Latest / The Curve / The Ben and Jerry’s Post That Just Broke the Internet.

Transcript

The Ben and Jerry’s Post That Just Broke the Internet. · The Curve

0:00
I actually can't believe that this happened with Ben and Jerry's in the last couple of days.
0:03
And I also can't believe how invested in this whole situation I am, context.
0:08
You might not have seen this on social media, but it has gone totally viral.
0:11
The guy who started this business, like 47 years ago, has stepped down because he just
0:16
doesn't agree with the way that the business is now being run since it's been brought
0:20
by uni-leaver, right?
0:21
Yep.
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And quite a few people have sent it to us on Instagram.
0:26
And reading the way that he resigned or what was shared on social media, I don't know.
0:32
I felt so sad and I also felt equally proud and empowered and full of hope that people
0:38
are standing up to what is currently a really fucked up world.
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And they've built something for 47 years and then step away for moral reasons.
0:50
I don't know.
0:51
I think it's very brave.
0:52
I think it's going on, been going on for so many years, this whole uni-leaver.
0:56
Oh, right.
0:57
It's been a juries thing.
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Yeah.
0:59
Like they've sued uni-leaver twice, like it's been, so Ben and Jerry's sold their business
1:06
to uni-leaver in like 2020, or maybe you'll have that.
1:09
But they could have, there's a weird deal where they could remain independent with a uni-leaver
1:14
so that they could have their own board, make their own decisions.
1:17
But that's obviously been fraught with like disagreements because it's like you've kind
1:22
of got this independence, but you're also owned by someone else.
1:25
Anyway, Ben and Jerry's has always been very socially vocal and uni-leaver didn't like
1:32
that.
1:33
And so they-
1:34
We use socially vocal.
1:35
What are some of the things that have come up in the last couple of years?
1:37
Oh, they're just very pro gay rights, like all of that.
1:40
Like, and they've always come out with like funny tubs of ice cream, you know, that like
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kind of encourage the conversation.
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And so they've always been very vocal with their views on things.
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Anyway, when the war in Gaza started happening, they pulled all Ben and Jerry's products
1:57
from Israel because they were pro Palestine.
2:00
And uni-leaver didn't like that, but then they were like, well, we're our own independent
2:04
entity within uni-leaver so we can do it with one, so it's just been like so much back
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and forth.
2:09
And now he's obviously got to the point where he's like, screw it, I'm out, I'm out.
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So basically-
2:13
And then also uni-leaver's selling their ice cream division anyway.
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So there's just like a lot going on in the whole space.
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uni-leaver's like, we just want to remain independent.
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We don't want to be like pro Palestine, pro Israel or anything.
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They're trying to be Switzerlanders.
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Yeah.
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And then Ben and Jerry's is like, no, we have to be vocal about this.
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We have to, you know, we have to do so much going on in the world.
2:33
You know, we have to be vocal on them.
2:35
Yeah.
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So I can see both sides, right?
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Like it's better that it is very sad that they, you know, after 47 years, you're like,
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you know what?
2:43
I'm going to have to leave.
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And it's incredibly brave as a business owner to stand up against what you know is going
2:52
to inevitably impact your sales, impact your reputation.
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And like there will be people who really respect you for that.
2:59
And there will be people that absolutely lose their mind over it.
3:01
And I just think when you have a whole lot of your own personal finances tied up in
3:07
a company and the success of that business, and like, I mean financial success of that
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business is something that you're personally attached to, to put that aside and have social
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issues be kind of more important to you than overarching sales or people liking you
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or agreeing with your point of view.
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I think it's quite inspiring.
3:29
Yeah.
3:30
Should we read the caption that says to the Ben and Jerry's community, it's with a broken
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heart that I've decided I can no longer and good conscience.
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And after 47 years, remain an employee of Ben and Jerry's.
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I'm resigning from the company, Ben and I started back in 1979.
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It honestly just like that is so long ago.
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This is one of my hardest and most painful decisions I've ever made.
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This isn't because I've lost the love for the people at Ben and Jerry's, quite the
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opposite.
3:54
The folks who show up every day in our factory, scoop shops and offices are some of the
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most passionate, caring and values driven people we've ever met.
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They are the soul of Ben and Jerry's.
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What has made their work so important to me and what has allowed the company to be more
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than just an ice cream company was the independence to pursue our values, which was guaranteed when
4:14
you need to board the company.
4:17
More than 20 years under their ownership, Ben and Jerry's, oh, shit, so it's been 20
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years they've been under their ownership.
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That's ages.
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Oh, maybe they're disgruntled and I started in 2020.
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Wow, that's a long time.
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Ben and Jerry stood up and spoke out in support of peace, justice and human rights, not as
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abstract concept but in relation to real events happening in our world.
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That independence existed in no small part because of the unique merger agreement,
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Ben and I negotiated with the Unilever.
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One that enshrined our social mission and values in the company's governance structure
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and perpetuity is profoundly disappointing to come to the conclusion that independence,
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the very basis of our sale to Unilever is gone.
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And it's happening at a time when our country's current administration is attacking civil
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rights, voting rights, the rights of immigrants, women and the LGBTQ plus community.
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Running up for values of justice, equity and our shared humanity has never been more important
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and yet Ben and Jerry's has been silenced, sidelined, the fear of upsetting those in power.
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It's easy to stand up and speak out when there's nothing at risk, which is so true, it's
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so true.
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And these guys are doing it even though they have a lot to risk.
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They have a lot at risk.
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The real test of values is when times are challenging and you have something to lose.
