Latest / Graeme Souness Tackles / Niall Quinn: Arsenal, a Run-In with Vinnie Jones & the Old Firm Derby | Graeme Souness Tackles Ep 5

Transcript

Niall Quinn: Arsenal, a Run-In with Vinnie Jones & the Old Firm Derby | Graeme Souness Tackles Ep 5 · Graeme Souness Tackles

0:00
Hi there, welcome to Graham Soonest tackles this week.
0:03
I've got Scott Minto as always, and I've got Niall Quinn, the
0:06
legend that is Niall. If you're watching on YouTube,
0:10
please hit like and subscribe. They're just a bunch of
0:13
lightweight. It's just a flow character,
0:15
small characters. Two weeks later we're playing
0:17
Wimbledon good. 45 minutes before the kick off, the doors
0:20
burst open and it's Vinny Jones Way Ladens.
0:24
Chelsea should not be a project. Chelsea's project should be the
0:27
next season. It should be where the players
0:29
go there to actually win the major trophies.
0:32
Could you win there for your stop?
0:34
We were beaten in the Senate. I'm not interested in getting a
0:37
game. I was a simple yes or no.
0:45
Graham, you know we're not here altogether.
0:48
We're in different places. Tell us where you are.
0:50
But obviously you come off the back of the the Three Peak
0:53
challenge as well. Just how tough was that?
0:55
For the people who don't know what it's about and why you do
0:59
it, just explain. Well, I, I am president of a
1:01
charity called Deborah. We look after young people who
1:04
have a skin condition which is truly horrendous.
1:07
It's the worst disease that people have never heard of.
1:10
It's the best of your life is the day you're you're born.
1:13
It's downhill from then. Every waking moment it's filled
1:16
with ridiculous pain and itch. It's life limiting.
1:21
And the impact obviously not just on the the individual
1:25
that's got this horrendous condition, but all their
1:27
families. It's, it's, it's such a sad
1:29
thing to to see. I've witnessed these, some of
1:32
these kids getting their dressings changed and it's
1:34
horrendous. They have to have drugs like
1:36
fentanyl, ketamine, morphine just to get through that.
1:40
That stand has changed. I can't talk about it.
1:44
They're getting sad because I've got pictures in my head I can't
1:46
and see and I've got noises in my head.
1:51
I can't forget for my knees because their dressings changed
1:53
so made them passive. I think because we started with
1:57
Snowden, which is easiest one. They went to Scafell Pike and
2:00
then up to Bend Nervous, which was easily the toughest one.
2:03
But it's done and it will not be getting repeated by Yeah,
2:07
definitely not. We did it and and we've raised a
2:10
lot of money and unfortunately we can never, we've got no
2:13
support from government. The big pharma companies won't
2:16
touch us. There's about 5000 sufferers in
2:19
this country. So there's no money for big
2:21
pharmaceutical companies. So we are, we're, we're fighting
2:25
alone. And right now, you know, we're
2:28
retrialing drugs which allow drugs that are already on the
2:30
market to be used and helping our, our poor kids.
2:36
You know, if you, if you discovered a drug today, it's
2:39
the best part of 15 to 20 years to get it to market that can
2:43
cost hundreds of millions of pounds.
2:45
So the drugs that are already on the market for skin conditions,
2:48
we're taking them and trying them on our kids to see what
2:52
results we, we can get and see if we can help.
2:54
But even that a child like that costs half £1,000,000, we're
2:57
travelling 3. Hopefully this money we get from
2:59
this this, this challenge, we'll get half £1,000,000 to allow
3:04
another child, but there's another 16 jobs that our our
3:08
scientists and researchers want to try.
3:10
It's just, it's just the saddest thing.
3:13
Well done for doing what you're doing and, and just it's Deborah
3:16
and if anybody wants to donate, they can just go on the on the
3:19
Deborah website. Yeah, if you go to the Deborah
3:22
Deborah website, just follow the Just Giving page and you can,
3:26
you can make a donation if you can, any, any, any, a pound, £2,
3:30
three or five, anything will help us.
3:32
It goes to it goes to a great, great cause.
3:34
Gaffer what? What sort of memories do you
3:36
have of of Niall? Well, I can't remember.
3:40
We never played against each other now did we?
3:42
Well, I tell you, would you believe I played against you for
3:45
Arsenal against Rangers in what was meant to be a friendly a
3:49
British Cup final because there was no teams in Europe at that
3:53
time in the late 80s and you and Terry Hurlock kicked us off the
3:58
pitch up at up at Ibrox. No, Is that right?
4:05
I was the elegant one in midfield.
4:07
Terry was the one doing all that sort of stuff.
4:10
Well, it's, it's a goal that doesn't appear anywhere on the
4:12
records, but I actually scored the winner that night at Ibrox,
4:15
which was a kind of a good thing to do for a young lad from
4:17
Dublin, but nobody ever found out about it.
4:19
It didn't get the recognition and I also, I think I Graham
4:23
Roberts kicking me around the place as well for most of the
4:26
night but it never took off. It was meant to happen year
4:29
after year that the winners of both championships would play
4:31
but because of crowd trouble I think something like that is it
4:35
evaporated into a sort of a lost cause bin.
4:39
I did play against you. I saw you in full throttle.
4:43
So you give everything you could to the referees verbally,
4:46
everything you could to us. You brought yourself on this.
4:49
So when you kicked us around the place, but it was a, it was a
4:52
pleasure. No, I don't remember myself like
4:54
that. I thought it was a more of a,
4:56
you know, gentleman type player. Anyway, that's.
4:59
Maybe you were. That that would have been the
5:01
timing, that would just be the emergence of the Arsenal team.
5:04
Yeah, George had brought us together and some of us had got
5:07
our debuts a little bit earlier on.
5:09
There's on how and George then added a little bit more to it.
5:12
But we we'd have, when you think back to it, like I played youth
5:15
team matches with Mickey Thomas, who went on to have an amazing
5:19
career, Tony Adams, Martin Keown, Dave Rowcastle and others
5:23
like Martin Hazen goes Caesar, who played lots and lots of
5:26
first team football. And then there was Paul, myself,
5:28
Perry Groves came into the club at a young age and we were all
5:32
sort of elevated very quickly. And George bought into that.
5:37
Luckily for us, he didn't get the job and decide to sign
5:41
player after player. He, he gave the youth a chance
5:44
and so we, we excelled and we got on and eventually, you know,
5:49
two or three years later, it all came good and field when on a
5:53
Friday night when nobody gave us a prayer, we, we took the lead
5:57
back down to to London, but. When you won the league at
6:01
Anfield, do you remember much about that?
6:03
Yeah, I do so. So on the way up to the game,
6:07
it's quite incredible when you think about it.
6:08
Today we trained in London Colony for a little bit.
6:12
The morning of the game. We have to win by two clear
6:15
goals. And George just had this plan to
6:17
get in and get out, not to stay up there, get hassled for a
6:20
night or so. And we got up there 3/4 o'clock,
6:24
something like that, and had a little bit of a sleep for a
6:27
while. And then I can remember, you
6:29
know, George Houston, who was quite close to George.
6:32
He was his number three, I would say at the time.
6:36
And Stewart said get yourself right.
6:37
He's put you on the bench, you know, because there's only two
6:40
Subs then and it was a big thing he said you know we may need you
6:43
later on in the game, you know, it's like so.
6:45
So I went to bed thinking that and then I was in the dressing
6:48
room and the team got named and I wasn't in the 2 Subs.
6:51
So I was a little bit upset in one way but then you have to
6:54
kind of put that to one side and wish the lads well.
6:57
There was no room in the dugout forest, there was no spare seats
7:00
for us except behind the goal in the Arsenal fans.
7:02
So Paul Davis, Alan Miller, who suddenly left us now and myself,
7:09
I can remember standing the goalkeeper, yeah, I can remember
7:12
all of us standing watching the game and things starting to
7:17
happen for us and the belief that was maybe coming in.
