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KILLER O.J. SIMPSON SPIED ON MY SOFA SEX SESSION WITH NICOLE · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
0:06
Speaker 2: He says double killer OJ Simpson spied on him during
0:12
Speaker 2: his sofa sex session with O. J. Simpson's wife, Nicole Brown. Well,
0:18
Speaker 2: that's just the tip of the iceberg. This guy has
0:22
Speaker 2: a brand new book, and he's right when he says
0:25
Speaker 2: that could have been me.
0:27
Speaker 1: I mean, is he Grace? This is Crime Stories.
0:29
Speaker 2: I want to thank you for being with us here.
0:33
Speaker 2: Can you send some one to my house or my
0:35
Speaker 2: ex husband or my husband?
0:36
Speaker 3: He broke into my house and he's ranting and raving.
0:39
Speaker 3: Now he's just walked out the front yard and.
0:43
Speaker 1: Nobody's crazy.
0:45
Speaker 2: You know what always strikes me about that portion of
0:47
Speaker 2: one of Nicole Brown's many, many nine one one calls
0:52
Speaker 2: is that she was just like, yeah, he's breaking into
0:55
Speaker 2: my house again. By this time, it had happened so
0:59
Speaker 2: many times, and she had been beaten so many times.
1:03
Speaker 1: That photo that was put up in the courtroom during
1:07
Speaker 1: Simpson's murder.
1:08
Speaker 2: Trial of her with her face just totally beaten and bruised.
1:14
Speaker 2: I mean, how that jury, Oh gosh, that's one of them.
1:19
Speaker 1: Look at her arm for Pete's sake. Oh gosh.
1:23
Speaker 2: It happened over and over and over, joining me right now.
1:30
Speaker 1: Two incredible guests.
1:31
Speaker 2: First, I want to introduce to you Keith Zulomsowitch. He
1:37
Speaker 2: is Nicole Brown's former boyfriend, and he is the author
1:41
Speaker 2: of a brand new book, Stalked, And I've got it
1:44
Speaker 2: right now, but I really think we should give the
1:46
Speaker 2: whole title it stalked. It could have been me, And
1:51
Speaker 2: I think what you mean by that, Keith, is that
1:56
Speaker 2: you could have been the one lying out in the
1:59
Speaker 2: driveway that night with your head nearly severed off your body.
2:05
Speaker 2: Nicole Brown's head was attached to her body by a
2:11
Speaker 2: thin a thin bit of flesh in the back of
2:17
Speaker 2: her neck. She had been almost totally decapitated. The killer
2:23
Speaker 2: had that immense strength. I wonder what he would have
2:27
Speaker 2: done with you if he had gotten a hold of you, Keith,
2:30
Speaker 2: knowing that you had been dating Nicole, actually spying.
2:34
Speaker 1: On you through the window. Freak.
2:39
Speaker 4: Freak is right, And you're absolutely right when you say that.
2:44
Speaker 4: In real time, maybe it didn't cross my mind as much,
2:47
Speaker 4: But after I saw what he was capable of in
2:49
Speaker 4: the murders I've had to live with for thirty years,
2:52
Speaker 4: I think that it could have.
2:53
Speaker 2: Been merry shots Nicole in life. Some of the happiest
2:59
Speaker 2: time of her life outside of being a mom, were
3:06
Speaker 2: with Keith Zulamsowitch. It's not just what he's saying, it's
3:11
Speaker 2: what other people said. Of course, their relationship was marred,
3:16
Speaker 2: ruined by this.
3:20
Speaker 5: It's three o'clock in the morning and Keith and Nicole
3:23
Speaker 5: made love on the couch, but they weren't alone. There
3:30
Speaker 5: was somebody watching. There was someone watching through the window.
3:39
Speaker 5: It was a defendant.
3:41
Speaker 3: Nicole hires a babysitter to watch the children while she
3:44
Speaker 3: and Keith go out to a comedy club. Arriving home,
3:47
Speaker 3: the children are asleep. It's about three am when Keith
3:49
Speaker 3: and Nicole become amorous on the couch. Unbeknownst to either
3:53
Speaker 3: of them, OJ Simpson is hiding in the bushes outside
3:56
Speaker 3: the house, stalking, watching the couple love on the couch.
4:01
Speaker 2: Did you have any idea that OJ Simpson was staring?
4:06
Speaker 1: He's about three feet away from you.
4:08
Speaker 2: It sounds like addy threesome watching you have sex with
4:13
Speaker 2: Nicole Brown with his shoulder asleep upstairs. I mean, did
4:16
Speaker 2: you have any idea the extent to which he was
4:21
Speaker 2: stalking you and her?
4:25
Speaker 4: We knew about the stalking because it had happened several
4:27
Speaker 4: times prior to this particular incident, but that evening we
4:32
Speaker 4: were out several places before we went home, one of
4:35
Speaker 4: which was Roxbury where Nicole saw Oj across the dance
4:39
Speaker 4: floor and brought it to my attention immediately that he
4:42
Speaker 4: was there, and we just sort of at that point
4:45
Speaker 4: had had enough of his stalking and following us. So
4:49
Speaker 4: she looked at me and she said, what do you
4:51
Speaker 4: want to do. Let's just get out of here. So
4:53
Speaker 4: we headed back to the house, not knowing he was
4:55
Speaker 4: going to follow us. In hindsight, maybe should have had
4:57
Speaker 4: an idea that that was going to happen. But you know,
5:01
Speaker 4: we got home and we were in the house thinking
5:03
Speaker 4: we were alone, and things happened. That was the first
5:05
Speaker 4: time we made love, so it was a special It
5:08
Speaker 4: was very special. Come to find out.
5:12
Speaker 1: You know, I need a strength and I named one
5:14
Speaker 1: really quickly.
5:15
Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany Marshall is joining us renowned psychoanalyst.
5:19
Speaker 1: Out of la this jurisdiction, author of deal Breaker.
5:24
Speaker 2: You can see her now on Peacock and you can
5:26
Speaker 2: find her at doctor Bethany Marshall dot com. Doctor Bethany Marshall,
5:30
Speaker 2: I'm just a trial lawyer, you're the shrink. But this,
5:34
Speaker 2: there's got to be a name for this, for what
5:37
Speaker 2: Simpson did before the double murders.
5:42
Speaker 6: Yes, well, obviously it's voyeurism, but Nancy, it is stalking,
5:47
Speaker 6: like the title of Keith's book, and the psychology of
5:50
Speaker 6: stalking is that the perpetrator, the stalker, lives in a
5:55
Speaker 6: state of rejection all the time, even when that other person,
5:59
Speaker 6: maybe in a wouldn't pick up a phone call or
6:01
Speaker 6: wouldn't spend time with him, and everything got interpreted as rejections.
6:06
Speaker 6: So he stalked her to punish her for rejecting him.
6:10
Speaker 6: He also believed that she belonged to him like property.
6:14
Speaker 6: So I imagine when he's standing outside the window watching them
6:18
Speaker 6: have sex, take each other's clothes off, make out. I mean,
6:21
Speaker 6: I'm imagining the whole thing, with his face pressed up
6:25
Speaker 6: against the mirror. Nancy, he was probably enraged and even
6:30
Speaker 6: at that point, possibly having homicidal fantasies. I'm not surprised
6:34
Speaker 6: that Keith waited so long to come out with this
6:37
Speaker 6: book because OJ Simpson is gone now. He can't do
6:40
Speaker 6: anything from the grapes, so it's a safe time to
6:43
Speaker 6: talk about it and It's a very important message this book.