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Love equity justice, they're part of who Ben and I are and they've always been the
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true foundation of Ben and Jerry's.
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From the very beginning, Ben and I believed that our values and the pursuit of justice
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were more important than the company itself.
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If the company couldn't stand up for the things that we believed, then it wasn't worth
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being a company at all.
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It was always about more than just ice cream.
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I got what is with me at the moment, I feel like I'm just getting so emotional, it's
5:56
with the very, it was a way to spread love and invite others into the fight for equity,
6:03
justice in a better world.
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Coming to the conclusion that this is no longer possible at Ben and Jerry's means I can
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no longer remain part of Ben and Jerry's.
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If I can't carry those values forward inside the company today, then I'll carry them forward
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outside with all the love and conviction I can with love, Jerry.
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I'm also like, what about Ben, Ben's like, I'm just going to stick around.
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He's like, he has to be like, so like, but I guess you know, I guess that's what you
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would want, right?
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You'd want to have a little part of you or a little part of how you want to sharpen business
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left.
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And if Ben can kind of be there and at least hold his own in some capacity, that probably
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feels better for Jerry than not.
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I can imagine.
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I would be like, if we truly, if we truly started this business on values and morals
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and that online, we should live together.
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Yeah.
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But that's kind of my point.
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I mean, I guess we don't know what's going on behind the scenes, but it's just like someone
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from the curved community sent this to us and I sent a message just being like, this
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is heartbreaking and also kind of full of hope in a weird way, standing up for what he believes
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in by walking away from something he's spent nearly 50 years building.
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That's like so moving to read and watch.
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Thank you for sending me a different talk about it in the curved weekly.
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And she replied saying, totally agree.
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It's so sad to have worked that hard on your legacy and to have tried to make a difference
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in the world.
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I can't imagine how he must be feeling.
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I wish that other businesses and world leaders had this moral compass and inspiring
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man.
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And the thing that she said is if you do cover, if you do cover it, I would love to know
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more about the history of the uni-leaver takeover and how we got here for Ben.
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But like, is there anything else to share on that?
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Like, did they basically, they were bought 20 years ago?
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Yes, but yeah, like I said, they could keep their own board of directors.
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So they're an independent company, which is quite a weird setup, but that's obviously
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just created more friction.
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If you bought by uni-leaver and like a normal, clean transaction, you wouldn't have
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say anything that gets done.
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Do you know what I mean?
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Whereas like, they kind of had this say, they're independent, but they'll also under a
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big parent company.
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And so, yeah, it's just like...
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I mean, that's kind of the dream for any business, right?
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To have the backing and financial support of a big company.
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Yeah.
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But to be able to make your decisions.
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Yes.
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But like, you can have that on paper, right?
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But if they're like, if they own a certain percentage of you and they don't agree.
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Like, it's like with any transaction, right?
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It's like, you can sell the dream and it can sound really good on paper, but they didn't
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practicality.
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How does it actually play out?
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And I don't know.
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Maybe uni-leaver didn't realise how passionate they were.
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Passionate and vocal and like, yeah.
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So, also, they didn't realise that something like the Palestine Israel conflict would come
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to a head and have this.
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But yeah.
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I guess it's also like the...
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And it could be.
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And what uni-leavers actually wanting to sell its whole ice cream division, it's like,
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you know what?
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Kind of too hard to ask it.
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I wonder if they will still sell it if he's leaving.
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Yeah.
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Or they are still happening.
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Yeah.
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Still happening.
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I wonder if like, you know, we've spoken before about contracts and like the importance
9:02
of firm and stuff.
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Like, I'd love to hear your insight.
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Like, they obviously did a really good job at trying their best to make sure that the
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sale enabled them to still remain independent, had their own voice and blah, blah, blah.
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And they've lasted 20 years.
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So there was obviously like push and pull.
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Yeah, yeah.
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But it's been like hard.
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I imagine for everyone, uni-leaver and Ben and Jerries, what would your insight be or
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like thoughts in general on when big businesses buy small ones and like, like, what, when
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you read all of this news, what do you think would have been happening behind closed doors?
9:34
I think it's always just think of worst case, right?
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And this is probably worst case.
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But like, we're going into any contract if they've run, if they're like, I don't
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just, it's like with a prenup, it's like with, yeah, any contract, it's like, what
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could be the worst case scenario in a player that play out those worst case scenarios
9:50
in your head?
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Always.
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Whenever you sign contracts, it's always, well, not always, nine times out of ten.
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It's in a really good calm setting.
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Do you know what I mean?
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And then it's like, when she hits the fan, that's when an emotion is getting involved
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and all of that.
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So I wouldn't do it.
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It means for Jerries, well, in terms of walking away, like, from a sheer holding perspective,
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would he just be like, it's sort of now out of his hands.
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So whatever part of the business he owns, he was only an employee, anyway, so he was
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a salary.
10:16
Yeah, yeah.
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So he's probably made quite a bit of money anyway, but it's still like his baby, but
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like even that in itself, don't you think?
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Like, if you've been bought out, say, like, say someone bought the curve and then 20 years
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later, we're still working in it.
10:28
Yeah.
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That's a pretty ginormous sign that you love what you do and you're really passionate
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about it.
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Your name attached to it as well.
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I mean, if this business was going back inside, I didn't even know Ben and Jerry were
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people, to be honest.
10:39
Yeah, no neither.
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I thought they were.
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It was cartoon characters.
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Yeah.
10:43
But that's Tom and Jerry.
