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Transcript

Rethinking Salvation · Rick Manis Ministries Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Peter, it's really good to see you, and it gives me and I'm glad to be here.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_01: I forget actually uh this is my second week in a row speaking here, so I got to do a two-parter.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_01: To me, it was a two-parter.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um if I don't know if you remember or if you were here or if you watched it um last week I was um what was I talking about?
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: What was it?
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: Huh?
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: Somebody said grace or God or Jesus or something.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: But but um it was talking about um uh the the the two kingdoms, one fear-based and one one love-based, and really it's um uh talking about what does the term born again biblically mean?
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: We got into that, and literally is born from above.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: That in fact, that word there, it's it there's when you look at a definition, again, is not anywhere to be found in there.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: It actually is from above or from the top or from the beginning.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: And so uh that was sort of a beginning of of a two-part thing that I really wanted to bring out, and this is what I'm really excited about, is the second part of it.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_01: But it's really about our salvation.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's really, really rethinking salvation, is what we're talking about today.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Now, I I had a dramatic uh in 1979, uh a born-again experience.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_01: I use that because we're familiar with that term.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I got saved, I had that experience, conversion.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: It was a radical conversion that changed so much in my life.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: Something happened to me, something that God did, and I did a very traditional thing as that was that you do back and then.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: I was at a church and and it was a little country church, so they had a wooden altar there, and and the way that you know that they they they did things, and I I knew it.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_01: I had been in church enough.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: I wasn't, I didn't had never been a church goer, but I was an I was you know, I would go with with a neighbor kid growing up or something.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I kind of knew how those churches did.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: I knew knew that they would have an altar call at the end, and I I was there to answer that altar call.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: That's the only reason I was in that church.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I don't know what the what the preacher preached.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't care.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'm waiting for the altar call because I'm there to get that saved business.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I wanted it.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_01: And the reason I wanted it was because I was living a lifestyle that I was tired of and it was it was destroyed it was destructive, and I had seen friends get saved or born again or have a conversion, and it changed their life.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I wanted that.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_01: So I believed that he would, I believe that if I did this, he it would get me off drugs, and it would save me from an eternal torture in hell.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what that's what I wanted.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so they made the altar call, and I came forward and I prayed something, but but with that prayer, something happened to me.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, and they called it asking Jesus into your heart, or receiving Jesus into your heart.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so I did that, but I wondered, how does that happen?
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: I I tried to picture Jesus coming into my heart, and the only thing I could come up with was that I think I thought of a Jesus that must be up there, right?
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: On like in my mind on a cloud, you know, and or somewhere up there, and when I did the right thing, when I responded or received or asked him, or that like he jumped off the cloud and jumped into my chest.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_01: That's what I pictured.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: Because I I asked him and he came into my heart.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_01: I pulled my shirt down because if I didn't, Judy would have said, pull your shirt down.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: She takes good care of me.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_01: But but I somehow always instinctively knew, like, I don't think that's quite how it works.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, is it's uh anyway, so I want to talk about that.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_01: I want to cover some of that this morning, and what happens with salvation and what is salvation?
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_01: And and so let's get into this.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: 1 Peter chapter 1, uh verse 8 is the first uh first scripture I want us to look at.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: And uh Peter writes here in verse 8, and he says, Though you have not seen him, and so we haven't seen Jesus physically, though you've not seen him, you love him.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: And even though you do not see him now, you believe in him.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that pretty much describes me, and I think probably all of you here, just about, right?
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: You haven't seen him physically, but you love him.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: And though you don't see him in that way, you believe in him, right?
