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“The Convention is good!” · Pod Save America

0:20
Speaker 1: Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau.
0:22
Speaker 2: I'm Dan Pfeiffer.
0:23
Speaker 1: On today's pod, Elizabeth Warren talks to Dan about her
0:26
Speaker 1: convention speech and her efforts to save the post office.
0:29
Speaker 1: Before that, we'll talk about some of the most memorable
0:32
Speaker 1: moments and speeches from the first three nights of the
0:35
Speaker 1: Democratic National Convention. Few quick housekeeping notes before we start.
0:40
Speaker 1: Check out this week's pod, Save the World, where Palestinian
0:43
Speaker 1: foreign policy expert Rula Jabril joins Tommy and Ben to
0:46
Speaker 1: explain the downsides of the U.S.-Israel-UAE deal. And they also
0:50
Speaker 1: cover the Senate Intel Committee's blockbuster report, on Russian election interference.
0:55
Speaker 1: It happened. There you go. Check out this week's episode
0:59
Speaker 1: of Missing America, where Ben Rhodes takes on the rising
1:02
Speaker 1: spread of nationalism. It's a fantastic podcast. Check it out
1:04
Speaker 1: wherever you get yours. Also, check out the latest campaign
1:08
Speaker 1: experts react for the Pod Save America Hacks on Tap
1:11
Speaker 1: crossover you've all been waiting for. David Axelrod joins Dan
1:15
Speaker 1: to break down some campaign ads on YouTube.com slash Crooked Media.
1:20
Speaker 1: Fun episode.
1:21
Speaker 2: Is YouTube.com the appropriate way of saying it? Did we
1:23
Speaker 2: have to say that? Do people just go to YouTube?
1:26
Speaker 1: You have to do the site. The site is slash
1:28
Speaker 1: Crooked Media.
1:29
Speaker 2: It's backslash Crooked Media. I don't know. Either way, super
1:34
Speaker 2: fun to talk with Axe about new ads from the
1:38
Speaker 2: Biden campaign, the relaunched Trump campaign strategy. And we looked
1:43
Speaker 2: at a very interesting ad from North Carolina Governor Roy
1:46
Speaker 2: Cooper about masks, which is you should check it out
1:49
Speaker 2: and adopt North Carolina as part of the Vote Safe
1:51
Speaker 2: America Adopt-A-State program.
1:53
Speaker 1: Good plug. Good plug. Finally, Tonight, on the last night
1:58
Speaker 1: of the Democratic National Convention, check out our Pod Save
2:01
Speaker 1: America live pre-show on crooked.com slash convention.
2:05
Speaker 2: Love it.
2:06
Speaker 1: Tommy, Dan, and I will all be there recapping the
2:08
Speaker 1: biggest moments of this year's convention, looking back at some
2:11
Speaker 1: previous conventions, maybe even playing some drinking games. We promise
2:16
Speaker 1: it will be a lot better than anything that's on cable,
2:19
Speaker 1: though I do realize that is a very low bar. But...
2:24
Speaker 1: Join us anyway at 5 p.m. Pacific, 8 p.m.
2:28
Speaker 2: Eastern.
2:29
Speaker 1: It is crooked.com slash convention. We'll have the whole show.
2:34
Speaker 1: It'll be fun.
2:35
Speaker 2: John, what do Barack Obama, Michelle Obama, Joe Biden, Jill Biden,
2:40
Speaker 2: Kamala Harris, Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, and the four of
2:43
Speaker 2: us have in common? I don't know.
2:47
Speaker 1: What do we all have in common?
2:48
Speaker 2: We're all officially part of the convention program.
2:53
Speaker 1: That's right.
2:53
Speaker 2: We are on the agenda.
2:55
Speaker 1: We are a pre-show. So like on one hand, we
2:58
Speaker 1: did get an hour, which is great. On the other hand,
3:02
Speaker 1: it's not streamed as part of the official convention, though
3:05
Speaker 1: it is on the official convention program.
3:08
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're the opening act. I am okay with that.
3:10
Speaker 2: We started this podcast four years ago.
3:12
Speaker 1: Where are we going to be in four years?
3:14
Speaker 2: That's the question. Probably in prime time.
3:16
Speaker 1: Look, we are opposite Phil Murphy and the Democratic governor's.
3:22
Speaker 1: Who also have a pre-show at 8 o'clock.
3:24
Speaker 2: It's a tough slot. It's a tough slot.
3:26
Speaker 1: Some of you Phil heads might be over on the
3:28
Speaker 1: other stream watching that. But, you know, if not, come
3:32
Speaker 1: check us out.
3:33
Speaker 2: All right.
3:33
Speaker 1: We have now seen the first three nights of the
3:36
Speaker 1: only Democratic National Convention not to take place in an
3:39
Speaker 1: actual convention hall with a cheering crowd of delegates and supporters. Instead. Instead.
3:44
Speaker 1: Each day has given us two hours of primetime programming
3:46
Speaker 1: that's included a mix of pre-produced videos, montages, musical acts,
3:50
Speaker 1: and live speeches from locations all across the country, featuring
3:53
Speaker 1: an incredibly diverse array of Americans from across the political spectrum.
3:57
Speaker 1: Joe Biden has officially been nominated as the Democratic Party's
4:01
Speaker 1: presidential candidate, and he will accept that nomination in a
4:04
Speaker 1: speech from Wilmington, Delaware, tonight, Thursday. So, Dan, we're going
4:09
Speaker 1: to save our reflections on the entire week for Friday's
4:12
Speaker 1: bonus pod with Tommy and Lovett. But before we get
4:15
Speaker 1: to the big speeches we've heard so far, I have
4:18
Speaker 1: two questions for you.
4:19
Speaker 2: Okay, great.
4:21
Speaker 1: First, general reaction to the week so far, just as
4:26
Speaker 1: you've been watching this unfold. And second, from a political standpoint, what,
4:31
Speaker 1: if anything, do you think the Democrats and the Biden
4:33
Speaker 1: campaign have accomplished so far?
4:36
Speaker 3: So.
4:37
Speaker 2: General reaction is I had no idea what to expect
4:40
Speaker 2: heading into this week.
4:41
Speaker 3: This is, I.
4:43
Speaker 2: Mean, truly unprecedented how they were going to pull this off.
4:46
Speaker 2: It was a relatively short period of time because it
4:47
Speaker 2: wasn't that long ago that Biden was planning to be
4:51
Speaker 2: in Milwaukee, largely by himself, but in Milwaukee, Kamala Harris
4:57
Speaker 2: would be in Milwaukee. But they had to change all
5:00
Speaker 2: of that and put most of this together very quickly.
5:03
Speaker 2: And I think it has gone tremendously well. I think
5:06
Speaker 2: one thing that is sort of understated in the coverage
5:09
Speaker 2: of this. And I think this is one of the
5:11
Speaker 2: things that they have accomplished politically is there's a lot
5:15
Speaker 2: of sort of Twitter theater criticism about how it was
5:19
Speaker 2: going and whether it was cringy and didn't love some
5:22
Speaker 2: of these videos. Or is it weird that Eva Longoria
5:25
Speaker 2: or Kerry Washington or Tracee Ellis Ross are the ones
5:27
Speaker 2: sort of moderating this? But what I think that misses
5:31
Speaker 2: is The medium is the message here. The abnormality of
5:36
Speaker 2: this convention is in part making Joe Biden's core political argument,
5:40
Speaker 2: which is that because Donald Trump is such a terrible president,
5:45
Speaker 2: we cannot gather in Milwaukee. So all of the weirdness
5:48
Speaker 2: buttresses that argument about how Trump has failed to handle
5:51
Speaker 2: the coronavirus, and that is to their benefit. In addition
5:54
Speaker 2: to that, and I think the organizers did a unbelievable
5:58
Speaker 2: job in putting this together. It is, I think, the
6:01
Speaker 2: creativity- The execution under tremendous circumstances is phenomenal. But they
6:07
Speaker 2: went into this convention with the goal of deepening knowledge
6:11
Speaker 2: of Joe Biden and Kamala Harris to the many voters
6:14
Speaker 2: who know them by name, but not by person and
6:17
Speaker 2: not by policy agenda. And I think they've made a
6:19
Speaker 2: lot of progress on that. It's up to Joe Biden
6:20
Speaker 2: to close that deal tonight in his speech.
6:24
Speaker 1: I have been so pleasantly surprised and I have been
6:28
Speaker 1: happier with the convention as it has gone on each day.
6:32
Speaker 1: Like there are certain things that absolutely just didn't work,
6:36
Speaker 1: partly because they tried so many unique things throughout this convention,
6:43
Speaker 1: different kinds of pieces, different locations, different kinds of people.
6:45
Speaker 1: I mean, it really ran the gamut. So of course
6:48
Speaker 1: there were a few things here and there that didn't work,
6:50
Speaker 1: but I think the real coup here is how they
6:56
Speaker 1: basically have tricked the media into covering a full two
7:02
Speaker 1: hours of convention material every single night. So like you
7:06
Speaker 1: and I know that, and people who have seen conventions before,
7:09
Speaker 1: typically there's about three hours per night, each night of
7:12
Speaker 1: a convention. The large majority of that time is spent,
7:17
Speaker 1: you know, giving every elected democratic official who holds an
7:22
Speaker 1: office a chance to give a speech. usually most of
7:26
Speaker 1: those speeches, 90% of those speeches are pedestrian at best.
7:31
Speaker 1: And then there are sort of highly produced videos that
7:35
Speaker 1: are supposed to illustrate something about the nominee's life, their record,
7:39
Speaker 1: their plans. And during those videos, most of the networks
7:43
Speaker 1: will cut away to a bunch of pundits on CNN
7:46
Speaker 1: or MSNBC or Fox or wherever, just blabbing about whatever.
7:50
Speaker 1: And they don't feel the need to show the videos
7:52
Speaker 1: or show a lot of the pre-produced stuff that's the convention.
7:55
Speaker 1: And for this week, none of the networks or the
7:59
Speaker 1: cable networks really pulled away for any of it. And
8:02
Speaker 1: so all of these like really moving videos and pieces
8:06
Speaker 1: that they all put together for the convention were just
8:09
Speaker 1: played in their entirety. And it's basically every single night
8:12
Speaker 1: of this week has been a two-hour infomercial for the
8:15
Speaker 1: Democratic Party and Joe Biden's campaign. And kudos to the
8:20
Speaker 1: organizers of the convention for pulling that off and especially
8:23
Speaker 1: pulling that off when They're all in different places. There's
8:26
Speaker 1: five different studios, a million different locations. Some of it's live.
8:30
Speaker 1: I mean, it is very difficult. You know, we can
8:33
Speaker 1: get into the specifics, but like the roll call was
8:36
Speaker 1: maybe one of the most beautiful moments, unexpectedly beautiful moments
8:40
Speaker 1: of the whole convention where usually in a roll call vote,
8:44
Speaker 1: you're just watching inside the convention hall where each state
8:49
Speaker 1: has to go one by one, all 50 states and
8:51
Speaker 1: nominate the candidate. And it is very boring. And people
8:54
Speaker 1: go make snacks, go to the bathroom, pundits talk. And instead,
8:57
Speaker 1: they went to all 50 states and then all the territories.
9:01
Speaker 1: And they had different kinds of people, a diverse group
9:04
Speaker 1: of people at each location nominating Joe Biden. And it
9:08
Speaker 1: was like a really wonderful moment that even broke through
9:13
Speaker 1: the cynicism on Twitter. I loved it.
9:15
Speaker 2: Can I admit something? I missed large portions of the
9:18
Speaker 2: roll call.
9:19
Speaker 1: Oh man.
9:20
Speaker 2: I know. I mean, they're like, I had a good reason,
9:22
Speaker 2: which is Kyla goes to bed between seven, seven 30 generally,
9:27
Speaker 2: or the next day can be an absolute disaster. And
9:29
Speaker 2: we've been keeping it the first night we kept her
9:31
Speaker 2: up because she has been watching when Michelle Obama reads
9:36
Speaker 2: books on PBS, like that is a thing. And she
9:38
Speaker 2: calls her mama's boss because how he worked for FLOTUS. Um,
9:42
Speaker 2: so we let her stay up to watch Michelle Obama,
9:44
Speaker 2: but We put her to bed during the roll. I
9:46
Speaker 2: put her to bed during the roll call. But I
9:48
Speaker 2: have to say, when I left, the group thread was like,
9:51
Speaker 2: oh my god, this is going to be the worst
9:53
Speaker 2: thing in the world. I left in the bees, teeth brushing,
9:57
Speaker 2: book reading, negotiating bed. We were in Ohio when I
10:01
Speaker 2: came back and you guys were all like, this is
10:03
Speaker 2: the best thing in the world. People are crying. And
10:06
Speaker 2: I was like, what did it impress me still? And
10:08
Speaker 2: I made it back in time to see the guy,
10:10
Speaker 2: the masked guy in Rhode Island holding the plate of calamari,
10:13
Speaker 2: which was unbelievable.