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Yeah, yeah.
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But every time I think of Ben and Jerry, I think of Ben.
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I think of Ben.
10:47
Wait, what's Tom and Jerry?
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The cat in the mouse.
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Yeah.
10:50
Oh my god.
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I've always thought Ben and Jerry's was that.
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Yeah.
10:53
That's so funny.
10:54
So every time you bring your hand up, like, we need to just be aware, it looks like you've
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been in a battle.
10:58
There's a ginormous bruise on VIX4 out of you.
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Can't see it.
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Watch on YouTube.
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Go on dusting, and I'm so sorry.
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I think it's gone better in a monastery.
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It's kind of gone right.
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It's the weird stuff in the middle.
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I don't know.
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It's kind of hard.
11:11
Oh, you do have a hematoma.
11:13
That's what it is.
11:14
What is a hematoma?
11:15
What is a hematoma?
11:16
A hematoma.
11:17
So is it a hematoma?
11:18
It's basically where there's, you've had such a whack, like there's so much impact that
11:23
you're like.
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It's got to do.
11:25
Yeah, it's like a scar tissue, yeah.
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So you kind of get it.
11:27
I think you might need to get a massage, doesn't it?
11:30
Oh, it's so, so.
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I'm not getting a massage right now.
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But yes, yeah.
11:33
Maybe give context for what happens.
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I fell over.
11:36
Thank you for that detailed story.
11:40
So I went on holiday last week and I was on a boat and they just got new floors and I
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got onto the boat.
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Literally was on there for like not even like 15 minutes and just skitted my feet came
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under and they were in and landed on a like a door frame, like the door frame going
12:01
in and outside to inside and I went inside and get it on the new floor and it came
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down on the door frame and I was like, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine.
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And I was putting my bag inside and I said, I don't mean shit, we need to be around.
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I was just like, oh, I was like, hi, did you cry?
12:16
No, but it kind of, it was more the shock.
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I was like, oh my goodness, what just happened.
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And they were like, oh, yeah, I've just said the floor is down, sorry, like everyone on
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the boat knows.
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You're like, where's the slip?
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I know.
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I was like, give me a sign.
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Yeah.
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And the whole time I was like, I feel, I know how old people feel because the whole time
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the rest of the day I was like, really unsteady on my feet.
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You know, you're just a bit like, you just, like you don't trust the ground anymore.
12:37
Yeah, like you're just kind of like, oh my god, I'm going to go back in and then like,
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yeah, but it honestly didn't hurt that much, but it, yeah, it's probably.
12:45
I reckon it did.
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And I think you were in shock and embarrassed.
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Probably.
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And you put your body underneath.
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I was ready for the long save, three song.
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You couldn't quite see.
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Yeah.
12:52
And then like progressive for the day.
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And after a few drinks, I was like, look at my bro.
12:57
What I will say is, I hate it when you really hurt yourself and you make a big deal out
13:01
of it.
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And then there's like no bruises to show it for.
13:04
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
13:05
So at least you've got a whopper to be like, how brave am I?
13:08
It was honestly like a cluster of a trip.
13:11
Like it was the whole trip or the just like, you know, when you go on a trip and you just
13:15
have to laugh at how much shit goes around.
13:17
Oh my god, what happened?
13:18
Well, like there was tube strikes in London.
13:20
So getting to the airport was an absolute shit show.
13:24
It was torrential rain.
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And anywhere in the rain is like, so like getting an uber was like not happening.
13:31
It's not happening.
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I had two different uber apps, so did my friend and we were just like, and I was like,
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oh gosh, I'm really cutting into my buffer of, you know, my time to get to the airport.
13:40
Finally got to the train station, went down and I was like, oh, I'm going to make it full
13:44
over again.
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I'm going to make it.
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And then they were like, this alarm went off.
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And they're like, evacuate.
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They're building.
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And I could see the train approaching and I was like, come on, come on, come on, come on,
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come on.
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And it just kept going.
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And I was like, no, I was going to be swayed to evacuate.
13:57
The building is getting on the bloody train.
13:59
But no, anyways, it came back up, standing in the pouring rain, I didn't have a number
14:02
of luck because I was going to the South France.
14:07
And I called for a man, I was like, I'm not going to make it.
14:10
And he was like, just walk to the next station.
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And I was like, I can't.
14:13
It's like torrential rain.
14:15
Anyway, they opened it up about 15, 20 minutes later, it was absolutely dream.
14:19
Oh, 20 minutes when you're trying to get to the airport.
14:22
And you're like, looking, it went down, anyway, got on the train, I was like, and
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then I was on the train nearly at the airport.
14:27
And I was like, looking at my flight, chicken in.
14:29
And I was like, oh my god, the flight's half an hour early than I thought.
14:33
And I was like, so I was running.
14:35
No.
14:36
Then we got there and we were like, oh, we made it.
14:38
And we arrived in Nice, and our bags didn't arrive.
14:45
And you know, when you can convince someone to put the bag in his chicken luggage.
14:49
You've done that to someone else.
14:50
No.
14:51
And so I was like, I'm so sorry.
14:53
And then we were staying an hour and a half out of Nice.
14:54
So we're like, okay, we'll do stay here and case our bags arrive.
14:57
Do we leave like, oh, what?
14:59
So then two days later, got our bags for one day of the holiday.
15:02
And then had to come back.
15:03
Oh my gosh.
15:04
But actually, the reimburse for everything, like had to buy new toilet trays and everything.
15:07
And like, thankfully, he had very generous friends that let me borrow the underwear.
