Latest / On The Lake with James Pitropov / The REAL Costs of Building a Lakeside Home

Transcript

The REAL Costs of Building a Lakeside Home · On The Lake with James Pitropov

• 0:00
  well, hi everyone.
• 0:01
  Welcome to On the Lake with James ov.
• 0:03
  I'm here today to give you the real deal on site development, and construction costs for your cottage project in Muskoka, Halliburton, the coauthors, even the Quinny.
• 0:12
  We've been working on all of them, and guess what?
• 0:14
  I've got real costs for you and real time schedules and all that.
• 0:19
  I'm gonna let you know what it takes to build your dream.
• 0:21
  Let's listen in and let me know what you think.
• 0:24
  your are listening to On the Lake, the podcast that explores the rhythms of waterfront living and what it takes to build your dream Lakeside home on the Canadian Shield.
• 0:33
  And now for your host, James Pitcher Pav.
• 0:36
  Ah.
• 0:37
  The reality of building a cottage, how much does it cost, James?
• 0:42
  I'm asked how much is it going to cost to clear our site, get the hydro in, get the septic built water supply.
• 0:54
  Access to the site in the winter and the summer.
• 0:57
  There's a lot that goes into a cottage build before the build.
• 1:01
  This is why when we hear construction costs, how much does it cost to build?
• 1:05
  Is it$400 a square foot?
• 1:06
  Is it$500?
• 1:07
  Is it$800?
• 1:09
  Why do there cottage cost so much?
• 1:11
  Well, here's some of the factors to consider.
• 1:14
  You have the amazing cottage, uh, property in a lot of cases we're we need to clear the land.
• 1:21
  There's bed work on the site.
• 1:22
  Sometimes there's a little bit of blasting to be done, and we would need to make sure that we can get our services in.
• 1:29
  Now, this varies with every project site I build and design cottages, luxury homes in Muskoka, in the Kartha via Quinte and elsewhere.
• 1:43
  And every property, every site's a little bit different.
• 1:46
  So even before we are looking at construction costs.
• 1:51
  I can be assured by the, the data that I've developed from our projects that chances are that there are between 40 to hundred thousand dollars worth of site clearing.
• 2:05
  Now, in addition to that, there's permit fees, consultants, engineering consultants.
• 2:10
  That is, which can add 60 40 to 60, uh, thousand to a project for a one of a kind project that is.
• 2:20
  And then there are the actual construction costs.
• 2:22
  Now instead of the actual construction costs, what I like to go buy is.
• 2:26
  What did they get built and how much did it cost?
• 2:28
  Like what is the real deal on the cost?
• 2:31
  So when people come in and I say, our sweet spot has been around$600 per square foot for the types of projects that we have done for the specifications that we have done, you can rest assured that that's backed up by data.
• 2:45
  Now if you're asking a contractor or a builder and they're telling you, oh, for certain we can get this thing built for 350 bucks a square foot, well.
• 2:54
  That would be difficult for the type of quality people are expecting for their special project.
• 3:00
  So if it is a, if your builder is, uh, familiar or, or comfortable building a track style subdivision style place for you, if it's a investment or if it's a resale, uh, yes, everything's possible, that's a possibility.
• 3:15
  But for the types of projects that we do, a lot of them will come in that, um, 6, 6 50 range.
• 3:22
  That gets you good materials, and that is based on cost, relationships that we have with suppliers and trades.
• 3:30
  We can get a lot of cottage built, at those costs.
• 3:32
  Now the caveat is if you have super specific tastes, the sky's the limit.
• 3:40
  And a lot of the cottage that you see built, they will come in.
• 3:43
  Yes, they will come in$800 a square foot, even higher.
• 3:45
  So I like to get people started in the, uh, in the realistic zone.
• 3:49
  Now.
• 3:51
  So the way that I think about it is this, James, show us a cottage that you have built and what were the costs and what, what were the timeframes and, and you'll find that a lot of cottages, well, let's put it this way.
• 4:05
  How much does the cottage cost to build?
• 4:07
  Let's think about how much cottage you need for of all, if you're building a four to five or 6,000 square foot cottage, it's not really a cottage anymore.
• 4:14
  And even if you're building it for$400 a square foot.
• 4:18
  The costs are going to get up there.
• 4:20
  So if that's within your inclinations and your means, that's great, but I like to look for the sweet spot to get people started off a good specification with realistic costs.
• 4:31
  I like to start with good foundations, strong materials, Douglas fir glass, granite quarry, granite and or limestone someplace, hardwood floors, reclaimed hardwood.
