate change. She was at the forefront of that,
11:41
Speaker 1: so she didn't answer the how and the why those
11:44
Speaker 1: gases could raise Earth's temperature. Also, the paper wasn't completely
11:49
Speaker 1: clear about her scientific methods, about the the details of
11:53
Speaker 1: the experimentation itself, so there are limitations in our understanding
11:57
Speaker 1: of what she did because of that. But in August
12:00
Speaker 1: of eighteen fifty six, her paper was presented at the
12:04
Speaker 1: tenth Annual Meeting of the a S and she didn't
12:08
Speaker 1: present it. Joseph Henry did, who was the secretary of
12:12
Speaker 1: the Smithsonian Institution at the time. Women did speak at
12:15
Speaker 1: those meetings, but it was uncommon. But yeah, so there
12:19
Speaker 1: were reports of her work and other journals afterwards, people
12:23
Speaker 1: talking about her role. UM. According to a later summary
12:27
Speaker 1: by David A. Wells and the Annual of Scientific Discovery,
12:32
Speaker 1: Henry had prefaced the presentation of the paper, Henry being
12:36
Speaker 1: the guy who presented it at the meeting. UM. He
12:39
Speaker 1: had prefaced the presentation of the paper by saying something
12:42
Speaker 1: along the lines of science. Was of no country and
12:45
Speaker 1: of no sex, so it seems like he kind of
12:48
Speaker 1: hyped up her role as a woman and being able
12:50
Speaker 1: to do this kind of scientific investigation, and probably most
12:55
Speaker 1: likely Um needed to do that in order to get
12:58
Speaker 1: people to listen um and understand the significance of it
13:02
Speaker 1: and why it was being presented at the time. It's
13:05
Speaker 1: although it was it wasn't completely clear why he was
13:09
Speaker 1: the one who presented it like that wasn't explicitly stated,
13:12
Speaker 1: but likely had something to do. Likely had to do
13:14
Speaker 1: with the fact that she was a woman. But the
13:16
Speaker 1: name of that paper was Circumstance Affecting the Heat of
13:20
Speaker 1: the Sun's Race, and it wasn't published in the conference proceedings.
13:25
Speaker 1: Neither she nor the presentation were mented in that proceedings
13:28
Speaker 1: volume that came out of that meaning. But that paper
13:32
Speaker 1: was published in the American Journal of Science and Arts
13:35
Speaker 1: that November, and you can actually go look at that online.
13:39
Speaker 1: It doesn't take very long to read at all. It's
13:41
Speaker 1: only like a page and a half long, and it
13:43
Speaker 1: comes right after her husband's paper on the heat in
13:46
Speaker 1: the Sun's rays. It was published right before and right
13:49
Speaker 1: after the end of that page. Um, at the very
13:53
Speaker 1: last page of his paper was hers and the pieces
14:00
Speaker 1: that covered her afterward, and publications like Scientific American that
14:04
Speaker 1: didn't bring up that she did this work and that
14:05
Speaker 1: had been presented mentioned how her work showed that women
14:09
Speaker 1: could do valid work in scientific inquiry, although they didn't
14:14
Speaker 1: really talk about the content of the work, which is
14:17
Speaker 1: I think something that we're very very familiar with, you know,
14:21
Speaker 1: a lot of ad being made about the gender of
14:24
Speaker 1: the person when it was women who were doing something,
14:26
Speaker 1: and much less ado happening about the actual content of
14:29
Speaker 1: the work. And now that I'm thinking about that, like,
14:31
Speaker 1: I'm really glad that we have this series doing female
14:35
Speaker 1: first because that kind of like allows us to high
14:38
Speaker 1: like that, yes they were women, but like here are
14:40
Speaker 1: there fabulously intricate stories and significant stories that there's a
14:46
Speaker 1: bunch of content underneath those headlines. So um, that was
14:50
Speaker 1: clear in some of the pieces that were written about
14:53
Speaker 1: her work too. Yeah, I mean it's one of I
14:56
Speaker 1: don't know the tone, but it does feel kind of like, oh,
14:59
Speaker 1: look of it a mintary can do, but not talking
15:02
Speaker 1: about like what she actually did or accomplished, much more like, Okay,
15:07
Speaker 1: she can do it. And now let's let them in
15:09
Speaker 1: do their work. So yes, I I also appreciate that
15:13
Speaker 1: you bring those stories, these stories does and we can
15:16
Speaker 1: talk about what they did. And Unis she only published
15:22
Speaker 1: two known papers, but they were the first two physics
15:26
Speaker 1: papers that were published by a woman in the United States.
