Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / PROLIFIC INFANT KILLER NICU NURSE WHINES BEHIND BARS, BEING MOCKED BY INMATES OVER HER NEW NETFLIX DOCUMENTARY

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PROLIFIC INFANT KILLER NICU NURSE WHINES BEHIND BARS, BEING MOCKED BY INMATES OVER HER NEW NETFLIX DOCUMENTARY · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: Well it's Saturday night, and boy, do I have something
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  Speaker 2: special for you. Convicted in seven murders of infants, one
• 0:17
  Speaker 2: of the most prolific infant killers in the world, now
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  Speaker 2: has her own documentary. Now that's special, right, One of
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  Speaker 2: the most prolific child killers that ever lived found guilty
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  Speaker 2: of murdering seven infants as a neo natal nurse. So
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: why why does Lucy let Be get her own documentary?
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: I'm Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories. I want to
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  Speaker 2: thank you for being with us. Lucy let Be at
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  Speaker 2: her crime so horrible it sparked insane media interest. All
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: the while she's stating, I feel like I have only
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  Speaker 2: ever done my very best for those babies. She did
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  Speaker 2: that while crying during a police interview. Seven infants, five boys,
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  Speaker 2: two girls lost their lives to Lucy let Be and
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  Speaker 2: those are the ones we know of. Yet there is
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  Speaker 2: a documentary about Lucy let Be. This is what really happened.
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  Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friend Rita Chabwickerbardi.
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  Speaker 3: They thought their son was in safe hands with nurse
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  Speaker 3: let Be, but a short time later they were told
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  Speaker 3: he was dangerously ill and they rushed back to find
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  Speaker 3: doctors trying to save him.
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  Speaker 4: We were taken in and we were told to talk
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  Speaker 4: to him and hold his hongue. And then the conversation
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  Speaker 4: with the consultant and she said, you know, we're going
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  Speaker 4: to stop.
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  Speaker 5: It's not helping.
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  Speaker 4: Were we wye in your arms?
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  Speaker 1: And more from reader Chakrabardi.
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  Speaker 3: Mum was taking milk to them when she heard one
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  Speaker 3: of her sons crying loudly.
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  Speaker 4: They had bloods around his mouth, and Lucy was there
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  Speaker 4: but fashing about, not really not doing anything. Lucy said,
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  Speaker 4: don't worry, the redistrub was coming. And when she told
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  Speaker 4: me to.
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  Speaker 3: Go back to the ward, the baby's mum left him
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  Speaker 3: in this intensive care area and went to call her husband.
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  Speaker 4: The crying, I've never heard anything like it since.
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  Speaker 1: It was screaming.
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  Speaker 4: It was screaming, and I was like, what what's the
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  Speaker 4: matter with them?
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  Speaker 3: Legally we can't identify the families in this case. The
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  Speaker 3: stories are distressing.
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  Speaker 2: And the babies don't have names. This is the mom
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  Speaker 2: and dad of babies E and F from our friends
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  Speaker 2: at BBC.
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  Speaker 1: I'm just trying to get my head around what I'm hearing.
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  Speaker 2: Hearing your child screaming and not understanding what was wrong.
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  Speaker 2: You know, Alexis Tereschuk joining me investigative reporter with Crime
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  Speaker 2: online dot Com. Alexis, you and I both went through
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  Speaker 2: a lot to give birth, right, and.
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  Speaker 6: You were by my side the whole time.
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  Speaker 1: That's right.
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  Speaker 2: Don't made me start crying because now I have this
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  Speaker 2: beautiful boy.
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  Speaker 1: That's amazing. I'm thinking back to these when we.
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  Speaker 2: Were in neonatal nick cut neonatal intensive care, well, the
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  Speaker 2: children were and I was in intensive care. But I
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  Speaker 2: was just thinking about when I would sit with them
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  Speaker 2: all day long until I was told I had to leave.
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  Speaker 2: Leaving them there and hearing them cry, it was just
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  Speaker 2: there's something about it. Never bothered me this way before
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  Speaker 2: I had twin, had the children, But now, even now,
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  Speaker 2: fifteen years later, when I hear a baby scream, it just, uh,
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  Speaker 2: it just turns me inside out. Did that happen to you?
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  Speaker 2: And I hear a baby scream? The impulse to run
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  Speaker 2: to the baby. I never had that before. I mean,
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  Speaker 2: I felt bad for the child. I was wondering what
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  Speaker 2: was wrong. But once you have a child, is it
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  Speaker 2: something instinctive? Is it physical? What is that?
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  Speaker 6: And even it is, it's a difference when you hear
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  Speaker 6: a cry of I'm hungry, I have a wet diaper,
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  Speaker 6: but when a child is in pain, you feel it
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  Speaker 6: so much more. Have some having my son and I
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  Speaker 6: know with you and how much you spent all of
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  Speaker 6: your time with them because they were so tiny and
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  Speaker 6: so little when they were born.
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  Speaker 1: You're right, Alexis Tereschuk.
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  Speaker 2: Karen Stark joining us a renowned psychologist in Manhattan, TV
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  Speaker 2: radio trauma expert consultant, and you can find her at
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  Speaker 2: Karenstark dot com. That's Karen with a C if you're
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  Speaker 2: trying to find her, Karen, is it physical? Because I
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  Speaker 2: never had that reaction before. I mean there were times
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  Speaker 2: in the district Attorney's office when a child was a victim.
