Latest / IB Unplugged / Creating Healthier Classrooms: Wellbeing as a Whole-School Practice w/ Junita Boy

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Creating Healthier Classrooms: Wellbeing as a Whole-School Practice w/ Junita Boy · IB Unplugged

• 0:00
  Welcome to IB Unplugged, a Kognity podcast for IBDP educators
• 0:04
  that tackles your submitted questions and challenges by connecting you with
• 0:08
  experts and peers who share their ideas and stories from real classrooms.
• 0:12
  Hello and welcome to IB Unplugged.
• 0:15
  This week we are talking with Junita Boy
• 0:18
  and we're talking about mental health, wellbeing and the IB diploma program.
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  And we're really excited to be talking with Junita
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  because she's an educator, a psychologist and inclusion
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  advocate dedicated to holistic student and teacher wellbeing.
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  She's got two master's degrees, one in educational psychology,
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  another one in advanced teaching and learning,
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  and alongside a Bachelor of Education in guidance in counseling.
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  So she brings a lot both to the academic expertise and practical expertise
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  in terms of what she does on a daily basis,
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  which, you know, now she's a teacher in an international school.
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  She's a certified psychologist and an IB psychology history and TOK teacher.
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  She's integrating mental health awareness, social emotional
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  learning and inclusive education into her teaching practice.
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  Her passions lie in supporting both students and educators
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  in navigating the challenges of learning and teaching,
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  and she strongly believes that a healthy learning environment starts with mentally
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  and emotionally supported teachers, which in turn fosters student success.
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  So through her work, she advocates for self-care, resilience,
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  and meaningful conversation around mental health in education.
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  And that's exactly what we were able to do with Junita today.
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  And we're really excited for you to dive into this episode
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  where there's been a lot of golden nuggets that are going to come your way,
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  here pretty soon.
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  Yeah.
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  We've had such a pleasure to be able to work with Junita in the past at Kognity.
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  We've really loved having a few opportunities to work with her.
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  She's been a conference speaker at Engage Ghana, and she's also
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  been behind one of our interviews for, World Mental Health Day.
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  And we've been able to, yeah,
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  get a lot of insights from her and be able to shape
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  some of the work that we've been doing in Kognity.
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  So it was a clear win when we had some people asking about,
• 1:55
  doing an episode on mental health for students and teachers.
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  We knew that she was the right person to talk to.
• 2:02
  So, yeah, it's been a great episode with her.
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  I've loved hearing her ideas of really ways that the teachers can work
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  really intimately with the individual students
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  and really about the noticing the subtleties and really noticing how to
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  build these relationships with students
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  in the classroom and outside of the classroom.
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  And, also about taking care of each other.
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  I think it's so clear how much her team love working together.
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  And I think how big of an impact that that can also have on teacher wellbeing, too.
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  Yeah.
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  I think what really stood out for me was essentially this idea of like, you're
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  creating a culture of inclusivity and wellness and essentially
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  looking after one another.
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  And not only translates between colleagues, but also through students.
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  And so this concept of like culture not just being from the leadership,
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  but everybody building that up together
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  is a message that I think held pretty strongly in our conversation.
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  So there's a lot to have in this episode.
• 3:00
  We're really excited for you
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  to be here with us again at IB Unplugged, and we hope you enjoy this episode,
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  focusing in on wellbeing and mental health in the IB diploma Program with
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  Junita Boy.
• 3:16
  Hi, Junita. Thank you so much for joining us today.
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  We're really excited to have you here for this episode.
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  I'm so excited to be here as well.
• 3:23
  Thank you. So we like to get started with just some warm up questions to kind of
• 3:27
  get people to understand a little bit of your background and your thoughts.
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  So our first question is always why education?
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  Why did you choose a career in education?
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  I know every teacher would back me up on this.
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  Nobody chooses to be a teacher.
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  I know, I know how it sounds,
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  but there's a good part about it. So education was never my first choice.
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  I actually wanted to go into law, but because I have a very traditional father,
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  I ended up in education.
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  He brought me the application papers for education and I was like, I want low.
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  But because how we are cultured,
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  it was hard for me to like push up against him.
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  Like, this is what I want.
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  So I was like, let me go get the education degree.
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  Then I'm just going to give it to you and go do low after that.
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  But apparently when I went into education, I realized
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  there were different choices to education.
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  So you can either go do education arts.
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  You can either do education guidance and counseling, or you can do special needs.
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  So I thought, this guidance in counseling looks interesting.
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  Why not try it.
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  So when I started teaching but at the same time I was counseling,
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  I was lured into teaching because of counseling.
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  So it's the one thing that drew me closer to students.
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  It's the one thing that when a child comes to me and talks to me about something,
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  that's what drew me to education.
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  And I realized when you are in the counseling office, it's not enough.
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  When you socialize with students outside in classroom,
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  you get to know them better and you get to help them better.
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  So that's what lured me to education.
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  And so when I finished even my teaching practice and everything,
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  I was like, okay, dad, thanks for education.
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  Okay. You you were kind of right.
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  I give in now, I'll do it.
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  And you probably also
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  didn't expect you to be off in India now and travel the world with education.
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  You probably regrets that part. Definitely.
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  Like even having to engage self like it has made,
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  it has changed everything in my life.
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  Like totally everything.
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  How I see people, how I see everything, like
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  my perspectives have really widened as a result of education,
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  which is a good thing.
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  Yeah, I'm sure that brings so much more to the classroom now too.
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  And, as you said, with kind of that gateway being the counseling and sort
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  of looking after people and now seeing that in the classroom,
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  I'm sure widening that perspective has made some really positive changes
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  for those young people too. Yeah. You never lose it.
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  That aspect because of that thing that's.. In education,
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  we as you, we tell ourselves what keeps you in education is your why.
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  You need to remember your why.
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  Why am I here.
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  So because teaching at times can be hectic.
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  It can be tiresome and at times more rewarding.
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  Everyone's like, it's rewarding as well.
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  Yes, at times it's rewarding.
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  But personally, at times you can feel like I'm not getting what I deserve.
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  I'm not being paid enough for this.
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  But then you remember your why.
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  Why am I doing this?
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  So for me, when I see a student who comes into my class,
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  shy, can't speak in class or has low self esteem,
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  demotivated, but they leave my class when they are totally different person.
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  That is my why.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah, that is now my why.
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  That's what moves me.
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  That gives me strength to come back to the same class over and over again.
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  Yeah.
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  And it's better than any paycheck could really be, right?
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  It's better.
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  It’s something that it's, it like steals you up and like I want to make a change.
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  I'm not just saying that but you have like intrinsic motivation
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  to do much more and to help other people do the same.
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  Yeah. Yeah.
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  I didn't just start teaching in an international school, by the way,
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  when I started teaching, I taught in a very remote school in Kenya.
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  Okay.
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  That was my first experience to teaching.
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  Yeah.
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  Where girls wouldn’t go to school and if they did,
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  they were married off when they were very young.
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  So most of them came to school, but they came from their husbands house.
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  Really?
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  So it was a different dynamics to it
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  when I was teaching these girls and seeing them and then empowering them,
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  giving them strength, they had kids at home, yet
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  they had to do your homework. Like they were nurturing their own kids.
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  And this was a secondary school, right?
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  This was a secondary school.
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  Yeah.
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  So I'm seeing girls who, some even feel like, why am I even doing this?
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  I should just drop off and steam my husband house.
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  And they need to look up to you.
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  And when I started teaching, I was around 21 years old.
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  So you'd find most of them because they went to school late.
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  Most of them were almost my age
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  and even 22 or 23 years old.
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  So they would look up to me like, how did you get there?
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  Like you made it.
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  So like my dad made me. Yeah.
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  Those are some of the things that really steered me and moved me towards education.
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  And I was like,
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  sometimes I'm not just doing this for me, I'm doing it for other people.
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  Like, I need to be strong to show these girls that you can do it.
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  You can be this strong, powerful woman that you want to be in the future.
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  And don't just think of yourself as, oh, I'm a married woman.
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  I have low hopes in life.
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  So those are some of the things that even motivated
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  me earlier on in my teaching career.
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  Yeah, yeah.
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  All right.
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  Well, that's,
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  we're calling that a warm up question, but I'm feeling pretty warm already.
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  But we do like to, kind of, take it onto the next question here,
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  which I wonder if you could just sort of stay within that vein of like, you know,
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  as you said, kind of,
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  drew you to education through guidance and essentially counseling itself.
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  And so with that in mind,
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  where do you see the role of educators evolving in the coming years?
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  Like and specifically with regard to like,
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  counseling and guidance with young people?
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  So even the beauty of IB, because I also didn't
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  start in IB, I started teaching the Kenyan curriculum.
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  The beauty of IB is its teaching methodologies are different.
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  We see teachers as facilitators and you don't just focus on
• 9:44
  academic performance, you focus on the holistic development of the child.
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  And when I talk of a teacher being a facilitator,
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  I'm not just saying that you stand there and say, okay, these are the tools.
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  Do your own thing. No.
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  A facilitator does more than that.
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  Other than availing tools, you create a safe environment for learning.
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  You create an environment where a student can engage in discovery
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  learning through either projects, through inquiry based.
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  You are also
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  creating a global citizen.
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  This child that you're nurturing is going to live amongst other people.
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  Yeah.
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  We need to create an environment
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  where this child that you're nurturing can coexist with others.
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  So you will see that a teacher's job is not just go there, teach you a history,
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  teach you a psychology and leave the classroom. Yeah.
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  You're not hurting somebody.
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  You're nurturing a person who's going to live with other people.
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  You're nurturing critical thinking skills, problem solving skills,
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  creativity.
