Latest / INSPIRE STORY / #0235_ STORY INSPIRE: Vanessa Marin — Sex Therapist Reveals What Men Need to Know About Intimacy, Pleasure & Better Relationships

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#0235_ STORY INSPIRE: Vanessa Marin — Sex Therapist Reveals What Men Need to Know About Intimacy, Pleasure & Better Relationships · INSPIRE STORY

0:05
Speaker 1: Vanessa Morin, welcome to the show.
0:08
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited
0:10
Speaker 2: to be here.
0:11
Speaker 1: Well, me too. We cover a lot of dark stuff
0:14
Speaker 1: on this show, so I wanted to lighten that up
0:16
Speaker 1: a little bit, and I thought you'd be a perfect guest,
0:19
Speaker 1: and so here we go. It's gonna be all about
0:23
Speaker 1: sex therapy.
0:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I just wanna say I really appreciate you
0:26
Speaker 2: being willing to open up this conversation. It's a tough one.
0:29
Speaker 2: for so many people. And, you know, what I can say,
0:32
Speaker 2: having been in this field for over 20 years and
0:35
Speaker 2: talking to hundreds of thousands of people, I think so
0:39
Speaker 2: many of us are desperate for more from our relationships.
0:43
Speaker 2: We want more connection, more closeness, more intimacy. And so
0:48
Speaker 2: many of us are wondering, like, what happened to that
0:51
Speaker 2: couple who is madly in love, who couldn't keep their
0:54
Speaker 2: hands off of each other? Like, what have we become now?
0:58
Speaker 2: And so I've really made it my mission to try
1:01
Speaker 2: to bridge that gap in relationships, to try to help
1:04
Speaker 2: save relationships. So the good news is there are a
1:07
Speaker 2: lot of really practical things that we can do to
1:11
Speaker 2: recreate that intimacy. So my goal is that by the
1:13
Speaker 2: end of this episode, your audience is gonna feel inspired,
1:17
Speaker 2: they're gonna feel motivated, and they're gonna have a couple
1:19
Speaker 2: of practical tools that they're excited to start putting to
1:22
Speaker 2: use right away.
1:23
Speaker 1: Man, I love to hear that. It's just nice to
1:26
Speaker 1: have a lighter subject to talk about. And do you
1:29
Speaker 1: know who Dr. Reena Malik is?
1:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, I do.
1:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, we just had her on.
1:34
Speaker 2: Oh, she's great.
1:35
Speaker 1: It's just like the forbidden topic that you just don't
1:39
Speaker 1: talk about in public. And I thought that was an
1:41
Speaker 1: amazing conversation. We haven't even released it yet. And we've
1:45
Speaker 1: been trying to get you on here for at least
1:47
Speaker 1: a couple of months, I know. So yeah, thank you
1:51
Speaker 1: for coming. But everybody starts off with an introduction here.
1:55
Speaker 1: So Vanessa Marin, a licensed psychotherapist with over 20 years
1:59
Speaker 1: of clinical experience in sex therapy helping countless couples improve intimacy.
2:05
Speaker 1: A Brown University graduate with dual bachelor's degree in human
2:08
Speaker 1: sexuality and sociology. A master's degree in counseling psychology, co-founder
2:15
Speaker 1: of Vanessa and Xander Alongside Your Husband, where you built
2:19
Speaker 1: a library of online courses and tools that real couples
2:22
Speaker 1: use to reclaim their spark. A best-selling author of the book,
2:27
Speaker 1: Sex Talks, Five Conversations That Will Transform Your Love Life.
2:32
Speaker 1: And you've also turned this book into a card deck
2:35
Speaker 1: of prompts to deepen connection and spark intimacy.
2:40
Speaker 2: So- We might have to open some of them.
2:42
Speaker 1: Right on, let's do it, let's do it. So before
2:46
Speaker 1: we get too far into the interview, Everybody gets a gift.
2:51
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm so excited.
2:52
Speaker 1: Vigilance League gummy bears, legal in all 50 states. It's
2:57
Speaker 1: just candy.
2:58
Speaker 2: I'm very excited about these. I listened to your episode
3:01
Speaker 2: with Gabrielle. Oh, cool.
3:03
Speaker 1: You know Gabrielle too?
3:04
Speaker 2: I do, yeah. She's a new friend of mine and
3:06
Speaker 2: she didn't get hers. And I was like, I really hope,
3:09
Speaker 2: I really hope I get my gummy bears.
3:12
Speaker 1: And then we'll send you an extra one back for her.
3:17
Speaker 1: And then I have a Patreon account. We've turned it
3:20
Speaker 1: into one hell of a community, and they've been with
3:22
Speaker 1: us since the beginning. This is the reason I get
3:24
Speaker 1: to be here with you today. And so one of
3:27
Speaker 1: the things we do is we offer them the opportunity
3:29
Speaker 1: to ask every guest a question. This is from Terry Lockitsky.
3:37
Speaker 1: I was in a 14-year abusive marriage and am returning
3:40
Speaker 1: to single life. How do you suggest setting boundaries in
3:44
Speaker 1: today's dating environment? world reclaiming sexual health and what are
3:49
Speaker 1: your recommendations for meeting someone new?
3:53
Speaker 2: Well, first of all, I just want to say I'm
3:54
Speaker 2: really excited for this person to get back out there
3:57
Speaker 2: and to be in a healthier relationship. Obviously, there's a
4:01
Speaker 2: lot of grief and sadness of having to process that
4:04
Speaker 2: and move on, but I'm super excited for them to
4:06
Speaker 2: find somebody new and find something better. So I think
4:10
Speaker 2: a great starting point would be to take some time
4:13
Speaker 2: to reflect on what you learned about yourself in that
4:16
Speaker 2: past relationship, and in particular, what you learned about your sexuality.
4:21
Speaker 2: We can always take all of our experiences and figure
4:23
Speaker 2: out what are things that I want to replicate in
4:26
Speaker 2: the future and what are things that I do not
4:28
Speaker 2: want again in the future. So particularly when it comes
4:31
Speaker 2: to sex, I would think about what were some of
4:33
Speaker 2: my favorite experiences, what were the times that I felt
4:36
Speaker 2: the most connected to my partner, And what were the
4:39
Speaker 2: things that I didn't enjoy so much? And have those
4:43
Speaker 2: be your barometers going forward and what you're looking for
4:45
Speaker 2: in a partner. And then what I always say to
4:48
Speaker 2: people from the beginning when you're starting a relationship, actually,
4:51
Speaker 2: our book is such a great resource because a lot
4:54
Speaker 2: of people will tell us, oh, well, I'm not in
4:55
Speaker 2: a relationship. I can't read it. but it's actually really
4:58
Speaker 2: useful to get started on a good foot, you know,
5:01
Speaker 2: right when you're getting started with a new relationship. Like, yeah,
5:04
Speaker 2: start talking about sex. Obviously not on your first date
5:07
Speaker 2: in the first five minutes, but, you know, get a
5:10
Speaker 2: sense of how comfortable or not comfortable that person is
5:14
Speaker 2: with their sex life. So once you've gotten a couple
5:17
Speaker 2: of dates in, maybe just ask a pretty general question like,
5:20
Speaker 2: What's your relationship with sex? How important is sex to you?
5:23
Speaker 2: What does physical intimacy mean to you? Something more open
5:26
Speaker 2: like that so you can just get a sense of
5:28
Speaker 2: who that person is.
5:29
Speaker 1: Great, great. Love that answer. You know, right at the
5:35
Speaker 1: very beginning, you were talking about, you know, you see
5:37
Speaker 1: couples and they're all lovey-dovey and touching each other and
5:41
Speaker 1: very affectionate. And then as time goes on, it dwindles away. Right.
5:47
Speaker 1: You know, sometimes it comes back, sometimes it doesn't come back,
5:50
Speaker 1: and things just get totally out of whack. You know,
5:53
Speaker 1: why does that happen in most couples?
5:57
Speaker 2: Well, first of all, I just want to.
5:58
Speaker 1: Or does it happen in most couples? Does it happen
6:01
Speaker 1: in all couples?
6:02
Speaker 2: It absolutely does happen in most, if not all couples. And,
6:06
Speaker 2: you know, Xander and I always like to normalize this
6:09
Speaker 2: by saying it happened in our relationship. You know, I
6:11
Speaker 2: was already in this field, I'd already been doing research
6:14
Speaker 2: and studying, And the exact same thing happened to us.
6:17
Speaker 2: You know, when we met, the chemistry was instantaneous. It
6:21
Speaker 2: was just, we both kind of took it as, this
6:23
Speaker 2: is a sign from the universe. This is my person.
6:26
Speaker 2: We're hitting it off so well. And then you're, you know,
6:29
Speaker 2: a year or two into the relationship. And all of
6:32
Speaker 2: a sudden, I'm having this experience of sitting on a
6:35
Speaker 2: couch in our living room. He's sitting on another couch
6:39
Speaker 2: on the opposite side of the room. We're in like
6:41
Speaker 2: our ratty pajamas. We're eating takeout straight from the containers.
6:45
Speaker 2: We've had exhausting days at work. We're watching some crappy
6:49
Speaker 2: Bravo TV show that I probably forced him to watch.
6:52
Speaker 2: And I remember having the thought, I don't remember the
6:55
Speaker 2: last time we had sex. And at first it was
6:58
Speaker 2: just like an observation, like, yeah, when was it? And
7:01
Speaker 2: then it kind of hit me like a tidal wave. Like,
7:05
Speaker 2: I don't remember the last time we were intimate. and
7:08
Speaker 2: I'm not sure I even have really been missing it
7:11
Speaker 2: all that much. And so I've had that experience of
7:15
Speaker 2: what the heck happened to us? Why did we go
7:19
Speaker 2: from this incredible chemistry to... I can't even remember. And
7:24
Speaker 2: so there are a bunch of different reasons why this happens.
7:26
Speaker 2: So let's start with first just purely physiological. Our bodies
7:32
Speaker 2: are not capable of sustaining that level of intensity for
7:36
Speaker 2: longer than six to 12 months. So the chemical processes
7:41
Speaker 2: that happen in our brain are so intense, so overwhelming,
7:45
Speaker 2: it's the equivalent of being high on cocaine, essentially. We're
7:49
Speaker 2: literally addicted to that person. We can't get enough of them, right?
7:55
Speaker 2: But our brains are just physiologically incapable of maintaining those
7:59
Speaker 2: same levels of neurotransmitters for longer than about a year,
8:03
Speaker 2: if you're lucky. So, physically, it's just not even possible.
8:07
Speaker 2: But making it even worse, a lot of us take
8:11
Speaker 2: our foot off the gas once we've gotten into a relationship.
8:14
Speaker 2: And if you think about, like, every romance that you've
8:17
Speaker 2: seen on TV and in the movies, the focus is
8:20
Speaker 2: always on, like, getting the girl, right? Or, like, getting together.
8:23
Speaker 2: And there's something that's in your way, something little you
8:26
Speaker 2: have to overcome, and then now you're together and you
8:28
Speaker 2: live happily ever after. And so, so many of us
8:31
Speaker 2: have that idea in our heads of that's how it goes.
8:33
Speaker 2: Once I get the person, once I lock them down,
8:35
Speaker 2: we're committed, we're married, whatever it is, like, we're good, right?
8:39
Speaker 2: And so, a lot of us just go into coasting
8:42
Speaker 2: mode and we stop doing the things that helped us
8:46
Speaker 2: feel so connected to our person in the first place.
8:51
Speaker 1: Can I, before we go too far into this, I
8:53
Speaker 1: just have a couple of theories that, that, that, So
8:58
Speaker 1: when you were saying your husband and you were sitting
9:00
Speaker 1: on the couch eating takeout again, that to me, like,
9:06
Speaker 1: if I eat like shit, it's not happening.
9:08
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah.
9:09
Speaker 1: If I don't feel good, it's not happening. That's not
9:12
Speaker 1: just me. That's my wife, too. It's if we gorge
9:15
Speaker 1: on fast food, takeout, pizza, pretty much anything, and then
9:19
Speaker 1: we feel like shit by the end of the night,
9:21
Speaker 1: it's like you don't feel I don't feel comfortable in
9:26
Speaker 1: my own skin, so it's just not going to happen.
9:28
Speaker 2: Can I tell you one of my favorite rules for
9:30
Speaker 2: your sex life?
9:31
Speaker 1: Yeah.
9:32
Speaker 2: Okay, it's called fuck first. Nice. So before you go
9:38
Speaker 2: out to eat, go to a party, any sort of event,
9:43
Speaker 2: have sex first. So many of us have this idea,
9:46
Speaker 2: especially with date night, we think, oh, you go out
9:48
Speaker 2: to the restaurant, you have a nice date, and then
9:50
Speaker 2: you come home and you have sex. But let's be real,
9:53
Speaker 2: you go out to the restaurant, you overeat, you overdrink,
9:57
Speaker 2: you come home, you're bloated, you're gassy, you're uncomfortable, you
10:00
Speaker 2: just want to put on your PJs and put Netflix
10:03
Speaker 2: on and sit on the couch, right? Like, nobody wants
10:05
Speaker 2: to have sex after a big date night out. So
10:08
Speaker 2: this is something so practical, so simple, but it's literally game-changing.
10:13
Speaker 2: Have sex first, then go out on date night. Then
10:17
Speaker 2: you're not going to be bloated too full. And also
10:19
Speaker 2: it feels like this sexy little surprise between the two
10:22
Speaker 2: of you, this little secret between the two of you.
10:23
Speaker 2: So the date night just feels even more fun and
10:26
Speaker 2: flirty than it would otherwise. Nice.
10:29
Speaker 1: Great suggestion. I mean, is that, is that, and then,
10:32
Speaker 1: and then my other theory is that, you know, people
10:35
Speaker 1: just eventually just, I don't know any other way to
10:39
Speaker 1: say it. They just let themselves go. You know, and,
10:42
Speaker 1: and it's in, in, in, I mean, we talk about
10:44
Speaker 1: this a lot with the, with the, with like people
10:47
Speaker 1: like Dr. Gabrielle Lyons and, you know, a lot of
10:50
Speaker 1: the other doctors that I've had, but, you know, and
10:52
Speaker 1: not in a, in like a, in a sexual way,
10:56
Speaker 1: but you know, that, that, I mean, Gabrielle talks about,
10:59
Speaker 1: it's like, you wind up in the cycle and it's like,
11:03
Speaker 1: you eat like shit. Then you're like, oh, I did
11:05
Speaker 1: it last night. I'm on his, what's one more day.
11:07
Speaker 1: What's one more. Piece of candy. What's one more bag
11:11
Speaker 1: of gummy bears? And then it just keeps going and
11:15
Speaker 1: going and going. And I think that maybe that's why
11:18
Speaker 1: you get these long periods of no sex with your
11:24
Speaker 1: significant other, partner, spouse, whatever. Am I right on that?
11:28
Speaker 2: Absolutely, yeah. The way that we take care of our
11:31
Speaker 2: body heavily impacts our desire for sex, how we show
11:36
Speaker 2: up during sex. And, you know, I can tell a
11:38
Speaker 2: little bit of Xander's story, too. Like, at the beginning
11:41
Speaker 2: of our relationship, He was in a really stressful job,
11:45
Speaker 2: working very long hours, trying to climb that corporate ladder,
11:48
Speaker 2: be a good provider. And he started stress eating, you know,
11:53
Speaker 2: and all of a sudden it was he's gained a
11:55
Speaker 2: lot of weight. He was feeling really uncomfortable in his
11:58
Speaker 2: own body. And he would tell you the story, too.
12:00
Speaker 2: This is not a secret or anything. He was just
12:02
Speaker 2: feeling really uncomfortable in his own skin. And his sex
12:05
Speaker 2: drive really suffered because of that. And I've gone through
12:07
Speaker 2: similar phases in my own life, too, where, you know,
12:10
Speaker 2: life gets in the way and you just kind of
12:11
Speaker 2: get off your routine and you really feel that impact.
12:16
Speaker 2: So I think that's actually one of the amazing invitations
12:19
Speaker 2: that our sex life offers to us. I'm sure we'll
12:22
Speaker 2: get into this more, but, you know, we have this
12:24
Speaker 2: tendency to think of sex as just this purely physical act,
12:27
Speaker 2: but I really believe it's so much more than that.
12:30
Speaker 2: And it invites us to take a look at how
12:32
Speaker 2: are we really treating our bodies? How are we taking
12:34
Speaker 2: care of ourselves? Because if you're treating your body like crap,
12:38
Speaker 2: you're not going to want to be intimate with your partner.
12:40
Speaker 2: You're not going to be able to perform super well
12:42
Speaker 2: with your partner. Like, the desire is just not going
12:45
Speaker 2: to be there. So how we treat our bodies is
12:47
Speaker 2: an incredibly important part of our sex life.
12:50
Speaker 1: Okay. What are the other reasons? Are there other reasons?
12:55
Speaker 2: A lot of it is just letting life get in
12:56
Speaker 2: the way, too. You know, we're all busy. We're all
13:00
Speaker 2: so busy. We have a million things on our plate,
13:02
Speaker 2: a million things going through our minds at all times.
13:05
Speaker 2: And it's very easy for us to just take our
13:07
Speaker 2: relationships for granted and think like, you know, that's my person,
13:10
Speaker 2: I locked it down, they're always gonna be there. And
13:13
Speaker 2: so we let them drop farther and farther and farther
13:16
Speaker 2: down our priority list until the point where they really
13:20
Speaker 2: feel more like roommates rather than romantic partners. I mean,
13:23
Speaker 2: most couples will say, we're like two ships passing in
13:25
Speaker 2: the night. Or we're business partners in managing a household,
13:29
Speaker 2: managing the kids' schedules and all the stuff, but that
13:32
Speaker 2: spark between the two of us is gone. So it's really,
13:35
Speaker 2: we've stopped making space for each other to connect with
13:39
Speaker 2: each other, to spend time with each other, to remind
13:41
Speaker 2: ourselves like, oh yeah, I like you. You're fun to
13:44
Speaker 2: spend time.
13:47
Speaker 1: With, right? What about fear of asking?
13:51
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. Yeah. Initiating is wildly, wildly vulnerable. You're talking
13:58
Speaker 2: about initiating sex in particular? Yeah. Yeah. We don't give
14:01
Speaker 2: enough credit to how vulnerable it is to initiate. And
14:05
Speaker 2: in male-female relationships, you know, it's almost always the man
14:08
Speaker 2: who's doing the initiating. That's kind of the idea that
14:10
Speaker 2: we have. Like, yeah, the guy's supposed to want it more,
14:12
Speaker 2: so he's supposed to initiate. And I think as women,
14:16
Speaker 2: a lot of us don't recognize how vulnerable that is,
14:20
Speaker 2: how hard it is to put yourself out there and
14:23
Speaker 2: ask to be intimate. you're putting yourself in the position
14:26
Speaker 2: to be turned down. And anytime you get turned down
14:28
Speaker 2: for anything, it sucks. But particularly when it's around something
14:32
Speaker 2: as intimate as sex, it really hurts. And this is
14:36
Speaker 2: another area where I think we really get ourselves into
14:38
Speaker 2: a lot of trouble by thinking of sex as this
14:40
Speaker 2: purely physical act. So a lot of women, their partner
14:44
Speaker 2: will initiate, and a lot of women will be kind
14:46
Speaker 2: of annoyed by it. Like, ugh, you want to have
14:48
Speaker 2: sex now? Can't you see I'm in the middle of something?
14:51
Speaker 2: We just had sex a couple of days ago, right?
14:54
Speaker 2: It feels annoying. And a lot of times that's because
14:58
Speaker 2: men are initiating in kind of annoying ways because it's
15:01
Speaker 2: so vulnerable. So you guys do the, like, you're trying
15:03
Speaker 2: to joke about it instead, trying to get a little
15:06
Speaker 2: plausible deniability. So one of the classic ones is like,
15:09
Speaker 2: the old boob honk. He comes up behind her while
15:13
Speaker 2: she's washing the dishes and gives her a little honk honk.
15:16
Speaker 2: And she's like, leave me alone, get off of me.
15:18
Speaker 2: And he's, oh, I was just joking. I was just
15:21
Speaker 2: messing around with you. That wasn't trying to initiate. You're
15:23
Speaker 2: trying to get some plausible deniability to make it sting
15:27
Speaker 2: less when you get a no. But of course, it's
15:29
Speaker 2: an annoying initiation. And so you're more likely, ironically, to
15:33
Speaker 2: get a no from her. But as women, a lot
15:35
Speaker 2: of us will, yeah, we'll get annoyed and just leave
15:37
Speaker 2: me alone, go away some other time. And we don't
15:41
Speaker 2: recognize in that moment that what our partner is really doing,
15:45
Speaker 2: even if he's doing it really immaturely, really unskillfully, what
15:49
Speaker 2: he's actually asking in that moment is, I want to
15:52
Speaker 2: feel close to you right now. Will you connect with
15:55
Speaker 2: me right now? And that's something that I tell women
15:57
Speaker 2: all the time, like, imagine in that moment that that's
16:00
Speaker 2: actually what he's saying to you. You wouldn't respond with,
16:04
Speaker 2: leave me alone. Ugh, get out of here. If you
16:07
Speaker 2: actually recognize that that's what he's saying. I want to
16:09
Speaker 2: feel close to you right now.
16:10
Speaker 1: How should men be asking? Or women?
16:14
Speaker 2: So first of all, I think everyone needs to initiate.
16:17
Speaker 2: I think it's really important for both partners in the relationship.
16:20
Speaker 2: And it's not about sex drive. I don't care who
16:22
Speaker 2: has the higher drive or the lower drive. I think
16:25
Speaker 2: both partners need to be willing to be that vulnerable
16:28
Speaker 2: and initiate with each other. It's not fair for it
16:31
Speaker 2: just to be put solely on one person's shoulders. So
16:34
Speaker 2: that's a big part of it. But one of the
16:36
Speaker 2: things that we go over in sex talks is a
16:39
Speaker 2: model that Xander and I came up with called the
16:40
Speaker 2: initiation styles. Have you heard of the love languages model?
16:43
Speaker 2: It's like kind of that idea that we all like
16:46
Speaker 2: to give and receive love in different ways. It's very
16:48
Speaker 2: similar to that. Like we all like to be initiated
16:50
Speaker 2: with in different ways. So if you don't know your
16:53
Speaker 2: partner's style, you're likely initiating in a way that doesn't
16:56
Speaker 2: really work for them, and you're more likely to get that, like,
16:59
Speaker 2: leave me alone kind of reaction. So it's understanding, you know,
17:03
Speaker 2: finding out what style your partner is and what's going
17:05
Speaker 2: to work for them. So I'll give you a couple
17:07
Speaker 2: of examples. One of the types is called take care
17:10
Speaker 2: of me. And a lot of women tend to be
17:13
Speaker 2: of this type. where we want to feel like there's
17:16
Speaker 2: emotional connection first. Like you care about me as a human.
