Latest / DA CREW Podcast / REPLAY CLIP ON THE NOLOAN WELLS CASE: GRAND JURY CAME BACK WITH A NO BILL INDICTMENT..... NO WAY !!! WE WANT JUSTICE FOR NOLAN AND HIS FAMI

Transcript

REPLAY CLIP ON THE NOLOAN WELLS CASE: GRAND JURY CAME BACK WITH A NO BILL INDICTMENT..... NO WAY !!! WE WANT JUSTICE FOR NOLAN AND HIS FAMI · DA CREW Podcast

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: But we're happy you're here. Good morning, everybody. Hey, thanks
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: for joining us here on Rooted in Progress. It is Thursday.
• 0:08
  Speaker 2: We are live with your favorite hosts, Deanne King and
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: Terrence Middlebrooks. How you doing this Thursday?
• 0:12
  Speaker 3: I'm feeling a little bit weird right now. I had
• 0:14
  Speaker 3: to add a tool to the artillery.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: You got some glasses, friend. Yeah, and I had to
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: get glasses, y'all.
• 0:20
  Speaker 4: Why?
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Because you're getting old? Yes, because I'm getting old. I've
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: learned to accept it.
• 0:26
  Speaker 3: All I thought about when I picked them up this
• 0:28
  Speaker 3: week was like, man, what is she going to say?
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: Because I know you're going to call me out. So
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: I brought attention to it. There you go. You're killing
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: me right now. Well, you look great. Thank you very much.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: I feel great. It's just fine. You know, a little
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: bit more studious. You know, that's all it is. That's
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: all it is. Okay. Okay.
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: Happy Thursday, Deanne.
• 0:45
  Speaker 4: How are you?
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: How are you real quick? I am doing well. I
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: am doing well.
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: This conversation, though, it's something that I feel like has
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: been heavy.
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: Definitely heavy, especially being folks who have been following the
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: Nolan Wells case. If you opened up any type of
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: social media platform today, more than likely you saw a
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: The blackout for Nolan, people have been changing their profile photos,
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: people have been changing or posting different posts to associate
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: and to bring more awareness and attention to what has
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: been going on with this case. So we're going to
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: catch you up today. We have a lot to talk about,
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: so we'll just jump right into things. The most recent
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: development when it comes to Nolan Wells, he was an
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: 18-year-old whose body was found face down in the water
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: on Monday, July 6th.
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: This was a while ago. He went on a boating
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: trip with some friends and never returned.
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: So what happened last week, the Mississippi grand jury decided
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: not to indict. They said they had insufficient evidence when
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: it came to criminally charging anyone in the death of
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: 18-year-old Nolan Wells. As a result of that, what we saw, Terrence,
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: was a press conference from Nolan Wells' family's attorney, which
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: was Ben Crump. But it was also accompanied by Andrew Garrett.
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: He's a digital forensics expert. expert who spoke about this,
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: about the Snapchat findings, all of these hot button topics
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: that have been on social media.
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: Let's hear from that news conference.
• 2:07
  Speaker 5: Make your later years your best years. Aging Untold will
• 2:10
  Speaker 5: help you take control with solutions for caregivers.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Give answers and encouragement.
• 2:16
  Speaker 3: An all new season of Aging Untold starts September 14th
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: on WMBF.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: They got me sweating like the devil for a dime. Oh,
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: I wish they let me be.
• 2:36
  Speaker 4: Got to hear me try to take what's mine. Holy God,
• 2:44
  Speaker 4: will let me rest in peace.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: The sun is up.
• 2:51
  Speaker 4: I was wrong.
• 2:57
  Speaker 6: During the process of forensically copying the phone, it takes
• 3:01
  Speaker 6: a while. Sometimes you plug the phones in, it's an
• 3:03
  Speaker 6: hour or two. Sometimes it's going to take quite a
• 3:05
  Speaker 6: bit of time. This took about 30 hours. So that
• 3:09
  Speaker 6: meant we blew our deadline by about 12 hours with
• 3:12
  Speaker 6: the government. We let them know that by text message.
