Latest / Marci talks money (and life) / Season 3 Recap: Guest Highlights, Money Mindset & Life Lessons with Caryn Martinez
Transcript
- Marci Grossman (01:02) Hello, I am MoneyMarci, welcome. This is the final episode of season three, the wrap up episode where we revisit the fabulous guests from this season. And I am thrilled to welcome my good friend Caryn Martinez who continues to join me on these wrap up episodes so I don't just sit here talking to myself. Caryn (01:26) So we just talk to ourselves. ⁓ Marci Grossman (01:30) Well yeah, but at least if we're talking to ourselves, I'm talking to someone, not just sitting here babbling by myself. So I was thrilled with this season. I think my guests are always fabulous. Like from day one, I've been very fortunate to get a wide variety of interesting people to talk to who are willing to share their knowledge, their experiences, their but I keep getting better at how to do this, whether it's the editing portion or asking better questions. So I apologize to my earlier guests from season one that I wasn't better, but you were fabulous. Caryn (02:13) We had a lot of really interesting guests this season. ⁓ look, Cattail! Marci Grossman (02:18) Yeah, Morgana's decided she wants to visit. Let's just jump in and start off. I had Jessica Lerner-Halprin from Swanky, which is party software. And I just thought that was fabulous. Things I don't think of, things you don't necessarily realize what you need when you're throwing a party or how it works when you hire a party planner. And then if you don't hire that party planner the next time around, what you might be missing out on to have software and organize that. Caryn (02:53) I do know about... party planning and entertainment. I should have rechecked this because what I wanted to find out is if she was doing a section for consumers or also to help the professionals that were there. But when it came to her story, it was a very interesting story. The way that things happened in her life that led her to do this. Marci Grossman (03:15) Yeah, and I love that. So she had information and she had the personal story and all the things that came with that. We talked about people holding on to a little bit of money, always having a little bit. And I should check her out because when I talked to her, doing videos was still a new thing for her. And to see how that's gone and if she's gotten more comfortable doing them. I think her software is for both the party planner and the individual so they can keep in touch and keep that information available as they do it. I wouldn't be surprised if there's some partnering going on of planners saying, one of the things we're gonna do is we're gonna work together using this software that lets us work together. I thought she was a great way to... to kick off the season, you know hey, it's a party here. Caryn (04:12) And she isn't the only party background later we'll get to somebody else that started in it. So she started in something completely different and then ended up in the party planning and your cat is cracking me up. Marci Grossman (04:26) Yeah, Morgana thinks life is her party. And then I went to Keisha Woods, Coach K, who I have talked to before. I actually guested on her podcast again this season, and years ago I had guested on a different podcast Caryn (04:28) Yeah. Marci Grossman (04:45) Keisha is coaching, speaking, and creating community. Marci Grossman (04:49) Her podcast is Upgraded MindsetZ and it's amazing what people are putting out there in the world to help make things more accessible for everybody. Caryn (05:04) Yeah, when it came to Keisha, there were two things that were really interesting. One is the Upgraded MindsetZ coaching, but she also has Upgraded MindsetZ suite. So this brick and mortar co-working space. And when women have their businesses in that co-working space, they also have access to business services right there and classes. So that is a very cool thing because not every city has something like that. And this is especially for female entrepreneurs. So I liked that aspect of her business. I also liked that she talks with great empathy and helps people to try to handle their money and career differently than their family and friends because what she's found in her coaching career is that people often get excited about doing something that for them makes a lot of sense but then it goes against all the things the other people are doing and it becomes more difficult for them. Marci Grossman (06:07) And then first tax preparer, Ron Silberstein, a CPA. It seemed during tax season, was the right time to be talking to people about tax preparation, organizing for tax season. He actually worked for Intuit for a year. You see the ads online and hey, you can talk to a real accountant or CPA or tax preparer, someone who's experienced. Caryn (06:10) You're fewest this time, yeah. This Marci Grossman (06:32) So it's an interesting perspective from that side of things. I wouldn't want to do it because I like to spend individual time with my clients. But it is a service that also has value. That is a challenge. A lot of interesting perspective, a lot of tax preparation knowledge, Caryn (06:52) He had so much good advice that I liked. Starting from of course you were you know interviewing him earlier in the year and he was talking about the importance of getting your information to an accountant as early as you can. Which I think a lot of people know but he says if this is the first time you've been with an accountant or you're new with them you really have to get to them early. So he was talking about the reasons why that's really important. Also the importance of not trying to make your own personalized financial tracking system and then trying to turn that over to an accountant. He