Latest / Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast / Episode 524: Admissions Director Q&A with J.R. McGrath of Carnegie Mellon Tepper

Transcript

Episode 524: Admissions Director Q&A with J.R. McGrath of Carnegie Mellon Tepper · Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast

• 0:17
  Speaker A: Welcome to the Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast. I'm your host, Graham Richmond, and this episode is part of our Admissions Director Q and A series today. I'm really delighted to welcome JR McGrath, executive director of Master's admissions and at Carnegie Mellon University's Tepper school of business. JR joined the master's admissions team back in 2021. In his role as executive director, JR oversees admissions across a portfolio of master's programs. And Prior to Tepper Jr. Was at SMU's business school in Dallas. So he's been in this space for quite some time, and I even think we're going to hear more about some additional experience he had maybe at Tepper. I can't remember this, but he's going to. He will enlighten us momentarily. JR Holds a Bachelor of Science in Physics. Physics. And a Master's in College administration from Slippery Rock University. Welcome to the podcast, J.R. it's good
• 1:05
  Speaker B: to see you, Graham. So good to see you. Always love doing these and having a little bit of time to chat together. Excited to be here.
• 1:13
  Speaker A: Yeah, I'm thrilled to have you. So I know we maybe talked about this on a past episode at some point, but I gotta ask, tell us the story of your background and this path that led you to the current role and if you can explain this whole Bachelor of Science in Physics thing, because I don't think I've ever interviewed, other than you, anyone in our space who's got a physics degree.
• 1:34
  Speaker B: Yeah. So, gosh. Thinking about careers, Right? So first generation college student. So for me, this was always exploring, figuring out what could be those career options. Even though first generation, my parents always put education as first because it was a way for us to essentially kind of make a better life. So the interesting pieces, really great at science, math, et cetera. Growing up, and I thought I was going to be a high school physics teacher, that was a class I like most. I actually took two levels in high school, and the second level was just building stuff. We built a soapbox to every race car and everything. And I just like building stuff. Always sounded cool. So I went for my undergrad in physics. Thought I was going to do education in the teaching capacity. And what I started to realize, though, was while that was fun for me, I didn't want to do the same thing 30 to 35 years in a row. And what was the pivot for me was going in, and I was pretty active on my college campus. And I thought, I always want to be in education and help others on their path, so maybe I should do that in the college environment. So that's where I got my master's. And what was really interesting then is I've done so many different things on a college campus. So I started off more in the activities and leadership space and student clubs. So I've done anything from creating open mic nights to having concerts at a football stadium to having great lectures. And then I kind of transitioned more into teaching leadership and creating programs. And all of that led over to the business school at smu, as you kind of alluded to earlier. And for me, what was always interesting, even though I went that physics route, business was always something that was interesting to me and I didn't have a formal education that way, so I thought it would be something that I would want to do more. Because in the morning, even before I was in a business school, I would read the business news, kind of interested in the stock market. And when I got the opportunity in SMU to really help run a full time MBA program, really found my fit there, then moved into admissions. I did that for seven years and now I've been at Tepper. This is my six years in admissions. So almost at 15 years. Yeah, not the complete OG yet, but we're getting there.
• 3:41
  Speaker A: Oh yeah, no, I'm going to. I think, you know, when I think of people in our industry, I just feel like you're a total veteran. So I'm going to, I'm going to say you have that status already, even if you haven't hit the 15 year mark yet. Come on. What initially, what initially drew you to admissions work though? I mean, you talked a little bit about that just now, but you know, you were talking more about education. So I guess, like, what is it about admissions specifically that got you kind of interested? And why is it still exciting today? Because you've been doing it for a little while now.