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  So this is what a facilitator is supposed to do.
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  And for you to connect with that you have to do more than just teach.
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  You need to get to know this child.
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  What are their likes? What are their dislikes?
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  What do they like more?
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  You'll find me in class coming to my students.
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  I don't want to just be
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  the boring psychology teacher or the boring history teacher.
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  I mean, I might be teaching something and I will say, okay, first,
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  before we start, can we relax?
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  Can we dance to this song?
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  I'll be the first one dancing to that song.
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  So that they see me as a human being first so that they can connect to me.
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  So this is important.
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  Not everyone can do that.
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  But when you connect with your students, I've had my students telling me so many
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  times, please, when I come to your class, that's when I'm at ease.
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  Like, I don't have stress.
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  I'm not saying psychology is easy, but this class gives me joy.
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  And that's what I want to hear from my students.
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  This is awesome, though, because you talk about,
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  like, okay, you're creating safety. You're creating a place for joy.
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  You're creating a place for people to feel comfortable.
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  And then talking about
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  inspiring a global citizen and somebody who can go on to, you know,
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  and what's great is sometimes we ask this question and a lot of people talking
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  like AI and tech and the sort of stuff which I think is going to be
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  present in our future.
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  But I love that you've rooted this back
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  in the fundamentals of, like, now what's the role of us as teachers?
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  It's to cultivate the youth into what's going to be coming.
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  I love that. That's a great answer.
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  Yeah.
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  I also think it's one that, it takes a lot of vulnerability
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  and a lot of confidence too to be able to say, like,
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  I'm not going to create a boundary between me and my students, or like,
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  there's a lot of feeling of maybe I need to be more professional,
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  but then it's also like, no, but I want to be myself as well.
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  And like, I think that there's so much impact in
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  like, students will react to what feels authentic in so many ways.
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  But then maybe there's also some schools where it feels like you need to be more
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  like straight and direct and like a bit more impersonal too.
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  But sometimes, Courtney, it's not even about the kind of who
• 12:48
  what kind of teacher or what kind of information that you have.
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  You'll find that the kids nowadays,
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  they have a lot of information, even regarding your subject.
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  Like you need to guide.
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  They will know a lot. Whatever you want to tell them
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  they can Google it in a minute.
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  They can get that information in Chat GPT in a second.
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  Yeah.
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  So what is your role as a teacher?
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  It is much more than that.
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  You are nurturing critical thinking skills.
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  You're nurturing creativity.
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  You're nurturing problem solving.
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  And that's the role of a facilitator.
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  Yeah, I love that.
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  Be more nurturing on it. Okay.
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  All right.
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  So let's get into kind of the the meat of what we wanted to talk about
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  with today's episode talking a little bit about like mental health
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  well-being specifically in the IB diploma program
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  and how that affects the people that are involved in it, both teachers
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  and the students.
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  And I wonder if you could talk to us about, you know,
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  what are some of the biggest factors that are affecting student well-being
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  and what are the biggest factors affecting teacher well-being or staff well-being?
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  And is there overlap between the two?
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  Is there any sort of similarities between them as well?
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  I think in my opinion, the two are interconnected
• 13:59
  because happy teacher, happy student, definitely.
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  Because, some of the struggles
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  that most teachers face is burnout,
• 14:09
  workload, toxic work environments, toxic bosses
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  because there can be toxic bosses, including micro managers
• 14:18
  and all that, which can be very overwhelming for teachers.
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  So for students other than also workload,
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  especially right now for the IBDP students who has to submit extended days is
• 14:30
  I is at the same time read for the exams.
• 14:34
  Sometimes these can be overwhelming.
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  My previous school where I worked,
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  there is a student who just did show up to school.
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  Like he said, I'm done.
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  And like, we just few minutes for you to sit for your IB diploma exam.
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  And he was like, no, it's okay.
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  I don't want to do it.
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  What about your future?
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  I don't care. You just hit a wall.
• 14:56
  Yeah, he just hit a wall.
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  He would not submit his extended essay.
• 15:00
  He would not submit his IAs he was like, do whatever you want.
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  I'm done.
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  Goodness.
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  So this student was also one of my history students.
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  And for me, he was a good student.
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  So for me to say, like a good student, somebody that I know wouldn't fail
• 15:15
  is hitting a brick wall, then that means there's a problem.
• 15:19
  So one thing they did, they actually sent him to a professional counselor.
• 15:23
  And I thank my former school for that because they had strategies for this.
• 15:28
  But now when this boy comes back
• 15:30
  he has to deal with teachers who are all the same under pressure.
• 15:34
  Sure.
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  Because my DP coordinator is on my neck.
• 15:38
  Where is your extended essay?
• 15:40
  Where is your IA for this boy?
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  And I'm like, have been trying to follow him up.
• 15:45
  Even if you write emails sometimes it does not.
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  We're lucky he's here, yet alone with his extended essey.
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  So I have to like go one on one with this boy and like, be at a personal level.
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  What are you struggling with?
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  And I'm like me, I already see myself
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  I've failed because I have not submitted my IA, I have not done anything.
• 16:05
  I have not read.
• 16:06
  So once he puts all these things down, it's like he's being overwhelmed.
• 16:11
  The workload is too much.
• 16:14
  So I'm like, I want you to break down.
• 16:16
  Let's do one things first.
• 16:18
  Let's start with my IA.
• 16:20
  Of course, mine has to come first.
• 16:23
  Mine will take priority and then we'll do the others.
• 16:26
  Yeah.
• 16:28
  Let's start with this one.
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  What can we do about this? I know your strength.
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  I know your abilities.
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  Like you have to reassure them.
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  That belief system is very important for a child.
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  Because once the student knows you believe in them,
• 16:43
  that's the best thing that they can ever get.
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  Like you're my best student.
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  Like I can't see you fail in this subject.
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  Come. What's your problem.
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  Let me guide you.
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  Let me show you. Where are you stuck?
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  And I'm on his neck every time. Come out of class.
• 16:59
  I mean, he sees me and he's like oh
• 17:02
  here she is again.
• 17:05
  Yeah.
• 17:06
  But I also want you to note that
• 17:09
  even this for a teacher it's overwhelming.
• 17:12
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 17:13
  Because I also have other students.
• 17:15
  Yeah. Right. You can't do that with every single student.
• 17:17
  You can't do that to everyone.
• 17:19
  And that goes now to the school culture in supporting teachers,
• 17:23
  in supporting students on this aspect. It's a very important thing.
• 17:28
  It's giving them that space to like believe in the student.
• 17:31
  And, you know, I think that's always kind of driven me
• 17:34
  is like every student needs somebody who believes in them,
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  and every student needs somebody who's going to push them.
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  And in some cases that might be the same person,
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  but in other cases might be different.
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  And so as you mentioned, like, okay, maybe you've got your DP coordinator
• 17:45
  or some other leader who's kind of like, okay, let's go, let's get this stuff.
• 17:49
  We need to get it turned in.
• 17:50
  It also requires them to be aware and empathetic
• 17:53
  and understanding of the situation too, right?
• 17:55
  So, like there's definitely got to be
• 17:57
  some clear communication so that people can understand
• 17:59
  like what the situation is and then assume one of those roles.
• 18:03
  And just speaking as a DP coordinator,
• 18:05
  you can guess often, I'm on the pushing side of things,
• 18:09
  but you absolutely have to have those people who like, I believe in you,
• 18:12
  you can do these things and you got to have that present.
• 18:16
  So you can imagine this is one teacher who's doing it.
• 18:20
  You don't know what the other teachers
• 18:21
  are doing in their subjects to make this boy do his paper.
• 18:24
  So if all of you would come together and just strategize
• 18:28
  to help this boy, that would be of much help to this kid.
• 18:31
  And then that again, close to the school culture and the strategy is
• 18:35
  and the resources you've put in place to help
• 18:38
  such students when they reach such a position.
• 18:41
  I also want you to note that students don't only struggle with workload.
• 18:46
  There’s emotional stress.
• 18:48
  Social stress.
• 18:50
  Even girls in my class come in class
• 18:54
  like they're mad because maybe their boyfriend has done this and that.
• 18:58
  And they will bring that energy in your classroom.
• 19:00
  Yeah.
• 19:01
  Not forgetting also, you come from home with your own energies.
• 19:05
  Like for me I have a three year old baby.
• 19:09
  I have toddlers in my house.
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  So when I come from whom I also have my own stress.
• 19:16
  So it's like two parts of stress meeting at the same time in the classroom.
• 19:21
  So if you can't have also self-management of yourself and your own stresses,
• 19:26
  you might end up venting out on this teenage girl in your classroom,
• 19:31
  which can be disastrous.
• 19:33
  And if you can't went out in the class,
• 19:35
  you will either end up venting out on another teacher.
• 19:40
  I've seen a teacher venting out on the school’s timetable.
• 19:45
  Like how comes I have 21 lessons?
• 19:48
  And it was like, no, no, the way we have scheduled and all that,
• 19:51
  the other teachers trying to explain and this one is just
• 19:54
  picks him up and pulls him on the floor. Like, what?
• 19:57
  Yeah, this would show other stresses behind this.
• 20:00
  Right, right.
• 20:01
  And this is a real scenario happening.
• 20:03
  Yeah. I mean it's like compartmentalizing, right?
• 20:07
  So we kind of have to
• 20:08
  and I think as adults and teachers, we're kind of expected
• 20:11
  to already know how to do that. Right? So I've got my stress at home.
• 20:14
  I've also got a toddler at home. And Courtney does as well.
• 20:16
  And so it's like, okay, we've got this, like,
• 20:19
  here's this thing and I have to leave that where it is and now come to where
• 20:23
  it can be in that mindset and being like, I'm in a service mindset
• 20:26
  now and I'm ready to like pour into other, you know, children and help them grow.