• 4:45
  We have a pretty good specification.
• 4:48
  But the important thing to do is to get it down on paper, get a design down, lay it out, and then compare it to current projects that you've done.
• 4:58
  Now, some current projects, let's talk about different areas in the musk, in Muskoka, rock hard granite.
• 5:06
  Obviously it's rock hard because it's granite on your site.
• 5:10
  If we're looking to control costs, we should consider the site.
• 5:13
  If you have a perfect, what you consider a perfect, uh, property.
• 5:17
  On Lake Bays or, or another lake with a lot of bedrock on it, lake Muskoka, and there's this knob of bedrock blocking your view.
• 5:25
  Well, how much are you willing to pay to, uh, get rid of it?
• 5:29
  Is it worth 20 grand?
• 5:31
  Is it worth more?
• 5:32
  In a lot of cases, this rock blasting is ranging from I see people spending from 50 to$200,000 on it.
• 5:39
  I would suggest the first thing that's gonna save you money today, and you will thank me all summer long, is if there's that much blasting to do.
• 5:47
  Maybe you should reconsider the, the property that you're on, because if you have to rework it so much, maybe it's not the right property for you.
• 5:54
  It's going to eat up a lot of budget.
• 5:56
  That's the first thing.
• 5:57
  That's what I see up in, in Muskoka now on, uh, lake Simco and Georgian Bay here at Lake Huron.
• 6:04
  Remember, I've done projects on a lot of different areas, and the characteristics of their sites are different in a lot of cases.
• 6:11
  You're on sand and possibly over bedrock.
• 6:14
  So if we can, uh, we can reduce the site development and we can, instead of building basements, because the water table is high already, why not looking?
• 6:23
  Look at doing, helical piles, for example.
• 6:26
  That'll save you 50 or 60 grand over even more over digging and doing full foundation.
• 6:34
  So we're not talking about con square foot costs, we're talking about scope of what you do.
• 6:38
  Where should your smart money go that you've worked for and want to, um, focus upon a beautiful cottage and finishes rather than digging holes in the ground.
• 6:49
  Now, uh, something else that is possible too is in, in other areas like on, on quinte, we have limestone as well, and, uh, it's about four feet down results in a high water table as well.
• 7:02
  Can we do partial basements and, and so forth?
• 7:05
  I guess the thing that I'm saying is based on.
• 7:08
  Real projects that we're working on now, there are usually two or three solutions to, cite, uh, challenges.
• 7:17
  So let's find out what the most resourceful way to work is, and you'll find that you can save a lot of money and get better results as well.
• 7:26
  Here's something else that people ask about.
• 7:28
  Can I reuse existing hydro?
• 7:30
  Yeah.
• 7:30
  In some cases you can, in some cases you need to bring a, a new line in.
• 7:34
  Is it.
• 7:35
  On an island, well, before you purchase a property, it, it would be helpful to know if there's a old, copper line in there.
• 7:41
  'cause that'll save a lot of cost.
• 7:43
  We can reduce, septic if you have a high bedrock, this is going to limit the areas on the site where you can, uh, lay out a, a septic field that can increase the cost if we're going for reduced bed sizes.
• 7:58
  However, the reduced bed size for some of the new systems.
• 8:02
  Might result in allowing you to have a, uh, expanded floor plan that might increase the cost.
• 8:09
  It might reduce the cost if you don't have to be so complex with your layout to fit a tight site.
• 8:13
  So what I'm getting at is we look at the overall, cost of developing a site, which include blasting hydro, bringing in roads, something else.
• 8:24
  Where are you getting your water from?
• 8:25
  Well, are you getting it from the lake that that's not too costly?
• 8:29
  Do you need to drill a well?
• 8:30
  What do you, if you have granite, four or five feet down?
• 8:34
  So there's, there's some opportunities there to look at different well types.
• 8:37
  Uh, also if we're digging into the, uh, if we're, if we're, uh, digging into the site, your heating system.
• 8:46
  So can we save money by, specifying, uh, propane, forced air?
• 8:51
  For a traditional place, that's not bad.
• 8:52
  There's places to hide the ducks, but if it's a modern place, you don't really wanna see the ducks everywhere.
• 8:56
  Maybe we could look at inflow, radiant heating.
• 8:58
  Maybe we can look at geothermal.
• 9:00
  Geothermal is great.
• 9:01
  Where are you gonna run the tubes?
• 9:03
  Well, you can run it in the lake if locally you're allowed to do that.