6:46
Speaker 6: I think it's so wonderful Keith that you wrote it
6:48
Speaker 6: and that people can read it about it.
6:49
Speaker 2: I forget what you just said, doctor Bethany, Because Simpson,
6:52
Speaker 2: even during his marriage was women threw themselves at him.
6:57
Speaker 1: How can you say OJ Simpson was in his state
7:00
Speaker 1: of rejection. The world loved him. He was an icon.
7:05
Speaker 1: Don't you remember those I believe it was.
7:07
Speaker 2: Was it Avas or hurt I think it was AVOs
7:10
Speaker 2: rental cars where he would be running through the airport
7:13
Speaker 2: and jumping over things, is very athletic, carrying like a
7:17
Speaker 2: bag with him or something.
7:19
Speaker 1: He was a star.
7:20
Speaker 2: He was in movies, he was in commercials. Everybody loved him.
7:25
Speaker 1: What do you mean a state of rejection but no dancy.
7:30
Speaker 6: This is what we see Bucker's and I believe was
7:33
Speaker 6: going on psychologically for Oj is that he probably had
7:37
Speaker 6: sexual relationships with other women, responded to women, flirted with women.
7:42
Speaker 6: But at the same time he was obsessed and preoccupied
7:47
Speaker 6: with Nicole. He only wanted her. And so we see
7:51
Speaker 6: with these guys often they're pathologically jealous. They feel betrayed
7:56
Speaker 6: all the time, even if the girl, the woman goes
7:59
Speaker 6: out having lunch with her friends or something like that.
8:02
Speaker 6: He would feel betrayed and rejected and then to get
8:05
Speaker 6: back at her, go have sex with other women. That's
8:08
Speaker 6: a really common thing for sociopaths, and he seems to just.
8:11
Speaker 1: Don't get it.
8:12
Speaker 2: Let me go back to Keith Zlamzowitch, the author of
8:16
Speaker 2: a brand new book Climbing the Charts on Amazon, stalked,
8:21
Speaker 2: but I like the rest of the title because it
8:23
Speaker 2: says so much more it could have been me. And
8:26
Speaker 2: he's right because in a blind rage, Simpson not only
8:31
Speaker 2: murdered decapitated his wife Nicole, but a completely innocent guy
8:36
Speaker 2: that had returned a pair of glasses to her home
8:39
Speaker 2: that night.
8:40
Speaker 1: You know, there he is Ron Goleman. And what a.
8:45
Speaker 2: Horrific phone call had to be made to Golman's family
8:49
Speaker 2: to tell them, just out of the blue, their boy
8:53
Speaker 2: is dead, murdered.
8:55
Speaker 1: They probably first thought, oh, it must have been a
8:57
Speaker 1: car crash.
8:58
Speaker 2: No, no, then they find out the awful truth.
9:02
Speaker 1: Guys, the stalking just so bizarre.
9:07
Speaker 2: But that night, the first time that Keith had sex
9:11
Speaker 2: with Nicole Brown they had been dating a while. He
9:15
Speaker 2: had no idea oj Simpson was peeking peeping tom through
9:21
Speaker 2: the window just a few feet away, staring at them
9:25
Speaker 2: the whole time. I'm really surprised he didn't break down
9:28
Speaker 2: the window and come in and strangle you right then
9:31
Speaker 2: and there. When did you find out he had been
9:34
Speaker 2: spying on you that whole night?
9:38
Speaker 4: The very next day, OJ burst into us. We were
9:42
Speaker 4: in the back bedroom of one of Nicole of Nicholl's house,
9:44
Speaker 4: in one of the bedrooms, and he came bursting in
9:48
Speaker 4: right on top of us and started declaring that he
9:51
Speaker 4: had watched us the night before, and he wanted to
9:53
Speaker 4: be left alone with Nicole. I wanted. I didn't want
9:57
Speaker 4: to leave her alone. I was scared for her safety.
9:59
Speaker 4: So I stood my ground, stood in between the two
10:01
Speaker 4: of them, and refused to leave. He was getting angrier
10:04
Speaker 4: and angrier, until finally Nicole realized the only way to
10:07
Speaker 4: get him out of there was to have me wait
10:10
Speaker 4: outside the bedroom door, so I did. She asked me
10:13
Speaker 4: to stay close enough so I could hear if anything happened,
10:16
Speaker 4: which I did, and then he continued to go after
10:20
Speaker 4: her and read her the Riot Act.
10:21
Speaker 1: What was he saying to you or let me guess,
10:23
Speaker 1: bitch or blah.
10:24
Speaker 4: Blah, Oh, how filthy she was, how disgrace she is.
10:31
Speaker 4: I watched you. I saw everything you did. You know
10:36
Speaker 4: it was as bad. I couldn't hear every word he
10:38
Speaker 4: was saying. But when she came out of the bedroom,
10:40
Speaker 4: when they came out together after about ten minutes, and
10:43
Speaker 4: he tried the old shake my hand thing, you know
10:46
Speaker 4: that wasn't wasn't.
10:49
Speaker 1: Oh okay, and he stretches out. He breaks in.
10:54
Speaker 2: He bursts into the bedroom when you were in a color,
10:57
Speaker 2: still in there, I think you said, still in bed?
11:00
Speaker 1: Me woke you up, and starts harassing Well what now?
11:03
Speaker 4: I was giving her a I was giving her a
11:06
Speaker 4: back massage, non sexual, and he came in through the
11:10
Speaker 4: back door, which also told us that he knew exactly
11:14
Speaker 4: where we at. We were at in the house. He
11:16
Speaker 4: didn't try to come through the front door, he didn't
11:17
Speaker 4: come through the screen door in the back. He came
11:19
Speaker 4: right through the bedroom French doors that we were in,
11:22
Speaker 4: so he knew where we were at in the house,
11:25
Speaker 4: and he came right through, stood right in my face
11:28
Speaker 4: as I'm looking up from sitting on Nicole's back. I
11:31
Speaker 4: was obviously mortified. I didn't know what to do. I
11:34
Speaker 4: got up slowly, and then he started in on both
11:37
Speaker 4: of us and wanted to be left alone with Nicole.
11:39
Speaker 4: So he repeatedly said, I want to talk to you alone.
11:42
Speaker 4: I want to talk to you alone. And I said,
11:44
Speaker 4: I'm not going to leave you alone with her. I
11:45
Speaker 4: don't trust you. Until eventually Nicole convinced me to go outside.
11:49
Speaker 4: I stood outside in the kitchen close enough that I
11:52
Speaker 4: could hear if something was going to go down, but
11:55
Speaker 4: I couldn't hear every word they were saying. Five ten
11:57
Speaker 4: minutes later, when they came out of the together, he
12:00
Speaker 4: approached me in the kitchen and gave me this half
12:03
Speaker 4: hearted sort of shook my hand. I'm a proud man,
12:07
Speaker 4: was his statement. I didn't reply. I just sort of
12:10
Speaker 4: stuck my hand out, and then he disappeared to.
12:13
Speaker 2: Say, she's a proud man, A proud man that hunkered
12:17
Speaker 2: down behind a bush the whole night to see.