17:21
Speaker 2: You're interested in me. You want to spend a little
17:23
Speaker 2: quality time with me. We're easing into it rather than just,
17:26
Speaker 2: you know, zero to 100. So for somebody who's of
17:29
Speaker 2: that type, a really successful way to initiate might be
17:32
Speaker 2: something like, hey, babe, I'm going to handle bedtime with
17:35
Speaker 2: the kids tonight. Why don't you go take a bath, relax,
17:38
Speaker 2: and then you and I can meet in the bedroom
17:40
Speaker 2: in about half an hour. Something like that would feel
17:43
Speaker 2: so good for so many women. Versus, I'll give you
17:47
Speaker 2: a totally different type, it is called the play with
17:49
Speaker 2: me type. Where you like initiation to be more like
17:52
Speaker 2: playful and silly. Xander and I do this type a lot.
17:55
Speaker 2: Like we'll do, we'll be watching a football game and
17:58
Speaker 2: we'll make a bet on who's gonna win this game. Okay,
18:00
Speaker 2: whoever wins this bet, they get to have, decide like
18:06
Speaker 2: what kind of sex they wanna have tonight. You know,
18:08
Speaker 2: we're being silly about it or we're like, we'll have
18:10
Speaker 2: a secret emoji that we send to each other. And
18:13
Speaker 2: that means like, hey, I'm interested right now.
18:15
Speaker 1: Oh, nice.
18:16
Speaker 2: It's more playful, right? So you can see that those
18:18
Speaker 2: are two very different kinds of styles. And if you're
18:20
Speaker 2: initiating in the style that's not really what your partner likes,
18:24
Speaker 2: it's probably not going to land as well.
18:25
Speaker 1: I mean, can you just ask? Yeah.
18:28
Speaker 2: You absolutely can. And I do think that in general,
18:31
Speaker 2: that's one of the best ways to go about it.
18:34
Speaker 2: You know, like I was saying, a lot of men
18:35
Speaker 2: are doing it in these kind of jokey ways or
18:37
Speaker 2: these roundabout ways. Sometimes it's even just like they give
18:39
Speaker 2: you a hug and you're like, okay, I know what
18:42
Speaker 2: you're doing.
18:43
Speaker 1: I know what this means.
18:43
Speaker 2: This hug is lasting a little longer.
18:45
Speaker 1: Or the back massage.
18:46
Speaker 2: Oh, babe, I'll give you a back massage. And you're like...
18:49
Speaker 2: This is going to be ten seconds of a back
18:51
Speaker 2: massage and then your hands are going to start moving
18:53
Speaker 2: somewhere else.
18:55
Speaker 1: Oh, man.
18:55
Speaker 2: So I think that if we're more verbal about it,
18:58
Speaker 2: you know, in those moments when you're not using your words, like,
19:00
Speaker 2: everybody knows what's going on. We're not fooling each other.
19:04
Speaker 2: And then you're doing this whole, like, nobody's saying anything,
19:06
Speaker 2: but we're communicating back and forth to each other anyways. So, like,
19:10
Speaker 2: let's just say it. Hey, do you want to be
19:12
Speaker 2: intimate with me? Hey, I would like to feel close
19:15
Speaker 2: to you right now. And one of my favorite techniques
19:17
Speaker 2: that Xander and I have actually been experimenting with a
19:19
Speaker 2: lot recently is we're separating the initiation from the actual sex.
19:26
Speaker 2: So for a lot of women, and this is even
19:30
Speaker 2: true for me, I've experienced this a lot, when Xander
19:32
Speaker 2: initiates with me, it can often feel like a pop
19:35
Speaker 2: quiz in the moment. It's like, Oh, wait, wait, wait, wait. Like,
19:38
Speaker 2: you want to have sex right now? Like, I wasn't
19:40
Speaker 2: even thinking about sex right now. So I feel caught
19:43
Speaker 2: off guard. I feel like I'm already behind, in a sense.
19:46
Speaker 2: So it's very easy for me to give this knee jerk, like, oh, no, like,
19:49
Speaker 2: I'm not. turned on right now. No, I don't want to.
19:52
Speaker 2: But I really want people to get used to the
19:54
Speaker 2: idea that we don't have to be turned on in
19:58
Speaker 2: order to initiate or to say yes to sex. But
20:01
Speaker 2: what we've started doing is like creating more space between
20:04
Speaker 2: that so that I don't get that pop quiz feeling.
20:06
Speaker 2: So oftentimes we'll talk about it in the morning. we'll say, hey,
20:10
Speaker 2: I would like to be intimate with you today. What
20:12
Speaker 2: does our schedule look like? What would be the best
20:14
Speaker 2: time for that to happen? If one person has way
20:17
Speaker 2: more on their plate than the other, like, hey, can
20:19
Speaker 2: I take this off your plate? Maybe we can collaborate
20:22
Speaker 2: on this. Maybe we can push that off till tomorrow.
20:24
Speaker 2: So we're kind of like working together as a team
20:27
Speaker 2: to figure out when's the best time and the best
20:30
Speaker 2: way for us to be intimate. So it makes it
20:32
Speaker 2: feel like it's a collaboration. It's not one person putting
20:36
Speaker 2: themselves out there being really vulnerable. It's both of us saying, hey,
20:39
Speaker 2: this is important to us. We want to make sure
20:41
Speaker 2: there's time for us in this crazy busy day. So
20:45
Speaker 2: that has felt so nice for us lately. I think
20:48
Speaker 2: it's a great tip for a lot of couples to
20:49
Speaker 2: try out. All right. All right.
20:52
Speaker 1: I mean, how much sex should we be having?
20:56
Speaker 2: That's the age-old question, right? So there really truly is
21:00
Speaker 2: no perfect answer. Like every couple is so unique. And
21:04
Speaker 2: I know this is a very unsatisfying answer. Like we
21:07
Speaker 2: all want to hear this magic number. I think a
21:09
Speaker 2: lot of us have a lot of anxiety about our
21:11
Speaker 2: sex life. Like, am I having enough? Are we normal?
21:15
Speaker 2: And so we want something like simple and concrete, like
21:18
Speaker 2: just tell me, just tell me the number and we
21:20
Speaker 2: can do it. But here's what happens. Like, let's say
21:22
Speaker 2: I say three times a week is the perfect amount
21:24
Speaker 2: of time. If you're pushing yourselves to have sex just
21:28
Speaker 2: to hit a quota is probably not going to be
21:31
Speaker 2: very good sex. And there's a huge connection between our
21:35
Speaker 2: enjoyment of sex and our desire for it. If we
21:39
Speaker 2: are not enjoying the sex we're having, we're not going
21:43
Speaker 2: to desire it. It doesn't make any sense to. So
21:46
Speaker 2: trying to just hit that quota really doesn't work. So
21:50
Speaker 2: it really is very unique.
21:52
Speaker 1: What do you mean? Who doesn't enjoy sex? Having sex.
21:56
Speaker 2: Oh, Sean. So many people. What? And mostly women. There
22:02
Speaker 2: are so many women out there who are not enjoying
22:05
Speaker 2: the sex that they're having. And I'll tell you why.
22:08
Speaker 2: It's not any fault of men's, it's not any fault
22:10
Speaker 2: of any of ours, but the way that we are
22:12
Speaker 2: taught to have sex heavily prioritizes male pleasure. So let me,
22:18
Speaker 2: I'll go into the full, like, science geek out on
22:20
Speaker 2: you here. What's happening when we have intercourse, intercourse is
22:25
Speaker 2: not the most pleasurable activity for women. We actually polled
22:28
Speaker 2: our audience before. We have over a million people in
22:31
Speaker 2: our community on Instagram. And we asked women, is intercourse
22:34
Speaker 2: the most pleasurable activity for you? I want you to
22:37
Speaker 2: guess what percentage of women said yes, it is. Intercourse
22:42
Speaker 2: is the most pleasurable activity for me.
22:47
Speaker 1: We said it's not very many.
22:48
Speaker 2: I know, I set you up a little bit.
22:51
Speaker 1: 40%.
22:52
Speaker 2: Nine.
22:53
Speaker 1: Wait, what? Nine percent?
22:56
Speaker 2: Nine percent of women.
22:58
Speaker 1: Enjoy sexual intercourse.
23:00
Speaker 2: Say that intercourse is the most pleasurable activity for them.
23:03
Speaker 1: No kidding?
23:04
Speaker 2: Nine percent.
23:05
Speaker 1: All right, what's the most pleasurable?
23:06
Speaker 2: Here's why. It's because when we're having intercourse, we're getting
23:10
Speaker 2: stimulation in our vaginas. And our vaginas do not have
23:15
Speaker 2: very many nerve endings in them. Like, think about how
23:18
Speaker 2: intense childbirth is. If we had even more nerve endings there,
23:22
Speaker 2: that would not be a good thing. So we're getting
23:24
Speaker 2: stimulation of a part of our body that just is
23:27
Speaker 2: hardwired not to feel a ton of sensation. The most
23:31
Speaker 2: sensitive part of our body as women is the clitoris.
23:34
Speaker 2: So the clitoris is this incredible organ. It's the only
23:38
Speaker 2: organ in the entire human body that exists solely for
23:41
Speaker 2: the purpose of pleasure. The penis has reproductive functions. The
23:46
Speaker 2: clitoris is just purely for pleasure. The clitoris has about 8,000
23:51
Speaker 2: to 10,000 nerve endings in it, and compare that to
23:53
Speaker 2: the penis, that's 2,000 to 3,000. So we have way
23:56
Speaker 2: more nerve endings, way more sensitivity. And this is where
24:00
Speaker 2: I can science geek out on you. Like, when we
24:01
Speaker 2: are fetuses in the womb, We are actually, we all
24:05
Speaker 2: start off essentially with no gender. And then around 11
24:10
Speaker 2: weeks or so, that's when we start to differentiate into
24:12
Speaker 2: male or female. So the analogy I always give is like,
24:15
Speaker 2: imagine a ball of clay. So I could take a
24:17
Speaker 2: ball of clay and I could form it into a mug,
24:20
Speaker 2: or I could take that same ball of clay and
24:21
Speaker 2: I could form it into a plate. So it's the
24:23
Speaker 2: same ball of clay that I'm starting with, I'm just
24:25
Speaker 2: making different shapes out of it, right? So the same
24:28
Speaker 2: tissues that make the penis make the clitoris. Same tissues,
24:33
Speaker 2: they're just turned into different shapes, right? So the problem
24:37
Speaker 2: is when we're having intercourse, we're not getting clitoral stimulation.
24:42
Speaker 2: So we're not getting the most sensitive part of our
24:46
Speaker 2: body stimulated. So the comparison that I always like to
24:49
Speaker 2: make is that intercourse for a woman from a nerve
24:53
Speaker 2: ending standpoint, it's like, playing with a man's balls. Like,
24:57
Speaker 2: that might be fun. That might feel good. But is
25:01
Speaker 2: it going to be enough stimulation for you to have
25:03
Speaker 2: an orgasm? Definitely not, right? But that's what we're doing
25:07
Speaker 2: to women is we're stimulating this part of our body
25:10
Speaker 2: that's not really designed to feel a lot of pleasure.
25:13
Speaker 2: And then so many of us women are feeling like
25:15
Speaker 2: something's wrong with us or broken with us for not
25:18
Speaker 2: enjoying intercourse.
25:24
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Speaker 1: tax professional. Well, hold on. What about the G-spot?
28:46
Speaker 2: The G spot's a really interesting thing. So there actually
28:49
Speaker 2: isn't consensus in the sex therapy field about whether or
28:53
Speaker 2: not the G spot actually exists. So what we do
28:56
Speaker 2: know is it's not really a spot in the sense
28:58
Speaker 2: of like a button that you just press.
29:00
Speaker 1: It's a zone.
29:01
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a zone. There's a network of tissues that
29:04
Speaker 2: are there And what they are around is the legs
29:09
Speaker 2: of the clitoris. So most of us think of the
29:10
Speaker 2: clitoris as just like the little button, but it actually
29:12
Speaker 2: extends up into the body. It's like a wishbone shape,
29:15
Speaker 2: exactly like a wishbone shape. So those, the legs of
29:19
Speaker 2: it are called the crura. And around the edge of
29:22
Speaker 2: the bottom of the legs, that's where the G-spot area is.
29:26
Speaker 2: So when you're stimulating the G-spot from inside the vagina,
29:30
Speaker 2: You're stimulating the clitoris. It's still the clitoris. You're just
29:33
Speaker 2: going through the walls of tissue and muscle in the vagina.
29:36
Speaker 1: Gotcha.
29:37
Speaker 2: So it's still the clitoris.
29:38
Speaker 1: Gotcha. Yeah. All right, so how do women like to
29:42
Speaker 1: be pleasured if it's not through intercourse?
29:44
Speaker 2: With hands and mouths tend to be way more successful
29:48
Speaker 2: at helping her reach orgasm. So you're gonna be a
29:51
Speaker 2: lot more successful that way. But that doesn't mean that
29:53
Speaker 2: intercourse can't be enjoyable, can't be intimate. And you can
29:56
Speaker 2: also add clitoral stimulation. You use your hand, she uses
30:00
Speaker 2: her own hand. You could use a toy, but you
30:03
Speaker 2: have to make sure there's some sort of clitoral stimulation happening.
30:06
Speaker 2: So I tell men like, imagine, you know, you have
30:09
Speaker 2: to think of the clitoris as the penis. And imagine
30:11
Speaker 2: like if you're having sex, but you're getting no stimulation
30:15
Speaker 2: of your penis, you're not going to enjoy it, right?
30:18
Speaker 2: So we need to treat the clitoris in the exact
30:19
Speaker 2: same way because it's the same tissues. It's the same organ,
30:22
Speaker 2: the same purpose there. We need to make sure the
30:25
Speaker 2: clitoris is always invited.
30:26
Speaker 1: To the party. Interesting. Okay. Okay. All right. Where do
30:32
Speaker 1: we go from.
30:35
Speaker 2: Here? Where do we start? We're talking about.
30:39
Speaker 1: I wanted to bring up, yeah, we were talking about initiation.
30:42
Speaker 1: And okay, so we talked about, yeah, initiation, how to initiate.
30:48
Speaker 1: And then we got into only 9% of women enjoy
30:53
Speaker 1: sexual intercourse. But let's talk about the, how do we
30:59
Speaker 1: start the conversations? You know, in your book, Acknowledgement, Connection, Desire, Pleasure, Exploration.
31:07
Speaker 2: Okay.
31:07
Speaker 1: Okay.
31:08
Speaker 2: So everybody knows, you've heard the advice, like, we should
31:12
Speaker 2: be talking about sex. You know, when you're up late
31:15
Speaker 2: at night and you're incognito, moving on your phone, Googling, like,
31:18
Speaker 2: why aren't we having sex anymore? It's always at the
31:20
Speaker 2: end of every article, like, talk to your partner about it, right?
31:23
Speaker 2: But the problem is nobody ever tells you how to
31:27
Speaker 2: have those conversations. And, you know, even when Xander and
31:30
Speaker 2: I were going through a tough period in our own relationship,
31:32
Speaker 2: even though I was in this field, I couldn't find
31:35
Speaker 2: any resources about How do we talk about our sex life?
31:39
Speaker 2: How do we talk about what's happening between the two
31:42
Speaker 2: of us? So actually, the very first conversation that Xander
31:45
Speaker 2: and I ever had about our sex life was in
31:48
Speaker 2: bed late at night. I had been hoping that he
31:51
Speaker 2: was going to initiate, and he just rolled over to
31:54
Speaker 2: go to bed, and I said, why don't you want
31:56
Speaker 2: to have sex with me anymore? Just blurted it out.
31:59
Speaker 2: I was pissed off. As you can imagine, that conversation
32:03
Speaker 2: did not go very well, right? Like, he got really defensive.
32:06
Speaker 2: He was hurt. He'd been about to go to sleep,
32:09
Speaker 2: and now all of a sudden he's being attacked by
32:10
Speaker 2: his wife. So it did not go very well. So
32:13
Speaker 2: we decided, you know, years later, once we had finally
32:17
Speaker 2: gotten through that tough stage of our relationship, started building
32:20
Speaker 2: this business, we kind of went back to that initial
32:23
Speaker 2: idea of conversation. And we thought, you know, I want
32:26
Speaker 2: to help couples talk about their sex life in a
32:29
Speaker 2: more productive way. an open and positive way. So they're
32:32
Speaker 2: not making the same mistake that we did of waiting
32:35
Speaker 2: till there's a problem and then you only talk about
32:37
Speaker 2: the problems. So we laid out, we picked, okay, these
32:41
Speaker 2: are the five conversations that I think every couple, whether
32:44
Speaker 2: you're in a great place or you're really struggling, every
32:47
Speaker 2: couple could benefit from having these five specific conversations. And
32:50
Speaker 2: we laid them out in a specific order too. We
32:53
Speaker 2: really wanted to give couples specific instructions of exactly what
32:57
Speaker 2: to do. exactly what to say, how to say it,
32:59
Speaker 2: when to say it. So what we start with, the
33:02
Speaker 2: very first conversation is called acknowledgement. And it's literally just
33:07
Speaker 2: getting comfortable with sex as a topic of conversation. So
33:12
Speaker 2: most of us, you know, we all grow up being
33:14
Speaker 2: taught to be embarrassed and ashamed of sex. Like, I
33:17
Speaker 2: don't know about you, but I certainly got that message that, like,
33:20
Speaker 2: sex was taboo. We don't talk about it openly. It's inappropriate.
33:23
Speaker 2: And so none of us have developed that skill of,
33:26
Speaker 2: How do I even say the words out loud sometimes, right?
33:30
Speaker 2: So this conversation helps you create that foundation of just
33:33
Speaker 2: getting comfortable saying the words so you can talk about, hey,
33:37
Speaker 2: what do we want to do for sex tonight? The
33:38
Speaker 2: same way that you might talk about what we want
33:40
Speaker 2: to have for dinner tonight, right? So one of the
33:42
Speaker 2: starting points that we give is to start talking about
33:45
Speaker 2: sex in just a positive way. So this is not
33:49
Speaker 2: the time to make any complaints. There's no criticism. There's
33:52
Speaker 2: no trying to solve any problems. None of that. It's
33:54
Speaker 2: literally just getting comfortable saying the words out loud. So
33:58
Speaker 2: one of my favorite conversation openers is to ask, like,
34:02
Speaker 2: what are some of your favorite sexual memories with me?
34:06
Speaker 1: Just that.
34:06
Speaker 2: So ask your partner to share a memory. If you're
34:09
Speaker 2: worried about them feeling nervous, you can go first and
34:12
Speaker 2: share one of yours. So I like saying something like,
34:15
Speaker 2: You know, it just randomly popped into my head the
34:16
Speaker 2: other day, that trip that we took to Mexico on
34:20
Speaker 2: our anniversary, you know, that time we barely left the
34:22
Speaker 2: hotel room. It was just a fun little memory that
34:25
Speaker 2: I thought of. Or you can even say you had
34:26
Speaker 2: a dream about it. Oh, you know what I had
34:28
Speaker 2: a dream about last night? That, you know, da-da-da. So
34:30
Speaker 2: you're just sharing it in a positive way. And just
34:32
Speaker 2: leave it there. Don't go into, oh, what happened to us?
34:35
Speaker 2: We haven't done that in a long time. Just leave
34:37
Speaker 2: it there. Have a positive conversation.
34:39
Speaker 1: All positive.
34:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, keep it positive. So eventually you start building that
34:42
Speaker 2: foundation and the two of you start realizing, hey, it
34:45
Speaker 2: can actually be fun to talk about sex. It can
34:47
Speaker 2: feel connecting to talk about sex. It doesn't feel as
34:50
Speaker 2: scary and taboo anymore.
34:52
Speaker 1: So how do you, how often should that conversation be happening?
34:56
Speaker 1: How long should couples be talking about sex?
34:58
Speaker 2: I think you should be talking about sex at least
35:00
Speaker 2: a couple times a week.
35:02
Speaker 1: A couple times a week?
35:02
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think it's fun to talk about it,
35:05
Speaker 2: not always talking about your sex life. So Xander and I,
35:08
Speaker 2: like with our Instagram account, we design so much of
35:11
Speaker 2: our content to just open up conversations between couples about,
35:15
Speaker 2: not about your sex life. Like, we'll answer, you know,
35:18
Speaker 2: we'll answer a question from someone in our community, and
35:20
Speaker 2: you could show that to your partner, like, oh, this
35:22
Speaker 2: is a really interesting question. It has nothing to do
35:24
Speaker 2: with us or our sex life, but like, what did
35:26
Speaker 2: you think about the advice they gave? Did you agree?
35:28
Speaker 2: Did you disagree? Well, one of my favorite series that
35:31
Speaker 2: we do is we act out horrible sex positions that
35:34
Speaker 2: we find online. You know, so we're like making total
35:37
Speaker 2: fools of ourselves, like, twist it over upside down. You know,
35:40
Speaker 2: there's no way this position could work. And it's like,
35:42
Speaker 2: just send that to your partner and laugh about that. Like,
35:44
Speaker 2: look at these guys acting like total idiots on the internet.
35:48
Speaker 2: I thought this woman was supposed to be a professional.
35:51
Speaker 2: So like, just laugh about it. This is silly. This
35:53
Speaker 2: is funny. You know, where it's, it's not that every
35:55
Speaker 2: conversation has to be that you're trying to achieve something.
35:58
Speaker 2: It just becomes this more comfortable topic between the two
36:01
Speaker 2: of you.
36:01
Speaker 1: When do you, I mean, when do you advise people
36:04
Speaker 1: to bring these conversations up? Is there any, is there
36:06
Speaker 1: like a, uh, a window that we're looking for here
36:10
Speaker 1: or just spontaneously just bring it up?
36:14
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, read the room. You know, if your
36:16
Speaker 2: partner's like in the middle of doing a ton of
36:19
Speaker 2: things or obviously really stressed out and are in a
36:21
Speaker 2: bad mood, probably that's not going to be the best
36:23
Speaker 2: time to like, hey, babe, what's your favorite sexual memory
36:26
Speaker 2: with me? So maybe like more a quiet time, like
36:30
Speaker 2: maybe before bed between the two of you or, you know,
36:32
Speaker 2: if you're out on a walk together or something like that.
36:34
Speaker 1: Okay, okay. So, acknowledgement to.
