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Evolution Vs. Creation: The Great Debate | Russ Breault | The Week in Bible Prophecy · The Week in Bible Prophecy

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Speaker 1: The Week in Bible Prophecy, a Prophecy Watchers podcast.
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Speaker 2: Hi, I'm Gary Steerman of Prophecy Watchers, and it's my
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Speaker 2: pleasure today to be talking with Russ Briault, who has
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Speaker 2: produced a new film that, by the way, I just
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Speaker 2: watched it and it's worth watching. Unmasking Evolution is the
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Speaker 2: title of it. And Russ, welcome to Prophecy Watchers and
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Speaker 2: it's good to talk to you again.
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Speaker 1: Well, thank you, Gary. It's my pleasure to be here.
0:36
Speaker 1: I always enjoy chatting with you.
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Speaker 2: You know, this is a topic I can remember back
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Speaker 2: in college a lot of argumentation about evolution versus creation.
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Speaker 2: And at that time, and I'm not going to tell
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Speaker 2: anybody how old I am, but at that time that
0:55
Speaker 2: was kind of a fresh argument. And I think most
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Speaker 2: people believe the argument has gone away. That is to say,
1:02
Speaker 2: we've solved that problem, we don't need to talk about
1:05
Speaker 2: it anymore. But I think you would speak to the contrary.
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Speaker 1: Well, I think it's an argument that has never really
1:11
Speaker 1: gone away. It's just you know, if you go on
1:15
Speaker 1: to college campuses and you take any any science based
1:18
Speaker 1: college course, you're going to get bombarded with evolutionary theory.
1:22
Speaker 1: And I think you have had a general you know,
1:26
Speaker 1: over the course of the years, you've had more and
1:29
Speaker 1: more people kind of question it. You know, at one
1:33
Speaker 1: point evolution was was was you know, locked and loaded,
1:37
Speaker 1: that was the way it was. And but I think
1:41
Speaker 1: fortunately with it and with advancements in in in modern
1:46
Speaker 1: genetics and information technology, I think a lot of people
1:50
Speaker 1: are not quite so sure anymore that evolution really is
1:53
Speaker 1: the answer. But my contention is is that you know,
1:56
Speaker 1: if this is still taught on college campuses and in
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Speaker 1: pretty much every science course you take, whether it's geology
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Speaker 1: or biology or astronomy, you're going to get bombarded with
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Speaker 1: evolutionary theory.
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Speaker 2: Now, you talked about kind of the question uh being
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Speaker 2: in two parts, creationism on one side, naturalism on the other,
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Speaker 2: and so you have a a an argument there, and uh,
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Speaker 2: what's naturalism as as you would explain.
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Speaker 1: It, Naturalism is essentially the the materialist view, which is
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Speaker 1: that which is that that that either either that God
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Speaker 1: doesn't exist or that that even if he does, we
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Speaker 1: cannot consider God when we when we're looking at at
2:47
Speaker 1: at at at the consideration of human origins. So in
2:51
Speaker 1: other words, everything must be examined from a from a
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Speaker 1: naturalistic perspective, which is kind of a problem that if
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Speaker 1: you know, if, if if God is in fact the creator,
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Speaker 1: then probably there are there are things you're gonna miss
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Speaker 1: if you're only assuming that that that things came about naturally,
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Speaker 1: with without without any kind of divine intervention.
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Speaker 2: Well, as a Christian, and I'm holding up my old
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Speaker 2: faithful King James Bible and looking at Genesis one on
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Speaker 2: one where it says in the beginning God created the
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Speaker 2: heaven and the earth, and that's pretty inclusive, the heaven
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Speaker 2: and the earth. And then of course as we go
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Speaker 2: on down through that chapter we speak about the creation
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Speaker 2: of humankind, the animals, the whole thing. And as Christians,
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Speaker 2: and it's no problem for me as a Christian, I
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Speaker 2: simply believe the Bible. However, that doesn't solve the problem
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Speaker 2: for other people who would rather find an alternative to God.
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Speaker 1: Well, this is true, I mean, I mean eighth, I
4:01
Speaker 1: mean evolution. Let let's just put it this way. I've
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Speaker 1: I think that there are essentially three religious questions. Number one,
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Speaker 1: how do we get here? That's the question of origins.
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Speaker 1: Number two, why are we here? Which is a question
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Speaker 1: of purpose? And number three, where are we going, which
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Speaker 1: is a question of destiny. And so you have to
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Speaker 1: answer the first question first, which is, you know, how
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Speaker 1: did we get here? And you know, so, are we
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Speaker 1: are we just the the the result of several billion
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Speaker 1: perfectly timed accidents of chance? Or as you just read, are.
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Speaker 2: We are we?
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Speaker 1: The? Are we are?
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Speaker 2: We?
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Speaker 1: Are we creating in the image and likeness of God?
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Speaker 1: And if so, then obviously we have a specific purpose,
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Speaker 1: you know. But if we're just here randomly, then we
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Speaker 1: have no purpose other than other than just survival, and
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Speaker 1: there would be no reason to believe that there's anything
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Speaker 1: after this. So, really, how you answer the first question,
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Speaker 1: the question of origins, question of how do we get here?
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Speaker 1: Really does impact all the rest of those of how
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Speaker 1: you're going to answer their rest of those questions.
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Speaker 2: Well, you know, let's just for discussions sake, Let's just
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Speaker 2: say the universe evolved and all the stars and planets
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Speaker 2: came into being, and then there were chemical interactions on
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Speaker 2: the surface of the planets, including Earth, and all those
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Speaker 2: chemical reactions, after millions and millions of tries, resulted in
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Speaker 2: a living cell, and that living cell became more and
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Speaker 2: more complex over time, and then it finally became a dinosaur,
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Speaker 2: and you know, believe it or not. And I know
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Speaker 2: you believe it because you've studied it. That that you
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Speaker 2: know sounds possible, doesn't it.
