Latest / The 47 Morning Update with Ben Ferguson / Lindsey Graham's American Legacy of Loyalty, Laughter and Leadership

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Lindsey Graham's American Legacy of Loyalty, Laughter and Leadership · The 47 Morning Update with Ben Ferguson

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Welcome in his verdict with Ted Cruz week in Review,
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: and it's so nice to have you with us. As
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: you know, normally we do the top stories of the
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: week and let you get up to date on what
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: you may have missed this past week. However, we're going
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: to do a special show today and is remembering our
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: good friend Lindsey Graham. If you missed Senator Cruz talking
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: about Lindsay after his sudden death, We took a moment
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: to talk about everything he'd accomplished in some really cool
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: behind the scenes stories. So with that being said, it
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: is the weeknd Review and it starts right now.
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: Look, this was a hard day. This was a shocking day.
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: I woke up, as so many people did across America,
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: with the news that Lindsay had passed away of what
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: has been reported to be a massive heart attack at
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: his home Saturday night. I was stunned. I had five
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: or six texts in my phone as I woke up,
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: and I just stared at them in disbelief. It did
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: not seem real. Lindsay was a good friend of mine.
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: Lindsay was he was one of a kind. He was
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: someone he and I did not always see eye to eye.
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: In fact, we battled on a lot of issues, but
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: we also agreed on a whole bunch of issues. And
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: we were close allies fighting for years uh to confirm
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: conservative judges and conservative conservative justices. We were close allies
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: fighting to defend the Second Amendment. We were close allies
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: fighting to support the men and women of the military.
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: We were close allies fighting to defend our national security,
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: to stand with our allies, to stand with Israel. And
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: we were close allies standing up to America's enemies, that
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: especially Iran, and and and Lindsay was someone he was
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: a force of nature. But his personality, I gotta say,
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: if you spent time with Lindsay, I think it was
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: impossible to dislike Lindsay. He was charming, He was funny
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: as hell, like just witty. For years, I used to
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: say to Lindsay and John Kennedy, I'd ask each of them,
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: I don't know which one of you is funnier, and
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: they'd kind of both sort of bow up their chests
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: and get mad at E and I Actually I do
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: have a theory. I think John Kennedy is the better
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: stand up comedian. Like, like, if John Kennedy and John
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: prepares a fair amount of his material, but when he's
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: delivering it, he could be a professional comedian, yes, But
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: but Lindsey was wittier just sitting there. He would fire
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: zingers that you're like it was, and many of them
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: were self deprecating. He did not take himself too seriously.
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: He would make fun of himself like crazy he did,
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: and it was you know, I've traveled abroad with Lindsay
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: multiple times. He loved our country absolutely with a passion. Look,
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: Lindsey wasn't married, he didn't have kids. Every ounce of
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: his life was the Senate. He would travel all over
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: the world. I mean, it's just what he did. He
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: was out, you know, I think it was beautiful in
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: some ways fitting. So he had just come back from Ukraine.
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: He'd been meeting with President Zelensky, came back to the
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: United States Saturday night. He was on the phone with
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: President Trump. And by the way, he was one of
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: President Trump's closest friends. And I say that without exaggeration
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: because Lindsay and Trump disagreed on a lot of issues.
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: But Trump loved the guy, and it was was hard.
• 3:39
  Speaker 3: If you saw him.
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: They're talking about him on Meet the Press He's like,
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: he kind of had like unfeathered access to the White House.
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: He goes out, he really did a lot of people,
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: but he was like, Lindsay just came over all the time.
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: Look, Look, Lindsay was like the Trump whisper. He would
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: call Trump. He talked to him early in the morning,
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: he talked to him late at night. He talked to
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: them day after day after day. And Trump Trump didn't
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: always agree with him, but he would listen to him
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: and Lindsey. When Trump was really mad about at something,
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: Lindsey could kind of walk him back off that cliff
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: a little bit. Lindsey was like, and I've spent a
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: lot of time with Lindsay and Trump together, and the
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: bond they had was really special, and it was in
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: some ways almost a perfect distillation of his life. That
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: he is in Ukraine, he flies back to the United States.
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: He's on the phone with President Trump and Sunday morning
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: he was scheduled to be on Meet the Press. It
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: would have been his sixty fourth appearance on Meet the Press.
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: And it's a.
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: Lot in colleges. By the way, Meet the Press is
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: kind of like Saturday Night Live. If you're like a
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: celebrity being on Meet the Press. That's a number that
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: I would love to know what that is ranking compared
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: to other Republicans. You've done it a lot, but it's
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: not sixty something times.
• 4:54
  Speaker 4: Now.
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: I've done it a lot, but it's nowhere close to that.
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: And I try to be pretty deliberate. I do Sunday
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: shows when I've got a particular message that I'm trying
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: to drive, like, when there's a reason, I try to
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: be quite deliberate about doing it. Lindsey, Look, look, I
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: have two teenage daughters, I've got a wife, I've got
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: a family. I want to be back in Texas, you know,
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: with my family, and so a Sunday show there had
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: to be a reason to do it. Yeah, Lindsay, part
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: of what he was was just a warrior. Every day.
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: He'd go to the Sunday shows when the news were great.