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  Speaker 2: I would cry secretly, not front of the jury, about
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  Speaker 2: what happened to the child. But when you hear a
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  Speaker 2: baby screaming now, and for me, it didn't matter if
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  Speaker 2: it was a wet diepee or they were hungry. When
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  Speaker 2: I heard that scream, it literally would send chills all
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  Speaker 2: over me and I would have to just run to
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  Speaker 2: find out what was wrong and try to fix it.
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  Speaker 7: It's a hormone that is just between mothers and babies,
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  Speaker 7: and there are stories that perhaps you can relate to
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  Speaker 7: this where a mother gets up in the middle of
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  Speaker 7: the night and as soon as she opens her eyes,
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  Speaker 7: the baby starts to cry. And it says though the
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  Speaker 7: baby had communicated that, and that's the hormone that you
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  Speaker 7: have when you attached to a trial.
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  Speaker 2: I cannot imagine why I still have it fifteen years on.
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  Speaker 2: But that said, I'm just thinking about these parents that
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  Speaker 2: are told there's something wrong with the baby, and the
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  Speaker 2: baby is screaming, and they leave the baby. They're told
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  Speaker 2: to leave the baby with the nurse, and the baby dies,
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  Speaker 2: not just one, not just two, but then another and
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  Speaker 2: another and another.
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  Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friends at Channel four.
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  Speaker 8: That's win boys known as babies L and M. We're
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  Speaker 8: just a day old. They both survived, but it took
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  Speaker 8: almost thirty minutes to restart Baby M's heart. Experts say
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  Speaker 8: was likely caused by air being injected into his bloodstream.
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  Speaker 8: His brother was poisoned with insulin. Their parents weren't told
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  Speaker 8: that for two years.
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  Speaker 6: We didn't know anything even afterwards, until the police came knocking.
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  Speaker 1: Air being injected into the bloodstream.
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  Speaker 2: Now I could understand one mistake but when one twin
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  Speaker 2: has air being injected into their bloodstream and the other
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  Speaker 2: twin is poisoned with insulin, that is no mistake for
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  Speaker 2: two babies, twins to be injected with potentially lethal substances.
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  Speaker 2: Joining me right now two renowned experts, Kat Thornton and
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  Speaker 2: our friend, doctor Kendall Crowns Doctor Kendall Crown's Chief medical Examiner,
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  Speaker 2: Terrant County. That's Fort Worth Lecturer, University Texas and Texas
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  Speaker 2: Christian University Medical School.
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  Speaker 1: Kat Thornton, She's.
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  Speaker 2: Got so many initials by her name, BSN, R N,
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  Speaker 2: I know what that one means, MT.
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  Speaker 1: I know what that one means. Neo Natal Nursing.
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  Speaker 2: Expert, Registered nurse, Forensic nurse expert with Goodoy Medical Forensics.
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  Speaker 1: Kat. Thank you so much for being with us. Kat.
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  Speaker 1: I'm just remembering all the weeks.
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  Speaker 2: Actually months that John, David and Lucy Lucy the longest,
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  Speaker 2: were in neonatal Intensive care unit and that was fifteen
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  Speaker 2: years ago. And do you know, Kat, I am still
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  Speaker 2: in touch with the nurses, some of them that took
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  Speaker 2: care of the twins. They I remember one day I
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  Speaker 2: was in ICU at the other end of the hospital.
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  Speaker 2: They were in Nick You, and I pretty sure I
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  Speaker 2: put on a pair of tights before I took off.
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  Speaker 1: I still had on the gown that's opening the back.
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  Speaker 2: Yes, I did definitely put on type before I made
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  Speaker 2: my way all through the securitiest route of the hospital
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  Speaker 2: to get to Nick you, and I was attached to
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  Speaker 2: one of the what do you say, kat a drip
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  Speaker 2: bag on a roller like a close hangars that really tall?
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  Speaker 9: Yeah, and ivy pump.
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  Speaker 1: That yes, listen.
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  Speaker 2: They didn't each se any of that law school all
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  Speaker 2: the way over there, and ultimately found out that I
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  Speaker 2: had set off the alarms by going through the wrong
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  Speaker 2: door leaving ICU. Okay, so I had ultimately had a
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  Speaker 2: trail of hospital police trying to find out how the
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  Speaker 2: alarm went off. But those neonatal nurses were amazing, incredible
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  Speaker 2: and I really believe no offense. Doctor Kendle crowns that
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  Speaker 2: I owe the twins lives to the neonatal nurses at
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  Speaker 2: Northside Hospital in Atlanta. I had been going to sign
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  Speaker 2: I in New York, but came home to visit my
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  Speaker 2: panm parents on a weekend and wouldn't you know, emergency
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  Speaker 2: see section and they I trusted them when I can't
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  Speaker 2: be there. It's a huge burden for a neonidal nurse.
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  Speaker 9: It is a burden and a huge responsibility and also
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  Speaker 9: a privilege to be able to care for these children
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  Speaker 9: at their most vulnerable states. And these families in their
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  Speaker 9: most vulnerable states. Many many of them have gone through
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  Speaker 9: all kinds of toil and trouble just trying to get
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  Speaker 9: pregnant and then to deliver early or to have complications
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  Speaker 9: during delivery. It's just heart wrenching for these families to
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  Speaker 9: not be able to go through a natural birth process
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  Speaker 9: and take your child home with you. But just as
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  Speaker 9: you said, Nancy, to leave them in the care of
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  Speaker 9: others who you really don't know, but you have to
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  Speaker 9: trust them. And the nic nurses are a very special
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  Speaker 9: special breed. The physicians, the nurses, all those care for
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  Speaker 9: those babies. So you had obviously a very good experience
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  Speaker 9: with the staff that cared for your twin.