10:15
Speaker 1: I think one of the reasons it worked so well
10:17
Speaker 1: is because all of us have been stuck home for
10:21
Speaker 1: six months and like I felt the same way when
10:25
Speaker 1: it started I was like oh boy 50 states I
10:27
Speaker 1: don't know about this but I think what came over
10:30
Speaker 1: most people is like we for the first time in
10:34
Speaker 1: a long time got to see what America looks like
10:37
Speaker 1: and why we love it it's like very simple just
10:41
Speaker 1: like it was joyful at and when at a time
10:44
Speaker 1: when not much of the news we see is joyful
10:46
Speaker 1: uh in any way You know, for good reason. We're
10:49
Speaker 1: living in the middle of a pandemic in Trump's presidency.
10:52
Speaker 1: But I thought it was great. And it's interesting, sort of,
10:56
Speaker 1: when it's, I thought the weakest time of the whole
10:58
Speaker 1: convention was basically Monday, almost up until Bernie and Michelle spoke.
11:04
Speaker 1: There were some good parts. But a lot of it
11:06
Speaker 1: was traditional speeches from elected officials. And they were giving
11:10
Speaker 1: the speeches as if they were at a convention.
11:12
Speaker 3: Yeah.
11:13
Speaker 1: And, um, for some, you know, it was just felt
11:16
Speaker 1: a little slow to me, mainly because I don't think
11:18
Speaker 1: the speeches were all that strong, but then starting with Bernie. And,
11:23
Speaker 1: and the rest of Monday night and then Tuesday, Wednesday,
11:25
Speaker 1: I thought even the pre prime time stuff was, they
11:29
Speaker 1: had very moving videos. I thought like it, it helped
11:32
Speaker 1: convey empathy for struggling Americans. Uh, you know, it conveyed
11:37
Speaker 1: the message that we need to take care of each
11:38
Speaker 1: other at credential Joe Biden's character. It laid out the
11:41
Speaker 1: states and stakes in the urgency. So I thought it
11:43
Speaker 1: worked very, very well. And I thought it was very
11:47
Speaker 1: emotional at times, too.
11:49
Speaker 2: All right.
11:50
Speaker 1: So one of the first major speakers of the week
11:52
Speaker 1: was Senator Bernie Sanders, who spoke from Vermont on Monday night.
11:56
Speaker 1: In his remarks, Bernie told his supporters that, quote, all
11:59
Speaker 1: the progress we have made will be in jeopardy if
12:01
Speaker 1: Donald Trump is reelected. He made a strong case for
12:03
Speaker 1: Biden's policies on everything from the minimum wage to paid
12:06
Speaker 1: family leave to climate change. And he ended the speech
12:09
Speaker 1: on this note.
12:11
Speaker 4: The future of our democracy is at stake. The future
12:15
Speaker 4: of our economy is at stake. The future of our
12:19
Speaker 4: planet is at stake. We must come together, defeat Donald Trump,
12:26
Speaker 4: and elect Joe Biden and Kamala Harris as our next
12:30
Speaker 4: president and vice president. My friends, the price of failure
12:37
Speaker 4: is just too great to imagine.
12:39
Speaker 1: Dan, what did you think of Bernie's speech?
12:41
Speaker 2: The context of Bernie's speech is fascinating to me, which
12:45
Speaker 2: is if you think back to that last debate between
12:49
Speaker 2: Sanders and Biden, which is one of the last things
12:51
Speaker 2: that happened when life was– this was right as life
12:53
Speaker 2: was becoming abnormal because they were socially distanced in that
12:57
Speaker 2: CNN studio, I think, during the debate. And it was
13:00
Speaker 2: pretty– it was relatively heated, that debate, on substantive, but heated.
13:04
Speaker 2: And then you flash forward to think that Bernie Sanders
13:06
Speaker 2: is giving a speech to the convention and there is
13:08
Speaker 2: no drama about the unity of the party. And so
13:12
Speaker 2: I think what makes Bernie Sanders' speech so interesting is
13:14
Speaker 2: everything that happened between when he got out of the
13:17
Speaker 2: race and now, and that he and Biden together have
13:20
Speaker 2: done so much to unify the party. So I think
13:22
Speaker 2: that's the first part. The second part is whenever you
13:25
Speaker 2: look at these speeches, we're all hearing them, but we're
13:27
Speaker 2: not all the specific target audience of those speeches. And
13:30
Speaker 2: so Bernie Sanders was speaking directly to it. It's a
13:34
Speaker 2: small percentage, but the some number of voters of his
13:37
Speaker 2: who are motivated and impassioned by Bernie Sanders' agenda and message,
13:42
Speaker 2: who may be skeptical about whether they're going to vote
13:44
Speaker 2: for Biden. And he was raising the stakes for them
13:47
Speaker 2: in a way that was very, very powerful. And it's
13:49
Speaker 2: a reminder that Bernie Sanders is a great political speaker.
13:53
Speaker 2: He makes a strong, clear, moral argument without equivocation whenever
13:57
Speaker 2: he speaks. And it works whether there's a huge audience
14:00
Speaker 2: of people at a rally in Phoenix or Iowa City
14:03
Speaker 2: or in a empty room with a lot of firewood
14:06
Speaker 2: as happened here.
14:09
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, look, Bernie is one of the best
14:14
Speaker 1: messengers in the party, bar none, when it comes to
14:17
Speaker 1: talking about economic issues and embracing the good version of
14:24
Speaker 1: economic populism. He is passionate about these issues in a
14:29
Speaker 1: way that is incredibly authentic. He did a fantastic job
14:33
Speaker 1: here spelling out Biden's progressive policies and vouching for them,
14:38
Speaker 1: said that Joe Biden would make it easier for workers
14:40
Speaker 1: to join unions, 12 weeks of paid family leave, universal pre-K,
14:44
Speaker 1: affordable childcare, 100% clean electricity over the next 15 years.
14:48
Speaker 1: He would end private prisons and detention centers and cash
14:50
Speaker 1: bail and the school to prison pipeline. I mean, just
14:53
Speaker 1: the idea that Bernie Sanders stood up there and said
14:55
Speaker 1: that Joe Biden would do all these things is incredibly
14:58
Speaker 1: valuable for the Biden campaign and incredibly good of Bernie
15:01
Speaker 1: Sanders to do. I think what struck me the most
15:04
Speaker 1: is his repeated references and warnings that Donald Trump is
15:11
Speaker 1: leading us down the path of authoritarianism. Now, Bernie Sanders
15:15
Speaker 1: has said that many times before. It was part of
15:19
Speaker 1: some of his major speeches during the primary. But what
15:24
Speaker 1: struck me as I've been watching this whole week, and
15:26
Speaker 1: we're going to talk about this with Obama's speech as well,
15:30
Speaker 1: from the far left of the party, Bernie Sanders is
15:33
Speaker 1: to the more establishment part of the party, Barack Obama,
15:38
Speaker 1: to some of our new Republican friends who are voting
15:41
Speaker 1: for Joe Biden, John Kasich, Colin Powell, there is a
15:46
Speaker 1: warning across ideological lines that democracy is at stake in
15:53
Speaker 1: this election and that something very dark could happen if
15:57
Speaker 1: Donald Trump wins a second term. And the unity around
16:01
Speaker 1: that warning from a broad array of people with vastly
16:08
Speaker 1: different ideological views should tell people something about how scary
16:13
Speaker 1: this could be. And basically, you know, we can talk
16:17
Speaker 1: about sort of like the unity in the party, but
16:20
Speaker 1: I think the unity is primarily around the fact that
16:24
Speaker 1: at least from the perspective of a lot of these
16:27
Speaker 1: elected officials, whether it's Bernie or Kasich or Obama, From
16:31
Speaker 1: their perspective, it's like, hey, this might not be your
16:35
Speaker 1: dream candidate. This might not be all the policies that
16:38
Speaker 1: you want. But in this election, we face a very
16:44
Speaker 1: stark choice. And if we do not make the right choice,
16:48
Speaker 1: then we are headed down a very bad path. And
16:50
Speaker 1: so we're going to have to put all of our
16:52
Speaker 1: problems aside for right now and come together to defeat
16:57
Speaker 1: Donald Trump in November. And I think that message came
17:00
Speaker 1: through perhaps clearer than any other message of the entire week.
17:03
Speaker 2: I think that's exactly right. But I think there is
17:06
Speaker 2: an additional piece of that that also weaves through the
17:09
Speaker 2: other speeches we're going to discuss, which is it's not
17:12
Speaker 2: just defeat Donald Trump. It is that we're going to
17:14
Speaker 2: have to do a series of things to fix the
17:16
Speaker 2: American political system so we don't end up with Donald
17:18
Speaker 2: Trump again. And that is where there has been, really
17:22
Speaker 2: in the last several months, a merging of various wings
17:26
Speaker 2: of the party around a democracy reform agenda that recognizes
17:30
Speaker 2: that Donald Trump is the symptom, not the cause. He
17:33
Speaker 2: is not an aberration. And that what we really is
17:35
Speaker 2: that Donald Trump is a particularly stupid authoritarian and waiting
17:39
Speaker 2: in the wings is a whole bunch of smarter, equally
17:41
Speaker 2: racist authoritarians in the Republican Party. And if we don't
17:45
Speaker 2: do things like get rid of the filibuster, pass the
17:47
Speaker 2: John Lewis Voting Rights Act, deal with the courts, we're
17:49
Speaker 2: going to have we're going to we're just going to
17:51
Speaker 2: do repeat this whole process in some number of years.
17:53
Speaker 2: And Bernie Sanders speech, I think, sort of helps set
17:56
Speaker 2: the stage for that as well.
17:59
Speaker 1: While we're talking about Bernie, you know, what's your take
18:03
Speaker 1: on is the party big enough for both John Kasich
18:07
Speaker 1: and Colin Powell and a video from Cindy McCain about
18:11
Speaker 1: John McCain and Joe Biden's friendship and Bernie Sanders and AOC,
18:16
Speaker 1: you know, who we should note spoke for a minute
18:19
Speaker 1: and nominated Bernie Sanders, which is tradition, by the way,
18:23
Speaker 1: that the runner up who has amassed a lot of
18:27
Speaker 1: delegates gets officially nominated and then releases the delegates to
18:31
Speaker 1: the official nominee afterwards. So that was part of just
18:33
Speaker 1: the process. I know there was a little confusion about that.
18:38
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think this is a pretty... complicated set of
18:42
Speaker 2: things that's all happening here. So is the party big
18:45
Speaker 2: enough for AOC, Bernie Sanders, and John Kasich? No, because
18:50
Speaker 2: John Kasich is not a Democrat. But to win the
18:53
Speaker 2: electoral college and become president of the United States, you
18:56
Speaker 2: need the votes of some people who are not members
18:58
Speaker 2: of the Democratic Party, large numbers of independents, and even
19:00
Speaker 2: some number of Republicans. That is what the demographic makeup
19:03
Speaker 2: and partisan split within the states against the 270 demands,
19:07
Speaker 2: which is why as much– look, I do not like
19:09
Speaker 2: John Kasich. I haven't liked him ever. I didn't like
19:12
Speaker 2: him when he hosted a terrible MSNBC cable show. I
19:16
Speaker 2: didn't like him when he was in the House. I
19:17
Speaker 2: really didn't like him as governor. I think he is
19:19
Speaker 2: at best a mediocre CNN commentator right now. I appreciate
19:23
Speaker 2: the fact that he hasn't followed the Republican Party off
19:28
Speaker 2: the cliff of Trump, but he served a purpose. He
19:32
Speaker 2: was speaking to a group of people. I'm not one
19:34
Speaker 2: of those people. I would rather do almost anything than
19:36
Speaker 2: watch John Kasich, Meg Whitman, Christy Todd Whitman, or any
19:42
Speaker 2: of these other people speak who spoke in that parade
19:45
Speaker 2: of mediocre Republicans, but they're speaking, they're trying to create
19:50
Speaker 2: the Biden campaign was trying to create a permission structure
19:53
Speaker 2: for people who either voted for Donald Trump in 2016
19:58
Speaker 2: or voted for, disapproved of Donald Trump and voted for
20:01
Speaker 2: a third party candidate because they couldn't bring themselves to
20:03
Speaker 2: vote for a Democrat. They were trying to create a
20:04
Speaker 2: permission structure for those people to vote for Biden. Now,
20:09
Speaker 2: that is not an excuse or a reason to not
20:12
Speaker 2: give more time to Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, one of the most
20:16
Speaker 2: talented messengers in the party, because she also has a
20:18
Speaker 2: very important audience that needs to see her and can
20:21
Speaker 2: be motivated by her. And yeah, John Kasich clearly doesn't
20:23
Speaker 2: want to hear AOC speak. I wish he had kept
20:26
Speaker 2: that sentiment to himself as he was arriving at our
20:29
Speaker 2: party under invitation. But there are voters who are deciding
20:34
Speaker 2: between voting and not voting who– AOC would be a
20:38
Speaker 2: very powerful messenger with. We know that Joe Biden is,
20:40
Speaker 2: prior to this convention at least, underperforming with Latino voters,
20:46
Speaker 2: and particularly young Latino voters. And AOC could have been
20:49
Speaker 2: very influential with that. So we are a big tent party.
