Latest / Brian Thomas / Ken Kober - Full reinstatement of Cincinnati Police Captain Danita Pettis

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Ken Kober - Full reinstatement of Cincinnati Police Captain Danita Pettis · Brian Thomas

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  Speaker 1: It's six or six here fifty five kersee detalk station.
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  Speaker 1: I'm very happy Friday to everyone. Tech Friday, Dave Hatter
• 0:10
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• 0:20
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  Speaker 1: bottom of this hour right now, a regular feature here
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  Speaker 1: lately on the fifty five cares of the Morning Show,
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  Speaker 1: all the what I will call Shenanigan's coming out of
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  Speaker 1: the orders and actions related to the mayor, the city manager.
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  Speaker 1: Back in the background, Iris Rolie, and of course our
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  Speaker 1: administratively police chief Threesy Thigi, who's implicated in this one.
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  Speaker 1: Welcome back FOP President Ken Kobert. It's great to have
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  Speaker 1: you on.
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  Speaker 2: Ken.
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  Speaker 3: Good morning, Brian. Thanks for having me again.
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  Speaker 1: I understand Joe suggested perhaps you should become a weekly
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  Speaker 1: feature or even a daily feature on the Morning Show
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  Speaker 1: with all of your press releases, and that's the genesis
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  Speaker 1: of Joe inviting you on the program. In my you know,
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  Speaker 1: happiness about having you on the program. You releast some
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  Speaker 1: to the press about what's going on over like, what
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  Speaker 1: in the hell how did this happen? Of course, that's
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  Speaker 1: the case with the firing of Danda Pettis. She was
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  Speaker 1: a police captain. That is a it's ab almost as
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  Speaker 1: high as rank as you can get, right, it's a captain.
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  Speaker 1: Then what assistant chief.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, assistant chief and then the chief, and the captain's
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  Speaker 3: really the highest rank. Yeah, that you can attain through
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  Speaker 3: taking promotional exams. Once you get to assistant chief.
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  Speaker 1: Their appointments then that becomes political, but we'll ignore that
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  Speaker 1: for the moment. So we're talking about someone a very
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  Speaker 1: high status in the police department. She is the or
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  Speaker 1: was and soon will be again the highest ranking black
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  Speaker 1: female fifty five years old, work for the Cincini Police
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  Speaker 1: Department for more than twenty five years. But then Police
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  Speaker 1: Chief three Sohigia, according to the reporting on this, in
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  Speaker 1: December of twenty four, fired her for alleged dishonesty and
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  Speaker 1: subordination rule violations like time and overtime issues. She appealed
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  Speaker 1: that and went to arbitration, and the arbitration panel said,
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  Speaker 1: uh uh, they've ordered full reinstatement of her as since
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  Speaker 1: a police captain with back pay, rejecting the administrations what
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  Speaker 1: they call unfounded efforts or what you kind of called
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  Speaker 1: unfounded efforts to terminate her.
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  Speaker 2: What happened? Why was she targeted?
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  Speaker 1: And I guess I have to ask you out loud,
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  Speaker 1: do you think this was police chief three so that
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  Speaker 1: Thiji's decision to fire her or maybe she got influenced
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  Speaker 1: by someone else in the hierarchy?
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  Speaker 3: Ken Kobert, Well, there's a lot of things they don't know.
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  Speaker 3: The why is the biggest thing. We don't know why
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  Speaker 3: why this was done.
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  Speaker 2: You know.
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  Speaker 3: They ultimately, after this interview and they came up with
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  Speaker 3: these charges, they decided that the fire chief would be
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  Speaker 3: the department level hearing officer. Why again, they say, well,
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  Speaker 3: it's because we wanted to be independent.
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  Speaker 2: The fire officer.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, the fire chief did a did the the department
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  Speaker 3: level hearing, which the department level hearing is basically like
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  Speaker 3: a predisciplinary hearing. They hear from both sides as to
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  Speaker 3: what they believe the fact pattern is and then they
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  Speaker 3: make a decision. Well, the fire chief after all this,
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  Speaker 3: and like I said, a lot of these questions go
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  Speaker 3: unanswered as he issues an eighty eight hour suspension. It
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  Speaker 3: then went to Chief Thiji, who determined No, I don't
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  Speaker 3: like this, I want her terminated. So then it goes
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  Speaker 3: to Cheryl Long, who's the city manager who is responsible
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  Speaker 3: for the hiring and firing of every city employee, upholds
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  Speaker 3: Chief Thiji's decision and they terminate her. Of course, now
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  Speaker 3: thirteen months later, you know, after going to arbitration over
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  Speaker 3: the summer, this three arbiter panel came back with a
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  Speaker 3: decision of she.
