Latest / Best of Business / Liam Dann: NZ Herald business editor at large responds to 2024 Mood of the Boardroom survey

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Liam Dann: NZ Herald business editor at large responds to 2024 Mood of the Boardroom survey · Best of Business

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  Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from Newstalks EDB. Follow this
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  Speaker 2: Sixteen past six on News Talks EDB. Liam Dan, the
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  Speaker 2: New Zealand Herald Business editor at large, was keeping a
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  Speaker 2: close eye on the mood of the boardroom today.
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  Speaker 3: Get a Liam gooday, Jack has think yeah.
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  Speaker 2: Very well, thanks. So what did you make of the
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  Speaker 2: superannuation called.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah? Heartening? From my point of view as someone who
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  Speaker 3: sits there and worries about our ability to pay for things,
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  Speaker 3: I guess you know, when you looked at listen to
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  Speaker 3: what was said in that debate, it's hard to make
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  Speaker 3: a news story out of it, exactly because Barbara Edmonds
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  Speaker 3: was very careful about what you said. You just said,
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  Speaker 3: we're open to conversation, but you know you it felt
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  Speaker 3: like the body language and so forth that there could
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  Speaker 3: be some mood for change there, which of course would
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  Speaker 3: put national could put national neighbor on the same page,
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  Speaker 3: and bipartisan sort of stuff like that is pretty powerful
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  Speaker 3: that the roadblock to it actually at the moment in
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  Speaker 3: the current coalition is of course New Zealand first and
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  Speaker 3: Winston Peter, who has been resistant for a long time.
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  Speaker 3: But you know, I know he's got a large base
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  Speaker 3: of older voters, but it really doesn't affect them. If
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  Speaker 3: we're honest. It's you're talking about raising the superage over
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  Speaker 3: a long period. I think the original plan under Bill
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  Speaker 3: English twenty seventeen was to lift it for twenty forty. So,
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  Speaker 3: you know, I don't know what a new one would
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  Speaker 3: look like, but there was there was a large consensus
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  Speaker 3: I guess seventy seven percent plus of those business leaders
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  Speaker 3: who see that we need to have a debate about
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  Speaker 3: the tax base because we're not going to be taking
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  Speaker 3: enough tax because it's just demographics. We're going to have
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  Speaker 3: fewer younger people, more older people. That means more people
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  Speaker 3: I guess to support, and fewer people actually generating income tax.
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  Speaker 3: And at the moment, of course, our tax system is
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  Speaker 3: built on income tax, not on other kinds of tax.
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  Speaker 3: Do I go near that debate? Yeah?
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  Speaker 2: No, avoid it, trust me. Hey, I mean that's a
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  Speaker 2: that's you know, that's what I find really interesting about this, right, So,
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  Speaker 2: not only because of the demographic changes, are we going
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  Speaker 2: to face the pressures of supporting people through the superannuation
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  Speaker 2: payments themselves? Like the four ninely payments. But the problem
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  Speaker 2: is when you have an older population, your healthcare costs
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  Speaker 2: massively increase as well, because like you know, so generally
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  Speaker 2: the average twenty five year old doesn't cost nearly as
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  Speaker 2: much to the health system as someone who's seventy five,
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  Speaker 2: right or eighty five. That generally, the older you are,
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  Speaker 2: the more you cost. So you have all of these
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  Speaker 2: pressures that come with those demographic changes, not just represented
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  Speaker 2: in super but when you combine them together, I mean,
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  Speaker 2: and given we're already in a structural deficit, it's very
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  Speaker 2: hard to see how we're going to we'd like it,
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  Speaker 2: and we'd.
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  Speaker 3: All like to keep that first world health system, yeah,
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  Speaker 3: into our into our later years, I think, you know.
