Latest / Goodlife Church Formation Podcast / The Power of the Blood and the Cross: Unpacking Biblical Covenants
Transcript
- Jack O'Brien: Welcome back to another episode of Good Life Podcast. So glad to have you join us. I'm joined today, Pastor Dave and Bex. Welcome, Dave. We're in the world of you. Dave Connett: I am in my office, Jack. Jack O'Brien: Two in a row, are you okay? You feeling unwell? Check your temperature? Dave Connett: Look, ⁓ I've been traveling. I'm over traveling. actually I'm getting I must be getting old, Jack, because I'm actually very happy to be at home in my own bed at night and in my own office during the day. It feels very good. But thanks for asking. Jack O'Brien: Yeah, you are getting old. Enjoy the cheap Maccas coffees. And Bex, where in the world are you? Rebecca Connett: Where am I? I am sitting at my kitchen bench also. Jack O'Brien: Amazing. Well, let's tee this up listeners. It's been a little while between innings, but here we are. And really the original intention of this podcast still stands to give you as good life as a peek behind the curtain. Some of the conversations that I get the privilege of having and more specifically in this season to maybe unpack what happens on a Sunday, go a little bit deeper. What didn't make the editors cut? What are some of the conversations that come out of? a sermon. so that's where we're at today. At the time of recording, it's early April and we are in the thick of leading into Easter, was classically known as the Lent season. This series at Good Life has been titled the Blood and the Cross. And so Bex, you preached last Sunday. Why don't you give us the, the cliff notes, the 62nd version of ⁓ what you covered on Sunday. Rebecca Connett: Yeah, so the blood and the cross, which I think is like one of the best topics you could ever be talking about. So I talked about, sort of unpacked the power of, I guess what was in the back of my head as I was writing the message was going, you know, to answer the question of why do Christians go on about the blood all the time? because when you've been around church for a while, you don't think anything of it. But if you're coming into church for the first time, you're like, why are they so obsessed with blood? this torture device, like it doesn't actually kind of make sense. And so sometimes even as Christians, you may have been a Christian forever, you're like, yeah, the blood, the blood, but why and what and what's the significance? And so that was kind of what I wanted to unpack and help people understand the power behind ⁓ what took place on the cross and the power behind the broken body and the shed blood of Jesus and what it actually means. And so that was kind of my intention. Hopefully I fulfilled the brief, but that was the goal. Jack O'Brien: Yeah, great. I think you filled the brief nicely and you spoke through a couple of examples of, of covenants and then through the new Testament. maybe what were some of those key scriptures or key stories? Rebecca Connett: Yeah, so what I compared was two covenants that you find in the Old Testament. And one of the covenants is a covenant that God made with the people of Israel and it's called a suzerain treaty. And the suzerain treaty is like a, it's a covenant or a treaty that would happen between two nations, a larger nation and a smaller nation. And it's basically a protection sort of thing. So the larger, more powerful nation will protect the smaller one, you know, if it gets invaded by another nation or whatever. And in return, the smaller nation has to pay taxes and be loyal to the larger nation. And this is a well-known covenant or treaty of the day. And it's interesting because that's the covenant that God actually made with the people of Israel at Mount Sinai with Moses. He said, OK, we're going to actually have a covenant together. And as God described that covenant to the people of Israel, they were like, ⁓ yeah, cool, we understand this because it was a well-known covenant. And the thing about that particular covenant is that it's conditional. the people actually had to fulfill their part of the covenant. And so if they were faithful to God, if they brought their tithes to God, if they worshiped God and didn't worship other idols, then God goes cool as the more powerful nation, for want a bit of a word, as the more powerful partner in this covenant. I will protect you, I'll look after you, I'll make sure that your crops work and all that kind of thing. And so that was the covenant that they made at Mount Sinai. And there's this really clear point where the people go, yes, we agree, we're signing onto this covenant. And the rest of the Old Testament, what you see is Israel then be really unfaithful to that covenant. And the prophets come along and they're going, well, these things are gonna take place. And it wasn't so much that they were reading the future, although they were. what they were actually doing was reminding the people of the covenant going, hey, you can't depend on God's protection if you're breaking this