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_01: He says, you believe in him, and you are filled with an inexpressible and glorious joy.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: I want to pause right there.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: So he's saying, he's describing something that happened, has happened, or is happening within you.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_01: That you believe in him, you um you love him, and he says, and you are filled, something is going on in your soul.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: You're filled with this inexpressible joy.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_01: Something has happened inside.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_01: Kind of like what I just described, something happened inside me.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_01: And joy was a big, big part of that.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_01: And he says, verse 9, he says, because, or four, you are receiving the end result of your faith, the salvation of your souls.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_01: So he says, you believe in him, you trust him, and you are filled with inexpressible joy for a reason.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_01: Because you are receiving something, and this something is called the salvation of your soul.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_01: So this salvation of your souls is producing something, and one of those things that we see right here is a joy.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_01: But these are things that are going on in inside of us.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: Now, the word salvation, if you look up the definition, is the Greek word soteria, and you'll look it up and you'll find the words rescue, restoration to safety, health is included in that, well-being, and it's generally well-being, welfare, when you look it up in all kinds of different places, it indicates a wellness or a wholeness or a soundness.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_01: Soteria implies restoration to a state of soundness and well-being, suggesting a positive outcome that goes beyond mere survival.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: See, it really is a soul, soteria, or this word salvation, is a soul prosperity.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's a richness in the soul, and it restores identity, and it gives value, and you could describe it as having within you an abundance of life.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: Remember, Jesus came to seek and save, Soter, came to seek and save that which was lost.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: I love to talk about that a lot.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_01: I've talked about it here.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_01: We sung about the prodigal son uh uh today and the 99 and the one sheep that was lost and all that.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_01: And and and especially with the story of the prodigal son, we see in that story a restoration of identity, right?
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_01: Paul called that in Romans 8, receiving the spirit of sonship.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: It says adoption in King James, but it's huathesia, the placement into sonship.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_01: The guy came to be a slave and work for the man that was his father, but the father wouldn't have that.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_01: He said, No, you're my son, you belong in the house, wear my ring, wear the family ring, put shoes on your feet.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: You belong here, you're my you're my son.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_01: The prodigal was always a son.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_01: And really that's a story of mankind.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the Gospels mentioned Adam one time in the Gospels.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_01: And that's Luke 3.38, where it says, Adam was the son of God.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_01: This, who was the son of that, who was the son of that, who was a son, goes all the way back to Adam and it says, and Adam, who was the son of God.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_01: So that's an interesting thing because that I don't read anywhere after that where he stopped being a son of God.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_01: And Jesus tells a story about that which was lost.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_01: The sheep was lost, the coin was lost, the prodigal was gone, he was out there, but he was still a son, and he came to get the son.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_01: He came to get man, he came to seek and save that which was lost.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_01: And in this saving or salvation, it would restore our rightful value, our rightful identity.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_01: And he says, and I came that you would have life, and have that life more abundantly.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: So what I'm getting at is when I'm talking about the about soteria or salvation, that even though initially all I basically thought that it was, it was it was mostly all about protection from having to spend an eternity in a fiery torment, I realized just as I grew and began to see, like, wow, this is a wonderful thing.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: That's that's a whole lot more than just that, that this is a changing inside of me.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: This is, and over time, you see, it restores all of these things.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's the soul, the inward part of you that that is being saved.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_01: Not saved from something, but saved to something.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_01: The prodigal son, when he came home and gets restored to his value, he wasn't saved from something, he was brought to something.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_01: The lost sheep was brought to something.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_01: The coin was brought was brought to something.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_01: And so that rescue that Soteria or salvation implies is something that that is really a restoration of us as a person, becoming our our uh our our true self, uh the veil being removed, as I talked about last week, where we behold the glory of God and we see ourselves, and doesn't that do something for the soul?
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_01: So Paul made this statement and he said, the gospel, the good news, is the power of God unto salvation.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, it gets to where you're not even I'm not even thinking about salvation in the terms that I once did when I first got started.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_01: You're enjoying the work that's happening inside you.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: And with this is the fruit of the spirit, isn't it?
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_01: That love is happening in here, right?
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: Wherever the soul is, somewhere in here.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_01: Joy, peace, gentleness, goodness.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: All the fruit of the spirit going on here.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: That's soul prosperity, that's soul salvation, that soul soundness and wholeness.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's not just a soul dangling over the fires or something and saving it from that.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: It's coming to soundness and wholeness.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: That's really what I see when I look at the word salvation.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: Colossians chapter 1, excuse me, verse 1 verse 26, Paul is talking about a secret, a message that he was given to declare to people.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_01: He says, and this message was kept secret for centuries and generations past, but now it's been revealed to God's people.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_01: So this message or this secret, this mystery, is not something that began to exist in Paul's modern day.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: He said, it's something that was true, it's something that was there, it's something that always was, but it was covered, it was hidden, it was kept secret.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: He says, but now, and talking, I say now because it's in Christ, is where the revealing happens, where the uncovering of the secret happens, but now it has been revealed to God's people.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_01: Verse 27.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: Because God wanted them to know, now pause for a moment.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: Why was it revealed?
