Latest / Beheaded / Beauty and the Bawd | Alice Tankerville

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Beauty and the Bawd | Alice Tankerville · Beheaded

0:05
SPEAKER_00: Hello and welcome to Beheaded.
0:07
SPEAKER_00: Welcome to season two, episode eight.
0:09
SPEAKER_00: I'm Megan Moore.
0:10
SPEAKER_00: And I'm Elizabeth Black.
0:12
SPEAKER_00: We are done with January.
0:14
SPEAKER_00: We are kind of a fast January.
0:17
SPEAKER_00: I don't think like I think most years it drags on, but this one felt a little bit fast.
0:22
SPEAKER_00: And that gives me hope.
0:23
SPEAKER_00: January is one of my least favorite months.
0:25
SPEAKER_00: I hate all months January through May, really.
0:28
SPEAKER_01: Oh really?
0:29
SPEAKER_00: I would say January through like April.
0:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
0:32
SPEAKER_00: April too.
0:33
SPEAKER_00: April and okay.
0:34
SPEAKER_00: May is kind of hit or miss.
0:35
SPEAKER_00: It's like, ooh, summer's coming and it's fun, or it's just like it feels like an extended April.
0:41
SPEAKER_00: But it sucks.
0:42
SPEAKER_00: Like, why is the spring so shitty?
0:44
SPEAKER_01: Because Well, actually, we should love the spring because we're in Arizona.
0:49
SPEAKER_01: And right now we right now it is perfect weather for us, but hit about April, we're not gonna be saying that.
0:56
SPEAKER_01: So why do we like these months?
0:58
SPEAKER_00: I really I've tried to unpack this because I've pretty much hated spring since I was a kid, like pretty much since middle school.
1:05
SPEAKER_00: But I'm also from Colorado where it's like dreary in the spring, and just like I don't know, I always associate it with just like exams and the end of a school year and whatever.
1:13
SPEAKER_00: But as an adult, like I shouldn't think any of those things.
1:15
SPEAKER_00: But I think it's like no, it's great outside of still horizontal.
1:18
SPEAKER_01: In Arizona, in Arizona, it's like 72 degrees right now.
1:22
SPEAKER_00: Sunny.
1:23
SPEAKER_00: We have no real complaints, but it's just a feeling.
1:26
SPEAKER_00: I love the summer.
1:27
SPEAKER_00: Summer's awesome, even though it's hot here.
1:29
SPEAKER_00: Summer is 115 degrees here in Arizona.
1:33
SPEAKER_00: So fun.
1:33
SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't know.
1:34
SPEAKER_00: I associate summer with trips and just carefree and like works a little bit lighter.
1:39
SPEAKER_00: And then I love the fall.
1:40
SPEAKER_00: I love the holidays.
1:41
SPEAKER_00: I love the fall too.
1:42
SPEAKER_00: And then once I hit January, I just hate everything.
1:45
SPEAKER_00: Oh blah.
1:45
SPEAKER_00: I hate everything now.
1:47
SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's because we had better hopes for ourselves and we're realizing we're not the people that we want to be.
1:52
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
1:54
SPEAKER_01: That's heavy.
1:55
SPEAKER_01: Like in in life, it is.
1:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like we set goals, we don't meet them, and we realize every year we're just who we are.
2:02
SPEAKER_01: This is not the way I want to kick off the doctor, Megan.
2:05
SPEAKER_01: You know what we should talk about?
2:06
SPEAKER_01: No.
2:08
SPEAKER_00: Not after that.
2:09
SPEAKER_00: You're you're done.
2:10
SPEAKER_01: I feel like our listeners haven't actually experienced our feelings during the summer.
2:16
SPEAKER_01: Oh.
2:17
SPEAKER_01: Because we have a lot of listeners who are not from Arizona.
2:20
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
2:21
SPEAKER_01: Not even from the Southwest or part of America.
2:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
2:26
SPEAKER_01: It is terrible, like every cliche that they have about the desert of the Southwest and Arizona in the summer is 1,000% true.
2:35
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
2:36
SPEAKER_01: Once last summer, my husband was waiting for an Uber outside, and he was just standing on the pavement wearing his sneakers, like waiting for the Uber to come.
2:46
SPEAKER_01: And the guy pulled up and he was standing there for so long.
2:49
SPEAKER_01: It was about a hundred and maybe like 15, 16 degrees outside.
2:53
SPEAKER_01: He walks out and his feet come out of his shoes because the soles of his sneakers were stuck to the ground.
3:00
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, they melted into the pavement.
3:03
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
3:03
SPEAKER_01: It is so hot.
3:04
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
3:05
SPEAKER_01: I mean So we should be so grateful for this wonderful weather and we can go out and walk outside right now.
3:10
SPEAKER_00: I'm a person who's always cold.
3:11
SPEAKER_00: I'll take the hot, hot heat.
3:13
SPEAKER_00: I'll I'll just sweat all day.
3:14
SPEAKER_00: But the nice thing too about Arizona is like because we know it's so hot, nobody just wants to hang out outside.
3:20
SPEAKER_00: Like if you do, you're on a patio with misters and tons of shade.
3:24
SPEAKER_00: Like I don't know.
3:25
SPEAKER_00: Don't go outside in the summer, which is so opposite from most places.
3:28
SPEAKER_01: Most places is like, let's go have a pool party where like you're not.
3:32
SPEAKER_00: I love the heat.
3:32
SPEAKER_00: Like, I I've moved from Colorado to to LA to here, and I I just keep chasing the sun.
3:38
SPEAKER_00: I don't want to I want to live on the sun if I can.
3:42
SPEAKER_00: I just like the heat.
3:44
SPEAKER_01: I wouldn't mind going to London in like the gloomy and the cold.
3:47
SPEAKER_00: Oh, Megan, you haven't talked about your your your desire to go to London.
3:51
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I haven't?
3:51
SPEAKER_00: No.
3:52
SPEAKER_01: I would like to go to London one day.
3:53
SPEAKER_01: I didn't know that.
3:54
SPEAKER_01: I didn't know people didn't know that.
3:56
SPEAKER_01: It's on my my list.
3:58
SPEAKER_01: Uh I'll go any time of the year, but I especially want to go when I can like drink tea.
4:03
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
4:04
SPEAKER_00: You probably don't want to be there in the summer, right?
4:05
SPEAKER_00: Because it's like tourist season.
4:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I'm not a tourist.
4:08
SPEAKER_01: I know I don't live there and I've never been there before.
4:10
SPEAKER_01: I am not a tourist.
4:11
SPEAKER_01: I'm beyond that.
4:12
SPEAKER_01: I'm educated.
4:14
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
4:14
SPEAKER_01: Good.
4:15
SPEAKER_01: We'll remember that when we go in the high time.
4:17
SPEAKER_01: I love watching some of these documentaries we just like watch in preparation of our show all the time.
4:22
SPEAKER_01: And they always show, like, I always really though, I haven't been to London to see what tourism looks like there.
4:29
SPEAKER_01: But every documentary and they they're showing around at all the people, like in line at you know, to go into the Tower of London.
4:35
SPEAKER_01: I'm always like, these fools don't even know what they're looking at.
4:38
SPEAKER_01: Maybe some of them do.
4:39
SPEAKER_01: But all I see all these rattles running around.
4:42
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, they don't even appreciate the grounds that they're stepping on.
4:45
SPEAKER_01: That's true.
4:46
SPEAKER_01: I feel like they should have days where they only allow appreciative people to enter.
4:50
SPEAKER_00: Like you have to take a test to stand in line of the appreciative people line.
4:57
SPEAKER_01: Then you go in line B.
4:58
SPEAKER_01: If you don't know the year that Thomas Cromwell was executed, you're out.
5:02
SPEAKER_00: You go in line C.
5:03
SPEAKER_01: If you don't know who the princes of the tower are, you're done.
5:08
SPEAKER_00: You're done.
5:09
SPEAKER_00: Okay, we'll uh we'll be the ones to enforce that.
5:11
SPEAKER_00: We'll go around with little like pop quizzes to everyone and then kick them out, just make two different lines, and the people at Tower Blender are like, what are you doing?
5:18
SPEAKER_00: We're like, don't worry.
5:19
SPEAKER_00: We just separate the families, we're taking left, right.
5:22
SPEAKER_01: I feel like Europe's done that before.
5:24
SPEAKER_01: We're not supposed to do that again.
5:26
SPEAKER_00: I'm pretty sure you're not supposed to do that ever again.
5:28
SPEAKER_00: But um I like your spirit.
5:31
SPEAKER_01: Um we really have nothing to talk about at the beginning of our episode tonight.
5:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's it's kind of bad.
5:36
SPEAKER_00: We're officially at a rug.
5:38
SPEAKER_01: We used to have things to talk about.
5:40
SPEAKER_00: Aside it from being spring and just shitty, like we also just have nothing going on.
5:45
SPEAKER_00: Shitty, beautiful weather.
5:46
SPEAKER_00: Shitty, beautiful weather.
5:47
SPEAKER_00: We're kind of in a mood tonight.
5:48
SPEAKER_00: I'm so sorry.
5:49
SPEAKER_00: No, they they get it.
5:53
SPEAKER_00: They can be in moods too.
5:54
SPEAKER_00: Maybe they were all feeling this way.
5:55
SPEAKER_00: Like we all wanted 2021 to be better.
5:57
SPEAKER_00: It's obviously not because you know, time doesn't magically change at midnight um on New Year's Eve.
6:02
SPEAKER_00: But uh, here we are, we're in February, we're trying to get it.
6:05
SPEAKER_01: I think we're just bummed because like I would love to share exciting things in my life for now.
6:10
SPEAKER_00: Literally nothing.
6:10
SPEAKER_00: We don't go anywhere.
6:12
SPEAKER_00: I didn't share last time.
6:13
SPEAKER_00: My marathon that's supposed to be in like three weeks is now postponed.
6:16
SPEAKER_00: So that's cool.