says, know, it would be easier, as a tax preparation professional, if you just handed me a shoe box of receipts. I can handle the shoe box of receipts, but figuring out, this... system that you've made for yourself that doesn't exist anywhere else is harder. Actually that should take the pressure off of some people who are thinking, what am I going to do with all my stuff? Don't worry about it. There's the professional to help you just give him your, last year's tax return and the shoe box full of receipts. Marci Grossman (08:04) Of course there's nothing wrong with sitting down with your tax preparer and saying how can I organize this? Can you help me set up a system that will work for you and work for me? Because people don't always understand the logic about what really needs to go together and what things really are separate. I also get things that are in a way that makes sense for that person for their business model but not for what I need to prepare taxes. You can say that in any business. You can say that in party planning. You can say that in anything out there. There are different ways to do things and you want to work with the professional you're working with. Caryn (08:42) I was going to say your spreadsheet will look different compared to your business because you might have to track different things, but ultimately you still have to pull the most important information. The information that the government wants to know for the taxes has to be easy for you to get. Marci Grossman (09:01) Right, absolutely. And then Linda Grizzly with with Me Money and we talked about money personalities and I thought that was fascinating and I don't remember the names of the personalities but you can go to her website and take the quiz and you'll find out your personality. But a lot of it is about communicating with your partner, with your spouse, and if you understand your personality and their personality, you can see where the challenges might be and have that better communication because, theoretically you and your partner want to go in the same direction. You want to do the best things you can to make sure you're communicating and finding that way to work together and get where you both want to go. Caryn (09:46) Yes, she had an interesting career path because she had actually owned a women's fitness center early in her career. She had also started her financial career helping people plan for philanthropic giving. And it was because of the things that she learned helping the people just set up for giving that she went into financial planning for the entire picture of the people. So that was a nice way that she got into it. Marci Grossman (10:16) I love these pivots. And then we're pivoting on to guest number five. Caryn (10:21) Who could that be? Marci Grossman (10:24) My friend with so many hats. I love that conversation not just because it was you but organizing and decluttering and sorting and we all have challenges with that and don't necessarily think of the way that impacts us financially when we can't find things we want or when we're holding space and it prevents us from getting other things because of things we're holding on to. Caryn (10:26) Yeah. Marci Grossman (10:51) Have you got Sortganize going again? Caryn (10:55) I have to say I haven't had people, although it would help if I advertised it. So I don't have a Sortganizers yet. But for anybody listening, if you want to join something fun and doesn't cost anybody to do, you can join the Sortganize, which is our sorting, organizing, and decluttering. It's a section of Caryn's Creative communities. Marci Grossman (11:27) And what's great about that is sometimes we just need that support to do something. I want to clean it up. I don't need a coach sitting on my shoulder, but I do need someone, I don't know if I'd say to be accountable to, but just to communicate with, to cheer me on as I move forward in doing these things and having that community is really helpful. And then Ryan Canfield, who is a financial professional, and talked about how he ended up there and the struggles, because he felt the financial professionals didn't necessarily listen to his parents and their situation. And he has big dreams and he is doing the work to get there. Caryn (12:18) I love his passion to make sports affordable for all families. He's done this in a private way, helping, his kids play baseball at a serious level where they're touring, going to from city to city. And I was surprised by how much some of this cost. I really didn't know how much it was. So he's made it so that nobody gets left behind. behind because the parents may not be able to afford some of the equipment. But he wants to expand that so that everybody can afford sports. But I also, it's a sad story, but it's a story that got him going is that the people that were supposed to be advising his parents didn't pay attention to what they needed to do with their money. Didn't pay attention to how the money had to be handled for his brother who was disabled. And it was handled so badly that the brother actually lost his disability eligibility. but that makes you say, always question those financial professionals that are helping you, don't automatically think whatever they do is good because it was not. Marci Grossman (13:37) wanna deal with experts who listen to you and hear you and pay attention to what you're saying and help you work toward your goals. And then another professional, Nick Agharkar, who started doing taxes because his mom took him to H &R Block and said, hey, teach this kid how to do taxes. Caryn (13:59) Yes, he did learn how to do taxes at H &R Block. And he described the three different types of tax attorneys, which he is. And that was interesting, you know, because people probably don't think that there