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The Ancient Gods Are Coming Back | Derek Gilbert | Repost · Prophecy Watchers

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Speaker 1: There is a propaganda battle being waged today and you
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Speaker 1: need to know about it. And here to talk about
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Speaker 1: that propaganda battle is our good friend, Derek Gilbert. Hi, Derek. Hi, Gary.
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Speaker 1: It's an honor to be here. It's great to have
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Speaker 1: you here. And, of course, off camera, you and I
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Speaker 1: have just had a mile-a-minute conversation. There's so much to
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Speaker 1: talk about. Derek and, by the way, his wife, Sharon,
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Speaker 1: have produced this book called Veneration. And when I read
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Speaker 1: this book, the thing that kept haunting me is this
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Speaker 1: is going on right now. When you look at cable TV,
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Speaker 1: you look at the movie listings, you see a propaganda
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Speaker 1: battle and it features supernatural characters, the Avengers and super
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Speaker 1: this and super that. And the kids are being spoon
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Speaker 1: fed on superhuman creatures and all of their exploits. And
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Speaker 1: some of them are even heroes like Thor is a hero.
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Speaker 2: Yeah.
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Speaker 1: But when you read about the real Thor, he's no hero. No, no.
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Speaker 2: This has been going on for a long time. And
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Speaker 2: this has really informed the research that Sharon and I
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Speaker 2: have been doing for some years now. It's led to
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Speaker 2: several books now and then more books in the wings.
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Speaker 2: But I remember as a kid getting hold of my
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Speaker 2: cousin's comic book collection and seeing the very first issue
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Speaker 2: of Thor, Thor versus Hercules, and just being really caught
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Speaker 2: up in the story. But now, I've got to confess,
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Speaker 2: the Avengers films, the Thor movies are very entertaining. Thor
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Speaker 2: is portrayed as a very likable character. But when you
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Speaker 2: understand who he is, he is the storm god of
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Speaker 2: the ancient Germanic religion. In that role, he is equated
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Speaker 2: with Jupiter of the Romans, Zeus of the Greeks, Baal
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Speaker 2: of the Bible. And as Baal and as Zeus, Jesus
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Speaker 2: identified that character as Satan. So 2,000 years ago, Christians
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Speaker 2: would have known hey, this is not a good guy.
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Speaker 2: Now he's a chart-topping Hollywood blockbuster leading action hero.
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Speaker 1: He really is. And, you know, I think back to
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Speaker 1: Josephus and going back to the beginning of the story
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Speaker 1: where he speaks of Genesis 6 by saying that the
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Speaker 1: sons of God who came down to the daughters of
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Speaker 1: men were the ones called titans. Yes. And Josephus actually
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Speaker 1: uses that word. Now, the Titans are demigods. And we
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Speaker 1: used to think that the Titans were sort of fictional characters. Now,
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Speaker 1: looking at the Bible and a lot of extant literature,
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Speaker 1: we're beginning to see that the Titans were real people.
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Speaker 2: Well, the Titans were the old gods of the Greeks.
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Speaker 2: They were the ones who ruled the earth under their king, Kronos,
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Speaker 2: until the Olympians, led by Zeus, the storm god, rebelled
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Speaker 2: against them and banished them to Tartarus, which was not
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Speaker 2: the same as Hades. That's a separate level of the underworld,
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Speaker 2: as far below Hades as the earth is below heaven,
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Speaker 2: and it was reserved for supernatural threats to the divine order.
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Speaker 2: But this myth is repeated in a number of ancient religions.
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Speaker 2: The Hittites and Hurrians believed that there were old gods
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Speaker 2: who'd been overthrown by their storm god called Teshub. The Canaanites,
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Speaker 2: the Amorites believed that their storm god, Hadad, called Baal
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Speaker 2: in the Bible, had taken over for their creator god, El.
