Latest / The Imperfect Impulse w/Bree O'Connor / S 3 Ep 3: Why Did That Room Feel Icky/Awesome?

Transcript

S 3 Ep 3: Why Did That Room Feel Icky/Awesome? · The Imperfect Impulse w/Bree O'Connor

• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Imperfect Impulse with Bree O'Connor.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, I'm your host, Bree O'Connor.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just going to dip right into it.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if I have any preface that I can offer for today's subject.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm just going to go right into it and meet it head on.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: I want to talk about building a good room.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: And now I'm going to say that I can't really call myself an expert at building a good room.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: I don't have all the answers.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_00: However, I've been lucky enough for the last 35 years to find myself in some very good rooms.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I think where we really need to start is to define what is a good room.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: From my perspective,
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_00: having been in these rooms as Producer, writer, actor,
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: director,
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_00: and designer that I find the best rooms in my experience have been fun,
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: open, and relaxed.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: And really that's about it.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I know the conversation over the last 10 years,
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_00: maybe longer,
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: but in my world it's been 10 years and then it got really intense over the pandemic.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: And people started writing all of these guidelines and rules and things that began
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_00: to feel really scary.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_00: I had been in some rooms where how you were supposed to speak
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: to your collaborators became regimented and prescribed
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: that it shut down conversation.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it was interesting because in talking to some of the people
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: Who I shared those rooms with after the fact.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_00: I had many conversations with different artists about how they felt not afraid
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: that they were going to be hurt,
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: but they were looking at the rules that were spread out before them
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: and they were deeply worried that they were going to hurt someone else.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: I think a lot of well-intentioned arts professionals and enthusiasts have kind
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: of gone the long way around here.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: In the interest of protecting people,
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: they've made everyone feel a little on edge and primed for conflict.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: And this is actually a real psychological thing.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_00: I am at best a hobby behaviorist.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: I really enjoy finding out about why and how people behave the way that they do.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: I'm fascinated by behavioral psychology.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: There's one experience that sticks out in my mind or experiment that sticks out in my mind.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I may have talked about this before because I do get kind of hung up on these things.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: But I'm gonna say it again,
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: so if you've heard it twice, here it is in a slightly different context.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: Let's say you have two rooms, okay?
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: And in these two rooms are a random assortment of people.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: Like,
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: not really put in there for any particular reason other than their names came up on
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: a list and they got divided into these two rooms.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: Then you have the subject of the experiment and they were told
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: to visit these two rooms and have a conversation about what have you with
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: the people involved in room A and room B and then come out and talk
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: about what their experience was like with these two groups of people.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: And most of the time they were, you know, pleasant enough.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: We, as adults,
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: happen to have a good sense of how we should behave in public and people behave
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: that way and they have their prescribed conversations and they left the room
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: and they had decent,
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: maybe not intellectually life-shattering experiences,
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: but they had decent experiences in both room A and room B.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: Then they decided that they were going to prime the test subject by labeling the doors.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_00: So let's say room A would be labeled as argumentative and room B would be labeled as agreeable.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: Now the key here is that the people inside room A and room B,
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_00: they have no idea that there are these signs on the door.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: None whatsoever.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: These are the same randomly assigned rooms, right?
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: So when the subject comes into room A,
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: which is labeled argumentative,
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_00: then they are primed with this idea that this is a group of people
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_00: that they are going to not agree with, that they're going to be Difficult.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_00: So it turns out that more times than not,
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: the subject will come into this space expecting these people to be argumentative
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: and will behave as such.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: And that triggers the group to become argumentative.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: And when that subject goes into room B,
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_00: that is,
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_00: Primed with the sign that says agreeable,
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: they're going to walk into those rooms and treat those people as
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: if they're agreeable.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: And when they are treated that way, they tend to behave that way.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: And what does this tell us about building our rooms?