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Speaker 1: I mean no, not at all.
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Speaker 2: Okay, tell me why it's not possible.
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Speaker 1: Well, because you have to you know, two billion years ago,
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Speaker 1: allegedly in the in the promordial soup, you know, there
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Speaker 1: was all it was just chemicals. And they've done the
6:11
Speaker 1: uh the mili Uric Ex miller Ury Ex experiment where
6:16
Speaker 1: they had lightning come in and and you know, and
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Speaker 1: and it energized the waters and presto, amino acids came
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Speaker 1: into being, and it's and you know, but but here,
6:28
Speaker 1: here's the thing is that there's about five hundred different
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Speaker 1: amino acids that occur naturally in nature, but only twenty
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Speaker 1: are used for for life. And when in this in
6:42
Speaker 1: this whole scenario of life beginning in the in the
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Speaker 1: primordial soup, you first have to have your your exact
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Speaker 1: twenty amino acids. They all have to be in place,
6:55
Speaker 1: and then they have to move on to form a protein. Now,
6:59
Speaker 1: protein is a very complex molecule. And but here's the
7:05
Speaker 1: problem is that is that a is that a single
7:08
Speaker 1: cell is the in fact, the the simplest single cell
7:16
Speaker 1: organism that we can find is composed of no less
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Speaker 1: than three hundred and ninety six specific proteins and and
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Speaker 1: so in other words, each protein forms a different function,
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Speaker 1: and so all these have to come together before you
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Speaker 1: even have a first cell. And so the it's just
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Speaker 1: it is absolutely preposterous because there's no reason for these
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Speaker 1: proteins to form to perform a function unless they have
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Speaker 1: a function to perform, and they have no function to
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Speaker 1: perform unless they're already within a cell. And so the
7:55
Speaker 1: whole thing just breaks down. And so of course, now
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Speaker 1: now now they evolutionists have for years been trying to
8:04
Speaker 1: figure out how life came from non life, and they've
8:08
Speaker 1: thrown in the towel on it. And now they just
8:11
Speaker 1: presumed that it came in off of comets and meteorites,
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Speaker 1: and so which is a really it's just a convenient
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Speaker 1: foil because it says, oh, I get it. We can't
8:20
Speaker 1: figure out how it evolved here, so it must have
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Speaker 1: evolved there.
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Speaker 2: And so if a common or a meteorite hits the Earth,
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Speaker 2: there's an explosion, and the explosion churns things around and
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Speaker 2: creates a complex organic molecule of some sort, and then
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Speaker 2: another comet hits later on, and there's even further complexity.
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Speaker 2: And so they're arguing in favor of order and complexity
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Speaker 2: out of accidental happenings. And I think that's a really
8:54
Speaker 2: good place to start the discussion.
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Speaker 1: Well, yeah, because you know, you know, mutation and natural selection,
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Speaker 1: which is the bedrock of Darwinism, you know, you know,
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Speaker 1: all all there, there's no indication that that mutations are
9:13
Speaker 1: are going to produce a gain of function within the organism,
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Speaker 1: and so, you know, the the whole lunacy of the
9:22
Speaker 1: of the of the argument is that you know, as
9:25
Speaker 1: you're going from a from a single cell bacteria, you know,
9:30
Speaker 1: evolving into a multi celled organism now that has now
9:35
Speaker 1: is able to replicate itself, and and all of a sudden,
9:38
Speaker 1: so the the the first real organism outside of bacteria
9:44
Speaker 1: is considered to be the sponge, and so from the
9:47
Speaker 1: sponge came the fish. You know, I mean these are
9:51
Speaker 1: enormous differences. I mean, you go from a sponge to
9:54
Speaker 1: a fish, all of a sudden, you have a you
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Speaker 1: have a you have a you know, a respiratory system,
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Speaker 1: a digestive system, you have a you have a skeletal system,
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Speaker 1: a nervous system. None of these things exists within a sponge.
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Speaker 1: And so but but this is this is what we
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Speaker 1: have to believe if you're going to be an evolutionist,
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Speaker 1: and it's and so, but the you know, we've we've
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Speaker 1: almost i would say, we've never observed a gain of
10:24
Speaker 1: function mutation. We talk about them. You heard gain of
10:28
Speaker 1: function a lot because of all the stuff going on
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Speaker 1: with the Wuhan lab and COVID nineteen and whether there
10:34
Speaker 1: was whether there was gain of function research. But all
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Speaker 1: that is that the is is that the is that
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Speaker 1: the hands of of of man. We're talking about gain
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Speaker 1: of function mutations that would occur naturally, you know, all
10:47
Speaker 1: by themselves, and they don't happen. It's so the in fact,
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Speaker 1: you know, we as human being, we're we're composed of
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Speaker 1: about ninety thousand different proteins that make up our body,
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Speaker 1: and so each protein performing a specific function and and
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Speaker 1: it's in in so but we've never observed the development
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Speaker 1: of a of a new functional protein. So I mean
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Speaker 1: that's a that's a big deal because I mean that
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Speaker 1: is the basis of evolutionary theory, is that is that
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Speaker 1: is that is that new functional proteins are developed, So
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Speaker 1: that's how you get a reptile evolving into a mammal.
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Speaker 1: All these different changes would occur, you know, Yeah, we
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Speaker 1: can't observe it.
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Speaker 2: So it's much much easier in my mind to argue
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Speaker 2: in favor of intelligent design rather than random mutation. Uh.
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Speaker 2: To me, it just makes more sense that there was
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Speaker 2: a designer. There is a designer, and the great intelligence
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Speaker 2: that we see in our creation is self explained story.