20:54
Speaker 2: We should welcome efforts to appeal to people that do
20:58
Speaker 2: not agree with us, because that's what both winning elections
21:01
Speaker 2: and governing demands. But we also should not short shrift
21:06
Speaker 2: our the base of our party. And I thought Heather McGhee,
21:10
Speaker 2: our friend and one of the smartest people in politics,
21:11
Speaker 2: pointed out that in the speaking program, there has been
21:13
Speaker 2: an absence of progressives, and particularly young progressives of color.
21:18
Speaker 2: And that's the one place where I would be critical
21:20
Speaker 2: of the speaking agenda thus far, is there could be
21:22
Speaker 2: more of that. And yes, AOC was giving the Bernie
21:24
Speaker 2: Sanders nominating speech, but she could have done something else.
21:26
Speaker 2: And I think that would have been good for the
21:28
Speaker 2: larger effort of electing Joe Biden.
21:31
Speaker 4: All right.
21:32
Speaker 1: Let's talk about Monday night's final speech from Michelle Obama.
21:34
Speaker 1: which was incredibly powerful and very direct to the point,
21:39
Speaker 1: both in the case she made for Joe Biden and
21:41
Speaker 1: the case she made against Donald Trump. Here is a
21:43
Speaker 1: clip of the latter.
21:45
Speaker 5: Over the past four years, a lot of people have
21:48
Speaker 5: asked me, when others are going so low, does going
21:53
Speaker 5: high still really work? My answer, going high is the
22:00
Speaker 5: only thing that works. Because when we go low, when
22:04
Speaker 5: we use those same tactics of degrading and dehumanizing others,
22:10
Speaker 5: we just become part of the ugly noise that's drowning
22:13
Speaker 5: out everything else. We degrade ourselves. We degrade the very
22:17
Speaker 5: causes for which we fight. But let's be clear. Going
22:23
Speaker 5: high does not mean putting on a smile and saying
22:26
Speaker 5: nice things when confronted by viciousness and cruelty. Going high
22:32
Speaker 5: means taking the harder path. It means scraping and clawing
22:37
Speaker 5: our way to that mountain top. Going high means standing
22:42
Speaker 5: fierce against hatred while remembering that we are one nation
22:47
Speaker 5: under God. And if we want to survive, we've got
22:51
Speaker 5: to find a way to live together and work together
22:56
Speaker 5: across our differences. And going high means unlocking the shackles
23:02
Speaker 5: of lies and mistrust with the only thing that can
23:06
Speaker 5: truly set us free, the cold, hard truth. So let
23:12
Speaker 5: me be as honest and clear as I possibly can.
23:16
Speaker 5: Donald Trump is the wrong president for our country. He
23:21
Speaker 5: has had more than enough time to prove that he
23:24
Speaker 5: can do the job, but he is clearly in over
23:27
Speaker 5: his head. He cannot meet this moment. He simply cannot
23:32
Speaker 5: be who we need him to be for us. It
23:36
Speaker 5: is what it is.
23:37
Speaker 1: Dan, why do you think Michelle's speech struck a chord
23:41
Speaker 1: with so many people?
23:43
Speaker 2: Because it wasn't a speech. So much of, especially on
23:46
Speaker 2: that first night, the remarks were speeches delivered in a
23:52
Speaker 2: context and environment that did not feel right for speeches.
23:55
Speaker 2: People standing at empty podiums speaking. And Michelle Obama, I
23:59
Speaker 2: think more than anyone else who has spoken in these
24:02
Speaker 2: first three nights, delivered a masterclass in how you communicate
24:08
Speaker 2: in a Zoom world, which is she sat in front
24:10
Speaker 2: of a camera and had a conversation. She talked like
24:15
Speaker 2: a human to a human, not like a politician speaking
24:18
Speaker 2: to a room of people. And it was powerful conversation.
24:23
Speaker 2: and raw, and it had no jargon or cliches or
24:26
Speaker 2: applause lines, which is something that a lot of these speechwriters,
24:29
Speaker 2: I mean, you know this, speechwriters build speeches around applause.
24:35
Speaker 2: And they did that in a lot of these speeches,
24:36
Speaker 2: even when there would be no applause. And Michelle Obama
24:39
Speaker 2: just spoke. A friend of mine After the speech, she said,
24:43
Speaker 2: watching Michelle Obama was like when your friend sits you
24:46
Speaker 2: down and tells you how to get out of that
24:48
Speaker 2: bad relationship you're in. It was just like how your
24:51
Speaker 2: friend talks to you in a serious time. And I mean,
24:54
Speaker 2: it was absolutely riveting.
24:59
Speaker 1: The best speeches tell a simple story that you can
25:02
Speaker 1: remember after the speech is done. That was the case
25:06
Speaker 1: with the best speeches over the course of this week.
25:11
Speaker 1: And the people who wrote those speeches, including the people
25:14
Speaker 1: who gave those speeches, they did not write them, like
25:17
Speaker 1: you said, to get a bunch of applause. They did
25:19
Speaker 1: not write traditional applause lines. They did not write sort
25:22
Speaker 1: of the cheap, you know, one-off quotable lines. They had
25:27
Speaker 1: a conversation with the audience and told a story, right?
25:31
Speaker 1: That was, I think that was, we know what, we
25:34
Speaker 1: can remember what Bernie's speech was about. We can remember
25:36
Speaker 1: what Michelle Obama's speech was about. We can remember what,
25:40
Speaker 1: Barack Obama's speech was about, what Kamala Harris's speech was about.
25:45
Speaker 1: We can remember what Jill Biden's speech was about. And
25:50
Speaker 1: it's hard to remember too many of the other ones
25:52
Speaker 1: because they were collections of lines and policies. And so
25:57
Speaker 1: I do think that hers especially rose to the moment.
26:02
Speaker 1: It was a very simple message. It was, I'm one
26:05
Speaker 1: of very few people who's seen the job of president
26:08
Speaker 1: up close.
26:09
Speaker 2: It is hard.
26:10
Speaker 1: Donald Trump is not up to it. Joe Biden is.
26:13
Speaker 1: That's it. That was the message from Michelle's speech. What
26:16
Speaker 1: made it more powerful is, as you said, she is
26:19
Speaker 1: not a politician. In fact, towards the end of the speech,
26:25
Speaker 1: now I understand that my message won't be heard by
26:26
Speaker 1: some people. We live in a nation that is deeply divided.
26:29
Speaker 1: And I am a black woman speaking at the Democratic Convention.
26:32
Speaker 1: But enough of you know me by now. You know
26:34
Speaker 1: that I tell you exactly what I'm feeling. You know
26:36
Speaker 1: I hate politics. but you also know that I care
26:39
Speaker 1: about this nation. You know how much I care about
26:41
Speaker 1: all of our children. So if you take one thing
26:44
Speaker 1: from my words tonight, it is this. If you think
26:46
Speaker 1: things cannot possibly get worse, trust me, they can. Which again,
26:50
Speaker 1: we're getting to the Obama speech, but Bernie, authoritarianism, Michelle, Obama,
26:57
Speaker 1: you know, some of the Republicans that spoke, it is
27:00
Speaker 1: the message that sort of connects throughout the convention. But she, she,
27:06
Speaker 1: She has more authority and is more persuasive, particularly because
27:10
Speaker 1: people see her as someone who is outside politics, who
27:14
Speaker 1: doesn't really like politics. So they trust her more because
27:18
Speaker 1: people don't trust politics that much. And it's one of
27:22
Speaker 1: the reasons that she was so effective. The other thing
27:24
Speaker 1: she does so well is I think that she humanizes
27:27
Speaker 1: political issues in a way that most elected officials do not.
27:32
Speaker 1: And so as she talked about Trump and criticized Trump,
27:35
Speaker 1: it was all around the value of empathy, which is
27:38
Speaker 1: something he lacks. And in that way, she took on
27:41
Speaker 1: not just Donald Trump, but Trumpism. She talked about how,
27:45
Speaker 1: you know, people are in stores not wearing masks and,
27:48
Speaker 1: you know, references to people calling the police on black Americans.
27:53
Speaker 1: And so she sort of talked about how Donald Trump's
27:56
Speaker 1: behavior has bled into society and and what that is
28:00
Speaker 1: doing to our children, which is a way to connect
28:03
Speaker 1: with other people who may not like politics very much,
28:06
Speaker 1: but don't like what's happening in the country right now.
28:09
Speaker 1: I will say one last thing about her speech. People
28:12
Speaker 1: really focused on the it is what it is line
28:14
Speaker 1: because it sort of threw Trump's words back in his
28:16
Speaker 1: face in a very effective way. I thought the line
28:19
Speaker 1: that came before it, he's in over his head. Donald
28:22
Speaker 1: Trump is in over his head, was actually the most
28:25
Speaker 1: effective line of attack against Donald Trump. And I think
28:29
Speaker 1: You know why we have talked about this before on
28:32
Speaker 1: Pod Save America. We have seen a lot of research
28:37
Speaker 1: now from a lot of different places, Democratic candidates, pollsters,
28:41
Speaker 1: progressive groups, change research polls that we've conducted. And it
28:46
Speaker 1: all points to the same thing, which is that the
28:48
Speaker 1: most persuasive argument for people who may have voted for Trump,
28:54
Speaker 1: but have since soured on him, The most persuasive argument
28:59
Speaker 1: is one that says Donald Trump is simply not effective,
29:02
Speaker 1: that he just cannot do the job. And the reason
29:05
Speaker 1: that that's effective is because it doesn't pass judgment on
29:10
Speaker 1: the voter for casting that ballot for Donald Trump in
29:13
Speaker 1: the first place. It says to them, you know what?
29:16
Speaker 1: You may have thought that even though this guy was
29:18
Speaker 1: an asshole, he was going to shake up Washington. He
29:21
Speaker 1: just couldn't get the job done. He just didn't get
29:24
Speaker 1: it done. He's in over his head. He didn't fix
29:26
Speaker 1: the system like he said he would, and he has
29:29
Speaker 1: failed you. So try someone else. And it's complicated because,
29:36
Speaker 1: of course, the rest of us want to say to
29:38
Speaker 1: those people, you should have fucking met. from the outset
29:41
Speaker 1: he was a racist, sexist, authoritarian fucking asshole. That's what
29:46
Speaker 1: we think. But again, to get the votes of those people,
29:49
Speaker 1: which are up for grabs now, those people are saying
29:51
Speaker 1: we are disappointed with him. The best way to do
29:54
Speaker 1: so is say this guy that you thought was going
29:57
Speaker 1: to fix your life, was He's in over his head.
30:01
Speaker 1: He can't do it. And that was the message from
30:03
Speaker 1: Michelle Obama. And I think it is very effective to the,
30:06
Speaker 1: not just to people who voted for Trump, but to
30:07
Speaker 1: those who are not paying super close attention to politics,
30:11
Speaker 1: haven't quite made up their mind, and yet are still
30:15
Speaker 1: considering voting in the first place. All right, let's talk
30:27
Speaker 1: about Tuesday night, which I thought was the most emotional
30:30
Speaker 1: night of the convention so far. There was the roll
30:35
Speaker 1: call nomination that we talked about. There was an incredibly
30:37
Speaker 1: powerful video about healthcare, as well as a video from
30:42
Speaker 1: our friend Adi Barkin and his family. And then there
30:45
Speaker 1: was the video that introduced Dr. Jill Biden. Let's play
30:49
Speaker 1: a clip. The boys fell in love with Jill too.
30:52
Speaker 1: I'm brushing my teeth one morning and they came running
30:55
Speaker 1: in and Bo and Hunt.
30:55
Speaker 6: Said, Dad, we think it's time we married Jill.
30:59
Speaker 2: Swear to.
31:02
Speaker 1: God.
31:03
Speaker 2: I said, marry me five times.
31:06
Speaker 7: It wasn't just my heart that was on the line.
31:09
Speaker 7: I loved the boy so much. I had to be
31:12
Speaker 7: sure that it had to be forever.
31:14
Speaker 6: Now, I'm going to ask you one more time. Will
31:18
Speaker 6: you marry me? She goes like this.
31:19
Speaker 5: Okay. Okay.
31:24
Speaker 2: She put us back together.
31:30
Speaker 1: How awesome was that video?
31:32
Speaker 2: I mean, one of the best biographical convention videos I've
31:34
Speaker 2: ever seen. It was just truly... Easily. I mean, it
31:37
Speaker 2: was just incredibly heartwarming and funny. I mean, just it
31:43
Speaker 2: was wonderful. I mean, I loved every second of it.
31:46
Speaker 4: I mean.
31:47
Speaker 1: Just to talk about like what it actually achieved. I mean,
31:50
Speaker 1: a lot of people don't know the full story of
31:55
Speaker 1: the Biden family and the full extent of the grief
31:59
Speaker 1: that the vice president and his family live with every day.
32:02
Speaker 1: I think a lot more people are familiar with, you know,
32:07
Speaker 1: the fact that Beau Biden passed away several years ago.