are different kinds but they're estate tax experts, tax controversy attorneys that fight the IRS for you, and tax strategists, which is what he is. So I think a lot of people might not have known that, so it was good information to have. Marci Grossman (14:25) Yeah, I love learning things because I think of tax attorneys and I group them together you want to make sure you end up with a professional that is an expert in the services that you are trying to get from them. So that was another great conversation. Now, Ly Smith, we took a pivot ourselves here because she's not a financial professional. She is, a life coach. She was more about the personal stories, how she's took charge of her own life and decisions she made, bad decisions and then good decisions and communicating and working with her partner to set things right and to learn from those mistakes. She had that cute little wordplay of reactor to creator. That's important for everyone and no matter what you're doing in life, you can either react to the things around you or you can be the one who creates your opportunities or takes charge and makes decisions rather than just responding to things going on around you. Caryn (15:28) Yeah, I think she now coaches female entrepreneurs. Isn't that her current thing that she does? Yeah. Marci Grossman (15:32) Yes, And then we're going back to financial professionals with Kristine Stevenson, an IRS agent, an enrolled agent, which is a type of tax preparer and she wrote a book and big follower of Dave Ramsey and just another fascinating life story of I did this and then I did this and then she likes volunteering so she was working one of those who worked with VITA because you can come to VITA from many different areas the one we'll talk about later and I did it when I was in college studying accounting and she came to it Caryn (16:12) I forgot, I have it written down later in my notes, but VITA is volunteer. Marci Grossman (16:12) ⁓ later on. Income Tax Assistance. Caryn (16:20) volunteer income tax assistance. Yeah, she's a former IRS agent and what she was emphasizing to people listening is that the IRS is filled with real people, not robots, but real people that they actually want to help you do your taxes right. She's like, just remember that if you need help, or if they reach out to you for something that says, this is wrong on your return, they actually want to help you make it right. They don't just want to complain, hey, you did that wrong. So she's advising people about that. Her whole business is to help people avoid tax trouble. Marci Grossman (17:01) Right, and if you do have trouble and you hire someone to help you, you want someone who has experience dealing with the IRS and resolving these things. And as an IRS agent, she certainly is able to communicate with them in a way that other people may not be. Cindy Koehler. So from Australia that was a fabulous conversation. I just love listening to the accent but the information was incredible as well. She is someone who has so much education and she coaches people on financial and life and entrepreneurship but she also coaches on, I think it was rock climbing and sailing and all kinds of things. She grew up, she lost her father when she was relatively young. And so her mom had to shift and start working. There are lessons you learn because things happen around you and you have to learn and you see the people around you working and making things happen. So she got educated in all these things that she hadn't been educated in growing up so that she could help others and and bring that perspective to the table. Caryn (18:16) A couple of things about her story are good things for people to remember. A good thing that happened is that her father had insurance so that when he died, although her mom did have to go to work, it really helped that he had that insurance money to keep the family going. But something that was difficult for the family is that her mother didn't know at all how her father had handled the money. The kids were little and suddenly she had to figure all of that out. So maybe even though there might be one spouse that is really taking care of a lot of things, the other spouse has to know about how that's done and where the money is and how they do it. Marci Grossman (19:01) It's important to make sure both parties are aware of what's going on with the money. Hopefully there aren't tragedies like that out there, but we know the reality is there are. Then you have to figure it out and find the people to help you get that education on your own financials. It's much easier if you communicate with your spouse and can stay on top of it earlier. And then Samantha Pearl, the construction and the family business and educating women about construction. I don't know if you've caught any of their videos on social media of why you want to do things. It's great what they're putting out there for women especially. Caryn (19:49) Hey, Super helpful. I can tell you personally with Samantha, if you have questions, if you want to learn from her. And if you live in Michigan, hire her to do things. But yeah, I was waiting and waiting for her episode to come out because. Marci Grossman (20:08) That's what you get from knowing things too early. Caryn (20:11) Yeah! So in fact, she's, I don't know when this is going to start, but she's actually gonna take her remodeling, I wanna say seminars, workshops on the road, hopefully, to go from city to city and have these special workshops just for women, how to fix stuff. Marci Grossman (20:33) That's so important because so often when you grew up, certainly at our age, I think now maybe not as much. My dad was unique in that he taught us how to use tools. My brother and I both are handy in using stuff. My sister not so much, but that was