Latest / The Inspired Stories Podcast / The $2 Trillion Retirement Crisis: How Niharika Shah's Company Plans to Fix It

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The $2 Trillion Retirement Crisis: How Niharika Shah's Company Plans to Fix It · The Inspired Stories Podcast

0:04
Welcome to another edition of the Inspired Stories podcast,
0:08
where leaders share their experiences so we can learn from
0:11
their successes and be inspired by how they've overcome
0:14
adversity. My name is Anthony Kotaspodi and
0:17
today's guest is Niharika Shah, founder and partner at Four O 4
0:22
Harmony. They are a dynamic venture
0:25
studio that focuses on the intersection of longevity and
0:28
vitality. Their mission is to invest in
0:35
and build transformative ideas that help people live longer,
0:39
healthier and more fulfilling lives.
0:42
They give start-ups a strong foundation for growth by
0:45
offering services like a Co founding approach, fractional
0:49
operating model and access to an expert network.
0:53
Now, Niharika has been recognized as one of the top ten
0:56
in Wealth Management in 2022, highlighting her impact in the
1:01
financial sector. She also contributes her
1:04
knowledge as an external advisor at EY and as a board advisor
1:09
plus adjunct professor at Rutgers Business School.
1:13
Now before we get into all that good stuff, today's episode is
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1:45
All right, back to our guest today, founder of four O 4
1:48
Harmony Niharika Shah. Thanks for making the time to
1:51
Share your story today. Oh, thank you, Anthony.
1:53
And it's such a pleasure to be here and, and talk a little bit
1:57
about my journey, what I'm up to and, and have a, you know,
2:00
meaningful conversation. Well, let's roll up our sleeves
2:03
and get into it then, Niharika. So you are an engineer turned
2:08
marketer, you grew up in consulting and you were part of
2:12
Cambridge Technology Partners. What drew you into consulting
2:16
initially? How did that unfold?
2:21
You know what, what you're looking for is looking for you.
2:24
And I think that is pretty much true of my entire career where
2:27
I've taken risks and and evolved and learned on the job as well.
2:34
So I think my foray into consulting was a little bit of
2:38
happenstance. I happened to get the job, but I
2:40
think I really enjoyed it because as an individual, I love
2:46
having conversations. I love solving problems.
2:48
My superpower, if I can save it as one, is to connect things
2:53
that other people can't or won't.
2:55
So it was a very powerful skill to bring to the consulting realm
2:59
where you could listen, analyze, and very succinctly deliver
3:04
meaningful ideas, right? So I think I was just wired that
3:09
way. I think consulting was the right
3:11
place to beat for my skills to grow and mature and learn.
3:16
And the second thing I, as I said, I'm an active learner.
3:20
So the idea of walking into, you know, an opportunity, a
3:25
consulting opportunity and really understanding the
3:28
business, diagnosing what might be the challenges of the
3:32
opportunities and very quickly coming back with, you know,
3:36
meaningful plans or Rd. maps or ideas, you know, combined with
3:41
financial implications was super exciting to me.
3:45
One of the things that do come with consulting is which you
3:49
have to avoid is the seagull effect, right?
3:51
You, you land in poop all over the place and leave.
3:54
And so I was. That's the first time I've heard
3:56
that one. I did begin to see some of that
4:00
and as much as you know, it was above my pay grade to make those
4:03
decisions. But I think that was one of the
4:06
other meaningful things I learned from consulting that
4:09
informed my career going forward is that I really wanted
4:12
ownership of, you know, seeing something through its launch and
4:17
and maturation, which has affected and impacted a lot of
4:20
my decisions as it relates to my career post consulting.
4:24
So is that kind of what was behind the move from consulting
4:27
into starting your own things that I'm looking at your resume
4:30
here and you've got stops at, you know, very notable companies
4:33
along the way. We mentioned Cambridge, there's
4:35
Toys-R-Us, there's a long stint at Prudential Tip and EY.
4:41
You know, I have to imagine that, you know, as you're making
4:44
these moves, you know, they're coming with pay raises.
4:47
You're, you're building a very nice and kind of a comfortable
4:50
career. So at some point you decide to
4:53
kind of leave the comfort of that nest and go out on your
4:55
own. What was behind that?
4:58
Yeah. I mean, first, none of this was
5:00
planned and and I think, you know, I have two daughters who
5:03
are now entering their own careers.
5:05
And I think especially in this day and age, to sort of think
5:09
you have a 5 or 10 year road map, I think they're good North
5:13
stars to have, but to be attached to the path to get
5:17
there, I think is, is self defeating.
5:20
So one of the things that I've always reserved the right to is
5:23
to adapt to the situation. And you know, I, I talked about
5:27
there was IQ, there's EQ. And I think in today's world we
5:30
need AQ, which is adaptability quotient.
5:33
How quickly are you able to adapt to where the world is
5:37
going and retool and rescale yourself?
5:39
So I think part of it was that just being able to understand
5:43
and not go with the flow per SE, but go with where the momentum
5:48
was having, you know, gone through a corporate career and
5:53
left consulting primarily because for family reasons, the
5:56
travel and so on. But the nine years at Prudential
6:00
were amazing. You know, prior to that, my
6:03
claim to fame was launching Babies-R-Us on Amazon when
6:06
Amazon was just books, right? So it was a tremendous
6:10
experience for somebody so young to sort of see that play out,
6:13
learn from the the good and the bad.
6:15
And I was able to bring that to my career post that and at
6:20
Prudential. And I, the reason I want to
6:22
share that story is I got to see, you know, big corporate
6:28
function. And while the heart is in the
6:29
right place, action becomes a challenge and my mandate and I
6:35
remember my boss saying, you know, I I'm going into his
6:38
office and just saying, Hey, look, I'm going to go, I'm going
6:41
to break some, you know, things along the way, but I'm going to
6:44
go. And he was like, just go, just
6:46
go. And I think at somebody like
6:49
that, a prudential to sort of come in and and shake things up
6:53
was very much probably the reason why I stayed for the nine
6:56
years I stayed for the reasons not why I joined.
6:59
It was really a very amazing learning experience, especially
7:05
from a leadership perspective, right?
7:07
I was leading a large team with a very generous budget, which is
7:11
very helpful. But two things dawned on me from
7:14
from that experience. One is potential, you know,
7:18
invest a lot in research. And it was very clear to me that
7:22
the financial ecosystem was letting the average person down.
7:27
A lot has been done and money has been thrown, but really in
7:31
terms of outcomes, we haven't been that effective this this
7:38
country, this economy and generally makes it really
7:41
expensive to be poor. And that really hit my heart.
7:46
The second thing, intellectually, being an
7:49
engineer, I I'm of the firm believe and we've seen this
7:53
happen. Disruption is going to come from
7:54
the outside. It's going to come through tech
7:57
and I wanted to be part of it. So my before going and launching
8:00
my own thing, I actually joined Tiffin, which is a venture
8:03
platform focused on wealth and asset management and learned
8:07
tremendously about what it means to stand up a business from the
8:11
ground up with the right sentiment at heart, with the
8:14
right technology at heart, with the right people, which was
8:18
which was just an amazing experience.
8:20
We launched 13 businesses in, you know, less than 3 1/2 years.
