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Are You Worried About The Cardinals Injuries? · Kenny Wallace Media

• 0:00
  What's up everybody? This is low hanging fruit.
• 0:02
  I am Charlie Marlow. That is Brendan Schaefer.
• 0:05
  Brendan, how you doing buddy? And we got some breaking news
• 0:09
  when it comes to Tommy Edmond. So first of all, how are you
• 0:12
  doing Brendan though? Oh, I'm doing.
• 0:15
  I mean, the doing couldn't be more done with where I am.
• 0:19
  Yeah, we're doing great. Great.
• 0:20
  OK, here's the news, Katie Wu. It's from 9:07.
• 0:25
  It's about an hour and a half ago.
• 0:26
  As we record here on a Thursday, Katie Wu tweets, Tommy Edmond
• 0:31
  has been shut down from hitting activities for a minimum of one
• 0:34
  week. He will not be cleared before
• 0:36
  opening day and will start the season on the injured list.
• 0:40
  Hashtag STL cards. I think we all kind of assume
• 0:43
  that, don't you think? Some of these is it.
• 0:46
  Prognosis, prognosi. Some of these, It's like I never
• 0:50
  expected Tommy Edmond to be on the Opening Day roster, but I
• 0:53
  guess this now solidifies it. When you say never, you mean
• 0:56
  like in December you didn't expect it, or like once we
• 1:00
  started learning about the setbacks, you kind of figured
• 1:03
  this is going to take a while. No, I knew all these things in
• 1:06
  December. OK, what I'm saying is, and
• 1:08
  look, we could start this podcast now with with the fact
• 1:12
  that in years past the Cardinals sometimes are too aggressive
• 1:15
  with with saying guys might be back if if you if you have the
• 1:20
  trifecta of Edmund Nuke bar, which happened after we recorded
• 1:24
  last week, and Sonny Gray. I don't anticipate any of them
• 1:29
  being on the opening day roster. Now they might miss a week or
• 1:32
  so, but to me it's early. The season hasn't even started.
• 1:36
  I don't expect any of those guys to start opening day on the
• 1:40
  roster. That's what I meant.
• 1:42
  Well, and I think you're right, like the the news that we just
• 1:45
  got from the reporters that are down in Jupiter about Edmond is
• 1:48
  not too surprising. It it is a little bit alarming.
• 1:51
  I think that the reason they can solidify in saying he's not
• 1:55
  going to be ready for opening day is that they're shutting him
• 1:57
  down again. He's not going to hit for
• 1:59
  another week and he never did progress to live pitching.
• 2:02
  It's not like he got to the last step of live pitching and he was
• 2:06
  feeling pain and they had to to go backward.
• 2:08
  He never even got that far along.
• 2:10
  And this is a surgically repaired wrist.
• 2:13
  Like he had the surgery to fix the issue.
• 2:16
  And he's dealing with a lot of inflammation.
• 2:18
  Ollie Marmel, I think his quote said something like they've got
• 2:21
  to let it cool all the way back down before ramping it back up.
• 2:24
  But every time they've tried to ramp it back up, it's barking at
• 2:27
  him. And I I don't.
• 2:28
  To me that says, hey, you've got a long term opening in center
• 2:32
  field, like that's the way you almost have to treat it.
• 2:34
  And anytime Tommy Edmond gets back in the first half of the
• 2:37
  season, it's a bonus. And that might sound a little
• 2:39
  bit, you know, alarmist, but I for me, mentally it's like,
• 2:43
  could it be June? Yeah, because until he gets to a
• 2:46
  point where he's actually progressing and not having this
• 2:48
  inflammation in this pain, it's impossible to say.
• 2:51
  New bar. I thought it was a little bit
• 2:53
  wild when they said initially we're still hopeful for opening
• 2:57
  day when you've got cracked ribs and that's typically an injury
• 3:01
  that's going to take a little bit longer to heal.
• 3:03
  And again, why at risk it because it's the beginning of
• 3:05
  the year. So I agree with you on new bar.
• 3:07
  I don't think he's on the open day roster either.
• 3:09
  We'll see if there's any little Nuggets that come out about him
• 3:12
  here in the next couple of days where we can get a better view
• 3:14
  of that. Sonny Gray is the one that I
• 3:16
  actually think does have a chance, but I wouldn't say it's
• 3:19
  a better than equal chance, but it's just dependent upon, like
• 3:22
  he's already back to throwing and throwing bullpens and things
• 3:24
  like that. So as long as he doesn't have
• 3:26
  another set back, I think you'll be kind of cutting it close.
• 3:29
  I expect him to be pitching in that first turn through the
• 3:31
  rotation. Maybe you just bump him back
• 3:34
  from Opening Day. That's kind of unless he has a
• 3:36
  set back where I'm thinking about it right now.
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  But yeah, the outfielders in particular, I'm just, you don't
• 3:41
  know, especially with Tommy, Evan, You really don't know.
• 3:44
  And so we'll we'll roll this conversation into Victor Scott
• 3:48
  here momentarily. But I think it also speaks to
• 3:52
  you know we're all know it alls I I try to I try to always give
• 3:56
  the Cardinals the benefit of the doubt.
• 3:58
  But as we've talked about this outfield glut over the last
• 4:01
  couple years and let's be real this this could go back ten
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  years in terms of just. I mean there's a lot going into
• 4:07
  that Oscar Taveras, Steven Pascotti, Randall Grichuk.
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  But like the Cardinals have been really bad for about a decade on
• 4:15
  either choosing or finding or bad luck with their outfield.
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  And what I'm trying to say is even after trading Palacios and
• 4:24
  Tyler O'Neill, I still kind of thought they they still have
• 4:28
  probably too many. You got Burleson, you got Dylan
• 4:32
  Carlson. And I think this does show all
• 4:34
  of us and and know it all's like me.
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  Here we are. The season hasn't started.
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  Newt is probably not going to be in the open day roster.
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  God knows how long until Tommy Edmond.
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  So you you never have as much as you think.
• 4:47
  I think with pitching we always know that.
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  But this does show that because we're thinking OK, is Burleson
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  now going to start the year as a starter in the outfield is Dylan
• 4:57
  Carlson Who? Let's be real.
• 4:59
  Nobody. Nobody I know is really high on
• 5:01
  Dylan Carlson. He might be your starting center
• 5:03
  fielder. Obviously we have Victor Scott,
• 5:05
  but I'm just saying you never have enough is my point.
• 5:07
  Yeah. And and that's kind of been the
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  challenge too. When we say there's always a
• 5:11
  glut, it's like they've got too many and then they're not
• 5:15
  getting the most out of the ones that they have or they're
• 5:17
  choosing to prioritize the wrong ones without really knowing.
• 5:21
  Because like, you know, we certainly don't know.
• 5:23
  It's kind of their job to know and to get those decisions
• 5:25
  right. But they, you know, they're just
• 5:27
  trying to go on the best information and beliefs.
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  And last year it was kind of, hey, Tyler, O'Neill's going to
• 5:32
  get sort of the benefit of the doubt to begin and let's see if
• 5:34
  he can make good on all those raw materials and and the the
• 5:37
  great tools that he has. And it didn't really come to
• 5:40
  fruition for him. And now you're coming into
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  another year after as you mentioned, O'Neill is gone,
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  Palacios is gone. So you've cleared the deck a
• 5:47
  little bit. You know Jordan Walker is going
• 5:49
  to be stationed in right field where you want him.
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  But then the other two guys that you were planning on new Par and
• 5:54
  Edmond are at at best questionable for opening day in
• 5:58
  Dupar's case and in Edmonds case we now know he's not going to be
• 6:02
  there. So it is nice to have those
• 6:03
  other options and it makes us feel a little bit silly for
• 6:06
  three weeks ago going oh is Alec Burleson.
• 6:08
  I mean they signed Brandon Crawford I guess Alec Burleson's
• 6:10
  in Memphis. No he's probably in your opening
• 6:12
  day lineup in hitting in spring training like he deserves to be.
• 6:16
  So it's it's a good point to be made that we often times think
• 6:19
  we know everything and you know things happen and and it
• 6:23
  completely changes our scope of a vision on some of these deals
• 6:26
  within a matter of weeks as we've seen this spring.
• 6:29
  I agree. And I was one of those guys.
• 6:31
  But to be fair, it wasn't as much about Brandon Crawford as
• 6:35
  it was going back to Matt Carpenter.
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  Because to me, you have the leadership guy with Crawford who
• 6:40
  also fills a need of backup shortstop.
• 6:44
  True, But Paul Goldsmith didn't ask for Brandon Crawford.
• 6:46
  He asked for Matt Carpenter. So.
• 6:48
  You know what? Yeah.
• 6:48
  What Goldie wants, Goldie gets. I I hear you.
• 6:51
  OK, so let's talk a little Victor Scott.
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  So I always like to be honest with my audience.
• 6:57
  I I haven't been locked into every single game.
• 6:59
  But here we go. Well, I'm just being honest.
• 7:02
  Hey. So he's played.
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  He's played Eleven games, 30 ABS, eight runs, eleven hits for
• 7:09
  Victor Scott. Four walks, 4 strikeouts, 4
• 7:12
  bags. Has stolen 4 bases.
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  I'm in. Really nice start. 367 average,
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  457 on base, 433 slug for an 890 OPS.
• 7:22
  It's the Grapefruit League. I do think for a guy like this
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  who entering the year, I kind of look at him a little bit like I
• 7:30
  did Mason win last year. Well, let me let me change that.
• 7:34
  Mason win, I didn't think there was any chance he was going to
• 7:36
  make the opening day roster. So it is a little different.
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  I think with injuries now and the fact that Victor Scott has
• 7:43
  had a really good spring so far, he has an opportunity and I
• 7:47
  think it's kind of the perfect opportunity for him.
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  There shouldn't be a ton of pressure.
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  This is because of injuries. Like they're not.
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  They're not really counting on him because in theory, admin
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  will be back. Newbar will be back pretty soon.
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  But if he's good, if he's really good, he's going to play.
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  So to me, it's a win, Win for Victor Scott.
