Latest / The Myth of Education Podcast / Ep. 23 | Reviving Young Minds w/Matt Beienburg

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Ep. 23 | Reviving Young Minds w/Matt Beienburg · The Myth of Education Podcast

• 0:00
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• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: I have with me today on the Myth of Education Podcast, Matt Beinberg.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: Matt is the Director of Education Policy at Goldwater Institute.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: He also serves as the Director of the Institute's Van Sittert Constitutional Advocacy Center.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_01: Matt is published in local and national outlets.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: His work focuses on promoting educational freedom,
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  SPEAKER_01: parental rights,
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  SPEAKER_01: and then of course, a greater civic appreciation of America's founding principles.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome Matt to the Myth of Education Podcast.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks very much for having me on.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: As we approach the 250th birthday of America, I've noticed that patriotism is steady declining.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_01: According to a 2025 Pew Research poll,
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  SPEAKER_01: a record low of 58 adults say they're extremely or very proud to be an American
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  SPEAKER_01: and only
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  SPEAKER_01: 41% of Gen Z say that they're proud to be an American.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: And although there may be many shifts in reasons why the attitudes are changing
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  SPEAKER_01: towards America,
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  SPEAKER_01: I think a large part of it is due to secular humanist
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  SPEAKER_01: and revisionist history that's being taught in our schools and colleges.
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  SPEAKER_01: But what do you believe is the cause of decline of patriotism?
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  SPEAKER_01: And would you say that those stats are accurate?
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, those stats certainly,
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  SPEAKER_00: they line up with what we've seen from a number of different measures.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I think there's a lot of contributing factors to it,
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  SPEAKER_00: but I think you hit the nail on the head,
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  SPEAKER_00: which is that there really has been an abandonment of these underlying principles
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  SPEAKER_00: that, you know, the idea of
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  SPEAKER_00: American exceptionalism,
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  SPEAKER_00: the idea that this is a nation that has aspired to the ideals of the Declaration
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  SPEAKER_00: of Independence,
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  SPEAKER_00: that for our history of being able to look back and proudly say,
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: yeah, this is our heritage and we want to defend that and promote this.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: And now we have seen really a decline in that and
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I think,
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  SPEAKER_00: you know,
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  SPEAKER_00: there was polling that came out just recently that showed,
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  SPEAKER_00: you know,
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  SPEAKER_00: they look it up by political affiliation and you ask folks,
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  SPEAKER_00: hey, are you proud to be an American?
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: And you've seen folks more on the right that that's typically a steady indicator.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_00: It might drop a little bit depending on if it's an administration that they support or don't
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  SPEAKER_00: support,
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  SPEAKER_00: but folks on the left that it has really in a sense cratered,
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  SPEAKER_00: particularly any time that there's an administration that isn't one that they view
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  SPEAKER_00: as kind of aligned with them.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so you've seen this really,
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: I would say, a concerted effort from a lot of people on the left, tired
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  SPEAKER_00: you know people like Howard Zinn who really have for years fomented and laid
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: the groundwork for a perspective that the United States is not a force for good
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_00: that it is something that is born in evil I mean the New York Times 1619 project
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  SPEAKER_00: from a few years ago I think is the perfect encapsulation
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  SPEAKER_00: We can talk about that some more,
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  SPEAKER_00: but that literally is to go back and say, no,
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  SPEAKER_00: the origin of the United States is slavery,
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  SPEAKER_00: is oppression,
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  SPEAKER_00: that this is a fundamentally corrupt system and framework,
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  SPEAKER_00: and so it's not works or improve, you throw it out.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I think that really underlies
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  SPEAKER_00: A lot of what we're seeing when you have kids growing up and
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  SPEAKER_00: the narrative they're told is it's not an imperfect but exceptional nation,
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  SPEAKER_00: but it's a deeply oppressive and backwards society.
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  SPEAKER_00: It's no shock that then you're going to see kids growing up without that allegiance
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  SPEAKER_00: to the principles and appreciation for the nation.
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  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so I'm taking notes and I wrote down the 1619 Project.
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  SPEAKER_01: I actually listened to this, the podcast, I want to say about three or four years ago.
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  SPEAKER_01: I sat at my kitchen table and I binged it.
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  SPEAKER_01: And by the time it was over, it was said and done.
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  SPEAKER_01: There was a little nostalgia with the music and things like that,
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  SPEAKER_01: and it pulls heartstrings if you're from that community.
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  SPEAKER_01: But by the time that I was done listening to the 1619 Project,
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  SPEAKER_01: I just kind of stopped for a moment,
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  SPEAKER_01: looked around, and I said, I still don't feel this desire to go burn down a Walmart.
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  SPEAKER_01: This was when I was very new to identity politics.
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  SPEAKER_01: I wouldn't have known that.
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  SPEAKER_01: I was just educating myself.