8:24
I ran them, grew them, see them, but then it was time for me to
8:28
sort of say OK. 13 businesses, all under the Tiffin umbrella,
8:32
Yes. OK.
8:34
And it was an amazing run. And you know, again, Tiffin's
8:39
based out of Boulder, so the travel was was becoming a
8:42
little. Because you're East Coast,
8:45
right? You're in New Jersey.
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I'm East Coast, I'm based in New York and I also had, you know,
8:48
let's talk about this. I had, even though my daughters
8:51
were growing up and in high school, they didn't need me as
8:53
much. It was now my parents, my mother
8:56
that needed me and she was diagnosed with Parkinson's.
8:59
So just it wasn't working. But I again, it's the outlook I
9:03
turned it into, OK, this is an opportunity for me to bring
9:07
create something of my own. And that's where 4 Four Harmony
9:11
emerged. There were, there were three
9:14
things, Anthony, that sort of inform the, the core essence,
9:21
the remit, the mandate of of four O 4 Harmony.
9:25
The 1st is that we want to stand up businesses that are truly
9:29
creating value. There is no financial
9:31
engineering. We're building solid businesses
9:34
from the ground up. So at the time that you know, P
9:38
and VC money is needed, these businesses are sound with
9:41
operational and financial rigor. To do that, we had to set up a
9:45
very unique operating model and we call it the fractional
9:49
operating model. And if you look at, you know,
9:51
how firms should be thinking about the future with AI and
9:56
stuff like that, the traditional way was here's our people, how
10:01
can we make them more productive with giving them technology and
10:04
tools. We've taken a different
10:06
approach. We're starting with digital
10:08
labour. What can we do, what can we use,
10:11
what can we build? So it's not only what we build,
10:14
but also how we build it. That is is the core part of our
10:21
platform and then we wrap human potential and talent around it.
10:25
It's a very different way of building the firm, but you can
10:28
do it that way to keep. It's tech 1st and then figure
10:32
out how to human beings sort of interact with that tech to make
10:38
it better. Exactly.
10:39
It's, it's the AI first approach, if you will, right?
10:43
Which is, I mean, eventually, look, we'll, we'll probably all
10:48
be agent bosses, right? That's going to be a new role.
10:50
We're going to have agents that are doing the work.
10:53
We're going to train them, we're going to monitor them.
10:55
We're going to derive insights from that and make decisions.
10:59
So yes, you're absolutely right. We start with what can we build
11:03
from a core technology perspective and then wrap human
11:06
potential around it. Now you do need human capacity
11:10
to train these models and stuff like that.
11:12
So don't get me wrong, but it's a very different way of, of
11:15
looking and approaching how we build businesses.
11:19
So what that that does is keeps the the burn rate down and
11:24
optimizes speed to market and and go to market as well.
11:29
So that was the second idea behind four O 4 Harmony.
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And the third, it's all heart and soul, which is I wanted to
11:34
work with people that I love and respect and have fun doing it,
11:39
but also doing it for a higher cause.
11:42
And going back to what I was just saying about parents and
11:45
general demography of the world, like longevity is staring us at
11:50
our face. If you go back and look at the
11:52
last hundred, 150 years and think about the greatest human
11:56
accomplishment, one would say airplanes, one would say AI or
12:00
chips or technology or penicillin or pasteurization of
12:04
milk. But these all ladder up to one
12:07
thing. We in the last 100 hundred years
12:10
have doubled lifespans. It's hard to imagine that less
12:14
than hundred, 120 years ago, the average lifespan in this country
12:18
was slightly higher. It was 51, but in other parts of
12:20
the country, it was in the 30s forties, right?
12:23
And now look at us. We're looking at average life
12:26
spans of, you know, 75 to 80, which is great.
12:30
But I also subscribe to, I'm a huge fan of Doctor Ghavande, who
12:34
who sort of wrote this book, who did write this book called Being
12:38
Mortal. And it was a call to action to
12:41
the medical community to say, hey, look, we prolonged life,
12:44
but we haven't exactly prolonged living.
12:47
And so that became our thesis, which.
12:49
Is a big part of what you want to do.
12:51
You're not just trying to extend life, OK?
12:53
The average age is 8085, depending on the part of the
12:56
world. Now we want to bump that by two
12:57
years. You say we want to make the
13:00
quality of life better as you get older as well?
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Yes. And, and what does that mean?
13:05
Like if you ask yourself, ask your parents, what does that
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mean? It means being vital, being
13:11
capable, having social relationships, being, you know,
13:15
having family, being able to function and be independent and
13:19
enjoy the the years that you worked so hard to enjoy, right.
13:23
So that became our thesis to invest and build at the
13:26
intersection of longevity and vitality, which from a business
13:30
perspective, you can call the category age tech, but it's sort
13:34
of spans fintech, health tech, Med tech, consumables, anything.
13:39
How does? Fintech fit into this.
13:41
I mean, I I get sort of the the age tech like let's improve the
13:45
quality of life. Where does Fintech fit in?
13:47
Well, what's 1 of the biggest concerns that people have as
13:52
they age that they run out of money before they do, right.
13:55
So financial security is inextricably linked to any kind
14:01
of Wellness. If you think about, of course,
14:03
health is first and foremost on people's minds, but what are the
14:07
things that impact your health besides, you know, something
14:10
that you might have from a, from a disease or illness
14:13
perspective, it is stress, anxiety over money.
14:16
And so the, the, the sort of in a, in a person's mind, we as an
14:22
industry might separate financial Wellness from health
14:25
and Wellness, but from an individual's perspective,
14:28
they're so inextricably linked. You, you know, you might have
14:33
health issues, but if you haven't planned for them
14:35
financially, you're not going to be able to manage that, the care
14:40
and the, and the cure that is needed and vice versa, right?
14:43
If you don't have the health, what's the point in having the
14:47
money if you're not able to enjoy it?
14:48
So, so Fintech, especially as we look, I think again, let's talk
14:53
about fintech, the industry has done, I think in the last 1520
14:57
years. If you go back from how we,
14:59
let's talk about retirement, how we move from a defined
15:02
contribution world, which you're familiar with, I'm sorry, a
15:05
defined benefit world to a defined contribution world in
15:09
the, in the mid 70s, we put a lot of burden on the individual
15:13
to start saving and planning for their retirement.
15:16
And we've, we've for the most part failed them.
15:19
The average account balances in four O 1K plans are not what
15:22
they should be. People treat them sometimes as
15:25
their checking account where they withdraw money, which is,
15:28
you know, with wrought with penalties and and other sort of
15:33
detrimental impact. So we as an industry, I think
15:37
over the last 1520 years have done a great job in sort of
15:40
helping people on the accumulation side.
15:42
You know, now you automatic opt in into your four O 1 KS, but
15:47
not so much on the decumulation side of side of things.
15:51
So I think when it comes to. Decumulation.
15:54
It's, it's how do you spend down the money that you've
15:57
accumulated in your working years, right.
15:59
So you there's accumulation, you sort of retire and the very
16:04
definition of retirement is changing.
16:06
So Naharko, maybe what's 1 of the like, if we can maybe do
16:10
like a specific portfolio company and and talk about like
16:14
something specific that they're offering that helps with this?
16:17
Yeah, for sure. I'll talk about the American
16:22
Retirement Company. It is our marquee project has
16:28
the potential to truly take a big bite out of the sort of $2
16:34
trillion retirement deficit that we're looking at by 2045.
