Latest / Auto Collabs / Loading the Statue of David with Michael Cirillo

Transcript

Loading the Statue of David with Michael Cirillo · Auto Collabs

• 0:00
  [upbeat music] This is AutoCollabs. Well, welcome to AutoCollabs, and, uh, it's just me, Kyle Mounts here.
• 0:13
  Normally, you'd see Michael Cirillo, and Paul Jay Daly, and myself jamming about a guest that we're about to interview. Uh, but today you get something a little bit special.
• 0:20
  It's a special episode because we were on the ground at the 800% Elite Automotive Club event, and we actually got the chance to sit down in person with Michael Cirillo.
• 0:30
  So, Paul and I turned the f- script on him and decided to interview him, and to get- get a little bit of backstory on his work with the Dealer Playbook and everything that that's been going on in the past, as well as Flex Dealer and the technology that they have there.
• 0:42
  So, uh, welcome to this special episode and we hope you enjoy this interview with Michael Cirillo. [upbeat music] Whoa. He just did a tour- Oh, my goodness... of Atlanta in the back of an Uber. I- He was like- Yes...
• 0:55
  "Let me out in every neighborhood. I wanna walk the streets." No, it was more like, "Are we supposed to see 'Welcome to Alabama' signs?" [laughs] No. [laughs] Where the balls are we? Well- Oh, boy.
• 1:05
  Look, coming- That's tough... coming- That's rough. [laughs] Yeah, that's so rough. Coming from a place that doesn't have much traffic. Yeah. I don't understand why anyone lives in a place with traffic. Yeah, fair.
• 1:16
  [laughs] Well, and I live- They have I-Fly. What was that? They have I-Fly. That's true. [laughs] That's true. Yeah, what- what do you have where you live? Clean water. [laughs] A lot of- Rolling, rolling hills...
• 1:28
  rolling hills. [laughs] Gorgeous landscapes. Five-minute commutes anywhere. Yeah, fair. Okay. [laughs] Beautiful lakes. Shall we go on? Is everybody ripping around on scooters- No... where you live?
• 1:39
  Well, there is one downfall of where I live in Syracuse. Which is? It stays snowy for a while. [laughs] Mm. Solid nine months of the year. Scooters don't work in snow. Yeah.
• 1:48
  All the good things I just explained was, like, three weeks. Yeah. [laughs] Make the most of it. Yeah. Hi, guys. Hey. It's been a while. Oh, ♪ Cara, cara ♪ [laughs] It has, it has. Well, let's see.
• 2:00
  We are here on the ground at a 800% Elite event. Mm-hmm. The last time we were together was at- We're not just on the, on the ground, but we're In the Dirt. We are in the dirt. See what we did there?
• 2:09
  See- You see what we did there?... this, this is- Cirillo actually doesn't even know this... this is a new podcast you're on. You didn't even know it. Okay. W- uh, hobbies are start podcasts. [laughs] One per month.
• 2:20
  One per month. One podcast. What is this podcast? It's called In the Dirt with a Soto. You're- [laughs] You're on In the Dirt- Hey, welcome back to-... with a Soto... In the Dirt with the same dudes from the other show.
• 2:30
  Well- [laughs]... you're technically not a reg- there are no regular- Okay, I'm not a regular. Well, there are no regular hosts of the show.
• 2:36
  So, the In the Dirt show is basically whenever we're on ground, whether it's us or somebody else. Maybe one day we're gonna flip you the podcast kit and you're gonna be hosting the In the Dirt podcast. I'll take this.
• 2:45
  I know you will. [laughs] He's like, "Sure." He's like, "I'll take it right now." It's the Portuguese. [laughs] Uh, you said free, right?
• 2:51
  [laughs] And so, and so yeah, whenever we're on the ground, this is gonna kind of be the catchall for when we just get... Like, we were at NAMM a couple weeks ago. Oh, right. Okay. So, we did the- Gotcha...
• 3:01
  because, like, you wanna do a podcast, but you can't, like, launch a podcast for every time you're on the ground somewhere. So, In the Dirt seemed like the right move. That makes sense. Good for you. Good job.
• 3:10
  How does it feel? It feels like you're making fun of me. I'm not making fun of you. [laughs] Good job. I mean, you did the thing. Hey, we- not all of us can be in 80 countries, okay, Cirillo? Uh, 104.