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  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, this does not lead to me wanting to go destroy anything.
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  SPEAKER_01: There must be something else at work.
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  SPEAKER_01: And that's when I started to learn about the ideology behind it.
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  SPEAKER_01: And then the communist mindset of just kind of that tear it all down mentality.
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  SPEAKER_01: And I just couldn't believe it that this now has seeped into K through 12.
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  SPEAKER_01: I understood that you had the critical theory and things like that on the collegiate level.
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  SPEAKER_01: But now we've got these things being taught to children even as young
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  SPEAKER_01: as kindergarten and I just find it to be outrageous.
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  SPEAKER_01: It should be something that's sending an alarm bell through all parts of society.
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  SPEAKER_00: It should be and instead it's celebrated and promoted by some of the largest,
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  SPEAKER_00: the New York Times is not a small fringe organization,
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  SPEAKER_00: this is a storied institution that should serve as a pillar of public discussion
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  SPEAKER_00: and information and instead it's organizations like that
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  SPEAKER_00: that are actively promoting,
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  SPEAKER_00: as you said,
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  SPEAKER_00: there's sort of the underlying ideologies here but you're absolutely right.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't think it should be so easy to tear down someone's identity.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so I guess it's not that easy, actually.
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  SPEAKER_01: This is the next point that I wanted to get to,
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  SPEAKER_01: is that I think the left have been working on this for a while.
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  SPEAKER_01: So in the 1940s, there was this case.
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  SPEAKER_01: and I know you know it, West Virginia Board of Ed versus Barnett.
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  SPEAKER_01: And this was a landmark Supreme Court decision that held no students could be forced
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  SPEAKER_01: to salute the American flag or say the Pledge of Allegiance.
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  SPEAKER_01: And this was interpreted as a First Amendment protection for students
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  SPEAKER_01: As a result,
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  SPEAKER_01: we now have no states basically require it or can compel students to say the pledge,
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  SPEAKER_01: although 46 states do require some time to be set aside for those who choose
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  SPEAKER_01: to participate.
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  SPEAKER_01: And then of course, our home state, Arizona,
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  SPEAKER_01: is one of four that has like no statewide requirements.
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  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't really address reciting the pledge at all.
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  SPEAKER_01: So I have a three-part question for you with this one.
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  SPEAKER_01: How important is it for students to recite the pledge daily?
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  SPEAKER_01: What are the positive or negative trends that we've seen in society since
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  SPEAKER_01: that SCOTUS ruling in 1943?
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  SPEAKER_01: And then what are your thoughts on Arizona legislatures for generations not addressing it?
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  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
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  SPEAKER_00: And it's a great series of questions.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I'll actually
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to try to broaden it a little bit
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  SPEAKER_00: because Arizona state law actually does have some provisions and we can kind of dive
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  SPEAKER_00: into this in terms of what is required and there are requirements
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  SPEAKER_00: that are not followed.
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  SPEAKER_00: The kids are supposed to be reciting actually the kind of famous words from
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  SPEAKER_00: the Declaration of Independence in grade school and oftentimes you don't see that
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  SPEAKER_00: I think at the end of the day,
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  SPEAKER_00: you know,
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  SPEAKER_00: what's really critical in this is we hear people say, oh,
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  SPEAKER_00: why are you doing the pledge or why are you supposed to be buying
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  SPEAKER_00: into this patriotism?
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  SPEAKER_00: This is just, you know, all the kind of statements that are said.
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  SPEAKER_00: At the end of the day, what I would say matters the most is inculcating and appreciating
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  SPEAKER_00: for the Constitution and for those founding principles.
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  SPEAKER_00: Even setting aside the pledge,
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  SPEAKER_00: the fundamental issue here is,
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  SPEAKER_00: even in the pledge, to the Republic for which it stands.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so this is an issue that our kids who are not taught why,
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  SPEAKER_00: What is it that you're actually supposed to be appreciative about this nation?
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  SPEAKER_00: What's the purpose of that?
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  SPEAKER_00: When we have seen,
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  SPEAKER_00: and again,
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  SPEAKER_00: we can kind of dive into this,
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  SPEAKER_00: the education that kids get about the Constitution,
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  SPEAKER_00: about these ideas of free speech,
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  SPEAKER_00: why is it that you have the right to say, I don't, you know,
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to say something critical about the administration I'm going
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  SPEAKER_00: to say something critical about a policy that these students don't have
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  SPEAKER_00: that really built into them more so even than the pledge itself I think is this idea
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  SPEAKER_00: that if our kids are not taught why you should be grateful why you are so
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  SPEAKER_00: The idea that someone has the right to badmouth the country or the flag or whatever it's like.