12:19
Speaker 1: What you were doing with the wife that he had
12:22
Speaker 1: broken up with him over the beatings, That proud man.
12:26
Speaker 2: Can you just see him squatted down behind the bush.
12:28
Speaker 2: It's probably the hides the kite, and we.
12:33
Speaker 4: Know it's my opinion that he tried to enter the
12:37
Speaker 4: house that night, whether through the front door, whether through
12:40
Speaker 4: the back door, but I'm convinced one percent that he
12:43
Speaker 4: didn't just watch us through the window and walk away
12:46
Speaker 4: and go home. I'm convinced he tried to get into
12:49
Speaker 4: the house. We didn't hear him. We had some music
12:51
Speaker 4: on and we were involved, obviously, but you know, to
12:56
Speaker 4: find out the next day how personal that was. And
12:58
Speaker 4: when Nicole came out of the bedroom behind him and
13:01
Speaker 4: he shook my hand and left, she was mortified. You
13:04
Speaker 4: could see it. She was white as a ghost, and
13:07
Speaker 4: she just looked me in the eye and said, he
13:09
Speaker 4: watched us. Oh my god, he watched everything we did
13:12
Speaker 4: last night. And then we just looked at each other
13:16
Speaker 4: and went, oh my god, what's safe. We didn't know
13:19
Speaker 4: what was SKay.
13:20
Speaker 2: You do know he probably camped outside her house the
13:23
Speaker 2: entire night.
13:24
Speaker 1: There's no way Simpson goes home and comes back. No, no, no,
13:29
Speaker 1: And this is why the children were home asleep upstairs.
13:36
Speaker 4: Yes, correct. And the eerie part of that whole thing
13:38
Speaker 4: is Nancy. And it goes back to the title of
13:41
Speaker 4: the book. Is you have to draw a direct correlation
13:45
Speaker 4: between that evening and the evening of the murders in
13:48
Speaker 4: June twelfth and ninety four, because the geography is so
13:51
Speaker 4: eerily similar, and you read about it in the book
13:55
Speaker 4: where I describe how I left about maybe four or
13:59
Speaker 4: fourth in the morning because I would never stay the
14:02
Speaker 4: night at Nichole's house because we were leary of the
14:05
Speaker 4: children waking up and finding another man in the house.
14:07
Speaker 4: That was just how we thought about it. So I
14:09
Speaker 4: left very early in the morning, and it was dead
14:12
Speaker 4: silent in Brettwood. I just remember that it was spooky
14:16
Speaker 4: silent as I walked out of the house to my car,
14:18
Speaker 4: which was parked on the street, so I was accessible,
14:23
Speaker 4: so I know he wasn't there. Then he must have
14:25
Speaker 4: gone home at some point. But if you look at
14:27
Speaker 4: the geography of how there's a long courtyard and a
14:31
Speaker 4: gate and another sidewalk that leads to the living room window,
14:34
Speaker 4: it's exactly what he did on June twelfth. He came
14:37
Speaker 4: through a gate, down along sidewalk around a corner through
14:41
Speaker 4: her front window where she had to come out the
14:43
Speaker 4: front door where he eventually murdered her and Ron. So
14:46
Speaker 4: there's a direct correlation if you look at it, and
14:49
Speaker 4: I write about it, to both those evenings, and that's
14:52
Speaker 4: what sparked in my mind the whole. It could have
14:56
Speaker 4: been me part of it, because I felt like had
14:59
Speaker 4: he been there that night, it would have been me.
15:02
Speaker 4: Or if he could have gotten into the house that
15:04
Speaker 4: evening through an unlocked boarder, which none of them were,
15:07
Speaker 4: that it could have happened right there in the living room.
15:09
Speaker 4: So I've had ninemars about that for in the last
15:11
Speaker 4: thirty years, and something that was an overbearing say.
15:15
Speaker 2: Such a Bethey Marshall, what does that mean. I mean,
15:18
Speaker 2: It's one thing to have an argument with your ex.
15:22
Speaker 2: I would expect that, especially when you've got children together,
15:26
Speaker 2: but to call your ex a whoror a bitch and
15:31
Speaker 2: everything else that he called her, told her he was
15:33
Speaker 2: trash and filthy and dirty and had shamed him. Really
15:40
Speaker 2: with the children, you know, they could hear me. He
15:42
Speaker 2: was screaming like a crazy man.
15:47
Speaker 6: Nancy is part of the pattern of abuse right devalue
15:50
Speaker 6: the woman, shame her for her sexuality, humiliate her, embarrass her,
15:56
Speaker 6: try to take down her credibility in front of the children.
15:59
Speaker 6: These are classic abuse signs. Also trying to isolate the
16:03
Speaker 6: victim from sources of support. So here she starts dating Keith.
16:08
Speaker 6: They're having this romantic evening, he bursts through the bedroom
16:12
Speaker 6: because what he's trying to do is assert dominance over
16:16
Speaker 6: Nicole and over Keith, and he thinks that by separating them,
16:21
Speaker 6: he's going to be able to separate them permanently. Now
16:23
Speaker 6: that really odd thing where he says, I'm a proud man.
16:27
Speaker 6: He turns reality on its head. He's actually humiliating himself
16:32
Speaker 6: as well as her. And then when he shakes hands
16:35
Speaker 6: with Keith, that's I think another dominance moves. He thinks
16:39
Speaker 6: that he's he's been successful in separating the two, getting
16:43
Speaker 6: them into different rooms, shakes hands and leaves, and I
16:46
Speaker 6: think he feels like he got his way.
16:48
Speaker 1: And what he won? What do you mean he won.
16:53
Speaker 7: That?
16:53
Speaker 1: He won that.
16:54
Speaker 6: He has now taken Nicole apart, psychologically abused her, beat
16:59
Speaker 6: her down emotionally, and now she will come back and
17:03
Speaker 6: depend on him instead of continuing to date Keith. He
17:06
Speaker 6: probably thought that.
17:08
Speaker 2: So basically, he's like a dog that comes in and
17:10
Speaker 2: TETs on everything that he thinks is his.
17:14
Speaker 6: Exactly that's exactly what he did. That's how he asserted
17:18
Speaker 6: the dominant. He lifted his leg and then he was
17:20
Speaker 6: happy and he left because her house was his Territory. Nancy.
17:25
Speaker 6: I used to live in Brentwood between Nicole was just
17:29
Speaker 6: to the south of me and O. J. Simpson on
17:31
Speaker 6: Rockingham was just to the north. So I know that
17:34
Speaker 6: area very very well. It is super quiet at four
17:38
Speaker 6: in the morning. Brentwood is such kind of like a
17:41
Speaker 6: sleepy community, but it's a very wealthy enclave. So her
17:47
Speaker 6: house where it was located, it was almost like walking
17:51
Speaker 6: distance between the house and Metsaluna where Rob where Ron
17:55
Speaker 6: Goldman worked, and so it was it was a place
17:58
Speaker 6: where there was a lot of visits ability. She and
18:01
Speaker 6: I went to the same hair salon and the same
18:03
Speaker 6: nail salon, and the girls in there will talk about
18:05
Speaker 6: the fact that she would come in with bruises on
18:08
Speaker 6: her face and on her arms. She lived her life
18:11
Speaker 6: being stalked and being beaten.
18:13
Speaker 1: That that was just her life. Very disturbing.