15:13
Can you just buy underwear?
15:14
I know, yeah.
15:15
You can buy skin care, like I'll borrow your undies.
15:19
But yeah, it was just a little bit...
15:21
Oh, yeah.
15:22
And then we were going to go to Paris afterwards, his flamenhead work.
15:25
But then that got canceled.
15:26
So then we had a trained Paris no flight time.
15:28
Oh, oh.
15:29
And then there's thunderstorms.
15:30
So what we went down for was the sailing and the sailing was canceled.
15:33
And so yeah.
15:35
Sounds like a great trip.
15:37
Had a really relaxing holiday.
15:38
She was so funny about this as I actually haven't heard this.
15:41
But all I saw was like your post on Instagram, which was like,
15:44
Saint-Truppet is the pool.
15:46
He's my cool house.
15:48
Like, you know, oh my gosh.
15:49
It actually was fun.
15:50
You know, but you know, like you have to get to that point where you're just like this,
15:53
like what more could go wrong?
15:54
Oh, cool.
15:55
There's something else, you know?
15:56
Whereas it could have spiraled and been like trips, trips, trips, but actually I was just like a laughing.
16:01
I was like, well, you know what I mean?
16:03
I feel like this is a story of my life here for I like, I think what happened to your net trip is every day.
16:10
No, it was.
16:11
It was.
16:12
Yeah, it was nice to catch up with friends and have not seen the Edmonds.
16:16
See the storm.
16:18
Can you see the storm?
16:18
Yeah.
16:19
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I'll see you there.
16:49
Let's TikTok is here to stay.
16:53
OK, this is huge news.
16:54
Yeah.
16:55
So yeah, for the last 18 months, it's kind of in this back and forth of life.
16:59
It's been that long.
17:00
Will TikTok stay in the US?
17:01
Will it not?
17:02
Yeah.
17:02
And so there's been an agreement this week that TikTok will stay in the US.
17:08
The US arm of the app will be bought by kind of like a consortium,
17:15
like a group of a group of people.
17:16
So Oracle is one of them.
17:18
Is that who sponsors the sailing?
17:19
Yeah.
17:20
They're used to, I don't know if they're, yeah.
17:23
Just remembering the like commentating whatever it's called being like.
17:25
And Oracle something or others making a, yeah.
17:28
Why not the left?
17:30
Up, come up the left, attack, attack to the right.
17:34
And then another PE company, another venture capital company.
17:36
So their private equity, Pee, Pee, Pee, NVC, yeah, the ETFs in S&P, yeah.
17:42
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
17:44
I met someone in a beat yesterday and she was like, we were talking about,
17:48
I was saying what the curve was and she was like, oh, yeah, yeah, I was an IB.
17:51
And I was like, I'm sorry, you were in, and what?
17:55
I was like, I be and I was like, I don't know what that is.
17:58
And she was like, investment banking.
17:59
I was like, oh, format.
18:01
Like, why does this happen?
18:03
Shit, sorry, if she's the same to us, because I did tell her to listen to blog posts.
18:07
It was more just, I was like, this is so classic.
18:09
You guys just lived in this world where it was like just the building blocks of acronyms.
18:13
But like, same with you in your world, right?
18:16
Right?
18:17
Like, the content.
18:18
The content.
18:19
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
18:20
The pre-roll, the post-roll.
18:21
I'm like, so I have a cheese roll, I'm like, well, I don't get it, yeah.
18:25
Oh my god, that's actually valid.
18:26
Yeah.
18:27
But I remember even like content, I do content content, I'm like, because content.
18:30
Yeah.
18:32
I think every industry has your jargon, right?
18:35
Like, you go into it.
18:36
Like, I now know what content is, and I'm like, yeah, we do content content.
18:38
But like, I'm glad you do after four and a half years, stilling.
18:43
But you know, like, it's kind of, I feel sometimes when I, I'm maybe not my parents,
18:47
but like, if I tell like the other, you start talking, you realize you're also talking
18:50
like, oh, yeah, it's a, it's a content business in there kind of like, yeah, yeah, yeah.
18:58
And is it weird that I sometimes like it?
19:00
But the jargon.
19:01
Just like, yeah, we're just like, no, you don't know, I'm looking at shame.
19:04
Yeah.
19:05
I just think this is whole, like, the whole career, you know, my whole draw of it.
19:11
And like, what I do every day is deciphering shit for other people, that it's kind of
19:14
nice sometimes to just say, there's so funny.
19:18
I love that so much.
19:19
She like gets a little kick out of it.
19:20
Oh, anyway, that's mean.
19:23
I love it.
19:24
Yeah.
19:26
Yes, TikTok is here to stay the key thing, the key thing is though, this weird relationship.
19:30
So that we'll have this new US company, which is buying, it's licensing the algorithm,
19:37
the TikTok algorithm from bike dance, the parent company, the owns TikTok in China.
19:42
So it's just a licensing this algorithm to then feed to US people.
19:48
So it can kind of control what people see.
19:52
So okay.
19:53
So let's backtrack for once again.
19:54
So the main thing about TikTok that makes it so unique and what is everyone's obsessed
19:59
with, the like kind of golden ticket for TikTok is the algorithm, right?
20:02
Yeah.
20:03
Like the algorithm or the way they serve content, the way that people find things, the way
20:07
stuff goes viral, like that is like really almost its IP is yes.
20:10
And the reason this whole conversation came about was that the US was getting scared
20:15
that it was all the data was being sent back to China and they were like, you know, having
20:20
eyes over what everyone in the US is looking at and there's like privacy issues and like
20:24
all of that.