6:18
SPEAKER_00: And you after you ran 16 miles, I ran 16 miles repair, yeah, in the rain, and I booked my flights, I booked my Airbnb, I was ready to go.
6:26
SPEAKER_00: It's finally like, you know what, it might happen.
6:28
SPEAKER_00: Literally, like days later, postponed indefinitely.
6:32
SPEAKER_01: The Arizona Renaissance Fair should have kicked off last weekend.
6:37
SPEAKER_00: Did not did not they're not coming back all season.
6:40
SPEAKER_00: You said the Irwindale one in California.
6:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the pleasure fair, the big one in California is also obviously it's California.
6:46
SPEAKER_01: They're a no-go this year.
6:48
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there is maybe, maybe one in Colorado in June.
6:52
SPEAKER_00: I hope so.
6:53
SPEAKER_00: I want one thing to look forward to.
6:55
SPEAKER_00: That would be nice.
6:55
SPEAKER_00: My birthday's in June, so maybe we can.
6:57
SPEAKER_00: Oh, it is?
6:58
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you didn't know that.
7:01
SPEAKER_00: Sorry.
7:02
SPEAKER_00: Um, but we can maybe try to go for my birthday in June if it works out.
7:06
SPEAKER_00: But I have a feeling we'll just be in the same situation.
7:09
SPEAKER_01: Man, I feel like people turn us on to listen to like get into a good mood, and we're just like reminding everyone.
7:17
SPEAKER_00: We're realists.
7:17
SPEAKER_00: We're telling you.
7:18
SPEAKER_00: Let's make stuff up.
7:19
SPEAKER_00: We're telling you, like, hey, we feel it too.
7:21
SPEAKER_00: Like, we are we're here with you guys.
7:23
SPEAKER_00: We are not going places.
7:25
SPEAKER_00: It's okay.
7:26
SPEAKER_01: Taking lots of walks.
7:28
SPEAKER_00: You just have to find things that make you happy.
7:30
SPEAKER_00: I'm reading a book that I really want to get through, and I can't because just no motivation.
7:37
SPEAKER_00: Maybe we'll go to the rent fair in in Colorado.
7:39
SPEAKER_00: Maybe, you know.
7:40
SPEAKER_01: Maybe I'll get my dress out and start steaming it.
7:43
SPEAKER_00: Need to make a list of things that are gonna make me happy in the near future.
7:47
SPEAKER_00: That might be a struggle, but hey.
7:49
SPEAKER_01: Control the controllables.
7:50
SPEAKER_01: Control the controllables.
7:51
SPEAKER_01: That's all we can do.
7:52
SPEAKER_01: And we're in this together.
7:53
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
7:54
SPEAKER_01: And we have wine, wine.
7:56
SPEAKER_01: We have so much wine.
7:57
SPEAKER_01: We the wine is still flowing.
7:59
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
8:00
SPEAKER_01: Um, it'll get better.
8:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
8:02
SPEAKER_01: You go.
8:02
SPEAKER_01: Valentine's Day is around the corner.
8:05
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
8:06
SPEAKER_01: And um we have an execution today that's kind of like we try to find something about lovers.
8:14
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
8:14
SPEAKER_01: And dying in love.
8:18
SPEAKER_01: Not Romeo and Juliet style, but I think that's the general theme of what we've got going today.
8:24
SPEAKER_00: I just noticed your uh pajama pants have little hearts on them.
8:26
SPEAKER_00: They do, actually.
8:28
SPEAKER_00: And Mickey ears.
8:29
SPEAKER_00: Your classic Mickey ears and then tiny little hearts.
8:32
SPEAKER_00: That was not intentional, actually.
8:33
SPEAKER_01: My top looks like it belongs on a Taylor Swift's lover album.
8:38
SPEAKER_01: It's beautiful.
8:38
SPEAKER_01: It's like pink cotton candy clouds.
8:40
SPEAKER_01: Tie-dye.
8:42
SPEAKER_01: Um, anywho.
8:43
SPEAKER_01: So our I guess we'll just get into our our executions for today.
8:47
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because we did fail at the drinks and the snacks again today.
8:51
SPEAKER_00: So sorry guys.
8:52
SPEAKER_00: I didn't just really again in that mood.
8:54
SPEAKER_00: We'll bounce back, I promise.
8:56
SPEAKER_01: Maybe next week.
8:57
SPEAKER_00: We'll do our best.
8:59
SPEAKER_01: Um, but this week, in celebration of love and in celebration of Valentine's Day.
9:05
SPEAKER_01: Yes, I know you're gonna keep saying that.
9:08
SPEAKER_01: Um, we have a very um flirtatious woman.
9:13
SPEAKER_01: Another woman.
9:14
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
9:15
SPEAKER_01: I really believe that going into making this podcast, I thought it would be 95% men.
9:21
SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of women who've been executed.
9:23
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
9:23
SPEAKER_00: And I actually like wrote my notes down with the intention of addressing both of the lovers like equally, but this woman clearly dominates the.
9:30
SPEAKER_00: Oh, she dominates it.
9:31
SPEAKER_00: So the other guy's just an accessory, really.
9:33
SPEAKER_00: Um, but go ahead and let us know who we are hosting today.
9:37
SPEAKER_01: We have Alice Tankerville, also known as Alice Wolf, which is her married name.
9:42
SPEAKER_01: Well, she only was married by common law.
9:45
SPEAKER_01: Common law married name.
9:46
SPEAKER_01: Um, so we'll just call her Alice Tankerville to make it easy.
9:49
SPEAKER_01: Right.
9:50
SPEAKER_01: Alice Tankerville and her husband, John Wolf.
9:54
SPEAKER_01: Right.
9:55
SPEAKER_01: And the lover.
9:57
SPEAKER_01: Should I get into all that, or is that like revealing the end of the story?
10:00
SPEAKER_01: I think we can say that.
10:01
SPEAKER_01: Okay, and her lover.
10:03
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
10:03
SPEAKER_00: John Bodd.
10:04
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, who was a prison warden.
10:06
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
10:07
SPEAKER_00: And we'll get into all of that.
10:08
SPEAKER_00: But we've we read a clever, I think it was a chapter of a book um about the three of them, and it was called The Wolf, the Woman, and the Warden.
10:16
SPEAKER_00: Or one of those.
10:17
SPEAKER_01: That was not already made in like published.
10:20
SPEAKER_01: I would want to steal that title.
10:22
SPEAKER_01: Brilliant.
10:22
SPEAKER_01: The Wolf, the Warden, and the Woman.
10:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
10:25
SPEAKER_01: Or something.
10:25
SPEAKER_01: It was one of something in that order.
10:27
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
10:27
SPEAKER_01: The woman, the wolf, and the warden, something.
10:30
SPEAKER_01: But I was like, ooh, I like that.
10:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
10:32
SPEAKER_00: Um so it's a love triangle.
10:34
SPEAKER_01: It's a love triangle, and guess what?
10:36
SPEAKER_01: Everybody ends up executed.
10:38
SPEAKER_01: I'm just gonna jump straight to the ending.
10:40
SPEAKER_01: That's kind of mood we're in tonight.
10:43
SPEAKER_01: Uh, and for some of you who may have heard her of her name, some of you maybe not, um, she is one of the very few people and the only woman who's tried to escape the Tower of London.
10:56
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
10:56
SPEAKER_01: So we have to give her some props here.
10:58
SPEAKER_01: She actually made it a little bit far.
11:00
SPEAKER_00: A little bit.
11:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, farther than Joan of Arc.
11:03
SPEAKER_00: But she she almost made it.
11:05
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
11:05
SPEAKER_01: Farther than Joan of Arc.
11:07
SPEAKER_01: She jumped out of the Tower too, or not the Tower of London, but like Tower.
11:11
SPEAKER_01: She jumped out and tried and didn't get it.
11:14
SPEAKER_01: Um, there's been only a few attempted escapes of the Tower of London.
11:19
SPEAKER_01: Um, one, from what I know of, has been successful.
11:22
SPEAKER_01: Most of them have not.
11:24
SPEAKER_01: Wait, who was successful?
11:25
SPEAKER_01: I don't think I know this.
11:26
SPEAKER_01: He was like a monk or a priest or something.
11:28
SPEAKER_01: Oh.
11:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
11:29
SPEAKER_01: It's always those monks we gotta watch out for.
11:32
SPEAKER_01: Story creatures.
11:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but um, no, but um, not to ruin things, but she was not successful, which is why she is our story for today.
11:40
SPEAKER_00: Right.
11:41
SPEAKER_00: Um, and so we we really tried to find a lot about her.
11:44
SPEAKER_00: We looked up, you know, between her maiden name and her her married name, but we really couldn't find anything on early life.
11:50
SPEAKER_00: She was obviously she, you know, wasn't a noble person or anyone you may have really heard of.
11:55
SPEAKER_00: Um, she wasn't a queen, like that she had nothing to her name.
11:59
SPEAKER_00: So most peasants in this era, I mean, there was no record of their birth, like really no record of their life unless they kept personal memoirs.
12:06
SPEAKER_00: So it's not surprising that we really know nothing of where she came from.
12:09
SPEAKER_00: We don't know how old she was.
12:10
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, nothing of her age.
12:11
SPEAKER_00: No, when she was born.
12:12
SPEAKER_00: Mm-hmm.
12:13
SPEAKER_00: All we know is that she kind of came onto the scene um circa 1531-ish.
12:20
SPEAKER_00: And we know that because her again, common law husband, John Wolfe, um, who was a dock worker and a sailor, just kind of a seedy guy, he got in a little bit of trouble with the law.
12:31
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
12:32
SPEAKER_01: He he was a petty thief, we could call him.
12:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
12:35
SPEAKER_01: Not nothing big up until now.
12:36
SPEAKER_01: Nothing big, but just kind of scrappy.
12:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, kind of sleazy guy.
12:40
SPEAKER_01: And 1531, so King Henry VIII is the king right now.
12:44
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
12:44
SPEAKER_01: Um, he's dating Anne Boleyn, but they're not married yet.
