Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / 'LAST DANCE' TEEN GIRL DEAD ON CRUISE, SPOTTED ON VIDEO JUST BEFORE MURDER

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'LAST DANCE' TEEN GIRL DEAD ON CRUISE, SPOTTED ON VIDEO JUST BEFORE MURDER · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
0:06
Speaker 2: The Last Dance, a beautiful young teen cheerleader found dead
0:12
Speaker 2: on a cruise ship. We learned Tonight spotted on video
0:17
Speaker 2: dancing just before her murder, and Tonight does the infantile way.
0:25
Speaker 2: Her body was hidden, covered in life vest and crammed
0:31
Speaker 2: under a bunk, point directly to her killer. Of its
0:37
Speaker 2: claims her family is giving off bad optics that they're
0:42
Speaker 2: more concerned with covering for her stepbrother suspect than about
0:47
Speaker 2: their dead daughter.
0:50
Speaker 3: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I want to
0:52
Speaker 3: thank you for being with us.
0:54
Speaker 2: The teen stepbrother is the main suspect in Anna's choke hold.
1:00
Speaker 4: There are so many confusing details about this teak.
1:03
Speaker 5: When is something going to happen, When is there going
1:05
Speaker 5: to be in arrested?
1:06
Speaker 3: When are the answers going to come out?
1:09
Speaker 2: Tonight joining us in addition to an all star panel
1:12
Speaker 2: of experts is the man who captured video of Anna Kettner,
1:19
Speaker 2: the teen cheerleader found stuffed dead. We still don't know
1:22
Speaker 2: whether she was clothed or unclothed, crammed under a bunk
1:27
Speaker 2: on a cruise line. There she is obscured by life vests.
1:34
Speaker 2: And her body there for hours and hours before anyone
1:37
Speaker 2: even notices she's missing.
1:39
Speaker 3: Where were the parents? For Pete's sake?
1:42
Speaker 2: Nobody knows she's not at breakfast, Nobody notices she doesn't
1:46
Speaker 2: turn up for lunch, Nobody checks on her the night before.
1:50
Speaker 2: How long had she been stuffed under that bunk? But
1:55
Speaker 2: we know this, A guy named Nick Gitdons was taking
2:00
Speaker 2: video on the cruise line of a big party the
2:04
Speaker 2: night before, a dance party.
2:06
Speaker 3: And here she is.
2:08
Speaker 2: There is Anna, so happy, so full of life, dancing
2:16
Speaker 2: in a line dance. It's hard to accept she would
2:21
Speaker 2: be dead, her body decomposing on a cruise trip. Anna
2:28
Speaker 2: Kettner the last dance video. Now that is from our
2:33
Speaker 2: new friend Nick Capo. That's Nick Capo six 'h nine
2:37
Speaker 2: on TikTok and he's with us tonight.
2:40
Speaker 3: Nick, thank you for being with us.
2:41
Speaker 6: Thank you appreciate it.
2:44
Speaker 2: Nick.
2:45
Speaker 3: What happened?
2:45
Speaker 2: How did you manage to take that video?
2:50
Speaker 6: So that was the shunaway party. That's the party to
2:53
Speaker 6: get the crew started when we start selling away from port.
2:56
Speaker 6: It was in port of Miami and you know this
2:59
Speaker 6: is my family. And then also in the video, hotel
3:01
Speaker 6: was becoreing them, but just you know, just going around
3:03
Speaker 6: and paying around saying, you know, you know, showing everybody
3:06
Speaker 6: having a good time and stuff like that. And that's
3:08
Speaker 6: basically what it was.
3:10
Speaker 3: When you took the video.
3:11
Speaker 2: You had no idea that Anna Kettner would be murdered
3:15
Speaker 2: within hours.
3:17
Speaker 3: When did you realize.
3:18
Speaker 2: The video that you took showed her as it's called
3:22
Speaker 2: last Dance.
3:24
Speaker 6: Well, I didn't notice her, and well what happened to
3:29
Speaker 6: after the cruise was over with when I posted I
3:32
Speaker 6: posted the video that day, November second, but it was
3:35
Speaker 6: after you know, everything happened and stuff like that where
3:38
Speaker 6: somebody commented on a video, I mean, on the video
3:41
Speaker 6: and they said that like, oh my god, that's the
3:43
Speaker 6: girl that you know that got killed. And then I
3:46
Speaker 6: went back and watched it. And then when I watched
3:48
Speaker 6: it and I seen her, then I seen the grandma
3:50
Speaker 6: and everything too, and that's why I changed it up
3:52
Speaker 6: a little bit and you know, you know, put the
3:54
Speaker 6: stuff on there. And that's when I, uh, we posted
3:56
Speaker 6: it or uploaded it again to a game where you know,
4:00
Speaker 6: to put attention to it bcently so people are.
4:03
Speaker 2: Seeing and I'm just wondering, what else, if anything does
4:07
Speaker 2: the video show the suspect tonight, still no arrest. Now
4:14
Speaker 2: over seventy five days later.
4:17
Speaker 1: Nothing.
4:18
Speaker 2: I wonder if this video shows anything else of probit
4:21
Speaker 2: to value. In other words, does it prove anything. I
4:24
Speaker 2: wonder if the step brother is anywhere in this video?
4:29
Speaker 3: I wonder if he was there that night. Who was
4:32
Speaker 3: she dancing with?
4:33
Speaker 6: Nick?
4:34
Speaker 3: We've been told she was dancing with her.
4:36
Speaker 1: Grandma, Yes, her grandma.
4:38
Speaker 6: And also it's actually two videos. Was you know the
4:42
Speaker 6: two songs? Says that why I'm seeing a song with
4:43
Speaker 6: them is a cupid shuffle song. I can't remember which
4:47
Speaker 6: one the grandpa was in, but one of them, I
4:51
Speaker 6: don't know, I don't I don't even know what the
4:52
Speaker 6: step brother look like. I don't know if he was
4:54
Speaker 6: in the video or not.