• 4:07
  Speaker B: Yeah, so. So I think it's two main areas. So for me, people are why I get up in the morning and that's always where I wanted to make my impact in my career. And why, why business school though, for that part of it? I think it's just so interesting because for especially a graduate business degree, you can have any different background, right? Like you don't have to go from like physics to physics or something like that for undergrad and masters. So you have all of these different people, different backgrounds, different parts of the world, different experiences. So like every day I get to learn, right? Like when I ask about a candidate's background and what they've gone through, it's Just so I guess I would say energizing for me. But then the second piece of that is really, in a way, I'll say, like, bring it back to whether it's my strategy or problem solving or kind of taking all these random variables and trying to kind of package something and make sense. So when you think about a candidate for business school, they have all these different backgrounds that you can do anything with a degree, so you're trying to piece together where someone was, where they want to go, and then what are all these experiences within a business school that can help develop them into who they want to be in the future? And. And it's. It's so much fun to, like, piece all these different things together. And every. Every candidate, in a way, is like a unique journey. So. So for me, it's those two things that just keep things exciting every day.
• 5:27
  Speaker A: Yeah, I could not agree more. I mean, just thinking back to the days when I was reading applications, like, you know, I would come home and be like, well, I just learned about this industry that I knew nothing about because the candidate happened to be working in that space. You know, or even today, we see people posting on Clear Admit with their profiles or whatever. I just am always. It's such a diverse group of people into this funnel, and then they go off and do an equally diverse number of things. So I hear you 100% there. That would definitely. I mean, it keeps it super exciting. What about, I think, candidates, when they get together on discussion forums or just on the Internet in general, they come up with all these, like, theories about admissions officers or the admissions process. Give me, like, one misconception that you think they tend to have when it comes to, you know, when they think about this process or the people reading files.
• 6:10
  Speaker B: Yeah. So. So I'll start on process.
• 6:13
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 6:14
  Speaker B: Everybody thinks there's a right answer, you know, And I put right in, like, quotation marks there. And I know. I know this is an audio thing so people can't see me, but I'm very animated on this side, you know, so, like, everybody. It's kind of human nature, right? Like, you were trying to get accepted, so you're trying to think in a way of, like, how do I do that? And so everybody thinks, like, there is a right answer. There is a perfect answer. And I think that's the misconception. So just what I was saying about what keeps this work exciting and is that everybody is different and there's a different path for everybody. And could you. Everybody wants to do something maybe slightly different in the future. There is no perfect answer. It's about you knowing yourself, knowing what you want to try to do, and then really, you know, in some ways, right, it's like kind of like, you know, trying to figure out is this the right fit. You know, it's a weird analogy, almost like to dating, right? It's like. But if you know yourself well and you're trying to find that right partner of like, who's going to make you the best version of yourself, that's what you're trying to do. So, like, in the process, there is no perfect or right answer. And I'll add this in because I feel like this is the interesting thing, because you say about admissions officers, and maybe it's because it's traveling to recruitment season. So we're just out there so much more right now and just meeting so many different people. On the admissions officer side, we're just people too, right? Like, everybody was just thinking about this of like, hey, they must be evaluating me at every stage. Or, you know, I have to, like, you know, be the person that they think, you know, that, that I should be. When really on our side, we're just like, we're so excited to meet you. We're hoping you're a great fit. Like, we're not evaluating you first. Like, we are really just, you know, like, kind of seeing. Right. Like getting to know you better if it's the right fit. So I think that those are the misconceptions, like, know yourself well and have fun with the conversations.
• 7:56
  Speaker A: Yeah. And actually that's one of the reasons why we do these podcast episodes as well as the kind of real human series on the website. We try, try to make sure candidates understand that both the kind of alumni and the admissions folks are all just people too. It's really important. And that's why you're going to humor me at the end and we're going to do some kind of ridiculous questions to let people get to know you a bit more. You've been in the space, as we said, almost 15 years. How has your thinking about admissions changed over the years?