7:20
There was Arsenal fans around us.
7:21
We were literally chucked into the into the far end where the
7:25
away supporters are. Raymond.
7:27
And then there was no cease. Then it was terrorists, I think
7:30
actually at that point. But as the, as the sort of game
7:35
was coming to its climax and we'd got the first goal and we
7:38
were looking for the 2nd and it was literally the clock was
7:40
counting down. You know, the the local lease
7:44
came along and lifted us out in case anything happened after the
7:47
game. And I can remember we were
7:48
walking around being escorted towards the dugout area when
7:54
Michael Thomas scored a great goal, wonderful layoff from Alan
7:57
Smith. The whole place erupted and it
8:00
went very sad. Obviously for Liverpool fans
8:03
coming off the back literally 5-6 weeks earlier, Hillsborough.
8:07
It was an incredibly emotional thing brain and as much as we
8:11
wanted to jump and celebrate and run around the place, we also, I
8:15
think there was AI don't know, there was something, there was a
8:19
bond or something between both clubs that that saw that as much
8:22
as excited as we are, there was respect for what had happened
8:25
near that time and we ended up having a bit of fun in the
8:30
dressing room. But essentially we were on a bus
8:33
back to London and got back in the early hours in the morning.
8:36
Nobody knew where to go. I knew a fellow who had a club
8:39
on the way home who'd keep it all open for us.
8:41
Shock. Shock, shock, shock.
8:43
It was called the Winners Club, would you believe that?
8:46
In Southgate in north London. And we made our way to that.
8:49
No mobile phones then of course and somehow word got out and we
8:54
came out of this place at all hours in the morning and it was
8:56
just thousands of people had gathered to say well done so.
9:01
So I remember a very point at night, I remember this being a
9:03
brilliant night to win the league even though I didn't
9:05
start or play. But I also I remember the
9:10
atmosphere, I remember the pain that was still in the air.
9:13
Very much so. Can I take you back when I was a
9:16
player there and I've always felt Arsenal were the classiest
9:18
out there and let me tell you why for one reason, apart from
9:21
when you went to that the old stadium with the under floor
9:24
heating, which is always used to bang up high in the summer
9:26
months for the way team in the way dressing room.
9:29
But I am I can remember coming out.
9:31
We had played you played Arsenal Anfield and our car is just to
9:35
be parked in the car parked outside the main stand and you
9:39
team busted reversed up to pick you guys up and I'm I get into
9:43
my car and I'm looking at the Arsenal Boston.
9:45
It was a we drove around on a bus that must have been 20 years
9:48
old. We were European champions, but
9:50
I think it was all about making sure our feet were on the
9:52
ground. And I'm looking at this bus that
9:54
the Arsenal lads were on and the white tablecloths on the on the
9:58
tables that a guy dressed as a chef must have a microwave on
10:01
there. We, he used to get running
10:03
around, used to come round before the game.
10:05
We played away from home saying, right, what do you want?
10:08
Pine chips, fishing, fish and chips, chicken and chips.
10:11
And we had two cases of beer underneath the bus which would
10:14
be brought on to the bus for our trip home.
10:16
Fish and chips and beer. How it's changed?
10:19
Yeah, well. How much chance?
10:22
Yeah, so I had that from day one in the 80s.
10:26
So I would have got in the the way on the away bus for the
10:28
first time in 85. And that's exactly what it was
10:31
like. I couldn't believe myself.
10:32
Wow. We have a we have a waiter here
10:34
and we have a cook out the back cooking and the waiter
10:37
delivering and bringing it all down.
10:39
It was quite incredible. I joined Man City five years
10:43
later and it was back to fish and chips with Howard Campbell
10:46
and and plenty of beers I can. More, more than two cases of
10:50
beer. More than two cases.
10:52
Niall, what do you what do you think of the the current Arsenal
10:55
team then? So I was, I was delighted for
10:59
them that they got over the line and it, it felt like it's, it's
11:03
a crossroads moment again for them now.
11:05
So are they going to kick on and be this this this great team
11:07
that can create history and and win this thing every year?
11:13
I was quite delighted to be asked to attend a preseason game
11:17
that they played against rail Bettis here in Dublin.
11:20
They struggled badly. They played really poor on the
11:23
night. They paraded the trophy to all
11:25
of the crowd sell out here in Dublin to all the arsenal fans.
11:28
And I came away a little bit worried about this season.
11:30
But then they got such a good start.
11:33
I was happy. But then the exact same feeling
11:35
came at the weekend. You know, they they really
11:37
didn't show up at all like they happened against Betty's and I
11:40
don't know. I mean, I know there's a a lot
11:43
of football is a break now, of course for international
11:45
football, but I don't know, it's early days for this for this
11:51
year. I like their strength.
11:53
Of course, they're very strong team and I think the, you know,
11:55
the signings they've made will complement.
11:57
I believe that. But I like what I see at City a
12:02
little bit more. I think everybody, everybody
12:05
said Man City, we're going to go through, you know, a period of
12:10
getting to know each other. The club will take a while and
12:12
they're going, no, we're straight out of the traps and
12:14
we're playing as good a football as ever.
12:16
And I know defensively they let in some goals yesterday against
12:19
my old team Sunderland. But I just I just feel there's
12:24
there's a little bit of reputation estate for these City
12:28
players that they want to get their trophy back.
12:29
And I don't think City will have it as easy as they did last
12:32
year. Sorry, Arsenal will have it as
12:33
easy as they did last year. Arsenal have to accept, and it's
12:37
something I experienced as a player, that you know there's a
12:41
target on their backs now every it's a cup final for everyone
12:44
who plays against Arsenal. They have to accept that they
12:47
want to beat them more than anything else, any other team
12:50
possibly, and then you have to deal with that.
12:53
Is that worrying the way that that Brighton did it, or was it
12:57
just a blip has Is there a blueprint being shown or was
13:01
this just the one? I I watched Chelsea play
13:04
Brighton. Somehow Chelsea beat them.
13:06
I think Brighton went to Stamford Bridge under about
13:08
6570% possession. They were fabulous and they just
13:14
couldn't put the ball away as much as Chelsea did that night.
13:17
But Chelsea did look vulnerable and I think we'll touch on that
13:19
later. Brighton are a good footballing
13:21
team. They'll give anyone a game.
13:23
And I just think maybe the intensity and you're not talking
13:26
about dropping off 2 yards a yard.
13:29
It can be 1/2 a yard, it can be a foot.
13:31
You know, if you're not on it, it can make all the difference
13:35
and you're not closing the ball down, you're not getting blocks
13:37
and you're not thinking that that bit quicker.
13:40
Arsenal are a really good team and I think I couldn't call it
13:43
right now, but I think it'll be between.
13:45
I hope I'm wrong, hope Liverpool get into the argument, but right
13:48
now I can't see that. But if you asked me right now, I
13:50
think it's been Arsenal in City. But I still think that striker
13:53
shot Niall. What do you think?
13:55
Yeah, it's been the, the big question over the last number of
13:58
years, you know, have they got the the lights of a Holland who
14:01
can go and almost, you know, guarantee you 2025 goals?
14:06
That's that's a problem. But having said that, when you
14:09
win something like that, it really does open it up for you
14:12
to kick on as a as a club and as a team.
14:14
And it should be easier, I think for for Arsenal from players
14:19
than it has been over the last couple of years.
14:21
I think there's, there's a quality and a depth to the side
14:25
now There's there's there's the badge of winning a trophy.
14:29
You're part of the group that have won the big one and you're
14:31
going again. There's nothing to be worried
14:33
about. You let yourself go and if
14:34
you're a top player and you were a top striker, it's going to
14:37
happen for you. You just got to believe it.