18:17
Speaker 2: And even though I prosecuted, by the time I got
18:22
Speaker 2: domestic violence cases as they are called euphemistically, somebody was
18:26
Speaker 2: dead or had had an aggravated assault or aggravated battery
18:30
Speaker 2: like lost.
18:31
Speaker 1: An eye, lost use of an arm, lost use of
18:34
Speaker 1: a limb.
18:35
Speaker 2: But when I worked at the Battered Women's Center as
18:38
Speaker 2: a volunteer at night.
18:39
Speaker 1: That was for nine years.
18:41
Speaker 2: And to hear these women because again by the time
18:44
Speaker 2: I usually got their cases, they were dead and I
18:47
Speaker 2: never got to speak to them. But as working the hotline,
18:50
Speaker 2: I did speak to them and they would be just
18:52
Speaker 2: totally numb.
18:53
Speaker 1: It would be just a way of life for them.
18:55
Speaker 1: You know, that's curious.
18:57
Speaker 2: Back to you, Keith Zlamzowitch new book stalked it could
19:02
Speaker 2: have been me. It's interesting the way you described and
19:07
Speaker 2: I didn't want to interrupt you when you first said
19:09
Speaker 2: it that you guys were at the Roxbury and you
19:11
Speaker 2: were having a great time.
19:12
Speaker 1: Everybody's dancing. Look there's Simpson. Oh what a coinciding there
19:15
Speaker 1: he is. He's probably been following you the whole night.
19:19
Speaker 1: And she was like, there he is. See I would
19:21
Speaker 1: have been shot, like why is he or what? What?
19:24
Speaker 2: But she it was just typical another day in Brentwood
19:29
Speaker 2: for her. There's Ojay stalking her again, Simpson Orenthal, James
19:34
Speaker 2: Simpson turning up again wherever she was.
19:37
Speaker 1: It was just routine for her at that point. She
19:40
Speaker 1: was numb to it.
19:41
Speaker 2: I mean, by the way you described it, she wasn't
19:43
Speaker 2: shocked or afraid.
19:45
Speaker 1: There he is like a bad penny.
19:50
Speaker 4: And we were getting used to it, to be honest
19:52
Speaker 4: with you, because this was the third or fourth time
19:54
Speaker 4: that he approached Does in public. And they had had
19:58
Speaker 4: an agreement that if they both showed up at the
20:02
Speaker 4: same place, the first one there was allowed to stay,
20:04
Speaker 4: the second one there if they saw the other person
20:07
Speaker 4: would leave. He never abided by that, obviously, but he
20:10
Speaker 4: knew where we were going because the times that he
20:13
Speaker 4: would show up would be just too uncanny. So we
20:16
Speaker 4: knew that we were either being followed or were being
20:20
Speaker 4: ratted out by someone as to where our destination would be.
20:24
Speaker 4: So he knew exactly where to go, where to find us,
20:27
Speaker 4: and that includes that night we had gone to a
20:29
Speaker 4: comedy show first before we went to Roxbury to go dancing.
20:32
Speaker 4: We get into Roxbury and there he is, We leave
20:35
Speaker 4: Roxbury and what you do follows us home. So there
20:38
Speaker 4: was a pattern.
20:39
Speaker 1: This is about it. I mean they even had an
20:41
Speaker 1: agreement in place.
20:42
Speaker 2: Hey, when we both show up at the same place
20:46
Speaker 2: at the same time, the one who got their first
20:48
Speaker 2: gets to stay. So obviously this had happened so many
20:51
Speaker 2: times they had to come up with some type of
20:53
Speaker 2: an agreement A truce of sorts.
21:02
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
21:08
Speaker 2: Another thing that you just mentioned that you think other
21:13
Speaker 2: people could have been riting you out. I started to say,
21:16
Speaker 2: hold on, Slammy, wait a minute, don't make this a
21:19
Speaker 2: big conspiracy that didn't happen. But you know, when it
21:23
Speaker 2: comes to Simpson, he had so many followers and so
21:26
Speaker 2: many hangers on and so many friends, it's entirely possible
21:32
Speaker 2: that they would call me and go, hey, your wife's here,
21:35
Speaker 2: although they were completely separated at that point.
21:39
Speaker 1: Guys, it didn't end there. Listen.
21:45
Speaker 3: Keith meets Nicole Aspen, Colorado. Zlimzowitch is director of operations
21:50
Speaker 3: for Metsaluna Restaurant chains California locations and Aspen. Keith returns
21:54
Speaker 3: to Los Angeles and he and Nicole begin dating. Keith
21:57
Speaker 3: and Nicole constantly under attack as Simpson stocks and harrasses
22:01
Speaker 3: the couple. During a dinner out in Metsalona and Brentwood,
22:05
Speaker 3: Keith and Nicole mortified to see Simpson pull up in
22:08
Speaker 3: front of the restaurant.
22:10
Speaker 5: Nicole was there, Keith was there. The defendant suddenly showed up,
22:13
Speaker 5: drove up in front of the restaurant, got out of
22:15
Speaker 5: the car, walked up to the table where there was
22:17
Speaker 5: seated and put his hands on and said, I'm O. J. Simpson,
22:20
Speaker 5: and she's still my wife when she filed for divorce
22:22
Speaker 5: and moved out of his house.
22:26
Speaker 4: That was intimidate.
22:32
Speaker 1: No one over here now and the three two, five,
22:34
Speaker 1: GrITT and a green.
22:35
Speaker 4: He's back, Timplon, I.
22:38
Speaker 8: Think you know his records be over here, throwing him over.
22:44
Speaker 1: What kind of cardie? He's in a white cronkle, always looking.
22:48
Speaker 2: To her here.
22:51
Speaker 1: The nine on one calls escalate, escalate, escalate.
22:54
Speaker 2: Nothing was ever done, and now she's dead joining us
22:59
Speaker 2: tonight a man that truly loved her and that she loved.
23:03
Speaker 2: In return, Keith Slums, which new book stalked it could
23:08
Speaker 2: have been me, and he's totally right.
23:11
Speaker 1: I want to look very quickly at what we were
23:14
Speaker 1: just viewing.
23:15
Speaker 2: And that's Darden's argument to the jury because I want
23:18
Speaker 2: to watch Simpson. This is Darden describing another incident where
23:23
Speaker 2: Simpson shows up where Nicole and Keith are.
23:27
Speaker 1: Let's watch.
23:30
Speaker 4: That's a messalone.
23:34
Speaker 5: Nicole was there, Keith was there. The defendant suddenly showed up,
23:37
Speaker 5: drove up in front of the restaurant, got out of
23:39
Speaker 5: the car, walked up to the table where there was
23:41
Speaker 5: seated that put his hands on and said, I'm OJ Simpson,
23:44
Speaker 5: and she's still my wife when she filed for divorce
23:46
Speaker 5: and moved out of his house.
23:50
Speaker 1: That's what I wanted to say. That's what I want
23:52
Speaker 1: to see.
23:52
Speaker 2: When Darden says she filed for divorce and moved out
23:54
Speaker 2: of the house, He's like, did you see that? I mean?
23:59
Speaker 2: And another thing I've noticed when I was watching him
24:02
Speaker 2: during the trial and Keith, you were called as a
24:04
Speaker 2: witness for both the state and the defense, so I'm
24:07
Speaker 2: going to get into but I notice every time it
24:10
Speaker 2: got sticky for Simpson, he would.