• 8:24
  Speaker B: So I think this is a great question, but in a way I'm going to have two answers for you. So one, fundamentally it has not. Because for myself, whenever I have thought about this, and maybe it's because of my background, you know, like I said, first grade generation college student, I always had to kind of match ROI with how I spent my time because I just didn't have a whole lot of resources just to kind of like test Things out. I don't think that has changed. Right. Because like, you're, you're, you're always looking at this from the candidate's perspective. What are your expectations? What do you want to try to achieve from this? And can we be that partner that can meet or exceed those expectations? And a lot of times that goes a lot on the career side because you may have all these personal development things you want to do, but a lot of times that really leads into can you have that professional career that you want? So when I'm looking at how we're evaluating candidates, how we're trying to make sure are we the right fit? Fundamentally, I don't think that has changed. What has really changed, though, is the behaviors of candidates. Right. Like, everybody wants things a little bit more in a virtual environment, a more on demand content. However, when they do want to talk to someone, they want to talk to someone now. And, you know, maybe there's like a looming deadline, they expect responses back in like minutes or hours. And, you know, the funny part about this is that everybody has questions at the same time. Right? So, like, the volume of questions coming in, like, in some ways it's almost impossible to get everybody the individual quick touch point that they want in the timeline that they want it. But I also think that that's the fun part of, like, the work that we're doing. Right. Like, we always want to meet the expectations of candidates. Can we get them the information to make good, informed decisions? And we're always trying to do it. But I'll go back to one of those other things I said earlier. Right. But we're just people, right? Right. So, like, you know, give us a little grace. If you have, if you have questions, ask it. Right. And we, we want to get back to you. Sometimes it just may not be in that immediate response time that maybe people are expecting.
• 10:14
  Speaker A: Yeah, no, these are great points. And I think, you know, I'm now thinking back to, like, when I applied to business school, you put a, you know, kind of a big package in the mail with all your materials, and then it was just nothing until you got a letter maybe saying you could have an interview or ultimately an acceptance. So, yeah, things are really different now. And I think, you know, I love how admissions has evolved in that regard. But I guess while we're kind of on that subject, like, what is something that applicants tend to worry about far more than you think they should?
• 10:44
  Speaker B: Oh, gosh. So my first real answer to this is, like, everything. Like, I feel like these generations recently are just so much more anxious about the whole process and everything. But, you know, again, I'm going to kind of go back to some of the thing I said earlier. Right. Is like, what they shouldn't worry about is they need to be this perfect applicant or perfect person or every aspect of their application needs to be perfect. You know, and I think you may have heard me say this in the past, but, like, you know, if you think about either your application or your. Or yourself or your story, right. As like, a book, right? You have all of these different chapters to be able to share all these things about yourself. And not every one chapter can have every part of the story or be that perfect thing, because sometimes they're just leading in to getting, you know, better, and it's the context for all these other things that are really important in your story.
• 11:37
  Speaker A: So.
• 11:38
  Speaker B: So I think it's like, we don't want anyone to be perfect. And you know what? Some of the best stories are not what seems on paper to be a perfect candidate. Right. Like, sometimes having a little bit of a failure or a little bit of, like a. A problem earlier in life and then overcoming from it or. Or learning from it doesn't always have to be this, like, you know, whole, you know, boomerang story of, like, there was a problem and I, you know, conquered the world. It could just be like, hey, I encounter. I encountered something, and I learned a lot from that. And the next time I take this on, I'm going to do so much better at this. Right?
• 12:11
  Speaker A: Yeah. So.
• 12:12
  Speaker B: So. So I think it's that piece of just feeling like you have to be perfect to get in. Like, that's just. That's just not life. It's just not reality.
• 12:22
  Speaker A: Yeah, no, that's really, you know, perfect. And I feel like, yeah, it's just a tough thing where, you know, like, a lot of schools will ask, whether it's in an interview or sometimes in an essay question about a time when you've, you know, faced a challenge or failed or whatever. And I feel like sometimes candidates try to go for what we would call, like, a veiled strength. You know, like, oh, at one time I, you know, this project didn't work out, and, you know, I was just working so hard and my teammates weren't, and that's why we failed. You know, it's kind of like, whoa. So people. Yeah, I think it's great to show some vulnerability and, you know, those kind of traits, a little bit of grit, et cetera. So I guess one thing I'm kind of curious about and wanting to get your take on is what kind of candidate comes into the program and really thrives. So this isn't really an admissions question so much as it is like, you know, what are the qualities that you think distinguish folks who come in and make the very most of the opportunities that are available to them in the NBA?