covenant, you can't. And so that's the Suserean covenant. And then I talked about a second covenant and that's the covenant that God made with Abraham and it's quite a different covenant because it's called the blood path covenant. You find this one in Genesis chapter 15 with God makes a covenant with Abraham. And the really interesting thing about this covenant is that Again, it's a covenant that Abraham was very familiar with. It was a common covenant of the time or contract is another way you could see it. And instead of signing on the dotted line the way we do, they would make this blood path contract or covenant where they would cut open these animals and lay them in two parallel lines so that the blood would flow creating a blood path. And then the two parties that were agreeing to this contract or this covenant, would walk along this blood path, meet in the middle, and that's where they would seal the deal. And the way that this contract or covenant worked is if either party broke that covenant, they were saying, hey, may my body be torn apart and my blood shed in the same way that these animals have. So was a really serious covenant. And what you find in Genesis 15 is that God, Abraham thinks, okay, I'm gonna make this covenant with God, but God puts Abraham into a sleep. And instead, God then appears, in two forms, a smoking fire pot and a blazing torch. And he actually passes between the animals along this blood path. In other words, God made the covenant with himself. And so what that meant was it wasn't a conditional covenant like the Sousa Rayyan one. It was completely unconditional. It was completely ⁓ not relying on anything that Abraham could do. All Abraham had to do was believe. And it's such a beautiful picture because it's God saying, hey, I am gonna make I'm gonna be faithful to this covenant. Even when you stuff up Abraham, I'm gonna be faithful. And more than that, he's saying, when you're unfaithful Abraham, may my body be broken apart and my blood shed for you. And so I talked about in this message about how that blood path covenant is a picture of what actually took place on the cross, where Jesus's body was broken and his blood was shed. and he was actually fulfilling the covenant from Abraham as people had been faithless and disobedient, God goes, okay, my body is broken, my blood is shed for you. And so then we brought that through to them, what actually took place on the cross. So these are the two covenants that I've talked about and the difference between them and that we live under that Abrahamic covenant, which is a picture of what Jesus did on the cross. Jack O'Brien: wild. So good. Dave Connett: doesn't it doesn't it make you doesn't it make you thankful like II love the the the theory of it through to practical and then my heart is actually overwhelmed with god you did that for me while I was yet when the Bible says while I was yet while we were yet sinners Christ died for us. I'm like that's what he did for me. I deserve none of this. I I ⁓ I'm so thankful and appreciative. I'm like Jack O'Brien: day. Dave Connett: I want to tell the world, like I want, like just people need Jesus, people need that. Like that is on offer for free. I'm thinking God use me to change the world. This is, it's a, to understand the scriptures more and more just brings me back to appreciation and then an action, which I'm, I'm, I'm so thankful. Rebecca Connett: Mm. Hmm. Jack O'Brien: Yeah, it's wild. Bex, what's it, what's the, the technical term for us being able to look and interpret the new Testament through the lens, look, sorry, look at the old Testament through the lens of the new Testament. And we see so many of those parallels there of the, the smoking fire, the smoke and the fire representing the Holy spirit. And as you described, it's, it's God making a covenant to have his body on, on our behalf. It adds so much richness to these stories, right? Rebecca Connett: Yeah, yeah. And you find this all the way through the Old Testament, these prophetic pictures pointing to Jesus right from Genesis 3.15, when God, know, Adam and Eve sin and the very first thing God does before he even speaks to Adam and Eve is he promises a savior. And all the way through the Bible, from that point onwards, until Jesus actually appears in Matthew, you see these signposts pointing towards Jesus. You see them all the way, even in the Tabernacle, the way that it's all set up, all these pictures and they're called types or foreshadowings. of Christ, you see these images that point to Jesus and what he's gonna do on the cross. because the incredible thing of what's taking place in the Bible is that you actually have three levels of narrative taking place at the same time. And this is something, sometimes we get a bit mixed up in the weeds of the Bible, like we're reading and we're reading about ⁓ Jonah and the whale or Daniel and the lion's den, all these individual stories and you go, ⁓ yeah, okay, okay, how does this apply to my life? there's actually two other narratives taking place at the