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: Because God's good, God loves you, God so loved the world, because God wanted them to know that the riches and glory of Christ are for you, Gentiles, too.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_01: And this is the secret Christ lives in you, and this gives you assurance of sharing his glory.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_01: Now remember, Jesus told people before he went to the cross, before he died, before he resurrected, all that, he told people when they were asking about the kingdom of God, when will you establish it?
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: He says, it doesn't come like that.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: He says, Because the kingdom is within you.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_01: Now, now, some translations will say, Because the kingdom's within you, and others will say, the kingdom is in your midst.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've I've had I've talked to people where they say, Well, it it wasn't in them because Jesus hadn't been to the cross yet, so they didn't have it in them.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: So what Jesus was saying that it was it was in your midst.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of, it's around here somewhere, it's close by.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, all you gotta do is look up the word.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't mean anything like that.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_01: You look up the word, all you will find is the word in or into.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: That's all it could mean.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: It can't mean anything else.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't have any other options when you look it up.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: So when he says it's in you, it can only mean it's in or it's into you.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't mean it's nearby, it doesn't mean it's around you.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_01: He says the kingdom is within you.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: So then the question is, what are you saying, Rick?
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: Are you saying, I mean, I I thought salvation was when God came into our heart.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that's true, but not like this.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_01: So let me let's get into this.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_01: And and as we get into this, this is something that that can really uh bless people, I believe.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: It it really uh it can make you rethink what's going on, and it's in a it's in a big, beautiful, powerful way that that goes along with your oneness with God and God's heart for for man and his plan for man from the beginning.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I want to say this if if you don't agree with what I'm saying today, that's okay.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: All you gotta do is just say, say, just pray for me.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_01: Say, God, Rick don't have a clue.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: Would you help him?
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's all you gotta do, okay?
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_01: But but but but let's understand something about about men.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: See, we've I was like a lot of other people I know, I was bred on messages that I like to say were probably maybe 10% gospel.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: Because, and and and maybe a lot of you can relate that how many of you say, you know, because you've grown and because you understand God more, that some of the things that you truly were sincere and thought about God, you don't think those things anymore.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: Can anybody say that?
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: See, that's a normal thing.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_01: So it doesn't mean we have to be mad at anybody or or anything like that, but it's a normal thing that we get get a glimpse or an idea of God, but as we get to know him, you know, when I first meet you, I get an idea of you, but as I get to know you, I might be changing some some some ideas about you.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_01: And uh they're probably going to get better ideas because I I'm of the belief that people are good inherently.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_01: I believe at the core of the human, it's good.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_01: And I won't even get into one verse that people somehow can find out of that whole big thick Bible with thousands upon tens of thousands of verses.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_01: There's only one verse that talks about the the the wicked, desperate heart of man.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_01: But we have all these other indicators, such as you know, look at this, how we many of us have a mindset of still being in Adam.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_01: And Adam, Adam, they they think that history began almost like with the fall.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: And then Jesus comes along and he offers something wonderful to us, but he's kind of a footnote in this story, and we still, and it's still Adam, Adam, Adam, Adam, Adam.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_01: Jesus helped, but Adam, Adam, Adam.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_01: But remember, Ephesians 1 4 says that before we were, before Adam fell, before we were in Adam, as Paul talks about, Ephesians 1.4 says we were in Christ.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: Before that, right?
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_01: It says we were, we that God chose us in Christ before the foundation of the world.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_01: So why do we have to start with Adam and we all still fight, either relate to that or try keep trying to fight that relationship in our mind?
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_01: And why can't we go back to God's eternal purpose, his original intent, and what he made us and who we are really before the fall?
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: Come on.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: Who we are really, because we were in Christ before everything, but got lost.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_01: I wish I could talk to you in classic rock language.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_01: There was a song by the Jay Giles band that I wish we could play on music.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_01: I must have got lost.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_01: I must have got lost.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: I must have got lost somewhere down the line.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what happened.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_01: I know all of you know who Jay Giles Band is, but anyway.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: I used to be one of the young people in church.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_01: That was so fun back in those days.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_01: The kingdom is within you.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_01: Job chapter 32, verse 8 says, This is Old Testament.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: Old, old, old, old testament.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: Isn't Job the oldest book in the Bible?
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_01: That's what I've heard.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_01: Says, but there is a spirit in man, and the breath of the Almighty gives him understanding.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_01: That's revelation.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: That comes from inside the deepest part, the core of a man.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_01: There is a spirit in man.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: Well, what is a spirit?