• 13:18
  Speaker B: You know, in, you know, I think what's sometimes the best answer here is like a very simple answer. However, it's also the execution is, is what either is going to make that impactful or not. So the, the simple answer is show up when you go through these programs and you're going to hear this when you talk to, you know, anyone in the program. Right? These programs are difficult. There's so many things that you need to do a lot of times at the same time, whether it's the academics and career search and everything, but you consistently deciding to show up. And you have this whole community around you that is going to be there to support you, right? Like you have your faculty member, you have your classmates, you have career coaches, leadership coaches, advisors, alumni, etc. Right. And there's going to be all these people that want you to succeed and they're going to provide you information, they're going to provide you feedback, you know, they're going to provide you pro tips of what you should be doing. And the showing up is important, but the execution of it is important in the way that you need to know yourself well. You need to know what you're trying to accomplish. And that doesn't mean every second of every day has to be towards a goal. But if you look back over your time over a couple weeks and you realize a lot of your time isn't being spent towards that, you need to probably refocus how you're doing your time. You need those exploration times, but at different times you just have to focus in on those because these programs, two years sounds like a really long time when you're thinking about being out of the workforce. But when you're in it and trying to develop, two years is a really short time. So those that have made the most out of it are the ones that I consistently see showing up. They'll go to events, they'll be there for their classmates, they're. They're always doing the other things rather than just expecting things to come to them.
• 15:04
  Speaker A: And I guess, I mean, you correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel like with Tepper being a really kind of, you know, supportive and you know, relatively smaller kind of tight knit community that it really matters to show up. You know, it's not the kind of place where you just sort of fade into the background. You know, it's a smaller program and people are supporting one another throughout.
• 15:23
  Speaker B: Right, Absolutely. And, and I think that, that, that is powerful. Right. Because when you hear about people going through these programs and at different times, especially, you know, as you go through this, not everything you do is going to be success. And that's, that's part of this process. Like, you need to learn a little bit about grit and everything. And that happens in the classroom, it happens on the career side. And having a community around you that when maybe you got a few things in a row that didn't go your way for people to check in on you, pick you up, kind of get you back to who you are as quickly as possible is going to be incredibly helpful in this process.
• 16:01
  Speaker A: Yeah, that makes sense. When alumni come back to campus, I mean, I'm sure you've seen a lot of them over the years now that you've been with Tepper for a while. What is something that they tell you that they didn't fully appreciate while they were students?
• 16:13
  Speaker B: You know, I think I have, I have two answers for this.
• 16:16
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 16:17
  Speaker B: So the first is being immersed in a learning environment. Some of the stuff I was just talking about. But you know, when you're in an environment where everybody is at the same place, everybody's excited to learn, everybody's trying to do more things, it gives you energy to try to do those things. It's a whole lot easier because again, I mean, for the most part we're talking full time programs. And you also have that ability that you can just focus on, on you and your development. And as you go off back into the workforce and you're doing these things and all of these other responsibilities start to kind of take hold again, when they come back, they're like, oh, man. Like to be in this environment again and, and be able to like, do all those things that have time and grow and, and also have personal time. Right. Like, I mean, it's just something that I think, I think people miss. But I think that's also a testament to the environment and the school and the program. Right. Is like when you have this supportive community and you're always learning and growing and, you know, it's something that you look back on in a very positive light.
• 17:19
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 17:19
  Speaker B: The second thing is, is Pittsburgh. So. And I don't hear this just from candidates or alumni. You know, when you ask someone a question of like, you Know, what are some of the best cities in America or in the us? Like, is Pittsburgh in the top five? Probably not for a lot of people. Right. But so many people are surprised by the city. It has great food scene, it has great green space. It has, you know, all the things that you would expect from a major city, professional sports teams, etc. But it's not one of the biggest cities in America. So, like, you actually get a little bit of, like a small town feel as well. So, you know, when I hear people go off and live in other cities or travel and come back to, like, man, I just missed it. It was so great to be here and it was such a. Such an underrated city. And so they're glad to be back.
• 18:10
  Speaker A: Yeah. So I had a thought about this, which is that something nice about a smaller city that maybe a lot of people in the class are not from originally. Right. Is that you kind of get to discover a new place together, which maybe is harder to reproduce when you're in one of these megapolises or whatever. I also just. I would be remiss. And people who listen to the show know that I'm kind of a nut about base. I would be remiss not to point out that I think you may have the best baseball stadium in all of baseball. I mean, I think some will quibble with Fenway and Wrigley or something, but it is a really beautiful ballpark and it's a great city, and the ballpark's in the heart of the city. So I've always appreciated that about Pittsburgh, too. And the campus, your campus is amazing. So give me, while we're talking about Tepper and Pittsburgh and Carnegie Mellon writ large, give me a stereotype about the MBA program that you'd love to debunk.