same time that you read all these individual stories. And so you've got, if you think of the individual stories as like your bottom layer of narrative, all those individual stories, know, David and Goliath, et cetera, et cetera. And then above that, you've got this other story that's taking place. that second, yep. Dave Connett: Sorry, sorry, Bex. Bex, is this kind of like when we're having a conversation and you're talking about something but you really mean this, there's a deeper meaning that I've got to try to find so I can really hear what's going on inside your heart. Is that what you're trying to say? Like there's a narrative and a meta narrative and I've got to stop and I've got to listen and understand and that's what I need to do. Jack, does that sound familiar to you? Is that what happens in your world? Rebecca Connett: Thank you. Absolutely. Yes. Yes, I'm so glad. Jack O'Brien: Yeah. Yeah, Dave, I know you said you've got to understand. I'd say you'll never understand, but you can dwell with understanding. Rebecca Connett: I'm just so glad this is being recorded because you know now I have evidence that he understands what his task is so yeah exactly Dave. Dave Connett: Jack, Jack, that's amazing. Jack O'Brien: Here to help, brother. Dave Connett: I'm doing my best shot. like, Lord, give me your grace. Whose phone's going off right now? Jack O'Brien: ⁓ Sorry, tell us about the meta narratives, Vic. Let's get back on track. Rebecca Connett: was my phone. Okay, so then you've got the second, ⁓ Dave, your phone's about to ring because that was my son ringing. ⁓ The second level of narratives is then the story that's taking place of God and his people. And so you see this in the Old Testament, how God selects Abraham and he goes, I'm gonna make you into a great nation. And then you see, you know, the nation of Israel is born and then God is with Israel as a people. and God has a plan for his people Israel. Then you see it out worked in the New Testament where God then chooses his church and the church's birth and God is with his people, the church. And so that second level of narrative that's taking place over and above and at the same time as all the individual stories is God's plan for his people. But all of that is what's known as the metanarrative. And that's this overarching narrative. or truth that is true for all of humanity, for all of history, right? For all of eternity. And that is not just God's plan for his people that he chose, but actually God's plan for all of humanity. And that's the story that we see over all the individual stories you see from Genesis to Revelation. And this is the miracle of the word of God is that throughout all these books, 66 books written by 40 different authors over 1600 years, there was one story taking place and that's the metanarrative. and it starts in Genesis and it ends in Revelation. And that is a story of God's plan for humanity. And so it starts with creation and then it moves on to the fall where Adam and Eve sin and then God promises a savior and then Jesus comes and he dies and he rises again. He goes back to heaven. He promises he's returning and then we get to live for eternity with him. And that's the overarching meta narrative of Christianity that began. in the beginning and will continue for all of eternity. And that's what we see taking place. And that's why when I look at Genesis 15 with Abraham and the blood path, it's such a beautiful picture and it's a perfect picture of what Jesus did for us because everything weaves together in this beautiful metanarrative. So when you're reading the Bible, if you can just think, okay, what's taking place in the individual's person's life, but then what's God doing in these other levels? What's he doing with his, how is this moving the plan? towards Jesus. How is this moving the plan towards eternity? What's God doing in the bigger picture there? It just helps bring a lot of depth to your understanding and to your reading. Jack O'Brien: Hmm. I really liked that because it is that it's helping people understand how to handle scripture. Right. And so I guess to summarize what you're describing is that we want to look at what is the individual story? What is the story for God's people? And what is the story for all people and that whole redemptive arc all the way through it adds a whole lot more depth to what is not just a nice story, but is the, the word of God is alive and powerful. Rebecca Connett: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Jack O'Brien: It probably was also helpful then for folks who were thinking, ⁓ Old Testament. So we cherry pick stories and we pick our own narratives and some things are prescriptive and some things are descriptive. And that's easy. You know, you can pick and choose. How do, how do we think about what is say prescriptive versus descriptive or why do we choose to accept some of the laws of the Old Testament, but discard others? How do we handle that sort of perspective? Rebecca Connett: Yeah, it's really important to learn these things because