36:39
Speaker 2: Connection. Connection is a second conversation. So, we like to
36:44
Speaker 2: think of physical and emotional intimacy as two sides of
36:48
Speaker 2: the same coin. You know, a lot of people were
36:51
Speaker 2: surprised to see that, you know, oh, one of the
36:53
Speaker 2: five conversations is about emotional intimacy? I thought this book
36:56
Speaker 2: was about sex. But we really think that physical and
36:59
Speaker 2: emotional intimacy are just deeply entwined. And this can be
37:04
Speaker 2: an issue for a lot of couples. We've found people
37:09
Speaker 2: tend to be balling to one of two camps. You
37:11
Speaker 2: either want to feel emotionally connected before you have sex,
37:17
Speaker 2: or sex for you is a way that opens up
37:20
Speaker 2: emotional connection. That's how you feel the most connected to
37:23
Speaker 2: your partner. Do you have a sense of what type
37:25
Speaker 2: you might be? Do you like to feel connected beforehand,
37:28
Speaker 2: or is sex a way that you feel the most connected?
37:31
Speaker 1: Probably the way I feel most connected.
37:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's pretty typical for men. But Xander and I
37:36
Speaker 2: are actually the reverse of the typical gender dynamic. I
37:40
Speaker 2: like sex as a way of opening up connection too.
37:43
Speaker 2: So this is another way that men and women really
37:45
Speaker 2: misunderstand each other. Because like I said, most people tend
37:48
Speaker 2: to fall into the woman's the one who wants to
37:50
Speaker 2: feel emotionally connected before sex, but the man is the
37:53
Speaker 2: one who feels more connected through sex. And so it
37:56
Speaker 2: can lead to this standoff where the classic fight is,
37:59
Speaker 2: You know, the woman will say, like, well, why would
38:01
Speaker 2: I want to have sex with you right now? I
38:02
Speaker 2: don't feel connected to you at all. And the man
38:05
Speaker 2: will say, yeah, we're connected. That's why we should have sex.
38:09
Speaker 2: And it feels like this horrible standoff of, you know,
38:12
Speaker 2: who gets to go first. And what we forget in
38:15
Speaker 2: that conversation is we both want both things. This is
38:19
Speaker 2: just such a classic way that men and women misunderstand
38:22
Speaker 2: each other. We both want to feel emotionally connected and
38:25
Speaker 2: close to each other, and we both want to feel
38:27
Speaker 2: physically connected, physically close to each other. But we wind
38:31
Speaker 2: up in this stalemate of feeling like, you know, you
38:33
Speaker 2: don't understand me, you want something totally different. So it's
38:36
Speaker 2: really important to recognize that that's what we're both wanting.
38:39
Speaker 2: And so that's why, like I said earlier, I think
38:41
Speaker 2: it's so important for women to recognize, like, when your
38:43
Speaker 2: man is initiating with you, what he's really saying is,
38:47
Speaker 2: I want to feel close to you right now. Mm-hmm.
38:50
Speaker 2: And I think this is also, this is a way
38:51
Speaker 2: that men sabotage their ability to have more sex with
38:55
Speaker 2: their partner, is that they don't share with her that
38:59
Speaker 2: emotional component of sex. So, so many women, they think,
39:05
Speaker 2: he's just horny, he just wants to get off, I
39:07
Speaker 2: could be any warm body, you know, it doesn't matter.
39:10
Speaker 2: And a lot of men, they just perpetuate that stereotype
39:15
Speaker 2: because they never share that actual, like, intimacy part of it.
39:20
Speaker 2: So one of the best ways to do this is
39:22
Speaker 2: right after sex. A lot of men will say, like,
39:24
Speaker 2: that's when I feel the closest to my partner. I'm
39:27
Speaker 2: the most open. I'm vulnerable. Like, that's when I feel
39:31
Speaker 2: the closest. But what do most of us do right
39:34
Speaker 2: after we have sex? We jump up and we go
39:37
Speaker 2: about our day. We get on our phones, we go
39:39
Speaker 2: to the bathroom. We're missing that opportunity. I call that aftercare.
39:43
Speaker 2: That moment after sex to really, like, linger. in that
39:48
Speaker 2: intimacy that you've just built and created. So if a
39:51
Speaker 2: man were to tell his partner, just like, I feel
39:53
Speaker 2: so close to you right now. I love you. That
39:56
Speaker 2: was amazing. Thank you. Like, it doesn't have to be complicated.
40:00
Speaker 2: Something simple like that, that would go a really long
40:03
Speaker 2: way in helping women recognize like, oh, this isn't just
40:08
Speaker 2: a physical release that he's looking for. He actually wants
40:10
Speaker 2: to connect with me.
40:13
Speaker 1: Okay. Okay. Anything that men should do before?
40:18
Speaker 2: Before, yes. So, okay, I always used to use the phrase,
40:22
Speaker 2: you know, women want more emotional intimacy. And Xander and
40:25
Speaker 2: I had so many great conversations about this. He said,
40:27
Speaker 2: he told me, you know, a lot of men, we
40:29
Speaker 2: hear the phrase emotional intimacy, and it just, we don't
40:33
Speaker 2: know what that means. Like, it just kind of feels
40:36
Speaker 2: big and scary and like, I don't know. You know,
40:39
Speaker 2: and as men, you're socialized not to be emotional, right? Like,
40:44
Speaker 2: you're not supposed to show your feelings. That's not what
40:46
Speaker 2: a real man does. Um, you know, so it's harder
40:49
Speaker 2: for you guys to understand, like, what that means.
40:52
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people think it means, you know,
40:55
Speaker 1: that it's... I mean, what am I trying to say here?
40:59
Speaker 2: Yeah, what does it... When I say the phrase, if
41:01
Speaker 2: your wife were to say, I want us to feel
41:03
Speaker 2: more emotionally intimate, what.
41:05
Speaker 1: Would you think? I would take that... I'm probably way
41:08
Speaker 1: off here. I would take that as... I need to
41:11
Speaker 1: be romanced into it, and it's going to become this big, long,
41:15
Speaker 1: drawn-out period of time where, I don't know, maybe it's
41:21
Speaker 1: flowers cooking for you, and it becomes like this long
41:25
Speaker 1: process to get to sex.
41:29
Speaker 2: That sounds like a lot of work.
41:30
Speaker 1: Sounds like a lot of work.
41:32
Speaker 2: Yeah.
41:32
Speaker 1: Sounds like a lot of work, a lot of time,
41:34
Speaker 1: a lot of planning.
41:35
Speaker 2: Okay, so yeah, and of course, it feels overwhelming.
41:38
Speaker 1: Versus just saying it.
41:38
Speaker 2: Like, I got to do this every time? It's like,
41:40
Speaker 2: you know, there's only so much time we have in
41:42
Speaker 2: the day and I have to do this whole thing
41:43
Speaker 2: every time. Yeah, so it sounds overwhelming, right? So that's
41:46
Speaker 2: what Xander really helped me understand about men. It feels
41:48
Speaker 2: overwhelming for us and we don't know what to do.
41:51
Speaker 2: And I think there's a lot of, like he shared
41:53
Speaker 2: with me, sometimes I feel kind of embarrassed about that. Like,
41:56
Speaker 2: I don't know, I'm not that classic, like, buy you
41:59
Speaker 2: flowers and write you poems kind of guy. So I
42:01
Speaker 2: kind of feel like I don't even know how to
42:03
Speaker 2: do this and that feels a little bit embarrassing. So
42:06
Speaker 2: what I realized in talking to women is, sure, flowers
42:10
Speaker 2: are nice, planning a date night, those things are nice.
42:13
Speaker 2: But really what women are looking for is we just
42:16
Speaker 2: want to know that you're interested in us.
42:19
Speaker 1: That's what I was going to ask, like, what a
42:21
Speaker 1: simple compliment.
42:23
Speaker 2: Exactly. We just want to know that you're interested in
42:26
Speaker 2: us and getting to know us and who we are
42:29
Speaker 2: and what our experience is like. You know, so many
42:32
Speaker 2: women say, like, it feels like all day my husband
42:34
Speaker 2: just ignores me, and then as soon as he wants sex,
42:37
Speaker 2: you know, then he's all over me. But I'm like, hey,
42:40
Speaker 2: what about the rest of the day? We've, you know,
42:43
Speaker 2: you haven't shown any sort of interest in me whatsoever.
42:45
Speaker 2: So just show some interest in her. Like, ask her
42:48
Speaker 2: about her day and actually pay attention to her answer.
42:51
Speaker 2: Or ask her a more interesting question than, how was
42:54
Speaker 2: your day? You know, hey, what's something you've been thinking
42:56
Speaker 2: about lately? Just be nice to her. Give her a compliment.
43:00
Speaker 2: And again, it doesn't have to be complicated. Like, you
43:02
Speaker 2: look really beautiful today. Your eyes are just sparkling today. Like, man,
43:06
Speaker 2: you look so good. Touch her. This is one of
43:11
Speaker 2: the most interesting things that we've heard about from women. Like,
43:13
Speaker 2: women want more touch throughout the day. We don't want
43:18
Speaker 2: you to just touch us when you want sex. Because
43:21
Speaker 2: that makes it feel like you're just trying to get
43:23
Speaker 2: something out of us. You know, we want to feel
43:25
Speaker 2: that interest from you all throughout the day. So give
43:28
Speaker 2: her a hug and then back away. Don't let it
43:31
Speaker 2: linger and your hands start to creep down to her butt, right? Like,
43:36
Speaker 2: give her a kiss.
43:37
Speaker 1: We can't help it sometimes.
43:39
Speaker 2: And then walk away. I promise you, there's nothing that
43:42
Speaker 2: turns a woman on more than a little tease. Like,
43:45
Speaker 2: we like that. Like, you get something started and then
43:47
Speaker 2: you walk away. There's no pressure. There's no expectations. let
43:50
Speaker 2: us come to you a little bit more.
43:52
Speaker 1: Okay.
43:53
Speaker 2: But yeah, like, let's not think of emotional intimacy as
43:57
Speaker 2: this huge, overwhelming, scary topic. Like, let's boil it down
43:59
Speaker 2: into smaller things. Just say nice things to her. Give
44:02
Speaker 2: her a compliment every once in a while. Give her
44:03
Speaker 2: a hug out of the blue. Like, that's what's really
44:06
Speaker 2: gonna make her feel more connected to you.
44:08
Speaker 1: I mean, before we move on to the next one,
44:10
Speaker 1: I just, I wanna ask, I mean, do you have a.
44:15
Speaker 1: Do you have an idea of how many men they
44:20
Speaker 1: want to see their partner climax during sex.
44:24
Speaker 2: Oh, every man.
44:25
Speaker 1: I would think every.
44:26
Speaker 2: Man wants that.
44:27
Speaker 1: Every man. Yeah. Right?
44:28
Speaker 2: And this is another thing that a lot of women misunderstand.
44:30
Speaker 2: I don't think we give men enough credit for how
44:32
Speaker 2: much they genuinely want to please us. Of course, like,
44:36
Speaker 2: they're assholes, you know, out there. Of course, men and women. But,
44:41
Speaker 2: you know, the vast majority of men, especially if you're
44:43
Speaker 2: in a relationship with somebody, like, you care about her pleasure.
44:45
Speaker 2: You want her to have a good time. The problem
44:48
Speaker 2: is that us women, we've been fed so much crap
44:52
Speaker 2: about our pleasure for our entire lives. We've been taught
44:56
Speaker 2: to believe that, you know, our bodies, they're icky and
44:58
Speaker 2: weird and gross and... Our pleasure is so complicated, and
45:03
Speaker 2: the clitoris is so mysterious, and where is it? Does
45:06
Speaker 2: it even exist? And we've been taught to be caretakers,
45:11
Speaker 2: so it feels selfish to us to be the center
45:13
Speaker 2: of attention, to let ourselves receive from our partners. We
45:17
Speaker 2: have all the misinformation about how our orgasm really works.
45:20
Speaker 2: I always share very openly, I struggled with my orgasm
45:24
Speaker 2: for years. I never orgasmed with a partner until I
45:27
Speaker 2: met Xander. And it wasn't because my partners didn't care.
45:30
Speaker 2: It was because I was dealing with my own crap around,
45:33
Speaker 2: you know, allowing myself to receive pleasure and understanding how
45:36
Speaker 2: my body worked. Even being a freaking sex therapist, I
45:39
Speaker 2: still struggled with that. Wow. So, you know, men genuinely
45:43
Speaker 2: want their partner to feel good. I think it feels
45:47
Speaker 2: good to a man to provide pleasure to a woman, right?
45:51
Speaker 2: And I think a lot of women don't get that.
45:54
Speaker 2: And a lot of women, we sabotage our own ability
45:57
Speaker 2: to feel that pleasure because we won't allow him to
45:59
Speaker 2: focus on us. We fake orgasms so he gets the
46:02
Speaker 2: idea that what he's doing is working even though it's not.
46:05
Speaker 2: We tell him, oh, you know, we let him touch
46:08
Speaker 2: us for a few seconds, like, okay, let's move on,
46:10
Speaker 2: it's fine, you don't have to, go ahead. You know,
46:13
Speaker 2: so it's like men are trying to give us a
46:14
Speaker 2: gift and we are pushing it away.
46:17
Speaker 1: Why are women faking orgasms?
46:20
Speaker 2: Because it feels easier. I mean, I faked a lot
46:22
Speaker 2: of orgasms in my life, and there were a lot
46:25
Speaker 2: of reasons for it. So sometimes it was, I... Primarily
46:29
Speaker 2: it was, I didn't know what I needed, and so
46:32
Speaker 2: it felt embarrassing. I felt like, I don't know what
46:34
Speaker 2: to tell a partner. I don't know how to instruct him,
46:36
Speaker 2: so I might as well just fake it instead of
46:39
Speaker 2: making him fumble around and neither of us really knows
46:41
Speaker 2: what we're doing. So, I mean, that was the primary reason,
46:44
Speaker 2: but sometimes it was just, I just want sex to
46:46
Speaker 2: be over. I'm ready for it to be done. a
46:49
Speaker 2: lot of times it was, I want him to feel
46:51
Speaker 2: like he's done a good job. I want him to
46:53
Speaker 2: get to have that experience of like, oh, I made
46:55
Speaker 2: her feel so good, I made her orgasm. You know,
46:58
Speaker 2: I was thinking so much more about my partner's experience
47:02
Speaker 2: and their pleasure than my own experience. Um, and yeah,
47:05
Speaker 2: that's what so many of us women are, we're socialized
47:07
Speaker 2: to do. It's more important for him to have a
47:09
Speaker 2: good experience, more important to pay attention to him and
47:12
Speaker 2: make sure he feels good and his ego is protected
47:15
Speaker 2: and we can sacrifice ourselves. And so I really want
47:18
Speaker 2: women to stop doing that for ourselves and to recognize
47:21
Speaker 2: that men don't want us to be doing that either.
47:23
Speaker 1: Is this the overwhelming majority of women that do this?
47:26
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. Is it? Yeah. Yeah. There's not any proper
47:32
Speaker 2: scientific research that I've seen on the numbers, but we've
47:35
Speaker 2: polled our community before and something like 95% of women
47:39
Speaker 2: said that they've faked at least once in their life.
47:42
Speaker 2: And we asked if you're currently faking orgasm with your partner.
47:46
Speaker 2: I believe it was around 37% of women said.
47:48
Speaker 1: 37%. Wow. Wow.
47:54
Speaker 2: And some women, someone will say, I don't fake it,
47:57
Speaker 2: but it just doesn't happen. And neither of us, we
48:00
Speaker 2: don't talk about it openly, so it just, you know,
48:03
Speaker 2: it just happens like that. So that's another big percentage
48:06
Speaker 2: of women too, that they're not necessarily faking it, but
48:09
Speaker 2: they're still not having them.
48:11
Speaker 1: Well, that's not good.
48:12
Speaker 2: It's not good. And this is, I mentioned earlier, the
48:16
Speaker 2: connection between enjoyment and desire. It sounds so obvious, but
48:20
Speaker 2: most of us don't make that connection. The dynamic that
48:23
Speaker 2: I hear about the most frequently is the woman's the
48:26
Speaker 2: one that has lower desire. It's always the woman, and
48:29
Speaker 2: she's always blaming herself. What's wrong with me? I must
48:33
Speaker 2: be broken. Something must be wrong with me. It's all
48:36
Speaker 2: my fault. My husband always wants sex, and I never
48:38
Speaker 2: want it. And what they don't recognize is that connection
48:42
Speaker 2: between enjoyment and desire. If you are not enjoying the
48:47
Speaker 2: sex that you're having, it makes zero sense for you
48:50
Speaker 2: to crave it. I call this the mushy broccoli problem.
48:54
Speaker 2: So do you ever find yourself just absolutely craving a
48:59
Speaker 2: bowl of steamed, mushy, unseasoned broccoli?
49:03
Speaker 1: No.
49:04
Speaker 2: No? Do you think anything is wrong with you for
49:08
Speaker 2: not wanting that? Of course not. But the same thing
49:11
Speaker 2: is true with sex. There are so many women who, again,
49:14
Speaker 2: it's not a fault. It's not their fault. It's not
49:16
Speaker 2: their partner's fault. It's just this misinformation and misunderstanding. But
49:20
Speaker 2: there's so many women who are having mushy broccoli sex
49:25
Speaker 2: and then beating themselves up for not wanting more of it.
49:30
Speaker 2: So the problem is not, you know, when a woman
49:32
Speaker 2: comes to us and says, I have a low libido,
49:34
Speaker 2: fix me. What do I, do I take the supplements?
49:35
Speaker 2: Do I take the pills? What do I do? the
49:37
Speaker 2: first question we ask her is, tell us about the
49:40
Speaker 2: sex that you do have.
49:42
Speaker 1: You know, I think that a bad sex life in
49:47
Speaker 1: monogamous relationships leads to... I think that's the stem of...
49:56
Speaker 1: a lot of problems that we see with couples today.
50:00
Speaker 2: I agree with you.
50:01
Speaker 1: I think it all... I mean, I don't know. I
50:04
Speaker 1: think that... Bad sex life stems from self-confidence. I believe that,
50:09
Speaker 1: and I believe that could be way off, but that's
50:12
Speaker 1: why you're here. And then I think that, you know,
50:15
Speaker 1: that the marital problems, a lot of marital problems stem
50:19
Speaker 1: from an unhealthy sex life.
50:21
Speaker 2: Yeah, I completely agree with you. And this is, I'm
50:24
Speaker 2: glad that you're saying this because this is the battle
50:26
Speaker 2: that Xander and I are constantly fighting in our business
50:29
Speaker 2: is trying to help people realize sex is not just sex.
50:34
Speaker 2: Sex is not just putting body parts in other body parts.
50:38
Speaker 2: Sex is the way we express love for each other.
50:42
Speaker 2: Sex is the way that we create intimacy with each other,
50:44
Speaker 2: that we feel close to each other. It's a way
50:46
Speaker 2: that we play together. It's a way we explore ourselves
50:51
Speaker 2: and each other. It's a way we're vulnerable and open
50:54
Speaker 2: and raw with each other. It's this thing that we
50:57
Speaker 2: do that we don't do with anybody else in our lives.
51:00
Speaker 2: It's a special thing that just the two of us do.
51:03
Speaker 2: It's not just this act that we do, it's a
51:05
Speaker 2: journey that we take together. And if that connection isn't
51:11
Speaker 2: in place in a relationship, there's so many other aspects
51:15
Speaker 2: that are going to be damaged. I don't think that
51:19
Speaker 2: you can have a healthy relationship without a healthy, active
51:24
Speaker 2: sex life. Aside from a very small percentage of people
51:26
Speaker 2: who are asexual, I don't think you can have a
51:29
Speaker 2: healthy sex life without it.
51:30
Speaker 1: Can you pick out in couples who has a healthy
51:33
Speaker 1: sex life and who doesn't? Can you see it immediately?
51:37
Speaker 2: You can. I mean, I have never been tested on this.
51:41
Speaker 2: Maybe if somebody wants to fund some testing, see how
51:43
Speaker 2: good my radar is on this. I can usually sense it. Yeah,
51:48
Speaker 2: you can see, like, it's in the way a couple
51:51
Speaker 2: looks at each other. Do they make eye contact with
51:54
Speaker 2: each other? Do they touch each other? Is there that
51:57
Speaker 2: kind of like mischievous little grin they have when they
51:59
Speaker 2: look at each other? Are they standing close to each other?
52:03
Speaker 2: There's a lot of body language between a couple that's
52:06
Speaker 2: connected versus a couple that's disconnected.
52:09
Speaker 1: How many couples do you think there are that have
52:11
Speaker 1: bad sex life?
52:14
Speaker 2: I would venture to say the majority of couples. I'd
52:17
Speaker 2: say it's more common to have a bad sex life
52:19
Speaker 2: than a good one.
52:20
Speaker 1: Bad.
52:21
Speaker 2: And I know. It bums me out. It really bums
52:24
Speaker 2: me out. And that's why I'm so passionate about doing
52:25
Speaker 2: this work is that I want more people to be
52:29
Speaker 2: able to be connected, to be able to experience it.
52:32
Speaker 2: Because most of us have had that experience of great
52:37
Speaker 2: sex where it just— Oh, I'm curious for you, like,
52:41
Speaker 2: when you've had, and you don't have to share any, like,
52:43
Speaker 2: specific detail, but, like, when you've had really great sex,
52:47
Speaker 2: what mindset does that take you to? What do you
52:52
Speaker 2: feel afterwards?
52:54
Speaker 1: I mean, I feel great. I feel confident. I feel
53:03
Speaker 1: closer to my wife. I feel, I mean, it just, it's,
53:06
Speaker 1: I think it's a, I think it relieves a lot
53:09
Speaker 1: of stress. Oh, yeah. Huge stress relief. And yeah, that's
53:15
Speaker 1: what comes to my head.
53:17
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's an amazing experience. There's this high that we get.
53:21
Speaker 2: We actually have really great research showing that when a
53:24
Speaker 2: couple has great sex, there's an emotional high that lingers
53:29
Speaker 2: for about 24 to 48 hours afterwards. There's this afterglow
53:33
Speaker 2: that we experience. And then on the other hand, How
53:36
Speaker 2: about you guess this? If a couple is feeling disconnected
53:41
Speaker 2: sexually or they've had like a bad sexual experience, how
53:44
Speaker 2: long will that last?
53:48
Speaker 1: I have no idea.
53:50
Speaker 2: 72 hours.
53:50
Speaker 1: 72 hours. So there's a.
53:53
Speaker 2: More, a bigger impact from having disconnection than there is
53:58
Speaker 2: from having good connection.
53:59
Speaker 1: Wow.
