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From Buckeyes To Bengals To Browns: A Season Of Frustration, Fixes, And What Comes Next · SCARLET ORANGE BROWN

• 1:01
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to the Scarlet, Orange, and Brown Podcast, the show that brings you the best of Ohio football every single week.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_02: From the Ohio State Buckeye to the Cincinnati Bengals to the Cleveland Browns, we've got every inch of the Buckeye State covered.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_02: Insight, passion, and plenty of bold opinion.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_02: Because here it's all football, all Ohio, all the time.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_02: Here's your host coming to you live from the Dublin bubble, Chris Husman and Ken Carpenter.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: Hello and welcome to the final installment of the SOB podcast, Scarlet, Orange, and Brown.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Ken Carpenter.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Chris Husman.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the show.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: And uh just uh start off with a quick review of what happened uh for the Buckeyes, Bengals, and the Browns.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: The Buckeyes suffer an upset loss to the Miami Hurricanes 24-14 in the Cotton Bowl.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_00: Cincinnati and Cleveland met in the final game of the season.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: Cleveland comes out on top 2018.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: Cincinnati finishes the season 6-11, third place finish in the division.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: And in the cellar, the Cleveland Browns had a 5-12 record.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know, Huey.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: You were at the you were at the Cincinnati Cleveland game, so let's start us off here.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I can just rest assure you that Ohio football is alive and well.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I'm saying that uh with uh with trying to keep a straight face.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um it was uh it was a battle of the uglies.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you know, our field goal their uh McPherson misses two extra points, and um, you know, it's just it was one of those games, Kenny.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_01: I like I looked up in the at the halftime stats, and it was like we had 250 uh yards in offense, and the Browns had 33, and we were getting beat by like 14 points.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_01: So I, you know, it was one of those ugly games, and um again, just typical for the Bengals, had the lead late and uh you know lost it in the last you know minute 10.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: So that it was just typical and it kind of summed up you know our whole entire season.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, definitely.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_00: I uh you know, going back, we we w I wanted to wait to get all uh both of these games in between Cincinnati and Cleveland and both Ohio State.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: But uh let's start off with the Buckeyes.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: Uh very disappointing uh game.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: They five sacks didn't correct anything from the game before with Indiana, so I believe a total of ten sacks given up in two games.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: We of course had the Brian Hartline distraction going to USF and split in time.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: Uh the field goal kicker Fielding, he was uh I guess uh a lot of Buckeye fans are gonna be happy that he's no longer on the team.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: And um the thing that kind of stands out to me was Carnell Tate was not an option, it seemed like.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: And will the Buckeyes look back on this five, ten years from now and say, how many of these guys went on to the NFL and how did they not win a national title?
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I totally agree, Kenny.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, um, you know, as a Buckeye fan, you're seeing uh back-to-back losses.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_01: I can't remember, to be honest with you, when that happened before.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um really have to go back and and and look through the history books to find that.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_01: But you're right.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, the uh O-line allowed five sacks in the past two games for a total of ten.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um the thing that I found interesting was that um they had blitzed Saiyan, and I say they, and I'm talking about Miami and Indiana, um half of the offensive possessions.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so you know, I mean, uh it was it was a blitz.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, they're bringing pressure, and I think they they found out that you know that pressure against Saiyan really reduces his efficiency.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: And um you saw it in the red zone.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's almost like we were just like, uh, what play do we run here?
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's like we'd never been there before.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, it was just it was um it was tough to watch, you know, knowing that um I in my mind I think we could have ran the ball right down the middle the whole entire game and scored at least 28 points.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um but you know, I who knows, you know, what the coaching staff was feeling.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, I have some other thoughts on it, but what'd you take away from that?
