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Normally Podcast: Trump's Tariffs Are Here...Now What?! · Normally

0:03
Speaker 1: Hey back.
0:04
Speaker 2: Normally the show with normal which takes but when the
0:06
Speaker 2: news gets weird.
0:07
Speaker 1: I am Mary Catherine.
0:09
Speaker 3: Ham and I'm Carol Marco. It's him Mary Catherine. I
0:12
Speaker 3: think we both had very exciting.
0:14
Speaker 1: Weekends we did.
0:15
Speaker 2: It was my birthday, so I got I took a
0:18
Speaker 2: little trip birthday, thank you. I took a little trip
0:21
Speaker 2: to New York City and had a sort of a
0:23
Speaker 2: stereotypically a little bit tourist in New York day Central Park,
0:27
Speaker 2: champagne at a steakhouse, got my nails done, went to
0:30
Speaker 2: the comedy cellar.
0:31
Speaker 1: It was a great day.
0:32
Speaker 3: That sounds amazing that any of that.
0:35
Speaker 1: Yeah.
0:36
Speaker 3: I celebrated my husband and I sixteenth anniversary, also in
0:42
Speaker 3: New York. Actually we didn't see each other, was different days.
0:46
Speaker 3: I also saw Sebastian Menescalco and Pete Corielli on Friday
0:50
Speaker 3: night in Florida. Hilarious. I will just say, if they
0:54
Speaker 3: are touring anywhere near you, it's a must see. I
0:58
Speaker 3: cried laughing for the whole time.
1:00
Speaker 1: That's awesome.
1:01
Speaker 2: I think I saw Sebastian one time years ago, but
1:04
Speaker 2: I will look out again.
1:06
Speaker 3: He's also my celebrity. Like one time I asked on Twitter.
1:10
Speaker 3: If you who do you think you'd be friends with?
1:13
Speaker 3: That's a celebrity that you don't know, and him and
1:16
Speaker 3: his wife are like my I feel like if we
1:18
Speaker 3: met each other, we'd have a good time.
1:21
Speaker 1: You guys would be buds.
1:22
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so. Does that sound creepy a little?
1:24
Speaker 4: Right?
1:25
Speaker 1: I'm here for it. It was yours, Come on, No,
1:29
Speaker 1: mine used to be.
1:30
Speaker 2: Actually, I used to think that I would be great
1:33
Speaker 2: friends with Mindy Kaling, But now she's hanging with Megan
1:36
Speaker 2: Markle and I just don't think it's a match anymore. Right, Yeah, talented,
1:41
Speaker 2: but I think she's Yeah, it's just a it's a
1:43
Speaker 2: bridge I can't cross. So if for that chance, I
1:45
Speaker 2: probably wouldn't be at the American Riviera with Mindy.
1:53
Speaker 1: Think of a couple.
1:54
Speaker 2: I have to think of a couple friend so that
1:56
Speaker 2: so that Steve can have a buddy, like maybe maybe
1:59
Speaker 2: whenever and Powell gets married, we'll see who he pairs
2:01
Speaker 2: up with.
2:04
Speaker 3: Well, it's also exciting weekend for America. My goodness, America
2:08
Speaker 3: had an exciting weekend. The Terriff thing really came to
2:12
Speaker 3: a head after we recorded our last episode, and of
2:15
Speaker 3: course we record this twice a week, and we get
2:18
Speaker 3: a lot of like, why didn't you cover this, and
2:19
Speaker 3: we're like, because it happened after we recorded, and that's
2:23
Speaker 3: how it goes. But the stock market had a real
2:27
Speaker 3: bad day on Friday, and it's not having a great
2:31
Speaker 3: day today Monday.
2:34
Speaker 1: You know.
2:35
Speaker 3: I have said on here that I'm cautiously optimistic. I'm
2:38
Speaker 3: still kind of in the same place on this, But
2:42
Speaker 3: I don't like the people that are similar to me,
2:45
Speaker 3: that are like, let's wait and see what happens. I
2:47
Speaker 3: don't like the dismissiveness, and I don't like the I
2:51
Speaker 3: just think it's it's it's got a very learned to
2:54
Speaker 3: code feel to it, like, oh, who cares about the
2:57
Speaker 3: stock market? Real Americans don't invest in the stock market? Well,
3:01
Speaker 3: I don't know that that's true. A but also be
3:04
Speaker 3: a lot of this does have a lasting effect, and
3:08
Speaker 3: not just for people who invest in the stock market.
3:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with you, there's a there's a lot
3:15
Speaker 2: of the there aren't There's a significant percentage of people
3:18
Speaker 2: who have investments in the stock market, including those who
3:21
Speaker 2: had a working class or a government career and have
3:27
Speaker 2: pensions that are invested in the stock market. So that's
3:31
Speaker 2: a large part of these sort of crossover union voters
3:34
Speaker 2: that those dismissing their concerns would be should be careful
3:38
Speaker 2: about doing that with.