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Speaker 2: You go back further into Babylon, where Marduk, a storm god,
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Speaker 2: replaced Enlil at the top of the Pantheon. This was
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Speaker 2: repeated over and over, and in each case, the old
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Speaker 2: gods were moved or banished to the netherworld, or to
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Speaker 2: the abyss, or to Tartarus, as the new gods took over. Well,
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Speaker 2: we see in 2 Peter, a hidden reference to these
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Speaker 2: old gods. 2 Peter 2, verse 4, talks about God
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Speaker 2: didn't spare the angels when they sinned, but thrust them
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Speaker 2: down to hell. Well, the word translated hell in English
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Speaker 2: is in Greek, Tartaraou. It's the only place it's used
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Speaker 2: in the Bible, which means it's important. We need to
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Speaker 2: take note. Literally means thrust down to Tartarus. Again, there's
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Speaker 2: a difference between Tartarus and Hades. And certainly Peter knew
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Speaker 2: the difference, writing under the influence of the Holy Spirit.
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Speaker 2: He was talking about the angels who sinned. And if
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Speaker 2: you read 2 Peter 2 in context, or Jude 6, 7, 8, 9,
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Speaker 2: it's clear that in context, they're referring to angels who
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Speaker 2: committed a sexual sin. And the only place in the
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Speaker 2: Bible we see that is Genesis 6, verses 1 through 4.
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Speaker 2: The watchers who descended made a mutual pact on the
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Speaker 2: summit of Mount Hermon, which we know from the book
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Speaker 2: of 1 Enoch. Those are to be equated with the
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Speaker 2: titans of Greek myth, the old gods of the Hittites,
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Speaker 2: and the Anunnaki of ancient Sumer. The story just retold,
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Speaker 2: but the Bible has the accurate account.
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Speaker 1: Now, my curiosity at this point, and by the way,
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Speaker 1: I'm speaking to our audience because I want them, and
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Speaker 1: I want everybody, I think, as many people as possible
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Speaker 1: to know what's in this book. How would you describe
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Speaker 1: what's in this book? It's an expose, I would call it.
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Speaker 1: That's a good way of describing it. We did a
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Speaker 1: deep dive into the theology and the history of the
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Speaker 1: Nephilim as they were destroyed, condemned by God and destroyed.
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Speaker 1: We know from the book of Enoch, and this was
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Speaker 1: the understanding of the apostles and the early church, their
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Speaker 1: spirits became demons. But in fact, even the pagan Greeks
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Speaker 1: understood that the spirits of the heroes who lived during
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Speaker 1: the golden age when Kronos ruled in heaven, in other words,
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Speaker 1: the pre-flood world, when they died, their spirits proceeded from them.
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Speaker 1: They were called daemons. They attracted cult, in other words,
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Speaker 1: worship or veneration, hence the title of the book. And
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Speaker 1: by the way, if you read the ancient Greek histories
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Speaker 1: and philosophies, they think of the demons as their friends.
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Speaker 1: Exactly right. That was the key difference.
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Speaker 2: The Greeks and The early church and the Jewish scholars
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Speaker 2: of the centuries before the birth of Jesus understood that
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Speaker 2: demons had the same origin point. They just had a
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Speaker 2: very different view of their nature. And Hesiod, for example,
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Speaker 2: actually said this. He said that demons are our friends.
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Speaker 2: And then he proceeds to go forth with a little
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Speaker 2: kind of an instruction on how to get close to
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Speaker 2: these people. Because if you get close to them, they
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Speaker 2: will bless you.
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Speaker 1: Yes. They will bring you good things.
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Speaker 2: But what we show in veneration is that secular scholars
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Speaker 2: in peer-reviewed research have shown that the Greeks didn't invent
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Speaker 2: this idea on their own, that they drew it from
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Speaker 2: the Semitic cultures, the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Hebrews, who
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Speaker 2: understood that the Rephaim were the spirits of the Nephilim
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Speaker 2: destroyed in the flood. A scholar by the name of
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Speaker 2: Amar Anus wrote a paper in 1999 in which he titled,
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Speaker 2: Are There Greek Rephaim? And showed that the origin of
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Speaker 2: these demigod heroes of the Greeks were actually the Rephaim
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Speaker 2: spirits who were venerated by the Canaanites and the Amorites.