4:56
Speaker 2: And here she is in that second clip that Nick
4:59
Speaker 2: managed to video, dancing, and it shows she's dancing with
5:03
Speaker 2: her Grandparents' this look you know what, Nick Giddons, I
5:07
Speaker 2: am so glad that you took that video and realized
5:12
Speaker 2: what it was and posted it because it shows her
5:17
Speaker 2: Anna keptain her to me in a different light, I mean,
5:20
Speaker 2: really just scrubbed in sunshine. There she is dancing with
5:24
Speaker 2: her grandparents it just precious guys, you were seeing video taken.
5:32
Speaker 2: His handle is Nick Capo six zero nine on TikTok.
5:37
Speaker 2: Nick Giddons joining us tonight.
5:40
Speaker 1: Wow.
5:41
Speaker 3: Okay.
5:41
Speaker 2: You know to Spencer Erinfeld joining us, he's known as
5:45
Speaker 2: the Creuse lawyer. Why because he has taken on giant
5:50
Speaker 2: cruise line industries fighting for his client. Trial lawyer, founder
5:55
Speaker 2: of Aaron Feld trial lawyer's author of a children's book,
6:00
Speaker 2: Sarah Rose Kid lawyer.
6:03
Speaker 3: Spencer, thank you for being with us.
6:05
Speaker 2: You know, it's amazing how cases are put together, patchwork, patchwork,
6:12
Speaker 2: a bit of information here, a bit of information there,
6:15
Speaker 2: and by the time this turns into an opening statement,
6:18
Speaker 2: it will all be woven into an incredible tapestry, including
6:22
Speaker 2: a time line.
6:24
Speaker 3: What you just saw has been called her last dance.
6:29
Speaker 2: But I find it poignant because she is there living
6:32
Speaker 2: it up with her grandparents.
6:35
Speaker 7: Yes, of course, Nancy. She's on a cruise and she's
6:38
Speaker 7: doing what people on cruises do, which is have fun,
6:43
Speaker 7: and they participate in things like the dancing and the
6:46
Speaker 7: bingo activities and shuffle board, and she's a cruise passenger
6:50
Speaker 7: having fun. Unfortunately, this dream vacation ended in such a
6:54
Speaker 7: nightmare for her and her family. But this is exactly
6:58
Speaker 7: what you'd expect us he saw one doing on a
7:00
Speaker 7: Carnival cruise.
7:02
Speaker 2: And this is no different than any of the other cruises.
7:04
Speaker 2: I mean, some cruises may cost more, or they may
7:08
Speaker 2: go to or less, or they may go to different locations.
7:11
Speaker 2: But everyone fraternizes with everyone, And the point of my
7:17
Speaker 2: assertion is that sometimes it's very hard to It's like
7:20
Speaker 2: a Nitel and Haystack finding that one person that would
7:24
Speaker 2: commit a murder out of three thousand people doing a
7:28
Speaker 2: line shuffle at the.
7:30
Speaker 3: Party that cruise wide party that night.
7:34
Speaker 7: These are fun cruises. Carnival in particular promotes the fun
7:39
Speaker 7: cruise concept. They want everyone to be together, they want
7:43
Speaker 7: big parties, they want a lot of alcohol consumed. They
7:47
Speaker 7: really push the alcohol consumption, and they just want people
7:50
Speaker 7: to have the time of their life and come back
7:53
Speaker 7: and cruise again. The problem is you don't know who
7:56
Speaker 7: the people are that you're cruising with, so you could
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Speaker 7: be cruising and with murderers, child predators, and all sorts
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Speaker 7: of criminals. They let everybody on the ship, so who
8:09
Speaker 7: knows who is in this line dance with this poor
8:12
Speaker 7: young lady.
8:13
Speaker 2: Guys, what we are learning tonight, is that, according to experts,
8:18
Speaker 2: this is her quote last dance and the infantile way infantile,
8:25
Speaker 2: like an infant juvenile. The way her body was disposed
8:30
Speaker 2: of could point directly to the killer.
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Speaker 8: We feel there are some circumstances regarding that the sixteen
8:39
Speaker 8: year old and the mother's judgment regarding that cruise that
8:44
Speaker 8: would affect you know, obviously that her ability to care
8:49
Speaker 8: for the minor child, the nine year old, The sixteen
8:52
Speaker 8: year old was allowed to drink, the teenagers were given
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Speaker 8: their own room in which to stay. Just a lot
9:03
Speaker 8: of circumstances that showed that the mother in this case
9:06
Speaker 8: was not exercising appropriate supervision over this child.
9:10
Speaker 2: Well, Spencer Erinfeld, according to what we were hearing and
9:14
Speaker 2: that family court hearing, and of course the cruise ship
9:16
Speaker 2: says no way. According to what we were hearing, the
9:20
Speaker 2: miners were allowed to drink on the cruise.
9:24
Speaker 3: The cruise ship.
9:25
Speaker 2: Says, no, that would never happen. But did alcohol play
9:29
Speaker 2: into her murder that night? And when I say murder, Erinfield,
9:34
Speaker 2: I mean murder because there is no way she killed
9:37
Speaker 2: herself or had an accident and ended up stuffed under
9:40
Speaker 2: a bunk crammed in with life ves.