12:48
SPEAKER_01: I think they get married in what, 1533, right?
12:50
SPEAKER_00: 1533 is when they marry.
12:51
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
12:51
SPEAKER_00: So this is still a big thing.
12:52
SPEAKER_01: So I like to put that in a perspective of thinking like, where are we at the lineage of royalty?
12:57
SPEAKER_01: So it's um Catherine of Aragon is a little bit still in the picture here, but it's Anne Boleyn and King Henry VIII are ruling England for the most part.
13:05
SPEAKER_00: And so what happened was um John Wolfe, he actually um he he stole the king's gold.
13:14
SPEAKER_00: So the king was expecting a shipment, and I believe the exact amount was maybe 366 pounds um that were lifted out of these like coffers.
13:23
SPEAKER_00: There was like a big chest uh in on this ship that was literally bolted into the ground, and when they went to unload it, it was gone.
13:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and and John was a merchant.
13:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so he was a merchant in like a steel yard, so he had all the access to this, and like Elizabeth said, this chest is not only chained into the ship, but they also it was guarded 24-7.
13:45
SPEAKER_01: Right.
13:45
SPEAKER_01: So when they went the the king's agents board the ship the you know as soon as this got docked and they went inspect the gold that's coming in.
13:53
SPEAKER_01: Now, 366 crowns in modern day money, that is almost a million dollars.
13:58
SPEAKER_01: Almost a million pounds.
14:00
SPEAKER_01: Oh, no, pounds.
14:01
SPEAKER_01: Okay, it's 900,000-ish pounds.
14:05
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
14:05
SPEAKER_01: I don't know what that is in American.
14:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't either.
14:08
SPEAKER_00: What's the currency rate?
14:10
SPEAKER_01: I can look it up.
14:11
SPEAKER_01: Rate of exchange right now.
14:12
SPEAKER_01: Keep talking, I'll find out for you.
14:14
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Megan's gonna look that up.
14:15
SPEAKER_00: Um, but but nobody knew who had done this right away.
14:18
SPEAKER_00: It's not like he was caught red-handed.
14:20
SPEAKER_00: Um, they had a two-year investigation once they discovered that the the gold was missing.
14:26
SPEAKER_00: And obviously, this is King Henry VIII, right?
14:28
SPEAKER_00: Like, he's not a forgiving guy.
14:29
SPEAKER_00: So if you steal his gold, he will find out who you are.
14:33
SPEAKER_00: That's why the investigation took so long, that's why there was so much interest around it.
14:36
SPEAKER_00: It was a lot of money to be gone.
14:38
SPEAKER_00: So finally, after two years, they didn't have a lot of evidence, but they kind of realized, hey, he was on the ship at the time.
14:45
SPEAKER_00: He's a thief.
14:46
SPEAKER_00: He's a thief.
14:46
SPEAKER_00: He's got a very sketchy pattern.
14:48
SPEAKER_01: Not a lot of evidence still, just like really presumption.
14:50
SPEAKER_01: Also, 900,000 sorry, 900,000 pounds is equivalent to 1,240,000 US dollars.
15:01
SPEAKER_01: Wow, okay.
15:02
SPEAKER_01: That's a lot.
15:03
SPEAKER_01: I get it why they were kind of pissed.
15:05
SPEAKER_01: I get it.
15:06
SPEAKER_01: But how rich is King Henry VIII?
15:08
SPEAKER_01: Is that a good one?
15:08
SPEAKER_01: Well, and Henry was in what this money was, it was like replenishing his treasury.
15:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:14
SPEAKER_01: Right here.
15:15
SPEAKER_01: He's already loaded.
15:16
SPEAKER_01: And this kind of also puts into perspective how loaded Henry VIII was.
15:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:21
SPEAKER_01: Because this is him just like replenishing, like, oh, I'm a little bit low on my savings account.
15:25
SPEAKER_01: Just gonna get another shipment of crowns coming over.
15:29
SPEAKER_00: Maybe he's not quite a Jeff Bezos in terms of how rich he is.
15:32
SPEAKER_00: Maybe like uh, I don't know, maybe like an Oprah Winfrey.
15:35
SPEAKER_00: Or like a um who's not a billionaire, but like a millionaire who has probably like, I don't know, Chris Pratt.
15:41
SPEAKER_00: Chris Pratt or someone's the first person who comes to your mind.
15:45
SPEAKER_01: Hey, Megan's like who's rich?
15:48
SPEAKER_01: Henry Cavill.
15:50
SPEAKER_01: Oh, Henry, if you're ever listening to this.
15:53
SPEAKER_01: Elizabeth has a huge crush on you.
15:56
SPEAKER_01: And so does Megan.
15:58
SPEAKER_00: But more so Elizabeth.
16:00
SPEAKER_01: Anyway.
16:01
SPEAKER_01: Okay, sorry, we got a little distracted.
16:03
SPEAKER_01: Got a little swarm in here.
16:05
SPEAKER_01: It's really hot.
16:06
SPEAKER_00: Valentine's Days around the corner.
16:09
SPEAKER_00: Let's get back to our story.
16:10
SPEAKER_00: Um, so anyway, so we've again two-year investigation.
16:13
SPEAKER_00: They finally pin it on John Wolfe.
16:15
SPEAKER_00: And so, what do they do?
16:17
SPEAKER_00: They go ahead and they throw him into the tower.
16:20
SPEAKER_01: 1533, because it's two years later.
16:22
SPEAKER_00: Yes, 1533.
16:23
SPEAKER_01: They're really harping on this.
16:25
SPEAKER_00: They're not letting it go.
16:26
SPEAKER_00: Right.
16:27
SPEAKER_00: And so uh at this point, um, Alice Wolf, who again like Alice Tankerville, not quite married, but she does feel a certain amount of devotion to John, obviously, starts to visit him every single day in the tower.
16:39
SPEAKER_00: Um, and not only that, but she's bringing him treats, she's bringing him gifts, she's really trying to make his stay more comfortable, and she's a very charming woman.
16:47
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
16:48
SPEAKER_00: So she starts to kind of have start a relationship with these two guards who are always there guarding her husband.
16:55
SPEAKER_00: Um, one is John Bodd, and the other, I forget his first name.
16:58
SPEAKER_00: Well, William Dennis.
16:59
SPEAKER_00: William, yeah.
17:00
SPEAKER_00: So William Dennis.
17:01
SPEAKER_00: Dentise.
17:02
SPEAKER_01: Denise.
17:03
SPEAKER_01: Um and sorry, really quick, something to add too.
17:06
SPEAKER_01: So when you're a prisoner in the tower, in any type of jail in this time, like actually, it wasn't just England, this was kind of around the world.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: Because I mean, mind you, it was a hundred years later, but Salem Witch Trials, we kind of talked about this, like way back.
17:20
SPEAKER_01: But when you're in jail, you're responsible for your own food, your own clothing.
17:25
SPEAKER_01: So it's not like it's a free ride.
17:27
SPEAKER_01: Like nowadays, modern prison, you know, you get fed, you get clothed.
17:33
SPEAKER_01: Right.
17:33
SPEAKER_01: I'm not saying it's a good situation, but the government takes care of you to make sure you're at like basic means.
17:40
SPEAKER_01: Right.
17:40
SPEAKER_01: But when you're in this time, if you didn't have anybody taking care of you, you could starve in front of you.
17:45
SPEAKER_01: You yeah, they really didn't give a shit.
17:47
SPEAKER_01: You could have just sat there and maybe you had broad day care.
17:50
SPEAKER_00: Or, you know, charity somehow bestowed on you, but it wasn't really an expectation that you're taking care of.
17:55
SPEAKER_01: Either a family member needed to physically come in and bring you food and new clothes and blankets and whatever and just give you the basic needs, or they needed to give money to somebody to pay for it for you.
18:05
SPEAKER_01: Right.
18:06
SPEAKER_01: And so um he should have been pretty grateful that he had this this common law lady, yeah, this common law wife, this hot lady coming and just feeding him.
18:15
SPEAKER_01: Right.
18:15
SPEAKER_01: And she was getting a little bit elaborate too with what she was bringing in.
18:18
SPEAKER_00: Like you said, the wine.
18:19
SPEAKER_00: She was bringing in the wine and the zert treat twin.
18:21
SPEAKER_00: And she was also sharing them with the guards, so it wasn't just a hey, you know, can I pr please bring this to my husband?
18:26
SPEAKER_00: It was a hey, you want to have a glass of wine with us?
18:29
SPEAKER_01: Like, we do that at tennis practice.
18:32
SPEAKER_01: You bring bottles of wine in.
18:33
SPEAKER_01: Not bottles of wine, but like on our practice on our I guess like almost every night, we like our team captain always makes treats, and she always gives one to the guy at the front who like you have to pay for the court usage.
18:48
SPEAKER_01: Oh, really?
18:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, she'll always give him like a lemon bar or a brownie.
18:51
SPEAKER_01: And I've noticed our lights, because we always practice at night, our lights stay on just a little bit longer.
18:57
SPEAKER_01: And we've pretty much called it out the correlation.
19:00
SPEAKER_00: Literally greasing palms.
19:01
SPEAKER_00: Like, here's a sticky chip.
19:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, she's like, Oh, you like brownies, right?
19:04
SPEAKER_01: And then she'll even be like, What do you want on Wednesday?
19:06
SPEAKER_01: I'm baking.
19:07
SPEAKER_01: He's like, I really love chocolate chip cookies.
19:11
SPEAKER_00: I admire women that have this much time.
19:14
SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
19:14
SPEAKER_00: People, not women.
19:15
SPEAKER_00: Women are not expected to cook.
19:17
SPEAKER_00: No.
19:17
SPEAKER_00: I'm saying anyone that has this much time to always bake and always bring treats, like, I'm lucky if I remember them for like a big event like Super Bowl.
19:24
SPEAKER_00: Like, I made cornbread muffins with little cute footballs on top of them.