16:39
And essentially the use case here is going back to human
16:43
behaviour. Just as an aside, when I was a
16:46
Prudential and we were researching 20 somethings, it
16:50
was easier for them to imagine a zombie apocalypse than it was to
16:55
imagine their own retirement. It is so distant and so unknown
17:01
that and, and it's not, you know, people imagining
17:04
themselves old is not not a fun thing to do.
17:07
So that was pretty insightful to me.
17:10
So what Archie essentially does is takes the liquidity.
17:14
If you do want to borrow money out of your 4O1K, the the
17:18
behaviour today is to hit up your account, pay a penalty and
17:24
if you don't pay it back, that account is liquidated, which is
17:27
bad for the plan sponsor, which is your employer.
17:29
It's bad for the record keeper and it's bad obviously for the
17:31
individual and their family because now they have
17:34
significantly impacted their retirement savings.
17:37
So what we're building at Archie is an alternative mechanism for
17:42
us to provide liquidity to people who need to borrow out of
17:45
their four O 1K while retaining a lot of the value and the
17:50
accumulation in the in their current plan.
17:53
So the plan sponsor benefits from a fiduciary perspective.
17:57
The record keeper of course loves it because the assets stay
18:00
in plan and then for the participant it's it's meaningful
18:04
as well. So is this using the four O 1K
18:08
as collateral for some kind of a more traditional loan so that
18:12
they're not incurring the penalties of withdrawing
18:14
directly from the four O 1K? I'm not going to give away the
18:17
secret sauce, but it is a credit, a generative AI
18:21
creditworthiness assessment that does involve the four O 1K, but
18:25
it takes into a lot of other factors as well.
18:28
And is this something that is currently available in the
18:31
market, people can access it we. Are we're about 18 months from
18:35
launch. We have, we've taken a different
18:38
view of, of look, the, the way that we think about Archie is, I
18:42
don't know if you're familiar with the Tappan Zee Bridge.
18:45
The Tappan Zee Bridge has been around, you know, for many years
18:49
was sort of wearing down to the nuts and bolts, but has
18:53
tremendous amount of traffic connecting New York and New
18:56
Jersey, right. All we all they did in five
19:00
years built this beautiful bridge that runs parallel to the
19:03
old bridge and nothing changed as far as the commuter was
19:08
concerned. The tolls remain the same.
19:10
It was just a better experience and it was faster, better, more
19:15
optimal, more environmentally friendly and all of that.
19:17
And that's exactly what we're doing at Archie, which is just
19:20
building an A bridge. So there's demand already.
19:23
We don't need to conjure up demand.
19:25
There's 40 years of pent up demand.
19:27
So to answer your question, the, the, the platform will be live
19:31
in about 18 months, but we're very confident that as soon as
19:34
we get up and running, it'll scale really fast simply because
19:38
demand already exists. And is there any thought, I
19:42
don't know if you want to share this yet on like what the actual
19:45
rollout looks like is this and are you talking to sort of the,
19:50
you know, 401K management companies?
19:51
Are you talking to the employers?
19:54
Are you going right to the employees who are already
19:56
enrolled in a participating program?
19:59
All of them actually. So we want to build this with
20:03
strategics. And by strategics here I mean
20:06
meaningful players on the record keeping side as well as on the
20:11
wealth side. Because one of the other
20:13
challenges that the financial industry has been looking to
20:15
solve for a long time is how do we take, you know, employer
20:22
participants, whether than group benefits or retirement benefits.
20:26
And convert them into retail customers.
20:28
So we think that is a very critical role for all players in
20:33
the ecosystem to play including Rias, wealth managers, plan
20:36
sponsors, record keepers, etcetera in this ecosystem that
20:42
we're standing up. So yes, we do have already
20:46
access to about 30 million participants through the the
20:50
strategics that have agreed to either invest or come on as the
20:56
first set of customers. Well, that's exciting.
20:59
It's kind of what you were alluding to like once once this
21:02
is ready, you know, 18 months ish from now you except you
21:06
expect this to just kind of, you know, take off because you've
21:09
got a lot of those partnerships in place that have access to so
21:13
many folks who are going to want this service that you're
21:15
providing. Yep.
21:17
Can you maybe is there something in sort of the like when I first
21:22
heard you say age tech, I thought more like, I don't know,
21:26
supplements or like medical advancements that would help.
21:31
Are there any companies in your portfolio currently that are
21:33
focused kind of more on that side of things?
21:36
Yeah, we have. We have, I will say 2, but
21:39
admittedly we're light. So our backgrounds in the
21:43
network, we're about 14 people strong plus our extended network
21:47
generally because of where we come from is strong on the
21:50
financial services side. We are actively looking for a
21:54
partner on the on the health and life sciences side to build out
21:58
the next strong trip of our portfolio companies In our first
22:02
set. I would say there are two ideas.
22:06
One in concept, which is a consumable.
22:09
You'll find this funny. That enhances sexual virility,
22:14
if you will. Very popular category.
22:18
Mixed with alcohol, it's sort of the, you know, so that's,
22:21
that's, that's one idea we're working on.
22:24
It's a fun project. And this is where some of my
22:28
students from Rutgers who, who might be able to help, right?
22:33
So they're helping with the formulation and stuff like that.
22:36
It's an exciting project, but the more advanced one, which is
22:40
actually which is actually launched is, is careful one and
22:44
careful 1 is my own personal ode, if you will, to to ageing.
22:50
And what I went through in terms of setting up a secure, fast,
22:57
reliable, responsible ecosystem for my mom in India when she,
23:02
when I moved her there is what now I have brought it in with
23:05
automation. And a lot of, obviously I'm
23:08
going to say this again, AI embedded in it, but it's, it's
23:11
basically a long distance caregiving application where if
23:16
you think about, you know, they're about 40 million.
23:18
And right now we've launched US and India, but I've already
23:21
gotten queries from Mexico, from the UAE, because we're all, we
23:25
live in a globally distributed world.
23:28
The diet, the Indian diaspora, just use that as an example.
23:31
It's about 40 million non resident Indians right who are
23:37
and I look at my peers, people I went to school and college with
23:41
my friends, family, we're all dealing with the same situation
23:44
with aging parents not physically Co located with where
23:47
we are so careful. 1 is a comprehensive sort of caregiving
23:52
solution spanning medical, you know, CCTV, yoga, nutrition,
23:57
financial, estate planning, social community, huge part of
24:02
Wellness because when mobility is impacted, social engagement
24:06
is impacted. So we're looking at ways that we
24:09
can use digital to bring a little more of that social
24:12
engagement and fulfillment to our elderly loved ones.
24:17
And so this is something that's already available in a couple.
24:19
Ofmarketscareful1.net is live, yes.
24:22
OK, interesting. It's it's the date of release
24:26
where right now standing up about 20 families and then in
24:32
September when we actually do our full launch, our goal is to
24:36
obviously scale to multiple cities as well within India.
24:40
So I want to better understand Niharika, the Co founding
24:44
approach that you take And so help us understand are you are
24:50
you investing in very early stage companies and then kind of
24:52
helping them along? Are you sort of incubating the
24:55
ideas and then finding operating partners to kind of bring into
24:59
the mix and you sort of both push forward together or what
25:02
does this look like? Our Co founding of founding
25:07
approach is actually flexible based on the quality of the
25:11
idea. If we like the idea, we will
25:13
find a way to work with the founder.