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: I just you know, I I saw a stat that that uh just you know with uh Carson Beck, where if he just gets to sit back here and throw the ball, he's really efficient.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: Which he should be with the number of years he's played in college.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_00: But when he was pressured with blitzes, I think he had a nineteen percent efficiency rating throwing the ball.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I just don't think we put any pressure on him, and I don't know why you know, me as just a fan of the game couldn't, you know, was able to figure that out.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: Why wouldn't you do that every time it was a passing situation?
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I we uh you know, we we mentioned this last week, Kenny, and um you know he was the 118th uh best quarterback in the nation when he's pressured.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_01: He was the thirteenth best quarterback in the nation when he was allowed just to sit back in the pocket and make throws.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what he did.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: We had no pressure, um, you know, we didn't dial up anything.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, Saiyan's pick uh really, really, really put us behind the eight ball um on that.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, uh there was just it it all snowballed, it seemed like to me.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_01: And um it was just tough to overcome, you know, especially with your knowing that uh okay, we have a chance to get on the board right before half.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: And you're and you look down and fieldings down there again, you're like, uh nobody in the stadium thought he would make that kick, and he didn't.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and it was just sad that you have uh perennial power like Ohio State, and we we haven't had a kicker like that and since um you know it's been a long time, Kenny.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's been a long time since we had a kicker that was just you know we could just count on.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I saw that where they went in the portal and went after the Illinois kicker, so yeah, I guess that'll change some things for them.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: But uh you know, I overall it was a it was a great season.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you finally got the Michigan off your back and still did not win a Big Ten title.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um as much as it was a a great season and a lot of fun to watch as a Buckeye fan, and just like every Buckeye fan, very disappointed.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, I I wonder about the people say I'd rather beat Michigan than win a night national title.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I totally agree with you.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I think um there's some validity in that.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um and and then I then I remember, hey, these are these are high these are kids just recently out of high school, you know, and um I I'm still not sold on this whole NIL thing, and um, you know, you're throwing all this money in their faces and they're not prepared for it.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, but that's the nature of the game today.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, that that's what mean led me to start, you know, looking at next year's, you know, way too early roster spots.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I think we're gonna add people like I think we just recently added today John Walker, who's a defensive lineman from University of Central Florida, supposed to be legit real deal.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we did add that another tight end from Ohio University, the Mason Williams kid.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um he kind of joins that casmeric, you know, that line of tight ends coming from OU.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um we picked up Cortez Hankton, um, which is the wide receiver coach from LSU to replace Hardline, which I think is a plus.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, we lost some of the biggest losses we had in the Portal Shibola offensive lineman.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um there's two schools of camp on him.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_01: You know, some were saying good, some are saying, yeah, we really need him.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um Milan Graham, the wide receiver, five-star, um, you know, took off as well.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_01: I think he saw the writing on the wall.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um when um you know he didn't play uh in that third game uh right before the uh um um in the inner game.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, it's one of those things where hey, you you know, as soon as you get here and you're a five-star, you have to really prove the ball is in your hands.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: You have to really prove uh, you know, what you want to make out of this.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_01: Just because you're a five-star um means totally nothing when it comes to the season.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you've got to prepare yourself and you've got to get yourself ready to play just like a three-star or a two-star.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_01: And um, some of these kids just don't get it, Kenny.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_01: All they're looking for is a paycheck.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_01: You know, they think that their work is done, and you know, that's not what happens here.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_01: You know, some of those people that we want, yeah, we want that Chas Coleman kid from Penn State, uh, the five-star.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, he's originally from Ohio.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we'd like to get him back.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_01: We there's a safety from Minnesota that we'd like to take, the Koy uh parish uh kid from Minnesota, and like you said, Kenny, the kicker from Illinois, uh David Alano, he was all Big Ten.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_01: So that'd be nice to have.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, without a doubt.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, I I think the secret to all of it is is what Kirk Signetti's doing at Indiana.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: The I the average age of their starting lineup is they're they're grown men.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's very few freshmen that are playing, and and you're 23, 24 years old playing college football.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: You got you got a chance to be pretty good, and I think he figured that out.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: He got guys in there and got them to stick around.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: And uh that kind of leads us into the the uh the playoff here with four teams left.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_00: Who do you have?