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_01: So let's look at a picture here.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: And this is a classic, classic teaching, but I like it, and it's it's it's simple, but it explains it very, very well.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_01: This the circle, this circular thing here is sort of a graph of, I guess, the the you know, the my idea and the common idea of the of the human three-part being.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_01: We got an outer body, an inner soul, and we have a spirit.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_01: And most most Christians I know talk with that kind of language, and I agree with it, I believe it.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so in the core of our being is the spirit.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_01: The soul, I think we understand, is essentially our mind, emotions, and will, what we think, what we feel, what we desire.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's our that the things that are going on inside of us, not outside of us, but inside of us.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: That's a part of us.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: We don't know that.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_01: But we believe that also there is a spirit.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: Well, what is the spirit?
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: I I tell you that we're that that that it's it's it's Christ in you, like we just read.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's the mystery, it's the secret that's been covered.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_01: But you but but see, it's been covered, and that's why we go to the tabernacle picture there, and we have an outer court which corresponds to the outer body, we have the inner court or the holy place, which is the inner soul, and we have the holy of holies where God dwells.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_01: The whole story of the tabernacle or the temple with this kind of a layout is a say is the same picture of us, but the story is that veil.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_01: It's that veil, and Paul just talked about it.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_01: He said it was veiled, it was covered, it was hidden.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: That's what that veil of the temple is talking about.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's the whole thing.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_01: It is the Paul talked about, every thought and imagination that has been erected against the knowledge of God to keep people from seeing and and and knowing God.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_01: And so I submit to you that here's what happens: that instead of Jesus jumping off a cloud and f and landing in our chest and now we're a new creation because of that.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_01: I do say that He does come into your heart.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: But He comes from the inside, He comes from a secret place, a holy place, a hidden place, the hidden man of the heart, as Paul said.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: And what happens is, and we see we see a picture of something happening when Jesus died on the cross.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_01: The veil was, oh gosh, I love this.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: And it was torn from top to bottom.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: That means we didn't do it, and God didn't need our permission, he did it.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: And and that veil being torn is the is is speaking to us that in Christ, God dwelling in you is unveiled.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_01: Know ye not, don't you know, Paul says, you are the temple of God, and God dwells in you.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: And so what happens here is what Ezekiel prophesied in his vision, while people, well, you know, see, well, we used to have this thing in church where it's take me into the holy of holies.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_01: We were on this journey trying to pierce the veil, right?
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_01: Cut through the veil.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: How do you do it?
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: You do warfare, you do, you pray strong enough, you sanctify yourself, you give up your, you do something.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_01: Huh?
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: And we're trying to journey into that place where God is.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: That's still a separation mentality.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_01: That veil, you're actually reinforcing the veil that it's that it's there and forgetting what Jesus did.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_01: Jesus rips the veil, he unveils.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_01: In fact, he is the unveiling of the Father, he is the revealing of the Father, for no man had seen God, perceived God at any time because of that veil that's in the heart of man that the Bible talks a lot about.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_01: And no man had perceived him, John 1 says, but the Son, he has declared him or revealed him to us.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_01: And the reason, come on, give God a thanks for that.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for giving your son.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: For in the son, it's in Christ, in Christ alone, that we can behold the Father.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_01: That's why he says, I'm the way.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_01: That's why he says, Nobody comes except through me.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody else is revealing the Father.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: There's nobody else that does this except Christ.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_01: He has declared him.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_01: Show us the Father.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: If you've seen me, you've seen the Father.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: Rip.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: As you grow in those moments when the light has turned on inside you.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_01: When you began to believe that God's grace was sufficient.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_01: And he was more gracious and good and more loving than you gave him credit for, what was that?
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_01: Rip.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_00: Here I am.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_01: But well, so you're just saying that nobody needs to get saved, or else no, we're talking about we need to be saved.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_01: Jesus came that we would be saved.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_01: Well, if God's already in us, yeah, but you can still be lost.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_01: Matthew chapter 6, verse 23, Jesus talked about it, and he made this statement.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_01: He says, if therefore the light, if the light that is in you is darkness, how great is that darkness if there's a veil?
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: There's so much about this.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_01: What does 2 Corinthians 3 talk about that veil?