19:27
SPEAKER_00: I didn't bring anything.
19:28
SPEAKER_00: But I was so proud of myself.
19:29
SPEAKER_00: I thought white claws.
19:31
SPEAKER_00: Megan talked of a game side note.
19:33
SPEAKER_00: She was like, I'm gonna make a really good chili.
19:35
SPEAKER_00: Because we were having like mostly nachos and obviously, you know, bad game day stuff.
19:38
SPEAKER_00: Um, but Megan was like, I know it'll go well with the nachos.
19:41
SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna make my famous chili.
19:42
SPEAKER_00: And then it came to like My Famous Chili, which is a Pinterest recipe that I've tried once.
19:46
SPEAKER_00: I don't have a famous chili, it's really just a recipe I found.
19:48
SPEAKER_00: And then she's like, I don't really have a good recipe, so I'm just not gonna make it.
19:52
SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna bring it in.
19:53
SPEAKER_00: Then it turned into, can we just stop for white claws on the way?
19:55
SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna bring white claws.
19:57
SPEAKER_00: It's like, wow, we dialed this way back.
19:59
SPEAKER_00: Anyway, um, but white claws are delicious.
20:01
SPEAKER_00: When I'm like when I make one batch of muffins for one stupid event every six months, I feel proud.
20:06
SPEAKER_00: So when I hear people like that that are like everyone's the box.
20:09
SPEAKER_01: I mean, they were good.
20:10
SPEAKER_00: Hey, I didn't say it wasn't from the box.
20:13
SPEAKER_01: I just said anytime I whip them up in an oven, I feel them from a mix of the little the little bit.
20:23
SPEAKER_00: True.
20:23
SPEAKER_00: Can't so damn Megan, what else would you like to say about my cornbread?
20:29
SPEAKER_00: I know what makes me not invited to the next Super Bowl.
20:32
SPEAKER_01: How much of that cornbread and queso did I eat to the point where today's grumpy because of her tummy?
20:38
SPEAKER_01: I only ate broccoli and shrimp and like a spinach smoothie to try to detox from the five cans of queso I eat.
20:46
SPEAKER_00: You just gotta run 10 miles and it goes out of your system.
20:49
SPEAKER_01: That must be it.
20:50
SPEAKER_01: Okay, back on track.
20:51
SPEAKER_01: So she's bringing treats and wine and like really flirting with the guards here.
20:56
SPEAKER_01: Right.
20:56
SPEAKER_01: The jailers.
20:57
SPEAKER_01: Right.
20:58
SPEAKER_00: And so at this point, you know, it's it's not quite a romantic thing yet, but her and specifically John Bod start to have a little bit of a relationship.
21:08
SPEAKER_00: Just friendly, nothing crazy, just a little bit of hey, I'm back, I'm gonna bring the wine again.
21:14
SPEAKER_00: Here's here's some wine for you.
21:16
SPEAKER_00: So they're getting very friendly, more so than her and Dennis.
21:19
SPEAKER_00: Um, and so uh what happens next?
21:23
SPEAKER_01: Well, it's about six months later, right, and they finally realize there's not enough evidence to even prove that John Wolf was the thief who took all million pounds, which is 366 crowns.
21:35
SPEAKER_01: Right.
21:36
SPEAKER_01: So he leaves the country.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, they release him, and I actually, this was the smartest thing he could have done.
21:41
SPEAKER_01: I would have done the same.
21:42
SPEAKER_01: I would have been like, peace out.
21:44
SPEAKER_01: Right.
21:44
SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna be sticking around when they realize it was me.
21:48
SPEAKER_01: So he went to Ireland.
21:51
SPEAKER_01: And but he did ask John Bod.
21:54
SPEAKER_01: He must have seen that there was you know, him and his his wife got along pretty well.
21:58
SPEAKER_01: He asked if, hey, can you just take Care of my wife Alice while I'm out of the country.
22:02
SPEAKER_00: Bot's like, Abso friggin' lutely.
22:04
SPEAKER_01: How dare a woman just like try to survive on her own?
22:07
SPEAKER_01: She needs a man there to take care of her, evidently.
22:11
SPEAKER_00: Um, so so John Bod agrees and he says, Yeah, go ahead, you leave the country.
22:15
SPEAKER_00: I've got you know an eye out for Alice, don't you worry.
22:18
SPEAKER_00: So I forget how long he's gone for.
22:21
SPEAKER_00: It's maybe only a year, two years.
22:22
SPEAKER_00: At least a year.
22:23
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was a good one.
22:24
SPEAKER_01: Because this is 1533, so it's not more than a year.
22:28
SPEAKER_00: Right.
22:29
SPEAKER_00: Um, but then new evidence, of course, who knows what that means, surfaces.
22:34
SPEAKER_00: Um, and they say, wait, wait, wait, we found new evidence.
22:36
SPEAKER_00: Did they say what the new evidence was?
22:38
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
22:38
SPEAKER_01: I never I never read what what the this new evidence was.
22:42
SPEAKER_01: Right.
22:42
SPEAKER_00: There's always some secret thing that only two people know in the council and nobody else knows.
22:47
SPEAKER_00: Of course.
22:48
SPEAKER_00: So they're like, they had fingerprints back then.
22:50
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like they're like, that John Wolf guy left.
22:52
SPEAKER_00: Um we found new evidence, bring him back.
22:54
SPEAKER_00: So not only that, but they also said they had enough evidence to implicate Alice.
23:00
SPEAKER_00: So all of a sudden they're saying, you know what, she was actually a co-conspirator.
23:04
SPEAKER_00: She's not just this nice person who, you know, was his common-law wife and then brought him treats in the tower.
23:09
SPEAKER_00: She's a vicious, plotting co-conspirator of this whole gold heist.
23:14
SPEAKER_01: They also, like, I read some things that she was a prostitute and they didn't like her for being that.
23:19
SPEAKER_01: And I I think that's a a thin line that you're walking on of if you're being flirty and a little promiscuous, maybe with the guards all the way to prostitute.
23:28
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
23:28
SPEAKER_00: Well, yeah, I was gonna say in this day or like era, it's like anything you do, you're considered harlot.
23:33
SPEAKER_01: You're ankles and you're a harlot.
23:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
23:35
SPEAKER_00: Your wrists, you're a harlot.
23:37
SPEAKER_00: So, um, so Thomas Cromwell specifically had some choicey words to say about Alice.
23:43
SPEAKER_00: I like Thomas Cromwell.
23:45
SPEAKER_00: He's an asshole.
23:46
SPEAKER_00: He's such an such a jerk.
23:47
SPEAKER_00: But he um he had different quotes, so we didn't find an exact one that was consistent through all the things we read, but he called her a diabolic woman.
23:54
SPEAKER_00: He like really did disliked her and uh basically said, you know, she's behind it, this diabolic woman.
24:01
SPEAKER_01: Can I just say it's about the same time that Elizabeth Barton is like the tower as well?
24:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
24:07
SPEAKER_01: And Thomas Cromwell had a lot to do with that too, because he was trying to like chase her down and get her arrested.
24:13
SPEAKER_01: So he was just a woman hater.
24:14
SPEAKER_01: I know, I was gonna say, I feel like Cromwell's just a little bit of like first Elizabeth Barton and now this Alice lady.
24:21
SPEAKER_01: Right.
24:22
SPEAKER_01: What's up with these women not keeping in control?
24:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so uh who knows what the reasons were, but Alice ends back at up in the tower, this time to stay, this time as a prisoner.
24:32
SPEAKER_00: And not only was she just held there, they treated her like really, really poorly.
24:37
SPEAKER_00: Like usually, and in stories we've covered before, it's like, okay, here's your cell, you figure it out.
24:43
SPEAKER_00: They chained her to the walls.
24:45
SPEAKER_00: Like they said that if she escaped, like the country would be in jeopardy.
24:49
SPEAKER_00: Like, literally made it so dramatic, and you know, put these giant iron cuffs on her and treated her just so so poorly.
24:56
SPEAKER_01: And in the past, we've always talked about how, you know, don't get this bad impression of like, for example, Mary Queen of Scots or um the Countess of Salisbury.
25:06
SPEAKER_01: We've talked before about some of the more noble prisoners in the Tower of London, who, yeah, for sure, they get in nice quarters and it's like not that shabby of living.
25:15
SPEAKER_01: They're basically in an apartment.
25:17
SPEAKER_01: Not Alice.
25:18
SPEAKER_01: When you're thinking the prisoner in a tower in the Tower of London, you think of Alice.
25:23
SPEAKER_01: This is what you're it's like shackled.
25:25
SPEAKER_01: I I don't know why I keep thinking of frickin' Jafar Aladdin.
25:30
SPEAKER_01: I knew you were your head was going in.
25:32
SPEAKER_01: The old man in the in the dungeon, and he's like all shackled up.
25:35
SPEAKER_01: That's how I even though I know she's on an old man with a beard, she might be.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: That's what I'm picturing her as right now.
25:40
SPEAKER_00: Right.
25:41
SPEAKER_00: So she she literally is shackled up, you know, and then the guards um start to take pity on her a bit.
25:47
SPEAKER_00: And again, she is beautiful, she is charming, she already like knows some of the guards.
25:51
SPEAKER_00: So they take a little bit of pity on her, but it's not until the schedules of the guards change and who's there to watch over her, but John Bod.
25:59
SPEAKER_00: John Bod.
26:01
SPEAKER_01: So her previous lover, I I suppose we can go as far as saying.
26:05
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, previous friend.
26:06
SPEAKER_00: We're not sure if they were quite lovers yet.
26:09
SPEAKER_00: I mean, they really liked each other.
26:11
SPEAKER_00: But this is when they really start to like each other.
26:13
SPEAKER_00: Once he feels terrible for her, he sees her in this state, and he's like, No, you're the beautiful woman that came and looked after your common-law husband and brought him treats.
26:22
SPEAKER_00: You're you're an angel.
26:22
SPEAKER_00: Like, why are why are they doing this to you?