14:38
You got to, you got to you got to believe that you're playing
14:41
for the best team. City will question that of
14:43
course, but I suppose the, the, the, the reliance on set pieces,
14:50
you know, has been, has been quite big at Arsenal over the
14:53
years and getting getting stronger, matching it all
14:57
together and playing the right brand of football to to, you
15:01
know, play the type like young down with for instance, coming
15:04
into a side and playing the type of football he plays amongst
15:08
what are really his peers, much older players who've done their
15:10
thing. Something must be really good at
15:13
that club. And I just, I just think, you
15:16
know, we sometimes over emphasise Holland and what he
15:20
does at City, you know, it's very hard to get that and
15:23
replicate it elsewhere. And I think the Arsenal
15:26
strikers, even over the last 3-4 years, there's always been a
15:31
question mark, a doubt. Now that they've got where they
15:34
are, I think it's time to, to remove that and go and say, OK,
15:36
can you know, can one of us get 2025 league goals?
15:40
Can we get 40 between us? You know, I don't know, I don't
15:43
know. But but I just, I, I do think, I
15:45
do think it's the one area where Arsenal have yet to show
15:49
themselves to be the best at. Yeah, I think, I think doesn't
15:53
matter what we say, but I think the fact that Arteta went so big
15:56
and we're so keen on the boy Athletico Madrid who ultimately
15:59
wanted to join Barcelona. So it didn't happen.
16:02
Was it Alvarez? Alvarez, I mean, he the fact
16:05
that he's maybe you're bidding maybe circle £100 million for a
16:08
player tells you how much he thinks he needs that that
16:12
position strengthening. I don't see how it's getting the
16:14
kind of goals that'll make life easy for you over a long hard
16:17
season. The boy go cares the same.
16:20
You can be a good team with an outstanding striker.
16:23
You can win the league. You know, I I you can be a very
16:27
good team, but not an outstanding striker and you
16:30
won't win the league. And I think Arsenal are very
16:32
good all over the park, but I still think they need that that
16:36
guy can get them. As you you touched on earlier,
16:39
twenty goals a season. I don't see them 20 plus goals a
16:42
season, winning games when you're not quite at it, dragging
16:46
you through a game just by a piece of you know, someone said
16:49
not a goal or nothing. I think they're still missing
16:52
that. So Niall after after Arsenal
16:55
losing, then how important was it that that City won?
16:58
Because obviously they're in transition with the new manager,
17:00
one of the greatest ever has left their their club.
17:03
Enzo Mareska feels like he's got a point to prove as well.
17:06
How important, after that unexpected blit from Arsenal,
17:09
that City went on and won. Well, you actually only in sort
17:13
of a week, 10 days ago, whatever it was, you know, like I think
17:17
he was in a bit of trouble, a bit of trouble.
17:19
You know, Man United managed to get him down to get his team
17:21
down to 10 men. It's the big Derby.
17:24
It looks like this is a real struggle and they turned it
17:26
around and they win the game. It was huge, somewhat sold to
17:29
the point that they ticked on from there.
17:31
They defensively, they weren't great yesterday, but they're
17:34
they're sitting proudly at the top.
17:35
They have, I suppose there's a belief already developing.
17:41
I was just mentioning it earlier.
17:42
I love the idea that the players are coming out and saying we're
17:44
not in transition, We know how good we are, You know, we're not
17:48
looking for excuses. And I think that all goes really
17:50
well and I think the manager deserves great praise to have
17:52
this group of players thinking that already because we always
17:56
fall back to old people, need time.
17:58
Let's not judge them too, too early then.
18:00
Of course we do. We always will anyway.
18:03
But he seems to have taken on the mantle filling, you know,
18:08
huge, huge, huge shoes. We all pointed places like
18:12
Manchester United went, Fergie left and what have you.
18:15
You know, that how, how, how difficult a role that can be at
18:18
any club after Wenger left as well, You know, it was so
18:23
difficult at Arsenal. But it's almost to me, it looks
18:27
as if it's a business as usual City.
18:29
Side City City have had the best group of players in European
18:32
football for a long time. I if you look at Pep's career
18:37
when Pep was at Barcelona, the best group of players
18:39
domestically and in Europe. When he went to Bayern Munich,
18:42
he certainly had the best players domestically and be an
18:46
argument for in Europe as well. And when he went to Man City he
18:49
had the exact same. So anyone taking over from him,
18:52
it wasn't going to be a major, you know, it was going to be
18:54
wholesale changes, just more of the same.
18:57
And I looked at him last week, I thought they were fabulous.
18:59
Last week when it went to 10 men, I think it dominated the
19:02
ball with 10 men. Yeah, well, what they can play a
19:07
different brand of football. I think someone and perhaps
19:09
obviously knows how to manage footballers, but I believe that
19:12
that someone at City playing a different style of football with
19:16
those players would have been equally successful.
19:20
My my think in the game, and I've experienced it.
19:23
It's about players, about having top, top players and getting
19:26
them, you know, to the point where they all want to be
19:29
fighting for the place every week.
19:30
And that's where his management skills were 2nd to none.
19:33
Like Fergie was getting the best out of group of players, but the
19:36
priority is get the best players in and I think City has that for
19:40
a decade now. I'm also very mindful in what
19:43
you say they're going to think about.
19:44
A bit of advice I got when I went back to Sunderland in
19:48
administrative role many years later and I went to see Bobby
19:52
Saxon, an old coach, old style coach, great friend of mine,
19:56
great coach to me. And I said, Bobby, give me one
20:01
thing that will help me. And he said I'll give you 3
20:03
things, recruitment, recruitment and recruitment.
20:15
It's great to score 5, you can't be conceding 3 so every week and
20:19
they do look vulnerably vulnerable defensively.
20:23
Where are they before? Though they didn't the week
20:26
before, when they go down to 10 men and they just have to be
20:29
right. We can't be so adventure.
20:31
They it's admirable. They want to be in the front
20:33
foot all the time because it's got the players to do that.
20:37
But OK, we've gone to 10 men. I thought they're unbelievably
20:40
good last week against United with 10 men, although that goal
20:43
should never have stood. Yeah, and getting it right all
20:46
the time. They didn't have TSA because
20:48
they were, they were so bad. Taking going forward, getting it
20:50
right all the time is fine. Look at Liverpool, they're just
20:53
started to get a few clean sheets.
20:55
It's starting to look a little bit better.
20:56
Obviously our front players have to have a lot more to do.
20:59
Very expensive frontline that they have.
21:02
I just guess that getting it all to fit and do do the right age.
21:07
I really, I scratched my head. You mentioned Chelsea's got I
21:10
scratched my head trying to work out why they're playing the way
21:13
they are. Is it a lack of confidence is
21:16
there, you know too many chiefs and not enough Indians?
21:20
I don't know. I really don't.
21:23
It's it's a mystery to me. You know more about that club.
21:25
But I look at them on paper like friends.
21:27
You said Man City have the best players.
21:29
Chelsea are we, are we blaming their recruitment?
21:32
You know what is it that that has them on the back foot?
21:36
This is how I see it. The business model that Boy
21:40
Andy's colleagues had was doomed.
21:43
You go out and buy the very best young players, you spend too
21:48
much money on them, you give them eight-year contracts.
21:50
So immediately you put them into their armchair.
21:52
They who do they look up to? The Chelsea young players, who's
21:56
who in the dress room as a young player saying in 7-8 years time
22:00
I want to be like him. They're all kids.
22:03
None of them have got a clue about how you act and how you
22:06
behave as a top, top player. And I would, I would suggest
22:09
that you look at Chelsea's stats.
22:11
Chelsea I've considered the most goals in the Premier League.
22:15
There was a start on Sky yesterday about Chelsea.
22:17
I've had their 20th out of 20. Football clubs have had more
22:21
shots on their goal than anyone else.
22:23
Now that's not your back four, that's the midfield and those in
22:26
front not doing their job properly, not making life
22:29
difficult for the opposition when they have the ball.
22:31
They're getting up the park too easily against them and they're
22:34
getting shots off against them too easily and that comes down
22:37
to your midfield. I played in a team my we had
22:41
fabulous players, great players, world class players.