• 3:20
  [laughs] 100, 104 now. Every- This man's podcast- Mom got VPNs... you know how long it took me to teach my mom NordVPN? [laughs] Yeah.
• 3:28
  Submit all those internet- Coming into, I didn't even know they had internet access there. Yeah, that's right. Starlink. They have Starlink. You're like, "Isn't that the island that, uh, Tom Hanks filmed Cast Away on?
• 3:36
  How did they get internet?" Yeah, well, Starlink. All right. We're interviewing you- Okay. Oh, all right... is what's happening. Is that what we're doing? [laughs] Let's do it. Okay. No. Okay, so here's the thing.
• 3:46
  Tomorrow we're talking a lot about technology. Mm-hmm.
• 3:48
  And a lot of people actually don't know this about you, that you, even though you are a massive per- podcast personality, have the silkiest, smoothest voice in automotive, and- He's setting you up for something.
• 4:00
  [laughs] I know. I'm very nervous right now. I'm so nervous... and have spoken in front of thousands of people across the country on massive stages, you also- That's all true. That's all true...
• 4:09
  you also have a technology company that kind of, like, circles around agency and marketing, but also you have leaned into some of these, like, by default, you just saw opportunities and created solutions for dealers.
• 4:23
  Yeah. Can you talk through, like, the migration of going, "Hey, we're gonna serve dealers as an agency." It started as, I know it was, like, newspaper, direct mail type stuff- Yeah, yeah, yeah... back in the day. Mm-hmm.
• 4:32
  Before, like, you were even a part of it, and then all of a sudden you're creating technology for dealers. What's that look like? How does that move happen?
• 4:39
  So, one, one of my, one of my things that I'm, I'm extremely proud of for the Cirillo family- Oh... which is why I wear this honkin' ring, by the way. Is that a crest? A lot of people- I always wondered.
• 4:47
  It's a family crest Why have we never asked you about that? Let me see this. It's a family crest. Put that up in the camera right up there. That's a fancy family crest. Look at that. Boom.
• 4:52
  One of the things that I'm extremely proud of is there hasn't been a time in the last 60 years that the Cirillo's haven't generated their own revenue. Like, with no capital to start. Wow. No bank loans, no nothing.
• 5:05
  Like, we just go for it and we do it. And so my dad started a phone book company back in the, like, like 1979.
• 5:12
  He started a phone book company, and it was deeply rooted in, there was no competition- That was, like, three years before you were born... but Yellow Pages. Uh-huh.
• 5:19
  And- I just saw your birth year in the, the, inside of your brain tattoo. Yeah, you saw that too? Yeah. Yeah. And, and so he did that, and he did it success- successfully. How do you know so much about me?
• 5:27
  [laughs] Yeah, how, how do you know? I read your wiki. Yeah. [laughs] You, you volunteered the information on Facebook. Um- I got your fingerprints too... so he started that company out of desperation, right?
• 5:37
  Which is, I think, a lot of good things actually come from that as a standpoint. You have to do it, right? You have to do it. Have to do it. It's life or death. I got four little babies at home.
• 5:44
  I don't know how I'm gonna produce. Hey, nobody's doing this thing. I'm interested.
• 5:48
  So, he actually, he, he's got one of those really cool stories where he spent his last dollar walking into a pawn shop buying a typewriter. No way.
• 5:55
  And he drove dump trucks, like garbage trucks, for the city during the day, and then he would come home at night and copy names out of the phone book, uh, one at a time on his typewriter.
• 6:04
  Taught himself how to sell-Went around to businesses in the, in the Vancouver area, sold... He, he's like, "I don't have the book yet, but like, your ad's gonna be like this big." It's gonna be great. Yeah.
• 6:14
  So they, he gets around to, to basically teaching himself everything that he needs to know about how to do this, and, uh, publishes the ph- first phone book.
• 6:22
  Gets a call from the chamber of commerce, and the chamber of commerce is like, "We're mad at you." [laughs] "We're so mad at you." And they're like, he's like, "What did I do wrong?"
• 6:29
  He's like, "You didn't ask all of the businesses that are members of the chamber if they wanted to advertise in your book." [laughs] You're like, "Oh." [laughs] "Oh, shame on me." Right. So- "Apologize." He, hold on.