26:24
SPEAKER_00: So he lessens.
26:25
SPEAKER_00: He's infatuated with her the harsh conditions a bit.
26:28
SPEAKER_00: He was definitely infatuated with her.
26:30
SPEAKER_00: Um, so he's trying to make her stay a bit more comfortable at this point.
26:34
SPEAKER_00: And then a couple months later, they also find John Wolfe.
26:38
SPEAKER_00: So he somehow comes back to the country.
26:39
SPEAKER_00: Why you would?
26:40
SPEAKER_00: I have no idea why you would show your face again in London society.
26:43
SPEAKER_00: I think they could angle to Alice, like, we've got your wife.
26:46
SPEAKER_01: We've got your common law wife.
26:50
SPEAKER_00: Your common law wife, do you want to come get her?
26:52
SPEAKER_00: Maybe you gotta come to the tower.
26:53
SPEAKER_00: And maybe that's how charming she was.
26:54
SPEAKER_00: So he's like, Well, I don't really want to leave her behind.
26:57
SPEAKER_00: So maybe I'll come and see if I can get her out of the tower.
27:00
SPEAKER_00: But again, because of that new evidence, they said, Hey, like, we know that you had left, but now you're back.
27:05
SPEAKER_00: Air quotes new evidence.
27:06
SPEAKER_00: We found air quote new evidence.
27:08
SPEAKER_00: Whatever it is.
27:09
SPEAKER_00: So he had to now join Alice in separate cells in the tower.
27:13
SPEAKER_00: So now they're both there.
27:15
SPEAKER_01: I will say, I think this is a good time I could kind of interject this.
27:19
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
27:20
SPEAKER_01: There was multiple stories of how they ended up in the tower.
27:24
SPEAKER_01: And we are sticking with this one because this is the one that we found the most on, and it seemed to be the most credible, which is just the robbery of the crowns.
27:32
SPEAKER_01: However, there is another story that some a lot of accounts didn't incorporate into it, which is why I'm kind of pulling this in as an afterthought.
27:41
SPEAKER_01: Right.
27:42
SPEAKER_01: That John Wolfe, her common law husband, Wolf and her actually murdered two Italian foreigners on a boat.
27:50
SPEAKER_01: Right.
27:50
SPEAKER_01: It was like this whole scheme where he was in sanctuary in Westminster because okay, tangent as we do.
27:58
SPEAKER_01: Tangent on the tangent.
27:59
SPEAKER_01: Tangent on the tangent on the tangent right now.
28:01
SPEAKER_01: But actually, this is kind of interesting.
28:03
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
28:04
SPEAKER_01: It was legally allowed if somebody was uh had a warrant for out their for their arrest, they could go into a church of some type and claim sanctuary.
28:15
SPEAKER_01: Like they had to file, like officially, like I'm claiming sanctuary.
28:19
SPEAKER_01: Right, like refuge.
28:20
SPEAKER_01: Refuge.
28:21
SPEAKER_01: And they could stay inside the walls of the church for up to 40 days without being arrested.
28:26
SPEAKER_01: Um, which I just again I just think of as Merilda.
28:29
SPEAKER_01: Right.
28:30
SPEAKER_01: Only have Disney references.
28:32
SPEAKER_01: Sanctuary!
28:34
SPEAKER_00: Um children of the 90s is what you get.
28:36
SPEAKER_01: But of course, people abuse that and end up being more than 40 days.
28:39
SPEAKER_01: Right.
28:40
SPEAKER_01: And I didn't know this.
28:41
SPEAKER_01: Like I kind of went on this rabbit hole today of how Westminster was just overloaded with sanctuary criminals just hanging out.
28:50
SPEAKER_00: Mostly petty criminals, petty criminals.
28:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, small ones, not to the extent, like nothing of huge major like significance, I feel like.
28:57
SPEAKER_01: But anyways, coming down from my tangent just a little bit.
29:01
SPEAKER_01: So a separate story is that they um he was kind of in sanctuary and they were trying to make a get out, and then they ended up murdering two Italian foreigners on a boat on the river.
29:12
SPEAKER_00: Right, and they murdered them for their gold.
29:14
SPEAKER_00: Um, threaten th they put them in chains, threw them overboard, and then the bodies surfaced later, which was quote unquote some new evidence that the new evidence new evidence.
29:25
SPEAKER_01: Oh, here's murdered people.
29:26
SPEAKER_01: Right.
29:27
SPEAKER_00: Right.
29:28
SPEAKER_00: So it was kind of strange because some stories just did not include that part at all, so we don't know how credible that is.
29:34
SPEAKER_00: Um, but we we wanted to note it because there are a lot of stories out there that claim this is the reason why they were brought back.
29:40
SPEAKER_00: Some even shifted the timeline a bit to say that was the reason why John Wolf was in prison in the first place.
29:45
SPEAKER_00: I was so it got a little dicey.
29:48
SPEAKER_01: I uh and I feel like it gets dicey when these are not, again, like noble people who have a memoir about them and have actual documents and we even know when they were born.
29:57
SPEAKER_01: Like a lot of this is just word of mouth, and this was supposedly like the international outcry.
30:02
SPEAKER_01: Like, this was like bigger than like the O.J.
30:05
SPEAKER_01: Simpson trial.
30:05
SPEAKER_01: Like, oh my god, these two, like Bonnie and Clyde type couple are murdering and robbing.
30:10
SPEAKER_01: So I'm sure things get a little bit mixed up in history.
30:13
SPEAKER_01: Right.
30:13
SPEAKER_00: Um, but we I don't know.
30:15
SPEAKER_00: I'm we had a funny moment where Megan and I were like writing all of our notes down and trying to assess the timeline and getting a little confused, and Jake, Megan's husband, kept interjecting.
30:24
SPEAKER_00: He's like, I think that they both happened at the same time, and it was the goal that the Italian merchants had, and we're like, Jake, no.
30:32
SPEAKER_01: And like you're not normally here for our note taking, you just happen to be laying on the couch right now, and you are not allowed to interject and distract.
30:38
SPEAKER_00: Megan just kept saying, she's like, I'm sorry, did you research all day?
30:41
SPEAKER_00: Were you reading things all day?
30:43
SPEAKER_01: How many documentaries have you watched on this, Jacob?
30:46
SPEAKER_01: You can't just make up your own history, and you just thought we could go in with confidence.
30:50
SPEAKER_01: So, anyways, I'm only I don't want to say this to confuse anybody that you know But it's worth noting.
30:55
SPEAKER_01: It's worth noting in case this is the story you have heard and you're wondering why aren't they talking about the murder?
30:59
SPEAKER_01: By all means, we did read about that, but I just there was more like actual historian with their books and things like that.
31:09
SPEAKER_00: Real historians with their hats and their books.
31:12
SPEAKER_00: Like we had books and their monocles, so we went with them.
31:15
SPEAKER_01: They had like doctor phrases in front of their names, so I went with their accounts.
31:21
SPEAKER_01: Right.
31:21
SPEAKER_01: That's basically us.
31:23
SPEAKER_01: We're historians.
31:25
SPEAKER_00: So we're gonna boldly claim that it was because of the King's Gold and the new evidence was the reason why they were a lot of freaking money.
31:31
SPEAKER_01: That seems like enough to like be up in arms over this if it was one million two hundred and forty thousand US dollars.
31:39
SPEAKER_00: Did any new evidence emerge in the case?
31:42
SPEAKER_00: We will let you know.
31:43
SPEAKER_01: We will let you know if there's new evidence.
31:44
SPEAKER_01: Unsolve mysteries.
31:46
SPEAKER_01: You never know.
31:46
SPEAKER_01: They have new evidence all the time.
31:48
SPEAKER_01: Like they just came out with how um they found the document from Henry the Eighth saying that Amberlynn was supposed to be burned at the stake before and like it was his choice.
31:58
SPEAKER_00: Right, like what he wanted for the execution.
32:00
SPEAKER_01: And just in 2012, they found Richard III's remains.
32:03
SPEAKER_01: Right.
32:04
SPEAKER_00: So you know And that's that's one thing about history because sometimes I think we all get like this.
32:08
SPEAKER_00: You're like, well, why would you write a book on King Henry VIII?
32:10
SPEAKER_00: It's been done.
32:11
SPEAKER_00: Or why would you investigate this?
32:12
SPEAKER_00: It's already been done.
32:13
SPEAKER_00: But you're like, well, new evidence emerges all the time, every decade.
32:17
SPEAKER_01: History is not just about the past.
32:18
SPEAKER_00: And if you're, you know, a person who's genuinely interested in one of these subjects, do you really want to dust off a book from like 1975?
32:25
SPEAKER_01: You'd rather have sexist in it.
32:28
SPEAKER_01: Like Anvelyn deserved her death for being a harlot and a witch.
32:32
SPEAKER_01: And a witch.
32:33
SPEAKER_00: So you kind of want something that's new and current, even if it is the same information presented in a very similar way.
32:38
SPEAKER_00: It's just nice to know that that's the most up-to-date version.
32:41
SPEAKER_00: So anyone who's an aspiring historian, like, don't think like, oh, I can't do that because it's already been done.
32:46
SPEAKER_00: You always need new versions.
32:47
SPEAKER_00: Like every 10 years, you need new versions.
32:49
SPEAKER_00: Preach it, girl.
32:50
SPEAKER_01: So they're gonna put it on so low, and now look at us.
32:55
SPEAKER_01: We're encouraging young historians.
32:57
SPEAKER_00: That's my process is I get really dark and then I go really, really uh highs.
33:03
SPEAKER_01: You go from lows to highs.
33:05
SPEAKER_01: That sounds bipolar.
33:06
SPEAKER_01: Sounds like that.
33:07
SPEAKER_01: That's why I shot myself and I didn't want to say that word.
33:10
SPEAKER_01: And then I get really excited and then I go down.
33:12
SPEAKER_01: And then I go down.
33:13
SPEAKER_00: I'm just saying, without any um lows, you wouldn't have any highs.