• 3:15
  Speaker 6: I was communicating with a technical field officer, Rainer. We communicated.
• 3:20
  Speaker 6: They said, that's fine. We can bring in the phone
• 3:22
  Speaker 6: the next day or bring in the forensic image. and
• 3:25
  Speaker 6: they would accept it as is. They were completely fine
• 3:27
  Speaker 6: with it. There was no nefarious acts. There was no
• 3:30
  Speaker 6: contention between the parties.
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: It was completely agreeable. What would have happened if you
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: would have stopped and tried to make this arbitrary deadline
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: to the phone and data?
• 3:40
  Speaker 6: Yeah, so we notified the government that if we stopped
• 3:44
  Speaker 6: the extraction during the process to meet their deadline, there's
• 3:47
  Speaker 6: a high possibility it could break the phone. That is
• 3:50
  Speaker 6: just the process that happens when you hook up a
• 3:52
  Speaker 6: phone to forensic equipment. So we issued a preliminary report
• 3:56
  Speaker 6: that explained some things in the phone. But there's one
• 4:01
  Speaker 6: thing that we know. Nolan doesn't use text message, but rarely.
• 4:06
  Speaker 6: Only with people that he doesn't know has Snapchat. He
• 4:10
  Speaker 6: uses Snapchat and Instagram for 95% of his communication. These
• 4:15
  Speaker 6: Snapchat messages are important to not only build a timeline,
• 4:19
  Speaker 6: but to see when the last time Nolan was communicating
• 4:22
  Speaker 6: using that phone. Nolan did use the phone that day,
• 4:28
  Speaker 6: swiped himself in, used Face ID, communicated, and looked at
• 4:34
  Speaker 6: certain applications, then locked the phone again. And from that
• 4:37
  Speaker 6: point forward, we knew the rest of the data we
• 4:40
  Speaker 6: needed to look at was GPS data.
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: All right, so a lot to unpack there. We're bringing
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: in none other than.
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: Attorney, a civil rights attorney, social justice attorney, a whole
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: bunch of other commas we could.
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: Add to the name of Michelle Rayner, our legal expert
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: on Rooted this morning.
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: How are you, friend?
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: I'm doing well. How are y'all? Good to be back.
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: Good morning.
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: We are so happy to have you back on Rooted.
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: Unfortunate under these circumstances. So I want to start with
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: just you personally, how you feel about this case with
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: the death of Nolan Wells, where we are today, months
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: after finding out that he died back in July.
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: Yes. So personally, you know, it is heartbreaking, right?
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: I actually had the opportunity to meet Nolan's mother at
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: the Congressional Black Caucus Week in D.C.
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: About two weeks ago.
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: Salt of the Earth met his mother and his father,
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: Salt of the Earth people. And I think that anyone
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: in their position wants to know what happened to their child.
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: And it is alarming that.
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: This happened in July and that personally it feels like
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: there's a lack of urgency from law enforcement and officials
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: to really get to the answers of what happened to
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: this young man. I think from what we know publicly,
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: with regards to the investigation, I am upset that the
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: grand jury declined to find a true bill and declined
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: to indict. But also I think that this is part
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: and parcel of, you know, y'all know me, while it
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: may be legal, all things are political, right? And so
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: I think it also goes to the political climate that
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: we've had in our country, that we've had in, for
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: as long as I can remember, But most specifically, you know, recently,
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: how we have seen in other states that Black folks
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: are getting lynched and they're saying it's suicides, all these
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: kinds of things. And it looks, you know, the deaths
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: of Black folks are looking rather suspicious.
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: And we have no real investigation. Let's talk about that investigation.
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: Sorry to cut you off there, Terrence.
• 6:57
  Speaker 6: No, you're fine.
• 6:58
  Speaker 4: Let's go.
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: So Mississippi grand jury decided not to indict. Can you
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: talk about the process?
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: And what does it even take to even seek sort
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: of an indictment, especially in this kind of a case?
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: Right. So I want to be super clear.
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: The indictment process is very different than the state of
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: Florida because, you know, I've heard a lot of people say, well, why?