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Speaker 2: We found in our research that this idea that spirits
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Speaker 2: continued on after death and interceded or intervened in the
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Speaker 2: affairs of mortal humans was a basic part of the
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Speaker 2: worldview of the Amorites who dominated the world of the
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Speaker 2: Bible from the time of Abraham... through the time of
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Speaker 2: the Exodus, but their influence continued down through the time
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Speaker 2: of Jesus Christ. They believed that the ancestors, the parents, grandparents,
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Speaker 2: great-grandparents who had gone on before, had to be summoned
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Speaker 2: once a month in a necromancy ritual. It was always
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Speaker 2: held on the 30th of the month, the night of
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Speaker 2: no moon, in a lunar calendar. The ritual was called Kispim,
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Speaker 2: and they would summon their ancestors by name for a
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Speaker 2: ritual meal where they would feed the ancestors. They had
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Speaker 2: to give them bread. drink water or wine. The ancestors
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Speaker 2: were buried below the floor of the house and in
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Speaker 2: many cases a tube was installed down to the corpse
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Speaker 2: so that water could be poured out. In fact the
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Speaker 2: heir who was responsible, the oldest son usually, for performing
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Speaker 2: this ritual every month was called the pourer of water.
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Speaker 2: And the Mesopotamians, the Amorites, believed that if their descendants
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Speaker 2: didn't perform the rituals faithfully they would be condemned to
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Speaker 2: eat dust and clay for all eternity and live a
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Speaker 2: miserable life in the afterlife. In fact, that explains, we think,
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Speaker 2: why Abraham was so distressed about not having an heir.
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Speaker 2: He didn't think he was going to have anyone, a
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Speaker 2: blood relative, who would perform the ritual so that he
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Speaker 2: and Sarah would be fed after death because he didn't
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Speaker 2: have the understanding of the afterlife that God revealed to
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Speaker 2: Moses and then to the prophets and the apostles.
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Speaker 1: I'm going to read from Isaiah 14. And by the way,
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Speaker 1: we're going in a specific direction here. Stay with us.
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Speaker 1: This is complex. But Derek has done so much research.
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Speaker 1: Isaiah 14, 19. It says, thou shalt not be joined.
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Speaker 1: 19 and 20, by the way. But thou art cast
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Speaker 1: out of the grave like an abominable branch and as
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Speaker 1: a raiment of those who are slain, thrust through with
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Speaker 1: a sword. Those that go down to the stones of
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Speaker 1: the pit as a carcass trodden under feet. Thou shalt
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Speaker 1: not be joined with them in burial because thou hast
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Speaker 1: destroyed them. thy land, and slain thy people. The seed
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Speaker 1: of evildoers shall never be removed. And we have a
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Speaker 1: mystery enemy here to be spoken of. And the reason
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Speaker 1: I want to bring this up, not only do you
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Speaker 1: use this as a topic verse in your book, but
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Speaker 1: it marks what's going on for me. Because there is
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Speaker 1: a propaganda battle. And when Isaiah talks about These evil ones.
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Speaker 1: You could read right over that and just think he's
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Speaker 1: talking about some bad people. But no, if you read
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Speaker 1: the whole of Isaiah in an enlightened way, suddenly you
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Speaker 1: have the story of the Rephaim. Yes, Isaiah 14. is
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Speaker 1: an amazing chapter because it describes the history and also
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Speaker 1: the future of these entities and why they're relevant to
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Speaker 1: us as Christians today. Isaiah 14, of course, is the
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Speaker 1: famous chapter that condemns the rebel from Eden. How thou
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Speaker 1: art fallen, O Lucifer, son of the morning. So in
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Speaker 1: the context, you see that that's the entity who's being
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Speaker 1: addressed here by Isaiah. But then when we see he
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Speaker 1: is cast out of Eden, and when he falls, shale
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Speaker 1: beneath is stirred up to meet you when you come.