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  SPEAKER_00: You can't go do this in some totalitarian communist state that you're going to talk
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  SPEAKER_00: about how great those policies are.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: Go try that in those countries and see how that works out
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  SPEAKER_00: And so I think again I would sort of broaden it as opposed to just to focus on
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  SPEAKER_00: the pledge itself to say why is it that we are failing to educate our kids
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  SPEAKER_00: on these core principles that they don't it is a failure of our system
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  SPEAKER_00: if they graduate high school and do not have a deep appreciation of the freedom
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  SPEAKER_00: of speech religion assembly like all these things should be inculcated in them in
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  SPEAKER_00: a way that doesn't mean you have to have a particular policy you know right or left
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  SPEAKER_00: but it should not be something that we view as just we're neutral on the concept of
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  SPEAKER_00: You know, all men are created equal and we have free speech.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like these are things that are inherently, we believe they are a good thing.
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  SPEAKER_00: We should be unabashed and unashamed in pronouncing that.
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  SPEAKER_00: I do think you've seen to your follow-up question there about the trends.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's been a one-way slide.
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  SPEAKER_00: I think we have seen, you know,
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  SPEAKER_00: and disrespect to outright animosity.
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  SPEAKER_00: I think that the fact that we celebrate,
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: we saw during the BLM movement,
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  SPEAKER_00: whether it's people who really you have,
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: and kind of the DEI movement more recently, you have seen alternate flags,
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_01: It kind of brings to mind this thought of that is what it looks like
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  SPEAKER_01: when freedom doesn't have sort of the accountability and responsibility that comes
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  SPEAKER_01: with it.
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  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of toxic.
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  SPEAKER_01: And this is my opinion that when you're free,
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_01: but you're kind of you're divorcing morals from it.
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  SPEAKER_01: That's where those alternate flags and those alternate ideas will come in.
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  SPEAKER_01: It's sort of a rebellion against tradition.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_01: It's a rebellion against what's good and what's right because you,
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_01: I guess you kind of want to have your own way.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: And unfortunately, that as I feel like is what a lot of students are being taught.
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  SPEAKER_01: And it's very important.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_01: I'm glad you brought up the flags.
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  SPEAKER_01: I've noticed over the last several years that there are a lot of school districts
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  SPEAKER_01: who are coming out with policies now that are saying we can only wave
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: the American flag and no other flags.
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  SPEAKER_01: I don't even know if people understand like the magnitude behind what waving a flag means.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if I do.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: I know I love the American flag.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: But I wanted to kind of follow up before we move on with what are some of
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: the provisions that the state of Arizona does provide and maybe some other states
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_01: that you have looked into when it comes to having the students say the pledge.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: So again,
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: there's several provisions where like,
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: as you point out, there's time provided there to do these things.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: But they're very clear that if a student does not want to,
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: that they can essentially sort of sit quietly.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: And so a student can't start disrupting other kids having the ability to do it.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: But they are not, as you point out, given the Supreme Court
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  SPEAKER_00: and the statute that they are not compelled to themselves do that if they
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_00: or their parents are going to say, hey, we would prefer not to do that.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: So in most of these cases, you do have that.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: Again, you're trying to say, hey, look,
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: we as an institution, we are supportive of trying to instill this idea of patriarchy
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  SPEAKER_00: patriotism and appreciation for it,
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: but also in deference to the idea of not pushing compelled speech or otherwise,
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: that those are there.
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  SPEAKER_00: Arizona does have other statutes.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: There's supposed to be a flag in the classroom.
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  SPEAKER_00: Again, there's time, sort of quiet time for whether that be prayer or meditation,
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_00: for students.
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  SPEAKER_00: So there are provisions there.
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  SPEAKER_00: There are also a lot of provisions that are not being followed.
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  SPEAKER_00: I mentioned there's a state law that was actually passed back in 2022 that required
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  SPEAKER_00: the State Board of Education to put into the state standards for civics
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  SPEAKER_00: instruction on essentially the clash between ideologies of freedom and ideologies
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  SPEAKER_00: of totalitarianism and communism.
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  SPEAKER_00: And that's been sitting there for four years.
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  SPEAKER_00: And unless or until the State Board of Education actually refreshes
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_00: the state standards,
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  SPEAKER_00: even though the legislature signed by the governor said,
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: we want this put into the state standards,
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: it's just been sitting there because they haven't gone through that process.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so there are a lot of examples, again, where,
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_00: and we can dive into this,
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  SPEAKER_00: that the state in some cases has actually said, hey,
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: here's something we want to do to promote this,
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  SPEAKER_00: but then the follow through isn't there.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: I will definitely make sure that I look into that and see what I can do my part
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  SPEAKER_01: to bring that back around because I do think that that's important.
