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Truth, Morality and Beauty: Not Just for Victorians (Ep. 12) · How to Be an Adult

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When people carry these burdens, it causes insomnia,
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it causes alcoholism, it causes so many issues
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that people Maintaining a lie, particularly I'd say
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lying to yourself is probably
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a very damaging thing to do. Even the
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points of view of a bully, even the
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points of view of someone who just doesn't
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think things through, the people pleaser tries to
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account for and accommodate.
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Welcome to How to be an Adult.
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This is a podcast for people just like
0:26
you who've inadvertently become adults and have no
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idea what to do about it. I'm Luke
0:32
Chao. And I'm Pascal Langdell.
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And this is the trail guide to everything
0:37
your parents didn't tell you when you reach
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the age of 18.
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And we spread these thoughts and these, perspectives
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in order to democratize them, so that you
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can have a good life as an adult.
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Today, we're gonna talk about
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capital t truth, capital m morality and capital
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b beauty
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as valid concepts in this 21st
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century
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and not just concepts for the Victorians.
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Why don't we just start off with the
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the big t word? Sure.
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Well,
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so ever since the other big t, Donald
1:11
Trump, was elected to the White House Mhmm.
1:14
There's been extra chatter in the,
1:17
public sphere about how we're in this post
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truth universe
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where narrative is everything
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and truth doesn't matter so much. It's really
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just what you get away with.
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Mhmm. And then we can also look from
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the perspective
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of, let's say, lawyers who have to advise
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their clients to tell the truth and the
1:36
whole truth and nothing but the truth when
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they, you know, make the oath on the
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stand. We can look at the perspective of
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engineers
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who have to design bridges
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and Wi Fi networks that actually work in
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the material
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universe.
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So certainly there are multiple
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perspectives
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that would advocate
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for this concept of objective
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or capital
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t truth, even if the very same people
2:02
would admit that it can be quite an
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ordeal to arrive at
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objective or capital t truth. I've been watching
2:10
a couple of things that has struck me.
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There was
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one TEDx talk that I caught of somebody
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who
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advocates for the idea that everything is a
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story. So the idea America isn't real, it's
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a story that we all agree. Also that
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human rights
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don't exist. It's not an objective truth that
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we have. And he said, you know, if
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you if you cut over a human
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there's nothing inside which actually I disagree with.
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There's quite a lot inside. But there's
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this incredibly reductionist,
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almost nihilistic I would say point of view.
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It sort of ties in as well with
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another trend with which a friend of mine
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had a name for, she didn't realize it
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had a name. It was called emotivism.
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So basically, it's the idea that
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if for instance I say, I think that
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fraud is bad.
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Mhmm. Right?
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That there's nothing good or bad about that.
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A fraud in itself.
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It's only my opinion that it's bad. It's
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my perspective. You might hold a perspective that
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is,
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that actually fraud is good.
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Mhmm. And that we both have invalid points
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of view
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because they there is no objective truth. Mhmm.
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There's only our opinions and our morality Yep.
3:19
That we carry around with us. But that's
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problematic
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because as you say, if I if you
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say this is 10 centimeters and I say
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it's 11 because I feel it's so and
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that feels right,
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then, you know, the Mars rover won't run.
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Well, a few 100 years ago, David Hume,
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the Scottish
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philosopher Yeah.
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Identified
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a distinction
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between what is and what ought to be
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Mhmm. And he said famously that you cannot
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derive an ought from an is.
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In other words, the realm of morality,
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the realm of what should be, like human
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rights, for example Mhmm. Is a separate domain
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Mhmm. From what is, like, if you cut
3:58
apart a human body, for example. It's true.
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You're not gonna find the human rights in
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a person's,
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you know, physical heart or or lungs or
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or brain,
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but that's because you're looking in the wrong
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place. You have to look in the realm
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of a separate domain called morality or ethics
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Mhmm. To find human rights. You can't just
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look into the material world made of atoms
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and molecules. So let's account for the fact
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that there's sort of this moral realm, which
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we're gonna talk about later in the episode,
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and then there's also the material realm made
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of atoms and molecules where we do have
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things like bridges that can stay standing. That's
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also lend itself to the idea of science
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as well in the sense
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that objective truth could be perhaps summarized as
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if I see that and you see that
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and we can all agree that we're seeing
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it and we describe it in the same
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way, then we can say this is the
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closest thing we can get to at this
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point for objective truth. But the scientific process
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is falsification,
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right? So this is where people somehow get
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in trouble by saying of the science like
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it was a thing, you
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know, rather than a process.
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But science is a process of reassessing objective
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truth but with a certain amount of rigor
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behind it rather than because I feel it
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so. And even scientists will acknowledge
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that sometimes their best hypotheses today
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are likely
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to to be falsified at some point decades
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in the future. And and so and subject
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to their own bias as well. Yeah. Yeah.
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So Yes. You know, truth is a tricky
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thing to to to isolate. But but the
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difference between such a scientist and and the
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friend you mentioned earlier Mhmm. Is the friend
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is not even
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trying to to arrive at some semblance of
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of an understanding of objective reality. Yeah. The
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scientist at least is trying to arrive at
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some semblance of understanding about objective reality. And
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that's and that's interesting. It's only odd when
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you say that. I also kinda go well
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that's
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almost similar to a spiritual endeavor as well.
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I I guess most difficult enough endeavors. Mhmm.
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So whether to develop one spiritually or whether
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to kind
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of formulate a model of
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reality that predicts what could happen in the
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future. Any of these difficult endeavors, they're they're
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gonna be worth
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doing even if it takes a long time,
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even a lifetime, even multiple lifetimes. So so
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what what definition of truth are we gonna
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work by? Because I mean Well,
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maybe I'll borrow from Philip k Dick and
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he he actually define reality as this.
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That which does not go away when you
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stop believing in it.
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So so so the Mac truck that's bearing
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down on you. It's not going away if
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you stop believing in it. So let's say
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that Mac truck exists in reality,
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and you'd better get out of its way
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because it's not just a figment of your
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imagination.