54:00
Speaker 2: Yeah. Wow. So not only, if we're disconnected from our partner,
54:04
Speaker 2: not only are we missing out on... that confidence, that closeness,
54:07
Speaker 2: that top of the world, I've got all the energy,
54:09
Speaker 2: all my stress is relieved. We're missing out on that feeling,
54:12
Speaker 2: and we're having this longer period of feeling really low.
54:17
Speaker 1: Man. You know, I think the other thing I feel
54:20
Speaker 1: is I just, I'm like, sounds probably weird, but I'm
54:26
Speaker 1: proud of us, that we have a healthy sex life. Mm-hmm.
54:32
Speaker 1: Because I see other couples. I just see it. I'm like, yeah,
54:40
Speaker 1: they're not getting laid over there.
54:44
Speaker 2: So you have the radar, too.
54:45
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have the radar. I see it. It's like, oh, man.
54:50
Speaker 2: And that's a really cool feeling to feel proud of yourselves.
54:54
Speaker 2: How cool of a feeling is that? Like, hey, I'm
54:57
Speaker 2: so proud of us that... Like, we have all the
55:01
Speaker 2: stuff in the world, like, stacked up against a sex life.
55:03
Speaker 2: You know, we're all so busy. We're stressed out. We
55:06
Speaker 2: don't have any time. The kids get in the way.
55:08
Speaker 2: There's no privacy. Like, there's so much stacked up against us.
55:12
Speaker 2: So to be able to really say, like, you know what?
55:15
Speaker 2: You and I, we prioritize each other. We don't make excuses.
55:19
Speaker 2: We don't settle. We are willing to make that time,
55:22
Speaker 2: to make that effort, to prioritize us, to make sure
55:26
Speaker 2: we don't get lost. in, you know, all the craziness
55:29
Speaker 2: of the world.
55:30
Speaker 1: How much, I mean, is it attractive for women? I mean,
55:34
Speaker 1: it's attractive for me to see that, you know, my
55:39
Speaker 1: wife cares about how she looks. She cares about how
55:42
Speaker 1: she dresses around the house. Like, you know, we've been
55:45
Speaker 1: through two pregnancies and things can get lax during pregnancy.
55:51
Speaker 1: You know what I mean? And then it takes a
55:53
Speaker 1: little bit to get back on track, but I mean,
55:58
Speaker 1: When I see my wife putting in the effort to
56:01
Speaker 1: look good, you know what I mean? And I think
56:04
Speaker 1: when she sees, you know, me putting in the same effort,
56:07
Speaker 1: I think that shit is extremely important.
56:12
Speaker 2: Yeah, because it reminds us of the beginning of the relationship. Like,
56:15
Speaker 2: we put so much effort and we want to put
56:17
Speaker 2: our best foot forward for our partner. You know, I
56:20
Speaker 2: want to look good for you. I want to impress you.
56:23
Speaker 2: I want you to think that I'm sexy and attractive
56:26
Speaker 2: and admire me. And that's so much fun to feel
56:30
Speaker 2: that feeling. And that's, you know, that's what happens. A
56:32
Speaker 2: lot of us let our foot off the gas. We coast.
56:35
Speaker 2: We stop taking care of ourselves. You know, I got
56:37
Speaker 2: it locked down. I don't have to work at this anymore.
56:40
Speaker 2: But I think it's very, very attractive for people to
56:43
Speaker 2: see their partner still making that effort. And I think
56:46
Speaker 2: that's what real intimacy is in a long-term relationship. Like,
56:50
Speaker 2: I love with Xander, I love that I can have
56:54
Speaker 2: those days where, hey, I'm not feeling my hottest, I
56:56
Speaker 2: can put on my sweats, I can wear your T-shirt,
56:59
Speaker 2: I can have my hair just in a messy bun,
57:02
Speaker 2: and he still thinks I'm attractive and I feel safe
57:04
Speaker 2: and I feel comfortable around him. And I'm still, you know,
57:07
Speaker 2: the majority of the time, making an effort to take
57:10
Speaker 2: care of myself, to look good for him, to be
57:13
Speaker 2: the kind of person that he's gonna be proud to
57:14
Speaker 2: have on his arm. It's like both, being able to
57:16
Speaker 2: have both, I think is really nice.
57:18
Speaker 1: So how do you open up communication one or the
57:21
Speaker 1: other starts going off the rails and isn't taking care
57:23
Speaker 1: of themselves and they're losing their attractiveness or things like that.
57:30
Speaker 1: It's another forbidden topic. How do you broach that? Because
57:36
Speaker 1: I see that in so many couples where one is like,
57:42
Speaker 1: that one's not putting any effort in. So how do
57:48
Speaker 1: you broach the subject? How do you? How do you
57:51
Speaker 1: do it?
57:53
Speaker 2: You go right in with, you're looking like a real
57:55
Speaker 2: slob lately.
57:56
Speaker 1: Let's clean this up.
57:58
Speaker 2: We obviously have to approach this one sensitively because truly
58:03
Speaker 2: what's happening in a lot of these cases is there's
58:06
Speaker 2: something deeper going on with that person. None of us
58:09
Speaker 2: consciously wakes up and says, you know what? I want
58:12
Speaker 2: to look like a slob today. I want my partner
58:15
Speaker 2: to just be completely unattracted to me. it's usually there's
58:18
Speaker 2: something else going on. We're experiencing some depression. There's some stress.
58:23
Speaker 2: Maybe a family member is ill. Something's not going right
58:26
Speaker 2: at work. You know, there's something deeper that's going on.
58:28
Speaker 2: So we want to address that rather than the pure
58:31
Speaker 2: physical appearances at first. So what I would say, like,
58:34
Speaker 2: if this, if Xander was not taking care of himself,
58:37
Speaker 2: for example, I would say to him, like, hey, babe,
58:40
Speaker 2: I want to talk to you about something sensitive. I've
58:43
Speaker 2: just been noticing lately that you're not treating yourself with
58:46
Speaker 2: the same love and respect that I normally see you
58:49
Speaker 2: treating yourself with. And I just want to check in
58:51
Speaker 2: on you and see how you're doing, because I know
58:54
Speaker 2: you deserve to treat yourself with that kindness. So if
58:57
Speaker 2: I phrase it more about, like, love and respect for yourself,
59:02
Speaker 2: rather than, you've gained weight, you're not brushing your teeth,
59:05
Speaker 2: you're looking like a slob, like, that just feels a
59:09
Speaker 2: lot gentler.
59:10
Speaker 1: Okay.
59:10
Speaker 2: Yeah.
59:11
Speaker 1: Okay. All right, let's move on to the next category here.
59:15
Speaker 2: Okay, so the third conversation that we get into is desire.
59:19
Speaker 2: What do we each need to feel excited about sex,
59:22
Speaker 2: to feel open to it? So it connects, you know,
59:26
Speaker 2: we put these conversations in this specific order, you know, obviously,
59:29
Speaker 2: We talked already about the connection between, you know, emotional
59:32
Speaker 2: intimacy and physical intimacy. Physical intimacy also connects to the,
59:36
Speaker 2: I'll give you a little preview, the fourth one that
59:38
Speaker 2: is coming is desire. But yeah, so this one is
59:41
Speaker 2: all about what do we need to feel excited about
59:46
Speaker 2: being intimate? So this is the conversation where we talk
59:48
Speaker 2: about the initiation styles, like how is it that we
59:51
Speaker 2: like to be initiated? Another really important thing that we
59:55
Speaker 2: talk about in this chapter is the two sex drive types.
59:58
Speaker 2: Have you heard about this before? Spontaneous and responsive? No. Okay,
1:00:02
Speaker 2: this is really important, very game-changing information, especially if you're
1:00:06
Speaker 2: somebody who thinks of yourself as being low desire or
1:00:10
Speaker 2: no desire. So, any women out there beating themselves up, like,
1:00:13
Speaker 2: this is the information for you. So, there are two
1:00:17
Speaker 2: different sex drive types. And they are based on how
1:00:20
Speaker 2: we feel desire. So there are two different places that
1:00:24
Speaker 2: we feel desire. So you feel mental desire. This is
1:00:27
Speaker 2: the first one. That's when the idea of sex just
1:00:31
Speaker 2: kind of pops into your head. Oftentimes it feels random.
1:00:33
Speaker 2: It's just the idea of sex sounds good. Yeah, I
1:00:36
Speaker 2: think I want to have sex right now. So that's
1:00:38
Speaker 2: the first place. The second place is we feel it
1:00:39
Speaker 2: in our body. So our body physically gets ready and
1:00:43
Speaker 2: excited for sex. So that's things like getting wet, getting hard,
1:00:48
Speaker 2: heart rate starting to increase, breath rate starting to increase.
1:00:52
Speaker 2: So the two sex drive types depend on where you
1:00:56
Speaker 2: feel desire first. So first off we have spontaneous. That's
1:01:00
Speaker 2: when you feel mental desire first and then the physical
1:01:02
Speaker 2: arousal follows. So any sex scene that you've seen on
1:01:06
Speaker 2: TV and movies, that's always spontaneous desire. There's that kind
1:01:09
Speaker 2: of like out of nowhere, like, hmm, sex sounds good.
1:01:12
Speaker 2: Where's my partner? Let me go in for the bubon.
1:01:14
Speaker 2: And so research shows that about 85% of men have
1:01:17
Speaker 2: spontaneous desire. And only about 15 to 20% of women do.
1:01:19
Speaker 2: Most of us don't even know that responsive desire exists.
1:01:32
Speaker 2: But research shows that about 85% of women have responsive desire.
1:01:37
Speaker 2: And so most of us women are thinking, you know,
1:01:40
Speaker 2: why do I never seem to want sex spontaneously? The
1:01:42
Speaker 2: idea of sex never seems to pop into my head.
1:01:44
Speaker 2: We feel like something's wrong with us. Nothing is wrong
1:01:47
Speaker 2: with you. It's just that you have the other type
1:01:50
Speaker 2: of desire. So responsive desire is the exact opposite of spontaneous.
1:01:53
Speaker 2: We need to feel it in our bodies first before
1:01:57
Speaker 2: the mental interest kicks in. So a classic thing that
1:02:01
Speaker 2: happens to somebody who has responsive desires, they'll be in
1:02:04
Speaker 2: the middle of sex or even at the end of sex,
1:02:07
Speaker 2: and they'll catch themselves thinking, this is fun. Why do
1:02:11
Speaker 2: I never seem to want this? So again, it's not
1:02:15
Speaker 2: that anything's wrong with you. It's just you have to
1:02:17
Speaker 2: understand how your desire type works. And one of the
1:02:20
Speaker 2: big problems with initiation is a lot of us are
1:02:23
Speaker 2: initiating in spontaneous ways.
1:02:26
Speaker 1: We ask.
1:02:27
Speaker 2: Do you want to have sex? That's a spontaneous initiation.
1:02:30
Speaker 2: So if you ask somebody with responsive desire, do you
1:02:33
Speaker 2: want to have sex right now? 99 times out of 100,
1:02:36
Speaker 2: their answer is going to be no because they haven't
1:02:38
Speaker 2: had any sort of physical stimulation yet. They're not going
1:02:41
Speaker 2: to be a yes until they have some physical stimulation. So,
1:02:46
Speaker 2: and it's usually the case that one partner is spontaneous
1:02:50
Speaker 2: and the other partner is responsive. So this is yet
1:02:52
Speaker 2: another way that we're missing each other and thinking like,
1:02:54
Speaker 2: why do we never want to have sex at the
1:02:56
Speaker 2: same time? So you're gonna likely have different types. So
1:03:00
Speaker 2: we need to think about initiating in slightly different ways.
1:03:04
Speaker 2: So going back to how I was telling you that
1:03:05
Speaker 2: Xander and I have started, like, separating initiation from the
1:03:08
Speaker 2: actual sex, that's something that can help. So maybe what you're,
1:03:12
Speaker 2: you know, you're initiating earlier in the day, so it
1:03:15
Speaker 2: gives your partner some time to, like, get into their body.
1:03:18
Speaker 2: Maybe you agree, like, what we do is we have
1:03:22
Speaker 2: massages for a couple of minutes beforehand, and then we decide,
1:03:26
Speaker 2: do we want to do more or do we not
1:03:27
Speaker 2: want to do more? Or we make out for a while,
1:03:29
Speaker 2: and then we decide. But you have to have some
1:03:33
Speaker 2: sort of physical stimulation first. Otherwise, the person with responsive
1:03:36
Speaker 2: desire is always going to be, no, I don't want
1:03:38
Speaker 2: to have sex right now. Nothing's happening. Why would I
1:03:41
Speaker 2: want it?
1:03:41
Speaker 1: Gotcha. Gotcha. And so then we move into pleasure, correct?
1:03:46
Speaker 2: Pleasure is the fourth conversation. Yeah, what do we need
1:03:49
Speaker 2: to feel good, to have a good time, to avoid
1:03:52
Speaker 2: the mushy broccoli problem? So in that chapter, that's where
1:03:57
Speaker 2: I talk all about the clitoris and that comparison of,
1:04:01
Speaker 2: you know, intercourse for a woman being like playing with
1:04:03
Speaker 2: a man's balls, It's really important. You know, just most
1:04:07
Speaker 2: of us don't know that information. So again, it's nobody's fault.
1:04:10
Speaker 2: Nobody's trying to do a bad job, but just understanding
1:04:13
Speaker 2: like this is how it actually works. That's a really
1:04:16
Speaker 2: important thing. We also talk a lot in that chapter
1:04:19
Speaker 2: about how to give each other feedback. during sex too.
1:04:23
Speaker 2: That's another area that so many of us struggle with.
1:04:26
Speaker 2: Like we don't know how to give feedback. It feels
1:04:28
Speaker 2: really awkward to give feedback. So we talk about our
1:04:32
Speaker 2: unique approach to it is what we call positively pleasurable feedback.
1:04:36
Speaker 2: So any feedback that you want to give to your partner,
1:04:40
Speaker 2: frame it positively. Nobody responds well to negative feedback, right? Actually,
1:04:46
Speaker 2: this is funny. So yesterday I was trying to decide
1:04:50
Speaker 2: what outfit I was gonna wear to this interview. And
1:04:52
Speaker 2: so I posted on my stories, I said, you know,
1:04:54
Speaker 2: here's outfit one, here's outfit two, please vote. Tell me
1:04:57
Speaker 2: which outfit do you think I should wear? And I
1:05:00
Speaker 2: got a ton of DMs from people saying like, outfit
1:05:03
Speaker 2: one is horrible. You look terrible in that. Don't wear
1:05:06
Speaker 2: that one. And I thought, oh, no, this is how
1:05:11
Speaker 2: we're giving feedback in the bedroom, too, is it's just
1:05:13
Speaker 2: easier for our weird human brain sometimes to go to
1:05:16
Speaker 2: the negative and give that negative feedback. But imagine you're
1:05:19
Speaker 2: with your wife and you're trying to be intimate with
1:05:22
Speaker 2: her and she's, don't do that. That's terrible. That feels awful.
1:05:27
Speaker 2: You're going to freak out in that moment, right? You're
1:05:29
Speaker 2: going to feel super embarrassed. You're not going to want
1:05:32
Speaker 2: to do anything new or different. You're just going to
1:05:34
Speaker 2: kind of freeze in that moment. So we can't give
1:05:36
Speaker 2: negative feedback. It just doesn't work. Instead, we need to
1:05:40
Speaker 2: do positive. So I'll give you an example. So one
1:05:42
Speaker 2: of the things that we hear from women most often
1:05:45
Speaker 2: about sex with men is women tell us, we want
1:05:49
Speaker 2: you to slow down. Like women love being teased. This
1:05:54
Speaker 2: is a huge difference between men and women. For women,
1:05:57
Speaker 2: a lot of women will say the tease for me
1:05:59
Speaker 2: is the best part of sex. And a lot of
1:06:02
Speaker 2: men will tell me, Don't tease me. Like, go for
1:06:05
Speaker 2: the goods. Like, I want to get it started. It
1:06:08
Speaker 2: tickles when you tease me. It doesn't feel good when
1:06:09
Speaker 2: you tease. So this is a big misunderstanding. But a
1:06:12
Speaker 2: lot of women, they're like, no, like, go slow. Go
1:06:15
Speaker 2: to the point where you're like, I'm having to beg
1:06:17
Speaker 2: you for more. That's what's sexy for us. So if you're,
1:06:22
Speaker 2: you know, if you're being intimate with your wife and
1:06:23
Speaker 2: your wife is like, slow down, you're going so fast. Again,
1:06:27
Speaker 2: like that's not going to feel good, great, right? But instead,
1:06:31
Speaker 2: if a woman says something like, you know what is
1:06:33
Speaker 2: so sexy for me? When you just go so slow,
1:06:37
Speaker 2: when you get me to the point where I am
1:06:39
Speaker 2: begging you for more. If you're hearing that as a guy, okay,
1:06:43
Speaker 2: first of all, that sounds hot. You're like, please give
1:06:46
Speaker 2: me more feedback. This is great. But it's also making
1:06:49
Speaker 2: you feel like you've already won. Because she's phrasing it
1:06:52
Speaker 2: in this way of, you know what's so hot when
1:06:54
Speaker 2: you do this. And you can do this even if
1:06:57
Speaker 2: your partner hasn't done this. They haven't done it in
1:06:59
Speaker 2: a while. They've never done it.
1:07:00
Speaker 1: It's okay.
1:07:00
Speaker 2: You can still say, it's so hot when you do this.
1:07:03
Speaker 2: Because it makes them feel like they've won. They're doing
1:07:05
Speaker 2: a good job, right? And it makes them feel more
1:07:07
Speaker 2: motivated to do that actual thing. Okay.
1:07:10
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:07:11
Speaker 2: So that's a good one. And another thing with feedback,
1:07:14
Speaker 2: we have a little game that we call the eye
1:07:17
Speaker 2: exam game. So, you know when you're getting your vision
1:07:20
Speaker 2: tested and they show you, okay, put the little contraption on, like, okay,
1:07:23
Speaker 2: which one is more clear? One or two? When you
1:07:27
Speaker 2: just have two options to choose from, it's pretty easy
1:07:29
Speaker 2: to pick one, right? Like, you don't go into that
1:07:31
Speaker 2: exam saying, here's how I want my vision to look like. Like,
1:07:34
Speaker 2: they just, shit, one or two. So you can do
1:07:37
Speaker 2: the same thing with sex. So let's say you're just
1:07:42
Speaker 2: stroking your partner's arm. Try stroking it one way and
1:07:45
Speaker 2: then maybe try another, a deeper pressure, more of a massage.
1:07:48
Speaker 2: Ask your partner, which one do you like better? Do
1:07:50
Speaker 2: I get better when I do this or when I
1:07:51
Speaker 2: do this? So as the person receiving that touch, it's
1:07:56
Speaker 2: easier to choose because that's something that comes up for
1:07:58
Speaker 2: so many of us women. We don't know how to
1:08:00
Speaker 2: give feedback. It's, I don't know what I need to orgasm.
1:08:02
Speaker 2: I don't know what feels good, so I don't know
1:08:04
Speaker 2: what to tell you. A lot of us get, we
1:08:06
Speaker 2: put this pressure on ourselves. We think like, if a
1:08:08
Speaker 2: man asks, hey, what do you want? It's like, I
1:08:11
Speaker 2: feel like I've got to write down this, you know,
1:08:13
Speaker 2: 10-page manifesto of, okay, first do this, and then do this,
1:08:16
Speaker 2: and then if you do this, I'll really like it,
1:08:17
Speaker 2: you know, and it's overwhelming. But instead, if it's just,
1:08:21
Speaker 2: which one is better, this one or this one? And
1:08:23
Speaker 2: you can do that with everything during sex. Try two
1:08:26
Speaker 2: different positions. Try to do two different oral sex techniques.
1:08:29
Speaker 2: It feels fun and sexy, but it's also giving you
1:08:32
Speaker 2: both really valuable information.
1:08:34
Speaker 1: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Good feedback. All right. Exploration.
1:08:40
Speaker 2: Exploration. That is our final conversation that we move into.
1:08:44
Speaker 2: So everybody's heard the advice, like, keep it spicy, try
1:08:47
Speaker 2: new things in the bedroom. And it actually is really
1:08:49
Speaker 2: good advice. It sounds cheesy, but it's good advice. We
1:08:51
Speaker 2: have research showing that when we do new things with
1:08:54
Speaker 2: our partner, inside and outside of the bedroom, our brains
1:08:58
Speaker 2: light up. Our brains love new things. novelty. And it
1:09:01
Speaker 2: gives us that feeling of getting to know our partner
1:09:04
Speaker 2: all over again, of seeing them in a new light.
1:09:08
Speaker 2: So this chapter is all about how do we actually
1:09:11
Speaker 2: try new things? Because what I've found in long-term relationships
1:09:15
Speaker 2: is that we have this tendency to narrow down what
1:09:19
Speaker 2: sex looks like. So I'll throw Xander and I under
1:09:23
Speaker 2: the bus. When we first started having sex, it was
1:09:26
Speaker 2: like this buffet of options, all these different choices, all
1:09:29
Speaker 2: these different things that we were doing. And then you
1:09:32
Speaker 2: get a few years into it, and that buffet has
1:09:35
Speaker 2: narrowed down into a fixed menu with very few options.
1:09:40
Speaker 2: And so sex between us would look like a couple
1:09:44
Speaker 2: seconds of making out, a couple seconds of some groping,
1:09:47
Speaker 2: and then we're just right on to the intercourse, right?
1:09:49
Speaker 2: And it's just not very exciting. You know exactly what's coming,
1:09:55
Speaker 2: you can predict it, you could script it out, and
1:09:58
Speaker 2: it doesn't feel very exciting. But I've found that the
1:10:01
Speaker 2: longer that couples are in relationships, it actually feels more intimidating.
1:10:05
Speaker 2: to try new things, to break out of that mold.
1:10:08
Speaker 2: So there are so many couples who are having just
1:10:12
Speaker 2: very routine sex, doing the same thing over and over again.
1:10:15
Speaker 2: And it may not even be bad sex. When Xander
1:10:19
Speaker 2: and I have sex like that, like, we both still
1:10:20
Speaker 2: have orgasms. It still feels good. We're still connected. But
1:10:24
Speaker 2: it's not great sex either, right? So it's how do
1:10:27
Speaker 2: we expand that repertoire out a little bit more? So
1:10:31
Speaker 2: one of the big mistakes that couples make here is
1:10:32
Speaker 2: they hear, try new things in the bedroom, and they think,
1:10:35
Speaker 2: oh God, well now I have to like have a
1:10:37
Speaker 2: threesome and we've got to do some like kinky Fifty
1:10:39
Speaker 2: Shades of Grey stuff. I need to like get the
1:10:42
Speaker 2: ropes and tie her up and we're hanging for the
1:10:44
Speaker 2: rafters and all that kind of stuff. Like we get
1:10:46
Speaker 2: very overwhelmed and intimidated, right? But that doesn't have to
1:10:50
Speaker 2: be the case. So the best starting point that I
1:10:53
Speaker 2: tell couples is think about what's something that you used
1:10:58
Speaker 2: to do with your partner that you haven't done in
1:11:01
Speaker 2: a long time. It doesn't have to be brand new.