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: He'd go to the Sunday shows when the news was
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: terrible and like, nobody wanted to be out there defending
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: whatever was on fire at that moment, and Lindsay was like,
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: I'll do it, and he would. Part of it is
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: he would do it in a cheerful, funny, affable way.
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: If things were a mess he'd kind of acknowledge, Yeah,
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: they're a mess, but you know, all right, it was
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: I literally have been been walking around in a daze
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: much of today because I mean I spent a lot
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: of time with Lindsay and we would go out and
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: I've been texting you guys.
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: By the way, you shared a picture that proud up
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: on your phone. You guys were recently in Paris.
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: So so, and this was just you know how iPhone
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: kind of randomly picks pictures.
• 6:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: Now I'm sort of convinced our phones like spy on
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: us and know everything.
• 6:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but yeah, that's that is accurate. I agree with
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: you on that one.
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: But bizarrely enough, today my iPhone kind of midday popped
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: up a picture of me and Lindsey and Katie Britt
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: and Eric Schmidt, all four of us in Paris and
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: we're on a river boat and we're right in front
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: of the Eiffel Tower and we went for the eightieth
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: anniversary of D Day. It was an amazing trip. It
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: was a powerful, beautiful trip with you know, we got
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: to see these World War Two veterans who it's it's
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: the very tail end of their journey on Earth, and
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: the four of us are just arm in arm and
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: it was just beautiful. And I've been I've been texting
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: and talking to friends and colleagues, and all of us
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: are just going, this doesn't seem real real, Yeah, I
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: mean it's you know, I did an interview with a
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: reporter today who said, who will fill the void? Who
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: will fill Lindsey Graham's shoes? And my answer is nobody. Nobody.
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: The role he played in the Senate, he was universally respected,
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: but also universally liked and even adored by people who
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: disagreed with him. Passionately he could be by the way,
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: the guy was as effective a cross examiner as I've
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: ever seen. Lindsay was a South Carolina trial lawyer, and
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: he could. On the Judiciary committee, the two.
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: Were committees together.
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: So people understand, you guys, it wasn't just being like
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: centaers together. You guys worked on committees as well.
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: We worked judiciary. We spent thousands of hours together. We
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: were on Senate Armed Services together, we were on Foreign
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: Relations together, and we just worked hand in hand on
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: a lot of issues. There are issues where we just immigration.
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: Lindsay and I were in very different places, but there
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: were a lot of issues when Lindsey was with you.
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: I don't know that there was a more potent ally
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: in the Senate when he.
• 8:12
  Speaker 4: Was with you.
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and it would he could be look it was
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: I can't count. There are a hundred different Senate Republican
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: lunches when people were having really passionate, sharp disagreements about
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: something and Lindsey would stand up and say something, and
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: he'd always have a joke and people be double over laughing.
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: There be times when people are like screaming at each other,
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: almost ready to like, you know, take a swing at
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: each other. Yeah, and Lindsey would sort of cut the
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: tension and bring people back to the task at hand.
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: You know, when I'm in d C fairly regularly, I'll
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: have dinner with other senators and there's kind of a
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: group of folks that I invite that are sort of
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: the like guys I like hanging out with. And Lindsey
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: was almost the auto invite, because if Lindsay showed up
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: at the table, your ribs would hurt from laughing. And
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: by the way, it wasn't just that he was like
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: telling jokes. He was just insightful and smart and he cared. Look,
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: look whether you are his customer.
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: That's one of the things I don't think people understand
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: how much he loved this country you mentioned. Didn't have
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: he wasn't married, he didn't have kids. His family was America.
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: His family was defending America. I said this this morning
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: on Fox and Friends. He had a grand It was
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: a love story with the United States of America.
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: Yes, I'll tell you, it was also with our military.
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: So Lindsay sosolutely. Lindsey spent thirty three years in the
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: Air Force, active duty.
• 9:43
  Speaker 3: As a colonel. People don't know that he.
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: Rose up to being a colonel. I did tell him.
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: I said, Lindsay, if the clowns at the Pentagon ever
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: try to give you a star, damn it. I'm going
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: to the Florida filibuster it. I ain't calling you General Graham.
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: You could be Colonel Graham, but just under there's a
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: hard ceiling. And and he basically agreed with me and said, yeah,
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: I sure hope they'll make me a general. They shouldn't.
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: I mean, I mean, that's like a classic he was.
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: And I've been with him both in the US and
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: abroad where we would meet with service men and women,
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: and he had a connection to the men and women
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: of the armed services, a love affair where they loved
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: him and I would see them come up and like
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: hug him, and he would. He viewed it as his mission.
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: I'm going to fight for you. If you're defending this country,
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: if you signed up to be in the military, I'm
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: going to fight ferociously for you. And that was it
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: was real, It was sincere, it was passionate. That was
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: a beautiful thing.
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: You know.
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: I think one of the cool things about his services country.
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: I've got a lot of friends that sign up after
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: nine to eleven, and in politics sometimes they get frustrated
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: with people that serve their country and they go to
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: Washington and everything is based on why I was in
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: the military.
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: And you weren't. Kind of thing.