• 8:09
  What do you think? Well, I I think, and I've said I
• 8:12
  think they should have him on the open day roster and that he
• 8:15
  should be the center fielder. Unless we see Dylan Carlson
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  catch fire, which to be fair, he hit a home run yesterday.
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  And if he starts to to put it together offensively, then I do
• 8:26
  think it's incumbent upon the Cardinals a little bit to say,
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  look, we have sort of yanked this guy around.
• 8:31
  Yes. His ability to hit right-handed
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  pitching is going to be everything for determining
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  whether he can be an everyday guy and and someone we can rely
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  upon or more of a of a, you know, short side of a platoon
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  playing against left-handed pitching, which he's been able
• 8:45
  to handle historically. But if Dylan Carlson kind of
• 8:48
  doesn't have the spring that they're hoping to see and you
• 8:51
  know that Tommy Edmond is not necessarily coming around the
• 8:54
  corner very soon, new bar should should make it back before
• 8:57
  Edmond in my estimation. But he's supposed to play left
• 9:00
  field. Like the answer wasn't going to
• 9:01
  be, hey, we'll put new bar in center and Burleson and left.
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  Like that's not the best version of your defense.
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  I think if you're going to have Burleson and left, which it
• 9:09
  seems like he's he's hitting, which is good, and he's he's
• 9:12
  trimmed down, he worked on his defense.
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  Is he going to be a plus left fielder?
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  Probably not. But can he be close to league
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  average? That's the hope.
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  Can Jordan Walker, with all the work he's put in, be close to
• 9:21
  league average and right field? That's a hope.
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  But if you have two hopes on either side of you, I am going
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  to prioritize the guy that can track down any ball in the gap,
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  that has great instincts, has great speed.
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  Victor Scott to me is the answer.
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  Defensively, he's a match for what they thought Tommy Edmond
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  was supposed to be in stabilizing that defense for the
• 9:41
  pitching staff in center field. Dylan Carlson, I think could do
• 9:44
  that if he's playing confidently.
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  And part of what I think Carlson's thing is, Ben is like
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  when he's not confident and the team hasn't exactly instilled
• 9:51
  confidence in him. It's been kind of hit and miss
• 9:54
  with his production. So if if they think, hey, he's
• 9:57
  looking good at the end of spring, we really want to kind
• 9:59
  of throw him a bone and and maybe feed into his ability to
• 10:03
  show us the most of of what he can bring to the table.
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  Maybe then you don't have an everyday role for Victor Scott
• 10:08
  and you don't kind of jump the gun on bringing him up.
• 10:11
  But if Carlson doesn't look like he's as good of an option for
• 10:15
  you in April as Victor Scott is to win baseball games, which I
• 10:18
  think is important because you don't want to get off to the 8
• 10:20
  and 19 start you had last year. Then Victor Scott would 100% be
• 10:24
  my guy. So yeah, I'm in a spot where I
• 10:26
  agree with you. He don't have to lead off.
• 10:27
  Look he's leading off in spring. People might be getting this a
• 10:29
  little bit confused. He's leading off in spring
• 10:31
  because they want every possible glance at him that they can get.
• 10:34
  They wanted to get the most at bats the most opportunities in
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  the field. They want to see what it looks
• 10:39
  like. This is a a proving ground for
• 10:41
  Victor Scott and so that's what's happening.
• 10:43
  That's why he's leading off. That's why he's playing center
• 10:45
  field everyday or or whatever he's playing.
• 10:47
  That's where he is because they they want to see what that looks
• 10:49
  like. So for me that's kind of what it
• 10:51
  boils down to is they're definitely taking a hard look at
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  this. It's going to be a 40 man roster
• 10:55
  decision. It's going to be, you know,
• 10:57
  start the clock, service time, all those things that
• 10:59
  historically we think the Cardinals are are trying to be
• 11:01
  hesitant to do. But if he helps, you win more
• 11:04
  games as an everyday player there than Dylan Carlson and you
• 11:07
  can platoon Carlson and Burleson and left, I think that makes a
• 11:11
  lot of sense for the Cardinals and trying to start on the right
• 11:14
  foot this year. And you can kind of do a little
• 11:17
  Jordan Walker from last year. You start him up, OK, what
• 11:21
  happens? Somebody comes back, you send
• 11:24
  him back down, you bring him back up.
• 11:26
  Oh, all of a sudden maybe then you do have the 7th year of of
• 11:30
  service time. But look, I I don't, I don't
• 11:33
  know that Victor Scott would be on the opening day roster even
• 11:36
  if he had a great spring. If not for injury, right?
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  Like if Edmund and Newt were both healthy.
• 11:43
  Even if he's really, really good, he would he.
• 11:46
  Would make it an interesting conversation, don't get me
• 11:48
  wrong, but I don't think he makes the roster right.
• 11:50
  No, it wouldn't even be interesting.
• 11:51
  It would be a great comp to win from last year who had a great
• 11:54
  spring. And then he looked at the roster
• 11:56
  and it's like even with Paul Deyoung starting on the IL last
• 11:59
  year, there still wasn't any playing time for Mason.
• 12:02
  Win, right? And then Deyoung came back and
• 12:04
  it would have even been more impossible.
• 12:07
  A player like Victor Scott, 23 years old, regarded prospect,
• 12:11
  You want him to be playing every day wherever he is.
• 12:14
  So not only is it the injuries that open the door, it's it.
• 12:18
  It really is. To me, a lot of this is bakes
• 12:20
  into what Dylan Carlson is doing because if he's having a great
• 12:23
  spring, we're going OK. Obviously he's your center
• 12:25
  fielder and then the other outfielder that makes the team
• 12:29
  needs to be kind of 1/4 outfielder type who's maybe not
• 12:32
  a prospect that you're worried about or are we going to stunt
• 12:35
  his development by having him ride the bench 4 out of seven
• 12:38
  days? That's Michael Siani.
• 12:40
  Like that would make a lot of lot more sense if you trust
• 12:42
  Carlson as your everyday center fielder and and feel good about
• 12:45
  that going into the year. But if he's having a lackluster
• 12:49
  spring and Scott's having a great one, that would be the way
• 12:52
  that I would kind of view it and say look I I think Scott might
• 12:55
  give you a better chance to win today and for the next six
• 12:58
  weeks, however long it is that Edmonds out.
• 13:00
  And yeah, I don't think it's the end of the world if Victor Scott
• 13:03
  goes out there and has a 600 OPS and doesn't really thrive
• 13:07
  offensively as your 9 hole hitter and then has to go back
• 13:10
  to Memphis where he's never been.
• 13:11
  By the way, we say back to Memphis like Jordan Walker from
• 13:14
  last year he had, he's never played in Memphis so that's part
• 13:16
  of the risk in like elevating him so quickly.
• 13:19
  But if he has a 600 OPS and then goes to AAA to refine himself,
• 13:23
  how is that all too different from last year bringing up Mason
• 13:26
  win, his OPS is 470. And then you say he's our
• 13:30
  starting shortstop. Like nobody is thinking that
• 13:32
  they ruined Mason win by doing that.
• 13:34
  That's not the narratives that are around that player.
• 13:37
  They say, oh, we think he's a a smart kid, confident kid and
• 13:39
  he's going to figure it out like he always does when he reaches a
• 13:42
  new level. I kind of view the the kind of
• 13:45
  the the swagger, the the just the regard that Victor Scott has
• 13:49
  when he can think about the game and that the way that he's
• 13:52
  spoken about with regard to hit the head on his shoulders.
• 13:54
  I feel like he can put it all together and find the
• 13:57
  confidence, even if he doesn't immediately thrive in the big
• 14:00
  least and if he thrives well, then he's here to stay.
• 14:01
  And that would be a great thing for the Cardinals.
• 14:03
  Good problem to have. Yeah, I I hate to say it, but at
• 14:06
  this point I don't really have any expectations and I certainly
• 14:10
  don't have any positive expectations about Dylan
• 14:13
  Carlson. To me it's it's all he has to
• 14:15
  prove it. I know he's not having a good
• 14:16
  spring and I'm not saying that 100% matters, but I I do want to
• 14:20
  do the the next little segment here about in your opinion,
• 14:25
  which guys you think it does matter that they're good or bad
• 14:28
  and I'll start. So Mason Wynn, who we've already
• 14:31
  talked about, I do think that's a guy that you'd like to see
• 14:34
  better stats from in spring. And look, he's in 25 at bats, he
• 14:39
  struck out 10 times, you know, 200 average, 333 on base, 320
• 14:44
  slug. So again, I'm not, I'm not
• 14:46
  saying it's the end of the world, but but that is a player
• 14:48
  that I think would benefit from a nice camp.
• 14:51
  It's it's so far not so good. You mentioned Dylan Carlson,
• 14:56
  he's got a OPS of 620. Now here here's a guy where
• 14:59
  again I would put Alec Burleson in the same category of Mason
• 15:04
  Wynn of I think a good spring is more important for those type of
• 15:08
  guys. And as I said Mason win not so
• 15:11
  much. Alec Burleson is having a really
• 15:14
  good spring 400 average 471 on base, 567 slug OPS over 1000.
• 15:20
  He's got a Homer couple double s and and there you go the
• 15:24
  opportunity is there for him and it it probably would have been
• 15:27
  anyway in more of a bench type role.
• 15:30
  But this guy we've we've heard that the all the batted ball
• 15:33
  stats, despite some of the results, weren't there in the
• 15:35
  big leagues. But the Cardinals have always
• 15:37
  loved this guy. He's doing great and I think
• 15:40
  that is big for him. He's a guy where I think his
• 15:42
  spring numbers and his spring performance matters more than
• 15:46
  others. I definitely think it matters
• 15:48
  for Burleson because yes, now that there are two injuries to
• 15:50
  the outfield, there would have been an opportunity for him to
• 15:53
  be on the roster anyway. But they would have been trying
• 15:56
  to consider like, OK, are we putting Donovan in left field,
• 15:59
  which they still may do with Burley as DH.
• 16:01
  But either way, I think both those guys are going to be in
• 16:04
  the the opening day lineup and then maybe Burleson's a bench
• 16:07
  bat like you said, but he's forcing the issue.