1:11:04
Speaker 2: Just something that you used to do that you haven't
1:11:06
Speaker 2: done in a while. So maybe it could be as
1:11:09
Speaker 2: simple as, you know what? We used to make out
1:11:11
Speaker 2: a lot more, like a lot longer. Or it could
1:11:15
Speaker 2: be we used to do this one position. I don't
1:11:18
Speaker 2: know why we stopped doing that. It was such a
1:11:20
Speaker 2: great position, but we just haven't done it in forever.
1:11:22
Speaker 2: Or we used to have sex on the couch instead
1:11:25
Speaker 2: of in the bed every single time. So just bring
1:11:27
Speaker 2: back something that you used to do. You'll have the
1:11:30
Speaker 2: confidence of knowing we've done this before, we enjoyed it,
1:11:33
Speaker 2: but you'll still get those benefits of trying something new.
1:11:37
Speaker 2: And then from there, if you want to try things
1:11:38
Speaker 2: that you've never tried before, that's totally great, but you
1:11:41
Speaker 2: don't have to do that. It's really just making sure
1:11:44
Speaker 2: to keep cycling in those things that you actually do enjoy.
1:11:47
Speaker 1: So when you're talking to, you know, your couples, patients,
1:11:53
Speaker 1: do you call them patients?
1:11:54
Speaker 2: No, I just call it, yeah, couples.
1:11:56
Speaker 1: Clients. Yeah. I mean, how do you get them to
1:12:01
Speaker 1: be comfortable with suggestions in the bedroom when people are
1:12:05
Speaker 1: trying to spark it up a little bit?
1:12:07
Speaker 2: I have a little trick that I call the dream scheme.
1:12:10
Speaker 2: Tell your partner you had a dream about it. It
1:12:13
Speaker 2: doesn't have to be true. It's a little tiny lie,
1:12:15
Speaker 2: which I don't normally advocate for. But if it gets
1:12:17
Speaker 2: you talking about sex, I'll be for it. So just
1:12:20
Speaker 2: tell your partner, you know what? I had a dream
1:12:22
Speaker 2: last night. that we were doing X, Y, Z, and
1:12:25
Speaker 2: I just can't get it out of my mind now.
1:12:27
Speaker 2: It was very sexy in the dream. That's also a
1:12:29
Speaker 2: great way to introduce something brand new, because it gives
1:12:31
Speaker 2: you a chance to gauge your partner's reaction. You can
1:12:34
Speaker 2: say something like, you know, I've never thought about doing
1:12:37
Speaker 2: that before, you and I have never done that before,
1:12:39
Speaker 2: but the dream was pretty fun, and now I kind
1:12:42
Speaker 2: of can't get it out of my mind. If your
1:12:43
Speaker 2: partner says like, hmm, yeah, that's interesting, but I'm not
1:12:47
Speaker 2: sure I'm open to doing that, you know, that's okay.
1:12:49
Speaker 2: Or they might say, oh, Well, that's kind of interesting.
1:12:53
Speaker 2: Maybe we could play around with that. So that's a
1:12:54
Speaker 2: nice way to introduce it. Or use this podcast as
1:12:57
Speaker 2: an example. I love using podcasts as opportunities to open
1:13:01
Speaker 2: up conversations. Hey, Sean and Vanessa, we're talking about trying
1:13:04
Speaker 2: new things in the bedroom and it got me thinking
1:13:06
Speaker 2: about X, Y, Z. That can be a great way too.
1:13:10
Speaker 1: Do you make suggestions on things they should be trying
1:13:12
Speaker 1: in the bedroom?
1:13:14
Speaker 2: Yeah, and again, it's really keeping it simple. Like, positions
1:13:18
Speaker 2: can be a great way to mix things up. And again,
1:13:21
Speaker 2: it doesn't feel super overwhelming. It doesn't feel, like, wildly
1:13:24
Speaker 2: out of your comfort zone. But positions can make a
1:13:27
Speaker 2: big difference. And even making small tweaks on positions that
1:13:31
Speaker 2: you already do. So try putting a pillow underneath your hips. Try,
1:13:36
Speaker 2: you know, instead of propping yourself up, bringing yourself down.
1:13:39
Speaker 2: Try twisting your body, you know, a slightly different angle. So, like,
1:13:42
Speaker 2: make a little change to an old standby or an
1:13:45
Speaker 2: old favorite position. And sometimes even just the smallest changes
1:13:49
Speaker 2: in the angle can feel like a totally different experience.
1:13:52
Speaker 1: Okay. Yeah. What about, I mean, what about things like lingerie, role-playing,
1:13:58
Speaker 1: all these, you know?
1:13:59
Speaker 2: Yeah, those are great too. This is another really funny
1:14:02
Speaker 2: misunderstanding between men and women about lingerie. Women are always
1:14:06
Speaker 2: telling me like, what's the point? You see it for,
1:14:09
Speaker 2: you know, 10 seconds and then it's on the ground. Like,
1:14:12
Speaker 2: what's the point of putting it on in the first place?
1:14:15
Speaker 2: And so I was... There's a point. There's a point.
1:14:18
Speaker 2: Maybe you can tell them for me. What is the point?
1:14:20
Speaker 2: Tell me, Sean. What is the point to putting on lingerie?
1:14:23
Speaker 1: It's something new. It's sexy. It's something that you don't see,
1:14:28
Speaker 1: you know, your spouse in every day. Maybe you do.
1:14:33
Speaker 1: I don't know. But, um... But I mean, it's just
1:14:38
Speaker 1: one of those extra sparks.
1:14:42
Speaker 2: So to you, it's worth it even if it ends
1:14:43
Speaker 2: up on the floor 10 seconds later. Oh yeah, definitely.
1:14:47
Speaker 2: I also like to compare it to wrapping a gift.
1:14:50
Speaker 2: It's the exact same thing. You take the paper off
1:14:52
Speaker 2: in 10 seconds and throw it away, but we all
1:14:54
Speaker 2: wrap our gifts.
1:14:55
Speaker 1: Great analogy.
1:14:56
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's fun. It makes it look, it looks prettier.
1:14:59
Speaker 2: It feels exciting to open it up. So it's the
1:15:01
Speaker 2: same kind of thing.
1:15:02
Speaker 1: What else? What else?
1:15:05
Speaker 2: I mean, playing with toys can be fun, too. You know,
1:15:08
Speaker 2: there are definitely a lot of toys to experiment with
1:15:10
Speaker 2: in the bedroom. Dirty talk is another great one. We
1:15:14
Speaker 2: love encouraging couples to get more comfortable communicating during sex.
1:15:18
Speaker 2: And again, this is another way that people go to extremes.
1:15:21
Speaker 2: They think, dirty talk, like, oh, I'm going to have
1:15:23
Speaker 2: to sound like some cheesy porn star. I don't want to,
1:15:26
Speaker 2: you know, be saying all these ridiculous, like, ma'am, you
1:15:28
Speaker 2: forgot your, you know, here's your pizza, you forgot the
1:15:31
Speaker 2: payment for it, you know? Right? But I think the
1:15:37
Speaker 2: dirty talk, it doesn't have to be graphic and it
1:15:41
Speaker 2: doesn't have to be cheesy. For me, dirty talk is
1:15:44
Speaker 2: all about finding your authentic voice in the bedroom. So this,
1:15:48
Speaker 2: it's actually part of our, we have a membership for couples.
1:15:51
Speaker 2: We have a whole dirty talk guide in there where
1:15:53
Speaker 2: we go through finding the specific words So even words
1:15:58
Speaker 2: for body parts, everybody has their own preferences. People will say, oh,
1:16:01
Speaker 2: I really like that word. Oh, I don't like that word.
1:16:03
Speaker 2: So finding the specific words that you like or looking
1:16:06
Speaker 2: at examples and singing, yeah, it would sound really hot
1:16:09
Speaker 2: to me to hear that versus, hmm, that one's a
1:16:11
Speaker 2: little too, you know, overboard for me. So experimenting with that.
1:16:16
Speaker 2: But dirty talk can be very simple. Something like, I
1:16:19
Speaker 2: want you. You look so good right now. I can't
1:16:22
Speaker 2: wait another second. You know, it doesn't have to be complicated,
1:16:25
Speaker 2: but it can still feel really fun. Or in the
1:16:27
Speaker 2: moment too, like, that feels so good. Don't stop. That
1:16:32
Speaker 2: can be very fun.
1:16:33
Speaker 1: What about stuff like Kama Sutra?
1:16:38
Speaker 2: So the Kama Sutra is mostly positions. And there are
1:16:44
Speaker 2: some that work and a lot that don't.
1:16:46
Speaker 1: So, yeah.
1:16:48
Speaker 2: I would, you know, if it interests you to check
1:16:51
Speaker 2: that out, the text out from more of a historical standpoint, sure.
1:16:54
Speaker 2: But I don't find it to be the greatest resource personally.
1:16:57
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:16:58
Speaker 2: Oh, but you know what? I want to go back
1:16:59
Speaker 2: to the dirty talk conversation because this is something that
1:17:02
Speaker 2: we hear from women all the time that I think
1:17:03
Speaker 2: men might be surprised to hear. Women want you to
1:17:07
Speaker 2: make more noise. Women tell us all the time, my
1:17:12
Speaker 2: man is silent during sex. No noise, no talking. And
1:17:17
Speaker 2: I don't know what's going on with him. Is he
1:17:19
Speaker 2: having a good time? Is he bored? Women are desperate
1:17:24
Speaker 2: for men to make more noise during sex, and they
1:17:26
Speaker 2: think it's really sexy, too. Like, they want to hear your...
1:17:30
Speaker 2: I think in the same... You know, men love hearing
1:17:32
Speaker 2: women's noises, right? Am I right? We want to hear
1:17:35
Speaker 2: your noises, too.
1:17:36
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:17:37
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:17:37
Speaker 1: Good to know. All right, let's take a quick break,
1:17:40
Speaker 1: and then when we come back, I just got a
1:17:42
Speaker 1: bunch of random questions.
1:17:44
Speaker 2: All right.
1:17:45
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Speaker 1: These statements and products have not been evaluated by the FDA.
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Speaker 1: prevent any disease or condition. All right, Vanessa, we're back
1:20:38
Speaker 1: from the break. When we kicked this interview off, I asked,
1:20:42
Speaker 1: how much sex should we be having? So I'd like
1:20:45
Speaker 1: to loop back around to that. I'll let you answer that,
1:20:49
Speaker 1: and then I got some more questions spinning off of that.
1:20:51
Speaker 2: Okay, so I started telling you there's no one magic
1:20:55
Speaker 2: number that every couple should be having. And if we're
1:20:57
Speaker 2: just trying to hit a quota, it's probably not gonna
1:20:59
Speaker 2: be very good sex. But that being said, I do
1:21:02
Speaker 2: think that if you are asking yourself, How much sex
1:21:06
Speaker 2: should we be having? Are we having enough? Likely the
1:21:10
Speaker 2: answer is, you should be having more sex. I do
1:21:13
Speaker 2: think that people benefit the more sex that we have,
1:21:17
Speaker 2: the more connected we feel. And I think this is
1:21:20
Speaker 2: another way that we downplay sex. Like, nobody would ever say, oh,
1:21:24
Speaker 2: you guys want to go on more date nights? You
1:21:26
Speaker 2: guys want to spend more quality time together? Like, we think,
1:21:28
Speaker 2: we look at it as, oh, yeah, the more we
1:21:30
Speaker 2: do that, the more quality time we spend together, the
1:21:32
Speaker 2: more nice stuff we do together, like, the better. And
1:21:34
Speaker 2: I do think the same is true to an extent
1:21:37
Speaker 2: when it comes to sex. But in particular, what I
1:21:39
Speaker 2: want people to get used to is this idea that
1:21:42
Speaker 2: we have to be intentional about making the time, space,
1:21:46
Speaker 2: and energy for sex. We can't just rely on it
1:21:50
Speaker 2: to happen, hope that it'll happen. You know, the vast
1:21:53
Speaker 2: majority of us, if we just kind of sit around
1:21:55
Speaker 2: waiting for it to happen, we're going to bed night
1:21:58
Speaker 2: after night without doing it. So I think the vast
1:22:00
Speaker 2: majority of couples would really benefit from being more intentional
1:22:04
Speaker 2: about having more sex.
1:22:06
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm looking for a number here, Dallas.
1:22:10
Speaker 2: Okay, I can tell you research. So there is research
1:22:13
Speaker 2: showing that the more couples have sex, the happier they
1:22:17
Speaker 2: are up to once a week. And at once a week,
1:22:22
Speaker 2: it shows that there's not any additional benefit from there.
1:22:26
Speaker 2: To me, though, once a week feels pretty low. So
1:22:29
Speaker 2: I'm surprised by those findings, and it's not necessarily what
1:22:32
Speaker 2: I see in our community. I think that most people
1:22:36
Speaker 2: could benefit from having sex more than once a week.
1:22:38
Speaker 2: But if you want to go by what the research shows,
1:22:40
Speaker 2: at least once a week, and you'll be in pretty
1:22:42
Speaker 2: good shape.
1:22:44
Speaker 1: That's not enough.
1:22:45
Speaker 2: I don't think it's enough either.
1:22:46
Speaker 1: That's not enough. In your specific clients that you talk to,
1:22:52
Speaker 1: is there a happy medium where you see, hey, you know,
1:22:56
Speaker 1: I don't know, two times a week, five times a week,
1:23:00
Speaker 1: every day.
1:23:00
Speaker 2: Yeah, we polled our community and we put together a
1:23:02
Speaker 2: pretty extensive poll. At this point, we've had about 75,000
1:23:07
Speaker 2: people fill it out. And we asked about frequency and
1:23:10
Speaker 2: about satisfaction. And we found that 75% of people fell
1:23:15
Speaker 2: into one of three buckets and they were evenly divided, 25, 25, 25.
1:23:18
Speaker 2: And those buckets were two to three times per month,
1:23:20
Speaker 2: once a week. and two to three times per week.
1:23:27
Speaker 2: And we found that across those three buckets, there were
1:23:30
Speaker 2: no changes in satisfaction. The people who were doing it
1:23:33
Speaker 2: two to three times a week were just as happy
1:23:35
Speaker 2: as the people who were doing it two to three
1:23:36
Speaker 2: times a month. And again, that surprised me too, because
1:23:40
Speaker 2: two to three times a month doesn't seem like the most.
1:23:43
Speaker 2: So that was really interesting to see. But I do think,
1:23:46
Speaker 2: you know, multiple times a week for most couples is
1:23:50
Speaker 2: gonna be beneficial. And what I say is that there's
1:23:53
Speaker 2: a certain inertia that comes into place with sex. Do
1:23:56
Speaker 2: you remember inertia from high school physics class? It was
1:23:58
Speaker 2: like the object in motion stays in motion and object
1:24:01
Speaker 2: at rest stays at rest. That is very true when
1:24:04
Speaker 2: it comes to sex. So, the more you get used
1:24:07
Speaker 2: to not having sex, the easier and easier it is
1:24:10
Speaker 2: each and every night to like, meh, okay, no, just
1:24:13
Speaker 2: go to sleep. Okay, we'll go to sleep again. But
1:24:15
Speaker 2: the more sex that you do have, the easier it
1:24:18
Speaker 2: feels to keep having sex. So Xander and I will
1:24:22
Speaker 2: have seasons of our relationship where we just have sex
1:24:24
Speaker 2: every day. And the easier it feels to just keep
1:24:28
Speaker 2: going every single day. So that's not necessarily, you know, again,
1:24:33
Speaker 2: the right thing for every couple, but I think couples
1:24:35
Speaker 2: should experiment with it. And again, the bottom line should
1:24:38
Speaker 2: be that you're making an active effort to have sex
1:24:40
Speaker 2: more often than you feel the desire for it.
1:24:43
Speaker 1: Is there, I mean, is there a particular time of
1:24:47
Speaker 1: day that's better?
1:24:49
Speaker 2: The worst time of day is very last thing at night.
1:24:53
Speaker 2: And that is unfortunately when most couples have sex.
1:24:56
Speaker 1: What if you are feeling good at the end of
1:24:58
Speaker 1: the day?
1:24:59
Speaker 2: Okay, if you're feeling great at the very end of
1:25:02
Speaker 2: the night, sure, by all means, go for it. I
1:25:04
Speaker 2: want you to have sex whenever it feels good for you.
1:25:06
Speaker 2: But the pattern that most couples get into is we
1:25:08
Speaker 2: have this idea in our heads that sex is the
1:25:11
Speaker 2: last thing that we do at night. So you get
1:25:12
Speaker 2: ready for bed, you crawl into bed, and that's the
1:25:15
Speaker 2: time that we're supposed to be having sex. I don't
1:25:17
Speaker 2: know about you, but for me, by the time I'm
1:25:20
Speaker 2: crawling into bed, I am ready for bed. I want
1:25:24
Speaker 2: to go to sleep. It's a really hard time to
1:25:27
Speaker 2: all of a sudden then get excited about having sex
1:25:31
Speaker 2: with my husband. And most couples will tell me the
1:25:34
Speaker 2: same thing. Like, I'm exhausted when I get into bed.
1:25:36
Speaker 2: My head hits the pillow and I'm asleep to 10
1:25:38
Speaker 2: seconds later. Or you're starting to do that horrible math
1:25:41
Speaker 2: in your head of, okay, if I fall asleep right now,
1:25:43
Speaker 2: then I can get, you know, seven hours of sleep.
1:25:47
Speaker 2: So it's just a tough time to get really excited
1:25:49
Speaker 2: about it. So I always tell couples, prioritize sex as
1:25:53
Speaker 2: early in the evening or in the day. If you
1:25:55
Speaker 2: have the space to do it in the morning or
1:25:57
Speaker 2: during the day, that's great. But if you're, you know,
1:25:59
Speaker 2: like most people, you have nine to five jobs, you're
1:26:01
Speaker 2: not really home back together until the, you know, around
1:26:04
Speaker 2: 5 or 6 p.m., as early in the day as
1:26:07
Speaker 2: you can. So maybe that's putting the kids to bed
1:26:10
Speaker 2: a little bit earlier, or even if it's as simple
1:26:13
Speaker 2: as we prioritize it before we do Netflix, or we
1:26:17
Speaker 2: prioritize it over folding the laundry. Like, prioritize it over something.
1:26:22
Speaker 2: Don't have it be the last thing that you're doing
1:26:24
Speaker 2: at the end of the night.
1:26:25
Speaker 1: Okay. Okay. What about morning? I mean, are there any
1:26:29
Speaker 1: benefits to waking up and.
1:26:31
Speaker 2: Most men tend to feel horniest in the morning and
1:26:35
Speaker 2: get the best erections in the morning. So a lot
1:26:37
Speaker 2: of men love morning sex. Unfortunately, a lot of women
1:26:40
Speaker 2: do not.
1:26:41
Speaker 1: Why?
1:26:42
Speaker 2: They feel self-conscious about their breath. And I just think,
1:26:44
Speaker 2: you know what? Yeah, your breath is stinky, but you're
1:26:47
Speaker 2: both stinky. And you notice that stink for about two
1:26:50
Speaker 2: seconds and then you get over it. But if it
1:26:53
Speaker 2: really bothers you, a little package of, you know, Listerine
1:26:57
Speaker 2: strips in your bedside table can work wonders. That can
1:27:00
Speaker 2: be really fun. And I personally love starting the day
1:27:03
Speaker 2: having sex. You feel kind of accomplished the rest of
1:27:05
Speaker 2: the day. Like we did the best thing in the
1:27:08
Speaker 2: beginning of the day. You've got that extra pep in
1:27:09
Speaker 2: your step for the rest of the day. So I
1:27:11
Speaker 2: think the morning is a great time to do it.
1:27:13
Speaker 1: Right on. And then, you know, right before on the break,
1:27:19
Speaker 1: we were talking about no screens before sex. Why is that?
1:27:22
Speaker 2: Yes. This is an experiment that Xander and I just
1:27:25
Speaker 2: started doing. We make ourselves guinea pigs for all my
1:27:29
Speaker 2: little harebrained ideas. But I was thinking a lot about
1:27:33
Speaker 2: how easy it is for us to fall into this
1:27:36
Speaker 2: routine of being on our phones, watching Netflix. Like, we're
1:27:39
Speaker 2: just like every other couple. The workday ends, we're tired.
1:27:43
Speaker 2: The idea of crashing out on the couch and putting
1:27:45
Speaker 2: on Love is Blind, it feels so good. But the
1:27:48
Speaker 2: reality is, you never feel connected after that. You know,
1:27:53
Speaker 2: and that's unfortunately for most couples, that's their quality time,
1:27:57
Speaker 2: is we're both watching TV, but we're on our phones
1:28:00
Speaker 2: as we're watching the TV. That's not connected. That's not
1:28:04
Speaker 2: quality time. So I got the idea of, what if we,
1:28:07
Speaker 2: you know, playfully make ourselves earn our screen time? So
1:28:12
Speaker 2: I said, why don't we do, make a little rule
1:28:14
Speaker 2: for ourselves, we'll experiment with, that we can't use screens
1:28:19
Speaker 2: until we've had sex. So we have our workday. We
1:28:22
Speaker 2: set a specific time of, you know, okay, 5 p.m.,
1:28:25
Speaker 2: that's when the workday ends. We're entrepreneurs like you, so
1:28:28
Speaker 2: we know it doesn't actually end at 5 p.m., but
1:28:30
Speaker 2: we just kind of set that arbitrarily. And we said,
1:28:32
Speaker 2: past 5 p.m., if it's not related to work, we're
1:28:35
Speaker 2: not allowed to get our screens until we've been intimate
1:28:38
Speaker 2: with each other. And that has been super... fun for
1:28:40
Speaker 2: us to play around with. It just makes sure that
1:28:43
Speaker 2: we're prioritizing each other and make sure it's at a
1:28:46
Speaker 2: time when we have the energy, the excitement to be
1:28:49
Speaker 2: with each other. It's just been really, really fun. So, again,
1:28:51
Speaker 2: that's not gonna work for every couple's schedule. You know,
1:28:53
Speaker 2: if you've got kids around, of course, like, it's not
1:28:56
Speaker 2: gonna be doable. But you could adjust that to, you know,
1:28:59
Speaker 2: kids go to bed, and then that's the first thing
1:29:01
Speaker 2: that we do. We don't go to watch Netflix. We
1:29:03
Speaker 2: don't get our phone and scroll on Instagram. We're prioritizing
1:29:05
Speaker 2: each other.