33:17
SPEAKER_01: You know who was in a real Alice Tankerville, who is still locked up in prison, and now 20 minutes later, October to this.
33:26
SPEAKER_00: They're still locked up in the prison.
33:27
SPEAKER_00: They're locked up.
33:28
SPEAKER_00: So at this point, they're both in there.
33:30
SPEAKER_00: Um they I don't know actually where John was, but Alice was for sure.
33:34
SPEAKER_00: I don't give a shit.
33:34
SPEAKER_00: No one didn't who's sin somewhere in the tower, who cares?
33:37
SPEAKER_00: Which John.
33:37
SPEAKER_00: Which John's bot or which she's got a lot of Johns.
33:40
SPEAKER_00: Um Wolf, I'm referring to Wolf.
33:42
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I think he's in the tower.
33:44
SPEAKER_00: Well, I know he's in the tower.
33:45
SPEAKER_00: I'm saying she specifically, if you let me finish, is in the cold harbor part of the tower.
33:52
SPEAKER_00: So what?
33:53
SPEAKER_00: The cold harbor part of the tower.
33:54
SPEAKER_00: So it's like an innermost wall of the tower.
33:57
SPEAKER_00: So that's where she is.
33:58
SPEAKER_00: Um again, I don't know in the tower where John Wolf is, but that's where she is right now.
34:02
SPEAKER_00: So she's very much like double barricaded, like she's in there with no chance of escape.
34:08
SPEAKER_00: But who's there?
34:09
SPEAKER_00: Who?
34:10
SPEAKER_00: Who's there to help her out?
34:11
SPEAKER_00: Who?
34:12
SPEAKER_00: Mr.
34:12
SPEAKER_00: Bod.
34:13
SPEAKER_00: Good.
34:14
SPEAKER_00: Go ahead.
34:14
SPEAKER_00: Uh, I don't even know what I was gonna say.
34:16
SPEAKER_00: Oh, then I'll keep going.
34:17
unknown: Okay, keep going.
34:18
SPEAKER_00: Well, I was just gonna say, so so Bod at this point, again, like knows that John Wolfe is back, but feels so much sympathy for Alice.
34:25
SPEAKER_00: So he actually starts conspiring with Alice and he says, you know what?
34:30
SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna get you out of here.
34:31
SPEAKER_00: I think I have a plan.
34:33
SPEAKER_00: You know, you and I obviously have something that we feel for each other.
34:36
SPEAKER_00: Why don't we run away together?
34:38
SPEAKER_00: So he and she hatch this large plan for her to escape and for them to run away together.
34:44
SPEAKER_00: Um, so he at this point makes a duplicate key of one of the outer walls.
34:49
SPEAKER_00: He gives her some sort of like stick so she can jimmy the door that leads directly to her cell and like greases the hinges.
34:56
SPEAKER_00: They do all these things, this very intricate plan, and he says, Okay, you're gonna come out, we're gonna meet at a certain time, and then uh I have a little boat waiting for us, and we're gonna go on the tames and take off.
35:06
SPEAKER_01: You know what's interesting?
35:07
SPEAKER_01: I was looking at my notes.
35:09
SPEAKER_01: Not that story?
35:10
SPEAKER_01: No, I was listening, but also I have notes on here on what happened to William Dennis.
35:14
SPEAKER_01: I didn't even know I knew that.
35:16
SPEAKER_01: Is that relevant right now?
35:17
SPEAKER_01: Or is that like a kind of okay, but William Dennis, who was actually a servant of the Lord Lieutenant, um, so he was also obviously her jailer too, and he was the other one that she was conspiring with.
35:29
SPEAKER_01: Supposedly, William actually showed her, like verbally, how to get out of the tower, but he got let go and was fired.
35:38
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he did fired.
35:40
SPEAKER_01: I say let go because I'm in management, and that's the nicer way to say it.
35:44
SPEAKER_01: They were terminated, they were he's being outplaced.
35:47
SPEAKER_01: Outplaced positions no longer needed, looking for other options, yeah, all of that downsize, they downsized the yell the yeoman, and um because he was fraternizing with a prisoner.
36:00
SPEAKER_00: Right, which also makes me think that she's extra sneaky and like she didn't like Dennis, so she was like, Hey, I know you're really smart, so I'm gonna be charming to you, and you're gonna tell me the way you're pulling up.
36:10
SPEAKER_01: So, like, I don't know, if you were just like, let's say you got trapped in here, like what would be your shortest way out?
36:16
SPEAKER_01: Like, so where am I here?
36:18
SPEAKER_01: Like, how many more towers are there around like if this rock is north and I'm here, tell me exactly.
36:24
SPEAKER_01: How many lefts do I navigate before I go right?
36:28
SPEAKER_00: And where's your wine cellar on the way out?
36:31
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
36:32
SPEAKER_01: So he so so they were fraternizing, she basically got the details, and then Bod came in, and then he was really just a dummy and fell in love with her, even more so, and like gave her the tools.
36:42
SPEAKER_00: Right.
36:43
SPEAKER_00: As you just mentioned.
36:44
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
36:44
SPEAKER_00: So she probably took the tools from Dennis and then was like, I'm actually gonna hang out with your buddy Bod over there, but thanks for the information.
36:51
SPEAKER_00: Bod was the one who gave me the key.
36:52
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he just gave me the directions.
36:54
SPEAKER_00: Ooh.
36:55
SPEAKER_00: Kind of like her style.
36:56
SPEAKER_00: I also like that she was a common-law wife.
36:58
SPEAKER_00: She'd really commit to marriage.
37:01
unknown: Sorry.
37:01
SPEAKER_00: It's still a thing.
37:03
SPEAKER_00: It is.
37:03
SPEAKER_00: Isn't it kind of antiquated?
37:05
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
37:05
SPEAKER_00: We'll get into that in another episode.
37:07
SPEAKER_00: I mean, we have time for another tandem just.
37:09
SPEAKER_00: No, we don't.
37:10
SPEAKER_00: We gotta move our story along.
37:12
SPEAKER_00: I'm listening.
37:13
SPEAKER_00: Um, all right, so so again, so he makes the secret key.
37:16
SPEAKER_00: It's 10 o'clock at night.
37:18
SPEAKER_00: It's 10 o'clock at night.
37:19
SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
37:19
SPEAKER_00: And what's the weather?
37:20
SPEAKER_00: Probably a balmy 72 degrees.
37:23
SPEAKER_00: I have no idea what time of year it is.
37:25
SPEAKER_01: It's like, um, we don't know what time of year it is.
37:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's springtime.
37:29
SPEAKER_00: It's like now.
37:30
SPEAKER_00: We hate it.
37:31
SPEAKER_00: We hate everything about this season.
37:33
SPEAKER_01: It's February 14th.
37:34
SPEAKER_00: It's February 14th.
37:36
SPEAKER_00: So, anyway, uh, it gets she gets the key, they have this whole plan.
37:39
SPEAKER_00: It's uh nightfall, and oh god, I think I just drank some cork.
37:43
SPEAKER_00: Ew, really?
37:45
SPEAKER_00: Was it yummy?
37:46
SPEAKER_00: All gritty.
37:48
SPEAKER_00: Maybe it was just one of those wine crystals.
37:50
SPEAKER_00: Anyway, back to my story.
37:53
SPEAKER_00: Thanks for interrupting.
37:54
SPEAKER_00: Uh 10 o'clock at night, it's shadowy.
37:57
SPEAKER_00: 72 degrees.
37:58
SPEAKER_00: It's 72 degrees.
37:59
SPEAKER_00: And all of a sudden, like, you know, her first door is wedged open by her and her stick.
38:05
SPEAKER_00: And then she gets the key and she opens the second door and she creeps through the night, and somehow she they knew the guard's schedule, so she knew she wasn't gonna get caught to a channel.
38:15
SPEAKER_01: Well, they knew because frickin' Bod was on done.
38:17
SPEAKER_01: He wasn't on duty.
38:18
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
38:19
SPEAKER_01: But he knew their shifts, and he knows.
38:22
SPEAKER_00: He was saying that he wasn't working at the time.
38:23
SPEAKER_00: He was like off-duty.
38:24
SPEAKER_00: Made copies of the manager's schedules.
38:27
SPEAKER_00: That's to the manager's schedule.
38:29
SPEAKER_00: And so she gets to a point where then Bod meets her.
38:33
SPEAKER_00: So they're together, and he says, Okay, I have this little boat, we're gonna take it and get off of the teams.
38:38
SPEAKER_00: So they make it all the way to the boat, they make it all the way to the other side of the river, and they think they're in the clear.
38:44
SPEAKER_00: They're like, wow, we escaped the Tower of London, we did it.
38:46
SPEAKER_01: And what's so sweet is so like they were imagining living a life together as husband and wife.
38:52
SPEAKER_00: Also, I like that that's pure speculation.
38:55
SPEAKER_00: Almost everything we read in every documentary was like they were imagining a life together.
38:59
SPEAKER_00: They were going to run off and have 12 kids together.
39:02
SPEAKER_00: What if she was about to murder the guy?
39:04
SPEAKER_00: You don't know that.
39:04
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, maybe she actually hated him.
39:06
SPEAKER_01: But she just needed to get out of it.
39:08
SPEAKER_01: Maybe he was just another tool in the toolbox.
39:09
SPEAKER_01: Like, why all the-but they did have a getaway house they were going to get to, and that was their plan.
39:15
SPEAKER_01: Right.
39:15
SPEAKER_01: They also, um, I like this little part.
39:18
SPEAKER_01: As she passed by the cells and she was like racing through the hallways of the tower with her hood on and like being all mischievous or something.
39:27
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
39:28
SPEAKER_01: Um, other prisoners were like yelling at her, like, free us too, free me.
39:33
SPEAKER_00: Take care.
39:34
SPEAKER_00: She gave them all the bird as she ran and was like, uh, no.
39:39
SPEAKER_00: Are you the one when you stole my lunch?