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  Speaker 2: I really did, and you know, doctor Kendall Crowns. I
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  Speaker 2: do remember that these parents were told by a consultant
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  Speaker 2: that they should leave, but I felt that I would be.
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  Speaker 2: Lucy was in a lot worse shape than John David was,
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  Speaker 2: although they were both in really bad shape.
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  Speaker 1: Lucy only weighed.
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  Speaker 2: Two pounds Doctor Kendall Crowns, and I remember they thought
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  Speaker 2: she was going to be blind and there was a
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  Speaker 2: procedure where they actually had to put a needle into
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  Speaker 2: her eye, and the doctor and my husband said do
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  Speaker 2: you want to leave?
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  Speaker 1: Because they obviously thought I couldn't take it. I didn't
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  Speaker 1: think I could take it either, but I.
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  Speaker 2: Didn't think I could leave Lucy there to face that
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  Speaker 2: without her mother, even though she really didn't know me yet.
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  Speaker 1: It's so emotional.
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  Speaker 2: Doctor, just have you had that experience during your rotation
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  Speaker 2: or when you deal with child victims.
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  Speaker 1: It's just gut wrenching for the parents. I think more
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  Speaker 1: than anything, well.
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  Speaker 10: I think it's unfortunate when a child dies, and I
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  Speaker 10: think as a parent myself, it's hard to see when
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  Speaker 10: a life that has potential and so much hope associated
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  Speaker 10: with it is kind of tragically snuffed out at an
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  Speaker 10: early age. To me, king cases are the worst cases,
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  Speaker 10: especially in a child abuse where you know someone else
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  Speaker 10: could have raised that child, loved that child, adopted them
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  Speaker 10: and taking care of them, And in situations where any
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  Speaker 10: child is murdered, it's just horrible.
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  Speaker 2: The toll it takes on parents and they second guess
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  Speaker 2: every single thing, every move they made.
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  Speaker 1: Would it had changed the outcome?
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  Speaker 2: Would my baby, my twins, my triplets be alive today?
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  Speaker 1: Take a listener friends at.
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  Speaker 3: BBC On the unit, there were typically up to three
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  Speaker 3: deaths a year, but they have that number in the
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  Speaker 3: month of June alone, and the pattern continued with babies
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  Speaker 3: dying or coming close to death.
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  Speaker 11: No one suspected any foul play. After several unexpected and
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  Speaker 11: near deaths in just over half a year, a second
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  Speaker 11: review was ordered, with inspectors issuing concerns about staffing levels
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  Speaker 11: that summer hospital bosses described reaching a tipping point after
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  Speaker 11: the deaths of siblings Baby O and.
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  Speaker 2: P oh in p hold on A B C D
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  Speaker 2: E F G h I J K L M N
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  Speaker 2: O p Q. Seventeen Babies.
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  Speaker 1: Crime stories with Metty Grace.
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  Speaker 2: Lucy let Be found guilty of killing seven infants, five
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  Speaker 2: boys two girls in her care in the neonatal unit
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  Speaker 2: of Chester Hospital. During the trial, her coworkers testified they
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  Speaker 2: witnessed unusual behavior from a former nurse. She got way
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  Speaker 2: too interested in even planning the funerals of the babies.
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  Speaker 2: As we go to air we learned that Lucy let
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  Speaker 2: Be is on suicide watch right now, behind bars, after
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  Speaker 2: she was mocked by her prisonmates over the Netflix documentary
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  Speaker 2: about her case. Yes, jailed baby nurse Lucy let Be
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  Speaker 2: is being monitored around the clock after she was mocked
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  Speaker 2: made fun of over this documentary. And my only question
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  Speaker 2: is that made her suicidal, that people were mocking her,
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  Speaker 2: not the fact that she killed at least seven infants
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  Speaker 2: in her care. This is what we know happened to
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  Speaker 2: those babies. I guess in the NICKU Neonatal Intensive Care Unit,
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  Speaker 2: the children are already at such a high risk. Like
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  Speaker 2: I said, Lucy, My little Lucy was two pounds and
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  Speaker 2: we knew it was.
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  Speaker 1: A long shot.
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  Speaker 2: But north Side and the nick you nurses and doctors
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  Speaker 2: saved her and John David's lives. So when you have deaths,
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  Speaker 2: I guess that's expected, not happy, but expected in the NICKU.
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  Speaker 1: Would you agree with that, cat.
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  Speaker 9: Well, we never like to say it's expected, but some
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  Speaker 9: of these children are in such severe physiological Oh gosh,
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  Speaker 9: that's not right. Some of these premature babies are so sick,
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  Speaker 9: They're little organ are not developed enough to be functioning
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  Speaker 9: outside the womb yet and we are basically assisting them
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  Speaker 9: by artificial means. So we do see death in the NICU.
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  Speaker 9: We see a lot of children who have who have
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  Speaker 9: issues with their lungs, with their heart, with their vision.
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  Speaker 6: Kind of what you said.
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  Speaker 9: So, any any instance where something happens that is unexpected,
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  Speaker 9: we're going to watch and try and see what happened,
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  Speaker 9: what we can do to fix that situation, what medications
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  Speaker 9: we can insist them with and try to help them
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  Speaker 9: just to continue to grow as if they were inside
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  Speaker 9: the mother's womb.
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  Speaker 2: I've never heard it pil like that. That's fascinating to me.
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  Speaker 2: So I guess to you.