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Speaker 1: It rouses the shades to greet you. It rouses the
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Speaker 1: Rephaim to greet you. This is the moment at which Lucifer, Satan,
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Speaker 1: is cast out from Eden to become Lord of the dead.
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Speaker 1: And then we go back to verse 19, which you mentioned.
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Speaker 1: There's a couple of interesting things here. The abominable branch.
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Speaker 1: We do a word study on that, and a scholar...
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Speaker 1: brilliantly pointed out that the word translated abominable branch in Hebrew, netzer,
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Speaker 1: it's a prophetic reference elsewhere in Isaiah where it talks
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Speaker 1: about the branch, the shoot that comes from the root
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Speaker 1: of Jesse. But here he says, no, this is actually
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Speaker 1: a loan word from Egyptian, which Isaiah would have been
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Speaker 1: privy to because King Hezekiah, who was ruled during Isaiah's day,
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Speaker 1: was trying to make an alliance with the Egyptians as
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Speaker 1: protection against the Babylonians and Assyrians. Netzer is a well-known
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Speaker 1: word in Egyptian that means dead god, like a divinized
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Speaker 1: dead king, or the Rephaim, who were the spirits of
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Speaker 1: these mighty men who were of old. And you go
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Speaker 1: into this rather deeply in your book.
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Speaker 2: So in context, it makes sense. And then, of course,
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Speaker 2: you go further down, and as we mentioned, the watchers
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Speaker 2: who are the progenitors of these shades, these Rephaim, these
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Speaker 2: dead kings of old. Verse 21 reads, and I'm reading
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Speaker 2: from the English Standard Version instead of the King James,
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Speaker 2: but Prepare slaughter for his sons because of the guilt
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Speaker 2: of their fathers, lest they rise and possess the earth
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Speaker 2: and fill the face of the world with cities. Now,
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Speaker 2: I'm a Chicago kid, so I wonder, what's the problem
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Speaker 2: with cities here? I mean, God had David in a city,
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Speaker 2: put his name in Jerusalem, and there he will dwell forever.
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Speaker 2: But again, it's another loan word. When we understand that
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Speaker 2: the word for cities in Hebrew, irim, is identical to
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Speaker 2: the Aramaic word for watchers. lest they rise and possess
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Speaker 2: the earth and fill the face of the world with watchers.
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Speaker 1: And you know what? All those ancient cities, the biggest
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Speaker 1: cities in the world, were dedicated to the gods. Yes, yes.
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Speaker 1: That was common practice in Mesopotamia. Each god had its
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Speaker 1: patron deity. Right. Or each city had its patron deity.
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Speaker 1: Moving forward a bit, and this is the last I'm
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Speaker 1: going to read from Isaiah, but I have to say
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Speaker 1: this because Derek has such insight. In this particular verse,
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Speaker 1: we talked about it a minute ago, Isaiah 26, 14,
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Speaker 1: they are dead. They shall not live. They are deceased.
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Speaker 1: They shall not rise. Therefore hast thou visited and destroyed
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Speaker 1: them and made all their memory to perish. They are dead.
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Speaker 1: Who are they?
