Latest / Cosmic Peach / CultXCosmic: Blood Ties Pt 3

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CultXCosmic: Blood Ties Pt 3 · Cosmic Peach

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Oh, bel there, Trigger Warren.
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: This podcast may include explicit content that will take you
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: out of your.
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: Comfort zone and make you question reality.
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: Listeners, discretion is advised.
• 0:55
  Speaker 4: Hello, and welcome back to the show. This is Blood
• 1:00
  Speaker 4: Ties Part three and I am, of course really excited
• 1:06
  Speaker 4: about this one. We left it on kind of a
• 1:09
  Speaker 4: cliffhanger in the last one, a little bit about what
• 1:12
  Speaker 4: we were going to talk about today, and it's some
• 1:15
  Speaker 4: more of the inconsistencies with John Wayne Gacy and Ted Bundy.
• 1:22
  Speaker 4: And of course we have Colby on this episode again. Hello,
• 1:28
  Speaker 4: how are you Colby?
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: Tired?
• 1:32
  Speaker 4: Tired of me? Tired of life? Are you feeling suicidal?
• 1:38
  Speaker 4: Are you having direk thoughts?
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: You should work for suicide hot line like Ted Bundy.
• 1:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you'd get off on it. So I'm going to
• 1:51
  Speaker 4: start us off with a quote as usual. So the
• 1:57
  Speaker 4: quote is quote like, you have a job. I have
• 2:02
  Speaker 4: a job. He has a job. His job is killing people.
• 2:06
  Speaker 4: That's what he was trained to do. In quote that
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: comes from Cynthia Hayden, a djur in the Richard Ramirez trial,
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: commenting on the convicted nightstalker. And I'm I mean, how
• 2:24
  Speaker 4: can you sum it up.
• 2:24
  Speaker 3: Any better than that did she say this too?
• 2:27
  Speaker 4: I don't know. It just says Adjur in the Richard
• 2:31
  Speaker 4: Ramirez trial commenting on him.
• 2:34
  Speaker 3: Where did you get the quote?
• 2:35
  Speaker 4: Program to Kill? I feel like, yeah, I was gonna say,
• 2:41
  Speaker 4: I don't feel like David McGowan would put it in
• 2:44
  Speaker 4: there if it was a fake quote.
• 2:46
  Speaker 3: Right, And I'm sure he said where it came from.
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: I was just curious. I'm like, what what the context
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: of the quote was.
• 2:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know, but it's interesting to say the least.
• 2:57
  Speaker 4: I feel like in the Program Him to Kill series,
• 3:02
  Speaker 4: I spent a lot of time trying to set the
• 3:06
  Speaker 4: ground for what we're going to talk about today, and
• 3:09
  Speaker 4: I think what people were waiting to hear in the
• 3:14
  Speaker 4: Program to Kill series is what we're going to talk
• 3:16
  Speaker 4: about today.
• 3:17
  Speaker 3: Well, let's go get them so they could hear this.
• 3:19
  Speaker 4: Yeah. So I want to first start us off taking
• 3:24
  Speaker 4: a little bit closer look at some of the weirdness
• 3:27
  Speaker 4: with John Wayne Gacy and as a teenager, John Wayne
• 3:32
  Speaker 4: Gacy worked in Las Vegas at both a mortuary and
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: as an ambulance attendant. At the mortuary, it was said
• 3:41
  Speaker 4: that he had a habit of sleeping in the embalming
• 3:44
  Speaker 4: room amongst the corpses, and he was fired after some
• 3:49
  Speaker 4: of those corpses were found to have been partially undressed,
• 3:53
  Speaker 4: which they don't really tell you for sure in any
• 3:58
  Speaker 4: documentary of I've ever watched at least if John Wayne
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: Gacy was into necrophilia. But just like the rest of
• 4:06
  Speaker 4: our cast of characters, it looks like he definitely was.
• 4:10
  Speaker 3: Maybe he just liked skin on skin, cuddles.
• 4:13
  Speaker 4: With cold stiff Maybe that's why he was in there
• 4:18
  Speaker 4: because the dead bodies had cold stiff ones.
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: Is that how it works?
• 4:23
  Speaker 4: He was gay? After you die? Did your dick still
• 4:27
  Speaker 4: stand up?
• 4:29
  Speaker 5: I doubt it.
• 4:30
  Speaker 4: You think it's flaccid.
• 4:31
  Speaker 3: I'll let you know when I died.
• 4:34
  Speaker 4: Well, I'm just saying clearly he was into necrophilia, or
• 4:39
  Speaker 4: he was molesting the dead bodies. I don't know if
• 4:42
  Speaker 4: he was actually fucking him because he was gay, he
• 4:46
  Speaker 4: could have fucked the dead ass though.
• 4:47
  Speaker 6: Why were they wearing clothes anyway? Do you usually have
• 4:50
  Speaker 6: clothes on in the morgue.
• 4:52
  Speaker 4: In a mortuary? Isn't that where they get him dressed
• 4:55
  Speaker 4: up to like for funerals?
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: Okay, so it wasn't a morgan. It was a mortuary
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: that makes sense.
• 5:01
  Speaker 4: So maybe, yeah. I mean, can you imagine all those
• 5:05
  Speaker 4: people's dead loved ones getting molested by jaycy after they're did?
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: I can if you want me to.
• 5:15
  Speaker 4: So. In the nineteen sixties, John lived in Waterloo, Iowa,
• 5:20
  Speaker 4: where he owned several businesses, including four restaurants, a clothing
• 5:25
  Speaker 4: design firm, and a motel. During that period of his life,
• 5:30
  Speaker 4: he joined the j CS and quickly forged a bond
• 5:34
  Speaker 4: with the man who soon became the local chapter president.
• 5:39
  Speaker 4: This particular JC chapter was known at the time to
• 5:43
  Speaker 4: be involved in prostitution, pornography, and various other crimes of vice.
• 5:50
  Speaker 4: The jc's, also known as the United States Junior Chamber,
• 5:58
  Speaker 4: is a nonprofit or organization that focuses on leadership training
• 6:03
  Speaker 4: and civic engagement for people between the ages of eighteen
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: and forty. I don't even know if that's still a thing.
• 6:10
  Speaker 3: So is it like the Rotary Club?
• 6:12
  Speaker 4: I guess so. I mean it was the sixties. I
• 6:15
  Speaker 4: don't think there is such a thing as j c's anymore.
• 6:21
  Speaker 4: But so he's getting involved.
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: Interesting how gay cy jc's.
• 6:27
  Speaker 4: He puts the gay and gay seeds. It's gross, I know,
• 6:32
  Speaker 4: But so this particular chapter of the Jac's was involved
• 6:37
  Speaker 4: in prostitution, pornography, and various other crimes.
• 6:41
  Speaker 6: So I mean is this child because if they're just
• 6:46
  Speaker 6: like involved in prostitution and pornography, other crimes, advice that
• 6:51
  Speaker 6: might be like gambling Black America gambling or.
• 6:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean it's not really specific on.
• 6:58
  Speaker 6: That, but I mean we've been talking so much in
• 7:00
  Speaker 6: these series, in your past series about child pornography rings.
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: Mm hm, so I just the distinction isn't made there, So.
• 7:09
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's not, but I mean, you get we could
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: probably use our imagination with what that really because it's
• 7:17
  Speaker 4: a nonprofit organization and we know what John Wayne Gacy
• 7:22
  Speaker 4: was getting up to later in his life, so I
• 7:25
  Speaker 4: can only imagine even if it was like regular prostitution
• 7:29
  Speaker 4: and pornography, though it's like the CIA and like organized
• 7:33
  Speaker 4: crime and shit, it's just I mean, two birds of
• 7:36
  Speaker 4: a feather really, So, a local prosecutor identified Gacy's motel,
• 7:43
  Speaker 4: managed by his newfound friend, as the hub of those activities.
• 7:51
  Speaker 4: According to the prosecutor, the motel was a front for
• 7:55
  Speaker 4: a gay and straight prostitution ring. Again, it doesn't spe
• 8:00
  Speaker 4: on kids or adults, but even if it was adults,
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: I mean he was clearly into some fucking shady shit. Yeah,
• 8:11
  Speaker 4: and Gacy was in the habit of hiring many young
• 8:16
  Speaker 4: people of both sexes to work at his businesses. He
• 8:21
  Speaker 4: also reportedly set up what was described as a social
• 8:25
  Speaker 4: club in his basement recreation room, which he kept well
• 8:31
  Speaker 4: stocked with drugs and alcohol to supply to his numerous
• 8:36
  Speaker 4: underage guests. He was also said by those who knew
• 8:40
  Speaker 4: him at the time to control his wife and to
• 8:45
  Speaker 4: openly offer her sexual services to friends and colleagues, because
• 8:53
  Speaker 4: I think it was a sham of a marriage anyways.
• 8:56
  Speaker 4: And if he was into all this other stuff, and
• 8:59
  Speaker 4: he a lot of his victims were underage, maybe he
• 9:02
  Speaker 4: was like luring them back to the house with like
• 9:06
  Speaker 4: drugs and alcohol, kind of Dohmer style. I don't know,
• 9:10
  Speaker 4: but he was clearly into like some next level shit.
• 9:16
  Speaker 6: Well, and this is interesting because all of the narrative
• 9:19
  Speaker 6: I've ever read, you know, and the low hanging mainstream
• 9:23
  Speaker 6: true crime stuff.
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: It was always an emphasis on young men, you know,
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: not men, but teenage boys. And this is saying he
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: had both sexes work in his.
• 9:35
  Speaker 4: Businesses well, and then he set up this social club,
• 9:41
  Speaker 4: and I mean.
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: He also seemed to take offense. It was something you mentioned.
• 9:48
  Speaker 6: I think in the last episode that people would refer
• 9:51
  Speaker 6: to him as gay.
• 9:53
  Speaker 3: He would correct them and say he was bisexual.
• 9:56
  Speaker 4: He could have been. You know what the crazy thing is,
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: like if a lot of the murders weren't really him,
• 10:03
  Speaker 4: then there's probably a bunch more victims we never found
• 10:07
  Speaker 4: out about, Like he could have killed other girls and
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: like whoever. But they only found the bodies that were
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: under his house.
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: Thirty three or right to shitload of bodies for under one.
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: House, No I know. So On March eleventh, nineteen sixty eight,
• 10:25
  Speaker 4: Donald Borhe's junior, the son of a JC and former
• 10:32
  Speaker 4: Iowa state representative, gave a statement to police alleging that
• 10:38
  Speaker 4: Gaysey had assaulted and sodomized him. So he assaulted and
• 10:50
  Speaker 4: sodomized the son of one of the oh the former
• 10:57
  Speaker 4: Iowa state representative and he was a JC. So you
• 11:03
  Speaker 4: know how they do in like those weird political circles,
• 11:07
  Speaker 4: like they passed their kids around and shit, do you
• 11:09
  Speaker 4: think that's something like this because it said he was
• 11:12
  Speaker 4: into like it was his motel was like a cover
• 11:16
  Speaker 4: and like he was clearly having a social club at
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: his house. And weird stuff like that. He's involved in politics.
• 11:24
  Speaker 3: And then he so you're basically asking if the father
• 11:27
  Speaker 3: may have been compliant.
• 11:29
  Speaker 4: Yeah, could be, or do you think this was.
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: I mean, he either had access to the kid, whether
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: the father knew about it or not. But yeah, speculating,
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: we do know that goes on.
• 11:46
  Speaker 4: Mm hmm. That's what's just kind of came to my
• 11:49
  Speaker 4: mind because he, like we said before, he met the
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: first lady and like was so respected and shit like that,
• 11:58
  Speaker 4: and like maybe he's just let him do it. I
• 12:02
  Speaker 4: don't know. But in early May, Gaysey was indided by
• 12:06
  Speaker 4: a grand jury, though no further action was taken for
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: several months about the assault asotomy of this JC kid.
• 12:16
  Speaker 4: On September twelfth, John made a court appearance at which
• 12:21
  Speaker 4: he was ordered to submit to a psychiatric examination at
• 12:26
  Speaker 4: the Psychopathic Hospital of the State University of Iowa Jesus Christ.
• 12:35
  Speaker 4: While in custody, there, he spoke freely to investigators of
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: wholesale corruption among the city's elite. He talked of gambling, prostitution, pornography,
• 12:48
  Speaker 4: wife swapping, and the corruption and complicity of local police.
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: He supplied the names of numerous j c's police personnel
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: and various other prominent individuals who were involved in criminal enterprises.
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: So that's why I think.
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: A snitch.
• 13:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah, he is a fucking snitch. But the thing is
• 13:17
  Speaker 4: he's talking about all this, and then his motel has
• 13:21
  Speaker 4: found out to be upfront for like gay sex and
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: straight sex or whatever, and he's got all these politician friends.
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: I think that whoever the dad was of that kid
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: let him do it, and maybe Gasey did something to
• 13:37
  Speaker 4: piss him off, and then he was like, I'm telling
• 13:40
  Speaker 4: everybody you raped my son.
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: What do you think I mean, that's possible.
• 13:45
  Speaker 4: Because they do what do we always talk about, They
• 13:49
  Speaker 4: use kids as blackmail in political circles. So who's to
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: say that he didn't get a hold of this kid
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: his dad let him get train on and then they
• 14:01
  Speaker 4: fucking took a video or something of him because he's
• 14:05
  Speaker 4: involved in gambling, prostitution, pornography, wife swapping, whatever. It just
• 14:12
  Speaker 4: seems like this could have been a case of like
• 14:14
  Speaker 4: some of this stuff we're always talking about in the
• 14:16
  Speaker 4: conspiracy theory community, because that was the first time he
• 14:19
  Speaker 4: ever got busted, and.
• 14:21
  Speaker 6: It's weird that it's on the record too. Did you
• 14:25
  Speaker 6: think that would piece of evidence like this would be
• 14:28
  Speaker 6: well known. Of course, we know they do sweep.
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: It under the rug.
• 14:35
  Speaker 4: When brought before a judge, Gaisey threw himself at the
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: mercy of the court and entered a guilty plea on
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: the assault asodomy of this kid. On December third, nineteen
• 14:48
  Speaker 4: sixty eight. He was sentenced to a ten year term.
• 14:53
  Speaker 4: He served less than two of those years, earning parole
• 14:57
  Speaker 4: on June eighteenth, nineteen seventy. While in prison, he somehow
• 15:02
  Speaker 4: managed to always have money, cigars and civilian shirts, all
• 15:07
  Speaker 4: difficult commodities to attain for most prisoners.
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: So he had somebody giving him some commissary.
• 15:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah or well, and you know what I always say,
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: if you want to know if they're involved in some shit,
• 15:22
  Speaker 4: just look at their sentence. He was sentenced to ten
• 15:25
  Speaker 4: years and he served less than two, and then it
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: was really straight back out onto the street. And somebody
• 15:32
  Speaker 4: was giving him all this money and shit while he
• 15:35
  Speaker 4: was in there. So clearly he's not just a psycho.
• 15:40
  Speaker 4: To me, this doesn't say I'm a low nut psycho
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: serial killer. This screams I'm on a team.
• 15:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 15:51
  Speaker 4: And according to some reports, Gacy received electro shock and
• 15:56
  Speaker 4: a version therapy while incarcerated, allegedly to cure him of
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: his homosexuality, which is in American Horror Story Season two
• 16:11
  Speaker 4: as uh huh. You remember when they take what's her
• 16:14
  Speaker 4: name and they do a version therapy and they do
• 16:19
  Speaker 4: something they make her throw up every time she watches
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: gay porn or something. And I said this earlier on
• 16:27
  Speaker 4: the episode that we just did that. I think we're
• 16:32
  Speaker 4: all living in one of the most interesting seasons of
• 16:36
  Speaker 4: American Horror Story.
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: It's got it all aliens, pedophiles. Mm hmm.
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: I mean, I think it is.
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: But pedophile aliens maybe, mm hmmm. Season twist.
• 16:49
  Speaker 4: So, just eight months after his release, he was again arrested,
• 16:55
  Speaker 4: this time for disorderly conduct despite the vibe violation. Just
• 17:01
  Speaker 4: eight months after that, he was released from parole. Another
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: eight months after that, on the summer solstice of nineteen
• 17:12
  Speaker 4: seventy two, he was again arrested and charged with aggravated
• 17:18
  Speaker 4: battery and reckless conduct. Gaysey had allegedly offered a young
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: man a ride on June seventh, identified himself as a
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: police officer, and then attempted to handcuff the boy. Failing
• 17:34
  Speaker 4: in that endeavor, Gaysey had then clubbed him on the
• 17:37
  Speaker 4: back of his neck, kicked him, and then pursued him
• 17:42
  Speaker 4: with his car and struck him down curiously. When they
• 17:47
  Speaker 4: arrested him and took him in for running this kid
• 17:52
  Speaker 4: down with his car, they scanned his fingerprints, and his
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: fingerprints were on file with local police under the alias
• 18:02
  Speaker 4: Colonel Gaysey Colonel like Michael Aquino type shit. Yeah, So
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: I don't know. I thought that was interesting.