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  Speaker 1: Doctor Kimball.
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  Speaker 2: Crown's in a hospital setting, you expect, you don't want it,
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  Speaker 2: but you know a likely outcome with very ill children,
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  Speaker 2: very premature children.
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  Speaker 1: They could die.
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  Speaker 2: And I doubt pretty seriously that anyone suspects foul play
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  Speaker 2: under those conditions.
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  Speaker 1: How would you find out, say a baby dies.
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  Speaker 2: An infant, a kneborn, a twin, how would you find
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  Speaker 2: out that someone had injected in air? And I wanted
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: to say an air bubble, But how do you find out?
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  Speaker 2: How do you figure out that air has been injected
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  Speaker 2: into a baby and killed it, and how does it
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  Speaker 2: kill the baby?
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  Speaker 10: So injection of air in the hospital setting, you have
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  Speaker 10: to have a idea that someone maybe up to something
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  Speaker 10: to catch it. Sometimes the physicians or the nurses are
• 17:52
  Speaker 10: suspicious when a child or even adult dies unexpectedly and
• 17:58
  Speaker 10: there's no reason. The problem is is you can get
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  Speaker 10: away with it for a period of time because hospital
• 18:05
  Speaker 10: deaths aren't necessarily brought to a medical examiner's office and
• 18:08
  Speaker 10: they're not necessarily autopsy. So usually it's a pattern where
• 18:13
  Speaker 10: they see this a number of times and then they
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  Speaker 10: start getting suspicious and then autopsies don't. So at autopsy,
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  Speaker 10: how you spot an air EMBLSS is if there's a
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  Speaker 10: suspicion of it. When you do the X ray, you
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  Speaker 10: can spot.
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  Speaker 2: Air an air EMBLSS. What is an endless First of all.
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  Speaker 10: An emblass is a large clot basically, so an emblas
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  Speaker 10: of air is a clock of air in the bass
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  Speaker 10: cardiovascor system. An X ray, you can spot it. It's
• 18:43
  Speaker 10: kind of like a black area in the heart, usually
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  Speaker 10: in the right ventricles will wear we'll see it. So
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  Speaker 10: at autopsy. When you're doing the autopsy, you actually open
• 18:53
  Speaker 10: the pair of cardial sack, which is a sack around
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  Speaker 10: the heart. You fill it with water and then you
• 18:59
  Speaker 10: coke the right ventricle and bubbles will come out, air bubbles,
• 19:04
  Speaker 10: and when you see those, you know you're dealing with
• 19:06
  Speaker 10: an air embolis Again, it's easily easily missed at autopsy
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  Speaker 10: unless you have a suspicious suspicion for it, so you
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  Speaker 10: have to have the X rays, and with the X rays,
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  Speaker 10: then you do the proper autopsy techniques catch it. So
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  Speaker 10: air embolism is one of those hard ones to spot
• 19:24
  Speaker 10: at autopsy.
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  Speaker 2: Trying to take in everything you're saying, and I know
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  Speaker 2: it's by wrote for you because you've done so many
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: autopsies thousands, But for me to think of a kneeborn
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  Speaker 2: baby lying on one of those cold autopsy tables being
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: sliced open, and you're filling out the pair of cardium
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: sack which goes around the heart, and trying to figure
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  Speaker 2: out was air injected into this baby, it's very upsetting
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: for us reg killer people, doctor Kendall Crowns, But I
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: thank God for you and other doctors across the country
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  Speaker 2: like you, because from what I can tell, this may
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  Speaker 2: be the single most prolific child killer in the world.
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  Speaker 2: One baby after the next, after the next, after the
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  Speaker 2: next dies. What is the common denominator? One thing Lucy
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  Speaker 2: let Be. Take a listen to doctor John Gibbs, who
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: worked with Lucy let Be on ITV.
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  Speaker 5: There was nothing about her behavior or her attitude that
• 20:48
  Speaker 5: worried me at all. The problem with Lucy let Be
• 20:53
  Speaker 5: was that she was consistently associated with an increasing number
• 20:57
  Speaker 5: of unusual collapses and deaths that happening on the Union.
• 21:00
  Speaker 5: That's where the worry was.
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: And more from doctor Stephen Breery. Lucy'd let you was there.
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  Speaker 12: She was sitting next to me. I spoke to her
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  Speaker 12: and said, how tired and upset she must be after
• 21:14
  Speaker 12: two days of this, and I hope that she was
• 21:16
  Speaker 12: going to have a rest for a weekend. And she
• 21:18
  Speaker 12: turned to me and said, no, I'm back on shift tomorrow.
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  Speaker 12: The other staff were very traumatized by all of this,
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  Speaker 12: but you were crumbling before your eyes almost and she
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  Speaker 12: was quite happy and confident to come into work.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, greg Algren is joining me. International lawyer with diz Ruis.
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: They practice all over the United States and beyond. Greg Algren, Yes,
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  Speaker 2: she was there when all of these babies were found dead,
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: when they were dying, when they were screaming with blood
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: on their mouth, as you heard the one father describe.
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: But that is entirely and yes, I've proven a case
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: on circumstantial evidence alone, but you've.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: Got to have more.
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: You've got to have more than just well, she was
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: there whenever the baby babies would die. She never seemed tired,
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: she couldn't wait to get back to the ward and
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: work around more babies.
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: That's not enough to prove a case, Greg, But I think.