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  SPEAKER_01: And here's what I kind of want to dovetail into because we're going to talk
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: about words now because we know that words matter.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: So in thinking about the ICE protests,
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_01: okay, there was an anti-ICE protest and there's other forms of act
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  SPEAKER_01: I think that this is sending a message when we see the children doing this
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_01: during educational hours.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_01: To me,
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  SPEAKER_01: it's sending a message to society that the Constitution is this antiquated document,
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_01: that the moral shift is
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: needed to address injustices, whether real or perceived.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_01: So something as simple as constantly referring to our nation as a democracy can
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  SPEAKER_01: and does lead many citizens to believe that protesting,
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_01: rioting, disruption is basically how we affect change.
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  SPEAKER_01: Just never mind the legislative process, it's just do or die.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_01: And that's kind of a pure democracy, that mob rule that our founders, you know, they hated.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: And so can you share your thoughts on
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: K-12 students using instructional hours for anti-constitutional demonstrations
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_01: and how the word democracy has shifted our nation's identity and perspective on
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_01: the rule of law because technically someone pointed this out to me that we are
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_01: a representative democracy we have a democratic process with our elections
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: but what's wrong with calling America a democracy for short
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, we are a democratic republic.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_00: You know,
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  SPEAKER_00: the constitution does not say every person,
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_00: this isn't Athens,
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  SPEAKER_00: we're not all going to gather and on every issue, you know, vote on that.
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  SPEAKER_00: We elect representatives who then are able to go do that.
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  SPEAKER_00: And under that constitutional framework, it is not just majority rule.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_00: the purpose you know again we hear about diversity we hear
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: about protecting minorities and it is actually the constitutional framework
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  SPEAKER_00: that does that because it says you can't just say well I've got 51% of
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_00: the population and I get to now steamroll the 49% no doesn't matter how large of a
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: The majority you have, the minority still has rights.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: They still have those freedoms of speech, religions, etc.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so this is not just a pure mob rule democracy.
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  SPEAKER_00: You get a majority and now you get to steamroll everybody.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: That is a fundamental pillar.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's one that has been lost.
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  SPEAKER_00: people don't have a recognition of the fact
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  SPEAKER_00: that actually you may view this constitution as a barrier.
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  SPEAKER_00: It's saying you don't get to do what you want to do right now,
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: but it's because it intentionally tries to make it more difficult for those
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: who are often temporarily in power to come in here and say, well, you know, and
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: You can look at it today, right?
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously people have strong opinions on the last two presidents.
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  SPEAKER_00: And whether you're on the left or on the right,
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: almost anybody,
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: there are very few people who are fans of both of the last two presidents.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe one, maybe neither.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: But in either case, you can see when your side is out of power,
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe it's good that they don't have absolute power to come in and take away all
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: of your rights and do that.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_00: The only reason they don't is because we have that constitutional framework.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_00: If this were just a, well,
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: Joe Biden or Donald Trump or whoever else,
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_00: if we say they receive a popular vote majority
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_00: and now they have unfettered power to do that.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that's the alternative.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: If you're not going to say we're going to hold fast to the Constitution.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that that is an important piece to recognize.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: It is a Republican form of government.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: The Constitution says these states will all be guaranteed a Republican form of government, not
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: big r you know gop but small r representative government at the same time you know you asked
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: about the proper use of class time I mean it's absolutely unconscionable that you're going to
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: fail to educate students in reading and math and history and then you're gonna deploy
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: and employ them in terms of social activism.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: That is absolutely inappropriate,
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: is a dereliction of one's duty and responsibility,
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: it's a betrayal of the public trust.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: If students are educated about the pillars of our system
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: and they develop strong opinions in one way or the other,
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: to get involved in that process.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: That's wonderful.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: But to short circuit this process and say,
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: we're not going to even bother teaching you the basics so that you understand
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: the mechanics,
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: the mechanisms,
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: the background,
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: the arguments,
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: and we're just going to immediately send you out to do a political demonstration
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: really is inappropriate.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, there's a debate even in conversations about teaching civics.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: There's some who say, well, we need action civics.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: We want the kids to be engaged.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_00: We want them protesting and writing letters and doing all these things because
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: then they're participating in democracy.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: What we need to start with is civic
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: literacy, a foundational knowledge of the ideas, the principles.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: Can they articulate to you the rationale for our system of government?
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: Do they understand what the founders are writing when they laid it out in the Federalist?
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_00: Do they understand what alternate forms of government look like and produce?
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_00: That's the kind of thing that you want to instill in these students
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: and not just push them because there's a hot button issue that you feel passionately
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_00: about today,
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: even though you have deprived those kids of an actual deeper understanding of
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: the issues.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: I know for one,
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_01: I have been in the boardrooms and I have seen how adults have gaslit the children
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_01: and they will just come in, I mean, 50,
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: 60 comments,
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_01: just one after another,
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: defending a program that's just laced with DEI and a lot of anti-American sentiment,
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_01: teaching the kids to
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: Operate on a scale of skin tone and gender and things like that.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's such a distraction.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_01: And you know what's interesting?