9:45
Speaker 7: One hundred percent, Nancy. I've investigated thousands of these cases,
9:49
Speaker 7: and in my thirty five years, alcohol is almost always present,
9:55
Speaker 7: even with miners. Carnival maybe taking the position they didn't
9:59
Speaker 7: serve alcohol to the miner, but that doesn't prevent her
10:03
Speaker 7: from consuming it because there's one hundred and one way
10:06
Speaker 7: so we can get booze on a cruise, even if
10:10
Speaker 7: they bring it on themselves. So it doesn't mean Carnival
10:13
Speaker 7: served it to her necessarily. But I would bet you
10:17
Speaker 7: the toxicology is going to come back with alcohol.
10:19
Speaker 3: You know.
10:20
Speaker 2: I want to talk about not just whether or not
10:23
Speaker 2: the teens were served alcohol, which leads me to where
10:26
Speaker 2: were the parents.
10:27
Speaker 3: If they were served alcohol, did that lead to her murder?
10:32
Speaker 3: Did it contribute in any way?
10:34
Speaker 2: This is what we've learned about how this teen cheerleader
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Speaker 2: was found dead.
10:40
Speaker 9: The keptor family frantically searching for anna. Last scene feeling
10:43
Speaker 9: unwell at dinner the night before, when a housekeeper makes
10:46
Speaker 9: a horrifying discovery. The maid starts to gather linens for laundry,
10:50
Speaker 9: but notices the sheet missing off the bed. Making the bed,
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Speaker 9: she notices a pile of life jackets stuffed underneath. Removing
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Speaker 9: the life jackets, she discovers the missing sheet wrapped around
11:02
Speaker 9: Anna's body.
11:04
Speaker 3: My stars too.
11:07
Speaker 2: Michelle Spitzer joining us out of Melbourne, Florida, investigative reporter
11:11
Speaker 2: for USA Today on the case.
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Speaker 3: From the very very beginning. Michelle, thank you for being
11:16
Speaker 3: with us.
11:16
Speaker 2: Describe in depth how Anna Keepner, the tech cheerleader's body
11:21
Speaker 2: was found stuffed under that bunk.
11:24
Speaker 5: Well, what we know about this case has really just
11:28
Speaker 5: come from family. The FBI is being very tight lipped,
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Speaker 5: So the family is really the one who has leaked
11:35
Speaker 5: information here and there and through court hearings, especially with
11:41
Speaker 5: the stepbrothers biological parents. As you know, they're in a
11:44
Speaker 5: custody battle, and there's been a lot of information that
11:47
Speaker 5: has been released in those court hearings. They have not
11:51
Speaker 5: specifically said how her body was found, but as you said,
11:56
Speaker 5: there is speculation that she was found under the bed
11:59
Speaker 5: by someone cleaning the state room. And we do not
12:04
Speaker 5: know what condition her body was found, if she was
12:06
Speaker 5: wearing clothes or not.
12:08
Speaker 3: Sidney s'mner joining US Crime Stories, investigative reporter.
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Speaker 1: What do we know?
12:13
Speaker 4: We've heard conflicting reports, all of this information coming from
12:18
Speaker 4: family members that are secondhand hearing this information from Chris
12:23
Speaker 4: Ketner and Sean tel Hudson. So these conflicting reports were
12:27
Speaker 4: not really sure whether or not Anna was found naked,
12:30
Speaker 4: whether she was wrapped in a blanket, in a sheet.
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Speaker 4: It's all a little bit vague at this point because
12:36
Speaker 4: the FBI has said nothing.
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Speaker 2: Okay, then let me cross examine you very briefly, Sidney Sumner.
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Speaker 2: Would you agree that, by all accounts, Anna Ketner's body
12:50
Speaker 2: was found, Anna was dead stuffed under a bump under
12:55
Speaker 2: one of the beds in the.
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Speaker 3: Room on the cruise ship. Do you agree with that?
13:00
Speaker 6: I do?
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Speaker 2: Okay, Sidney Sumner, let me further clarify. Would you say that,
13:05
Speaker 2: by all accounts, life vest had been crammed under the
13:10
Speaker 2: bed to conceal her body.
13:13
Speaker 4: That's also true.
13:15
Speaker 2: Joseph Scott Morgan joining me, Professor Forensics Jacksonville State University
13:19
Speaker 2: who has an incredible crimpro program. He is an author
13:23
Speaker 2: of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon. He's the star
13:27
Speaker 2: of a hit new podcast, Bodybags with Joseph Scott Morgan,
13:30
Speaker 2: but for our purposes tonight. He is a death investigator
13:33
Speaker 2: that has investigated ten thousand death scenes and for some
13:38
Speaker 2: people that's a little hard to.
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Speaker 3: Imagine Joe Scott Morgan, But it's.
13:42
Speaker 2: True because I was asked to count up how many
13:45
Speaker 2: cases I handled. Okay, think about it, about one hundred
13:48
Speaker 2: and eight felonies a week, times four per month, times
13:54
Speaker 2: twelve months times ten years plus it adds up to
13:59
Speaker 2: literally thousands of cases that you and I have both handled.
14:05
Speaker 2: So you as an expert, a forensic expert, a death investigator,
14:10
Speaker 2: has stated that the infantile way in which Anna's body
14:16
Speaker 2: was concealed could point directly to her killer.
14:22
Speaker 10: Explain yourself, Yeah, of course, because this is something that
14:25
Speaker 10: was done spontaneously. If you think about the body covering,
14:31
Speaker 10: this is a matter of convenience. What do I have
14:34
Speaker 10: in my in arms reach in order to conceal the body?
14:39
Speaker 10: And from the infantile perspective, you have deluded yourself the
14:44
Speaker 10: perpetrator or whoever did this the concealment. That is, you
14:49
Speaker 10: have deluded yourself into thinking that, oh, yeah, well, if
14:52
Speaker 10: I put her here, no one will ever find her.