• 18:13
  Speaker 6: Well, and it's weird too, because he did I don't
• 18:17
  Speaker 6: know if it was like volunteer work with the police,
• 18:19
  Speaker 6: but he had established a relationship with the local police
• 18:23
  Speaker 6: and did ride alongs and stuff, so maybe that was
• 18:27
  Speaker 6: just like.
• 18:28
  Speaker 4: Oh, you think they did that as like a joke
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: or like a nickname Gasey, Yeah, nickname, whether jokingly or otherwise,
• 18:36
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: It could be something to that effect.
• 18:38
  Speaker 4: Well. I also thought, and you know this because I
• 18:42
  Speaker 4: talk about it all the time, all the eights eight
• 18:45
  Speaker 4: months after he was released from parole, eight months after
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: that he was arrested again, I thought there was another
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: aid in there.
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: Maybe he kicked him in clubbed him eight times.
• 19:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah, But anyways, I always find the eight to be
• 19:02
  Speaker 4: really oh yeah. Eight months after his release. Eight months
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: after that release from parole, Oh so yeah, there is
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: three eighths in there. So anyways, he continues his murder
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: spree and gets arrested again, and while his home was
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: being searched, Gasey was taken to Holy Family Hospital for
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: a medical examination, allegedly due to complaints of chest pains.
• 19:31
  Speaker 4: Immediately upon his release from the hospital, John read and
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: signed a Miranda waiver and began confessing to the fucking murders.
• 19:43
  Speaker 4: One of his first questions to police was quote who
• 19:48
  Speaker 4: else do you have in the station? There are others
• 19:51
  Speaker 4: involved in quote. Gacy was then asked if the others
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: who were involved were directly or in directly involved, to
• 20:01
  Speaker 4: which he responded, quote directly, they participated in quote. Asked
• 20:08
  Speaker 4: who these others might be, he answered simply, quote my
• 20:13
  Speaker 4: associates in quote. He was also asked where one of
• 20:18
  Speaker 4: the victims, Rob Peaste, was, to which he answered, quote,
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: I don't know. I didn't transport him in quote. When
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: asked who did he, he replied, quote I can't say
• 20:33
  Speaker 4: in quote. So when he finally starts talking about the
• 20:39
  Speaker 4: murders and admitting to them, he says, there are others
• 20:45
  Speaker 4: involved who else do you have in the station. There
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: were people who were directly involved that participated. He referred
• 20:54
  Speaker 4: to them as my associates. And he said the victim
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: rob p he didn't even know about him, and he
• 21:02
  Speaker 4: didn't transport him, quote unquote, and then he couldn't say
• 21:07
  Speaker 4: who was working with him. Do you think this is
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: bullshit because Gasey was a horrible liar, or do you
• 21:14
  Speaker 4: think this is genuine and there were people working with him.
• 21:17
  Speaker 6: I mean, one thing that con validated is he obviously,
• 21:22
  Speaker 6: just from what you were saying a little bit earlier,
• 21:25
  Speaker 6: he was protected from on high by somebody. And it
• 21:30
  Speaker 6: also makes me wonder that being the case. He blabbed
• 21:35
  Speaker 6: the first time they took him in mm.
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: Hmm about all this other stuff that he was into with,
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: you know, upper echelon of his.
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: Community, wife swapping.
• 21:45
  Speaker 6: And then well you know that one's not illegal, but
• 21:49
  Speaker 6: the prostitution and the pornography, depending on what kind of
• 21:52
  Speaker 6: pornography it was, but black market gambling in the legs.
• 21:56
  Speaker 6: But you know, he's blabbing about that and then he
• 21:59
  Speaker 6: starts doing this. Almost makes me wonder why he got
• 22:02
  Speaker 6: to live up until his execution. But they never sent
• 22:08
  Speaker 6: like a Jack Ruby type character after him to just
• 22:11
  Speaker 6: pop him and shut him up.
• 22:13
  Speaker 4: I mean, does that make you think he was lying?
• 22:16
  Speaker 6: It doesn't necessarily mean he's lying. It's just like maybe
• 22:19
  Speaker 6: he said enough or left enough out of what he
• 22:25
  Speaker 6: was saying, because he would say what was going on,
• 22:28
  Speaker 6: but he wouldn't drop names. He just alluded to the
• 22:32
  Speaker 6: fact that he didn't work alone, he had associates, YadA, YadA.
• 22:37
  Speaker 6: It's just strange to me because usually, like you get
• 22:41
  Speaker 6: these guys, even when they, you know, spill the beans
• 22:46
  Speaker 6: on everything they've done, they won't finger.
• 22:50
  Speaker 4: Others and they won't leave you alive usually, or they'll
• 22:53
  Speaker 4: suicide you and take you somewhere.
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: Well, you would figure that like Epstein protocol, but I
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: don't know.
• 23:01
  Speaker 6: Look at Charlie Manson, despite what we all think may
• 23:04
  Speaker 6: have happened or may not have happened that night, he
• 23:08
  Speaker 6: had a code of not being a snitch.
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: That he took rather seriously. Whether that was just part
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: of his role or whatever.
• 23:16
  Speaker 6: But this is it just kind of Casey's always been
• 23:19
  Speaker 6: one of those that is a part of all this
• 23:23
  Speaker 6: stuff going on. But he's got or he's lacking certain markers,
• 23:27
  Speaker 6: like he doesn't have military experience. He's one of the
• 23:31
  Speaker 6: only ones out of all these major cigarette serial killers.
• 23:34
  Speaker 6: But he does have political yeah, political, and you know,
• 23:37
  Speaker 6: definitely organized shoulders with the mob, the police, other of
• 23:43
  Speaker 6: these I don't know, processed church type organizations that all
• 23:47
  Speaker 6: that kind of tie everybody together.
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: But he don't know, he just always seemed like an
• 23:51
  Speaker 3: anomaly to me.
• 23:52
  Speaker 4: M m yeah. And the clown thing, well.
• 23:56
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean he's he's like one of those reasons
• 23:59
  Speaker 6: that everybody's scared of clowns.
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: We have John Wayne Gacy and then Pennywise.
• 24:04
  Speaker 4: Who was also into kids.
• 24:06
  Speaker 6: Yeah, and I never knew if perhaps King I haven't
• 24:11
  Speaker 6: heard one way or the other true inspiration from he.
• 24:13
  Speaker 4: Had to killer clown Yeah. Yeah. But so this instance
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: where he's blabbing a little bit. So this interrogation was
• 24:26
  Speaker 4: cut short by a Sergeant Long and then later resumed
• 24:32
  Speaker 4: with two attorneys at Gaysey's side. No further mention was
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: made of any accomplices, and the issue does not appear
• 24:41
  Speaker 4: to have been pursued thereafter. So it kind of for me,
• 24:48
  Speaker 4: if I'm just gonna say an opinion, I think that
• 24:55
  Speaker 4: he was being honest about the accomplices.
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And I'm not saying he wasn't.
• 25:02
  Speaker 4: No, I know you're not. Just if I had it,
• 25:04
  Speaker 4: like make an opinion out of the information provided, I'm
• 25:10
  Speaker 4: gonna say I think he was telling the truth about
• 25:13
  Speaker 4: the accomplices.
• 25:14
  Speaker 6: Yeah, and I mean he ruffled feathers, but apparently not
• 25:16
  Speaker 6: enough to take him out.
• 25:19
  Speaker 3: Then he got to see I don't know how many
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: years in prison. I don't know the exactly.
• 25:26
  Speaker 4: I don't know how long they let him sit in
• 25:29
  Speaker 4: there for.
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: They get it was a while because.
• 25:32
  Speaker 6: By the time Jeffrey Dahmer was caught in the mid
• 25:35
  Speaker 6: nineties or I guess that was early nineties. Still, that
• 25:38
  Speaker 6: was a pretty significant amount of time because you know,
• 25:42
  Speaker 6: there's the famous synchronicity of the eclipse with Dahmer getting
• 25:49
  Speaker 6: baptized and Casey get yeah, Casey getting executed. So, yeah,
• 25:55
  Speaker 6: he was in there for you know, between ten and
• 25:58
  Speaker 6: twenty years.
• 25:59
  Speaker 4: Do you think if you keep them in there long enough,
• 26:02
  Speaker 4: they'll just start saying crazy shit so they can get
• 26:04
  Speaker 4: out of their cell, like Charles Manson.
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: Well, also the ship that Bundy pulled when.
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: He oh god, I won't even get me started on that.
• 26:16
  Speaker 6: They stayed that execution like fucking a dozen times or
• 26:20
  Speaker 6: some shit, and.
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: Then he blamed it all on pornography.
• 26:24
  Speaker 6: Well, yeah, he wanted his ex girlfriend to show up
• 26:27
  Speaker 6: and he would I'll tell where these bodies are, but
• 26:29
  Speaker 6: only her, And it was just like, I don't know
• 26:33
  Speaker 6: a circus really, But yeah, it kind of seems like
• 26:36
  Speaker 6: Gaycy near the end of his life kind of just
• 26:39
  Speaker 6: took his fate.
• 26:41
  Speaker 4: He get the Gaysy tapes, right, and that was like
• 26:45
  Speaker 4: his chance to say shit. And he didn't say anything
• 26:48
  Speaker 4: about composes and stuff in those tapes, so they either
• 26:53
  Speaker 4: got him good and shut up on that or he lied.
• 26:58
  Speaker 6: Well I had listened to I think I would think
• 27:00
  Speaker 6: I have mentioned this in this series already, But it's
• 27:03
  Speaker 6: another set of tapes that a young journalist independently started
• 27:08
  Speaker 6: reaching out. And the whole thing that was funny was
• 27:13
  Speaker 6: this guy knew that Gasey wanted to fuck him, and
• 27:18
  Speaker 6: they would He would kind of just like laugh it
• 27:20
  Speaker 6: off and change the subject.
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: But anyway he couldn't just flat out turn him down.
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: He'd be like, so you're gonna come pay me a
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: visit and we're gonna fuck. Like I would be like, well,
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: let's talk about this.
• 27:30
  Speaker 6: But anyway, he got him to allude to some things,
• 27:33
  Speaker 6: much like what Gasey had been saying when he was
• 27:36
  Speaker 6: you know, taken in, but he never really would get
• 27:40
  Speaker 6: specific about it, and he would kind of change the
• 27:42
  Speaker 6: subject back.
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: To like wanting to fuck the guy.
• 27:44
  Speaker 6: Yeah, and they were just playing this weird tennis game.
• 27:47
  Speaker 6: But yeah, it does seem for the most part, he
• 27:49
  Speaker 6: really never said anything significant other than he didn't work alone.
• 27:53
  Speaker 4: Well, there is just a little bit of substantial proof
• 27:59
  Speaker 4: to back up the theory that he wasn't working alone,
• 28:03
  Speaker 4: because the homicide rate in the Chicago area soared following
• 28:07
  Speaker 4: Gaysey's arrest, possibly indicating that a large cleanup operation ensued,
• 28:14
  Speaker 4: and on December twenty eighth, a week after John's arrest,
• 28:19
  Speaker 4: a fresh body was fished from the des Plains River.
• 28:26
  Speaker 4: Gacy and the Smiley Face Killer somehow could be connected
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: to the same group of people, though I'm not sure
• 28:36
  Speaker 4: who those people are, but it does seem odd because
• 28:40
  Speaker 4: the Smiley Face victims are all male. All Gaycy's victims
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: were male as far as we know, and even though
• 28:48
  Speaker 4: he was arrested, there's still bodies pilot up and the
• 28:51
  Speaker 4: first one they found was fished out of the river.
• 28:54
  Speaker 4: So when I talked to William Ramsey. He said that
• 28:58
  Speaker 4: the Smiley Face murders have been going on since the sixties.
• 29:01
  Speaker 4: So yeah, I don't know if like Gaysey was just
• 29:05
  Speaker 4: like part of it and then they moved on and
• 29:07
  Speaker 4: now it's because we do know that the Smiley face
• 29:10
  Speaker 4: killers are multiple assailants.
• 29:13
  Speaker 6: Well even just with the time span they'd have to be.
• 29:17
  Speaker 6: They're still happening today.
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: Mm hmm. I think there was just one in outside
• 29:21
  Speaker 3: of Austin, Texas, and earlier in this year, Yeah, there was.
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: There's a lot, a lot of interesting theories on Smiley
• 29:29
  Speaker 3: faced killers. It's all. It's kind of rescissent of.
• 29:32
  Speaker 6: Zodiac where they didn't really just at any point come
• 29:37
  Speaker 6: up with just one figurehead to take the blame for
• 29:40
  Speaker 6: it all. It's almost like a cautionary tell, like your
• 29:44
  Speaker 6: son's going to a college party that don't walk home
• 29:47
  Speaker 6: drunk alone, you end up in the river.
• 29:49
  Speaker 4: I mean right, yeah, I mean do you think there
• 29:52
  Speaker 4: could have been like Gaysey could have been part of
• 29:55
  Speaker 4: a weird smiley face cult.
• 29:57
  Speaker 6: Well, I mean possibly, but his oh was getting these
• 30:02
  Speaker 6: kids back to his house and having the bodies, you know,
• 30:07
  Speaker 6: stashed away under his floorboards.
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: Or whatever, And.
• 30:10
  Speaker 6: That doesn't really fit the smiley face killer, not saying
• 30:13
  Speaker 6: he couldn't have been out there having fun doing that too.
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: Well, no, I'm saying they could have been working in tandem.
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and he could have been helping out.
• 30:21
  Speaker 4: But you know, who knows, just saying if there's multiple assailants,
• 30:27
  Speaker 4: it's like I said, they might each have a style. Right,
• 30:31
  Speaker 4: And Gaysey gets locked up and there's still bodies piling up.
• 30:34
  Speaker 4: Now they're finding them in the fucking river.
• 30:36
  Speaker 6: So well, Chicago's never been a stranger to weird violent crimes.
• 30:43
  Speaker 4: Well, here we here we go with another point too.
• 30:48
  Speaker 4: Although Gaysey confessed to being a mass murderer, he had
• 30:53
  Speaker 4: very little knowledge of the crimes to which he confessed.
• 30:58
  Speaker 4: He claimed, for instance, that all of the victims were strangled,
• 31:02
  Speaker 4: but forensic evidence suggested that at least thirteen of them
• 31:06
  Speaker 4: had been suffocated. He provided a map of the locations
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: of the bodies under his house that press reports claimed
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: was accurate, even though it actually contained numerous discrepancies. So
• 31:22
  Speaker 4: do you think there were like this sounds crazy, but
• 31:25
  Speaker 4: do you think there was people putting bodies under his house?
• 31:29
  Speaker 4: And like some of them he didn't even kill without
• 31:33
  Speaker 4: his knowledge, and like he knew they were putting them
• 31:36
  Speaker 4: under thee.
• 31:36
  Speaker 6: Yeah, think of season five of Dexter, and if anybody
• 31:41
  Speaker 6: out there hasn't seen that, it's it opens up with
• 31:46
  Speaker 6: Dexter finding a guy who's killing women and storing them
• 31:51
  Speaker 6: in formaldehyde in barrels, and he kills the guy and
• 31:55
  Speaker 6: then he finds a victim who survived and she lets
• 31:59
  Speaker 6: him know that he's just like the clean up guy.
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: They bring him the girls to put out of their misery.
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: So Gasey's house could have been such a place where
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: they know they've got this stick fuck who likes to choke.
• 32:13
  Speaker 6: Boys, and they my god, through the ringer and then
• 32:17
  Speaker 6: they take them there. He has his fun finishes them off.
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: Then maybe there's a team of people three or four
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: putting bodies under the house.
• 32:26
  Speaker 4: Oh my god, that's a brilliant theory.
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: Well it's just a theory.
• 32:32
  Speaker 4: Because he is like a garbage disposal.
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, he's.
• 32:36
  Speaker 4: A big, fat, sweaty gross.
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: Literally looks like he could be a garbage.
• 32:40
  Speaker 4: Man, Like he's throws. So they do all this stuff
• 32:45
  Speaker 4: to these kids and then they kind of take them
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: back to Gacy's house. He finishes them off, and then
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: like maybe he buries some maybe they bury.
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: Some kind of thing. I mean, who knows, damn.
• 32:57
  Speaker 4: And Gacy was able to recall sketchy details of only
• 33:04
  Speaker 4: five of the killings. Of the other twenty eight, he
• 33:10
  Speaker 4: had no memory at all. He claimed that the murders
• 33:15
  Speaker 4: began in nineteen seventy four, but then later stated that
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: the first occurred in January nineteen seventy two. He attributed
• 33:25
  Speaker 4: all of the murders to an alter personality that he
• 33:28
  Speaker 4: referred to as Jack Hanley, Which brings me to another point.
• 33:34
  Speaker 4: Do you think that he doesn't remember killing all of
• 33:37
  Speaker 4: them because he has an alter personality? Or do you
• 33:44
  Speaker 4: think that he has an alter personality because he is
• 33:48
  Speaker 4: a part of this group doing this stuff.
• 33:51
  Speaker 3: It is either could be the case.
