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Finally, a DSA candidate we can support! Vote Brittany for Rhode Island! · Gimme a Break!

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_03: Who is the real threat?
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_03: The peace in the region.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_03: We did a preemptive strike last night while having peace talks.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_03: We attacked them.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_03: Unprovoked.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_03: Once again, it seems like the United States is solution to the problem of terrorism.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_03: It's killing more people.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_03: They are not the aggressor.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_03: We are.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_03: The United States are the real terrorists.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_03: Something I've been thinking about a lot with regard to this attack is how Fed Astro once said we strangled us for 40 years and then criticized us for the way that we breathe.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_03: We overthrew their democratically elected leader in a coup in 1953, and that's largely led us to where we are now.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_03: The U.S.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_03: doesn't care about democracy.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_03: They care about control.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_03: Just like the genocide of Palestine.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_03: The blockchain of Cuba.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_03: The objection of a durable.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_03: The purpose is to subjugate the people and kill any resistance.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_03: The US has been in war for 232 after 249 years that it's existed.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_03: We've heard members that both parties support intervention in Iran.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_03: Intervention law amongst other places.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_03: Our ruling class four parties support war and five genocide.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_03: The U.S.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_03: is the greatest threat to world police peace and global stability.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_03: We are here today to show the asking class that we will not be silent.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_03: We will not stand for these unprovoked attacks.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_03: We will not stand for more U.S.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_03: aggression.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_03: Down with U.S.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_03: imperialism.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_03: Down with US imperialism.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_03: Down with U.S.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_03: imperialism.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_02: Hello and welcome to another episode of Give Me a Break, the podcast of the Just Break Already caucus in the DSA.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_02: I'm your host, Lee Tal, here with Edward.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_02: Hello.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_02: The audio you heard at the beginning is from a speech from Brittany Kubasek that she gave at a protest in Providence, Rhode Island at the outset of the U.S.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_02: attack on Iran.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_02: The speech was clear in standing with Iran against U.S.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_02: imperialism.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_02: It was also clear in placing the responsibility for the war as well as the attacks on Cuba, the abduction of Maduro, and other U.S.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_02: crimes at the feet of both Democratic and Republican parties.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_02: Brittany gave this speech shortly after launching her independent socialist campaign for the General Assembly of House District 5 in Rhode Island.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_02: She is part of Rhode Island DSA and is, I believe, the only DSA campaign that's truly independent and not democratic party, and that's being run in opposition to both parties of American capitalism.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: Her campaign website says that to quote, fight back the working class needs its own movement, its own party, and its own elected representatives.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_02: Of course, this message is what the Just Break Already caucus fights for all across the country, for a clean break with the hated Democratic Party as the basis for building a genuine socialist alternative that working people so desperately need.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_02: For many decades, the left has mostly been an echo chamber for Democratic Party liberalism.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: And this is a big reason why the left is so small and divided today and largely irrelevant to the working class.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_02: We have to change this.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_02: And we at JBA think that this campaign is a small step in that direction and that the left should really rally behind it.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: So our guest today spent last weekend on the ground in Provenance campaigning with Brittany and also interviewed her for our podcast.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_02: So welcome Monica.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_02: Hello, who is with the JBA here in New York City, and welcome Jason.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_02: Hello.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_02: Who is with Labor Militant and United Front for Workers' Party.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_02: And Jason is based in Seattle.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_02: So the first part of this episode will be us interviewing Monica and Jason about their experiences canvassing for Britney.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: And the second part will be the interview that they did with Britney in Provence.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_02: So just to start, Jason, if you want to let us know a little bit about what your group is.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_05: I'm a member of Labor Militant and United Front for a Workers Party.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_05: And United Front for a Workers Party, we've been organizing in Seattle and have had some members go out to Indiana.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_05: And I just got back from Rhode Island supporting various independent socialist campaigns around the country.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_05: And here in Seattle as well, we have an independent socialist, Shama Sawant, running for Congress.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_05: We were in Indiana because there's a Socialist Party of Indiana that just launched and is running some independent socialists and also a member of DSA fighting for break from the Democrats, both in the the DSA like uh JBA is, but also like, you know, broader than just the DSA.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_05: Because I think people are sick and tired of the Democrats and also the Republicans, and we're seeing those cracks show.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_05: We need to get organized amongst working class people who also are fed up with this and find these concrete issues to fight around.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_05: And been doing that in Seattle, fighting back around things like free health care and attacks on working people from the city council and stuff, but also nationally.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_02: Great.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: So I guess I just wanted to start by asking you guys uh what what was it like canvassing on the ground?
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_02: What did you do?
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_02: I assume you door knocked and stuff like that.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but maybe you guys can describe uh some of the work you guys actually did down there.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it was with other comrades of the Rhode Island DSA.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe Yes, that's right.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um so it was a really interesting two days there um going around a working class neighborhood where we knocked on people's doors and provided them with materials from the campaign and actually got a chance to have conversations with people.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember very clearly the composition of the neighborhood being like heavily Latino.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: And for example, this one bus driver worker Puerto Rican who at first told us, you know, I'm not really interested in politics.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think this is for me.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: And shortly after that, when we asked, well, what do you think about the current parties that exist, she let us know how she's completely um under circumstances that come from having taken like a 50% pay cut, that the roads where she drives are a mess, that her family needs more affordable like healthcare.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_00: And so we started talking actual politics through the demands that are in the campaign that Brittany is fighting for.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_00: And we were very engaged with her.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: And at the end of the discussion, she let us know that it would be really interesting to have other working class women around her meet Britney and talk about these questions.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: It provided an opportunity to touch on these issues.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't just about vote for Britney, but getting to listen to the opinions of some of these workers that know that Rhode Island is one of the most expensive, if not the most expensive city to live in, to rent.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, like other youth that we ran into were also talking about how concerned they are against the attacks on LGBTQ people and how how could we fight back?
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: And this open real conversations on what are the issues that people are thinking the Democrats um and the Republicans are not going to come with with answers.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: I would also say that there was a lot of skepticism about, you know, like, okay, she's for these things, but is she really gonna accomplish um the demands?
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: Like what is this all about?
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: And that provided an opportunity to talk about how, well, actually, the change is gonna come from working class methods and uh struggles on the different fronts, like unions defending themselves or fighting together against ICE.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_00: That the point is you cannot start doing this if you rely on the capitalist party.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_00: So those were some of the the conversations I remember.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: But there were there were many, like people that voted for Trump, people that voted for Bernie, and just a general discontent about the existing political options.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: By saying this, it's clear that you know people were curious about socialism, but they are not socialists, they're not open for a revolution, like some people in the left think that, you know, like the fact that there is so much people that hate the Democrats or hate Trump, that their consciousness is higher than what it is.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_00: But in this election, that's part of the purpose, right?
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_00: To use these impulses and this hate towards the ruling class and channel it out in building a workers' party and starting with class independence.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't know, Jason, if you also had because we weren't together, we were knocking doors different teams.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_05: So if you want to talk a little bit about what you encountered, I think it was a lot of similar mood to what you described.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_05: Basically, everybody we actually got to have a conversation with was totally in agreement that the Democrats and the Republicans are not fighting for working people.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_05: And like in Rhode Island, it's a state that's up and down run by Democrats.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_05: Washington is the same way, and it was very interesting to see the dynamic that I've experienced a lot, door knocking and canvassing in Seattle, the mood around the Democratic Party, specifically like the anger towards that is reflected the same way in Providence.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_05: And it was the same way in Indiana, and just points to me towards that people are like itching for something else.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_05: I think that the thing I ran into was similar in the sense of the pushback I got was not around Brittany's an independent or a socialist or anything, but how how do we win this stuff?