14:56
Speaker 10: And so that goes to that kind of mentality when
15:01
Speaker 10: you begin to think about it. Interesting point here relative
15:04
Speaker 10: to this particular carnival cruise vessel. This is called the horizon,
15:10
Speaker 10: and the Horizon unlike other ships in their fleet, they
15:15
Speaker 10: have life vests that are actually in the state rooms. Okay,
15:18
Speaker 10: so anybody that's ever been on a cruise, they take
15:21
Speaker 10: you through the safety thing and you have to meet
15:24
Speaker 10: at a gathering point and then these things are kind
15:27
Speaker 10: of dispersed to you. In this particular case, someone within
15:31
Speaker 10: arm's reach had access to life veest. So this is
15:36
Speaker 10: going to facilitate the shielding of the body. Covering of
15:39
Speaker 10: the body, and listen, the covering of the body is
15:42
Speaker 10: not necessarily what we refer to as a memorialization of
15:45
Speaker 10: the dead. You'll get that lots of times with perpetrators. No, no, no, no.
15:49
Speaker 10: This is an event where somebody is trying to shield
15:52
Speaker 10: the body so they can get distance from the body
15:55
Speaker 10: and then leave the questions to be answered later. And
15:58
Speaker 10: still to this date, we don't have any answers at
16:03
Speaker 10: this point other than what the OCME down in Miami.
16:08
Speaker 10: The me is saying is her cause of death?
16:11
Speaker 2: Now I agree with everything that you just said, Joe
16:14
Speaker 2: Scott Morgan, but still I need clarification. We often see
16:20
Speaker 2: some of that videos from our friends at Mojo South
16:23
Speaker 2: on TikTok. When we're looking under the bed. When you
16:25
Speaker 2: say bunk, you may think of a bunk bed, one
16:28
Speaker 2: on top of the other. It's more like this in
16:30
Speaker 2: that particular cruise room and Spencer Hinfeld, you're the cruise lawyer.
16:35
Speaker 2: Jump in if you see or hear anything that you
16:38
Speaker 2: can expound upon or correct.
16:40
Speaker 3: You're the cruise expert, not us. Okay, back to you,
16:44
Speaker 3: Joe Scott Morgan.
16:46
Speaker 2: Very often with seasoned criminals, they use whatever's at hand.
16:52
Speaker 2: May it be a it could be a ball, peen hammer,
16:55
Speaker 2: it could be a vase, it could be running somebody
16:58
Speaker 2: down with a care. That does not suggest infantile. A
17:05
Speaker 2: lot of killers use whatever is at hand. But you
17:09
Speaker 2: specifically said the infantile way, infant child, child ish, puerol way.
17:17
Speaker 3: That she was killed and hidden points to a child,
17:23
Speaker 3: a young person. Why did you choose that word? I
17:28
Speaker 3: find it very probative in this case.
17:30
Speaker 10: Okay, who occupies her space? Ken has? Let me ask
17:34
Speaker 10: you this, Nancy, has this eighteen year old young woman
17:39
Speaker 10: developed some kind of enemy on this ship that would
17:44
Speaker 10: drive somebody to what the me? This is the me
17:48
Speaker 10: saying this, what the me is describing as using an
17:52
Speaker 10: armbar across her neck to asphyxiate her. Who on this
17:56
Speaker 10: population the ship is driven to do that. Well, most
18:00
Speaker 10: of the time, as you well know, we look at
18:03
Speaker 10: these violent cases. There are certainly more cases that end
18:07
Speaker 10: up in people's desks that have familial connection than some
18:11
Speaker 10: kind of stranger case where somebody emerges out of the
18:14
Speaker 10: dark shadows because you have relationship issues, you have motivations
18:19
Speaker 10: and all this sort of thing. Well, who's in her group?
18:21
Speaker 10: Who would have access to that state room other than
18:26
Speaker 10: immediate family or maybe a worker. I guess you could
18:29
Speaker 10: say that somebody could have followed her in there. But
18:31
Speaker 10: I got to tell you, Nancy, I'm hearing hoof beats
18:34
Speaker 10: and I'm not thinking camel at this point, Tom, I'm
18:37
Speaker 10: thinking something that is more reasonable here. And when you
18:41
Speaker 10: get her in this position and you have understandably ended
18:45
Speaker 10: her life, Oh my goodness, what in the world do
18:48
Speaker 10: I do. You don't have somebody that's sophisticated enough to think, well,
18:51
Speaker 10: maybe I can kind of wrap her body up, get
18:54
Speaker 10: her over a railing somewhere they're at sea. That's not
18:57
Speaker 10: what happens. They take her body, place her under this
19:00
Speaker 10: rack here and hoping against hope that no one is
19:04
Speaker 10: going to find it. That's what I mean by infantile.
19:07
Speaker 1: Exactly, Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
19:16
Speaker 2: Straight out to doctor Sue corn Bluth, director of clinical Psychology,
19:22
Speaker 2: owner of Doctor Sue and You, author of Building Self
19:27
Speaker 2: Esteem and Children and Teens, and you can find her
19:30
Speaker 2: a doctor Sue and you dot com, Doctor Seue, thank
19:35
Speaker 2: you for being with us now. I think Jesscott Morgan
19:39
Speaker 2: explained fully why he a death inveter investigator expert, used
19:44
Speaker 2: the term infantile. I mean, play it out, follow it
19:47
Speaker 2: through to its logical conclusion. You killed the girl, You
19:52
Speaker 2: killed the teen cheerleader, and then.
19:54
Speaker 3: You think, oh my stars, now what am I gonna do?
19:57
Speaker 2: Hey, I'll just hide her under the bed like it
19:59
Speaker 2: with my dirty socks and underwear.
20:01
Speaker 3: Nobody'll ever find her here.
20:02
Speaker 2: Instead of right there, let's see a video of the
20:06
Speaker 2: room again. Right there, you've got a sliding glass door
20:12
Speaker 2: and a balcony. You could throw her overboard and hours
20:20
Speaker 2: would pass.