• 33:53
  Speaker 6: But also when you get a guy like this, he's
• 33:56
  Speaker 6: just running out the mouth every chance he got before
• 33:59
  Speaker 6: he was in curged rated indefinitely, a guy like that,
• 34:04
  Speaker 6: you know he might have just a tactic of his
• 34:07
  Speaker 6: was like, maybe if I'm a little fuzzy on the details,
• 34:11
  Speaker 6: I could you know, you could get a stay of execution,
• 34:15
  Speaker 6: possibly by an insanity play. And so he starts being
• 34:19
  Speaker 6: fuzzy with the details, and then he starts claiming that
• 34:22
  Speaker 6: there's this alter ego. It could help his case and make,
• 34:25
  Speaker 6: you know, ensure his prolonged survival or he's just a
• 34:32
  Speaker 6: fucking mkltrure victim.
• 34:34
  Speaker 4: I could go either way on that, yeah, because you
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: would want to do anything you could to stay alive,
• 34:41
  Speaker 4: even if it was like another month.
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 34:44
  Speaker 6: So then I don't know the laws in Illinois, but
• 34:48
  Speaker 6: you could get a stay of execution based on insanity
• 34:51
  Speaker 6: in some states. Yeah, I assume that that's a possibility there.
• 34:55
  Speaker 6: They're a pretty liberal judicial system.
• 34:58
  Speaker 4: Well that's pretty much all I wanted to touch on
• 35:01
  Speaker 4: with Gasey. Do you have anything else, like you feel
• 35:05
  Speaker 4: like we left out before we move on?
• 35:08
  Speaker 6: I mean, I can't think of anything that is pressing
• 35:11
  Speaker 6: that we didn't talk about.
• 35:14
  Speaker 4: It just seems like this what the information that I
• 35:17
  Speaker 4: just provided you never sees the light of day as
• 35:20
  Speaker 4: far as documentaries are concerned, but leans more towards the
• 35:25
  Speaker 4: program to kill idea for sure.
• 35:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 35:27
  Speaker 6: And I mean, just to even assume, knowing everything we know,
• 35:32
  Speaker 6: if you've been listening up to this point through all
• 35:34
  Speaker 6: these series, the official narrative is always going to be
• 35:38
  Speaker 6: a narrative and if they're selling the loan nut I
• 35:44
  Speaker 6: know model to us when it comes to every single
• 35:46
  Speaker 6: one of these serial killers. Yeah, Gaysey's definitely not someone
• 35:51
  Speaker 6: who seemed to have acted alone. I mean, whether you
• 35:54
  Speaker 6: trust what he said or thought that he had like
• 35:57
  Speaker 6: some kind of grand scheme to you know it just
• 36:01
  Speaker 6: cause of stay for the execution, or even just.
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: I don't know. The guy liked to talk.
• 36:06
  Speaker 6: He was he would talk to anybody who who started
• 36:10
  Speaker 6: a correspondence with him.
• 36:11
  Speaker 4: Behind bars, he probably talked to his fucking self. Yeah,
• 36:15
  Speaker 4: like legit insane stuff.
• 36:17
  Speaker 3: Hey, John h Yeah, yeah, Jack. What was his name,
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: Jack Hanley?
• 36:23
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Jack Jack. Yeah.
• 36:27
  Speaker 6: Mainly the imagination is certainly lacking there. My name was John,
• 36:31
  Speaker 6: and then I had an alter ego.
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: I'd be like, it's Jack. I mean, if you grew
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: up with the name.
• 36:36
  Speaker 6: So bland as John, you'd be like, yeah, Pedro Hanley.
• 36:42
  Speaker 3: But no, it's just Jack. It's just Jack, John and Jack.
• 36:46
  Speaker 4: John and Jack. Yeah, if you had an altar, would
• 36:50
  Speaker 4: what would you name them?
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: Tony Tony.
• 36:53
  Speaker 4: That's right, you do have an altar.
• 36:56
  Speaker 3: Tony's blackout line alter alter ego.
• 36:58
  Speaker 4: Yeah, he he uh, he's fun that about Tony. Do
• 37:04
  Speaker 4: I have one?
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: Wouldn't you like to know?
• 37:08
  Speaker 4: I would like to know, so I kind of want
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: to switch gears a little bit and move on to
• 37:14
  Speaker 4: our next serial killer, Ted Bundy.
• 37:21
  Speaker 7: He didn't look like anybody's notion of somebody who would
• 37:23
  Speaker 7: tear apart young girls.
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: When pat Buddy, I've never spoken to anybody about this.
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: I am looking for an opportunity to tell the story
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: as past I can.
• 37:41
  Speaker 7: Person of this type chooses his duke for a reason
• 37:46
  Speaker 7: possession control files.
• 37:51
  Speaker 4: There was something unique about tense brain. He talked in
• 37:54
  Speaker 4: terms of a voice in his head, and this voice
• 37:57
  Speaker 4: would start saying things about women.
• 38:00
  Speaker 8: Yet very blue eyes when he really got to go,
• 38:03
  Speaker 8: and his eyes went absolutely black.
• 38:05
  Speaker 2: Murder, leaving the cherson of this type hungry unfulfilled, would
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: also leave him with the obviously irrational belief that the
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: next time he did it he would be fulfilled, and
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: the next time he did it he would be fulfilled,
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: or the next time he did it he would be fulfilled.
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: Theodore Bundy has escaped, suspected of dozens of sex killings
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: in Washington State, Idaho, Utah, and Colorado.
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: I think things are going to work out That's about
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: all I have to say.
• 38:33
  Speaker 4: Monday is acting as an own lawyer.
• 38:35
  Speaker 5: What is unusual to see is that many of the
• 38:37
  Speaker 5: onlookers are women.
• 38:38
  Speaker 3: You a little scared when you.
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: Look at him.
• 38:39
  Speaker 4: He just doesn't look like the type to kill combany
• 38:41
  Speaker 4: real killer.
• 38:42
  Speaker 3: Theodore Bundy has escaped once again, one of the FBI's
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: most wanted man.
• 38:45
  Speaker 4: He was charming and looking Mark, sure you have the
• 38:50
  Speaker 4: right guy.
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: I mean, I thought it animal and I'm not crazy.
• 38:56
  Speaker 5: I'm a bit personality, the normal.
• 39:00
  Speaker 4: Individual, interesting motherfucker, and I have a little bit of information.
• 39:08
  Speaker 4: I feel like if anybody is up to speed with
• 39:10
  Speaker 4: true crime stuff, they already kind of know about the
• 39:14
  Speaker 4: mainstream his victims and stuff like that. So I want
• 39:18
  Speaker 4: to just talk about some of the stuff that you're
• 39:20
  Speaker 4: not going to find in the Netflix documentary. So Ted
• 39:24
  Speaker 4: Bundy's mom, Louise, legally changed Ted's name from Theodore Robert
• 39:31
  Speaker 4: Cowell to Theodore Robert Nelson for no discernible reason whatsoever.
• 39:39
  Speaker 4: And then she ends up married to Johnny Culpepper Bundy
• 39:45
  Speaker 4: and changed Ted's name once again. So you know the theory,
• 39:50
  Speaker 4: or it's not a theory. Ted Bundy's mom was his
• 39:54
  Speaker 4: sister raised by Louise, who was his grandmother.
• 40:00
  Speaker 3: Well, I don't know, you're saying his mom's.
• 40:02
  Speaker 4: Louise, but he only knew her as his mom, So
• 40:06
  Speaker 4: I'm taking it this is his grandmother. Yeah, so she
• 40:11
  Speaker 4: gets Ted his name is Theodore Robert Cowell and then
• 40:16
  Speaker 4: she changes it to Theodore Robert Nelson, and then she
• 40:22
  Speaker 4: ends up getting married to uh Bundy and changes his
• 40:27
  Speaker 4: name again to Bundy. But there's this weirdness like he
• 40:32
  Speaker 4: doesn't have a birth certificate and stuff like that. There's
• 40:34
  Speaker 4: almost no record of him ever being born.
• 40:37
  Speaker 6: Yeah, he's It's We've maybe said this already, but it's
• 40:41
  Speaker 6: strikingly similar to Jack Nicholson's story, Jack Nicholson's mom. And
• 40:46
  Speaker 6: when you say that Ted Bundy's mom was his sister,
• 40:49
  Speaker 6: don't think that, like his sister was impregnated and gave
• 40:51
  Speaker 6: birth to him. He thought his mom was his sister
• 40:55
  Speaker 6: because she had him so young. I mean, just in
• 40:57
  Speaker 6: case that, you know, confused some people.
• 41:00
  Speaker 9: Bit.
• 41:00
  Speaker 6: Yeah, so he was raised by his grandmother, thought his
• 41:03
  Speaker 6: grandmother was his mom.
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: I mean, did he ever know the truth about.
• 41:05
  Speaker 4: That way later in life? Yeah?
• 41:09
  Speaker 3: I think Jack Nicholson was thirty seven years.
• 41:11
  Speaker 4: Old when he yeah, so so was Ted Bundy, and they.
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: He said, played by Jack Nicholson.
• 41:17
  Speaker 4: Dude, I said that, and somebody got mad as fuck
• 41:20
  Speaker 4: at me.
• 41:21
  Speaker 6: Oh, let's not have some fun and kick around some
• 41:23
  Speaker 6: crazy ideas. I mean, it sounds like you're marrying yourself too.
• 41:26
  Speaker 4: Do you want to know? It's ironic? I said it
• 41:28
  Speaker 4: on Dangerous World podcast and I got fucking attacked as
• 41:31
  Speaker 4: fuck after I said that, and they were showing me
• 41:34
  Speaker 4: all these ry no no, no, no, no, oh yeah listeners
• 41:38
  Speaker 4: Ryan's listeners, because they were like, look at this picture
• 41:42
  Speaker 4: Jack Nicholson, and look at this picture of Ted Bundy.
• 41:45
  Speaker 4: But it's like we were talking to our guest that
• 41:48
  Speaker 4: we had on earlier. There's characters, and I feel like
• 41:51
  Speaker 4: they're interchangeable. Sometimes they get swapped out and shit and
• 41:55
  Speaker 4: like weird stuff. Sojack Nicholson, Ted Bundy, I don't know.
• 42:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's all strange.
• 42:06
  Speaker 4: So this Johnny Culpepper Bundy, by the way, was a
• 42:10
  Speaker 4: former Navy man and himself and a bunch of his
• 42:13
  Speaker 4: family members were employed at a military hospital at a
• 42:17
  Speaker 4: joint Army slash Air Force complex. So this was taking
• 42:23
  Speaker 4: place in the early seventies, and so we were talking
• 42:29
  Speaker 4: about Jack Nicholson, we might as well say, like, this
• 42:34
  Speaker 4: is more Laurel Kenyony type shit with Ted.
• 42:38
  Speaker 6: With the military connections, I mean a military hospitals, bases, daycares.
• 42:46
  Speaker 3: Seemed to be some very nefarious stuff being covered up
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: with these places.
• 42:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and so Ted attended Woodrow Wilson High School in Tacoma, Washington,
• 42:59
  Speaker 4: at least according to his former classmates, he did. But
• 43:03
  Speaker 4: here's the thing that cannot be verified, since all records
• 43:11
  Speaker 4: of Bundy's enrollment there have strangely disappeared, just like it's
• 43:16
  Speaker 4: sucking birth certificate.
• 43:18
  Speaker 3: Well, was there ever a birth certificate?
• 43:20
  Speaker 4: Like see a fucking homunculous baby?
• 43:23
  Speaker 6: You're acting like, I mean, I'm not saying you're saying this,
• 43:26
  Speaker 6: but the way this is worded, that his enrollment records disappeared.
• 43:31
  Speaker 3: But did they ever exist? It's not like they went
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: in there and cleaned.
• 43:36
  Speaker 4: This guy up, right, I surely said, but I mean
• 43:40
  Speaker 4: they don't exist.
• 43:41
  Speaker 3: So but did they at one point?
• 43:42
  Speaker 6: Because that's kind of what they try to say about
• 43:45
  Speaker 6: Bob Lazar when his story about all this a UFO shit.
• 43:49
  Speaker 6: They went and looked at where he claimed to have
• 43:51
  Speaker 6: gone to school and they're like, oh my gosh, they got.
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: Rid of all the records I was even here. But
• 43:56
  Speaker 3: with with Ted Bundy.
• 44:00
  Speaker 6: Mounculus, the way you put it, I'm picturing like you
• 44:04
  Speaker 6: just found a kid or you were handed this kid
• 44:09
  Speaker 6: might not even be your daughter's kid, but you raised
• 44:12
  Speaker 6: this kid for whatever reason. I mean, they're saying that
• 44:15
  Speaker 6: it's the daughter's kid of this woman who raised him.
• 44:19
  Speaker 3: Louise, But we don't know that.
• 44:22
  Speaker 6: We don't know what the fuck Louise was into, and
• 44:26
  Speaker 6: maybe this is one of those kids that.
• 44:29
  Speaker 3: They yeah, manipulated and then gave to a handler.
• 44:35
  Speaker 4: Whoever Louise is That to me makes more sense than
• 44:38
  Speaker 4: the sister getting pregnant.
• 44:39
  Speaker 3: Right, I'm not saying she did it.
• 44:41
  Speaker 6: I mean there's the tell tale always his real mom
• 44:45
  Speaker 6: was a prostitute. She would service her clientele right in
• 44:48
  Speaker 6: the presence of young Ted. But it also makes you wonder, like,
• 44:53
  Speaker 6: how long did she even have him? In this narrative
• 44:55
  Speaker 6: and this story, how long did this woman have this kid?
• 44:58
  Speaker 6: But she was pulling tricks while he was in the
• 45:00
  Speaker 6: same you know.
• 45:01
  Speaker 4: Studio before the grandma got him.
• 45:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but it just seems like in this story, the
• 45:06
  Speaker 3: grandma would have taken him immediately. I don't know unless.
• 45:09
  Speaker 4: Unless it's like we were saying, and it's all just
• 45:12
  Speaker 4: a story.
• 45:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, like why is this old woman have this young kid?
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: And you know, you could say, oh, it was her
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: daughter's kid, really, but.
• 45:20
  Speaker 6: For some reason she ends up with him. She changes
• 45:22
  Speaker 6: his name twice, she shack, She fucking pairs up with
• 45:26
  Speaker 6: this was it Navy?
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah he maybe guy and.
• 45:31
  Speaker 6: Changes her his name to his name Johnny Culpepper Bundy
• 45:35
  Speaker 6: to Yeah.
• 45:36
  Speaker 4: So weirdness, right, I mean, did the guy adopt him?
• 45:41
  Speaker 4: Not that I know of. So and so here's the thing.
• 45:48
  Speaker 4: In July of nineteen seventy three, Bundy flew to the
• 45:52
  Speaker 4: San Francisco area, just as the dusk was settling from
• 45:56
  Speaker 4: the fucking spree of Zodiac ritual murders that had terrorized
• 46:00
  Speaker 4: the city. Interesting timing, not really.
• 46:05
  Speaker 6: You know, your your one preak shows kind of losing it.
• 46:09
  Speaker 6: It's zest with the crowd. You gotta get them something new.
• 46:12
  Speaker 6: So it makes perfect sense they would fla Bundy in there.
• 46:15
  Speaker 4: But it's like we were saying in the very first episode,
• 46:19
  Speaker 4: all those other serial killers were the training wheels for
• 46:23
  Speaker 4: bringing in like the Bundies and shit. We don't even
• 46:26
  Speaker 4: know where Bundy fucking came from, honestly, right, like literally
• 46:30
  Speaker 4: he just dropped off at this That's how.
• 46:32
  Speaker 3: I like got a cover story with lots of holes in.
• 46:37
  Speaker 4: Then, just after his return to Washington, women began disappearing
• 46:45
  Speaker 4: from the Seattle Tacoma area. Before that time, the Seattle
• 46:51
  Speaker 4: area had experienced very few murders, but that was about
• 46:56
  Speaker 4: to change drastically. So my other theory is, did he
• 47:00
  Speaker 4: go to San Francisco to get trained because there were
• 47:06
  Speaker 4: no murders going on at all. He flies to San
• 47:10
  Speaker 4: Francisco just as the Zodiac murders are dropping off. Then
• 47:15
  Speaker 4: he flies back to Washington and bitches start fucking turning
• 47:19
  Speaker 4: up dead and decapitate and shit all over the place.
• 47:22
  Speaker 3: Well, and then you referred it makes me think of.
• 47:27
  Speaker 6: The crime scenes and True Detective that a lot of
• 47:31
  Speaker 6: the stuff that Bundy was first doing, the twigs.
• 47:34
  Speaker 4: And berries, the twigs and berries.
• 47:36
  Speaker 6: So you know, that sounds like all that random shit
• 47:39
  Speaker 6: that started popping off in the Santa Cruz Hills where
• 47:43
  Speaker 6: you have these like almost ludicrous to the amount of
• 47:48
  Speaker 6: being like bad TV, just fucking coult slaughters m It's
• 47:53
  Speaker 6: just they're just going through the fucking mountains around that
• 47:56
  Speaker 6: Santa Cruz area.