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_05: Is she going to be able to do these things?
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_05: And I think that's partially because people see the only examples of politicians we have of like elected officials managing capitalism, because it's all Democrats and Republicans that go these state legislatures and they operate in the interest of the capitalists.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_05: What we need to do by putting up these independent candidates is building that towards that workers' party.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_05: I think that it was good to be able to get into these conversations with people to explain that the role of any of our elected independent candidates, of an elected socialist, an actual socialist, is to use their office as a movement-building tool to build this workers' party to fight for these things because that's the only way that we've ever won free healthcare anywhere in the world or raises to the minimum wage, et cetera, independent movements of working people.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_05: It was good to get into those conversations with people.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_05: I see that the anger there is the same as it is in a lot of other places in the country.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_05: Um, something I learned while I was there is Providence is like the most expensive city in the country by like the difference between what it takes to live there versus like the median income that people make.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_05: That gap is the biggest of any city in the country.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_05: And so people are really frustrated about cost of living.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think that point you made a little bit earlier when you were talking about running people for office as a means to build movement toward a workers' party is really uh one of the biggest differences we have with, I guess you could call it the establishment DSA position on elections, which is you run a candidate and then they get into office and they do all these good things, right?
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: But that's not how socialists approach elections at all.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: Our whole point is we are approaching elections to split society on class lines, right?
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: We want the working class to be organized in its own name and fight for its own interests, to help the working class move to an understanding that they're the ones who should be called the shots in this society, not the capitalists.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: Actual change, like winning anything for the working class, has always come through class struggle.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_01: And the socialist position on elections, going back to the time of Lenin and the Bolsheviks, is we use elections to get out socialist ideas, support, advance class struggle.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's a really important and key point.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_01: That's one of our biggest differences with the other caucuses within the DSA.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_05: I mentioned at the beginning that there's an independent socialist running for Congress in Seattle, named Shama, and she was on the city council for like a decade, and she got elected originally as an independent socialist fighting for the$15 minimum wage, which Seattle was like the first city in the in the country to pass.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_05: That example of using your office to build a movement.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_05: There was Energy 415 in Seattle at the time.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_05: There were fast food workers walking out of the job.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_05: I see that as an example of the way that socialists should be using their office.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_05: And this is the strategy that is going to win.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_05: And I talked to some people at the doors about that, using that example of Seattle, of some of the victories that she won with her council office.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_05: And that's the thing that we need.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_05: That's the thing that's missing.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_05: When you continue to run Democrats over and over again, you get people who are not only like selling out to the Democratic Party, but it's also just like, you know, because the Democratic Party is capitalist party, et cetera.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_05: It's also like you were saying the difference between the establishment DSA and us is this strategy of what do you actually use your office for if you get elected?
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_05: Like we're not just trying to elect like a majority of socialists or whatever, so that one day we can have a vote where we vote for free healthcare.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_05: Like one day there's enough DSA electeds in Congress that can vote for Medicare for all.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_05: We're not just sending people to Congress to take votes and that's it.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_05: Like, or to any elected position as socialists.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_05: That's not the responsibility.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_05: And if that's the way that you see it as somebody who's running for office, independent or otherwise, you will sell out.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think that uh for Marxists, Edward spoke to this and Jason did some too, but what is our purpose in running elections is not to like sell a bag of goods, like I'm gonna get elected and you're gonna get all this good stuff, but actually say that in order to actually advance the needs of the working class, of black people, of immigrants, of Latinos, of women, of LGBTQ, you have to actually struggle against the capitalists and against uh the Democrats.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that's a really uh counter way of looking at elections than how the DSA majority looks at it.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I always thought it was funny.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_02: A lot of people in the DSA love to quote Rosa Luxemburg.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_02: You know, one of her finest quotes was really a polemic against the DSA's electoral reformism.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_02: Um, it was against municipal socialism, or in the US, they call it sewer socialism, i.e., Mamdani, who just by the way, added more cops in his budget to oppress black people, immigrants, and workers in New York City.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_02: But so Rosa Luxemburg said that the character of a bourgeois government isn't determined by the personal character of its members, but by its organic function in bourgeois society.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_02: With the entry of a socialist into the government and class domination continuing to exist, the bourgeois doesn't transform itself into a socialist government, but a socialist transforms himself into a bourgeois minister.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that's a really useful quote because like Marxists understand that you don't get workers' power through elections, but as long as there's illusions in elections, which of course there are, uh Marxists have to use them to propagate our ideas and concretely as possible aid the class struggle.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_02: You can see like when so-called socialists run as and promote the Democratic Party, it literally like puts struggle back.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_02: Britney's campaign, it's really running on a basis that is against the interests of the capitalists and for the interests of the working people.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's why it's kind of exceptional right now in the DSA.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_02: You get a lot of it's not the time for these campaigns.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_02: I think like from your guys' stories about talking to people, I don't think it's a question that people don't want these things or aren't open to them.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's the question of how much people see this as something that is possible.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: I think like for that, the left has a lot of responsibility because if the left united behind these campaigns and actually pushed them, then that would actually give them a lot more momentum and then you would get more votes.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_02: And then you would see that in the results that this is something that you know people are hungry for.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_02: But right now it's on a very small level.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_02: Did you have a sense of how much like working class support like unions, or maybe it's on the level of individual union activists that are supporting Britney, or is that maybe like an area that maybe needs more conscious attention to try to get more of that?
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_02: Because her opponent is a Democrat, I believe, right?