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_01: I saw this other statistic recently.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_01: I can't remember if it was Gallup or Pew, but it said that 70 of Americans fail civics literacy.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: And then I think it said another 25 don't know how our government works,
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: you know, the three branches of government.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: And
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_01: It leads me to ask the question, how did we get here?
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_01: It was slow, but then it feels like it was all at once.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_01: How did we get here, Matt?
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that's probably longer than just one podcast episode, but several things.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_00: We touched on higher education.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: I think you do have some.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_00: who willfully do not want to see the system held up and would rather advocate for
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_00: a radical departure from the American tradition.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_00: I think in a lot of cases,
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_00: it's something that we obviously saw during the No Child Left Behind era.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_00: This has been discussed by others that the focus
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: The Myth of Education
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: these federal prescribed approaches to education in which civics
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_00: and history sometimes get left aside
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: you have even in arizona we have a requirement this is actually something
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_00: the goldwater institute
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_00: supported the requirement that the students in order to graduate have to get a passing score on
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_00: the u.s citizenship exam and so that you know includes basic questions about it but even then
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: these kids only need a 70 percent uh to pass on that they're able to take it over and over and
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: over the schools themselves in many cases don't actually get to the what is
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: the underlying reason
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: for this again if you just ask a kid what's the number of years for a term of a member
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: of congress or what's the next
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: There's a reason that you would want shorter or longer term
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_00: because you want your government to be accountable to your people,
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_00: but you also want some stability in the government.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: You don't want the whole government changing over all the time.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_00: And so to actually get the kids to wrestle with these underlying important measures,
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_00: that I think is not typically done.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: I think there's been a failure
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: of the training of our teachers i think that
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: the higher education teacher prep programs have done
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: an abysmal job for decades in doing that when you look at the course requirements and again
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_00: arizona has statutes on the book that these teachers are supposed to be getting education
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: in the U.S. and Arizona Constitution
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: But when you actually look at the preparation that they're given,
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: it is absolutely not transmitting that.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: So then those teachers don't have that information.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: And so then when they're teaching the students,
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_00: it does get boiled down to just a very simple, unsophisticated and uninspiring
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: account of the American form of government.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so we've actually been working with groups that the School of Civic
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: and Economic Thought and Leadership at ASU focuses
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: on promoting these constitutional principles on trying to educate
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_00: and have students wrestle with and debate and discuss actual core mechanics of
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: the constitutional order.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: And so we've worked with them and other organizations to help provide programming so
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_00: that teachers actually can go and get
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: on this kind of content so that they can effectively transmit it to students i think people
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: think oh us government that's boring it's dusty it's a bunch of it's actually really when you
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_00: delve into what are the problems that the founders are grappling with while trying
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: to prevent tyranny trying to prevent a majority from crushing a minority these are things
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_00: that are still applicable today and so it's absolutely something that really engages with
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_00: everybody has an opinion on donald trump or joe biden and so understanding the power
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: that they have and the congress have
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: These aren't just 250 year old dusty documents.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: These are things that have tangible impacts on students today.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: And yet we have failed to really engage them because
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_00: the only engagement we do is say, well, you don't like that person or that policy.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: So go out and protest it instead of why don't you understand the framework
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: of government that actually is at play here?
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what's so important for students to understand.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I know when I was in high school, I believe that I blew off American history.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: I
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_01: because it only told history just from the perspective.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_01: This was what I remember about the textbook we used was that it only told history
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: from the perspective of who was the president at the time.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_01: I don't remember having those deep lessons of how we should appreciate the flag
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: or the Constitution or any of the founding documents.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_01: As far as the Declaration of Independence, that popular part, I had to relearn it.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_01: There were so many things that I had to teach myself as an adult
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_01: because it just wasn't in my memory bank.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that what you're doing is great.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I want to segue into this initiative now because
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_01: With your work at the Goldwater Institute,
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: there is a $300,000 initiative through the Excellence
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: in Civics Education School District.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_01: And this is a grant program.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_01: The notes I have here say that this initiative, you're going to award $300,000
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_01: and support of a selected public school,
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_01: charter school,
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_01: or network, or it could be a private school, and you're doing this via textbooks.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_01: You're giving three grand per teacher stipend,
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_01: paid professional development offered by university faculty,
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_01: and then veteran Arizona public school social
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_01: I want you to give us more details on this
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_01: but it just looks like this grant program is kind of helping combat some of
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: the issues at least on I don't know the high school level
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_01: but maybe you can give us some more details of whether this goes down
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_01: into middle school etc.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, we're very excited.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's the American Civics Initiative.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_00: And if folks are interested,
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_00: AmericanCivicsNow.com will take you to kind of the landing page on this.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it really is a two-piece program.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: One is an opportunity for schools, districts, school systems, and the other is
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: for students because we basically look at this and we say there's need