• 20:31
  And then I have to leave all that stuff elsewhere.
• 20:32
  And I think that compartmentalization is tough
• 20:36
  anyway for anybody.
• 20:37
  And yet at the same time, we're also expecting this from
• 20:39
  like our teenagers and younger students as they go through the diploma program.
• 20:43
  And we're kind of expecting them to show
• 20:44
  like this level of maturity that says, okay,
• 20:46
  that thing stressing you out, but it can only stress you out at this time
• 20:49
  and that place, not now.
• 20:50
  Now I need you to focus in on this, right?
• 20:53
  So it needs also a lot of emotional intelligence for a teacher
• 20:57
  to handle this stuff, but they can't also do it alone.
• 21:00
  Management has to come in and find ways of making the environment conducive
• 21:05
  as well. For teachers.
• 21:07
  In my former school, what we used to have, we used to have like
• 21:10
  on Fridays, every end of the month, Fridays,
• 21:14
  it's just time for teachers to relax provided by the school.
• 21:18
  They would call it music and all that for teachers to relax.
• 21:22
  On Wednesdays of every month it was time for like yoga and exercise.
• 21:27
  This was provided by the school.
• 21:30
  They're trying to show that we care about your well-being.
• 21:32
  We care about your mental health.
• 21:34
  And it's a very important aspect.
• 21:36
  Another important thing is that also try to understand
• 21:40
  the kinds of workers that you have, also as a manager or somebody in management.
• 21:46
  Learn to know that when somebody is fatigued
• 21:49
  and needs it, there are some teachers who didn't even take leave
• 21:53
  because they are feeling, oh, I can't finish that.
• 21:55
  The struggle of every teacher is that you do
• 21:58
  a lot of work to go to work so that you can work.
• 22:02
  Yeah, yeah.
• 22:03
  But because you I'm creating my lesson plans,
• 22:06
  I'm working around the clock.
• 22:08
  I'm always working.
• 22:09
  Even when I'm sick.
• 22:10
  I have to leave work for my substitute teacher.
• 22:13
  Yeah, I have to do work to make sure that I can do work when I do later.
• 22:16
  So, it’s also important for teachers to know when to ask for help.
• 22:21
  Collaboration is an important aspect.
• 22:23
  When you feel like you're overwhelmed, ask another teacher in the department
• 22:27
  to chip in. Have professional mentors
• 22:30
  who can mentor you, who can talk to you when you hit a brick wall.
• 22:34
  It's a very important aspect for a teacher to have,
• 22:37
  or even just anyone who's working to have a professional mentor
• 22:40
  and also learn to ask for help and know when to put boundaries
• 22:45
  so that you can know when your boundaries have been crossed
• 22:49
  and you can now act towards them.
• 22:51
  Yeah, I also think it's important to create a space
• 22:54
  where you can ask for help and where you can say that, I'm
• 22:58
  about to hit a brick wall where I think, like that's a huge part of it
• 23:02
  too, is really being able to create that space, the safe space, just like you say,
• 23:06
  you want to create that for your students, where your students can say,
• 23:10
  I'm struggling or I'm having a hard time right now.
• 23:13
  Teachers also have to be able to feel comfortable doing that.
• 23:18
  It's very, very important for teachers
• 23:19
  to feel even just having approachable bosses.
• 23:23
  Like, I'm struggling with this.
• 23:26
  You will work in a certain environment where there's a lot, the toxic environment
• 23:30
  that I was talking about, there's a lot of competition
• 23:32
  where when you say you don't know something,
• 23:34
  it's seen as a sign of weakness that will be used against you later on.
• 23:38
  Right.
• 23:38
  So if you have a work culture that's like that
• 23:42
  or an environment that's like that, then nobody would ask for help.
• 23:45
  Everyone will be struggling with everything on their own.
• 23:49
  But if you have bosses who have an open door policies
• 23:52
  and also you know when you can't do something
• 23:55
  and you're like, I know you give me this task, I can't do it.
• 23:58
  Can I get some help or guidance on helping me achieve this or that?
• 24:02
  That is an environment that's open, that people can be able
• 24:06
  to assist one another, other than compete against one another.
• 24:10
  So, I think one of the best places I've worked is where I'm currently working.
• 24:15
  Like I told you, my department members are psychos in a good way.
• 24:20
  Like I love them.
• 24:24
  Apologies for any department members listening.
• 24:26
  I love them like I love them.
• 24:28
  I've never worked in an environment that,
• 24:31
  I am the head of department, but I don't feel like the head of department.
• 24:35
  Like, I tell them, if I don't know this, I don't know it.
• 24:38
  So can we put our heads together and manage it, know how to do it, go about it.
• 24:42
  So it's an environment of collaboration, helping one another.
• 24:47
  If I have a task and somebody has not done it,
• 24:50
  the first thing is not for me to yell at them.
• 24:52
  It's like, what happened?
• 24:53
  What are you struggling with?
• 24:54
  Okay, guys, come, John has a problem.
• 24:57
  Let's tackle that problem together.
• 24:59
  Multiple problems.
• 25:03
  So even my department
• 25:05
  members, they feel confident even to go for higher positions.
• 25:08
  Like, currently my department, even though I'm the head of the department,
• 25:11
  in my department we have the DP coordinator.
• 25:14
  We have the DP coordinator because we support each other.
• 25:17
  If somebody feels like, I think I have enough knowledge
• 25:21
  to go for a higher role.
• 25:22
  I'm like, oh, we are like cheering you on.
• 25:25
  Go for it.
• 25:26
  How do we help you get it?
• 25:28
  So, it's one of the most wonderful departments I've worked in so far.
• 25:32
  That's great.
• 25:33
  And I think like having that is so much more important
• 25:36
  than probably anything else.
• 25:38
  It's like the classic companies that are like a startup company
• 25:40
  and they're like, oh, but we have a ping pong table and it's like, that's great.
• 25:43
  But if we're all about to burn out here, it's not going to help.
• 25:47
  It starts with every person and how they treat one another.
• 25:51
  And the work culture
• 25:53
  and the environment that has been created by the school itself.
• 25:57
  If it's a competitive environment, trust me, everyone is going to be
• 26:01
  sick and tired and there will be a lot of turnover rates in that place.
• 26:06
  Yeah.
• 26:08
  As we mentioned in the intro,
• 26:10
  Junita has worked at Kognity in the past,
• 26:11
  to be able to really set some concrete ideas on how to support
• 26:15
  well-being in your schools. So we wanted to
• 26:18
  give you a few of the examples that she shared with us previously.
• 26:22
  For students, you can create free spaces in classrooms for when students
• 26:26
  need to take a mental break or process emotions independently.
• 26:30
  You can also start a peer counselor club to establish a culture
• 26:33
  among students where mental health can be discussed.
• 26:36
  You can also start what she calls an unmasked club, which focuses on
• 26:41
  creating awareness within schools around mental health issues.
• 26:45
  To work with your staff on mental well-being,
• 26:47
  you can provide mental health breaks on Fridays, for example,
• 26:51
  where you tell stories, play music and more to help prevent teacher burnout.
• 26:56
  She also has established open forums with school leadership
• 26:59
  to create a culture of transparency.
• 27:01
  And you can also start a mental health committee, which is made up of elected
• 27:05
  staff members who communicate needs and concerns to administration.
• 27:09
  If you want to read this article or listen to her other interview,
• 27:13
  you can go to kognity.com/ibunplugged,
• 27:16
  where we're sharing some of these resources that Junita recommends that highlight
• 27:20
  the importance of acknowledging mental
• 27:22
  health's role in education and proactively improving your well-being.
• 27:28
  It sounds a lot like
• 27:29
  what you're talking about here is to create that culture.
• 27:31
  It kind of lends itself back to what we were talking about
• 27:33
  with, like believing, like we believe in the students
• 27:35
  and students need to know that we believe in them.
• 27:37
  But it also comes down to like believing in your colleagues.
• 27:39
  So like the people that are there, like
• 27:41
  believe the best in what they're aiming for.
• 27:43
  People don't wake up wanting to do a bad job.
• 27:46
  You know, and say it like
• 27:49
  that sort of fundamental belief of like, okay, I know you want to come in
• 27:53
  and do your best.
• 27:53
  I know you want to come in and do good things for other people
• 27:55
  and do good things for the students in our school.
• 27:58
  And that, you know, I think if you're starting to see, as you mentioned, burnout
• 28:01
  or some people like unable to accomplish tasks or something like this,
• 28:05
  you know, should be a time for leadership or anybody else
• 28:07
  to kind of reflect and go, like, am I asking too much right now?
• 28:10
  Are we pushing too far?
• 28:12
  Or like there's also that line of like, well, no, we still have some expectations.
• 28:16
  We have to push those.
• 28:17
  And so I'm very interested to hear your thoughts on this a little bit.
• 28:19
  Like where do you,
• 28:20
  where do you kind of toe that line of making
• 28:22
  sure like yes, you're definitely supported.
• 28:24
  We understand where you're at and that sort of situation and
• 28:27
  and we've got to hit these sort of deadlines.
• 28:29
  So what's sort of the how do you hit that sort of middle road?
• 28:33
  I've been accused mostly of being a pessimist when it comes to people.
• 28:38
  Yeah, I've gotten that impression, Junita.
• 28:40
  No, I'm an optimist.
• 28:41
  I'm an optimist when it comes to people.
• 28:44
  Like, I believe so much in people and their intentions.
• 28:48
  Like, my first intention is not like this one is up to sabotaging me.
• 28:51
  Like I'm not that kind of a person.