22:43
My priority when I went out wasn't to come up with a cute
22:47
pass, wasn't to score a goal. It was to protect the guys
22:50
behind me. And I think Chelsea fall into
22:52
that category. I think Liverpool fell into that
22:54
category last year, were a bit gung ho.
22:57
I think we're talking about Man City fill in.
23:00
They don't fall into it, but they know they're going to
23:02
outscore, they're going to outgun anyone to play against.
23:04
But you know, Man City can be the other team, as he showed at
23:07
Old Trafford last week. I think Tottenham fall into that
23:10
category and it's all about doing the hard yards and making
23:14
life difficult for opposition so they can't get your back four
23:17
and get shots off against your goalkeeper.
23:19
Chelsea are poor at that and the stats tell you that.
23:21
Yeah, look, I think with Moises quite say though being out and
23:25
Malagusta sometimes played there, he's a right back.
23:27
Rhys James, I think he's a good enough midfielder but but Lavia
23:30
is not 100% fit all the time. They've lost Enzo Fernandez,
23:34
Andre Santos as well. Look, the bigger picture for me
23:37
in terms of Chelsea is it's not often you have a go at owners
23:41
for spending too much and they have spent a lot.
23:43
It's about how they spent it. And again, what Nile was saying
23:46
about recruitment, recruitment, recruitment get the youngsters.
23:49
We know the policy nowadays on many clubs up and down the
23:52
country and around Europe, try and buy young, try and improve
23:56
them, get a better players. But Chelsea should not be a
23:59
journey, it should be the destination.
24:02
It should be where the players go there to actually win the
24:05
major trophies. And I've been harping on for
24:07
three years, which it looks like now they're changing.
24:10
They have a manager, not a head coach.
24:12
They've got senior proper senior pros in there.
24:15
Maybe they're a little bit old, but they're senior pros on a
24:18
daily basis, will set the standard, set the culture and
24:22
then it's going to take time and we don't give people time.
24:25
Now alluded that a little bit earlier.
24:29
Javi Alonso obviously will will be given time and he should be
24:31
given time. But from the outside pressure
24:34
and the noise, that was a terrible result.
24:37
You've not used that word to all use the project.
24:40
Chelsea should not be a project. Chelsea's project should be the
24:44
next season. Absolutely.
24:45
Not any further than that. Seems it should be for Arsenal,
24:48
Liverpool, Man United, Man City. You know, with the buying power
24:53
they have, it's all about the supporters.
24:55
Don't Spurs even spending £400 million.
24:58
Who wants to go there first? Niall, you'll you'll enjoy that
25:01
Guna well. I can remember playing my first
25:04
ever youth team game against Spurs and Pat Rice had come back
25:09
at that time and he went. The big thing you need to know
25:11
about that is this club is soft. These players are soft.
25:15
I was in an under 18 team. If you like playing in a youth
25:20
competition, to be told about this now that wasn't him just
25:23
and it all through my career I witnessed good Spurs team
25:27
lacking that centre, that hardcore centre that was needed.
25:32
It got there a little bit. It might have been tough enough
25:34
at the back. I can remember playing against
25:36
Maxie Miller and Graham Roberts and finding life difficult all
25:39
right. But they had nice players like
25:41
Hubble and our delays and Mickey Hazard who could do nice things.
25:45
But generally they were overran by strength and and formula
25:49
versus, you know, sort of I, I guess just scale so.
25:53
Pat, Pat Rice said to you as an 18 year old, you're playing
25:56
against a football club. It's soft.
25:59
That's fascinating. Good players, some very good
26:02
players you'd like to Clive Allen scoring huge goals at that
26:05
time at one end of the pitch. You don't got over 41 year.
26:09
As I said, you know, I mentioned the the ideas of this world, but
26:11
Glenn Huddle, what a player didn't tackle like you, Graham.
26:17
Not well. Tell me, how did you get on in
26:19
that youth game? Did you win?
26:21
We did. Of course we did.
26:23
Now can I tell myself I won there for youth?
26:24
Did you win there for Youth Cup? We were beaten in the semi.
26:28
I'm not interested in getting. I was a simple yes or.
26:31
No, I, I got to the final now the final.
26:34
Go away boys. Now my story is we got to the
26:37
final, we played Coventry in the final.
26:40
This is middle. No, this is at Spurs.
26:43
Oh, you've got the Spurs first, yes, Yeah.
26:45
Yeah, we got to the final and we won one nil quite hotly and I
26:49
scored a goal. We lost one nil.
26:51
It was Coventry were playing up at Highfield Rd.
26:55
We lost one nil, I got booked unbelievably and then the second
26:58
game, the third game, sorry the tossed up where that should be
27:03
and it was at Highfield Road 2, two and I got sent off.
27:07
And then the 4th game back at White Hart Lane, we won one nil.
27:10
I scored the goal, I was allowed to play, I score the goal, we
27:13
won at one nil and I, I never got a medal for it, but I got my
27:17
£6 win bonus. So if you'd asked me at the
27:20
time, what do you want, medal bonus, I would have got for
27:23
bonus since there was a lot of money then.
27:25
But I find that fascinating, that Pat.
27:28
Pat was a real football man as well.
27:30
Yeah, but he all those years ago could say that.
27:33
Yeah, well, I suppose that that was coming down from the the
27:37
type of football team we're trying to play.
27:39
But yeah, it has the Spurs club at that time, we're trying to
27:42
bring a breed of football in. They were, they just, you know,
27:46
before I started playing against them, they had won a European
27:48
Cup, sorry, UEFA Cup Winners Cup medal.
27:51
They had they had done their thing.
27:52
They they had they had a decent setup, but they were, they were
27:57
what I'd call it top 16, you know, at that time.
28:00
And they never really went further than that.
28:03
A lot of managers, a lot of a lot of effort went in.
28:05
And it always boils down, I think to a sort of a lack of
28:11
winning the battle first to help you in the war.
28:14
I think they like to try and be as creative as possible as a
28:18
football club. I see.
28:19
Like last year I got very frustrated watching them when
28:21
they were in danger of being relegated.
28:23
A couple of minutes to go on matches and the goalkeeper still
28:25
knocking the ball out to his own corner flag and it's going to
28:27
cross back to the Unicorn flag and you're 2 minutes to get a
28:30
goal to stay. You know, I find I find it
28:33
really hard. Whatever the the the the
28:37
messaging is like in there over the last number of seasons in
28:40
particular, you know, I've yet to see a man jump up and take it
28:44
by the squirt for the neck and saying I'm not going with this.
28:46
I'm going to show on a different type of like Rice would for
28:50
Arsenal. He take it by the squirt for the
28:52
neck. I don't see a Rice and I haven't
28:54
seen a Rice playing for Spurs for quite a while.
28:57
Rock bottom going into a three-week international break.
29:01
No wins, just two goals and we know it will take time after 217
29:06
finishes Graham, but how disastrous is this start?
29:10
Shocking, you know, is it an excess of £400 million they're
29:14
spent coming back to Bobby Sexton Recruitment, recruitment,
29:20
recruitment. And that is you're, I don't
29:22
know, the guy who's in charge at Top N can't never remember
29:25
playing against them or seeing them on Match of the Day.
29:28
And he's like, I don't know if you ever kicked a football.
29:30
Not that that's black and white, but that that position is so
29:34
important at any football club. If you're spending £400 million
29:39
during a during a transfer window, the season starts, you
29:42
find yourself where Spurs are. Sure, there's questions being
29:46
asked. You know, the first Spurs, like
29:49
Arsenal, like Man United, like Liverpool, Man City, You know
29:54
you, you pay a premium on a premium because if you're in the
29:57
Premier League and you're buying from outside the Premier League,
30:02
another club's eyes liked up the seller.
30:04
His eyes like that similar because you know he's going to
30:06
get far more than he ever thought he'd get for that
30:09
player. He's selling to the Premier
30:10
League. But then there's a Premier,
30:12
there's a premium on the premium if you like, for the big guys
30:16
and Spurs have paid through the nose for a lot of the players.
