Latest / Financial Survival Network / You Can Be Exceptional -- Joe Navarro #5807

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You Can Be Exceptional -- Joe Navarro #5807 · Financial Survival Network

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You were listening to Carrie Letz's Financial Survival Network, where you get valuable information
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and welcome. This is Financial Survival Network. I'm your host, Carrie
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Leuts. We have a very special guest for you today. The last time
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I had him on the show was eleven years ago. He had a best
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selling book that's been translated into thirty two languages around the globe. The name
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is Joe Navarro, Joe former FBI agent. That was quite a career in
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and of itself, but it looks like your career as an author, as
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a motivational speaker, as a train as far eclipsed what was an extraordinary career
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in the FBI. The book that I first met you on it was your
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first book back in two twelve, was what everybody is saying. I want
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to say personally that thank you for it. It has served me, or
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the ten ninety nine that I paid for it, I believe I've gotten returns
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in the many, many thousands in interviews on my podcast, in dealing with
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company CEOs and officials, thussing out what they're really saying rather than what I
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hear them saying. So that was great. And now the latest book you
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did out a while ago, be Exceptional master the five traits that set extraordinary
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people apart. So thank you for coming on the show. Your first trait
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is self mastery and you define that. What does that mean? Yeah,
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and carry. It's good to see you again. I've always enjoyed the questions
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that you ask. I think you have one of the finest shows programs out
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there because you ask good questions. Mastery of self. You know, when
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I was in the Beer I did thousands of interviews. In fact, it's
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somewhere it's around thirteen thousand interviews. And it's too easy always to focus on
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the negative things. And so I look back on those interviews and people I've
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met over the years, and I looked at, well, what were the
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positive attributes. And one of the things that I found was that exceptional individuals
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really have mastery over themselves. They had the capacity to fulfill obligations, they
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had the ability to focus on what they need to focus on. They are
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conscientious, and they had the ability to moderate their emotions so that they're not
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not out of control. And of course, uh, you know, within
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reason, Um, they don't do things that get him in trouble with drugs
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or alcohol or or the law and so forth. And just looking back throughout
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history and you think, well, what would be an example in history?
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And you look at Leonardo da Vinci, and you think, oh, the
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most valuable painting in the world was painted by his man, by this man,
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but he had no mastery over himself. In fact, he was looking
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anywhere from eight to eleven lawsuits during his life for failure to complete jobs that
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he had been paid for, what we call that felony. And so I
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was looking at that and sometimes because of you know who they are, we
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think, oh they were exceptional, no doubt, nobody painted like he did.
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But the man did not have mastery over his life. In fact,
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he was always on the run because someone was always after him. And I
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think this is something that you know, you and I were talking earlier,
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that introspection, being able to look at our lives, being honest with ourselves,
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because that is so hard to be honest and say, you know what,
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I don't do this very well, or I'm failing here, or you
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know, I'm going from my thirties to my forties, and am I still
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the same person? Am I not changed? I think that honesty has to
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to kick in. And I think exceptional individuals, you know, harness everything
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that they can, even if it's not perfect, but they have and they
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exercise mastery over their own lives. I think that's a great point. Two
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things come to mind. Number one is there's a book by a guy named
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Scott Adams talking about failing your way to success. So self mastery means learning
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from failure, not being defeated by it. Right absolutely, That's how we
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learned to use computers. You know, everyone I talked to, which which
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it was, everything from farmers to day laborers to physicians, they took whatever
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circumstances they had and whatever failure they had, and they said, failure is
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not going to define me. What's going to define me? They didn't put
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it this way, but I discerned this from them. What's going to define
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me is what I do each day in furtherance of where I want to go
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and what I want to be. A young, young man I talked to.
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He said he was so poor that everything they read, or he and
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his siblings read, they got from garbage cans. And you know, you
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could sit there and and take pity on that, and they said, please
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don't. I got a lot of reading done. People throw up a lot
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of stuff. He was defining his life by where he was headed. He
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knew he had to be to educate himself, and so he created the architecture,
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which a lot of people don't do. They expect they outsource everything.
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Oh, school teach me everything I need to know. No it won't.
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One book will not teach you everything you need to know. They apprentice themselves.