otherwise you do have the danger of cherry picking and you just you get to decide and suddenly you're the authority over the word of God and it should be the other way around. So understanding that you know these stories are telling what happened and it's not saying that that should happen. So people do dumb things in the Bible all the time and I'm so glad the Bible records that because I also do dumb things and it makes me feel better about myself. But ⁓ So understand that this is describing, it's descriptive, describing what took place versus prescriptive, which is where it's like, okay, so for example, the 10 commandments is like, this is how I want you to live. And not everyone lived like that, right? And so that's describing how they lived. It's not saying that's how we should live, right? They have multiple wives doesn't mean you should have multiple wives, okay? ⁓ And then in terms of understanding, you know, all the laws of the Old Testament, ⁓ Dave Connett: Sorry, sorry, so I shouldn't have multiple wives? Rebecca Connett: Yep, you got it. Jack O'Brien: I can see that coming from a long way away. I'd suggest you your hands full with one as do I, Dave. I have zero desire for multiple wives. Rebecca Connett: Yeah, I realize that this is a... Dave Connett: I agree, I do have my hands full right now, it's good. Back to you Rebecca, tell us more. Rebecca Connett: So later that will... Yeah, look, you've got different types of laws in the Old Testament. You've got God's moral law and that continues into the New Testament and it's reaffirmed by Christ in the New Testament. ⁓ Yeah, like do not murder, right? So the Ten Commandments are a great example of ten laws that are reaffirmed in how Jesus teaches in the New Testament. Jack O'Brien: Like what? Like what? Like life. Mm-hmm. Rebecca Connett: And we go, yeah, that still applies. That is the moral law of how God wants us to live. Then there's a couple of other types of laws in the Old Testament, because you've got to understand when the people of Israel came out of Egypt, they had gone into Egypt as a family of 75 people. Then over the next 430 years, as they grew and multiplied, they became slaves in Egypt. So when they came out of Egypt under the leadership of Moses, there was about a million or more people. coming out of Egypt, they were now a nation, but they'd never been a nation. They'd been a family and then they'd been slaves. And so God had to teach them how to be a nation. He had to teach them how to relate to him. So he gave them ceremonial laws, which are, this is how I want you to worship me. He had to give them ⁓ also an understanding of how to relate to each other and how to relate to the nations around them. So he gave them moral laws, he gave them ceremonial or worship laws, and he gave them like then just life laws, ethical laws. Jack O'Brien: Civil wars, yeah. Rebecca Connett: Yeah, civil laws. And so those are the laws that we go, okay, like the laws of our country. And so often when you read the Old Testament law, you go, wow, they've got a lot of laws, they have about 600, we have thousands in Australia, like multiplied thousands. And so when you remember that Israel was a nation and he was giving them their laws. And so the ceremonial laws of Israel don't apply to us anymore. Okay, because they were again, coming back to that idea of pointing everything's pointing towards Jesus. So the ceremonial or worship laws of the Old Testament were a type or a picture or a foreshadowing of what Jesus was gonna do. So they would sacrifice animals, there'd be blood shed for the forgiveness of sins. And it wasn't that that animal's blood shed, it was a prophetic picture by faith looking forward to when Jesus as the son of God would come and his blood would be shed. Now that he's come and his blood has been shed for our sins, we don't need to have sacrifices of animals anymore. So that is now done away with. The Bible says it's now. obsolete. Okay, so we don't have to worry about those laws. ⁓ So we follow the moral laws. And ⁓ then obviously, the civil laws, which are the laws of that nation of Israel as well. there you go. Jack O'Brien: Hmm. Dave, ⁓ I'll come to you. Obviously, there's some things we're talking about there that are descriptive, prescriptive, and then there are things in the New Testament that are instructive that are not necessarily laws, but really good practices. And really the New Testament example of the blood path that Bex is talking about is communion, right? It is our practice of the covenant that Christ made or fulfilled on our behalf. Rebecca Connett: Mm. Jack O'Brien: How do you think about the blood and the cross, the bread, the wine communion? Like how does that apply pastorally for the average good lifer? Dave Connett: Yeah, good question, Jack. And there have been many discussions ⁓ over the years in regards to communion and what's the biblical way of actually ⁓ receiving it. ⁓ First up, the individual's response needs to be a ⁓ reference and a thanks. I'm there to remember Jesus says, do this