24:13
Speaker 1: Like suddenly start writing notes. I would have loved to
24:15
Speaker 1: see those notes. I did it come in get me.
24:18
Speaker 1: But he would look away from the journey start writing notes.
24:21
Speaker 2: So I would always know when I was watching the
24:23
Speaker 2: trial at the time that whatever was happening that would
24:27
Speaker 2: make Simpsons act like he was taking legal notes was
24:30
Speaker 2: something that was damaging to the defense.
24:33
Speaker 1: I want to move forward. Guys, listen to this.
24:37
Speaker 3: After the incident at Metzaluna, when Keith refuses to back
24:40
Speaker 3: down to Simpson, Nicole opens up and shares her life
24:44
Speaker 3: of abuse with Simpson. As the couple continues to date,
24:48
Speaker 3: Simpson stalks Keith and Nicole wherever they go, showing up
24:51
Speaker 3: at every restaurant in the nightclub, hiding in bushes and
24:54
Speaker 3: watching through windows, making it impossible for Nicole to have
24:58
Speaker 3: a romantic relationships.
25:00
Speaker 1: Keith Zlamzowitch, author of a brand new book, Stalked It
25:02
Speaker 1: could have been me?
25:04
Speaker 2: Keith, when did she first tell you that Simpson had
25:07
Speaker 2: been beating her for years?
25:13
Speaker 4: Very early on? Actually, when I got to Los Angeles
25:16
Speaker 4: and we started the dating thing, we became and as
25:20
Speaker 4: these incidents of stalking started to present themselves, we were
25:25
Speaker 4: living it in real time, so we had this sort
25:29
Speaker 4: of bond. She understood I was going through the same
25:32
Speaker 4: thing she had gone through in the past, So she
25:34
Speaker 4: started to tell me about certain incidents between them, beatings,
25:39
Speaker 4: you know, control, all his possessiveness, personal stuff that I
25:44
Speaker 4: think she felt at that time because we had a
25:47
Speaker 4: bond from what we were going through together, so she
25:50
Speaker 4: opened up about everything, and I think she opened up
25:53
Speaker 4: more to me than she did to a lot of people,
25:55
Speaker 4: maybe even some of her family. You know, she wasn't
25:58
Speaker 4: very proud of of some of the stuff that had
26:02
Speaker 4: happened to her in the past. So some of the
26:03
Speaker 4: stuff she kept inside she shared with me because we
26:07
Speaker 4: were living it in real time. She also was visiting
26:10
Speaker 4: a psychologist at the time. We used to almost laugh
26:12
Speaker 4: about it because the psychologist gave her a book entitled
26:16
Speaker 4: something to the effect Women Who Love Men who Hate Them.
26:20
Speaker 4: And I remember she used to have that book at
26:22
Speaker 4: the house and she'd read from it and talk to
26:24
Speaker 4: me about it a little bit, and she was trying
26:26
Speaker 4: to figure out what it was that kept her with
26:30
Speaker 4: him all those years.
26:31
Speaker 2: At the hands of it did that Nicole Brown was
26:34
Speaker 2: not proud of things that had happened to her.
26:39
Speaker 7: Like what.
26:43
Speaker 4: Like beatings. I described some of them in the book.
26:46
Speaker 4: There are times when they'd be on a trip together,
26:49
Speaker 4: a business trip, and he'd leave the room and he'd
26:51
Speaker 4: come back and she'd know that he was with another woman,
26:53
Speaker 4: and she would confront him and she'd be beaten and
26:56
Speaker 4: locked in a closet. That happened more than once, and
27:01
Speaker 4: she told me about those. So obviously she wasn't very
27:04
Speaker 4: proud that she was still around after some of those incidents.
27:08
Speaker 4: But it was her family, it was the children, it
27:11
Speaker 4: was the thought of having that family unit together that
27:15
Speaker 4: kept her around all those years and ultimately led to
27:17
Speaker 4: the reconciliation. The failed reconciliation that cost her her life.
27:22
Speaker 1: Leads me to another ship got back with. Did her
27:25
Speaker 1: family encourage her to stay with Simpson.
27:31
Speaker 4: No, I don't believe that. I know that they liked OJ. Initially.
27:37
Speaker 4: OJ was very charming. There were two Ojs and this
27:40
Speaker 4: is something she told me directly. There's two OJ Simpson's Keith.
27:44
Speaker 4: There's the public one that everybody sees, and there's a
27:47
Speaker 4: private one that only I see. And you don't never
27:50
Speaker 4: want to be left alone with the private one because
27:52
Speaker 4: you don't know what he's capable of. I mean, we
27:54
Speaker 4: had that conversation. So I think the family thought OJ
28:00
Speaker 4: was a nicer guy than he really was. I mean,
28:03
Speaker 4: they were aware a few incidents. Obviously, Denise testified to
28:06
Speaker 4: several domestic violence incidents that Nicole told her about. But
28:11
Speaker 4: I can't get in the middle of the family dynamic
28:13
Speaker 4: and tell you exactly what they were thinking. But I
28:16
Speaker 4: know Denise, you know, was witnessed to from Nicole telling
28:20
Speaker 4: her several incidents.
28:21
Speaker 1: Did they take money from Simpson her family?
28:28
Speaker 4: I don't know that they took money. I know that
28:31
Speaker 4: it's widely reported that they helped Nicole's father with I
28:36
Speaker 4: believe it was a hurtz rent a car franchise that
28:40
Speaker 4: you know, he ultimately made some money. What from so
28:43
Speaker 4: I think that happened. I never heard anything like he
28:47
Speaker 4: you know, provided them with cash for a house or
28:49
Speaker 4: anything like that. And I don't think that was the case.
28:51
Speaker 4: I mean, lou and Judy were salt of the earth
28:55
Speaker 4: people they met well.
28:57
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know what, I think they stood.
28:59
Speaker 2: For the door that people make those claims against her
29:03
Speaker 2: family to somehow, I mean I see it all the time.
29:07
Speaker 1: Somehow blame the victims. It's their fault.
29:11
Speaker 2: They were leeches, they took money, they encouraged it, and ooh, he.
29:15
Speaker 1: Lost his temper and killed her.
29:17
Speaker 2: It's just total crap, Doctor Bethany Marshall, this brings up
29:21
Speaker 2: another issue, if you could touch on it very quickly.
29:25
Speaker 1: Why is it the woman feels ashamed of what quote.
29:29
Speaker 2: Happened to her. It's like ooh, a trip that happened
29:32
Speaker 2: to me. No, it didn't happen to her. Someone physically
29:38
Speaker 2: assaulted her, beat her to a pulp, and would lock
29:41
Speaker 2: her in the closet, which is a new to us.
29:44
Speaker 1: That's something I didn't know would lock her in a closet.
29:47
Speaker 2: Now, look again, that's a trial lawyer, but that means
29:50
Speaker 2: something to lock somebody in a closet.
29:56
Speaker 6: Well, he again, he wanted total control and dominance over her,
29:59
Speaker 6: So to locker in a closet is to have her
30:02
Speaker 6: all for himself and also to terrify her and discourage
30:05
Speaker 6: her from interacting with other people. Nancy, this self blame
30:09
Speaker 6: that victims do. I think of it as a crisis
30:13
Speaker 6: of boundaries, meaning the victim knows that something is severely
30:18
Speaker 6: wrong with the perpetrator. The perpetrator is disregulated, obsessed, self preoccupied,
30:25
Speaker 6: relating to the victim through power instead of love and affection.