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They create an apprenticeship for themselves. I was talking to this young man,
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and he says, I scavenged for books. I asked people for books,
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any book. And he created his own learning program. And and I
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think that's what sets extraordinary people apart. That is mastery of self. What
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we often see is people say, well, I'm overwhelmed by life and everything
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that has gone against me. And and I listen, I understand. My
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My family was poor. We live my mother lived on tips, people living
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leaving fifteen cents on the table. I understand poverty, but it's what you
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do with that and and the concept of or the construct of I don't care
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what life presents. I'm going to go the other way. I'm going to
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keep create the architecture to go in the other direction. And that's what really
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sets exceptional people apart. All right. So I remember a former Speaker of
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the House, John Bayner, said, I have to deal with every son
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of a bitch who walks through the door, whether I like them or not,
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whether I want what he wants or not. I got to deal with
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them. And isn't that really an encapsulation, a summation of life. You've
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got to deal with these people, A lot of them. You don't like,
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a lot of them. You like, Hey, you're in the federal
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bureaucracy. There's superiors who you just want to punch out because they just really
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But then you realize, I have to make this work. I can't just
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act out on emotion. I've got to communicate, which is communicate, build
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a bridge and get to where take that bridge where I want to go.
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But isn't that like the most difficult thing when you're dealing with people, A
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lot of them. Person we seem to be in a society dominated by personality
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disorders, and we got to deal with these people on our day to day
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life. What can you tell us how we do this more effectively? Joe?
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Yeah, And you bring up a great point. You know what,
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when four percent of the population is antisocial, at least one percent is psychopath
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and anywhere from to the eight percent of certain occupations are just filled with the
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narcissistic personality, including as you say, in politics, you never know what's
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going to come through the door. But I can tell you this, if
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you don't have mastery over yourself, then whatever comes through that door, you're
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not gonna be able to deal with it. Because the easiest thing for humans
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to do is go emotional, and that's what often happens. Hey, how
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did this get out of control? Well, somebody had to be the adult
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in the room. Somebody had to control their emotions, and someone didn't.
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And that is a very difficult thing to get across if you don't begin to
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practice that at an early age. If you grow up with the belief system
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that if they're angry, then I have to be angry, otherwise I'm perceived
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as weak. You're you're going to have problems all your life, because the
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most exceptional people that I dealt with learn to observe that things we're getting out
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of control, or that this person has problems, or they come in with
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emotional luggage, as I'm sure speaker Baner faced all the time. And the
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question is how do we move forward? Because you know there are many ways
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to de escalate. You can do it with distance. You can do it
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by angling your body so that you're not as intense in somebody's space, by
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lowering your voice, speaking with cadence, tilting your head. These things de
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escalate and it's up to you. And you said, and I do these
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things all the time. I don't see it as weakness. In fact,
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I see it as power because by me being in control of my nonverbals,
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including my voice, I'm actually in a way controlling them because I can literally
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see them calming down. How can I help you? First of all,
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what is your name? All right? I have a seat? You know
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all the things that you learn in what everybody is saying, and be exceptional.
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It's about being able to observe these things and then using the mastery over
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yourself so that then you can exert influence on others you, and you have
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to realize that this is not a losing proposition. That by me being in
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control, I'm exercising dominance the me in it I go emotional, it's over
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because once the emotional brain kicks in, right, this is the subcortical area
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of the brain. We have the neo cortex, the outer area that thanks
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the executive brain, the more primitive area, the limbic system, is all
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emotions. And if you're doing everything there, then it's just about physicality,
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pushing your chest out, you know, breathing heavy and so forth, and
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you're you're out of control. So the exceptional individual learns to control themselves knowing
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that by how I look at you, the angles, the distance, the
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breathing, I can actually begin to get you to change. That's that's not
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just influence, that's power. Sure, And it makes me think about the
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media because the media in general, they're just pot stirs. They want to
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shift you to that retilient emotional brain. Right then you accept information uncritically and
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you just believe whatever they tell you, because hey, when you see a
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kid in a horrible situation, it immediately shifts you into that primitive brain emotional
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state. And then you just once your critical mind shuts off, they own
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you. And you know it's so hard to do that. I've just stopped
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watching news for the most part because I felt like I can't control it.
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You know, watching like the World Trade Center come down still affects me very
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deeply. And I have to be careful when I get into that emotionally charred
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state, because that's when for me, I make mistakes. When I'm in
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that state, I'll believe things that people tell me because I want to believe
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them, not because I've proven a true to myself right. And and that's
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part of what you said earlier. It's at self honesty. I know the
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things that trigger me. I've been I've been to too many autopsies. I've
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been at too many optous autopsies where there were children. To this day,
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forty years later, I'm still affected by those autopsies. The little broken hands
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at in the Oklahoma building, the the the baby that was well in Youume,
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Arizona in nineteen seventy nine. I cannot get that out of my head.