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: Didn't the state attorney or the prosecutor just, you know,
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: file an information and they file charges on their own?
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: So in Mississippi, the way that it works is that
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: law enforcement investigates a case. It goes to the district
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: attorney or their prosecutor, the state attorney, and that the
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: attorney then after their investigation investigates.
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: They go through a grand jury process.
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: A district attorney cannot file charges on their own unless
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: it's a misdemeanor or if it's a felony that the defendant,
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: probably along with its counsel, has waived the indictment process
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: and then said, okay, we will go ahead and file
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: an information. And that usually happens when there's like a
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: plea agreement or something of that nature. So, literally, this
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: is really the only process for a state attorney or
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: a prosecutor to file any type of charges to the
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: level that the family would want in this process. So,
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: they have to file, go through the indictment process. But
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: here's what I know about the indictment process, and I
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: think it's really important that people know that. There is
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: no defense attorney on the other side. It is not adversarial. So,
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: it is literally, if I'm the prosecutor... I take my papers.
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: I take my witnesses. I get to tell you what
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: I want you to know. You don't get to hear
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: any defense. You don't get to hear any other sides.
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: So when they say it's easy to indict in a
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: ham sandwich, I say, listen, if a prosecutor wants an indictment,
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: they will get an indictment. And I think people need
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: to understand that because there's no other side saying, well,
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: here's another way to think about this. Here's some other evidence.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: Here's some other evidence that would negate what what the
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: prosecution says. It's literally the prosecution just giving you their case.
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: So once again, if a prosecutor wants an indictment, they
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: will get an indictment.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: It's one sided, clearly one sided.
• 9:14
  Speaker 4: Clearly.
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: All right.
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: At this point, let's let's just ask the obvious questions.
• 9:18
  Speaker 3: Grand jury comes back with this. There's not enough evidence
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: to indict anybody.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: Case closed. What's next? So here's the thing.
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: It's not technically case closed because I think people also
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: need to be aware that the indictment process is not
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: a jury trial.
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: So there's no what we call double jeopardy. Double jeopardy
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: does not attach. That doesn't mean that these young men
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: can't continue to be investigated.
• 9:43
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: That does not mean that the prosecutor can't come back
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: and potentially file either new charges and seek an indictment
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: on maybe a manslaughter or maybe involuntary manslaughter or a
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: second-degree murder.
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: Is not done. However, you know, it is.
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: Once again, disheartening to see, uh, that in this particular
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: situation that, um, that, uh, uh, indictment was not brought back.
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: So once again, it really is going to be if
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: the prosecutor and law enforcement continues to investigate this. But
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: what I think is probably going to happen knowing I've
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: been crumbed knowing cause I used to work with him
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: is that he also probably has his own investigators. The
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: family has probably already hired their own investigators, uh, And
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: it is hopeful that if the investigators are able to
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: uncover more evidence of wrongdoing, that we would be able
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: to see some type of evidence brought back to the
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: prosecutor and then the prosecutor, you know, go through the
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: grand jury process again. I want to take a step back.
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: And for those of you joining us live on Facebook,
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: good morning to you. If you have any questions, any
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: specific questions for Michelle, please drop them and we will
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: address those questions as well.
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: But let's go back to.
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: Basically you saying if a prosecutor wants an indictment, a prosecutor.
• 11:06
  Speaker 3: Will get an indictment.
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: A hundred percent. What went wrong here? They don't want
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: an indictment. I mean, like if we're going to like
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: just like if we're going to name it.
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: From the very beginning, this case, I believe, my opinion,
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: from what I've seen, what I've heard, what I've read,
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: I've read a lot, I've kept up on this case,
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: was not taken seriously. You had Nolan Wells, a young
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: black man, hang out with a bunch.
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: Of white boys.
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: Their families connected to law enforcement and criminal justice system
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: in this area.
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: You....
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: Like, let's just, like, really think about this, y'all. Like,
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: really think about this. All of a sudden, we're hanging out.
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: You go missing. I take your phone. I wipe your phone.
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: Any normal law enforcement officer is going to say, well,
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: why was his phone wiped?