a personal choice. Spent a lot of time with my dad fixing things and learning how to use tools and all of that. And I love the conversation about aging in place and thinking about it as you do projects. When your wall is open is the best time to put these things in even if you're not gonna use them, but prep for those things. Sure. Caryn (21:13) the future. I also liked her advice about deciding are you going to do something yourself or are going to hire somebody? So she says what's the worst thing that could happen if it goes wrong? And if the only thing that goes wrong is like you put in tiles and they're a little wonky that's not so bad. However if these are $200 tiles each maybe you don't want to experiment with it. Also if you do it wrong will you electrocute yourself? That could be bad. So I just kind of think like what's the worst thing that would happen? You know, why will I lose a lot of money or will I die so? Marci Grossman (21:54) You might not die, you might just glow in the dark. Zandberg, so he is a young entrepreneur and he started out planning parties. Caryn (22:07) Yes, he did. Marci Grossman (22:09) He always knew he wanted to be an entrepreneur. And so he was taking classes. He and his friends were spending thousands of dollars taking online classes and a lot of times feeling like they wasted the money on the class. That the class. I don't know if it wasn't as described or just the quality of what the instructor had to share. So he's creating this place for online education where you can see what's offered and you can see the reviews on them and they're an independent site. It's not me just getting a bunch of my friends to say Marci's awesome. Hopefully it would be random people saying Marci is awesome, and those random people would put value to it. So I love what he's doing with All Pros. It should be up by now. Caryn (22:59) It's live now. I checked, I checked because with the time of recording it wasn't, but now it is and I looked at it Right now these courses are for IT professionals, different things at IT. He wants to expand it in the future, but we should make it clear that this is for people who need to learn IT. he's got some programming. also related to it up there right now. And he also wants to eventually do it different languages. Right now it's all in English. ⁓ Marci Grossman (23:27) So I would say keep an eye on that site as he continues to expand his courses because whatever the structure is that has to go through before he says, this is something that someone is saying is a good course. So I love that idea because we all know of scams that are out there on the internet or otherwise, give us your money and we'll teach you this amazing thing, which is telling you to... Put an ad out there that says hey if you give me your money I'll teach you an amazing thing which is to tell you to Tell everyone to give you their money and you'll teach them amazing things Which no one actually teaches anything anything amazing other than how to scam people out of their money. Caryn (24:04) Thank Marci Grossman (24:09) I look forward to seeing where All Pros goes. And then Jermaine Ee with Heir Light. And this is another young man who is an entrepreneur. He was already working on all of these things and starting to gather stories. And then his mom passed relatively suddenly, but they had already started having some adventures because he had been talking to her about what kind of things she wanted to do. I love that idea because so many people, HeirLight is wills, but it's the relatively simple wills. Caryn (24:46) listening that it's H-E-I-R as in your heir. So that will make more sense. It's for helping people create wills and directives. Marci Grossman (24:55) you follow my podcast, you can go back and you can check out episodes and the episodes all have links to these various people and businesses that we talk about here. So many times people are like, I want to get a will, but it's expensive to go to an attorney. And I'm not sure if I'm organized or whatever else. And this gives you a way to kind of get started. I don't know how many states they're in at this point in time because he is continually working with attorneys to make sure that when they say this is a will that is valid in the state of whatever, that it really is a will that is valid in the state of whichever state. Caryn (25:37) Right now he's still, I checked it, right now he's still in California, but in the podcast he said that within the next couple of months there'll be several more states that they're in. Marci Grossman (25:47) Right. I'm not an attorney. I don't play one online. I don't know what it takes for a will to be valid in one state versus another, but to just get organized and to start having these conversations about what's in a will has to be valid and valuable, an experience for your family, for your partner. Caryn (26:03) Mm-hmm. And the HeirLight app actually has a chatbot that asks the questions of the people using it. So you're not just like looking at static questions on the screen. You can have an interaction with the chatbot about the questions it's asking. Marci Grossman (26:30) That is cool. If you don't have a will, if you are married, if you have children, you should have a will of some kind. You should have documentation and all of these things. I don't know, I can't tell you, Heirlight is the way to go for you. I definitely think though this is a conversation you need to make sure you have and this is an option of a useful tool to help you have it. And then Dr. Meera Viswanathan of the Ethel Walker School. This one you found me because you saw that article in Wall Street Journal. So kudos for that. Caryn (27:10) Yeah, I was really excited about this. Marci Grossman (27:13) She is the head of school, Caryn (27:15) The programs that they have there are just so very cool. Should you want me to go over them? Because I got a bit. So if you're an Ethel Walker student, as a sophomore, Marci Grossman (27:22) Sure, go over it. Caryn (27:30) And this is actually funded by a huge grant from grandparents that are actually had donated this. So when you're a sophomore, first you take seminars on financial markets and then each student gets $1,000 to invest. They invest and track those investments until they graduate. Every year they beat the market and they've also beaten the financial professionals that are actually overseeing their program. So these students are... have become very good at it. And then as juniors, they are part of that VITA program, the Volunteer Income Tax Assistant programs. So they pass their IRS tax exam. Every junior in the school has done this. And then they help low income families in their area ⁓ to fill out taxes and get their tax credits and refunds that they would need. So that's just such a neat part of what sounds like a really wonderful school. Marci Grossman (28:36) Yeah, though I do want to, you know, because I said this in the broadcast and I got to say it again. Yes, they beat the professionals, but that's because they don't have any of the strict requirements and they're not given that money. They're managing that money as part of the overall endowment for the fund. So. Caryn (28:53) yeah, I didn't make it clear that no, don't go back and go, ooh, here's $1,000 and I'm going to make more money on it I get to keep it. No, they don't. Marci Grossman (29:04) Right, they're each individually managing $1,000. They don't have the rules of diversification that the professionals do. They could choose to put all of their money into one stock, and if you put all your money in the right stock, you're gonna beat the market every time. But you hear the words diversification because the market is not Caryn (29:08) I guess. Good luck. Marci Grossman (29:29) predictable and you want to be able to in the overall time frame make money and come out ahead and typically investing in one stock does not do that. So the investment committee has rules they have to follow that these young women do not have to follow. So don't go thinking you're looking for a 16 year old to be your next financial advisor. Caryn (29:54) Yeah. Marci Grossman (29:57) I love the programs that they're doing. I would love to see what innovative things she comes up with in the future for them. And she's not even the teacher of the course. So you never know what the teacher of the course is doing individually. Every time the course is taught, that teacher brings in some more experiences, some more things they're willing to try that different perspective. So that's exciting to see what an educational course that is not coming from a here is the hardcover book, let's teach this hardcover book. Financial literacy is a growing field of education and I think there's a lot of opportunity there to really give foundational knowledge to people that can serve them all their life. Marci Grossman (30:48) And this is absolutely where I should plug my book, MoneyMarci's Guide to Financial Literacy. It's available on Amazon. It's available at the library. It's available at other online bookstores, especially in the digital edition. I even have an educator's edition that has lesson plans in it. And I would love to talk to or work with any school district interested in using that as a starting point for their financial literacy education. Marci Grossman (31:19) And then we are onto Jenna Biancavilla, who is a financial professional and she created SVVY, S-V-V-Y with her sister, which is a platform to give women a safe place to find financial experts and investing. And she brings with it a wealth of varied experience, including her own start in a bank. Caryn (31:45) She has two other companies that she runs as well, one for capital management and one for home loans, that kind of work together. But yeah, when she started working at a bank as a financial advisor, she was very unhappy that the bank really wanted to sell customers things that they didn't need, investments that weren't good for those particular customers. That's what made her want to go off on her own. Marci Grossman (32:12) But she brought a valid point. As a stockholder, as someone holding stock in the bank, I want them to sell stuff. As client of the bank, I don't want them to sell me the stuff. And so you've got to balance those different perspectives. I mean, it's not like she was selling them, this is the worst investment ever and ha ha ha, if we get you to buy them. It's just not necessarily. the best product out there for you. might have been the product the bank had that was out there that you fit into whatever the requirements were for buying You always have to find that balance of being the client versus being the stockholder versus selling something that you believe is this is the best product out there or this is the best product that we offer and there's a difference between the two. Caryn (33:01) She also talked about the four different ways that investment advisors charge their clients. you know, looking at that and seeing what is your investment advisor doing? How are you paying that investment advisor? ⁓ Marci Grossman (33:15) And what is the best way for you to pay that investment advisor because you have different opportunities at different levels of wealth. Okay, and then Bostic Poindexter, who created a game and used the time in COVID to follow his interest and learn about finance. I mean, that's a useful time to pivot. Caryn (33:39) Yeah, and what a cool thing that he did. You know, he really felt that people needed to know more about financial matters. And so instead of, you know, there's