• 19:02
  Speaker B: Yeah. You know, I mean, this, this is something that, you know, I'm going to say, like, now more than ever is probably also a selling point and a positive in terms of, like, what's going on with AI. Right. But, like, Carnegie Mellon as a whole already has a reputation of being much more of, like, maybe a quantitative. It has, like, the number one school for CS and engineering and all these other things. Right. And so I think Tepper has always had that viewpoint as well as, like, it's really only for engineers or like, you know, like the quant geniuses. And, and, and I just know that not to be true. Right. Like, you know, MBA programs as, you know, maybe, you know, probably even better than I do. Right. Is like, you know, every program is going to be quantitative at some. Some level.
• 19:45
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 19:45
  Speaker B: Right. Like, you need to have that type of skill set that you're developing. But when I think back over, you know, some of the, you know, the students that have been most successful here, you know, just like everywhere else, like, we have people that come through that had arts degrees or professional athletes or musicians or others. And so just because we have this ecosystem that can really help in terms of the intersection of technology and business and, you know, kind of like where the world is moving now, that doesn't mean that it's really only for those that come from those STEM or quantitative backgrounds.
• 20:17
  Speaker A: I mean, I will say that I think Tepper's got to be an amazing place to be for that connection to, you know, in an, in an era now where people are saying, oh, the best. That that combination of like a business degree with some technical savvy is like, more important than ever. Right. With AI, et cetera. And obviously AI has a little bit of history at Carnegie Mellon. Right. I mean, I feel like I've read that before.
• 20:39
  Speaker B: Yeah. So. So just, just a bit. And, and actually, interestingly enough, part of what the business schools. So when, when AI was invented years and years and years ago, it was also part of one of our business school professors that, that were part of that kind of inaugural team.
• 20:56
  Speaker A: Oh, wow.
• 20:56
  Speaker B: But I think what, what's interesting about it as, like, everybody in now is like, evolving in this new environment of like, how do you work with this type of technology? Everyone always thinks that, like, maybe it is. And it is technical. Right. Like, but, but that's the back of it. Not everybody is going to be the builder.
• 21:12
  Speaker A: Right.
• 21:12
  Speaker B: But everybody's going to have figure out how to include it into your workflows. And what's really interesting about that is a lot of times this is about, you know, a lot of skills that don't really come from a quantitative background. Like, how do you break down a problem? How do you ask the right questions? And that's not just prompt engineering. Right. But it's like, you know, you, you know, when you ask a question to an AI, it's going to give you an answer that doesn't mean the answer is correct and it doesn't mean that, you know, so like, in some ways, like, if you think about, about liberal arts or philosophy and others, and like, it's always about like, asking more questions to like, get to the point of like, feeling more confident that that answer was correct and having this intersection with where you have like a top CS school in engineering also A top art school where you do like a lot more like design thinking and pushing on things and figuring out your communication. Having the intersection of that ecosystem with the business school here is amazing. And actually I think is going to be much more impactful of like how people are going to include it in their workflows going forward, rather than us just producing people that are going to create the AI models.
• 22:17
  Speaker A: Yeah, I could not agree more. That makes a lot of sense. Last question before we get into the fun stuff. What role does Pittsburgh or PA or just the broader community within Carnegie Mellon even play in the student experience?