20:21
Speaker 3: The ship was moving.
20:24
Speaker 2: People may have thought, hey, she fell overboard last night
20:27
Speaker 2: at some point, but no, they were so short sighted
20:32
Speaker 2: that they thought, hey, I'll stick her.
20:34
Speaker 3: Under the bed.
20:35
Speaker 1: They'll never find her.
20:37
Speaker 3: Oh that video from our friends at Mojo South on TikTok.
20:40
Speaker 1: What about it?
20:40
Speaker 3: Doctor Sue, Yeah, I.
20:42
Speaker 11: Think show has a great point here that whoever did
20:46
Speaker 11: this probably was young and panicked and didn't know what
20:52
Speaker 11: to do with the body. And like in a child's mind,
20:56
Speaker 11: what do you do when somebody gets hurt? You hide
21:00
Speaker 11: them or you tell? But if you tell, then you're
21:04
Speaker 11: gonna get in trouble, so instead you hide her under
21:07
Speaker 11: the bed, hoping that nobody is going to find her.
21:12
Speaker 11: I mean, it's very infantile the way that this all
21:16
Speaker 11: went down. And now we're the thing is here, Nancy,
21:22
Speaker 11: do we have proof that her stepbrother did this? That
21:26
Speaker 11: is what is going to be, you know, in my mind,
21:30
Speaker 11: the major component here. But it definitely seems like this
21:36
Speaker 11: was possibly done by somebody that was young or her age.
21:43
Speaker 5: Everybody now asking these questions a step brother being a suspect,
21:47
Speaker 5: what is the truth?
21:48
Speaker 1: Why no charges?
21:52
Speaker 2: Tonight we are learning more about the timeline and so
21:55
Speaker 2: called infantile way that annakt Or the teen cheerleader's body
21:59
Speaker 2: was hidden, points directly to her killer. We are also
22:05
Speaker 2: learning tonight that video does exist. It's only been talked
22:10
Speaker 2: about or speculated upon in the past. Video does exist
22:15
Speaker 2: of Anna Kaptner going alone to her room. Her braces
22:19
Speaker 2: were bothering her. That night at dinner, she goes alone
22:23
Speaker 2: to her room. Video then reveals other family members, the
22:27
Speaker 2: younger brother and the older step brother going into the room.
22:33
Speaker 2: Further video shows the little brother leaving the room alone
22:38
Speaker 2: and then wandering around the ship all by himself for
22:42
Speaker 2: the evening, but Anna doesn't leave the room and the
22:47
Speaker 2: step brother doesn't leave the room four hours. In fact,
22:52
Speaker 2: Anna never leaves the room. To Michelle Spitzer joining us
22:57
Speaker 2: out of Melbourne, Florida, investigator Reporter USA today, what can
23:02
Speaker 2: you tell us about the video.
23:05
Speaker 5: In these court hearings that the stepbrothers biological parents have had,
23:10
Speaker 5: they are the ones who have named their son as
23:14
Speaker 5: a suspect, and his biological mother actually said in text
23:20
Speaker 5: messages that were revealed in court documents, she sent a
23:24
Speaker 5: text message to her ex husband saying, once the autopsy
23:28
Speaker 5: results are revealed, we will see if he is charged,
23:32
Speaker 5: which I think is very telling.
23:35
Speaker 2: Spencer Arnfield trial lawyer called the cruise line lawyer and
23:40
Speaker 2: for a reason, tell me about the abundance of video cameras,
23:44
Speaker 2: surveillance cameras where you at least expect them on the
23:47
Speaker 2: cruise ships.
23:48
Speaker 7: So all the common areas of these ships, Nancy are
23:52
Speaker 7: wired like a casino. They have high definition CCTV footage
23:57
Speaker 7: that will capture with facial recognition software any passenger at
24:02
Speaker 7: any time, anywhere on the ship that's a common area.
24:07
Speaker 7: So for sure they have video that will track Anna
24:11
Speaker 7: from the moment she got on the ship until she
24:14
Speaker 7: was last seen entering her cabin. And they also have
24:19
Speaker 7: electronic key cards that will time whose card was used
24:24
Speaker 7: to get in that cabin at what time, and when
24:27
Speaker 7: the door opened and shuts. They can piece this entire
24:30
Speaker 7: thing together and have a very succinct timeline of what
24:35
Speaker 7: happened to her.
24:36
Speaker 3: Sidney Sumner Our Crime Stories investigative reporter. How old do
24:39
Speaker 3: we believe the little brother is?
24:42
Speaker 4: Anna's biological younger brother is about thirteen years old.
24:46
Speaker 2: And he's going to be a critical witness because he
24:48
Speaker 2: heard a big blowout happening in that cabin after he
24:52
Speaker 2: had been ousted, an argument, an explosive argument between the
24:56
Speaker 2: older step brother and Anna Kepner, Furniture being thrown reportedly
25:02
Speaker 2: at Anna. Where I'm going with this, Spencer erinfield, and
25:05
Speaker 2: I'm going to circle back to Anna's body. Is the
25:09
Speaker 2: little brother twelve or thirteen years old, wandered the cruise
25:12
Speaker 2: ship all by himself the remainder of the evening.
25:15
Speaker 3: He's caught on camera.
25:17
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's very sad, Nancy. It's not uncommon for parents
25:20
Speaker 7: to turn a blind eye on their kids on these cruises.
25:24
Speaker 7: They get lulled away into the false sense of security
25:28
Speaker 7: that these cruise ships are safe. And I've had many
25:31
Speaker 7: cases with kids of all ages that are walking around
25:36
Speaker 7: unsupervised at all hours of the night on these cruise ships,
25:40
Speaker 7: and they're not safe. It's kind of like letting your
25:43
Speaker 7: child walk around Times Square or New York City at
25:46
Speaker 7: two in the morning. No parent would ever do that,
25:49
Speaker 7: but they seem to do this on cruise ships because
25:52
Speaker 7: they mistakenly believe cruise ships are safer than they really are.