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Speaker 2: Well, this is another reference, another hidden reference to the
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Speaker 2: Rephaim in the Old Testament. The word translated deceased is
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Speaker 2: actually Rephaim. And The scholars, the great theologians of the
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Speaker 2: last 2,000 years, didn't have access to some of the
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Speaker 2: texts from the pagan neighbors of ancient Israel that had
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Speaker 2: been translated within the last 50 years or so. We
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Speaker 2: understand now that in context, Rephaim means more than just
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Speaker 2: run-of-the-mill dead. It means these divinized kings of old. The Canaanite,
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Speaker 2: the Amorite neighbors of ancient Israel, believed that their kings
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Speaker 2: upon death would join the assembly of the Rephaim or
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Speaker 2: something that in some of these texts only translated since
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Speaker 2: the 1980s, called the Council of the Tidonu, which is
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Speaker 2: the origin of the name Titans of the Greeks. They
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Speaker 2: believed that these spirits existed in the afterlife, their kings
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Speaker 2: would join this council. But what's interesting is when you
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Speaker 2: skip down in Isaiah 26 to verse 19, you get
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Speaker 2: a prophecy of their destruction. Your dead shall live, their
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Speaker 2: bodies shall rise. This is a prophecy of those who
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Speaker 2: are faithful to God the Father, our Creator. You who
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Speaker 2: dwell in dust, awake and sing for joy, for your
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Speaker 2: dew is a dew of light, and the earth will
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Speaker 2: give birth to the dead. The thing is, the Septuagint
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Speaker 2: translation renders this differently. The Jewish scholars who translated Hebrew
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Speaker 2: into Greek a couple hundred years before the birth of Jesus,
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Speaker 2: the Bible that would have been available to the Apostles,
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Speaker 2: actually translates that differently and renders that last sentence, the
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Speaker 2: earth will give birth to the dead. The verb give birth, nephal,
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Speaker 2: many scholars believe is the origin of the word nephilim,
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Speaker 2: which is possible, but everywhere else it's used in the
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Speaker 2: Old Testament, it means to fall or has fallen. The
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Speaker 2: Septuagint translator said the land of the impious will fall.
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Speaker 2: In other words, scholars who look at that say, you know,
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Speaker 2: the Jewish translators of the Septuagint understood that this verse,
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Speaker 2: this whole prophecy here, was a reference to the Rephaim,
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Speaker 2: the giants, and the progenitors, the titans, the watchers. If
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Speaker 2: it's a reference to Tartarus, the land of the ungodly
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Speaker 2: will fall.
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Speaker 1: Now I have a special connection with Isaiah 26, 14,
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Speaker 1: because years ago, and I won't say how many years ago,
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Speaker 1: but it's been decades ago, I read this and I
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Speaker 1: started looking that word up, Rephaim, and That took me
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Speaker 1: in a jillion other places, but the whole Old Testament
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Speaker 1: talks about the Raphaim, the offspring of the fallen ones,
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Speaker 1: the Nephilim. And they were giants. But here's the thing.
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Speaker 1: They are treated with absolute contempt by our Lord, that
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Speaker 1: is to say, and by his prophets. And there's a
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Speaker 1: deeper story. That is, once you begin to recognize that
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Speaker 1: the Bible talks about the Rephaim in a very special way,
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Speaker 1: suddenly you go another layer deeper and you have an
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Speaker 1: amazing story about the old heroes, the Titans, the Olympians,
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Speaker 1: the gods, the demigods, coming all the way, I think,
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Speaker 1: down into our day because there are literally thousands of
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Speaker 1: gods being worshipped all over the world today. And they
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Speaker 1: are a remnant of the fallen ones. Yes. Paul makes
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Speaker 1: it clear. The pagans were worshiping demons. And bringing us
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Speaker 1: right up to today, you go to the movies, you
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Speaker 1: buy your ticket, you go in there, and you can
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Speaker 1: actually sit down and be treated to two and a
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Speaker 1: half hours of superheroes who are nothing but cheap copies
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Speaker 1: of everything the Bible talks about. Mm-hmm. And that's really
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Speaker 1: what is exciting, I think, about your book, because anyone
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Speaker 1: who reads this book is suddenly going to have their
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Speaker 1: eyes open and say, wait a minute, this is real.