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: Is that in some ways these excessive rules over how
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: to communicate are Actually having the opposite effect.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: They are creating discord or setting us up to assume that we are going to be
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: in opposition to someone in that room.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: So from the get-go, you are set up for a difficult working situation.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_00: Any one person can tip the scales and if everyone else is coming
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_00: into this space neutral but you as the director or as an actor are coming into
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: the space with your own idea of like oh my god this is going
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_00: to be awful it's probably going to be awful.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: That's probably going to be your experience.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: So how do we,
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: before anyone sees anyone else,
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_00: how do we prime ourselves for openness and positivity?
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, certainly we do our best as people putting rooms together to try
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_00: and find compatible collaborators, right?
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: And in some ways the project itself is the organizing factor.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you are doing something very,
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_00: very specific,
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: let's say you have a show that's all about clowning and you have five clowns in
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: the room,
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: trained,
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: people who are way into clowning, then already they've got a starting point.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: They've got a place where they can connect.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, we have this baseline of commonality.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: We're all clowns here.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: So...
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_00: Let's start from there.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_00: And that ends up to generate a more positive experience when that's where you start.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_00: So with any project, where do you start?
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_00: How do you emphasize the commonality?
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_00: And then you are more likely to have a better outcome.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so let's start.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: Let's call that step one, intention, commonality.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: We are all in this space to do this thing together.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_00: That's a positive affirmation, right?
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: That is a stated goal in which we can all get around.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_00: And to be honest,
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: if you're there just to collect a paycheck or to become a star,
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: then you're not in a common goal because...
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_00: Never have I ever, ever entered a room in which I've thought, you know what?
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: All 15 of us are here to make Bill a star.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: Not once.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: Not any time have I ever been in a position,
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: even when I've worked with people Who have star quality or who are sought
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: after artists?
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: Have I ever entered a room in which all of the energy is poured into that one person
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: where we're all there to make that one person look good?
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_00: Oh man, that is just a miserable working situation.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: So let's never weight this on one person that will cause problems from the get-go.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: This is a community,
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_00: this is a communal art form that requires everyone's effort and the respect for
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_00: that effort.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_00: If we don't have that, then we are asking for trouble.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: So how do we maintain that camaraderie throughout the process?
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: I have seen throughout my career that this becomes way more successful
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: when bad behavior is not rewarded.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: Where diva behavior is not rewarded.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: If there's nothing you can get from that behavior,
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: You are either likely to not stay in the room, or you'll join the team.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: If there's no reward for you in being the greatest thing since sliced bread,
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: then you're more likely to be supportive and find more rewards in
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_00: that mutually supportive behavior,
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: which is the basis of theater, and I'm afraid that we've forgotten that a bit.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's really important,
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: especially those of us who are running these rooms,
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: that we decide we don't have favorites or pets or people that we lavish attention
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: upon.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: That is going to create discord in the room.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously,
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_00: there are times when you gel with someone better than someone else,
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: but respect doesn't mean the exact same treatment.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_00: Because sometimes some people really need and require a little bit more verbal acknowledgement.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: And some people prefer to be left alone to figure things out on their own.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: And it's our job in creating and maintaining these rooms that we learn how
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: to respond appropriately to the individual in front of us and what their needs are.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: And if we can't understand their needs,
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_00: then we have to be comfortable with just talking about it.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: Asking them, hey, would it be helpful for you if I sit down with you to talk about this moment?
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_00: Or would you prefer to go through it a few more times and then talk about it?
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: Let me know what works best for you.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: If you can honor and respect the way each person works and the way they function,
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: you're going to have a much more cohesive room.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: Let me bring that to talking about prescribed language.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: I've seen this become a huge problem in feedback spaces.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: Over the last six years in particular,
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_00: I've been in spaces that have been so minutely moderated so as to protect
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: the author's feelings that it has pretty much shut down any feedback whatsoever.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: I want to be cautious about how we model talking to each other about the work.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_00: I think one of the biggest issues that I've identified in my artistic practice is
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_00: that I tend to be very,
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_00: very defensive when someone tries to rewrite or heaven forbid act my role for me.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_00: That tends to put my back up.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: It makes me very defensive.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't think I'm alone there.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_00: I think most people get defensive when they feel that someone else is trying to take
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_00: over their expression, right?