• 28:54
  So I give people a lot of chances. And trust me,
• 28:57
  there are also some who will violate this.
• 29:00
  Yeah.
• 29:00
  So the most important thing is knowing to have a farmhand
• 29:04
  and knowing to show empathy and understanding.
• 29:08
  There are some situations that need
• 29:10
  empathy and understanding, and there are some situations that need the farmhand.
• 29:14
  So the most important thing is know where to draw the line.
• 29:17
  Are there simple ways to do that?
• 29:19
  There are no simple ways to that because it comes by case by case situations.
• 29:23
  Trial and error. Like you will make mistakes,
• 29:26
  definitely.
• 29:27
  Some will violate this trust that you have, on them.
• 29:32
  But the most important thing is for you to always be
• 29:35
  sober and objective, even as a manager.
• 29:38
  Even when you're doing your task: sober.
• 29:41
  Sobriety is very important.
• 29:43
  Objectivity is very important.
• 29:45
  And also call other members. Like you would say,
• 29:49
  if I have one unruly member who is not doing something, I'm
• 29:53
  not even the one who will say something, the other members would be like,
• 29:56
  you're letting us down.
• 29:57
  Can you just go do that job? Like I'm not
• 30:00
  even the one saying, because they collaborate relative spirit that's there,
• 30:04
  I don't even have to say anything. Like everyone will be on him.
• 30:07
  What is your problem? Why?
• 30:08
  Why is this not finished?
• 30:10
  Like, we finished like last week.
• 30:12
  Why you're not finished? What's the problem?
• 30:14
  You're letting us down.
• 30:15
  You're letting our department down. So I don’t have to say it.
• 30:18
  So you see this person,
• 30:19
  like they are seeing the energy that the ones who have low energy
• 30:23
  and they have to match up the other's energy.
• 30:25
  Once you, like, create
• 30:27
  this spirit of collaboration and just cheering each other on,
• 30:33
  there's one way or another somebody will feel so badly
• 30:36
  if they do something that's not supposed to be done,
• 30:38
  or when they just let the team down, they feel like they need to come up.
• 30:42
  I've had people coming to me in person and saying, I'm really
• 30:46
  sorry I'm late with this submission, but just give me this night.
• 30:49
  I'm really, really sorry.
• 30:51
  And it's like, oh, chilled out. It's okay.
• 30:54
  Just submit it when you have time.
• 30:56
  Because they feel like if they don't submit it, they let you down.
• 31:00
  They let the department down.
• 31:01
  Let it be like a team work.
• 31:03
  They are doing it for the team and not for you.
• 31:05
  If you make them feel they are doing it for the team, they'll do it.
• 31:08
  But if you make them feel they are doing it for you, trust me,
• 31:11
  they'll let you down.
• 31:12
  And part of that, like creating that team atmosphere, is,
• 31:15
  I guess, also making sure that people understand
• 31:16
  the role they play on the team,
• 31:18
  you know,
• 31:18
  because it's like I'm not just part of a team
• 31:20
  and as you say, like, oh, I have to do this for this person.
• 31:22
  Rather, you start to understand, like,
• 31:24
  this is a part of a bigger wheel that I contribute to.
• 31:27
  And I think that's a really important aspect of making sure
• 31:29
  that people understand, like, yes, we believe in you.
• 31:31
  And too, your valued member like we like, you've got to do this, like we need you
• 31:35
  to do these things because that's the role that you're bringing right now.
• 31:39
  So it's sort of that like recognition of like,
• 31:43
  you have an important role to play and we need you to play.
• 31:45
  Recognize their strengths.
• 31:47
  As a leader it does not mean that you know everything.
• 31:50
  Every person in your department has a strength,
• 31:54
  and you need to play out to the strengths.
• 31:56
  Oh, you're good with tech, teach us this.
• 31:58
  You're good with this, teach us this.
• 32:02
  Help us understand it much better.
• 32:04
  Like play to their strengths.
• 32:06
  And when they feel their strengths are being valued and they're helpful
• 32:10
  and it's being brought to the table and you see their strengths,
• 32:14
  then they feel like they're part of the team.
• 32:17
  Yeah.
• 32:18
  Okay here's the rub.
• 32:20
  Here's the tricky thing I think as a as a leader. Like if you are
• 32:23
  you know you need to be objective and have that sober approach
• 32:26
  to the problems as you mentioned before.
• 32:28
  And also have that empathy, that like ability
• 32:32
  to understand where somebody is coming from
• 32:33
  and you know, kind of really come to connect with them.
• 32:36
  And I think in order to have that connection,
• 32:39
  there's got to be those emotional aspects as well.
• 32:41
  Like you mentioned, okay, we have the Friday afternoon
• 32:43
  dancing thing or the Wednesday yoga
• 32:44
  or these things that are set up for staff to connect with one another.
• 32:48
  You start to blend this line where I think, personally,
• 32:50
  I think it's okay if you if your relationships exist outside
• 32:54
  of a professional setting because it helps to enhance the professional setting,
• 32:57
  but it can obviously go wrong in many respects as well.
• 33:01
  So how do you toe that line?
• 33:04
  How do you make sure that like, here's a problem that I need to
• 33:07
  approach objectively, but I need to show this person who I know
• 33:11
  and care about that compassion and that empathy that they need.
• 33:14
  And how do I make sure that that line is just right?
• 33:17
  So the issue to this is that the boundary can kind of times be blurred,
• 33:22
  if you mix business with other things, like it's very easy to blur the line
• 33:28
  and be very hard, like to be firm and tell somebody I need this submitted today.
• 33:33
  And this is your friend, right?
• 33:35
  So at the same time, the same regard and respect
• 33:40
  that you show them as a friend,
• 33:41
  as a colleague, then they should also be able to show you the same.
• 33:46
  And if they are not able to show you the same,
• 33:48
  it means they have violated trust, they violated everything.
• 33:52
  And that's not right.
• 33:53
  So like depending on the case and the person
• 33:58
  you need to be firm like these are time for,
• 34:01
  yeah, this is empathy, this is friendship.
• 34:03
  And there's also a time to just be firm like I need this submitted today.
• 34:08
  And if they know you and they know the kind of person that you are
• 34:12
  and how you work, they know when it's coming
• 34:15
  from a professional place and not a personal place.
• 34:18
  Yeah.
• 34:19
  So fundamentally if you were coming at it with that authentic like approach
• 34:22
  to doing a good job of what you want to do and that relationship exists,
• 34:26
  then it can build out of what you just said, that trust that exists
• 34:29
  outside of school as well as in school
• 34:31
  or in the professional setting to say like, okay, I trust this
• 34:34
  person still wants the best for me and what I can get out of it.
• 34:37
  And I need to do this because this is talking
• 34:39
  about being in a team, not just a friendship.
• 34:41
  Yeah, that this is work now.
• 34:44
  This is business.
• 34:45
  Yeah. I mean, I'd imagine it'd be similar for you, John.
• 34:48
  Like, you work in a school in a in a pretty small town.
• 34:52
  You have the relationships with people.
• 34:54
  You want to be able to be friends with the people on your team,
• 34:57
  but then you also do have to show up in a professional way.
• 35:00
  I do think that is tricky sometimes.
• 35:01
  Definitely. Yeah, definitely.
• 35:03
  So and I mean, you know, to your point earlier,
• 35:04
  Junita, like sometimes I will have people coming up
• 35:07
  and just like overly apologetic that they're going to miss something.
• 35:10
  And as a leader, it kind of makes you go like, whoa, what sort of conditions
• 35:13
  have I created?
• 35:14
  This person feels like they have to like,
• 35:16
  you know, just oh, I'm so, you know, so you,
• 35:20
  it's a constant work, I think.
• 35:22
  It's a constant practice.
• 35:23
  Just like, you know, all of our professions are.
• 35:25
  But it's, you know, it's that constant practice of,
• 35:27
  am I making sure I've got some high expectations with some low threat,
• 35:31
  but still making sure that people feel like they can be their best selves here.
• 35:36
  And you can never really sit comfortably on that.
• 35:38
  It's a constant work. I think. Yeah.
• 35:40
  And I guess it's like that with your students too,
• 35:42
  like you were saying, like, I'm going to be the teacher
• 35:43
  who's going to be the first one dancing in class.
• 35:46
  But I'm also going to make sure you submit yours IA.
• 35:47
  Yes, I think you're going to submit your IA.
• 35:50
  This is the deadline.
• 35:51
  And then we can dance.
• 35:54
  Yeah. So they know that,
• 35:56
  and you would see them even like, the environment that I created my class,
• 36:01
  it's one that a student would approach me.
• 36:04
  I'm not the school counselor,
• 36:06
  but they would approach me about a personal thing they're struggling with.
• 36:10
  Because I've taught my students for long to know when somebody is not
• 36:13
  in a good mood, when somebody has an issue, I'm like,
• 36:17
  today you don't look yourself, Courtney.
• 36:20
  Are you okay?
• 36:21
  No me some fine.
• 36:22
  And after the class I'm like, okay, come.
• 36:25
  Now, can you tell me what's up? Tell me what's going on.
• 36:28
  Yeah. What's up there.
• 36:29
  You know me is it's just that.
• 36:31
  No. What. Just you know I'm here, right?
• 36:33
  You know I'm here anytime you feel like you need to talk, just know that I'm here.
• 36:37
  And even though at times they would not tell you at that time
• 36:40
  you would even get an email like, miss,
• 36:43
  I didn't want to tell you all that time, but this is what I'm struggling with.
• 36:46
  Yeah.
• 36:47
  And I'm like okay do
• 36:48
  you want to come to class and talk next time, or is it okay
• 36:52
  if I tell this to the school counselor so that you can talk to them?