32:11
Speaker 1: But just sort of the origin story of when Biden
32:16
Speaker 1: was this very young newly elected Senator and his, his
32:19
Speaker 1: wife and baby daughter were killed in a car accident
32:22
Speaker 1: that his two boys were in as well. And then
32:24
Speaker 1: I didn't even know when, and Jill mentioned it in
32:26
Speaker 1: her speech and in the video that she met them
32:28
Speaker 1: all at 26, you know, and at 26 years old, she,
32:34
Speaker 1: you know, basically decides to marry this widower and his
32:37
Speaker 1: two boys. I think a lot of people didn't know
32:40
Speaker 1: that Jill was, not only was a teacher, but remained
32:43
Speaker 1: a teacher while she was second lady, which we knew
32:47
Speaker 1: working with her in the White House that she would,
32:50
Speaker 1: that her White House job as second lady was part-time
32:52
Speaker 1: and that part-time she was teaching.
32:54
Speaker 2: At a community college in Virginia, yes.
32:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is an incredibly unusual arrangement, but one that
32:58
Speaker 1: she insisted on and, you know, was a fantastic teacher by,
33:03
Speaker 1: you know, all of her students' accounts. So I think
33:06
Speaker 1: it told a wonderful story about Jill Biden, about the
33:09
Speaker 1: Biden family, and about her husband and sort of the
33:15
Speaker 1: qualities and the character that he has, which she continued
33:18
Speaker 1: to do in her speech, which she gave from her
33:22
Speaker 1: former classroom in Delaware. And here's a clip of that.
33:24
Speaker 7: You know, motherhood came to me in a way I
33:27
Speaker 7: never expected. I fell in love with a man and
33:31
Speaker 7: two little boys standing in the wreckage of unthinkable loss,
33:37
Speaker 7: mourning a wife and mother, a daughter and sister. I
33:42
Speaker 7: never imagined at the age of 26 I would be
33:46
Speaker 7: asking myself, how do you make a broken family whole? Still,
33:53
Speaker 7: Joe always told the boys, mommy sent Jill to us,
33:58
Speaker 7: and how could I argue with her? We found that
34:02
Speaker 7: love holds a family together. Love makes us flexible and resilient.
34:08
Speaker 7: It allows us to become more than ourselves together. And
34:13
Speaker 7: though it can't protect us from the sorrows of life,
34:17
Speaker 7: it gives us refuge, a home. How do you make
34:21
Speaker 7: a broken family whole? The same way you make a
34:27
Speaker 7: nation whole. With love and understanding and with small acts
34:33
Speaker 7: of kindness. with bravery, with unwavering faith. You show up
34:40
Speaker 7: for each other in big ways and small ones, again
34:44
Speaker 7: and again. It's what so many of you are doing
34:48
Speaker 7: right now for your loved ones, for complete strangers, for
34:52
Speaker 7: your communities.
34:53
Speaker 1: A lovely speech. Dan, what did you think that Jill's
34:57
Speaker 1: speech accomplished for the campaign and for Biden?
35:01
Speaker 2: I mean, in addition, obviously, to introducing her and testifying
35:05
Speaker 2: to who Joe Biden is and telling that story. What
35:08
Speaker 2: I thought, and it's in that speech, is she goes
35:12
Speaker 2: the step of connecting how she and Joe Biden and
35:17
Speaker 2: their family dealt with grief. How they used love to
35:19
Speaker 2: put their lives back together, both after the initial tragedy
35:24
Speaker 2: involving Trump. Vice President Biden's wife and daughter. And then
35:29
Speaker 2: now after Beau, they connected that to what the country
35:33
Speaker 2: is going through. Because right now we are a broken country. 170,000
35:37
Speaker 2: of our citizens have died in the last six months
35:40
Speaker 2: due in part to incompetence from our president. Not to
35:43
Speaker 2: mention the absolute tearing of the moral fabric from having
35:46
Speaker 2: an authoritarian racist as president. And we are going to
35:49
Speaker 2: have to heal. And Joe Biden's life story makes him
35:55
Speaker 2: perhaps one of the most qualified people on the planet
35:58
Speaker 2: to help heal the country. We've talked about this before,
36:00
Speaker 2: but when Joe Biden talked about healing the soul of
36:02
Speaker 2: the nation, when he got in this race well over
36:05
Speaker 2: a year ago, I was pretty skeptical that that was
36:08
Speaker 2: a message that would work. Now, I was wrong about
36:11
Speaker 2: that because he won the nomination before we befell the strategy.
36:15
Speaker 2: So he was right and I was wrong. But right now,
36:18
Speaker 2: the context of as someone with the empathy to heal
36:24
Speaker 2: a nation, that is what we need right now because
36:26
Speaker 2: we are a nation that is hurting.
36:29
Speaker 1: I've always thought that maybe the most important question you
36:33
Speaker 1: should answer when you're running for president is why me,
36:37
Speaker 1: why now? And I think she answered that question more
36:43
Speaker 1: succinctly and more powerfully in that speech than we've heard
36:46
Speaker 1: the entire campaign. And like you said, the reason we
36:50
Speaker 1: haven't heard it And the entire campaign is because we
36:53
Speaker 1: were in a country where 170,000 people had died of
36:56
Speaker 1: a horrible pandemic back in the primary. And now we are.
37:00
Speaker 1: But it was in that moment you can connect. This
37:04
Speaker 1: is like fate has led us here. And this is
37:07
Speaker 1: exactly why Joe Biden is the right person for this moment.
37:11
Speaker 1: And I do think sometimes like Joe Biden's message, the
37:16
Speaker 1: let's all be bipartisan part of the message is gets
37:19
Speaker 1: confused with let's heal the nation, because I think those
37:22
Speaker 1: are two very different things. And you and I would
37:26
Speaker 1: disagree that there's a lot of room for bipartisanship right
37:29
Speaker 1: now with the political system the way it is. But
37:32
Speaker 1: I do believe that a president can help heal some
37:36
Speaker 1: of the divisions throughout the country. Not totally, but can
37:41
Speaker 1: sort of set an example that helps heal divisions. probably
37:45
Speaker 1: doesn't fix the fucking asshole Republicans in Washington, but you
37:49
Speaker 1: can set an example that heals the country, or at
37:51
Speaker 1: least begins to heal the country, certainly more so than
37:54
Speaker 1: Donald Trump has done.
37:56
Speaker 2: There is a confusion, I think, around the huge emphasis
38:01
Speaker 2: on bipartisanship at this convention within the speaking program and
38:04
Speaker 2: within telling a Biden story, like in the Cindy McCain
38:06
Speaker 2: video was about Joe Biden being somebody who reaches out
38:08
Speaker 2: to Republicans. And I think we need to separate A
38:12
Speaker 2: desire for bipartisanship as a character trait and bipartisanship as
38:16
Speaker 2: a strategy to accomplish progressive goals. They are two different things.
38:19
Speaker 1: That's right.
38:20
Speaker 2: Joe Biden is someone who in his core believes you
38:23
Speaker 2: should reach out to the other side and try, right?
38:27
Speaker 2: And in that sense, he is where the country is.
38:31
Speaker 2: The American people want you to get caught trying to
38:34
Speaker 2: work with the other side. The question will be, what
38:36
Speaker 2: do you do when Mitch McConnell turns his back on
38:39
Speaker 2: you when the nation needs you? How are you going
38:41
Speaker 2: to respond to that? There have been some hopeful signs
38:43
Speaker 2: among Joe Biden and some of the people around him
38:45
Speaker 2: that he will take aggressive action, the filibuster, ending the
38:49
Speaker 2: filibusters on the table. But it is the right thing politically,
38:52
Speaker 2: both in the campaign and in the White House, to
38:55
Speaker 2: talk about the fact that he wants to work the
38:58
Speaker 2: other side, right? And now what he's going to have
39:00
Speaker 2: to manage is the expectations that come with that, right? Is, wait,
39:05
Speaker 2: this is where we fell prey in 2009, right? which
39:10
Speaker 2: is Obama also ran on reaching out to their side.
39:12
Speaker 2: And then he did. And then the press and the
39:15
Speaker 2: American people, to some extent, judged him on his failure
39:17
Speaker 2: to get Mitch McConnell to do things that did not
39:19
Speaker 2: benefit Mitch McConnell. And so if you're going to do it,
39:21
Speaker 2: you have to manage expectations. And you say this, like,
39:25
Speaker 2: I don't think Mitch McConnell will ever do anything to
39:27
Speaker 2: help anyone other than Mitch McConnell. I wrote a book
39:30
Speaker 2: with a section titled Bipartisanship is Dead. Yet I still
39:32
Speaker 2: think Joe Biden is doing the right thing in this
39:34
Speaker 2: convention about talking about his history of trying to work
39:36
Speaker 2: with Republicans and his intention to try to do so again.
39:39
Speaker 1: Let's talk about Kamala Harris, who gave the final address
39:42
Speaker 1: of the evening on Wednesday night when she formally accepted
39:45
Speaker 1: the nomination for vice president in her speech. She paid
39:48
Speaker 1: tribute to the women, especially black women, who helped pave
39:50
Speaker 1: the way for her historic candidacy. She introduced herself and
39:53
Speaker 1: shared her own story, particularly the profound influence her mother
39:56
Speaker 1: had on her life. The speech was lighter on direct
39:59
Speaker 1: hits on Trump, and she did focus on the positive
40:02
Speaker 1: case for herself and for Joe Biden. She ended her
40:06
Speaker 1: remarks with a stirring call to action. Let's hear it.
40:09
Speaker 8: In years from now, this moment will have passed, and
40:14
Speaker 8: our children and our grandchildren will will look in our
40:19
Speaker 8: eyes and they're gonna ask us, where were you when
40:24
Speaker 8: the stakes were so high? They will ask us, what
40:28
Speaker 8: was it like? And we will tell them. We will
40:34
Speaker 8: tell them not just how we felt, we will tell
40:39
Speaker 8: them what we did.
40:43
Speaker 1: Dan, what'd you think of Kamala's speech?
40:45
Speaker 2: I don't think any person in the history of modern
40:48
Speaker 2: American politics has ever been given a task as difficult
40:52
Speaker 2: as the one she had last night. To give that
40:55
Speaker 2: speech in that empty room with that level of expectation,
41:00
Speaker 2: with that much pressure on her, and to deliver that
41:02
Speaker 2: way was a tremendous accomplishment. It is a fundamentally different task.
41:07
Speaker 2: Some of those pieces we've talked about were recorded in advance,
41:09
Speaker 2: where if you mess up, you just start over again.
41:12
Speaker 2: So Barack Obama's speech, which we'll discuss, Barack Obama's one,
41:16
Speaker 2: there's only a small handful of people who have ever
41:18
Speaker 2: had to deliver a high-stakes speech in an empty room before.
41:23
Speaker 2: And those are presidents who are giving nationally televised addresses.
41:25
Speaker 2: So Obama has a lot of reps doing what he
41:27
Speaker 2: did from all of the speeches he gave in the
41:30
Speaker 2: Oval Office or in the East Room after big events.
41:34
Speaker 2: For any other politician, this is something they've never been
41:36
Speaker 2: able to do. And I thought her delivery was incredible,
41:39
Speaker 2: the parts about her story and the part you just
41:41
Speaker 2: played is I think where Kamala Harris is at her best,
41:44
Speaker 2: which is where she is motivating people to action. Because
41:48
Speaker 2: it ties to the activism of her parents, her history,
41:53
Speaker 2: and connects it to what is happening right now in
41:56
Speaker 2: America within the Democratic Party. And so I was incredibly
41:59
Speaker 2: impressed and very motivated by the speech. I was fired
42:03
Speaker 2: up for Kamala Harris as vice president after this.
42:06
Speaker 1: I was too. I think that you're exactly right, that
42:10
Speaker 1: her connecting... the historic nature of her candidacy with both
42:17
Speaker 1: her life story, particularly what her mother meant to her,
42:21
Speaker 1: and connecting that to all the women who came before,
42:25
Speaker 1: civil rights activists and women's suffrage activists who made her
42:30
Speaker 1: candidacy possible, was beautiful and stirring and certainly the strongest
42:36
Speaker 1: part of the speech. Kamala Harris... There are some public
42:40
Speaker 1: figures who make every single written speech better with their delivery.
42:47
Speaker 1: There are other public figures who, speechwriters will tell you this,
42:51
Speaker 1: inevitably make every written speech worse.
42:53
Speaker 2: It's never the speechwriter's fault. That's what speechwriters.
42:56
Speaker 1: Will tell you. We will not talk about those public
42:59
Speaker 1: figures now. But she is one of the public figures
43:03
Speaker 1: who makes every speech even better, even great, well-written speeches
43:08
Speaker 1: better with delivery. her delivery. She is comfortable and confident.
43:13
Speaker 1: She has an incredible amount of charisma. I mean, it's just,
43:17
Speaker 1: I'm continually impressed with Kamala Harris every time she delivers
43:22
Speaker 1: a speech. And like you said, the speech she had
43:24
Speaker 1: to deliver last night was the highest stakes kind of
43:27
Speaker 1: speech in the most unusual environment possible, particularly for someone
43:33
Speaker 1: who was just nominated to be vice president and now
43:35
Speaker 1: has to face a national stage. Usually you get weeks
43:38
Speaker 1: of prep and prompter prep and you get crowds and
43:41
Speaker 1: you learn how to ride the applause and you have
43:43
Speaker 1: your applause, all that kind of stuff. And it wasn't
43:46
Speaker 1: like she could give sort of the Michelle Obama speech
43:49
Speaker 1: where she's just sitting on a couch and talking directly
43:51
Speaker 1: to camera. Like I do think it was better to
43:52
Speaker 1: have her at a podium. She had to do that.