25:15
In some cases the ideas come from within the network.
25:18
In some cases the the ideas would come from external
25:23
sources, like a founder looking to within, you know, just an
25:26
idea on paper. And if we believe in the idea,
25:30
the way that it that it works is again, you know, with some
25:34
guardrails around it. But the founder retains majority
25:39
of equity. We coach them.
25:41
That's a big part of founder LED businesses.
25:45
The CEOs, you know, could be young, not not or or immature in
25:51
their leadership, don't know how to stand up a company besides
25:54
just building the tack. So there's a, there's a whole
25:57
track around CEO coaching and founder coaching that we have.
26:01
In addition to that, we do invest.
26:05
Again, it depends on where how the founder is capitalized.
26:09
But the beauty of of our model is when we take a business on,
26:14
we are hands on operating partners, right.
26:17
So we'll jump in, we'll take fractional roles and we bring
26:21
the power of our network to bear.
26:24
So whether it's our curated partners on the marketing,
26:28
creative, engineering, OPS, finance, we've got partners for
26:33
all of that as well as extended network, right?
26:37
So what's the other challenge besides once the product is
26:40
ready is opening doors and especially enterprise doors,
26:45
right? Those are very, very hard to to
26:47
knock on and and open. So that's where the power of our
26:49
network comes in. So we can see a founder all
26:52
through their entire at least initial first three-year journey
26:56
is pretty much where we are committed to right from bringing
27:00
MVP. You know, our goal is to reduce
27:04
MVP time, which on average is about 8 months depend for
27:07
startups especially in this space down to about three to
27:10
four months. Our burn rates are very, very
27:13
low given our fractional operating model and our
27:15
partners. And then we just test and
27:19
iterate and we can we our goal is to see them through their
27:24
subsequent round of funding, which usually happens to be a
27:27
Series A, at which point we either liquidate our position or
27:31
we'll stay on depending on what the financials look like.
27:37
I want to go back to care for one for a moment because I
27:40
understand this just recently launched in the Indian market
27:46
and you got to be there for that, am I right?
27:49
Tell me about that trip. It was, it was a very meaningful
27:55
trip. And you know, something like I
27:57
said, what you're looking for is looking for you.
27:59
I had wanted to launch Care for One earlier this year, but for a
28:03
variety of reasons, I got, you know, I, I had other priorities.
28:08
It happened to be my mother's 80th birthday, which I was going
28:12
down to India for. And it just the two things
28:14
aligned and I was delighted to have announced Care For One on
28:19
on my mother's 80th birthday. Even the name, I should say this
28:24
four O 4 Harmony. There's a story behind it.
28:27
There's a lot of personal and romantic story behind it.
28:29
And of course, the brand story is we harmonize business, tech
28:33
and people so that your business doesn't become a four O 4.
28:36
But I'll tell you this, Anthony four O 4 Harmony is my parents
28:40
residential address in India. So this is all.
28:45
So it's it's not a reference to a 404 page error on the
28:48
Internet. Well, that's the brand story.
28:50
But. The real story is that it's my
28:52
parents home address in in in India.
28:57
Oh, I love when there's sort of those double meanings and, and
29:00
crossovers like that, you know, and I've heard you talk a bit
29:05
Niharika about sort of the the challenges earlier on in your
29:09
career of requiring lots of travel, you know, having a
29:13
family sort of maybe we can talk a little bit about the
29:17
challenges of a professional woman kind of balancing this.
29:21
How do I raise my family? How do I be there and how do I
29:24
also be here for a very demanding career?
29:29
Yeah, and look, there's no book and I don't think anybody solved
29:32
it. The only thing I can talk about
29:34
what's worked for me. And every day was brought
29:36
different challenges, right? You can have it all, just not in
29:43
one day. I think that's the first thing.
29:45
And the second is, as you look, people talk about balancing.
29:49
There is no such thing as balance, right?
29:51
I think it's prioritization. And if you take the three things
29:55
of, you know, your, your family, yourself and your work, one rule
30:00
that I lived by is 1 can't lose all the time and one can't win
30:04
all the time. And so if I, you know, I have a
30:09
board meeting, I can't go to my parents, you know, the PTA
30:12
meeting, that's OK. But if it happens 3 or 4 times,
30:17
it's not OK. You know, that's, that's kind of
30:20
the thing. The other thing I would say it
30:21
takes a village. I made the silly mistake when my
30:25
first child was born saying I got to do everything like I had
30:29
a nanny, but I got to do everything else, right?
30:32
I got to, you know, always change the baby's diapers.
30:35
I got to oversee the food. I, you know, and it's not
30:39
possible. So you know, however much you
30:42
can afford outsource, take all the help you can and it takes a
30:47
village. And so I learned, you know, a
30:49
few Hard Knocks that way, but it helped.
30:52
It also helps when you have a supporting partner.
30:54
My, you know, my children have always grown up with thinking of
30:58
us as a parental unit. And they were like, if one of
31:01
the parentals around, we're OK. But it does get silly sometimes.
31:06
And this was when I decided to leave my consulting job, which I
31:09
absolutely loved. My husband was in France and I
31:13
had to go to Dallas for a for a pitch and my nanny wasn't
31:17
available or she was ill. I had to wake up the kids at
31:19
4:00 in the morning, drive to the airport, wait for my husband
31:21
to land. He got in the car and then I
31:24
took the plane and I, I was sitting in the plane and I was
31:26
like, this is no wait, you know, to bring up children and even
31:30
for my own sanity. So that's when you've got to
31:32
recognize that something needs to change and having that sort
31:37
of self-awareness that some something needs to change
31:41
because people will not. And this is something that I
31:44
even noticed when I was deciding to leave Tiffin for, you know,
31:48
with everything that was going on with my mom, We as women and
31:53
I think as professionals do an incredibly good job of hiding
31:56
what's going on inside and pretending like everything's OK.
32:00
So at both instances, when I decided to leave the marketing
32:03
agency and when I decided to leave Tiffin, it wasn't my Co
32:06
workers or my bosses that were more shocked.
32:08
It was my family that was very shocked that we didn't even know
32:12
that this was going on inside of you, right.
32:14
And so we because we try to sort of, you know, I can do it all.
32:20
I'm. Strong put up a good front.
32:22
And nobody wins in that case. So I think be honest, being
32:26
honest with oneself in terms of, you know, something needs to
32:29
change and weighing the options in terms of there is no best
32:35
outcome. That is the optimal outcome.
32:38
And that varies depending on the context in your own situation.
32:42
But I think this constant, not constantly, but ever so often
32:46
just sitting down and having a think about what you're doing.
32:51
Is it is it fulfilling you? Because at the end of the day, I
32:55
mean, you would agree what matters it's people and
32:58
relationships and you know, and the love that you have in your
33:01
life and the love that you're able to give back.
33:04
And there is absolutely no compromise on that, right?
33:06
So it just sitting down and saying, are you am I living true
33:10
to that has been helpful and helped me make those right
33:14
decisions and navigate jobs. And you know, I've turned down
33:19
some amazing opportunities. There was one one job that was
33:23
based out of Columbus and I said, I can't move.