• 6:39
  "Will you take me back?" "Let me check with the accountant." Right. "Hey, hey honey, raise the price." [laughs] Yeah. "Let me check with the accountant. You good with it?" "Yeah, I'm good with it."
• 6:48
  He's like doing his own voice. [laughs] And that's where the voices stem from. Yeah. [laughs] Um, so he did that. We, he, he built it up, you know, sold franchises of this telephone directory right across Canada.
• 6:59
  Saw the writing on the wall, you know, '95, '96, something like that. He was like, "This is not gonna end very well." So he sold the franchise right as the internet was coming around.
• 7:09
  And I remember my dad pulling us into his home office. He's like, "Guys, come check the family council." He pulls- Oh, is that what it's called? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Cirullo family council. Cirullo's unite, you know.
• 7:18
  You hold the crest up, right? That's right. Everybody touches rings. [laughs] Yeah. Earth. You're like, "How did you know?" Wind. Yeah. [laughs] Fire. Fire. Dirt. [laughs] Ground and dirt, dude.
• 7:29
  [laughs] Um, and uh, and he's like, "Watch this." [imitates computer sounds] Yeah. Yeah, I remember that, yeah. And I'm like, "What is happening?" You know, like- Aliens... before time began, there was the cube.
• 7:43
  Like that- Right... that sort of thing. I'm like, "What's happening?" [laughs] He's like, "This will kill the encyclopedia salesman." Dang. Literally? Yeah. I was like, "Whoa." He's like, "This right here."
• 7:55
  So there were like four websites available in Canada. Britannica. I was like, yeah. Right? AOL. Encyclopedia Britannica. Britannica all day. And it was like, [imitates bouncing]
• 8:02
  It was like the Statue of David, and we're like- Load it... "Why is it taking so long for his penis to load?" [laughs] You know? You were really waiting for that? I was like, "Well, oh, is he gonna be wearing shorts?"
• 8:10
  [laughs] Uh, this is gonna kill the encyclopedia salesman, and that set me down a path. And this podcast episode. Go ahead.
• 8:15
  I'm gonna talk a little bit about this, uh, tomorrow or the next day, whenever, whenever I talk about it. But, um, that sent me down a path where I was like, "What is, what is the implication of this?"
• 8:24
  'Cause I remember people coming to my doorstep, like Watkins sales people- All day... selling their ointments and their oils. Well, the encyclopedia, it was the best value proposition for a salesman ever, right?
• 8:34
  Right now you think like, "Well, a car is a good value prop-" It's like, "Do you want your kids to be stupid?" [laughs] Because- Right... all your neighbors bought this one. Yeah.
• 8:43
  Your kids are gonna be the dumbest kids on the block. You're like, "Okay, I get it." Oh, and you get world history volumes one through three, right?
• 8:49
  That's right, 'cause we were always like, "Why are there more than 26 volumes?" Kyle's like, "This used to happen?" [laughs] Oh, no, we had an encyclopedia. Are you kidding me? Do you remember the salesman, though?
• 8:57
  Oh, yeah, without a doubt. We had a, we had three different versions. What, what are the other ones? Britannica. World Book. World Book. World Book. Yeah. We had a World Book, we had a Britannica, we got...
• 9:05
  You know, what's even more crazy about it- [laughs]... is like- Got them up now... the, what's even more crazy about it is you had to buy a new one every three years. The updated version. Or you were like- Yeah...
• 9:15
  you were totally writing papers the wrong way. Right. Yeah. You were screwed. History changed. Yeah. Right. [laughs] Yeah. Th- think about this. Think about this.
• 9:22
  It took 1500 years to go from a chariot and horses to a horse and buggy. Like, it took 1500 years for someone to be like, "But what if the kids wanna come with us?" Right. Oh. [laughs] And my spouse.
• 9:36
  'Cause there's room for one. Like that. Right. And, and so to your point, updating this thing every three years, my dad, my dad saw the writing on the wall. He was like, "They're out."
• 9:44
  And sure enough, h- here we are all these years later. But that sent me down a path. I t- I just took such an interest in that.
• 9:51
  Um, but you know, in, i- in many cases, you know, family businesses are often born out of necessity. So I remember my dad coming to me one day after he had sold the, the phone book franchise. He took a few years o- off.