43:54
Speaker 1: She had to do that. But it makes the job
43:56
Speaker 1: all the harder to basically pretend you're speaking to an
44:00
Speaker 1: audience that you can't see. And I think she absolutely,
44:04
Speaker 1: I think she absolutely nailed it. So it was, and look,
44:07
Speaker 1: we're talking about sort of the mechanics of the speech
44:09
Speaker 1: and how it went, but it was, I was, I
44:12
Speaker 1: was emotional just watching it, thinking about the history of
44:15
Speaker 1: that moment and what it meant that, you know, especially
44:19
Speaker 1: with what we had seen. I mean, there is this
44:21
Speaker 1: arc where Barack Obama, the first black president, you know,
44:27
Speaker 1: chooses Joe Biden to be his vice president, this older
44:30
Speaker 1: white guy. And then years later, he chooses, as he's
44:34
Speaker 1: running for president, the first black woman on a major ticket.
44:38
Speaker 1: And she gives that speech right after Barack Obama on
44:41
Speaker 1: the Wednesday night of the convention. And I think it
44:45
Speaker 1: was a moment. It was a moment.
44:47
Speaker 2: There was one part of that speech that I thought
44:49
Speaker 2: was incredibly historic and I think a little under-discussed, at
44:53
Speaker 2: least among sort of mainstream political commentaries. Here you have
44:57
Speaker 2: a black woman accepting the nomination to be vice president
44:59
Speaker 2: of the United States. Saying the names of Breonna Taylor
45:03
Speaker 2: and George Floyd and others who were murdered by the
45:06
Speaker 2: police was just such a powerful thing to do. And
45:09
Speaker 2: I think it really, it spoke to the moment we're
45:14
Speaker 2: in and how we're responding to it, I think, in
45:16
Speaker 2: a very powerful way.
45:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. All right, let's end on Barack Obama's
45:21
Speaker 1: speech because I suspect we both have a lot to
45:24
Speaker 1: say about it. The former president spoke at the Museum
45:27
Speaker 1: of the American Revolution in Philadelphia in front of a
45:30
Speaker 1: display about the Constitution and delivered an urgent and at
45:34
Speaker 1: times emotional plea for people to treat this election as
45:37
Speaker 1: a referendum on the future of democracy itself. Here's a clip.
45:41
Speaker 3: This president and those in power, those who benefit from
45:44
Speaker 3: keeping things the way they are, they are counting on
45:48
Speaker 3: your cynicism. They know they can't win you over with
45:53
Speaker 3: their policies. So they're hoping to make it as hard
45:57
Speaker 3: as possible for you to vote and to convince you
46:01
Speaker 3: that your vote does not matter. That is how they win.
46:05
Speaker 3: That is how they get to keep making decisions that
46:08
Speaker 3: affect your life and the lives of the people you love.
46:13
Speaker 3: That's how the economy will keep getting skewed to the
46:16
Speaker 3: wealthy and well-connected. How our health systems will let more
46:20
Speaker 3: people fall through the cracks. That's how a democracy withers,
46:28
Speaker 3: until it's no democracy at all. And we cannot let
46:33
Speaker 3: that happen. Do not let them take away your power.
46:40
Speaker 3: Do not let them take away your democracy. Make a
46:44
Speaker 3: plan right now for how you are going to get
46:47
Speaker 3: involved and vote. Do it as early as you can
46:50
Speaker 3: and tell your family and friends how they can vote too.
46:55
Speaker 3: Do what Americans have done for over two centuries when
46:58
Speaker 3: faced with even tougher times than this. All those quiet
47:04
Speaker 3: heroes who found the courage to keep marching, keep pushing
47:08
Speaker 3: in the face of hardship and injustice.
47:12
Speaker 1: So I will stipulate here that you and I both
47:18
Speaker 1: have saw drafts of that speech before. He delivered it.
47:23
Speaker 1: And the reason I want to stipulate that is because still,
47:28
Speaker 1: even though I read it many times, I was surprisingly
47:32
Speaker 1: moved by his delivery, which was, I think I have
47:37
Speaker 1: rarely seen him deliver a speech like that with that
47:43
Speaker 1: much emotion towards the end of that speech when it
47:49
Speaker 1: almost seemed like he was fighting back tears.
47:53
Speaker 2: That's right. I mean, there is this really stupid Washington
47:58
Speaker 2: narrative perpetuated by the New York Times as recently as,
48:01
Speaker 2: I don't know, fucking yesterday, that Obama is some sort
48:03
Speaker 2: of aloof Vulcan. I tried so hard not to yell
48:06
Speaker 2: about that for 24 hours. That's what, give me a
48:09
Speaker 2: platform with a couple million listeners and I'll take my shot.
48:12
Speaker 2: And that he's like this aloof Vulcan who feels no emotion.
48:16
Speaker 2: And he is the embodiment of hope And, you know,
48:19
Speaker 2: enjoy in a lot of ways when he speaks and
48:22
Speaker 2: he's funny and all of that. But there are only
48:25
Speaker 2: so many times in the thousands of times that you
48:29
Speaker 2: and I have seen him speak where you've seen him
48:30
Speaker 2: actually have to, I think, fight back choking up. And
48:34
Speaker 2: it is in times of great tragedy. You know, I
48:37
Speaker 2: think most notably and famously after the death of his
48:41
Speaker 2: grandmother right before the 2008 election, after Sandy Hook. talking
48:48
Speaker 2: about his daughters. But that's it. As people who know him,
48:51
Speaker 2: to hear him have that level of emotion about what
48:53
Speaker 2: is happening to his country is just so powerful and
48:58
Speaker 2: bespeaks the incredible stakes of this election, because that was
49:03
Speaker 2: ultimately his task here, right? He had two tasks, I guess.
49:07
Speaker 2: One was a first-person testimonial about who Joe Biden is
49:12
Speaker 2: and the kind of president he would be. And the
49:13
Speaker 2: other one was to raise the stakes for the election,
49:14
Speaker 2: to speak to people who are not deciding between Obama
49:17
Speaker 2: and Trump, but primarily people who are deciding between voting
49:20
Speaker 2: and not voting about why it matters. And like the
49:23
Speaker 2: through line of all of Obama's speeches over the years
49:26
Speaker 2: is that it's not about him. It's not about Joe Biden.
49:28
Speaker 2: It's not about Trump. It's about you. You, the voter,
49:32
Speaker 2: control what happens next. And he's telling you it is
49:36
Speaker 2: all on the fucking line right now. And you decide.
49:40
Speaker 2: what is going to happen in this country. And I
49:41
Speaker 2: thought that was powerful and riveting and inspiring and scary
49:45
Speaker 2: all at the same time.
49:48
Speaker 1: There are two main reactions to the speech, um, that
49:52
Speaker 1: I sort of want to talk about as a way
49:55
Speaker 1: to discuss what he was thinking. Um, which, you know,
50:01
Speaker 1: I'm not an expert on much in politics here, but
50:03
Speaker 1: I usually know what Barack Obama is, uh, what's on
50:07
Speaker 1: his mind. Um, So the most shallow reaction to the
50:11
Speaker 1: speech from many reporters is he's never taken on Trump
50:16
Speaker 1: like this. He's finally let loose on Trump. So I
50:20
Speaker 1: just want to read a lead from The New York Times.
50:22
Speaker 1: Former President Barack Obama reentered the national political debate with
50:26
Speaker 1: a scathing indictment of President Trump, assailing his successor as
50:29
Speaker 1: a threat to our democracy and a dramatic break from
50:32
Speaker 1: the normal deference former presidents usually show to incumbents.
50:35
Speaker 5: Mr.
50:35
Speaker 1: Obama ended a long period of public reticence with a
50:38
Speaker 1: lacerating assessment of Mr.
50:39
Speaker 4: Trump.
50:40
Speaker 1: Dan, that lead was from September 7th, 2018. We seem
50:47
Speaker 1: to not be able to remember just two years ago
50:51
Speaker 1: during the midterms when he consistently called Donald Trump a
50:56
Speaker 1: threat to our democracy. So we'll put that aside.
51:00
Speaker 2: I mean, in fairness, the New York Times right now
51:04
Speaker 2: I would fail a quiz about what happened on Tuesday.
51:06
Speaker 2: So two years does seem like a long time ago.
51:10
Speaker 1: It is also funny. I mean, he did, of course,
51:12
Speaker 1: directly mention Donald Trump. He said his name. I do
51:15
Speaker 1: think it was probably even more direct than he was
51:17
Speaker 1: in 2018. So I will give people that. But again,
51:20
Speaker 1: even the way it's funny that just describing reality, we've
51:25
Speaker 1: talked about this before, but just describing reality, the way
51:29
Speaker 1: everything is right now is seen as some gigantic hit
51:33
Speaker 1: on the person in the Oval Office. The way he
51:36
Speaker 1: coached it, I never expected that my successor would embrace
51:40
Speaker 1: my vision or continue my policies. I did hope for
51:42
Speaker 1: the sake of the country that Trump might show some
51:45
Speaker 1: interest in taking the job seriously, but he never did.
51:48
Speaker 1: Donald Trump hasn't grown into the job because he can't. Again,
51:51
Speaker 1: that sort of mirrors Michelle's line that he is in
51:55
Speaker 1: over his head. That it is not any personal vendetta
51:58
Speaker 1: against Donald Trump. Barack Obama did not leave office thinking
52:02
Speaker 1: that Donald Trump would embrace all of his policies, would
52:06
Speaker 1: keep all of the policies. He didn't expect that. But
52:08
Speaker 1: he hoped that maybe the seriousness of the job would
52:11
Speaker 1: weigh on him, and it did not. If that is
52:14
Speaker 1: taken as a massive frontal assault, I guess, sure. And then,
52:19
Speaker 1: of course, he went through this list. He said there
52:20
Speaker 1: are certain principles that shouldn't be Democrat or Republican, but American,
52:24
Speaker 1: like not using the military against peaceful protesters, like not
52:27
Speaker 1: calling the press the enemy. that a working government depends
52:30
Speaker 1: on the belief in facts and science and logic. And
52:32
Speaker 1: he said that Trump doesn't believe in those principles. Again,
52:34
Speaker 1: I haven't seen anyone argue otherwise. Those are all like
52:39
Speaker 1: he did. He used the military against peaceful protesters. We
52:42
Speaker 1: all saw it. So that was sort of one set
52:45
Speaker 1: of reactions about Obama taking on Trump. But I think
52:49
Speaker 1: there was another set of reactions from a lot more
52:52
Speaker 1: people that I do think is worth talking about. which
52:55
Speaker 1: was a lot of people said that Obama was unusually
52:57
Speaker 1: dark and had lost his optimism. And Jonathan Chait, who,
53:03
Speaker 1: you know, wrote a book about Obama and knows, you know,
53:06
Speaker 1: knows how Obama thinks pretty well, also said that it's
53:08
Speaker 1: the first time he has seen Obama express fear. And
53:14
Speaker 1: I do think it's fair to say that the speech
53:15
Speaker 1: felt different and more urgent, but I don't think I
53:20
Speaker 1: guess I would say that Obama's message and his central
53:23
Speaker 1: belief about politics in America haven't changed since 2004. And
53:29
Speaker 1: it goes to precisely what you said about the fact
53:33
Speaker 1: that it's not about he doesn't believe that democracy is
53:38
Speaker 1: about him. or Donald Trump, or Joe Biden, or Kamala Harris,
53:41
Speaker 1: or any one politician, but it is about us and
53:44
Speaker 1: what we can do. And the way that we knew
53:47
Speaker 1: that is because the whole purpose of the speech, as
53:50
Speaker 1: he said up top, was to speak to those people
53:53
Speaker 1: who were cynical, and speak to the people who have
53:56
Speaker 1: lost faith in the system. And he particularly said, you know,
53:59
Speaker 1: I can totally understand if you're a young person, and
54:01
Speaker 1: you're looking around at politics, and you're saying, what's the point?
54:05
Speaker 1: But then I think that the The part where he
54:08
Speaker 1: got emotional was the key to the whole speech. He
54:12
Speaker 1: gets emotional where he tells the story about a civil
54:16
Speaker 1: rights leader who once told him that the day Obama
54:18
Speaker 1: was born was the day he stepped into a jail
54:20
Speaker 1: cell for the first time. And Obama said, quote, whatever
54:23
Speaker 1: our backgrounds were all the children of Americans who fought
54:26
Speaker 1: the good fight, black Americans chained and whipped and hanged,
54:31
Speaker 1: spit on for trying to sit at lunch counters, beaten
54:34
Speaker 1: for trying to vote. If anyone had a right to
54:37
Speaker 1: believe that this democracy did not work and could not work.