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_00: to revitalize civics and history instruction at all levels.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_00: We need training and preparation for the teachers who are hungry for that.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: We need good resources for them to use in the classroom.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_00: We need to help provide pathways for students who are interested
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: So all these things right now really are critical.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so this American Civics Initiative does two things.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_00: The first provides scholarship opportunities for students
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_00: who are graduating high school or going to college who want to enroll in programs
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: that focus on things like civics,
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: institutionalism, classical education, government, public policy, etc.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: One of our partner organizations, again, SCETL,
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_00: the School of Civic and Economic Thought and Leadership at ASU is a partner program
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: so that for students who go and want to get a major or a minor through that program
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: where they would be exposed to these big
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: That's a lot of big issues.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_00: Either they want to major or maybe they want to be a biology student,
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_00: but they want to knock off their gen eds in that,
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_00: providing financial support to them.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_00: So those are scholarships up to $1,500 per student.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_00: Again, that's to take coursework that either they would be already interested in
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: or they can use to satisfy
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: So that's sort of piece number one here that we're doing.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_00: We've got partners at Grand Canyon University and at SCETL at ASU.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so those are the two programs that right now we've partnered with
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_00: to provide these opportunities for folks.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_00: So if there are people who are going to ASU or to GCU, strongly recommend for folks to apply.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's a very simple process to do that.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: Again,
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: essentially trying to reward and encourage students to take seriously these issues
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_00: and really dive into programs where they'll have that.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_00: The second piece that you referenced is this school district piece.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: And so this is a really a huge opportunity to provide help to
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_00: to the school districts and the school systems themselves.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_00: And what this grant does essentially says,
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_00: we know that teachers have for years been trying to pull stuff off of teachers,
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: pay teachers or use old textbooks or use just a smattering of stuff from online.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of teachers
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: have said, we're really hungry for content.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_00: We're hungry for training.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_00: We're hungry for good resources we can use in the classroom.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a million different things out there, but we need something that's really solid.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: But textbooks historically have been very boring.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_00: They're not very engaging.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: The teachers themselves report not even using them.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_00: You can look at the data and administrators think that
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_00: the teachers use their textbooks,
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_00: you know, 15 days a month and the teachers say, I use it two or four days a month.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: And that's for a variety of reasons.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so what we said is, okay,
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_00: we want something that's actually high quality,
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_00: that's engaging for the students, engaging for the teachers.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so there's actually a new textbook,
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: The Land of Hope,
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_00: that came out in 2019 and
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: a revised version is actually just being released this summer.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: And so this grant program that we're doing,
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_00: this American Civics Initiative,
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: says for school districts who are interested in revitalizing their civics
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_00: and history instruction,
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: we using our funds will actually pay to outfit with brand new copies
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_00: of this textbook for every high school student taking U.S. history.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_00: So this is the,
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_00: in Arizona and in most states, the kids have to take a year-long U.S. history class
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: And so this says,
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_00: for every one of those kids, we wanna provide them a really excellent resource.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: And so this textbook,
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: Land of Hope,
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_00: is actually written not to just be, hey,
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: here's a bunch of facts that are really boring,
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_00: but here's all the information,
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_00: here are the facts,
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_00: but actually written in a narrative voice as if you're sitting there listening to
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: historian talk to you about this and so you actually are drawn into the story. You understand
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_00: that the personalities, the characters, the motivations, the background all the things
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: that are happening instead of just a series of timeline of events
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_00: So the kids can actually appreciate that and understand it draw connections
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so the grant program says we will literally pay for every kid who's taking this
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_00: to be given a copy of that textbook.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: We will, using our funds, donate that to the school.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_00: We will also provide professional development training to the teachers.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: So it's not just, hey, here's a textbook, now go use it.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: But here are faculty who can talk to you about these principles and periods in U.S. history.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_00: Here are veteran Arizona public school teachers who have used this textbook,
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: who can walk you through how to engage students with it.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_00: You mentioned also provides a stipend, rewarding and recognizing the time of teachers.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: Anytime there's a transition,
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's fair for teachers to say,
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: it seems like every year there's something new coming down and a new fad and
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_00: a new change to say, look, we are providing resources for you, but also recognizing
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_00: that anything new and different is an adjustment.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_00: And so to value and recognize the time for the educators who are involved with this.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_00: So there's a massive program to provide that.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: There's other pieces of the grant program,
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_00: some programming for younger kids, a little introductory book,
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_00: A's for the American Dream for the younger grades and also a resource bank
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: of other kind of supplemental content that the teachers can draw from
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_00: but this is intended to really be a massive opportunity at the scope and size of
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_00: an entire school system so yeah we're very fortunate to be able to offer that
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_00: and very excited this is the first year this is getting off the ground and
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: so this will be for schools starting this fall and then also looking
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: to hopefully continue this in future years as well
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, well, I love it.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_01: As you were talking,
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: I'm over here looking at the textbook and I'm like, I'm going to order this.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a teacher in some capacity or another.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_01: So where are you in the process with awarding the scholarship?