• 16:03
  unknown: Right.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_05: Her opponent is a Democrat.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_05: I didn't get a sense.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_05: I don't know if you learned about any union support they had, Monica, while we were there.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_05: Her opponent is a she talks about this a little bit in the interview, but her opponent is a uh like a Nepo baby Democrat, like his dad held the seat earlier.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_05: And I don't know what the union presence is like in Providence, but I definitely think that's like something that needs to happen.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_05: I don't know the makeup of how many union members are involved with her campaign, but I think that's something that they'll need to, you know.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_05: I don't necessarily think it's the perspective that one member will necessarily be able to win their union locals' endorsement, but fighting for that is important and polarizing around that and exposes the union leadership for their rotten role in this country today of supporting Democrats hand over fist undemocratically without votes of their union members, donating millions and millions of dollars to elected Democrats all across the country.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_05: And like, sure, that's no different in Providence, but uh putting up that struggle in the union to both polarize against the union leadership, but also find more union members who want to break and support the campaign, etc.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_05: I think that's definitely a part of the campaign that they have to if they aren't already, they need to get going.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_00: No, I'm I didn't get confirmation that there's unions being motivated around the campaign, but certainly I know that Britney's very much for better union organizing, including around the the campaigns that she's had in this regard.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_00: But from the anecdotes I was mentioning, in particular the the bus driver, when we were asking her if that's a possibility uh for campaigning or or having people need Britney, she was very excited.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: And this is this is something that has some potential.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't get the confirmation or I'm not certain if there's already some unions that are endorsing her or involving her or campaign.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_02: I I got from the interview and from what you guys were saying that the wealth gap is like massive.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_02: Um maybe it's the biggest in Providence, I don't know.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_02: But also Providence is 45% Hispanic, which I didn't know until recently.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_02: And a large proportion of that is Guatemalan, Dominican, Puerto Rican, uh all countries oppressed by US imperialism, and it's also I think 13% black.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_02: And I think any working class campaign really needs to speak to the fight for uh black and brown liberation and for defense of immigrants in this country, and why the fight to advance the conditions of the whole working people is is so connected to those struggles.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_02: And that to fight imperialism, to stop ICE, to stop racist cop terror, you ha you have to fight the Dems.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like there are elements of her campaign that really do speak to those questions.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I was really happy when I saw pictures, Monica was holding up campaign material in Spanish, and I thought that was really important that you guys were doing that.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_02: I figured that her opposition to US imperialism too would have some appeal as well with the large Hispanic population.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I think that for the people that I spoke could be the people I was having some conversations, it was very refreshing, like as a starting point that someone is not just probably because you're a democrat and you know what it entails.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_00: So there was in particular this uh this white woman, she's been for decades a painter and uh very much opposed to the conditions that she's facing and trying to do some work in her union to improve them, and and we got into this conversation about why are all the jobs going to Mexico and China and what can we do about that.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so it really did lead to well, it is US imperialism that is oppressing these countries, and workers in America have a material interest in the fact that conditions for other working class people uh outside of the US and in countries under the boot of US imperialism are not oppressed and are able to improve their conditions.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: So it really did lead to these conversations, having the issues posed in her campaign and like talking to workers that you would think are very conservative and pro-America.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_00: If you open the conversation and place it in terms of what we're talking about, which is uh polarizing along class lines, it leads you into a place where people really listen to it.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: They're not happy with the gas prices, they're not happy with the inflation.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: Some of them are just really, really angry and and tired of of what's happening in the country.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: So they connect the dots.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_00: I think that comes also in the interview, how the fight against the Democratic Party in Rhode Island is linked to broader issues.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_05: We had a couple conversations with Spanish speakers at the doors, which I don't speak Spanish, so I didn't get, but the the volunteer that I was door knocking with did.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_05: People were were interested, and I also think people recognize the Democratic Party is just as responsible for both US imperialism, but also they created and funded ICE and these detention centers.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_05: And that is not lost on people, even though the Republicans are in power right now.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_05: And they're also seeing Democrats like nationally call for not even cutting the ICE budget at all.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_05: They're moralizing around how horrible all of these attacks by ICE are around the country, but then what are they concretely doing about it?
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_05: That's another piece, I think, connected to running independent socialist campaigns.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_05: Brittany is anti-ICE.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_05: I saw some stuff about the DSA chapter in Rhode Island fighting back against ICE in Providence.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_05: And so I think that is also an element of why it's important to be running these independent socialist campaigns and connecting both the fight for for free health care and a rent freeze and a$30 minimum wage to the fights against oppression and U.S.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_05: imperialism.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_05: It's the same movement that will get ice out of our cities and shut down these detention centers that will win free health care.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_05: It's the same kind of fight that's needed.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_01: Unless those struggles are connected, there's really no way forward.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_01: All of the campaigns that we've seen.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_01: I think Brittany's campaign is really strong in terms of being really clear about why you need to oppose the Democratic Party.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: You see all these other Canada's DSA endorses, and of course it might be against the Democratic Party.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: Establishment, or maybe not, in the case of the guy they endorsed in California.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_01: You get into these individual conversations with DSA personnel's sort of the same deal, right?
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah, we're we're against the Democrats, we're our own thing, but reality is they aren't.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_01: This Britney campaign stands out among every DSA campaign that's being run right now because it's like, no, I'm against the Democrats, I'm against the Republicans.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_01: And it's interesting the national DSA did endorse Britney, which you look at all the other endorsements.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: You have the poster child for the Democratic Party, AOC, you've got uh Stire out in California, so it's interesting.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know why do you guys think national DSA endorsed the Britney campaign?
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_05: I don't know a hundred percent, but it seems to me that the whole Rhode Island DSA fully behind breaking from the Democrats.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_05: They have that in writing, the chapter is not allowed to endorse Democrats, work with Democrats, and my sense from talking about uh the national endorsement was that the chapter is fully committed to this, and I think not endorsing is like, well, you might lose a chapter of DSA, but that's the sort of logical conclusion of this to me is like you create more polarization against the majority in DSA by not providing this paper endorsement.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_05: But I think what's hidden under the surface of that endorsement to me is the fact that it's basically just a paper endorsement, uh, as far as I can tell.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_05: They're not providing any kind of uh like full-time organizers, national resources of any kind to the Brittany campaign, uh, which you counterpose that to all of the resources and energy they put into all these Democrats around the country.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_05: The Seattle chapter has endorsed uh Democrat for State House that uh they're going very all out for, like weekly canvassing shifts, training people to be field leads and stuff like that.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_05: And at the same time, they endorsed that Democrat.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_05: The Seattle DSA refused to have debate on endorsing Shaman, who is also a DSA member, but is running as an independent socialist.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_05: And some of the discussion revolved around DSA doesn't want to do paper endorsements and we don't want to put the resources into supporting Shawma because her election is going to be really hard or something to that effect.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_05: They use this organizational thing around paper versus like more supportive endorsements to avoid the politics of the questions which are like we need to break from the Democratic Party.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_05: It's good the national DSA has endorsed her, but what is DSA nationally doing to support this campaign, which I see of all the endorsed DSA candidates, Brittany's is the most important of all of them because she's the only one who's like clear about the Democratic Party.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_02: Um Yeah, I think it also gives the national leadership a little like more credit or cover that it's not true that they only endorse Democrats, because look, and it doesn't really pose like much of a threat to them or their their overall strategy or support to Democrats.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_02: Is there anything else you guys wanted to add?
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I think just as a very brief conclusion, I would say that campaigning and doing uh doing the work that they're doing, which is a lot of work and is really well organized, and it was a pleasure working with everybody, points also to the need to create this united front for those of us that are for a clean break.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I totally agree.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_02: So I think this was a really good way of introducing the interview that you guys did with Britney.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_02: Um, thank you so much for joining us today.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I would encourage DSAers all over the country to help Britney's campaign in any way you can if you support making a real fight for class independence.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so without further ado, um now we're gonna play the interview that Jason and Monica did with Brittany Kubisek.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, Brittany.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um my name is Monica.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: I'm here to ask you a few questions on behalf of Just Break Already Caucus, part of the DSA for a clean break.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, congratulations on your campaign.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: We were canvassing today and we plan to do that tomorrow.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_00: So that's very exciting to be part of the campaign.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_00: The questions I want to ask you have to do with informing our audience.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: This is our our podcast, Give Me a Break.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: And my first question for you is why are you running uh this campaign and what are what are you running for?
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like for what office?
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, um, so we're running for Rhode Island State House of Representatives here in District 5, um, which is it's a Rhode Island State House seat.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but the district uh encompasses a couple of neighborhoods within Providence.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_04: So um the neighborhoods are Charles neighborhood here, and then we got the Wanscook neighborhood and the Providence College area.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_04: So very much a lot of uh a lot of working class people, a lot of uh people that are just you know families trying to get by, trying to live their day-to-day.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_04: Um so we're running that that's the seat we're running for.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_04: Uh and then why we're running uh more broadly is is because this is a pretty important political moment, you know, as we as as as I think everybody recognizes with what's going on in the national level, um, where you know that we are getting capitalism without the veneers at this point, right?