a lot of ways that you can do that. If you have a passion for that, he created a game. Yeah. Marci Grossman (33:57) I think that's brilliant. I have not played the game. I can't speak from that way, but he's working to get it into schools. And again, anything that finds a way to share and spread financial literacy, to educate people more about money is good for everybody. We talk about the varying levels of wealth in the United States and in the world as a whole. And one of the most powerful ways we can, what is it, raise all ships is teaching about how much things you can control by understanding more the decisions you're making. When people have to file for bankruptcy, yes, of course it sucks for them or it's good for them because it gets rid of debt that they would never have been able to afford. But that is where credit card interest rates and credit card fees, they have to make up that money somewhere. And we talk about people who can't pay their medical bills and then the hospital has to charge everybody more to cover their losses on that. So you want people to understand more about money. You want everyone to understand more about money to make better decisions to have the knowledge that they can improve their situation because if credit cards didn't have so much bankruptcies to deal with then maybe their fees would be lower. If hospitals didn't have so many well we did the work but we're not going to collect any money from this. And any businesses, all businesses have bad debts of some kind for services they provide that they are never paid for a varied amount of reasons. And I love the idea of potentially being a part of that solution and helping people understand their money a little bit better. Caryn (35:56) When it came to Bostic and his game, he said that when he was learning about financial matters, he realized how many people he knew personally and how many people he knew at work that didn't understand how banking, investing, the Federal Reserve or economics work. I mean, he had, but then he realized how many people didn't. And it kept them from making good decisions. It kept them from investing. It kept them from doing a lot of things. So when he did his game, and I haven't played it yet either, but he says the game has everyday financial dilemmas, and it also has the chance to take financial risks in the game. Both of those things are built into it. Marci Grossman (36:41) Kind of like the game of Life except souped up for financial decisions, real financial decisions as opposed to, okay, here, now you've got a kid, okay, here, now you've got a dog. Caryn (36:51) Yeah. Marci Grossman (36:55) I like the example. Someone says, what do mean I'm divorced and I lost half of everything? so that was my season Caryn (37:03) That was a good season. Marci Grossman (37:04) Yeah, I've already started recording for next season and I've got some interesting guests lined up. I'm still looking, I want to have someone that can really talk to me about the specifics of the different types of health insurance. I would love to talk about a better understanding of Medicare. I'd love a social security expert because you hear people talking, well, you should start taking social security, not until your last date, because it's the largest amount or the earliest date, because then you have a longer timeframe of receiving it. I'd love an insurance claims adjuster, a mortgage broker. Don't tell me you do all of those jobs, Caryn, because I know those are not your area. I know this. Caryn (37:47) Nobody wants me to manage their money, let's just say. Marci Grossman (37:53) Well, you I know you've worn a lot of hats, but, and I'd love to have more schools or teachers that are teaching financial literacy to see how they're doing it, how they're doing it differently. Caryn (38:06) That would be good. Marci Grossman (38:07) I do have some ideas for you in the future. Caryn (38:09) ⁓ I have two things to do. Okay, I need another hat. Marci Grossman (38:14) You've got plenty of hats and we haven't even talked about all of your hats. I'm always looking for interesting people. I'm looking at personal finance, individual financial literacy, so I do have to turn down a number of those that are really bigger organizations than what I'm looking for. Caryn (38:31) mean, they want help larger businesses and that sort of thing. Marci Grossman (38:36) Yeah, yeah, they want to talk to larger businesses than really what my listeners are and where I'm focusing. But I've been amazed by the response I've gotten for the work I'm doing. so I guess I'll keep doing it. And season four will start the week after season three ends. Caryn (38:56) Yay! Marci Grossman (38:58) Yep, so you'll have an opportunity to wrap up with me in another couple of months. I've decided my seasons are going to run in four month increments. So it'll be like 16 to 18 episodes a season, but my next season will start the beginning of May and so it'll run May, June, July and August. And then my next season will be September through December and then January through April. I'll just keep doing this until I run out of guests or listeners and hopefully I won't run out of either. Caryn (39:30) Yeah. Marci Grossman (39:33) Caryn, it has been great having you on the show to do the wrap up with me. I If you found any of these guests interesting that we talked about, that we had seen during the season, please feel free and go back and look at any of my episodes and listen to the episodes and hear what they have to say. And of course there are links to all of them on their episode write up. Caryn (39:38) I love doing it. Marci Grossman (39:57) And don't forget, subscribe, leave us a review and stay tuned. I'll see you next time. This has been MoneyMarci on Marci Talks Money (and Life). You got this.