• 36:56
  Like they need to know who to confide in and that it's okay.
• 37:01
  Yeah.
• 37:01
  So depending on the issue, if it's something that I feel
• 37:03
  that it can handle, it's sometimes adolescence tough.
• 37:07
  Like I've broken up with my boyfriend, or
• 37:10
  they have a lot of issues though.
• 37:12
  Yeah.
• 37:13
  Well this lends itself to kind of what you were talking about earlier.
• 37:15
  Like people come in with different stressors
• 37:17
  and different things that have, like, affected their lives already.
• 37:19
  And now they're in the classroom.
• 37:21
  And I guess,
• 37:21
  you know, as we're talking about mental health and mental wellbeing and how people
• 37:24
  can really take care of themselves, especially on the diploma program,
• 37:27
  you know, how many of these sort of like situations or things
• 37:31
  that might be affecting their mental health are kind of isolated
• 37:33
  to a school situation in a place where, like school leaders
• 37:37
  or teachers can impact that thing or like, to what extent do these things
• 37:41
  kind of out of our hands, I guess you could say, like,
• 37:43
  what's the role of the educator in ensuring that mental health,
• 37:46
  the mental well-being of young people?
• 37:48
  What I would like to say is that sometimes an educator
• 37:51
  can't work in isolation, and that's where the parents come in.
• 37:55
  Like, I'm not expected to fix
• 37:57
  everything about the child once they're in school.
• 38:01
  The home environment plays a very big role.
• 38:03
  The parents, the people they're surrounded with, it plays
• 38:06
  an incredibly big role to making up this kid.
• 38:10
  As an educator I can only do enough.
• 38:13
  I don't know the environment that kid lives in.
• 38:15
  And that's why in certain situations
• 38:17
  you will see that we would call in the parents
• 38:19
  so that we try and understand the home dynamics.
• 38:22
  What is happening at home, how is it affects how affecting this child?
• 38:26
  So even parents have a role to play
• 38:30
  with the child and how the child ends up.
• 38:32
  And with that, when you have the parents in,
• 38:35
  like does it kind of click?
• 38:36
  You're like, oh, this is this is what's going on.
• 38:38
  Like this parents kind of bringing too much, you know? In some cases, yes.
• 38:42
  Yeah. In some cases yes.
• 38:44
  When you see the parent, you can actually be able
• 38:47
  to tell why this kid is behaving the way they do.
• 38:50
  Right? Yeah.
• 38:52
  And so then do you feel an obligation to almost
• 38:54
  you kind of a well-being almost counseling session with the parent to be like,
• 38:58
  we got to sort you out because
• 39:00
  all your stress is manifesting itself in this poor kid.
• 39:03
  At times I would say it in a very polite or like,
• 39:08
  nonobjective way, like I just did.
• 39:09
  Yeah, not like that.
• 39:14
  Because you will have very fussy parents.
• 39:17
  So I wouldn't say it like straight on, head on.
• 39:20
  And it's like anytime you say something, people never like to hear the truth.
• 39:25
  Yeah.
• 39:25
  So I will say it in a very subtle manner,
• 39:28
  like, do you think your kid needs more space?
• 39:31
  Is the environment peaceful?
• 39:33
  Like in a very subtle manner so that I know
• 39:37
  when they say this, they understand what I'm saying.
• 39:40
  They know where it’s coming from.
• 39:42
  So in case they would want to talk to me more because I've had parents,
• 39:46
  you are there the meeting and you're talking to both the parent of the child
• 39:50
  and then they would say, can I just see you a few minutes?
• 39:53
  And then they would tell you everything so that you have the whole picture,
• 39:56
  and then they would say, what?
• 39:57
  What can I do to help the situation?
• 39:59
  How can I help my child?
• 40:01
  So we have those parents, but you will have others who can't take any criticism.
• 40:06
  They can't like they'll be like, there's a problem with this teacher.
• 40:10
  Yeah.
• 40:11
  So you need to be very careful with such parents
• 40:14
  so you will know when your help is needed and when your help is not required.
• 40:20
  So at the same time, to also protect your mental health, create your boundaries.
• 40:25
  If you know your help is not required, you can give suggestions,
• 40:28
  but you cannot control what they do with those suggestions.
• 40:31
  Yeah.
• 40:32
  At either of your schools, do you have like,
• 40:35
  strict,
• 40:36
  overt, like straightforward ways of talking to parents about mental health?
• 40:40
  Is there anything that you do?
• 40:43
  Because I agree that they're a huge stakeholder
• 40:45
  in a student's mental health and mental well-being.
• 40:48
  I've walked into different places currently.
• 40:51
  When I was in Kenya, the school that I was in, had
• 40:55
  deliberate measures to handle issues with mental health.
• 40:59
  One of this is because the kids that we were handling came from
• 41:03
  very poor backgrounds.
• 41:06
  So it's like the school sponsored everyone in that school,
• 41:10
  everyone in that school was sponsored
• 41:12
  because they were intelligent and they came from poor backgrounds.
• 41:15
  Not just for others came from like traumatic backgrounds.
• 41:19
  I think I've said this earlier,
• 41:21
  some students were in situations where either they've been raped or
• 41:26
  they just lived in bad conditions.
• 41:31
  So when they come, we already know the baggage they carry.
• 41:34
  So we already know how we need to handle them.
• 41:37
  Some didn't even have parents, some were orphants.
• 41:41
  So we already knew how to handle them.
• 41:43
  Strategies, counseling and everything was put in place to ensure
• 41:48
  these kids were provided a safe environment for this to happen.
• 41:53
  Yeah.
• 41:54
  So it made it very easy cause now I know what you like,
• 41:58
  you already know what you're handling and you know how to go about it.
• 42:02
  And some parents who are present, some parents who are not present.
• 42:05
  So it's like nurturing this kid until they finished
• 42:09
  secondary school was up to you as a teacher.
• 42:14
  So like you are the mother, the father, the brother, the mentor.
• 42:18
  You are everything to this child.
• 42:20
  So that's also an overwhelming responsibility.
• 42:22
  But the school created measures including resources to help us manage these,
• 42:29
  including, like teachers to come and
• 42:32
  teach us about some stuff of handling trauma and all that.
• 42:35
  So it created an environment where we understood what we are handling
• 42:38
  and you know, how to go about it.
• 42:41
  Now, currently, I'm teaching in a school which is not the same as the school
• 42:45
  that I was teaching, but still we have the guidance counseling in the school.
• 42:51
  But the most important thing is that every teacher at some point
• 42:55
  you will need to be just more than a teacher.
• 42:59
  And it takes a very good teacher
• 43:02
  or a committed teacher to notice when a kid is struggling,
• 43:06
  not just struggling with your subject but struggling emotionally, struggling
• 43:10
  socially because a child who struggles socially and emotionally can never learn.
• 43:15
  They will never learn because they are head space is not for them.
• 43:19
  They are not there.
• 43:21
  You will not be teaching them anything until they're in that space
• 43:24
  where their environment is good and clear and open for learning.
• 43:28
  That's when they can learn.
• 43:29
  So as a teacher, you need to clear these up before you start teaching.
• 43:33
  And that's the aspect of creating a safe learning environment for this child.
• 43:37
  So that's why I would be teaching my psychology.
• 43:39
  But I noticed somebody off in my class, somebody
• 43:43
  is fussy in my class
• 43:45
  or for the first time, a child who's usually very disciplined in class,
• 43:49
  I give them their psych paper exam
• 43:53
  and the child just takes the paper, throws it back at me
• 43:56
  and bangs the door and leaves the room.
• 43:58
  And I'm like, what happened?
• 44:03
  That's not something I said.
• 44:07
  The first time that happened, I was like, what happened?
• 44:10
  So for me, I take time.
• 44:12
  Like I said, I take time to handle things.
• 44:16
  I don't just bust out. Come back here.
• 44:18
  What's wrong with you?
• 44:20
  I give you time to bust out.
• 44:22
  Go out, bust out.
• 44:23
  I give you time to do that.
• 44:25
  And relax.
• 44:27
  So I will not fuss about it.
• 44:29
  But the girl will come back in class.
• 44:31
  Pick come bags and I'm like oh please can you can just come a minute.
• 44:35
  Yes, miss.
• 44:35
  And then adolescents they usually have an attitude.
• 44:38
  So they're like, yes, what do you want?
• 44:42
  For those listening we just
• 44:44
  got an excellent like mimicry of what that looks like.
• 44:47
  Yeah. So, I’m like are you okay?
• 44:50
  Yes., miss, I’m fine. Anything else?
• 44:53
  Yeah. Yeah. One of these.
• 44:54
  So you know these can push off a teacher who is trying to help.
• 44:58
  And at times that's when
• 45:00
  some teachers say I'll do my job and go home.
• 45:04
  Yeah.
• 45:04
  But there's something in me that would not let this let go.
• 45:07
  I would just not let not let this go.
• 45:09
  Like, come back.
• 45:12
  So I love that because you,
• 45:13
  what you're talking about here
• 45:15
  is like a persistence to create a safe space first.
• 45:18
  And even if somebody
• 45:19
  is kind of resisting against that, it's like, just stay persistent.
• 45:22
  Like our goal is to create a safe environment.
• 45:24
  And then from that safe environment we can learn. Right?
• 45:27
  And I love that's kind of coming back to hierarchy of needs sort of thing
• 45:30
  and making sure that like, yeah, I'm comfortable
• 45:32
  and I'm safe and I'm valued here and now I can add information.
• 45:35
  So most of the time is just creating.
• 45:37
  And I know this is coming from a counseling background,
• 45:40
  but the unconditional positive regard
• 45:44
  is a very important thing.