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But then something like you're imagining
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that the next flight you take is gonna
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go up in flames,
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if that never manifests before your eyes, when
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you stop believing in it that imagining goes
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away. The imagining in other words is is
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not actually the truth. So that's interesting because
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going into the idea of what what is
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truth for?
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Because you could say, well, okay, well, what
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use is it? Because I could live in
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my own fantasy world. Mhmm. I could choose
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to to believe anything. It might not do
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me any good, but I'd be happy as
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I as things went wrong.
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Yeah. And that that that is I would
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argue more more of like the child's perspective.
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Right. Where, you know, one could be protected
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from dangers or protected from scarcity
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despite living in a fantasy play world
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by the time we have to fend for
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ourselves
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So metaphorically by the time we're driving our
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own cars.
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We'd better have our eyes on the road.
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Mhmm. So I'll extend this metaphor.
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When we're driving a car, right,
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we can't navigate the roads with only what
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we imagine might be ahead of us,
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nor can we navigate the roads that we've
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taken a 100 times with only our memory
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of what was on the roads the past
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100 times we can only navigate the roads
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with our eyes with our ears and then
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with our hands
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if with our eyes we can't see what's
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over the next hill for example we just
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kind of keep driving and then we reach
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the crest of the hill and then we
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can see with our eyes Oh, that's what's
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over the hill, and we keep navigating accordingly
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and thereby complete every journey that we begin.
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So this is very much an argument in
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support of empiricism
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above just pure reason in that the evidence
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of her senses though imperfect
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will give us the best representation
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of reality
8:30
that we could then use to navigate by
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that a person could have.
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So often we kind of go to conjecture,
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you know, like, is this person gonna call
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me back? We kind of like imagine stuff,
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But but the future you is gonna actually
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be perceptive and intelligent enough to have information
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and then, you know, make decisions with information,
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which absolves you from any need to make
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decisions without information.
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So so flipping around then,
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saying that
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lying or lying to yourself or deceiving yourself,
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you could say, well,
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at least you can start off by not
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doing that because it's it's rather easy, right?
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It's actually quite easy to kid yourself or
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even other people for that matter. There's a
9:10
a study which I can share with you,
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I think it's in the notes, that showed
9:13
that having successful small lies
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leads to more lies because the social cost
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of being found out in a lie is
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close to death. Right? It's like there's death
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and then there's social shame. Those are the
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2 biggest things that the human old brain
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is kind of afraid of, right?
9:30
But apparently if you put a scenario while
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small lies are swallowed then the lies get
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bigger and bigger because you can get away
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with it. The self censorship
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begins to disappear. So actually in some ways
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you have to be your own best
9:43
monitor because even when you're telling things to
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yourself
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you could be kidding yourself. And it's and
9:48
you kid yourself to start off with, that
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can snowball into
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really going into territory where your perception of
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the truth about your imaginings, for example,
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is entirely wrong.
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Often what we imagine in our heads and
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I'm gonna say like all lies are basically
10:04
like imagined thoughts. Yeah. So what we imagine
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it ends up obscuring
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our view of what's in front of us.
10:12
So if you tell yourself that
10:15
your tires can handle that patch of black
10:17
ice, but you've not changed your tires for
10:18
the winter time. Mhmm. You're lying to yourself
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and then you screw around and you find
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out. Yeah. But but if if nothing happens
10:25
you might go, oh, well, okay. That calibrated
10:28
my my truth, I'm okay. You know, the
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the more that your
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your lies are swallowed and accepting you get
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away with them, the worse your calibration can
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become can become. Does that make sense? I
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I guess so.
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I'm kind of imagining that that maybe some
10:41
of our raters
10:43
have, you know, got
10:44
themselves caught in this pattern of like telling
10:47
little white lies to make other people happy
10:49
or to not rock the boat. Or we
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can turn lies to themselves in order to
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fill some kind of emotional hole.
10:55
So let's imagine that we we kind of
10:57
have listeners who have these kinds of fantasies
11:00
obscuring
11:01
their view of the truth,
11:03
right? So they think they're a better driver
11:05
than they are,
11:06
so they'll take like tighter turns than they
11:08
ought to, or they're gonna drive on the
11:10
black ice even though they've not changed their
11:12
tires to winter tires yet. In such a
11:14
situation,
11:15
could we say it's inevitable that a bad
11:18
thing is gonna then follow?
11:20
Could could we say that? It's likely.
11:22
Okay.
11:23
Okay. So not inevitable,
11:25
but it's likely on a long enough time
11:27
that if you, you know, if you overestimate
11:29
your driving ability ability, that you're probably gonna
11:32
get into some kind of, you know, 1
11:33
person accident, 1 car accident.
11:35
If you tell, like, white lies to to
11:37
your friends, eventually, you're gonna suffer that social
11:40
shame you've been alluded to of being called
11:42
out as untrustworthy.
11:44
Mhmm. And and I think the same thing
11:46
happens internally as well. So you could have
11:47
somebody who tells himself, I am a bad
11:50
driver.
11:50
And repeats that and it may not be,
11:53
you know, let's say it's not true. Yeah.
11:55
They're neither good nor bad, they're they're just
11:56
a driver. Let's say, but I'm a bad
11:58
driver. And then you believe that and then
12:00
repercussion is that you don't drive, so you
12:02
feel safe. But it also justifies
12:04
and reinforces the idea that you're a bad
12:06
driver because you don't drive and so on.
12:09
Well, one one thing I often end up
12:11
saying to my clients is that when when
12:13
you put in a really good effort
12:16
to ascertain the truth about a situation,
12:20
that most likely you're gonna be better off
12:22
afterward.
12:23
So
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when one is, like, self deceptive, you know,
12:27
to to, like, pump themselves up or or
12:29
to feel okay about themselves,
12:31
They are neglecting their best qualities.
12:34
So they're making up fake qualities to feel
12:36
good about at the same time that they're
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neglecting their better qualities where they can still
12:41
feel good,
12:42
but also have their feet on the ground.
12:45
Or if someone is overestimating their driving ability,
12:48
let's say that they're neglecting the fact that
12:50
they could just, like, take some extra driving
12:52
lessons
12:53
to have the false idea that that they
12:55
can handle it. So, like, maybe their vision
12:57
is failing.