• 9:07
  And there's a condenser and a boiler that can condense the water so you release the heat, even a small amount of temperature differential.
• 9:16
  Results in a warmly heated place, but you need a place to run the the tubes.
• 9:20
  So in the lake's, not too bad to your thermal cost more money, but over the course of seven or eight years, it pays off for itself.
• 9:27
  It makes sense.
• 9:28
  Um, if you're on the bedrock, uh, you could, uh, d trenches and that costs a little bit more.
• 9:35
  But you can lay your pipes s above the bedrock and cover it up with the back soil.
• 9:40
  The backfill, um, it costs a little bit more.
• 9:43
  So let's compare the costs and then if not, if you're on a soft site, like if you're on, uh,, just a north cotus and you're not over bedrock, or if you have some spaces in the limestone that's underneath there, sometimes it's fractured.
• 9:56
  It's gotta pickle around.
• 9:57
  With a mini excavator, you might find that you can put your tubes down vertically in a well, that saves space.
• 10:02
  It's just one well hole, and you're not doing a lot of trenching.
• 10:04
  So far the benefit is that.
• 10:06
  Before you even get into the construction cost, let's figure out how to best deal with your site.
• 10:10
  That's the best thing you can do so far.
• 10:12
  So already, hopefully we've saved a little bit of money and narrowed down the scope for you a bit.
• 10:17
  Next, how much do we spend on the cottage?
• 10:20
  For a lot of clients, uh, this is their cottage.
• 10:23
  They're selling their place in the city.
• 10:24
  Yeah, they're going to, um, use their cottage as a cottage for a while, and then they, uh, typically will, will move there.
• 10:32
  So in that case, it's built like a house.
• 10:34
  They sell their place in the city.
• 10:36
  It's a pretty good trade, and you're gonna get a, a pretty spectacular, uh, change of scenery when, when you, uh, live at your cottage, which is no longer cottage these days.
• 10:46
  By the way, folks, these are, uh, let's call them, uh, uh, more of a, luxurious.
• 10:53
  Uh, wilderness Home.
• 10:54
  Maybe that's a better way to describe them.
• 10:56
  I like to work in 3D modeling.
• 10:57
  This is what, what I do, and physical modeling, but with the, with, with my, uh, software, which I've, modified and, and, and made very specific to cottage construction, what I can do is I can work with your layouts and then we can use different, specify different materials.
• 11:13
  Our clients like a lot of, uh, natural materials, reclaimed hemlock floors, polished concrete floors, west Coast Douglas for timbers, oversized glass.
• 11:23
  A lot of the clients right now, they've gone from the traditional style more to a contemporary, almost like a West coast modern style.
• 11:30
  And the thing about it is that you can have the open spaces, but it doesn't have to be all cold and austere.
• 11:35
  You can get a lot of warmth outta the materials, and they really suit themselves to the, forested lake fronts up north.
• 11:42
  It just, it's a good fit.
• 11:44
  So I like to start you on the, on the right spec and instead of only talking about the, the square foot costs, our projects.
• 11:54
  Some people will, will argue against it, but it's not, A lot of our projects, they're probably worth 800 a square foot.
• 12:02
  Our sweet spot, my sweet spot's been 600 to six 50.
• 12:05
  There's just what I end up being able to get deals and costs on.
• 12:11
  So if you're looking at a 2000 square foot cottage, 600 bucks a square foot, there's your math.
• 12:18
  Okay.
• 12:19
  A lot of projects come into 1.2 to 1.6 million.
• 12:22
  I would say the cottage process, if you're in that range, if that makes sense to you, either through your own resources or you're selling a place in the city, it makes sense because you get good value and a completely new, uh, lifestyle with a, with a new cottage working that way, we start with off with a good spec, and then you can increase your spec.
• 12:44
  You can make things simpler, but you're getting a lot of cottage that way.
• 12:47
  Now I'm gonna save you.
• 12:49
  A lot of money with my, my next, uh, opinionated, uh, uh, thought here.
• 12:54
  So I have a lot of clients that will come in and they're looking for the four to 5,000 square foot place.
• 13:00
  Now that's a lot of, that's a lot of, uh, uh, construction there.
• 13:05
  And if it's a cottage or even a home or a lot of clients that will retire after their professional careers, do you really need, like what is the benefit of the, of the.
• 13:18
  Excessively large places.
• 13:20
  And if this is your goal, uh, it's no problem.
• 13:23
  Call me and right away we'll start on your five, six, 10,000 square foot place.