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Speaker 1: That's the thing that's really excited Sharon and me about
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Speaker 1: this research that we've been doing for the last four
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Speaker 1: years or so, is that it makes it very clear
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Speaker 1: that the Bible has got all of the elements of
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Speaker 1: these modern superhero stories. You've got wizards and sorcerers and
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Speaker 1: monsters and demons and heroes and self-sacrificial love. And then
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Speaker 1: when you realize that because this is actual history and
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Speaker 1: we are part of that history, we are part of
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Speaker 1: a story that is much bigger than we are. We
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Speaker 1: are part of the fellowship of the ring, if you will,
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Speaker 1: you know, Tolkien or Lewis or any of these great
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Speaker 1: stories of quests. I mean, you know, think medieval knights
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Speaker 1: with chivalry and honor and loyalty and love. And, you know,
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Speaker 1: it is the kind of story that would attract our
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Speaker 1: youth groups, our kids, our teens, if we told them
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Speaker 1: the story in these contexts, and God bless them, there
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Speaker 1: are young men and women out there who are beginning
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Speaker 1: to pick up on these stories and transfer this into
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Speaker 1: teaching materials for youth groups for this reason. Because when
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Speaker 1: kids understand that they are part of a story that's
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Speaker 1: just as exciting as what they're seeing on the screens,
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Speaker 1: except it's real. Exactly. Suddenly they get really excited about
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Speaker 1: the Bible. And I have to tell you, when I
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Speaker 1: read Veneration by Derek and Sharon Gilbert, I thought, mission field.
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Speaker 1: This is what hit me. Because I know of so
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Speaker 1: many families who have had so many teenagers get to
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Speaker 1: a certain age and say, Mom, Dad, I know you
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Speaker 1: raised me in the church. But you know what? I've
18:23
Speaker 1: outgrown that. I don't believe that anymore. So thank you
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Speaker 1: very much. I'm leaving. I'm going to go off to college.
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Speaker 1: And don't bother me with this Christianity garbage. It's just
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Speaker 1: no longer pertinent to my life. And that's it. I've
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Speaker 1: seen this happen hundreds of times, literally, as a pastor
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Speaker 1: over the years. And suddenly I read your book, and
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Speaker 1: if that group of people could be convinced, as you are.
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Speaker 2: One of the most exciting things we saw was standing
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Speaker 2: on Mount Nebo and looking down at the plains of Moab,
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Speaker 2: where Moses and the Israelites camped before crossing over and
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Speaker 2: attacking Jericho, which incidentally was named for the moon god
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Speaker 2: of the Amorites, Yarik. And we go into some depth
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Speaker 2: on the moon god in other books and why the
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Speaker 2: moon god was so important. But down there, while they
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Speaker 2: were on the plains of Moab, the Bible tells us
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Speaker 2: that they began to worship a deity called Baal Peor.
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Speaker 2: And we explain in veneration that when you do a
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Speaker 2: deep dive into the origin of that word, Baal just
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Speaker 2: means Lord. Peor comes from a root that means cleft
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Speaker 2: or gap or opening. But in the context, when you
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Speaker 2: piece together the puzzle, it probably means entrance or opening
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Speaker 2: to the underworld. Because that was when God was provoked
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Speaker 2: to send a plague among Israel for their worship of
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Speaker 2: this entity that killed 24,000 Israelites until Phineas, the grandson
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Speaker 2: of Aaron the priest, took a spear and stabbed a
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Speaker 2: young Israelite man and Midianite woman who were engaging in
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Speaker 2: some rite in the sight of Moses and all Israel,
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Speaker 2: which is shocking. This pagan act that was taking place
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Speaker 2: right there in front of the tent of meeting or
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Speaker 2: possibly even inside the tent of meeting. But that isn't
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Speaker 2: what The psalmist in Psalm 106 verses 28 and 29
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Speaker 2: said was what provoked God. They said it was because
20:14
Speaker 2: Israel began eating sacrifices offered to the dead. They were
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Speaker 2: lured into this worship of these ancient spirits that were
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Speaker 2: believed to be the ancestors or the mighty kings of old,
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Speaker 2: but were in fact the demons who proceeded from the
20:27
Speaker 2: Nephilim in the flood.
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Speaker 1: Now, are they coming back? Yes. Are they really, really
20:33
Speaker 1: coming back? I mean, there's a tendency. And by the way,
20:36
Speaker 1: for years, I must say, maybe even decades, I was
20:41
Speaker 1: one of those people who put the Titans and the
20:43
Speaker 1: Olympians in the mythological category. They were just nice stories
20:47
Speaker 1: written by the Greeks and the Romans and the Babylonians
20:49
Speaker 1: and the Assyrians. But they weren't about real people at all.