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so we have,
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: for the student scholarships,
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: those are actually being awarded on a rolling basis for students.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_00: For the district grant program,
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: we have actually selected four school systems for this inaugural year.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_00: Two very large school districts, a public charter school, and a private high school.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so we have actually
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_00: You know, again,
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_00: as we made clear in the grant opportunity,
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_00: this isn't about picking, you know, one form of education or another.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_00: This is saying at the end of the day,
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: what matters most is can we get high quality resources in the hands of teachers
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_00: and students.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, as you're looking at the book, this is for the, again,
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_00: Again, it's a fantastic resource that's been out there for a few years,
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: but now they're coming out with this new revised edition with beautiful maps
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_00: and timelines and images.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_00: And again, it's almost like you're walking through the pages of U.S. history.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: You're not just reading.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: and this really stilted kind of bland description of events.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_00: And so, yeah, we're very excited to be supporting this.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: You know, the professor, Bill McClay, writes this to be approachable.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_00: This is a rigorous text, but it's readable, it's approachable, it's something that, you know,
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_00: The schools want to literally have the kids read it during the school day
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_00: or have them read it as a supplement to whatever else they're learning.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: There's nothing, I think, more foundational for these students than in that high school year.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's really when they get an opportunity.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_00: They've learned a little bit in kind of the earlier grades.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: That's the real
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: is a real deep dive that they get into US history.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so this is providing a resource that says, this is extremely robust, it's engaging.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the other things that we like,
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_00: kids are obviously spending an increasing amount of time staring at laptops,
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_00: on Chromebooks, on screens.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know, a lot of schools have moved exclusively to digital content.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_00: And now we've actually seen parents say, hey,
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: the research is starting to say maybe the kids remember the recall is better
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: or we just don't want them staring at a screen or they're distracted.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_00: And so the other piece of this is this is providing physical hard textbooks to these kids.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: so that even if everything else is staring at a screen,
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_00: they have an opportunity to experience having a real book that they can leaf through
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: the pages.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: They can look at these pictures and maps and not be bombarded by a bunch of links
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: and pop-ups and everything else that's there.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I definitely appreciate that you guys are targeting whatever school system.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't matter.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_01: We have to at least be school choice,
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_01: knowing that the majority of families are still going to be in
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_01: the public education system.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that that is where a lot of the civics education is lacking.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_01: I think in different school systems,
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_01: from what I can tell, it is still very much a part of the curriculum.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_01: It's not turned into this activist thing.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_01: It's just you do reading, you do math,
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: you do your writing but then you also have this civics piece and I think that
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_01: that just needs to be brought back in as just a normal subject maybe devoid of all
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: of the emotionalism that we're seeing
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_01: and just teaching people to be appreciative,
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: young people to be appreciative of where they came from.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_01: And here's how I wanna end this though.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think,
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: while the scholarship is amazing,
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think that parents should rely solely on the education system to instill
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: the knowledge and values and attitudes of American patriotism.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_01: So what are some key ways,
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_01: and even if it's using some of your resources privately at home,
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_01: but what are some key ways that parents can pass down
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_01: the legacies and the traditions that's going
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_01: to keep our constitutional republic alive for another 250 years if
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_01: the Lord should tarry.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's a great question.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: And I think you're right.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_00: It can't be just dependent on what's happening at school.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: But actually,
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: that should be where they are introduced to a lot of these concepts
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_00: or having those concepts reinforced that they've already learned at home.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: But I would say,
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_00: and that's something that's beautiful about the Land of Hope book,
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_00: that is something that
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_00: even for parents,
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_00: even if you're not teaching or you're not in a class,
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: to go through that and read through that and to yourself be reminded
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_00: of these principles.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of,
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_00: I would say,
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_00: parents who maybe took these classes themselves years ago and have an affinity for
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_00: the country,
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: but they themselves might feel like, ah,
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_00: it's been a long time since I really delved into this
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: and I don't feel comfortable trying to walk my kids through it in
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_00: a way that's anything more than just kind of the issues of the day.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_00: Even them going through and reading a book like Land of Hope and really having
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_00: an appreciation for that and talking with the kids and sitting and kind of doing
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: that.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: I think there are a lot of opportunities for parents,
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_00: taking the kids to,
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_00: whether it's a trip to the Capitol and understanding the,
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: here's the institution and understanding that,
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_00: you know, there's a lot of great resources that are out there.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_00: I mentioned, you know, Skettle has a whole civic leadership.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: literacy curriculum online.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: Groups like 1776 Unites has a whole bunch of content.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: And again,
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: one thing to emphasize here,
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: we hear a lot of criticism often from the left who says,