3:40
Speaker 1: You know, I I don't feel great about it.
3:44
Speaker 2: I am always rooting for the policies of the US
3:47
Speaker 2: and the president, no matter the party, to work out
3:50
Speaker 2: for us.
3:51
Speaker 1: And yet I see a.
3:52
Speaker 2: Lot of indications that or a lot of confusion about
3:56
Speaker 2: this one and exactly what we're trying to accomplish.
3:59
Speaker 1: And I know we have some clips about it. By
4:01
Speaker 1: the way, there was a huge.
4:04
Speaker 2: Dip in stocks and then a huge rise in stocks,
4:06
Speaker 2: and then a fall off again because of a very
4:09
Speaker 2: strange thing this morning, which was that someone named Bloomberg
4:14
Speaker 2: on X watched a clip of an economic advisor of
4:20
Speaker 2: Trump's on Fox overinterpreted it hit as him saying Trump
4:26
Speaker 2: was considering a ninety day pause in tariffs, and when
4:29
Speaker 2: he tweeted that, a bunch of people saw it on
4:32
Speaker 2: X and it.
4:34
Speaker 1: Changed the market. The market soared for a few seconds,
4:36
Speaker 1: and then some one.
4:37
Speaker 2: Said no, that was fake news, and then the market
4:40
Speaker 2: sank again.
4:41
Speaker 1: So there. It's an interesting just.
4:44
Speaker 2: A microcosm of how news works these days, and sometimes
4:48
Speaker 2: a random dude named Bloomberg not getting the right thing
4:50
Speaker 2: from an interview on Fox means that the world markets
4:54
Speaker 2: will change, and also maybe a signal to Trump that like, hey,
4:58
Speaker 2: if I paused these series, look what happened to the market.
5:02
Speaker 2: I think my concern is that it looks like he's
5:07
Speaker 2: trying to solve the problem, not so much of tariffs, right, Like,
5:12
Speaker 2: there's been news that fifty countries have come to him
5:15
Speaker 2: and said, hey, we'll do zero tariffs if you guys, like,
5:19
Speaker 2: let's get this figured out. You know, Taiwan is among them,
5:23
Speaker 2: Zimbabwe I think was mentioned. You know, there's everybody's coming
5:26
Speaker 2: to the table. I have no doubt that he wants
5:28
Speaker 2: to do those deals. Right, But if we wanted zero tariffs,
5:34
Speaker 2: how does that get us back to American manufacturing? You know,
5:38
Speaker 2: that's just free trade, which I am in favor of,
5:42
Speaker 2: but maybe not doing in this fashion, which is pretty disruptive.
5:48
Speaker 2: So there's that going on. But then there's also people
5:50
Speaker 2: who are saying, no, we need to fix the trade deficit.
5:54
Speaker 2: And I don't find the trade deficit inherently to be
5:58
Speaker 2: a problem. Sometimes it's a problem, but like I always
6:01
Speaker 2: I've pointed this out since Trump's first term, because he
6:04
Speaker 2: does not like trade deficits. He feels like we're getting
6:06
Speaker 2: ripped off if we have a trade deficit.
6:08
Speaker 1: I have a.
6:09
Speaker 2: Trade deficit with Bojangles because I want to do lots
6:13
Speaker 2: of bits there and it's the best place to buy biscuits.
6:17
Speaker 2: But they don't need my podcasting skills yet. So we're
6:21
Speaker 2: in a trade deficit. But that's not inherently problematic because
6:24
Speaker 2: I can sell my products elsewhere and I'm getting the
6:27
Speaker 2: thing I need efficiently from Bojangles. Right, So if we're
6:31
Speaker 2: trying to solve every trade deficit, we're going to be
6:35
Speaker 2: in trouble. And I don't think that's going to be
6:37
Speaker 2: a free trade scenario like the ones where Vietnam and
6:40
Speaker 2: others are coming to the table and saying zero tariffs.
6:43
Speaker 5: Right.
6:43
Speaker 3: That's the question going forward is who do we want
6:46
Speaker 3: to be? And I don't see why we want to
6:50
Speaker 3: be a manufacturing hub. I think that that is just
6:55
Speaker 3: sort of not necessarily a positive for US. I get
6:59
Speaker 3: the argument of bringing some manufacturing back to the US,
7:03
Speaker 3: but a lot of it it benefits us not being here.