15:29
Speaker 1: The paper, the other paper that she published was just
15:32
Speaker 1: a year later, in eighteen fifty seven, and that was
15:34
Speaker 1: called on a New Source of Electrical Excitation. So if
15:40
Speaker 1: you look up Unis foot story, you'll see that the
15:43
Speaker 1: fact that she had this first was it was overshadowed
15:47
Speaker 1: by other men who had done research in the field
15:52
Speaker 1: very early on. And we're foundational in the history of
15:56
Speaker 1: modern climate science. So that one of those people was
15:59
Speaker 1: Irish physicists John Tendall, who is considered a founder of
16:02
Speaker 1: modern climate science. He has been credited with discovering the
16:07
Speaker 1: absorption of thermal radiation by carbon dioxide and water vapor.
16:12
Speaker 1: He announced his discovery in eighteen fifty nine, which was
16:15
Speaker 1: three years after Foot's eighteen fifty six paper, and in
16:19
Speaker 1: it he showed that water vapor and gases like carbon
16:22
Speaker 1: dioxide absorb and emit thermal infrared energy rather than visible sunlight,
16:28
Speaker 1: which was what Unice Foot did. Her experiment with visible sunlight,
16:33
Speaker 1: she used sunlight in shade and her experiment which she
16:36
Speaker 1: put the cylinders in to test the rising of the
16:40
Speaker 1: temperatures and the cooling of the temperatures in both of
16:43
Speaker 1: those places. But it wasn't until eighteen sixty one when
16:47
Speaker 1: Tendel himself suggested that changes in the amounts of water,
16:51
Speaker 1: vapor and carbon dioxide that we're in the atmosphere could
16:54
Speaker 1: cause changes in climate. So that's where that link with
16:58
Speaker 1: those what we now call in house gases. They weren't
17:01
Speaker 1: calling them that back then, but those changes in the
17:03
Speaker 1: water vapor um and the carbon dioxide and the carbon
17:08
Speaker 1: dioxide being a thing that Unice Foot worked with and
17:11
Speaker 1: that was integraling her getting her first because she linked
17:14
Speaker 1: it with climate change. Tindall didn't make that link until
17:18
Speaker 1: eighteen sixty one. He didn't reference Foots work, although he
17:22
Speaker 1: did called back and credit other people who had done
17:25
Speaker 1: earlier work in the field. And you know, it didn't
17:29
Speaker 1: help also that Foot's experiment was not explained comprehensively. It
17:33
Speaker 1: didn't have illustrations to go along with it. If you
17:36
Speaker 1: go look at the work, then you'll see that She
17:39
Speaker 1: did have this graph of the temperatures that she used
17:41
Speaker 1: in that paper, but she didn't have any illustrations, and
17:45
Speaker 1: she didn't differentiate between the effect of solar radiation and
17:49
Speaker 1: the effect of long wave infrared radiation, which is more
17:53
Speaker 1: of the radiation that we're concerned with when talking about
17:57
Speaker 1: the greenhouse effect and the effect that the car indo
18:00
Speaker 1: side has on the atmosphere and climate, and so greenhouse gases,
18:06
Speaker 1: of which carbon dioxide is one, they let the sun's
18:10
Speaker 1: light shine onto Earth's surface, but then they also trapped
18:13
Speaker 1: the heat that's radiated by Earth back up into the atmosphere,
18:18
Speaker 1: and that whole process, what we now call the greenhouse effect,
18:22
Speaker 1: is what keeps the planet's climate comfortable, which is why
18:28
Speaker 1: this is such a big conversation right now. And the
18:30
Speaker 1: fact that the amounts of carbon dioxide that we're emitting
18:33
Speaker 1: through the all these huge industrial economic processes that we
18:38
Speaker 1: have as a human species on the Earth, and how
18:41
Speaker 1: the rising amounts of carbon dioxide meant into the atmosphere
18:45
Speaker 1: affect the climate change um and has led to the
18:49
Speaker 1: process that we now call global warming. So that's all
18:52
Speaker 1: that all her work ties into that. But even though
18:56
Speaker 1: she didn't make a distinction between solar radiation and radiate
19:00
Speaker 1: heat from the Earth. She does seem to have been
19:02
Speaker 1: the first person to notice how carbon dioxide and water
19:06
Speaker 1: vapor together absorb heat and to then from there to
19:11
Speaker 1: make the direct link between changes in these things and
19:15
Speaker 1: changes in climate. So there are some sources, including a
19:20
Speaker 1: twenty nineteen paper by scientists Roland Jackson, that say that
19:24
Speaker 1: it's likely that Tindall was unaware of Foots work. He
19:27
Speaker 1: didn't know about it. He wasn't interested in climate change.