12:58
You know, they're neglecting going to the optometrist
13:00
Mhmm. You know, in favor
13:02
for for for for the lie.
13:04
So there was another study that also showed
13:06
that
13:07
maintaining a lie
13:09
has
13:10
really bad outcomes for as your health is
13:13
concerned. It can reduce how is the classic,
13:15
it'll reduce your life by 10 years. So
13:17
so the bad outcomes were things like, you
13:18
know, high
13:20
stress levels,
13:21
heart disease,
13:22
I think diabetes was mentioned as well. And
13:25
it's the theory goes that it takes a
13:27
cognitive load to maintain a lie.
13:30
That
13:31
cognitive load increases stress and stress causes
13:34
the issues. And then, so that then plays
13:37
into the idea, why is it a cognitive
13:39
load? What's so important about maintaining a lie?
13:42
And because when you're a kid you grow
13:44
up you kinda have to learn about lying,
13:46
you know? And kids learn about lying pretty
13:48
early on as well. And so
13:51
there's gotta be something that you
13:55
learn that is about the social
13:58
damage that's possible with the lion. That creates
14:00
this, sort of,
14:01
this mental overload that creates the stress.
14:04
So generally speaking it's not just that truth
14:06
is a good thing, I suppose.
14:09
Is that,
14:11
maintaining a lie particularly I'd say lying to
14:14
yourself
14:15
Mhmm. Is probably a very damaging thing to
14:18
do. Yeah. Well, I'll share with you that
14:20
when I think back to me in elementary
14:23
school, right, I can think of a few
14:25
incidents where I kind of like experimented with
14:27
lying. And it was very clear to me
14:30
in elementary school that the adults around me
14:33
could just plainly see through. Mhmm. Whatever it
14:36
is I was telling my fib about, and
14:38
I just couldn't get away with it. And
14:39
I could only gain their respect by being
14:42
truthful. And, you know, if I had to
14:44
own up to something or apologize for something
14:46
that I own up to and apologize. And
14:47
that's how you kind of have the trust
14:49
and the respect of of the adults around
14:51
you.
14:52
So that's kind of what I learned about
14:54
lying when I was experimenting with lying as
14:57
a kid.
14:58
I don't know if everyone has had that
15:00
that experience, but I imagine if if my
15:03
experience had been
15:04
that life is grand when I tell lies.
15:08
Maybe
15:09
then today I wouldn't have as much of
15:11
a positive regard for speaking truthfully and candidly
15:15
and honestly.
15:16
Well, it's it's a downside of lying where
15:19
enough of the adults around you
15:22
care about
15:23
truth and being respected enough that you tell
15:25
the truth to them. Mhmm. That you end
15:27
up losing friends over lies. You end up
15:29
losing jobs over lies. You end up losing,
15:31
you know, relationships over lies
15:34
because it's, you know, once trust is broken
15:37
Yeah. It's very hard to regain
15:40
because people see you as someone that they
15:43
can never just quite believe in and, you
15:45
know, that adds extra stress in their minds
15:49
when they're speaking
15:51
to you. Mhmm. So in the idea that,
15:54
you know, you didn't get your eyes checked
15:56
and then because of that
15:58
you ran somebody over or something terrible happens,
16:01
right? So then the question moves on to
16:03
the other big topic which is morality.
16:06
And as we've already
16:08
discussed, you know,
16:10
well somebody saying, It's good to get your
16:12
eyes checked if you drive a car. And
16:14
then the motorist might say, that's your opinion.
16:17
That's not a that's not a truth, right?
16:21
So
16:23
how do we
16:24
derive our morals? Where do we get them
16:26
from? How do we know that they're useful
16:28
or good?
16:29
In the context of driving Mhmm. We could
16:31
sort of identify a duty
16:34
to your fellow drivers on the road or
16:36
even pedestrians
16:37
on the sidewalk
16:39
to make sure that you are a competent
16:42
driver.
16:43
So if you were to somehow lose your
16:47
competence
16:47
to to drive,
16:49
such as if you lose your eyesight, if
16:51
you're taking, you know, medications that make you
16:53
drowsy, if your car is so much in
16:56
disrepair that it's a hazard,
16:58
well, then your duty
17:00
to your fellow citizens of the road or
17:02
even pedestrians crossing the road will be
17:06
to get yourself back up in in into,
17:09
competent shape. Mhmm. In in order to drive.
17:12
So in order to not hurt people and
17:14
not kill people.
17:16
Exactly. Exactly. It comes it comes back to
17:18
the idea of, again, a pro social idea.
17:21
Yes. Morality being based in something that's pro
17:23
social. Exactly, because you're not the only driver
17:26
on the road. To your point,
17:28
we keep seeming to arrive
17:30
at this definition that
17:33
a universal
17:34
human kind of morality, if we're going to
17:37
be like,
17:38
you know, not absolutist, but if we're
17:42
if we're gonna be,
17:44
definitive
17:45
about things,
17:47
it's going to be
17:49
behaviors that are prosocial behaviors that are good
17:52
for your friends, for your neighbors, for your
17:53
family, and not only for yourself.
17:56
It happens that when you are good to
17:58
your friends and your neighbors and your family
18:00
and your coworkers, that it ends up coming
18:01
back to you in a positive way, so
18:03
it's good for you too. But it it
18:05
seems like if we're gonna try to define
18:06
a universal morality, it's gonna be to act
18:08
in ways that foster
18:11
community and, you know, good trusting social relationships.
18:14
And I suppose this also does relate to
18:15
truth as well because you can't do that
18:17
effectively
18:18
unless you're on guard against lies,
18:21
external lies or internal lies. Because you could
18:24
kid yourself that I don't know, forcing everybody
18:26
in the office to shave their head is
18:28
a social good. You could whatever it is,
18:30
I'm thinking something ludicrous, right?
18:32
And who's to say no? You know, like
18:34
I said, well it's prosocial.
18:37
But is it true? And so that's where
18:40
morality and truth do have a relationship is
18:42
that
18:43
you can judge a moral
18:45
to some degree,
18:47
surely, by the degree of truth that supports
18:49
the moral.