• 10:02
  I don't know, did like a, like what do you, like a little- Found himself? Yeah... like a little Springer. Yeah. [laughs] You're like, you're like, "Well, I don't know. Whatever." [laughs] And, uh, he came back.
• 10:12
  I, I remember distinctly, he went on a motorcycle trip to Washington State. Oh, he really did it. Oh, yeah. He was like- Go walkabout. Yeah. Yeah... massive long hair. Little mullet, mustache. Yeah, bandana.
• 10:22
  [laughs] Put the... He came back from that motorcycle trip, I must've been 16, 17 years old, and he's like, "You're gonna learn to sell." And I was like- [laughs] Cowabunga, dude.
• 10:34
  Like, he's like, "No, you're gonna learn how to sell. There's no competition to Autotrader in Canada." And that was the beginning of it. We didn't have mock-ups. We didn't have anything. That's how we- Yeah...
• 10:42
  that, so he knew print. He took the, the next opening that he saw in familiar territory, and he's like, "You're gonna learn how to sell."
• 10:49
  So we literally split the valley, well, not literally, figuratively split the valley- [laughs]... that we lived in in half. Yes, sir. And he was like, "You're gonna go north and visit all these old dudes," right?
• 10:59
  'Cause now, like, look at the face of car dealers that we have here. Oh, they're so beautiful. When I was 16- Look at these ones... they were not this young. Right? When I was 16- That's true... they were not this young.
• 11:07
  They were old. They were all named Dave, for starters. [laughs] They were all named Dave. Every single one of them was named Dave. [laughs] D- there's a Dave here. Dave. He's like, "What do you got?" Poor Dave.
• 11:16
  Oh, my gosh, Dave. They're still named Dave. Exactly. Dave is here. It's Dave. They're all grumpy, and they were all- Dave from '93... like, they were all loud talkers. You know what I'm saying?
• 11:24
  Like, they were all loud talkers. You'd come in and you'd be like- Dave's so loud, too. Yeah. [laughs] It was, it was like- Dave never said a word the whole time...
• 11:31
  so I, I remember walking into dealerships, you know, 16, 17-year-old Michael talking to 67-year-old Dave who's like, "What do you want, kid?" And it's like- They saw you coming up and they said to the guy, "Watch this."
• 11:41
  The, there's a thing. You know, the, what's the nervous- I'm gonna make him cry in 30 seconds. And then these people, the nervous swallow. Yeah, yeah. The nervous swallow.
• 11:47
  [laughs] Um, I'm, it's gonna be a double pitch spread, and I'm gonna have a high gloss, and...
• 11:55
  You know, so, um, you know, but I'm grateful to my dad, you know, both my parents really, for knowing that I was gonna be so awful at that, and, and in some way putting the, [laughs] like the outcomes of the family- On your shoulders [laughs]...
• 12:11
  like, I can't imagine what my dad was thinking. Like, he's driving to the other side of this valley in rural British Columbia being like, "Hope my son doesn't F up the business plan today."
• 12:19
  [laughs] Driving in his Kia Rio like, "Nee"... down the freeways trying to get to dealers. Um, but you know, that was successful. Around, around 20- 2006, I saw the writing on the wall.
• 12:32
  So I'd kind of cut my teeth and I'm like, "Hey, I'm, I hear some rumblings. Dealers are like, 'There's this website craze-" Yeah... "and this thing.'" So that's when I came to my dad.
• 12:43
  It was around 2010, I came to my dad and I said, "I gotta kill your whole business." He's like, "What you talking about, Willis?" [laughs] He was like- You're like, "Remember that family council?" Yeah.
• 12:52
  I'm like, "Watch this." Earth! [laughs] And I just, like, did stand up for five minutes, and then I was like, "Now back to business."
• 12:58
  [laughs] No, I was like, "Hey, we gotta kill the whole business or else we're gonna be out of business." Yeah. Right? We're gonna be out of business. '08, '09 ra- like, raked us over the coals, dude.
• 13:07
  We were watching clients leave. Oh, yeah. Right? 'Cause there were- For sure... w- like, look, we all wake up... A- and I do this sometimes.