19:31
Speaker 1: Jackson says it wasn't the main focus of his work,
19:34
Speaker 1: but that others in hindsight have dubbed him a father
19:38
Speaker 1: of climate science, but he wasn't the one who put
19:40
Speaker 1: that title on himself, and Jackson um in that paper
19:47
Speaker 1: asserted that there were several things that were to account
19:49
Speaker 1: for her work getting little recognition at the time. That
19:53
Speaker 1: included a coherent scientific community, let alone one in the
19:57
Speaker 1: physics field was just urgeining in the US, it was
20:01
Speaker 1: just forming. Communication with Europe was shoddy, it wasn't great,
20:05
Speaker 1: so there were things that got lost in translation across
20:09
Speaker 1: the Atlantic. She was an amateur scientist without extensive formal training,
20:14
Speaker 1: and she was a woman at a time when many
20:16
Speaker 1: people view women as incompetent or less capable in science,
20:21
Speaker 1: and they didn't have much opportunity to join scientific communities,
20:24
Speaker 1: are published in scientific journals. So those are some of
20:28
Speaker 1: the reasons that Jackson and other people who are more
20:30
Speaker 1: on the stance of like, it probably was just the
20:32
Speaker 1: case that Tendall didn't know about it. He didn't see
20:34
Speaker 1: the work, So it's not like he was purposefully snubbing
20:37
Speaker 1: her or discrediting her work. He just didn't know. But
20:41
Speaker 1: there are other people who do think that Tendall had
20:43
Speaker 1: to be aware of her work. He was working in
20:46
Speaker 1: the field. Uh, So he was a researcher who looked
20:51
Speaker 1: to other people to be able to complete his own
20:54
Speaker 1: work and add on to theirs, as he noted in
20:57
Speaker 1: some of the credits that he gave to others, and
21:00
Speaker 1: and her work. Foots work was republished in some European journals,
21:04
Speaker 1: and because it was a kind of a known thing
21:06
Speaker 1: that Tendal view women as intellectually inferior to men. So
21:11
Speaker 1: there are views on both sides, but overall, like, I'm
21:16
Speaker 1: definitely not the one to make the judgment of what happened,
21:18
Speaker 1: and I'm not sure if anybody could ever make that
21:21
Speaker 1: determination if we don't find something directly from Tindal that if,
21:25
Speaker 1: I mean, it would how scandalous would it be if
21:28
Speaker 1: we did, like dig up some letter from Tendal to
21:31
Speaker 1: some other huge scientists be like, yeah, I heard of
21:34
Speaker 1: that foot girl. You know, we got his word of
21:36
Speaker 1: some of her papers over here in these journals. But
21:39
Speaker 1: you know, I'm not even gonna try to do a
21:40
Speaker 1: British accent. But she's just a silly American and she's
21:44
Speaker 1: just a woman, And what does she know she's talking about.
21:46
Speaker 1: She doesn't even she hasn't even gone to school for this.
21:48
Speaker 1: So I mean, that would be scandalous and a great,
21:52
Speaker 1: great historical thing to find if you're you know, into
21:56
Speaker 1: you know, that kind of shade. But otherwise I don't
22:00
Speaker 1: think that, you know, there's a way um to fully
22:04
Speaker 1: know if we don't get those words from Tindal himself.
22:06
Speaker 1: But at the end of the day, it's important to
22:09
Speaker 1: view it holistically in terms of like, yes, there were
22:14
Speaker 1: legitimate um limitations too, maybe two Tindal's ability to have
22:21
Speaker 1: access to it, and perhaps from his own shortcomings of
22:25
Speaker 1: maybe he did see it and just skipped over it.
22:27
Speaker 1: Knowing it was a woman's work. And then there are
22:30
Speaker 1: you know, legitimate claims to the other side that he
22:33
Speaker 1: had to be aware of it. So all these things
22:36
Speaker 1: can be true and should be taken into consideration when
22:38
Speaker 1: thinking about that and generally the way that we view
22:41
Speaker 1: women's contributions to history when something, especially when an achievement
22:47
Speaker 1: has already been so heavily contributed to a prominent man
22:52
Speaker 1: in a field. Um. So yeah, that was the hole
22:55
Speaker 1: in sum of Unit's foots work. Like I said, there
22:58
Speaker 1: wasn't much else that really made waves in her scientific
23:02
Speaker 1: inquiry and how that affected the community at least that
23:06
Speaker 1: people know of. Um. But she also fouled patents for
23:10
Speaker 1: invention inventions, and her husband also fouled at least one
23:13
Speaker 1: for something that she invented, which was a thermostatically controlled
23:17
Speaker 1: cooking stove. She died in September of eight. There are
23:22
Speaker 1: no photos of her, but there has been a growing
23:25
Speaker 1: interest in her work and contributions to scientific thought once
23:29
Speaker 1: people began rediscovering it in the last couple of decades,
23:33
Speaker 1: and there were twenty of century scholars who noted her work,
23:36
Speaker 1: and in twenty eleven, a petroleum geologist named Ray Sorenson
23:40
Speaker 1: wrote about coming across her work in a journal called
23:43
Speaker 1: Search and Discovery, and since then there's been an up
23:47
Speaker 1: taking interest in her work and more papers, more presentations
23:51
Speaker 1: and exhibitions, and even a short film call Units that
23:54
Speaker 1: was released in twenty eighteen about her. So that is
23:58
Speaker 1: the whole and some of some of what we know
24:02
Speaker 1: about uniceitz life in her scientific work, and and like
24:19
Speaker 1: I said, it was a great story. And as you
24:21
Speaker 1: kind of alluded to, most of the results I found
24:26
Speaker 1: at first when I was looking into her were like
24:29
Speaker 1: how much did she really do? Did this guy take
24:32
Speaker 1: all that credit? Like all of this like argument that's
24:35
Speaker 1: happening around her to this day, and a lot of
24:38
Speaker 1: people saying like, yes, we've just discovered her, are rediscovered
24:42
Speaker 1: her work, and which I find fascinating that there's like
24:46
Speaker 1: still this scientific debate about what she did. And also
24:52
Speaker 1: kudos to you Ease for your scientific explanation, because I
24:55
Speaker 1: saw I read the paper and I was like, oh,
24:58
Speaker 1: let you handle that one, So thank you. This is
25:02
Speaker 1: from my personal limited knowledge of things like this too.