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: He didn't use his military service that night, and a
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: lot of people didn't realize that. Number One, he was
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: a colonel until he passed away. A lot of people
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: didn't realize he was in for thirty years. A lot
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: of PEO didn't realize he was in the reserves while
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: serving his country. In Congress, he continued to be in
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: the reserves and to continue to do that, but he
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: didn't come in and go, well, I would I serve
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: it wasn't a trump card for him, and it was
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: it was. It was he obviously fought hard for military
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: and he fought hard for things in a state that
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: were related to military and military complex and bases. But
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: it wasn't his number one thing on TV, like, well,
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: let me tell you why because I served and you didn't.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: He didn't use it that way publicly.
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: Never.
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: A lot and a lot of people that I know
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: that are in the military and have recently retired that
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: gave twenty twenty five years, that's what they liked about
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: him the most.
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: Well, and look to understand Lindsay, he grew up in
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: modest circuit stances in South Carolina. He grew up his
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: parents ran a bar in a pool hall. And part
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: of to understand Lindsay's magic is he was like the
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: best bartender you've ever seen, who would smile and crack
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: a joke and and whether you were celebrating a great
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: thing that happened in your life, or you were there
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: weeping because your wife just divorced you, or you just
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: had a death in the family, and and he could
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: the charm that he brought, the sort of effortless. I
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: remember years ago I was at a Silver Elephant dinner,
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: which is the big Republican dinner in South Carolina, and
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: he was speaking there.
• 12:39
  Speaker 3: And at the.
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: Time, Ryan's prebus was the chairman of the r NC,
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: and I think Ryance was speaking at that dinner. This
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: was a while ago, but I think Ryance was speaking
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: at that dinner. I remember Lindsay got up and went
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: Ryan's previous, Ryan's previous, What the hell is that is
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: not like a French electric car, and like it brought
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: the house down. I mean, he would throw lines out
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: there all the time, and it was He also had
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: a special gift for I would say, earning the trust
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: of and providing really valuable counsel to extraordinarily volatile, larger
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: than life figures and two in particular, John McCain and
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: Donald Trump. Yes, now, look John McCain, I served a
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: lot of years with John. When I arrived in the Senate,
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: John McCain hated my guts. In fact, he was quoted
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: as saying I hate his eff and guts. Like John
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: and I battled in a bloody way. Yes, over the years,
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: John and I became friends. But John was you know,
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: in terms of the history of the Senate. John McCain
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: was one of those legends who have walked the halls
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: of the s And I disagreed with so many positions
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: John had. But but the man was a war hero.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: The man fought for a country. He was He was
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: imprisoned in Vietnam, he was tortured, he denied early release.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: I mean, he was larger than life, yes, and he
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: could be volcanic like John's temper.
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: It was real. It was real.
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: Oh, I had been on this.
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: I've been on the other end of that.
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: You've been on the other end of that, and it
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: is let me tell you, I the talking to is
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: that I received you earlier in my career were brutal
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: when I got them.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: Lindsey was John McCain's best friend in the Senate, and
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: he was the McCain whisperer. I mean, it was an
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: amazing thing. And Lindsey would kind of soften John's you know,
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: he come in and pound the hell out of someone,
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: and Lindsay sort of cut a joke and like, you know, men, Yeah, it.
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: Was Joe Aberman said, he spoke Democrat and Republican. Well
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: is I think the way he described it he could.
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: He could, he could, and he could speak McCain, which
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: was really important.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: And he also speaks Trump. Like, look their times, just
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: like John McCain. We get really pissed off their times.
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: This is no secret. When Donald Trump gets pissed off
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: and when he's angry and he's like on a tear, Lindsey,
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: we kind of all say, Lindsey, go on in there
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: and sort of talk him down, and Lindsey could. It
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: was an amazing thing. He'd just sort of laugh a
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: little bit, and you know, Trump would yell at him,
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: and he'd make Trump laugh and it would just soften
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: the whole thing. He had a gift for that, and
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: it was not just because he wanted people to like him.
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: He had a gift because he was trying to get
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: these these great men. He was trying to move them
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: in what he believed was a positive direction for America.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: And it was a beautiful thing to watch him do that.
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: I will say, Lindsey, some of y'all who listened to
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: Verdict may not know this. Lindsey Graham was the very
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: first guest in the history of Verdict, Like when we
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: had just launched this show. This show launched on the
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: first night of the very first Trump impeachment and the
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: show went from zero. Look, before we launched, we had
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: zero viewers, zero listeners. Yeah, it's skyrocketed up the charts
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: and it became the number one ranked podcast in the world.
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: And as we're doing it, and we would do it
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: every night. This was PB pre Ben. This is what
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: I was doing with Michael Knowles, who's a great friend
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: of both of ours. Yeah, and it would be every
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: night after the impeachment trial, we'd go and do a
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: Verdict that night and put it out real time. And
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: Lindsey came, all right, I want you to watch the
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: cold open for our show that Lindsey recorded as our
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: very first guest ever.
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: All right, take a listen. This is again the cold
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: open Lindsey Graham, the first guest on Verdict back in
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: the day.
• 16:52
  Speaker 4: Hello, I'm senner Lindsey Graham. Welcome to Verdict with Ted Cruz,
• 16:56
  Speaker 4: the number one podcast in the entire country.
• 16:59
  Speaker 5: What is the fun guest, Welcome back to Verdict with
• 17:10
  Speaker 5: Ted Cruz. I'm Michael Knowles.