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_00: well, you're trying to only offer a one-sided, stilted view of American history.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's all positive.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't think that the
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: anything could be further from the truth because works like Land of Hope
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_00: or otherwise are very explicit.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: They're very clear.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the good, the bad, and the ugly.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_00: Here are all the shortcomings of all the different periods and people in US history.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_00: And yet it is that exceptionalism that says you're not defined
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_00: by your imperfections or your failures.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_00: It is this opportunity to live up to the ideals that you have declared in
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_00: the Declaration and otherwise.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that for parents themselves,
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_00: it's obviously challenging a lot of times to find extra time,
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_00: but to go through and resources like those
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_00: and provide those.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_00: There's a great resource.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_00: We recommend this as well.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_00: The Victims of Communism Memorial Foundation has short little 15 to 20 minute videos.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: They can be shown in the classroom.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_00: They can be shown at home.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: And it shows personal testimonies of those who have lived under regimes outside of America.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_00: I think nothing helps to foment an appreciation for the United States
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_00: and understanding of what are the alternatives.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I think for students who might hear, oh,
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: this idea of socialism or communism,
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_00: that sounds kind of neat and edgy to actually see these very heartfelt testimonials
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_00: of people who
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_00: who lived under those systems.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_00: And so I would highly recommend for parents to look at resources like that.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_00: That's something you can put on, you can watch that.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: Not with super young kids,
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_00: because some of these things are pretty graphic in terms of the description
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_00: of what happened.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_00: But I think that sort of thing really gets that conversation.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: We can't just look at the US or the constitution in isolation.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_00: I think it really is important to understand what else has human history produced.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_00: And many times it's not great.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: and I think that'll promote an additional appreciation for sure
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_00: the system's not perfect,
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_00: but we really have come a long way and it really is an amazing framework
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_00: that we have inherited from the founders.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_01: I agree.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_01: And I will include everything that Matt is mentioning in the show notes.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_01: I always include lots of show notes because I expect my audience to do the research,
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_01: not just listen to the conversation and walk away.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I wanted to touch on something before we close is that there are people
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_01: who are opposed to the constitution
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_01: or American history as we tell it in saying that it's all positive.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_01: But when I look at Pew Research polls and Gallup,
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_01: from what I see, socialism is being sold as something positive.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_01: And you do have to do the
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: I had to do the work because when I was first trying to educate myself again,
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_01: four or five,
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_01: six, whatever years ago, I didn't even I'm not even ashamed to say this.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know what socialism was.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_01: I saw how it was being presented.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_01: And then I just went to some man on the street interviews like people showing up
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_01: in Venezuela, Cuba, whatever, or even in New York, whatever.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_01: And they're interviewing people about socialism.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_01: And it was a night and day.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_01: And once I started to dive into countries like Venezuela, Cuba, even China, like I lost sleep.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_01: Matt, when I first started looking into this,
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: I said, this is gonna happen in America, there's no way.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_01: And in addition to losing sleep,
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_01: I immediately felt guilty, like why haven't I been involved more?
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: I'm registered to vote and I'm just, you know, not paying attention.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_01: So I really appreciate that you took the time today.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciate what the Goldwater Institute has been doing and is continuing to do.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_01: and we just wanted to highlight that here at the Myth of Education Podcast.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have any final thoughts and any further information that my audience should look into?
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_00: I just really appreciate the time.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_00: I mentioned for folks who are interested and it sounds like you'll put out
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_00: the show notes,
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_00: but AmericanCivicsNow.com will take folks to both pieces of
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: the American Civics Initiative.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_00: So if they have, again,
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: graduating high school seniors,
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_00: kids who are starting at ASU or GCU, strongly encourage them to check that out.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_00: Those are scholarships that are intended to be not
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_00: Not overly difficult in order to achieve.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_00: This is really to encourage those students to be exposed to this kind
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_00: of great content and for those school systems.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_00: Again, this is something we're very fortunate to have been able to offer this year
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_00: and looking to be able to do that in future years.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_00: So for people who are starting schools or
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_00: you know whether it's your own kids or you're trying
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_00: to do micro schools pods home schools or just your local private or public
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_00: or public charter school to encourage them
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_00: and say hey there are opportunities out here it's not a partisan it's not a left or
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_00: a right issue it is we're trying to create we're trying to reclaim
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: really that common framework and appreciation for these things.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_00: We can have wonderful debates about all the particulars in American history
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_00: to reestablish really a common understanding of the historical record of here's
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_00: the events that have led us to where we are today.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_00: We can debate the motivations,
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_00: we can debate who was the good,
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_00: who was the bad,
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_00: but to just even have an understanding of where we have come from,
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_00: I think really is critical.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_00: So we're really delighted to support the Land of Hope textbook and thank you for
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: the time to talk about the initiatives.