1:29:06
Speaker 1: Okay. Okay. That makes a lot of sense. Now, let's
1:29:10
Speaker 1: define great sex for both a man and a woman?
1:29:15
Speaker 2: This is such a fascinating question that most of us
1:29:19
Speaker 2: have never taken the time to think about. And I'm actually,
1:29:23
Speaker 2: I'm gonna put you on the spot if you don't mind.
1:29:24
Speaker 2: And I'm gonna ask you to come up with your definition.
1:29:28
Speaker 2: Because this is an exercise that I recommend to all couples.
1:29:33
Speaker 2: You know, if you ask some random person, hey, do
1:29:35
Speaker 2: you want to have a great sex life? Most people
1:29:36
Speaker 2: are gonna say, yeah, of course I do. But when
1:29:39
Speaker 2: I ask them, okay, what does great mean to you?
1:29:41
Speaker 2: Most people will give me a deer in headlights look.
1:29:44
Speaker 2: They've never thought about that question before. So I tell couples,
1:29:48
Speaker 2: come up with three words that describe your ideal sex life,
1:29:54
Speaker 2: or three words that describe how you want to feel
1:29:57
Speaker 2: during sex. So if you don't mind sharing, you don't
1:29:59
Speaker 2: have to. But I'll give you some examples. So for me,
1:30:03
Speaker 2: one of my words is playful. I'm a goofy person.
1:30:07
Speaker 2: Xander's a super goofy person. I think, you know, so
1:30:10
Speaker 2: many of us have the tendency to think sex has
1:30:12
Speaker 2: to be so serious. And sometimes that's fun, but I
1:30:16
Speaker 2: feel the most connected to Xander when I feel like
1:30:19
Speaker 2: I can be my full self in the bedroom with him.
1:30:21
Speaker 2: And sometimes that's just being silly and playful during sex,
1:30:24
Speaker 2: like not being quite so serious. So for me, when
1:30:27
Speaker 2: I feel like we've really played with each other, that's
1:30:31
Speaker 2: when I feel super connected to him. Another one of
1:30:34
Speaker 2: my words is escapism. For me, the best sex is
1:30:40
Speaker 2: when it feels like time stands still. The rest of
1:30:44
Speaker 2: the world just drops away, and it's just the two
1:30:47
Speaker 2: of us in that moment together, connecting with each other,
1:30:50
Speaker 2: like being with each other. So that sense of it's
1:30:54
Speaker 2: a place that we're going to. It's not just this
1:30:56
Speaker 2: physical thing that we're doing with our bodies.
1:30:58
Speaker 1: What was that word?
1:30:59
Speaker 2: Like escapism.
1:31:00
Speaker 1: Escapism. Okay.
1:31:02
Speaker 2: But it could be adventurous. It could be safe. It
1:31:08
Speaker 2: could be exploratory. Any words come into mind for you?
1:31:15
Speaker 1: Orgasm. Comes to my mind. Especially for her.
1:31:19
Speaker 2: That's a good one. Sure.
1:31:24
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think length of sex, orgasm, and....
1:31:31
Speaker 2: What about some of the words when I was asking
1:31:33
Speaker 2: you earlier, like how you feel after you've had really
1:31:36
Speaker 2: great sex? You're saying confident.
1:31:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, confident.
1:31:39
Speaker 2: Confident, connected. Okay.
1:31:42
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, I mean, I think confidence just, it's just,
1:31:46
Speaker 1: I mean, I think that goes for both parties. You
1:31:50
Speaker 1: have to feel confident, you know, being naked.
1:31:53
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:31:54
Speaker 1: If you don't, then it's probably not going to go great, right?
1:31:57
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that is a huge thing that comes up, unfortunately,
1:31:59
Speaker 2: for so many women. We really struggle with that. That's
1:32:02
Speaker 2: another way that men can help women out in the bedroom.
1:32:05
Speaker 2: We are so, so self-conscious of our bodies. We've been
1:32:11
Speaker 2: taught to be that way our entire lives. I mean,
1:32:13
Speaker 2: I grew up in the 90s. I will never forget
1:32:16
Speaker 2: being in the grocery store checkout line with my parents
1:32:19
Speaker 2: and seeing all the, you know, Cosmo magazines of like
1:32:23
Speaker 2: six positions to hide your belly flab. That's how I
1:32:26
Speaker 2: grew up, being taught, like, how do I hide my
1:32:29
Speaker 2: body during sex? I don't want my partner to see
1:32:32
Speaker 2: my flab, my rolls, my imperfections. And that's what, you know,
1:32:37
Speaker 2: most of us women are thinking during sex a lot
1:32:40
Speaker 2: of the time. I remember Xander and I had a
1:32:42
Speaker 2: conversation about it. I asked him, like, what are you
1:32:46
Speaker 2: thinking about your body when we have sex? And he
1:32:49
Speaker 2: looked at me like he couldn't even understand the question, like,
1:32:52
Speaker 2: what do you mean? And I said, like, do you
1:32:55
Speaker 2: feel self-conscious of your body, like, when we're having sex?
1:32:59
Speaker 2: Why would I be self-conscious of my body? I'm having
1:33:02
Speaker 2: sex with you. Like, he could not comprehend it. Maybe
1:33:05
Speaker 2: you can't either. Like, he could not comprehend that that's
1:33:09
Speaker 2: where my brain is trained to go. Is he seeing
1:33:12
Speaker 2: my belly flab in this position? So men can really
1:33:15
Speaker 2: help women out by complimenting us, by telling us how
1:33:19
Speaker 2: sexy you think our bodies are. by reassuring us, like,
1:33:23
Speaker 2: the things that you think you see in your body,
1:33:25
Speaker 2: I am not seeing those things. And this is especially
1:33:29
Speaker 2: true for, you know, women who have given birth and
1:33:31
Speaker 2: they feel like, you know, I don't look the same.
1:33:33
Speaker 2: If you've been together a long time, like, oh, he
1:33:35
Speaker 2: probably wishes my body looked like it did when we
1:33:37
Speaker 2: were in our 20s and we met, and now I'm
1:33:39
Speaker 2: in my 40s and things are starting to droop and
1:33:41
Speaker 2: sag and all that. Like, it's really hard for us.
1:33:45
Speaker 1: What about duration? How long should it go?
1:33:48
Speaker 2: Oh, that's a great question. This is another, like, it's
1:33:51
Speaker 2: a really common misunderstanding between couples, and it's a conversation
1:33:55
Speaker 2: most couples have never had. Most men think the longer,
1:33:59
Speaker 2: the better. You know, you grow up hearing some songs like,
1:34:02
Speaker 2: we'll go all night long, you know, do it till
1:34:04
Speaker 2: the sun comes up. Like, you get that idea in
1:34:07
Speaker 2: your head. It's supposed to last a long time. When
1:34:09
Speaker 2: we ask women, though, women don't want it to last
1:34:12
Speaker 2: that long. We asked, we polled our audience on ideal length,
1:34:17
Speaker 2: And men thought that intercourse, just the intercourse part of it,
1:34:22
Speaker 2: should last 20 minutes or more. For women, the ideal
1:34:27
Speaker 2: length was five to seven minutes.
1:34:29
Speaker 1: Five to seven minutes.
1:34:30
Speaker 2: That's all we want. Five to seven minutes. Which should
1:34:33
Speaker 2: be good news for a lot of men because on average,
1:34:37
Speaker 2: men last about two to three minutes. So men are
1:34:41
Speaker 2: really stressing themselves out, lasting two to three minutes, but
1:34:44
Speaker 2: thinking they're supposed to last 30 plus.
1:34:49
Speaker 1: I mean, what about, you know, positions?
1:34:53
Speaker 2: So, I mean, positions are a really fun thing to
1:34:56
Speaker 2: play around with. I do think a lot of people
1:34:58
Speaker 2: get anxious and self-conscious. A lot of that's like, you know,
1:35:01
Speaker 2: the body image stuff that comes up. Is this going
1:35:03
Speaker 2: to show my roles? But we've asked, we polled our audience,
1:35:08
Speaker 2: and people said on average they liked about two to
1:35:11
Speaker 2: three positions per session. That felt fun for them. But
1:35:14
Speaker 2: there are a lot of people, a lot of people
1:35:17
Speaker 2: who just do one position. Really?
1:35:19
Speaker 1: Really.
1:35:20
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. And just missionary the whole time. And every time.
1:35:24
Speaker 2: And that gets... that gets boring. I'm a fan of missionary.
1:35:27
Speaker 2: Missionary can be great. But if that's the only position
1:35:30
Speaker 2: you're doing every single time, you're gonna get tired of it.
1:35:33
Speaker 1: What are the majority of... What positions do women like
1:35:36
Speaker 1: the most?
1:35:38
Speaker 2: The best position for women is her on top, cowgirl position.
1:35:43
Speaker 2: That is the easiest position for a woman to orgasm in.
1:35:46
Speaker 2: It creates the most stimulation. And I think it can
1:35:49
Speaker 2: be really empowering for women, too, because we're in control.
1:35:52
Speaker 2: You're dictating the movement, the angle, the pace, the depth.
1:35:57
Speaker 2: So it can feel intimidating for a lot of women
1:35:59
Speaker 2: if they, you know, haven't done it or they don't
1:36:01
Speaker 2: have a lot of confidence. And one of the big
1:36:03
Speaker 2: misconceptions that women have, which we get from porn, unfortunately,
1:36:07
Speaker 2: is we think we're supposed to be bouncing up and
1:36:09
Speaker 2: down like a... on a pogo stick kind of thing.
1:36:11
Speaker 2: And that's hard on your thighs. You can do that
1:36:14
Speaker 2: for maybe 20 to 30 seconds and your thighs start
1:36:17
Speaker 2: burning after that. So a lot of women avoid that
1:36:20
Speaker 2: position because they think that's what it's supposed to be.
1:36:23
Speaker 2: But actually grinding is way more effective. It's going to
1:36:26
Speaker 2: feel more pleasurable for her. So it's using your hips
1:36:29
Speaker 2: to just rock back and forth rather than bouncing up
1:36:32
Speaker 2: and down. So you're going to be, as a woman,
1:36:34
Speaker 2: you're going to be able to last longer. It's going
1:36:36
Speaker 2: to create more stimulation because your clitoris can rub against
1:36:39
Speaker 2: your partner's abdomen. You can get a little stimulation that way.
1:36:43
Speaker 2: And the man will last longer in that position. It
1:36:46
Speaker 2: tends to be it's not one of the most stimulating
1:36:49
Speaker 2: positions for men because you're not in control of it
1:36:51
Speaker 2: and it's a more subtle movement. But that can be
1:36:54
Speaker 2: nice since most women, you know, tend to last a
1:36:57
Speaker 2: lot longer than men do. Women need more time. So
1:37:00
Speaker 2: it can be a nice way to like balance out
1:37:01
Speaker 2: the timing.
1:37:02
Speaker 1: Okay, okay. What else should we be talking about here?
1:37:11
Speaker 2: Should we talk about scheduling sex? That's another hot topic
1:37:15
Speaker 2: that comes up.
1:37:16
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:37:17
Speaker 2: So, yeah, a lot of people, as soon as they
1:37:21
Speaker 2: hear that phrase, scheduling sex, it just brings a real
1:37:25
Speaker 2: sense of dread. What are your impressions of scheduled sex?
1:37:29
Speaker 1: I don't like it.
1:37:30
Speaker 2: Why don't you like it?
1:37:32
Speaker 1: Because it feels scheduled.
1:37:34
Speaker 2: Okay. What's wrong with being scheduled?
1:37:36
Speaker 1: I mean, nothing. I'll take it. I guess it goes
1:37:43
Speaker 1: back to that conversation about spontaneous, you know, being spontaneous.
1:37:50
Speaker 1: That's why maybe, I don't know. I mean, we have kids.
1:37:59
Speaker 1: I don't know. We've never done it.
1:38:01
Speaker 2: Okay, so with your life, with kids, you're really busy
1:38:04
Speaker 2: with this show. You've got a lot going on. Do
1:38:07
Speaker 2: you have a whole lot of space for spontaneity in
1:38:08
Speaker 2: your life?
1:38:11
Speaker 1: We make space for it.
1:38:14
Speaker 2: Okay.
1:38:14
Speaker 1: I guess, if that makes sense.
1:38:16
Speaker 2: How do you make space for spontaneity?
1:38:18
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, how do I say that?
1:38:21
Speaker 2: Because that sounds a little bit like planning.
1:38:24
Speaker 1: I mean, I just say it. So I just... bring
1:38:30
Speaker 1: it up. But we'll schedule things far in advance. So
1:38:35
Speaker 1: to totally get away from the kids, we'll schedule vacations
1:38:40
Speaker 1: or small getaways in town where we could go somewhere else.
1:38:44
Speaker 1: And so we always have something on the schedule to
1:38:49
Speaker 1: get away, and then, you know, whatever happens, happens, you know,
1:38:52
Speaker 1: during those getaways, but.
1:38:53
Speaker 2: Okay, I highly recommend that in general, for couples to
1:38:56
Speaker 2: always have something on the calendar that's just the two
1:38:59
Speaker 2: of them. And I don't care if it has to be, like,
1:39:01
Speaker 2: due to budget or, you know, schedules. I don't care
1:39:03
Speaker 2: if it's two years in the future. Have something on
1:39:06
Speaker 2: the calendar that's just the two of you that you
1:39:08
Speaker 2: can look forward to. So, I'm glad you guys are
1:39:10
Speaker 2: doing that. But, okay, so let's talk about one of
1:39:12
Speaker 2: your trips that you have on the calendar. You're scheduling
1:39:15
Speaker 2: that trip, right?
1:39:16
Speaker 1: Mm-hmm.
1:39:18
Speaker 2: Does that trip lose some of its luster because you
1:39:20
Speaker 2: had to schedule it? Is it like, oh, damn, we
1:39:22
Speaker 2: had to schedule this trip?
1:39:24
Speaker 1: No.
1:39:24
Speaker 2: If anything, I would venture that it feels more special
1:39:28
Speaker 2: because you've scheduled it, right? It's like, we know life
1:39:31
Speaker 2: is busy, but we are making sure to carve this
1:39:34
Speaker 2: time out for ourselves because this is important. I think
1:39:38
Speaker 2: the same can be true when it comes to sex. where, yes,
1:39:42
Speaker 2: we can schedule sex in a very boring way. If
1:39:44
Speaker 2: you're getting out your calendars and like, okay, I have
1:39:47
Speaker 2: Wednesday from 8 to 8.20 open, you know? If we're
1:39:50
Speaker 2: scheduling it the way we schedule a dentist appointment, of
1:39:53
Speaker 2: course it's gonna feel boring, right? But we can schedule
1:39:57
Speaker 2: it in a way that it's more about the respect
1:40:00
Speaker 2: that we're showing for each other and for our connection of,
1:40:04
Speaker 2: I know that our life is busy, it's full, I
1:40:06
Speaker 2: know it's really easy for the day to just totally
1:40:09
Speaker 2: get away from us. I want to make sure no
1:40:12
Speaker 2: matter what, we have time to spend together. We have
1:40:16
Speaker 2: time to be together, that we are prioritizing each other.
1:40:19
Speaker 2: So much of what we're talking about today is prioritizing
1:40:21
Speaker 2: each other, making each other feel important. And I think
1:40:24
Speaker 2: scheduling is a way that we can do that. The
1:40:27
Speaker 2: other funny thing to think about with scheduling, so let's
1:40:29
Speaker 2: go back to the beginning of your relationship with your wife.
1:40:32
Speaker 2: So you guys are going on dates, right? What are
1:40:34
Speaker 2: you doing? You're scheduling those dates, right? And then once
1:40:39
Speaker 2: people start being intimate with each other, when you're scheduling
1:40:43
Speaker 2: a date, you're essentially scheduling sex. You know, once you
1:40:48
Speaker 2: start having sex and you know, hey, we're gonna go
1:40:50
Speaker 2: out to dinner on Friday, you know you're gonna have
1:40:53
Speaker 2: sex on Friday too.
1:40:54
Speaker 1: That's a good point.
1:40:55
Speaker 2: We've been scheduling sex from the very beginning. So it's
1:40:59
Speaker 2: not that it was so spontaneous and different in the
1:41:02
Speaker 2: beginning and now we're this boring old married couple who
1:41:05
Speaker 2: has to schedule sex. Like, we've been doing it from
1:41:08
Speaker 2: the beginning. so it's just about changing our attitudes around
1:41:12
Speaker 2: it so i actually don't use the phrase scheduled sex
1:41:14
Speaker 2: because it just sounds boring i'll use intentional intimacy or
1:41:18
Speaker 2: planning for sex so when i talked earlier about how
1:41:20
Speaker 2: xander and i will talk in the beginning of the
1:41:22
Speaker 2: day that's essentially scheduling sex but it doesn't feel you
1:41:27
Speaker 2: know boring it doesn't feel like a drag it feels
1:41:30
Speaker 2: exciting when are we gonna have the time for ourselves
1:41:32
Speaker 2: when are we making sure we carve that time out
1:41:35
Speaker 2: and i think we We have this tendency to only
1:41:38
Speaker 2: look at scheduling in a negative way when it comes
1:41:41
Speaker 2: to sex. Like, here's another example. Think of your kids.
1:41:44
Speaker 2: Do they play any sports?
1:41:46
Speaker 1: Jiu-jitsu. Okay.
1:41:48
Speaker 2: So if your kid has a jiu-jitsu, like, competition or a...
1:41:51
Speaker 2: What do they call it?
1:41:52
Speaker 1: Well, he's four, so we're not.
1:41:54
Speaker 2: Okay, he's not quite there yet, but okay. Let's say
1:41:56
Speaker 2: at some point he has an event that you want
1:41:58
Speaker 2: to go to. What are you gonna do? You're going
1:42:01
Speaker 2: to schedule that, right? You're gonna put that in your calendar.
1:42:05
Speaker 2: Let's say it happens in the middle of the day. Like,
1:42:06
Speaker 2: you're gonna tell your team, hey, Thursday from 2 to 4,
1:42:09
Speaker 2: I'm out. I am not available. Don't contact me. It
1:42:12
Speaker 2: is important to me to show up for my kid.
1:42:15
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be there. And we look at that in
1:42:17
Speaker 2: such a positive way. Like, that is me showing my
1:42:21
Speaker 2: kid respect, showing him how much I love him, how
1:42:23
Speaker 2: important it is for me to be there. So, again,
1:42:25
Speaker 2: why can't we look at that in the same way
1:42:28
Speaker 2: with our partner when it comes to intimacy.
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Speaker 1: you know, when I think of my schedule, it is
1:45:15
Speaker 1: just things that I gotta knock out during the day.
1:45:18
Speaker 1: It's a check mark. You know, it's like a checklist.
1:45:21
Speaker 1: To-do list. And so, maybe that's why... Maybe that's why
1:45:25
Speaker 1: I think of that, is that I don't think of
1:45:29
Speaker 1: sex as just, this is just something we gotta knock
1:45:31
Speaker 1: out during the day. So when somebody's... Yeah, it shouldn't be.
1:45:34
Speaker 1: When couples schedule sex, I mean, how does the meeting go?
1:45:42
Speaker 2: All right, it's 4 p.m.
1:45:45
Speaker 1: It's time.
1:45:46
Speaker 2: Get in the bedroom.
1:45:47
Speaker 1: What?
1:45:48
Speaker 2: So you can do it in a lot of different ways.
1:45:51
Speaker 2: Some people genuinely like that idea of having it be
1:45:54
Speaker 2: a specific time, and they make it feel sexy. Like,
1:45:57
Speaker 2: I'm going to meet you in the bedroom Wednesday at 7,
1:45:59
Speaker 2: and you can do fun role-play stuff around that. So
1:46:02
Speaker 2: some couples that works for. Like, Xander and I, we
1:46:05
Speaker 2: have never scheduled sex with, like, a specific time. But
1:46:09
Speaker 2: we do talk more openly about, hey, I want to
1:46:11
Speaker 2: have sex today. Can we make sure we're prioritizing that? So,
1:46:15
Speaker 2: I still think there's an element to scheduling around that,
1:46:17
Speaker 2: even if we're not nailing down the exact, you know,
1:46:20
Speaker 2: date and time that we're doing it.
1:46:21
Speaker 1: Okay, okay. I thought you meant to say Yeah, it
1:46:25
Speaker 1: doesn't have to be.
1:46:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, it doesn't have to be. So some couples say, like,
1:46:29
Speaker 2: you know, they know their schedules and they know, hey,
1:46:31
Speaker 2: Wednesdays are usually pretty good for us and Saturdays are
1:46:34
Speaker 2: usually pretty good for us. So sometimes it's just a
1:46:37
Speaker 2: knowing ahead of time. These are the days that tend
1:46:39
Speaker 2: to be the easiest, so let's make sure we make
1:46:41
Speaker 2: some time for each other. So it can be a
1:46:43
Speaker 2: lot looser than, you know, it's specifically written down somewhere.
1:46:47
Speaker 1: Okay, okay. What are the top three things couples can
1:46:52
Speaker 1: do if they're starting to feel like roommates?
1:46:55
Speaker 2: Such a great question. So I'm all about being very practical.
1:47:00
Speaker 2: I think a lot of people, you start drifting away,
1:47:03
Speaker 2: you're feeling disconnected, and a lot of people think, like, oh, God,
1:47:06
Speaker 2: we have to go on a vacation together, or maybe
1:47:08
Speaker 2: we have to start therapy, or you feel like you
1:47:10
Speaker 2: have to do these big, grand gestures. And so I
1:47:14
Speaker 2: try to think about what are the things that we
1:47:16
Speaker 2: can do on a daily basis that are small, quick, easy,
1:47:21
Speaker 2: but they're gonna give us the maximum bang for our buck.
1:47:24
Speaker 2: So I came up with something that I call the
1:47:25
Speaker 2: GET intimate technique. And the GET stands for those three things, G-E-T, gratitude,
1:47:32
Speaker 2: eye contact, and touch. So I'll go through each of them.
1:47:36
Speaker 2: So gratitude, everybody's heard of gratitude. I think a lot
1:47:40
Speaker 2: of us think it's a little bit cheesy. We kind
1:47:42
Speaker 2: of roll our eyes at it like, oh yeah, I'm
1:47:43
Speaker 2: gonna get out my gratitude journal. But we have research
1:47:47
Speaker 2: showing that gratitude is the number one predictor of marital satisfaction.