18:51
Because otherwise I don't know because otherwise you
18:53
could anybody could say like you could say,
18:56
I'm sure the Nazis in in Germany thought
18:58
that their final solution was pro social in
19:01
their terms, as horrifying as that is. And
19:04
that that to me, the roots of that
19:06
is self deception.
19:08
Well, you could also argue in this 21st
19:12
century
19:13
that
19:15
because we kind of draw a boundary around
19:17
humanity
19:18
and we don't really, like, include
19:20
cattle and,
19:22
geese and goats and chickens and other poultry
19:25
that
19:26
were delirict in our duty
19:29
to the fellow
19:30
species on the planet Mhmm. Even if we
19:33
are fulfilling our duty to our fellow human
19:36
beings.
19:37
So there is sort of
19:40
this culturally determined or socially
19:42
determined
19:43
aspect to morality,
19:45
even though it might be uncomfortable
19:48
to kind of examine
19:49
you and see your own flaws, right,
19:53
or emotions or whatever else is in there,
19:55
like,
19:56
behind the scenes.
19:58
It is also something that I wish to
20:00
normalize for for one to kind of look
20:02
look inwardly and to see one's flaws and
20:05
emotions in all of one's humanity. Mhmm. Yeah.
20:07
Yeah. So we we've defined morality as prosocial.
20:10
And just so I'm not a hypocrite, I
20:11
am excluding the animals. Right. Yes. Fair enough.
20:14
Yeah. Except for the cute ones. Like Right.
20:16
Cat cats and dogs, I count among, you
20:19
know, social species I socialize with. Some people
20:22
don't, right? Yeah. And like even horses, I
20:24
I include among like social species who I
20:26
might socialize with. But that's because I've never
20:28
eaten horse before. I have. Oh, okay. So
20:30
And I've ridden horses as well. Yes. So
20:33
Yeah. I'm a true hypocrite and I Well,
20:35
yeah. At least conflicted.
20:38
I see it as being a part of
20:40
being of my version of a human being
20:42
at the moment. Well, yeah. I mean, like,
20:44
I I participated in jet travel recently, even
20:47
though I am aware that we had a
20:48
very very hot year last year and I
20:50
contributed to that for this
20:52
this season. This is struggle session. Well,
20:55
I mean
20:57
it's it's it's it's an We're talking about
20:59
morality. So, yes. Yeah. We're
21:01
we're talking about, yeah. We're talking about morality.
21:04
One way to bring all of this self
21:06
flagellation to a point is
21:09
to say
21:10
these kinds of thoughts and these kinds of
21:12
discussions
21:13
where we are talking about capital m morality
21:17
are worth having even if the participants in
21:20
the conversation
21:21
start start getting uncomfortable
21:22
because we realize our failings. We realize our
21:25
moral failings, you know, because I ate meat
21:27
and I flew in a jet airplane and
21:29
I try to be a climate conscious person
21:31
at the same time. And how do I
21:32
reconcile all of this? The only way
21:35
to end up eventually at an old enough
21:38
age coming to a reconciliation
21:40
Mhmm. Is if we have these thoughts and
21:42
this kind of introspection
21:44
and then these kinds of conversations where I
21:46
actually believe that at some point I'm gonna
21:47
stop eating meat and stop doing jet travel.
21:49
Mhmm. There's also an argument that says that
21:52
the
21:53
prosocial course still needs to have
21:56
some kind of backing.
21:57
And so therefore you go- and then that's
21:59
when you go back to the idea of,
22:00
you know, God is dead, so now we
22:02
have to make him. Is that one one
22:04
role that religion
22:07
does have and certainly did have more in
22:09
the past
22:10
was
22:11
a
22:12
a foundation of these things are true because
22:15
they're ordained by something
22:17
or you know some other
22:19
spiritual
22:21
thing. Humans didn't make this up. Right? So
22:23
delegates it to somebody else that you can't
22:25
really argue with.
22:27
Right?
22:28
So if you take that away,
22:30
then
22:31
you are in a situation where you do
22:33
have to figure out your own moral touch
22:35
stones. And that's
22:37
actually no small thing. I actually think that
22:39
if you ask somebody who says they don't
22:41
believe in God for example, Well, how do
22:43
you know what's right and wrong?
22:45
Often
22:46
it can be a problematic question because they
22:48
go, Well, I decide. And I say, Okay,
22:49
what if I decide differently? What does that
22:51
mean? And everything becomes relative and suddenly you're
22:54
in trouble.
22:55
So it's really important to figure out
22:58
the foundation
22:59
of your
23:01
moral underpinning. Whether it's religion or not, it's
23:03
neither here nor there. But you've gotta have
23:06
something. I think that's probably Well, well what
23:08
it comes down to. Where do you think
23:10
it would come from if not from organized
23:13
religion?
23:14
Again, the idea
23:15
of reciprocal
23:17
benefit, I suppose. Okay. So so from from
23:19
reason
23:20
and to some degree enlighten self interest?
23:23
Yeah. Yeah. Although, yeah. To some degree. Yeah.
23:25
So but it's yeah.
23:27
That's that's a good start.
23:31
It's not easy. Yeah, well there definitely
23:33
is, even in the absence of formal or
23:36
organized religion, there is sort of
23:39
like these socially
23:41
enforced norms
23:43
where,
23:44
like, if someone finds out that all the
23:46
art in your home is stolen,
23:51
from from a country that, like, your grandfather
23:53
invaded Mhmm. And you tell proud stories about
23:57
the war. Right. Like, I just made up
24:00
that that, you know, in that made up
24:02
scenario,
24:03
you're gonna get social heat.
24:06
Mhmm. I mean, you might not have broken
24:08
any laws. Mhmm. But you're gonna definitely get
24:11
social heat
24:13
because you're speaking so flagrantly about these stolen
24:17
artifacts.