25:05
Speaker 1: I mean, I know that there are scientists and physicists
25:08
Speaker 1: out there who can talk more deeply about it, but
25:10
Speaker 1: I think, um, it's like just as impactful and meaningful
25:15
Speaker 1: to even know a little bit about the surface, because
25:17
Speaker 1: I think that's how we generally go a lot around
25:19
Speaker 1: in our lives, like we don't know everything about every field.
25:23
Speaker 1: But yeah, I think, um that I am glad that
25:29
Speaker 1: this quote unquote rediscovery is happening, but also want to
25:33
Speaker 1: just acknowledge the fact that like these people, of course,
25:37
Speaker 1: grateful to them to bring her back into light, but
25:39
Speaker 1: like people who are finding her work in twenty eleven,
25:42
Speaker 1: they're not the first ones to know about her work,
25:45
Speaker 1: like there were other people, other women before before them,
25:50
Speaker 1: who were talking about her work and publishing her story
25:53
Speaker 1: in different places. Always a good note. But yeah, I,
25:58
Speaker 1: like I said to it's just with everything that's going on,
26:02
Speaker 1: this is so important to talk about, um, And I'm
26:05
Speaker 1: glad that you brought this brought this story to us.
26:09
Speaker 1: And now that there's actually a movie already, I'm gonna
26:11
Speaker 1: have to go watch it since I can't say this
26:13
Speaker 1: movie it's very short. The film is very short. It's
26:17
Speaker 1: like eleven minutes long. Okay, let's go. I love So
26:34
Speaker 1: I do have to say I understand and appreciate why
26:37
Speaker 1: you didn't do a dramatic British like reenactment, Eves. But
26:41
Speaker 1: now I'm going to miss that for the rest of
26:43
Speaker 1: my life. I would love if someone would do it.
26:45
Speaker 1: To be honest with you, I'll do it, not with Mike.
26:48
Speaker 1: I love doing those Are those are trapping orders to tread? Yes?
26:56
Speaker 1: I agree? I agree? Well, I look forwards and I
27:04
Speaker 1: look forward to having you again on here. It's always
27:06
Speaker 1: such a pleasure. Where can the good listeners find you?
27:09
Speaker 1: You can find me on many other episodes of Female
27:13
Speaker 1: First right here on Sminthy featuring a lot of other
27:16
Speaker 1: people who have other inventions and accomplishments and achievements and
27:22
Speaker 1: cool and interesting things that they did in history. So
27:24
Speaker 1: go back and listen to that. There are like over
27:26
Speaker 1: twenty episodes um of Female First. Also, you can find
27:31
Speaker 1: me on Instagram at not Apologizing. You can find me
27:35
Speaker 1: on Twitter at Eves Jeff co and everything else. You
27:38
Speaker 1: can just find on eve jeffc dot com. And you
27:40
Speaker 1: should be able to dig anything else up through there
27:44
Speaker 1: or hit me up through there. Yes, yes, yes, And
27:47
Speaker 1: if you would like to contact us listeners, you can
27:49
Speaker 1: or emails stuff to your mom stuff at I hired
27:51
Speaker 1: me to dot com. You can find us on Twitter
27:52
Speaker 1: at mom Stuff Podcasts or on Instagram at Stuff I
27:55
Speaker 1: Ever Told You. Thanks as always to our super producer Christina,
27:58
Speaker 1: Thank you, and thanks to you for listening Stuff I
28:01
Speaker 1: Never Told You. The protection of I Heart Radio from
28:02
Speaker 1: more podcast in My Heart Radio, you can listen to
28:04
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28:06
Speaker 1: your favorite shows.