• 17:11
  Speaker 6: I'm joined by not one, but two US Senators to
• 17:15
  Speaker 6: help us break down the most shocking day of the
• 17:18
  Speaker 6: entire impeachment trial. Senator Graham, thank you so much for
• 17:21
  Speaker 6: being here at VI. Here gentlemen. The last time that
• 17:24
  Speaker 6: we sat down, I was told this impeachment was going
• 17:27
  Speaker 6: to drag on for weeks. We were going to get witnesses.
• 17:29
  Speaker 6: We were going to get Bolton, we were going to
• 17:31
  Speaker 6: get Hunter Biden. This was going to get long and ugly.
• 17:33
  Speaker 6: I go to sleep. I wake up today and the
• 17:37
  Speaker 6: senators are voting no more witnesses. This thing could be
• 17:40
  Speaker 6: over next week. Senator Cruz, what happened?
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: Well, today was a big day. And let me say, Lindsey,
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: thank you well you. I appreciate your coming. This is
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: late at night. We spent all day in.
• 17:49
  Speaker 4: The setting and a lot of money on production.
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: Well, this was you're right yesterday. If the vote had
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: gone differently today, this trial could have gone on for months.
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: We could have seen it drag on and on and on,
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: and it was a big deal. It was up in
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: the air, and today was the most important vote we've
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: had in the.
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: Entire By the way, I love it. Even there he
• 18:11
  Speaker 3: cracked a joke.
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: He's like, you're not spend a lot on production, like
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: he had to get his zinger in there.
• 18:16
  Speaker 3: That's just what made Lindsay Lindsay.
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: Well, and look, at the time, we were filming Verdict
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: in a basement studio about a mile from Capitol Hill,
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: and so we drove there after the day of the trial.
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: It was like midnight, and you went to this basement studio.
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: You walked at a dark alley and you walked down
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: these like concrete stairs, and listen, Lindsay and I at
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: the time were not actually that close of friends. We
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: had been more adversaries than friends. Our friendship developed over
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: the years. And as we're walking down the stairs, he's like,
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: I feel like Joe Peshi and good Fellows. Are you
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: getting ready to whack me? Because like we're like walking
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: into a dark basement in the middle of nowhere. And
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: he looks around. In our studio, we had this this
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: shag carpet out of the nineteen seventies. We had these
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: big old brown leather chairs. We had these giant microphones,
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: kind of like we still have the giant microphones. Yeah,
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: and he says on the show, the cactus don't yeah, Okay,
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: I miss miss our cactus. Our cactus is still our
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: cactus is still part of the Verdict family. But he
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: looked around and he said this on the podcast. He's like,
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: you guys are the number one podcast in the world.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: Who the hell is number two? Some guy in a
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: van by the river Like it was. It was size splitting,
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: But but that charm, it had real power, Yes, because
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: it would cause people to listen. It would break through
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: and listen. He was not always joking. If you were
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: to think of the singular moment, what is the number
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: one thing people remember that Lindsey Graham did, And I'm
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: gonna suggest it was when during the Brett Kavanaugh confirmation.
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: Here I was gonna say no doubt Brett Kavanaugh and
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: saving Brett Kavanaugh from the insanity of the left that
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: were accusing him of the most horrific crimes without any evidence,
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: making it up as they went trying to destroy him,
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: the same way they went after Clarence Thomas very much,
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: but in a TMZ twenty twenty plus year type of
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: going after him, just more vile social media. You didn't
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: have that with a Clarence Thomas, right, Like Clarence Thomas
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: was ABCNBC, CNN, it was mainstream. Now they were trying
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: to assassinate Brett Kavanaugh's integrity and they were using all
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: social media to try to accomplish it.
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: Well, and Lindsey unloaded on the Democrats and it changed
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: the entire dynamics of the hearing. I want you, most
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: of y'all have seen and heard this, but I want
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: you to give a listen again, because I think there's
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: a real argument. Without Lindsay doing this, Brett Kavanaugh may
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: not get confirmed. Give a listen to Lindsay at the hearing.
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: Are you aware that at nine to twenty three on
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: the night of July the ninth, the day you were
• 21:07
  Speaker 4: nominated to the Supreme Court by President Trump, Senator Schumer
• 21:12
  Speaker 4: said twenty three minutes after your nomination, I will oppose
• 21:16
  Speaker 4: Judge Kavanaugh's nomination with everything I have. I have a
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: bypartisan I hope a by person majority will do the same.
• 21:23
  Speaker 4: The stakes are simply too high for anything less. Well,
• 21:27
  Speaker 4: if you weren't aware of it, you are now. Did
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: you meet with Senator Diane Feinstein on August twentieth? I
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: did meet with Centa Finestine. Did you know that her
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: staff had already recommended a lawyer to dodnor Ford. I
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: did not know that. Did you know that her and
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: her staff had this allegations for over twenty days.
• 21:47
  Speaker 5: I did not know that at the time.
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: If you wanted an FBI investigation, you could have come
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: to us. What you want to do is destroy this
• 21:55
  Speaker 4: guy's life. Hold this seat open and hope you went
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: in twenty twenty. You've said that, not me. You've got
• 22:04
  Speaker 4: nothing to apologize for. When you see Soda Maron Kagan,
• 22:08
  Speaker 4: tell him that Lindsay said, oh, because I voted for them,
• 22:12
  Speaker 4: I would never do to them what you've done.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: To this guy.
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: This is the most unethical sham.