• 12:00
  Speaker 4: Like.
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: There are things that show that something, you know, barring guilt, right?
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: There are things that show that need to be investigated.
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: It's the obvious. That's what, like I said, it's... Correct.
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: It's too obvious that something is being covered up.
• 12:19
  Speaker 6: Correct.
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: So because when we talk about the evidence and who
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: we just heard from was the digital forensics expert, because
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: that's been the big thing. What's going on with the phone?
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: The message is being wiped. The Snapchat message is being deleted.
• 12:31
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: So he basically clarified. And he explained that Nolan's phone
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: remained locked. So the last time he locked his phone,
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: it did not become unlocked until it got into the
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: hands of his mother, right? However, he said messages were
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: deleted remotely. Phone wiped remotely. Snapchat messages missing remotely, right?
• 12:55
  Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: How does that then translate to there not being enough
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: or sufficient evidence? Is that like in a court of law,
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: does that not rule or, you know, does that mean
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: that there shouldn't be any charges or we shouldn't be
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: looking into anything more specifically? Or could that just mean
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: that it wasn't argued well enough?
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: That charges needed to be brought.
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: So I think where you have to look at the state, one,
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: is going to have to prove who actually was holding
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: that phone, who deleted.
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: It, who had access to it.
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: And I think a phone can tell us what a
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: device did, but a phone cannot tell us who was
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: holding it. It cannot tell us the intent. It cannot
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: tell us any of those things. However, a phone can
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: lead us to other parts of this case. A phone
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: can lead us to say... it's almost like you're pulling
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: a string, right? If you're pulling, you know, a string, okay, well,
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: we're pulling the string and it begins to unravel and
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: then you will see the other parts of that case.
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: So I think that for one of the things that
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: the phone is, who.
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: Was able to access his messages remotely, who was able
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: to access his Snapchat remotely, I don't think that, you know,
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: his mom would delete it remotely because she has no
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: reason to do any of those things because she wants
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: to know where her, at that point, what happened to
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: her son. At that point, I believe when she got
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: access to his phone, I don't believe that. They have
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: found him yet. And then so she was wanting to
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: see what's going on. And then there's no reason for
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: her to do that. So then if I'm an investigator,
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: my question becomes, well, who would have a reason to
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: want to access this phone remotely?
• 14:27
  Speaker 6: And why?
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: And see, these kids are different today because they keep
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: up with each other's locations.
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: They share passwords. We share passwords. They share locations. All
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: of those kinds of things.
• 14:35
  Speaker 3: So real quick, folks, we're going to take a break
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: and we're going to dive more deeper into this case
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: and what was revealed at the presser.
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: So we'll be right back.
• 14:43
  Speaker 5: Make your later years your best years. Aging Untold will
• 14:47
  Speaker 5: help you take control with solutions for kids.
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to Rooting in Progress, y'all.
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: We continue taking a deeper look into the case of
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: the death of 18-year-old Nolan Wells.
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: We were just talking about.
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: The evidence or lack thereof when it comes to the
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: Mississippi grand jury deciding not to indict any criminal charges
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: as it relates to this case. Let's talk about the
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: forensic evidence, the autopsy.
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah. The manner of death is still undetermined.
• 15:27
  Speaker 4: It is.
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: We still don't know how he died. And there was
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: no water in his lungs, I believe. No water in
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: his lungs. That's the true question. Because they said it pointed...
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: To drown.
• 15:39
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: It wasn't definitive. Correct.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: But they said they believed it to be drowning. However,
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: here's what's also very interesting because you have two sides.
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: You have the Mississippi government basically saying we don't have
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: a cause of death. But you also have the independent
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: investigators and that independent autopsy by Crump's crew saying, who
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: also said we cannot definitively create or you know give
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: you all um a cause of death or rule drowning
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: as the cause so we technically have both sides on
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: the same page with that how do we get there
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: so here's the thing i think that first you got
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: a level set you know something happened correct something happened
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: that was i would argue that is outside of this
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: young man's control I would argue that, um, how he
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: was found, some of the reports of what we heard
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: from other folks that weren't with the, with those kids
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: of just, uh, When he was interacting with some of them,
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: what he said, where they left him, all of those
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: kinds of things, we know something happened. So, undetermined does
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: not mean that it was not an unlawful killing, right?