• 16:09
  And last year the Cardinals gave him a lot of playing time where
• 16:12
  some fans were like who's this Burleson guy?
• 16:14
  Why are they so obsessed with Alec Burleson?
• 16:16
  And you you you look at the abets that he takes and I I do
• 16:20
  think it makes sense. He doesn't strike out a lot and
• 16:23
  he does put the ball in play there.
• 16:24
  There's a a really good hit tool there and he's worked hard in
• 16:28
  the offseason to kind of put his body in a in a good shape.
• 16:31
  He's trimmed down. Can he find a power stroke
• 16:34
  within that as well to go with the contact rate and then maybe
• 16:37
  have a little better luck? I mean, Alec Burleson was
• 16:39
  hitting balls to the wall last year that were just like
• 16:41
  highlight reel catches against him on like almost a nightly
• 16:44
  basis for a while it was kind of bizarre and and you just kind of
• 16:47
  throw your hands up. What can you do if you're Alec
• 16:49
  Burleson at that point? But I do think that there's a a
• 16:52
  good tool there to be had and he's a left-handed bat as well.
• 16:55
  The Cardinals have some mainstays in their line up that
• 16:57
  are right-handed like Arenado and Goldspit and Wilson
• 17:00
  Contreras and Jordan Walker. So having another guy like new
• 17:04
  bar would have been in that left field spot having Burleson there
• 17:06
  to kind of slide into that role. Is it another way to balance the
• 17:09
  line up really nicely, which some people say I don't care
• 17:11
  about just get hits, which is absolutely right.
• 17:14
  But if you're a lefty that does often give you a a nice edge
• 17:16
  against right-handed pitching, which is what you're
• 17:18
  predominantly going to see. And then I do think it works out
• 17:21
  nicely for a platoon because he he's a lefty bat and then Dylan
• 17:25
  Carlson who's better against lefty pitchers can kind of slide
• 17:29
  in, which is why I think earlier this week when we saw Scott and
• 17:32
  center and Dylan Carlson and left.
• 17:34
  But that was kind of interesting, maybe a little bit
• 17:36
  of a a signal from the Cardinals that like yeah, they're they're
• 17:38
  wanting to see what this looks like and consider that that
• 17:41
  could be an alignment that we actually see during the season.
• 17:44
  I I think Victor Scott is definitely getting that type of
• 17:46
  consideration. OK let's switch over to the
• 17:49
  pitching side and again I'll just throw some stats out there
• 17:52
  and and guys that I think again for some it matters more than
• 17:56
  others. Zach Thompson is having a nice
• 17:58
  spring. I think it matters more for him.
• 18:01
  Matthew Libator so so 6. ERAI did watch his first outing.
• 18:06
  I still I like him in the bullpen.
• 18:08
  I'm not saying he can never be a starter, but to me, I just think
• 18:11
  he trends better out of the pen in terms of starting pitching.
• 18:15
  We know what's going on with Sonny Gray.
• 18:18
  Miles Michalis is having a nice spring.
• 18:20
  Basically. Everybody else in your starting
• 18:22
  rotation, not so good. Kyle Gibson pushing a 13, ERA
• 18:26
  Steven Matz at a 12. I mean, this is only three
• 18:29
  innings, so I'm not going crazy. Lancelin, what has he got one
• 18:32
  inning? So I'm sorry.
• 18:35
  No, you're right. He's only pitched.
• 18:37
  A little bit like 2 innings. Yeah, so Lancelin, 2 innings, 18
• 18:41
  ERA. I'm not going crazy about any of
• 18:44
  those, but it's not a good start for for a lot of the starters.
• 18:47
  So what do you think of the guys I mentioned or some other folks
• 18:50
  you think were? Maybe it matters more so to have
• 18:52
  a good camp for a for a guy. We'll talk about the the
• 18:55
  performances, but first you bring up Lance Lynn.
• 18:58
  Did you see Angel Hernandez ejected Lance Lynn from his
• 19:01
  spring training start? Like, is that not the most
• 19:04
  classic Angel Hernandez thing ever?
• 19:06
  And then because Lynn So the deal with Lynn is he has worked
• 19:09
  his way up to a pitch count on the back fields, which Ollie has
• 19:13
  described. That's just the way he prefers
• 19:14
  to do it. It worked out for the Cardinals
• 19:16
  because they could showcase Thompson and Libby Moore as they
• 19:19
  kind of try to figure out who's going to be that that next man
• 19:21
  up in the rotation. And so it worked out for
• 19:23
  everybody. But now he gets his chance to
• 19:25
  actually pitch in a great fruit league game and he is ejected
• 19:29
  from that game and then goes out to the bullpen to try and
• 19:32
  continue because he needs to get to his pitch count.
• 19:34
  Like that's still work he needs to do.
• 19:36
  And Angel Hernandez, like goes out there and says no, you can't
• 19:39
  throw in the bullpen. I've ejected you from the game.
• 19:41
  So Ollie Marmo gets ejected and they like, walk off the field
• 19:44
  together. Ollie and Lance Lynn with his
• 19:46
  glove on his head, that's that was classic.
• 19:50
  So I don't know if you had any thoughts about that, but I
• 19:52
  thought it was pretty good. OK, I did see that.
• 19:55
  And even though I do think Angel Hernandez is horrible, I
• 19:57
  actually liked, I liked that because it was interesting and
• 20:00
  it's such an Angel Hernandez thing to do.
• 20:03
  And Lancelin is also like the one ornery guy that he would do
• 20:06
  it too. And then of course, we all know
• 20:07
  these are exhibition games and the guys have to get their work.
• 20:10
  And hey, by the way, again, I, I, I like to be 100% honest, in
• 20:15
  terms of not watching all these games, do guys still run their
• 20:18
  poles during the game, 'cause that was something growing up.
• 20:21
  I always laughed at that during the spring training games.
• 20:25
  You would have dudes getting the pitchers, getting their work in
• 20:28
  and running polls during the game, which I always found funny
• 20:32
  because we all know that on the back fields there's just tons of
• 20:36
  fields and space. Do they still do that?
• 20:39
  I don't think I've seen anybody doing that on a field during a
• 20:42
  game or or in the in the stadium, no.
• 20:45
  But you remember that right back in the day?
• 20:46
  Vaguely. I mean, my day was maybe
• 20:48
  different than your day, Charlie.
• 20:49
  So I don't know if it's a little bit of a age gap there, you
• 20:52
  know? How old are you?
• 20:54
  29 I'll turn 30 this summer. Oh, nice.
• 20:58
  OK, so I'm 41. I'll be 42, you'll be 30.
• 21:01
  So I'm so I'm 12 years old. 1000 years man.
• 21:05
  That is, you know what, we are kind of different.
• 21:07
  We are kind of different generations.
• 21:09
  I'm a millennial, So what are you?
• 21:10
  What are you? I don't know if I'm tail end of
• 21:12
  millennials or the beginning of whatever the next thing is.
• 21:15
  I don't believe in generations either.
• 21:17
  So that's like a whole other thing because like, what are you
• 21:21
  like? Well, if they tell me I'm the
• 21:22
  same thing as you, I'd say no. There's a lot of differences in
• 21:25
  US growing up a dozen years apart in age, and so it's kind
• 21:29
  of hard to group it that way. That's a podcast for another
• 21:31
  day. I'm sure you have a channel with
• 21:33
  all with all your channels you have a a channel where that
• 21:35
  podcast would go. Well, I have discussed this
• 21:38
  before. I agree with you in this sense
• 21:41
  sometimes, and we'll go off on a quick tangent.
• 21:44
  Sometimes, like millennials, they've cut it off where it
• 21:47
  starts at 1980, which I don't think it makes any sense because
• 21:50
  I was born in 82. My older brother Sam was born in
• 21:54
  79. So technically he's in a
• 21:56
  different generation. But but we had the exact same
• 22:00
  upbringing because it shouldn't be based on arbitrary years, it
• 22:04
  should be based on technological advances.
• 22:07
  And to me, I didn't grow up with a smartphone or social media.
• 22:11
  That was the big change. That was the disruption.
• 22:14
  So myself and my older brother are way more like growing up
• 22:19
  than folks who were maybe five years younger than me but had a
• 22:22
  smartphone and had Facebook, let's say, in their teenage
• 22:26
  years. Right.
• 22:27
  And I just googled it. It says 81 to 96 is millennial,
• 22:30
  I'm 94. So they would say, yeah, we're
• 22:32
  both in the same, but like you said, you and I had completely
• 22:35
  different upbringings regarding you know what was going on in
• 22:38
  the world, technology being a big thing there.
• 22:40
  So that's that's Exhibit A of why I'm like, I don't even pay
• 22:44
  attention when people ask the generation question, 'cause I'm
• 22:46
  like, it's all fake, they just made it up.
• 22:48
  OK, so this might have gone out of style 10 years ago and I
• 22:51
  forgot, but people who are watching this, this podcast or
• 22:54
  listening will remember that back in the day in Grapefruit
• 22:57
  League games, the pitchers used to run polls on the warning
• 23:01
  track during the games. That was a thing.
• 23:04
  I just don't remember when it stopped.
• 23:06
  Right. Yeah, I don't really remember
• 23:07
  it. It might be one of those things
• 23:09
  where, like I say, Oh yeah, I remember it just because I've
• 23:11
  heard somebody talk about it. But did I ever actually see it?
• 23:14
  I don't know that I did. I don't know.
• 23:17
  On that note, what were we talking about?
• 23:20
  Because I don't. Remember.
• 23:21
  No. I remember you asked me about
• 23:22
  the pitchers, kind of you. You read their box scores, which
• 23:25
  is really enthralling. I'm glad you did that.
• 23:27
  And then I was going to and then I was going to say what I
• 23:31
  thought about those guys. So Lance Lynn, whatever, I think
• 23:35
  he's going to be what he's going to be almost regardless of
• 23:37
  spring performance. And like you said, so minimal of
• 23:40
  what we've seen, partially thanks to Angel Hernandez that
• 23:42
  it's hard to draw any conclusions.