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  Speaker 2: Didn't do any of this.
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  Speaker 3: All of the charges that they had, they said, absolutely not,
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  Speaker 3: all of this was unfounded. In fact, you're going to
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  Speaker 3: reinstate her with full back pay, full benefit immediately.
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  Speaker 2: Wow.
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  Speaker 1: And I suppose giving a collective bargaining agreement, And I
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  Speaker 1: don't know what's in it. Is that her sole remedy.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, it's a good one that she got her
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  Speaker 1: job back on all the back pace she's been out
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  Speaker 1: for that long. But is there any opportunity like so
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  Speaker 1: many others, for example, the fired police chief Washington or
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  Speaker 1: the fire chief Washington's gonna end up getting a big
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  Speaker 1: fat settlement checked because they wrongfully terminated him. It's been determined.
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  Speaker 1: Is she because she's now still an employee or reemployed
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  Speaker 1: by the sin Sty Police department. Can she pursue like
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  Speaker 1: civil actions for this damage to a reputation and that
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  Speaker 1: kind of thing, or is that is that covered by
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  Speaker 1: the arbitration.
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  Speaker 3: I don't know's that's something I know she has private counsel.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, I don't know if that's.
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  Speaker 3: Something they're exploiting or not. But I could tell you
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  Speaker 3: from the labor perspective. You know, we filed for arbitration.
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  Speaker 3: We filed aggrievance based off of just cause, which means
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  Speaker 3: there was no just cause to fire her, which this
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  Speaker 3: arbitration panel said absolutely, there was no just cause. But
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  Speaker 3: there's another interesting part of this, and we have child
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  Speaker 3: that her right to do process was violated, and part
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  Speaker 3: of that was, you know, in our collective bargaining agreement,
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  Speaker 3: it says that everyone that is uh, you know, subject
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  Speaker 3: to any kind of disciplinary action will be treated fairly
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  Speaker 3: and I'm trying to remember exact words, but you'll be
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  Speaker 3: treated all with dignity and respect.
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  Speaker 2: And based off of.
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  Speaker 3: Their findings, the arbitrator panel said she was not treated
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  Speaker 3: with dignity in respect. Hmmm, So they sustained that charge
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  Speaker 3: as well. So we had two charges they sustained both
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  Speaker 3: of them, which is what led to ultimately for reinstatement.
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  Speaker 1: Well, I can only rely on Jennifer Edwards Baker from
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  Speaker 1: Fox nineteen to reporting on this. But apparently her termination,
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  Speaker 1: least according to her lawyer, was a retaliation because she
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  Speaker 1: had filed a complaint with the Ohio Civil Rights Commission
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  Speaker 1: alleging unlawful discrimination retaliation against her by the city. So
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  Speaker 1: she does that before she gets fired. That that sounds
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  Speaker 1: like at least a logical predicate for them wanting to
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  Speaker 1: fire her. Do you know what she said to the
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  Speaker 1: House Civil Rights Commission Ken Cover?
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  Speaker 3: I don't because those are all things. When we look
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  Speaker 3: at what the FFP does is we don't get involved
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  Speaker 3: in cops filing complaints against other cops because ultimately we
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  Speaker 3: may end up defending them. Good point, So our responsibility
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  Speaker 3: is what happened here. She was terminated, She came to
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  Speaker 3: the FFP said I don't think this is right. She
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  Speaker 3: laid out why. Our grievance committee said, yeah, we should
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  Speaker 3: fight this. So we filed for arbitration and this is
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  Speaker 3: where ultimately we landed. But as far as the cops
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  Speaker 3: file complaints against each other mid administration, we don't get.