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: Even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil is still upon the hearts.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_01: We don't see.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_01: Because the veil is only done away in Christ.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_01: Rip.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: But when one turns to the Lord, the veil is removed, and we behold the glory of the Lord.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like looking in a mirror because we see who we are in that, because that's a picture of us, your body, your soul, your spirit.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: But with the veil ripped, there is a oneness.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: There is no division.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_01: And the only thing that made a division was the veil.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: Paul called it the thoughts and the imaginations that had been erected against the knowledge of God.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what started with the fall of man.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_01: The veil comes up.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: Let's go hide, let's go cover, let's blame the woman, let's do something.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_01: And Ezekiel saw a vision.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_01: While everybody else is like, go into the Holy of Holies, go into the Holy of Holies, pierce the veil.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: Let's who shall ascend unto the holy.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_01: Ezekiel sees it and he says, I saw the glory of God coming out of the Holy of Holies.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: And it filled, his glory filled the temple.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: Because of this soteria salvation, you are filled with joy unspeakable and full of the glory of God.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_00: So you know what happened?
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_01: You know, Paul used this language.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_01: For it pleased the Lord to reveal his son in me.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_01: I found a translation that says reveal his son to me, because that kind of fits the standard thought.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_01: Look up the word.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's the word and which is in or into.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_01: It cannot mean to, it only means he revealed him in me, whether you like it or not, that he was unveiled inside of me.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_01: Is anybody hearing this?
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_01: So he says, so if that light that's in you be darkness, how great is that darkness?
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_01: I lived in darkness, oblivious, obscurity, blindness, could not see, even though I was a child of God, but I was lost.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: And how great was that darkness.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_01: My lifestyle was manifesting darkness.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: I wasn't an evil being.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_01: God didn't, when when when this boy was born, believe it or not, I was a cute little baby at one time.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_01: I was not some evil being.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_01: Well, what happened?
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: I must have got lost.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: Why?
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: Because the darkness was so great.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I talked last week about the veil there.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: Why, you know, the my the Paul Paul said it says it this way.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_01: They have their understanding darkened.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: This making any sense to you?
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_01: So, what's it look like if God lives in you?
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_01: But it's dark.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: We got another picture, another graphic.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_01: You look kind of like this.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_01: This is close to what I could.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_01: So there's the veil.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_01: That's what that's where that veil is.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_01: And on the other side of that is the holy of holies, where God dwells.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_01: That's where all the wisdom of eternity is.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: That's where all the love is.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_01: That's where all the godly joy is.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_01: That's where all the fruit of the spirit is, fruit of the spirit, not the soul.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_01: That's where all the good stuff is.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_01: That's behind that veil is that which saves the soul, makes the soul whole, makes it sound, makes it full.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: See, I talk about when I when the uh the veil ripped where I could begin to see that God's grace was sufficient for me and that he loved me no matter what.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: That was a ripping.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: And something flooded from God who was covered within me into my soul area, the holy place.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_01: And my soul began to feel the only word I could describe it with was full for the first time in my life.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_01: And with that experience, I wrote a book called Fullness.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_01: It was a book about grace, but I didn't know what else to call it because I just felt full for the first time.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_01: And my soul settled and I had rest and peace.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_00: God loves me.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: God's with me.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_00: I lack nothing.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: He's here.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_01: He said, In that day you will cry and say, Lord, Lord, and I will say, Here am I, I am here.
• 28:09
  unknown: Rip.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: But if the if the light that's in you be darkness, how great is that darkness?
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a veil.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_01: God's there.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_01: Do we see him?
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_01: What do we see?
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_01: The veil.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't have time to get into that, but that veil is made up of imaginations.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_01: Just false thoughts.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_01: That's why Jesus, why Paul, excuse me, said the gospel, the good news, which counters the thoughts and imaginations that were false.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_01: The good news is the power that brings salvation to all, he said.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's the truth that makes us free.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_01: Galatians 1:15, here's how Paul said it.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_01: He said, But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb and called me through his grace to unveil his son in me so that I can preach him among the Gentiles?
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_01: So what is it that happens when you when so the Bible says, so but when one turns to the Lord, the veil is removed and we behold the glory.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_01: This creation called man, this beloved creation called man.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_01: How many of you believe that God likes humans?
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_01: That all of you raised your hand.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_01: That to me, that's a big deal.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I don't that I'm actually you know, I did not think that for a long time.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_01: Look at us, how could he?