30:19
I mean £100 million for Tonali. I just can't see that.
30:22
I think he's an ordinary job and I think he's not alone.
30:26
I think they look weak. They look as if they've lacking
30:30
someone, as you just alluded to, someone that will stand up and
30:33
drag them through the difficult moments.
30:34
I don't see what that player is. I hope the.
30:36
Manager I, I don't either, but you just, you reminded me of the
30:39
story I was thinking about, you know, in, in the role I had at
30:42
Sunderland, I, I had, we had to do that.
30:44
We had to recruit and we, we were pushing the club where we
30:48
were. Roy Keane was in charge.
30:50
We didn't have the money to go and do what he wanted in the
30:53
transfer market. He wanted three players and I
30:56
called a meeting with the Dromovil Consortium who had been
30:58
brilliant to us from day one looking for the extra funds and
31:02
right, right, gave a really brilliant reason, you know, a
31:05
chat as to why this would be the one that makes a difference and
31:08
bring us to the Premier League. And so they probably go up and
31:11
get us the money to do that. So that was a real sort of
31:14
moment where this had to go, right for me.
31:16
Great. You know, Roy, Roy, perhaps not
31:18
as much pressure on him, believe it or not, but it was a big one
31:21
for me. I haven't got an extra funds now
31:23
to go and buy these three players.
31:25
We got the three players in for the final push after Christmas
31:28
to to try and get into the Premier League and first game
31:32
was Barnsley away. We brought 12,000 fans down to
31:36
Barnsley. The guys flew over from Ireland.
31:38
I collected them at Ellen Rd. They were going to see the the
31:42
fruits of their of their finances and we got to the
31:45
ground and Louise Wanless and suddenly passed away.
31:49
Since was head of our PR comes to me in the boardroom.
31:52
Roy has sent the new signings home.
31:56
So I'm now I'm now having collected the guys at the
32:00
airport to update for the three. I'm now saying, OK, how do I
32:04
explain this one? You can you can look back at
32:09
this game. I think we won 4142.
32:12
The crowd knew what had happened.
32:13
It got out on Radio 5. The team played magnificently.
32:18
We won the game and I can remember in the car park I was
32:22
bringing the guy they could like you can imagine, like what were
32:24
they getting themselves into? They spent all this money that I
32:27
didn't need them anyway. And they they just won the game.
32:29
And I saw Roy walking through the car park and I just went
32:33
well, well done. That was a big call.
32:35
And he went discipline, discipline.
32:38
And he got in his car and drove off.
32:40
And I remember thinking afterwards, you actually, you
32:45
can, you can buy the best, but things, things might work out
32:48
for you. Whatever you do, you know,
32:49
there's a lot of things have to fall into play.
32:51
But that that journey home, that journey home with also adds to
32:55
the airport and saying and joking, saying, listen, I'll be
32:58
back in a few months for more money.
32:59
We'll do this again. It was, but it just shows, you
33:03
know, you can't. There's no exact science or
33:05
formula. I don't care what anybody says.
33:07
Brentford's and the Brightons have done it brilliantly.
33:10
I like what they do and everybody's moving that way.
33:12
But it's not simple. But it but it's, it's five win,
33:16
5 home wins out of the last 36 at that brand new fantastic
33:20
stadium. And they've got a fantastic
33:22
training ground as well. What did you make of Roberta
33:26
Deserbi calling his players fragile?
33:29
And the way we're talking now at the moment and what we've seen
33:32
in the last couple of years, despite there being a new
33:34
manager and new players coming in, are we saying there could be
33:38
the end result pretty similar to how it's been the last two
33:40
years? Well, I think there's no doubt
33:43
about it. They are fragile.
33:45
And that's when you know you're looking for some men in your
33:48
dressing room to drag the lesser lights out of that mode and and
33:53
roll the sleeve. See the fact that's that.
33:57
Tell me if you you boys have played the game at highest
33:59
level. Tell me if you agree with me.
34:01
That's that. What was it?
34:02
5 out of the last? How many?
34:04
36. You've won at home.
34:06
Yeah, that means there's an element of fear about playing at
34:10
home. What is there to be fearful
34:12
about? Getting booed.
34:15
Getting booed? Oh, Didoms.
34:17
I mean, I love getting abuse. It's just, you know, I get at
34:21
home as well. My wife can hear me some dodgy
34:23
graphic. Yes, darling.
34:25
Anyway, I am. I, I, I'd love getting booed.
34:29
And that's part of the deal. You know, that stat tells me
34:33
that they are frightened players, that they are weak
34:36
characters. They won't take the ball when
34:39
you're 1 down. They won't show.
34:41
You know what it's like. The difference with wanting the
34:43
ball and not wanting the ball is 6 inches.
34:47
You know you'd be marked by someone move 6 inches that way
34:50
and you can take the ball and you're outside Bigfoot.
34:52
It's and I find that staggering. That tells you there.
34:58
I can't swear, can I? That tells you they're just,
35:00
they're just a bunch of lightweights.
35:03
Just stuff low characters, small characters.
35:06
You're missing trouble going forward.
35:08
Yeah, you've mentioned, I think the word you mentioned two or
35:10
three times again, what you said.
35:11
You said a big character in recruitment.
35:16
You really don't know what you're getting unless you unless
35:18
you you've somehow managed to to to get the go ahead that the
35:21
character here is strong. And I just wonder, is that
35:24
important anymore in the recruitment of players?
35:26
Because the bloody should be. So, So what about United then?
35:35
Because it's it's almost a, a similar thing really, isn't it?
35:38
Late equaliser, deflected equaliser.
35:40
Fulham, of course they lost, as you said, despite having an
35:43
extra man for over an hour at Old Trafford in the Derby as
35:48
well. They're out of the Carabao Cup.
35:49
It's five points from five games.
35:52
I mean, we talked about the disastrous start for Spurs.
35:55
What about for United? And who's to blame here?
35:57
I really think Michael Carrick was going to come into his own,
36:01
get off to a good start. Everything looks settled and
36:04
right. I went to see them play, they
36:06
played Leeds and a big friendly in Dublin as well. 80,000 people
36:09
came and I I went telling everybody who I saw.
36:13
United don't be better this season and then Hull go and beat
36:15
them four days, five days later and I looked like a right clan.
36:19
Hard to figure out again. Grey mentioned something there
36:23
about some things being too big for people and, you know, the,
36:27
the whole Man United responsibility as a player these
36:30
days and how difficult it is. I, I guess we're going to say
36:35
the same things again, you know, not as bad as Spurs, but a
36:38
character deficiency at times, you know, not all the time.
36:43
I think there are times when they look OK, they really do.
36:45
And they've got some very good players.
36:48
But the city game hurt, you know, the, the, the game that
36:52
the midweek hurt. Of course it did.
36:54
That was a bruising loss. But the big one, I know how big
36:58
Derby, I remember every minute of every Derby I ever played it,
37:02
you know, and they're bigger games.
37:03
And when that goes wrong and you're on, you're trying to
37:05
bring the players through onto a new higher level and it takes a
37:09
while to get going. But I, I really didn't see the
37:13
weekend's performance against Fulham coming.
37:14
I thought they would be better than that.
37:16
They were absolutely lucky to get out of it with a point.
37:20
So I like Michael Carrick. I am.
37:22
I spent an afternoon with them at Wimbledon in the summer,
37:28
charming, nice guy, like a real football man and I thought he
37:34
would do really well. Now, is it?
37:36
You can't say Man United's group don't have good players in
37:39
there, are they? Are they?
37:42
Is it a cultural thing at Chelsea?
37:44
Is that cultural thing at Tottenham?
37:46
Is that cultural thing, you know, is it because they can get
37:50
away with it? Because no one's put them under
37:52
enough pressure. No manager.
37:54
I don't believe any manager goes in today and speaks like George
37:58
Graham would have spoke to you, Niall.
38:00
And I'm trying to, well, I've spoke to Scott like that when we
38:02
were. Eventually.