• 22:20
  Speaker 13: There's a I think there's a certain pattern in practice
• 22:23
  Speaker 13: that starts to emerge. That is the question of lack
• 22:27
  Speaker 13: of supervision. Apart from the criminal liability, I mean, there's
• 22:33
  Speaker 13: there's a civil issue. There's the lack of supervision, and
• 22:38
  Speaker 13: I mean perhaps even the concept of corporate manslaughter, the
• 22:43
  Speaker 13: failure to adequately participate in the controls that are necessary
• 22:49
  Speaker 13: to ensure that things are being done the right way.
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: You know, all that is absolutely correct. I don't think
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: that's any consolation to the parents, one after the next
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: after the next, who.
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: Suffered the loss of their child.
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: But Greg Agrin, of course, is completely correct. Robert Crispin
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: joining me, high profile private investigator former Federal Task Force
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: officer for the US Department of Justice with the DEEA
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: in the Miami Field Division. Former homicide and Crimes on
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: Children investigator, and you can find him at Crispininvestigations dot com.
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: Robert, thank you for being with us. If you were
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: handed this.
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: Let me just say Rubik's Cube, one baby after the
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: next is dying on this ward. Lucy let be is
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: there every time one of these babies dies and you
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: hear about the baby screaming They didn't just fall off
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: to sleep with too much benagdrill, which is bad enough
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: in itself.
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: They were screaming, What would you do? You got to
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: have more than that.
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: Now I find air injected into a baby to be damning, but.
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: I know I need more. What would you do to
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: prove this case? Robert Well sadly.
• 24:09
  Speaker 14: This case because of who we are dealing with, because
• 24:13
  Speaker 14: the access to the kids, and because we spoke about unfortunately,
• 24:18
  Speaker 14: death very final. You're expected that it's okay if someone
• 24:22
  Speaker 14: dies in hostile that's where they're supposed to die.
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: Oh, you just gave me a thought. It reminds me of.
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: Arson cases, which it took me years to develop an
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: expertise improving arson because first you have to prove a
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: crime even happened. And then once you prove a crime happened,
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: you got to figure out who did it and really
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: why Like this, you expect babies in a high risk
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: neonatal unit, some of them, God help them, are going
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: to die. So a lot of people don't think it's
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: anything unusual when a baby dies in the neonatal unit.
• 24:57
  Speaker 14: That's why she got away with it for so long.
• 24:59
  Speaker 14: So long she got away with it. By the time
• 25:01
  Speaker 14: it got to law enforcement is when this thing accelerated,
• 25:05
  Speaker 14: until the administrators got together and they started to compare
• 25:09
  Speaker 14: the facts and compare the charts and compare the employee
• 25:12
  Speaker 14: and the behavior, and then it went to law enforcement
• 25:15
  Speaker 14: after it was first denied to go to law enforcement,
• 25:18
  Speaker 14: and the employees were told, if you do anything about it,
• 25:21
  Speaker 14: there will be reach percussion.
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: You're making my stomach hurt right now? Is this true?
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: Alexis to rest Chut with us Crime online dot Com
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: investigative reporter that all these disks were flagged and employees
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: were begging for help and they were told, don't you
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: dare say a word.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: Did that happen?
• 25:40
  Speaker 9: It?
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: Did it?
• 25:41
  Speaker 6: Was not only it was the nurses and the doctors
• 25:43
  Speaker 6: who worked with her. They all first time it was
• 25:46
  Speaker 6: a tragedy, but immediately the way that she reacted was
• 25:51
  Speaker 6: a red flag.
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: She how does she react?
• 25:54
  Speaker 6: Well, she wanted to come back to work immediately. She said, well,
• 25:57
  Speaker 6: you know, I just have to be there immediately. I
• 26:00
  Speaker 6: need any time to grieve. It's the best thing to do.
• 26:02
  Speaker 14: Well.
• 26:02
  Speaker 6: While everybody else was devastated and crushed by this and
• 26:05
  Speaker 6: thought she was. But each time a child died, each
• 26:09
  Speaker 6: time a baby died, and she was there, she wanted
• 26:12
  Speaker 6: to come back to work and insisted on And as
• 26:14
  Speaker 6: you said, remember many of them were twins or triplets.
• 26:17
  Speaker 6: She wanted to work with the other sibling immediately and
• 26:20
  Speaker 6: people and that really raised the red lights. So the
• 26:22
  Speaker 6: doctors and the nurses really started a file and tried
• 26:26
  Speaker 6: and complained about her and said this is really very
• 26:30
  Speaker 6: very suspicious.
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: Okay, somebody's going to have their pants suit off.
• 26:34
  Speaker 14: Well, to add insult to injury, they had to write
• 26:37
  Speaker 14: her an apology.
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: Whoa okay, what who's this is this? Crispin?
• 26:41
  Speaker 14: Or all great, that's Krispin.
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: What did you just say?
• 26:44
  Speaker 14: It had gotten to administration administration shut down the people
• 26:48
  Speaker 14: that were bringing this forward and we're not going to
• 26:51
  Speaker 14: do anything further and there'll be consequences. And then Lucy
• 26:55
  Speaker 14: filed a complaint and the doctors had to do a
• 26:59
  Speaker 14: risk apology to Lucy. I'm sorry, we're all stressed out, we're.
• 27:05
  Speaker 10: All under a lot of pressure.
• 27:07
  Speaker 14: That's how this all started. And then another death, that's
• 27:11
  Speaker 14: when administrators caught on. That's when they decided to call
• 27:14
  Speaker 14: law enforcement. And then that's when this case got some
• 27:17
  Speaker 14: traction and it took off, and it's where it is today.