• 45:45
  And it has helped me as a teacher.
• 45:47
  Like the child will fuss and go away.
• 45:50
  But next morning they will have time
• 45:51
  to think about their behavior and what they did.
• 45:53
  And it's like, miss I'm sorry.
• 45:55
  Yesterday I was a brat.
• 45:57
  They would actually use that word.
• 45:59
  And I'm like, what happened?
• 46:02
  I don't know what you're talking about. Yeah, yeah.
• 46:05
  That didn't sound right. I don't recall like what happened.
• 46:07
  If that's not you, that's not the you that I know.
• 46:09
  What happened.
• 46:10
  And they were like, miss this and this is what happened.
• 46:14
  And then they would explain the situation.
• 46:16
  So then that goes back.
• 46:18
  If I would have overreacted, it would have escalated badly
• 46:22
  and brought other problems and broken the trust between me and the student.
• 46:27
  So I love the idea of like this unconditional positive regard and kind of
• 46:30
  having that in our teaching, in our learning spaces all the time.
• 46:35
  I wonder because there are schools and is one of them.
• 46:37
  To answer your question, Courtney,
• 46:38
  where we have like explicit sessions on well-being
• 46:42
  and we have like set aside classes, if you will, where we talk about
• 46:45
  certain things that go over outside of the curriculum,
• 46:48
  but things that could be affecting some of these mental health.
• 46:50
  And I'm interested to hear your perspective on that, Junita.
• 46:53
  Do you think like that's
• 46:54
  a beneficial thing that people should be doing?
• 46:56
  Like what are the possible drawbacks to that kind of thing?
• 46:58
  Do you do it in your classes?
• 46:59
  Like how do you kind of approach it?
• 47:01
  Do you do it like explicitly, or is it just something that every teacher
• 47:04
  has to kind of internalize and create
• 47:05
  that culture of like constant positive expectations?
• 47:08
  Like I said earlier, when I started the session is like
• 47:12
  the culture has to be there first
• 47:14
  at a school. That would like,
• 47:17
  even if there's a teacher turnover, when teachers come
• 47:21
  in, they already find an established culture that already works.
• 47:25
  And if it's not there then
• 47:27
  it's never too late to create one.
• 47:31
  And this goes also to providing resources for teachers,
• 47:34
  whether it's PDs, or training from these kinds of things
• 47:38
  and how to deal with such that they will never be enough trainings
• 47:41
  to help teachers understand and manage classroom behavior.
• 47:45
  Trust me, even
• 47:47
  classroom behavior has been a reason why teachers are quitting their jobs.
• 47:51
  For sure.
• 47:52
  Like, you can have
• 47:54
  a class that you cannot manage, you cannot teach,
• 47:56
  and if you have a class that you can't manage or teach, it drains your energy.
• 48:01
  It drains you as you as a teacher.
• 48:03
  It kills your passion.
• 48:05
  I've seen teachers who talk to me and tell me,
• 48:08
  Junita, those students just killed my passion.
• 48:11
  Like, I love teaching, but I don't feel I'm teaching anymore.
• 48:15
  Create strategies, the schools should notice this, and create strategies
• 48:19
  for teachers to learn how to manage classroom behaviors.
• 48:22
  And behaviors keep changing.
• 48:24
  The students that we are handling today are not the same that we had
• 48:28
  a long time ago.
• 48:31
  I've taught in two continents.
• 48:33
  Afterwards, students would sit, pay attention
• 48:36
  and trust the teacher. And students who are talking
• 48:39
  when you're talking, they talk over you,
• 48:42
  when you're talking. At the times they don't even listen.
• 48:46
  And it's time for exams that you're saying, okay, everyone,
• 48:50
  let's sit down and do this paper.
• 48:52
  And somebody is like, can I open my laptop as I do this paper?
• 48:56
  Can I Google it?
• 48:58
  And I'm like, seriously? No, you can't.
• 49:03
  You shot your shot.
• 49:04
  But no. Yeah.
• 49:05
  The first time I was shocked.
• 49:07
  Like I was totally shocked.
• 49:11
  Sometimes I think they ask those questions
• 49:13
  just to see the look on our face. Yeah.
• 49:15
  Like, hey, I got one for you.
• 49:17
  Watch this.
• 49:19
  And I'm like.
• 49:20
  And the first question they will always ask you is
• 49:24
  will this be assessed?
• 49:26
  Will this go into my grades?
• 49:28
  Okay.
• 49:28
  If it doesn't go into my grades I don't bother with it.
• 49:31
  Sure.
• 49:31
  So it's you just be talking and everyone is not paying attention.
• 49:35
  Yeah.
• 49:35
  So classroom management is a big deal.
• 49:38
  Yeah. Have you seen a lot of engagement in those courses
• 49:41
  you were talking about John? Because like
• 49:43
  she said it's like when sometimes the students like not on the exam.
• 49:47
  No, I don't need this by. Right. Right.
• 49:49
  Yeah. I mean it's interesting.
• 49:50
  So we've got this set up is like a once a week kind of thing.
• 49:53
  And it rotates through lots of different things that go on.
• 49:55
  Beyond the curriculum, I guess you could say,
• 49:58
  you know, and I think our students value the opportunity to go into a session
• 50:01
  that's focused on well-being or their own sort of like health and how that can
• 50:05
  impact what they're learning.
• 50:08
  And but I do think, like the entire program itself
• 50:12
  kind of takes on a second tier, if you will,
• 50:14
  because it's like just as you mentioned, this isn't being assessed.
• 50:16
  It's not the massive thing.
• 50:17
  But what I will say is that over the time of doing that explicitly,
• 50:21
  I've seen a few more people or few more students feel more comfortable,
• 50:25
  and therefore they feel like they can be more authentic
• 50:27
  and they can be more genuine in this course because it's
• 50:31
  because it's not being assessed,
• 50:32
  because they're not going to get particular grades for it.
• 50:35
  And I think you still have students
• 50:36
  who maybe don't fully engage with whatever the topic might be.
• 50:41
  But I think for some of those students who do you start to lay
• 50:43
  a better foundation for that culture you were talking about before.
• 50:46
  You need to like, you want to create a culture
• 50:49
  that, and so often we talking about culture.
• 50:52
  It's not always top down.
• 50:54
  It's not just management.
• 50:55
  It's not just, you know, like who's running the place.
• 50:57
  It's got to be everybody who's there.
• 50:59
  And therefore when we're talking about like students
• 51:01
  being co-creators of that culture, I think it's important
• 51:03
  for them to understand, like I have a role to play here too,
• 51:06
  you know, and yes, I might come with my stresses
• 51:08
  and yes, I might come with my stuff
• 51:10
  and I might have some people that I can vent to are
• 51:12
  that I can speak to about it, and that'll help me.
• 51:14
  But it's also inappropriate for me
• 51:16
  to take all my stuff and throw it at everybody else
• 51:18
  and just say, hey, you need to start with this now.
• 51:20
  So I think those sessions kind of help in that regard.
• 51:24
  But it does,
• 51:25
  I think it raises a question because it's like,
• 51:27
  do we value this thing enough and do we have the evidence of it enough
• 51:30
  that says it's worth it while to then replace or take up
• 51:34
  curriculum time for this thing that exists beyond the curriculum?
• 51:38
  And I think every school kind of needs to wrestle with that
• 51:40
  a little bit and understand, like just as you were talking about,
• 51:42
  you need to like,
• 51:43
  what are the students that are coming our way
• 51:45
  and how are we making sure
• 51:46
  that they feel safe first so they can learn beyond that as well?
• 51:49
  And it's not just creating an exclusive program for it,
• 51:53
  but also as a teacher in class, try and find teachable moments,
• 51:58
  like when you see a behavior, call it out, create a teachable moment.
• 52:03
  Right there.
• 52:05
  These teachable moments can do a lot even than just having a complete session
• 52:11
  outside class, like, in the former school that I taught,
• 52:14
  most students that all finished their diploma program,
• 52:19
  most of them told me, like most of the life lessons,
• 52:22
  I liked it in your class, like you remember when you told us this and this.
• 52:26
  Those teachable moments are very important,
• 52:30
  not even just for their mental health.
• 52:32
  Even in aspects of socializing with other people, dealing with other people,
• 52:36
  when you see something in class, call it out.
• 52:39
  When you see that this is something I need to tell students about,
• 52:42
  if it's related to your topic that you're teaching, bring it closer.
• 52:47
  I was teaching a topic in history that is now my class,
• 52:52
  health and medicine,
• 52:54
  and we are looking at how the past used to treat medicine, you know, psychoses,
• 52:59
  how they used to think that somebody has been bewitched and everything.
• 53:03
  And I
• 53:04
  tried to tell them, because at times history can be boring.
• 53:08
  And I'm saying that as a history teacher.
• 53:13
  Careful now.
• 53:14
  It's up to you to relate it to what is currently happening.
• 53:18
  So I give the students a project based task and I say,
• 53:21
  how can we turn this past knowledge and use it now?
• 53:26
  How will this knowledge help us now?
• 53:29
  And I was so impressed with my students when they came up with
• 53:32
  what they called like a mental health teenager or something.
• 53:38
  Like this was an app like Instagram or something, but
• 53:44
  they called it healthy,
• 53:45
  healthy Instagram or something.
• 53:48
  I can't remember exactly.
• 53:49
  Like other than body shaming and all that.
• 53:52
  It's about encouraging.
• 53:53
  Anytime you log into it,
• 53:55
  it tells you something positive about yourself and things like that.
• 53:58
  So the fact that students can relate these to that,
• 54:02
  which is an aspect of mental health,
• 54:05
  for me, that's important.
• 54:09
  Are you an IB educator wanting
• 54:10
  to improve your practice and needing just a bit more support getting there?