38:04
Teasing. But I had to take it, you know?
38:06
You know, they can just can put it on the line and I think any
38:10
manager in doing that would last five minutes in adjusting them.
38:13
Today the players got a favourite murder and I look at
38:16
the way Spurs are, the way Man United are the which are,
38:21
they've got all, they've all got good players, but for whatever
38:24
reason they can't do it for 90 minutes, a hard 90 minutes.
38:29
They can't put a hard shift in. I'll tell you a story.
38:34
And I, I stayed with me all my life.
38:38
I'm a player at Liverpool and Ronnie Moran and Joe Fagan, they
38:42
were psychologists before football even thought of it.
38:45
They they were just the best. They cut, they'd be in the dress
38:48
room, 1 would be on one side, 1 would be on the other.
38:50
And they would say, isn't it a strange Joel?
38:55
What's that? Well, the team that does the
38:59
closing down the best is the team that generally wins the
39:01
league and leave it there hanging.
39:04
And when you analyse that now, that means closing down the best
39:09
at doing that means they're the team working the hardest without
39:12
the ball. So the team that works hardest
39:14
without the ball generally wins the league.
39:16
Great, here's a stat for you. Like the one before, Fun ran as
39:19
a team 6 1/2 kilometres more than United in that game.
39:25
And I come back to you play for Man United, Man United.
39:28
Man United have always had players that are a super
39:32
football club, but they always had when I was a player, they
39:37
weren't. They didn't really challenge us.
39:39
I think one year we run Atkinson, they challenged us,
39:40
but they didn't really challenge us.
39:42
But we never ever had an easy game against them.
39:44
They always had super players but they never really could
39:47
sustain a challenge and win the league.
39:50
And I always felt it was a cultural thing then because in
39:54
Manchester, if you had a bad afternoon, you could go out to
39:56
Manchester that night and and still get treated really well
40:00
and enjoy yourself. Try that in Liverpool.
40:02
If you have a bad result. When I played you couldn't.
40:05
If you asked you, the current would be after you, they'll let
40:07
you know. It was like, if you look at Man
40:10
United, there's got a whole. They've got a whole list of
40:13
players who are going to be the new George Best, the new Bobby
40:16
Charlton, the new Dennis Law and never achieved anything because
40:19
it got too much too soon. And that still continues today.
40:23
And I think that that permeates through not just Man United,
40:27
there's other clubs and your club.
40:30
So Chelsea are that. I think maybe Spurs are that as
40:32
well. First game after the
40:34
international break, Manchester United against Spurs.
40:37
That's going to be some game there.
40:39
Just just to finish on the weekend's results.
40:42
I want to ask you each a question on on your old teams,
40:44
Liverpool, Graham, obviously you wasn't able to to go and watch
40:48
the game. I assume probably you you would
40:49
have done if you were in the country.
40:51
What did you make of it? That's a really good win.
40:54
But how far are they from clicking?
40:56
You know, I'm, I'm, I'm thinking about individually as well as
40:58
collectively. Well, I really like the manager,
41:01
saw him several times when he managed Bournemouth.
41:04
He, he got them playing a a brand of football which was a
41:08
great watch, high intensity. Now if he can get that same
41:12
intensity out of the Liverpool players then they'll be a
41:15
formidable team. That's a big result from the
41:18
weekend. Although you know, they
41:20
travelled Bournemouth. Bournemouth play a brand of
41:22
football where they have to be all have to be 100% fit and
41:26
fully on it to be effective. You know, they really have a
41:29
right goal to test you physically.
41:31
It's a good, it's a great result for Liverpool.
41:33
It really is. You know, they were in Spain, it
41:36
was at Wednesday, Thursday night, Bournemouth.
41:38
So, you know, maybe some of them just dropped off a wee bit below
41:41
what they would normally be operating at.
41:44
But I, I think that's a really good result.
41:45
No one gets into the game at Bournemouth where they're going.
41:49
I know there's still question marks about some of the players
41:51
are brought in. Can I sit on the fence and ask
41:56
me that? I mean, I really I'm not I'm.
41:58
Like all Liverpool sports, I'm not quite sure what I'm getting
42:00
every week. OK.
42:01
And Scott, I. Just throw into that three clean
42:04
sheets I think they've had in a row now looking at looking a bit
42:06
better and Dyke looks as if he's got the guys, the new guys that
42:10
spread the invite is coming alongside and that they they're
42:13
they're they're defending like a proper team just lately.
42:17
And I think that all. As well, they just get all those
42:19
400 million words of striking down to to go and do their
42:23
thing. Can I?
42:24
Can I? Mention my the team of support
42:27
is a boy Glasgow Rangers, of course.
42:30
I think I think I watched that game and there's been such a
42:34
turn around in Scotland. Football's mad you know, go back
42:38
to the start of the season again.
42:39
It's under so much pressure. There's talk on bloody you know,
42:44
getting shown in the P45 and then last between in seven days
42:48
last week, weekend and yesterday they turned it completely
42:52
around. I think they're in the
42:54
ascendancy now. Celtic look like they're feeling
42:56
a little bit sorry for themselves and the both games
42:59
I've watched, which was last week and yesterday, they were
43:02
bullied, Rangers just bullied them.
43:04
And for any Rangers team to go to Parkhead and win it's, it's
43:08
quite a feat. It's a hard place to go and get
43:10
a win and I think Celtic are looking like a team that often.
43:15
Also, I'm a big fan of. Mark O'Neill and I just look at
43:17
him yesterday in his interview. He looked.
43:20
It was a tired Mark O'Neill yesterday and I'll just throw
43:23
this at you now, Roy, keep being in the stand.
43:25
Does that mean anything? He was at this game yesterday at
43:27
Parkhead, I think. If.
43:31
Roy. Wanted to put his name.
43:32
In the heart it would be huge and I'm sure Dermot and the
43:36
board of Celtic would look at that in in in a way of, you
43:40
know, you're bringing character into the room.
43:42
He hasn't managed for a while, but you'd be testament to say
43:45
that when it's in you, it's in you forever.
43:47
I think he's more or less said as much himself and I certainly
43:50
wouldn't object. I think that would be a hell of
43:53
a thing to do. I, as you know, I added myself
43:55
at Sunderland and I always tell people he didn't just bring what
44:00
he had and that Man United Way that he had learned on his own
44:03
way into our dressing room. He brought it into the city and
44:07
he really. Got the city.
44:09
Going because he's box office, the man, there's no doubt about
44:12
that. And it could be the perfect time
44:15
for him, who knows? But I just think he looks very
44:18
happy doing what he does these days.
44:19
Never seen him smile so much, you know, going in back in at
44:24
the deep end and having referees and things go wrong and matches
44:27
at the weekend and players, you know, I wonder will it, will it,
44:29
will it still be? Will the fire still be raging in
44:32
them? And there must be two.
44:34
Roy Keynes now, because I remember a Roy Keane many years
44:37
ago saying you never catch me doing any of that punditry.
44:40
Yeah, I think. He held his hands up on that
44:43
one. He's also very good at his
44:44
friend we have to give him. He's excellent.
44:47
Like you say, he's he's worth listening to now before we move
44:50
on to to. You personally, I've got to ask
44:52
you about Sunderland as well and, and get your thoughts on
44:55
the rise and the rise of, of, of Sunderland from League One to
45:00
Europe in just five years and the first time in Europe in over
45:03
half a century. It's just amazing, isn't it?
45:06
Well, it really is. And I think what happened last
45:10
week for that European game, first game in 53 years and the
45:13
show that they put on for the world, whoever was watching in
45:16
and obviously those who attended it was, you know, I suppose the
45:20
common together of plans of football club where the people
45:24
just live for it up there. And these plans were put in
45:28
place. And I have to give Bob Murray
45:30
some huge credit here. He builds an incredible stadium
45:33
and Sunderland were playing in Roker Park that was falling
45:36
down. We were getting crowds of 18,020
45:39
thousand and he built a stadium for 49,000.