in remembrance of me. And so what I wanna do is I wanna keep remembrance of Christ central. and I want to be living in constant communion where I'm continually remembering and going, how am I receiving it? How do I apply this? How am I living that out? So I keep close, I suppose, short accounts with God in regards to the way that I live my life, in regards to me being in constant communion with Him. But when it comes to the elements that Jesus shared with the disciples in the Last Supper. as they celebrated Passover just before he's about to become the ⁓ the completion of that covenant, ⁓ that he was to be the lamb slain once and for all for the sins of the world. I think that's the kind of thing where Jesus said, every time you eat and drink, do this in remembrance of me. And so I love that at Good Life Church, we do this a lot. ⁓ in the Bible, Jesus had with him and 12 mates. And that to me looks a whole lot like a small group. For many years we went, we want you to do small groups. there was, we were looking at the way we did that. And I was just like, I can see it where people actually open up and share and it becomes really real. And ⁓ they actually had a meal. And you look at the way that Paul dug into communion into. uh you know one of the epistles I forget which epistle off the top of my head but he's talking about how to do it he's like some of you guys are getting drunk and others are going hungry and I'm like well that's a that's a meal going on right there and he's trying to bring some order to that kind of meal and um so looking at the way that we try to encourage people to do communion is breaking uh the the bread and and drinking the wine and sharing together a meal so that we can actually be one in Christ that it's not just I'm there to have a meal, but I'm there to have a meal as we actually pour over the word of God and see how we can actually discuss it, apply it, and then support each other through it. And so that's probably one of the key things about the way that we do small groups is that we're doing, and it's probably not an official communion stop. We're going to take, you know, mean, have a bit of bread, a bit of juice, but we're sharing a big chunk of what communion is about right there in community. I think the community thing is really, really key. ⁓ The community thing where we actually remember Christ, where we actually ⁓ break the bread and share the wine ⁓ and do that is really, really important. On top of that, we've recently continued to add communion into our official services. Now, official services with the size that we've got become one way communication. So there's not a lot of two way or trust or communication or openness. And ⁓ with the way that we serve it with those little you know, little servings. ⁓ It's certainly we don't have the contention that Paul had with communion because everyone's going hungry and there's no chance of anyone getting drunk. communion is I think God weighs the heart and I think we've got to try to be as accurate to his directives as possible. And if we can have our heart ⁓ in the place of remembering Christ and then applying it, then I get to think. However I've taken communion, however I remember Christ, whether I've done it in a small group or I'm doing it large with that tiny little wafer and that funky juice that we give away, then I'm thinking I need to actually apply the body and the blood of Jesus to my life. Now the body would say, don't be isolated. I want to be a part of his body. I get to be a part of his body. It's to say, I've got to... I've got to be connected. I want to be connected with my wife in marriage. I want to be connected with my children in relationship. I want to be connected with my brothers and sisters that I'm accountable to, that I'm open, that can actually speak and have communication and connection that way. I want to avoid isolation. ⁓ Even the temptation part of James chapter one talks about it only ever happens as you're drawn away or isolated. So I to be joined with my brothers and sisters. but also I want to have the blood of Jesus over my mind, over my heart, over my actions, over everything. So the blood of Jesus is the once and for all sacrifice for sins, but also for curses and for ⁓ sickness. So I'm going to stand under the blood of Jesus, under that covenant, because God made the covenant with himself and his body was broken. That's a brilliant picture from the blood path. My spiritual warfare is actually standing under the blood of Jesus. with the body of Christ and then saying, well, how were my reactions, my thoughts, my words affecting that to the negative or to the positive? Are my words, that the words of my mouth, the meditation of my heart be acceptable in your sight? I want to allow the blood of Jesus to speak and start to transform the way that I think, way that I act and the way that I speak. And so the discipleship is, am I letting Jesus' His sacrifice speak? to the adaptation of my soul's response that I could be more like Christ. That happens in communion. It happens