7:07
Speaker 3: And look, you know, I feel like my impulses is
7:12
Speaker 3: to be anti tariff, and that's why I'm being kind
7:15
Speaker 3: of cautious here and kind of listening to what the
7:19
Speaker 3: Trump administration actually wants to do. And I'll say, there
7:23
Speaker 3: are two kinds of intense Trump supporter, right. There's the
7:26
Speaker 3: supporter that just likes the guy, trusts him, maybe loves
7:30
Speaker 3: how crazy he makes. The left is willing to give
7:33
Speaker 3: him leeway on the more far out ideas like tariffing
7:37
Speaker 3: the whole world. And then there's the type that loves
7:40
Speaker 3: Trump because of these kinds of proposals. I think of
7:44
Speaker 3: Badya Unger Sargan as one person. She basically overlooks everything
7:49
Speaker 3: she doesn't like about Donald Trump and you know, his
7:51
Speaker 3: Trump and trump Ism, because he speaks to her values
7:55
Speaker 3: and aligns with her issues. And of course that makes
7:57
Speaker 3: me a little nervous because I love her, but she's
7:59
Speaker 3: pretty far left right exactly, Yeah.
8:02
Speaker 1: Well move been to our original issue with Trump?
8:04
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, exactly.
8:06
Speaker 6: So.
8:06
Speaker 3: My friend John Carney, he's finance and economics editor at Breitbart,
8:10
Speaker 3: He's another person like this. He has been pro tariff
8:13
Speaker 3: before Donald Trump was a thing. He doesn't fall in
8:15
Speaker 3: line with Trump. He supports Trump because Trump believes what
8:19
Speaker 3: he believes. And I have a clip I want to
8:21
Speaker 3: play from John Carney because I think he's saying some
8:25
Speaker 3: things I haven't heard other people say.
8:27
Speaker 7: Trump just didn't want to inflict that much pain, or
8:31
Speaker 7: he didn't think he'd get.
8:32
Speaker 1: Them to come down.
8:34
Speaker 7: I mean, I think that I know this is wonky,
8:37
Speaker 7: but you get this is that, Like it's one thing
8:39
Speaker 7: to say your tariff is ten, you take it, We're
8:41
Speaker 7: going to go to ten, and if you want to
8:42
Speaker 7: come down, we'll both come down. But when they started
8:44
Speaker 7: adding these non tariff.
8:46
Speaker 8: Bearers, like the VAT right, which is what Europe.
8:48
Speaker 7: Uses their tax system, I don't know how you place
8:50
Speaker 7: a number on that, Like, so how does Europe say,
8:53
Speaker 7: how are you valuing our vat? You guys have fifty
8:56
Speaker 7: state taxes and you want us to you know, you
8:59
Speaker 7: subsidize certain and things. You know, so what are we
9:01
Speaker 7: supposed to do? I think that that's that to me
9:05
Speaker 7: is kind of the kicker. Is that, Like, do you
9:10
Speaker 7: think that they have set themselves up for success? I
9:12
Speaker 7: guess is the best way to do this at getting
9:14
Speaker 7: another country to say, fine, we can get that number lower.
9:17
Speaker 8: I do think they have set themselves up for a
9:19
Speaker 8: success in this. I think that just doing it mechanically,
9:23
Speaker 8: I'm like, Okay, here's your tariff, but we're going to
9:26
Speaker 8: ignore the non tariff barriers. Actually wouldn't have been very productive. Remember, ultimately,
9:31
Speaker 8: what the goal here is to achieve a more balanced
9:34
Speaker 8: trade with the rest of the world. We yes, we
9:38
Speaker 8: don't like the particular non tariff barriers, and we don't
9:41
Speaker 8: like the tariffs, but those are really means to an
9:44
Speaker 8: end that countries use to create their giant surpluses that
9:48
Speaker 8: then the US has been forced to absorb. What we're
9:51
Speaker 8: saying is we're not going to absorb these surpluses anymore.
9:54
Speaker 8: We are going to put a terrify on you. If
9:56
Speaker 8: you start to bring down your tariff barriers and non
9:59
Speaker 8: teriffic and those result in our trade deficits and trade
10:04
Speaker 8: surpluses coming closer, then we will lower the reciprocal tariff.
10:09
Speaker 8: So this is a like I said, it's a proxy
10:13
Speaker 8: for tariff levels and trade barriers. And the way they
10:16
Speaker 8: can fix that is by fixing the things that their
10:20
Speaker 8: country does that create this giant trade imbalance.
10:24
Speaker 3: Now, John and I have disagreed plenty on this kind
10:27
Speaker 3: of thing. During the first Trump administration, I was remodeling
10:31
Speaker 3: and the price of bathroom tile spike because of the
10:34
Speaker 3: China tariffs, and Carney got an earfull for me. But
10:37
Speaker 3: I just want to put a voice out there that
10:39
Speaker 3: you may still disagree with. And I definitely listen to
10:43
Speaker 3: him and say, oh, don't I don't agree with this
10:46
Speaker 3: part or other things that he says, but that just
10:48
Speaker 3: isn't just raw raw Trump for the sake of it,
10:51
Speaker 3: and I think that that's important to hear.