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Speaker 2: There's a God and he made this is he and
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Speaker 2: he made it very carefully, including by the way my ancestors,
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Speaker 2: so that I came into existence not by evolution but
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Speaker 2: by creation. And it's really easy for me to believe that. However,
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Speaker 2: and I'm really glad you've taken up this question because
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Speaker 2: there are people out there being brainwashed. There there's propaganda,
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Speaker 2: and and you're standing up against that.
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Speaker 1: Every every college dude who takes a science class, even
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Speaker 1: on even in even in Christian schools, are hearing evolutionary
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Speaker 1: nonsense and it's and that it just doesn't stand up
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Speaker 1: to any kind of real scrutiny.
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Speaker 2: Yep. And you've taken us through many steps in your presentation. Uh,
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Speaker 2: that sort of make waste of the argument of non
12:51
Speaker 2: intelligent design, our design by accident.
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Speaker 1: Well, it is a classic. This is I have to
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Speaker 1: read this to you. This is a quote from Richard Dawkins,
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Speaker 1: who is the atheist biologist, you know, and he's famously
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Speaker 1: written a lot of books teaching. He speaks on college
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Speaker 1: campuses and he's still filling out auditoriums right now across
13:11
Speaker 1: the across the country. He says in in his Put
13:15
Speaker 1: on My Glasses. He says in his book called The
13:17
Speaker 1: Blind Watchmaker, biology is the study of complicated things. They
13:23
Speaker 1: give the appearance of having been designed for a purpose.
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Speaker 1: Oh was it actually done that way? It's just the
13:30
Speaker 1: appearance of design. So so when you see a chair
13:36
Speaker 1: and you know it's this the whole notion of you know,
13:38
Speaker 1: you know, you could say, well, it obviously is designed.
13:41
Speaker 1: It wouldn't exist of it unless it was the product
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Speaker 1: of you know that that someone designed it, manufactured it,
13:49
Speaker 1: engineered it, developed it. And now we have a chair.
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Speaker 1: But when but when we see a comparable structure in nature,
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Speaker 1: we have to assume that it's only there. Ran we
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Speaker 1: we we we we cannot assume any kind of design
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Speaker 1: and this is this is what, this is what kids
14:07
Speaker 1: are being taught, even at this very moment, and it's
14:11
Speaker 1: in you know, and and it's it's it's amazing how people.
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Speaker 1: You know, there's an old saying, you know you you've
14:18
Speaker 1: been you've been been in this preaching business for a while,
14:21
Speaker 1: and the you know, there's an old expression that says,
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Speaker 1: you know that you know you don't you don't have
14:27
Speaker 1: to check your brain at the door to be a Christian. Well,
14:30
Speaker 1: let me tell you you do have to check your
14:33
Speaker 1: brain at the door to be an evolutionist. You really do.
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Speaker 1: I mean, because when you look at the entire Grand
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Speaker 1: Plan of evolution, from bacteria to a sponge, to a fish,
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Speaker 1: to an amphibian to a reptile to a mammal, and
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Speaker 1: from the mammal, all the different mammals that we see,
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Speaker 1: you know, and then ultimately to the primate and to
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Speaker 1: and to and to man, we're looking at bill millions
15:00
Speaker 1: of missing links. They don't exist. And so but I
15:04
Speaker 1: just wanted to narrow this focus down and have us
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Speaker 1: look at one one transition because we always hear about
15:12
Speaker 1: the missing link between ape and man. We always hear
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Speaker 1: about the missing link there's not the missing link, there's billions.
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Speaker 2: I've heard about that for years, and I've heard the
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Speaker 2: other expression that goes along with that, the appearance of design.
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Speaker 2: You know, evolutions love to say, well, yeah, yeah, yeah,
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Speaker 2: there is the appearance of design, but no, it's not
15:36
Speaker 2: the design. It's a series of events that happened in nature.
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Speaker 2: And they'll do anything to avoid talking about a god
15:47
Speaker 2: of creation.
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Speaker 1: So one of them narrow this. Let's look at this
15:53
Speaker 1: transition from reptile to mammal. What has to happen? So,
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Speaker 1: in other words, cold blooded has to become warm blooded,
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Speaker 1: a complete change in the metabolism scales become fur, egg
16:07
Speaker 1: laying has to become live bearing. Egg nutrients now now
16:13
Speaker 1: have to become mammary glands. A three chambered heart has
16:16
Speaker 1: to become a four chambered heart, A multiple bone jaw
16:20
Speaker 1: has to become a single bone jaw. All these are
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Speaker 1: massive changes, and we're supposed to believe that these occurred
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Speaker 1: by small, minute mutations over the course of millions of years.
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Speaker 1: And why mammals exist simultaneously with with reptiles right now,
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Speaker 1: And it wasn't exist. It wasn't as if the reptiles
16:41
Speaker 1: had to become a mammal in order to survive. They
16:44
Speaker 1: both exist right now, and so the whole thing is
16:48
Speaker 1: absolutely ludicrous that that that that these changes could have
16:52
Speaker 1: taken place by small minute you know, mutations.
16:58
Speaker 2: And of course that's has become kind of a religion. Uh,
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Speaker 2: the idea of mutation uh be random, and yet somehow
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Speaker 2: some part of it becomes it takes on the appearance
17:15
Speaker 2: of having been been created. In other words, nature without
17:21
Speaker 2: God is simply capable of creation. And that you have
17:26
Speaker 2: to make that point. And I think in your presentation
17:30
Speaker 2: you take it, take it head on. Uh, and you
17:33
Speaker 2: have just touched on the idea of complexity for one.
17:37
Speaker 2: What's what's another idea that goes against chance creation?