20:25
There was almost like they were paranoid about what TikTok, what the secret eyes of TikTok
20:29
were doing or like kind of worried about it being a breach of all people's privacy and
20:34
other of them.
20:35
Yeah.
20:36
Threatening national security was kind of their life.
20:37
That's right.
20:38
And that's how they got around the free speech thing, right?
20:39
Was the national security because everyone was like, it's free speech, like we should be
20:42
able to like consume content on wall on it.
20:46
Content.
20:47
I heard someone call it tent the other day and I thought that's a bit far.
20:50
Oh my god.
20:51
How are you going with tent?
20:52
How's the tent going?
20:53
You're like, what tent?
20:54
No, I'm not camping.
20:55
Why?
20:56
I'm confused.
20:57
I can't believe you.
20:58
Oh my god.
20:59
That's just not.
21:00
That's too far for me.
21:01
Yeah, that's tent as well.
21:02
I'll probably throw it out there one day though, just to make sure.
21:04
Hey, go with the tent.
21:05
Yeah.
21:06
Sorry, move on.
21:07
Yes.
21:08
Sorry, that was the kind of the whole push and pull was like, well, no, no, it's
21:09
free speech.
21:10
It's, you know, we should be able to consume content on whatever platform we want.
21:14
And the government was like, no, no, it's national security risk anyway.
21:18
And then what was happening was basically the US was saying, if you want to have TikTok
21:22
in the US, you have to sell it to the US.
21:24
You have to sell it to a US own company so that we feel we have control from a national
21:28
security standpoint.
21:29
And this has been going on for like so, so long.
21:32
And then it got to like the 11th hour, like not that long ago, it was like six months
21:37
ago.
21:38
Even was pulling out.
21:39
And you go, my god, I'm going to lose my income and like fear enough, it's like when
21:41
you've built up such a brand, but then it's been delayed, like the band date has been
21:46
like pushback, pushback, pushback, pushback.
21:47
And a very good PR can be totally, yeah, uh, for Instagram, I reckon.
21:52
Yeah.
21:53
Well, I reckon also for TikTok, because the number of people though at that limit hour,
21:56
we're like, follow me on Instagram, you know, they would have been like, come here,
22:01
come here.
22:02
Yeah.
22:03
But also, I think this is a really good step for China in the US, like the fact they've
22:08
agreed on something.
22:10
I don't know.
22:11
This is like a little slither of hope.
22:12
Like, well, I don't know, maybe I'm being naive, but so hold on.
22:15
So, um, with the whole algorithm thing, so basically this company now has access to
22:20
the algorithm, and is almost the intermediary between TikTok and the US, so that the US
22:27
can breathe and feel safe and fine with, and it's got its own board of directors with
22:32
a member from the US government on it.
22:35
I just think it's going to be, um, what do you mean?
22:39
Well, I just, I just think when there's regulation like that, it's almost like, it's
22:43
ruining the magic of what TikTok is.
22:45
Is that what you mean?
22:46
Yeah.
22:47
And I just feel like I, it'll be interesting to see what we see being in the UK versus
22:52
what?
22:53
Oh, US friends see, and just like the updates and like all of that kind of stuff, like,
23:00
do they get that?
23:01
Do they not like, do people actually want to say what they feel?
23:09
But now knowing that there's someone from the US government that's owned the business,
23:12
I don't know.
23:13
Yeah.
23:14
I think in all honesty, maybe this is being really like reductive to people who are using
23:19
TikTok as their main source of income, but I imagine while they're aware of what's going
23:26
on with the US and with the purchase of course, because it was like all over TikTok, I don't,
23:31
I think people will just be happy that it's staying, I don't know if they'll be looking
23:34
into it in too much detail, being like, oh, there's a US government official on the board
23:37
of this company that now is the intermediate, you know, like unless they start cracking
23:40
down on, it'll be interesting to see what happens.
23:43
I mean, I think that if anything, the main thing it's made me realise is social media
23:49
and general, like so many businesses rely on it, it's us included, it's a huge part of
23:53
how we market the podcast and our brand and general and everything we do, our investing
23:58
club, I think that there's probably a bit of a realisation amongst a lot of businesses,
24:03
how fragile and also how political it is now, and just the like, what felt independent
24:12
is like starting to really not feel that way.
24:15
It's also realising what your fear is not independent, right?
24:18
Oh, that freaks me out, it freaks me out so much, and also we're kind of complaining
24:25
about the giant almost division between left and right, and really it does stem a lot
24:29
from politics, whatever people believe, but yeah, the way that the algorithms are designed
24:36
is to feed that, like insatiable hunger, to like re-atherm your own political views or
24:43
your own views or whatever, to think that there's all these little echo chambers, I don't
24:48
know, it really freaks me out, and the idea that, you know, you can get quite frustrated
24:54
with someone who has a particular view on the world, right?
24:57
You're like, how do you believe that?
24:59
Yeah, yeah.
25:00
But you have no idea what they're being fed in the algorithm.
25:01
They're being fed that for years and years and years.
25:03
It's like high brainwashing, definitely.
25:05
But miraculously, China has now dropped a antitrust probe that it had against Google as
25:12
well.
25:13
Oh, so there's like, there's a lot of it.
25:14
There's something's going on.
25:16
So there is like, there would have been negotiations behind this being like, okay, if you
25:19
drop this, we'll agree to that, like, so, so backtracking, about nine, six, nine months
25:25
ago.