• 23:45
  It'd be nice to see some good things from Steven Mats, I
• 23:48
  think, but the main thing is getting him healthy and and
• 23:50
  having him be healthy when the season begins.
• 23:53
  But you remember the beginning of last year, he pitched so
• 23:55
  poorly that they took him out of the rotation, so having results
• 23:58
  for him would be kind of nice to see.
• 24:00
  I don't know. The one I want to ask you about
• 24:01
  is Kyle Gibson. He's been getting kind of
• 24:03
  shelled into oblivion just a little bit.
• 24:06
  His first outing was like back-to-back homers against the
• 24:09
  Nationals, and that was how he began his Grapefruit League with
• 24:13
  the Cardinals. So his ERA is to the roof.
• 24:16
  I get it. Are you worried about that for a
• 24:18
  guy that's 36 years old and also like had kind of a high ERA last
• 24:22
  year, so you kind of with what you're getting with Kyle Gibson,
• 24:25
  it's like he will throw 30 plus starts, his ERA will be 5 and
• 24:29
  that is what you were getting. And that's kind of what the
• 24:32
  Cardinals paid him to do. I don't think they paid Kyle
• 24:34
  Gibson thinking he's suddenly going to be like a 3 1/2 ERA guy
• 24:38
  this year. That wouldn't have been
• 24:39
  particularly prudent, and I know that's probably part of why
• 24:42
  Cardinals fans were underwhelmed by the offseason and what they
• 24:45
  did in the rotation, because they they sensed the lack of
• 24:48
  upside and more like, OK, stability on the floor.
• 24:52
  That's great, but this doesn't feel good if a guy's going to go
• 24:54
  out and and and get beat up every fifth day.
• 24:57
  So what are you worried about, Kyle Gibson?
• 24:59
  I'm going to, I'm going to just kind of shove the question in
• 25:01
  your direction because I don't really have a great read on how
• 25:05
  I should feel about this right now.
• 25:06
  OK, my my short answer is is kind of, and here's why I think
• 25:11
  I think you'll appreciate this as a fantasy baseball guy.
• 25:15
  I think sometimes you can think about these pitchers in terms of
• 25:19
  fantasy baseball, and I usually think of this with guys in the
• 25:24
  postseason. I think about it.
• 25:26
  Do I feel good about that guy starting a postseason game?
• 25:30
  I kind of think about it in the fantasy lens.
• 25:33
  There are guys that you're going to start no matter what.
• 25:35
  There are guys that suck. There are guys in the middle and
• 25:39
  sometimes you have to start them, but you know there's a
• 25:42
  very good chance they could give up 7 urn runs.
• 25:45
  And I was trying to Google this right as you're asking my
• 25:48
  question because I I knew what you're getting to.
• 25:51
  I also have this image in my head.
• 25:52
  I think it was a couple years ago.
• 25:54
  Didn't Kyle Gibson give up an insane amount of homers
• 25:57
  consecutively? Was it?
• 25:59
  Four he might have. And all I'm saying is I'm not
• 26:04
  trying to knock Kyle Gibson. I think he's a very nice, solid
• 26:08
  middle to end of the rotation pitcher at this point, his
• 26:10
  career. I think with a guy like that,
• 26:13
  there's going to be some games where he gives it up, like prom
• 26:17
  night. I think there's going to be some
• 26:18
  games where he's good. But correct me if I'm wrong, I
• 26:21
  was trying to see it. No, you're not wrong.
• 26:23
  It happened against Cardinals too, OK.
• 26:25
  So yeah, what what what was it? Nolan Arnado, Nolan Gorman, Juan
• 26:29
  Yepez and Dylan Carlson or the history making crew is each
• 26:32
  connected for a long ball against Philly starter Kyle
• 26:35
  Gibson. That was July of 2022, beginning
• 26:38
  of July 22nd, you know. It's funny, I I forgot it was
• 26:41
  the Cardinals. I figured it was two years ago.
• 26:43
  Maybe that's implanted in my brain that if any guy can give
• 26:46
  up four straight homers I'm never I'm sorry I'm never going
• 26:50
  to feel just really great. So I I don't know like I don't
• 26:55
  have, I don't have high expectations.
• 26:57
  If Lynn, Matt, Michaelis and and Gibson.
• 27:03
  If their ER As are all around 4/4 and 1/2, I think that's OK.
• 27:08
  I I don't know if that guarantees.
• 27:10
  I don't know if that guarantees him a playoff spot.
• 27:12
  If Sonny Gray, if his ERA is closer to three, if everybody
• 27:16
  else gives you healthy starts and you're around 4 to 4 1/2.
• 27:21
  I think the Cardinals can sneak in.
• 27:23
  So I don't know if I answered your question.
• 27:25
  I just think, I think Kyle Gibson is who he is.
• 27:28
  He had a really nice win loss record last year.
• 27:30
  I don't think his win loss record will be the same, but he
• 27:33
  very well could be the same kind of pitcher which is 4.
• 27:37
  ERA gives you innings, nice, solid, dependable guy, but you'd
• 27:41
  never feel great starting him in a post season game.
• 27:44
  Is that fair? Yeah, and I think the ERA was
• 27:47
  closer to five, right? Like 4.7 was the ERA last year.
• 27:50
  It's kind of he's like 4645 for his career.
• 27:53
  That's kind of around what he is.
• 27:54
  And so I agree with the sentiment he's going to be what
• 27:56
  he is, but that is going to maybe mean some of those games
• 28:00
  are going to be like 6 innings and six runs.
• 28:02
  Like he might get the innings you were looking for.
• 28:04
  But that's how the ERA balloons. But if that's the case, there
• 28:07
  should also be a hefty dose of 6 innings, two runs that are that
• 28:12
  are games you're going to feel good about and he can get a win
• 28:14
  in those games if the offense does its job.
• 28:16
  So like that's that's going to be one that's interesting.
• 28:19
  And then with other guys like Lance Lynn, I'm going to want to
• 28:22
  know like what's his velocity at?
• 28:24
  Because he throws only fastballs predominantly.
• 28:27
  And so if the velocity is solid, you're like, OK, you know, this
• 28:31
  can work. But if the velocity is 89 and
• 28:34
  and he's only throwing fastballs, you're like he's
• 28:36
  going to really have to mix his pitches well and hit his spots
• 28:38
  or they're going to be days where he sort of gets gets
• 28:41
  beaten up a little bit. So there is risk there.
• 28:43
  With this cardinal rotation, I don't think there's the
• 28:46
  perception of a ton of upside. And so I think that's why
• 28:49
  Cardinals fans are a little bit, you know, they're feeling a
• 28:52
  little bit iffy about things And I get that the way they've built
• 28:55
  this team. And and I think you're right, if
• 28:57
  they're all four, even if all four of them pitch 30 times in
• 29:00
  our 4.5 URA, I still think that can be enough because I I do
• 29:04
  have faith in the bullpen to be pretty good.
• 29:06
  But then you're going to have to say is this offense top ten, top
• 29:08
  eight or top five. Like it might have to be top
• 29:11
  five and with the health issues that could be a question as
• 29:14
  well. So there before we even get to
• 29:17
  game one, I do feel like they're teetering a little bit like
• 29:20
  today. How many wins would you predict?
• 29:22
  I think we've always been in that mid 80s kind of range, but
• 29:25
  have have the injuries and the way this has started taking you
• 29:28
  to a lower number or have the issues for the rest of the NL
• 29:32
  Central made you go. This is just going to end up
• 29:35
  with the Cardinals finding a way to get there.
• 29:37
  How do you lean on that, I guess?
• 29:39
  Well, and and we'll get the Devin Williams thing, because
• 29:41
  that wraps into what you said. I still am right around.
• 29:44
  I think Pakoda might have it right now with the 85.
• 29:47
  But again, to me, remember, like everything can change at the
• 29:51
  trade deadline. Everything can change.
• 29:53
  If you suck, you're going to suck more.
• 29:55
  If you're in it all of a sudden, that could be 90 if they add to
• 30:00
  me. I just have a real hard time
• 30:03
  with this Cardinals team because I think one of the one of the
• 30:07
  things is they're never bad. And they were bad last year and
• 30:10
  you wonder were they really that bad?
• 30:12
  I've said a million times, you never start Wayno in any of
• 30:15
  those games. They didn't care for the
• 30:16
  second-half basically after the trade deadline the last couple
• 30:21
  months. So I I still am probably 8485.
• 30:25
  I do think these injuries chip away a little bit here and
• 30:28
  there, but again, if they're in it at the deadline, they
• 30:31
  probably add a starter and they add a reliever and then 8889
• 30:34
  wins wouldn't surprise me. What I was going to say, though,
• 30:39
  is is you brought this up with the pitching staff and I think
• 30:42
  this is interesting and I think this could make Ollie Marmol's
• 30:45
  job a lot easier. I think last year was the
• 30:48
  perfect storm where the pitching sucked and so Ollie had to make
• 30:53
  all these tough decisions, especially early in the game,
• 30:57
  and we would critique them. But it's never a good decision.
• 31:00
  If you're oh, should I pull this guy in the fourth?
• 31:02
  Well, it's because the guy sucks.
• 31:04
  I also think Ollie maybe is a little too by the book for me.
• 31:08
  I think there could be a little more feel there and and this is
• 31:12
  him just learning to be a big league manager after a couple
• 31:14
  years. So you brought up that there's
• 31:17
  going to be some games where Gibson and probably Lynn, they
• 31:19
  go six, they allow five more. Hell, maybe in a bad game it's
• 31:24
  six, but maybe the game is 5, four at that .65, whatever it
• 31:28
  is. And I think it makes sense for
• 31:31
  Ollie to let those guys pitch their six.
• 31:34
  I think that takes a lot of tough decisions off Ollie's
• 31:37
  plate. Hopefully you're still in these
• 31:39
  games. If you're down a run and you let
• 31:41
  Lynn leave the game and it's 54 or 43, whatever it is, you still
• 31:46
  have a lot of time to to make it up.