24:18
So
24:19
I think that even in the absence of
24:21
religion or, you know, even laws mandating certain
24:24
behaviors,
24:25
there are going to be social pressures
24:29
that prevent people from acting in certain ways
24:31
or doing certain things. And there's gonna be
24:33
also social incentives
24:34
for you to make a big show out
24:36
of donating the artifacts back to the country
24:38
that your grandfather stole them from. As I
24:39
do know, somebody,
24:41
a friend Michael John Dower, who's a director
24:44
in the UK, and he comes from a
24:46
rich family, well, originally,
24:49
that
24:50
significantly benefited from the slave trade. And so
24:52
he and his family got together
24:55
and funded an institution in the country where
24:58
those,
24:59
slaves were taken from and were used in
25:02
order to redress
25:03
the effects of slavery
25:06
that were still manifesting there. Yeah. I think
25:09
that's but when I see a direct line
25:11
like that, it seems pretty clear. When it's
25:13
a direct line. I mean, when it's more
25:15
indirect, I find it more problematic. Yeah. But
25:17
that I could see the logic behind that.
25:19
Yeah. Well, in some cases,
25:21
you know, having extra wealth is not the
25:24
main point.
25:25
Being able to be happy with your
25:34
most toys. Mhmm.
25:35
As a hypnotherapist,
25:37
I I often see
25:39
that
25:40
the the anxiety,
25:42
sometimes even the depression that my clients
25:46
present with and and believe they have
25:49
are actually problems of demoralization.
25:54
And once I help them to find their
25:56
moral center,
25:58
once I help them to to feel that
26:00
their sense of right and wrong counts.
26:03
Once I help them to be able to
26:05
say, no, I can't abide by that, but
26:08
let's do it this other way instead. Once
26:10
they're able to say that,
26:12
then they're not so anxious. Then they feel
26:14
a lot better about themselves, then they sleep
26:16
better at night and they don't have to
26:18
like drink as much or smoke cigarettes.
26:20
This I don't hear talked about that much
26:23
where we are kinda treating like anxiety as
26:25
a mental illness
26:27
and not as a problem of demoralization.
26:29
In fact, it's considered to be an outdated
26:32
Victorian thing to consider mental illness to be
26:35
a moral issue. Mhmm. But I'm actually going
26:38
to, you know, in 2024, make a case
26:41
here
26:42
that
26:43
many of the problems that a hypnotherapist might
26:46
see
26:47
are problems that are solved by having the
26:50
client connect with their moral center.
26:53
So people pleasing, people who won't set boundaries,
26:56
people who are are afraid to feel or
26:58
to express anger in a healthy way.
27:01
These are problems
27:02
of being out of touch with your moral
27:05
center.
27:06
Once you get in touch with your sense
27:07
of right and wrong and good and bad,
27:09
and you feel that that you're an adult
27:12
and you're in equal to the the person
27:14
who's wronged you,
27:17
then there's so many burdens
27:19
you unshoulder.
27:20
Mhmm. Right?
27:21
When people carry these burdens, it causes insomnia,
27:23
it causes alcoholism, it causes so many issues
27:26
that people come to a hypnotherapist for.
27:28
I mean, I'm not saying in every case,
27:30
but in the cases
27:32
specifically that I'm thinking about and talking about.
27:35
And
27:36
I think that,
27:37
for example,
27:39
when one is a people pleaser,
27:42
he or she
27:43
feels
27:44
the need to consider
27:46
every point of view as valid.
27:49
Right?
27:50
Even the
27:52
the points of view of some jerk,
27:53
even the points of view of a bully,
27:55
even the points of view of someone who
27:57
just doesn't think things through. The people pleaser
27:59
tries to account for and accommodate all of
28:02
these views.
28:04
So when I have such a person tap
28:07
into their moral center
28:09
and develop a strong sense of right and
28:11
wrong and good and bad and the willingness
28:13
just to say, Well, no. Hold on. I
28:15
can't abide by that.
28:18
Then it's not just
28:20
that they're no longer people pleasing. It's not
28:22
just that they're setting and enforcing boundaries.
28:25
It's that a lot of the the other
28:27
problems,
28:28
which is often what they present with, go
28:30
away.
28:31
Is there also to again tie back
28:34
morals with truth is that the people pleaser,
28:38
or somebody who's very high in agreeability
28:40
is in essence
28:42
kind of lying to themselves that every opinion
28:45
is of equal merit or lying to themselves
28:47
that their own opinion
28:49
has equal or less merit than somebody else's.
28:52
It it it's it's usually that everyone's opinion
28:55
counts except for theirs. Everyone's needs count except
28:57
for theirs. Every one else counts except for
29:00
them. The the the lie is the erasure
29:03
of them as a person.
29:05
So so, yeah, I mean, the the truth
29:06
thing was basically I'm saying
29:09
epistemology
29:10
matters. Sound epistemology
29:12
makes happier,
29:13
more even keeled, clear headed people. Mhmm. Now
29:16
we're saying morality matters because
29:19
being connected with your moral center Mhmm. Allows
29:22
for also happier, more even keeled level headed
29:25
people. That's actually been true in my practice
29:28
as a hypnotherapist.
29:29
So
29:31
earlier today, I talked about
29:33
when when I was a kid, I kind
29:34
of like experimented with lying. Right? Well, what
29:37
happened? I was kind of a brat back
29:39
then. But that's not just a lesson about
29:42
why truth matters.
29:43
It's also a lesson about why morality matters.
29:47
So it's not just like the content of
29:48
what I'm saying. It's also, you know, the
29:50
fact that I've chosen to lie or tell
29:52
the truth to begin
29:55
with, that that matters.
29:56
So
29:57
the judgment that I would get,
30:00
it's not just that the teacher
30:03
thought I was mistaken.
30:05
Mhmm. That wouldn't have hurt as much. It's
30:08
that that teacher who I trusted
30:11
now thinks truthfully that I lied to them
30:14
and that cuts a lot more deeply.