54:40
Speaker 1: It was those Americans. And yet, instead of giving up,
54:43
Speaker 1: they joined together and said, somehow, some way, we are
54:46
Speaker 1: going to make this work. We are going to bring
54:48
Speaker 1: those words in our founding documents to life. Throughout Obama's
54:53
Speaker 1: entire life, the struggle for civil rights has always been
54:57
Speaker 1: central to the story he tells about America. And it's
55:00
Speaker 1: not just because it made his presidency possible. It's because
55:03
Speaker 1: it illustrates to him how black Americans who've been enslaved
55:08
Speaker 1: and subjugated and excluded from democracy in every way possible
55:12
Speaker 1: are the very same Americans who've shown the most faith
55:16
Speaker 1: in the power of democracy to change the country for
55:19
Speaker 1: the better. And if they didn't give into cynicism throughout
55:23
Speaker 1: all those decades, then neither should you. And that's where
55:26
Speaker 1: he became emotional because, and that's where he sort of has,
55:31
Speaker 1: that's where he has hope. That's where his hope comes from, right?
55:33
Speaker 1: That like, Yes, everything is on the line. Yes, this
55:36
Speaker 1: is very scary. But all of you actually have the
55:39
Speaker 1: power to do something about it. And that is amazing.
55:41
Speaker 1: That is amazing that you have agency, right? And so
55:45
Speaker 1: I took that part as pretty hopeful that we can
55:48
Speaker 1: do something about this.
55:50
Speaker 2: I agree with that. I don't think the speech was darker.
55:52
Speaker 2: I think it was starker than any speech before because
55:55
Speaker 2: the context is different. We are in the middle of
55:59
Speaker 2: a pandemic where a thousand Americans are dying every single day.
56:02
Speaker 2: Most people are out of work. The president is basically
56:06
Speaker 2: doing like Nixon pantomime from the White House with racist
56:13
Speaker 2: tropes about suburbs. Like this is serious fucking shit that
56:18
Speaker 2: is happening right now. But what he is not like–
56:22
Speaker 2: you're exactly right. He continues to believe that the solution
56:27
Speaker 2: to the problems is bottom up, not top down. And
56:31
Speaker 2: he's saying to you, the voter– This is your choice.
56:35
Speaker 2: You have the power to do it. I believe you
56:38
Speaker 2: can do it and you will do it, but it
56:40
Speaker 2: is your choice. And I think it is a, it
56:43
Speaker 2: felt like I said this last night, it felt different
56:45
Speaker 2: than any speech I've ever seen Obama give. Not because
56:50
Speaker 2: he is different, but because he was speaking to the
56:52
Speaker 2: moment in a way that was more powerful and starker
56:57
Speaker 2: than ever before. And context is everything here.
57:02
Speaker 1: Optimism or pessimism, I think are the wrong way to
57:04
Speaker 1: think about his tone and his beliefs because optimism and
57:08
Speaker 1: pessimism both involve predictions about what might ultimately happen.
57:12
Speaker 3: Right.
57:12
Speaker 1: And the question Obama wants us to ask is not
57:15
Speaker 1: what might happen, but what are we going to do
57:17
Speaker 1: about it? And in that way, it's not, I mean,
57:21
Speaker 1: he said, look, he said that in the 2004 convention speech, right?
57:26
Speaker 1: He was like, I'm not talking about blind optimism here.
57:29
Speaker 1: I'm talking about something more substantial here. the hope of
57:32
Speaker 1: slaves sitting around campfires singing freedom songs. And that sounded
57:38
Speaker 1: nice and hopeful and cheery in 2004 at the time.
57:42
Speaker 1: But that idea of slaves singing freedom songs when they
57:46
Speaker 1: were enslaved, when people were enslaved and believing that they
57:51
Speaker 1: could have a better life and then fighting for that,
57:54
Speaker 1: that is hope. And that's not like, you know, it's
57:58
Speaker 1: so funny because I saw so many people on Twitter
58:00
Speaker 1: being like, Does Obama know something that we don't? Is
58:02
Speaker 1: he worried? It's like, it's not about what he knows
58:06
Speaker 1: that's gonna happen. It's that he knows that if we
58:09
Speaker 1: don't vote, that if we sit out, that if we
58:10
Speaker 1: don't do enough, then yes, something bad will happen.
58:14
Speaker 2: Something bad is happening, right?
58:16
Speaker 1: Right, yeah, yeah, we're already in it.
58:17
Speaker 2: We're fucking living it. I do, like, obviously we love Obama.
58:22
Speaker 2: So much of what we have in our lives is
58:24
Speaker 2: because Obama hired us at one point. And so take
58:27
Speaker 2: that stipulation. We have– I mean you have written many,
58:31
Speaker 2: many of the words that have ever come out of
58:33
Speaker 2: his mouth. We have watched and participated in most of
58:37
Speaker 2: the big speeches he's given over the last decade. But
58:41
Speaker 2: when I watch some of the commentary on this, I'm like,
58:43
Speaker 2: do you people listen to what he actually fucking says?
58:46
Speaker 2: There were a lot of people last night who were like,
58:48
Speaker 2: I thought Barack Obama said the arc of the moral
58:50
Speaker 2: universe bent towards justice. Listen to the words he said,
58:54
Speaker 2: which is that we have a responsibility to bend it.
58:58
Speaker 1: Remember when everyone made fun of we are the ones
59:01
Speaker 1: we've been waiting for? That's what he was fucking talking about.
59:04
Speaker 1: that's that was back in 2008 i mean and i'm
59:07
Speaker 1: you know he said specifically we've talked about this a
59:09
Speaker 1: million times democracy is not transactional it is not about
59:13
Speaker 1: you give me your vote and i will fix everything
59:16
Speaker 1: and i do think that you know part of the
59:19
Speaker 1: issue when obama was elected in 2008 is a lot
59:21
Speaker 1: of people thought we have we have elected this charismatic
59:26
Speaker 1: guy who's wonderful and gives good speech, inspiring, whatever. And
59:31
Speaker 1: he's going to fix everything. 2008's over. We can go home.
59:34
Speaker 1: Barack Obama's going to take care of everything. And it's
59:36
Speaker 1: not the system that we have set up, right? We
59:38
Speaker 1: don't elect a king. We don't even have a parliamentary system.
59:41
Speaker 1: We have a fucking Congress. We have state houses everywhere.
59:43
Speaker 1: We have a very complex system of democracy, a republic
59:47
Speaker 1: that requires citizens to be active every single day. And
59:53
Speaker 1: that is going to be true if, God forbid, Donald
59:55
Speaker 1: Trump wins another term. And it's going to be true
59:57
Speaker 1: if Joe Biden wins a term as well. It's not
1:00:00
Speaker 1: like Joe Biden wins, but it's not over.
1:00:03
Speaker 5: It is not.
1:00:04
Speaker 1: We can't count on Joe Biden to go fix everything.
1:00:06
Speaker 1: We have to keep this up. And that is Obama's
1:00:08
Speaker 1: central message. It has always been his central message in 2004.
1:00:12
Speaker 1: The reality has changed. These are darker times, but the
1:00:15
Speaker 1: central message is the same.
1:00:16
Speaker 2: Citizenship is a full-time job. That's it. That is his point.
1:00:20
Speaker 1: That's it.
1:00:20
Speaker 2: And if we don't do our job This time, in
1:00:24
Speaker 2: this context, we're in big fucking trouble. That's what this
1:00:26
Speaker 2: speech was about.
1:00:28
Speaker 1: VoteSaveAmerica.com Adopts North Carolina. Yeah, and Arizona. All right, final question,
1:00:35
Speaker 1: and then we can go. Joe Biden formally accepts his
1:00:38
Speaker 1: nomination tonight, the final night of the convention, with a
1:00:41
Speaker 1: keynote address to, again, like Kamala Harris, a mostly empty room.
1:00:46
Speaker 1: What piece of business, what pieces of business does Biden
1:00:50
Speaker 1: still have to get done?
1:00:52
Speaker 2: Joe Biden's task is to use this huge platform he
1:00:55
Speaker 2: has to explain to the American people why he can
1:00:58
Speaker 2: fix what Donald Trump has wrought. People, we have said
1:01:02
Speaker 2: this before, Joe Biden has high name ID, but he
1:01:04
Speaker 2: is not deeply known, particularly among the voters who will
1:01:07
Speaker 2: decide this election. As we know, periodic or calcined voters
1:01:11
Speaker 2: pay less attention to politics, certainly than almost everyone. And
1:01:15
Speaker 2: so he has to, even though he has been on
1:01:17
Speaker 2: the national stage for a long time, he has to
1:01:18
Speaker 2: introduce himself to the country. And that includes... some of
1:01:22
Speaker 2: the substance of his agenda, what he will do. But
1:01:25
Speaker 2: it also includes, and this is what was so important
1:01:28
Speaker 2: about Joe Biden's speech and what Barack Obama and Michelle
1:01:30
Speaker 2: Obama and everyone else said about Joe Biden is, the
1:01:33
Speaker 2: person and the policy are completely interconnected because voters have
1:01:38
Speaker 2: heard politicians for decades talk about their policy plans. They
1:01:42
Speaker 2: need to know that they are the kind of person
1:01:43
Speaker 2: who will execute on them. And so it is the
1:01:45
Speaker 2: intersection of Joe Biden's personal story, his character, his values,
1:01:50
Speaker 2: and then what he will do when he is elected.
1:01:54
Speaker 1: And look, that's a tough piece of business. I do think,
1:01:58
Speaker 1: you know, if you ask people who didn't know much
1:02:01
Speaker 1: about Joe Biden before the convention, you're right that they
1:02:05
Speaker 1: want to know who he is and what he's going
1:02:06
Speaker 1: to do. Who he is, I think, has been answered
1:02:09
Speaker 1: very effectively by his family through a lot of these videos,
1:02:13
Speaker 1: through a lot of these testimonials from people who know him.
1:02:15
Speaker 1: So I do think people have a lot more knowledge
1:02:17
Speaker 1: right now about who Joe Biden is and what values
1:02:20
Speaker 1: drive him. I think that has been accomplished by this convention.
1:02:23
Speaker 1: What he's going to do hasn't been as accomplished just yet.
1:02:28
Speaker 1: I think Bernie Sanders did some of that work. I
1:02:29
Speaker 1: think on Wednesday night, Wednesday night sort of talked about
1:02:33
Speaker 1: the stakes in terms of different issues. And I think
1:02:36
Speaker 1: the convention did a great job of laying out those
1:02:38
Speaker 1: issues and talking about what Biden wanted to do. But
1:02:40
Speaker 1: I think Biden's big piece of business is talking about
1:02:43
Speaker 1: his vision and what he's going to do as president.
1:02:45
Speaker 1: And like you said, how he's going to get that done.
1:02:48
Speaker 1: And I will say the reason I think that's a
1:02:49
Speaker 1: tough job is because it is very easy for that
1:02:52
Speaker 1: to sound pedestrian and workmanlike in a speech. And the
1:02:56
Speaker 1: trick of a speech is to sort of lift that up.
1:02:59
Speaker 1: But you should know that when he is talking about
1:03:01
Speaker 1: his agenda, again, not really for us, not really for
1:03:05
Speaker 1: the performance judges. It's for people out there who are like,
1:03:09
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure I want to vote for Joe Biden.
1:03:11
Speaker 1: But I really just want to know what specifically he's
1:03:14
Speaker 1: going to do to make my life different and how
1:03:16
Speaker 1: we're going to get there. And he does need to
1:03:18
Speaker 1: do that tonight.
1:03:18
Speaker 2: I mean, this is where the absence of applause makes
1:03:21
Speaker 2: it so much harder. Because in a normal speech, you say,
1:03:25
Speaker 2: we're going to raise the minimum wage to $ 15. And
1:03:27
Speaker 2: everyone cheers. And it seems great. When you say that,
1:03:31
Speaker 2: there's always a danger of a laundry list doing that
1:03:33
Speaker 2: in an empty room. So this is a very challenging
1:03:37
Speaker 2: environment to do this in. And it matters. You know,
1:03:41
Speaker 2: this will be the biggest audience he will have for
1:03:43
Speaker 2: a speech this entire campaign. So it's his best chance
1:03:47
Speaker 2: to make his unfiltered case to the voter about why
1:03:50
Speaker 2: he is the right person to be president and Donald
1:03:52
Speaker 2: Trump is not.
1:03:53
Speaker 8: That's right.
1:03:54
Speaker 1: All right. When we come back, we'll have Dan's interview
1:03:56
Speaker 1: with Elizabeth Warren.
1:04:06
Speaker 2: Senator Elizabeth Warren, thank you for coming back on Pod
1:04:08
Speaker 2: Save America. It's always great to talk to you.
1:04:10
Speaker 6: And it's always good to be with the pod.
1:04:13
Speaker 2: So I want to start with your speech last night. Obviously,
1:04:16
Speaker 2: when you imagine the convention speech you would be giving
1:04:19
Speaker 2: at the 2020 convention, it probably involved people. How did
1:04:22
Speaker 2: you go about preparing to give a speech under these
1:04:25
Speaker 2: very unusual circumstances?
1:04:27
Speaker 6: So actually, the part for me was not as much
1:04:30
Speaker 6: about the people. I mean, look, because you've just readjusted
1:04:34
Speaker 6: your brain. So that's not what this is going to be.