• 47:57
  Speaker 3: But I mean maybe he was a part of that.
• 47:58
  Speaker 6: Maybe that was like they saw the Phoenix program's success
• 48:03
  Speaker 6: in Vietnam and then they come back here and they're like,
• 48:06
  Speaker 6: we could just do this here, and you know, Santa Cruz,
• 48:09
  Speaker 6: San Francisco, that whole area, and now like we need
• 48:12
  Speaker 6: to expand, we need some new franchises. We could get
• 48:15
  Speaker 6: this Ted guy to manage the Seattle area. You know,
• 48:19
  Speaker 6: he could just be put loose there.
• 48:22
  Speaker 4: Mm hm. And July nineteen seventy three when he flew
• 48:27
  Speaker 4: to San Francis Cisco, that was a year after William
• 48:31
  Speaker 4: Colby came back. Yeah, so God only knows now. The
• 48:41
  Speaker 4: body of the first victim attributed to Bundy was found
• 48:44
  Speaker 4: on December sixth, nineteen seventy three. Catherine Mary Divine. She
• 48:50
  Speaker 4: had last been seen two weeks earlier getting into a
• 48:54
  Speaker 4: pickup truck after running away from home. The man from
• 48:59
  Speaker 4: whom she will accepted the ride was not Ted Bundy,
• 49:04
  Speaker 4: witness confirmed. It's also pretty odd that her body was
• 49:08
  Speaker 4: found to be missing its heart, liver, and lungs, later
• 49:14
  Speaker 4: attributed to scavenging animals. But if it was scavenging animals.
• 49:21
  Speaker 4: The fucking scavengers were very selective. And it also doesn't
• 49:26
  Speaker 4: fit the mo of any of the other Bundy victims.
• 49:30
  Speaker 4: So what do you think about this?
• 49:33
  Speaker 3: Well, the whole animal thing.
• 49:35
  Speaker 6: Yes, predatory animals will go for the liver, like with
• 49:41
  Speaker 6: the when a wolf pack takes down and elk. The
• 49:44
  Speaker 6: alpha gets the liver, but you just don't stop eating.
• 49:47
  Speaker 6: Oh we got the lungs and the liver and what
• 49:49
  Speaker 6: else is missing?
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: The heart?
• 49:50
  Speaker 9: M h.
• 49:51
  Speaker 6: Yeah, animals don't just like go for the gourmet and
• 49:54
  Speaker 6: then just leave the scraps.
• 49:55
  Speaker 3: So that's kind of weird. Also, the other.
• 49:59
  Speaker 4: Question was, well, she got into a truck. Witness confirmed
• 50:05
  Speaker 4: was not Ted Bundy, right, but they attributed this as
• 50:10
  Speaker 4: his very first victim. None of the other victims they
• 50:15
  Speaker 4: found that were attributed to Tad Bundy had missing organs.
• 50:18
  Speaker 4: So where was this? This was in the Seattle area, okay,
• 50:25
  Speaker 4: seventy three. So next to disappear was Linda Heey in
• 50:31
  Speaker 4: the morning hours of February first, nineteen seventy four. According
• 50:37
  Speaker 4: to the official version of events, Linda was abducted from
• 50:42
  Speaker 4: the home that she shared with roommates. Okay, so Bundy
• 50:48
  Speaker 4: allegedly entered the house undetected by any of the home's
• 50:53
  Speaker 4: other occupants, crept noiselessly downstairs, overpowered and killed Linda without
• 51:02
  Speaker 4: waking a single fucking roommate, who, by the way, were
• 51:05
  Speaker 4: sleeping just on the other side of a thin plywood wall,
• 51:11
  Speaker 4: and without leaving behind any signs of a struggle. He
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: also wrapped Linda's body, carried it back upstairs undetected, and
• 51:21
  Speaker 4: then returned, still unnoticed, to make Linda's fucking bed, hang
• 51:26
  Speaker 4: up her fucking nightgown, and grab a change of her
• 51:31
  Speaker 4: fucking clothes. Nothing unusual about any of that, though, right
• 51:37
  Speaker 4: the only remains of Linda Healey that were ever found
• 51:42
  Speaker 4: was her skull, which investigators speculated that she had been
• 51:47
  Speaker 4: bludgeoned to death. According to Heally's mother, the positive identification
• 51:52
  Speaker 4: of that skull was based on one single fucking tooth,
• 51:56
  Speaker 4: raising the question of whether Linda was ever actually found
• 52:02
  Speaker 4: out all So, what do you think about this, because
• 52:07
  Speaker 4: in the documentaries it makes it out to be that
• 52:10
  Speaker 4: Linda had one other roommate away on the other side
• 52:13
  Speaker 4: of the house, and you know, that's why nobody heard
• 52:18
  Speaker 4: him coming in and out, But she had actually had
• 52:21
  Speaker 4: several roommates, and to pull all this off and then
• 52:26
  Speaker 4: make her bed, hang up her night gown, grab a
• 52:29
  Speaker 4: change of clothes for her. What do you think about that?
• 52:35
  Speaker 3: I mean, are you suggesting that this may have been
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: done somewhere else? Or yeah, maybe.
• 52:42
  Speaker 4: Not at all, because maybe not at all.
• 52:46
  Speaker 3: Their blood.
• 52:47
  Speaker 4: They said that there was blood on her mattress, but
• 52:51
  Speaker 4: I looked at the pictures. Definitely could have been period blood.
• 52:56
  Speaker 4: To me, it could have been old blood.
• 52:59
  Speaker 3: That was it.
• 53:00
  Speaker 4: Mm hmmm.
• 53:01
  Speaker 3: And she was allegedly bludgeoned.
• 53:04
  Speaker 4: Mm hmmm.
• 53:05
  Speaker 6: I mean, if you nick your forehead, it bleeds like
• 53:08
  Speaker 6: a stuck pig. So to have your fucking skull bashed
• 53:12
  Speaker 6: the fuck in makes me, Hey, you're gonna make some noises.
• 53:21
  Speaker 4: No signs of a struggle too, didn't wake a single person.
• 53:25
  Speaker 6: Well, god knows, when you kill somebody, you want to
• 53:27
  Speaker 6: take him out then return to make the bed.
• 53:30
  Speaker 4: That makes a hell of a lot of sense, but
• 53:32
  Speaker 4: it just does it.
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: So he's cleaning up her room for her, Yeah, after
• 53:36
  Speaker 3: killing her. He didn't want to. That's any other rap
• 53:41
  Speaker 3: with your roommates.
• 53:43
  Speaker 4: Grabbed, hung her night gown up, grabbed her the dead body,
• 53:46
  Speaker 4: a change of clothes, So can we say maybe Linda
• 53:52
  Speaker 4: and heally, is it real?
• 53:54
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 53:55
  Speaker 4: Do you think she's a character because she was also on.
• 53:59
  Speaker 3: The news, right, I don't think she would have to
• 54:03
  Speaker 3: be fake to be a part of all this.
• 54:05
  Speaker 4: No, she wasn't like a news anchor, right.
• 54:07
  Speaker 3: So when you say she was on the news, you.
• 54:10
  Speaker 4: Well like a character, so you should tell.
• 54:14
  Speaker 6: You know, you keep alluding to the episode that we
• 54:16
  Speaker 6: did earlier for our other shows. We did kind of
• 54:20
  Speaker 6: a swapcast thing with a guest who's not quite to
• 54:24
  Speaker 6: the level of human vibrations but also very much on
• 54:27
  Speaker 6: the wagon that much of this stuff is not only exaggerated,
• 54:33
  Speaker 6: but you know, sometimes just straight up created. So yeah,
• 54:39
  Speaker 6: if she's like a newscaster, some I mean newscasters are
• 54:44
  Speaker 6: at least like, in small pockets, celebrities of type.
• 54:48
  Speaker 3: I mean you'll see them out at dinner and you're like,
• 54:50
  Speaker 3: oh my god, she's on the news.
• 54:52
  Speaker 6: So I mean, yeah, who knows she could have been
• 54:57
  Speaker 6: a character because the fact that.
• 55:00
  Speaker 4: They found this bashed in skull and identified it off
• 55:03
  Speaker 4: of one tooth, and the type of forensics they were
• 55:07
  Speaker 4: doing in the seventies wasn't like they took DNA from
• 55:09
  Speaker 4: that tooth. They just said, this looks like one of
• 55:12
  Speaker 4: Linda's teeth. This must be Linda.
• 55:15
  Speaker 3: Well, many people, especially I don't know.
• 55:18
  Speaker 6: This was the seventies, so it might not have been
• 55:21
  Speaker 6: as common, But most people have dental records, and it's
• 55:25
  Speaker 6: supposed to be one of the most.
• 55:28
  Speaker 3: You know, tight form of science.
• 55:32
  Speaker 6: It's not like DNA science, which is flawed in lots
• 55:34
  Speaker 6: of ways, but your dental records are supposed to be
• 55:37
  Speaker 6: pretty spot on, almost.
• 55:39
  Speaker 4: Like fingerprints, like one tooth do you think.
• 55:41
  Speaker 6: I don't know the extent of it, but I do
• 55:44
  Speaker 6: know that they have identified bodies burned beyond record. I
• 55:48
  Speaker 6: mean it could have been but whether it was her
• 55:53
  Speaker 6: being killed at all or not being killed at this house,
• 55:56
  Speaker 6: the fact that.
• 55:59
  Speaker 3: They want to paint.
• 56:00
  Speaker 6: The narrative that this is where the murder took place,
• 56:03
  Speaker 6: but they didn't even bother to like go stage a
• 56:06
  Speaker 6: crime scene. This woman disappears a skull that couldn't have
• 56:11
  Speaker 6: been hers, I mean, based on so what was it
• 56:15
  Speaker 6: the mom said?
• 56:16
  Speaker 4: The mom said, the positive identification of this skull was
• 56:20
  Speaker 4: based on a single tooth.
• 56:22
  Speaker 3: So is she saying that in like a doubtful way yeah, okay.
• 56:25
  Speaker 4: I mean, I think if it was your kids.
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: So she's like, you'd want more than that in the depths.
• 56:29
  Speaker 6: Of woe, like to the level of Johnny Gosh's mom perhaps,
• 56:33
  Speaker 6: and she doesn't buy the bullshit their feet in her Yeah,
• 56:37
  Speaker 6: it's very sketchy, And the fact that it's supposed to
• 56:40
  Speaker 6: be one of Bundy's first victims is kind of weird too,
• 56:44
  Speaker 6: because you know.
• 56:45
  Speaker 4: It seems meticulous for someone who's just getting started, that's
• 56:49
  Speaker 4: for fucking sure.
• 56:50
  Speaker 6: If that's the funny thing about Bundy is he seemed
• 56:53
  Speaker 6: to start meticulous, and near the end of his reign
• 56:57
  Speaker 6: he was going into a goddamn dormitory with a hammer
• 57:02
  Speaker 6: and just fucking.
• 57:03
  Speaker 4: Going all out dismastic.
• 57:05
  Speaker 3: It's in whack a mole. Yeah, fucking arcade.
• 57:10
  Speaker 4: Well, so, okay, if this was even Bundy, right, So
• 57:14
  Speaker 4: that's another theory.
• 57:16
  Speaker 6: If it was Bundy, somebody went out of their way
• 57:19
  Speaker 6: to make this look like something it wasn't.
• 57:21
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 57:21
  Speaker 3: This is also.
• 57:22
  Speaker 4: Interesting now, the Pacific Northwest was also dealing with another
• 57:28
  Speaker 4: emerging problem in the spring of nineteen seventy four, which
• 57:32
  Speaker 4: was an abundance of what we're referred to as cattle mutilations.
• 57:38
  Speaker 4: Conspiracy theories, frequently involving UFOs and alien experimentation floated around,
• 57:44
  Speaker 4: but many police investigators and independent researchers linked those occurrences to
• 57:50
  Speaker 4: local satanic cult activity because they would secretly love to
• 57:54
  Speaker 4: brainwash everyone with UFO shit. But you know what I
• 57:58
  Speaker 4: find interesting about this that they were finding cattle mutilations
• 58:01
  Speaker 4: the same time Bundy was running around, and they blamed it,
• 58:05
  Speaker 4: and then the police said it was cult activity and shit.
• 58:10
  Speaker 4: In the Pacific Northwest in Oregon, my cousin's been texting
• 58:15
  Speaker 4: me like a lot about there being cattle mutilations popping up,
• 58:20
  Speaker 4: And the first thing she says was, it's aliens. They're
• 58:23
  Speaker 4: drained of blood, They're this, they're that. I bet you
• 58:26
  Speaker 4: there's some fucking serial murder shit going on always in
• 58:31
  Speaker 4: the Pacific Northwest, you know what I'm saying, Like, it's.
• 58:33
  Speaker 6: Always We've had cattle mutilations and serial killers since the seventies.
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: It's never like stopped.
• 58:42
  Speaker 4: What do you think it is because it's so close
• 58:43
  Speaker 4: to Seattle or what? What do you mean this Pacific
• 58:48
  Speaker 4: Northwest like where we are in like Oregon, the I
• 58:52
  Speaker 4: five murders and all that. Do you think like, well,
• 58:54
  Speaker 4: it comes from there, and like trickles.
• 58:56
  Speaker 6: Down, we happen to be damn near sin Point between
• 59:01
  Speaker 6: Portland and San Francisco. And then Seattle's only a few
• 59:06
  Speaker 6: hours in car north of Portland.
• 59:10
  Speaker 4: So you're saying we could be victims of a potential
• 59:13
  Speaker 4: future serial killer.
• 59:15
  Speaker 3: I mean, you don't give them any ideas. If they
• 59:17
  Speaker 3: want to shut you up.
• 59:18
  Speaker 4: I've donet let the cat out of the bag.
• 59:20
  Speaker 3: I mean, I can see the I five from our window.
• 59:23
  Speaker 6: Oh god, the I five is the freeway we take
• 59:26
  Speaker 6: when we take the freeway.
• 59:27
  Speaker 4: I'm just learning this. So on July third, nineteen seventy four,
• 59:33
  Speaker 4: a law enforcement summit was held in Olympia, Washington that
• 59:38
  Speaker 4: was attended by one hundred representatives from Washington and Oregon.
• 59:43
  Speaker 4: A prime topic of conversation at the summit was the
• 59:47
  Speaker 4: wave of missing girls, which was actually kind of weird
• 59:51
  Speaker 4: and fucked up since only one of the girl's remains
• 59:54
  Speaker 4: had been discovered at that time, and it didn't necessarily
• 59:58
  Speaker 4: confirm that she had been met with foul play, and
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 4: there was no indication whatsoever that the disappearances, which occurred
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 4: over a wide geographic area were connected in any way.
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 4: So why was this already the hot topic?
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 6: Well, all it kind of is reminiscent of me to
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 6: how the military always seems to know who they're going
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 6: to be fighting in what area way before the war
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 6: actually breaks out. So it's like, yeah, they're gearing up
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 6: knowing that this is going to be the next big
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 6: thing they're fighting against. Why do they know that at
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 6: this early on? It's this It's nineteen seventy four, still,
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 6: I mean, this is definitely enough time has passed since
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 6: the Manson killings.
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 3: This is five years later, and.
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 4: You think they were being on the offensive or defensive?
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 4: I mean, or do you think that they were planning
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 4: this shit?
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 3: Well, I don't think it would have gone down to that.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 6: The level of all the law enforcement people, I think
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 6: that they're definitely role players in this game, most.
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 3: Of them, probably unwittingly.
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 6: You know, they're just little ponds in the grand scheme
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 6: of things. But yeah, whoever set this meeting up or summit,
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 6: it was, yeah, here's the next thing for you.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 3: This is going to be an issue by nineteen eighty,
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 3: there's gonna be twenty by in nineteen ninety, there could
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 3: be hundreds.
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 6: Yeah, no joke, it's almost also like when Fauci and
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 6: all these fuckers meet up and they're.
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 4: Like the World Economic Forum.
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 3: No, no, no, not even them.
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 6: It's just like these drills that they run like at
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 6: John Hopkins University.
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 4: Like what if there was a pandemic type shit. Yeah,
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 4: that's that's what it felt.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 3: Like, preparing for what we know is going to happen.
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah. When I read that about the summit, I was thinking,
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 4: this is, you know, like a rehearsal for the big show.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 3: Like, yeah, they're having a little pepp rally.
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah. So, each of the seven girls that disappeared, Katherine Divine,
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 4: Linda and Healey, Donna Manson, Susan Rancourt, Kathleen Parks, Brenda Ball,
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 4: and Susanne Hawkins had vanished without a single clue having
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 4: been left behind. There were no witnesses and no forensic
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 4: evidence to tie anyone to any of the crime scenes.
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 4: In some of the cases, it couldn't even be determined
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 4: when or where the crime had occurred. Completely undetectable, maybe
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 4: by design, I think, as a beginning serial killer, when
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 4: there's not even a lot of serial killers to be found,
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 4: it's odd that he was so undetectable. Not a scrap
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 4: of evidence.