10:54
Speaker 1: Yeah.
10:54
Speaker 2: I think my concern about some of that is that
10:56
Speaker 2: some of the surplus we absorb or willingly and.
11:01
Speaker 1: In fact enthusiastically.
11:03
Speaker 2: Right, so the surplus such that it is, and sometimes
11:07
Speaker 2: I agree that they're like ethical and trade practice concerns
11:09
Speaker 2: about like sheen clothes and all the Chinese plastic that
11:14
Speaker 2: my children are given at every birthday party they go to, right, Like,
11:17
Speaker 2: I have some concerns about that. But if you take
11:20
Speaker 2: those cheap goods from people quickly, much like the bathroom tile,
11:26
Speaker 2: and then they're not available to them any longer, they
11:28
Speaker 2: will find that they liked having those things, and then
11:31
Speaker 2: they will be mad at you. I think one of
11:33
Speaker 2: the issues with this move too is that whatever comes
11:35
Speaker 2: of it, I think the uncertainty has already caused some
11:39
Speaker 2: problems and some damage. If you pull your own butt
11:42
Speaker 2: out of the fire at this point, that's I think
11:45
Speaker 2: that's better. And if you get some lower teriff rates, great,
11:48
Speaker 2: maybe that redounds to our benefit. But it's a it's
11:54
Speaker 2: a real tough sell to tell people that they're feeling
11:58
Speaker 2: the short term pain for all long term gain. That Again,
12:02
Speaker 2: I think American workers have are correct in saying, hey,
12:06
Speaker 2: I'm not sure cheap goods were worth the trade, including
12:09
Speaker 2: machine clothing. Yeah, worth the trade for losing all these
12:13
Speaker 2: solid jobs that we had back then. But I think
12:16
Speaker 2: that a new generation of Americans often doesn't really understand
12:19
Speaker 2: what that manufacturing, if it returned, would look like. A
12:22
Speaker 2: lot of it would be automated. Yeah, it's going to
12:25
Speaker 2: be a long time to get there. So I'm not
12:28
Speaker 2: sure we're fixing the problem that we're trying to fix,
12:30
Speaker 2: and I think there's other damages happening along the way.
12:33
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that that's exactly right. Somebody made the
12:36
Speaker 3: comment that the people on the right saying like, oh,
12:39
Speaker 3: we'll just all go back to the factories, like the
12:42
Speaker 3: communists who believes that they'll be the poet in the
12:45
Speaker 3: Marxist collective they don't realize they're going to be like
12:47
Speaker 3: cleaning bathrooms. And the great Thomas Soul had a very
12:54
Speaker 3: rare comment on these tariffs. Let's roll that clip.
12:57
Speaker 4: It's painful to see a ruinous decision being repeated now
13:03
Speaker 4: in so far as he's using these terriffs to get
13:06
Speaker 4: various strategic things settled, and that he's satisfied with that.
13:10
Speaker 4: But if he's got set off a worldwide trade war
13:14
Speaker 4: that has a devastating history, everybody loses because everybody follows suit,
13:20
Speaker 4: and all that happens is that you get great reduction
13:23
Speaker 4: and international trade. But if you are the one who's
13:26
Speaker 4: making the root, then all the other people have no
13:29
Speaker 4: idea what you're going to do next, and that is
13:32
Speaker 4: a formula for having people to hang on to their
13:35
Speaker 4: money until they figure out what you're going to do.
13:39
Speaker 3: Right. So I'm with Seul. I'm hoping he's using these
13:42
Speaker 3: tariffs to get very strategic things settled and that Trump
13:46
Speaker 3: will be satisfied with that. But it is concerning because
13:49
Speaker 3: people are paused right now and they're waiting to see
13:53
Speaker 3: what will happen. You know, they are they building a
13:56
Speaker 3: factory in America? Are they opening factory in Vietnam that
14:01
Speaker 3: they were planning to. It's that kind of thing that
14:05
Speaker 3: really makes the markets worried. And again, even if you
14:09
Speaker 3: don't have money in the markets, it does trickle down
14:12
Speaker 3: to everybody, and.
14:14
Speaker 1: It will affect goods at some point as well.
14:16
Speaker 2: Behind the markets, there is a bill in the Senate
14:20
Speaker 2: sponsored by Grassley and I forget who the Democrat companion
14:23
Speaker 2: is for co sponsoring, that would basically take be Congress
14:26
Speaker 2: taking back.