39:41
SPEAKER_00: Fuck you guys.
39:42
SPEAKER_01: I'm the only one smart enough to seduce the the bee feeder over here.
39:47
SPEAKER_01: If you guys were hotter, you get out of here.
39:49
SPEAKER_01: Um I was gonna say something else.
39:51
SPEAKER_01: It was significant.
39:52
SPEAKER_01: Uh, they were running, she got in front.
39:54
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, she also disguised herself as a man.
39:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
39:58
SPEAKER_01: Which we've always talked about.
39:59
SPEAKER_01: Disguise yourself as the opposite sex.
40:01
SPEAKER_00: Finally did it.
40:02
SPEAKER_00: We finally found a woman smart enough to know hey, you disguise yourself as the opposite sex.
40:06
SPEAKER_00: Yes, you always do that.
40:07
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
40:07
SPEAKER_00: Mr.
40:08
SPEAKER_00: Tober.
40:11
SPEAKER_01: Bob was not as smart.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: He's freaking wearing his uniform.
40:15
SPEAKER_01: Beef eater outfit.
40:16
SPEAKER_01: His beef eater, how do you say eelman?
40:18
SPEAKER_01: Eelman.
40:19
SPEAKER_01: Nope.
40:20
SPEAKER_01: Damace.
40:22
SPEAKER_00: Jailer outfit.
40:23
SPEAKER_00: Gowler.
40:24
SPEAKER_00: Gowl.
40:25
SPEAKER_00: American.
40:26
SPEAKER_00: Anyway, he's wearing his outfit, which I was wondering, was he wearing his like guard outfit because he wanted to blend in?
40:33
SPEAKER_00: Like, oh no, I'm just a guard.
40:34
SPEAKER_00: Or did he like just get off shift?
40:36
SPEAKER_00: Or was he that stupid to be like, oops, I forgot I had this thing on still.
40:39
SPEAKER_00: Or maybe he that's all he owns.
40:42
SPEAKER_00: Or that's his only option to wear, yeah.
40:44
SPEAKER_00: I couldn't.
40:44
SPEAKER_01: Anyways, stupid because people recognize him.
40:47
SPEAKER_01: Hmm, what's this guard doing with this old crippled?
40:50
SPEAKER_01: Again, I'm just picturing Jafar when he's all dressed up as an old man.
40:54
SPEAKER_01: Probably.
40:54
SPEAKER_01: Probably look just like him.
40:56
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, so people recognize him and they're like, hey John, like what you doing here?
41:00
SPEAKER_00: I thought you were off, buddy.
41:01
SPEAKER_00: Like, I thought you went to the tavern.
41:03
SPEAKER_00: And then he's like, Oh, I'm just I've got my keys, I don't know.
41:08
SPEAKER_00: And they see immediately the person that he's with recognize not only is it not a man, but it's a woman who they know very well because she's a very famous prisoner, very charming prisoner.
41:20
SPEAKER_00: Alice is Alice.
41:24
SPEAKER_01: They were not kind.
41:25
SPEAKER_01: They threw those two back into the tower quicker than they could have said hippopotamus.
41:30
SPEAKER_01: Oh, that's specific.
41:33
SPEAKER_01: Um she was brought back into her shackles.
41:36
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
41:37
SPEAKER_01: Bud did not have it so easy.
41:39
SPEAKER_01: So, I mean, again, he's a jailer, he works there, he's one of the guards.
41:44
SPEAKER_01: Right.
41:44
SPEAKER_01: And they do not like traitors.
41:47
SPEAKER_01: They do not like any guards who are being kind and trying to get the prisoners free.
41:54
SPEAKER_01: So he's basically a traitor.
41:56
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he's like the worst type of traitor.
41:59
SPEAKER_01: They put him in a cell called the Little Ease.
42:02
SPEAKER_01: Which is the first I've ever heard of this.
42:04
SPEAKER_01: Have you ever heard of that?
42:05
SPEAKER_00: Never heard of the and I thought I really like knew my shit on the Tower of London.
42:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you're already separating the A, B, and C groups of the Tower of London tourists, so I'm surprised you didn't know about that.
42:14
SPEAKER_00: That's gonna be one of our quiz questions.
42:16
SPEAKER_00: Ah.
42:17
SPEAKER_00: What is the little ease?
42:19
SPEAKER_00: And why do they call it that?
42:20
SPEAKER_01: The little ease translates into something about not being comfortable.
42:24
SPEAKER_01: I forgot.
42:25
SPEAKER_01: Of little comfort.
42:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's basically saying you literally have little ease, like little comfort.
42:30
SPEAKER_00: Which I was like, oh, so New Orleans is big easy.
42:33
SPEAKER_00: That means you got a lot of comfort there.
42:35
SPEAKER_00: Get it?
42:36
SPEAKER_01: No?
42:36
SPEAKER_00: That's pretty funny.
42:37
SPEAKER_00: You weren't even listening to my house because I don't want to say it again.
42:40
SPEAKER_00: Megan staring off into the distance with this blank face.
42:44
SPEAKER_00: Megan.
42:45
SPEAKER_01: Um I'm not gonna say it again.
42:46
SPEAKER_00: You will listen next time round when you hear it.
42:49
SPEAKER_01: The little ease was like what, like one meter by one meter or something extremely tiny.
42:54
SPEAKER_00: It wasn't, we saw different like dimensions on different you know, sources, but generally it wasn't enough space for you to stand up in or lay down in, so all you could really do was like be in the fetal position.
43:04
SPEAKER_01: You can like crouch on your knees or like go into the fetal position, but you couldn't do anything.
43:09
SPEAKER_01: You can't stand, you can't lay down, you can't sit completely.
43:12
SPEAKER_01: Right.
43:12
SPEAKER_01: And it's just a windowless, dark confinement.
43:16
SPEAKER_01: And that is the epitome of torture.
43:20
SPEAKER_01: And the only time they took him out was to do what?
43:23
SPEAKER_01: Torture him.
43:24
SPEAKER_01: More.
43:24
SPEAKER_01: He's like, finally, I get to come out for a fresher breath air, and they'd be like, oh no.
43:29
SPEAKER_01: I'm actually going on the rack.
43:30
SPEAKER_01: I'm getting out to stretch out a little bit, but really stretch.
43:34
SPEAKER_01: Stretching out too much than you want.
43:36
SPEAKER_01: Hey, so it looks like you could stretch your legs a little.
43:38
SPEAKER_01: Let me pull those out of this sockets.
43:40
SPEAKER_01: So they did rack him.
43:42
SPEAKER_01: They racked him, they tortured this poor guy.
43:44
SPEAKER_01: I think he was young.
43:45
SPEAKER_01: We don't know how old he was.
43:47
SPEAKER_01: Well, he was unmarried, you know, so he must have been fairly stupid.
43:50
SPEAKER_01: So he must have been young.
43:51
SPEAKER_01: You're only young.
43:52
SPEAKER_00: During like 1920.
43:54
SPEAKER_00: Maybe.
43:55
SPEAKER_00: Um, but so they only took him out to torture him until they finally got to a point where they put him on the rack.
44:00
SPEAKER_00: They pulled him until all of his muscles basically tore and his ligaments tore.
44:04
SPEAKER_00: So he was at this point just terror broken body.
44:08
SPEAKER_00: His limbs aren't torn off, you know, like we had in our last gruesome episode.
44:11
SPEAKER_00: Um, but they're, you know, everything's out of their sockets and he couldn't walk or move.
44:15
SPEAKER_00: A Betty Spaghetti limp noodle.
44:17
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's a good one.
44:18
SPEAKER_00: Betty spaghetti.
44:19
SPEAKER_00: I wonder if they had that in England.
44:21
SPEAKER_00: Probably not.
44:21
SPEAKER_00: Is that a toy anymore?
44:22
SPEAKER_01: Um, really quick, also though, the little ease.
44:25
SPEAKER_01: Oh, back to this.
44:26
SPEAKER_01: Don't know for sure where it was located in the tower.
44:29
SPEAKER_01: Right.
44:30
SPEAKER_01: So we even if we wanted to see it, we don't know where it was located.
44:32
SPEAKER_01: But it for sure was around because there's documents of them throwing people into the little ease.
44:35
SPEAKER_01: Right.
44:35
SPEAKER_01: And John Bott was one of them.
44:37
SPEAKER_01: Poor guy.
44:38
SPEAKER_01: So he got racked.
44:39
SPEAKER_00: Racked, stretched out, tortured.
44:41
SPEAKER_00: And then once his again, all of his uh, you know, things were out of their sockets, they finally put him up on the tower.
44:48
SPEAKER_00: Was it the tower bridge or tower wall?
44:50
SPEAKER_00: The one of the walls, one of the tower.
44:52
SPEAKER_00: One of the big walls, and they hung him from his arms.
44:55
SPEAKER_00: So his arms are just straight up above his head.
44:57
SPEAKER_00: Already dislocated.
44:58
SPEAKER_00: Already dislocated.
44:59
SPEAKER_01: Oh man, that's gotta be painful.
45:01
SPEAKER_00: Leave him there to die.
45:03
SPEAKER_01: They don't even like really execute him, they just leave him there.
45:06
SPEAKER_00: They just it's so he dies of exposure, they dehydration, starvation, pain.
45:10
SPEAKER_00: The yeah, the pain from all the injuries, and then the ravens and the crows get to him and start pecking out his flesh and his eyes.
45:18
SPEAKER_01: What would be worse for you?
45:19
SPEAKER_01: Getting drawn and quartered or getting left for days a slow death like that?
45:25
SPEAKER_00: That's a good question.
45:25
SPEAKER_00: We had a similar question in our Captain Kid as well.
45:27
SPEAKER_00: Would you rather like would you rather?
45:30
SPEAKER_00: A little bit of a quitter quo.
45:31
SPEAKER_00: Maybe this is a tangent.
45:32
SPEAKER_00: I don't know because oh god, like drawn and quartered is honestly probably my worst fear in terms of torture and death.