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Speaker 1: Well again, I I always like the things say that
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Speaker 1: everything living is is exhibits complexity, order and design and
17:55
Speaker 1: the so when you this this complexity is real challenge
18:00
Speaker 1: is because when when Darwin wrote his book in eighteen
18:04
Speaker 1: fifty nine on the Origin of Species, he thought that
18:09
Speaker 1: the that the cell was just a massive protoplasm. He
18:13
Speaker 1: didn't Now we know that a single cell within your
18:17
Speaker 1: body is astonishingly complex, with about seventy or so different functions,
18:24
Speaker 1: happening simultaneously and uh within that cell. And then if
18:29
Speaker 1: you if you eliminate one of those functions, the cell
18:33
Speaker 1: ceases to ceases to work or to perform. So in
18:37
Speaker 1: other words, what we find is that is that is
18:40
Speaker 1: that things when you get down to that, to that
18:43
Speaker 1: single cell level, they become irreducibly complex. So in other words,
18:48
Speaker 1: how did they come together, you know, gradually over the
18:52
Speaker 1: courts of millions of years. If they if they can't
18:55
Speaker 1: function at all, if you if you if you remove
18:58
Speaker 1: one of the one of the components, the whole thing
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Speaker 1: is absurd, and it's so the and so there there
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Speaker 1: is this concept of irreducible complexity, which is which is
19:10
Speaker 1: very true because you think that when when we look
19:13
Speaker 1: at ourselves, you know, we are all everything about us.
19:18
Speaker 1: We have all these things, your your your your respiratory system,
19:22
Speaker 1: your digestive system, your circulatory system, your skeletal system, your
19:28
Speaker 1: you know, your immune system, all these it's they all
19:31
Speaker 1: existed in what's called systemic interdependence, which one can we
19:36
Speaker 1: do without none of them? That's right, and so and
19:42
Speaker 1: and so and so be because and then to think
19:45
Speaker 1: that we evolve gradually, I mean because at some point,
19:48
Speaker 1: you're not going to have all these things, you know,
19:50
Speaker 1: but the whole thing just makes is it's just absurd
19:55
Speaker 1: and it's but I I will say this that that
19:58
Speaker 1: that one of the things that is challenging evolution among
20:03
Speaker 1: people in way maybe maybe maybe it's less and less
20:05
Speaker 1: of a problem is because with information technology, I mean
20:13
Speaker 1: in nineteen fifty three, when they when they discovered the
20:16
Speaker 1: double helix DNA molecule, they should have thrown in the
20:20
Speaker 1: towel on evolution then right then and there. They should
20:23
Speaker 1: have realized that there's no way that a molecule with
20:27
Speaker 1: that degree of complexity could ever arise from a random process.
20:33
Speaker 1: And you know, but they still hung on. They still
20:36
Speaker 1: hung on because you see, evolution is the creation story
20:40
Speaker 1: of atheism, and so every religion has to have its
20:44
Speaker 1: creation story and so so they so they hang onto
20:49
Speaker 1: their creation story no matter what. And it's the the uh,
20:55
Speaker 1: but I just when when when you look at the
20:58
Speaker 1: because now we know that our DNA at you your
21:03
Speaker 1: you're packed in every single cell of your body, is
21:07
Speaker 1: your DNA is replicated and it in it will give
21:12
Speaker 1: you an ex by comparison. Let me just mention this
21:15
Speaker 1: that that that Microsoft Office uses about fifty million lines
21:23
Speaker 1: of computer code, Facebook uses about seventy five million, Google
21:30
Speaker 1: uses about two billion. The your DNA is composed of
21:38
Speaker 1: three point three billion lines of genetic code, and so
21:45
Speaker 1: we to do and we'd fix. And we learned this
21:49
Speaker 1: when we map the human genome, which was completed around
21:52
Speaker 1: the year two thousand and and so now we know
21:57
Speaker 1: that we have this astonishing numbermber of the of this,
22:01
Speaker 1: of this, of these, of these of well, for instance,
22:06
Speaker 1: we have about twenty thousand genes that are spread across
22:10
Speaker 1: our twenty three base pairs of chromosomes, and and they're
22:14
Speaker 1: they're making full use of this three point three billion
22:18
Speaker 1: lines of genetic code. And but here's what we learned
22:21
Speaker 1: from information technology is that is that that these genes,
22:27
Speaker 1: our genes, are specified information. Each gene is like a
22:33
Speaker 1: packet of DNA, that is the that is the specific
22:37
Speaker 1: instructions for everything that's going on in your body, how
22:41
Speaker 1: to make the hemoglobe and in your in your in
22:43
Speaker 1: your bloodstream. You know, everything is is is is guided
22:47
Speaker 1: and determined by our genes. So in other words, it's
22:50
Speaker 1: specified junk.
22:53
Speaker 2: Right there. I think in your presentation this particular point
22:58
Speaker 2: you're going to right now is very important and it
23:01
Speaker 2: is the point of purpose. In other words, somebody says, well,
23:05
Speaker 2: the cell just eventually, through chance, manufactured itself, but it
23:14
Speaker 2: does leave out the question of how many cells had
23:17
Speaker 2: to evolve in a certain way in order to fulfill
23:21
Speaker 2: a purpose. And they and you go into that in
23:25
Speaker 2: your presentation about these cells are not just there for nothing.
23:30
Speaker 2: These cells have very very complex purposes that were obviously
23:38
Speaker 2: there from the beginning.
23:39
Speaker 1: The best example you probably remember seeing this, I use
23:42
Speaker 1: the example of the pencil.
23:44
Speaker 2: I was gonna ask you about the pencil.