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_04: And seeing how things are, so many people are frustrated with the state of the world and don't really feel like they have a political home.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_04: Um, a lot of people are looking for something else, looking for something different, and and we believe that this is a perfect time and perfect opportunity to be able to push something harder, to be able to use the in the true Eugene Debs Debs sense of it, right?
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_04: Be able to run as an open socialist and not be afraid of using like explicitly socialist language and fighting for labor rights, fighting for the working class, fighting for the right to you know unionize and strike.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_04: So uh yeah, that's that's that's overall like why we're why we're doing this campaign and and and what the what the point is.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_04: The uh some other little context too.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_04: Uh you know, Providence City Council is also like fairly progressive, as we were talking about a little bit earlier.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_04: Um the so we had like considered running for different seats, right?
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_04: State there's state senate, there's city council, there's all sorts of stuff we could have run for, Congress, right?
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_04: Don't really have the chops to run for Congress yet, um, as as a chapter up in here.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_04: But um City Council and uh state rep, it's really interesting because the the size of the area is fairly similar.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_04: The amount of votes that you need is fairly similar between the two.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_04: Um, it is slightly more votes that are needed for a state rep seat, but in terms of like the general like the geographic area that we have to cover to be able to get the number, get to that win number that you need, it's it's pretty comparable for um you know a seat that has a little bit more power and you can do a little bit more with a little bit more of a mouthpiece.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_04: So um that's why this seat specifically.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um so what are the main demands in your campaign that you can tell us more about?
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, on a broad level, what we're fighting for is how uh housing, healthcare, uh, energy infrastructure improvements, as well as power in the workplace.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_04: Now, what do we mean by when we say housing?
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_04: Um the main thing we're fighting for with regard to housing is we want to see a statewide rent freeze.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_04: In this city, um, Providence has uh quickly become the least affordable city in the country uh in terms of uh like affordability metric of what it takes to make an income in order to live here versus what the average income is.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_04: That gap is the largest in the country.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_04: Um most, you know, most apartments are going for close to for a one bedroom close to$2,000.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_04: Um if you want, if you've got a family and you're renting and you need a place with a couple, two, three bedrooms, like that's two,$2,500,$3,000,$2,500 probably if you're lucky.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_04: Um so we want to see a statewide rent freeze, which is pushing further or further pushing the envelope, which is um on something that is already kind of happening in this city, which is a rent stabilization ordinance that they're working on at the city council.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_04: What that would do is uh is cap rent increases at 4% year over year with some caveats, um, but largely cap rent increases at 4% year over year.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_04: And that's seeing a lot of fight um from the landlord class in the city.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_04: Um as well as uh, you know, the there's so many organizations and so many people in this community that have been working for like almost 10 years on this, and it's like, yeah, it is still like still hasn't gone through.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_04: So we're like uh we don't like we're fighting for something hard, pushing for something more, right?
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_04: Seeing an actual rent freeze and stop the rents from going up for a minimum of two years.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_04: We also want to see the funding for uh affordable publicly owned housing, right?
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_04: To be able to increase supply and then drive down cost of rent for everybody.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_04: Um, healthcare, this one's you know, pretty pretty boilerplate for what I think most of us are looking for.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_04: Um, you know, quality care that's free of the point of service, single-payer system paid for by a progressive tax rate.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_04: Um, with regard to energy and infrastructure, so our energy in Rhode Island, we import a lot of our energy.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_04: So a lot of people see really high distribution costs and uh transmission costs.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_04: Uh the company that uh provides a lot of the electricity for most people in Rhode Island and in Providence is a company called um Rhode Island Energy, and that is a complete misnomer on purpose.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_04: Rhode Island Energy is not at all Rhode Island, it is owned by a private, you know, a corporation out in Pennsylvania, Pennsylvania Power and Lighting, out of Allentown PA, whose concerns are what?
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_04: Their shareholders, their bottom line, right?
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_04: So we've seen people talk to people that are paying three, four, five, six hundred dollars to keep their you know their houses warm in the winter, keep the lights on and stuff, and that's just absolutely unacceptable.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_04: So we want to see a public utility.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_04: We want to see a public takeover of our energy grid.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_04: So we're actually investing in ourselves rather than just patting the wallets of some stockholders.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_04: Um and then with regard to infrastructure, we we are also ranked um pretty high every year on uh the the roads being the worst in the country.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_04: Uh we literally, the state's literally falling apart.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_04: A couple weeks ago, a section of an overpass over the train tracks fell onto the train tracks in Cranston, um, which is the city just just south of Providence, and it shut down this entire corridor for a couple of days while they cleared that.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_04: What is it now?
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_04: Three almost two, three years ago at this point.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_04: I think it's three years.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_04: The Washington Bridge, which connects you know, there's a lot of islands, there's a lot of rivers, a lot of water.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_04: The Washington Bridge connects like two parts of the state.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_04: It connects East Providence to Providence, and then just you know, Providence in general to that part of the state.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_04: And um, a couple of years ago, that bridge failed.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_04: Um, we're lucky that it didn't collapse.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_04: And it was due to um yeah, uh poor maintenance by the contractors that we pay to maintain these bridges and take care of them.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_04: So um, you know, we want to see investment in that infrastructure, kind of that sewer socialism type idea, as well as the last thing I have is we um had you know austerity politics in the last couple of years where we've cut funding for our you know Rhode Island Public Transportation Authority and cut it, cut a lot of bus routes to pay for uh budget deficits.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_04: So we want to see that funding fully restored, and we want to see the expansion and improvement on our public uh public transit network in general as well.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um what do you think makes you the Fernand Hassan independent candidate for, say, the Democratic Party?
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, uh well, for one, like I'm not a Democrat, right?
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_04: So um what makes me different is yeah, I I'm running as a socialist because I am a socialist.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_04: Um and the difference is that we're we're people are fed up with the Democratic Party at large on the local level and the state level, or excuse me, and the and the national level.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_04: Um so when we talk to people at the doors, a lot of them are fed up.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_04: A lot of them uh don't don't see a point or are losing, uh have have been disillusioned um about voting for Democrats and voting blue.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_04: We've been voting blue no matter who in this state for 40 or 50 years, and what's the result, right?
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_04: We end up with these crumbling bridges, crumbling roads, sky-high energy costs and cost of living in general.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_04: Um, so people are just like fed up with it.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_04: And when we are running this independent campaign, um we don't have to defend being like a good Democrat at the doors.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_04: We can agree with people and see, like, yeah, like you're you're fed up with things, so am I, so are we.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_04: That's why we're trying to push something that's actually fighting for working people, um, rather than like respecting the establishment and respecting the leadership within the state Democratic Party.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_04: Um, we don't have to kowtow to that leadership, right?
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_04: Um we've seen at this in in this state uh is when a lot of uh progressives get into office and they've done some really good stuff to be to be 100% fair, uh, but a lot of them get sidelined by the establishment because the establishment controls what goes through the state house.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_04: The speaker of the house in the state is incredibly powerful.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_04: Um So that's what makes us different, is that we we we see that the change isn't gonna come through the Democratic Party at the local level, at the state level, at the national level, um, and people are ready for something different.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_04: And uh we're trying to build the foundation to be able to get to a point where we are able to build a party that actually represents the working class.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_00: That sounds great.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, how do you think that you will achieve your platform once you're in office?