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: Undetermined does not mean that there was not.
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: that, you know, a homicide did not take place, right?
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: And so, also, I think we want to be really
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: careful when we use the word homicide. Homicide, all homicide
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: means is that it was a killing of a human
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: by another human, right? So, I think, one, it is undetermined.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: So, by both entities.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: So, you have two medical teams that cannot determine the
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: cause of death.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: So, what we know now is that something happened.
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: However, it's.
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: What we see in the law, the totality of the circumstances.
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: So when you take.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: Everything that's happened, right, you take all of the things
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: you're like, well, something happened because once again, why is,
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: why is, you know, phones being, you know, uh, deleted?
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: Why are people, you know, ultimately lawyering up?
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: And obviously as a defense attorney, of course, if I'm
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: a defense attorney, I would say, yes, you know, if
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: your kid did something or you don't want your kid
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: to be involved in, you know, the legal system must
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: certainly get a lawyer. If However, when you begin to
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: look at the totality of the circumstances, it looks like
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: it points to that there was human involvement or outside
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: involvement in this young man's death, especially when it says,
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: you know, well, he just drowned.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: Well, there's no water. There was no water in his lungs.
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: I don't know many people who drown who don't have
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: water in his lungs. Dry drowning is a thing. But
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: I don't think that's what we saw here.
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: Well, let's also talk about the missing organs.
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: In the second autopsy.
• 18:21
  Speaker 3: Which is insane.
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: Which is wild.
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: So, like you said, the dots aren't connecting.
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: Correct.
• 18:26
  Speaker 3: And it's just, there's so many questions and so many
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: red flags that are being brought up in this case
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: that it's like, how come there hasn't been any arrests?
• 18:36
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: And I think here's the thing. You know, people want their.
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: to be an arrest but i also you know tell
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: people arrest is just the beginning right because at the
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: end of the day they have to prove beyond into
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: the exclusion of every reasonable doubt and so while you
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: know there it is concerning and it is disheartening from
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: a personal.
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: Perspective jones making mealtime better since 1889.
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: The best way I can maybe explain this is that when,
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: I'm going all the way back, but we think about
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: Trayvon Martin, right?
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: Everyone wanted an arrest. We got an arrest.
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: But however, the state overcharged, state overcharged, George Zimmerman is
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: walking around free. And we know, we all sitting here
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: know that that wasn't self-defense. We all sit, we're all
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: sitting here knowing that he 100% hunted that young man
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: and meant to kill him.
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: However, if the state is.
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: Not able to prove their case or they overcharge, an
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: arrest is great, but arrest is not justice.
• 19:50
  Speaker 6: Correct.
• 19:51
  Speaker 5: That's good.
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: I kind of want to play devil's advocate because I
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: want to get both sides here. He already got enough advocates.
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: You right about that.
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: You spot on.
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: I'm going to start with you being criminal defense attorney.
• 20:05
  Speaker 6: Okay.
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: If you were representing any of his friends, what would
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: you be doing right now?
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: They would not be talking. They would not be talking.
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: I would have all their phones. They would have new
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: phone numbers. They would not be on social media. They
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: would not be talking to each other. If I was
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: representing any one of them, they would not be talking.
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: There would not be a word uttered.
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: So these interviews that they've been doing. I would lose
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: my mind.
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: I honestly maybe at that point would say, so we're
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: going to have to agree that I'm.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: No longer going to represent you. Here's the thing. And
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: I tell this to clients. Stop talking. Stop talking to police.
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: Stop talking to media. Because what you think is going
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: to help you is not going to help you. Because
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: what we.
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: Do as human beings and the psychology behind it, right,
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: is that we tell on ourselves.
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: And we don't realize that we're telling on ourselves.
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: Or we say things that are not, that would not
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: look great in front of a jury. So if I
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: was representing them or any one of these individuals, absolutely not.