33:26
They said, don't worry. We we have we have a jet plane
33:28
that leaves from Teterboro airport to to Columbus every
33:31
morning and you can just go on the 7:30 and come back at six.
33:34
I was like, heck no, you know, so, but it was an amazing
33:38
opportunity. But no, you know.
33:42
So I've got younger boys. They're 9:00 and 11:00 and, you
33:46
know, sometimes they ask me questions about my work and oh,
33:50
why do you have to work today? Like we're recording this in the
33:53
middle of July and they're on summer break and why do you have
33:56
to go to work everyday? Dad and I mostly kind of blow
33:59
off their questions because I just think that they won't
34:01
understand the answers. But, you know, I, I suspect that
34:07
if I were more open about the things that I am working on, the
34:12
highs, the lows, the challenges, that's probably going to be
34:15
helpful for them as they get older and find themselves
34:19
starting their own career. And they don't feel, so I don't
34:22
know, maybe alone or isolated when they run into struggles.
34:26
And because they're like, oh, you know, they make, I'm
34:28
thinking and tell me now because, you know, you've got
34:31
daughters who are kind of in, you know, the early stages of
34:33
their career now, You know, do you think it's helpful for kids
34:37
to be able to hear things like that from their parents so that
34:39
when they get there, they don't think that it's just all, you
34:43
know, rainbows and sunshine? They're like, oh, yeah.
34:46
I remember seeing my mom. I remember seeing my dad kind of
34:49
have a hard time with things at times.
34:51
And that's, you know, sort of part of the the natural path.
34:54
Yeah. I mean, I would, I would balance
34:56
the venting with the teaching moment, right?
35:01
I think, you know, kids are watching all the time.
35:06
And it was it was interesting because about three months ago,
35:10
my daughter, who's about a year and a half into her job, said
35:13
mom, now I realize how mad you must have gotten because the
35:17
number of times I called you at work, because now she gets it
35:22
right. But on the other hand, I think,
35:26
and this is where, you know, whether it's daughters or sons,
35:31
I think they're both fiercely independent and so terribly
35:35
proud of the way that I've managed my career.
35:38
I think. So I've been a really good
35:40
resource to them, but I've also involved them, you know, and
35:44
this is much kudos to companies like Prudential where we had
35:49
bring your child to work day and you know, as an advertising
35:52
marketing, so they could see some of the the output.
35:55
It was interesting, right? Hey, that's my TV commercial
35:58
that's just running. My mom did that right?
36:00
And there were times and I tried right.
36:03
I I was class mom, but in when they were in elementary school
36:07
and I was very clear, look, I can't be there all the time, but
36:11
and I'll do all the background work, right.
36:13
Give me the shopping, give me the collecting the money because
36:16
my, the physical schedule is tough, but I can do some of the
36:19
back end. So they understood that and they
36:21
understood the rationale of why I was doing what I was doing.
36:25
But I did try to, I didn't completely disconnect.
36:28
But again, I also understood boundaries because you, you
36:31
can't be everything all at one time.
36:35
So that, that's kind of the way that I managed it.
36:38
But I would say my, you know, especially my daughter's, there
36:43
were times that there were emergencies and I was, let's say
36:47
in a meeting and I couldn't answer the the phone and shit
36:51
happens. But then they defaulted to.
36:54
We had a whole, you know, call list in case of those.
36:58
The village, the village call list, the village that it takes
37:02
to raise. Yes, yes, Niharika.
37:05
Tell us about your life philosophy of playing to win
37:09
with a bad hand. Well, first, I'm a card counter,
37:16
so the analogy to cards is is one that is very personal and
37:21
unique to me. I.
37:22
So if I'm going to Vegas, I should I should buy you a seat
37:26
on the airplane, OK. I will say this, but this
37:30
happened a long time ago when I was walked out of a casino so I
37:32
don't do that anymore. OK.
37:35
But I grew up playing bridge with my parents, so that's where
37:38
the whole card counting thing came in.
37:40
But look, I, I think you just have to assume that things will
37:48
not go the way that you want them to go.
37:50
There will be things that will come in your way.
37:52
There will be people that you know, situations, etcetera,
37:55
etcetera. I think if once you stipulate
37:58
that and you get over it and you just say, OK, now I'm here and
38:03
I'm here to win and I don't mean win in that ruthless, I'm going
38:06
to push you out with my elbow kind of win.
38:09
It is defining what it means to be to to win, right.
38:13
And for me, playing to win was working with great people coming
38:18
up with things that could impact other people.
38:21
I want to be part of a million stories in this world, not just,
38:25
you know, four or five stories. So that for me is, is, is
38:30
winning, but also understanding that, you know, you're going to
38:33
get a tough, many tough blows and you're going to, again,
38:36
going back to adapt. You're going to have to adapt.
38:39
And that's what skillful card players do is they look at what
38:44
strengths they have, what weaknesses they have.
38:47
They read the room, right? If you played poker or
38:51
blackjack, it is analytical in terms of how you make the
38:57
decisions to hey, hit or pass or stay or whatever.
39:01
So I think that's that's kind of been my philosophy.
39:05
And again, a card player never walks away as opposed to, you
39:11
know, some other careers where you're only as smart as your
39:13
last campaign or your last business.
39:16
You're playing the long game if you're a true card player and
39:20
you're playing it with all your strengths and weaknesses and
39:23
any, everything else that's that's thrown at you.
39:26
But life again is law of big numbers, right?
39:31
This is my engineering mathematics and this is showing
39:34
up. But it is, you know, you believe
39:37
in the in the law of large numbers and some of them will be
39:41
good and some of them won't be, won't, won't be in your favour,
39:45
but just keep going. Whatever the hand is that you're
39:48
dealt, you've got to do your best job to play that.
39:50
That hand, yeah. Know when to walk away.
39:54
Know when to stay. Who was the Kenny Kenny?
39:58
Rogers. Yeah, great song.
40:00
I'm going to have to go listen to that.
40:02
You know, and it's interesting with your such a strong
40:04
background in engineering, Niharika don't often see sort of
40:07
this mix of, you know, engineering, marketing and you
40:12
really see yourself as a connector of people.
40:15
Ideas and technology. Is there a story you a story you
40:19
can tell where kind of this knack for connection led to some
40:24
kind of a breakthrough in your work or for, you know, one of
40:27
your portfolio companies? Yeah, I'm, I'm thinking of an
40:36
example. I'll, I'll give you an example,
40:38
which actually I had to shut down post COVID, but I'm a
40:45
foodie at heart and I'm a storyteller too.
40:50
And I was looking at ways to bring this together.
40:53
And I was, I was at an event, I was speaking at an all women's
40:56
event and I, I came across these amazing immigrant women who were
41:02
aspiring chefs but didn't know where to go.
41:06
And so the challenge thrown at me as as advisor on the non
41:09
profit board was can we do something, you know, to to
41:14
create an income stream for these women?
41:18
And the idea was to take heirloom recipes from each of
41:24
these immigrant women and bottle them as sauces.
41:31
And the, the actual brand was the woman herself and her story,
41:36
right? So I had sofrito, I had, you
41:40
know, vindaloo and, and some, you know, peri peri sauce,
41:45
etcetera from all these different these women.
41:47
And was such a beautiful experience because I was able to
41:50
create a platform for them to network together, to share their
41:53
skills, create an income stream for them.