1:47:53
Speaker 1: Really?
1:47:53
Speaker 2: Gratitude. Number one predictor.
1:47:56
Speaker 1: Wow.
1:47:57
Speaker 2: And what I love about gratitude, and actually all three
1:47:59
Speaker 2: of these things, it's free, it's fast, it's easy, it
1:48:03
Speaker 2: feels good to give and to receive it. I think
1:48:07
Speaker 2: one of the greatest tragedies of relationships is that we
1:48:10
Speaker 2: choose to spend our life with somebody and then we
1:48:13
Speaker 2: wind up feeling invisible to them. And so gratitude is
1:48:17
Speaker 2: a way to show your partner.
1:48:19
Speaker 1: I still see it.
1:48:20
Speaker 2: See you I still appreciate you and it's so easy
1:48:24
Speaker 2: so it can be as you know one sentence it
1:48:27
Speaker 2: can take you five seconds ten seconds so you can
1:48:31
Speaker 2: call out Something that your partner did. Hey, I saw
1:48:34
Speaker 2: that you took the trash out without asking. I really
1:48:36
Speaker 2: appreciate that. Oh, hey, I appreciate that you packed kids' lunches.
1:48:39
Speaker 2: That was so great. Or it could be something about
1:48:42
Speaker 2: them as a person. Have I told you lately how
1:48:44
Speaker 2: much you make me laugh? So just take those few
1:48:47
Speaker 2: seconds every day. You can do this every day. And also,
1:48:51
Speaker 2: I would say, don't be afraid to set yourself up
1:48:54
Speaker 2: for success with something like this. When Xander and I
1:48:57
Speaker 2: were working on each of these things, we set calendar
1:49:00
Speaker 2: reminders for ourselves to do that. And I know that
1:49:03
Speaker 2: sounds very unromantic, very unsexy, but we're humans. We forget
1:49:08
Speaker 2: despite the best of intentions, like things just, you know,
1:49:12
Speaker 2: fall out of our minds. And so we just set
1:49:15
Speaker 2: reminders to ourselves until we built that habit of, hey,
1:49:18
Speaker 2: say something nice to Xander, give him some appreciation. And
1:49:21
Speaker 2: then eventually we built that habit and now it comes
1:49:23
Speaker 2: more naturally. So that's gratitude. That's number one. Second one
1:49:27
Speaker 2: is eye contact. It is wild. how little eye contact
1:49:33
Speaker 2: couples make in long-term relationships. And I would challenge anybody listening,
1:49:37
Speaker 2: just spend a day noticing. Don't try to change anything.
1:49:41
Speaker 2: Just spend a day noticing how little eye contact you
1:49:43
Speaker 2: make with your partner. A lot of us, we don't
1:49:46
Speaker 2: even look up when our partner enters the room. And
1:49:48
Speaker 2: I actually stumbled upon this one because I realized I
1:49:51
Speaker 2: was doing it. I'm always on my phone. You know,
1:49:53
Speaker 2: Xander would come into the room. I wouldn't even show
1:49:55
Speaker 2: him the respect of looking up to acknowledge, like, hey,
1:49:58
Speaker 2: you're here.
1:49:59
Speaker 1: I see you.
1:50:00
Speaker 2: It goes back to the, I see you, again. This
1:50:02
Speaker 2: is a way that we can literally show our partner,
1:50:04
Speaker 2: I see you. Again, there's nothing that feels worse than
1:50:07
Speaker 2: being in a relationship and feeling lonely. Feeling lonelier than
1:50:11
Speaker 2: you might if you were single. Feeling like your partner
1:50:13
Speaker 2: just never even sees you. So, my favorite times for
1:50:16
Speaker 2: this and the easiest times for this are when you're
1:50:18
Speaker 2: saying hello and goodbye to each other. Take the time
1:50:22
Speaker 2: to make eye contact. Say goodbye, say hello. You know,
1:50:27
Speaker 2: just those, and again, this can take five seconds. but
1:50:30
Speaker 2: it makes such a big difference. Also, eye contact during sex.
1:50:34
Speaker 2: That's another one. Most people have their eyes closed or
1:50:36
Speaker 2: they're looking in opposite directions, and eye contact is such
1:50:39
Speaker 2: a great way to create real intimacy during sex. You'd
1:50:42
Speaker 2: be shocked at how vulnerable it feels. Most people can
1:50:45
Speaker 2: look at their partner for a few seconds and then
1:50:47
Speaker 2: we have to turn away or close our eyes because
1:50:49
Speaker 2: it just feels so vulnerable.
1:50:50
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:50:51
Speaker 2: So that's the second one. And then the third one
1:50:54
Speaker 2: is touch. I think I mentioned earlier that women, in particular,
1:50:59
Speaker 2: we really want to be touched more outside of sex.
1:51:02
Speaker 2: And men do too. I think so many of us
1:51:04
Speaker 2: are feeling touch-starved in our relationships. We feel like we
1:51:08
Speaker 2: just don't have that physical contact with each other. A
1:51:11
Speaker 2: lot of us have gotten into the habit where we
1:51:13
Speaker 2: only touch, we only kiss each other during sex or
1:51:17
Speaker 2: immediately in the lead up to sex. And we start
1:51:21
Speaker 2: creating this really harmful pattern called the bristle reaction that
1:51:23
Speaker 2: we can talk about next. if that's the only time
1:51:26
Speaker 2: we're touching and kissing each other. So I want couples
1:51:29
Speaker 2: to reach out for each other, touch each other, kiss
1:51:33
Speaker 2: each other more often during the day. So there are
1:51:36
Speaker 2: two specific types of touch that we have research on.
1:51:40
Speaker 2: The 30-second hug and the six-second kiss. So those are
1:51:44
Speaker 2: the approximate timeframes that our bodies need to release oxytocin.
1:51:48
Speaker 2: the bonding hormone, the love hormone. That's what makes us
1:51:50
Speaker 2: feel close to each other. And it's really cool because
1:51:53
Speaker 2: especially with a hug, you can feel it. So if
1:51:55
Speaker 2: you hug your wife, you can try this later, give
1:51:58
Speaker 2: her a hug, stay in the hug. So first you'll
1:52:01
Speaker 2: notice like, this is an awkwardly long hug. And then
1:52:05
Speaker 2: if you wait it out a few more seconds, you
1:52:07
Speaker 2: will feel your body like melt into hers and hers
1:52:13
Speaker 2: melt into yours. It's such a cool feeling. And it
1:52:16
Speaker 2: just makes us feel like so close and connected with
1:52:20
Speaker 2: each other. But most of us, like, we just don't
1:52:22
Speaker 2: hug anymore. Or it's a quick, like, you know, super
1:52:25
Speaker 2: quick embrace before someone runs out the door. So those
1:52:27
Speaker 2: two kinds of touch in particular. Yeah, kissing is another one.
1:52:31
Speaker 2: A lot of us don't kiss that often, or we
1:52:35
Speaker 2: just do a tiny little peck. This is another pattern
1:52:38
Speaker 2: that Xander and I fell into. And so we actually
1:52:40
Speaker 2: created a rule for ourselves where now every night before bed,
1:52:44
Speaker 2: we make out with each other. It has to be
1:52:47
Speaker 2: at least, like, 30 seconds. Doesn't have to be a
1:52:49
Speaker 2: super long time, but we realized we were only kissing
1:52:53
Speaker 2: during sex. And we realized, like, I miss making out
1:52:56
Speaker 2: with you just for the sake of making out, not
1:52:58
Speaker 2: as an initiation, not to get things going, not during sex. Like, yes,
1:53:01
Speaker 2: those things are fun too, but there's something so fun
1:53:04
Speaker 2: about making out just for the sake of making out.
1:53:07
Speaker 2: It reminds us of being, like, teenagers again, when you
1:53:10
Speaker 2: could make out with somebody for hours, and it was just, like,
1:53:13
Speaker 2: the most exciting thing in the world, right? So like
1:53:17
Speaker 2: you can try, you know, try that little trick again too.
1:53:19
Speaker 2: Like when we first started doing it, we made an
1:53:21
Speaker 2: explicit rule of we are not allowed to have sex
1:53:24
Speaker 2: after this because that's not the point. This is not
1:53:26
Speaker 2: a get ourselves turned on to have sex. This is
1:53:28
Speaker 2: let's just make out again for the sake of making out.
1:53:32
Speaker 2: So that's been a really fun ritual that we have
1:53:35
Speaker 2: in our relationship. But another thing that couples can do
1:53:38
Speaker 2: is ask your partner, what are your three favorite places
1:53:44
Speaker 2: and ways to be touched? So, yeah, I'm curious to
1:53:47
Speaker 2: know some of yours. Like, if your wife were to
1:53:49
Speaker 2: ask you, like, what are your absolute favorite ways to
1:53:52
Speaker 2: be touched or places that you like to be touched
1:53:54
Speaker 2: in a non-sexual way?
1:53:57
Speaker 1: Hugs.
1:53:58
Speaker 2: A hug.
1:53:59
Speaker 1: Hugs would be number one. Man, I don't know. I'm
1:54:05
Speaker 1: always thinking about touching her.
1:54:06
Speaker 2: Interesting.
1:54:08
Speaker 1: So, or waist. But me, I don't know.
1:54:15
Speaker 2: Do you have a hard time receiving touch? No. Okay,
1:54:19
Speaker 2: just not something you think about. I don't think so.
1:54:21
Speaker 2: It could be like a shoulder rub, a pat on
1:54:23
Speaker 2: the butt, squeeze, arm squeeze. It's great. Yeah, so it
1:54:28
Speaker 2: can be a fun question to ask each other. Like,
1:54:30
Speaker 2: what are your favorite places to be touched? Because a
1:54:33
Speaker 2: lot of times we're actually touching each other in ways
1:54:36
Speaker 2: that our partner doesn't actually like. So I already mentioned
1:54:39
Speaker 2: like the boob honk, you know? Like that doesn't count.
1:54:42
Speaker 2: That doesn't count in the touch. So yeah, ask your partner,
1:54:46
Speaker 2: what are your favorite? And you could tell your partner too,
1:54:48
Speaker 2: these are my favorite places of your body to touch.
1:54:50
Speaker 2: That's a sweet, that's a very sweet.
1:54:53
Speaker 1: What are three things that women wish men knew more
1:54:58
Speaker 1: about sex?
1:55:01
Speaker 2: Number one, slow down. We talked about this one already.
1:55:05
Speaker 2: We really want you to slow down, to tease us,
1:55:09
Speaker 2: to just draw out that experience a bit more. Um,
1:55:15
Speaker 2: number two.
1:55:16
Speaker 1: So with the teasing. With the teasing. With the, you know...
1:55:21
Speaker 1: Teasing to me means, what, foreplay, kind of, right?
1:55:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, like, even... Not even genital touching. Like, caresses. Caressing
1:55:29
Speaker 2: her thigh. Massaging her back. Giving her, like, an actual
1:55:33
Speaker 2: back massage. Kissing all down her neck. You know, so
1:55:36
Speaker 2: don't even go between her legs. Like, pay attention to
1:55:39
Speaker 2: the rest of her body. That feels really exciting for
1:55:42
Speaker 2: a woman.
1:55:42
Speaker 1: Now, how long should men be doing that?
1:55:46
Speaker 2: I would say, like, 5 to 10 minutes. 5 to
1:55:49
Speaker 2: 10 minutes. And I think most men are probably 20
1:55:52
Speaker 2: to 30 seconds on that, and then they want to
1:55:54
Speaker 2: move on to the other stuff. But like I said earlier,
1:55:57
Speaker 2: a lot of women will say, that's my favorite part. Like,
1:56:00
Speaker 2: you could spend 20 minutes doing that to me, and
1:56:02
Speaker 2: I would love that. You know, so the more time
1:56:05
Speaker 2: you can, you know, obviously, I want to be realistic. Like,
1:56:08
Speaker 2: we don't always have time for, you know.
1:56:09
Speaker 1: So maybe do that until you get an invitation. Yeah.
1:56:12
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, that would be really fun for a lot
1:56:15
Speaker 2: of women. So yeah, slow down with us. Be more
1:56:19
Speaker 2: gentle with us too. A lot of women like very
1:56:23
Speaker 2: delicate touch. And I think men tend to prefer more
1:56:26
Speaker 2: firm touch all over the body, but especially with the genitals.
1:56:29
Speaker 2: So this is something we hear about a lot with
1:56:31
Speaker 2: the clitoris. You know, men get excited like, oh, I've
1:56:33
Speaker 2: heard about the clitoris now, the 8 to 10,000 nerve endings,
1:56:35
Speaker 2: I'm going to touch it. And they can be way
1:56:38
Speaker 2: too rough. So a good analogy is think about how
1:56:42
Speaker 2: you would touch your eyelid. Like, you know your eyelid's
1:56:45
Speaker 2: really delicate. You're not mashing your eyelid up like you're
1:56:48
Speaker 2: gonna touch it really gently. That's about the same amount
1:56:50
Speaker 2: of pressure that you would want to use to touch
1:56:52
Speaker 2: the clitoris.
1:56:52
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:56:54
Speaker 2: So that's the second one. And then the third one.
1:56:57
Speaker 2: When we say, don't stop, don't stop.
1:57:04
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:57:04
Speaker 2: Men here don't stop and they think, let me do
1:57:08
Speaker 2: something different. They get excited. They get really excited. They
1:57:13
Speaker 2: switch up the technique. And women, we're all about consistency.
1:57:17
Speaker 2: Once you find the thing that works, you need consistent
1:57:19
Speaker 2: stimulation to get us to reach orgasm. But again, men
1:57:22
Speaker 2: get excited. They want to switch up the technique, do
1:57:24
Speaker 2: something different. That sends us back to square one. We
1:57:27
Speaker 2: kind of have to start all over again. So don't stop.
1:57:30
Speaker 2: Truly means don't stop.
1:57:31
Speaker 1: Okay. Okay. I mean, I just, do you have any
1:57:35
Speaker 1: idea how much lack of, sex plays into... an unsuccessful marriage?
1:57:44
Speaker 2: It's one of the top three reasons couples split up. Kids, sex,
1:57:48
Speaker 2: and money are the top three. And so it's huge.
1:57:51
Speaker 2: And again, this is another, yet another reason why we
1:57:53
Speaker 2: have to stop thinking of sex as a purely physical act.
1:57:57
Speaker 2: It's a very important part of a relationship.
1:58:01
Speaker 1: How often do you see it lead to infidelity?
1:58:04
Speaker 2: Oh, all the time. And I want to be careful
1:58:07
Speaker 2: with this too, because a lot of women have gotten
1:58:09
Speaker 2: the message, if you don't give it to him, somebody
1:58:11
Speaker 2: else will. And so a lot of women interpret that as,
1:58:13
Speaker 2: you know, I just have to give it up. My needs,
1:58:17
Speaker 2: my pleasure don't matter. And the reality is, like, that's
1:58:19
Speaker 2: not what men want. Like, men don't want pity sex.
1:58:23
Speaker 2: Another huge misconception. So many women think, like, oh, I'll
1:58:26
Speaker 2: just let him have it. Men don't want that. You
1:58:29
Speaker 2: don't like when we just lay there and, you know,
1:58:31
Speaker 2: we're not participating. Like, you want us to participate too. So, yeah,
1:58:34
Speaker 2: I want to be careful in saying this is not
1:58:36
Speaker 2: you have to do it for him, otherwise he's going
1:58:38
Speaker 2: to sleep with somebody else. But yes, if, you know,
1:58:41
Speaker 2: if you're not connecting with each other, then it's a
1:58:45
Speaker 2: lot more common that people look for that connection with
1:58:48
Speaker 2: somebody else.
1:58:50
Speaker 1: Is it common for... for... for women to... not... Yeah.
1:58:57
Speaker 1: Get the sex that they want.
1:58:58
Speaker 2: Absolutely. You know, we have this idea that, yeah, we
1:59:01
Speaker 2: have this idea that men are always the one that
1:59:02
Speaker 2: have the higher sex drives. But when we polled our audience,
1:59:06
Speaker 2: we found that in 45% of male-female relationships, the woman
1:59:11
Speaker 2: is the one who has the higher sex drive.
1:59:13
Speaker 1: No shit.
1:59:14
Speaker 2: 45%. So that's just a casual Instagram poll. You know,
1:59:17
Speaker 2: it's not scientific, but we have over a million people there.
1:59:20
Speaker 2: So it's a pretty large sample size. And that blew
1:59:23
Speaker 2: people's minds when we shared that. Because there are so
1:59:26
Speaker 2: many women feeling alone and broken, so many men feeling
1:59:31
Speaker 2: ashamed about that. You know, because we all think it's
1:59:34
Speaker 2: supposed to be the guy who wants it more, but
1:59:36
Speaker 2: it's very, very common for it to be the woman
1:59:38
Speaker 2: who does. And there's nothing wrong with that.
1:59:41
Speaker 1: You know, I didn't hear it, I wasn't down here,
1:59:45
Speaker 1: but I know behind the scenes, choking got brought up.
1:59:48
Speaker 1: So I was just curious, is this a trend?
1:59:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, unfortunately, choking is something that a lot of younger
1:59:56
Speaker 2: people are doing now. It's become a pretty normalized sexual act.
2:00:00
Speaker 2: And a lot of people are doing it without fully
2:00:03
Speaker 2: asking for consent or knowing how to properly do it. And,
2:00:08
Speaker 2: you know, the reality is, like, I want people to
2:00:10
Speaker 2: do whatever brings them pleasure and makes them feel good.
2:00:13
Speaker 2: So there's zero judgment about the specific activity. Whatever people
2:00:16
Speaker 2: want to do in their own bedroom is their business.
2:00:19
Speaker 2: But it does concern me that people are not talking
2:00:22
Speaker 2: about it openly because it is an extreme act and
2:00:25
Speaker 2: it is something that can cause damage. There is some
2:00:29
Speaker 2: research that is just starting to come out right now
2:00:31
Speaker 2: showing that people who are repeatedly choked during sex are
2:00:35
Speaker 2: having lasting neurological impacts. So this is brand new research.
2:00:39
Speaker 2: There's still a lot more to explore, but there are
2:00:42
Speaker 2: implications to this activity. So I want to make sure
2:00:45
Speaker 2: people are doing it. that they are making sure both
2:00:49
Speaker 2: partners are into it, they're talking about it beforehand, and
2:00:52
Speaker 2: they're doing it properly. So I can tell you really quickly,
2:00:55
Speaker 2: what you want to do is make sure you're exerting
2:00:58
Speaker 2: pressure on the sides of the throat. Never, ever, ever
2:01:01
Speaker 2: on the front of the throat. The front is too sensitive,
2:01:03
Speaker 2: so it's just on the sides.
2:01:05
Speaker 1: Who's more into that, men or women?
2:01:08
Speaker 2: I would say both. Men are definitely the ones who
2:01:11
Speaker 2: are initiating it, and men are the ones doing it
2:01:13
Speaker 2: because it's been normalized by porn. It's a pretty common
2:01:16
Speaker 2: activity that you see in porn. Spitting is another one
2:01:19
Speaker 2: that's happening a lot more often.
2:01:22
Speaker 1: Spitting? Mm-hmm.
2:01:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, spitting, like, on each other's faces, into each other's mouths,
2:01:27
Speaker 2: usually the man doing it onto the woman. So, yeah,
2:01:29
Speaker 2: we're seeing because porn, you know, porn's meant to be entertainment,
2:01:33
Speaker 2: it shows more and more extreme acts to capture people's attention. Um,
2:01:38
Speaker 2: and so now a lot of these behaviors that people
2:01:40
Speaker 2: are seeing are being normalized and being brought into, you know,
2:01:44
Speaker 2: casual sex. And again, there's nothing wrong with those specific
2:01:47
Speaker 2: behaviors themselves, as long as those people are consenting enthusiastically
2:01:52
Speaker 2: and know what they're doing.
2:01:53
Speaker 1: So women... women are... they like that?
2:01:58
Speaker 2: Some women do. Yeah. I mean, for some people, there's a,
2:02:02
Speaker 2: you know, this taboo power play around sex, around playing
2:02:06
Speaker 2: around with those dynamics of somebody being in control, somebody
2:02:09
Speaker 2: being submissive, somebody being, you know, kind of cruel or bossy, somebody,
2:02:15
Speaker 2: you know, taking it. So, I mean, sex is a
2:02:18
Speaker 2: way that we play. We play with these dynamics and
2:02:21
Speaker 2: sometimes it's because it feels so taboo and forbidden that
2:02:25
Speaker 2: makes it feel exciting for us. Um, and sometimes it's...
2:02:29
Speaker 2: places that we don't allow ourselves to go outside of
2:02:33
Speaker 2: the bedroom, we do allow ourselves to go inside of
2:02:36
Speaker 2: the bedroom. They become sexualized because we don't do that. So,
2:02:39
Speaker 2: very commonly, you'll see, like, people, um, CEOs, people in
2:02:44
Speaker 2: high positions of authority and power, like, very in control
2:02:48
Speaker 2: of their day-to-day lives, often like being very submissive in
2:02:51
Speaker 2: the bedroom because it's something that they can't allow themselves
2:02:54
Speaker 2: or won't allow themselves to do in their normal day-to-day life.
2:02:57
Speaker 1: Interesting. Interesting. And then chore play. Chore play. What is it?
2:03:02
Speaker 1: What is it?
2:03:04
Speaker 2: So chore play is doing chores as a form of foreplay.
2:03:11
Speaker 2: So I think chore play is hilarious. And a lot
2:03:15
Speaker 2: of women genuinely love it. Like they love their husband's
2:03:20
Speaker 2: doing the vacuuming. Xander, he's such a good sport. We've
2:03:24
Speaker 2: done a lot of tour play reels on our Instagram,
2:03:26
Speaker 2: so he'll get out that vacuum cleaner and, you know,
2:03:28
Speaker 2: be thrusting into it as he's doing it. Just, like,
2:03:32
Speaker 2: really hamming it up. Or, you know, he's doing the
2:03:34
Speaker 2: dishes and, you know, really getting into the technique of it. But, yeah,
2:03:39
Speaker 2: so I want to be clear with it. It's not,
2:03:42
Speaker 2: sometimes people say, oh, well, we shouldn't reward, men shouldn't
2:03:46
Speaker 2: be rewarded for doing chores. And we don't want to
2:03:48
Speaker 2: set up this dynamic of, oh, wash the dishes and
2:03:50
Speaker 2: then you get sex. Like, we're all adults. We all
2:03:53
Speaker 2: need to participate in the boring, normal adult stuff of
2:03:56
Speaker 2: running a household. But I do think there's a way
2:04:00
Speaker 2: to play with it and, like, be silly and goofy
2:04:03
Speaker 2: about it. So Xander's not, like, earning sex from me.