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and I don't see what's going on.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know that God was there to love me from the inside out.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_01: What did I what did I need?
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_01: I just needed rip.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: I just needed a truth.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_01: I just needed unveiling.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, doesn't the Bible talk about that a lot?
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_01: Unveiling, revealing.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_01: We talk about, oh, I got a revelation, revelation of God, what is it?
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_01: It's this, it's rip.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: And when you get a revelation, Judy and I were talking about this the other day.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: You know, there's a there's a scripture that says that we we are changed in the moment in the twinkling of an eye, and the way I like to look at that is that uh maybe it's it's metaphoric, or but either way, I I know that when truth, when your eye sees truth or when light hits the eye, a change happens.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_01: You see something differently.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_01: So what happens when one turns to the Lord?
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_01: When I saw that something was revealed to me.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_01: Something had to be revealed to me.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_01: In fact, and even though something, I I I got a revelation that changed my life with my initial experience with God, I also have the story that many people have that I lived for a while with a mixed message, and so I had a mixed experience with God.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_01: And and I can honestly say that a lot of my the things that I knew were just not so.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but they were what I thought, and there was no condemnation to me, and it didn't mean I was stupid or anything like that.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's just all I could see.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I was hindered by a lot of the religious rhetoric that that I inherited and believed, and I passed on, and a lot of that was keeping a veil in my in my in my inner man, my mind, my heart, whatever you want to call it, but it was keeping me from seeing the beauty of God's glory uh in a way that I see I see him more now.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I love him because of that unveiling, because of that salvation uh or being made more whole within my soul.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_01: But because of some of the ideas that I had, see, I was I was talking all about trying to get in there, trying to get where God is.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I'm still believing I was separated, reinforcing an idea of a veil.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_01: And so it becomes hard to trust a God who's behind a veil.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: That you're not connected to.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_01: It becomes hard to you can try, you can believe in faith as I did, but you keep, you're trying to faith, you're trying to faith it up, you're trying to believe, you're trying to, you know, do all these all these things, trying to fulfill all these areas of obedience, so you'll force God into a corner, and God will say, Okay, I guess I have to bless you here, you know.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: Because he's a God that's separated by that by that veil with within my mind and within my heart, even to this day.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_01: When we read, a veil can be upon our heart.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_01: And the veil is removed in Christ.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_01: And what is Christ?
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_01: He is the revealing of the Father, He is the good news, He is grace.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_01: We beheld, we beheld the glory as of the only begotten Son.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_01: Full, somebody say full.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_01: Not just a little bit, not just some, not like, yeah, but full of grace, full of truth.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_01: Rip.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: We have another picture.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_01: What happens when the heart turns to the Lord?
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_01: This is what happens.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_01: And we behold the glory of the Lord, and we're changed because of Christ in you, God dwelling in you, the Spirit of God pouring out that love into your heart, or say into your soul by the Holy Ghost.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_01: Spirit of Christ, Spirit of God dwelling in you.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what floods the soul and it changes things.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_01: Changes what you think, changes how you see things, changes how you act.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_01: People, your, your people, well, what about character?
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_01: What about behavior?
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_01: Come on, I like grace, but come on, what about behavior?
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_01: It changes you.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_01: Huh?
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_01: You get your heart flooded with love, you think I still have to harp on your behavior?
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_01: You get your heart flooded with joy.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_01: You think I still have to preach?
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_01: Don't fear now, don't fear, don't fear.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_01: The joy of the Lord, your strength, perfect love cast out fear.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's all done in Christ.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_01: The fullness of God is in him.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: Paul said, I pray that you would know that this kind of love, so you can be filled with all the fullness of God, that you would know the goodness of God.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_01: All you guys preach, you don't preach, you don't preach balanced over there.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_01: All you do is just talk about grace and love and and the goodness of God.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_01: And that's if you can see him, that's all it is.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_01: So when I had an experience after 20 years of Christianity that was a dramatic change, and that's the change that I talk about more than anything else.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_01: Why?
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_01: Because on that day, I made a more full turn towards Christ, who is the fullness of the expression of God.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_01: What do I mean by turning towards Christ?
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_01: I turned more to one that was the true God, true Father, true creator, and not this image that I had, because before I was turned to an image.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_01: Is he take my glory and reveal it to you, he'll show it to you.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_01: Someone says, Ah, see?