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 6: Well, you also got to take into consideration the fact
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 6: that the serial killer phenomenon being slightly new.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 3: Do they even have like advanced for in teams? Why
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 3: would a local police station even be able to deal
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 3: with something that's never been an issue before? Because that's
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 3: very true.
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 6: You're not having these murders left and right until the
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 6: late seventies, late sixties through the mid seventies where it really.
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 3: Starts to take off.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 6: Having a summit like this would be like, and now
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 6: we need all this money too to fight this new
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 6: emergence of all these serial killers. So I think pretty
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 6: much nice back in the day, the FBI would just
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 6: step in.
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they weren't equipped to handle it on the local level.
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean you always bring up good points. That
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 4: gets me to thinking about shit, because how about this.
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 4: Not only is there no good forensics and shit like
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 4: to in, no good crime scene investigating, like they don't
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 4: even know what they're doing. Really, they could have been
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 4: contaminating evidence and all kinds of shit. Let's go in
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 4: a completely different fucking because a lot of the victims,
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 4: friends and family and roommates and shit like that say,
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 4: it's almost as if they disappeared right with no trace
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 4: of anything left behind. I almost want to go human
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 4: vibrations and say that none of these girls were real.
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 6: That that would be just at first glance, not a
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 6: bad theory.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 4: I don't In all of the documentaries, you only ever
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 4: see adult pictures of them. There's no pictures of them
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 4: as babies, there's no pictures of them as kids.
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 3: One of them's a local news celebrity.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 4: Mm hmm, what if and that sucks for Let's just
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 4: say they are real, and like, there's victims family members
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 4: out there that would be like fuck you, But like
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 4: what if they were what if they were all fake?
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 6: If you're a victim family member who would like to
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 6: reach out and say fuck you Julia, you can go
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 6: to cosmicpeach dot com send her an email, and if
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 6: you don't get any keep going with the theory.
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 4: But yeah, so I mean to disappear without a trace,
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 4: and I don't know, like in all of the documentaries,
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 4: it's only one family member that's like, yeah, they were
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 4: taken and they can find crisis actors really easy, and shit,
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 4: you know they've done that a million times.
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 3: Oh and you know we always talk about how back
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 3: when they first start doing these staged events slash false flags.
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 3: They didn't have Internet sleuths willing to tear it apart
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 3: the minute the shit gets put out. They're gonna look
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 3: for holes in the story. They're gonna look for inconsistencies.
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 6: They're gonna look for Oh, this person also showed up
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 6: at the Boston marathon bombing. She was the one that
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 6: was there at the Parkland school shooting. She was also
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 6: at Sandy Hook. Back then, they didn't have anything going
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 6: on like that, so they could be so sloppy and just, yeah,
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 6: disappear people who never really existed in the first place.
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 3: Is something that would be easy to pull off.
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 6: You're not going to have people come out and say,
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 6: anybody who knew them come forward and talk to me
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 6: so I can verify if I think this person's real
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 6: or not.
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 3: I mean, that's just can you imagine in the seventies
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 3: the level of.
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah, thoughts, oh yeah, it was non existent.
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 3: Really, I mean, you would just most people would just take.
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 4: They said it, so therefore it is true.
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 6: Yeah, it's on the news, and I don't know anybody
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 6: that knows this person. But look, they just interviewed somebody
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 6: who said they were their friend and they're crying, so
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 6: this is real.
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and they also made Ted Bunny you have to
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 4: be like a handsome, good looking get dude and like, look,
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 4: freaking Brad Pitt's a murderer. That's pretty much what they did. Yeah,
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 4: but we have to have a bad guy to pin
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 4: these so called murders on, right, So conveniently, on July fourteenth,
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 4: just days after the summit that we talked about earlier,
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 4: Janisawt and Denise Naslin both reportedly disappeared from the very
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 4: crowded Lake Samamish Park in broad daylight and in front
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 4: of literally thousands of potential witnesses, including a sizeable part
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 4: of the Seattle Police Force, who just so happened to
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 4: be holding their annual picnic there that day. A total
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 4: of eight witnesses came forward claiming to have seen the
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 4: elusive predator in the park that day. One of them
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 4: had seen Janis aught in the company of a man
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 4: with sandy blonde hair around the time of her disappearance.
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 4: The descriptions offered by the other witnesses varied. Only two
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 4: of them were ever able to identify Bundy as the
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 4: man they had seen, and only after his image had
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 4: been widely aired by the media, but the one thing
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 4: that several of them agreed on was that the man
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 4: had introduced himself as Ted. So now we conveniently have
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 4: a name for our mystery man. And this occurred just
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 4: days after the summit. What do you think about that?
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 6: I mean, the timing of it or the lack of
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 6: like witness testimony, and also the witness testimon Well that does.
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 3: Stand is calling this guy a blonde.
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 4: There's several layers to this, because let's go with this.
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 4: They hold the summit and they say, all these girls
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 4: are gone missing, what are we going to do about it?
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 4: Just days later they got a name for this guy.
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 3: And they're also showing you how easy this happens.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 6: Look, you can be abducted right in the middle of
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 6: a fucking please conference or pretty much police picnic policic.
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 6: I mean, yeah, they're off duty, they're probably tying one on,
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 6: eating lots of food and not really acting like they're
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 6: on the job.
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 3: But it's just not a good look.
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 4: Also, out of thousands of people that were at the park,
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 4: one of them said he was a sandy, blondheaded person.
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 4: The other witnesses varied on what he looked like.
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 6: And well, remember Ted could change what he looked like
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 6: just by wanting to.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 3: According to the.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 4: Lot in the Dead Puss Smell.
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, he's walking around in a cloud of stench.
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 4: Now, how about this if they if these girls didn't
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 4: even exist and they just had some people like, Hey,
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 4: so you saw a guy today that well, I mean,
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 4: what do you think about that?
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 6: I mean, it's always a possibility in my mind that
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 6: these things are orchestrated.
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 3: Especially when.
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 6: I don't know you you have this legendary serial killer,
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 6: Ted Bundy, where this is just the start of it,
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 6: and there's already so many inconsistencies in it. And when
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 6: you get near the end of Ted's killing spree, he's
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 6: killing people like two counties apart in Florida, where to
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 6: clean up the crime of his first killing and then
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 6: get to it. Even in the best traffic scenario where
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 6: there's no delay, he still couldn't have done it.
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 3: So this shit continues throughout his entire story.
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 6: It seems to be, you know, all these holes in
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 6: the story from day one and then all the way
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 6: to the end.
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm actually gonna touch on one of those closer
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 4: to the end of the episode, because it's just so.
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 4: It's like you were saying, it's just almost impossible for
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 4: this stuff to all have been him. But like, why
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 4: the fuck would this stealthy killer choose to show his
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 4: face before thousands of potential witnesses, and why would he
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 4: use his real fucking name? And I think the most
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 4: important why here is why in the actual fuck if
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 4: this is really the story, this Ted Bundy not appear
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 4: in one of the hundreds of photographs that were taken
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 4: at La Samamish Park that day.
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 3: Good question.
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 4: And they're having this picnic and shit, like you would
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 4: think a motherfucker would have noticed him, or he would
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 4: have been in like a photo bomb like some lawyer's
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 4: waldo type shit somewhere, and get this shit. One witness
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 4: saw a girl matching Denise Naslin's description ride off from
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 4: the park with a biker gang. She reportedly yelled, quote, no,
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 4: I can't let me off and quote Then many years later,
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 4: Naslyn's mother wrote a brief note that was displayed at
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 4: her daughter's memorial service, which read, quote God forgive them
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 4: for what they've done. I love you end quote. Unless
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 4: Ted was trans and pioneered the day them trend, it
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 4: does seem to be an odd choice of words.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 3: You just broke the case. Ted was the day Them's
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 3: all alone. He was a trance and I would have
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 3: got away with it too if it wasn't for you
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 3: pesty podcasters.
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 4: So there are witnesses that say they see someone that
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 4: looked exactly like Denise Nasalin right off and obviously struggling
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 4: with a biker gang. And then Denise Naslyn's mother writes
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 4: something for her memorial that says, God, forgive them for
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 4: what they've done.
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 3: Why why angels?
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean it is the seventies. It's I don't know,
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 4: it's just all to me. It's like a bunch of
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 4: random shit that they've like placed on.
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 6: Biker gangs play a significant and interesting role in a
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 6: lot of this stuff, going back to the Laurel Canyon
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 6: and San Francisco music scenes. They rubbed shoulders with a
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 6: lot of these other people who are kind of tied
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 6: into all this other stuff.
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 3: Hunter s.
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 6: Thompson, the stabbing at the Three Rolling Stones concert, Oh,
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 6: the Fremont Yeah, or the ultramont so and you know,
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 6: biker gangs were a prominent feature of the sixties and seventies.
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 3: But it is something that pops up a lot in
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 3: weird places.
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 6: It's almost like, you know, when you're looking at a
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 6: staged scene of chaos, they always strategically place shoes and
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 6: something to.
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 3: Do with firefighters. But it's like the fucking biker gangs
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 3: play a weird.
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 4: Role they're in. They're always like.
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 3: In the LSD movement, they were in like all the
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 3: big underground drug markets in the seventies too.
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 4: Well, I was gonna say, it's like they're always in
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 4: the background somewhere, you know.
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they're like foot soldiers.
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 6: So the fact that she was taken off from this
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 6: picnic by a biker gang doesn't seem that insignificant.
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 4: No, we're random and so following the like some mammish disappearances,
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 4: the task force tracking the Seattle killer was dubbed the
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 4: Ted Squad, and.
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 3: It'll be a killer fucking movie, Ted Squad. I could
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 3: see like Robert Rodriguez directing a Tarantino executive producing Ted Squad.
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 4: It would be a cool movie, just like Jim Morrison
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 4: and Charles Manson, like the real story, the real Ted Bundy.
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 4: You know.
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 4: And one of the very first teds ever reported to
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 4: the task force was none other than Theodore Robert.
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 3: But so they're just going around looking at any Ted
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 3: Nick could find.
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, they were also looking at any Volkswagon they could find,
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 4: because they said that he drove a volts Wagon.
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 6: So wasn't it the Shining Book had the Volkswagen being
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 6: yellow and Kubrick changed it to red?
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 4: Or was it the vice versa?
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 6: So Kubrick made the change to the yellow bug that
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 6: to me always made.
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 3: If that doesn't make you think of Ted Bundy.
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 4: And Jack Nicholson Ted Bundy.
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 3: Again, that's why I brought that up.
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 4: Literally, the connections are weird.
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 6: Jack Nicholson's almost like a Forrest, gumpy and kind of
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 6: player in a lot of this ship. I mean I
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 6: always said, if you could get anybody to be honest
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 6: with you that's still alive today and get him to
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 6: spill the beans on all this, Jack Nicholson would be
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 6: a good one.
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 4: Get alone in a room with some I would love
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 4: to pick his brain.
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean it sounds like he's kind of on
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 6: the decline mentally lately. I've heard a lot of weird
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 6: stuff about he's just kind of looking or acting crazy.
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 4: Isn't he like a million years old?
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 3: Well, he would be eighty close to it.
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 9: But so.
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 4: Here's a question for you, babe. You know how they
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 4: say Ted Bundy's appearance could change and it's like he
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 4: was a completely different person. What if it was because
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 4: he was a completely different person.
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 6: That's always been on the forefront of my mind when
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 6: people say shit like that, like, yeah, he's a chameleon,
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 6: like sometimes it didn't even look like the same guy.
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 6: I mean that was the direct quote from a direct
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 6: from a neighbor of his in Florida.
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 4: Uh huh.
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 3: And just for him to like say shit like that
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 3: if that's real witness testimony.
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 6: Yeah, we talk about like body doubles and stuff all
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 6: the time, and or many people playing one role.
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 4: Have you seen a young picture of Jack Nicholson young?
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 4: How young like when he first got started?
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I mean I loved those I literally getting.
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 4: Him to look like Ted Bundy. Yeah, the skinny bridge
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 4: on the nose and like the dapper kind of pushed
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 4: over hair and at the beach they said he had
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 4: sandy blonde hair, right, And Jack Nicholson had sandy blonde hair,
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 4: did he didn't he?
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 6: I think it's always been on the more brunette side,
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 6: But fucking hair color is easy to deal with. I
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 6: don't know, you know, it's not ever a theory that
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 6: I really gave too much credence to. It was always
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 6: fun to just kick it around. But there are weird ties.
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 6: Even in Program to Kill, McGowan made the comparison. He's
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 6: talking about Jack Nicholson and weird sceninges inside the Canyon,
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 6: and he.
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 3: References this his second book, Program to Kill.
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 6: When he's talking about Jack Nicholson, he's saying, this is
• 1:17:56
  Speaker 6: very reminiscent of Ted Bundy's story.
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 4: So he he made a loose connection.
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 3: I don't think he was trying to take it to
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 3: where we are.
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 4: I'll only take it there because why not.
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 3: I mean, I can't with why not? Because they do
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 3: a lot of shit.
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 6: They use actors, they use created personas to push shit
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 6: like this and oftentimes, like we've talked about Morrison being
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 6: a literal actor and Morrison being you know, yeah, maybe
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 6: that was his real name.
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 3: But Ted Bundy's literally came out of thin air.
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 4: So yeah, and with this whole Ted Squad thing, his
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 4: name was actually turned in by his friend who we
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 4: mentioned before in the last episode, the true crime author
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 4: and Rule, who by the way, attended the fucking law
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 4: enforcement summit we spoke about earlier, and they pretty much
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 4: announced that they needed to find the bad guy who
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 4: was abducting bitches, and Rule was in attendance. And then
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 4: she was the first one to give his name to
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 4: the police. And she was friends with him, Okay, and then.
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 3: Where this creative story.
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 4: That's what I'm saying. She's an author anyway, she likes stories.
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 4: And then Ted would also later be reported by his
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 4: fiance Liz Deadpuss enthusiast Captford. But while we're talking about
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 4: and Rule, I want to go over a couple points
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 4: here because it's important. In the late sixties, Bundy briefly
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 4: dated Kathy Swindler, daughter of Herb Swindler, who would later
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 4: become head of homicide with the Seattle Police Department during
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 4: the beginning of the murder spree. He was also, of course,
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 4: a longtime friend of Anne Rules. What do you think
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 4: about that? That's fucking nuts.
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, these are small circles.
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 4: Literally. Anne Rule had at least second hand connections to
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 4: two Bundy victims. Denise Naslin that disappeared from Lake Samamish
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 4: babysat for a friend of hers, and Brenda Ball was
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 4: an acquaintance of her daughters. So Anne Rule is the
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 4: first she attends the summit. She works with Bundy. She
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 4: is a true crime author, She's good with stories and shit,
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 4: and she knows two of the victims, and fucking I mean, it's.
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 3: Just what she's speared to me, constructing the whole thing
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 3: to help her writing career.
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 4: It's not to help her writing career.
• 1:20:53
  Speaker 3: I bet she's a true crime novelist. She's basically creating
• 1:20:58
  Speaker 3: or she's right in the middle of all the shit
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 3: that's going on.
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 6: That's going to be the main thing she's probably gonna
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 6: write about for the rest of her life.
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know her work outside of this stuff.
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 4: I've read a ton of her book.
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 3: Her claim to fame is this.
• 1:21:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so the Stranger beside Me.
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 3: If this was some cheesy, fucking eighties action movie, think
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 3: of Basic Instinct.
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 6: You know that was the premise, was that Sharon Stone's
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 6: character was a mystery novelist. I'm not necessarily saying that's
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 6: what I think is going on, but it is just
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 6: weird that she's she knows him, she has connections to
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 6: the victims, and she's at this summit and days later,
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 6: this other thing happens, and then she reports him to
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 6: the TED squad.
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 4: Yep.
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 3: Awfully weird places to be for a woman who's not related.
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 4: To any of it. Yeah, no, I know, I don't
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 4: even know why she was there.
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 3: Well, I mean, at the conference, I can understand why
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 3: she was there, But she just happens to be in
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 3: all these weird places and tight end with all these
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 3: people of various aspects of this of this Bundy saga.
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 4: And you know, she does kind of play a part
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 4: in what happens after he gets arrested, because she was
• 1:22:28
  Speaker 4: one of the ones that was Like, she's guilty of
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 4: sensationalizing him too, you know, So if she's a part
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 4: of the beginning, she's a part of like the after too,
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 4: like the aftermath of it, writing books and going on
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 4: TV talking about interviews of his character and this stranger
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 4: beside me and all this stuff. Like she made a
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 4: celebrity out of him, you know, she was one of.
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 6: The first ones and herself mm hmmm, I mean she's
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 6: making herself famous.
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Another interesting point is that anthropologist Daris Swindler, who'd
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 4: worked on identifying some of Bundy's victims in Washington, happened
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 4: to be in Tallahassee on the night of the kya
• 1:23:15
  Speaker 4: Omega murders.
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 6: Why is an anthropologist helping identify victims?
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 9: Is that just.
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 6: Like that's just happened to be what he does. He's
• 1:23:26
  Speaker 6: an anthropologist, he's not like a.
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 4: And he's related to Kathy Swindler, the girl he dated.