in community. It happens under the blood of Jesus and allowing that to have its complete work day by day as I come closer to him. Jack O'Brien: I love it. I love that. The rhythms of our calendar remind us every year to come back to the cross that this season of Easter, said to someone the other day, there's this juxtaposition of feelings for the Christian at Easter of, good Friday and resurrection Sunday of Christ's death, but also his resurrection. ⁓ For me, Easter is... the most wonderful time of year. know, we talk about it for Christmas, but it's like really our calendar centers on Christ's death, resurrection and Holy Spirit power. And I love that. You know, communion is that too, right? It's that we would center ourselves back on the core tenants of our faith, that his body was broken for us, his blood was shed for our sins and that our victory is in his body and his blood. That is the centrality of all of our faith. Dave Connett: Yeah. Rebecca Connett: Yeah, yeah, I think again, like you just said, centers us in the victory, because I think sometimes we go, know, because Satan hates humans, he hates the people of God, especially, and so he does everything he can, he throws everything he can at us, and sometimes it can just feel like things are actually really tough. And I take great comfort looking at, you know, when Satan, when God, sorry, when Jesus died on the cross, Satan thought he'd won. He thought that was his victory day, right? And the beautiful picture that God gives in John, ⁓ I can't speak right now, Genesis 3.15, he says to the serpent, which is Satan, he says, you'll strike his heel, but he will crush your head. And I think of that a lot around Easter and Good Friday. And I think sometimes Good Friday is a very somber moment because we focus on the torturous death and how horrible it was and all the rest of it. But I think we actually need to remember why it's called good because at that moment, Satan thought he'd won. He thought he'd killed God at that point, but all he could ever do was strike his heel. And in the process, Jesus crushed his head. And I think for our own life, when we're actually just coming against it and we feel defeated or we feel like we're actually a victim, Dave Connett: Come on. Rebecca Connett: to remember that no matter what Satan tries, he actually is already a defeated foe. Jesus already crushed his head, you know? And so he can, Satan can try what he likes, but the most he can ever do is strike Christ's heel. And in the process, he was crushed, he was dead. And so Good Friday, as much as it can be somber, is actually victory. It is victory in that moment. And then, Jack O'Brien: Rot. Rebecca Connett: And then that victory is then shown even more in the fact that he rose from the dead on Sunday. You know, he didn't stay dead. There was nothing Satan could do to keep him dead because in that process, in the process of Christ's death and resurrection, he took back all authority. He took back the keys of hell and death. There was nothing Satan can do to destroy what Christ did on the cross. And there's such victory that's available for us in that. And that's why communion is not just a remembrance. It's an act of participation in the broken body and the shed blood of Jesus and all of the power that that involves, all of the authority that that involves. We are partakers in the power of God through the blood and body of Christ. And that's what we want about blood, you know. Jack O'Brien: And there's right for me, there is, it's, it's not just a token symbol, though it is that it's, it's so much more than that. It's, it is a literal embodying of his, not his literal body and blood, but we embody what the bread and the wine represents. Dave Connett: Sorry, sorry Jack, that was really close to Catholic. Jack O'Brien: I pulled it back nicely though, didn't I? Dave Connett: Yeah, look, I'm just saying you danced and then you probably shouldn't, probably shouldn't. That's great. There was there was good self correction on the fly. Jack O'Brien: No, it's not good. Rebecca Connett: But I think on that though, and sorry, Jack, I will let get back to that. I think it's really important to, you know, we err one way or the other. And sometimes we err, you know, we don't want to be Catholic, but we err to the other extreme, we go, ⁓ it's just a symbol. And we empty a bit of its power in that moment, right? Which is what you're referring to. Jack O'Brien: Correct. Correct. Yes. Yes. The technical term is consubstantiation, if I'm correct, but it's, it is, it's, it's, no, I don't know about that. We'll see. That's another podcast. ⁓ but it is, it is, it's a physical act. is that sacramental practice that it is not just a, a mental assent for us or a confession, but it is a ⁓ practice that we can. Rebecca Connett: Thank you. Transignification is another one you could use if you wanted to. Jack O'Brien: I said to Christina who shared communion on Sunday, she's like, is the message enough? Do I cover? I'm like, you don't have to dress up what is the power and the