30:29
Speaker 6: But the victim feels that it's her job to fix it,
30:32
Speaker 6: and if she can't fix it, then she has failed
30:35
Speaker 6: in some way. In some ways, these men pull the
30:39
Speaker 6: women in kind of a mothering role. That becomes the
30:42
Speaker 6: woman's job to keep the man's world safe and predictable,
30:47
Speaker 6: to make him okay. So when she can't do it,
30:51
Speaker 6: when that task breaks down, she then falls into self blame. Also,
30:56
Speaker 6: there's so much humiliation going on, Nancy, it's almost like
30:59
Speaker 6: a form of brain where she begins to feel that
31:02
Speaker 6: she's a failure, because you hear.
31:04
Speaker 2: What she said to Keith that there were two ojs
31:08
Speaker 2: when everybody sees in public and the one that she
31:11
Speaker 2: sees in private. I have seen that in court. Of course,
31:16
Speaker 2: by the time I get it, it's a domestic homicide.
31:20
Speaker 1: But no one would ever think this guy was the devil.
31:24
Speaker 1: The devil when he's alone with the woman at home.
31:29
Speaker 2: He's so charming and charismatic, some people even think attractive physically.
31:34
Speaker 1: It could not be more of a dichotomy, you.
31:40
Speaker 6: Know, Nancy, I thought of sociopathy, right, the personality disorder
31:44
Speaker 6: of being a sociopath when Keith was talking about this,
31:47
Speaker 6: because one of the criterias is that the sociopath has
31:52
Speaker 6: a thin veneer of affability. They're charming, they're outgoing because
31:57
Speaker 6: of how people really tend to like them. At the
32:00
Speaker 6: minute they get their feelings hurt or they feel diminished,
32:04
Speaker 6: minimized in some way, that veneer cracks, and what you
32:09
Speaker 6: see underneath is a very cold, calculated interior. So he
32:15
Speaker 6: was calculating, probably for a long long time, how he
32:19
Speaker 6: was going to put a stop to all of this,
32:22
Speaker 6: and we know especially.
32:23
Speaker 1: You get what we're doing tonight, right.
32:26
Speaker 2: I'm not only talking about your new book Stalked, but
32:29
Speaker 2: I'm trying to tell and I want you to help
32:33
Speaker 2: me tell it along with Bethany to other women.
32:38
Speaker 1: They think nobody's gonna believe me. This is somehow my fault.
32:42
Speaker 1: I screwed up. I don't want my family to know.
32:44
Speaker 1: I'm gonna wear a high neck and long sleeves and
32:47
Speaker 1: long pants. I don't want anybody to see the bruises.
32:49
Speaker 1: I don't want my children to know. I don't want
32:51
Speaker 1: to mess up, mess up my family. I don't want
32:54
Speaker 1: to do that. It's all technical, legal term crap bs.
33:00
Speaker 1: They will be beaten. It statistically will not get better.
33:04
Speaker 1: It won't. It will get worse. I don't like being
33:07
Speaker 1: the harbinger of doom, but.
33:09
Speaker 2: I know what the statistics tell me, and the woman
33:12
Speaker 2: will live through it for the rest of her life
33:15
Speaker 2: if she stays, and even worse, the children will see it,
33:20
Speaker 2: hear it.
33:21
Speaker 1: Mommy's a whoreror, mommy's a bitch, and they will grow
33:25
Speaker 1: up numb to that and think it's okay.
33:29
Speaker 2: The girl growing up will end up with a man
33:32
Speaker 2: that beats her Statistically and the boy growing up. He
33:35
Speaker 2: starts off like a little angel will grow up to
33:39
Speaker 2: beat someone.
33:40
Speaker 1: Statistically, this is true. You've got to tell this story, Keith.
33:46
Speaker 1: Do you hear me?
33:49
Speaker 4: You hear you? And that's part of the reason I
33:51
Speaker 4: wrote the book. Over the years, certainly since the advent
33:55
Speaker 4: of social media, I've been reached out to by numerous
33:58
Speaker 4: women around the country and some overseas that followed the story,
34:03
Speaker 4: followed Nicole in my plight and appreciated what I did
34:08
Speaker 4: to try to defend her and pick up for her.
34:10
Speaker 4: Made a lot of I've helped a lot of women
34:13
Speaker 4: out of circumstances where they've come to me and said,
34:16
Speaker 4: you know, you gave me the strength to get out
34:18
Speaker 4: of this relationship when I didn't think I had that,
34:21
Speaker 4: and I'm still friends with some of them to this day.
34:23
Speaker 4: So I wanted this to be a sort of wake
34:26
Speaker 4: up call for some women who are going through this
34:28
Speaker 4: right now as we speak, who may be watching this,
34:30
Speaker 4: to know that it doesn't change. Guys like that are
34:35
Speaker 4: going to be like that. They do not change. When
34:39
Speaker 4: OJ tried his reconciliation with Nicole fifteen months after I
34:43
Speaker 4: had met her and we had been so close during
34:45
Speaker 4: that time, he took her away to Mexico. She was
34:48
Speaker 4: at her parents' house for Easter weekend, I believe it was,
34:52
Speaker 4: and he knew she would be there, so he showed
34:54
Speaker 4: up unannounced, uninvited, and tried to convince her he had
34:59
Speaker 4: been to therap, he had changed, he was a new man,
35:02
Speaker 4: and he swept her away to Mexico to spend some
35:04
Speaker 4: time together to try to get her back. She fell
35:07
Speaker 4: into it, and you know, sadly, all Nick really wanted
35:11
Speaker 4: was her family. She wanted that family unit together, and
35:15
Speaker 4: we talked about this many times, and she fell back
35:18
Speaker 4: into his trap of I've changed, let me show you
35:22
Speaker 4: how good I can be. And she called me and
35:23
Speaker 4: we had long talks about it, and she decided she
35:26
Speaker 4: was going to give it a try. And that's when
35:28
Speaker 4: our incredible friendship that we had developed came to an
35:32
Speaker 4: end because he never got over me. And then fast
35:36
Speaker 4: forward to October that year when the nine to one
35:38
Speaker 4: one tape occurs. Something else you have to remember is
35:42
Speaker 4: he did all this in front of the children. He
35:45
Speaker 4: belittled Nicole over the year and a half about making
35:49
Speaker 4: love to me with the children in the house. That
35:51
Speaker 4: was his big thing. Look what you did. The kids
35:54
Speaker 4: are here, Look what you did. You're trash, You're dirty,
35:57
Speaker 4: You're filthy. All the things he said to make her
36:00
Speaker 4: feel that way. But look at the facts. He kicked
36:05
Speaker 4: in the door and threatened to beat her when the
36:07
Speaker 4: children were there. He killed her and Ron Goldman when
36:11
Speaker 4: the children were there and the door was open and
36:13
Speaker 4: they were sleeping right upstairs. And if they hadn't found
36:17
Speaker 4: those bodies, the children would have woken up. Tommy was
36:22
Speaker 4: Keith your father?
36:25
Speaker 2: And women out there are looking at Nicole Brown, you know,
36:29
Speaker 2: before she was murdered by Simpson, thinking oh, she's so beautiful,
36:33
Speaker 2: she's so glamorous, she's so perfect.
