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How will Action SA fix issues in 702 land? · Drive with John Perlman

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Your community, your concerns, your voice.
• 0:05
  Speaker 2: Follow every moment of the local government elections on 702
• 0:09
  Speaker 2: Cape Talk and EWN.co.za. Right, let's focus our attention as
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: we will around this time. Every day over the next 10,
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: where we will be speaking to different political parties about,
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: in particular, as they approach local government elections, how they
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: plan to deal with the very complex challenges of running metros.
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: Michael Beaumont is the National Chairperson of Action SA and
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: joins us now on 702 Drive.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: Mr.
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  Speaker 2: Beaumont, welcome and thanks very much for your time. I'm
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: going to start with money and the way in which
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: you plan to A, raise money and then put together budgets,
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: because in many ways, virtually everything else flows out of
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  Speaker 2: the clarity and effectiveness of decisions you make in that regard.
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: So when I look at your manifesto, you'll say you'll
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: limit annual municipal rates and tariff increases to no more
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: than the prevailing rate of inflation, which will have many
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: people smiling. until they hear this word, unless, unless a
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: higher increase is demonstrably necessary to protect essential services. Isn't
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: that almost inevitable that given the backlog, given the depth
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  Speaker 2: of the problems that any government taking over in November
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  Speaker 2: will inherit, you are going to need as much money
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  Speaker 2: as you can get hold of?
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  Speaker 1: That is the case, John. But I think first, before
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  Speaker 1: any additional money is raised from the overburdened ratepayers and residents,
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: of these municipalities, the first trick is to make sure
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: that government tightens its own belt. I know from the
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: time when Herman Mashaba was the mayor of Joburg, two
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: billion rand in wasteful expenditure was redirected from the frivolous
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: kind of things like international travel and self-promoting advertising and
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: all the things that government officials love to do on
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: public money. And those funds were redirected to the service
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: delivery and infrastructure priorities of the city. in such a
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: way that the capital share for electricity, water and roads
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  Speaker 1: went up from 58% of the budget to 71% of
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  Speaker 1: the budget. Now, I think it's entirely possible that these
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  Speaker 1: measures can be taken. Certainly, I think there needs to
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  Speaker 1: be a rationalisation of staffing structures as well. We've seen
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  Speaker 1: a ballooning of upper management and middle management in many
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: of these places. I think all of these measures need
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: to be undertaken before an additional sense is raised from
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  Speaker 1: the residents of these municipalities. And it's entirely possible... that
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: these funds can be redirected to where they belong.
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  Speaker 2: I can see, Mr. Beaumont, no scenario in which Action
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  Speaker 2: SA governs any metro outright. You may beg to differ,
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  Speaker 2: but humor me if you will. You spoke now about
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: controlling expenditure, particularly on upper-level management, and you make that
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  Speaker 2: a very prominent part of your manifesto. How are you
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  Speaker 2: going to do that, though, under coalition politics? Because you
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  Speaker 2: will have some say in that. Perhaps if you have
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  Speaker 2: an MMC position, I don't mean you personally, but your party,
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  Speaker 2: you could say, well, hang on a bit. We're not
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: spending money on this or that. But across an entire metro,
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  Speaker 2: your opportunity to get rid of what you call unnecessary
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  Speaker 2: management and politically motivated appointments, I would have thought would
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  Speaker 2: be extremely limited.
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  Speaker 1: Not at all. Actually, I think the point to remember,
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  Speaker 1: when you consider the Gauteng context in particular, is that
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  Speaker 1: no government is going to be formed in the helping
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  Speaker 1: metros without Action SA. Mathematically, that's very clear. And we
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  Speaker 1: are free to determine under what circumstances we join a coalition.
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  Speaker 1: Action SA doesn't have to be like these parties in
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  Speaker 1: the GNU that just made Cyril Ramaphosa the president without
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  Speaker 1: demanding any reforms in exchange. And one of the things
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  Speaker 1: that we are very clear about is that we will
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  Speaker 1: only enter coalitions under particular circumstances. That includes, by the way,
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: the financial reforms we are talking about now, That includes
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  Speaker 1: service delivery to all of the residents and not just
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  Speaker 1: some of them. It means programmatic level efforts to combat
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  Speaker 1: corruption and efforts to address the scourge of illegal immigration
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  Speaker 1: in our country. Now, at the end of the day,
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  Speaker 1: political parties are not going to agree to a programmatic
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  Speaker 1: level intervention to ensure that those three principles are being met.