30:17
So we'll use the the the same story
30:20
about me being like grade 3 experimenting with
30:22
lying,
30:23
you know, to to make the point not
30:25
just about why telling the the truth matters,
30:27
but also, you know, the the moral argument
30:29
for doing the right thing. So so if
30:32
people judge you as just ignorant, I mean,
30:34
that kinda hurts,
30:36
but it's not gonna hurt as much
30:38
as if they judge you and truthfully to
30:41
be a liar, to be untrustworthy. I think
30:43
the roots of a lot of negligent lying
30:46
or,
30:47
instantaneous
30:48
lying both to yourself and to to others
30:50
is normally drive from
30:52
fear. Mhmm. Some It can be even a
30:53
small fear. You know that thing when somebody
30:55
says, Oh, did you watch so and so
30:57
that that film? I don't know if anybody
30:58
else has done this. But but I can
31:00
I know that I've gone, Oh yeah? Like
31:02
I saw the film. I didn't see the
31:04
film. But in that instant, there's like this
31:06
thing that sort of goes, Oh well, you
31:07
better show that you know the movie. It's
31:10
quite silly, why do that? Right? But then
31:13
again, with kids as well, you see this
31:14
all the time that
31:16
the the the fear of telling the truth
31:18
will define whether they tell the truth or
31:20
not. And if they are allowed to
31:23
admit their vulnerability, their wrong, their, and they
31:25
they're in a safe place, they will come
31:27
clean.
31:28
Most people, not everyone, but most people have
31:30
a conscience.
31:31
So even if you quote get away with
31:34
the lie,
31:36
in your own head you didn't really.
31:39
Yeah. So And that's
31:41
probably gonna play on you. So that's And
31:43
that's what causes insomnia. That's what can cause
31:46
alcoholism.
31:47
I mean, often
31:48
when people present with anxiety,
31:50
there is an element of a guilty conscience
31:53
in there somewhere. Now that doesn't mean they've
31:55
done anything wrong, but usually there is some
31:57
element that they could be a bad person.
32:00
Yeah.
32:01
So let's round out the trifecta
32:04
of branches of philosophy
32:07
that we're going to advocate
32:10
for here in 2024.
32:12
We've advocated for epistemology. We've advocated for morality.
32:16
Now we're gonna advocate for aesthetics,
32:19
for beauty
32:20
because those let's be honest, a lot of
32:23
really ugly architecture in Toronto
32:26
That there really is and I I I'm
32:28
not a fan of brutalism.
32:29
Right? Robarts library at U of T looks
32:32
like a giant turkey
32:34
And it was novel at first,
32:37
but you know, it's it's a big ugly
32:39
concrete sculpture or not not sculpture, it's a
32:41
it's a building. Mhmm. But I mean it
32:43
it it it it it's not pretty to
32:45
look at. I do have theories about that
32:47
which we'll get. Okay. Please. Please. You're Okay.
32:49
Okay, you want it. Okay, I'll give it
32:51
to you. So, okay.
32:52
So, this is Pascal's grand idea about beauty.
32:55
Alright. Ready? Go. Okay. So,
32:57
the Greeks,
32:59
and particularly Plato,
33:01
saw beauty
33:03
as kalos or kalos. I think that's the
33:04
right right way to say it. Yep. And
33:06
this could be translated also as something that's
33:08
not just beautiful but noble as truthful as
33:11
well to some degree as well. So in
33:13
English, it sort of transferred to often translated
33:15
as fine, like fine dining.
33:18
And I was thinking this, I think, what
33:19
is what is that exactly? And I was
33:21
thinking, well, I was thinking that really the
33:23
the beauty
33:25
in nature, beauty in art,
33:28
beauty in politics or whatever it is, is
33:31
this to me it's like the balance between
33:33
chaos and order.
33:35
Right? So if you have string and an
33:37
instrument, you have two points where they're anchored,
33:39
that's the constraint.
33:41
And then you pluck the string and it
33:43
vibrates and it creates a sound and the
33:46
oscillation
33:47
is actually quite even.
33:49
Right? So it's balanced.
33:51
And balanced over time.
33:54
And to me that's like, that tautness if
33:56
you like is the definition of what makes
33:58
something beautiful. Because
34:01
if you think
34:03
of those
34:04
poems, pieces of music,
34:06
stories or whatever it is that persist over
34:09
time,
34:11
they do tend to show this
34:13
balance between
34:15
chaos
34:15
and the constraints and the order
34:18
put together in a good way.
34:20
Now that doesn't mean that it can't be
34:22
messed around with and that's where we could
34:24
come to your library, right? So
34:27
there is also merits and this is what
34:29
the artist does,
34:31
is to create discordance.
34:33
Right? So something that's,
34:36
you know, an Elgar piece that's very discordant
34:38
for example, some modern music,
34:40
you might hear the discordance and go: Well,
34:42
that's ugly.
34:43
Well,
34:45
if your touchstone is that there should be
34:47
a balance between chaos and order then sure
34:49
you might call it ugly. But the honest
34:51
answer might turn around and say yes. But
34:52
there's what what I'm doing is that in
34:54
doing this I'm
34:56
revealing
34:57
something
34:58
that resonates with, my audience.
35:00
A discordance,
35:01
a
35:02
a feeling, a sensation.
35:04
And that in itself is that's the purpose
35:06
of art if you like, is to create
35:07
that relationship.
35:09
But that means that those
35:10
that fall away from this ideal are necessarily
35:13
culture bound. Mhmm. Because what's discordant to one
35:16
culture won't be to another.
35:17
What speaks to one culture won't be the
35:19
same as to another. So although the if
35:21
you like the ideal of beauty might be
35:23
this balance between chaos
35:26
and order.
35:27
So you have an idea of your your
35:29
brain. It's perfect.
35:30
Your pen is the mediation, You write, it
35:33
becomes manifest and it becomes flawed. Mhmm. Right?
35:36
That's the process of art. In that translation,
35:39
it's the wrangling between the idea and the
35:41
reality. Mhmm. The the freedom and the constraint.
35:44
Mhmm. That that's where the beauty comes from.
35:47
Because if you think of, as I say,
35:48
if you think of those things that persist,
35:50
you're talking about architecture for example.
35:53
Well,
35:54
if you think of the cathedrals and the
35:56
mosques that were built 3, 400 even
35:59
8, 900 years ago,
36:01
that the aesthetic if you like was trying
36:04
to do that.