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: Miami or Ole Miss in the first game and then Oregon versus Indiana in the second game?
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I I like uh an athletic quarterback in Ole Miss.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, this kid's good.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_01: Uh he won a national championship at Ferris State uh last year.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_01: He's a winner.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: He knows what it takes to get it done.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um you put a chip on Miami or Ole Miss's uh shoulder with Wayne Kiffin leaving.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um and now you look about all the uh portal kids that had an opportunity to go, they're staying.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I think there's a um I think there's a little bit of uh something special brewing down at Ole Miss right now.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_01: And it's kind of like Ohio State last year where everything was just working out right.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_01: And man, I would really, really hate to be Miami right now.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um I think one of their best players, uh one of those guys on the defensive um side of the ball got hurt in the Ohio State game.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: Don't know if he's gonna be able to play.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so uh, you know, I I like old miss in this game, Kenny.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I'm I'm kind of leaning.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: I picked him last uh the last week, and I'm gonna I think I'm gonna stay with him again.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I just uh one, I'd like to see somebody brand new in the championship.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: And and two, I just can't stand ESPN constantly showing Michael Irvin on the sideline, so I'm gonna go all miss.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, 100%.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_00: And Oregon, Indiana, who you got there?
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_00: I think this is gonna be the the really good game between the two of them.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, you know, uh again, for all intent and purposes, there should have been three Big Ten teams in there and then, you know, one SEC.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, but it didn't work out that way for us.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, we we we saw it last week.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it was you know, Georgia's supposed to win the they've already beaten Omez, they're supposed to win this game by, you know, 50 points, and you know, look what happened.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_01: I and I I think this game here, Oregon, Indiana is gonna be, you know, a lot of the same.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_01: I I I just I see Oregon, and we mentioned it last week.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: Oregon's being very, very uh experienced with their players, haven't been there.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um Indiana, you know, um they keep playing, you know, they keep putting their best foot forward every week, except for the Penn State week where they should have got beat, um, but they didn't.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_01: They found a way to get it done.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I think to me this is gonna be the best game.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um and um, you know, I still I I like Oregon in this one.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I I'm kind of I'm gonna just I'm gonna continue with uh Indiana.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they just they got Alabama to quit, so um, which I was not expecting, and I I just think that uh Signeti, whatever he he's doing, he's doing it right.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: And uh but it's gonna be a good game and it it's a toss-up, but I'm gonna I'm gonna lean toward Indiana.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_00: So you got Ole Miss and Oregon in the championship.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: Who you got winning at all?
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: Oregon.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, have Oregon doing that.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, I just think they're experienced, Kenny.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_01: I you know, it's one of those teams where you know I think Daniel Andon's a good coach, and uh those guys do, you know, they did it, they do they have a great uh great uh set of seniors and leadership and so on and so forth, just like Indiana.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_01: But you know, it's it's gonna be one of those two or three point games.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um you know, on both of them.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_01: Somebody's gotta come out on top.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_01: And um yeah, I hope it's uh I hope it's Oregon.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I've got uh I think Indiana would uh since I have old miss, I'm gonna go with Indiana to win it all.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: And uh just unbelievable turnaround by the by that program and that coach is uh it's amazing how one guy could just change a whole program and way of thinking in a state like that.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I I I'll go with Indiana to win it all.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: I wanted to mention something too, Kenny, about um the 2026 schedule for the Buckeyes.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's out.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you've seen that or not, but let me I let me just run down through this real quick.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and just get your take on it.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: All right, we're a home game against Ball State.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_01: We're at Texas.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: Home game against Kent State.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_01: Game four, we're at Indiana.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: Game five, we're at Iowa.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_01: Game six, we're at Nebraska.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_01: Now that's four of the six games away.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: Then we have Illinois at home, Maryland at home, Michigan at home, excuse me, Northwestern at home, Oregon at home, and then our last games at USC.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: Lots of that's gotta be the toughest schedule in the country.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you would think, I mean, you know, Florida always plays a tough schedule year in, year out.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I mean you're looking at Indiana, Oregon.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: Uh two two of the four final four teams in there.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_00: Texas bringing back Arch Manning.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_01: Texas bringing back Manning.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_01: Uh playing at Iowa's not a fun thing to do.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um Michigan, you know, your rival's in there.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um you got Northwestern who is not afraid of anybody.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um and then you're you know, you get rewarded last game of the year going out to USC.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_00: So the last game of the year is at USC.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_01: Uh-huh.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: Not Michigan.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_01: No, Michigan is the ninth game this year.