• 22:20
  Speaker 4: Since I've been in politics. And if you really wanted
• 22:24
  Speaker 4: to know the truth, you sure as hell wouldn't have
• 22:26
  Speaker 4: done what you've done to this guy. Are you a
• 22:29
  Speaker 4: gang rapist?
• 22:31
  Speaker 6: No?
• 22:32
  Speaker 4: I cannot imagine what you and your family have gone through. Boy,
• 22:37
  Speaker 4: y'all want power. God, I hope you never get it.
• 22:39
  Speaker 4: I hope the American people can see through this sham
• 22:43
  Speaker 4: that you knew about it and you held it. You
• 22:45
  Speaker 4: had no intention of protecting doctor Ford none. She's as
• 22:50
  Speaker 4: much of a victim as you are.
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: God.
• 22:53
  Speaker 4: I hate to say it because these have been my friends,
• 22:56
  Speaker 4: but let me tell you, when it comes to this,
• 23:00
  Speaker 4: you're looking for a fair process. You came to the
• 23:03
  Speaker 4: wrong town at the wrong time, my friend.
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: Senator, you look at that frustration. That was genuine.
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: It wasn't inauthentic, It wasn't something that was a pre
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: planned moment.
• 23:16
  Speaker 3: It wasn't scripted.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: We see a lot of scripted moments from politicians these days,
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: and some of these hearings there it's all pre organized,
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: pre planned protesters involved. That was real and raw and
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: as you mentioned, and I think you should explain a
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: little bit more, this forced and change the direction that
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: hearing was going.
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: Well, and listen Lindsey's career. For a lot of his career,
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: he's been a very bipartisan senator. Senator, He's worked with
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: a lot of Democrats. As he noted, he voted to
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: confirm both Justice Sotoma Ora and Justice Kagan, and the
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: Democrats were all happy with him. They were all lovey
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: dove And so when he says, look, I would never
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: do to them what you're doing to Brett Kavanaugh, that
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: had power to it. I was sitting there at the
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: DAAs when when Lindsay was unloading, and you could have
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: heard a pin drop in the room, you know, the
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: silence when he asked Brett Kavanaugh, Are you a gang rapist?
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: And Brett says no, and Lindsey's just silent for about
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: four seconds, and the entire silence, there's not a peep
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: in the hearing room. That was a riveting moment. And
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: by the way, you mentioned Clarence Thomas. Clarence Thomas is
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: on the Supreme Court because during his confirmation hearing, the
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: Democrats did the same thing, which is they sand bagged
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: him with allegations from Anita Hill. And the American people
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: heard Anita Hill's testimony in Clarence Thomas's and by a
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: margin of about two to one, they believe Justice Thomas.
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: The same thing happened with Brett Kavanaugh. That's why Clarence
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: Thomas got confirmed. That's why Brett Kavanaugh got confirmed. And
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: Lindsey's that moment there played I think a real part
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: in people assessing and saying, wait a second, this is
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: not a real inquiry, this is not a fair assessment.
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: This is a political slime job. These guys had these
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: allegations for weeks, they sat on them, they held them back.
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: This is it is a drive by shooting by partisans
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: who just want power. That was what was effective. And
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: I'll tell you. So my mom, Ben, you know my mom.
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: She's love my mom. She's ninety one, about to be
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: ninety two in November. She is as conservative it can be.
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: My mom thinks you and I are little wobbly. She
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: is a rock rib conservative.
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: By the way, I don't know if I ever said
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: this on the show, I've never had more fun hanging
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: out with your mom than than your reelection night, watching
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: her be excited, watching her son not a senator, her
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: son when reelection, and just the beaming joy.
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: On her face. You weren't there when in that part.
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: You were busy, and she came in and she was
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: just so happy, and I was like, this might be
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: my favorite moment of the whole night.
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: So my mom, prior to the Kavanaugh hearing, was not
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: a Lindsay Graham fan. She mostly knew Lindsay because he
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: and I had battled a lot on immigration. We had
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: very different views on immigration, and so that's, you know,
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: anyone who fights her son my mom doesn't like. And
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: so when that cross examined examination ends, my mother sends
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: me a text and says, Okay, I now love Lindsey Graham,
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: And I actually got up a few minutes later and
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: I walked over to Lindsay and I pulled out my phone.
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: I said, Lindsay, here's a text I just got from
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: my mom, and I clicked on it and he cracked
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: up laughing, and then my mother proceeded to go to
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: his website and to give him thirty five dollars?
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: Are you serious that I am?
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: I am serious? And I told him, I said, Lindsay,
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: in my entire time in politics, my mother's never contributed
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: to my campaign. She's given you money like it was.
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: And he loved that. But it was look he could
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: be when he was engaged in a fight. He was
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: as effective a warrior as you could see. And that
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: was powerful. And it was he and I worked together. Look,
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: you look last summer the Working Family's tax cut, the
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: big Reconciliation bill, which we've talked a lot about on
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: this podcast. I still think it's the legislation that has
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: the most conservative victories in it of any bill that's
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: ever passed into law. Yeah, Lindsay was the chairman of
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: the Budget Committee, and the Budget committee plays a critical
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: part in reconciliation has to pass the budget resolution. To
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: begin with, Lindsay and I worked hand in hand I
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: don't know that we win that reconciliation battle without Lindsay's
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: leadership as chairman of the Budget Committee, and he would
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: there were times when people are you know, look, our
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: majority is not always rock solid. You have people that
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: run off this way, run off that way, and to
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: get fifty votes to yes is really really hard. And
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: Lindsey was awfully good at it.