• 22:31
  Speaker B: All right, so I'm going to try to make this a concise answer, but Pittsburgh's my hometown, so I'll do my best. So I think Pittsburgh has a huge component for us. And if you think about this, and I'll go into a bit of history, I know you're a history buff too, so I'll say it this way. Obviously Pittsburgh was part of an industrial type city. You have the three rivers, which also makes one of the phenomenal skylines. When you were talking about the ballpark earlier. Yeah, but, but it had the, this, this strategic point within the US of being able to make things and then ship them through throughout the rest of the United States earlier whenever things are kind of run more in that way. But when everything started to get offshore, Pittsburgh had to reinvent itself. And over a few decades we did. And it was really because of the universities being at the hub of having great talent and to move into different industries. And obviously Carnegie Mellon being at the hub of that on the technology side and entrepreneurial side and a representation of that is like. I know, so like this business school as well. So you have like the G20, right? Like they come together every year for a summit Pittsburgh. And this is the last time I'm going to be able to say this because it's going to be in Miami at the end of this year. Pittsburgh is the only city outside of D.C. to host as actually like a test case for these other top economies to kind of see how someone was able to do something. So Pittsburgh was able to reinvent itself and actually get into a new growth mode because introducing technology and healthcare and all these other industries that were growing and moving away from industrial. The reason why I give all that history is because like when the city was able to grow like that this. Universities were at the center of that. So our students, like, when I say like this entire city is like your learning laboratory, like, I mean that in the city believes it Rather than being, in other words, cities that you're just part of, you know, its overall ecosystem, like we are part of the story and the growth of that. So when our students go out in the community, like everybody else wants them to be there, they look at them as like intellectual capital, these experiences that they want to infuse. And so like when we, we joined that Gallo Board Fellow program, it was easier for us to go out to all these organizations, say, do you want our students to come in and work with your organizations and do these impact projects? Like, we overshot the number of positions that we wanted initially to grow this program because everybody comes and wants to see our students here and get involved. And then lastly, because I would be risked without kind of going over this AI piece. Right. We actually have pockets in the city that are hubs for that. So we have something called AI Avenue. So you have, Google has a huge hub here and you have Duolingo, the kind of home base for it. And in between Those you have 20 plus AI startups and you have this kind of like AI ecosystem that is kind of pushing that industry forward in many different capacities. And our students, that, that's a mile from campus. Right, right. So like our students are able to take part in these things beyond the campus and classroom to really be able again make Pittsburgh their learning laboratory.
• 25:38
  Speaker A: Yeah, And I knew Duolingo was headquartered there, but yeah, I'd forgotten that Google has that lab there. And then all these startups is great. Seems like a good, good place to be studying, especially in the current, you know, kind of time we're in. Those are all the, like, serious questions I have, but I do want to get into some lightning round questions. If your game and the rules here are just, I'll just throw you the question. Just give me a quick, you know, quick answer and we'll, we'll zip through them and hopefully our listeners get to know you a little bit better the way that I know you. So. All right. Coffee or tea?
• 26:07
  Speaker B: Coffee.
• 26:08
  Speaker A: Okay. Yeah, I remember we were at an event and you were like, there needs to be more coffee here. And I remember noting that, you know,
• 26:15
  Speaker B: you need a little energy for the day.
• 26:17
  Speaker A: Yes. Beach or mountains?
• 26:20
  Speaker B: Oh, I gotta go beach now.
• 26:22
  Speaker A: Okay. Are you a morning person or a night owl?
• 26:25
  Speaker B: You know, this has shifted over time. I would say myself more of a morning person now. You know, get up every day, happy, excited, you know, kind of want to take on the day. But you know, there's times a night owl can come out.
• 26:35
  Speaker A: Okay, that's right. You Used to organize concerts and things. Right. When you were. When you were in undergrad or in grad school. I can't remember when that was, but
• 26:43
  Speaker B: yeah, grad school, but also was a server. Right. So like when you were working late shifts and then you want to go out after and things.
• 26:49
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. What's a pet peeve that you have?
• 26:53
  Speaker B: So if you ask me and if you ask my. It'll probably be clutter.
• 26:56
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 26:56
  Speaker B: Like, I just like things to be orderly, so. So clutter would probably be my pet peeve.
• 27:01
  Speaker A: Okay. A comfort food ice cream.
• 27:04
  Speaker B: I mean, maybe it's summer. I just got to kind of throw that one out there. It kind of shifts over the years, but love ice cream.
• 27:09
  Speaker A: I thought you're going to say a sandwich with french fries in it. You know, isn't that what Pittsburgh has? That. That famous sandwich, but ice cream? I'm with you there. Yes, that's right. What about a guilty pleasure? Something you like to do if you got some free time and et cetera.