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_00: Like what would be your idea of how that would happen?
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it would definitely have to be an inside-outside game and approach.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_04: Um, like I was just saying, with the way that the state works with the establishment and the leadership of the party, the especially the Speaker of the House, having so much power, I'm under no disillusion that uh it's it's gonna be easy to pass some of these things.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_04: Like a lot of these things are are we're asking for a lot, right?
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_04: Uh something I forgot to mention a second ago when you asked what we were running for and what our demands are is we want to see a$30 minimum wage and we want to see stronger labor rights so that people can organize their workplaces easier so that people can go on strike against excuse me, um, you know, the expect exploitation that they see.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_04: Um but uh because of the way that the state works, we're we understand that it's gonna be really hard to get some of this stuff through.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_04: That's where the outside game comes in.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_04: Every change that we've ever seen happen in in our country, in the world, has not just been through voting and not just been through politicians passing good policy, right?
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_04: Like we got the civil rights movement, we got civil rights, however, you know, there you know, many issues there may be and what Trump's doing right now is another story.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_04: But we got those, not because the politicians were like the ones championing them, because people outside the system got together in a mass movement and fought against it, right?
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_04: We got labor rights for the same reason.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_04: We got labor rights because of people literally giving their blood, sweat, and tears to being able to have the eight-hour workday, to being able to have the stuff we take for granted now.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_04: Um so how do we achieve this?
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_04: It's gotta be a movement.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_04: It's gotta be um normal people coming together and understand and being engaged politically.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_04: And in running as an independent and not being part of that um the Democratic Party, we hope to be able to show people that like they do have a voice and they can be part of this and be heard and be able to build something larger that will actually achieve these goals.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_00: I am also here joined by Jason from Labor Militant, and he has a few questions to ask you.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, uh yeah, I'm I'm with Labor Militant and also an organization out in Seattle called United Front for a Workers' Party.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_05: And like we have been, you know, supporting a bunch of these independent socialist campaigns like around the country, uh uh, including in Seattle and New York and California and these other places.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I guess uh and I had a couple questions.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I was curious.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_05: Uh are you running against a Democrat?
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_05: Are you running against a Republican?
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_05: Tell us a little bit about your opponent and like what their record is and why why what you're putting forward is different, et cetera.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, no, that's a good question, and this segues well from what you were asking.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_04: So our opponent is is a Democrat, um, and he's very much part of that establishment um in this state.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_04: The way Rhode Island works and has worked for a very long time is it's it's about who you know.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_04: Everybody knows somebody who knows somebody who knows somebody, right?
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_04: Um and the uh my opponent, Anthony De Simone, he's an establishment Democrat that whose father held the same seat for like 20 years, I want to say, um, before him, from I believe the late 90s till he got voted out in 2016 by a progressive challenger, right?
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_04: Which is another uh thing why we're running for this seat is because it it's a very vulnerable one and it's been done before, right?
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_04: With somebody coming in talking about and pushing for something for working people, showing them an alternative, showing them something different, because so many people in the state have never seen had had the option, right?
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_04: It's either you you vote for a Democrat or you don't vote, right?
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_04: Um trying to think if there's anything else pertinent about um does that answer your question?
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_04: Is it what was there was there more to it?
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I mean, has he do you like anything maybe about the has he supported policies that have hurt hurt working people or or whatnot?
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_05: Like yeah, yeah, which is also curious if you have yeah, yeah.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_04: Uh well the big one for me, um, and I've I have some other ones that I could get into as well, but the big one for me is last year um the city was facing a budget deficit, right?
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_04: So the uh the mayor of Providence wanted to raise property taxes by I think he was shooting for seven and a half percent, but in order to do that, the state has a has a cap on how much you can raise property taxes year over year at four percent.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_04: So in order to raise them more than that, they have to get legislative approval for it.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_04: So um the mayor went to the state house to get approval for to be able to raise the rates, um, the the property tax rates.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_04: And our uh the current incumbent voted in favor of allowing those increases.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_04: Um the city council did um you know negotiate, they did bring it down.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_04: It wasn't a 7.5% increase.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_04: I think they were able to get them down to like 5.9% or something like that.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_04: But um, you know, that was only possible in in in part because of our you know, our the current representative in this district voting in favor of that, um, which hurts just a lot of working people, right?
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_05: Property taxes really hurt working people with like inflation already going crazy and interest rates and anybody who's managed to scrape together to buy a home, just making it more likely for them to get foreclosed on and stuff.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_05: So yeah.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_05: Um I I also wanted to ask, uh, yeah, I mean, we talked already, you talked already a bit about like the fact that you're running as an independent socialist.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_05: Um do you think that we uh you know need a new like a workers' party, a socialist party in this country?
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_05: Uh I guess is part of the question.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_05: And then like if so, like how do you think we build that and how is your campaign connected to that fight?
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_05: Um, yeah.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_04: Like we were saying earlier, this is a big political moment.
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_04: People are hungry for something different, people want to see something else.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_04: Um and and and and they feel completely um disillusioned and not represented by either neither the Republican nor Democratic Party.
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_04: So the reason like for an independent, you know, for me, um, I was raised, you know, in a very conservative background, right?
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_04: Um my my family's uh my parents are still fairly conservative, but um, you know, as as as I've grown up and I've gotten to the point where I'm at now in politics where I'm running openly as a socialist, um, which you were telling me that 10 years ago, I you say you're crazy.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_04: But it it's it's interesting how life experiences and stuff, uh the way that you you know progress through life and seeing these contradictions of this capitalist system um really change your mind, right?
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_04: So being able to connect with people who are conservative, which uh from in my experience just means that they don't trust the establishment, they don't trust the status quo, they don't want things to be the same as they are.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_04: Um and like back when we saw what we saw back in 2016 with Bernie and Trump, is like you had a lot of people that were gonna vote for Bernie end up voting for Trump.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_04: Why?
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_04: Right?
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_04: Because they were offering something different.
• 41:32
  SPEAKER_04: At least Trump had that going for him, right?
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_04: He was calling out that, yeah, your stuff costs a lot, yeah, there is corruption in the government, yeah, like this is bad.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_04: Obviously, we you know he was he was lying about all of it, what he was gonna do about it.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but people like saw the difference.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_04: So there's it's it's not a coincidence why people either voted for Bernie or voted for him.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_04: Um and me personally, I don't believe change will come through the Democratic Party just on the nature of what it is.
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_04: It's funded by corporations, it's funded by um, you know, a lot of a lot of wealthy donations.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_04: And it it's impossible to separate that from the party itself, right?
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_04: And whether you know a lot of people think, you know, are in the the the clean or the dirty bright camp, either way, like they think we everybody most of us think at some point there's gonna be a party that is needed to actually represent working people.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_04: Um, the question of is just when when to start doing that.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_04: And how this campaign fits in is again, this is a safe blue state, right?
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_04: So we're not gonna risk letting some conservative take a major office or anything.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_04: Like this is an ideal testing ground for this experiment to prove that it can work, right?
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_04: To prove that um no, we we don't need to run as Democrats and and hide our policies.
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_04: We can be very open about what we're fighting for and what we're running for to be able to put working people first.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_04: Um sorry, I'm getting off on a bit of a tangent.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_04: Uh the um, can you remember me?