presence of the Holy Spirit as we commune around his body and his blood. It's his body and his blood and his presence and his spirit that does the redeeming work and the indwelling power. It doesn't depend on us. It is his presence in that moment. Rebecca Connett: Yep, exactly right. Love it. Jack O'Brien: Wonderful. Dave, any... Dave Connett: the the the great no sorry yet look I don't know if you were trying to wrap me up or whatever but I was thinking out of Colossians 2 15 and and Kev preached this on the Sunday just gone but ⁓ it says through the cross Christ disarmed spiritual rulers and authorities making a public spectacle of them triumphing over them in the cross that when when the enemy thought that he'd killed God there was actually this was a public spectacle of the victory Rebecca Connett: Yeah. Dave Connett: of Jesus over death, hell and the grave. that sacrifice means all of that. Not just that I get heaven, not just that my sins are forgiven, I get to actually live out this life of now victory ⁓ in so many. And that's what God wants for us. And that we would help each other do that is why He puts us together in the church. It's actually spiritual warfare to be united as a part of His. as a part of his body. It's spiritual warfare. If you think about with the Suserean Treaty that the smaller body would pay taxes to the bigger body. We're actually, my spiritual warfare is that tithes and offerings. I think about what I get with my tithes and offerings. The windows of heaven are open, the devourer rebuke. All of these things are actually a part of relationship. I don't have to tithe. This is a part of a remarkable covenant. Are you kidding me? I get to do it. ⁓ I get to be in connection and relationship as the body of Christ. so walking these things through starts to change the way that I think about it, including my finances, including the confession of my mouth and allowing God to have his complete work in us is not just relationship with him, but relationship with him, with others. And that journey is super, super helpful because communion is not just that I have communion, it's that I do it with my brothers and sisters. Rebecca Connett: Hmm. And it's interesting, like everything, you can get so much out of this, even this picture, this jewel picture at the same time of when Christ's body was broken on the cross, at the moment of his death, the curtain that separated the place where humanity could be and the place where God dwelled, that curtain was ripped from top to bottom. all the way through, which basically opened a way for humanity to go into the very presence of God. And that took place as Christ's body was broken open. But Paul also then says, and he speaks, he's talking about communion and he starts to do these layering of metaphors where he's talking about communion, but then he goes, but now you are the body of Christ. And so this beautiful jewel picture of Christ's body being broken apart so that we could enter into the presence of God. And in the process, we become his body. Dave Connett: Yeah. Rebecca Connett: And Paul says, you together are that body. And I think even that just reminds us, hey, we have to gather together on our own. You can't do Christianity on your own. Gathering together as a church is so important because the Bible says we together are the body of Christ. And it's such a great picture of the importance of how we live this out in community. Jack O'Brien: So good. we'll, on when you're listening to this, it'll be sometime before or after Easter. If it's after Easter, we're on our way to Pentecost and spiritual warfare and all the fun things that are rolling through. Dave, any final last thoughts from you? Rebecca Connett: . Dave Connett: live it out large. You wanna take the word of God and apply it with everything you've got. Submit yourself to the word of God and the spirit of God and it's only out what the steps of the righteous lead upward. So learning to grapple with difficult things of the Bible and asking the right questions and learning and growing is something that you do in community. I would say continuing that and continue to keep short accounts with God and let him to shape your thinking. I'm the classic one that's come from a dysfunctional set up in a lot of different ways and I've had to just go God, this is not this I'm going to be absolute jackwag and unless I let your blood and your word and your body actually shape me and ⁓ long way to go nowhere near perfect. ⁓ Contrary to popular belief, but I would just say to everyone, I'd encourage you continue that journey, the word, the blood in community, no matter what the world throws your way. Jack O'Brien: Super. Thank you. Well, good lifers, thank you for joining us. Trust this is encouraged you in your faith. Looking forward to pulling apart Sunday sermons and tackling topics that will help us as we navigate through these seasons. Thank you, Pastor Dave. Thank you, Pastor Bex. We'll see you on another episode again. Dave Connett: Thank you, Jack. Rebecca Connett: Thanks guys.