• 54:14
  Ever wanted to learn more about a specific aspect of the diploma program,
• 54:18
  or just ask a question to an educational theorist about a specific IB aspect?
• 54:23
  IB Unplugged is the place for you.
• 54:25
  Simply visit kognity.com/ibunplugged to submit your question to us,
• 54:30
  and have your question explored in more detail in an upcoming episode.
• 54:33
  And now, back to the show.
• 54:36
  So okay, let's talk about like IBDP specifically,
• 54:39
  because we know that the IB Learner Profile
• 54:41
  has all these different aspects to it.
• 54:42
  And of course one of the main ones is balanced.
• 54:44
  And I think there's like this expectation that we can help create
• 54:47
  balanced individuals who come out of the program itself.
• 54:51
  And it kind of subtly implies well-being.
• 54:54
  But I'm wondering if like,
• 54:57
  I don't know, in your opinion
• 54:57
  and the stuff that you've worked with so far,
• 54:59
  do you feel like well-being should take more
• 55:00
  of a center stage on that, and maybe even remove that idea
• 55:03
  of a balanced learner and more of like somebody who's well?
• 55:09
  I think the term balanced is just appropriate there because
• 55:12
  in my understanding when IB says balanced
• 55:15
  they mean intellectual, physical and emotional balance.
• 55:20
  And the fact that all these together,
• 55:23
  we don't forget the aspect that we are educating students on something.
• 55:28
  So education is at the center, but we are not just focusing on education.
• 55:32
  You need to balance all these aspects of your social, emotional and intellectual.
• 55:38
  And the most important thing about the aspect of being balance
• 55:41
  is the interdependence of people, that you are
• 55:45
  because I am. We depend on each other, so we need to coexist.
• 55:50
  So you're not just balanced intellectually,
• 55:52
  you're balanced emotionally, you're balanced socially.
• 55:55
  You can relate with other people.
• 55:58
  And this is the aspect of creating global citizens.
• 56:01
  Can you live with others?
• 56:03
  Can you live amongst other people like a sane human being?
• 56:10
  And I’m putting sane in quotes.
• 56:11
  Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah, I love that.
• 56:13
  I think so often we look at balance and we,
• 56:16
  at least people that I've spoken with, you constantly think like,
• 56:19
  oh balanced means I've got to have like a work life balance
• 56:21
  or I've got to have like this sort of well-being idea.
• 56:24
  But I love what you're talking about here because it extends beyond the individual
• 56:28
  and the like balance and the idea of like, what am I contributing
• 56:31
  to the society around me? And how is that contributing to me?
• 56:34
  So not just intellectual,
• 56:35
  but as you say, the social, the emotional, the physical balance as well,
• 56:39
  that I'm not overemphasizing one thing versus the other.
• 56:42
  And I guess there's room for that with regard to like a focus on well-being.
• 56:46
  But it doesn't have to be restricted to that.
• 56:47
  Is that fair enough summary of what you said?
• 56:50
  Yeah that's okay. Yeah. Okay.
• 56:52
  So then I guess with regard to
• 56:55
  the platforms and the ways that people are learning now,
• 56:57
  I think there's ways in which we possibly tried to increase that balance.
• 57:00
  I guess, like for you, Courtney, especially like with work at Kognity,
• 57:03
  it seems like this is something
• 57:04
  that allows a little bit better balance for young people as well.
• 57:08
  It gives them a chance to maybe have a bit more like control over their learning,
• 57:12
  I guess.
• 57:13
  Or were those some like the aims
• 57:14
  with regard to the Kognity work itself, or is there other stuff that plays there?
• 57:19
  Yeah, it's
• 57:20
  I would say it's there's such a huge part of well-being
• 57:24
  that's tied also to agency for student and feeling
• 57:28
  like they have some kind of control over what they're learning
• 57:32
  and how they're learning and building confidence.
• 57:36
  And there's all of these kind of pieces that go into, I would say maybe the
• 57:40
  tech side or the program side of how you're learning.
• 57:44
  And from our end, I would say some of the most powerful ways
• 57:50
  that we feel like we've hopefully been able to contribute to student
• 57:53
  well-being is building a sense of agency and a sense of control
• 57:57
  for students, students being able to know how am I doing and build confidence
• 58:02
  and feel like I can learn things at a pace
• 58:05
  and in a way that I feel confident in and that
• 58:10
  resonates with me.
• 58:13
  And I think it's that idea of
• 58:16
  if something doesn't make sense to me in the classroom,
• 58:19
  if it's not always like if you don't speak up in the classroom, you're screwed.
• 58:24
  It's like, okay, I can look at this on my own.
• 58:27
  I can maybe watch a video or manipulate some different,
• 58:32
  resources and do different activities that I can build up
• 58:36
  my confidence independently as well.
• 58:39
  I think that's a really big part of student
• 58:42
  well-being, is being able to show up confident.
• 58:44
  And I think that we hope to be able to do that with student agency in a platform.
• 58:50
  Yeah. So and I guess that relates a lot back to what you were talking about there.
• 58:52
  You need to it's like if we've got people who feel,
• 58:56
  you know, safe, but also feel like they've got something
• 58:58
  they can contribute, then you can expect a lot more from them as well.
• 59:00
  And suddenly you've created now that culture you were talking about,
• 59:03
  like, here's a collaborative culture where everything kind of works well together.
• 59:06
  And I've seen students who don't even want to join.
• 59:08
  I don't see that in class.
• 59:09
  We do group students,
• 59:10
  some don't want to be in groups because of their social issues.
• 59:13
  Like, I don't want to be grouped with her.
• 59:15
  I don't want to be grouped with her.
• 59:17
  And even though you're supposed to foster collaboration
• 59:21
  in the classroom, you're not supposed to force it.
• 59:25
  I've seen students who go
• 59:27
  present to work, and the student is like, I don't want to present my work.
• 59:31
  And I'm like, why?
• 59:33
  Yeah. Because they will mock me.
• 59:36
  So it it happens a lot.
• 59:38
  And sometimes a student won't just tell you they will keep quiet
• 59:42
  and sit down and you're like Courtney can you present your work.
• 59:46
  And they don't move. They just sit.
• 59:50
  So if you are a teacher who gets mad easily
• 59:52
  you'll be like can you stand up and go present your work.
• 59:55
  But if you are a student who like senses
• 59:59
  the dynamics of the classroom, you will notice there is a problem.
• 1:00:03
  It's not that she's not done her work.
• 1:00:05
  There's something bigger to it.
• 1:00:06
  She prefers doing it differently.
• 1:00:09
  And then when you move closer and ask what’s the problem?
• 1:00:12
  Miss, can I just present it to you alone?
• 1:00:15
  But the aspect of presenting is not that you present it to be alone.
• 1:00:19
  Yeah. Right. Right, right. Yeah.
• 1:00:21
  So the aspects of collaboration
• 1:00:23
  that also edtech has made it very possible for students to do
• 1:00:28
  who cannot do it physically and other things, which really helps even
• 1:00:32
  teachers in the classroom and also provide that individualized learning.
• 1:00:37
  I think it's that you can when you have tools that help you
• 1:00:41
  with that individualized learning, it gives you that space
• 1:00:44
  to be able to have more authentic conversations.
• 1:00:46
  When you're talking about what's going on at home,
• 1:00:48
  do you have a platform that's actually going to help you see,
• 1:00:52
  the student is usually, you know, star performer or whatever we want to call it.
• 1:00:56
  But then the last two weeks, they've just completely gone radio silent.
• 1:01:01
  I see something's going on here. Now
• 1:01:03
  I can have this conversation and be like, I have something to back me up.
• 1:01:06
  It's not just that intuition in which you said, you know,
• 1:01:09
  of course you've been able to develop in your classroom, but maybe not
• 1:01:12
  every teacher can pick up on those subtleties.
• 1:01:17
  And so it's nice to be able to have some kind of foundation,
• 1:01:20
  some kind of conversation,
• 1:01:21
  like an artifact, I guess, to be able to have those conversations too.
• 1:01:26
  I mean, it sounds like what you're bringing up here you need
• 1:01:28
  is that teachers need to be constantly aware of, like, the subtleties. Yes.
• 1:01:32
  Very important. Even classroom misbehavior.
• 1:01:36
  It's not always somebody’s
• 1:01:38
  indiscipline, because we are too quick to punish and
• 1:01:42
  like we tell a child, you're misbehaving in my classroom.
• 1:01:46
  You're doing this in my classroom.
• 1:01:48
  Yes, there are instances where students do that all the time.
• 1:01:53
  But once you've created a rapport
• 1:01:55
  with your students, you'll be able to notice things that are just off.
• 1:02:01
  And the beauty of IB is most classes are not big.
• 1:02:07
  If it's a bigger classroom,
• 1:02:09
  15 students.
• 1:02:11
  So you can create that one on one contact with your students
• 1:02:14
  and get to know what are the issues that students are facing.
• 1:02:18
  And it needs time for a teacher to do that.
• 1:02:22
  And for you to be able to see some of the subtle signs,
• 1:02:26
  it needs you to also work on yourself.
• 1:02:29
  As a teacher,
• 1:02:30
  create time for you, create hobbies for you
• 1:02:34
  that will be able to make you relax and just be sober at all times.
• 1:02:39
  I'm not saying teachers are saying that all times,
• 1:02:43
  but a lot of a time.
• 1:02:49
  Yeah.
• 1:02:50
  All right.