45:42
We got relegated the eve. We went into the stadium and
45:46
everybody reckoned all it's going to be a, you know, in
45:50
Galva, what they call it, that word and suddenly things started
45:55
to happen. But it didn't quite happen while
45:56
he was in charge. But I remember him clearly
46:00
speaking and saying, I may sound cheeky, but I'd love to see
46:05
European football at the stadium one day.
46:07
And I'm so pleased for him after everything he put in that
46:09
European football came to stadium like we missed out
46:12
because there weren't that many English teams qualifying as
46:15
there are today. I think we finished in the same
46:17
position as them but didn't get in.
46:19
And it really is a statement of progress at a football club
46:24
where, as I said earlier, that means so much to the people.
46:27
And I think the Sunderland to like die documentaries that went
46:31
out on Netflix. The fact that people could see
46:34
what this meant means it's a very easy question for me to
46:37
answer and tell you, you know, that for instance, there's, I
46:42
don't know, maybe in the centre and in the surrounding old pit
46:45
villages and towns. There's probably 300,400
46:48
thousand people there in, in, in the main.
46:53
And now you've 49,000 going to the games and you've got waiting
46:57
lists to get on the season tickets.
46:59
Every household is represented, everybody lives for it and when
47:03
it goes well, it's party time up there.
47:05
And I'm just so pleased for everyone.
47:07
And I have to say I find it incredible and fascinating.
47:12
And I know how difficult it is to be a chairman, that the young
47:14
man who's been behind all this is as young as he is to have the
47:20
wisdom to do and make all the decisions and put the team
47:23
around and that he has be behind the scenes, the appointments he
47:26
made. You know, like Reggie, La Briefs
47:29
was relegated very soon before he came to us, before he came to
47:32
Sunday. And I think on paper, people go
47:36
hang on. A year ago he was no good, you
47:38
know, And I spent a day up there when all this had gone really
47:42
well. Last year, I spent a day with
47:43
him and I said to one of the players afterwards, I didn't
47:47
hear him raise his voice today. So he never raises his voice.
47:50
He's never shouted at us. So it's an incredible new way
47:55
for me anyway, you know, observing how to get the best
47:57
out of these players. But they play with pride and and
48:00
going back to to points, we were talking about the recruitment.
48:05
Recruitment, recruitment, recruitment and also, you know.
48:09
That character, they, they, they obviously have players who have
48:11
bought in to what it means to be something.
48:13
It is different. It is a different football club.
48:16
They'll have a. They'll have a.
48:17
Fight on to keep Broby at the end of the season now.
48:20
They sure will. Like he's gone.
48:21
He looked wrong when he first came in.
48:23
He had been a diet. He scored a number of goals in
48:26
the Dutch league. He then came and he could fight
48:29
his corner, you know. But he's powerful man.
48:32
A powerful. Man, but what I.
48:33
Loved about his goals yesterday. They were all culture type
48:36
goals. They weren't the guy that was
48:38
holding it up, laying it off, doing the hard work.
48:40
He saw things, he made his run a little bit earlier times.
48:43
Hard things might happen, you know?
48:45
I really like that. Remember, he's had a World Cup
48:47
this summer and scored World Cup goals.
48:49
You know this, this is a huge time for him.
48:52
He's playing at his height and hopefully it can go on and on.
48:54
But as you say, 1 of the big guys will probably come out
48:57
there and that's always been the problem.
48:59
It's always been the problem at Sunderland, you know.
49:02
But having said that, I'm enjoying every minute of it.
49:05
Scott, sorry, just to go back to your question, no and no.
49:08
And. Rightly so as well.
49:09
So the Premier League is a is a monster.
49:12
I think we can all agree here. We've seen what happens in the
49:15
last two years where the Premier League has won.
49:19
Obviously Villa won the Europa League last season, they beat
49:22
Forest in the semi final who perhaps would have gone on A1 if
49:25
they hadn't lost to to Villa. The season before the final was
49:29
Manchester United against Spurs. Can Sunderland do it?
49:32
Can they do it? Or maybe Brighton or Palace?
49:37
Oh, it's a great question the. Euphoria.
49:39
There is no, I have to say watching the game the other
49:42
night, you know, as I had so many chances and heroic
49:48
defending gave Sunderland the victory and it was an amazing
49:50
victory to go on. And I'm also started that we're
49:54
talking here about Sunderland possibly winning a thing in
49:56
Europe when we would have looked to have just seen about the
49:59
thirds here, not what, four years ago.
50:01
It's an incredible story just to even be asking that question.
50:05
But you know that you build your own pressure by being by getting
50:08
better and better, but they just kept doing it.
50:10
I think have a great chance the European.
50:13
Competition, I think our football, the intensity of the
50:16
Premier League, catches a lot of foreign teams out and I think
50:20
Sunderland are a team that. Get after you and you.
50:25
Know lots of the continental teams don't like that, it's too
50:29
intense for them. So I think I've got a great
50:31
chance, Hey, priority is to stay in the Premier League, priority
50:34
is to do well in that. But I wouldn't, I wouldn't write
50:39
something off going all the way in that European competition.
50:49
Thanks to our whiskey partner. Saint Andrew's three fingers
50:52
Whiskey, the legendary measure. Listen, I want to get a.
50:55
Few stories in AS. Well, with you, Nile, as I
50:58
mentioned at the top, I spoke to Perry about you.
51:00
He's given me loads. Can't get them all out here.
51:04
He did tell me, first of all, that you saved his life in
51:07
Puerto Penus, not in a night time incident.
51:09
But you were David Hasselhoff, weren't you?
51:12
We were standing. Beside the port there, wondering
51:14
whether we should go into Sinatra's for a drink.
51:16
Famous bar two or three doors up on the Port of Venus.
51:20
This was way back now in the 80s, smaller place then than it
51:23
is now. And Perry was kind of standing
51:26
on the edge of the water. And I think for a joke, somebody
51:29
kind of gave him a bit of a nudge and he ended up going in,
51:33
but he couldn't swim. I spoke, it was a little bit of
51:38
what's going to happen here now and saw a ring.
51:41
So I got the ring through the ring and jumped on top of the
51:43
ring and got him out of the water.
51:45
And then also I remember is all of these fantastically dressed,
51:49
beautiful people that were walking the the port of of Port
51:53
of Banus come up and see this wreck being hauled out of the
51:57
water, shaking the water off himself and I'm going home to
52:01
get changed. He didn't even go home and go to
52:04
bed. He went and got changed and came
52:06
back down. But there were great times.
52:08
George used to bring us away, reported the news twice a year
52:11
for about 3 or 4 years. And look, it was he didn't
52:16
realise it at the time, but it was, you know, it was, it was
52:18
just lovely. And As for, you know, for team
52:21
spirit, people would laugh at that phrase.
52:23
Now that's nothing that actually exists, but there was a bond in
52:26
that team and it was no, no flute that, you know, a couple
52:29
years later with the signings attitude that they that we won
52:33
the league. You know, that's that's that's
52:35
my view on it. Anyway.
52:36
It was a great squad, great, great team of lads to me to hang
52:39
around with Tony Adams, Paul Merson, Perry Groves, you know,
52:42
it was just and I have to I have to give a mention of, you know,
52:45
probably our best young player after all that was David
52:48
Rocastle and David left us way too early.
52:51
And that was that was a real, real a real judge for all of us.
52:56
We couldn't, you know, believe what had happened because he'd
52:59
come up to Man City to me as well.
53:01
You know, he ended up there and. Leeds United in between, That's
53:07
right. And then he he went to Thailand
53:08
as well. I think I tried to buy him when
53:11
I was. Manager of Liverpool, but what a
53:13
player he was. I signed with with Rocky.
53:16
The same year with Paul Furling was well at Chelsea.
53:19
Incredible human being as well as incredible.
53:21
Wasn't he just. You mentioned a few of.