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: He was all making friends.
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: I mean, that's one of the lost arts in politics,
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: I think, is just how good he was at making
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: friends and making friends that he disagreed with in his
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: own party and making friends on other side. But he
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: also had just a way of understanding when there's moments
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: to laugh and not.
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: I told this earlier. I was young. I don't think
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: I've ever told you this story.
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: It was probably two thousand and five or six seven,
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: somewhere in there, and it was something to deal with
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: Iraq or Afghanistan. And I was on I think it
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: was Shepherd Smith's show on Fox back in the day,
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: and they asked me directly about Lindsay Graham and something
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: he'd said. They played the soot come out of it,
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: asked me, and I was pretty blunt, and I was like,
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: I strongly disagree with him.
• 29:04
  Speaker 3: YadA YadA, YadA. I get done.
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: And it was one of those you don't know it's
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: coming moments, welcome to Live TV, and so I gave
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: my assessment.
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: I get done.
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: Center within probably a minute. I was not out of
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: the seat yet. My phone rings. Now, if you're twenty something,
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: in your phone rings, and it's a senator like that's like,
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: it's you know, you answer right? So I answer it.
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: It's two two number and it's Lindsey Graham. I don't
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: know who he got my number from. And I answer
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: and he starts just unloading on me, telling me why
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: I'm wrong.
• 29:36
  Speaker 3: But it was all a ruse.
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: He was messing with me because he was down the
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: hall in the green room at Fox, knowing he was
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: gonna see me in twenty seconds. So I'm on the
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: phone walking out of the studio and it's you know,
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: the hallway there, it's a short hallway you go down
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: make it's on the left, green rooms on the right,
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: and I'm hearing the conversation in my ear delayed, and
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: I'm hearing his voice and I walk in and we'd
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: never met before.
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: I never had met before that moment.
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: And I'm on the phone with him and he looks
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: at me and goes, gotcha, And that.
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: Was it, Like he didn't mind that was ripping on him.
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: And I walked in there.
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: We laughed and he talked to me for a minute,
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: but he literally just wanted to mess with me. Like
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: it was like the perfect you know joke there, and
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: that's how he was. But like after that, it was hard.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: He was smart. It was harder for me to go
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: after him on TV because I liked him personally from
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: that moment of him.
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: He could have been a jerk, he wasn't.
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: He saw the humor in the moment and was like,
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna mess with this guy, and it was.
• 30:32
  Speaker 3: It was a brilliant political move.
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: And that's who Lindsay was. I don't know a single
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: senator out of ninety nine other senators who didn't didn't
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: like genuinely like Lindsay and consider him a friend like
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: all of them. And it was a gift. And by
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: the way, I've been in Senate lunches, and we've talked
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: about a lot of those Senate lunches on this podcast
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: where things got raw and bare knuckles and on foreign policy, look,
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: Lindsey was an interventionist. He was an aggressive interventionist in
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: the style of John McCain. He believed it, it was honest,
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: but he was very much an interventionist. We've had lunches
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: where Lindsey and Ran Paul would scream at each other
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: and Lindsay Rand is very much an isolationist Lindsay and
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: by the way, I'm in the middle of both of them,
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: I agree with with with with Lindsay about half the
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: time and Rand about half the time. I've also been
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: in lunches where Lindsay and JD Vance would be screaming
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: at each other. JD is is much more of an
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: isolationist and disagreed with Lindsay. Like on Ukraine. I mean
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: they would go at it where where JD Vance wanted
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: us to get the hell out of Ukraine yesterday, Lindsey
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: was passionate on the other side, and they would slug
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: it out.
• 31:48
  Speaker 5: You know.
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: JD put out a very kind and gracious tweet today
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: actually telling that story, saying, look, you know, Lindsay has
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: yelled at me, but I respected him and he was
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: my friend. And actually I saw a clip today that
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: I never seen before. So Blake Masters, Blake Masters ran
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: for Senate in Arizona. I like Blake. I went and
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: campaigned for him. He didn't win. I wish Blake had won,
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: but he did not. Uh and uh, you know, Blake
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: is is more on the isolation side of things. He's
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: more with with Rand and JD. And on Ukraine, he
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: was a vocal opponent of the Ukraine conflict. And it's
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: interesting Lindsey went to campaign for Blake and and they
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: asked him, all, wait a second, you guys disagree on Ukraine.
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: I want you to listen to to Lindsay's response as
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: the he's there campaigning for a guy with whom he
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: has sharp disagreements on foreign policy.
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: Give a listen, remember my race, Remember Lindsey Graham dot com.
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: Anybody watched Sean Hannity. So I was on Sean Hannity
• 32:48
  Speaker 4: three nights a week. Blake saying they're gonna shoot my
• 32:52
  Speaker 4: dog tomorrow at midnight. If you don't give me I
• 32:57
  Speaker 4: know you're living on cat food, but you can. You
• 33:00
  Speaker 4: can spare a few bucks here, people responded. My opponent
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: raised one hundred and thirty two million dollars against me,
• 33:08
  Speaker 4: the most in the history of the Senate. Man, why
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: have across the cabin. They hated my guts. They wanted
• 33:15
  Speaker 4: to destroy the guy's life. I sort of got in
• 33:17
  Speaker 4: the way. That's the way these people are, right, There's
• 33:21
  Speaker 4: nothing they won't do for power. So the reason people
• 33:25
  Speaker 4: responded to me is you don't have to agree with
• 33:27
  Speaker 4: me all the time, but when there's a fight, I
• 33:29
  Speaker 4: will show up.