36:36
Speaker 1: She's got this perfect life, this beautiful home, gorgeous.
36:39
Speaker 2: Home children Simpson, and they think, you know, why can't
36:44
Speaker 2: I have a life like that?
36:46
Speaker 1: And the reality is abuse, And that seems to be
36:50
Speaker 1: sugarcoating it. I mean, downright beatings.
36:53
Speaker 2: Breaking arms, noses, blood gushing out of your mouth, losing teeth.
37:00
Speaker 1: That's the reality.
37:01
Speaker 2: And if it could happen to someone like Nicole Brown,
37:05
Speaker 2: it can happen to anybody.
37:06
Speaker 1: Speaking of the other O. J. Simpson, take a lesson
37:13
Speaker 1: someone over here now three two five.
37:15
Speaker 4: Britton agree, he's that?
37:17
Speaker 3: Please?
37:17
Speaker 4: Okay?
37:18
Speaker 8: What does okay, Jimpson?
37:20
Speaker 4: I think you know his record?
37:22
Speaker 5: Over here?
37:23
Speaker 3: What is he doing here?
37:27
Speaker 4: Over?
37:29
Speaker 1: He's in a white bronc Broke.
37:33
Speaker 5: Wait a minute.
37:34
Speaker 6: What's your name?
37:36
Speaker 4: Okay?
37:36
Speaker 5: Is either sports Canter or whatever?
37:38
Speaker 6: Yeah?
37:39
Speaker 5: Okay, wait a minute?
37:41
Speaker 4: What is he? Is?
37:48
Speaker 9: Mister Simpson kissing Denise Brown? Because mister Dtha Brown, it
37:52
Speaker 9: is mister Lewis. Brown's talking to a friend Rex his
38:01
Speaker 9: son Justin let me kisses.
38:02
Speaker 3: After Sydney's dance recital, Nicole, the children, and her family
38:06
Speaker 3: leaves Simpson behind at the school and go to dinner
38:08
Speaker 3: with friends at Metzaluna in Brentwood. Nichole's mother accidentally leaves
38:12
Speaker 3: her glasses behind, and Ron Goldman, a friend of Nicole
38:15
Speaker 3: who works at the restaurant, volunteers to drop the glasses
38:18
Speaker 3: off at Nichole's house. Goldman leaves Metsaluna at nine forty
38:21
Speaker 3: five pm.
38:22
Speaker 7: Non invited to family dinner at Mezzaluna, Simpson grabs McDonald's
38:26
Speaker 7: with his house guest, Kayln Cato. The pair returned to
38:30
Speaker 7: Simpson's home around nine forty pm. Around ten forty pm, Kayln,
38:34
Speaker 7: here's several thumps outside his room and goes to investigate,
38:38
Speaker 7: but gets distracted by the limo waiting outside Simpson's gate,
38:41
Speaker 7: hired to take him for the airport.
38:43
Speaker 2: Closing arguments by my former co anchor Johnny Cochran's from
38:46
Speaker 2: our friends at Court TV. And you know what they're
38:49
Speaker 2: doing right there at Keith's Lumsawitch, author of a brand
38:51
Speaker 2: new book, stalked Cochrane, brilliant, great trial lawyer. You'd have
38:58
Speaker 2: a jury eating out his hand. He's portraying Simpson as
39:02
Speaker 2: being charming and in with the family. That Simpson kissed Denise,
39:08
Speaker 2: he kissed JUDITHA, he kissed mister Brown, picks up his
39:12
Speaker 2: son Justin, his son with Nicole and kisses him.
39:17
Speaker 1: Oh what a great family guy. They all love him.
39:21
Speaker 2: I know exactly what Johnny Cochrane, god rest Is Soul
39:25
Speaker 2: is doing.
39:25
Speaker 1: This guy would never look at him. The whole family
39:29
Speaker 1: loves him. He wasn't beating Nicole Bs, Yes he was.
39:33
Speaker 1: That's from Court TV, Keith. That's what Cochrane is doing
39:37
Speaker 1: right there. He's a puppet master.
39:41
Speaker 4: Absolutely, But that goes back to what I was saying earlier.
39:45
Speaker 4: There's two O. J.
39:46
Speaker 3: Simpsons.
39:47
Speaker 4: He's in public. There he's around the kids, he's around
39:50
Speaker 4: the family. So you're gonna see that O. J. Simpson,
39:52
Speaker 4: You're not going to see the private one. That was
39:55
Speaker 4: the one who beat Nicole and the one who stalked
39:57
Speaker 4: us and followed us and made our life possible to
40:00
Speaker 4: be together and miserable. So it just goes right into
40:04
Speaker 4: what I was saying about the ches.
40:05
Speaker 2: Is all of this is happening the night Nicole and
40:12
Speaker 2: Ron are murdered. There was the piano recitaled, and the
40:16
Speaker 2: family goes to Messaluna after he's not invited, and his
40:19
Speaker 2: rage begins to build, and this is where it ends.
40:23
Speaker 3: Listen a neighbor's seas Nicolls white Akita Cato wandering the
40:27
Speaker 3: neighborhood alone, barking, agitated, and on closer inspection they notice
40:31
Speaker 3: he has bloody pause.
40:39
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Gray.
40:45
Speaker 3: A neighbors seas Nicolls, white Akita Cato wandering the neighborhood alone, barking, agitated,
40:51
Speaker 3: and on closer inspection they notice he has bloody Pause.
40:54
Speaker 3: The neighbor follows Cato to investigate, discovering Nicole and Ron's
40:58
Speaker 3: bodies at twelve ten am.
41:00
Speaker 1: Wondering the neighborhood covered in blood.
41:04
Speaker 2: Nichole's blood, her head practically cut off her body in
41:07
Speaker 2: the front yard, but no one believes Simpson could have
41:13
Speaker 2: done it.
41:13
Speaker 1: We know he hides in the bushes and stalks her home.
41:16
Speaker 2: He sees Ron Goldman. He thinks, Oh, they're the whores
41:21
Speaker 2: with another man. I'm sure that's what he was thinking.
41:25
Speaker 2: Nothing could have been further from the truth, so Lapd
41:29
Speaker 2: heads to Simpson's home.
41:34
Speaker 7: Detectives, Furman, and Fanatter go to simpsons nearby home to
41:38
Speaker 7: notify him of his wife's death. Furman sees what appears
41:41
Speaker 7: to be bloodstains on Simpson's Ford Bronco and decides to
41:44
Speaker 7: jump the fence to gain access to Simpson's property. Fanatter
41:48
Speaker 7: declares Simpson's home a crime scene and goes to secure
41:51
Speaker 7: a search warrant for the house around seven am.
41:54
Speaker 3: Simpson leaves home at eleven ten PM to catch an
41:56
Speaker 3: eleven forty five flight to Chicago, lands by thirty am,
42:00
Speaker 3: backing into the O'Hare Plaza hotel. At six fifteen. Seven am,
42:03
Speaker 3: detectives inform Simpson of the murders over the phone and
42:06
Speaker 3: ask him to return to La Simpson flies back June
42:09
Speaker 3: thirteenth and his handcuffed. On arrival, Simson his question for hours,
42:13
Speaker 3: an investigator's photograph.
42:15
Speaker 1: On his bronco cut on his hand. How did this
42:20
Speaker 1: guy walk free?