23:46
Speaker 1: The pencil is just about one of the simplest things
23:51
Speaker 1: that you could use. It's five basic ingredients. Right, you
23:55
Speaker 1: have the rubber tip at the end, a metal band,
24:00
Speaker 1: a wooden a wooden shaft here with some paint, and
24:03
Speaker 1: a graphite core. You have five basic ingredients. Now, now,
24:08
Speaker 1: we would never assume that the that the pencil could
24:12
Speaker 1: evolve by itself.
24:14
Speaker 2: Right, Well, you just were walking one day in the
24:17
Speaker 2: country and you look down and there was a pencil
24:19
Speaker 2: on the ground.
24:22
Speaker 1: Right, and and you and I would say, well, someone
24:26
Speaker 1: must have dropped a pencil.
24:29
Speaker 2: But the evolutionist would say, no, that pencil created itself.
24:33
Speaker 1: And it came out of nothing. It's a miracle, evolutionary miracle.
24:38
Speaker 2: The so.
24:39
Speaker 1: But but the the the analogy here is that what
24:43
Speaker 1: if you took all the raw materials, take the paint,
24:46
Speaker 1: the wood, the graphite core, the metal band and the
24:49
Speaker 1: rubber at the end, put it all in a pile
24:52
Speaker 1: and had a million years? Is it possible for it
24:56
Speaker 1: to have to to for a pencil to emerge from there?
25:00
Speaker 1: And the answer is no. But the question is why
25:04
Speaker 1: is it no? Why is the answer no is because
25:08
Speaker 1: the raw materials cannot determine their own purpose. In other words,
25:13
Speaker 1: the pencil exists because man needed something to write with.
25:17
Speaker 1: So we invented it, We designed it, we engineered it,
25:21
Speaker 1: we manufactured it, and distributed it to be exactly what
25:25
Speaker 1: it is. But here is the punchline is that neither
25:28
Speaker 1: can you. Neither can the individual proteins or or amino
25:33
Speaker 1: acids or cells within your body. They can't determine their
25:37
Speaker 1: purpose either and so and so, In other words, who
25:41
Speaker 1: instructs the these proteins that are coming together to become
25:45
Speaker 1: a heart cell or a liver cell, or a kidney cell,
25:48
Speaker 1: or a cell within your within your eye or anything
25:52
Speaker 1: who determined debts. It is determined by the DNA and
25:56
Speaker 1: the and the and the and the and The kicker
25:59
Speaker 1: here is that is that the DNA must exist first.
26:05
Speaker 1: It cannot be the result of evolution because that's where
26:09
Speaker 1: all the instructions are. And so so in this whole
26:13
Speaker 1: nonsense notion that that life evolved from non life. You know,
26:18
Speaker 1: even with the development of the of the of the
26:21
Speaker 1: first cell, you still had to have DNA first because
26:26
Speaker 1: that's where the instructions are.
26:29
Speaker 2: Inscriptions, by the way, fit the idea of purpose very
26:33
Speaker 2: very well. In other words, how are you going to
26:37
Speaker 2: do something? Is very a very important part of creation.
26:42
Speaker 1: Is absolutely I mean, purpose is the key to everything. Yeah,
26:47
Speaker 1: I mean, in in my view, nothing exists without purpose.
26:52
Speaker 1: You know, I invite your listening audience to just, you know,
26:56
Speaker 1: look around the room, the car, the office, the the
26:59
Speaker 1: the dorm room, wherever they happen to be. Look around
27:02
Speaker 1: at everything you see, everything, your clothes, the carpet, the lights,
27:07
Speaker 1: the paint. Everything in your world exists on purpose. Even
27:12
Speaker 1: a scrap of paper on the floor, what is not there? Accidentally?
27:16
Speaker 1: It was, it was so so nothing exists in our
27:20
Speaker 1: world randomly. It all exists on purpose to serve a purpose,
27:25
Speaker 1: and yet we're supposed to believe that comparable structures in
27:29
Speaker 1: nature are all just pure randomness and chance. With we
27:34
Speaker 1: have to remember that the that the that the essence
27:37
Speaker 1: of evolution is that it is a process that by
27:40
Speaker 1: definition is unguided, undirected, with no plan and no purpose.
27:45
Speaker 1: And in the the logical mind, you know, can't grasp that,
27:51
Speaker 1: and and nor should they because God gave us a
27:54
Speaker 1: sound mind of with that with enough common sense hoping
27:57
Speaker 1: to say, you know this, the doesn't past the smell
28:01
Speaker 1: test and it's and so yeah, purpose is the key
28:05
Speaker 1: to everything.
28:07
Speaker 2: I'd like to ask you a question about time, because
28:10
Speaker 2: in your presentation you talk about the word instant. Was
28:14
Speaker 2: creation instant or did it take a long time? And
28:19
Speaker 2: so how does time figure in it? Is because evolutionists
28:23
Speaker 2: need lots of time?
28:24
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, you see, I mean, you know, the there
28:28
Speaker 1: are many different ways to consider the age of the Earth.
28:32
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, there's of course, there's the with it.
28:35
Speaker 1: I guess it's the radiometric of measurement of rocks, which
28:41
Speaker 1: says it's four point five billion years old, But that
28:44
Speaker 1: and that can vary depending on what part of the
28:46
Speaker 1: lava flow that you're measuring and could vary by a
28:50
Speaker 1: billion years. But but then also you know, there's other
28:53
Speaker 1: ways of determining the possible age of the Earth, by
28:56
Speaker 1: the by the increasing salinity of the oceans, by the
29:00
Speaker 1: appletion of healum in the atmosphere, and so they all
29:03
Speaker 1: give different measurements. Now, now for me, I don't claim
29:08
Speaker 1: young Earth old Earth. I don't care how old the
29:11
Speaker 1: Earth is because I don't know. No one was there.