• 27:21
  Speaker 6: And Nancy, I think, and this is kat I think.
• 27:23
  Speaker 9: Another most interesting fact about.
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: Her behavior was.
• 27:29
  Speaker 9: She reached out to these parents, multiple different parents of
• 27:34
  Speaker 9: the deceased children, and searched for them on social media
• 27:38
  Speaker 9: and watched their response to their grief and was almost relishing.
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: Their grief, and she.
• 27:47
  Speaker 9: Sent them notes. She said she was apologetic that she
• 27:50
  Speaker 9: couldn't make it to the funerals. It's really very distressing
• 27:53
  Speaker 9: to look at someone with such narcissistic behavior and attention
• 27:59
  Speaker 9: seeking behavior. It's just horrifying.
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: Oh man, oh man, she is going straight to hell.
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: Did you know that?
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: Also after the deaths of these tiny babies, she would
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: help the parents prepare the baby for the funeral.
• 28:16
  Speaker 9: Yes, it did mention in the evidence that she helped
• 28:20
  Speaker 9: to prepare memento boxes and gather footprints and handprints and
• 28:25
  Speaker 9: locks of hair, which is a very common practice. And
• 28:29
  Speaker 9: I see you after a child passes away because maybe
• 28:33
  Speaker 9: a photograph prior to the death, and these mementos are
• 28:37
  Speaker 9: the only thing that these parents have to remember the
• 28:40
  Speaker 9: short life that they had with their child.
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: Who was jumping in was that you, Karen start, Yes.
• 28:45
  Speaker 7: It was. I wanted to say that in addition to
• 28:48
  Speaker 7: her own cases, they would also find her involved in
• 28:52
  Speaker 7: cases that were not hers, where she was told not
• 28:56
  Speaker 7: to be there, and she would get involved with these
• 29:00
  Speaker 7: supposedly babies that were so sick and dying, which of
• 29:04
  Speaker 7: course she was causing.
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: So she wasn't just her patience. She would seek out
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: other babies.
• 29:09
  Speaker 7: And she relished taking care of the babies once they died.
• 29:14
  Speaker 7: She baved them and found clothes for them. She became
• 29:18
  Speaker 7: very very involved in the aftercare as well.
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: Okay, I'm sure you've got a diagnostic name for that.
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: Jackie is waiving a note to me that one of
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: the babies was actually buried and a gown provided by
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: Lucy let Be.
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: Guys take a listener our friends at BBC.
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: Lucy let Be was eventually moved to a clerical role.
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: The doctors kept trying to get managers to investigate the
• 29:44
  Speaker 3: suspicious deaths and her connection to them, even though consultants
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: here repeatedly made loud warnings to senior management. They say
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: they were ignored. Even after Lucy let Be came off
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: duty on the neonatal unit, executives to draw a line
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: under the case. Dr Stephen Breery led the team of
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: seven consultants on the unit who shared joint concerns.
• 30:08
  Speaker 12: It's something that nobody really wants to consider that a
• 30:13
  Speaker 12: member of staff might be harming the babies and your care.
• 30:17
  Speaker 3: Things came to a head when two out of three
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: healthy triplets died within twenty four hours of each other.
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: Oh got two out of three triplets. Karen Stark, you're
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: the shrink. We're just a mere mortals. What is There's
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: got to be a name for the hatred of babies,
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: the desire to kill infants.
• 30:41
  Speaker 7: Well, usually when that happens, it's still side. It's a
• 30:44
  Speaker 7: parent who's killing the baby. Unfortunately, in this case, you're
• 30:50
  Speaker 7: talking about a cold and I mean cold bloody killer,
• 30:53
  Speaker 7: the definition of a psychopath. She was sadistic. She enjoyed
• 31:00
  Speaker 7: and I know this is hard for people to take in,
• 31:02
  Speaker 7: but she actually enjoyed watching not just the baby suffer,
• 31:07
  Speaker 7: but the parents suffer.
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: Now there's pedophobia, which is a fear of babies, but
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: the hatred of babies. They desire to kill babies, not
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: anybody else, just helpless infants.
• 31:27
  Speaker 7: But that's part of it, Nancy, is that they're helpless
• 31:30
  Speaker 7: and they're innocent, and that's extremely appealing to killers, as
• 31:34
  Speaker 7: we know, and all the natural instincts that you would
• 31:39
  Speaker 7: assume somebody would have when it comes to babies. A killer,
• 31:43
  Speaker 7: a cold blooded killer like this just the opposite. She's
• 31:48
  Speaker 7: in her environment. She relishes the fact that this is happening.
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: Guys, take a lists to our friends over at ap.
• 31:55
  Speaker 15: Lucie let Be was entrusted to protect some of the
• 31:58
  Speaker 15: most vulnerable. Little did those working alongside her know that
• 32:04
  Speaker 15: there was a murderer in their midst. She did her
• 32:07
  Speaker 15: utmost to conceal her crimes by varying the ways in
• 32:11
  Speaker 15: which she repeatedly harmed babies in her care. In her hands,
• 32:16
  Speaker 15: innocuous substances like air milk or medication like insulin would
• 32:22
  Speaker 15: become lethal. She perverted her learning and weaponized her craft
• 32:28
  Speaker 15: to inflict harm, grief, and death.
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: Crime stories with nitty grace.
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: Fallout continues over the ninety minute documentary on Netflix about
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: Lucy let Be. She's being checked on an hourly basis.