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 4: Where is it. Yeah, he's related to Kathy Swindler, the
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 4: one he dated, and Herb Swindler, the one who became
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 4: the head of homicide during the murders Free and he's
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 4: in Tallahassee on the night of the Kyomega murders.
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 3: See.
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 6: That's always the things you gotta look for is people
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 6: that keep I mean this is literally on the opposite
• 1:23:55
  Speaker 6: corner of the United States.
• 1:23:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and right in Washington, Washington, and then he shows
• 1:24:03
  Speaker 4: up in Tallahassee on the night of the Kyomega murders.
• 1:24:06
  Speaker 9: Yeah.
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 6: I mean, these kind of things are the one They're
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 6: the ones that make me think the most that you
• 1:24:13
  Speaker 6: can say it and say it and say it and
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 6: say it till you're blue in the face. You can't
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 6: believe in coincidences when they keep happening.
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 3: In the most convenient ways. There are there is such
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 3: a thing as coincidence, but not usually in this kind
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 3: of shit.
• 1:24:29
  Speaker 4: Well, and to even drive that point home further about coincidences,
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 4: Bundy was born on the twenty fourth of November, executed
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 4: on the twenty fourth of January, and his inmate ID
• 1:24:44
  Speaker 4: zero six nine zero six three sums up to twenty four.
• 1:24:49
  Speaker 4: So we have three twenty fours, four five, six, six
• 1:24:53
  Speaker 4: sixty six. Are you getting Jamatria, No, I'm saying four
• 1:24:56
  Speaker 4: plus two is six, so six six six, I'm.
• 1:25:01
  Speaker 3: Just saying, hey, it is. So does Ted Bundy really
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 3: the devil?
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 4: I don't know. I think it's all part of the game.
• 1:25:09
  Speaker 4: You know, it's like a joke to them, the twenty fourth,
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 4: twenty fourth. His number is the twenty fourth. What do
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 4: you think I might look for stuff in numbers?
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I on my show, my co host, he's really
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 3: big into another numerical patterns, whether it be numerology, Jamatria,
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 3: goa Matria.
• 1:25:30
  Speaker 6: He'll correct me if I say it wrong, But yeah,
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 6: I like, I think they're fun. But I don't put
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 6: as much stock in that kind of shit as I
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 6: do the other shit. We were just talking about where
• 1:25:40
  Speaker 6: this guy's here and he happens to help identify the bodies,
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 6: and then wouldn't you know it, he just happens to
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 6: be in Tallahassee the night though. That shit, to me
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 6: is more interesting than like, I'll look at all these
• 1:25:51
  Speaker 6: numbers shit, and yeah, I'm probably that even was planned
• 1:25:54
  Speaker 6: out by somebody.
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 4: But I think you're right about like looking for the
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 4: connections with this guy identifying the victims and stuff.
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 3: Well, and it's not just him. I mean, throughout all
• 1:26:05
  Speaker 3: these stories, there's very conveniently placed people that play crucial
• 1:26:13
  Speaker 3: roles in totally unrelated things or a big, big like
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 3: mass operation like Ted Bundy where it is related, but
• 1:26:22
  Speaker 3: still like the just the small chances that he would
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 3: be at those two places. He's a character in all this.
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 4: Yep.
• 1:26:30
  Speaker 6: So those are the patterns I like to point out.
• 1:26:33
  Speaker 6: The numbers thing is fun, don't.
• 1:26:35
  Speaker 4: Yeah, no, I think it is at least and you
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 4: know how I am about the eights. So it was
• 1:26:43
  Speaker 4: later determined that both girls who disappeared from Lake Samamish
• 1:26:47
  Speaker 4: had been strangled or bludg into death, but that was
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 4: a largely speculative conclusion. Only the girl's skulls and a
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 4: few assorted bones were ever found, and actually the fact
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 4: that only the skulls of the girls were ever found
• 1:27:04
  Speaker 4: further fueled the belief that the killings were somehow cult related.
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 4: Police at the time said occultism and Satan worship always
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 4: found a home with many practitioners around Seattle. And I've
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 4: heard a lot of people I actually had a lady
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 4: on my show talk about Seattle is like crazy with it.
• 1:27:26
  Speaker 3: I mean, it is.
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 6: A strange city. I've been there and just all of
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 6: the innovation that's taken place there, Peck industry, lots of
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 6: the corporate shit started there, and it's just it's an
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 6: oddly placed city, kind of nustled off of the Pugot
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 6: Sound or is it fugit, but it's I felt like
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 6: that city shouldn't be there the way it's built.
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 3: And San Francisco is very similar.
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 6: There's just hills where they build these roads that are
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 6: just just like you're on a roller coaster. It's not
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 6: a good place to learn how to drive stick shift.
• 1:28:07
  Speaker 6: And it's just like, what is it about these certain
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 6: focal points that have chosen you know, maybe Freemasons knew
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 6: something about this is where a town needs to be
• 1:28:18
  Speaker 6: or whatever. Have fun with your imagination on That could
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 6: be a number of reasons, but there's a reason certain cities.
• 1:28:23
  Speaker 3: Are where they are.
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 6: Eugene, Oregon's another great example of that. There's some kind
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 6: of frequency with Eugene, Oregon where the Russians and the
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 6: CIA were using it as a focal point to test
• 1:28:35
  Speaker 6: all this weird technology on us on each other. But
• 1:28:40
  Speaker 6: getting back to the point of Seattle, the music scene also,
• 1:28:45
  Speaker 6: and just you go to Seattle and surrounding areas and
• 1:28:50
  Speaker 6: it's just foggy and dreary, and then there's Heroin and
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 6: fucking Starbucks, and it's just a weird feeling that you
• 1:29:01
  Speaker 6: feel it when you're there.
• 1:29:02
  Speaker 3: Anyway, I'm speaking for myself, but I've.
• 1:29:04
  Speaker 6: Heard other people say that, like, if you want to
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 6: be if you fucking want to cure a depression, you
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 6: don't move to Seattle.
• 1:29:11
  Speaker 4: Well, yeah, and they filmed a lot of Twilight there
• 1:29:13
  Speaker 4: for that reason.
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 3: Was that in Seattle or Portland.
• 1:29:17
  Speaker 4: They filmed it some in Portland and.
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 6: Some in Seattle, and Portland to me, is very similar
• 1:29:21
  Speaker 6: in the dreariness, it's not quite the same. I mean,
• 1:29:25
  Speaker 6: the atmosphere is similar, but Seattle just seems weird, like
• 1:29:29
  Speaker 6: the energy's off. Yeah, probably like Eugene.
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 3: I lived in Eugene for about six months.
• 1:29:35
  Speaker 4: Did your nipples get hard, Well, they're always hard. Did
• 1:29:41
  Speaker 4: you feel weird?
• 1:29:42
  Speaker 9: Though?
• 1:29:43
  Speaker 6: I thought it was the strangest city I've ever lived in.
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 6: I actually drove a two am to six am paper
• 1:29:50
  Speaker 6: route and there was like another city that just emerged
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 6: at night. Like I kind of started believing vampires after
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 6: I lived in there. You just see weird shit.
• 1:30:00
  Speaker 4: At night, and like skin walkers, no.
• 1:30:05
  Speaker 3: Just like people that seem out of place.
• 1:30:07
  Speaker 6: And I'm not talking about junkies, they're just like they're different. Yeah,
• 1:30:13
  Speaker 6: And it's it's weird because I mean I was driving
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 6: in all different parts of the city and wherever you went,
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 6: every night, I would see something weird. And I just
• 1:30:25
  Speaker 6: got to thinking, like after years after I lived there,
• 1:30:29
  Speaker 6: and I learned all of this stuff that Jeremiah was
• 1:30:31
  Speaker 6: researching for an episode we did, He's talking about Eugene,
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 6: and it's just like, God, that makes all sorts of
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 6: sense to me that that's where they were.
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 4: Doing that Well, whatever experiments they were conducting could have
• 1:30:45
  Speaker 4: fucking made fucking vampires out of these people.
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 3: Well, and also phonetically eugenics you can't spell you eugenics. Yeah,
• 1:30:54
  Speaker 3: eugene is literally the.
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 4: First several genics.
• 1:30:57
  Speaker 3: It's the first several letters of that word. I don't
• 1:31:01
  Speaker 3: know if that's why it's named that. Oh my god,
• 1:31:05
  Speaker 3: I didn't come up with that, by the way.
• 1:31:07
  Speaker 4: Well, you know, uh, you know when I figured out vampires.
• 1:31:11
  Speaker 3: Morial when you watch Twilight.
• 1:31:13
  Speaker 4: No, when I started researching Nicholas Cage, I think he's
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 4: a vampire.
• 1:31:20
  Speaker 3: Well, there's that movie where's running down the street going.
• 1:31:24
  Speaker 4: He played a vampire recently?
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 6: Well he supposed Yeah, it was the remake Rinfield. Yeah,
• 1:31:30
  Speaker 6: so Nicholas Cage also might be a time traveler.
• 1:31:33
  Speaker 3: But if he's a vampire, he'd be immortal.
• 1:31:35
  Speaker 4: That would explain why have you seen his.
• 1:31:38
  Speaker 3: Civil War era portrait?
• 1:31:41
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. But if he's a vampire,
• 1:31:44
  Speaker 4: you know, yeah.
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 3: He could have just turned. I mean, Nicholas Cages even
• 1:31:49
  Speaker 3: when he was young, he looked old. Yeah, he's always
• 1:31:52
  Speaker 3: had that Nicholas Cage hairline. Uh huh, he's a Coppola. Yes,
• 1:31:58
  Speaker 3: if there's a bank fucking family of vampire.
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 4: Well, I found his tombstone and it's in New Orleans
• 1:32:04
  Speaker 4: and it's a big white pyramid cage. No, it had
• 1:32:09
  Speaker 4: some weird Latin shit on it.
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 3: But it's a picture of him. Like, what do you
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 3: mean you found his tomb?
• 1:32:15
  Speaker 4: He bought the tombstone ahead of time.
• 1:32:16
  Speaker 3: Oh, it's yeah, and he bought it like in the
• 1:32:19
  Speaker 3: seventeen hundreds.
• 1:32:20
  Speaker 4: And it's white marble and it has weird Latin shit
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 4: on it. It's the most culty looking thing I've ever seen.
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 4: Do you wanna do you want to see it?
• 1:32:29
  Speaker 3: Let's keep going that you can show me after.
• 1:32:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Well, anyways, kind of getting back to the weirdness
• 1:32:36
  Speaker 4: with Ted. Many people at the time were convinced that
• 1:32:41
  Speaker 4: an offshoot of the Charles Manson family had moved to
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 4: the Seattle area and had begun a new reign of
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 4: terror led by fucking Ted quote unquote, because they hadn't
• 1:32:51
  Speaker 4: identified Ted Bundy yet, and so people were coming to
• 1:32:54
  Speaker 4: their own conclusions. There's cattle mutilations and all this other
• 1:32:57
  Speaker 4: bs going on. You remember all those murders I talked
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 4: about in the last episode that were attributed to family members,
• 1:33:04
  Speaker 4: but they kind of were like swept under the rug,
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 4: like late later on, like disciples of the family became murderers. Well,
• 1:33:14
  Speaker 4: they thought of fucking Charles Manson family member moved to
• 1:33:17
  Speaker 4: Seattle and started isn't it interesting how people are so
• 1:33:21
  Speaker 4: smart and they don't even know it, like putting fucking
• 1:33:23
  Speaker 4: those two together like a connection.
• 1:33:26
  Speaker 3: Well, and what if Ted.
• 1:33:30
  Speaker 6: Was himself a member of the family whoever Ted is
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 6: because he did come down to the Bay area m hm,
• 1:33:37
  Speaker 6: and that was in the seventies.
• 1:33:39
  Speaker 3: But I don't do you know that the year he
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 3: was born Ted? Uh huh. I'm assuming it would have
• 1:33:46
  Speaker 3: been late forties, forty six, forty six, so he easily
• 1:33:54
  Speaker 3: would have been old enough to be wrapped up in
• 1:33:56
  Speaker 3: all that stuff.
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 4: Oh my gosh. He died at forty two.
• 1:33:59
  Speaker 3: So that's another that's also twenty four in reverse.
• 1:34:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so there you go.
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 3: I'm sold it's all about twenty four.
• 1:34:09
  Speaker 4: Well, so, some on the police force were convinced that
• 1:34:13
  Speaker 4: there was cult involvement in the murders, and a hefty
• 1:34:19
  Speaker 4: file on occult activities in the area had been assembled,
• 1:34:23
  Speaker 4: referred to as File one zero zero four. But of
• 1:34:29
  Speaker 4: course the occult theories were ridiculed by county police and prosecutors.
• 1:34:34
  Speaker 4: But they did the same thing with the Manson murders.
• 1:34:37
  Speaker 4: So Ted eventually moved to Utah to attend law school
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 4: at the University of Utah, where he worked as a
• 1:34:45
  Speaker 4: fucking campus security guard. Ironically, and the first Utah victim
• 1:34:51
  Speaker 4: credited to Ted was Nancy Wilcox, last seen on October second,
• 1:34:56
  Speaker 4: nineteen seventy four. She was never seen again, dead or alive.
• 1:35:03
  Speaker 4: Melissa Smith was the next to vanish. On October eighteenth,
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 4: her intact nude body was found strangled and bludgeoned. But
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 4: here's the thing. The body had been almost entirely drained
• 1:35:20
  Speaker 4: of blood and revealed a fucking bombshell that blows the
• 1:35:24
  Speaker 4: Ted Bundy mainstream narrative to shit. Melissa had not been
• 1:35:29
  Speaker 4: killed immediately, but she had been kept alive for up
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 4: to a week after her disappearance. But with that in mind,
• 1:35:40
  Speaker 4: wouldn't it be odd to find out that her fucking
• 1:35:44
  Speaker 4: makeup was undisturbed, none of her nails were broken, and
• 1:35:48
  Speaker 4: there was no signs of ligatures. If she was held
• 1:35:55
  Speaker 4: against her will prior to her murder, there was appslce
• 1:36:00
  Speaker 4: no indication of that fact. If it was Ted Bundy
• 1:36:05
  Speaker 4: who held her for that duration of time, then he
• 1:36:08
  Speaker 4: had to have had fucking accomplices and wouldn't you also
• 1:36:13
  Speaker 4: like to know that the day after Melissa's disappearance, Bundy
• 1:36:18
  Speaker 4: fucked off on a hunting trip with his fiancee's father. Oh,
• 1:36:23
  Speaker 4: by the way, Melissa just so happened to be the
• 1:36:26
  Speaker 4: daughter of the chief of police in Midville, Utah. So
• 1:36:31
  Speaker 4: what I'm gathering from this, kind of like the smiley
• 1:36:35
  Speaker 4: face killers because they're finding out they're being held somewhere
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 4: for a long time before they're killed, is that this
• 1:36:43
  Speaker 4: doesn't fit the Ted Bundy narrative at fucking all. She
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 4: was entirely drained of blood, but she wasn't bludgeoned or
• 1:36:54
  Speaker 4: fucking suffocated or any of the other Ted Bundy victims.
• 1:36:59
  Speaker 4: She was up alive for up to a week, and
• 1:37:03
  Speaker 4: her makeup was undisturbed. None of her nails were broken.
• 1:37:06
  Speaker 4: There was no sign. You know how I look in
• 1:37:08
  Speaker 4: the morning when I wake up, how my makeup? Is
• 1:37:11
  Speaker 4: you telling me? She was completely drained of blood and
• 1:37:13
  Speaker 4: kidnapped for a week and her makeup was completely pristine,
• 1:37:17
  Speaker 4: No nails, nothing, no signs of literatures, no bludgeoning. It
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 4: doesn't even fit. And he's actually supposed to be on
• 1:37:25
  Speaker 4: a fucking hunting trip when this.
• 1:37:27
  Speaker 3: Is going down, Well, whether I mean that right there.
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 3: He would have had to have.
• 1:37:35
  Speaker 6: Nabbed her, stored her somewhere, went on this hunting trip,
• 1:37:40
  Speaker 6: which oftentimes.
• 1:37:42
  Speaker 3: Those can last up to a week.
• 1:37:44
  Speaker 4: Mm hmm.
• 1:37:45
  Speaker 6: So he gets back and then just finishes her off
• 1:37:48
  Speaker 6: or yet has nothing to do with them. But like
• 1:37:52
  Speaker 6: you're saying, it's not his.
• 1:37:54
  Speaker 5: M at all.
• 1:37:55
  Speaker 4: No, And because if you put her somewhere for a
• 1:38:00
  Speaker 4: week while you were on the hunting trip, she would
• 1:38:03
  Speaker 4: have cried, She would have scratched Claude escape. He could
• 1:38:07
  Speaker 4: have had her somewhere secure and like drug Yeah, or
• 1:38:10
  Speaker 4: so she's not crying.
• 1:38:12
  Speaker 3: I mean he had gone for several days, he would
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 3: have had to given her access to water. But yeah,
• 1:38:18
  Speaker 3: we're entertaining that. Yeah, it doesn't mean it wasn't him,
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 3: but it doesn't sound likely either.