• 33:31
  Speaker 3: He shows up. He's not lying when he says that.
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And look, he would joke all the time, like
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: when he was running for reelection the last time. He
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: would go on on Hannity, to go on Fox News
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: and he'd say Lindsey Graham dot Comlinsy Graham dot Comlinsy
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: Graham dot com. And he was shameless. I mean, he
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: was like, Hi, my name is Lindsay Graham dot com.
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: He would raise money and he'd say he'd say, if
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: you're a little old lady and you're trying to feed
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: your cat, don't feed your cat tonight, go and give
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: me money instead. And it would people would crack up,
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: but they would do it. But so Blake Masters who
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: lost that race. He tweeted out that video. But here's
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: what he said in his tweet, which is interesting. Blake said,
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: quote once when a donor asked Senator Graham, why are
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: you helping Blake given how much you two disagree on
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: foreign policy. He replied with a grin. So Blake's wrong
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: about Ukraine. Who gives a shit. We aren't here to
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: talk about how correct I am all the time. We're
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: here to talk about getting the Senate majority because I
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: want to be chairman of my committees. And Blake continues,
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: Lindsey was cheerful and determined, and he understood that he
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: played a team sport. May his memory be eternal. That's
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: pure Lindsey Graham. He could disagree with you, and Lord
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: knows he and I did, but it wasn't personally, wasn't
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: angry with you, and and that sort of joy. Look,
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: it is amazing the number of times you look at
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: his relationship with Trump. Lindsay was a huge Trump critic. Yeah,
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: and he ran against him, said he was going to
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: destroy the world. But by the way, you look at me,
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: all right, So in the presidential look, Lindsay ran against Trump,
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: ran against me. And in the course of that campaign,
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: Lindsay said, you know, if you killed Ted on the
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: Senate floor, and the Senate was the jury, nobody could
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: convict you. I gonn admit that. That was funny as hell.
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: I like laughed, I'm like, all right, that's a hell
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: of a line. Now, Lindsay ended up not prevailing in
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: that race, obviously, he dropped out, and after Lindsay dropped out,
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: he endorsed my campaign. So he came and endorsed my campaign,
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: and he campaigned with me for president twenty sixteen. And
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: and Lindsey said at the time, he and I were
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: doing a fundraiser together, and I stood up and I said,
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: you know, I got to say, this is the first
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: time in my life I've ever been endorsed by someone
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: who's publicly called for my murder. And that was kind
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: of how Lindsay was. He He had, you know, in
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: the same time. You know, he and Trump would battle
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: like crazy, but Trump just liked him and it was real,
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: and Lindsey liked Trump. Lindsey saw the power. Look, Trump
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: has a cast iron backbone, he has courage, and and
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: Lindsey saw that the historic value of President Trump's strength,
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: and it was really important. Now, all right, I'll give
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: you another story from from first term Trump. We were
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: having a disputed about funding the border wall, and the
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: President wanted to sign and was going to sign an
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: emergency declaration and use the emergency powers of the president
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: to shift funding to the border wall. I came up
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: with a different legal theory that would let him build
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: the border wall, let him build every penny of the
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: border wall one hundred percent, but not do it through
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: an emergency declaration. And my concern was, look, if you
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: create the precedent for doing this the next Democrat president,
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: the next if we have a President Bernie Sanders or
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: President Elizabeth Warren, they're going to declare an emergency on
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: climate change. They're gonclare an emergency on gun violence and
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: use it to justify all sorts of bad policies. So
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: I had a second theory that would have done one
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: hundred percent of the upside without the downside of the
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: bad president. And I pitched it to Lindsay, and Lindsay
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: was like, Yeah, that makes sense. And so Lindsey and
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: I spent a day trying to call the President and
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: pitch this theory. And at the time, the White House
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: staff did not want Lindsay and me to talk to
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: the president, so they were blocking us. They were preventing
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: us from getting through to the president.
• 37:40
  Speaker 3: The oldest trick in Washington is that one right there.
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: And so we were sitting there, it was getting to
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: be maybe seven seven thirty at night. We were on
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: the Senate floor, and we were both frustrated because for
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: twenty four hours we'd been calling the president, we hadn't
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: gotten through. And I finally said to lindsay, screw it,
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: let's get in the car and drive over there. Like
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: what And I'm like, yeah, let's just go over there
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: right now. He's like all right, let's go. And then
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: oddly enough, a third senator jumped in the car, Ben Sass,
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: who was another friend, but he was just kind of
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: standing there, and Ben's like, oh, I'll go. And so
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: the three of us drove over and we're literally we're
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: not invited. We're uninvited.
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: We're just you're not list.
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: And by the way, people need to understand, there's two
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: gates you go through and if you're not on the list,
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: they look at you like you're an alien.