14:27
Speaker 1: Its power to handle these tariffs. There is a.
14:30
Speaker 3: Companion ridge they used to like make laws and stuff.
14:33
Speaker 2: I know there's a companion bill in the House. Representative
14:37
Speaker 2: Don Bacon introduced that one. I said over the weekend,
14:41
Speaker 2: I was like, if so help me, if this man
14:43
Speaker 2: makes Congress take back its power and do its job,
14:46
Speaker 2: I'll be like, this is what I voted for. But
14:51
Speaker 2: I don't think that's the forty chests at hand. Nonetheless,
14:54
Speaker 2: I like to see a little gumption from the Congress,
14:56
Speaker 2: and who knows what will happen as that goes forward.
15:00
Speaker 1: Because of you, that's anything.
15:01
Speaker 2: I am highly suspicious of y'all's emergency powers post COVID, right, Like,
15:06
Speaker 2: so he's saying this is a trade emergency.
15:09
Speaker 1: I don't believe it's a trade emergency.
15:10
Speaker 2: I think you're using emergency powers for something you wanted
15:13
Speaker 2: to do anyway. And I didn't like it in COVID
15:15
Speaker 2: and I don't like it now. So Congress, you should
15:19
Speaker 2: get in that game.
15:20
Speaker 1: Get the game.
15:21
Speaker 9: Maybe, you know, I don't know, do the jobs you
15:23
Speaker 9: were elected to do.
15:25
Speaker 1: Indeed, we'll be right back on normally. Shall we talk
15:32
Speaker 1: about the big protests, Carol?
15:34
Speaker 9: They were protests. They didn't seem as exciting as the
15:39
Speaker 9: pink hat protests in twenty sixteen. They didn't seem as motivated.
15:43
Speaker 9: They seemed less clear, hands off, hands off, that's what
15:46
Speaker 9: they want.
15:46
Speaker 2: With Yeah, it feels very dated because one of the
15:50
Speaker 2: one of the speeches was like, you know, he thinks
15:54
Speaker 2: he can put his hands on anything, and I was like,
15:56
Speaker 2: are we really doing access Hollywood quotes? Right still on that,
16:01
Speaker 2: it felt dated and it felt sort of tired, perfunctory.
16:07
Speaker 2: Maybe now there were big crowds like I have no
16:09
Speaker 2: doubt that there are impassioned Democrats out there and that
16:13
Speaker 2: the base wants to get out and be mad at
16:15
Speaker 2: Donald Trump.
16:16
Speaker 1: It does feel a little late and a little tired.
16:20
Speaker 1: I think, as you noted on x Carol.
16:22
Speaker 2: The time would have been to get everybody out before
16:24
Speaker 2: the voting and then to the voting booths.
16:27
Speaker 1: That would have been that would have been the way
16:29
Speaker 1: to do the resistance.
16:31
Speaker 9: Yeah, I would just say about that. It's because the
16:33
Speaker 9: media over the weekend was just so excited about these
16:37
Speaker 9: protests and it was so like, these protests are, you know,
16:41
Speaker 9: the most just amazing thing that's ever happened, and they
16:44
Speaker 9: kept referring to them as powerful. And that's why I
16:47
Speaker 9: was like, you know, it's even more powerful the nationwide.
16:49
Speaker 1: Protests the voting, the voting and the voting.
16:54
Speaker 2: I think we have one clip from one of these rallies,
16:57
Speaker 2: and look, I'm just using this as sort of a
16:59
Speaker 2: symbol this this young man. I'm not meaning to single
17:03
Speaker 2: him out, but this is just kind of perfect.
17:05
Speaker 1: Here.
17:05
Speaker 2: He has asked about why he's there. He's got a
17:07
Speaker 2: big sign that says Donald Trump is a fascist?
17:11
Speaker 6: So what what makes Trump a fascist?
17:19
Speaker 7: What makes Trump a fascist?
17:20
Speaker 6: Does does things without? Yeah, talk loud and do all
17:24
Speaker 6: have my mic on I'm not really going into the
17:29
Speaker 6: Tibet Sorry, he just doesn't. He just does everything he
17:33
Speaker 6: wants and you know, not following laws or you know
17:39
Speaker 6: he was a he's a convicted felon.
17:40
Speaker 4: You know.
17:41
Speaker 1: That's all I know.
17:43
Speaker 3: That's all he knows.
17:44
Speaker 1: I there you go.
17:45
Speaker 9: I think a lot of these people have no idea
17:47
Speaker 9: why they're so angry. I get it, I really do
17:51
Speaker 9: get it.
17:51
Speaker 1: I think that they need.