• 1:02:50
  So as we kind of come to a close here, like you've brought up
• 1:02:53
  some really powerful things and I wonder if there's like
• 1:02:55
  if there's some simple wins some ways that, like, teachers can really help
• 1:02:59
  to create and foster these, you know, this culture
• 1:03:02
  that you're talking about, a culture that helps to support well-being and helps
• 1:03:05
  young people feel safe and ready to kind of give their best.
• 1:03:08
  And you've already alluded to it, you know,
• 1:03:09
  like being aware of the little things as well as like looking after yourself.
• 1:03:13
  But are there other sort of simple wins that, you know, educators
• 1:03:16
  who are listening right now could take to their classrooms right now
• 1:03:18
  and be like, here's how
• 1:03:19
  I can create a more inclusive, a better classroom that helps
• 1:03:22
  to build up that well-being as well as the intellect of of the young people.
• 1:03:25
  I get to work with.
• 1:03:26
  So I'll just choose what.. I’ll say what I use for myself.
• 1:03:31
  One thing I usually do is I remember my why.
• 1:03:35
  I remember why am I doing this.
• 1:03:37
  What motivates me.
• 1:03:38
  What drives me to do this every day.
• 1:03:41
  That is my why.
• 1:03:43
  My why is when I see a child that smiles, that's happy, that has developed.
• 1:03:48
  If you had low self-esteem, you come to my classroom
• 1:03:51
  and you leave with a smile and you're like, I love psychology.
• 1:03:54
  I love that lesson.
• 1:03:56
  You're excited to come to my class.
• 1:03:58
  That is what I want to do to. Like I want a student to leave my class
• 1:04:03
  and say, I'm glad I took psychology, not just because
• 1:04:06
  of what it entails, but because of the teacher that I had. So
• 1:04:12
  those are the things that drives me.
• 1:04:14
  Another thing is just have a supportive environment.
• 1:04:17
  If you're a teacher and you're overwhelmed,
• 1:04:21
  they don't have to be your colleagues as well.
• 1:04:23
  If they are your colleagues that's even better.
• 1:04:26
  But have a professional mentor who would lend to you.
• 1:04:29
  And if you're in a class and you want to create this environment
• 1:04:33
  for your kids, get to know the kids that you're dealing with,
• 1:04:36
  get to know their interests.
• 1:04:39
  And one way of getting to know their interests is not just being stuck up
• 1:04:42
  in the classroom.
• 1:04:43
  Join an activity in the school.
• 1:04:44
  Join a club in the school.
• 1:04:46
  Don't just be a teacher who checks in and checks out.
• 1:04:50
  Yeah.
• 1:04:50
  So find other activities in the school to be involved with
• 1:04:54
  because it makes your students see you in a different angle.
• 1:04:59
  I am a teacher in
• 1:05:01
  psychology, but once I'm on the track, I'm running with them.
• 1:05:04
  Yeah.
• 1:05:05
  So I'm like, you're not going to beat me in this.
• 1:05:08
  So they see me in a different angle.
• 1:05:11
  They see me like,
• 1:05:12
  miss, are you going to participate in the athletics team?
• 1:05:15
  I'm like, yeah.
• 1:05:15
  And I'm like, miss you, not beat me this time, and
• 1:05:17
  I'm like, okay, see you there.
• 1:05:21
  The child sees you more than just a teacher.
• 1:05:25
  So join something else that you will get to bond with these kids even more.
• 1:05:30
  Yeah.
• 1:05:30
  And it's not easy to create that trust relationship.
• 1:05:33
  And once it's created that trust will never leave.
• 1:05:37
  Find out their interests. I love movies a lot.
• 1:05:40
  And one time I challenged my class and I told them
• 1:05:44
  there's no movie you've watched that I haven't watched.
• 1:05:47
  So every day somebody comes to class with, miss,
• 1:05:50
  have you watched this?
• 1:05:51
  Have you watched this like it creates interest
• 1:05:56
  and they know that you care.
• 1:05:59
  So it's much easier for them to relate to you, to share their troubles.
• 1:06:03
  And once they like you, they would want to pass your subject.
• 1:06:06
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:06:08
  So no student will like you and fail your subjects.
• 1:06:11
  I've never heard of that before.
• 1:06:15
  That's pretty common with me.
• 1:06:20
  No, but I like it.
• 1:06:20
  Okay, so remember your why,
• 1:06:22
  get yourself in a positive environment and get involved in the students lives.
• 1:06:26
  Yes. Yeah.
• 1:06:27
  That's cool.
• 1:06:27
  Those are my top three, and they're easy to do.
• 1:06:30
  It's just like you create time for this to happen.
• 1:06:33
  It's nice.
• 1:06:34
  I have one last question.
• 1:06:36
  This one I want to kind of hear from both of you.
• 1:06:38
  So I have the pleasure of being able to work with a lot of professional
• 1:06:41
  learning for teachers.
• 1:06:42
  And I'm wondering if I know that you mentioned at your previous school
• 1:06:46
  you did a lot of professional development and a lot of training for things
• 1:06:49
  like trauma and being able
• 1:06:50
  to work with these students that have this really particular background.
• 1:06:55
  And I'm wondering for both of you, what's something
• 1:06:57
  that's really resonated for you about, like, really stuck with you
• 1:07:01
  in any of the trainings that you've done in the well-being space?
• 1:07:05
  That's a great question.
• 1:07:07
  Junita, you go first.
• 1:07:11
  I need more time think.
• 1:07:14
  It's not what you teach.
• 1:07:16
  It's what type of teacher you are.
• 1:07:18
  It's not what you teach, it's what type of teacher you are.
• 1:07:22
  That, like, sinks deeply to me.
• 1:07:27
  What kind of teacher am I?
• 1:07:29
  Am I a teacher who Inspires?
• 1:07:32
  Am I a teacher who creates
• 1:07:34
  a global citizen?
• 1:07:38
  That's the most important thing
• 1:07:40
  that I'm not just teaching my subject,
• 1:07:43
  I’m inspiring a generation.
• 1:07:46
  So for me, that's basically it.
• 1:07:50
  That global citizen.
• 1:07:51
  Would I want to live with you in my space
• 1:07:55
  or once you're out of my class, you just go away?
• 1:08:01
  Get out.
• 1:08:01
  We're done now.
• 1:08:07
  That for me is very important.
• 1:08:10
  I can't say anything better than that.
• 1:08:12
  So, we're going to leave it there.
• 1:08:16
  Now, I mean, yeah, similar.
• 1:08:18
  I guess
• 1:08:18
  I'd be in a similar vein,
• 1:08:19
  but I was thinking a little bit more specifically practical, too,
• 1:08:22
  like this stuff that I've looked at and I guess,
• 1:08:24
  you know, some of the ones that we've looked at with regard to well-being
• 1:08:26
  and that sort of thing is constantly toe the line between
• 1:08:29
  expectation and, of course, care and looking forward
• 1:08:33
  or looking after somebody because a big part of what somebody can bring
• 1:08:37
  is understanding their confidence of being a positive contributor.
• 1:08:40
  And you alluded to this earlier, Courtney, and of course, we've been talking about
• 1:08:43
  as well.
• 1:08:43
  Here are some of the things you've said you need to, but like if somebody believes
• 1:08:47
  that they have something valuable
• 1:08:48
  to bring to the table, then they'll bring it
• 1:08:50
  and they'll feel better about being in that space.
• 1:08:52
  So it was constantly this idea of like, how am I creating those opportunities
• 1:08:56
  for somebody to feel like they're valued as well.
• 1:08:59
  And I think for me as an educator in that practical realm of like,
• 1:09:01
  okay, when I create an assignment or when I create a lesson plan,
• 1:09:04
  what opportunities do I have here for somebody to feel autonomy
• 1:09:08
  and also that they are a positive contributor.
• 1:09:11
  And by doing those things,
• 1:09:12
  I can simultaneously show that I believe in them and push them.
• 1:09:15
  And therefore I get both of those things going
• 1:09:17
  and they can be a stronger person, I think. Great, thank you both,
• 1:09:21
  I appreciate that.
• 1:09:23
  No, I and yeah, I think just wrapping up.
• 1:09:26
  Thank you so much for taking the time. I've loved this conversation.
• 1:09:29
  I think it's such an important one.
• 1:09:30
  I think that we could have done an hour each just thinking about teacher
• 1:09:34
  well-being and student well-being.
• 1:09:37
  It's such an important topic,
• 1:09:39
  but I love that you bring it in a very, like, humanistic way.
• 1:09:43
  That's been fantastic to hear about what you're doing at your school
• 1:09:46
  and the way that you think about how you show up as a teacher.
• 1:09:50
  Yeah, Junita,
• 1:09:51
  thanks so much for taking the time to chat with us and keeping it positive
• 1:09:54
  and fun like this is a really enjoyable conversation for me as well.
• 1:09:57
  And I hope for you too.
• 1:09:59
  But thanks so much for taking the time and to share your thoughts with us.
• 1:10:02
  Definitely, I enjoyed it.
• 1:10:03
  I would love to have you in my school now.
• 1:10:08
  We would much your crazy.
• 1:10:12
  I don't know if you want that.
• 1:10:16
  Wonderful.
• 1:10:17
  All right, well, thanks so much. And, yeah,
• 1:10:19
  wish you a wonderful rest of the day. Thank you.
• 1:10:22
  IB Unplugged as a Kognity podcast hosted by John Patton
• 1:10:25
  and Courtney Marline and produced by Katilina Gaffney.
• 1:10:28
  Be sure to subscribe or follow and share with your fellow IB educators.
• 1:10:32
  If you'd like to submit a topic, request, or question, please do
• 1:10:35
  so on kognity.com/ibunplugged.
• 1:10:38
  Let's keep the conversation going
• 1:10:40
  and support each other in teaching with confidence, creativity, and joy.
• 1:10:43
  See you next time.