20:54
Speaker 1: Now we know they are about real people. And it
20:58
Speaker 1: makes everything different in our world when we realize that
21:02
Speaker 1: there literally is a battle of the gods going on.
21:07
Speaker 2: I mentioned those Rephaim texts from the ancient Amorite kingdom
21:10
Speaker 2: of Ugarit written about the time of the judges around
21:13
Speaker 2: 1200 BC. They make reference to several rituals in which
21:19
Speaker 2: these Rephaim spirits were summoned through a necromancy ritual to
21:22
Speaker 2: the threshing floor of El or the sanctuary of El. Well,
21:25
Speaker 2: that's a reference to Mount Hermon. The threshing floor. Apparently
21:29
Speaker 2: a portal, and Sharon wrote a wonderful chapter in there
21:31
Speaker 2: on the imagery, the symbolism of the threshing floor and
21:34
Speaker 2: the importance of threshing floors in the ancient world as portals.
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Speaker 2: In fact, the threshing floor of Orana on the summit
21:40
Speaker 2: of Mount Moriah is where the Temple of Solomon was built.
21:44
Speaker 2: It is the Temple Mount today where we believe the
21:48
Speaker 2: final battle, Armageddon, will be fought. Ezekiel says in Ezekiel
21:54
Speaker 2: 39 verse 11, He makes reference to the hordes of
21:58
Speaker 2: Magog being buried in a place called the Valley of
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Speaker 2: the Travelers, east of the sea. The word traveler in
22:04
Speaker 2: the Semitic is avarim. Well, God said to Moses, climb
22:09
Speaker 2: this mountain of the avarim to get your look at
22:11
Speaker 2: the promised land. Well, that's Mount Nebo. There's a place
22:15
Speaker 2: somewhere in the Exodus route, we believe right there on
22:17
Speaker 2: the plains of Moab, called Ayit HaAvarim, which means ruins
22:20
Speaker 2: of the travelers. And there's a site there. in plain
22:23
Speaker 2: sight of the plains of Moab, with 1500 dolmens at
22:26
Speaker 2: the base of a ruined city. These dolmens are megalithic
22:29
Speaker 2: funerary monuments, like miniature stone hinges, little trilithons of stone.
22:35
Speaker 2: The Israelites would have seen them there. But the key
22:38
Speaker 2: is in these Rephaim texts from Ugarit, in which they
22:41
Speaker 2: are summoned to the threshing floor of El, they mount
22:43
Speaker 2: their chariots, they travel first one day and then another,
22:46
Speaker 2: and arrive at dawn of the third day, where the
22:49
Speaker 2: word of El, the name of El, will revivify or
22:52
Speaker 2: resurrect The Rephaim. And they are specifically called travelers in
22:57
Speaker 2: those texts. And scholars agree that in Ezekiel 39, the
23:01
Speaker 2: reference to travelers is not talking about people on vacation
23:05
Speaker 2: on the king's highway east of the Dead Sea. It's
23:08
Speaker 2: talking about these entities. They travel. They cross over from
23:11
Speaker 2: the land of the dead to the land of the living.
23:13
Speaker 2: These warriors of Baal will be in the army at Armageddon.
23:17
Speaker 2: And there they will fall.
23:18
Speaker 1: And by the way, Derek, you're referring to Ezekiel 38,
23:22
Speaker 1: Battle of Gog. Everybody's got his private interpretation of the
23:25
Speaker 1: Battle of Gog. You need to read about this interpretation
23:29
Speaker 1: in Veneration. There are some very, very high spiritual battles
23:36
Speaker 1: being fought there, high-level spiritual battles. It sort of takes
23:40
Speaker 1: me forward to Revelation where Satan and his angels are
23:45
Speaker 1: gathered against Michael and his angels. You try to visualize
23:49
Speaker 1: what that is. And it's very difficult because we simply
23:53
Speaker 1: don't have the background, the history, the base to understand
23:58
Speaker 1: what it means when two groups of angels go to war.