25:57
Speaker 2: Sidney Sumner tell me the timeline when Anna was last
26:03
Speaker 2: saint alive and then when her body was discovered.
26:08
Speaker 3: How many hours passed.
26:10
Speaker 4: Nearly eighteen, Nancy, she was last seen at dinner around
26:15
Speaker 4: six thirty pm the night before, and nobody was alarmed
26:19
Speaker 4: wondering where she was until breakfast the next day around
26:24
Speaker 4: nine am.
26:25
Speaker 3: Okay, so what does that mean?
26:27
Speaker 2: Michelle Spitzer joining us from USA today. Anna Kettner, the
26:32
Speaker 2: teen cheerleader, she was killed by a quote, bar hold
26:36
Speaker 2: something held over her neck and that asphyxiated her, suffocated her.
26:41
Speaker 5: Yes, and that's been a question that's been brought up
26:45
Speaker 5: in the court case, the custody hearing. Where were the
26:49
Speaker 5: parents and the step brother's biological mother. Anna's stepmother has
26:56
Speaker 5: said that she went to bed that evening at seven
26:58
Speaker 5: point thirty and doesn't really know what happened after that,
27:03
Speaker 5: she claims because she was sleeping. But as we've heard,
27:07
Speaker 5: we have video to I'm sure the FBI is investigating
27:11
Speaker 5: did she leave her room after seven thirty?
27:13
Speaker 1: Did she go anywhere?
27:16
Speaker 5: Did she actually go to bed at seven thirty that night?
27:20
Speaker 1: Two?
27:20
Speaker 2: Joe Scott Morgan, forensics professor at Jacksonville State University, You
27:24
Speaker 2: know what I'd be doing right now. I'd be looking
27:26
Speaker 2: at that big buffet the video.
27:30
Speaker 10: I'm also going to be interested if she was impacted
27:32
Speaker 10: by any furniture that was in that room. There would
27:36
Speaker 10: be evidence of markings on her body, potentially any kind
27:39
Speaker 10: of contusions, because at that point time, you wouldn't be
27:43
Speaker 10: getting them to resolve. They'd still be kind of very
27:46
Speaker 10: pronounced in this short wind of tom. I know we're
27:48
Speaker 10: talking about eighteen hours, but from a change of body,
27:53
Speaker 10: the changes that happened in the postmarm context, you would
27:56
Speaker 10: still be able to appreciate those readily. One more thing
27:59
Speaker 10: and I'll shut my mad talk about the arm bar, Nancy.
28:03
Speaker 10: The arm bar. The arm bar itself is you're taking
28:07
Speaker 10: You're taking the leading part of your arm. That's why
28:11
Speaker 10: they call it an arm bar. Okay, And you're compressing
28:15
Speaker 10: the laynix. This is not like a choke hold where
28:18
Speaker 10: you're compressing the blood supply to the brain. You know
28:21
Speaker 10: what would have happened here if you're talking about talking
28:24
Speaker 10: about an arm bar, you're pressing down literally on the windpipe.
28:29
Speaker 10: I'm very I'll be very interested to see what the
28:33
Speaker 10: OCME in their detailed report is noting as far as
28:36
Speaker 10: trauma to all of the cartilaginous bodies, all of the
28:40
Speaker 10: cartilage in the trachea, to see if it's been fractured
28:43
Speaker 10: in any way. And yeah, you can have cartilaginous fractures.
28:47
Speaker 10: I want to know if that exists, because this is
28:49
Speaker 10: a very specific diagnosis.
28:51
Speaker 2: No one has been charged formally in this case with
28:55
Speaker 2: the death of Anna.
28:56
Speaker 3: Kettner, but that said doctor C. Cornblooth. Another thing I
29:01
Speaker 3: want to find out is what.
29:02
Speaker 2: Was the step brother, the older stepbrothers behavior in his
29:07
Speaker 2: demeanor at breakfast the next morning? Was he stuffing himself
29:11
Speaker 2: on the all you can eat breakfast buffet because they
29:14
Speaker 2: are notorious. Was he doing that or did the mom say, hey,
29:19
Speaker 2: what's wrong, you're not hungry.
29:21
Speaker 3: I want to find out everything.
29:23
Speaker 2: Was he sick to his stomach or was it sop
29:25
Speaker 2: stand an operating procedure.
29:27
Speaker 3: Breakfast is usual. I can't wait to find out.
29:31
Speaker 2: And you know, we heard Joe Scott saying I want
29:33
Speaker 2: to find out what she hit by a piece of furniture.
29:34
Speaker 3: I want to find out was she sex assaulted.
29:38
Speaker 11: It's a great question, Nancy. You know I've been on
29:42
Speaker 11: cruises myself. There are big buffis that you know you
29:46
Speaker 11: just eat whatever you want. But you know, I don't know.
29:49
Speaker 11: It's a great question. Was he sitting there not eating?
29:53
Speaker 11: Was he very quiet or was he participating in conversation?
29:59
Speaker 2: Also tonight, bad optics are Anna's family members more worried
30:06
Speaker 2: about covering up for the step brother than they are
30:10
Speaker 2: about the daughter being dead.
30:14
Speaker 12: Texts submitted as evidence of the custody battle over Chantelle
30:17
Speaker 12: and Thomas Hudson's youngest daughter revealed the family's attempt at
30:20
Speaker 12: damage control. In the hours after they're told their son
30:23
Speaker 12: is a suspect in the stepsister's murder, Chantelle Hudson first
30:27
Speaker 12: informs her ex Anna is dead and their son may
30:30
Speaker 12: be involved a whopping thirty two hours after the eighteen
30:33
Speaker 12: year old's body is discovered. From there, the parents' priority
30:36
Speaker 12: is protecting their son from scrutiny.