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_04: The what was the second half of your question?
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, it was like how it was like, how do we build that?
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_05: Like, how do we build a new party in this country?
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_05: And like how does that how does your campaign like tie into that, the like building that and fighting for that, I guess?
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, exactly.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, okay.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_04: Um, yeah, showing that it's possible to do this.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_04: How I think that this would look on a on a if I if we're taking a big step zoom out, right?
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_04: Like, I think at some point there's gonna have to be some sort of coalescing or um um um coalition of the left in this country, at least the major uh like socialist groups, um, in order to be to like kind of merge membership in a way.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_04: Um, you know, the DSA, the reason I'm a DSA member is because we're the largest socialist organization in the country.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_04: Uh 100,000 members now, right?
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and this is the first place a lot of people go when they start seeing something other than the two party duopoly.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_04: When they start thinking of something other than just like capitalism, they start breaking that mold.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_04: Like a lot of people first come to the DSA.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and we have an opportunity here to be able to push something a little bit more radical.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and when people come through because they're excited by Zoran or they've, you know, whatever it might be, uh, we can.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_04: Catch them and be like, hey, yeah, like I'm glad you see the contradictions.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_04: I'm glad you see that this isn't working.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_04: That's why we're trying to do this and try to push that further, more of like a yes and type situation, right?
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_04: Type type conversation, trying to bring people in and get them, help them understand that, like, no, we do need to build power outside of the Democratic Party.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_04: Because if we're not building that foundation and building that infrastructure at some point, right, when it gets to the point of wanting to break, when does that come, right?
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_04: We're gonna have to have something to jump to.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_04: We're gonna have to have the foundation and have an understanding of what that looks like, how to do it, and all that stuff.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_04: And if we're not putting in the work now, we're not gonna have the foundation built already.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_04: So it'll never be the opportune time because we're never gonna have the have any of the opportunity to be able to do it outside.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I think I got uh I think it's good that you brought in DSA because that was gonna be part of my next question, which is like I think as far as I know, right now in 2026, you are the only DSA member running as an independent socialist anywhere in the country.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_05: Uh like DSA's main electoral strategy.
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, they they just uh Chris Robb, who is a DSA endorsed candidate, just won his uh election.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_05: DSA in California endorsed uh billionaire Tom Styres running for governor.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_05: Obviously, Mamdani won his election last year as a DSA member, and DSA just endorsed like AOC for her re-election campaign.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_05: Like, what do you think uh about DSA's like strategy nationally uh of continuing to run and endorse these Democrats in comparison to like what you know what you're doing here with your campaign?
• 45:39
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, um I I'm really not like a big fan of the what national DSA's approach is with that.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_04: Like I I really wish we were trying to push this at a national level.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_04: And I think that again, tying back into how this campaign becomes part of that conversation, it's it's it's proving that it's possible, um proving that we can do this.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_04: Um, because yeah, it's great that we're getting all these DSA members elected, right?
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_04: Or DSA candidates elected, like like the ones you're mentioning and plenty of others.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_04: I think it's fantastic.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_04: I think it is continuing to show that people aren't scared of socialism anymore.
• 46:11
  SPEAKER_04: Like this isn't the 1950s, this isn't McCarthyism anymore.
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_04: Like people see the problems with the current system and they're willing to listen to people who are pushing something different.
• 46:22
  SPEAKER_04: So there's no need for us to be able to hide behind the Democratic Party label anymore.
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_04: Like we we we can build um outside of that and actually um and and and and and show people and give them an opportunity to be part of the political process.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_04: Um sorry, I got myself off on a tangent again.
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_05: Um I think something connected to that to me is like DSA is I mean, I mentioned all of these different things, uh these different Democrats that DSA has been supporting, and some of whom have won their elections, but uh it's also like you know, there's uh a number of other independent socialists who aren't uh DSA members, or some of whom are actually DSA members that DSA hasn't endorsed, but there's various projects around like you know, we're seeing like a rise in these in these types of campaigns.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_05: There's like uh an independent socialist running for Congress in the Bronx, there's an independent socialist running for Senate in Massachusetts, uh, one running for Congress in Seattle, there's a Socialist Party of Indiana that was just launched by DSA members uh um in Indiana that's running some candidates.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_05: And uh it's like the DSA is supporting these Democrats, people like Tom Steyer in who's the billionaire in California, but then you know Central Indiana DSA has not supported the Socialist Party of Indiana or these other candidates that are running for Congress and Senate and stuff around the country, and like they I guess like I don't know, what what is your what is your thought on that?
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_05: I guess it's kind of connected to that previous question, but like how do you yeah.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_04: I think we gotta force the issue, right?
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_04: Um we're we've already seen um that there are conversations happening that we're not even in the room for about um you know the the the the the opportunity that we have here um and making people like have a conversation actually think about like okay well like is you know Brittany is is is a great candidate.
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_04: She is um you know very DSA forward, very socialism forward, and not afraid to like speak up for working people's um on working people's behalf.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_04: Um and is there a piece to that that is that she's allowed to do that, or she's able to do that because she's not running as a Democrat because she doesn't have to worry about ruffling feathers.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_04: And if we're able to like have this conversation um and and bring that to the forefront of the the of of the national politics and actually see like some some movements.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_04: Um I think we were talking the other day.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_04: I think the DSA is a lot more 50-50 on this than it might seem.
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_04: I think it's becoming a lot more um split, evenly split between people who want to um take over the Democratic Party and use that party surrogate type idea, or people that want to see some form of a break, whether it be clean or dirty.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and this is just another piece to that.
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_04: It's being able to um show that, hey, like no, we don't have to do this anymore.
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_04: We can we can do something else.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_05: I I guess then my the last thing I wanted to ask is like, yeah, there's this uh you mentioned it a couple times, but just to clear, I mean, uh the the dirty there's the dirty break strategy where some people in DSA and just on the left, I guess in general, argue for we should like I mean uh there's various levels to where where these dirty breakers like think the the dirty the the break should be, but uh the basic premise is that we should run some Democrats and like do work with the Democratic Party and at some point then we'll have enough power to break away.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_05: And like JBA and uh you know is for a clean break, United Front for a Workers' Party.
• 49:53
  SPEAKER_05: Uh I'm also a member of DSA, we're for a clean break.
• 49:56
  SPEAKER_05: Where do you fall on that?
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_05: Like, do you think that we need a clean break?
• 49:59
  SPEAKER_05: Clean break says we should break from the Democrats right now.
• 50:02
  SPEAKER_05: We should not be supporting.
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, I guess we've sort of talked about this a bit, but like, yeah, what do you where where do you lie on that?
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I mean, I guess just definitionally on my campaign, I'm I'm I guess I'm in the I'm in the clean break camp.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_04: Cool.
• 50:15
  SPEAKER_04: Um, you know, it's I'm not trying to disparage people that are, you know, still think that there's that there's potential in running as Democrats and eventually breaking.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_04: Um I just believe that we need to have that that piece uh actually built as well, right?
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_04: Because I've had conversations with people where like, you know, they there's the opportunity to be able to peel off some of these progressive Democrats to be able to break, right?
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but we have to show them that it that it can happen, that we can actually be successful doing it this way.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_04: Um but yeah, personally, like I I wish the DSA on a national level would.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_04: I know we had last convention we had passed a resolution to um uh run somebody for president, right?