• 13:27
  But realistically, you can build a really beautiful place.
• 13:31
  Like anywhere from 1200 to 2,800 square feet with maybe 2,500 is, is a real sweet spot.
• 13:41
  You can build a lot of place and it's not necessary to build these endless constructions.
• 13:46
  I would rather that you focus on a well designed, well laid out place.
• 13:51
  Let's start off a little smaller because these projects get bigger anyways, like guaranteed, and let's track the cost and then see where you end up.
• 14:00
  This is the way to think about things.
• 14:02
  The way not to get misled is to, uh, avoid.
• 14:06
  Asking everyone and their dog and their uncle, what things cost because you don't know what things cost until you actually specify it.
• 14:14
  You have actual quantities and you have options, and you have some strategy.
• 14:19
  So I have some, uh, takeaways, uh, for you.
• 14:23
  Uh, first of all, let's stop thinking about square footage.
• 14:26
  Let's talk about overall project costs.
• 14:28
  The way to do that is we get on a phone.
• 14:30
  You tell me, uh, what you wanna build, how you wanna build it, show me an example, and then we start preliminary modeling.
• 14:37
  And I get you real costs based on the exact costs that I've been, uh, uh, paying out on our last, like say five to 10.
• 14:46
  Well, let's tighten it up.
• 14:46
  Last three to four projects is the real current cost.
• 14:49
  There is no other cost other than the real current cost that I can get for you.
• 14:53
  If you're doing a fall build, I'll tell you now what we anticipate the cost to be.
• 14:58
  Then we should have a look at your site and see what it's all about and see, how much work it is to get it up to date.
• 15:05
  Get all the services in cleared out, and then, uh, have a plan, like a construction plan.
• 15:11
  Uh, where are the disposal bins going to be?
• 15:13
  Can we can some workers siting, or sorry, some a little lodging, uh, for the workers.
• 15:18
  Sometimes they, they like to, uh, they'll work at odd times, uh, sometimes to keep schedules going.
• 15:25
  Power and all that.
• 15:27
  Let's get those costs under control and I'll give you real costs, not the guesstimate cost.
• 15:33
  And then, we'll, we can set up a, a budget for hard and soft costs for all of your projects so you know exactly where the money goes.
• 15:42
  And then we'll even give you a contingency plan.
• 15:44
  It'll tell you every single possible thing that can happen because they can and do happen.
• 15:48
  And luckily we have, we, we have a plan on.
• 15:52
  Based on what we've experienced, you know, you learn things the hard way in careers.
• 15:56
  We, uh, have a way to, uh, address and improve upon our designs when things come up.
• 16:02
  So that's the big four.
• 16:04
  And what I would encourage you, uh, to do if you wanna a quick, uh, giveaway to make this worthwhile for you.
• 16:10
  I have, uh, uh, two companies they serve different functions.
• 16:14
  I'm a registered architect and the company is Lakeside Architecture Inc.
• 16:17
  You can check out the website, lakeside architecture.ca.
• 16:20
  If you get on there, download your, your absolutely free design, your dream, design guide just to get your ideas down and have a look at some of the projects on there.
• 16:31
  You can even subscribe to on the lake if you're just looking for ideas.
• 16:35
  And when it comes down to it, let's work out a preliminary design and get you the real cost so there's no guessing, and we can actually design what you want.
• 16:44
  And what fulfills your dream rather than what someone has built someplace else?
• 16:49
  All the work I do is completely custom and it's, guided by the.
• 16:52
  Uh, clients have vision, so I wanna make sure that we get it right, but we get you the cost as well.
• 16:57
  And then you can flip over to the other, super exciting website.
• 17:01
  It's Lakeside Construction Management, Inc.
• 17:03
  Just look it up and there's links to, uh, Instagram and so on.
• 17:07
  You can see the current build, uh, just out of necessity.
• 17:10
  I've had to be a very hands-on, uh, designer over the years just to get things done, get them on budget, get them on time, get them built strong.
• 17:18
  So there you'll see like current projects and you'll see more of the, the software and the pricing, and the, actual specifications that were built.
• 17:26
  So please do check out those two websites and then I would be more than delighted if you could meet me on the next episode.
• 17:33
  I promise it'll be exciting.
• 17:35
  Shoreline rules and setbacks.
• 17:37
  Yes, we can get them under control and get things built for you.
• 17:40
  Thanks again.
• 17:41
  I'm James OV Lakeside.
• 17:43
  Bye for now.