29:14
Speaker 1: Everyone has an opinion, and you know what they say
29:16
Speaker 1: about opinions, and so you know, my view is simply this,
29:26
Speaker 1: I really I let me just say that in my experience,
29:33
Speaker 1: as I have learned this subject and read lots of
29:35
Speaker 1: books on it, and it's I used to be a
29:41
Speaker 1: young Earth guy. You believe that the Earth is ten
29:43
Speaker 1: thousand years old and all that. But then I saw
29:47
Speaker 1: a debate this must to be at least fourteen fifteen
29:50
Speaker 1: years ago, now, a debate with ken Ham and Bill
29:54
Speaker 1: ny the science guy, and I expected for this to
29:58
Speaker 1: be a slam dunk. But you know, I came away
30:01
Speaker 1: from that debate and they both scored points. And I
30:05
Speaker 1: would have if I was if I was if I
30:07
Speaker 1: was scoring it like a like as if some kind
30:10
Speaker 1: of boxing match, I would have to say that was
30:13
Speaker 1: probably a draw. And I said, I came away saying,
30:16
Speaker 1: you know what, you know, if i'm if I'm feeling that,
30:19
Speaker 1: you know, Bill and I had points and ken Ham
30:22
Speaker 1: had points, then then then why am I? Why am
30:25
Speaker 1: I spending all my time trying to prove a young
30:28
Speaker 1: Earth when really no one knows, because there's because there's
30:33
Speaker 1: just as many older creationists as there are Young Earth creationists.
30:37
Speaker 1: And so I don't want to. I don't want to
30:39
Speaker 1: waste all my time trying to defend something which we
30:42
Speaker 1: don't even know the answer to anyways. And so so
30:46
Speaker 1: I much rather, I'd much rather dismantle the the the
30:50
Speaker 1: lunatic suppositions of evolution, and and then let people make
30:56
Speaker 1: a decision on their own whether they want to be
30:59
Speaker 1: young Earth. Oh earthan I'm I have. My position is
31:03
Speaker 1: I don't care, and it's a whether it's young or old.
31:07
Speaker 1: It's all I know is that complexity, order and design
31:11
Speaker 1: did not come about to an unguided random process. That
31:16
Speaker 1: is preposterous.
31:17
Speaker 2: You mentioned that we're complexity again, and that touch is
31:23
Speaker 2: on another subject, which is reproduction because reproduction, cellular reproduction,
31:29
Speaker 2: human animal reproduction very complex and had to proceed from
31:35
Speaker 2: the beginning until now, I had to proceed in a
31:38
Speaker 2: very special way in order to work at all. And
31:43
Speaker 2: the whole question of reproduction is rarely mentioned in this argument.
31:49
Speaker 1: No, I mean reproduction is huge, especially, you know, because
31:53
Speaker 1: this whole principle of natural selection, which Darwin, you know,
31:57
Speaker 1: he's that's like his his religion. It's it's right in
32:01
Speaker 1: the right in the title of his book, you know,
32:04
Speaker 1: the when so on on the origin of species by
32:08
Speaker 1: means of natural selection. So, but but what we know
32:12
Speaker 1: now about natural selection is that it is not a
32:16
Speaker 1: creative force. It really just preserved the integrity of the
32:22
Speaker 1: of the of the organism, so that it's it's it's
32:25
Speaker 1: able to root out harmful mutations. It doesn't have some
32:29
Speaker 1: innate knowledge to know that this mutation is going to
32:33
Speaker 1: be beneficial and this mutation is going to be bad.
32:35
Speaker 1: Will keep the one that's good, and we'll and we'll
32:38
Speaker 1: get rid of the one that's bad. Natural selection doesn't
32:41
Speaker 1: have that capability, and so and so when you when
32:45
Speaker 1: you so, when you get into this into this issue
32:48
Speaker 1: of of of reproduction, you know by by mutation. Allegedly,
32:53
Speaker 1: there's a mutation that that has that creates something that
32:58
Speaker 1: is beneficial to the species. But here's the problem is
33:02
Speaker 1: that is that you're going to have to have two
33:04
Speaker 1: organisms in the same plub in the same location at
33:08
Speaker 1: the same time, with the exact same mutation, and then
33:13
Speaker 1: they got to get romantic and then and then at
33:16
Speaker 1: that point, then that mutation can be transferred to the
33:19
Speaker 1: next generation as a as as a dominant trait. Now,
33:24
Speaker 1: you could see that this could happen once in a while,
33:27
Speaker 1: but to suggest that this happens on a grand scale,
33:30
Speaker 1: it's just it's just ridiculous. And so medically, yeah, mathematically
33:36
Speaker 1: it's you know, in fact, you're speaking of mathematics. By
33:39
Speaker 1: the way, the the probability of a single complex protein
33:47
Speaker 1: evolving by a random process is one in ten of
33:52
Speaker 1: the one hundred and sixty fourth power, which means it's
33:57
Speaker 1: never going to happen. And yet yet that's their religion.
34:02
Speaker 1: The religion of the religion of atheism is is is
34:08
Speaker 1: built on just you know, smoke mirrors.
34:12
Speaker 2: So let's suppose that you're having a discussion with someone
34:16
Speaker 2: who is absolutely convinced but life evolved and he's very
34:23
Speaker 2: content with this idea. Uh. And and he says, don't
34:27
Speaker 2: bother me. I believe what I believe. What are you
34:32
Speaker 2: going to say at that point?
34:35
Speaker 1: Well, you know, it's interesting. I had I had an
34:39
Speaker 1: interesting interaction with a gentleman at the Philadelphia airport and
34:44
Speaker 1: I was, I was traveling through, had about an hour
34:48
Speaker 1: to kill. So I went into a bookstore and they
34:50
Speaker 1: had a little rack of books, their choice books, you know,
34:54
Speaker 1: And and I was, I've been another thing. I've always
34:57
Speaker 1: been interested in his near death experiences. I think the fascinating.