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_04: Um and that you know, we we are working on building a party.
• 51:01
  SPEAKER_04: However, we we just see the party as being a DSA member.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_04: Um I I think we need to have an actual party line um to be able to say that, in my opinion.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_04: Otherwise, you're still dependent on all the Democratic Party infrastructure, whether it be van or the funding or anything else, um, to be able to run campaigns.
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_04: And at a certain point, like um I think that even if we were able to take over enough of the Democratic Party to be able to have some real say, like, there's nothing stopping them from taking their toys and going home, right?
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_04: Like pulling Eric Cartman, right?
• 51:34
  SPEAKER_04: Um so yeah, I I I want to see us pushing something more radical and because I think it dilutes the movement a little bit.
• 51:41
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I will say, like, uh I think we were talking about this earlier too, like, you know, it does break trust a little bit.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_04: When you're forced to kowtow to capital um and not stand on your business, um, I wouldn't even say like, you know, not stand on your business, it loses trust with the public.
• 51:59
  SPEAKER_04: It loses trust with you know, regular everyday working class people because they hear what you say and they want to believe what you say, but then you go and don't support um um people trying what was the 24 hours down in New York?
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, no more on 24, you know, and plenty of other things.
• 52:15
  SPEAKER_04: Um it's it I think I think it breaks that trust and kind of dilutes what we're trying to achieve here and just uh again funnels people back into the status quo.
• 52:27
  SPEAKER_05: I don't know.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 52:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, just to close up, do you want to say anything else?
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_00: When are people heading to the polls?
• 52:34
  SPEAKER_00: What's you know, anything else that you want to add?
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, this is good.
• 52:38
  SPEAKER_04: Um yeah, so I'm running as a I'm running as an independent, not a Democrat.
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, so we don't have to run uh our finish line isn't the primary in September, which has been absolutely like an absolute godsend.
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_04: You know, it's given us a we have a longer runway.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_04: We have an extra two months compared to what most most campaigns are doing, um, which makes it really nice in terms of time, in terms of being able to reach people, in terms of our messaging, right?
• 53:02
  SPEAKER_04: Like even if there was somebody that ran against um our current opponent um in the primary and won, like our message still doesn't change.
• 53:09
  SPEAKER_04: Like we're challenging the establishment, we're challenging the Democratic Party.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_04: Um so we're able to just continue pushing that and have plenty of time to get there.
• 53:16
  SPEAKER_04: So we'll be in the general election on November 3rd.
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_04: Um yeah, Britney Kubasek for District 5 here in Rhode Island.
• 53:23
  SPEAKER_04: Um, my website is uh www.brittney4i.com.
• 53:29
  SPEAKER_04: Um it's got more of the policies on there.
• 53:32
  SPEAKER_04: I know I kind of talk fast.
• 53:33
  SPEAKER_04: So my so when we were going through the actual platform and demands, I know we went through that pretty quick, but it's got all of them on there for for being able to look a little bit more into.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_04: Um plenty of other stuff on there as well.
• 53:45
  SPEAKER_04: Um but uh yeah, let's see.
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_04: What else?
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_04: What else?
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_04: I've got two cats.
• 53:51
  SPEAKER_04: We've got two beautiful cats.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_04: I got I got Lily.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_04: Um Lily and Holly, I don't remember where I don't know where Holly went.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_04: She's somewhere around here.
• 53:58
  SPEAKER_04: Um but uh yeah, I'm an I'm an engineer by trade.
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_04: I'm uh I'm a Navy veteran.
• 54:04
  SPEAKER_04: Um we I would love to have a conversation with you guys another time about my views on the military-industrial complex.
• 54:09
  SPEAKER_04: If you let me go down that path, I will not shut up.
• 54:11
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but that was radicalizing for me, right?
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_04: Like I did it in a nutshell, like I had truly believed the lie that we were told of like defending freedom and democracy around the world, and then to be part of that machine and and then get out and and and kind of you know become radicalized through corporate America and just your the experience in the military and realize that like it's like that, like the what was that uh it was like a college humor video or whatever with the with the two guys.
• 54:37
  SPEAKER_04: Are we the baddies?
• 54:38
  SPEAKER_04: Like are we the like to realize that and realize that like you were part of that machine?
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_04: Like it made me so mad.
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_04: And that's again to circle back to your original question about like what are what and why are we running.
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_04: Um I'm I'm upset about being lied to.
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, you know, I I I I joined the Navy to get out of my my my small hometown in Wisconsin where you know that like you know, people pretty much, you know, they grow up there, they live there, and that's it, right?
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_04: Like, and I and I I wanted to get out of my hometown.
• 55:07
  SPEAKER_04: And to do that, I joined the military, and there it it there's it's not a coincidence that they are recruiting at high schools in rural areas or in you know city centers in urban urban areas or whatever at schools, because the only way to get out of your situation is to, in a lot of cases, is to join the military, that poverty draft concept type thing, right?
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_04: Um so joining the military to escape um you know my oppression and exploitation, just to be part of the machine that does that around the world is infuriating.
• 55:37
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm angry about it.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_04: And I, to sound like Liam Neeson here, right?
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_04: Like I've I have some skills, right?
• 55:43
  SPEAKER_04: Like the Navy made me incredibly disciplined, it made me incredibly organized, it made me incredibly militant in more ways than one.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and I want to use it against them, and I want to fight back.
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_05: Um yeah, you had talked about you know your experience being in the military, and we talked about your your some of your demands, but I guess a two-part question is like uh, you know, you you uh have an anti-war stance, like what is could you like explain maybe your your uh what is your position on uh I guess opposing you know the war in Iran, the genocide in Gaza and US imperialism, I suppose, around the world, and then also like how does that connect to these local issues in Rhode Island that we were talking about of like you know, uh it being unaffordable and fighting for a rent freeze, fighting for free healthcare, how are those fights linked and like what how does like how does your um like if you win this election, like how how does how how does that translate into um you yeah, and I guess you also talked about like what you would do, like how to achieve these things and how does opposing those things connect to fighting for these issues.
• 56:53
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it's that old uh that Tupac quote, right?
• 56:56
  SPEAKER_04: You got we got money for war, but we can't feed the poor.
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_04: Um we I am I am staunchly anti-imperialist at this point in my life.
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_04: Like I if we spend so much money on the military, obviously that's why there's no money for any of anything else, right?
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_04: Because we have to make sure that the military-industrial complex gets their gets their buck um at the expense of all the social programs.
• 57:19
  SPEAKER_04: And at a na I mean, at a on the state level, you know, that affects how much money we're getting back, you know, getting from the federal government in terms of funding, right?
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_04: Because there's only so much uh left to go around, however much we can get from the federal government because we spend so much on war.
• 57:33
  SPEAKER_04: Um additionally, you know, we have uh a detention center, an ICE detention center here in in what is it over in Central Falls, um, the the the Wyatt, um and uh you know they have contracts with ICE and there's there's been plenty of protests over there about this.
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_04: And I think that's really how it all ties back in together, right?
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_04: Because we understand that you know imperialism abroad means fascism at home, right?
• 57:57
  SPEAKER_04: That the the that when we you know a lot of our police departments go over and train with IDF, right?
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_04: Um whether that be you know like like uh uh Providence, Rhode Island, New York City, whatever, right?
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_04: There is so much cross-connection, and a lot of the stuff that they do over there ends up coming back here.