• 31:48
  And I think that makes Ollie's decision making better if you
• 31:52
  allow these veteran pitchers to throw their six innings, even if
• 31:55
  their ER As are going to be 4.6. Yep.
• 31:58
  And they can they can yell at me if I'm speaking for them and I'm
• 32:01
  wrong about this. But I think that's exactly how
• 32:03
  they view it. Like that's precisely nail on
• 32:06
  the head exactly how they see it in last year and I can't
• 32:09
  remember even when I asked Ollie this question.
• 32:11
  I think it was somewhere in the offseason and it was to the and
• 32:14
  I and I forget specifically what his answer was, but I remember
• 32:17
  sort of the gist of it, which was like you had those sorts of
• 32:21
  decisions last year and you you did tend to pull guys early with
• 32:24
  with some level of frequency. Does part of that decision
• 32:29
  process have to do with knowing the pictures and and kind of
• 32:32
  believe in what you can get out of them and how does that
• 32:35
  compare to now you have these guys who were kind of trumpeting
• 32:38
  as their workhorses. They go 6-7 like that's what
• 32:41
  they're built to do. That's what they're expected to
• 32:44
  do. They know that and they they
• 32:45
  embrace that. And he basically was like, Yep,
• 32:47
  that's exactly it. Like, that's that's why you
• 32:50
  couldn't necessarily do it with last year's group, because look
• 32:53
  at last year's group. Look at the players he had on
• 32:55
  that rotation. Even guys like Jack Flaherty,
• 32:58
  who right now is looking great with Detroit and spring.
• 33:00
  But he wasn't that last year. He was talking about the art of
• 33:02
  pitching and throwing 91 like that.
• 33:05
  They didn't have the guys where you want a manager to let him
• 33:09
  go, right? And inevitably, on a Tuesday in
• 33:12
  June, there's going to be a guy who's going well and he throws 5
• 33:16
  and he's at 82 pitches, but his track records not great.
• 33:20
  And so when Ollie pulls him, because the third time through
• 33:23
  the orders coming up and he's got bad numbers analytically
• 33:26
  against that handedness of batters, and they're 123 of the
• 33:29
  opposing lineup and they make that move, fans go crazy because
• 33:33
  they they don't maybe have the bullpen covers to do it.
• 33:35
  He was damned if he did, damned if he didn't last year.
• 33:37
  That's kind of my view on it, because the bullpen wasn't quite
• 33:40
  good enough to cover for the starters that just weren't going
• 33:43
  very deep, and the starters weren't good enough to be
• 33:45
  trusted to go much deeper because they just weren't
• 33:48
  consistently getting the job done.
• 33:49
  So I completely agree that that's a big crux of what the
• 33:53
  Cardinals are hoping they're going to be allowed to do this
• 33:56
  year. But these pitchers have to do it
• 33:58
  like they They gave him 12,000,013 million bucks apiece
• 34:01
  to do it. Can Lynn and Gibson do that?
• 34:04
  Can they actually, in practice, make that happen and make that,
• 34:07
  make that easier on all the normal by pitching through some
• 34:11
  of the the issues that they might encounter early in games
• 34:13
  and getting you into the 7th inning despite having given up
• 34:16
  four or five runs? Like, that's going to be the
• 34:18
  test of whether this model that they've built for the 2024
• 34:21
  season actually works. Yeah, I know you and I have
• 34:24
  quasi debated this once before, but I do want to.
• 34:27
  Say. No, that in terms of what he
• 34:32
  gave the Cardinals. I know he sucked with the
• 34:34
  Orioles once he was traded, but to me, Jack Flaherty's numbers
• 34:39
  in production with the Cardinals weren't much different than what
• 34:42
  Kyle Gibson did. I understand that Flaherty was
• 34:45
  bad once he was traded, but like Flaherty, they kind of had the
• 34:51
  same numbers. I know Gibson had a great win
• 34:54
  loss record last year, but in terms of kind of what what you
• 34:58
  got, that's why I just, I always like to wonder like how much
• 35:01
  better did they get? If you are, you're essentially
• 35:04
  trading, I've said this 1000 times I'll go quick, but you're
• 35:08
  you're kind of replacing Monty with Sonny Gray, which I think
• 35:11
  is fair. You're kind of replacing Kyle
• 35:13
  Gibson. Excuse me?
• 35:15
  Jack Flirty with Kyle Gibson. And then Wayno was horrible.
• 35:17
  Let's, let's be honest, we all love Wayno, but he was horrible.
• 35:20
  And you're replacing him with Lance Lynn, who could be pretty
• 35:22
  good. So there's the big upgrade, in
• 35:25
  my opinion. Yeah, and I think that is, is
• 35:28
  accurate. And I've looked at this before,
• 35:30
  too, when it comes to Flaherty versus Kyle Gibson.
• 35:34
  Because, all right, the the, the thing with Flaherty was he had
• 35:38
  several games last year, and I'm trying to make sure which of
• 35:41
  them were with the Cardinals, because some of them were with
• 35:42
  the Orioles. But several games where he would
• 35:45
  not get you through five innings, like at least that it
• 35:48
  feels like at least a handful, maybe more with the Cardinals,
• 35:51
  where he was not, you know, he was getting shelled and he was
• 35:54
  also not able to get you deeper in the game.
• 35:57
  So I was like, well, I wonder how often Kyle Gibson had that.
• 35:59
  And you kind of go back and look and it's like, well, he had
• 36:03
  maybe a similar number, maybe not quite as many instances of
• 36:06
  that as Flaherty over the full season, but it's going to happen
• 36:10
  to him at times too. So that's where I think it is a
• 36:12
  little bit interesting that I don't know that you got a ton
• 36:15
  better. Ideally, Kyle Gibson goes out
• 36:16
  there and he's the best version of himself.
• 36:18
  He's had years where he's been much better than he was last
• 36:21
  year. But generally he's going to kind
• 36:22
  of hover around what he's always been.
• 36:25
  I think you're right, though, Lance Lynn replacing way.
• 36:27
  No, Lynn could be there too. I mean, we'll see what Michael
• 36:31
  has ends up doing. I just think there's more upside
• 36:33
  for Lynn if he's on to strike guys out, which is always going
• 36:35
  to make your life easier as a pitcher.
• 36:37
  And so he could end up being, yeah, a little bit better than
• 36:41
  Michael. It's like I'm thinking again
• 36:42
  about that playoff rotation. But there's the other side where
• 36:44
  if Lynn's velocity is not there and he's, you know, not able to
• 36:48
  to dot up his pitches and his spots the way he needs to, he
• 36:50
  could be your your five that you're going me.
• 36:53
  And this is kind of the guy that we we saw him be last year and
• 36:56
  we signed him anyway, Like very, very wide range of outcomes.
• 36:59
  I feel like for Lynn, and obviously for Matt's too,
• 37:01
  because we've seen various versions of him went healthy
• 37:04
  over the last couple of years. Yeah, and I don't want to
• 37:07
  belabor this point, but also with Flaherty, I do think there
• 37:10
  was the one outing, and I just found it here against the Angels
• 37:13
  where he gave him a 10 spot, he gave a 10 spot, two and a third.
• 37:17
  So also I think I'm I'm not saying I'm, I'm gonna do a Steve
• 37:20
  Spagnola. If you take away the 85 yard
• 37:23
  touchdown run, you can't take that out.
• 37:25
  But that particular outing absolutely destroyed his ERA.
• 37:28
  It's kind of like, remember the Randy Choate game years ago
• 37:30
  where, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, he threw.
• 37:32
  He threw one inning for every game.
• 37:34
  But then like one game Mike Matheny left him in and he gave
• 37:37
  up eight. And his ERA never recovered for
• 37:39
  the rest of his life. Yes, that.
• 37:41
  That is pretty much what happened.
• 37:43
  I'm right. When, when was that the the game
• 37:45
  against the Angels was in May. It was early.
• 37:48
  Yeah. Flaherty's ERA was like sub four
• 37:51
  before that game and he spent the rest of the year trying to
• 37:54
  get it back down, so I don't know what.
• 37:55
  Look at this. The number would have been.
• 37:57
  I'm sorry, I'm sorry to interrupt, but look, look at who
• 38:00
  wrote the article. That was you.
• 38:02
  Wait, my my ring light is. Oh yeah, Schaefer.
• 38:05
  OK, Brendan Schaefer. Oh, that is Brendan Schaefer.
• 38:09
  KMOV. I'll take your.
• 38:10
  Word for it. No.
• 38:11
  It says Cardinals suffer second consecutive sweep as angels
• 38:14
  bombard Flaherty for ten runs. That was by Brendan Schaefer on
• 38:18
  May 4th of 2023 at 3:59 PM Central Time, he posted.
• 38:23
  That article, that was a that was a tough one.
• 38:26
  That was a rough one. OK, so all right, let's move on
• 38:28
  from that. And Devin Williams, St.
• 38:31
  Louis area guy, Hazelwood. I've talked to him multiple
• 38:35
  times. Great dude.
• 38:36
  I remember doing a story on him when he was drafted at his
• 38:38
  workout facility. I think that was 2013.
• 38:40
  I talked to him a couple years ago when I was still in TV.
• 38:43
  Did a nice interview, cool guy. Bad news for him.
• 38:46
  Jeff Passan's tweet from what? Last night?
• 38:49
  So Devin Williams, two stress fractures in his back, expected
• 38:52
  to miss around three months. Sources tell ESPN Williams
• 38:55
  pitched through back soreness in September, but it returned
• 38:58
  earlier this spring. He'll rehab and should return by
• 39:00
  mid season. And again, it's just it sucks,
• 39:03
  'cause we like Devin Williams and you want to see.
• 39:05
  I mean, he's amazing. His change up is just absolutely
• 39:08
  sick. Yeah, so.
• 39:09
  But also, it's the Brewers. You just keep nicking away.
• 39:12
  Corbin Burns already traded. You have amazing closer, one of
• 39:15
  the best relievers in baseball with Devin Williams.
• 39:18
  I mean, are the Brewers going to be there now when they have
• 39:21
  another big time injury? The Central, It's kind of always
• 39:24
  there for the taking for the Cardinals.