25:26
And actually, this is probably been going on for a while.
25:28
The tech companies had become bigger and bigger and bigger.
25:31
And they're like these big monopolies that owned so much.
25:34
Like, it's like Amazon.
25:35
It's the anti-competitive nature means that it can be really hard for other brands to
25:40
sell stuff online because Amazon kind of just takes like 90% of market share.
25:44
It's the same thing with Google when it comes to searches.
25:48
They are so dominant that it's like the anti-competitive thing was basically China
25:53
slapping these giant finds and trying to like, take, it was essentially then being like,
25:57
if you're going to come at us for TikTok, we'll come at you for Google.
26:01
And so now are you saying that essentially that's like, been dropped?
26:05
No, so it was, yes, there is that going on and that's been going on in lots of different
26:09
countries because it's effectively too big for its boots.
26:12
But this was more around its Android operating system, having to be on certain smartphones
26:17
and like kind of dominating, dominating that.
26:20
So yeah, essentially it's just like saying there will be so many other things I think
26:24
that will go on behind the scenes.
26:27
When these big deals, I always think when these big deals are like, and it's news headlines
26:31
that TikTok has agreed to do this, it's like, what else was behind the scenes?
26:36
What are the 10 other things that you have given up or agreed to or whatever to get to
26:40
that point?
26:41
Because I think what we see is like the tip of the iceberg to be honest.
26:45
Have you, have we spoken about this?
26:46
I don't know if I've already said this.
26:48
Have you watched the Netflix show, Hostage?
26:51
Your hostages?
26:52
Yeah.
26:53
You know how, so I won't give anything away, but basically it's about the UK government
26:58
and the French government and all of the kind of like political dealings that go on behind
27:02
the scenes and the deals they're making with each other to get some things.
27:04
Yeah.
27:05
And I know it's dramatized.
27:06
I know that this is a TV show, but it really opened my eyes up to like, what a game politics
27:13
are.
27:14
I'll give you this if you give me that.
27:15
So and like just the idea of power and what power does to people and to want to stay in
27:21
that position to be able to make decisions and the things that that you'll do and give
27:25
up and compromise to get what you want.
27:28
And I just think this is one of those things, like imagine the conversations to get to
27:32
this point.
27:33
Yeah.
27:34
It would have been what in money's power, right?
27:35
And like there is a lot of money on the table with tech talk, with Google, with like all
27:40
of that.
27:41
So, but I do hope, I do hope this is like the start of like, hey, you know what?
27:45
Let's work together here.
27:46
Yeah.
27:47
I think I'm very hopeful in naive.
27:49
I mean, it's better than the opposite, right?
27:52
Yeah.
27:53
We could be seeing them going further apart, continuing to like, I think this is, I mean,
27:57
maybe I'm also being naive, but I feel like this is better than the opposite.
28:00
Apparently that people have to download a new app.
28:03
So a new tech talk app.
28:04
Oh, yeah.
28:05
You imagine being that you just be like screaming at them because to get someone to download
28:10
an app is like, oh, difficult, right?
28:12
I've been having 2,000,000,000 in millions of people, like you're going to lose most
28:16
of one or most of them.
28:17
If I had to download a new app to follow US people, I'd be like, oh, is that the thing?
28:22
So it's specific for US content creators.
28:24
Yeah.
28:25
Even as content creators, they'll be gutters because that sucks.
28:28
For all Trump sins, there is one thing that I have to get on board with that he has announced
28:34
this week.
28:35
And that is changing reporting for US public companies to twice a year, not four times
28:43
a year.
28:44
Oh, cool.
28:45
Yeah.
28:46
So in New Zealand, in the UK, in Australia, everyone does it twice a year.
28:49
So you have, it's a public company.
28:50
You have to report to investors.
28:52
You'll find actual results at the end of the financial year and then halfway through.
28:56
So twice a year.
28:57
You can do more if you want, if you wanted to do monthly, you could.
29:00
But there's obviously a cost with that, right?
29:02
You have to do accountants and lawyers.
29:04
And in the US, it's always been quarterly, but that actually instills like this real short
29:09
termism view by CEOs because they're like, oh, we need to put out a good quarterly result.
29:13
And like three months for a big company is like, nothing, nothing.
29:16
Also, this for you to like, just not like I'm just realizing how many political chats
29:21
we're having today, but like not to liken this to politics, but it's similar to the idea
29:26
of being in power for a country.
29:27
Yes.
29:28
You're only in power for a short period of time.
29:30
You're not thinking about 50 years time, what's happening to your country.
29:33
I mean, maybe you are, but pointers is the same thing with businesses, like when the targets
29:39
or the things that you're having to report a three monthly short term, the decisions
29:44
that you make or the way that you are in your job, you make different decisions if you're
29:48
thinking about short term or long term.
29:50
Definitely.
29:51
Yeah.
29:52
It just takes away this whole long term focus, which is how we invest as investors is for
29:56
the long term.
29:57
So that is the reason that, you know, with these results that come out quarterly, do you
30:02
think that is really a huge amount of the volatility and the idea of share prices going
30:07
all over the show?
30:08
Does that generally happen like if you'd zoomed in on a year of the stock market?
30:12
Yeah.
30:13
Is that generally four kind of dips?
30:15
It depends, right?
30:16
Like some companies are pretty consistent, like supermarkets, for example, you know, they're
30:21
not like shooting the lights out, being like, oh my god, we had millions more people
30:25
getting the store, you know, but then there's ones where like we had Oracle last week
30:30
and they've just announced a ridiculous contract with OpenAI, yeah, all like tech companies
30:34
when you get a big contract and it just like shoots lights out in terms of revenue,
30:37
then yes, that'll create volatility.