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_00: We need to be careful about telegraphing to someone else what we think they should do.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: Instead, we should invite them to clarity.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: And this means that there's a lot of open language.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot more Being curious about what the artist is bringing to the table and
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: then trying to find a way to either meld your two ideas or
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: to figure out together what makes the most sense.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_00: That's a very abstract idea.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: Let's talk about first from the writer's perspective because this is
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: the most accessible example and I'll try to move into to acting in a second.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: When giving feedback to a writer especially
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: in early work first second drafts it's really helpful to get an idea from
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: the writer what their intention is and if you can't Figure out their intention.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: Well, then that's a spot where clarity is essential.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, okay,
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_00: I'm trying to figure out at the end of the scene why character A walked out
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_00: on character B. I wasn't particularly clear on that.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: Can you tell me what your thought process is there?
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what did you want me as the audience member to take away from that moment?
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: Then they'll tell you what they're hoping you take away.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: And then comes this series of questions and pulling them out.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like, oh, that's interesting.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I can see that it's not that character A was angry.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: Character A was embarrassed.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: So that means that I missed a cue earlier on in the scene that something was embarrassing.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: So is there any way that you could highlight that trigger for the audience
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: that came earlier in the scene?
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: Or maybe I need more information to know why character A had that response.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: Did character B mean to offend or embarrass them?
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, so if that was accidental,
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: maybe there's some circumstances that needed to be clear for why they said that at
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: that moment.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_00: Did they know that that would be embarrassing?
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: Did they do it on purpose?
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: See, there becomes a whole bunch of questions that come around how to make
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_00: that moment Work the way the artist intended.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: Not what I usually get from inexperienced feedback givers.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: That's a really clunky, maybe you can give me some feedback on how to express that.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_00: But for people who are more focused on Making sure that their idea gets into
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: the mix, that their idea is the best idea.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: They'll just come in and say, I don't think character A should have left there.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_00: Character A should definitely have pulled out a gun and shot character B.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_00: Because then you will have character A on the run for the rest of the play running
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_00: from this murder.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's all about guilt and things that I'm interested in.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, that's not helpful to the writer.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: The writer was writing something else entirely.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: But yet, you see this all the time in rooms that become antagonistic.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_00: Instead of helping the other artist,
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: not to become a better artist, but to make the moment clearer.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_00: Because those are two different intentions, right?
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: If you're coming into the room thinking that you're going
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: to help these people become better artists,
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_00: you've already set yourself above everybody else and you're going to have problems.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: If you are partners in creating the moment,
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: then you are going to have a more amicable, pleasant room.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: This all goes back to my original thought about how do we create these rooms so
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: that every voice matters and that everyone is here to lift each other up and
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: to create the moment that could only happen between the people who are in this room,
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_00: between the artists who are here.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: And let's face it, since they are there in the room, they belong there.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: You belong.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: If you're in the room, that's it.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: You belong.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: And if that is communicated by priming the group in advance that this is a room
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_00: of belonging,
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_00: you can use that whole experiment with the door A and door B to your advantage
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: by setting it up with Positivity,
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: And welcoming and by modeling that our focus is on creating
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: the right dramatic moments.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: And not about elevating or making anyone in particular look good.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_00: This isn't about Bill.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_00: It isn't about Susie.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_00: It's about the collective.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: And when we are encouraged...