• 18:19
  unknown: Wow.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: I you know, I I I happened to see, I believe it was Penn State schedule.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I you you couldn't find an easier schedule in college football.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: They don't have to play Oregon, Ohio State, Michigan, or Indiana, I believe.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean they're just gifting them, you know, a chance to be in the Big Ten championship game, I think.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_01: But uh Well that's what happened with Indiana this year.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, they didn't have to play Ohio State or Michigan.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: So I mean that that scheduling's definitely gonna be a factor next year in the Big Ten.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, it's uh you know, Indiana's gonna look a little different.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and I think that uh they made the right higher up at Michigan in Whittingham, so it's not gonna be an easy, easy way to go next year, that's for sure.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: No, and the offense, you know, for for you know, just looking at the weight too early part of it.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_01: I mean I think the offense will be a little bit better.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I'm saying that just because Tate really didn't play the last four weeks.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um but yeah, you're bringing you're adding Chris Henry Jr.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: to that mix.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, pretty much everybody else is back.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, they're making a few changes on the offensive line, which is good.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: Defensively, that's where you're really gonna have to, you know, that's where Matt Patrici is really gonna have to step in because there's a lot of different uh pieces there that they're gonna have to go out and fill.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, without a doubt.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_00: Well, let's move on to the uh the Cincinnati Bengals.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: They uh you know they had they had the tough loss there with Cleveland, a game that probably on paper and statistically and having Joe Burrow as your quarterback should have won easily.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um they end up losing, finishing one game ahead of the Browns.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: But uh Zach Taylor, he gets to keep his job.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, uh not only that, uh Duke Tobin, um, who is you know the uh draft guru, so to spot, for the Cincinnati Bengals.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I mean, Duke Tobin's somewhat rel I think he's related to the Brown family somehow.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, Katie Blackburn is related somehow.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, all these people, and it's like um, you know, at some point somebody's gotta do their job.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's um we have$77 million in cap space coming up.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um we really need to concentrate on four positions linebacker, safety, uh, defensive line, cornerback, debatably offensive line.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: We can add one there.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um but Kenny, I mean, it's it's just you can't let Joe Burroughs, you know, best days be wasted, you know, uh on these on these mediocre seasons that you know just can't get it done.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, I think the people in Cincinnati have had enough, at least what I heard this weekend down at the game.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, they've had enough.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_01: And it's time for change.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_01: And um, so I think this is gonna be uh, you know, uh get it done or get out type situation coming up.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, same thing with the defensive, I'm you know, Al Golden.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I get it your first year, but my God, you know, it's gotta be better.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_01: They did play better towards the end defensively, but you know, I mean, hey, we gave up two touchdowns on uh interception and a fumble return.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, Brown scored six points.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_01: You know, one on within, you know, under a minute to play.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, it's one of those things where um, you know, defensively we're getting a lot better and we're starting to find our identity, but you know, now you get all these guys being free agents and whatnot.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, we're drafting 10th this year.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so you know, we'll see.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I I got uh schedule too.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: I want to run by you here in a second after I get your thoughts.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I I think he's at a point in his career that Joe Burrow he needs to go in and put his foot down.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_00: And if that means taking the two receivers in there with him and say, look, we want to win.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, you guys need to you guys need to do something, change something.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_00: Or if not, you know, I'm I want out because he, like you said, he's too good to not be playing in the playoffs and even in a Super Bowl right now.