42:22
Speaker 2: And then there's the NFMUS slow speed chase for Simpson
42:27
Speaker 2: basically holds himself hostage.
42:29
Speaker 1: Remember that, because I'll never forget it.
42:34
Speaker 3: What are you reporting?
42:35
Speaker 1: One?
42:36
Speaker 3: I have in the car?
42:38
Speaker 1: Okay, where are you free? I'm coming up to five freeways.
42:42
Speaker 3: Okay, right now, we all we allkay, but.
42:44
Speaker 1: You gotta sell a brass back off. He still laughs.
42:47
Speaker 2: He's got to go through his hair.
42:49
Speaker 1: Okay, hold on a minute, Micah, let me hold on
42:55
Speaker 1: a moment.
42:55
Speaker 4: There's everything else, Okay, everything right now, go everything.
43:05
Speaker 2: That's all.
43:05
Speaker 5: That's all. We have got.
43:12
Speaker 3: Something, all right.
43:14
Speaker 1: I cannot believe the arrogance of these two. You know
43:19
Speaker 1: who I am?
43:21
Speaker 7: What?
43:22
Speaker 1: No, the dispatcher does not know who you are.
43:24
Speaker 2: Callings for your first two initials, and he says he's
43:27
Speaker 2: going to his mother's.
43:29
Speaker 1: This guy murder two people?
43:32
Speaker 2: Why is he even out walking around on bonds holding
43:35
Speaker 2: himself hostage?
43:37
Speaker 1: Uh?
43:38
Speaker 2: No, anybody else they would have police would have overtaken,
43:42
Speaker 2: gotten them out of that car and put them face
43:45
Speaker 2: down on the ground.
43:46
Speaker 1: But no, not Simpson. And it all culminates in this.
43:54
Speaker 7: Matter people versus Orienthal James Simpson. You plead to count
43:59
Speaker 7: one and two.
44:00
Speaker 4: Absolutely what Simson is.
44:07
Speaker 10: This is oj Simpson's one day in court by your decision,
44:15
Speaker 10: control of his very life in your hands. Treat you carefully,
44:20
Speaker 10: treated fairly, be fair, don't be part of this continuing
44:25
Speaker 10: cover up. Do the right thing, remembering that if it
44:29
Speaker 10: doesn't fit, you must acquit.
44:31
Speaker 8: In the matter of the People of the State of
44:33
Speaker 8: California versus Orenthal James Simpson, Case number b A zero
44:37
Speaker 8: ninety seven two one one, we the jury and the
44:39
Speaker 8: ambolved and title action find the defendant or Orenthal James Simpson,
44:44
Speaker 8: not guilty of a crime of murder in violation of
44:46
Speaker 8: penal cult Section one eighty seven a A felony upon
44:50
Speaker 8: Nicole Brown Simpson our.
44:51
Speaker 1: Forends a Court TV. Were you surprised at the verdict?
44:56
Speaker 4: Keith, Yes, Now I was concerned that the jury was
45:04
Speaker 4: going to buy into Johnny Cochrane's both for the lack
45:08
Speaker 4: of a better word, but I wasn't over it.
45:11
Speaker 1: You were actually a pall bearer. You carried Nichole's coffin.
45:18
Speaker 1: What was going through your mind? You knew he murdered her.
45:28
Speaker 4: This is almost a surreal, out of body experience. You
45:31
Speaker 4: got to remember the murders took place on a Sunday night,
45:34
Speaker 4: Monday morning. The funeral was on a Thursday. It was
45:38
Speaker 4: so lightning speed. I flew out there immediately. The family
45:42
Speaker 4: asked me if i'd be a ballbearer. I didn't see
45:44
Speaker 4: them because I flew into Los Angeles the night before.
45:48
Speaker 4: So the first interaction I had face to face with
45:51
Speaker 4: the Brown family was as holding the basket at the funeral.
45:57
Speaker 4: And that's when one of the sisters came up to
46:00
Speaker 4: me and said, do you realize what we were talking
46:02
Speaker 4: about that night? And I said, no, I don't, She
46:05
Speaker 4: said you she was talking about Surprise and Aspen. So
46:10
Speaker 4: imagine my heartbreak. I hadn't spoken in Nicole for six
46:14
Speaker 4: months or so, since that infamous nine one one call
46:18
Speaker 4: where we weren't allowed to speak anymore because of OJ
46:22
Speaker 4: still loving her, still thinking about her every day. She's dead,
46:27
Speaker 4: she's gone. I'm holding her casket. I'm standing two feet
46:29
Speaker 4: away from the guy I know in my heart and
46:31
Speaker 4: mine murdered her. And I'm told that she was thinking
46:35
Speaker 4: about me the night she was murdered. I was. I
46:38
Speaker 4: can't even tell you the emotions that went through me
46:40
Speaker 4: at that point. So it was crazy. And then as
46:45
Speaker 4: we went down to the burial site, I actually had
46:48
Speaker 4: to stand next to oj Simpson almost elbow to elbow
46:52
Speaker 4: for an hour or whatever time it took to read
46:56
Speaker 4: the rites of Passage and everything that took place down there,
47:00
Speaker 4: knowing what had happened, and having to stand next to him.
47:04
Speaker 4: So just imagine my emotions during that whole thing.
47:07
Speaker 7: It was.
47:08
Speaker 4: It's hard to describe. I try to do that in
47:09
Speaker 4: the book. I do my best job of trying to
47:12
Speaker 4: walk the reader through exactly what I was feeling in
47:15
Speaker 4: my emotions. But it was crazy.
47:20
Speaker 1: Case you never married after all these.
47:23
Speaker 4: Years, ever married, never had children. I don't know if
47:31
Speaker 4: that's strictly because of my relationship with Nicole, but I
47:34
Speaker 4: never got over it. My life turned into a circus, obviously,
47:38
Speaker 4: with what was going on. It took me years to
47:40
Speaker 4: get over that, and I always kept a place for
47:44
Speaker 4: in my heart and I just never could get that
47:46
Speaker 4: attached to anyone else from that point on. So I'm
47:49
Speaker 4: pushing sixty five now, I'm still single, and I have
47:54
Speaker 4: a lot of great memories, but this tragic event shaped
47:57
Speaker 4: my life, my entire adult or not.
48:00
Speaker 1: I know exactly how you feel.
48:05
Speaker 4: I know you do it.
48:08
Speaker 1: This book is amazing.
48:12
Speaker 2: I'm so honored that you joined us, Keith, this book
48:17
Speaker 2: Stalked it could have been me, And there's just so
48:22
Speaker 2: much more to say beyond what we've talked about tonight,
48:26
Speaker 2: even beyond.
48:27
Speaker 1: What's in your book.
48:29
Speaker 2: Just I'm very grateful for you shining a light on
48:34
Speaker 2: this plague in our world of women being abused so
48:40
Speaker 2: horribly and ending up dead and their children destined to
48:46
Speaker 2: repeat the pattern. Stalked it could have been me. Tonight,
48:52
Speaker 2: we remember all the women who proceeded and followed Nicole Brown,
49:01
Speaker 2: victims to domestic violence. Not just them, but they're children
49:08
Speaker 2: victims as well. And we honor the women that find
49:14
Speaker 2: the strength to speak out. They are all our American heroes.
49:22
Speaker 2: Nancy Gray signing off, Goodbye friend,