30:38
Speaker 13: November eight, at seven thirty five pm, Chantell Hudson texts
30:42
Speaker 13: Thomas Hudson, I need you to call me asap. It's
30:45
Speaker 13: an emergency. Nearly an hour later, after a shocking phone call,
30:49
Speaker 13: Thomas Hudson offers to get their daughter away from the situation.
30:53
Speaker 13: Hudson promises good intentions, and Chantelle Hudson replies that she
30:57
Speaker 13: appreciates the offer but doesn't think it will help, explaining
31:00
Speaker 13: she's only told the nine year old her older brother
31:02
Speaker 13: is having a hard time coping with losing Anna, so
31:05
Speaker 13: he's getting checked out by the hospital.
31:08
Speaker 2: Okay, let me understand what happened to Michelle Spitzer joining
31:12
Speaker 2: US investigative Reporter USA today. Michelle, when the stepbrother, the
31:18
Speaker 2: older stepbrother, not the younger twelve thirteen year old natural brother.
31:24
Speaker 2: The older stepbrother, the one that reportedly was throwing the
31:27
Speaker 2: furniture room was alone in the room with Anna Kittner
31:29
Speaker 2: just before her death, that one when they returned to
31:33
Speaker 2: Port after her body was found, he.
31:36
Speaker 3: Went straight to the hospital. Is that correct?
31:39
Speaker 5: He did go to a facility, is what it was
31:42
Speaker 5: referred to in court documents. We do not know how
31:45
Speaker 5: long he stayed there, but by all accounts it was
31:49
Speaker 5: not long. And then he was released to a relative
31:53
Speaker 5: and another part of Florida. He did not return back
31:56
Speaker 5: to Titusville, his home in Bervard County, and has remained
32:00
Speaker 5: with this relative who now has a guardianship over him now.
32:07
Speaker 2: When he was rushed for psychiatric evaluation.
32:11
Speaker 3: Wasn't that the first time.
32:14
Speaker 2: The FBI detectives tried to speak with him, he suddenly
32:18
Speaker 2: had to go to the hospital because he couldn't remember
32:22
Speaker 2: what happened.
32:23
Speaker 5: We do believe, we know that the FBI did meet
32:26
Speaker 5: the cruise ship when it docked important Miami, and as
32:29
Speaker 5: far as timing on when they were able to first
32:32
Speaker 5: speak with him. We're not really sure on when that was,
32:34
Speaker 5: but believe it was pretty shortly after he disembarked from
32:38
Speaker 5: the cruise ship. And yes, according to court documents, he
32:42
Speaker 5: has told his mother he does not remember anything from
32:47
Speaker 5: what happened on the cruise ship.
32:49
Speaker 13: Sean tell Hudson tells her ex over text that their
32:52
Speaker 13: son just keeps repeating over and over he can't remember anything.
32:56
Speaker 13: Chris Kepner's parents say the same thing. The sixteen year
32:59
Speaker 13: old he cannot remember anything and is clearly distraught. The
33:03
Speaker 13: boy's step grandparents also say he was unable to speak
33:07
Speaker 13: the first time FBI detectives try to question him. The
33:10
Speaker 13: teen has rushed to a hospital for psychiatric evaluation. The
33:13
Speaker 13: moment investigators allow the family to leave the cruise ship.
33:17
Speaker 2: So investigators are trying to speak to him Sidney Sumner,
33:22
Speaker 2: and that's when he remember eight this is where I'm going.
33:27
Speaker 3: Eighteen hours. Everything's been fine.
33:30
Speaker 2: He could walk, he could talk, he dressed himself, he
33:33
Speaker 2: went to the breakfast buffet.
33:34
Speaker 1: But then the.
33:35
Speaker 2: Investigator showed up, and suddenly he can't function. He can't
33:41
Speaker 2: speak to the FBI and has to be raised for
33:45
Speaker 2: a pit hold.
33:47
Speaker 3: Do I have that right, Sydney Sumner Exactly.
33:50
Speaker 4: The grandparents' family members say, once they found Anna's body,
33:55
Speaker 4: this teen boy was completely distraught, unable to speak, appearing
34:00
Speaker 4: to go through some sort of mental episode, and he's
34:03
Speaker 4: rushed to that hospital for a psychiatric evaluation. The moment
34:08
Speaker 4: investigators allow them to step off of that cruise.
34:11
Speaker 2: Ship, Spencer Erinfeld, is he unable to speak because his
34:19
Speaker 2: stepsister is dead, or because they found the body row.
34:26
Speaker 7: Right, or maybe Nancy he was sort of invoking his
34:29
Speaker 7: Fifth Amendment privilege and refused to speak. So I kind
34:34
Speaker 7: of hope that is what happened, and that he decided
34:38
Speaker 7: he was not going to cooperate with the FBI and
34:41
Speaker 7: not speak until he had a lawyer, And maybe this
34:43
Speaker 7: was an opportunity to create a gap in time.
34:47
Speaker 3: To do that.
34:48
Speaker 2: Doesn't he want to find out who killed Anna, his sister.
34:51
Speaker 7: He also doesn't want to be wrongfully convicted, so perhaps
34:55
Speaker 7: he was doing the right thing until he had a
34:57
Speaker 7: chance to speak to a lawyer.
34:58
Speaker 2: You know that's crazy because when I've witnessed a car accident,
35:03
Speaker 2: for example, I didn't try to leave the scene and
35:06
Speaker 2: climb up and take the fifth I told the responding
35:09
Speaker 2: officer what I saw, So why not saw?