• 1:38:23
  Speaker 4: No, and she happens to be the daughter of the
• 1:38:26
  Speaker 4: chief of police.
• 1:38:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know.
• 1:38:29
  Speaker 6: It could have been a targeted type of thing too,
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 6: like a like a hit or a message to that guy,
• 1:38:34
  Speaker 6: or he's involved.
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 3: In some shit.
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 1: Mm hmm.
• 1:38:38
  Speaker 4: So Melissa's disappearance was followed by that of Laura Amy,
• 1:38:42
  Speaker 4: who vanished on Halloween night nineteen seventy four. Amy was
• 1:38:46
  Speaker 4: also reportedly held for up to a week before her murder,
• 1:38:51
  Speaker 4: and yet the hair on her strangled and bludgeoned corpse
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 4: had been freshly shampooed just before or just after her death.
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 4: Forensic tests revealed that she had been drunk at the
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 4: time of her death as well. The local sheriff mac
• 1:39:07
  Speaker 4: hauley was sold on another suspect as Laura's killer, a
• 1:39:12
  Speaker 4: man who was later convicted of the brutal sex slaying
• 1:39:15
  Speaker 4: of his own girlfriend. And get this shit, the fucking
• 1:39:19
  Speaker 4: sheriff mac Hauley told the fucking ted squad, quote, Bundy
• 1:39:24
  Speaker 4: had nothing to do with our case, So forget him.
• 1:39:28
  Speaker 4: That man didn't do our case. I wish you'd get
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 4: that through your head in't quote. So Amy has found
• 1:39:39
  Speaker 4: right after Melissa fucking disappeared, and they're both found completely
• 1:39:46
  Speaker 4: or like she's not drained of blood. So they're both
• 1:39:50
  Speaker 4: found having been stashed somewhere for a week, and both
• 1:39:55
  Speaker 4: of them have been like either redressed or like hair
• 1:39:58
  Speaker 4: shampooed or make up done, or like this does not
• 1:40:03
  Speaker 4: And then the sheriff says, this is not Bundy, Please
• 1:40:08
  Speaker 4: fucking get off the Bundy thing. But there's still both
• 1:40:10
  Speaker 4: Melissa and Laura. They are attributed to Ted Bundy. It
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 4: just doesn't make sense to me at all. It's like
• 1:40:18
  Speaker 4: a bunch of random shit that they put on him.
• 1:40:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, reminiscent of Zodiac.
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah. There were indications that Laura had some awareness that
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 4: her life was in danger. Her mother reported that she
• 1:40:33
  Speaker 4: had said to her a few weeks before her death,
• 1:40:36
  Speaker 4: out of the blue, quote, mother, at my funeral, I
• 1:40:40
  Speaker 4: don't want to be buried in addressed end quote? Is
• 1:40:44
  Speaker 4: this just a spiritual thing? Like she knew she was
• 1:40:46
  Speaker 4: gonna die? Or did she know something? Oh? The holding
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 4: of the victims for over a week is reminiscent of
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 4: the Smiley Face killings as well that we kind of
• 1:40:58
  Speaker 4: touched on at the beginning with Gacy.
• 1:41:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the mo o and styles the same, but the
• 1:41:04
  Speaker 3: victims are women.
• 1:41:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And what I was getting at is it a
• 1:41:09
  Speaker 4: spiritual thing or did she know something? Is Laura Amy
• 1:41:13
  Speaker 4: told her mom that she was going to die, like
• 1:41:15
  Speaker 4: right before she died.
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 3: Well, she was talking about her funeral. Did she know
• 1:41:19
  Speaker 3: it was going to be that week?
• 1:41:21
  Speaker 4: Well, we don't know what the fuck she was into.
• 1:41:24
  Speaker 6: People say weird shit like that, but it is. It
• 1:41:26
  Speaker 6: is strange that she said it at that time.
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 4: Do you think it's a coincidence.
• 1:41:31
  Speaker 3: I don't know, Probably not.
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 4: So we're going to get a little bit more into
• 1:41:35
  Speaker 4: what Colby was talking about earlier with this last couple
• 1:41:39
  Speaker 4: with these last couple points here. So, the night of
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 4: November eighth, nineteen seventy four was supposedly a very busy
• 1:41:47
  Speaker 4: night for Ted Bundy. He first allegedly attempt to abduct
• 1:41:52
  Speaker 4: a girl by the name of Carol Deranch from a
• 1:41:54
  Speaker 4: shopping mall in Murray, Utah. Failing in that endeavor, he
• 1:41:59
  Speaker 4: went to a completely different towns supposedly and abducted Deborah
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 4: Kent from outside the building where a school play was
• 1:42:07
  Speaker 4: going on. And Kin's body was never found. But the
• 1:42:12
  Speaker 4: fucking problem with this official version of events is that
• 1:42:16
  Speaker 4: it would have been physically impossible for Ted Bundy or
• 1:42:20
  Speaker 4: anyone else to have committed both of those crimes. First
• 1:42:24
  Speaker 4: of all, the descriptions given by witnesses at the two
• 1:42:27
  Speaker 4: crime scenes differed considerably. Fucking Deranch described her attempted abductor
• 1:42:33
  Speaker 4: as having slicked back hair and the strong scent of
• 1:42:37
  Speaker 4: alcohol on his breath. At the school, the suspect was
• 1:42:41
  Speaker 4: described as having long, brown, wavy hair, and was said
• 1:42:45
  Speaker 4: to be handsome and well dressed and with no hint
• 1:42:49
  Speaker 4: of alcohol on his breath. Sure Ted could have changed
• 1:42:55
  Speaker 4: his clothes, washed and restyled his hair, and swished with
• 1:42:59
  Speaker 4: some fucking list sometime between the commission of the two crimes,
• 1:43:03
  Speaker 4: but he would have had to do so while driving
• 1:43:07
  Speaker 4: his Volkswagen at over one hundred miles per hour over
• 1:43:11
  Speaker 4: rain soaked streets. Why because the two fucking crime scenes
• 1:43:17
  Speaker 4: were twenty six miles apart, and according to the narrative,
• 1:43:22
  Speaker 4: only fifteen minutes passed between his departure from the Deraj
• 1:43:26
  Speaker 4: abduction and his first sighting at the school.
• 1:43:30
  Speaker 6: And everybody knows that Volkswagens don't go one hundred miles
• 1:43:33
  Speaker 6: per hour.
• 1:43:34
  Speaker 4: No way, no fucking way. But I mean, it's like
• 1:43:37
  Speaker 4: you were saying, there's no way, and it gets the
• 1:43:41
  Speaker 4: same way in Florida, obviously, But this is the first time, Yeah,
• 1:43:46
  Speaker 4: in the timelines not adding up, and.
• 1:43:48
  Speaker 3: I don't remember the exact logistics of it, but the
• 1:43:50
  Speaker 3: one in Florida, one of the murders does seem like
• 1:43:55
  Speaker 3: Ted's emo, if there even is one. But what we're
• 1:43:58
  Speaker 3: told is.
• 1:44:00
  Speaker 6: And then the other one that they also pinned on him.
• 1:44:02
  Speaker 6: It was a scenario a lot like this.
• 1:44:05
  Speaker 3: It was like two different counties and the victim, victim
• 1:44:12
  Speaker 3: b she was like a little girl, I think like Kimberly.
• 1:44:18
  Speaker 3: She was like twelve twelve, And that wasn't something that
• 1:44:21
  Speaker 3: he had done. And I'm not saying that he wasn't
• 1:44:24
  Speaker 3: capable of all sorts of evil, but the fact that
• 1:44:28
  Speaker 3: he that was pinned on him with this other one,
• 1:44:31
  Speaker 3: it's a lot like the one you just talked about, and.
• 1:44:36
  Speaker 4: It didn't match any of the victims.
• 1:44:38
  Speaker 3: Well, it's just what you see throughout his story, inconsistencies, oles,
• 1:44:46
  Speaker 3: weird people showing up in multiple places throughout, like an
• 1:44:50
  Speaker 3: anthropologist identifying bodies. Nobody knows that's.
• 1:44:55
  Speaker 4: What anthropologists do, right, And so it's not like.
• 1:44:59
  Speaker 6: They were digging up lost societies, right, Like, why was
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 6: this guy identify helping identify bodies?
• 1:45:05
  Speaker 4: It doesn't make sense. And there was an interview. I
• 1:45:08
  Speaker 4: don't know if you did you watch the Ted Bundy tapes.
• 1:45:10
  Speaker 3: I didn't.
• 1:45:11
  Speaker 4: I mean I probably.
• 1:45:12
  Speaker 6: Already that I may have tried them out, but a
• 1:45:15
  Speaker 6: lot of that Netflix stuff I just got fed up with.
• 1:45:18
  Speaker 3: It just was so.
• 1:45:20
  Speaker 6: Uh, mainstream there not even that it was just redundant.
• 1:45:24
  Speaker 6: You could have had like ten episodes b.
• 1:45:26
  Speaker 4: One like they draw it out.
• 1:45:28
  Speaker 6: Yeah, and it's just like a lot of stuff already knew.
• 1:45:31
  Speaker 6: But anyway you were gonna Well, there was.
• 1:45:33
  Speaker 4: An interview that was in the tapes where they asked him,
• 1:45:37
  Speaker 4: have you ever done anything to hurt anybody? And the
• 1:45:40
  Speaker 4: way that he answers the question is like, well, it's
• 1:45:44
  Speaker 4: not me kind of, but I mean he says like, well,
• 1:45:49
  Speaker 4: I've never directly done anything to hurt anybody, is how
• 1:45:54
  Speaker 4: he said it. That's how he said it. Ever, I've
• 1:46:00
  Speaker 4: never directly done anything.
• 1:46:03
  Speaker 3: So he's saying he's a patsy. Yeah, I don't know.
• 1:46:08
  Speaker 6: He also supposedly wanted to confess to a lot of
• 1:46:12
  Speaker 6: it and helped find other bodies.
• 1:46:15
  Speaker 3: Even though he never did.
• 1:46:16
  Speaker 6: Yeah, it was like we said earlier, he was, yeah,
• 1:46:20
  Speaker 6: putting off that old fucking date with death.
• 1:46:23
  Speaker 4: M Well, these times that we're talking about were recorded
• 1:46:29
  Speaker 4: in police logs, so it was well known to the
• 1:46:32
  Speaker 4: members of the Ted squad that it wouldn't have even
• 1:46:36
  Speaker 4: been fucking possible for Bundy to essentially be in two
• 1:46:40
  Speaker 4: places at once. But even still, they pretended as though
• 1:46:44
  Speaker 4: both crimes were the work of the elusive Ted, even
• 1:46:48
  Speaker 4: after a drama teacher at the second crime scene positively
• 1:46:52
  Speaker 4: identified a drug dealer who was also the initial suspect
• 1:46:57
  Speaker 4: in another alleged Bundy victim, Deborah Kent case. So Deborah
• 1:47:03
  Speaker 4: Kent was the one that they found with their hair
• 1:47:05
  Speaker 4: freshly shampooed. They identified this same drug dealer with Deborah Kint,
• 1:47:11
  Speaker 4: as they did with the person who abducted the girl
• 1:47:13
  Speaker 4: at the school, but they're still blamed on Ted, even
• 1:47:17
  Speaker 4: though it's physically impossible for that who have even happened.
• 1:47:21
  Speaker 4: So I don't know what you think about that, but
• 1:47:25
  Speaker 4: we're gonna get into even more of this type of
• 1:47:30
  Speaker 4: information in the fourth and final episode, and hopefully we've
• 1:47:37
  Speaker 4: convinced everyone that these serial killers do have blood ties.
• 1:47:44
  Speaker 4: Woo is there anything you think I left out or Nope?
• 1:47:50
  Speaker 4: Any closing words? Good job, thanks honey. Well, we will
• 1:47:56
  Speaker 4: see you back next week for like said, the fourth
• 1:48:00
  Speaker 4: and final episode in blood Ties. But until then, there
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 4: is one very important vital piece of information I need
• 1:48:12
  Speaker 4: you to learn just as soon as humanly possible.
• 1:48:17
  Speaker 1: Life.
• 1:48:22
  Speaker 9: Well, yes, I should just ask how are you doing
• 1:48:24
  Speaker 9: out here?
• 1:48:26
  Speaker 5: So short question deserving a long answer. I'm doing well.
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 5: I feel good.
• 1:48:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, working hard in my case, you need a lot
• 1:48:37
  Speaker 2: more sun and a lot more fresh air.
• 1:48:39
  Speaker 5: But other than that, I'm doing okay.
• 1:48:41
  Speaker 9: Do you get fresh air?
• 1:48:42
  Speaker 2: Sam, do you get out well?
• 1:48:44
  Speaker 5: I get to go to the library.
• 1:48:46
  Speaker 2: It's a fifty yard walk from here, across this, across
• 1:48:50
  Speaker 2: the parking.
• 1:48:50
  Speaker 5: Lot to the library. That's my fresh air.
• 1:48:53
  Speaker 9: Ted, when you left salt Let, when you were extra douted,
• 1:48:56
  Speaker 9: you wish you to stay in and saying you feel
• 1:48:59
  Speaker 9: it everything will turn on or right that you are
• 1:49:02
  Speaker 9: in this.
• 1:49:02
  Speaker 2: Do you still feel that?
• 1:49:03
  Speaker 5: Mm mm yeah, yeah, more than ever.
• 1:49:06
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 1:49:07
  Speaker 9: There's always one thing that amazed me. As you know,
• 1:49:09
  Speaker 9: I covered your trial and I was there every day
• 1:49:12
  Speaker 9: when you uh, when the judge fan you guilty mm
• 1:49:17
  Speaker 9: of uh second degree kidnapping, you never showed any emotion.
• 1:49:21
  Speaker 9: Do you know for somebody who believes he is so innocent,
• 1:49:24
  Speaker 9: why was there no emotion?
• 1:49:27
  Speaker 2: My attorney, John I co John O'Connell is so a
• 1:49:29
  Speaker 2: like and I've always mused over just how I should
• 1:49:32
  Speaker 2: behave what's the right way for Ted money to behave
• 1:49:35
  Speaker 2: and make sure that people get the right impression.
• 1:49:37
  Speaker 5: And I just behaved the way I feel it is right. Okay,
• 1:49:40
  Speaker 5: let me take.
• 1:49:42
  Speaker 2: The day of March first first, nineteen seventy six, the
• 1:49:46
  Speaker 2: day that the judge rendered this verdict in my case.
• 1:49:50
  Speaker 5: First, I didn't show any emotion because.
• 1:49:54
  Speaker 2: You know what am I supposed to do? Am I
• 1:49:56
  Speaker 2: gonna jump up on the table. Am I gonna scream?
• 1:49:58
  Speaker 5: That's what I felt like doing. I heard my mother cry. Uh.
• 1:50:03
  Speaker 5: It's an emotional time. I don't even like to think
• 1:50:05
  Speaker 5: of that day.
• 1:50:06
  Speaker 2: But I wasn't gonna give these people who went out
• 1:50:08
  Speaker 2: and built a case around the non existent eyewitness other
• 1:50:12
  Speaker 2: than any uh an eyewitness snification was built.
• 1:50:14
  Speaker 5: By the police.
• 1:50:16
  Speaker 2: I wasn't gonna give them satisfactions seeing me break down
• 1:50:19
  Speaker 2: and uh sure, I'm man, I'm showing emotion right now
• 1:50:22
  Speaker 2: because inside that man. Uh, But I've kept it together
• 1:50:29
  Speaker 2: because there's no point in destroying myself. I had got
• 1:50:32
  Speaker 2: to keep myself together. I have got to stay calm.
• 1:50:34
  Speaker 2: I've got to keep my presence of mind because as
• 1:50:36
  Speaker 2: long as.
• 1:50:37
  Speaker 5: I do that, I'm gonna beat these people. And that's
• 1:50:40
  Speaker 5: the way I feel.
• 1:50:42
  Speaker 1: Uh.
• 1:50:42
  Speaker 2: I showed no emotion.
• 1:50:43
  Speaker 5: I felt emotion, Believe me. Now the irony comes here.
• 1:50:48
  Speaker 2: When Carol Deroche, the kidnapping victim from Utah, came to
• 1:50:52
  Speaker 2: testify in this preliminary hearing here, I was beside myself
• 1:50:56
  Speaker 2: with rage. Uh, she is turning into a professional witnesses.
• 1:51:00
  Speaker 2: As far as I'm concerned, she has a prosecution witness.
• 1:51:03
  Speaker 5: And when I heard her go through that routine.
• 1:51:05
  Speaker 2: That I had heard three times before, I had restrained
• 1:51:07
  Speaker 2: myself every time.
• 1:51:09
  Speaker 5: I couldn't do it this time. And I told my atturney.
• 1:51:11
  Speaker 2: I says, I'm gonna get up, and I cut up,
• 1:51:14
  Speaker 2: and I pointed to Judge and I pointed at her
• 1:51:16
  Speaker 2: and I said, she's lying. She's lied three times before
• 1:51:18
  Speaker 2: and she's lying now. And I'd helped it. And he
• 1:51:21
  Speaker 2: pulled me down and he says, listening.