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: So I I think it's gonna be up to him to go ahead and step in there and uh talk to talk to ownership and say, look, I this ain't working.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and you talk about the 10th pick in the draft.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if Arvell Reese is gonna be around.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: I think he's probably a top five pick.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, but there's a good chance that Caleb Downs from the Buckeyes, which would be a phenomenal pick for any team, I think.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that would that would satisfy our safety situation right there.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: The thing I like about Caleb Downs is Kenny, he's smart.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like he can look at it, he can look at a situation and just be like, you know, hey, we got a bracket over here, or hey, you know, you got the back coming out of the backfield.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, he's just he's the quarterback of the defensive backfield.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, the kid's not even in the NFL yet.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I think he's only gonna get better.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think he could be a potential Hall of Fame type player.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, and if we can grab him, I'd like you know, I'd love a Sonny Styles.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_01: 6'5, 240.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I'd love that.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_01: I'd love an Arvell.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: Rvell's not gonna be there, but you know, um, hey, if we if we can see a Sonny Styles drop down, you know, that'll side that'll take one of our linebacker situations that we need away.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_00: So and those two guys never miss tackles.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_01: Never.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_00: They never miss tackles, and that's so huge when it comes to playing a game of football.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know who Caleb uh Downs reminds me of?
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, it it's evident by that hit he put on that co on that uh Miami player, and the ball went, you know, 20 miles in the air.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_01: We couldn't come up with it, but um, he reminds me a lot of Ronnie Lott and Troy Palomalu, um, you know, that played for Pittsburgh.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_01: Ronnie Plott, Ronnie Lott played for uh the 49ers and just big hitters, quick, very heady, you know, that's what he kind of reminds me of.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I I think if we take care of those things and get better, like we said, we've said it on here all the time, Kenny.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_01: If you know we could have the um uh Bengals offense and the Browns defense on the same team, I mean we'd win the Super Bowl every year, you know.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_01: So it's just a matter of getting serious about this, and I think you're right about Burrow.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_01: Looking at their schedule, um, you know, and it's similar to the Browns, we have similar opponents except for three.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but we have home games against Tennessee, New Orleans, Tampa Bay, Pittsburgh, Baltimore, Cleveland, Jacksonville, Kansas City.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: Rway games, Pittsburgh, Baltimore, Cleveland, Miami, Washington, Houston, Indy, Atlanta, and Carolina.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: So I think there's anywhere from I think there's 10 wins in there.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_01: If we play, if we play good enough, um, I think and Joe stays healthy.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_01: I think there's 10 wins in there that we could get, Kenny.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I agree with you.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that uh wanted to see what your thoughts were on Zach Taylor.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: Do you are you okay with him coming back for another year?
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_00: Is it just the Brown family just being cheap and not wanting to pay for another coach?
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think you and I being head coaches in the past, I mean, um, we know how uh pigeonholed we get when we have terrible leadership.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I mean, we know if you have terrible administrators, which we've had in the past, and you know how that just kind of hand ties us and handcuffs us and doesn't allow us to do what we want to do.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um I've been there, Kenny.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_01: You've been there, and you know, it's just one of those situations where you know uh maybe he can't do what he wants to do, and he's just trying to get a little bit of a time, and then oh, Joe goes down hurt, you know.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, so T goes down hurt, you know, and then it all you know it all uh amasses in a big pile, you know what?
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: So I I'm torn on that, Kenny.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_01: I really am.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: What's your thoughts on that?
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_01: What's your thought on Stefansky?
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that's that's a complete uh they they did the opposite of what Cincinnati did.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_00: They they got rid of Stefansky, and part of me says, How many times have Cleveland Browns had a two-time coach of the year in six years?