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  Speaker 1: We will simply not join that coalition. And that's why
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  Speaker 1: we have a lot of power in the coalition environment
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  Speaker 1: to ensure that these principles are first and foremost in
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  Speaker 1: the work of government.
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  Speaker 2: Let's focus on something as fundamental as it gets, and
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  Speaker 2: that's water. Under the heading Securing Our Water Future, you say,
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  Speaker 2: we will prioritize the repair, maintenance, and replacement of aging pipes, pumps, reservoirs,
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  Speaker 2: and other critical water infrastructure. If we take Ikurileni, Johannesburg,
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  Speaker 2: and Tswane, have you put a number on that? Because
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  Speaker 2: that could take more than just the life of the
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  Speaker 2: next government.
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  Speaker 1: Without any question, we're talking about more than 100 billion round.
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  Speaker 1: in water infrastructure between these three metros alone. And that's
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  Speaker 1: the consequence of long-term infrastructure neglect. The reality is it's
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  Speaker 1: not dissimilar to a car. If you continue driving a car,
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  Speaker 1: it goes well at first, but if you don't service it,
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  Speaker 1: it becomes more and more expensive to make that car roadworthy.
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  Speaker 1: The water pipes are no different. The good news and
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  Speaker 1: the positive news is that the oldest pipes leak the most.
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  Speaker 1: So the earlier interventions you make into that water network
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  Speaker 1: have the highest return on investment. And the answer is
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  Speaker 1: not complicated. When Herman Mashaba was the mayor of Joburg,
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  Speaker 1: and I'll keep saying that because Action SA doesn't have
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  Speaker 1: to make things up. We've actually got leaders who've done
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  Speaker 1: these things before. 200 kilometers of water pipes were being
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  Speaker 1: replaced every year. That figure is now 20 kilometers in
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  Speaker 1: the city of Joburg. And it just demonstrates how the
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  Speaker 1: eroding financial position of these municipalities allows for infrastructure to
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  Speaker 1: be underinvested in, while politicians prefer above-the-ground events like and
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: programs that are easier to market than the underground infrastructure priorities.
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  Speaker 1: This is certainly a place where positive changes can be
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  Speaker 1: delivered with great effect.
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  Speaker 2: I'm looking at some related undertakings that you give, and
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  Speaker 2: they're in different sections of your manifesto. But I'd like
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  Speaker 2: clarity on something that seems to be, you know, perhaps
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: slightly at odds. So with water security, you say, we
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: will plan for population growth, increasing demand and some other factors.
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  Speaker 2: I'm paraphrasing now. You didn't say some of the factors.
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  Speaker 2: You list them. And then when you talk about maintaining
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  Speaker 2: and renewing infrastructure, again, you say, we'll respond to service needs,
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  Speaker 2: population growth, and economic development while taking account of what
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  Speaker 2: municipalities can sustainably operate and maintain. And then when we
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: get to electricity, once again, you say you're going to
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  Speaker 2: keep pace with population growth, housing development, economic activity. I
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: put it to you that you can't do both. If
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: you're going to live within your means, you cannot possibly
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: keep up with those changing demands that you've detailed yourselves.
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: Well, you certainly can actually, John, because at a development
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  Speaker 1: planning level, city planning level of a municipality, one of
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  Speaker 1: the first things that a city must do and it
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  Speaker 1: receives applications for new developments and large-scale developments particularly, is
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  Speaker 1: to assess the infrastructure and its ability to deal with
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  Speaker 1: the load that will arise from the additional development. That
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  Speaker 1: includes the road, electricity, water networks. And certainly it would
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  Speaker 1: be irresponsible of a city to increase demand on a
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  Speaker 1: network that cannot match with supply. And obviously then supply
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: needs to increase, but that can't happen overnight. But these
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: are important things that the city needs to do. If
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  Speaker 1: you look at places like Centurion, one of the reasons
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: Centurion has so many electricity outages now that the new
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: government is working to address is over a long period
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  Speaker 1: of time, the developments in that area have increased. The
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  Speaker 1: supply has not. And that's why substations are constantly tripping
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  Speaker 1: and burning down. These are things that cities need to manage. Absolutely,
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  Speaker 1: you can't just put a cap on it and say
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  Speaker 1: no more development, particularly not in places with such high
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: levels of unemployment. But also, you can't authorize new developments
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  Speaker 1: if you cannot meet that capacity in the short and
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  Speaker 1: medium term.