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: What are you talking for? There is nothing for you
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: to say. If you were on Krump's team, which you've
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: worked with him before, what would you be doing either differently?
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: Is there anything you would have changed? What would you
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: be doing in this moment right now?
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: I think, honestly, like, this is the playbook. I would
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: be doing basically the same thing he's doing. I mean,
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: I would be having, so.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: We have a saying. When we work together, pressure bust pipes.
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: And so we would be putting the same amount of
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: pressure on, you know, the state's attorney, like what we
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: did here with Marquise McLaughlin, you know, many years ago.
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: What we have seen in other cases, we would be
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: putting so much pressure on.
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: On the state, on law enforcement.
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: We would be putting pressure on the public that, listen,
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: I am tired of hearing about this.
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: If I would literally be talking to folks, you know, we.
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: Would have, like, I remember we had, like, a dedicated, like,
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: cell phone number for Marquise McLaughlin for people to call
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: if they saw something and they just were not, you know,
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: they were afraid to, you know, maybe, like, go to
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: law enforcement.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: So I think he's doing what is right. Like, he's,
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: you know, he's doing it. There's nothing you would change.
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: I mean.
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: So real quick, I don't want to cut you off.
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: We got to go to a quick break.
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: Before we go to break, and you're going to answer
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: when we come back out of break, is that people
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: are saying that Crump's team is.
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: Moving at a very slow pace.
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: There was a period of time when we didn't hear
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: from Crump.
• 22:35
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: Why now with the presser and understanding this digital forensic.
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: I got you.
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: You know, he comes out with a really heavy hitting
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: topic or evidence. But we want you to elaborate on
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: that and the process and the speed that Crump's team
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: is taking.
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: So when we come right back, guys. At McDonald's, when
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: you order a meal, you save.
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: Some call it the extra value meal. I call it another.
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: Great day to be a Big Mac fan.
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: Get a Big Mac meal for.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: Just $ 8.
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: Let justice roll down like water and righteousness like a
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: mighty stream.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to Rooted in Progress, y'all. Still diving into
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: this Nolan.
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: Wells case, the death of 18-year-old Nolan Wells. Still several
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: questions lingering after a Mississippi grand jury decided not to
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: indict in this case. We were just talking about if
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: there's anything you would have changed when it comes to
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: what Crump has done thus far. Do you think that
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: when it comes to evidence, are they missing anything? When
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: it comes to bringing in experts, are they missing anything
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: when it comes to the independent autopsy that they did?
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: Are they missing anything from a media standpoint?
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: Like, anything? So, you know, it's hard to play Monday
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: Night Quarterback, right?
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: Because I'm not intimately aware of the case as he is, right?
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: And so I think one of the things is that,
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: you know, there was, I think, maybe a concern is, like,
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: you know, folks have said, well, we didn't hear from
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: him for X amount of months.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: And I will say this. Sometimes... if you're working with
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: the state.
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: And so I can talk about when I've represented families
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: in the same situation, the state will say, could you
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: chill out for a minute? Let us do our investigation.
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: Let us see what we can find. And still, you know, advocate, but,
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: you know. In those moments, you kind of quiet down.
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: Quiet down a little bit so they can do their work.
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: Because ultimately, like, I want to make sure folks know,
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: Bancroft cannot prosecute anybody, right?
• 24:57
  Speaker 6: Correct.
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: He cannot prosecute anybody. He cannot bring charges against anybody.
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: He cannot do any of those things. It is only
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: a district attorney, a state attorney, a prosecutor who can
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: do that. And so I think that, you know, there
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: is a space of, as lawyer to lawyer, I'm going
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: to respect you and allow you to do your work
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: on the side that you're doing, right?
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: And then.
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: after I see what the results are, I then may
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: have something more to say. I think that what happened
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: is that they did get an independent, you know, independent
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: autopsy done.
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: They've done the independent toxicology done. You have gotten that done.