41:58
And eventually each one of them actually took off and are now
42:03
really good entrepreneurs on their own.
42:06
And I just shut the platform down during COVID because for a
42:09
variety of reasons. But that was one example in
42:12
which it was, it was because of my appreciation of food, my
42:17
appreciation of the immigrant story, being a woman, having
42:21
connections with nutritionists and chemicals, you know,
42:25
biochemical scientists, and obviously also having the
42:29
funding. And this is where something with
42:31
Rutgers, you know, the food and innovation program really
42:33
helped. It's bringing all of those
42:35
pieces together to create something meaningful.
42:39
I'm not sure if that was a a good example, but.
42:41
I think it's a great example. And I didn't realize that you
42:44
had kind of, you know, leveraged the relationships at Rutgers
42:49
and, you know, what did you say biochemical scientists, Like how
42:52
were they sort of playing a role in the.
42:54
Food production, even though the products were organic, when you
42:57
bottle something, it has to have a shelf life, it has to go
43:02
through. So the formula, the recipe
43:05
itself has to be adapted a for large volume, even if it was an
43:10
artisanal batch, you're still looking at, you know, 250
43:13
bottles in every batch. So the recipe has to adapt to
43:16
that. And then the ingredients, while
43:18
we wanted to stay all, all organic, all natural.
43:22
And when you look at shelf stability, there are certain
43:25
things like related to pH level, etcetera that you have to modify
43:29
in the original recipe to make sure it's shelf stable.
43:31
So all of that has to be done with, you know, a a food
43:35
scientist. Yeah, that makes sense.
43:38
You, you've talked earlier in our conversation, Harka about
43:42
the fractional model that you guys leverage and it works so
43:46
well. Can you maybe speak to a
43:49
specific example of that? And I've got one in mind,
43:54
Custodia Financial where and tell me if I've got these
43:57
numbers right because they seem unbelievable.
44:00
You reduced operating costs by 73% and you were able to
44:04
complete a project for $220. $20,000. $220,000 instead of the
44:13
initial $500,000 proposal, sort of less than half.
44:17
Yep. Details please.
44:21
Yeah, it's, it's, it's a fascinating relationship.
44:25
Again, custodial financial operates in the retirement loan
44:28
areas of fintech aligns with our mission and a great sort of
44:36
leadership team there. They came to us because they
44:38
were at a pivot moment and one of our partners was actually
44:42
responsible for helping them figured out how to pivot their
44:46
strategy. We can talk a little bit more
44:48
about what that pivot is, but which essentially required a
44:53
whole new platform to be stood up in, in less than three
44:58
months. And they're willing to pay as
45:02
you can, as you can see, a lot more than what we actually
45:05
charged them. And this, this happened a,
45:09
because we understood the strategy, we were able to
45:12
influence it. Our set of partners that we
45:18
activated, we have, you know preferred rates of them, but we
45:21
know exactly how to how to work with them.
45:24
So there was no wastage there. And then some of our network
45:28
members actually took on fractional operating roles just
45:33
to see the initial 6 to 9 months until we got the first set of 6
45:38
customers for them. So All in all, I would say that
45:42
that was a, for me, it was a hard moment, which was because
45:46
we didn't even go in planning these to be the outcomes, right?
45:50
It's when we look back and said, hey, this is what we were able
45:54
to achieve. Now let's productize this, this
45:57
offering, if you will. So yeah, it was, it was an
46:01
interesting learning experience, data point, but also like a
46:05
proof point of where I think start-ups will go to, which is
46:10
you'll have, you know, 10-15, maybe 20 people companies
46:15
achieve billion dollar valuations with with AI and this
46:19
fractional model and the desire to keep operating burn rates
46:24
really low. I think this is the model for
46:25
the future. You know, I'd like to explore
46:28
something kind of along these lines.
46:31
As you talked earlier about IQ, everybody is familiar with
46:36
intelligence quotient, EQ, emotional quotient, and now
46:40
something you're calling AQ, the adaptability quotient.
46:44
And I think this is something that is really coming to the
46:47
forefront for a lot of people and their thought processes.
46:49
Probably, you know, a lot for your daughters or people, you
46:53
know, a little bit earlier, maybe just in college, coming
46:55
out of college, trying to think like, what am I going to do?
46:57
Like the jobs that five years ago seem like the Primo jobs to
47:02
be shooting for now, nobody's hiring for and people who have
47:06
had those roles for a long time are, are losing their jobs.
47:09
How do you kind of think of this and sort of a, a big picture
47:13
way? And I don't know what coaching
47:15
might you give to a parent like myself who's got young kids that
47:19
you know, in the next several years are going to be making
47:22
choices for, you know, that that steer them towards their future
47:25
careers and not really knowing kind of how the AI landscape is
47:29
going to unfold and, and what it means for job prospects.
47:33
Yeah. I mean, look, everybody's
47:35
grappling with with with this question.
47:38
I would say, you know, change is constant, its velocity is not.
47:44
And I think what we're all getting a little whiplashed and
47:48
maybe shocked about or or paralyzed is that velocity has
47:54
picked up tremendously over the last, you know, 5-10 years.
47:59
And especially now, right, every day is something new.
48:04
So I think just again, let's stipulate that that's the fact
48:09
things are. Change is a constant.
48:12
And it, and the velocity is increasing, right?
48:14
It's accelerating. That piece of change has is has
48:18
increased tenfold, hundredfold and it's only going to get
48:23
faster and faster. So I think with that
48:26
understanding, I do think the the power of the human mind and
48:31
there are two thoughts to it, right?
48:32
One, one thought is that we're actually getting Dumber.
48:36
And this is not just because of tech.
48:37
If you go back to, you know, Hindu mythology from thousands
48:42
and thousands of years ago and what they were able to consume
48:45
and document blows anybody's intellect today.
48:50
If we had to sit down and do it, I mean, go back 270 years, look
48:53
at the American Constitution. These these people were 202540
48:56
at most, right? That came up with that
48:59
masterful, you know, peace and idea and concept of what America
49:05
needed to be. So I think this idea we're all
49:09
going to get Dumber. I think let's just put that to
49:11
the side. It's been happening for a while.
49:14
I do think that as it relates to professions, it's not very
49:19
quickly at least the people are going to get replaced by AI, but
49:23
I think the people who don't know how to use it will get
49:26
replaced, right. So the advice that I would give
49:30
is again, going back to how we built for a, for start with
49:35
digital labour, what is going to be there that is going to be
49:38
available digitally? And then how can you yourself as
49:43
as human potential and creativity and and intellectual
49:47
prowess, how do you maximize that to the to the benefit or to
49:53
an outcome, right. Just just technology for its own
49:57
sake has no meaning. When technology is applied
50:01
carefully, constructively, it can have outcome at scale.
50:08
So I think there are certain careers that are going to die.
50:12
I think coding as such, just pure writing lines of code
50:19
probably not going to exist in a few years.
50:23
Crazy. You know, marketing my, my, my
50:28
vertical is marketing, right? I grew up in the world of
50:30
marketing and I'm actually leading a couple of discussions
50:34
with two different advisory groups on the impact of AI and
50:37
marketing and creative services. Huge.
50:41
And I think if that industry doesn't really contemplate their
50:44
future in the world of AI, it's going to suffer.