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  Speaker 2: It isn't the bigger problem, though, that, I mean, if
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  Speaker 2: I would ask you what proportion of development, and we
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  Speaker 2: may need to put development with a very small d,
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  Speaker 2: in our metros is unplanned, uncoordinated, and certainly not... dealt
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  Speaker 2: with with the kind of foresight that you're outlining I
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  Speaker 2: mean that works when you've got a developer in a
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  Speaker 2: area perhaps like Centurion but it certainly doesn't work for
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  Speaker 2: much of what we're seeing in our metros where the
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  Speaker 2: stuff comes at you from every angle at a pace
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  Speaker 2: that you can probably expect but not accurately predict.
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  Speaker 1: Well certainly and I think the key role of the
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: city needs to ensure that an environment of law and
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  Speaker 1: order prevails we can't have chaos in those environments and
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  Speaker 1: And certainly there's a lot of illegal development that's taking
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  Speaker 1: place all the time. And this is where the work
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  Speaker 1: of the JMPD and bylaw enforcement is so important. Once again,
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  Speaker 1: I keep referring you back to when we've had people
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  Speaker 1: who've been mayors. But Herman Mashaba's work in expanding the
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  Speaker 1: JMPD by 50% in the time in which she was there, Dr.
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  Speaker 1: Nasipi Moya right now, initiating the first metro police recruitment
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  Speaker 1: in over 12 years, in the time in which the
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  Speaker 1: city of Tawane's population has doubled, is vital to this
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  Speaker 1: kind of work. As to our municipal courts, it's not known,
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  Speaker 1: but municipalities have the ability to set up municipal courts,
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  Speaker 1: to have magistrates provided by the Department of Justice, and
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: to ensure when people break your bylaws, it's not just
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: carry on with impunity, but there actually are consequences. And
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  Speaker 1: these are vital aspects to restoring the rule of law
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  Speaker 1: in these municipalities.
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  Speaker 2: And just finally, and very briefly, if you can, because
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: I'm sure it is something you can summarize, you talk
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: about fixing potholes faster. We will set clear standards for
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: repairing potholes and other dangerous road defects. Give us, in summary,
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  Speaker 2: maybe the key points of your clear standards for repairing potholes.
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  Speaker 1: Well, first, you've got to talk about road renewal, because
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  Speaker 1: there's many roads, particularly in the East metros we're discussing.
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  Speaker 1: The condition of those roads has declined to the point
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  Speaker 1: where pothole repair just becomes a short-term fix. I think
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  Speaker 1: that's the first point. The second point is that throughout
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  Speaker 1: any government we want to be involved in, we want
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  Speaker 1: to start that five-year term saying this is the standard
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  Speaker 1: we want to meet five years from now. Yes, right
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  Speaker 1: now the pace of pothole repair is not acceptable. It
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: takes two or three or four months or even longer
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: to get a pothole repaired in some of these municipalities.
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  Speaker 1: But in five years' time, we want to say that
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: it should take no more than a week. to get
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  Speaker 1: a pothole repaired, and ultimately to undergo a journey with
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: your residents where you work through these KPIs, you report
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: progress over those five years, and you can be held
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: accountable for that standard. But certainly there's a lot of
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: technology available when it comes to pothole repair and street
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: fixing that can be employed. There's a lot of best
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: practice around the world and properly resourced teams to do
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: that kind of work in a municipality are vital, And
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: I think more and more there's got to be an
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: understanding in these municipalities that external contractors that come in
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: at great expense are not the way forward. The city
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: needs its own internal capacity to meet the demand of
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: collapsed municipalities that have not been looked after.
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: Michael Beaumont, National Chairperson of Action SA. As I said,
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: over the next 10 shows and possibly a little longer
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: if we can get in some more, we're going to
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: be talking to different political parties, looking at their manifestos,
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: asking them some questions about their plans today. for the
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: metros here in Gauteng and beyond. 28 minutes past four.