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and with all the injuries they had, an old quarterback, a rookie, two rookie quarterbacks.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_00: I I just think that uh and and the thing that drove me the craziest was the worst receiving core in the NFL.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_05: Oh yeah.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, he he did everything he could with what he had, and he he won't be uh sitting very long.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_00: He's gonna have his pick of where he wants to go coach football, and I would have brought him back.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, I I just think that uh you know, credit the the rookies this year for the Browns because they they probably got the defensive rookie of the year.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um the the running game was good with uh Quinshawn Judkins, the uh the uh defensive line up front there.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_00: They they they did their jobs.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_00: I just think that uh they just uh they were young and you know Stefansky pays, and I don't know who they're gonna bring in, possibly just give the job to the defensive coordinator.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_01: But uh Jim Schwartz, yeah.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: They get the number six pick in a draft, and you know, I as much as I think you need a receiver, I think you also need an offensive line because those guys are getting old and and they're playing uh squad team guys out there, you know, and it's tough.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: So still not sold on Chadur.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_01: They get an additional uh first round pick from Jacksonville, don't they?
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: So so they they got a couple things they can work there.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_00: I I would think that maybe you get a receiver and then you uh go out and pick up an offensive lineman.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: I that would be my way to go.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, speaking of the offensive line for for Cincinnati, I mean, you know, Mims, Mims is, you know, he's solid.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um and um big Georgia boy there coming in, and then you know, Orlando on the other side.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, he only had three or four false starts, Sunday Kenny, so that's good for him.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_01: You know, but you got you got Teddy Karis in there as center.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, he's just Mr.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_01: Personality, Mr.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_01: Sensi.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, with his 614s uh foundation, and um you got Dalton Risner.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, he's just he was to me, he got better and he got solid all year.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then you had the young uh first-year guy Fairchild.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you know, I think there's some promise there.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_01: I really do.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm thinking maybe, you know, one, maybe two, two more guys with 77 million cap space.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_01: Speaking of cap space, Kenny, I looked at this the other day.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_01: I looked at this the other day.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_01: Watson, Deshaun Watson, is gonna cause an$80.7 million cap hit for the Browns.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_01: So we're gonna keep them.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_01: Because if they don't, and they cut them before a certain time, I think it's June 1st, they would face a$131 million dead cap charge.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_01: So they would have to keep them, in other words.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_01: And um, I think this is the last year of it, if I'm not mistaken, but um man, I mean, just$80.7 million just in one player right there.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's just that's a lot of money.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and that that you can credit, I believe it was uh Paul Depot Depotesto who uh went and left for the Colorado Rockies.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: He said he was a they they thought he was some kind of guru, and he admitted as soon as he left for the Rockies, he goes, I didn't know what I was doing.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's like how do you hire a guy to do that?