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: Even more, Steph has been told to engage her in
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: quote meaning full conversation and talked to her for at
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: least ten minutes at a time throughout the day to
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: gauge her mood and state of mind. Why because all
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: the inmates are buzzing about a Netflix show and mocking
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: Lucy let Be about the show. In the documentary, Lucy
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: let Bey's never before seen letters sent from prison boasting
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: about her posh on sweet sale to a quote special friend.
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: Now she is the butt of ridicule behind bars. In
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: these previously unseen letters, Lucy let Be, convict to kill
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: her whines about her own heartbreaking situation. Her word, not
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: mind heartbreaking. What about the moms and dads whose infants
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: were murdered by you, Lucy let Be, And you're whining
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: about the fact that you don't like being behind bars,
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: also whined about quote missing her pets behind bars. She brags,
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: I have my own room and toilet, I shower each
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: day and go outside for a walk. Really, and you're
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: still whining. We also learned let Me has a new
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: job behind bars, bragging about that too, that she got
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: a quote top new job behind bars, leaving the other
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: inmates jealous. Yes, she has been promoted from cleaner to
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: dishing out books and DVDs to the other inmates in
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: the jail library. Being the jail librarian is a very
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: sought after role and it gives her influence among the
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: other inmates, but that has not stopped them from mocking
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: her about the Netflix documentary about her. What does being
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: the jail librarian intel? Going around on a trolley delivering
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: box sets and books to yoursels. She may be bragging
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: about her cushy jailshill and enjoying her new role as
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: prison librarian, But I know who you really are, Lucy
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: let Be.
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: You're a baby killer.
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: In her hands, innocuous substances like air, milk or medication
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: would become lethal.
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: Then there's baby e.
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: The mom arrived to give the baby breast milk, and
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: she found the baby with blood around his mouth before
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: he died from a fatal bleed, which we now believed
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: to be caused by let Be interfering with a naso
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: gastric tube.
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: The mom actually walked in on her with the baby. Guys,
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: take a listen to this.
• 35:49
  Speaker 11: It was in June and when Lucy let Be murdered
• 35:51
  Speaker 11: the first newborn, who we can only call Baby A,
• 35:55
  Speaker 11: by injecting air into his bloodstream. The following month, after
• 35:59
  Speaker 11: the deaths of Baby and Baby D, the head of
• 36:02
  Speaker 11: the Neonotal Award ordered an internal review and found that
• 36:06
  Speaker 11: let Be had been the only nurse on shift for
• 36:09
  Speaker 11: each death. By October, baby and Baby I had also died,
• 36:13
  Speaker 11: and consultants warned senior management that let Be was present
• 36:16
  Speaker 11: each time.
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: That was Sean Fletcher at Good Morning Britain. BABYE Baby
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: I also died and senior management was warned Lucy let
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: Be was present each time. Greg Algrin, Why in the
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: world would a hospital tried to suppress the knowledge that
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: babies were dying on Lucy Letb's watch, not by accident,
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: not by normal or natural causes, but by injections of
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: air or insulin or interference with a NASO gastrel tube.
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: Why would they suppress that and actually warn the doctors
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: and nurses of repercussions if they continued to investigate and
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: force the Dodgers is Robert Crispin pointed out to apologize
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: to Lucy.
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: Let me the killer right.
• 37:07
  Speaker 13: It's disgusting, It's inconceivable. Yeah, I think we and I
• 37:11
  Speaker 13: conclude that this institution was trying to protect itself. There's
• 37:16
  Speaker 13: no excuse for it, and there have to be other
• 37:22
  Speaker 13: investigations and hopefully prosecutions that come out of this because
• 37:27
  Speaker 13: the organizational manager there is exhibited here is completely unexcusable, inexcusable,
• 37:33
  Speaker 13: I mean, it can be allowed to repeat itself in
• 37:36
  Speaker 13: the future.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: Take us now to Janet More.
• 37:39
  Speaker 16: To lose a baby. There's a heartbreaking experience that no
• 37:43
  Speaker 16: pair intodup how to go through, or to lose a baby,
• 37:46
  Speaker 16: or to have a baby harmed and these particular circumstances
• 37:49
  Speaker 16: is unimaginable. Over the past seven to eight years, we've
• 37:53
  Speaker 16: had to go through a long, torturous and emotional journey
• 37:56
  Speaker 16: from losing our precious newborns and grieving their loss see
• 38:00
  Speaker 16: God children who survived, some of whom were still suffering
• 38:03
  Speaker 16: today to being told years later the death all collapse
• 38:07
  Speaker 16: might be suspicious. You'll think to prepare you for that news.
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: I'm just trying to get my head around it.
• 38:12
  Speaker 13: To you.
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: Alexis Tereschak joining us from crime Online. The murderers of
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: all these babies occurred over the space of one year.
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: Why did it take eight years to bring her to justice?
• 38:25
  Speaker 6: Concern raised by doctors and nurses, and they had the
• 38:29
  Speaker 6: hospital started an investigation into it, and.
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: Because she was so.