24:03
Speaker 1: But I think you get a pretty good idea in
24:05
Speaker 1: this book because you go back and reference all of
24:07
Speaker 1: the ancient references to supernatural creatures, as we would call them.
24:15
Speaker 1: But they were real. And there really was a battle. Yes.
24:19
Speaker 1: The battle's not finished. That's correct.
24:22
Speaker 2: And that's the thing that we remember. We need to
24:23
Speaker 2: remember when we look at the War of Gog and
24:25
Speaker 2: Magog and we look at the uttermost north, that phrase
24:28
Speaker 2: translated in Ezekiel 38 and 39 is only used three
24:31
Speaker 2: places in the Bible. And the other two places refer
24:34
Speaker 2: to a mountain on the border between Syria and Turkey,
24:37
Speaker 2: right on the Mediterranean coast called Mount Tsefon. And that
24:41
Speaker 2: is a reference to the mountain that everyone in the
24:43
Speaker 2: ancient world knew was the mountain where Baal's palace was located.
24:47
Speaker 2: That is the rallying point for Gog of Magog. It's
24:49
Speaker 2: a supernatural north that we need to look to. Not,
24:53
Speaker 2: is it Turkey, is it Russia? Well, yes, there will
24:55
Speaker 2: be human actors involved, but we need to remember that
24:57
Speaker 2: Gog of Magog is the Antichrist figure. He is the
25:01
Speaker 2: chief of staff for Satan, and that supernatural army, or
25:04
Speaker 2: a demonically infused army that comes against Israel for Armageddon,
25:08
Speaker 2: that's their headquarters, is this mountain that everyone in the
25:11
Speaker 2: ancient world knew was the headquarters for, well, Satan.
25:14
Speaker 1: I wish we had three hours. We haven't even scratched
25:18
Speaker 1: the surface or begun to. The book is called Veneration
25:23
Speaker 1: by Sharon and Derek Gilbert. She got top billing, by
25:26
Speaker 1: the way. And by the way, she is a great researcher,
25:30
Speaker 1: I must say.
25:32
Speaker 3: Prophecy Watchers just celebrated 12 years of ministry, and we're
25:36
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26:01
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Speaker 3: Mondo Gonzalez, L.A. Marzulli, Tom Horn, Bill Salus, Jan Markell,
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Speaker 3: the Nephilim, artificial intelligence, Gog and Magog, Israel's future, and
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Speaker 1: We are going to spend another broadcast with Derek. We
27:49
Speaker 1: have not scratched the surface here, and we're going to
27:51
Speaker 1: go a little deeper next time. Derek, less than a minute,
27:56
Speaker 1: what would you have people to know about your book?
28:00
Speaker 2: That the spirit realm is real, and that God takes
28:03
Speaker 2: very seriously the protection of us from these entities who
28:08
Speaker 2: want to destroy us. When you look at this long
28:12
Speaker 2: war in context, God sent his only son, to shed
28:16
Speaker 2: his blood to die for us, where these false gods
28:20
Speaker 2: who rebelled against our creator want to shed our blood
28:25
Speaker 2: so that they can live forever. When you think about it,
28:28
Speaker 2: that Last Supper, where Jesus gave the bread and the
28:31
Speaker 2: wine to his disciples to show his sacrifice, it's complete
28:36
Speaker 2: reversal of that monthly ritual that the pagan neighbors of
28:39
Speaker 2: ancient Israel performed for their, well, what they thought were
28:42
Speaker 2: their ancestors, but were in fact the spirits of these demons.
28:46
Speaker 1: His love.
28:47
Speaker 3: Amen.
28:47
Speaker 1: Those other gods, well, not so much. Thanks, Derek. It's
28:51
Speaker 1: good to have you here. Thank you. I'm Gary Stearman.
28:54
Speaker 1: You keep watching. We are.
28:57
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