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: And it's Cleveland, so you know I I could, you know, there's so many shirts that you could make up for the city of Cleveland, you know, and then that you could just say that's that's Cleveland, you know.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_01: 100%.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: I sat there and watched the game, and when Cincinnati scored and took the lead there, I was just like that's that's about what I expected.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_00: Now I didn't expect them to drive down and you know make a 49-yard field goal, but uh you know they got they got well that's what happens, Kidd.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_01: That's what happens when you miss two extra points.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_01: You can't you can't miss an extra point.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_01: Let alone two.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and um it was just what I was saying, you know, forced us to go for two.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and you know, we didn't get it, and Joe threw behind the receiver again.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_01: And um, I mean, it was just sloppy football.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it got to the point where the only thing I was doing was rooting for Miles Garrett to get the sack, believe it or not, you know, which was a whole nother situation.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, Zach got all bent out of shape about Miles Garrett getting the sack, and you know, he's like, hey, in our pre-meetings, we didn't say anything about we're gonna stop the game and hand him the key to the city.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm like, you know what, it is a pretty big deal.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_01: And um, yeah, but you know, he got all bent out of shape about that.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: But to me, you know, six seasons of Kevin Stefansky, and you know, uh, hey, you had you had uh Mike Vrabel in house to listen to an offer.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um you got two uh first round drafts coming up, you've got um you know the Watson cap.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know uh yeah, you have offensive line issues, uh definitely wide receiver issues, maybe a safety, but to me it all centers around the quarterback.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and the thing you you just mentioned that there.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_00: If you know, obviously you can't foresee what's gonna happen in the future, but going into the season, you know, I'm sure the Hasm had to say, if we don't have a good season, you know, we're gonna move on from the coach.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_00: You got a guy in the house in-house in Vrabel, who is coach of the year probably this year.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, why not just, if that's what you're gonna do, make the move and get the guy that's right there in the building who's an Ohio guy, and and it just it just blows my mind that some of the decisions that I just I I look back at past drafts and the guys that we could have drafted and should have drafted and didn't take, and now their Hall of Famer careers going on, and it just I don't know, it's just so frustrating to be a Cleveland fan.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and you know, I mean uh Njoku walked past us, you know, we're sitting on the third row down the end zone, and uh Najoku walked past us, and I tell you what, what a big man.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, it's huge.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, he's not he's not signed.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, he's a free agent.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um the Bengals have a ton of free agents uh that they have to make their mind up on.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, the here let me throw the schedule out for um uh um for the Browns here, real quick.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_01: You know, Baltimore, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh at home, Houston at home, Indy at home, Atlanta, Carolina at home, and Las Vegas at home.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_01: The away games, Baltimore, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Jacksonville away, New Orleans, Tampa Bay away, Tennessee away, and New York Giants and New York Jets away.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, uh the Bengals got Jacksonville, Kansas City, and Washington.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_01: You guys got Las Vegas, New York Giants, and New York Jets.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, that's three wins, Kenny.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that's gotta be and um yeah, anyway, I you know, uh it's with that defense, if it stays intact, I mean, you never know what could happen.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's uh a promising schedule.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, and the thing I think about is you look at Carolina, you look at Jacksonville, I mean they they turn things around in one season, you know.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_00: So I mean, anything's possible for Cleveland and Cincinnati, and it's it's year-to-year, you know.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_01: So well, and and you look at the quarterback play.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I was dead wrong, I'll admit it.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_01: I was dead wrong on Aaron Rodgers.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I mean, I'm like, how can a 40-something-year-old man, A, survive the AFC North in the cold, you know?
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_01: And how is he gonna stay healthy all year?
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_01: And how what's he gonna do?
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_01: What's he just gonna, you know, throw his way down the field?
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_01: You know, no, uh he did it, Kenny.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, he, you know, for all intent and purposes, he did it.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_01: As much as I hate to admit it, because I can't stand Pittsburgh, but you know, he did it.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, I I just think one of the worst, uh, one of the worst jobs wasn't Stefansky and it wasn't Zach Taylor.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_01: I think one of the worst jobs was Harbaugh.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_01: How can you have those guys that he has and not make the playoffs?
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, it it it helped.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_00: I for you know Pittsburgh's purposes, they three of the four teams in the division had losing records.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, 500 gets you in the in the playoffs.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_00: And think about all the games you look back at, you know, with Cincinnati, where you know, if Borough was healthy, they they would have been 500.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_01: Well, we um you know, if we would have beat Cleveland uh the other day, we would have been four and two in a division.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so it's crazy to think about.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_00: But talking about the NFL playoffs, I want to get your thoughts, and and since this is our our last show in the AFC, Houston plays at Pittsburgh.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_00: Who are you taking in that one?