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: I know that there was interviewing of witnesses and other
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: folks as well. So at this point in time, his
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: hands are really tied because there's nothing else that he
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: can really do but give that information to the prosecutor
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: and let the prosecutor decide if they're going to actually
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: move forward with an indictment and how they're going to
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: present that evidence. So it's hard for me to say,
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: I would have done this, I would have done that.
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: From the outside looking in, it looks like he has
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: done what he can do in his capacity as a
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: civil attorney. Remember, he is a civil attorney. He is
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: not a criminal defense attorney. He is not a prosecutor.
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: And so I think it's a distinction is that, one,
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: he's doing twofold. He's advocating, making sure that this family
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: is going to get a modicum of justice and that
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: this incident, horrific incident, is investigated appropriately and that if
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: there is some type of culpability, criminality, any of those
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: things that we want to say, that as a civil attorney,
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: he would be able to sue and recover on behalf
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: of the family.
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: Will the family need to go out and get a
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: criminal defense attorney?
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: So the family, the Nolan Wells family, no. They would
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: use Ben. So he's able to advocate for them. And ultimately,
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: if they decide to sue civilly, you know, he would
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: be able to do that. Now these young men, they
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: need a criminal defense attorney.
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: Big time.
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: I want to talk about, we've seen several calls for
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: the U.S. Department of Justice to conduct their own independent investigation.
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: Not this one. Not the one we got now. Here's
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: my question real quick. You don't think it's going to happen? Well,
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: you would... Okay, see, y'all. Y'all would trust them people.
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: But here's my question.
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: Because it took place, his body was found on federal property.
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: When does the federal investigation.
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: The feds could step in.
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, what's... So from my understanding, the mechanism is that
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: you have to ask, you have to invite... The states
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: have to invite the feds to come in. So you
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: have to... So there... Yes, it was used, found on
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: federal property, but within the state of Mississippi.
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: And so they have to invite the feds to come in.
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: So I liken it to when we had the Marquise
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: McLaughlin case, you know, then Senator Kamala Harris and Senator
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: Booker and Bill, Senator Nelson, they and a couple others
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: penned a letter asking for federal oversight, requesting federal oversight.
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: That federal oversight be given to them. And of course,
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: our then governor, well, I guess he's still the governor,
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: DeSantis declined. And so you have to be able to
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: invite the feds in. They just can't come unless it's
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: something that falls squarely within their jurisdiction.
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: And I think.
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: I mean, there's an argument that it could, right? Because
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: of where his body was found. But I think that...
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: But the DOJ getting involved, do you think is... I mean,
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: come on, this DOJ?
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: Okay, okay.
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: Like, I mean, this is the same DOJ that's led
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: by someone that, you know, I mean, we don't.
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: Have to get into that. Yeah, that's a whole other show.
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: We're just going to leave it right there, period. Listen, listen.
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: Y'all know what I'm talking about.
• 28:44
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: It's a difficult one. So overall, Michelle, what's next? What's
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: next with this case? What should we be looking out
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: for when it comes to this? Listen, I think that
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: if I if I am Ben Crump, what I would
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: do is I would most certainly continue pushing for deeper
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: investigation by law enforcement agencies. I would most certainly keep
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: pushing for deeper investigation by the district attorney.
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: I would also continue to conduct my own investigation.
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: I think that right now, I think people have to
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: understand is that the time that we're in, unfortunately, you know, y'all,
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: like we've been here before, right?
• 29:24
  Speaker 4: We have.
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: Way too many times. Time and time again. And so
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: it is.
• 29:30
  Speaker 5: Make your later years your best years. Aging Untold will
• 29:34
  Speaker 5: help you take control with solutions for caregivers.
• 29:38
  Speaker 4: Get answers.
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: It is hard to keep your heart soft when you
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: see these things and not become numb and say, well,
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: of course, like, you know. And so I think that,
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: you know, if I'm his family, that they keep fighting,
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: they keep pushing for answers.
• 29:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: And that's what I think, that, you know, there still
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: needs to be a commitment to an ongoing investigation.
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: I don't know if it will. I mean, the state
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: attorney texted his mom.
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: They got so many odds against him.
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: Correct.
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: Not only just the state of Mississippi, but like you said,
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: the affiliation these.