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  Speaker 1: Involved with that, Okay, I can understand your need to
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  Speaker 1: remain neutral on matters involving police against police because you
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  Speaker 1: do represent all of the police, and of course you know,
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  Speaker 1: this case is a great illustration of the benefits of
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  Speaker 1: membership in the Fraternal Order of Police. I mean, you're
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  Speaker 1: providing all this valuable service when when the police officers
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  Speaker 1: I will say loosely rights have been violated.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, without a doubt.
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  Speaker 3: I mean Kim Ratowski, who you know is a partner
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  Speaker 3: with Lazarus's law firm that we have. I mean, she
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  Speaker 3: spent hundreds of hours preparing for this, you know, going
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  Speaker 3: to this arbitration, writing briefs. I mean, it just does.
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  Speaker 3: She does a phenomenal job. She really needs to be recognized,
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  Speaker 3: you know, for the work that she did to defend
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  Speaker 3: these cops. And she's done it, you know, with this
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  Speaker 3: law firm for over twenty years, and she's certainly an
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  Speaker 3: invaluable piece to the FOP.
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  Speaker 1: That's wonderful, And you just gave a shout out to her.
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  Speaker 1: Now double down on that for her great work on this. Now,
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  Speaker 1: I guess I'm kind of curious since Police Chief Fiji
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  Speaker 1: determined that Denita Pettis should be fired rather than put
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  Speaker 1: on at min Lee for eighty eight hours or whatever
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  Speaker 1: was recommended initially. Did she testify at the hearing at
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  Speaker 1: the arbitration, Yeah, she did. Did she I mean shed
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  Speaker 1: any light on this specifically? No, No, this is exactly
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  Speaker 1: what happened, why I terminated or rejected this suspension part
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  Speaker 1: of it, I mean, any flesh on the bones of
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  Speaker 1: that boiled down Stavid.
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  Speaker 3: Not really. I mean she testified, she gave what she
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  Speaker 3: believed was her fact matter. I mean there were probably
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  Speaker 3: I don't know twenty people or so that testified. I
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  Speaker 3: mean this was.
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  Speaker 2: Hours upon hours. I mean it was nearly.
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  Speaker 3: Roughly thirty hours of testimony roughly throughout everybody, and it
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  Speaker 3: just came down to the arbitrators didn't believe that any
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  Speaker 3: of this warranted discipline. Not only did they not only
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  Speaker 3: did they believe that it didn't warrant it any discipline,
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  Speaker 3: they also obviously didn't believe that it warranted her termination.
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  Speaker 1: Right, Well, if there's no underlying disciplinary problem, they didn't
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  Speaker 1: believe there were any ethn clearly there was nothing to
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  Speaker 1: justify the termination. That's just crazy. Did okay, Since the
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  Speaker 1: chain of command goes all the way up apparently to
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  Speaker 1: the final decision maker. Cheryl Long, the city manager that
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  Speaker 1: should share a long testify at this hearing.
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  Speaker 3: No, she did not.
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  Speaker 1: Well, she's like three times removed from any of the
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  Speaker 1: information relating to Danita Pettis on the job work anyway.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, she doesn't know what's going on with this
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  Speaker 1: woman on a day to day basis.
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  Speaker 2: No.
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  Speaker 3: And that's the thing is you're the city manager said,
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  Speaker 3: they're ultimately responsible for for who's fired in this city.
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  Speaker 3: But certainly it calls into question and I get it way,
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  Speaker 3: we have six thousand employees. I don't know whether or
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  Speaker 3: not how well this is reviewed. I mean, that would
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  Speaker 3: be certainly questions for her. But it certainly is very
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  Speaker 3: concerning when you have a fire chief that's been fired,
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  Speaker 3: you know, to have you know, Captain Pettis fired, we
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  Speaker 3: have an assistant fire chief fire we have a situation
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  Speaker 3: that Chief Fiji's in right now. That is certainly concerning
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  Speaker 3: that there's a pattern being created that certainly questions as
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  Speaker 3: to whether or not any of these people should be
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  Speaker 3: in the predicament that they're in.