36:05
It was trying
36:07
to encompass
36:09
the firmament. It was trying to encompass something
36:11
that was chaotic and completely open and to
36:13
constrain it into
36:15
something that we could understand. That's why there's
36:17
these big vaulted
36:18
buildings because you look up and you're filled
36:20
with awe. Right? And it's because the sky
36:22
contained.
36:24
Freedom constraint,
36:26
right? And but these these were endeavors that
36:28
were this is important,
36:30
were also designed to persist over generations. They
36:33
took 300 years to build, took 500 years
36:36
to build. Right? So it's a multi generational
36:38
effort
36:39
in pursuit of creating something beautiful.
36:41
And even if you take away the religion
36:43
side of it, to me that's an extraordinary
36:46
endeavor. And actually, if you think of the,
36:48
if you compare your library to a cathedral,
36:51
you could say, well,
36:53
the culture pound the culture pound discordant
36:56
artifacts
36:57
will see whether those last as long.
37:00
Because
37:01
if they don't then I'll be proved right.
37:04
I but I won't be around to figure
37:05
it out whether that library is still gonna
37:07
be there in another 100 or 200 years
37:09
time. Well, the the reason I'm picking on
37:11
on architects,
37:12
specifically,
37:14
is that I have to look at it.
37:16
Right. Right? So, like, the art I have
37:18
hanging on my walls in my office and
37:20
in in my home,
37:22
I've chosen it.
37:24
So I don't have to look at it.
37:26
I chose to look at it, and I
37:28
chose what I wanna look at. Right? But
37:30
when I walk down the sidewalk in Toronto,
37:33
I am subject
37:35
to the architectural
37:37
decisions
37:37
made by
37:39
others.
37:40
So
37:41
I think architects
37:43
and you know, if you're an architect and
37:45
you don't like what I'm saying, just leave
37:46
a comment
37:47
in the comment section
37:49
or send us an email with your hate
37:51
mail.
37:52
The things that we see and hear around
37:54
us are going to affect our mood. Right?
37:58
So
37:59
we have to kind of construct buildings
38:02
to live and work in or you know,
38:03
buildings that function as hospitals and schools.
38:07
And since they're going to be there anyway,
38:10
I am advocating
38:12
for the extra effort
38:14
put into something that's as universally
38:18
beautiful or pleasing or mood lifting or spiritually
38:22
elevating as possible
38:24
since we got to look at it anyway.
38:25
Mhmm. Right?
38:26
It's different from like personal fashion
38:29
where, you know, not that many people really
38:31
look at the clothes I wear. Mhmm. It's
38:33
different from painting and sculpture
38:36
where it's gonna maybe be in a private
38:38
office or a private home.
38:40
Public architecture, I'm including, like, landscape architecture here.
38:44
You know, it's something that we're gonna kind
38:46
of have to look at over and over
38:48
again on mass.
38:49
Mhmm. And that's that's why I'm picking on
38:52
on the architects.
38:53
You know, I would say that if someone's
38:55
going to make
38:56
a painting,
38:57
then
38:59
they're elevating themselves
39:00
and that the person who's eventually going to
39:02
exhibit the painting and own the painting
39:04
when
39:05
they put care and effort into making it
39:08
beautiful.
39:10
We could veer into a whole discussion about,
39:13
you know, modern art and whether it truly
39:15
is just what you can get away with.
39:18
Actually,
39:18
I I kind of
39:20
disagree with that. Although,
39:21
just what you can get away with, you
39:23
could also say it's the balance between chaos
39:25
and order. You're still coming back to trying
39:28
to find a balance between the 2, What
39:29
you can get away with?
39:31
So Marcel Duchamp's,
39:33
toilet and and and Tracy Emmett's
39:36
bed
39:38
is it like my unmade bed or is
39:40
it Yeah. She was like she she was,
39:42
she'd had a mental crisis and and had
39:45
basically lived in her bed for, like, 3
39:47
months or something and then she Well, that
39:49
that makes a better story. It makes a
39:50
better story than if it's just like I
39:52
don't think it was bad. Yeah. Oh, okay.
39:53
I saw it. Yeah. Yeah. Well well, so
39:56
that, I know it was exhibited in a
39:58
gallery, but as someone who does buy
40:00
art, there's not a chance I'm gonna buy
40:02
someone else's bed dirty sheets, condom wrappers,
40:05
and then put it in my living room.
40:07
Sure. I suppose I can see again the
40:09
chaos order. The chaos was her life. The
40:11
order is putting it into a
40:14
gallery and having it scrutinized.
40:16
So True.
40:17
There's there's there's something there. Whether it's beautiful
40:19
or not, that's
40:21
another question. So, if you go to the
40:23
Greek idea of beauty,
40:25
which is callus, which is noble, which is
40:27
a sort of fun. You might say, well,
40:28
what are those things that persist over 100
40:30
of years Mhmm. That we still kinda go,
40:33
oh yeah. Like mountains for example, they're eternally
40:36
considered,
40:37
they fill you with oil. That's why people
40:38
don't like that, fine.
40:39
But mountains are
40:41
the creation
40:42
as a they are created as a result
40:45
of chaos upon order.
40:47
So the idea of there being an ideal
40:49
of beauty would be that there is
40:51
a perfect balance between chaos and order. Mhmm.
40:54
And that the closer you are to that
40:56
perfection,
40:57
the more likely you are that it's going
40:58
to persist over time because it becomes not
41:01
bound by culture. Yeah.
41:03
But I don't know if I'm right. Well,
41:05
I I I I I like to present
41:09
another stab at a definition. Okay. So, you
41:12
know, we, you know, we don't really necessarily
41:14
have to defend art in this episode. We're
41:16
just gonna kind of defend like beauty. Yeah.
41:18
Right?
41:19
Robert Persick
41:21
defined quality, capital q quality
41:24
as I'm gonna mangle his words, but it's
41:27
something along the lines
41:28
of that which is done with care. Mhmm.
41:31
So that which is done with care
41:34
necessarily will be a thing of quality. Mhmm.
41:36
And if you see something that is of
41:38
quality,
41:39
then certainly
41:40
that that thing was done or created or
41:43
painted or built with care.