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: These suspects have were... suspects have with the law enforcement.
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: It's tough.
• 30:19
  Speaker 6: So tough.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: It's very tough.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: All right. Well, we'll continue to keep our finger on
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: the pulse and any updates, any developments. Michelle, we'll have
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: you right back on over here on Rooted in Progress.
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: We appreciate you coming and joining us. I'm glad you are. Well,
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: you look amazing. Well, thank you. As always, happy belated birthday.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: Happy belated birthday. Thank you.
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: So yes, September birthday is always the best. How can
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: folks keep up to date with you and whatever you
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: have going on? Listen, it's still Michelle4FL on socials. If
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: you look at the most recent socials, you'll see me
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: jumping over Angie Nixon, which is insane.
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: But that was like literally very unhinged.
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: But also very on par. Very on brand. My brand
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: is strong. And Michelle4FL and... uh, Gant and Rainer, uh, uh, law.
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: And so it's, we call it girl. And yeah, so, um,
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: just keep up with, uh, keep up with me there.
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: We have a lot going on.
• 31:14
  Speaker 4: All right.
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: Well, we appreciate you joining us.
• 31:16
  Speaker 4: All right.
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: Terrence, we'll continue to keep folks updated on the death
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: of 18 year old Nolan Wells. Y'all can follow us
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: on all social media platforms, all of our episodes available
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: on all streaming platforms as well.
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: Stay rooted. Stay rooted folks. Lord, here Mississippi crying We
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: tired But we ain't silent Say.
• 31:52
  Speaker 4: His name Say his name Darling, well Gone too soon
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: But never forgotten Say his name We want justice, we
• 32:07
  Speaker 4: want truth, we want answers White privilege will not prevail
• 32:13
  Speaker 4: Now while our people still got breath We gon' pray,
• 32:17
  Speaker 4: we gon' walk, we gon' stand Till justice rises from
• 32:23
  Speaker 4: the depths Mama's tears hit the floor like rain Another
• 32:29
  Speaker 4: black family carrying pain They said drowning, but the facts
• 32:33
  Speaker 4: cried out loud. Evidence speaking through a buried crowd. Mississippi,
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: how you sleep at night when troops been knocking and you.
• 32:43
  Speaker 2: Dim the light?
• 32:45
  Speaker 4: A no bill came, but we still believe. God sees
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: blood that the courts won't grieve.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: We ain't disposable. We ain't your shame.
• 32:56
  Speaker 4: We ain't statistics without a doubt of name. My son's
• 33:00
  Speaker 4: got purpose. Our daughter's got dreams. And heaven heals when
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: a mother screams.
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: Say his name.
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: Nolan Wells.
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: Nolan Wells. Gone too soon.
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: But never forgotten. Say his name.
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: Nolan Wells.
• 33:18
  Speaker 4: We want justice.
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: We want truth.
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: We want answers. White privilege will not prevail. Now while
• 33:26
  Speaker 4: our people still got Till justice rises from the depths
• 33:37
  Speaker 4: Community tired of being expendable Tired of systems being indefensible
• 33:41
  Speaker 4: Hands clean on paper, hearts cold.
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: In rooms But truth got a voice.
• 33:44
  Speaker 4: That can shake, seal tombs This ain't hate, this is
• 33:46
  Speaker 4: holy resistance Faith with fire and righteous persistence We won't stop,
• 33:49
  Speaker 4: we won't bow We won't fold to the full truth
• 33:52
  Speaker 4: True story gets told. Mississippi, you must dance.
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: Mississippi, hear the cry.
• 33:58
  Speaker 4: A family deserves just.
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: Another reason why. We call for truth. We call for light.
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: We call for what is fair and right.
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: No more silence.
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: No more games.
• 34:07
  Speaker 4: We lift our voices and say his name. Say his name.
• 34:11
  Speaker 1: Know them well.
• 34:13
  Speaker 4: Just as now.
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: Know them well. Truth come forth.
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: Know them well.
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: We won't fall.
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: Wake up the nation shake every.
• 34:29
  Speaker 4: System.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: They're just