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And I have to be careful. As you say, you have to
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be careful with emotions. This is why mastery is so important because you know,
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I tell people, I give people the example, think of how many
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times you've been in an argument, and then an hour later you think of
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all the clever lines you should have said. And the reason you didn't think
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of those clever lines in the moment is because you want emotional. You want
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emotional. It's only when we are cognitive, when we're in the thinking mode,
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and emotions are a side that we think of all those Churchillian things that
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we could have said, which reminds me of when Churchill. Somebody said to
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Churchill, Sarah, if you were my husband, I'd feed you poison,
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and he retorted, as only he can, and Madam, if you were
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my wife, I'd drink it. You can only think of those things when
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your mind is clear. But yeah, we have to be careful not to
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be driven to the emotional side. We have to be able to think through
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things, all right. So get into a little touchy subject. So men
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and women are different, regardless what the medium might be telling us. Now,
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they're distinct differences between the sexes, and one is female operating system is
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based on emotion and experiential more so than men. Not that women can't be
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rational. I'm not saying that at all, but um in dealing in these
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interpersonal relationships, men are coming out it often from a logical standpoint, women
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from an emotional standpoint. What I'm saying is that that this is the crux
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of all the problems that we have in society today. A lot of what
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you're saying there, Well, let me answer it this way, because I've
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looked at the literature, and what we know is this, our brains are
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not necessarily all wired the same way. We know that in women they're the
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connections between the right and the left side of the brain. They're more inconnect
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interconnected, men less. So we're barely now starting to understand the brain.
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We know that the times while we're growing up, we're testosterone sort of is
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infused into us at different intervals, and even estrogen is infused at different intervals,
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begins to shape us. There are internal differences, and of course there
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are the external ones. I think the biggest mistake that we make, and
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I tell this to everybody, and it has nothing to do with whether you're
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a man or a woman, It is the failure to understand or the failure
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to think that you talk to everybody the same way. And that everybody responds
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should respond the same way. And I wish universities on a minimum and schools
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maximum would begin to teach that, just as you and I carry find our
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own way of communicating with each other, and of for instance, something as
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simple as turn yielding our agreement behaviors, realize that every single person on this
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planet we should address differently because we all. Some people think very fast,
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some people are slower, Some people are more pensive. Some people are emotional.
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We may not know why they're emotional at normoust we sit there in judgment
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over that. The fact of the matter is, and I been. I
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was in a room with about seventy six other FBI agents and we had just
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come back from the Murrah building and on the wall on the wall were little
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hands that had been drawn by local children in and every single man that was
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there was in tears. So I don't want to hear about well, some
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people are more emotional than others. Let me tell you something. If it's
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emotional enough, right, unless you're a psychopath, you're gonna cry. All
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these men that were there, I don't remember any women on that particular day,
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although there were many there. We were all crying just because of the
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imagery. What's important is, because I may be in a position to be
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working both with both men and women. Is what are the specific needs,
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wants, desires and preferences of each individual when I hold when I hold my
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training and we do training around the world. In fact, we've got one
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coming up in Amsterdam in June. I say, hey, what do we
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use no verbals for. It's not the detect deception. It's to assess individuals
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for their needs, their wants, their desires, their preferences. And if
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you get this one right, you're gonna win. Their fears. What do
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they fear you? As an investor, what do you fear I'm going to
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get the losing money losing money right? We don't say I fear it.
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You know, I'm doing the due diligence because I don't want that to happen.
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But the brain works on fear. And if you can do that for
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every person, if you can figure out what are their preferences for talking to
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each other, I think we're better ahead. I think to a certain extent,
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the media and society wants to park us into these the silos of men,
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women alternets. This boy scouts this. No, the Mormons are over
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here, and you know it's like stop, stop, we're one species,
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but it but we need to be individuated because we all have references. Yeah,
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well, I couldn't agree more. It's these preprogrammed responses where you know,
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you shoot the messenger without to the message, you immediately discount the message
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because you don't like the messenger. And when you were talking before, you
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get into an argument, and then an hour later you realize you were wrong
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and why didn't I it was wrong then? And the emotions when they kick
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in, they're so powerful and they're always there right, just waiting to come
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to the surface. Yeah. Yeah, it's um and and that's part of
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it. And you know, there's so much good advice out there about dealing
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with emotions and so forth. And you know, even programs like yours,
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where you know, there's a lot of things I don't know about business,
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but you can create your own learning experience so much easier now than in the
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sixties and the seventies and in the eighties. So really there's no excuse.