1:04:37
Speaker 6: We're going to find another way to talk to a
1:04:39
Speaker 6: lot of folks. I only had five minutes. So sure.
1:04:44
Speaker 6: I'm just going to describe everything that, you know, I
1:04:47
Speaker 6: think we ought to be working on and why I
1:04:48
Speaker 6: think we ought to be hopeful in the places, you know,
1:04:50
Speaker 6: why we have to, to get rid of Donald Trump.
1:04:53
Speaker 6: So it was a, how to make a coherent argument
1:04:59
Speaker 6: to get in key pieces and to be able to
1:05:03
Speaker 6: make it personal because it That is what this is about.
1:05:08
Speaker 6: This election is about making the opportunity. And I really
1:05:12
Speaker 6: wanted to tell the story of what so many parents
1:05:18
Speaker 6: are going through right now and have gone through before
1:05:25
Speaker 6: the pandemic hit and now that the pandemic has hit.
1:05:29
Speaker 6: I feel like we need to have a federal government
1:05:35
Speaker 6: that is on the side of human beings. That's on
1:05:38
Speaker 6: the side of folks out here who are just working
1:05:43
Speaker 6: so hard to keep it together day to day. So
1:05:46
Speaker 6: that's what I wanted to be able to do and
1:05:48
Speaker 6: do all that in five minutes.
1:05:51
Speaker 2: Never easy. You know, obviously your audience was everyone tuning in,
1:05:55
Speaker 2: but did you have a particular segment of the electorate
1:05:57
Speaker 2: that you were trying to persuade or motivate when you
1:05:59
Speaker 2: were giving the speech sort of a target audience, if
1:06:01
Speaker 2: you will?
1:06:02
Speaker 6: Yes. And it was, it's, two separate segments that I
1:06:07
Speaker 6: really cared about. One segment is mamas, mamas and daddies, okay?
1:06:14
Speaker 6: Folks with children who are struggling through this to say,
1:06:19
Speaker 6: I hear you, I see you. Joe Biden hears you
1:06:22
Speaker 6: and sees you. Kamala Harris hears you and sees you.
1:06:27
Speaker 6: And we need you in this fight. This fight matters
1:06:30
Speaker 6: in a very personal way to you. But the second half,
1:06:34
Speaker 6: is all the people who don't have kids. All the
1:06:37
Speaker 6: people whose either kids are grown or they don't yet
1:06:39
Speaker 6: have kids, they never thought about kids, or they don't
1:06:41
Speaker 6: like kids. The reason I wanted to reach them is
1:06:47
Speaker 6: that's what the argument I wanted to make was about.
1:06:51
Speaker 6: Childcare is not like some favor that we should be
1:06:56
Speaker 6: doing for mamas and daddies who are struggling. Child care
1:07:05
Speaker 6: is how we keep our economy going. And we invest
1:07:11
Speaker 6: in roads and bridges and power and communications all so
1:07:17
Speaker 6: that this economy can go forward, all so that people
1:07:21
Speaker 6: have an opportunity to get out and take on a
1:07:24
Speaker 6: job and make their families financially secure. But we still
1:07:32
Speaker 6: build an economy as if there is one full-time stay-at-home parent.
1:07:37
Speaker 6: And that's just not reality in the 21st century. So
1:07:42
Speaker 6: I really feel like it's both of those. And it's
1:07:47
Speaker 6: a layer into that. I've heard so many moms and
1:07:51
Speaker 6: dads who are so worried about their kids. School-age kids,
1:07:57
Speaker 6: can schools open safely? Little babies. On the campaign trail,
1:08:03
Speaker 6: I heard about child care in my town halls. I
1:08:06
Speaker 6: heard about it in the selfie lines. Not from the press,
1:08:10
Speaker 6: but I heard about it from the people who were there.
1:08:13
Speaker 6: And I just think that's why it's important to speak
1:08:18
Speaker 6: to them directly.
1:08:20
Speaker 2: What's your level of optimism that a Biden administration could
1:08:25
Speaker 2: make addressing the child care crisis in this country a
1:08:28
Speaker 2: centerpiece of their economic agenda?
1:08:30
Speaker 4: Wow.
1:08:31
Speaker 6: Notice your verb, that they could do it. Are you kidding?
1:08:34
Speaker 6: I think the moment is ripe. I mean, I just,
1:08:38
Speaker 6: so many people who are at home with school-aged children,
1:08:43
Speaker 6: with little babies, and mamas trying to hold down a job,
1:08:47
Speaker 6: two mamas are trying to hold down jobs, both parents
1:08:50
Speaker 6: are trying to do this, have suddenly realized, damn, this
1:08:55
Speaker 6: system just doesn't work. I mean, talk about it is
1:08:59
Speaker 6: time to declare broken big time. This is it. And
1:09:04
Speaker 6: that means people are more ready. You know, actually, I
1:09:08
Speaker 6: hadn't thought about this, Dan, but do you ever think
1:09:11
Speaker 6: about part of how we got the CFPB, the consumer
1:09:15
Speaker 6: agency with President Obama? Enough people have been cheated. And
1:09:20
Speaker 6: enough people had looked around and said, I don't like
1:09:23
Speaker 6: this anymore. We've got to make change here. So this
1:09:29
Speaker 6: is a moment. We get a Democratic Congress. It's going
1:09:32
Speaker 6: to take both, Democratic House, Democratic Senate. And Joe Biden
1:09:37
Speaker 6: and Kamala Harris in the White House. Boy, this could happen.
1:09:42
Speaker 2: You know, by bringing up the CFPB, you lead into
1:09:45
Speaker 2: what sort of my next question is, is how– Joe
1:09:50
Speaker 2: Biden has talked about this, and I imagine informed somewhat
1:09:54
Speaker 2: by the many conversations you guys have reported about having
1:09:55
Speaker 2: on policy, is he wants an FDR-style presidency to respond
1:09:59
Speaker 2: to this crisis. The Affordable Care Act, the CFPB, Dodd-Frank
1:10:03
Speaker 2: was a response to the 2008 financial crisis. How do
1:10:07
Speaker 2: you think the combination of crises we're facing right now
1:10:13
Speaker 2: between the pandemic, the the large national debate we've been
1:10:17
Speaker 2: having about structural racism, the effects of climate change that
1:10:22
Speaker 2: we're feeling in California, what happened in Iowa last week
1:10:26
Speaker 2: with derecho. How does all that combine to create an
1:10:29
Speaker 2: environment for big, bold, progressive action with a political system and,
1:10:35
Speaker 2: to some sense, a Democratic Senate that has in the
1:10:37
Speaker 2: past included some incrementalism as the way in which it
1:10:41
Speaker 2: approached these issues?
1:10:41
Speaker 6: So I think like anything, it's the moment. we couldn't
1:10:47
Speaker 6: have passed the CFPB the year before the 2008-2009 crash.
1:10:54
Speaker 6: We just couldn't have. There wasn't enough external pressure and
1:10:59
Speaker 6: there wasn't enough internal attention, notwithstanding the fact that George W.
1:11:04
Speaker 6: Bush was president and so on. But I'm just saying,
1:11:07
Speaker 6: the moment wasn't there, and I'll tell you the truth,
1:11:09
Speaker 6: the moment wouldn't have been there two years later. It
1:11:13
Speaker 6: was the moment when people were feeling in a very
1:11:17
Speaker 6: tangible way. In other words, the outside was ready, but
1:11:22
Speaker 6: also inside attention and pressure on this because President Obama,
1:11:27
Speaker 6: God bless him and his team, were trying to rescue
1:11:30
Speaker 6: a broken economy and farsighted enough to say, let's put
1:11:35
Speaker 6: in place the pieces to make sure this doesn't happen
1:11:37
Speaker 6: again in three years and again three years after that
1:11:40
Speaker 6: and again in three years after that. And so it
1:11:43
Speaker 6: was that moment. It was You know, we talk about
1:11:46
Speaker 6: the Overton window, that you shift what is possible. But
1:11:51
Speaker 6: this is a little different. I don't know that it
1:11:53
Speaker 6: has a name.
1:11:53
Speaker 4: Should I?
1:11:54
Speaker 6: I don't know. Can I call it?
1:11:55
Speaker 2: Name it. Let's do it.
1:11:59
Speaker 6: Let's get our own name going for this. But the
1:12:01
Speaker 6: point is, the moment when there's enough outside pressure and
1:12:08
Speaker 6: when there's enough inside attention. You know, and here's the
1:12:13
Speaker 6: other part. Part of when I talk about what creates
1:12:17
Speaker 6: the right moment, look how many young people are engaged now.
1:12:21
Speaker 6: I am so inspired by young people because they're so
1:12:24
Speaker 6: policy oriented. You know, Ayanna Pressley always teases me and says,
1:12:30
Speaker 6: policy is your love language. You know that this is,
1:12:34
Speaker 6: but it is. And we've got so many young people
1:12:38
Speaker 6: now who care about the details. They care about what
1:12:43
Speaker 6: a police reform bill looks like. They care about what
1:12:49
Speaker 6: climate policy looks like. These are our future elected officials,
1:12:57
Speaker 6: our future volunteers, our future small dollar donors. They care
1:13:03
Speaker 6: about big change. And they are creating this moment where
1:13:09
Speaker 6: we can make big changes.
1:13:13
Speaker 2: Enacting a policy agenda, right, the discussion about how we
1:13:15
Speaker 2: fix the country is an intersection of what and how.
1:13:18
Speaker 5: Yep.
1:13:19
Speaker 6: Right.
1:13:19
Speaker 2: And you need both. That's right. And the what is
1:13:24
Speaker 2: often to a lot of people somewhat evident. It's the
1:13:27
Speaker 2: how that gets tangled up to do any of the
1:13:29
Speaker 2: things you're talking about. We cannot depend on. eight to
1:13:33
Speaker 2: nine of Mitch McConnell's friends to agree. How optimistic are
1:13:37
Speaker 2: you that you'll be able to convince your Senate colleagues
1:13:39
Speaker 2: to join you in eliminating the filibuster if we see
1:13:44
Speaker 2: what we expect, which is Republican obstruction?
1:13:47
Speaker 6: So when we've got a Democratic majority in the Senate,
1:13:51
Speaker 6: I think when Mitch McConnell starts to block our first actions,
1:13:56
Speaker 6: which I think are going to be very popular actions,
1:14:00
Speaker 6: important things to get done, I think as soon as
1:14:04
Speaker 6: that happens, we're going to have a lot of senators
1:14:08
Speaker 6: who are going to say, we need to get rid
1:14:10
Speaker 6: of the filibuster. And notice, it's already happening. I mean,
1:14:15
Speaker 6: having President Obama come out and say, we just cannot be.
1:14:22
Speaker 6: The Senate of a dozen years ago doesn't exist anymore.
1:14:26
Speaker 6: We cannot... have filibuster block everything that Joe Biden and
1:14:32
Speaker 6: Kamala Harris want to get done. Having President Obama say
1:14:35
Speaker 6: that was very important. And I'm so glad he did that.
1:14:39
Speaker 6: And I think that was, it helped a lot of
1:14:42
Speaker 6: other senators. I mean, I'm, you know, we already had
1:14:46
Speaker 6: a cabal that was really into this, but I think
1:14:50
Speaker 6: it helped a lot of other senators shift over and say, yeah,
1:14:54
Speaker 6: we got to be realistic because look, People are not
1:14:58
Speaker 6: going to get out there and fight the next 75
1:15:01
Speaker 6: days to elect someone only to have nothing change. They're
1:15:07
Speaker 6: in this fight, sure, because they don't like Donald Trump.
1:15:12
Speaker 6: They're in this fight because they do like Joe and Kamala.
1:15:16
Speaker 6: But they're in this fight for change. And that's what
1:15:19
Speaker 6: we've got to do.
1:15:19
Speaker 2: And, you know, look.
1:15:21
Speaker 6: I'll put the question back to you. You've been vocal
1:15:24
Speaker 6: on filibuster. You and the pod guys, you know, so
1:15:30
Speaker 6: that's inside, outside. That's what it's going to take. I'm
1:15:34
Speaker 6: meeting with folks on the inside. I'll keep talking about
1:15:37
Speaker 6: it publicly, but you keep talking about it too. Because
1:15:41
Speaker 6: this is like one of those key pieces to make
1:15:45
Speaker 6: real change. And if you're not willing to get rid
1:15:47
Speaker 6: of the filibuster, then you just, you're not there on change.
1:15:51
Speaker 2: Well, I promise you that our to-do list is help
1:15:55
Speaker 2: get people to defeat Donald Trump and then help get
1:15:58
Speaker 2: people to defeat the filibuster, in that order.
1:16:00
Speaker 8: Yep, yep.
1:16:01
Speaker 6: And I want to pull you in at some point.
1:16:04
Speaker 6: It's all the economic things we talk about, but it's
1:16:06
Speaker 6: also dealing with corruption.
1:16:08
Speaker 3: Yep.
1:16:09
Speaker 6: We've just got to. Barack Obama moved presidential candidates in
1:16:14
Speaker 6: the right direction on funding, put in some restraints on lobbyists.