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: Okay, So we're driving over and and Lindsey calls and
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: actually gets Trump on the phone as we're driving over,
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: and he's like, yeah, we're come over right now. And
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: Trump was getting ready to have dinner with Milania, and
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: it was like their first like couple's dinner, a romantic
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: dinner in like a month. And Lindsey's like, no, we
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: need to see you right now. And so we go
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: up to the residence and Trump is pissed. He is
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: madder than a hornet because like his whole date night
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: has been blown up by us going over to the
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: White House. And so we come over there and we're
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: up in the residence and and Trump brings up a
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: couple of lawyers from the White House Counsel's office, and
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: and they're smart guys, but they were on the other
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: side of this. And we begin arguing, and I got
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: to say, look, Lindsey could judge the prevailing wins really quickly,
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: and and he could see that Trump was not buying
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: what I was selling that particular night. So Lindsey very
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: quickly abandons me. He just jumps out, and he goes
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: and sits with with with with Trump, and I'm arguing
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: with this lawyer from the White House Council. I mean,
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: we are slugging it out. I mean it's uh, it
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: was a bare knuckle fight. And Lindsey turns to Trump
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: and said, who do you think is winning. How they
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: do it, and like Trump's kind of laughing, and they're
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: almost like color commentators watching us have this legal argument.
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: And then in the middle of it, Trump calls one
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: of one of the staff of the White House and says,
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: bring us some of those pigs in a blanket, those
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: those those little ordures. So they bring a plate of
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: pigs in the blanket and this goes on for like
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: three hours.
• 39:59
  Speaker 3: No, so you guys straight up Trump the date night.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it blew up the date night. We ended up
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: not being persuasive that night. Although I will say lindsay,
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: cut me loose so fast and any job. But he didn't,
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: like he admitted after he is like, yeah, you weren't winning,
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: So I wasn't gonna be with that. He's like, I'll
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: be behind you, way way way behind you.
• 40:20
  Speaker 3: Right behind you. Yeah, around the corner.
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: But it was the sort of thing that's that was
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: very much Lindsey Graham, and it's part of why Trump
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: listened to him, because he didn't win every argument, but
• 40:33
  Speaker 2: he was there to go again and to go again,
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: and it was really effective. And I'll tell you where
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: it mattered enormously. There's no area Lindsay and I worked
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: more closely on than Iran and standing up to the
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: incredible danger to America. If the Iyotola ever gets a
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: nuclear weapon, I think it's an existential threat to America.
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: I think if the Iatola who chanced death to America
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: it's a nuclear weapon, I think the odds are unacceptably
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: high that that hundreds of thousands or even millions of
• 41:06
  Speaker 2: Americans would be murdered. And Lindsay agreed with that, and
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: he and I wereked hanned in hand over and over
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: and over again, talking with President Trump every week, sometimes
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: every day, saying you're exactly right to stand up to Iran.
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: The President has said repeatedly Iran will never get a
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: nuclear weapon. There will be zero enrichment. And Lindsey was
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: an incredible ally UH that that that I've was fighting
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: alongside and the President listened to us, which is part
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: of why we've seen, UH seen the President's incredible strong
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: leadership UH taking out Iran's military capacity and stopping them
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: from getting nuclear weapons. That that that was one of
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: the most important legacies Lindsay ever had.
• 41:51
  Speaker 3: It's it's really incredible.
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: We're gonna do something really fun this week as well,
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: that first podcast that you did with your first guests
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: was Lindsay Graham. We're gonna put that out this week,
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: so look for that on the feed as well. Senator,
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: I'm so glad you got to talk about your friend.
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: I mean this so sincerely. I'm so sorry for your loss.
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: When you lose a friend, I've lost too many you lose,
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: especially a sudden like this.
• 42:14
  Speaker 3: It is gut wrenching.
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: Hug your family, Hug your friends, call your friends, check
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: on your friends. I say that often to people you
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: just never know. And and I'm glad You've got to
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: spend so much quality time with him.
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: Well, he will be missed. He left a legacy that
• 42:32
  Speaker 2: was extraordinary. And I will say, whether you agreed with
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: him or disagreed with him, Lindsey loved this country and
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: he devoted every waking moment of his life to fighting
• 42:46
  Speaker 2: for this country. That that was his mission. And I
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: admired that. I admired that it was real, it was genuine,
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: and he made a profound difference. It is a good
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: reminder Lindsay was just seventy one years old. He was
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: full of energy and vigor. To be honest, if I
• 43:04
  Speaker 2: were to pick one of my colleagues who was not
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: going to be making not gonna make it. Lindsey would
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: not have been on the list. He had the energy
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: that that he was unstoppable at energy. And it's a
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: good remindered all of us that that that none of
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: us are guaranteed to be here tomorrow. So so hug
• 43:22
  Speaker 2: your family, hug your kids, and and say thanks to
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: God for the for the privilege of living in a
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: time of consequence and and and making a difference in
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: our country. And I will say this, Lindsey Graham made
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: an enormous difference for our country.
• 43:36
  Speaker 3: Amen to that as always.
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Verdict with Center Ted Cruz
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: Ben Ferguson with you don't forget to deal with my podcast,
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: and you can listen to my podcast every other day
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: you're not listening to Verdict or each day when you
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: listen to Verdict. Afterwards, I'd love to have you as
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: a listener to again, Ben Ferguson Podcasts, and we will
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: see you back here on Monday morning.