• 39:26
  And it looks like, you know, Cardinals, Cubs.
• 39:27
  We'll see if the Reds make a step.
• 39:29
  But the Cardinals, I feel like, will at least just fall into
• 39:32
  second place, at least based on just the other team's rosters.
• 39:35
  Yeah, I mean, we kind of thought that last year though, too.
• 39:37
  But I I agree, like that should be the way that it shakes out.
• 39:40
  And I would have had, I don't know, Milwaukee's the toughest
• 39:42
  team to figure because I think mentally everybody's looking at
• 39:45
  the Corbin Burns trade and going, oh, oh, they're basically
• 39:48
  tanking. They're giving it up.
• 39:50
  I think that was more isolated to they didn't think they could
• 39:52
  sign Burns. They were right.
• 39:54
  He was pissed at him from the arbitration stuff and they
• 39:56
  probably want to pay him what he was going to cost anyway.
• 39:58
  So they made the trade, got what they could for him.
• 40:01
  But really the rest of their roster is someone intact.
• 40:03
  They've got Jackson Churio that they gave the the big contract
• 40:07
  to, that's he's never played a game, but he's going to his top
• 40:10
  prospect for them. They signed Reese Hoskins, which
• 40:12
  I think is an underrated AD at first base.
• 40:14
  So, like, I think they're going to be OK.
• 40:16
  I would have had them, you know, 81 to 82 wins, maybe with Devin
• 40:19
  Williams. So maybe they're like 79.
• 40:21
  I don't know. They've got, they really do a
• 40:24
  nice job, though, of producing random relievers that you didn't
• 40:26
  know were good until you look up and they've got, you know, 50
• 40:29
  strikeouts in 30 innings. You're like, who's this guy?
• 40:32
  So I I think they're going to still be like, in that soft
• 40:35
  cushy around 500. The Reds, as we've talked about,
• 40:38
  are to me very dependent on the young pitchers that are going to
• 40:41
  line their rotation, stepping up and and kind of taking that next
• 40:44
  step. I think the Reds are still going
• 40:46
  to be threatening and then the Cubs, you know they're going to
• 40:48
  be right in that range too. I think all four teams are
• 40:51
  really close and it's great that Pakoda says Cardinals are at
• 40:54
  84.6. Everybody else is between like
• 40:56
  787981. That's nice that that makes you
• 41:00
  feel good going into the season. But I really don't know that
• 41:03
  there is that level of separation until the Cardinals
• 41:05
  show it on the field. There's they did lose 90 some
• 41:07
  odd games last year, so they they got to figure that out.
• 41:11
  OK. So because you mentioned Corbin
• 41:14
  Burns, I want to make sure that that Burns looks like he did
• 41:19
  change to being a Scott Boris guy last last March.
• 41:25
  And so I had this conversation earlier today.
• 41:28
  I was on Hot Take Central of course, which you're also a part
• 41:30
  of 590 The Fan, 590 thefan.com. And we were kind of talking
• 41:34
  about the need for the Cardinals to to add that front end pitcher
• 41:40
  with Sonny Gray and how you how you get it.
• 41:43
  And we started the conversation with Dylan Cease because
• 41:45
  obviously Dylan Cease gets traded to the Padres.
• 41:49
  There was a lot of talk of the Cardinals potentially being
• 41:51
  interested in Dylan Cease. And my thought was, well, if you
• 41:54
  don't get a Dylan Cease or a Logan Gilbert, you know what's
• 41:59
  the market look like next year. And I thought it was actually
• 42:02
  worse than it is. There's more names than I
• 42:04
  thought but but look, Blake Snell.
• 42:08
  Jordan Montgomery. This was a pretty good class.
• 42:10
  Those guys are still available. Obviously.
• 42:12
  This was a pretty good class of of pitchers out there with with
• 42:15
  Yamamoto with Aaron Nola who didn't leave.
• 42:17
  But Shohei Otani, so next year. So, so Shane Bieber.
• 42:22
  I'm not giving him a big contract with what I've seen for
• 42:25
  him as he's aging strikeouts down velocity down.
• 42:28
  What not Corbin Burns strikes me as the guy who's going to get
• 42:31
  the absolute biggest amount of money.
• 42:32
  Boris guy. He's not, to me, a Cardinals
• 42:35
  match. Max Freed is the guy that kind
• 42:38
  of we always do. This feels like a Cardinal.
• 42:40
  Everybody else, how about, you know, Kyle Hendricks feels like
• 42:44
  a Cardinal. Then there's all the older guys
• 42:46
  with the opt outs and Max Scherzer's there.
• 42:50
  Doesn't it make sense? Doesn't it feel like Max
• 42:51
  Scherzer finally ends up with the Cardinals when he's, you
• 42:53
  know, 44 years old? Whatever it is, if he's healthy,
• 42:56
  he certainly might. He's out till mid season or
• 43:00
  whatever it is. But that's possible.
• 43:02
  Like I don't know if he's going to be wanting to still pitch.
• 43:05
  Depends on how this year goes probably for him, I could see
• 43:09
  it. Kyle Hendricks feels very
• 43:10
  Cardinals because he's 34, so that that goes right in line
• 43:13
  with what you're looking for. So Reed would be the one that's
• 43:17
  interesting and also like he's good and and not yes, so you
• 43:21
  could see a long good term deal. Right.
• 43:23
  That's the one. Like, I almost feel like it's
• 43:25
  funny you say Kyle Hendricks, but to me, Kyle Hendricks is
• 43:27
  going to replace either Lynn or Gibson.
• 43:30
  So if if they were to get Kyle Hendricks.
• 43:32
  This is to me, said state of affairs, but keep going.
• 43:34
  Oh, it is. But my my point was if the
• 43:38
  Cardinals, in my opinion, really want to win in the next 2-3
• 43:41
  years, whatever it is, and of course they want to win.
• 43:43
  But to be able to win, I think you got to match somebody with
• 43:46
  Sonny Gray. And I don't think there's any
• 43:48
  chance of Corbin Burns and you know, Garrett Cole has an opt
• 43:52
  out Verlander vesting option. You know, Walker Bueller, Ace
• 43:56
  like he's always hurt. Again, Max Freed is the one that
• 43:59
  jumps out, and I'm just throwing that out there.
• 44:01
  There's a bunch of names, but eventually the Cardinals need 2
• 44:05
  front end guys and it's really hard to get the other one.
• 44:09
  But Dylan Cease was moved, so we can't we can't say anymore.
• 44:12
  Oh, he wasn't traded. He was moved.
• 44:14
  And I saw what the top prospect was.
• 44:16
  It like #85. I know they gave up four guys,
• 44:19
  but. The headliner was Drew Thorpe.
• 44:22
  But what you have to realize is the Cardinals don't have a Drew
• 44:25
  Thorpe. You can't look at #85 and go
• 44:27
  well the Cardinals have somebody above #85 so they should have
• 44:30
  been able to do this deal. It's not at all how it works.
• 44:33
  They they wanted a guy with the skill set that Drew Thorpe has
• 44:37
  who's now I think it was in AA last year and and lightened it
• 44:40
  up 44 strikeouts in 30 innings with A14 ERA after getting the
• 44:44
  call up mid season from high A. If I'm looking at the right guy
• 44:49
  I think I'm looking at the right guy.
• 44:51
  What? About Tink.
• 44:53
  Well that's what I was going to say is like you might have a guy
• 44:56
  that you go well this guy's similar and and I believe Thorpe
• 45:01
  by the way the reason I was getting confused is because it
• 45:03
  was saying New York Yankees I think he went to San Diego in
• 45:06
  the Juan Soto deal and then now is is flipped around in this
• 45:11
  trade for Dylan sees. So like OK Tin Kents but how do
• 45:15
  the White Sox view Tin Kents We really don't know the answer to
• 45:17
  that If the Cardinals were really involved let's pretend
• 45:19
  they were and they were saying hey we really like Dylan sees we
• 45:22
  want to add it. I don't think that was the case
• 45:23
  but let's pretend and they they would say, hey we have this Tink
• 45:26
  hence to offer he's a really good pitcher that can headline
• 45:29
  the deal and the White Sox could look at him and go OK kind of a
• 45:32
  smaller build. We haven't really seen him build
• 45:34
  up and throw a lot of innings yet in the minors.
• 45:36
  What if maybe he's just kind of going to profile as a future
• 45:39
  reliever. We really need a guy that
• 45:41
  profiles as a future ace. I don't know that any of these
• 45:43
  conversations were were had but it's it's the only kind of
• 45:47
  insight that we can glean of we don't really know how certain
• 45:50
  teams view certain guys maybe the White Sox said look at the
• 45:54
  Cardinals man. If we're going to trade with the
• 45:55
  Cardinals we're getting one of those those stud hitters, we're
• 45:58
  getting Donovan or Gorman because that's what they have,
• 46:01
  right? And and if the Cardinals were in
• 46:02
  that conversation, they go, well, you're crazy you're not
• 46:04
  going to get a Donovan or Gorman level player from somebody else
• 46:08
  for this guy and the white section say OK fine, but that's
• 46:10
  who we want from you. Like, I don't know that these
• 46:13
  things happened, but I could see that's a little bit more of how
• 46:16
  it probably works. Then what's his ranking on the
• 46:19
  prospect rankings from MLB.com. Well, we got to you know it
• 46:23
  probably doesn't go that way. So that would be the little bit
• 46:26
  of a frustration there. But you're right.
• 46:28
  Like that's let's not just make excuses for the Cardinals.
• 46:31
  They they could have tried to get into the deal and sees you
• 46:34
  know the situation if they if they really wanted to.
• 46:37
  But it what would it have cost them.
• 46:39
  We can't just look at what it cost the Padres and say it would
• 46:41
  have been I identical to what the Cardinals have in their
• 46:44
  system. That's number one.
• 46:45
  Number two, how do you get the guy that paired with Sonny Gray?
• 46:49
  Well, I'll say it. I'll ask the same question you
• 46:51
  asked. Well, what about Tink?
• 46:53
  You got to develop somebody at some point you winning recipe to
• 46:57
  having multiple frontline aces is not paying all of them.