50:46
We can, you know, deny it and push it on the corporate, but
50:50
that is going to change tremendously.
50:52
The sales process is going to change and it's all for the
50:55
better. There's so much waste.
50:57
I mean, you take, I'll give you an example, the asset management
50:59
industry, it's a $53 billion problem in terms of
51:03
distribution, distributing products.
51:06
And the answer is being let's make more products.
51:08
There are more model portfolios than the ETFs today.
51:10
Who cares, right? And the model is, is very sales
51:15
wholesaler based. That needs to change so that
51:19
that waste can be applied to something more productive.
51:22
So I think they will obviously be opportunities and careers
51:26
that people will look at, but that's the beauty of it.
51:30
I hope that we get to the point that we can all work 5 or 6
51:33
hours a day and enjoy life and maybe that's the best outcome we
51:36
all get. So you see that there's a lot of
51:39
upside to it. And obviously there's going to
51:41
be any time that there's been sort of big technology changes,
51:45
there have been people who, you know, that they struggle sort of
51:49
during that transition. And I think what's most scary
51:52
about this for people today is, and you hit on it, is that the
51:57
pace of the change is so fast. We've never seen it this
52:02
quickly. This happened this quickly
52:04
before. And that's kind of giving people
52:06
that whiplash. Like, I don't know what to do.
52:09
I don't know where to be. You might be somebody who's
52:11
later on in your career and you've been very good at what
52:14
you're doing, and now, yeah, those roles are getting
52:17
eliminated. You could be somebody very early
52:19
on in your career or in college or high school and trying to
52:21
figure out what's next. And I think that's where that AQ
52:24
comes in, right? Being able to be adaptable and I
52:29
think anyways sort of embracing the the power of curiosity and
52:33
getting really good at learning new things, getting really good
52:38
at the skill of learning itself because I think that's probably
52:42
what sets you up best for success long term.
52:45
Absolutely. And I, I think it's also not
52:48
being, you know, tied to the path so much.
52:53
I've seen some really brilliant 35 year olds saying, hey, look,
53:00
we've got a whole generation of people.
53:02
I mean, we talked about this 83 trillion wealth transfer that is
53:05
sitting on the on the sidelines. But if you if you sort of peel
53:09
back the onion and look inside it, what is it?
53:12
It's about small businesses, right?
53:16
With the folks who ran them coming to the age of retirement.
53:21
That is a superb industry right now.
53:25
Small businesses, whatever they might be is to go in and and run
53:30
them because either they do not have generational pass through
53:35
or they don't have people who want to run those businesses.
53:37
But look at it purely from a portfolio perspective.
53:40
Those are very, very interesting businesses to invest and run and
53:44
grow a whole franchise. So you don't have to be wedded
53:47
to just the path that you know, you've, you've learned through
53:50
college or your career. I think that is another part of
53:53
adaptability. You know, what was I doing?
53:56
Setting up a food business, right?
53:58
But it was, it was fun and interesting and, and look, if
54:01
COVID hadn't happened, I think that business would have been a
54:05
a moderately successful one as a small business.
54:09
Let's shift gears. Niharika would like to hear
54:11
about a serious challenge that you have overcome, whether it's
54:15
personal or professional. How did you get through that?
54:18
What did you learn? I think I've talked about, you
54:25
know, my transition from Tiffin as I was dealing with my
54:27
mother's situation. So I won't go there again.
54:29
I'll talk about something that it took me, it was humbling and
54:36
it, it took me a while to process it.
54:39
So this is during my career at Prudential and there was a time
54:43
that I let as the leader, I let my leadership team down.
54:48
And I'd say I was very disappointed in myself.
54:54
No, I won't say it was entirely my fault, but I was, I was the
54:57
leader. It's my fault.
54:58
I have to take responsibility. But it's when you're faced with
55:02
circumstances like this is what do you do?
55:04
And who are the people you call on?
55:06
And coincidentally, as I, I was going off on a 10 day vacation
55:13
and I went to my boss and I said, look, I screwed up and I
55:18
all I want you to do is to meet with my team.
55:20
And it's not that I needed to tell him.
55:23
Maybe it would have gotten to him anyways, but I went to him
55:26
and like, Mia culpa, how we got here, we're here.
55:31
But I want you to just do one thing for me, which is while I'm
55:35
awake, can you meet with my team and just tell me, have I lost
55:38
the locker room? If I've lost the locker room,
55:42
then I'm done. If I haven't, then I'm willing
55:48
to put in the work to make things right.
55:53
And fortunately when I, by the time I got back, my boss, who
55:59
has really been instrumental, I think, in in influencing how I
56:02
grew up as a leader at Prudential, said you haven't,
56:07
They still respect you. They don't agree with some of
56:10
the decisions you've made, but you haven't lost the locker
56:13
room. And I was like, OK, that's it.
56:15
I can go from there. And it was like I said, it was
56:19
very humbling. I had to walk in with a big pit
56:21
in my stomach, like, you know, go to each one of them and say,
56:25
I'm sorry, I screwed up, I own it, let's move forward.
56:29
How do we do that? And I think that was also
56:33
appreciated. And I and they still remain
56:35
lifelong friends. But I didn't, again, I asked for
56:40
feedback. I asked for help.
56:44
I came to terms with it because as as an individual, as a
56:50
professional, sometimes telling yourself the truth is the
56:54
hardest thing to do. But I think I'm, I'm better for
57:00
it. It was not easy.
57:01
It took me about six months to win back the team and but I did
57:06
and I I grew a few, lost a few hair and went Gray a little bit.
57:12
But it was all worth it because at the end of the day, I think
57:15
there is still respect and we I continue to be friends with
57:18
them. So when you say you screwed up,
57:21
obviously we're not talking about you, you know, brought in
57:23
the wrong coffee or something. This was obviously a a more, you
57:26
know, significant kind of misstep and to the point where
57:30
you were concerned about, you know, have I lost the team?
57:33
Do they no longer respect me? You know, do I is it, is it just
57:37
time for me to go? And that's really hard.
57:40
You know, I have to imagine you're, you know, in a position
57:42
of leadership. You had these people's respect.
57:45
You know, they came to you. You were guiding the team in the
57:48
past on, you know, important decisions.
57:50
And now this thing happens and it's not easy to sort of go
57:55
within and be like, all right, this was on me, my fault.
58:00
I I messed this up. Let's fix it together.
58:04
Let's move forward as it that's not easy to do.
58:06
Like kind of a natural human reaction is to to have a reflex
58:11
of being defensive and point fingers and not my fault or just
58:17
a tiny bit my fault or it was really, you know, him or her or
58:20
circumstances out of my control. So I mean, hats off to you for
58:24
kind of being able to step into that, own that situation, talk
58:27
with your boss and then go and have those hard conversations
58:31
with each one of those employees individually.
58:34
Was there anyone else besides, you know, your your boss at the
58:38
time that was kind of really helpful in guiding you sort of
58:42
through that difficult period? I would say guiding but
58:48
supporting. I think I did let my husband
58:51
know what was going on and Moore also telling him I need space.
58:58
There was a time that I got into the pool and didn't come out for
59:01
8 hours. I just, I had to walk through it
59:05
and, and my family also, like the girls were, were big enough
59:10
to know that there was something off with mom, but they let me be
59:13
and they let me be because I brought my husband into the fold
59:17
and said, this is what I'm what's going on.