• 38:36
  Speaker 6: Forthcoming, she was a nurse, they just never suspected that
• 38:39
  Speaker 6: this would happen. Did nothing was found. However, when they
• 38:43
  Speaker 6: decided that they did, they did a survey. They did
• 38:45
  Speaker 6: and they saw that she was the only nurse on
• 38:49
  Speaker 6: duty in the room with these children for every single
• 38:52
  Speaker 6: death and every single attempted you know where there were
• 38:56
  Speaker 6: children that were assaulted by her that did not die,
• 38:59
  Speaker 6: but that were treated in the same way. And then
• 39:01
  Speaker 6: they realized that something happened. She then filed a complaint
• 39:06
  Speaker 6: against the hospital and said, you are targeting me. I
• 39:10
  Speaker 6: am not doing anything wrong. And because it appears that
• 39:13
  Speaker 6: they were afraid to be they were afraid that she
• 39:15
  Speaker 6: would sue them more than just file a complaint. They
• 39:18
  Speaker 6: backed down on this, and it took years for them
• 39:21
  Speaker 6: to finally contact the police, and many of the doctors
• 39:24
  Speaker 6: there have said that the hospital dragged their feet on
• 39:28
  Speaker 6: this and that they should have contacted the police immediately.
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: I guess I didn't want the bad public relations that
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: so many babies were dying number one and potentially the
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: hands of a nurse.
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: Listen to justice, James Goss.
• 39:42
  Speaker 17: This was a cruel, calculated, and cynical campaign of child murder,
• 39:49
  Speaker 17: involving the smallest and most vulnerable of children. Knowing that
• 39:54
  Speaker 17: your actions were causing significant physical suffering cause untold mental suffering,
• 40:05
  Speaker 17: you created situations so that collapses or causes of collapses
• 40:10
  Speaker 17: would not be obvious or associated with you. You removed
• 40:15
  Speaker 17: and retained confidential records of events relating to your crimes,
• 40:20
  Speaker 17: and checked up on bereaved parents. There was a deep
• 40:25
  Speaker 17: malevolence bordering on sadism in your actions.
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: Karen Starger, I can't figure out if she delighted more
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: in actually killing the babies or watching them die the
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: act of killing them, standing by watching them die, or
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: watching the parents grieve and actually enjoying the funeral preparations.
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: It's I can't figure out what her motivation is.
• 40:53
  Speaker 7: There doesn't need to be that everyone's trying to understand
• 40:56
  Speaker 7: her motivation. And when we're talking about a psychopath, this
• 41:00
  Speaker 7: is a person who has no feelings and the only
• 41:04
  Speaker 7: motivation is for her to be able to see they
• 41:08
  Speaker 7: are distressed. That really turns her on. It's hard to
• 41:13
  Speaker 7: conceive it, but it's true.
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: And she had no.
• 41:17
  Speaker 7: Look how manipulative she was, which really goes along with
• 41:21
  Speaker 7: being a psychopath. And she turned the tables and she said,
• 41:25
  Speaker 7: you're harassing me, so that she could take the attention
• 41:30
  Speaker 7: away from she's doing something wrong and put the attention
• 41:33
  Speaker 7: on the fact that she's a victive.
• 41:35
  Speaker 2: Kat Thornton joining US Neo Natal Nursing expert, what precautions
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: are in place in hospitals to make sure nurses are
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: not killingants, infants that of course have no voice for themselves.
• 41:49
  Speaker 9: Well, Nancy, I think this is an excellent example of
• 41:53
  Speaker 9: a situation where the surrounding support staff did not feel comfortable.
• 42:00
  Speaker 9: They were also chastised about bringing forth concerns. And I
• 42:04
  Speaker 9: will say that I think most institutions do an excellent
• 42:08
  Speaker 9: job of providing ongoing annual training. The compliance departments and
• 42:14
  Speaker 9: regulatory departments develop really good education and affirmation to each
• 42:21
  Speaker 9: employee at annual training.
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: That is their responsibility, So continue training, Alexis Tereschuk joining us.
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: So many of these parents probably thought that the potential
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: deaths of their children were to be expected, and when
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: a child passed away in the neonatal unit, they thought, well,
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: he just didn't make it. What happened at sentencing? Is
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: it true Lucy Letby would not even come to sentencing
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: where the parents were all there.
• 42:55
  Speaker 6: That's one hundred percent truth. She did not show up
• 42:59
  Speaker 6: for her sentencing. She was not there when these parents
• 43:02
  Speaker 6: gave their victim impact statements where they talked about how
• 43:06
  Speaker 6: they completely trusted her and that they knew something was
• 43:10
  Speaker 6: wrong because their child was screaming in the unit and
• 43:14
  Speaker 6: they went in and the parents and it was there,
• 43:16
  Speaker 6: and she was the only one there. She was too
• 43:20
  Speaker 6: much of a coward. She did not show up in
• 43:21
  Speaker 6: her parents. She is an only child who was doated
• 43:25
  Speaker 6: on her whole life. She was everything to her parents.
• 43:28
  Speaker 6: When she graduated from college, they sent a picture of
• 43:31
  Speaker 6: it to the local newspaper. They adored her, They gave
• 43:34
  Speaker 6: her everything. They were so proud of her. They had
• 43:36
  Speaker 6: been there every single day at the trial. But they
• 43:39
  Speaker 6: also did not show up for this sentence thing, so
• 43:42
  Speaker 6: nobody was there to hear what these parents had to
• 43:45
  Speaker 6: say after she had murdered their babies.
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: So chilling that after one baby died, photos have emerged
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: of Lucy let Be with this huge smile on her
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: face at a fundraiser. The baby had just died and
• 44:02
  Speaker 2: she went to a fundraiser for neonatal patients and had
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: this huge smile. She really had a great time at
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: the party after just killing one of the babies. Seven
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: babies dead at her hands that we know of, attempts
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: on the life of six other tiny infants. Lucy let
• 44:25
  Speaker 2: Me continues to devise methods scheming to get out of
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: that conviction. We wait as justice unfolds. Nancy Graf signing
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: off goodbye friend.