30:40
So it's, it depends, but it does create more news, means more things you can react to
30:46
or as investors.
30:47
So I think it's a really good idea.
30:49
I think also it makes it more attractive for companies to float on stock market, which
30:55
just means that go public, go public, float on the stock market, if you're going to float
31:02
a company, really, was that what it means?
31:05
Yeah.
31:06
Like you can float on the stock market.
31:07
Oh my god, fun.
31:08
It sounds really fun.
31:09
I want to float.
31:10
Floating up.
31:11
Yeah.
31:12
And is the idea of floating on the stock market?
31:13
Like what?
31:14
I don't get it.
31:15
I don't get it either.
31:16
But it's just like, we love it.
31:17
Another little analogy.
31:18
Okay.
31:19
But yes, it's, it's hoping to encourage more companies to float because otherwise,
31:24
you know, if you have to report your results four times a year, that's a costly,
31:28
it's like admin for business.
31:31
So I mean, there's been like decline, yes, we've had a lot of IPOs last week, in like
31:37
the last few weeks, but natural, there's been a natural decline, like less companies are
31:42
wanting to go public and like, been back in the day, it used to be kind of like the
31:48
glory of like being a public company and now it's just saying, oh, it's actually quite
31:52
admin.
31:53
Yeah.
31:54
Yeah.
31:55
No, they're not.
31:56
Yeah.
31:57
So, okay, right.
31:58
So this is, is this been bought in now?
31:59
Like, is it, when does it start?
32:00
No, it's been tabled in terms of, like, it's been discussed, but it's not like, done
32:05
and dusted yet.
32:06
Right.
32:07
Yeah.
32:08
And update actually on the Clana IPO, which we spoke about, but it hadn't actually listed
32:11
when we recorded.
32:12
So has it listed now?
32:13
It has listed.
32:14
It listed at, so the price is $40 and it's now at $45.
32:19
So it's done quite well, which is quite rare.
32:22
So it's a stock market.
32:23
The stock markets don't quite well over the last few days.
32:25
Last week.
32:26
So.
32:27
Yeah.
32:28
Done well.
32:29
What does that say to the broader view of like the financial side of the world and where
32:34
people are in terms of like Clana is buying our pay later, so it, it is the idea of people
32:38
living outside of their means.
32:40
Do you think that that gives any kind of indications?
32:42
Like, no, I think it's too new, like it's too much of a new technology, but I think
32:47
it is when you see the missed payments start going up, that's concerning.
32:54
So they report like people that, you know, what they call defaults, people have not been
32:59
able to pay the second or the third or the fourth payment, that when that starts creeping
33:03
up, that's concerning, because that means people can't actually, yeah.
33:06
That's also where they get more revenue, right?
33:08
Yeah.
33:09
And lastly, with Tesla, we haven't talked about Tesla in ages, but that generally means
33:14
something's happening behind the scenes and we've missed it and now, sorry, I'm so
33:19
dramatic.
33:20
Point is, when you don't hear about something often, when it makes a comeback, it's because
33:25
you've missed the opportunity to unbeast.
33:27
Yes.
33:28
So I'm getting a feeling here that we've missed something, everyone.
33:33
Oh my god, shit.
33:37
I knew it.
33:38
Okay, so Vixie showed me a graph.
33:40
I did say this about nine months ago, didn't I, so did you, we were both saying the same
33:44
thing.
33:45
So Offie pops, he's gone off, he's left the US politician, you know, offers and he's gone
33:52
back and focused on Tesla and it is back in the game.
33:55
18% in the last six months.
33:57
So it's gone, plodding along, down, looks terrible, terrible, starting to make a cut.
34:02
When did it start making that climb up about my, oh my god, that is honestly, sorry, but
34:10
for all of Elon Musk's, all of Elon Musk's sins and things that I don't like about him,
34:18
he's obviously, he knows what's going on, he's very good at running it.
34:22
So he has just bought a billion dollars worth of Tesla stock.
34:26
Well, what an effuud everyone.
34:28
Yeah.
34:29
Tused to own Tesla.
34:30
Yeah, and I bought more.
34:31
Damn it.
34:32
Yeah, I felt really sick when he was like in bed with Trump and doing all that and I was
34:35
like, aww.
34:36
And then as soon as he left office, we got kicked out whatever, I was like, no, I was
34:41
like, the fact that it was when they announced those targets, you know, that he was going
34:45
to be compensated.
34:46
Yeah.
34:47
So it was like, he can be awarded a trillion dollars of stock if they reach, reaches these
34:52
certain targets and he did it last time, he shot the lights out last time.
34:56
He's now bought stock, he's, so he's signed to the steal, he's bought stock like, you
35:03
don't buy a trillion dollars with a stock if you think there's a slight chance you're
35:06
not going to have those targets.
35:07
So I'm just saying, happy days.
35:09
Sorry, can I just tell you?
35:11
I was just looking at my investments.
35:13
I have invested in this thing called Shark Ninja, have you heard of it?
35:16
Oh, they're like, something to do with that game plan, is I?
35:19
Vacuums, frying pans here, like, that's the new, like, AirRap.
35:24
It is up 43% since I invested in it.
35:28
Most.
35:29
Sorry.
35:30
I have a Ninja fry band.
35:31
A professional investor.
35:33
I mean, do you want me to comment?