53:25
Those lads there in the sort of the the drinking side of things,
53:28
you've also missed out. Steve Bold, I was told by Perry
53:30
there's five of you were in the drinking club.
53:33
Did you ever get yourself into a bit of a mischief at all?
53:36
No, I was good at avoiding. It all, I didn't let it succumb
53:39
to some of the guys get into trouble but I'm the most famous
53:42
one. I think I remember we we trained
53:46
really hard on a Monday, we won on the Saturday and we trained.
53:49
He did a physical with us George around the track and up the
53:51
terraces at Old Highbury and we were all flaked out lying on the
53:56
pitch afterwards. It was a grueler and he just
53:59
came over and said right you're 2 days off, take it easy, see
54:03
you all, see your family, do whatever you have to do, see you
54:06
Thursday. I have no family.
54:09
You know what I do for two days. It was merits, but it's OK.
54:12
Let's get ourselves together. We'll go, we'll go to Winsor
54:14
Races. And we ended up getting a boat
54:17
up to Thames, had a few drinks somewhere both up to Thames into
54:20
Winsor Races. And anyway, we're the last Tony
54:24
Adams myself, we lost Mercy Baldy.
54:25
I don't know where they ended up, but we come out of we come
54:29
out of Winsor Races and there was a big long driveway.
54:32
All that it was dark, all the the transport had gone and this,
54:36
we stopped this little car, tiny little car and asked the fellow
54:39
for a lift and he said, yeah, I'll bring in.
54:41
Oh, lovely to meet you, Tony, love to meet you.
54:42
Nile and I got in the back of the car.
54:45
Tony was in the front, very small car, but there's Wimbledon
54:48
stickers all over the car. I'm a Wimble, I'm a Womble.
54:51
Follow me to Wimbledon. Wimbledon forever, Wimbledon
54:54
till I die. And we're driving along anyway.
54:56
And the driver goes to Tony Adams.
54:59
What do you think of Wimbledon? And I'm looking in the mirror,
55:02
trying to get his attention, to go say the right thing.
55:04
They'll get the game done away with, you know, full of drink,
55:07
full of 80s young bravado. And he went, really?
55:10
Oh, yeah. And that's what that Billy
55:11
Jones. Anyway, all that.
55:13
Right. So we have that kind of a drive
55:15
into Windsor. Your man let us off. 2 weeks
55:17
later, we're playing Wimbledon. A good 45 minutes before the
55:21
kickoff, the doors burst open. There's Billy Jones.
55:23
Where's Adams? I'm telling you about something.
55:26
He went, I'll tell you what's up.
55:27
That was my mate in the car that gave you a lift up Winzer.
55:30
And people had to drag him off. And then he went.
55:32
Where's Quinn? You're a good lad.
55:36
And he walked out and left me. He didn't he didn't go.
55:38
He didn't go near me because I had tried to put her up saying,
55:41
hey, tell me no, come on, take it easy.
55:42
Or a good side. You know, I was able to get out
55:45
of trouble that kind of way, you know, and and tell us about the.
55:48
The penalty competitions as well after training, which apparently
55:51
you just rinse the lads of their money.
55:54
Yeah, I used to love talking about getting a goal.
55:56
After training and I worked it on the view that this is long
55:58
before AI or stats were a thing, but surely a player wouldn't
56:02
score three against me in a row, particularly if I just have this
56:05
big body and I dive and I guess and I get it once right out of
56:09
three. And I used to play them, it used
56:11
to be a fibre and then they'd lose.
56:12
They want to do it for a tenner and then suddenly, you know,
56:15
they go, I haven't got enough, I'll pay you next week, you
56:17
know. So I did it with Ireland as well
56:20
and Jack, Jack Charlton. Like this was, this was
56:22
incredible. Jack Charlton was so impressed
56:25
with me doing this that he only picked 2 goalkeepers for the
56:29
World Cup in 1990s. Any trouble, any trouble, we'll
56:32
stick you on, you know, if the other two get injured.
56:34
So it was, I just love doing it. I loved trying.
56:37
I mean, look back now. Look, I liked a night out and I
56:42
did all that, but I used to love going in and that dressing room.
56:47
Commitment to each other. That you had in a good dressing
56:49
room and and wanting to get in there every day as a young lad
56:52
into Arsenal. I mean it, it wasn't easy to
56:54
leave. I'd been out of the team and I
56:57
had to leave. We qualified for World Cup and
56:59
Jack said he wouldn't bring me if I didn't get football.
57:01
So I had to leave in March of that year.
57:05
But I, I to this day, I still regret that I wasn't like
57:08
Stapleton or I wasn't like Brady, who had run the course
57:11
there and who had done everything.
57:12
I, I learned to meet a footballer there.
57:14
I think that's, that's probably as much as I could say.
57:17
Yeah, See, see what you've said there.
57:20
Scott, you'll agree with this about you wake up when you're a
57:23
player. You wake up in the morning, you
57:25
can't wait to get to work just to sit in the direction for that
57:29
half an hour getting changed, the banter, the Mickey taking.
57:33
Someone's made a clown on themselves.
57:35
Guaranteed a few days before just the ribbing that went on.
57:39
How many people are that lucky? Can't wait to get to work this
57:43
morning and my wife tells the. Story Twice I forgot I had the
57:48
kids in the car to drop them to school.
57:51
I was in head in what was there today.
57:53
Everything's going to be great. And twice I had to go to the
57:56
lady who used to do the breakfasts and say to her, will
58:00
you look after them while we're training?
58:02
And I had to bring them to McDonald's and keep them out
58:04
till after school time. I'm home.
58:07
So they wouldn't they wouldn't tell their mother.
58:08
Do you think it's still the same case today?
58:11
I hope so. I mean.
58:12
I sometimes ask myself that question.
58:15
I don't know a lot of the the modern young players.
58:17
I haven't, I haven't got friends in that world.
58:20
But at the same time, you know, it's never what did they do or
58:24
not. It's never going to take for me
58:25
what I had and the special times.
58:27
The Man City dressing room was just as good in the Sunderland
58:29
dressing room. Amazing, Peter Reed said to me.
58:33
When the players go out, I want you to get them all home.
58:36
Now Can you imagine me going to my wife?
58:37
I don't really want to go out tonight, love, but I have to get
58:40
them all home. He was really, really was
58:45
meaning. Himself, he took some manager.
58:49
Yeah, I don't. Think it is the same.
58:53
I don't think it can be the way that the camera phones and not
58:56
just the media, the way it's been intensified even more, but
58:59
social media as well. You know, one night out, Jack
59:03
Grealish is a bit of a throwback, isn't he?
59:05
If if he's seen a little bit tipsy, then it's all over the
59:08
papers. I don't see how you can have
59:10
that team bonding that we did back in the day.
59:12
So while obviously the money is very, very good, I think they've
59:15
lost a bit of the soul that that that was the rounds back in this
59:18
day. When?
59:19
When? You know, when football's not
59:21
going well, I would say to them, I'd say, look, do you remember
59:24
when you were a kid when you're 67, you're kicking the ball
59:26
against the wall. Why did you do that?
59:28
It was enjoyable. Now you're getting paid
59:31
fortunes. She'd still be enjoying it and
59:34
it became a real burden to them. And it comes back to some people
59:39
find playing under pressure really, really difficult.
59:42
And you've got to, this is maybe White House psychologist today,
59:45
where it was left to coaches to get the best out of players.
59:51
Yeah, I agree with you. But I wouldn't swap the thing.
59:54
If you handed me today and said I could have it all from day one
59:56
today, I'd say no thank you. Mine was better.
59:58
Well, well done now. No thanks guys.
1:00:01
Thank, yeah, Thank you. Thanks for coming on, very much
1:00:05
appreciated. I just want to finish off myself
1:00:07
here. You're not paying fortunes.
1:00:10
But I don't want my check for this.
1:00:12
Will you give it to the Deborah people?
1:00:14
Oh. You're a gentleman now, you're a
1:00:16
gentleman. Thank you.