• 1:51:22
  Speaker 5: He says, you can't do that, and I says, okay,
• 1:51:24
  Speaker 5: But I had to do it for once. For once,
• 1:51:27
  Speaker 5: they had to do it.
• 1:51:27
  Speaker 2: And do you know something, people say Ted Bundy didn't
• 1:51:31
  Speaker 2: show any emotion. There must be something in that. I
• 1:51:33
  Speaker 2: showed emotion, you know what people said. See, you really
• 1:51:36
  Speaker 2: can't get violent and angry. Uh, there's no wi right
• 1:51:40
  Speaker 2: way for me to act. I act and I don't
• 1:51:43
  Speaker 2: care what people think about how I'd act. I act
• 1:51:47
  Speaker 2: according to the way I think is right and best
• 1:51:49
  Speaker 2: for me at the time. And I'm not gonna try
• 1:51:50
  Speaker 2: to please people or impress people, because quite frankly, the
• 1:51:54
  Speaker 2: amount of bias and and prejudice surrounds me as a
• 1:51:58
  Speaker 2: as a media image, I can't begin to tear down.
• 1:52:02
  Speaker 5: Not with this interview were underd interviews t.
• 1:52:05
  Speaker 2: Do you believe.
• 1:52:08
  Speaker 9: A person from the media m other people here?
• 1:52:11
  Speaker 5: Do you believe that we created you?
• 1:52:12
  Speaker 9: That that that it's that it's our fault that we
• 1:52:15
  Speaker 9: created this image of of the mass murder?
• 1:52:18
  Speaker 2: Is that?
• 1:52:18
  Speaker 9: Is that what you're saying to us?
• 1:52:22
  Speaker 2: Well, I think in the course of doing your job,
• 1:52:25
  Speaker 2: you did not at a not in a malign way,
• 1:52:28
  Speaker 2: not not not in a a personal vendetta against me.
• 1:52:32
  Speaker 2: But in the course of of of publishing the uh
• 1:52:36
  Speaker 2: material UH and broadcasts and material coming out of the
• 1:52:39
  Speaker 2: Saltly County Sheriff's Office or the Salty County Prosecutor's office,
• 1:52:44
  Speaker 2: you began to plant the seed in people's minds. Now,
• 1:52:48
  Speaker 2: that may be your constitutional right and duty as well
• 1:52:52
  Speaker 2: as you know your livelihood, uh, but I think in
• 1:52:57
  Speaker 2: the process you did create a media image of me Uh,
• 1:53:03
  Speaker 2: that's far beyond you know, the reality of me.
• 1:53:06
  Speaker 5: Does John Connell called the Bundy Monster.
• 1:53:08
  Speaker 2: That's what he called it, Leota, So I suggested that
• 1:53:10
  Speaker 2: to John we oughta get Mattel to make little dogs
• 1:53:13
  Speaker 2: that walk, and say I knew the Bundy Monster.
• 1:53:16
  Speaker 5: Tell me I should this. You totally believe you're innocent.
• 1:53:22
  Speaker 5: I'm not questioning that.
• 1:53:25
  Speaker 9: My question to you is how did it come to
• 1:53:28
  Speaker 9: be the Ted Bundy MM could be involved in some
• 1:53:32
  Speaker 9: of these things and has now been charged, conviction, convicted,
• 1:53:35
  Speaker 9: wants is now facing first screen murder charges and as
• 1:53:39
  Speaker 9: you know, I was being suspected in in other murders.
• 1:53:41
  Speaker 5: How did Ted Bundy come out? Where did it come from?
• 1:53:45
  Speaker 2: That's a very long story, and I could really can't
• 1:53:47
  Speaker 2: be If I knew the answers to that question, I
• 1:53:49
  Speaker 2: wouldn't be.
• 1:53:49
  Speaker 5: Sitting here right now. I'd be back in Salt Lake
• 1:53:51
  Speaker 5: with a new trial. And one day I'll have those
• 1:53:53
  Speaker 5: new Uh. One day I'll have those answers, and one
• 1:53:55
  Speaker 5: day I'll have a new trial.
• 1:53:57
  Speaker 2: Okay, But I don't know why, Okay, I I can't
• 1:54:00
  Speaker 2: begin to understand why. I know that there's a lot
• 1:54:05
  Speaker 2: of uh, police ego on the line.
• 1:54:08
  Speaker 5: I know that a lot of men.
• 1:54:09
  Speaker 2: In the Detective's division in sol the County Sheriff's office,
• 1:54:12
  Speaker 2: jobs are on the line.
• 1:54:14
  Speaker 5: I know that it's it's a long time ago.
• 1:54:15
  Speaker 2: It ceased to be an issue as whether or not
• 1:54:17
  Speaker 2: I was innocent or guilty. The issue is now is
• 1:54:20
  Speaker 2: can we pentant on it? Can we can we follow
• 1:54:23
  Speaker 2: through and this A and maintain a.
• 1:54:26
  Speaker 5: Rep reputation as law enforcement officers.
• 1:54:28
  Speaker 2: And I'll tell you, as long as they attempt to
• 1:54:30
  Speaker 2: keep their heads in the stand about me, there's gonna
• 1:54:33
  Speaker 2: be people turning up in canyons, and they're gonna be
• 1:54:35
  Speaker 2: people being shot in Salt Lake City because the police
• 1:54:38
  Speaker 2: there aren't willing to accept what I think they know,
• 1:54:42
  Speaker 2: and they know that I didn't do these things.
• 1:54:46
  Speaker 7: If you'll have to admit there's a there's a a
• 1:54:49
  Speaker 7: hell of a lot of circumstantial evidence, at least circumstantial
• 1:54:52
  Speaker 7: it seems to somebody who has read simply read the
• 1:54:55
  Speaker 7: newspapers and articles.
• 1:54:58
  Speaker 5: No, I won't admit that. No, there's uh, I I
• 1:55:02
  Speaker 5: don't call it ser.
• 1:55:02
  Speaker 2: It's not circumstantial as far as I'm concerned, and I
• 1:55:05
  Speaker 2: I don't really know exactly what you're referring to and
• 1:55:07
  Speaker 2: I don't really wanna discuss it, but uh it, I
• 1:55:11
  Speaker 2: don't care what they's anybody says or or the uh
• 1:55:15
  Speaker 2: the suspicions anyone harbors on the basis of that misinformation.
• 1:55:18
  Speaker 2: And indeed that's what I call it, circumstantial uh information
• 1:55:21
  Speaker 2: perhaps been misinformation.
• 1:55:23
  Speaker 5: As far as I'm concerned.
• 1:55:24
  Speaker 2: UH A lot of people trying to pin a lot
• 1:55:26
  Speaker 2: of stuff on somebody because UH, you know it's convenient.
• 1:55:31
  Speaker 2: But uh do you think you're gonna set up Well,
• 1:55:37
  Speaker 2: I don't think there's any broad scheme, UH, but I
• 1:55:43
  Speaker 2: think one begins to I would have to infer that, uh,
• 1:55:46
  Speaker 2: based on some of the police activity I think following
• 1:55:50
  Speaker 2: November of seventy five, you have to say that there
• 1:55:53
  Speaker 2: is a general uh.
• 1:55:57
  Speaker 5: Design amongst police.
• 1:55:58
  Speaker 2: Officers and several jurisdictions to to do whatever they could.
• 1:56:02
  Speaker 2: And I think a statement recently made by UH a
• 1:56:05
  Speaker 2: sheriff in Utah, in Utah County, I believe he said
• 1:56:09
  Speaker 2: they walked out in some of those meetings because it
• 1:56:11
  Speaker 2: was just clear that they were just gonn They had
• 1:56:13
  Speaker 2: one thing on their mind and they were gonna do
• 1:56:16
  Speaker 2: anything to prove it.
• 1:56:16
  Speaker 5: And I think this trial would show exactly what they've done. Uh.
• 1:56:21
  Speaker 2: I'm not gonna sit here and say people have purjured themselves,
• 1:56:23
  Speaker 2: but I think that will come out.
• 1:56:25
  Speaker 5: Are you angry?
• 1:56:26
  Speaker 7: Sure?
• 1:56:27
  Speaker 5: I get angry. Uh, you're very very un angry and indignant.
• 1:56:30
  Speaker 2: I don't like being locked up for something I didn't do,
• 1:56:33
  Speaker 2: and I don't like my liberty taken away.
• 1:56:34
  Speaker 5: And I don't like being treated like an animal. And
• 1:56:36
  Speaker 5: I don't like like people walking around and ugly me
• 1:56:39
  Speaker 5: like I'm some sort of waydough because I'm not. Uh.
• 1:56:44
  Speaker 2: You know, I'm perfectly happy with the person I am
• 1:56:47
  Speaker 2: and I've always been.
• 1:56:49
  Speaker 5: There's nothing not a I mean.
• 1:56:50
  Speaker 2: I uh yeah, I don't pay my telephone bills on time,
• 1:56:54
  Speaker 2: and I don't write my mother uh as many letters
• 1:56:57
  Speaker 2: as I should. There are all kinds of things I
• 1:56:58
  Speaker 2: can improve about myself, but weird don't know this.
• 1:57:01
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 1:57:01
  Speaker 5: I feel good about myself. I'm happy with myself.
• 1:57:05
  Speaker 1: It don't change you.
• 1:57:06
  Speaker 7: Stayed tech BONDI twenty four hours a day.
• 1:57:10
  Speaker 2: Well, gee, that name sounds funny. You know you hear
• 1:57:14
  Speaker 2: ted Bundy in so many different contexts.
• 1:57:17
  Speaker 5: I stay me.
• 1:57:18
  Speaker 7: Okay, what happens if you're in prison five years and
• 1:57:23
  Speaker 7: nothing like what has happened in the past happens again.
• 1:57:26
  Speaker 5: Who do you mean, I mean any any of the
• 1:57:28
  Speaker 5: things that you have been accused.
• 1:57:29
  Speaker 7: Of any one by any window, by rumor, by the
• 1:57:32
  Speaker 7: police departments or whatever. What if there are no killings
• 1:57:35
  Speaker 7: or no kidnappings.
• 1:57:37
  Speaker 5: It's already happened, hasn't it. I've heard some reports.
• 1:57:40
  Speaker 2: I you know, I remember the the incidents between between
• 1:57:43
  Speaker 2: five and eight which are similar to the ones which
• 1:57:47
  Speaker 2: the the police have had the nerve to try to
• 1:57:49
  Speaker 2: associate with me. It's gonna continue to happen in Salt
• 1:57:53
  Speaker 2: Lake in Utah until those police start to wise up
• 1:57:57
  Speaker 2: and stopt st stop counting their chickens before they had.
• 1:58:01
  Speaker 2: I think it's a terribly dangerous mentality to try to
• 1:58:04
  Speaker 2: pin something on somebody who who they might. They believe
• 1:58:08
  Speaker 2: there's a possibility it couldn't have done it. And as
• 1:58:12
  Speaker 2: long as they believe that, they're not going to find
• 1:58:14
  Speaker 2: the right man, and the man who who kidnapped caroled
• 1:58:17
  Speaker 2: Ranch is going to continue to be free, and not
• 1:58:19
  Speaker 2: only her, but every other young woman in the Salt
• 1:58:21
  Speaker 2: Lake Valley is going to is going to be threatened
• 1:58:24
  Speaker 2: by that person or person's and it's happening today and
• 1:58:27
  Speaker 2: it's going to happen in the future. What do you
• 1:58:29
  Speaker 2: think about in your mind?
• 1:58:31
  Speaker 7: What do you conjure up about the man that they're
• 1:58:32
  Speaker 7: after or the real man who did.
• 1:58:34
  Speaker 5: These things man or man person's persons.
• 1:58:37
  Speaker 2: I don't know, I really have. I can't even begin
• 1:58:41
  Speaker 2: to understand the mentality.
• 1:58:43
  Speaker 7: You are not guilty.
• 1:58:46
  Speaker 5: I'm not guilty.
• 1:58:49
  Speaker 2: Does that include the time I stole a comic book
• 1:58:52
  Speaker 2: when I was five years old? I am not guilty
• 1:58:55
  Speaker 2: of the terriages which have been filed against me and
• 1:58:57
  Speaker 2: the allegations and the allegations of the room or I
• 1:59:01
  Speaker 2: don't know all of what you're speaking about, like a
• 1:59:03
  Speaker 2: it's too broad and I can't get into it in
• 1:59:05
  Speaker 2: any detail. Uh, but I'm satisfied with with my blanket statement.
• 1:59:12
  Speaker 5: That I'm innocent.
• 1:59:13
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 1:59:14
  Speaker 5: No man is truly innocent.
• 1:59:16
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 1:59:16
  Speaker 5: I mean we all just transgressed in somewhere in our lives.
• 1:59:19
  Speaker 2: And as I say, I, I've been uh impolite, and
• 1:59:24
  Speaker 2: there are things I regret having done in my life.
• 1:59:28
  Speaker 5: But then nothing like the the things I think that
• 1:59:31
  Speaker 5: you're referring to. You ever physically harmed.
• 1:59:35
  Speaker 2: Anyone, ever physically harmed anyone, No no, you know, uh.
• 1:59:45
  Speaker 5: Again, not in the context. I think that you're you're speaking.
• 1:59:48
  Speaker 3: Of being as strange.
• 1:59:51
  Speaker 8: When you're a strange, faces look ugly.
• 1:59:55
  Speaker 1: When you're a.
• 1:59:56
  Speaker 8: Lone woman seeing with kid. When you're unworded, streets are
• 2:00:02
  Speaker 8: run even when you're down. When you're a strange, faces
• 2:00:08
  Speaker 8: got out of the rain. When you're strange, no one
• 2:00:14
  Speaker 8: remembers the name when you're strange. When you're strange, When
• 2:00:22
  Speaker 8: you're strain, eat well a strain. When you're a stranger,
• 2:00:30
  Speaker 8: faces not done. Let when you're alone when the same week,
• 2:00:36
  Speaker 8: when you're unwonted, streets are.
• 2:00:39
  Speaker 4: Round eva when you're down.
• 2:00:51
  Speaker 3: Hello, and welcome Cosmic Peach podcast, where we go cosmic
• 2:00:58
  Speaker 3: all over your feet.
• 2:01:07
  Speaker 4: He was also asked where Rob Peaste was, to which
• 2:01:12
  Speaker 4: that's peaced. I fucking know it's peaced because I watched
• 2:01:15
  Speaker 4: the documentary.
• 2:01:16
  Speaker 3: Also asked.
• 2:01:20
  Speaker 4: Who's that guy one of his victims, but they.
• 2:01:25
  Speaker 3: Didn't have a body yet.
• 2:01:27
  Speaker 9: No.
• 2:01:29
  Speaker 4: Yeah, oh, I thought you were saying I said the
• 2:01:30
  Speaker 4: last name.
• 2:01:31
  Speaker 3: No, I just name came out of nowhere.
• 2:01:37
  Speaker 8: So let me.
• 2:01:40
  Speaker 4: Rephrase it for the listener.
• 2:01:44
  Speaker 3: What do you want to call it?
• 2:01:45
  Speaker 4: Like when he got baptized?
• 2:01:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a word I'm trying to find. It's an
• 2:01:51
  Speaker 3: easy word. Told h, I'm tired.
• 2:01:53
  Speaker 4: But well, not coincidence.
• 2:01:57
  Speaker 3: It's not a coincidence.
• 2:01:58
  Speaker 4: It's like, oh my god, when she's been tapping at
• 2:02:06
  Speaker 4: the same time synchronous.
• 2:02:07
  Speaker 3: Yes, parting or is that dexter it's texter.
• 2:02:14
  Speaker 4: I thought it was you.
• 2:02:17
  Speaker 3: That's definitely a chicken furt.
• 2:02:19
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it smells like.
• 2:02:22
  Speaker 3: Mother chape. This breaths marijuana. Instance, she just sticks some
• 2:02:35
  Speaker 3: popery and dexter fearble.
• 2:02:39
  Speaker 4: Oh my god, that's so disgusting to bring the stink
• 2:02:44
  Speaker 4: out so happy with.
• 2:02:57
  Speaker 3: Text to your disgusting fuck, Can at least leave the
• 2:03:06
  Speaker 3: room actually fucking burden?
• 2:03:14
  Speaker 4: Okay, I do think I'll want it puffed, though, let
• 2:03:16
  Speaker 4: me take some pressure. I'm scared because that's the thickest
• 2:03:20
  Speaker 4: part of it.
• 2:03:20
  Speaker 3: This actually, the resonating stuff gets you way harder because
• 2:03:23
  Speaker 3: it's a concentrated brand. Are you okay, baby, enough to
• 2:03:32
  Speaker 3: bob your eyes? Oh? Anyway, I'm not saying that's when
• 2:03:48
  Speaker 3: I shut.
• 2:03:49
  Speaker 4: The help me down.
• 2:03:53
  Speaker 3: M cool mm hmm, se mm hmm.
• 2:04:03
  Speaker 4: Zero last time, Hello, and welcome back to the show.