• 13:14
  You wake up on the wrong side of the bed, what's the first thing that gets axed? Your marketing budget. Right. [laughs] Son of a! Where's the marketer? No one has ever done that in this room- Right...
• 13:23
  that's a dealer, ever. They're all like, "No, we keep that around." It's marketing's fault. Ha ha, ha ha, ha ha. Yeah. [laughs] Yeah, yeah. Listen- Oh... they're getting rowdy out there. [laughs] Oh, yeah.
• 13:34
  Hey, put the chair back, Strosnider. [laughs] Uh, so, um, I was like y- "We gotta do something about this." Right.
• 13:42
  Um, I contacted my best friend growing up, who, who's our CTO today, and I'm like, "Hey, I don't know how we're gonna pay you, but can you join this thing? I have this vision.
• 13:52
  I wanna, I wanna basically go and, as a value add to people to advertise in our magazine as kind of a transition period, if they do a double page spread, we'll put their entire inventory online for free on our port-" On the internet...
• 14:05
  on our portal site. And he's like, "First of all, do you have a portal site?" And I'm like, "First of all, I don't know what a portal is." [laughs] Let's get this straight. But we're giving it to them.
• 14:14
  That's why I need you. I heard it somewhere. Someone said... Right? And, uh- One time, the Statue of David. I don't know [laughs] It was- Let me tell you about David's penis.
• 14:24
  [laughs] Let me bring it back to Kelln's family council. [laughs] Right. And he's like, "So do..." 'Cause you know CTOs, they're always, like, they bring you right back down to the dirt as quick as possible.
• 14:33
  They're like, "It's gonna take $38 million- It's level six... 74 months with 58 devs. You ready for that, asshole?" And that is, and that's if we get the Israeli dev team on board. [laughs] Right. [laughs] That's right.
• 14:44
  So we came to him, I was like, "We're gonna need to build an inventory management system, 'cause h- how else are we gonna get this inventory online?" Naturally. Naturally.
• 14:52
  We're like, "Uh, w- what's the, what's home brew?" [laughs] You know, "Let's do everything ourselves." Uh- Call Vertical, baby. I, I called...
• 15:00
  You know, those were our moments of ignorance as we were trying to sort things out. But all these years later, um, you know, so, so we were selling tech. We built our own CMS.
• 15:09
  We built our own inventory management system. Uh- CMS, content management system. Content management. Yeah. So manage your own website, do all those sorts of things. We built all of that.
• 15:18
  Um, and you know, that was, like, that was, like, my career vom springe. 'Cause you know those moments as an entrepreneur where you're like, "I freaking suck. I don't know what I'm doing." Yeah, I remember.
• 15:27
  "Holy crap, look at that-" You mean 3:00 today? I remember this morning. Yeah, and 5:00 today. 3:00 and 5:00 today.
• 15:32
  [laughs] Yeah, you're like, "Cool, look at that gazillion dollar business that's well-funded doing the thing that I thought I was clever at," and, you know, they're doing it in 83 million- I know... stores...
• 15:41
  I'll be a podcaster instead. I'll be a podcaster. [laughs] You know, uh, so we built this thing and it did quite well.
• 15:51
  And then I had an idea which was, "How can I cleverly, and in a good, human kind of way, get to know all of our competitors out there better than our competitors know themselves? I'll create an agency arm."
• 16:04
  And that blew up. Like, that took off. It did so well. Uh, and that's what, you know, part of our company does that today.
• 16:10
  But now we're at a place where as the agency has kind of continued to grow and we've proved our thesis that you can, in fact, be inc- not just say transparency, but actually demonstrate it and behave with transparency.
• 16:23
  Now that we've proven that that works, we've revisited back to this tech piece where we're like, "Wait a minute. Why are dealers paying five, six..."
• 16:31
  Why are they paying all this money for something that we've had all along that they could deploy and use and scale without a three-month learning curve? Yeah.
• 16:39
  You want, you wanna get your inventory managed and know how to do it in 30 minutes? Shabam, I'm like fricking Emeril Lagasse over here. Sa-plow! Wow. So- Bam! Yeah. And then it just works.
• 16:50
  [laughs] So, so the- Yeah, we need a soundtrack... the, the side note is- So all that to say... we've, we've nicknamed our tech Bobby, after Bobby the Wonder Dog.