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  Speaker 1: Well that and then you add on a sort of side,
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  Speaker 1: is you all the checks that the city's writing for
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  Speaker 1: to various employees. We know about Chief Washington, we anticipate
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  Speaker 1: Chief THEG getting one, but we also have you know,
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  Speaker 1: the money paid to the protesters, and we've got money
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  Speaker 1: being paid to well, perhaps being paid for wrongful death
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  Speaker 1: actions involving justified police shootings. I mean, this is this
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  Speaker 1: is just I want to say a Charlie Fox trot,
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  Speaker 1: if I can be so bold, I just I can't
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  Speaker 1: see anything good going on with this administration relative to
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  Speaker 1: police operations and how they handle matters involving litigation.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, this is something that this is snowballing out of
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  Speaker 3: control quickly, as we've seen over here just in the
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  Speaker 3: first couple of weeks of the year. The problems that
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  Speaker 3: we were were seeing.
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  Speaker 1: All right, Well, one of the other ongoing problems moving
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  Speaker 1: away from Police Chief DJs involvement in this wrongful termination
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  Speaker 1: to her also being subject to that kind of approach.
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  Speaker 1: She was let go and fired without any burden in
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  Speaker 1: place on administer to leave without any articulated reason. We
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  Speaker 1: still don't to this day, and they've extended the investigation
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  Speaker 1: to Police CHIEFDG. The investigation can and confirm for me
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  Speaker 1: if I'm wrong or right. Investigation is to decide whether
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  Speaker 1: there is any grounds to either place or an administratively
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  Speaker 1: or fire herb because they didn't say there were. This
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  Speaker 1: is like looking backward in an effort to support something
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  Speaker 1: that they've done already.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, this is certainly one of the questions
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  Speaker 3: that comes is, you know, wasn't arrest made and then
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  Speaker 3: the charges have been Are they trying to determine the charges?
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  Speaker 2: Yes, that's exactly what it sounds like.
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  Speaker 3: It's just I mean, the this has been the common
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  Speaker 3: theme is the lack of transparency, not knowing why why
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  Speaker 3: why do we have Chief DG on administrative leaf. No
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  Speaker 3: one seemed to be able to answer that, And I
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  Speaker 3: guess we're gonna have to wait till the end of
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  Speaker 3: February now, Yeah, to see what's going to happen next.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, we're paying a law firm substantial amount of money
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  Speaker 1: to look into what police Chief three FIGI either did
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  Speaker 1: or didn't do. We'll get a report on that and
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  Speaker 1: then they'll be able to retroactively whether they were appropriate
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  Speaker 1: in letting her go.
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  Speaker 2: This is crazy. That's where we have you FLP President
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  Speaker 2: ken Kober.
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  Speaker 1: Keep issuing the announcements, keep making public statements. You know,
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  Speaker 1: I just learned this morning that the fire department actually
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  Speaker 1: has someone in your capacity. There is a union fire representative,
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: you know, president, and just Riker said, just missing an action.
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  Speaker 1: I didn't even mean we had one. Apparently, anybody who
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  Speaker 1: reaches out to that guy asked for a comment or
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  Speaker 1: anything that's like got crickets in response. So we're lucky
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  Speaker 1: to have you, Ken, Kobe are actually speaking out loud
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  Speaker 1: on behalf of the folks. You represent the Cincinnati Police Department.
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  Speaker 3: You know, it's it's a job that I certainly take seriously.
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  Speaker 3: I think it's a very very important one of these
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  Speaker 3: men and women that call out every day to protect
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  Speaker 3: the citizens of the city deserve to have somebody that's
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  Speaker 3: going to be vocal, that's going to fight from And
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  Speaker 3: it's something like I said, that I certainly take seriously,
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  Speaker 3: and I certainly enjoy being in this role.
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  Speaker 1: I know you do, and I'm certain that the police
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  Speaker 1: department and the members of the Sinsint Police Department appreciate
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  Speaker 1: what you're doing and your activism on their behalf. And
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  Speaker 1: you're always welcome here in the morning. Ken, I don't
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  Speaker 1: know if you're a regular feature. Part of me wants
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  Speaker 1: to say no, because things will settle down and things
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  Speaker 1: will approve and you'll have nothing to report to the
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  Speaker 1: public about. But until that time, Ken, thanks again, have
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  Speaker 1: a fantastic weekend and go on behalf of all of
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  Speaker 1: my listeners and me and my family. God bless the
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  Speaker 1: men and women in law enforcement.
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  Speaker 3: Thanks Brian, I appreciate it. Take care of a good weekend,
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  Speaker 3: and I'm sure I'll talk to you soon.
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  Speaker 2: Yes, you probably will. Take care of man