35:36
I'm not.
35:37
Anyway, this is a massive green flag and we've talked about this a lot in terms of, you
35:42
know, when a founder or CEO, someone inside the company that can see what's going on, buys
35:48
a whole lot of stock.
35:49
There is no bigger green flag than that.
35:51
Okay.
35:52
And when someone who already owns 13% of the company doubles down and buys one trillion
35:58
dollars worth of stock, surely this is going to go viral.
36:01
Because there's this little tiny clip of Victor who just wants to go viral because honestly
36:05
think about it.
36:06
It's like, it's kind of like, and I know a lot of people might not agree with Elon
36:10
Masks.
36:11
And I'm like, Masks, why not?
36:12
Why do you know if there was two of them?
36:14
He's got about 14 kids, so there's quite a few.
36:19
I know a lot of people don't agree with Elon Musk, but this is a great example of like,
36:23
well, do you want to make money?
36:24
I mean, this is the debate, right?
36:26
Yeah.
36:27
Because it's so hard to sit on this, like, it's really interesting.
36:34
I'd be curious to know anyone that's listening to this podcast, but some more insight into
36:39
the types of ways you want to invest, because like, I mean, the dream one day would be for
36:42
us to be able to invest on behalf of the community, right?
36:44
And how amazing would that be?
36:46
Yeah.
36:47
But like, understanding what is the tilt of the curve community?
36:50
Like, is there an element where you just are quite interested in making money and you're
36:54
not super worried about the, I just think it's more everyone's different, right?
37:00
Like, you might be like, absolutely not.
37:02
I do not want there's shark men drive way where I can make money in that.
37:06
And I'm like, no, you know what?
37:07
Like, for all his sins, I am fine with making money in Tesla.
37:10
Like, no, two people for a second.
37:13
Sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you, but I just want to get a third opinion here.
37:16
You're going to have to make a snap decision.
37:17
Come here.
37:18
Three, two, one.
37:19
Would you invest in Tesla if it meant you were going to make some money?
37:24
That's too hard of a question because, yes, obviously, I want to make money, but not
37:29
through Tesla.
37:30
So it's a no.
37:31
It's a no for me.
37:32
Okay.
37:33
Okay.
37:34
Interesting.
37:35
I really want to know in the comments of this podcast, if wherever you're listening, would
37:37
you invest in Tesla if you were making money or are you kind of like, nah, absolutely
37:42
a no from Elon?
37:44
And I also think this is a really good example of like, when you give your money to someone
37:49
else to manage and they outline, this is what we will and won't invest in.
37:54
Like, you have to agree with that, they aren't set.
37:56
Do you know what I mean?
37:57
You can't then be like, hang on.
37:58
I don't want you to invest in that or I don't want to because it's like, no, no, you
38:01
almost signed an agreement saying, yes, I might agree with 90% of what you've written
38:09
down.
38:10
And there might be a few things they don't agree with, but I'm willing to hand over that
38:13
decision making to you.
38:14
Well, the difference between giving your money to someone else to manage is that you
38:18
don't get as much of a say as to where your money is going.
38:21
Like you get the, like, professional lens and you get someone else making those decisions
38:26
in blah, blah, blah.
38:27
But like, I ultimately don't have as much control.
38:29
Like to me, Tesla has taken so many cars off the road and made such progress in reducing
38:36
emissions for this planet, like, you, nobody can disagree with that.
38:41
Like for me, that's enough to make me want to invest.
38:44
We actually talked about Tesla in the club before it started moving, before the cheaper
38:50
I started going up.
38:51
So if anyone out there wants to be in the know with companies, before they start to move,
38:58
then run the club.
38:59
Yeah, join the club.
39:00
Well, the link in the podcast show notes, but yes, we'd love to have your thoughts in
39:03
the comments as well.
39:04
Yeah.
39:05
It's so fun reading the comments.
39:06
There's been so many lately.
39:08
Also, we don't do enough self promotion.
39:11
If you enjoy the podcast, if you learn something, if you come back every week, place in this
39:15
to your friends family, anyone you think would be interested because the more that you
39:19
share it, the more that it helps us, the more that it changes.
39:22
Like even just commenting, if you're listening to this podcast, helps, like, would the Spotify
39:26
algorithm, which lets you notice there's nothing on TikToks, but it's still really amazing.
39:31
So please share, comment, rate the show, and thanks so much for listening.
39:35
We'll be back next week.
39:38
If you've just listened to this podcast and you've thought, hmm, some very interesting
39:42
thoughts in there, some investing ideas, and actually maybe, for example, even like,
39:47
if you've heard us talking in this episode about Tesla and like, whether or not people
39:50
are buying or selling, this is such a good opportunity to check out the NBC club.
39:54
Because this is where everyone is talking about what they're doing with their money and
39:58
how they're investing.
39:59
So you can listen to other people that is not just, they can I rambling on, on a podcast.
40:03
And they're also a seven day free trial.
40:06
So if you're interested, sign up with the link in the podcast show notes.
40:13
Okay, quickly, the curve was created to empower and educate you about investing, but we are
40:17
not financial advisors.
40:19
Our platform exists for educational purposes only, and it doesn't provide personalized
40:23
investing advice for your individual needs and should not be relied upon to make an investment
40:27
or financial decision.
40:29
And always remember to do your own research before making any investment or financial
40:32
decision.
40:33
We're here for any knowledge and support you need, but the final call is always yours.
40:37
And thanks for being here.
40:39
You got this.
40:40
Yeah, we know you got this.