• 17:00
  I don't know if you guys know the story of Bobby the Wonder Dog where this- I do not. Okay, so Bobby- No. I'm ready for it, though... the, the, the story of this is basically- I thought you meant Bobby Brown...
• 17:05
  a family drove across the country on a family vacay. Their dog gets lost at, like, a truck stop somewhere on the other side of the country. They're on the East Coast from the West Coast. Months go by.
• 17:15
  They're like, "Bobby dead. Like, there's no way. Like, he's lost." Bobby dead. "He got hit." He's dead. Bobby's dead. This dog, this, look him up. No, Bobby. Bobby's dead. This dog found his way home.
• 17:24
  This dog found his way home all the way back to West Coast. Like Bolt. They made a Disney movie about that. Yeah, it's kind of like Bolt.
• 17:28
  And so we, we nickname it Bobby 'cause we're like, "No matter what we do, we've tried to kill it at times- Find its way home... it just keeps finding it- Keeps coming back... its way back." That's fantastic.
• 17:36
  So we've decided to really lean heavily into this. We've got about 67 rooftops now that are using this. Uh, 30 to- About 67... th- 35. [laughs] Yeah, about 67. 66 to 68. Almost 100. Between those two.
• 17:49
  Um- I haven't checked my phone since I've gotten on the podcast. Yeah, let me just see. Yeah. Every time my phone dings, by the way, that's a new sign up 'cause it's just that good. Oh, yeah.
• 17:56
  [laughs] There's another one. Uh, so about 68 now. [laughs] Um, and we're just leaning into that. So it's a, it's a lot of fun. But, you know, here's, here's my controversial statement [laughs] of the day. Okay.
• 18:08
  Um, it's not about- Like- It, it's not about what you have, it's about how you use it. Something about you and that statue of David is just hanging on.
• 18:18
  I di- I didn't, yeah, I was like, "Statue of David, not what you have, how you use it." Yeah. Yeah. Hanging on, hanging on.
• 18:24
  [laughs]Uh, and, and that seems to be the, the, the thing that I kind of picked up on, uh, early on in my career, was you can have all the bells and whistles.
• 18:33
  The problem with it is if you rely too heavily on the tool, you're a tool. It makes you a tool. Mm. You're an idiot because... And now that's not any, that's not the end user's fault, not, not by any stretch.
• 18:45
  It's, it's I think how we position things. It's the marketing speak. "Hey, if you do this, it's gonna lasso the sun, the moon, and the stars for you, and you're gonna be able to do all these things, blah."
• 18:53
  And, and we're like, "I wanna do all the things." Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Right? Silver bullet. Right. You fork out for it- Yeah...
• 18:59
  and you realize, "Holy crap, this actually required way more on my part in order to make it work." Amen. Technology freaking sucks. What was Kip from Napoleon Dynamite talking about? [laughs] Yeah, right.
• 19:07
  Freaking loves technology.
• 19:09
  Um, but you know, I try to be a realist because I think one of the things that our industry deserves, and it's high time for, which is why I love aligning with you guys, and, you know, the, the stuff that we're working on together and, and whatnot, is because it's high time somebody stood up and says, "Here's what it's actually going to take."
• 19:28
  Sorry if that sounds different. There's your first Canadian sorry of the podcast. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry.
• 19:36
  Um, sorry if it looks different than what's been fed to us for the last 30 years, but here's- And it might actually be hard. It might actually take work, but you know what on the other end of hard and work is? It scales.
• 19:45
  It scales. It scales, so there you go. We're talking 800% potentially.
• 19:48
  Well, thanks for hanging out with us on In the Dirt this, uh, today, and, you know, doing a podcast when we already have a podcast about podcasts and all of that. Thanks for... Thanks.
• 19:58
  [laughs] Sign up for our free and fun-to-read daily email for a free shot of relevant news in automotive, retail, media, and pop culture. You can get it now at asotu.com. That's A-S-O-T-U.com.
• 20:13
  If you love this podcast, please leave us a review and share it with a friend. Thanks again for listening. We'll see you next time.
• 20:20
  [upbeat music] Welcome to Auto Collapse. [laughs] Welcome to Auto Collapse. [laughs] Why are we recording? [laughs] Are we rolling yet?
• 20:38
  Not yet.