1:16:21
Speaker 6: But the world around, you know, it's the kudzu has
1:16:25
Speaker 6: been growing and we've really got to come in and
1:16:29
Speaker 6: hack it back. I hope the gardening metaphor works. appeal
1:16:33
Speaker 6: to you there. Okay, good. Yes.
1:16:35
Speaker 2: I'm not sure I know entirely what kudzu is, but
1:16:37
Speaker 2: I use context clues to figure it out.
1:16:39
Speaker 6: It eats up everything.
1:16:40
Speaker 2: It seemed bad, yes.
1:16:42
Speaker 5: That's right.
1:16:42
Speaker 6: If you don't attend to it, it actually will take
1:16:44
Speaker 6: down a house. There are examples of this.
1:16:47
Speaker 2: Okay. This seems like a very well-done metaphor. Yes, it does.
1:16:50
Speaker 6: Perfect to describe lobbying.
1:16:53
Speaker 5: Yes.
1:16:54
Speaker 2: Is there anything that you are particularly looking to hear
1:16:57
Speaker 2: for Joe Biden as he prepares to address the convention tonight?
1:17:01
Speaker 6: So, My sense of it is two things. First, Joe
1:17:07
Speaker 6: will be the human being that we have missed for
1:17:11
Speaker 6: the last three and a half years now. Joe Biden
1:17:15
Speaker 6: is a decent man who's in public service to serve
1:17:19
Speaker 6: the public, not to flatter himself, enrich his family and
1:17:27
Speaker 6: his friends. and spend all his time worrying about his
1:17:31
Speaker 6: ratings and his new version of his reality TV show. So,
1:17:36
Speaker 6: but I think this matters. I mean, it's not just,
1:17:37
Speaker 6: I'm not just here to throw insults at Donald Trump,
1:17:40
Speaker 6: although I'd be glad to. I could do that. No,
1:17:44
Speaker 6: but I really mean it as, I think about this
1:17:47
Speaker 6: in leadership. It's not just, leadership is not just getting
1:17:55
Speaker 6: everybody decision right and people look at you and say,
1:17:57
Speaker 6: I like that decision, I like that. It's feeling like
1:18:01
Speaker 6: people care about you and that all the decisions you
1:18:04
Speaker 6: don't understand are coming from the right place. Can I
1:18:09
Speaker 6: tell you a quick story? Actually, I'll tell you a
1:18:11
Speaker 6: story around this. My grandmother, she was born in the
1:18:16
Speaker 6: late 1800s. And my mother was born, as they used
1:18:19
Speaker 6: to call it, very late in life to her. I
1:18:21
Speaker 6: was born very late in life to my mother. So
1:18:23
Speaker 6: my grandmother is really old. And When she was in
1:18:26
Speaker 6: her 90s, when I was a little girl, she used
1:18:29
Speaker 6: to talk about the Great Depression. And she said she
1:18:34
Speaker 6: loved Franklin Roosevelt. And I kind of think, I'm not
1:18:38
Speaker 6: sure they were very political ever before then. She never
1:18:40
Speaker 6: talked about it much after that. But she loved Franklin Roosevelt.
1:18:44
Speaker 6: And I can remember asking her why. And she said, well,
1:18:48
Speaker 6: she said, Franklin Roosevelt made it safe to put money
1:18:53
Speaker 6: in banks. Pause. And I'm sure he did a lot
1:18:57
Speaker 6: of other good stuff too. And I only say that
1:19:02
Speaker 6: by way of saying, if you do things... You want
1:19:07
Speaker 6: to know that somebody's fighting on your side. So I
1:19:09
Speaker 6: think that's number one for Joe Biden. And then number two,
1:19:12
Speaker 6: that he really does have plans to do things that
1:19:17
Speaker 6: it's not going to all be, yes, I have a
1:19:18
Speaker 6: good heart, but I'm going to just stand by. No,
1:19:21
Speaker 6: it's yes, I have a good heart and I'm going
1:19:22
Speaker 6: to use that good heart and my brain and all
1:19:25
Speaker 6: of my energy and Kamala and all of my friends
1:19:30
Speaker 6: to make the changes we so desperately need to make.
1:19:32
Speaker 6: So good heart. and a determination that's concrete. Here are
1:19:38
Speaker 6: changes we're going to make.
1:19:40
Speaker 2: You've been helping lead the fight to deal with the
1:19:43
Speaker 2: politicization of the Postal Service. You wrote a letter calling
1:19:47
Speaker 2: for an investigation from the inspector general. What do you
1:19:49
Speaker 2: hope to learn from that investigation? Is there any chance
1:19:52
Speaker 2: that we would get findings by the election?
1:19:57
Speaker 6: So, you know, I'm a huge fan of inspectors general.
1:20:01
Speaker 6: I was actually long before Barack Obama came along. And
1:20:06
Speaker 6: I was really glad that I had sent a letter
1:20:10
Speaker 6: to the IG saying, whoa, hold on here just a minute.
1:20:15
Speaker 6: This guy owns stock in companies that compete with the
1:20:20
Speaker 6: post office. He's doing business with the post office. This
1:20:23
Speaker 6: looks like a bunch of conflicts of interest here to me.
1:20:26
Speaker 6: Will you do an investigation? And actually in a pretty
1:20:29
Speaker 6: timely way, the IG stepped up and said yes. Now,
1:20:33
Speaker 6: that hasn't stopped DeJoy. He's out there speculating in Amazon stock, evidently,
1:20:38
Speaker 6: and all kinds of stuff. But partly, it is the
1:20:42
Speaker 6: reminder to DeJoy. We're watching, and there are things here
1:20:47
Speaker 6: that are illegal. So partly, that's what I want. I
1:20:53
Speaker 6: just want the IG to stay on it. He will
1:20:56
Speaker 6: get an answer. But I also have questions for DeJoy tomorrow.
1:21:01
Speaker 6: You want to think about those?
1:21:02
Speaker 5: I do.
1:21:03
Speaker 2: I would love to hear about those.
1:21:04
Speaker 3: Yes.
1:21:05
Speaker 6: So I don't get to ask questions because it's a
1:21:07
Speaker 6: House hearing. I kind of think Mitch McConnell's not going
1:21:10
Speaker 6: to do a hearing in the Senate. But look, we
1:21:15
Speaker 6: all know what Donald Trump has said. He has been
1:21:19
Speaker 6: spreading lies and conspiracy theories about mail-in voting during this
1:21:24
Speaker 6: pandemic because he doesn't want people to vote. He knows
1:21:28
Speaker 6: that If everybody votes, Donald Trump loses. So this is
1:21:32
Speaker 6: one of his voter suppression techniques is to keep people
1:21:35
Speaker 6: from voting. And he puts DeJoy in, I believe, to
1:21:39
Speaker 6: try to shut down the post office. So the question
1:21:42
Speaker 6: I want to ask him is, has the president or
1:21:46
Speaker 6: have any of his staff ever requested or suggested that
1:21:52
Speaker 6: DeJoy take any action? based on Trump's opposition to mail-in
1:21:57
Speaker 6: voting or to make it more difficult for people to
1:21:59
Speaker 6: vote by mail. I want to know what kind of
1:22:02
Speaker 6: conspiracy we have going on here. I want to know,
1:22:08
Speaker 6: you know, DeJoy had, what is it, 671 mail sorting
1:22:13
Speaker 6: machines removed by the end of September. They can sort
1:22:18
Speaker 6: over 20 million pieces of paper an hour. I don't
1:22:23
Speaker 6: want to just hear, oh, I'm not going to take
1:22:25
Speaker 6: out any more. I want to know, is he going
1:22:28
Speaker 6: to replace the mail sorting machines that he ordered the
1:22:33
Speaker 6: UPS to remove? Same kind of thing on overtime. I
1:22:40
Speaker 6: want to know if DeJoy is going to commit to
1:22:44
Speaker 6: approve all the requests for overtime between now and the election.
1:22:52
Speaker 6: That's just a few of them. But I've got a
1:22:55
Speaker 6: lot of questions for this guy because I think there's
1:23:00
Speaker 6: a lot he needs to answer for. He's not only
1:23:04
Speaker 6: destroying or trying to destroy one of the Central American institutions,
1:23:15
Speaker 6: our post office, but he's also trying to destroy the
1:23:20
Speaker 6: upcoming elections. And he needs to be held accountable for that.
1:23:25
Speaker 6: More importantly, he needs to be stopped.
1:23:28
Speaker 2: I'm curious about whether any of your Republican colleagues have
1:23:32
Speaker 2: expressed some concerns about this. Prior to this election, Republicans
1:23:35
Speaker 2: in many states benefited at a greater rate than Democrats
1:23:38
Speaker 2: from vote by mail. And we tend to talk about
1:23:41
Speaker 2: the election and the ballots because that's what we focus on.
1:23:44
Speaker 2: But as you know from all your constituents, there are
1:23:47
Speaker 2: veterans not getting their prescriptions. There are people not getting paychecks,
1:23:50
Speaker 2: not getting bills that are delayed. And obviously the tendency
1:23:56
Speaker 2: of many of your, maybe all of your Republican colleagues
1:23:59
Speaker 2: in the Senate have been to sort of abide silently
1:24:01
Speaker 2: by Donald Trump's. But this seems like a pretty big
1:24:05
Speaker 2: bridge politically, even if we put aside the morality and
1:24:09
Speaker 2: legality of all of this, but politically to be on
1:24:11
Speaker 2: the side of delaying prescription drugs to veterans to steal
1:24:15
Speaker 2: an election seems bad. Any chance there's going to be
1:24:18
Speaker 2: bipartisan pressure put on Trump here?
1:24:21
Speaker 6: You know, my view on this is that the post
1:24:25
Speaker 6: office is very nonpartisan, right? And has been forever. Rural areas,
1:24:33
Speaker 6: both in states that have urban and rural and states
1:24:35
Speaker 6: that are almost entirely rural, they count on those post offices.
1:24:40
Speaker 6: As you said, people having prescriptions delivered, pension checks getting
1:24:45
Speaker 6: delivered on time. This is going to hurt in my view,
1:24:50
Speaker 6: it's going to hurt Republicans as much as Democrats. But
1:24:52
Speaker 6: here's the thing. I appreciate your asking about do they
1:24:56
Speaker 6: say things quietly on the floor of the Senate or
1:24:58
Speaker 6: out in the hallway. To me, that's not what this
1:25:02
Speaker 6: is about. This is about are you willing to stand
1:25:04
Speaker 6: up and say it out loud? You know, Trump told
1:25:09
Speaker 6: us what he is doing. He didn't say it behind
1:25:12
Speaker 6: closed doors. It wasn't leaked in the New York Times.
1:25:17
Speaker 6: This wasn't a well-known secret around Washington that was thinly sourced.
1:25:22
Speaker 6: He told us flat out that if people vote by mail,
1:25:26
Speaker 6: he is going to lose and the Republicans are going
1:25:29
Speaker 6: to lose. And where were all those Republican senators and
1:25:34
Speaker 6: representatives who stood up and said, wait, you have now
1:25:39
Speaker 6: gone too far. We cannot shut down the post office
1:25:43
Speaker 6: in order not to have ballots counted. And in order
1:25:49
Speaker 6: for people to feel like there's no point in casting
1:25:51
Speaker 6: a ballot. No, they stood silently by. And to me,
1:25:56
Speaker 6: that's enabling Donald Trump. And I'm cutting no slack for
1:26:00
Speaker 6: any of them on this. And this is why I
1:26:04
Speaker 6: think we need to push so hard back 75 days.
1:26:10
Speaker 6: We not only have to keep up why we've got
1:26:12
Speaker 6: to get everybody turned out to vote, but we've got
1:26:15
Speaker 6: to keep up the pressure on access to that vote.
1:26:17
Speaker 6: And that includes keeping up the pressure on the post office.
1:26:21
Speaker 2: Well, Senator Elizabeth Warren, that seems as good a place
1:26:23
Speaker 2: to end as any. Thank you so much for being here.
1:26:26
Speaker 2: It is always wonderful to talk to you. And we
1:26:29
Speaker 2: would love to talk to you many, many times between
1:26:30
Speaker 2: now and election day. Thank you so much.
1:26:33
Speaker 6: So let's do it. Thanks so much, Dan. It's always
1:26:35
Speaker 6: good to talk to you. 75 days, 75 days.
1:26:44
Speaker 1: Thanks to Elizabeth Warren for joining us today. We'll see
1:26:46
Speaker 1: you tonight for the big pre-show. Go to cricket.com slash convention.
1:26:52
Speaker 1: We'll see you there. And we will see you guys
1:26:54
Speaker 1: again tomorrow for our Friday bonus pod with the two
1:26:57
Speaker 1: of us, Ann Lovett and Tommy.
1:27:00
Speaker 2: You cannot get rid of us. We are everywhere.
1:27:02
Speaker 6: We're here.
1:27:03
Speaker 1: We're here. And of course, there's another group thread tonight too.
1:27:06
Speaker 2: Group thread. There's a pod on Monday, pod next Thursday,
1:27:08
Speaker 2: maybe some group threads next week.
1:27:09
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1:27:10
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1:27:12
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1:27:16
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1:27:19
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