35:13
Speaker 3: Why not say what happened?
35:15
Speaker 7: That assumes he saw something maybe he didn't. And I
35:18
Speaker 7: do want to give this kid the presumption of innocence.
35:21
Speaker 7: I know there is strong indications that he may not be,
35:25
Speaker 7: but he does deserve this presumption. And he does deserve
35:28
Speaker 7: that well.
35:28
Speaker 3: Of course he and he does deserve to. I appreciate you.
35:34
Speaker 2: I appreciate you reiterating and giving him the protections, but
35:37
Speaker 2: I believe the US Constitution has already done that.
35:40
Speaker 3: Look around, are you in a courtroom, know you or not?
35:43
Speaker 2: You're in front of a camera and where you're discussing
35:45
Speaker 2: the evidence as we know it now. And what I
35:48
Speaker 2: know is the family is very concerned about image optics.
35:53
Speaker 12: Listen, Thomas Hudson's concerned about keeping his son's name private.
35:57
Speaker 12: Already coming across social media post mentioning the team. I
36:00
Speaker 12: know everything is supposed to be hush hush for now,
36:02
Speaker 12: but I've seen that it is still getting out with
36:05
Speaker 12: posts and comments between Facebook, TikTok and stuff. I just
36:09
Speaker 12: want to make sure, until things are certain, that he
36:12
Speaker 12: doesn't get any unnecessary comments towards him.
36:15
Speaker 13: Sean tell Hudson assures Thomas Hudson she is doing everything
36:18
Speaker 13: she can to keep their son's name private. Quote everything
36:22
Speaker 13: that's been posted on TikTok and social media, nobody knows anything,
36:25
Speaker 13: and everybody's just speculating. Nobody knows anything about him. He
36:29
Speaker 13: is a minor and has been kept completely out of it.
36:32
Speaker 13: We have not said anything to anybody, and we are
36:34
Speaker 13: going to try our best to keep it completely out.
36:37
Speaker 13: When we talk to the FBI again, we will reiterate
36:39
Speaker 13: that we do not want his name out there.
36:46
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
36:52
Speaker 2: Let me understand, Scott Morgan. When the family, the bio
36:59
Speaker 2: dad and stepmom meet with the FBI, their concern is
37:04
Speaker 2: protecting the privacy of the.
37:06
Speaker 3: Step brother suspect.
37:08
Speaker 2: Why are they saying to the FBI, where's the charges?
37:11
Speaker 2: Who did this? What is something totally pass awkwards here?
37:16
Speaker 10: Yeah, in my opinion it is. I mean, why are
37:18
Speaker 10: you not climbing up on the rooftops of every home
37:22
Speaker 10: in your immediate vicinity and screaming I want to find
37:25
Speaker 10: out who did this to my child? Because Nancy, I
37:28
Speaker 10: can tell you this, she did not fall down and
37:32
Speaker 10: strike her neck so that it gives the appearance of
37:35
Speaker 10: an arm bar. All right, so I want to know
37:40
Speaker 10: who facilitated this. We talked a lot about CCTV. We
37:44
Speaker 10: talked about her being visualized. I think that that the
37:48
Speaker 10: first guest that you had on Nancy with the video
37:52
Speaker 10: is incredibly powerful there. So you know we have videography here.
37:57
Speaker 10: What's the hold up at this point in time? Let's
37:59
Speaker 10: move forward with this. Because Anna is the victim.
38:04
Speaker 2: The texts between the family are very very concerning to me.
38:10
Speaker 12: Listen in text, grief for Anna's loss is barely discussed.
38:14
Speaker 12: Chantelle Hudson describes youngest daughter Brooks, struggling with the loss
38:17
Speaker 12: and declined to call from Hudson because this is the
38:20
Speaker 12: first time we will be home without Anna and their son. Otherwise,
38:24
Speaker 12: the focus lies on their son. Chantell Hudson never mentioning
38:28
Speaker 12: feelings on her stepdaughter's murder.
38:31
Speaker 3: The child is dead.
38:34
Speaker 2: Anna Kettner is dead, either clothed or partially clothed, stuffed
38:38
Speaker 2: under a bed. I don't quite get why the focus
38:44
Speaker 2: is on protecting the privacy of the step brother as
38:49
Speaker 2: opposed to apprehending their daughter's killer, Sidney Sumner.
38:56
Speaker 3: What is happening?
38:58
Speaker 2: We don't know.
39:00
Speaker 4: There has been no word from any investigative agency on
39:04
Speaker 4: why this pager who is named of the suspect in
39:09
Speaker 4: these court documents in this custody case is still living
39:15
Speaker 4: freely with relatives. Because my concern, Nancy, is he's going
39:20
Speaker 4: to run.
39:21
Speaker 2: Nick Gitdons came forward and showed us his video from
39:26
Speaker 2: the cruise video that captured Anna Kettner and her so
39:30
Speaker 2: called last dance with her grandparents.
39:35
Speaker 3: Is it probative, Yes, it is.
39:38
Speaker 2: It can prove something if carefully analyzed. So if you
39:43
Speaker 2: know or think you know anything about this case, even
39:47
Speaker 2: if you think it is inconsequential, please dial seven five
39:52
Speaker 2: four seven zero three two thousand, repeat seven four seven
39:56
Speaker 2: zero three two thousand. We from an American hero, Deputy
40:02
Speaker 2: Sheriff Noah Rainey, Carroll County Sheriff's, Indiana, just twenty nine,
40:07
Speaker 2: killed in the line of duty, leaving behind his young
40:11
Speaker 2: wife and two little boys. American hero Deputy Sheriff Noah
40:17
Speaker 2: Rainey
40:19
Speaker 3: Nancy Gray signing off goodbye friend,