17:53
Speaker 9: Something to change channel their anger into, and that's what
17:56
Speaker 9: these protests are about. I am worried about what I
18:00
Speaker 9: see is really escalating violent rhetoric. And obviously there's actual
18:04
Speaker 9: violence happening as well. A pro life reporter was punched
18:09
Speaker 9: in the face in Harlem on the weekend. There was
18:12
Speaker 9: some other incidents. A lot of these people are having
18:15
Speaker 9: signs at say, eighty six forty seven, eighty six means
18:18
Speaker 9: to end. One of them is standing right alongside Minnesota
18:22
Speaker 9: Attorney General Keith Ellison with this kind of sign. There's
18:25
Speaker 9: a lot of keying and defacing Tesla's. All of this
18:30
Speaker 9: is very worrisome, and I think that I understand that
18:35
Speaker 9: Democrats are trying to get their base back to being
18:38
Speaker 9: excited after Democrats have like a twenty six percent approval rating,
18:43
Speaker 9: and they're trying to get them to focus on how
18:45
Speaker 9: much they hate Donald Trump, to get that that their
18:47
Speaker 9: numbers up, but they need to bring down this temperature.
18:50
Speaker 9: I think things are really heading in a bad direction
18:53
Speaker 9: with this kind of violent talk.
18:55
Speaker 2: Yeah, give me a clueless guy any day over the
18:58
Speaker 2: guy king Tesla's.
19:00
Speaker 1: Yeah.
19:01
Speaker 2: You know, there is a lot of that, and it
19:02
Speaker 2: will be inevitably downplayed by media, even when it results
19:06
Speaker 2: in physical attacks as it did on a California campus
19:09
Speaker 2: against the Turning Point USA gathering and booth and against
19:15
Speaker 2: Savannah Craven, who's the activists you were talking about doing
19:18
Speaker 2: man on the street interviews? Who was hurt and significantly
19:25
Speaker 2: so that will be downplayed as it always is. Speaking
19:27
Speaker 2: which did you hear that the would be assassin of
19:31
Speaker 2: Brett Kavanaugh who did not become a household name because
19:35
Speaker 2: the target was a right leaning conservative jurist instead of
19:40
Speaker 2: a liberal one. He played guilty last week after that attempt,
19:46
Speaker 2: But again, not a huge story, Nor is the fact
19:49
Speaker 2: that people are standing around with eighty six forty seven
19:53
Speaker 2: signs when he's already been attempted, assassinated twice and the
19:58
Speaker 2: state of Iran has verified plans to do the same.
20:02
Speaker 2: That's right, I like real flipping about.
20:04
Speaker 9: It, exactly.
20:06
Speaker 3: I have a column.
20:07
Speaker 9: I think it'll be in This episode comes out Tuesday.
20:09
Speaker 9: I think it'll be in Tuesday's New York Post, not
20:12
Speaker 9: confirmed yet. But also there's a new report by this
20:15
Speaker 9: group called the Network Contagion Research Institute found high numbers
20:19
Speaker 9: of left leaning people find violence to be acceptable. Over
20:23
Speaker 9: fifty five percent of left leaning respondents felt there was
20:26
Speaker 9: some justification for killing President Trump. It's a real powder
20:31
Speaker 9: keg and I think we need to be way more
20:34
Speaker 9: worried about it again, these protests. I get it, and
20:37
Speaker 9: I understand that there's this pent up anger, but we
20:43
Speaker 9: need to bring down the temperature, and democratic politicians need
20:46
Speaker 9: to be at the forefront of that. Saying violent rhetoric
20:49
Speaker 9: is not going to be okay. Yeah, no I'm not either,
20:53
Speaker 9: but it's my hope. I just say what you want.
20:57
Speaker 9: Leave the fisticuffs, heart, you know.
21:00
Speaker 1: Draw the line clearly.
21:02
Speaker 9: We're going to take a short break and come right
21:04
Speaker 9: back with normally. Our last topic is Megan Kelly, who
21:11
Speaker 9: I think you know. We both stand Megan Kelly, we're
21:14
Speaker 9: both big fans over here. Made a comment about women
21:19
Speaker 9: working and how apparently conservative men are not into that idea,
21:24
Speaker 9: which I've heard from lots of women who are like
21:27
Speaker 9: where are these men who don't want me to work?
21:32
Speaker 1: That's great? Where do I get one of these? Where's
21:34
Speaker 1: this pool?
21:36
Speaker 4: Right?
21:37
Speaker 9: But you know, I take everything Megan says pretty seriously.
21:40
Speaker 9: So let's roll that clip and discuss it.