• 47:01
  And right now the Cardinals don't have multiple frontline
• 47:03
  aces and yet you look in their rotation, they're paying all of
• 47:07
  them. All five of them are guys that
• 47:09
  have free agent contracts or extension.
• 47:11
  In the case of Miles Michaelis, they're paying the whole group.
• 47:14
  So this narrative of like, Cardinals don't want to pay any.
• 47:17
  It's all they're doing is paying starting pitching because they
• 47:19
  haven't been able to develop any.
• 47:21
  This has to be a summer where that changes, where we see one
• 47:24
  of these guys latch on and know that going into next year he can
• 47:27
  be not just. Well, maybe that's your #5 if
• 47:30
  there's an injury, like no, somebody.
• 47:32
  I don't know if it's Gracefo, if it's Thompson, if it's Libby, if
• 47:35
  it's Drew, ROM if it's Tink. Hence if it's Cooper jerky, like
• 47:40
  I don't care who it is. They got to start having some of
• 47:43
  these guys. They drafted all all these guys.
• 47:46
  Can they advance? Michael Mcgreevey?
• 47:47
  Like can some of these guys advance to be worth anything to
• 47:50
  be able to plug into a rotation and compete and be a number two
• 47:54
  or at least a #3 in a rotation or the Cardinals every year
• 47:57
  going to have to go out. I mean we like Randy Flores but
• 48:00
  eventually some of these pitchers have got a hit.
• 48:02
  This is just, it's it's been kind of a while and that is
• 48:06
  what's holding the Cardinals back.
• 48:07
  Not their, you know, their inability or their unwillingness
• 48:10
  to spend their spending, but they're they're having to kind
• 48:13
  of toe that line. Because if you throw out
• 48:15
  multiple 5-6 year deals to starting pitchers in, one or
• 48:18
  both of them get hurt. You are the Phillies of 2011
• 48:22
  when Ryan Howard tears the Achilles and then like, oh, that
• 48:26
  was the last moment that they were relevant and it was all
• 48:29
  downhill from there. And then it's a, you know, 5-6
• 48:31
  year rebuild like the Cardinals are trying to avoid putting
• 48:34
  themselves in that spot. So is there spending kind of
• 48:36
  savvy and penny pinchy and annoying?
• 48:38
  Absolutely. But you could be more effective
• 48:41
  with the way you spend if you didn't have to fill 5 spots
• 48:44
  every time, Like they got to have somebody developed that can
• 48:46
  get in that rotation and pitch on the minimum for a couple
• 48:49
  years. So then you can allocate your
• 48:51
  resources effectively around that.
• 48:54
  Yeah, I agree with you 1000%. I've said the same thing a
• 48:58
  million times, but you know, Tink, Tink is not close.
• 49:03
  If he's the guy, you know, maybe maybe next year, but from an
• 49:08
  inning standpoint, maybe really a workhorse in 2026.
• 49:12
  And so my point is, I agree with you 1000%.
• 49:15
  That's the teams that were great for the Cardinals from 11 to 15
• 49:19
  had all those pitchers, not just starters, but relievers.
• 49:22
  The Rosenthals, the Wakas. The Carlos Martinez's Lance
• 49:25
  Lynn. Shelby Miller for a while Kevin
• 49:28
  Segrist The list goes a I think I said Trevor Rosenthal the list
• 49:31
  goes on and on and on. The reason I brought up a cease
• 49:34
  like player is the Cardinals need to fix that.
• 49:38
  But if we don't think that guy is here for a couple years they
• 49:41
  they still need a guy for the next couple years and that's why
• 49:44
  I think a cease like pitcher could be that guy.
• 49:48
  But also you know we had this conversation either you and I
• 49:51
  are on the radio. You know Dylan Cease great
• 49:53
  strikeout guy, career fit, 3.86 career ERA, 3.83 one amazing
• 50:00
  year in 2022 with a 2.2 ERA. But also that that 3.8 pitcher,
• 50:08
  you know that's that's a Jordan Montgomery type pitcher.
• 50:11
  So I'm not some guys are just aces like boom that dude's ERA
• 50:16
  is going to be in the twos or 2.8 Dylan sees had one really
• 50:21
  great year. And don't get me wrong, he would
• 50:23
  be the the ace or the number 2 on the Cardinals, 1000%.
• 50:28
  But you could also say maybe the Cardinals don't think he's as
• 50:30
  good as as other teams think he is.
• 50:33
  I don't know. He's pretty damn good.
• 50:34
  Strikes out a lot of guys. I don't know.
• 50:37
  Yeah, And was pitching on that same White Sox team last year
• 50:39
  where we say, well, Lance Lynn was kind of going through it
• 50:41
  last year. That team sucked.
• 50:43
  It was a terrible clubhouse environment, etcetera, Which
• 50:45
  then I I don't even know why, I didn't realize this until a
• 50:48
  couple of days ago. But they didn't fire that guy.
• 50:50
  They didn't fire the manager that everybody is saying this
• 50:53
  was the worst clubhouse in the history of the universe.
• 50:55
  Pedro Grifal or whatever his name is.
• 50:57
  I just saw like a quote about him talking about some like wait
• 51:00
  a minute, he's still there. They had literally everybody
• 51:04
  come out and say, Yep, I've never seen a clubhouse this bad.
• 51:06
  We all did whatever we wanted and they didn't fire him.
• 51:09
  I just, I don't know why. I just assumed.
• 51:11
  I guess I assumed and missed that nugget that he was still
• 51:14
  there. But my point being the 4.5 Adra
• 51:17
  for Cease last year was maybe in a in a A-Team environment that
• 51:20
  wasn't so good. He was still striking out a
• 51:22
  bunch of dudes, kind of like what Lance Lynn did for them.
• 51:25
  And maybe Dylan sees goes to a better team and kind of reverts
• 51:28
  back to maybe not the 2.2 version of himself but like a
• 51:32
  little bit closer to his career norms and and the fact that the
• 51:35
  strikeouts never went away is encouraging.
• 51:37
  So I do think Dylan sees is really good, but I I wouldn't
• 51:40
  have given up Brendan Donovan for him like Ting Kent.
• 51:44
  I would have yeah. But I don't know if the White
• 51:46
  Sox are are interested in that. They might have more faith in
• 51:49
  Drew Thorpe. Right.
• 51:50
  So that's where it gets a little bit tricky.
• 51:51
  But you're right, they need a guy.
• 51:53
  And I don't know the answer to getting one if it's not paying
• 51:56
  somebody. If we go through 2024 and none
• 51:58
  of these guys who you got like 8 to 10 names, you could point to
• 52:02
  the guys they traded for at the deadline to KOA Roby.
• 52:04
  Like you've got a bunch of names.
• 52:06
  Can somebody emerge? Other teams haven't happened all
• 52:08
  the time. Other teams have.
• 52:09
  Who's this? Where'd he come from?
• 52:10
  Oh, now he's an ace. Like, Cardinals need one of
• 52:13
  those. It's time.
• 52:14
  It's time for one of those to fall into their lap.
• 52:16
  But that doesn't happen by magic.
• 52:18
  Like they have to develop them. The players got to have the
• 52:20
  drive. He's got to have the
• 52:21
  determination and he's got to go out and do it and have the right
• 52:24
  coaching and leadership, etcetera.
• 52:26
  So like, it's not going to fall out of the sky for them but me,
• 52:29
  and it would be nice if it could.
• 52:31
  Well said, you said it's time and I think it might be time to
• 52:35
  end the show. Is that OK?
• 52:36
  We're we're, I think that we're over we're over 50 minutes.
• 52:40
  You know, I I did make some notes on the back of a piece of
• 52:42
  paper and I think I think I hit on all of them there.
• 52:46
  Look. At that so.
• 52:47
  What did I miss? Is there anything else we always
• 52:49
  like to say? Brendan.
• 52:51
  Empty or. Notebook.
• 52:52
  I'm not at spring anymore. I have no notebook.
• 52:54
  There's nothing to empty. I barely can watch the games
• 52:56
  when they, you know, sometimes they're not even on.
• 52:58
  It's going to be a lot better When we get to the season.
• 53:01
  The notebook will be a little more, a little more full.
• 53:04
  But for right now, no, we're watching Victor Scott.
• 53:06
  I keep talking about that being the thing because I think the
• 53:09
  Cardinals should put him on the like, you think they should put
• 53:11
  him on the roster. Where are you at?
• 53:13
  Like, opinion? Not like, give me the wishy
• 53:15
  washy, but what? What do you think they should
• 53:16
  do? Well, at this point, yes,
• 53:19
  because because of the injury issues and that that means he
• 53:23
  might only be up for a week or two.
• 53:24
  But do you worry about that tanking his development?
• 53:27
  You know, if he comes up and goes back down.
• 53:29
  No. So I actually, we discussed this
• 53:32
  on Hot Take Central this morning and I said this and I understand
• 53:36
  that narrative and I do agree with the development of position
• 53:40
  players, which is why in the past, going back to the Dave
• 53:43
  Duncan era, if you had a guy that you thought was going to be
• 53:46
  a future big league starter, they did this with so many
• 53:48
  people wayno, that first year use them out of the pen, you
• 53:53
  know, you can kind of manage his innings.
• 53:55
  He gets a taste of the big leagues, boom, he's a starter
• 53:57
  next year. I totally understand that if
• 53:59
  you're a position player and you're a prospect and a a future
• 54:03
  starter, a a future position player starter, you don't want
• 54:07
  that guy playing twice a week with a pinch hit here or there.
• 54:10
  So if there weren't injuries, I would say Victor Scott stay in
• 54:15
  the minors and and my point was this.
• 54:18
  Now if Victor Scott stayed up in the big leagues all season and
• 54:20
  played twice a week, I think that would be horrible.
• 54:23
  If he gets a cup of coffee for a week or two, if he's good, he's
• 54:26
  bad, he's in between. If he can't deal with the
• 54:29
  failure of a couple weeks in the big leagues then I don't think
• 54:32
  he's going to be a good player anyway, so if that.