35:01
Speaker 1: And so I there was a book there on near
35:04
Speaker 1: death experiences, and I and there was this one guy
35:06
Speaker 1: in the whole there was nobody in the shop, just
35:09
Speaker 1: the just the young man who was there, you know, uh,
35:13
Speaker 1: running it. And he appeared to be of Middle Eastern origin,
35:16
Speaker 1: of maybe in his late twenties. And so I figured,
35:20
Speaker 1: I just have some fun. And I showed him in
35:22
Speaker 1: the book and I said, what do you know about this?
35:24
Speaker 1: He looks at it and says, I don't believe any
35:27
Speaker 1: of that. I'm an atheist. That's it's said. I put
35:30
Speaker 1: the book down. I walked over to him and I
35:32
Speaker 1: and he said and I said, so you're an atheist
35:34
Speaker 1: and he says, yeah, I says, and I said, man,
35:37
Speaker 1: that sucks for you. And he kind of startled him
35:41
Speaker 1: a little bit. And then and I said, and then
35:44
Speaker 1: I said to him, I said this, so, so you
35:47
Speaker 1: actually believe that all of life and all of its
35:51
Speaker 1: complexity and all of its variety came about to an
35:55
Speaker 1: unguided random process, no plan, no purpose, no guidance, no direction.
36:01
Speaker 1: You actually believe that. And he said, well, I just
36:06
Speaker 1: think religion is the cause of all the man's problems.
36:08
Speaker 1: We immediately backed away from from claiming to be an atheist,
36:13
Speaker 1: at least an evolutionary atheist.
36:15
Speaker 2: You know.
36:16
Speaker 1: And so because once you once you challenge someone with okay, now,
36:20
Speaker 1: if you say you're an atheist, then this is what
36:24
Speaker 1: you have to believe, because you have to because you
36:28
Speaker 1: have to answer the question of how did we get here?
36:33
Speaker 1: You know, and so and so it's amazing how they
36:37
Speaker 1: will back away once you challenge them about what they
36:41
Speaker 1: truly actually believe, or at least are supposed to believe.
36:46
Speaker 2: Well, they say, I'll take my chances. You know.
36:50
Speaker 1: Well, as I said, that sucks for them.
36:55
Speaker 2: It does. And yet I think we live in a
36:58
Speaker 2: world where that is one of the major systems of thought,
37:03
Speaker 2: and it's sort of like, don't bother me with this
37:07
Speaker 2: God stuff. That's too complicated for me. And I've got
37:10
Speaker 2: work to do, and you're just messing around with my life,
37:13
Speaker 2: and we're all going to go to the same place.
37:16
Speaker 2: And after a while, what you have is this homogeneous
37:22
Speaker 2: society of atheists who want the best and they're striving
37:29
Speaker 2: for the best for themselves. And what evolves out of
37:32
Speaker 2: that is the last ten thousand years of wars and
37:36
Speaker 2: rumors of wars and disasters of every sort, because people
37:43
Speaker 2: do what they want to do. And of course, we,
37:50
Speaker 2: having read the Bible and have having believed in a
37:54
Speaker 2: God of creation, suddenly realize, Wow, there is a system
37:59
Speaker 2: that goes with God's creation, and that system promises us
38:05
Speaker 2: resolution and eternal happiness. Hey, why not accept that?
38:11
Speaker 1: Well, when you compare the the two origin statements, we
38:16
Speaker 1: have the one which you just read, in the beginning,
38:19
Speaker 1: God created the heavens and the earth. But then the
38:23
Speaker 1: creation story of the evolutionist is, in the beginning there
38:27
Speaker 1: was nothing, and nothing became everything all by itself. And
38:31
Speaker 1: so so you have to say to yourself which one
38:34
Speaker 1: is more intellectually satisfying, because because sometimes I call it
38:39
Speaker 1: the battle of the fairy tales. Okay, you say that
38:42
Speaker 1: I believe in a fairy tale. Okay, well here's your
38:44
Speaker 1: fairy tale, and so the and so you know it's
38:48
Speaker 1: like you know to me when everything speaks of design
38:53
Speaker 1: and intelligence and that you know the in these complex arrangements,
38:58
Speaker 1: don't you know, any time you add a layer of complexity,
39:02
Speaker 1: you make any kind of random process that much more ridiculous.
39:06
Speaker 1: And so and and all we're doing and through in
39:10
Speaker 1: fro through modern genetics and and all of and modern
39:14
Speaker 1: medicine is that we're we're we're we're going deeper and
39:18
Speaker 1: deeper into into our into our selves, and we're finding
39:24
Speaker 1: how that we truly are fearfully and wonderfully made.
39:28
Speaker 2: Yeah, we are. And by the way, uh as we're
39:33
Speaker 2: kind of coming to to the end of our time here.
39:36
Speaker 2: Uh I wanted just to go back to your production
39:41
Speaker 2: Unmasking Evolution. You you give what I think is a
39:45
Speaker 2: very concise presentation, and and you you lay out a
39:52
Speaker 2: groundwork of believability that's really uh I think worth watching.
39:57
Speaker 2: But but as as we're getting sort of toward the
40:00
Speaker 2: conclusion of our discussion, how would you describe your motive
40:07
Speaker 2: in unmasking evolution? How did you put this together? And
40:11
Speaker 2: what were your goals in doing that?
40:15
Speaker 1: Basically, I hate being lied to and in we're we've
40:20
Speaker 1: been told, we've we've learned for the past ten years now,
40:24
Speaker 1: or we learned all about fake news? Who knew there
40:27
Speaker 1: was fake science? And there's lots of fake science, and
40:32
Speaker 1: and you know, there's a there was a meme running
40:34
Speaker 1: around on the internet that says ninety seven percent of
40:37
Speaker 1: scientists but believe in whoever's funding them, you know, wherever
40:42
Speaker 1: they're getting their money from, they will support that premise.