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_04: Um you know, a lot of the surveillance that we see, a lot of the um the the violence that we see and the tactics that they have.
• 58:20
  SPEAKER_04: Like I saw that uh the Warwick Police Department, another city just south of Providence, is starting to use drones as like first responders, right?
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_04: So like when there's a call made in 911 call for police or whatever, they send up a drone and they go, right?
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_04: Again, it's like, what are we like we have all this money for all this high-tech military surveillance and software?
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_04: Like, if your music is too loud, there are sound cameras that'll send you a ticket in the mail, right?
• 58:44
  SPEAKER_04: But then a really awful thing happened earlier this year over on the Braun University campus, right?
• 58:50
  SPEAKER_04: And they couldn't find the guy for a week, right?
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_04: So, like, we're paying for all this surveillance, we're paying all this money to oppress ourselves under the guise of safety.
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_04: And then when we actually need to be kept safe, they can't keep us safe, right?
• 59:03
  SPEAKER_04: It doesn't make any sense.
• 59:04
  SPEAKER_04: And if we continue down this path where we're spending all this money on the military, like we need to bring that money back here, right?
• 59:10
  SPEAKER_04: If we stop spending, like we have we have 800 military bases around the world.
• 59:14
  SPEAKER_04: Like that money could very much be used better, used here.
• 59:17
  SPEAKER_04: Um, yeah, and it's not just the military aspect either, it's the the economic piece that the the United States does to other countries, right?
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_04: That's what you're seeing Trump do to these sanctuary cities where he's threatening to cut funding and this and that, right?
• 59:30
  SPEAKER_04: Like that's kind of analogous to like what you see happen to countries like Venezuela or Mexico or Cuba in regards to um the economic sanctions and embargoes, right?
• 59:40
  SPEAKER_04: It might not be a physical blockade, but like if you're not able to trade with other countries and and exchange currency because of the you know the US control over the global financial structure, um it starts you off, you know, it with the with you know you're not on the even playing field.
• 59:59
  SPEAKER_04: And um, until we do something about that, unless we do something about that, you know, we can have all these um we might be able to get some some things here at home, but it'll we'll never actually have um you know a truly free and just society.
• 1:00:14
  SPEAKER_05: Um yeah, so if people so for people listening who want to help build the campaign, how can they get involved?
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_05: Where can they find, where can they follow you?
• 1:00:23
  SPEAKER_05: Uh yeah, anything any of any of that stuff you want to plug.
• 1:00:26
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 1:00:27
  SPEAKER_04: I mean if you if you live in Rhode Island, especially if you live in the Providence area, please go on my website.
• 1:00:32
  SPEAKER_04: Um there's a there's a form you can fill out where to you know put your name and number in there to get you know get in contact with the campaign.
• 1:00:39
  SPEAKER_04: There's also an events page that'll take you canvassing, Brittany4ri.com slash events.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, we canvass every Saturday and Sunday.
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_04: Um so there's plenty of opportunity.
• 1:00:48
  SPEAKER_04: We're actually push have our big push um canvas next weekend.
• 1:00:51
  SPEAKER_04: So if you if you're in Providence in the Rhode Island um area, please come through.
• 1:00:55
  SPEAKER_04: We'd love to see you.
• 1:00:56
  SPEAKER_04: Otherwise, you know, if you we're uh donations can help a lot.
• 1:01:01
  SPEAKER_04: Um our opponent brings in like$40,000 every campaign cycle, which is you know a solid amount for a state for a race of this size.
• 1:01:09
  SPEAKER_04: So um we're definitely gonna we definitely can can use the help in that sense as well.
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_04: And that's uh Britney for R for RI.com slash donate.
• 1:01:18
  SPEAKER_04: Um and then the last thing I'll say is uh I got my socials, so I'm on um I'm on Twitter, I'm on TikTok, I'm on Instagram, I'm on Facebook, I'm also on YouTube, although the only thing I've ever posted on YouTube is my campaign launch video, which I I would recommend watching.
• 1:01:32
  SPEAKER_04: Like I really enjoyed making it.
• 1:01:34
  SPEAKER_04: I made you know we had a local uh um you know videographer and editor that that that helped us get that all shot and made.
• 1:01:41
  SPEAKER_04: So please watch that.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_04: I really I love it.
• 1:01:43
  SPEAKER_04: Um but I guess I'm a little biased, right?
• 1:01:47
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but uh yeah, my all my socials are the same at Britney4RI.
• 1:01:52
  SPEAKER_04: So I make it real easy.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_04: Everything is Britney for RI.
• 1:01:56
  SPEAKER_04: And so um yeah, please check me out.
• 1:01:59
  SPEAKER_04: You can donate if you're in the area and can come canvas, we'd love to have you.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_04: And yeah, I just appreciate you guys taking the time to talk to me and letting me uh letting me talk about all this stuff.
• 1:02:08
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah, it was great, great to great to talk.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_05: Thanks for coming on.
• 1:02:11
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, of course.
• 1:02:12
  SPEAKER_00: So there is an additional message from Britney in regards to what's happening in the world, and I'm just recording this one now.
• 1:02:20
  SPEAKER_04: So the way that we achieve this change, I think um we in America can take a lot of inspiration from what's going on down in Bolivia right now, um, where you have working people in all sorts of different towns, villages, and then the cities putting up roadblocks and and and and organize, right?
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_04: Like they have what they have specific times that they're they're on watch, they have specific times that it's it's their shift or whatever to to watch the barricade to shut the country down.
• 1:02:42
  SPEAKER_04: That's what I'm talking about when I say that this needs to be a movement.
• 1:02:45
  SPEAKER_04: We need to be organizing as workers in our workplaces against the the corporations and these bosses.
• 1:02:51
  SPEAKER_04: We need to be organizing as tenants and renters against these local landlord barons, right?
• 1:02:57
  SPEAKER_04: That are that are that are specifically in like this district.
• 1:03:00
  SPEAKER_04: We have this, we have a couple, um, uh Strive Realty and uh 02 and 908, where they own a ton of housing, right?
• 1:03:06
  SPEAKER_04: Um and we need to be organizing as tenants against that.
• 1:03:09
  SPEAKER_04: There are some organizations in Providence that are doing an incredible job with tenant organization, and I think that's some real revolutionary stuff.
• 1:03:16
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and then obviously organizing our communities, right?
• 1:03:19
  SPEAKER_04: Mutual aid type stuff, showing up to the protests, like being present in the community, as well as politically.
• 1:03:24
  SPEAKER_04: And that's how I see my role.
• 1:03:26
  SPEAKER_04: I don't see my role as like I'm gonna be the one to champion and bring socialism.
• 1:03:29
  SPEAKER_04: Like I am, I am more or less just a pawn, right?
• 1:03:32
  SPEAKER_04: I am I I I want to be a mouthpiece to be able to help um working people like understand the power that they that they have when we as a collective like come together and stand up and say, like, no, like we're done.
• 1:03:44
  SPEAKER_04: Like, if if we as Americans did what the Bolivians are doing right now and just stop going to work tomorrow and all like you know, linked arms in a chain on 95, like we would get what we want real fast.
• 1:03:58
  SPEAKER_04: So um, yeah, we should take a lot of inspiration from that.
• 1:04:02
  SPEAKER_04: Um and then there was something else that you had just said um with regard to this question.
• 1:04:07
  SPEAKER_04: Um, that's good.