• 54:34
  Agree if I don't like you. Yeah, and by the way, that is
• 54:38
  not specific to Victor Scott. I don't know the dude.
• 54:41
  I'm saying in general, if two weeks of failure in the big
• 54:44
  leagues breaks a player, that player probably is not mentally
• 54:48
  strong enough to be a really good big league player.
• 54:50
  And I have no doubt that Victor Scott is the opposite of that.
• 54:55
  Like the way that that that you talk about him getting to hear
• 54:57
  him speak at winter warm up too was kind of like the first
• 54:59
  integration where everybody gets a chance to see what he's about.
• 55:02
  And just the way he answers questions and you can tell he
• 55:04
  thinks through things and talked about his upbringing in the way
• 55:07
  that he was kind of raised to to to kind of be analytical.
• 55:11
  And I think kinesiology even said was like his his field of
• 55:14
  study in college. So like this is a guy who is
• 55:17
  smart and and again smart guys have been, you know, chewed up
• 55:21
  and spit out by MLB before I get it.
• 55:24
  But I look at Victor Scott and I'm like, I don't know, I don't
• 55:26
  it's just call it a gut feeling, whatever you want to call it.
• 55:29
  We all are going to have our various opinions on whether or
• 55:32
  not that's something that could be damaging to a guy.
• 55:34
  My opinions is that it won't be with this player and I'm
• 55:37
  perfectly comfortable with him coming up, even if it's for
• 55:39
  three weeks and if it's for three weeks and he's good, he's
• 55:41
  not ever going back. So that's that's the other side
• 55:44
  of that. If it's three weeks and he has a
• 55:46
  Mason win like OPS that he had in September of last year, they
• 55:50
  can send him down and then he can learn from that.
• 55:52
  But nobody's looking at Mason Wynn right now.
• 55:53
  Going Cardinals ruined him by bringing him up.
• 55:55
  He wasn't ready. Nobody's saying that because
• 55:57
  it's not true. I I mean, 10 years we could go,
• 56:00
  Well, Mason Wynn never panned out and maybe it will have been,
• 56:02
  but like, I I just don't. I'm agreeing with you.
• 56:05
  I don't personally subscribe to that narrative.
• 56:08
  So we get to end the show on an agreeing tone.
• 56:10
  That's good. But one more thing.
• 56:12
  I'm going to make one more football analogy, because here's
• 56:16
  where. What's the old football analogy?
• 56:18
  On the road in the playoffs? Defense travels.
• 56:22
  Run, game travels, whatever you want to say, tough weather.
• 56:25
  I'm making a football analogy. I like it.
• 56:27
  Victor Scott. Speed is always there.
• 56:31
  Speed kills. If you're not having a fantastic
• 56:34
  week bat to ball, you can slap a ball around, get an infield hit.
• 56:38
  You can bun a ball here, get an infield hit.
• 56:41
  Defense. Your speed in the outfield, that
• 56:45
  usually doesn't slump. So again, I don't know if he's
• 56:48
  going to consistently hit at the big league level, but when
• 56:51
  you're super, super fast, there's a lot you bring to the
• 56:55
  table all the time. I mean, even pinch running
• 56:58
  again, slapping the ball around, playing defense, that's
• 57:01
  something you can't teach and it's always there.
• 57:03
  I want to see a day this week where he goes over three and
• 57:06
  strikes out a couple times and has to go in the field and like
• 57:09
  the Cardinals will get a good glimpse at.
• 57:11
  How does he handle that? You say you know defense doesn't
• 57:14
  slump. It shouldn't.
• 57:15
  So, like how does a young player handle a little bit of failure
• 57:17
  at the plate? Does he go out and and low fit
• 57:19
  the field or does he make a diving catch?
• 57:20
  Does he does he help out his pitching staff?
• 57:23
  Let's ask the Cardinals rotation.
• 57:24
  You're worried about the Cardinal rotation maybe not
• 57:26
  being up to snuff. Let Victor Scott go out there
• 57:28
  and be in center field. He's going to save him runs.
• 57:30
  He's going to save them potentially games with what he
• 57:34
  can bring to the table in center field, getting the balls in the
• 57:36
  gaps, making plays. He would be my day one center
• 57:39
  fielder, unless Dylan Carlson goes on a tear and I'm, I like
• 57:42
  Dylan Carlson, man. I want him to have that
• 57:44
  confidence to play with it. I might like him more than you
• 57:46
  do. I don't know you're laughing,
• 57:47
  but I that would be the one thing where I say, look if Dylan
• 57:50
  Carlson has a 620 OPS today and he ends spring with a 920 OPS,
• 57:54
  it's because he started to really lock it in.
• 57:56
  And at that point, I'm back to saying, look, you don't actually
• 57:59
  have the playing time necessarily to offer Victor
• 58:02
  Scott every day unless you're benching Burleson, which they're
• 58:04
  probably not going to do against right-handed pitching.
• 58:06
  So that would be the one instance where I would go, maybe
• 58:09
  not, but if Victor Scott continues to look like this and
• 58:11
  Carlson doesn't like just stake a claim, Carlson's going to play
• 58:14
  plenty. There's going to be lots of
• 58:15
  opportunities to go around. But if there's enough for Victor
• 58:18
  Scott to kind of be your mainstay in Center for that
• 58:21
  first month or so, whatever it is that Tommy's out, get some
• 58:24
  run, I'm all for it. Because I think too, it can help
• 58:26
  the vibe of the team. The team knows when there's a
• 58:28
  guy out there making place in center and and and doing things
• 58:32
  on the bases that can get everybody kind of integrated and
• 58:34
  pumped up. So I'm all for it.
• 58:36
  I think you should be their day one center fielder.
• 58:39
  And we will end. But I have to say my favorite
• 58:42
  saying, to be fair or to be clear, I have nothing against
• 58:45
  Dylan Carlson. I just until he proves it to me,
• 58:49
  I no longer view him as a Major League starting player.
• 58:53
  Now whether he's a fourth outfielder, he could be good.
• 58:56
  I'm just saying. I no longer have those
• 58:58
  expectations for him until he proves it.
• 59:01
  Is that fair? Yeah, I mean it's just the
• 59:03
  consistency against right-handed pitching.
• 59:04
  But he had a 780 OPS in 2021 like that.
• 59:07
  I know that we're talking about three years ago at this point,
• 59:09
  but like that's really good and I think he's a good athletic
• 59:12
  defender too. So I think he's certainly can be
• 59:15
  an everyday but like figure out against right-handed pitching.
• 59:18
  He's been a switch hitter his whole life.
• 59:19
  A lot of Cardinals fans would say stop switch hitting.
• 59:22
  It's like that's what he's always done as the Cardinals.
• 59:24
  Do you feel that way internally? And how do you relate that to a
• 59:28
  player that may already kind of feel like he's on the outs
• 59:30
  because they're not giving him playing time like it's a it's a
• 59:32
  delicate balance, but at the end of the day, you're right, he
• 59:35
  just has to go out and do it and that that'll clear everything
• 59:38
  up. Look at that.
• 59:39
  We snuck over an hour, even though, you know, I pressed
• 59:42
  record. I don't remember when we
• 59:43
  started, so whenever I shut up it might be exactly an hour, but
• 59:47
  great show. Brendan Low, Hanging fruit,
• 59:50
  whatever the hell episode this was.
• 59:51
  One of these days we are going to make it up and do two in a
• 59:54
  week. And again, when the season
• 59:55
  starts, we. Can do more.
• 59:57
  We'll do a bunch if if people are liking it.
• 59:58
  So Brendan, thank you B Shave Daily.
• 1:00:01
  Follow him. Subscribe.
• 1:00:03
  That's right on on youtube.com. Slash at B Shaffer 12.
• 1:00:07
  Subscribe. There you go.
• 1:00:09
  Harley steals all the videos. I need some love.
• 1:00:12
  Charlie's been doing all NASCAR. Charlie's a Charlie's allowing
• 1:00:15
  an opening for yourself and Jim Hayes and all these new
• 1:00:17
  Cardinals creators because Charlie's balls in the wall.
• 1:00:20
  NASCAR It's been a year almost that I've been doing.
• 1:00:23
  It OK, but newish. I didn't.
• 1:00:24
  I didn't say that as a pejorative.
• 1:00:26
  OK, I think it was a little bit of a pejorative.
• 1:00:28
  No, we're all hey, look. I was talking.
• 1:00:29
  It's like saying the Democrats, right?
• 1:00:31
  Oh, now we've gone political. Uh oh.
• 1:00:33
  No, just real quick. I I tweeted that wrong.
• 1:00:39
  You did. I don't agree with this.
• 1:00:40
  Somebody was saying that, saying the Democrat Party instead of
• 1:00:45
  the Democratic Party. Was a pejorative.
• 1:00:47
  And I said, even if that's the case, I don't think most people
• 1:00:51
  at all view it as that. Right.
• 1:00:54
  OK, 'cause that's you tweeted, like if you call someone the
• 1:00:57
  Democrats, then that would be the pejorative.
• 1:01:00
  But it was the party name. OK, well, we talked about that
• 1:01:04
  all last Friday too on the. I put that in there and I was
• 1:01:08
  wrong about it. What on on the radio you did?
• 1:01:10
  Yeah. On High Tech Central, yeah, that
• 1:01:12
  was about you all the time. I hear you like that.
• 1:01:13
  You like that when we talk about you when you're not there.
• 1:01:16
  Well, you guys talk about me. Yeah, I feel like, should I?
• 1:01:18
  Should I still get paid when I'm not there If I'm always?
• 1:01:20
  Definitely not. You could just listen, though,
• 1:01:22
  and then you would know what's going on.
• 1:01:24
  But I'm. Busy.
• 1:01:25
  All right. On that note now we're
• 1:01:27
  definitely over an hour. Brandon.
• 1:01:28
  Thank you. Comment, like, subscribe, share
• 1:01:30
  the channel, share the videos, share the show, put in your
• 1:01:32
  group text, post it on social media.
• 1:01:34
  Let's grow this bad boy, Brandon.
• 1:01:37
  See you, buddy. Peace out.
• 1:01:38
  Bye.