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: And now this is where we get into some nitty gritty and I think this is
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: where I really believe in the repertory model in that
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: the more you know your ensemble,
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_00: the better off the ensemble is and the more smoothly that they work together.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: So when building your ensemble,
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: it is really helpful to have at least some members
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: who understand what this community standards are so that they just model it.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's just alive in this space.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm all for having new-to-you artists join the room,
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_00: but if everyone is a complete stranger, It's a bit of a heavier push.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: That's why at Playful Substance, I don't like auditions.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_00: I prefer to get to know artists through developmental reading,
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_00: which is low stakes, and I get to see how people respond to one another.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_00: Can they listen and respond honestly?
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, can they They really set themselves free to do their artist thing.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_00: Are they interested in feeling their way through the moment and in figuring it out together?
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_00: And if we can set up a space in which all of that is free and possible,
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: but there are boundaries so that everyone feels held and supported,
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_00: then you have yourself an ideal space for creativity.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: An ideal space that is about building the ensemble and the piece in front
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: of you moment by moment and not about anyone in particular.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_00: Ensemble truly is a rising tide lifts all boats and that's generally a phrase
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: that I don't like because it's usually a bit disingenuous when we talk about it in
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: the political sphere but in terms of an ensemble I think it's very very true.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_00: If the room is good for one person it has to be good for all people
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: and I don't think That micromanaging everyone's behavior and standards is the way
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_00: to make everyone feel safe.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's a way to make people feel paranoid.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's a way to make people feel on edge and worried that they're not saying
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_00: or doing the right thing.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: I was once in a development space where a director and writer...
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: had decided that they wanted only comments from the actors
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: about how they felt inside the role but they didn't want any commentary on
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: the script.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_00: Now as I said that to you, do you know what kind of feedback they want?
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_00: I'll tell you I didn't know either.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: It was very confusing and it on several occasions led to tears.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: That is not the kind of room that you want to be in.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's not the kind of room that you want to cultivate.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_00: That's very adversarial and confusing and frightening.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: And let's face it, as much as like the theater and entertainment, like what we do is Is fun.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_00: It should be fun.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, we work hard.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_00: We work very hard to do the things that we do.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_00: And we take risks that most people don't want to take.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we willingly walk into spaces and say,
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: I am going to experience the worst things a human being can experience.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm going to do it voluntarily.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: Is I'm going to go ahead and experience loss and heartbreak and betrayal.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_00: All of these things that we sign up for when we walk into the rehearsal room is hard work.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: But it's also very rewarding and lovely work if we can all feel like we are in it together.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and we can take that out into the real world.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: I think that is also extraordinarily beneficial when that happens to me
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: in my real life, outside the rehearsal room, outside the theater.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_00: But, you know,
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: for now,
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_00: let's focus on creating development spaces and rehearsal spaces
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: and performance spaces that feel like everyone belongs.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: That feel like everyone can have a say and do so respectfully and
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_00: with honoring each person who is in the space.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: There's so much more to talk about with this subject,
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: but I think that if all we do is walk away from this discussion thinking
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: about how we enter spaces, what assumptions we bring with us,
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_00: And how we are priming ourselves for experience.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: And whether or not we are coming to this space with an egalitarian outlook.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: We are coming to this space to uplift the entire community in that space.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_00: Or if we are looking to rise above in some way.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: That those are things that we need to check in ourselves.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_00: And make difficult for other people to do.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_00: We should make it really difficult to be demanding for no reason.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: To be honest, we shouldn't have to become demanding.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: In an ideal world,
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: we are being seen and acknowledged as full people and trust that we are being held
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_00: by the group.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_00: And if that's true, What demands do we actually have?
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_00: That's really all there is, folks.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then,
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_00: of course,
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_00: let's be honest about listening and responding with authenticity,
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_00: which I think is something we should talk more in depth about,
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_00: because I think that a lot of our problems in spaces are really
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_00: Intertwined with our inability to do that thing that is at the core of
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_00: the actor's work, which is to listen and respond with authenticity.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_00: But we've already gone about a half hour and I think we should leave it here for now.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's always fun to think that we have more to talk about.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_00: That's it for me today on the Imperfect Impulse.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_00: I look forward to chatting with you again next week.