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_01: Wait.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_01: Gotta be that Holy Spirit that comes in.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_01: You figure out where from where does it come from?
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_01: Where does the Holy Spirit come from?
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_01: From the Holy of Holies.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_01: From heaven.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_01: Not just the Uranus, not just the sky with clouds.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_01: But the heavens, the heaven in you.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_01: God, uh Ecclesiastes, God has put eternity in the hearts of men.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_01: Jesus said, the kingdom of God or the kingdom of heaven is within you.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_01: Heaven is in your heart.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: And with salvation, with the truth, Soteria, the unveiling of Christ that does continue to happen in us, rip, rip, rip.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_01: He says, the whole being shall be full of light.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_01: And that's your you are that's your authentic self.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_01: That's your true self.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_01: That's who you were born and really made to be in Christ from the foundation of the world.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's your true identity.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's not a mind trick trying to trick yourself that you're something to God.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's the reality that has been from eternity and always will be.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_01: Verse 14 says, But their minds were made dull.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_01: Because to this day, that same veil remains when the old covenant is read.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_01: And that's all they had to read as far as scriptures in those days, right?
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_01: It has not been removed because only in Christ is it taken away.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_01: Full of grace, full of truth.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_01: What about the other side?
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_01: What other side if he's full of grace and full of truth?
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_01: And if you ever have a question about that, well, see, it says truth too.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_01: So it's full of grace, but he's also full of truth.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_01: Well, what truth are you talking about?
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that he's mean, too.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that he, you know, there's so many things you can say, but what he's saying is that that grace is the truth.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_01: Full of grace.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_01: Full of truth.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_01: And we hear it around here a lot, and I don't have to take a lot of time to make the point, but everything about Jesus in his life, in his teachings, especially his work on the cross, shouts grace to the hearer.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_01: Shouts a loving father, shouts a good God, shouts a being who is your father, your creator, if you will, your origin, whose existence is defined as absolute love.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_01: He is light and in him is no darkness at all.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_01: For where the Lord is, there can be no darkness.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_01: For where the because the spirit that's in you, the Lord is that spirit.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_01: And where the spirit of the Lord is, there's liberty in the soul.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_01: We rejoice today, we celebrate Jesus, for he is the revelation of the Father who has always been.
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_01: Let's finish this up.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_01: Verse 15 says, even to this day when Moses is read, the veil covers their hearts.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_01: But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, that veil is taken away.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_01: This is why we preach what we do, because if you can consider that maybe God is absolutely wonderful, good in love and grace, and we're not being, we're not being overbalanced, and we're not we're not overstating it.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_01: I promise you.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_01: Every time I get I stand up in a in a in a pulpit, I talk about how good Daddy is, and I promise you, I have never overstated him.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_01: I have never said, Oh God, I'm so you know, I I need to apologize because I said you were this good, but you're only that good.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_01: And we do that because when you can believe him, see.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes Judy and I, we tell people, they say, How do we do that?
• 40:51
  SPEAKER_01: I say, maybe you just need to start with considering.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe consider it, maybe it's true.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_01: What if God really loved me this way?
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_01: What if?
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_01: What if, what if, what if it's true?
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_01: What if it's true?
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_01: You consider that.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_01: That's the beginning of the rip.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's ripped in Christ.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_01: We are but we are victims, I think many of us, we have been victims a lot of times of systems that instead of unveiling the beauty happened to us, they're doing this.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_01: They're sewing up what Christ has unveiled.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_01: But that's okay, those threads can be broken again.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_01: Verse 16, but when one turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_01: 17, now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_01: And we all, with unveiled faces, we contemplate the Lord's glory.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_01: And we're being transformed, Soteria, changed into his image with ever-increasing glory.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_01: Now remember, we're not something horrible, evil, and bad being turned into something better and good because he says it's like looking in a glass, a mirror.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: What we're seeing when we behold him is we find our identity in him and we see who we are.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_01: The prodigal son came to be a servant in a man's house that was called his father.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_01: But when he beheld the goodness of his father, his identity was restored.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_01: We're being transformed into his image because that is the original, before the fall of Adam, the original image inscribed upon us.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: And it's happening with ever-increasing, unveiling glory, and it's coming from the Lord who is that spirit.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_01: The secret is Christ in you.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_01: And it's always been, but it's revealed in the truth of Christ.
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_01: Have a wonderful day.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_01: God bless you.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_01: I believe in you, I love you.