21:42
Speaker 5: Here's what's happening on the right young women. And I
21:45
Speaker 5: talk to young conservative women all the time about their
21:47
Speaker 5: lives and their goals and you know, the things that
21:49
Speaker 5: they want. And what's happening is they can't find men
21:55
Speaker 5: who are maybe more conservative. Usually they're looking for somebody
21:59
Speaker 5: who is religious, you know, like a lot of conservative
22:02
Speaker 5: women tend to be God, God loving conservatives, and they
22:08
Speaker 5: can't find a lot of young men who want to
22:11
Speaker 5: marry a working woman. Now, this is an actual problem
22:14
Speaker 5: that's coming up on the right, and to me, it's
22:16
Speaker 5: so sad because it's like, how did we get to
22:19
Speaker 5: the point where we were now telling young conservative, amazing
22:24
Speaker 5: women that they're not attractive if they also work, if
22:28
Speaker 5: they choose to, let's say, do what I'm doing and
22:31
Speaker 5: what you're doing, and like get their voice out there.
22:33
Speaker 1: But I'll stick with me.
22:34
Speaker 5: Just because I think conservatives listening to this will like
22:37
Speaker 5: the thought of another Megan Kelly voice up and coming. Well,
22:41
Speaker 5: why wouldn't we want that? Why would we take somebody
22:44
Speaker 5: who's talented in this field and really wants to make
22:47
Speaker 5: a difference and have the messaging to her be you're
22:50
Speaker 5: really not that valuable unless you give it up and
22:53
Speaker 5: go into the home and only have a family and
22:56
Speaker 5: only raise a family, and not only resenting her that message,
22:59
Speaker 5: but young men are actually believing that. They're actually believing it,
23:03
Speaker 5: especially on the right because like the trad mom has
23:06
Speaker 5: gotten so popular and it's like, no, if we do that,
23:09
Speaker 5: we're not going to.
23:09
Speaker 1: Have any strong.
23:11
Speaker 5: Conservative or right leaning women to provide a role model
23:15
Speaker 5: for younger conservative women who and there's nothing to apologize
23:21
Speaker 5: for here, don't necessarily want to spend all their twenties
23:25
Speaker 5: in their thirties getting married and having kids or can't.
23:29
Speaker 5: They just weren't able to meet somebody and definitely don't
23:31
Speaker 5: need to be shamed over it.
23:32
Speaker 9: So I agree with her. Obviously we want the next
23:35
Speaker 9: Magan Kelly, and obviously we want conservative women kind of
23:39
Speaker 9: doing their thing. But what I would say is a
23:42
Speaker 9: lot of jobs a are not as flexible as what
23:44
Speaker 9: we do. I am done most days by three pm.
23:48
Speaker 9: It's rare the day that I'm not picking up my
23:50
Speaker 9: kids from school the day, that I'm not there for dinner,
23:53
Speaker 9: all of that. And look, we live very busy lives,
23:56
Speaker 9: you and I. I know that, but I also am
23:59
Speaker 9: able to say my own schedule, as is Making Kelly
24:01
Speaker 9: in a way that a typical working person is not.
24:05
Speaker 9: So I get the argument that men want I guess again,
24:10
Speaker 9: I've shown me this pool because a lot of women
24:13
Speaker 9: are having childle finding men like this. But I get
24:15
Speaker 9: the argument that conservative men want the woman that's home
24:19
Speaker 9: when they get home, that has dinner ready, that is
24:21
Speaker 9: with the kids. All of that has a kind of
24:24
Speaker 9: a more home based life. But you can have that
24:28
Speaker 9: only if you have the Make and Kelly type job.
24:30
Speaker 9: It's much harder to have that. My job before media
24:34
Speaker 9: was I was a paralegal. That's not a job that,
24:37
Speaker 9: first of all, not super fulfilling. Let's start there. I
24:40
Speaker 9: feel a lot more fulfilled now, but also not flexible
24:44
Speaker 9: at all. And I worked insanely long hours and I
24:47
Speaker 9: wouldn't have been able to be there for my kids
24:49
Speaker 9: every day to pick them up. So I get her argument,
24:52
Speaker 9: but not every job is like ours, and it's tough.
24:59
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think this is a pendulum swing problem because
25:02
Speaker 2: all even conservative men of my age, I've never met
25:06
Speaker 2: one who was like, I must have a woman who
25:09
Speaker 2: stays at home. Like that just was not the message
25:12
Speaker 2: in the eighties and nineties, and the message for us
25:15
Speaker 2: was girl power. Everybody goes out and gets their job.
25:19
Speaker 2: I think it leaned too heavily, and this is the
25:21
Speaker 2: part where the pendulum swings. It leaned too heavily on
25:24
Speaker 2: like you gotta go get that sweet sea sweet and
25:26
Speaker 2: do everything that men want, and get everything that men want.