40:46
Speaker 1: And it's so uh, it's it's it's it's a sad truth.
40:50
Speaker 1: But I just wanted to I find so many kids,
40:54
Speaker 1: young young people walk away from their faith is because
40:58
Speaker 1: they're they're their underpinnings of faith have no foundation. And
41:05
Speaker 1: I was convinced that if I could just have one hour,
41:08
Speaker 1: let me have one hour with with these with these kids,
41:12
Speaker 1: college students, high schools and students, and let them, let them,
41:16
Speaker 1: let them see the other side. Let's kind of expose
41:19
Speaker 1: the underbelly of evolution, not the not the picture perfect
41:24
Speaker 1: view that they're going to get in their textbook or
41:26
Speaker 1: that's painted for them by their or by their professor.
41:30
Speaker 1: You know. But but you know, what does the underbelly
41:32
Speaker 1: look like? And that's and and and and it and
41:35
Speaker 1: it exposes all of all of the fallacies that that
41:40
Speaker 1: that they want to hide. And it's so that's why
41:43
Speaker 1: it's called Unmasking Evolution. Here's a graphic for it.
41:48
Speaker 2: Is it is.
41:48
Speaker 1: Uh, you can get this on YouTube. You can just
41:51
Speaker 1: you can just search for Unmasking Evolution. Search for my
41:54
Speaker 1: name or Shrouding count. It's on my It's on it's
41:57
Speaker 1: on my shroud and Counter channel, and it's I do
42:01
Speaker 1: I recommend people just just you know. It's an hour long,
42:04
Speaker 1: and I think it's I think it covers all the bases.
42:08
Speaker 2: Well, you know, as you're talking, I'm thinking about the
42:12
Speaker 2: news and all the news media that we all watch,
42:17
Speaker 2: and all the street marches and the flags being set
42:20
Speaker 2: on fire, and the university is going south in a hurry,
42:26
Speaker 2: and we're seeing society degenerate. And we're looking now at
42:30
Speaker 2: a young group of street marchers out here, and you
42:34
Speaker 2: know very well what they believe about creation versus evolution,
42:38
Speaker 2: And so I would I would say that you have
42:41
Speaker 2: a real goal here in terms in terms of what
42:45
Speaker 2: society needs to hear today. Yeah.
42:48
Speaker 1: Well, and that's why I did it. I spent hundreds
42:50
Speaker 1: of hours, you know, putting it together. And it's I
42:55
Speaker 1: think it's I think it's you know, succinct and and
43:00
Speaker 1: gets the message across the so and it just makes
43:03
Speaker 1: people think, you know, I I just you know, it's
43:06
Speaker 1: it's like a form of inoculation. You know, once you've
43:09
Speaker 1: you know, once you've been inoculated to something, when you're
43:11
Speaker 1: exposed to the real virus, you have the antibodies built
43:15
Speaker 1: up and you don't get sick. That's what I want.
43:17
Speaker 1: I want for this presentation to be like an inoculation
43:20
Speaker 1: for young people. Inoculate them to the to the to
43:24
Speaker 1: all of the bs that they're gonna that they're gonna
43:26
Speaker 1: get when they when they And I'm convinced a lot
43:30
Speaker 1: of your college professors don't even believe this stuff either,
43:33
Speaker 1: but they have to teach it otherwise they lose their tenure,
43:36
Speaker 1: they lose their chairs, they lose their funding. They you know,
43:40
Speaker 1: so you know, just just you know that that that
43:44
Speaker 1: movie that Ben Stein did years ago called No and
43:47
Speaker 1: you know, Uh, no intelligence allowed. Nothing's changed. All that's
43:53
Speaker 1: the same right now, even though that movie was done
43:55
Speaker 1: probably fifteen twenty years ago.
43:57
Speaker 2: As I'm thinking here, it suddenly occurs to me that
44:01
Speaker 2: your presentation would be a great thing for parents to have,
44:06
Speaker 2: so that they could sit down with their kids and
44:10
Speaker 2: just watch it and then have a discussion.
44:12
Speaker 1: I think it's be.
44:12
Speaker 2: A terrific idea, and it wouldn't be over the hiss.
44:16
Speaker 2: I think of the average ten, twelve, thirteen, fourteen year
44:19
Speaker 2: old kid, not at all, And it's badly needed in
44:23
Speaker 2: our era. The respect for a creator God needs to
44:27
Speaker 2: be reintroduced into our society. Well, wouldn't it.
44:31
Speaker 1: Wouldn't it be just like Satan to try to strip
44:34
Speaker 1: God of his glory as being the creator. And so
44:38
Speaker 1: that's the first thing he did, you know. And yet,
44:41
Speaker 1: and yet I love Revelations for where it says you
44:44
Speaker 1: know and in the and you know, for it talks
44:49
Speaker 1: about the glory of God and that he is He
44:53
Speaker 1: is worthy of all praise and all honor and all
44:55
Speaker 1: glory because He is the creator of all things. And
44:58
Speaker 1: by his and by his and by his will they
45:01
Speaker 1: were created and have their being. So we have to
45:05
Speaker 1: return to our worship, to worship God number one as
45:11
Speaker 1: the creator of all things. We don't exist if it's
45:15
Speaker 1: if it were not for God as the creator.
45:18
Speaker 2: Well said Russ Brill. The presentation is called Unmasking Evolution
45:24
Speaker 2: and it's very very much worth a watch, just to
45:28
Speaker 2: refresh yourself on creationism at large. Russ has been great
45:33
Speaker 2: talking with you. Appreciate it, Gary, and we'll talk again soon.