45:40
SPEAKER_00: But it's exposure's so slow.
45:42
SPEAKER_00: I feel like, I don't know.
45:44
SPEAKER_00: I maybe I'd opt for exposure, but then I would just find a way to end it faster somehow.
45:50
SPEAKER_00: Like I'd convince a passerby.
45:51
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I would just hold my breath that of hot oil and throw it on me.
45:55
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
45:56
SPEAKER_01: God, it's just so terrible.
45:58
SPEAKER_01: Um, but let's not forget about Alice because she also had her punishment coming.
46:02
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
46:03
SPEAKER_01: They basically they they really wanted her and her husband to be executed together.
46:08
SPEAKER_01: Here's the funny thing because technically their crime was committed on water when they took the robbery, they're pirates.
46:14
SPEAKER_01: They're pirates.
46:15
SPEAKER_01: Right.
46:15
SPEAKER_01: So they intentionally wanted to execute them in a pirate manner.
46:19
SPEAKER_01: Right, give them a pirate death.
46:21
SPEAKER_01: Kind of going back to our um William Kidd episode of how pirates were executed, they weren't just hanged like normal.
46:28
SPEAKER_01: Um, they were either hanged kind of like Bod, like out in the elements in in chains, right, or in this sense, they were basically kind of like Bod hung on a wall, but they were hung on the lower wall of the tower, right above the Thames River, right.
46:45
SPEAKER_01: And waited for the tide to come in so that they drown.
46:49
SPEAKER_00: Right.
46:50
SPEAKER_00: So basically, when they're being strung up, it's low tide.
46:52
SPEAKER_00: So maybe the water's at their ankles, like thighs, waist, and then dirty water.
46:58
SPEAKER_00: Dirty water.
46:58
SPEAKER_01: So again, our Disney references.
47:00
SPEAKER_01: Now we're thinking Peter Pan and Tiger Lily is being hung over the rock and the water's coming out.
47:06
SPEAKER_01: That's basically what's happening.
47:08
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
47:09
SPEAKER_00: So they're just waiting for that long, slow death of drowning together, side by side, which is hilarious because she doesn't like wolf.
47:16
SPEAKER_00: She was with Bod the whole time.
47:18
SPEAKER_00: Um then.
47:18
SPEAKER_01: He freaking ran off to Ireland.
47:20
SPEAKER_00: She's like, I was just about to run off with the other guy, but I guess I'll die with you.
47:24
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
47:25
SPEAKER_00: This really is a good lover story.
47:27
SPEAKER_00: It's such a such a lover's triangle.
47:30
SPEAKER_00: And it's funny because I'm also thinking, what does John Wolf think throughout all of this?
47:34
SPEAKER_00: Like, he obviously probably appreciated her presence when he was in prison.
47:37
SPEAKER_00: Then he ran away.
47:38
SPEAKER_00: Then he came.
47:40
SPEAKER_00: I guess you gotta love someone for that and treats.
47:43
SPEAKER_00: You give me wine and treats.
47:46
SPEAKER_00: Just like Miss Alice.
47:49
SPEAKER_00: Um, so but but it but he's destined to die next to her.
47:52
SPEAKER_00: So is he happy about that?
47:53
SPEAKER_00: Is he kind of pissed at her?
47:55
SPEAKER_00: No one's happy about dying.
47:56
SPEAKER_00: No, of course not.
47:57
SPEAKER_00: But is he happy that they're together, or is it this point is he resentful because he knows that she almost ran away with another dude?
48:02
SPEAKER_00: You know, I don't know what was going through his head.
48:06
SPEAKER_01: Well, this was our Valentine's Day story.
48:09
SPEAKER_01: Um, then they just die.
48:11
SPEAKER_01: Then they died, then they died.
48:13
SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, I think we didn't really have any follow-up of where they were buried.
48:17
SPEAKER_01: We had nothing else beyond that, besides there was a big crowd.
48:20
SPEAKER_01: It was a big spec like a spectacle.
48:23
SPEAKER_01: No, I don't give me that look.
48:25
SPEAKER_01: Okay, I didn't know.
48:26
SPEAKER_01: People came to go look at them because people enjoyed watching like the dirty like petty thieves getting executed because it was just as exciting.
48:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, well, they were kind of more rambunctious and like it wasn't so like noble and somber.
48:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
48:44
SPEAKER_00: Uh they did record people got rowdy.
48:46
SPEAKER_00: But they did at least record the date of the execution, they did, which is rare for peasants.
48:50
SPEAKER_00: Um, but it was March 31st, 1534.
48:52
SPEAKER_00: So this is after Queen Anne is well now Queen.
48:56
SPEAKER_00: She's in the middle of her reign.
48:59
SPEAKER_01: Um, I only really have one quote with all of this.
49:02
SPEAKER_01: Quote.
49:03
SPEAKER_01: Quote.
49:04
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
49:04
SPEAKER_01: Um, going back to John Bodd, he did confess while he was being racked.
49:07
SPEAKER_01: He almost confessed immediately.
49:09
SPEAKER_01: He was like very guilty from the like, yeah.
49:11
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I got caught red-handed.
49:12
SPEAKER_01: I was letting her escape.
49:14
SPEAKER_01: I was catching her down.
49:16
SPEAKER_01: Um, and he stated in his confession, he said that he participated in the escape, quote, for the very love and affection that I bear to the woman.
49:27
SPEAKER_00: Oh, the woman.
49:30
SPEAKER_00: Why not name her name?
49:32
SPEAKER_00: Um that's cute though.
49:34
SPEAKER_00: I like that.
49:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, very much.
49:35
SPEAKER_01: I I feel like he was just a sad little like puppy who got ringed into all of this, and she just wanted to get out.
49:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, she didn't care about him.
49:43
SPEAKER_00: I was like, she had a common law husband, she just flirted with all of the men who would possibly let her out.
49:49
SPEAKER_00: So who knows where her change really was.
49:51
SPEAKER_01: I liked where she was going.
49:52
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, just to change survivor.
49:55
SPEAKER_00: Um, and then the gold was also never recovered.
49:58
SPEAKER_00: So King Henry VIII did this whole thing, and I think that's why it was such a big spectacle, too, of you know, Bod dying and of um, you know, the wolves dying, is because they wanted to make sure the wolves throw them to the wolves, but they wanted to make sure they like everyone knew, like, hey, these people were caught stealing, you know, a million dollars in gold.
50:17
SPEAKER_00: So it was very much like you don't fuck with the king's treasury, and they wanted it to be a very big spectacle.
50:22
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, for sure.
50:23
SPEAKER_01: Possibly they murdered Italians.
50:25
SPEAKER_01: Who knows?
50:26
SPEAKER_01: I'm I actually I'm really interested to know if if someone is super confident in the timeline of the story.
50:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, please reach out.
50:34
SPEAKER_01: We can always be contacted at um beheaded.podcast is our Instagram handle.
50:40
SPEAKER_01: That's what you call it, right?
50:41
SPEAKER_01: A handle?
50:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
50:42
SPEAKER_01: Uh uh, where else are we?
50:44
SPEAKER_01: I don't really look at Twitter.
50:46
SPEAKER_01: I don't know how to work that.
50:47
SPEAKER_00: No.
50:47
SPEAKER_01: Um every now and then I look at my email.
50:50
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
50:50
SPEAKER_01: Beheaded.podcast at gmail.com.
50:52
SPEAKER_01: Perfect.
50:53
SPEAKER_01: Really, Instagram's the best one.
50:55
SPEAKER_01: Um, thank you for those who have contacted us, but I've heard some really cool stories.
50:59
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we keep getting like more and more interesting people that have reached out.
51:02
SPEAKER_00: You know, people have different stories uh from different areas of the country, from different countries.
51:07
SPEAKER_00: Um, we just had a one one guy reach out to us.
51:10
SPEAKER_00: Uh, you talked to him, Megan, I think.
51:11
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, Chef James reached out to us on Instagram, and he is he it sounds like he's a bartender at several pubs, but one he works at um the Hatchet in Bristol and he was giving all just like he was sending pictures and everything, but I guess this place is first of all, the walls are made out of human skin.
51:31
SPEAKER_01: Like, that's how let's start with that.
51:34
SPEAKER_01: I'm not kidding you because at first I was like, okay, and then I started Googling, I was like, oh my god, like seriously.
51:40
SPEAKER_01: Are they allowed to do that?
51:41
SPEAKER_01: And they would pass health code?
51:43
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
51:43
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's England, so England.
51:46
SPEAKER_01: I don't know what their health codes are.
51:48
SPEAKER_01: And uh they would perform executions in front of this pub, and it's extremely haunted.
51:53
SPEAKER_01: So when we do go to London because we will do a lot of places on our list.
51:58
SPEAKER_01: We have so many friends who've been reaching out to us, and I call you friends because honestly, like you're a friend.
52:03
SPEAKER_01: It's it's fun just recording this, and we would probably still do it if nobody listened.
52:08
SPEAKER_01: But I really love the people that we've been chatting with and meeting around the world because of this.
52:13
SPEAKER_01: So um, thanks for reaching out, and we are gonna make like our tour around.
52:16
SPEAKER_00: And my should be there for a month just to see if we're gonna be able to do it.
52:19
SPEAKER_01: We're just gonna meet everyone and visit and go find dead people at the hatchet.
52:24
SPEAKER_01: Perfect.
52:25
SPEAKER_01: I can't wait.
52:26
SPEAKER_01: We don't want to meet anymore.
52:27
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, let us know who you are.
52:29
SPEAKER_01: We love hearing about you.
52:31
SPEAKER_01: Uh, like us, follow us, all those stupid things I have to say.
52:34
SPEAKER_01: Blah blah blah.
52:35
SPEAKER_01: Happy Valentine's Day, man.
52:36
SPEAKER_01: Happy Valentine.
52:37
SPEAKER_01: Woohoo.
52:38
SPEAKER_01: Uh Elizabeth, on that note, any any final words?
52:41
SPEAKER_01: Not today.