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_01: I'm taking Houston.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_00: And they had the winner of that goes on to play the at the Broncos, the number one seed.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_00: Buffalo travels down to Jacksonville, so they don't have to deal with weather.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_01: I got I got Jacksonville.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_01: They're on a heater, they're on a heater, Kenny.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_00: And the Chargers got to go up and play the New England Patriots.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, I got the Patriots in that one.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm gonna go.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna go Pittsburgh, Buffalo, Patriots on that one.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_00: And the NFC, you got the Rams going to Carolina, and the winner of that go has to go play the number one seed, Seattle.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I got the Rams in that just because of experience.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_00: San Fran versus Philadelphia, which I think is probably gonna be the best game.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_01: Where's that game at, Kenny?
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_00: At Philly.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_01: That's a toss up for me.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um I like uh I probably like Philadelphia in that game.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, and the uh the Green Bay Packers, they get to go to Chicago and play the Bears.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_01: I I I don't care if you said they would have played the Bengals.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_01: The Bengals would have beat beat the Packers because the Packers are playing terrible right now.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, and um, so yeah, I'm taking Chicago all day on that.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I will I'll go uh Rams, Philadelphia, and the Bears on that one.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_00: So who do you have advancing out of the AFC to make it to the Super Bowl?
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_01: Denver.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_00: Denver and out of the NFC.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_00: Seattle.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I I picked Buffalo at the beginning of the season.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_00: And I picked Philadelphia to make it back to the Super Bowl.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_00: So who do you got winning it all?
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, I like Seattle.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, uh they're just wow.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_01: Anybody can go down to San Francisco and just handle San Francisco like they did.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_01: They're just playing well.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, Sam Darnold.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: What by the way, what was Minnesota thinking?
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_01: Sweet Lord, you had the number one wide receiver in the NFL and you get rid of them and put you know McCarthy back there, and you get rid of Darnold?
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there there's some serious psychosis going on there, you know.
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but Darnold, I mean, that kid's he's just solid, Kenny.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_01: He's solid.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's you know, he his career at the beginning wasn't great, and everybody kind of wrote him off, and you know, he just got better and better, and an interesting stat about him that most people don't know is probably ever maybe they do know.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: I sounded like Trump right there for a second.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_00: But uh is that his grandfather was the Marlborough man.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_01: You're kidding me.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, out there in the country with the chaps on, you know, smoking the silhouette.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_01: I wanted to be that guy, Kenny.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there's uh yeah, his his grandfather was a stud.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_00: I think he was a stud at volleyball player or something at at USC also.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_01: Unbelievable.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_00: You know, but made his money made his money dressing up as a cowboy with a cigarette in his mouth.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_00: So might as well.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_00: All right, well, I think we've covered it all.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I I gotta say that uh first time for me doing a uh a football podcast, but I I I had an absolute blast, and I love the I love the stories, and I love doing it week to week and kind of just uh it kind of helped me get the frustration out of my system to talk about it, yeah, being a Cleveland fan.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I agree, Kenny, and uh you know it's you know, trying to do your homework on these guys and keep up with them really made me respect them even more, you know, and just being with you um, you know, over this past year doing that made it even more special.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we uh you know gotta thank the listeners who check us out.
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, Huey, I uh, you know, there I I've had a I told my wife on New Year's Eve, I said, whatever happens in 2026, I don't want it to be 2025 because I was sick the whole entire year, and it it would help a ton to be able to jump on here and and talk football and tell stories, and uh, you know, I I'll be forever grateful for that.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and this is something that um you know I I I make time for, and um, you know, uh my wife's like, well, you you guys, you're not getting paid for this.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, I I don't need paid for this.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_01: You know, my pay is uh hanging out with Kenny for you know uh half hour, 45 minutes every day or every week, and you know, just talking football, and and that's what SOB is all about.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we're just a couple blue-collar coaches, and you know, we've we've had our time in the sun, but at the same time, it's fun to look back and and do something different.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_01: And uh man, I had a blast.
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_00: All right, sounds good.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_00: Well, signing off for the SOB Scarlet, Orange, and Brown Podcast.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Ken Carpenter.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_01: Season one in the books.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Chris Usman.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_01: SOB.