59:20
And he was his was just a good listening, non judgmental
59:24
sounding board. There were times that he was
59:28
worried for my Wellness and he's like, why are you doing this?
59:31
Just like, you know, you could get another job if you just
59:33
like, you know, made a few phone calls and I was like, no, I, I
59:37
need to see this through. Maybe at the end of it I will
59:40
leave, but I need to make this right.
59:43
You can't run from the problem you got to, you got to face it
59:45
head on, you got to fix it, and then you can make decisions
59:48
about what it looks like going forward.
59:50
Exactly because it'll follow you somewhere or the other if you
59:52
don't fix it now, right. So, and I and I cared
59:56
tremendously for for these group of people for me to, to actually
1:00:01
even think of doing that right because it for me, it all goes
1:00:06
back to again, people and relationships.
1:00:08
So I think he was very supportive through through.
1:00:12
That journey and thankfully I'm blessed with few other career
1:00:17
women who have who I've grown up with as well.
1:00:22
So I am very, I don't hesitate in using that network when I
1:00:32
need to. And I think it works the other
1:00:34
way around. If you don't ask, you don't get.
1:00:37
And whether it's a good thing or a bad thing or whatever, when
1:00:40
you need help, just ask. And I think people are just
1:00:42
willing to help. I think what comes in the way is
1:00:45
many people don't ask for it, and somehow or the other I'm
1:00:49
shameless enough to always ask for help.
1:00:51
Good for you. What's your superpower,
1:00:53
Naharika? The one that I already said, I
1:00:59
think besides, you know what I would say the technical side of
1:01:02
it, which is the system's thinking, right, which is
1:01:04
connecting things that other people can't or won't.
1:01:08
I would say now at this point, my superpower is that I'm not
1:01:16
attached to the journey or the destination.
1:01:22
I'm I'm attached to the people and the impact, right?
1:01:28
It's my favorite. It's actually an adaptation of
1:01:31
my favorite philosopher, who happens to be Winnie the Pooh.
1:01:34
And so Winnie the Pooh and Piglet are walking up forest
1:01:36
and, and Winnie asks, actually it's Piglet.
1:01:38
But Winnie asks Piglet, like, what's more important?
1:01:41
Is it the journey of the destination?
1:01:43
And Piglet turns to Winnie and says, no, you're silly.
1:01:46
It's the company and and I think I've made that to be my
1:01:51
superpower now, which is it is all about people and the quality
1:01:55
of work and the fun that you have doing it and the impact
1:01:58
that you will have. At the end of the day, how we
1:02:01
get that and how much money we make and all of that is not so
1:02:04
important to me. I like that I've never heard it
1:02:07
put quite like that before. Maybe I should get back to
1:02:10
reading more Winnie the Pooh. Because you know, I've always
1:02:14
thought, I mean, I think we're naturally wired to like, it's
1:02:18
the destination. I've got this goal in mind.
1:02:19
I want to get there. And you know, we're wired
1:02:22
similarly. Once you hit that goal, what
1:02:24
happens? You move the goal line, right?
1:02:25
Like you, you keep setting a new destination point.
1:02:30
And so it's like, well, let's, let's enjoy the journey along
1:02:33
the way. But to your point, how are you
1:02:35
really enjoying that journey, right?
1:02:38
It's not fun to walk it alone, right?
1:02:41
It's it's who you're walking with as you as you make that
1:02:44
traverse. So I, I like that Winnie the
1:02:47
Pooh wins again. How about a daily habit routine,
1:02:52
Something that helps to start your day or keep you on track?
1:02:58
This doesn't happen every all every day, but I I want to.
1:03:05
I aim to start my day and end the day with a smile on my face.
1:03:11
And even if it is not, there is no reason or I'm not feeling
1:03:14
that way, I force it because there is a chemical change that
1:03:19
happens in your body when you force yourself to smile.
1:03:22
And the way that I've done it is there's a principle called habit
1:03:26
stacking. When you want to introduce a new
1:03:28
habit you stack on, stack it on to something that you already
1:03:31
do. So in the night.
1:03:34
I know I, you know, put cream on my hands and, you know, as as
1:03:39
women do and eye cream and all of that.
1:03:41
And that's my reminder to smile. And in the morning, and this is
1:03:47
my contract with my husband, whenever he's around, he gives
1:03:49
me coffee in bed. And when I have that first sip
1:03:53
of coffee, I smile to myself. And it's just I've stacked it
1:03:56
that way. So I think that that that habit
1:03:59
has, has really helped me. But otherwise, and you can see
1:04:05
I, I love puzzles and stuff like that.
1:04:07
I cognitively as much as, you know, people go out and work out
1:04:12
fitness wise, you got to work your mind too.
1:04:14
Besides the work that we do everyday.
1:04:16
So I'm a big fan of doing crosswords and puzzles.
1:04:20
So I carve out 15 minutes in the morning and 15 minutes at the
1:04:23
end of the day to, to do my crosswords.
1:04:25
So, you know, other puzzles got. It just one more question for
1:04:30
you, Niharika. But before I ask it, I want to
1:04:32
do 2 things. First of all, it's everyone
1:04:34
listening. Just pause for just a moment,
1:04:36
take a deep breath and hit the follow button on your favorite
1:04:39
podcast app so you can continue to get more great conversations
1:04:43
like we've had here today with Niharika Shah from Four O 4
1:04:46
Harmony. I also want to let people know
1:04:50
the best way to get in touch with you or follow your story,
1:04:52
Niharika. What would that be?
1:04:54
Niharika at 4 O fourharmony.com or you can look for me on
1:04:57
LinkedIn. Excellent.
1:04:58
We'll include those links in the show notes for folks.
1:05:01
So last question for you, Niharika, you and I reconnect
1:05:05
one year from today and you're excited you're celebrating
1:05:08
something. What's that thing that you're
1:05:10
celebrating one year from today? I'm celebrating the fact that we
1:05:17
have impacted more lives and I'm, I'm going to think about
1:05:27
this for a moment in terms of numerical numbers.
1:05:30
Let me let me play that back again.
1:05:32
I would be really happy if there were two things.
1:05:34
One is careful. One has made caregiving the
1:05:40
standard of care of the way that we provide it, the standard of
1:05:43
care and reduce the sort of the guilt and the burden on
1:05:47
caregivers and, and, and families.
1:05:49
I would be very happy saying that.
1:05:52
The second thing I would say is, you know, for for harmony from
1:05:56
our portfolio perspective has added on some more health
1:06:02
related businesses or start-ups in our portfolio.
1:06:07
And, and the third would be that we have, you know, and I say
1:06:12
this in, in a, in a, in the most global citizen way, which is
1:06:21
we've made a little more progress towards some of this
1:06:24
nonsense that's going on in this world not happening anymore.
1:06:30
We can all drink to that. Yeah.
1:06:32
Miss Niharika Shah from Four O 4 Harmony, I want to be the first
1:06:36
to thank you for sharing both your time and your story with us
1:06:39
today. I really appreciate it.
1:06:40
It's been my pleasure, Anthony, and thank you so much for the
1:06:43
conversation. Folks, that's a wrap on another
1:06:46
episode of the Inspired Stories podcast.
1:06:48
Thanks for learning with us today.