25:29
Speaker 2: And it didn't consider and you see this in polling
25:32
Speaker 2: of women of my generation, that message didn't consider that
25:35
Speaker 2: maybe we don't want the same thing, right, Maybe we
25:38
Speaker 2: want the flexible schedule. Maybe we want to take five
25:41
Speaker 2: to seven years off while our kids are at home
25:43
Speaker 2: before we get them off to school, or even longer,
25:46
Speaker 2: and then re enter the workforce later. Right, those are
25:49
Speaker 2: things that women can want instead of the sea sweet life.
25:53
Speaker 2: Now the pendulum has been swinging back, and I am
25:55
Speaker 2: willing to believe that with that younger cohort of men,
25:58
Speaker 2: that there are some religion or manisphered or whatever the
26:01
Speaker 2: reason is that say, if she wants to work, that
26:04
Speaker 2: is going to interfere with me wanting to have a
26:07
Speaker 2: family and form a family in the way that I want.
26:10
Speaker 2: Being straightforward about that is one thing. Being strong arming
26:14
Speaker 2: about that is another, because you might have a couple
26:17
Speaker 2: of years before y'all have kids, and she would like
26:20
Speaker 2: to do something with those years earn skills that she
26:22
Speaker 2: can then use later. Right, It strikes me as unfortunate
26:28
Speaker 2: that in a time when we have many more choices
26:32
Speaker 2: than we used.
26:33
Speaker 4: To have, that.
26:35
Speaker 1: Diet the discourse sort of shoves us to the sides again,
26:39
Speaker 1: and it's.
26:39
Speaker 2: Like you're either doing this hardcore or you're doing this hardcore,
26:41
Speaker 2: And I feel like there's a there's a lot of
26:43
Speaker 2: room in the middle to be able to make choices
26:45
Speaker 2: that even my mom didn't have available to her, including
26:48
Speaker 2: this flexibility part that is available more often than it
26:52
Speaker 2: ever was in the past.
26:53
Speaker 9: Absolutely. Also, there's the fact that life is long, and
26:57
Speaker 9: just because you're a stay at home mom today doesn't
26:59
Speaker 9: mean you're going to be stay at home to mom
27:01
Speaker 9: tomorrow or vice versa. I've been a stay at home mom,
27:05
Speaker 9: I've been a work at home mom, I've been a
27:06
Speaker 9: work outside the home mom. I've done it all. You know,
27:10
Speaker 9: life changes, and you shouldn't commit to just I'm going
27:15
Speaker 9: to be this one thing. Your kids can go off
27:16
Speaker 9: to school after you've been a stay at home mom
27:18
Speaker 9: for a few years, and you might find you want
27:20
Speaker 9: to work outside the house, or you might find they
27:23
Speaker 9: need you more than ever and you don't. So I
27:26
Speaker 9: would just say, don't be so rigid about it either way, like,
27:29
Speaker 9: see where life takes you, and see where your economic
27:32
Speaker 9: situation takes you. Anything is really possible.
27:35
Speaker 2: And then one thing I would say as a caveat
27:37
Speaker 2: to what I already said because I want is I
27:41
Speaker 2: do think the thing where women are told like.
27:43
Speaker 1: You've got all the time in the world, don't worry
27:46
Speaker 1: about it.
27:47
Speaker 2: You know, you're only twenty seven or what have you, Like,
27:50
Speaker 2: there is actually a time at which it becomes harder.
27:53
Speaker 2: And if it's something, if having a family something you
27:56
Speaker 2: want to prioritize, you should actively prioritiz You should try
28:01
Speaker 2: to meet somebody who's the right match with that. You
28:03
Speaker 2: should try to meet someone with your values. You should
28:05
Speaker 2: date intentionally. You should think about when you're gonna have kids.
28:08
Speaker 2: So I think that part if you're like sort of
28:10
Speaker 2: have a goal in mind. But the simple solution is
28:13
Speaker 2: not just marry someone who's perfect when you're twenty one
28:16
Speaker 2: and then stay home forever, because like a lot of
28:18
Speaker 2: people don't meet somebody when they're twenty one.
28:20
Speaker 3: I didn't, sure didn't.
28:22
Speaker 2: Doesn't work out that way, so you gotta I think
28:24
Speaker 2: Megan's right that, like, let's reflect the fact that a
28:27
Speaker 2: lot of people make a lot of different choices for
28:29
Speaker 2: a lot of different reasons, and you can't be stuck
28:31
Speaker 2: in one track forever.
28:33
Speaker 9: Yeah, we love you, Megan, You're the best. Thanks for
28:37
Speaker 9: joining us on Normally. Normally airs Tuesdays and Thursdays, and
28:40
Speaker 9: you can subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts. Get in
28:43
Speaker 9: touch with us at normallythepod at gmail dot com. Thanks
28:46
Speaker 9: for listening, and when things get weird, act normally