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I mean you you you've had the world class speakers on your program. Um,
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you know, I don't have time to travel around the country to cashe
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spokes. So there really is no excuse for not working on mastery of self.
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It really should be should be a lifelong learner, and you're never fully
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the master of yourself. So now lifelong occupation, if you will. And
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it's the most important one, I think, because it's going to determine your
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success in life, your success relationships. And you know, so many times
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you say something and because you're in that emotionally charged state and you can't take
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it back, and then the wreckage follows. Yeah, and once it's out,
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it doesn't go back. Yeah. So you're doing, uh, these
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boot camps on the communication. You know, I just have a joke for
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you. You know they say that the eighty percent of all communication is nonverbal.
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But me and my X, we have that beat. One hundred percent
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of ours was not just stopped talking. Huh. That applies to a lot
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of lives that I know. Mary Um. You know, over the years,
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I've been asked that question, what's the number? What exactly is a
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number of how important body language is? I can tell you this. It
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is the principal means by which we humans communicate. It is the best way
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that we communicate. Empathy. It is the way that we assess for our
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mate, whether we play with them for ten minutes or we marry them.
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We do this nonverbally. It's how we assess for danger and safety. And
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it's certainly assists us in socializing. So when people say, well, so,
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what percentage is that, I say, it really depends on where you're
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at. You could be staring at a loved one and you know, and
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it's one hundred percent or maybe down to sixty in a business meeting. But
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it's never much lower than that because I've sat in business meetings where we were
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talking numbers and we were all kind of reading each other the way we were
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saying the information. What our attitude was is how confident we were. And
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you know, all of that was nonverbal. So um, it's an important
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part of our lives. And and and I would just caution everybody stop looking
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for deception. It's useful to look for issues, right, look for psychological
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discomfort, as I teach in my books, but uh, and use it
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to communicate effectively. Right. I couldn't agree more. Hey, Joe,
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where is the best place to find you? These days? All your books
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obviously on Amazon? That's where I purchased them, but the West, which
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one's the best to find? Yeah, my website if you go to Joe
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Navarro dot net, everything is there. And I've got my books articles psychology
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today and uh and this wonderful event that we're going to be doing. It's
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two days of intense training in Amsterdam. It's one of my favorite cities,
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and we really do a deep dive into how we use nonverbals. And I
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tell folks, especially in the you know, most of the people that I
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work with are in the financial sector. The most important thing that we can
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do is to try to understand the other person, communicate with them effectively.
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But also is what messages are we sending? Are we are we sending messages
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that you know, sometimes we come across as a little too plightful, maybe
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crass, maybe narcissistic, whatever is we have a role to play and what
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messages am I sending when I sit there in a meeting and so forth,
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And so we explore that those those kinds of things, because it's not just
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about reading others. Always remember everybody else is reading you, and the question
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is what message are they getting? Do they see you as competent, do
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they see you as with hesitation. Do they see you equivocating? Do you
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have to bite your lip and pull on your shirt collar to answer a simple
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question? Delays in answering a throat clearing. I remember Bob Gates when who
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was I think for a while there he was the CIA, then he was
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at the Pentagon, and obviously the media would ask him questions he wasn't allowed
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to answer it. He always cleared his throat when he was gonna have to
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bamboozle us. If you got to clear your throat to answer a question,
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I want to ask more questions. That's that's very clearing your throat, Yeah,
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exactly. They Well, if you've got a question for Joe, shoot
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me an email kl at Kerry Lutz dot com and we'll get you an answer.
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And the link to Joe's website is in the show notes this interview.
28:17
All the books are available on Amazon or wherever fine books used to be sold.
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And Joe really appreciate you coming on spending time with us, and we
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really appreciate it, and we will talk to you again soon. That's great.
28:30
Thank you for having me, Carrie, and let's not wait eleven more
28:33
years. Huh. Definitely, thanks for listening to Carry Lutz's Financial Survival Network,
28:40
your solution to today's trying times. For the latest, go to Financial
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Survival Network dot com. Financial Survival Network now more than ever,