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  Speaker 3: And does leave you with options that are either tax more,
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  Speaker 3: spend less or the one that all the politicians always
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  Speaker 3: fall back on is that we're going to deliver policies
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  Speaker 3: which dry productivity and Zealand is going to be. But
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  Speaker 3: you know, the issue is do we really have the
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  Speaker 3: right economy to do that, even if even if things
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  Speaker 3: are you know, are starting to improve, or there's signs
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  Speaker 3: of hope another cyclical upturn as you know, rising house
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  Speaker 3: prices and the immigration going to be enough this time,
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  Speaker 3: we'll only the answer is probably not. We're not gonna
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  Speaker 3: have another another China boom the way we did have,
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  Speaker 3: So we're looking looking for something else a bit deeper
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  Speaker 3: and a bit more structural. I think it was happening today.
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  Speaker 3: I think, you know, it was a pretty high level
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  Speaker 3: kind of debate between Barbara Nicola and people are pretty
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  Speaker 3: impressed with the ability of them to communicate and that
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  Speaker 3: sort of thing, and so I know there is a
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  Speaker 3: lot of them desire, whether it's infrastructure or whatever, for
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  Speaker 3: a bit more bipartisan thinking so that we can stop
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  Speaker 3: flip flopping in these political political cycles.
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  Speaker 2: And liam a bit more of a nuanced debate about
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  Speaker 2: a cd TEA.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I mean I just think you know, certainly
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  Speaker 3: a large percentage of the people in that room, which
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  Speaker 3: you wouldn't necessarily expect it tends to come from the left,
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  Speaker 3: the CGT, and that that's kind of a hindrance in
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  Speaker 3: a way because people are never quite sure whether it's
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  Speaker 3: tied up with wealth tax and all the rest of it.
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  Speaker 3: But the people for the people in that room who
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  Speaker 3: like it. I was talking to tax you know, accountants,
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  Speaker 3: high level accountants and tax experts and things. It's really
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  Speaker 3: about broadening that tax spaces, as I mentioned, you know,
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  Speaker 3: so it's about you know, maybe we've got to get
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  Speaker 3: away from calling it a capital gains tax or whatever,
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  Speaker 3: but you know, it's some some level we need to
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  Speaker 3: broaden it and people need to remember. And this was
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  Speaker 3: not something that the Prome Minister to make clear when
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  Speaker 3: he was responding to Antonio Watson today and zet the
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  Speaker 3: original Colen plan was tax revenue neutral, so it's not
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  Speaker 3: taking not meant to be taking more tax, first instance,
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  Speaker 3: off New Zealanders, so you should actually be getting an
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  Speaker 3: income tax break if they're taking some tax off off
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  Speaker 3: the other end, at the at the wealthier end or
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  Speaker 3: at the possibly the older end. It does it does
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  Speaker 3: shift the demographic of the tax base, but that's really
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  Speaker 3: what's going to have to move.
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  Speaker 2: It's a version of the of the John Key tax switch.
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  Speaker 3: Well, that's right, and I talked to Bill English And
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  Speaker 3: last week or so that's up online right now, and
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  Speaker 3: he talks about that being one of the things you're
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  Speaker 3: most proud of achieving because it's a very difficult thing
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  Speaker 3: to do. It's a difficult argument to win, right, So.
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  Speaker 2: Revenue neutral from the top of my head.
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  Speaker 3: It wasn't. I can't remember. But one of the things
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  Speaker 3: Bill English said is he was lucky to have a
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  Speaker 3: prime Minister like John Key who could sell that argument,
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  Speaker 3: so they managed to get an unpopular policy through. I
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  Speaker 3: wonder whether as good as Barbara Edmonds is likely to
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  Speaker 3: be it actually building or writing a tax policy, because
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  Speaker 3: he is a tax expert, where the labor has the
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  Speaker 3: leadership there to actually sell it at the moment, I
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  Speaker 3: don't think so.
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  Speaker 2: Hey, thanks Liam, I appreciate it. That's New Zealand Herald
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  Speaker 2: Business editor at large, Liam Dan. You can hear that
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  Speaker 2: interview with the Bill English by subscribing to Money Talks,
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  Speaker 2: which is Liam's superb podcast. You can hear it on
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  Speaker 2: my Heart Radio as well twenty two past six.
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