• 27:25
  Speaker B: Oh, well, all right, so here's how I'm gonna answer this one. So not exactly free time, but one thing that we started doing actually when I lived back in Dallas, I don't know if you hear these on different radio shows or podcasts, but they have something called a second date update and they hear about all these people went on a first date, didn't lead to a second date, and it's just hilarious listening to them. So it's like my guilty pleasure. It's like a five minute podcast I listen to. To. And truthfully, my wife listens to it as well and we always kind of joke about the different scenarios that people get themselves into and. So glad that I found my partner and don't have to be out there anymore. But that's the guilty pleasure.
• 28:00
  Speaker A: Okay. Yeah. I'm not familiar with this, but I mean, I remember that show like Love Connection when I was a kid or whatever. But. All right, this sounds like a fun five minute listen. What about the best advice you've ever received?
• 28:11
  Speaker B: The person is always more important than the goal or the task. I always believe, like, if you have the right people around you, you can move mountains. So make sure it's about the people and it's going to come back to you way more than completing that goal or task.
• 28:25
  Speaker A: Oh, I love that. That's. That's a great piece of advice. Yeah, I think a lot about that kind of thing when it comes to like hiring or, you know, you just want the right people. Yeah. Like you're saying the right people can do anything. What about something you think that applicants should stop doing immediately?
• 28:44
  Speaker B: Ghosting.
• 28:44
  Speaker A: Oh, interesting.
• 28:46
  Speaker B: You know, I think this is something that has popped up. I mean, it's always been there a little bit, but when all of us go to things like, you know, when we're together maybe you know, at a clear mid event or other things and we're talking to each other, that has consistently been going up across all schools. And it's getting to the point where you'll have someone apply, they'll get an offer, they'll do a scholarship appeal. Like, I mean, they interact with you, but when it comes to like actually telling you that it's decision it, you know they're not coming. Right. Because they're not talking to you anymore, but they just disappear. And after all that time and work and effort not to do like a one line type of thing just, just seems crazy to me. But, and, and I'll say it in this way, there's low stakes when you're doing the missions.
• 29:26
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 29:26
  Speaker B: Be careful when you do that with companies. Don't develop that habit. Right. Because like you, you may think that it's not going to bite you later, but you never know who goes from one company to the next and, and don't make it a habit.
• 29:37
  Speaker A: Yeah, that's a great piece of advice, I think. Yeah. And that's, you know, maybe it's generational a little bit, but I do think you're right. You know, when you get in the workforce, you need to be able to communicate. I mean, that's one of the things you learn in business school. So. All right, last question for you is what's the best thing that you've either read, watched or listened to recently? And let's say you can't talk about a dating podcast because, you know, I
• 29:59
  Speaker B: so a huge fan of the show. So glad it's back. So I'm gonna say Ted Lasso.
• 30:03
  Speaker A: Oh, yeah.
• 30:04
  Speaker B: You know, I think it was a phenomenon early because of just the positivity like this, the realness of it and obviously that popped up during COVID and I think a lot of people needed that, that type of thing. Just so, so glad that it's back as I'm only part way obviously into the season this right now. But it's always one of my favorite shows just because of how they approach.
• 30:25
  Speaker A: So yeah, I definitely remember watching the early seasons and feeling like it's. Yeah, it's like we don't see a lot of positivity on TV and it's just kind of yeah, really. JR I'm sure you got a thousand things to do, you're running all these programs at Tepper, but I do want to thank you so much for making time to catch up. It's always fun to hang out with you and yeah, just been a real pleasure chatting now.
• 30:47
  Speaker B: Same on my sitegram. Like this is always so much fun. Love seeing you. I know you're across the world right now and then we'll see you in the US Here later. But I appreciate the time and everything that you and Clear Mid and your whole team does.
• 30:58
  Speaker A: Oh, thanks so much. Well, that's going to do it for this episode of the show. Thanks for tuning in to the Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast. Please remember to subscribe, rate and review the show wherever you listen and we'll be back with more of these admissions Q&As as we head into the fall here, as well as our regular weekly episodes airing on Mondays.