41:46
So,
41:46
you know, care is kind of the effort
41:48
that you you put into it and then
41:50
the the end result is something of quality.
41:52
And I I very much believe in that,
41:54
at least, you know, for my work as
41:55
a therapist, for, you know, anything that I
41:57
wanna kinda put out there to the public
41:59
where I know that
42:01
for
42:02
the the the product or or the the
42:05
experience to be of high quality,
42:07
much care has to be put into
42:10
it. So I guess my criticism
42:12
of like Marcel Duchamp for example
42:15
is that, is there really that much care
42:17
in picking a urine a urinal off the
42:19
ground and
42:20
scrolling your signature on it? If there's little
42:23
care that's been placed in it, can we
42:25
really say that it it it has quality
42:28
or
42:29
Either. I I think in that case, again
42:32
this is culture balance discordance.
42:33
Right? So in his time
42:36
doing that was revolutionary. And so if there
42:38
was care, it was Yeah. Him as an
42:40
artist creating something that was discordant and spoke
42:43
to the culture. So whether or not it's
42:44
beautiful is almost secondary.
42:46
I I guess so.
42:48
Oh, okay. So what kind of set aside
42:51
the, like, what is art argument
42:52
to, you know, really focus on the, you
42:55
know, advocacy
42:56
for beauty at least as something to strive
42:58
towards. Absolutely. Yes. CC is an aspiration. As
43:01
an aspiration. Yeah. I think it's because so
43:03
I have to get dressed in the morning
43:05
anyway. Right? Mhmm.
43:07
And then people are gonna look at whatever
43:10
shirt I put on in the morning.
43:12
So why would I make someone look at
43:15
a very ugly Christmas sweater
43:18
in like mid February
43:21
if I could have them look at like
43:23
a pleasing color
43:25
and a, you know, a pleasing pattern
43:28
since they're gonna look at me anyway. I
43:29
think it's part of my social duty. You're
43:32
being prosocial again. I am being prosocial
43:35
and taking into consideration
43:37
the emotional impact that that my aesthetic choices
43:40
have on others.
43:42
Just like, you know, how I decided to
43:44
set up the set for this podcast, how
43:46
I set up my office, even paintings I
43:48
hang on my living room wall.
43:50
They're selected
43:51
to affect human beings like me and guests
43:54
in my home in a positive way.
43:57
That doesn't mean I have just like a
43:58
kitsch on my walls, you know, so I
44:00
have this almost demonic looking horse that was
44:03
galloping,
44:04
but that horse
44:06
makes me feel deep feelings.
44:08
And I, you know, like other people look
44:10
at the horse, they're gonna feel similar feelings.
44:12
That to
44:14
me is the validity
44:15
in taking the care
44:17
to set up one's environment so that it
44:19
is beautiful.
44:21
You know, dead house plants are gonna create
44:23
a certain feeling
44:24
and probably not the feeling you want your
44:26
clients or your guests to create.
44:28
But thriving,
44:30
lush, tropical plants are gonna create a different
44:33
feeling, and it's probably more in line with
44:35
the feeling that you wanna create. Again, we're
44:37
advocating
44:39
for beauty as a thing. We're not defining
44:41
it. It's not for me to tell you
44:43
what painting you find beautiful
44:45
or whether you find cacti or, like, you
44:47
know,
44:49
to
44:52
understanding and defining what beauty is for you
44:54
just like I'm advocating for you to define,
44:56
you know, how you arrive at truth and
44:58
how you arrive at morality,
45:00
and I'm making these worthwhile pursuits for you
45:03
to pursue.
45:04
So beauty is in the eye of the
45:05
beholder. That that yeah. I I I am
45:07
making that argument,
45:09
but it's also not haphazard.
45:11
Mhmm. So
45:12
if we kind of go back to Robert
45:14
Persick's definition of quality,
45:17
if that which is done with care
45:20
then has quality, all that's done carelessly
45:24
lacks quality
45:25
and probably lacks that aesthetic quality of beauty
45:28
if if the thing being done is something
45:30
like home decoration or painting or sculpture or
45:33
architecture.
45:34
So that wraps up our defense
45:37
of truth, morality
45:39
and beauty as valid
45:42
concepts,
45:43
even though it's now 2020 4
45:46
and hopefully people are still listening to the
45:48
podcast in 2030,040.
45:50
Let's hope optimistically humanity survives because I've not
45:53
done too much jet travel.
45:55
And in 2060,
45:57
you know, people are still listening to to
45:58
these timeless ideas.
46:00
But no matter what you're you're listening to
46:02
this in, I
46:03
hope that we've been able to make a
46:05
case
46:06
for why the pursuit of truth and the
46:08
pursuit of morality and the pursuit beauty as
46:11
valid concepts
46:12
and universal concepts
46:14
is worthwhile.
46:16
And I hope that we've been able to
46:18
at least
46:19
help you
46:20
turn away a bit from nihilism and cynicism
46:24
and not feel like you're crazy
46:27
because you're pursuing these ideas, which have a
46:30
place in the 21st century and are not
46:32
just quaintly Victorian
46:35
concepts.
46:36
Thank you again for listening. Pascal and I
46:38
are available for hire through the Morphis Clinic
46:40
For Hypnosis
46:41
in Toronto, Canada, but seeing clients worldwide.
46:44
If you go to our website at
46:46
www.morphisclinic.com,
46:48
you can read all about us and our
46:50
work, and you can contact us for a
46:52
free consultation.
46:53
As you can hear from these episodes, Pascal
46:55
and I are kind of practical philosophers in
46:58
a way. We think about these issues deeply
47:01
so that you can just hear us speak
47:04
about these issues
47:05
in a way that's pertinent to you and
47:07
to your situation.
47:09
So if you like what you've heard and
47:11
you want to keep on listening to some
47:13
of these good ideas and perspectives, then,
47:16
follow us on YouTube at Morpheus Hypnosis
47:19
or on Spotify or Apple Podcasts, wherever it
47:22
is that you get your podcasts.
47:24
We will look forward to, producing more of
47:26
these over the coming months. So stay tuned
47:29
and keep posted.