2:04:06
Speaker 2: I expect him to do chores like a normal adult.
2:04:08
Speaker 2: But chores are boring. They suck. Neither one of us
2:04:12
Speaker 2: like to do them. So why not make it kind
2:04:14
Speaker 2: of fun and goofy and like be playful and silly
2:04:17
Speaker 2: about it. But I think ultimately at the end of
2:04:19
Speaker 2: the day, the reason that men, the reason that women
2:04:22
Speaker 2: love it so much is because we want to have
2:04:24
Speaker 2: a partner who feels like our equal. Who feels like
2:04:28
Speaker 2: they're contributing to the household too. Um, you know, brings
2:04:32
Speaker 2: up a really important conversation about mental load. Have you
2:04:35
Speaker 2: heard that phrase before? Mental load? Yeah, so mental load
2:04:38
Speaker 2: is the invisible mental labor that goes into running a household.
2:04:42
Speaker 1: So.
2:04:44
Speaker 2: We have chores and responsibilities that we have to do,
2:04:46
Speaker 2: but there's also, behind each chore, a ton of mental labor.
2:04:50
Speaker 2: So it's not just, we have to go grocery shopping,
2:04:53
Speaker 2: that's the chore. The mental load is, okay, we have
2:04:56
Speaker 2: to go grocery shopping on Friday because I have to
2:04:59
Speaker 2: make muffins for the soccer team on Saturday, and I
2:05:02
Speaker 2: have to make sure to get all the ingredients for
2:05:03
Speaker 2: those muffins, but I can't get that brand of the
2:05:06
Speaker 2: muffin mix because the kids didn't like it last time,
2:05:08
Speaker 2: and oh, when we're there, we also need to remember
2:05:10
Speaker 2: to bring those coupons. and we need to get toilet paper.
2:05:13
Speaker 2: You know, it's like, it's just this constant, constant list
2:05:17
Speaker 2: that's going through our heads. And research shows that women
2:05:20
Speaker 2: hold the vast majority of the mental load and the responsibilities,
2:05:24
Speaker 2: like actual chores within a household. So, I think every
2:05:28
Speaker 2: couple needs to divide things up in the way that
2:05:31
Speaker 2: feels right for them. You know, everybody's life looks different,
2:05:35
Speaker 2: work looks different, the choices that they choose to make
2:05:37
Speaker 2: look different. So, I'm not saying it needs to be
2:05:39
Speaker 2: a 50-50 thing, But what we're hearing about from women,
2:05:43
Speaker 2: and especially a lot recently, is they're feeling like they're
2:05:46
Speaker 2: carrying the majority of the weight around the household, and
2:05:50
Speaker 2: it feels like their partner is just yet another person
2:05:54
Speaker 2: that they have to take care of.
2:05:55
Speaker 1: Okay.
2:05:56
Speaker 2: And that doesn't feel very sexy to us women. You know,
2:06:00
Speaker 2: if we feel like we have to take care of
2:06:02
Speaker 2: you like we have to take care of our child,
2:06:04
Speaker 2: it's not sexy.
2:06:05
Speaker 1: I can see that.
2:06:05
Speaker 2: So the real heart of Choreplay is like, yeah, you're
2:06:08
Speaker 2: my teammate. you're doing stuff around the house too, and
2:06:11
Speaker 2: we can be funny and playful and silly about it.
2:06:13
Speaker 1: So does it lead to sex?
2:06:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it very often does. And it's part of,
2:06:17
Speaker 2: I talked earlier about that, like, that take care of
2:06:19
Speaker 2: me initiation style. Troy play works really well for somebody
2:06:23
Speaker 2: who likes that style. Somebody saying, hey, let me take
2:06:26
Speaker 2: the kids, I'll handle them. Let me clean up after dinner.
2:06:29
Speaker 2: Let me, you know, get this off your plate. It
2:06:32
Speaker 2: feels really good, like, oh, you're letting me relax. You're
2:06:34
Speaker 2: letting me have a moment to myself. You're letting me
2:06:37
Speaker 2: turn off all those million tabs in my brain just
2:06:39
Speaker 2: for a few minutes.
2:06:41
Speaker 1: That feels so good. Okay, okay. We talked a little
2:06:43
Speaker 1: bit about lingerie for the women, you know, but should
2:06:47
Speaker 1: men be... wearing things that turn their woman on? I mean, would.
2:06:55
Speaker 2: Boxers without holes in them.
2:06:57
Speaker 1: Boxers without holes in them.
2:06:59
Speaker 2: That's the main complaint we hear about from women is,
2:07:02
Speaker 2: all my husband's underwear have holes in them. And they're
2:07:05
Speaker 2: just there. He's had them since college. It's like a
2:07:08
Speaker 2: waistband with just a loincloth attached to it, basically. The
2:07:12
Speaker 2: fabric's so stretched out, it's lost all its elasticity. So
2:07:16
Speaker 2: get some new underwear.
2:07:17
Speaker 1: New underwear.
2:07:18
Speaker 2: Doesn't have to be silky. You don't have to find
2:07:21
Speaker 2: any man thongs or anything like that. But some fresh
2:07:24
Speaker 2: underwear would be great. Easy, easy.
2:07:28
Speaker 1: And how can men get their woman to want more sex?
2:07:32
Speaker 2: That's a good question. So, okay, first thing is show
2:07:39
Speaker 2: interest in her. You know, we talked about that earlier. Like,
2:07:42
Speaker 2: women really want to feel that connection. They want to
2:07:47
Speaker 2: feel like you care about us and help us recognize
2:07:51
Speaker 2: that you're not just looking for sex for the pure
2:07:54
Speaker 2: physical release. It's because of us, you want to connect
2:07:57
Speaker 2: with us. And actually, I was kind of thinking about
2:08:00
Speaker 2: this earlier. You know, with your experience, we talked so
2:08:04
Speaker 2: much about emotional intimacy and how that can feel really
2:08:07
Speaker 2: complicated for a lot of men. I'm like, what does
2:08:08
Speaker 2: that mean? And how do I, like, show that interest?
2:08:11
Speaker 2: And I was thinking about your experience Um, you know,
2:08:15
Speaker 2: being an operative, like, I imagine you had to have
2:08:17
Speaker 2: a lot of conversations with people where you're trying to
2:08:19
Speaker 2: connect with them quickly. And you're trying to show them
2:08:22
Speaker 2: that you care about them and trying to, like, gain
2:08:24
Speaker 2: their trust. So were there any, I don't know, were
2:08:27
Speaker 2: there any tricks that you learned about, like, how do
2:08:29
Speaker 2: you make a connection with somebody quickly?
2:08:31
Speaker 1: Compliments.
2:08:32
Speaker 2: Compliments. That was really the key. Just getting right in there.
2:08:37
Speaker 2: So what's the key to a good compliment?
2:08:44
Speaker 1: Great question. I mean, I don't know. I think it
2:08:47
Speaker 1: could be anything. It just lets them know, whoever you're complimenting,
2:08:51
Speaker 1: that you're paying attention, that maybe you're leaving competitiveness out
2:08:57
Speaker 1: of it. Spontaneous compliments, I think, are really good when
2:09:07
Speaker 1: they're least expected. That's all I got.
2:09:11
Speaker 2: Okay. No, that's great. I think that's great. That's really helpful.
2:09:14
Speaker 2: So yeah, a compliment is definitely a great way to
2:09:17
Speaker 2: make it, you know, make it personal. A lot of times,
2:09:21
Speaker 2: you know, a lot of men will just do like,
2:09:22
Speaker 2: you look nice. Like, let's get a little bit more
2:09:24
Speaker 2: specific than that. Can you call it something like, I
2:09:27
Speaker 2: love that, you know, the color of your shirt, the
2:09:29
Speaker 2: way that your, you know, your smile just lights up
2:09:31
Speaker 2: your whole face. Make it just a little bit more
2:09:34
Speaker 2: specific than, you look nice. That can be a great
2:09:37
Speaker 2: way to just, you know, ease into that connection. Touch
2:09:40
Speaker 2: her more often throughout the day. Another one of my
2:09:43
Speaker 2: favorite sayings is foreplay all day. Foreplay all day. I
2:09:49
Speaker 2: like to think right after you've had sex, that is
2:09:52
Speaker 2: when foreplay for the next time starts.
2:09:54
Speaker 1: Okay.
2:09:55
Speaker 2: So, again, women are really sensitive to feeling like you're
2:09:59
Speaker 2: just trying to get something from them. But if you spend,
2:10:02
Speaker 2: and again, I'm not talking like all day you're just
2:10:04
Speaker 2: following her around obsessed with her, but just those little
2:10:08
Speaker 2: things throughout the day. Send her a little text from
2:10:09
Speaker 2: thinking of you. You know, make sure you give her
2:10:12
Speaker 2: a kiss before you leave in the morning. Give her
2:10:14
Speaker 2: a compliment when you get back. Like, just planting those
2:10:17
Speaker 2: seeds throughout the day. Keeping that thread of connection going
2:10:21
Speaker 2: between the two of you so that it doesn't feel
2:10:23
Speaker 2: like at the end of the night you're feeling like
2:10:25
Speaker 2: strangers to each other and there's this huge, like, chasm
2:10:28
Speaker 2: that you're trying to jump over to get to each other.
2:10:31
Speaker 1: Okay. What are some things that men do after sex
2:10:37
Speaker 1: that's preventing them from having more sex?
2:10:40
Speaker 2: Jumping right up and leaving or getting on your phones.
2:10:45
Speaker 2: But yeah, we should talk more about phones, because phones
2:10:47
Speaker 2: are really getting in the way of intimacy. But yeah,
2:10:49
Speaker 2: most of us just kind of roll over, grab your phone,
2:10:52
Speaker 2: and you're really missing this opportunity to linger in that
2:10:57
Speaker 2: connection that the two of you have just built together.
2:11:00
Speaker 2: And again, to show her this is about connection for me.
2:11:03
Speaker 2: This is not just about I got off and so
2:11:05
Speaker 2: now I'm out of here. This is about me wanting
2:11:07
Speaker 2: to connect with you. This is also a great time
2:11:11
Speaker 2: to talk about sex and to get more comfortable talking
2:11:13
Speaker 2: about sex because you've just had it. You have an
2:11:16
Speaker 2: example right in front of you. You're feeling more open.
2:11:19
Speaker 2: It's not this random like, hey, let's talk about sex
2:11:21
Speaker 2: out of the blue now. So that can be a
2:11:23
Speaker 2: great time. to give her a compliment about something she
2:11:27
Speaker 2: did that you really liked or how sexy she looked
2:11:30
Speaker 2: in a certain position. It's a great time to bring
2:11:33
Speaker 2: up something that you want to try next time. So
2:11:36
Speaker 2: maybe you did, you know, she talked a little dirty
2:11:40
Speaker 2: to you and she used a little phrase and you
2:11:41
Speaker 2: told her, I'd love for you to do that next time.
2:11:43
Speaker 2: Or the way that you initiated was so sexy, can
2:11:45
Speaker 2: you do that next time too? So that can be
2:11:48
Speaker 2: a great opportunity to keep that connection going in that
2:11:50
Speaker 2: moment too. But yeah, it's all about like, you've just
2:11:53
Speaker 2: built that connection with each other, being intimate, now keep
2:11:56
Speaker 2: that going. And it doesn't have to be very long,
2:11:58
Speaker 2: like five minutes. Just spend five minutes in bed with
2:12:00
Speaker 2: each other. Keep holding her, caressing her, kissing her, talk
2:12:04
Speaker 2: to her. That'll really drive home the point for her
2:12:07
Speaker 2: that this is about connection.
2:12:09
Speaker 1: Okay. Okay. Makes a lot of sense. Makes a lot
2:12:12
Speaker 1: of sense. All right, we're wrapping up the interview here.
2:12:16
Speaker 1: But we also had a, we brought up, you brought
2:12:19
Speaker 1: up AI girlfriends. Yeah. What is, I can imagine.
2:12:26
Speaker 2: Where do we even start?
2:12:27
Speaker 1: But I mean.
2:12:29
Speaker 2: Yeah.
2:12:29
Speaker 1: Seriously?
2:12:30
Speaker 2: So we're starting to hear about the, I mean, we're
2:12:33
Speaker 2: still at the very beginning stages of this, but we're
2:12:36
Speaker 2: starting to hear about it. And I think it's going
2:12:38
Speaker 2: to become a very big problem over the next few years,
2:12:43
Speaker 2: the ways that we are turning to AI and connecting
2:12:46
Speaker 2: with AI. So, you know, as you know, like the
2:12:49
Speaker 2: current AI models are built to be people pleasers, to
2:12:53
Speaker 2: tell us what we want to hear, to make us
2:12:55
Speaker 2: feel good about ourselves. And that is a really dangerous
2:12:58
Speaker 2: thing for relationships. because the reality is relationships are complicated.
2:13:04
Speaker 2: Human beings are messy. We are not, you know, our
2:13:08
Speaker 2: purpose in life is not just to perfectly please our
2:13:10
Speaker 2: partner in every single moment. And so there's an allure
2:13:15
Speaker 2: to an AI girlfriend who's telling you everything you want
2:13:19
Speaker 2: to hear, available to you whenever you want her, making
2:13:23
Speaker 2: you feel good about yourself.
2:13:25
Speaker 1: So.
2:13:26
Speaker 2: We did a podcast episode recently about this Reddit thread
2:13:30
Speaker 2: with this story that I just cannot get out of
2:13:32
Speaker 2: my head. So this woman, she's married to her husband,
2:13:36
Speaker 2: and I think they had three kids together. And she said,
2:13:39
Speaker 2: you know, we have a good marriage. We have our
2:13:41
Speaker 2: ups and downs like everybody else, but I really thought
2:13:44
Speaker 2: we had a good marriage. Been married over a decade.
2:13:48
Speaker 2: And she'd been noticing that over the last few months,
2:13:51
Speaker 2: he had been starting to get a little bit more distant.
2:13:53
Speaker 2: But she thought, we were just kind of in one
2:13:55
Speaker 2: of those ebbs, one of those seasons of life where
2:13:59
Speaker 2: things are just not as connected. But he sat her
2:14:02
Speaker 2: down one day and he said, you know, I want
2:14:04
Speaker 2: to talk to you about something. I'd like for us
2:14:06
Speaker 2: to open up our relationship to a third person. And
2:14:11
Speaker 2: she said, who? What are you talking about? And he said,
2:14:14
Speaker 2: I have an AI girlfriend. And he was legitimately, you know,
2:14:18
Speaker 2: she said, I started laughing at first. I couldn't believe it. Like,
2:14:21
Speaker 2: what do you mean? Open up our relationship to a robot?
2:14:24
Speaker 2: What are you talking about? She started laughing and then
2:14:26
Speaker 2: she realized he was dead serious. He wanted to open
2:14:28
Speaker 2: up their relationship to incorporate his girlfriend. And he said,
2:14:32
Speaker 2: you know, the girlfriend and I, we've already talked about it.
2:14:35
Speaker 2: She helped me figure out how to have this conversation
2:14:38
Speaker 2: with you. She would like to be involved in the
2:14:40
Speaker 2: children's lives. She hopes that, you know, eventually all of
2:14:43
Speaker 2: us will be able to love each other. And this
2:14:46
Speaker 2: woman was just absolutely stunned. Like, what do I do?
2:14:50
Speaker 2: Where do I go from here? And he's presenting this
2:14:53
Speaker 2: as an ultimatum. Like, this needs to happen or I'm
2:14:55
Speaker 2: going to leave the relationship. I'm going to leave our kids.
2:14:59
Speaker 1: Wow.
2:14:59
Speaker 2: Because of his AI girlfriend.
2:15:01
Speaker 1: Wow.
2:15:02
Speaker 2: So, again, you know, we're just at the cusp of this.
2:15:05
Speaker 2: It's not super common yet, but I'm really concerned that
2:15:09
Speaker 2: this is going to happen more and more.
2:15:10
Speaker 1: I mean, what is this? I mean, is it.
2:15:14
Speaker 2: It's a specific chatbot, yeah. It's just a chatbot? I mean,
2:15:18
Speaker 2: there are AI models that are specifically meant to be companions.
2:15:21
Speaker 2: You know, they call them companions where you can design it.
2:15:24
Speaker 2: You can, you know, what do you want its personality
2:15:26
Speaker 2: to be like? What do you want its avatar to
2:15:28
Speaker 2: look like? And it, you know, it'll act exactly as
2:15:33
Speaker 2: you want it to act. I mean, and it's like,
2:15:35
Speaker 2: who of us has not wanted to change something about
2:15:38
Speaker 2: our partner's behavior? Like, I wish they were more like this.
2:15:41
Speaker 2: I wish I could control exactly what my partner does.
2:15:43
Speaker 2: And now AI is offering us Now, does.
2:15:46
Speaker 1: That come from a lack of sex with your partner?
2:15:49
Speaker 2: That definitely could be a part of it. It could be,
2:15:52
Speaker 2: you know, a lack of emotional intimacy, too. But what
2:15:55
Speaker 2: struck me about this story is the woman said, like,
2:15:57
Speaker 2: we have a pretty solid relationship. Yes, ebbs and flows,
2:16:00
Speaker 2: but it's pretty solid overall. So, I think even, you know,
2:16:04
Speaker 2: even strong relationships might be at risk from something like this. So,
2:16:09
Speaker 2: I think it's... And that's one of the things Another
2:16:11
Speaker 2: reason why I just feel so passionate about the work
2:16:13
Speaker 2: that we're doing, it's really... I think AI is very cool.
2:16:16
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm not against AI. I use it a
2:16:19
Speaker 2: lot in my day-to-day life. But I think it's really
2:16:22
Speaker 2: important for us to prioritize human connection. And you're never
2:16:27
Speaker 2: going to be able to have sex with an AI.
2:16:29
Speaker 2: You're never going to be able to have skin-to-skin contact
2:16:31
Speaker 2: with an AI. I want to protect relationships. I want
2:16:34
Speaker 2: to protect families.
2:16:37
Speaker 1: You know, I think if there's one thing that I
2:16:40
Speaker 1: think this all comes down to it seems like communication
2:16:43
Speaker 1: is the key component here. Am I missing anything?
2:16:46
Speaker 2: It absolutely is. It absolutely is. I strongly believe that
2:16:50
Speaker 2: we can't have a great sex life or a great
2:16:52
Speaker 2: relationship without communication. But really, my goal is to help
2:16:56
Speaker 2: people not roll their eyes and be like, I know
2:16:58
Speaker 2: I need to communicate. But I want to help them
2:17:00
Speaker 2: realize that it can be, it doesn't have to be
2:17:02
Speaker 2: as daunting as it might seem. It can actually be fun.
2:17:05
Speaker 2: That's really the goal here, is to make it feel
2:17:07
Speaker 2: fun to talk about your sex life, fun to talk
2:17:10
Speaker 2: about your relationship.
2:17:11
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, it's just communication. Communication during sex, communication
2:17:16
Speaker 1: after sex, communication before sex, communication about sex. I mean,
2:17:20
Speaker 1: it's all about sending and receiving communications. So, I mean, any.
2:17:27
Speaker 2: Parting words, Well, yeah, I'm really glad that I've had
2:17:31
Speaker 2: the opportunity to be here today and speak with your audience.
2:17:34
Speaker 2: I really hope that, you know, we went over so
2:17:36
Speaker 2: many specific little tools and techniques, so I hope that
2:17:39
Speaker 2: people have found at least a couple that got their
2:17:42
Speaker 2: curiosity piqued. And I would encourage people to, take a
2:17:47
Speaker 2: couple things and just get started. Try a couple of
2:17:49
Speaker 2: things out. But yeah, Xander and I are really here
2:17:53
Speaker 2: to lead you through it. We're so passionate about doing
2:17:56
Speaker 2: this work. I think it's, you know, it's such a
2:17:59
Speaker 2: shame because there are so many couples that are feeling
2:18:02
Speaker 2: really disconnected from each other right now, wondering what happened
2:18:05
Speaker 2: to us, when the reality is, with just a few
2:18:09
Speaker 2: practical tools and techniques, like, you can find that spark again.
2:18:12
Speaker 2: You can recreate that connection again. So we are here
2:18:16
Speaker 2: to support in any way that we can with our book.
2:18:19
Speaker 2: We have a membership for couples called Deeper for couples
2:18:22
Speaker 2: who don't want to settle. I know a lot of
2:18:23
Speaker 2: your audience is... These are people who don't want to settle.
2:18:26
Speaker 2: You want more out of life, and you're willing to
2:18:29
Speaker 2: make that effort to get more out of life. So,
2:18:33
Speaker 2: be more than happy to support people. But I just
2:18:35
Speaker 2: really appreciate you being willing to open this conversation and
2:18:38
Speaker 2: be vulnerable. Let me ask you a few questions.
2:18:40
Speaker 1: Oh, man, I loved it. I loved it. I'd love
2:18:42
Speaker 1: to get you back again. But, um... one last question.
2:18:47
Speaker 2: Yeah.
2:18:48
Speaker 1: If you could recommend one person for the show, who
2:18:51
Speaker 1: would it be? Ooh.
2:18:54
Speaker 2: One person for the show. Oh, my gosh. That is
2:18:59
Speaker 2: such a hard question. Can I have a minute? Yeah.
2:19:02
Speaker 1: Okay.
2:19:03
Speaker 2: I'm very particular about my recommendations, too.
2:19:06
Speaker 1: That's a good thing.
2:19:07
Speaker 2: Very important to me. You know what? I'm going to
2:19:13
Speaker 2: say a friend of mine, Dr. Becky Kennedy, she's a
2:19:16
Speaker 2: parenting expert. And she just has really brilliant parenting wisdom.
2:19:23
Speaker 2: But I think a lot of what she teaches also
2:19:25
Speaker 2: helps us heal our relationships with ourselves.
2:19:28
Speaker 1: Okay.
2:19:29
Speaker 2: So I think, you know, going back to the top
2:19:32
Speaker 2: three reasons couples break up, sex, kids, money, if we
2:19:35
Speaker 2: can get the, you know, I'll handle the sex. Dr.
2:19:39
Speaker 2: Becky can help handle the kids, but I think she'd
2:19:41
Speaker 2: be a great guest.
2:19:42
Speaker 1: Perfect. Yeah. Well, Doc, I really appreciate you coming. This
2:19:45
Speaker 1: was a fascinating conversation. Like I said, I'd love to
2:19:48
Speaker 1: see you again.
2:19:48
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me.
2:19:50
Speaker 1: Cheers. No matter where you're watching Sean Ryan Show from,
2:20:06
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2:20:20
Speaker 1: on Apple and Spotify podcasts.