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Ecosistema del cambio climático - Invitada: Marina Aizen · Ecosistemas

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Hello from ecosystems. We send a fraternal greeting to all radio environment staff,
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the National Federation of Health Workers and its Secretary, Carlos Adamo, for allowing
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them to be part of this great family that is radio ecosystem environment under the
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prism of polyhedron. How today' s world works, increasingly complex, more
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uncertain, changing, seemingly chaotic, a world of all against all or all
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for all. Not one thing or the other. The world operates in a
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delicate balance of interacting ecosystems. I propose that you think together about how these
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ecosystems work. A small pocket manual, perhaps just a bunch of thoughts and
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reflections that allow us to accommodate, order, orient, understand how we work
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in these hyper- informed and communicated societies, where it is hard for us
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to discover their senses and motives every day. I invite you to listen and
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discover together these ecosystems in which we are often inserted without wanting to be part
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of them and which, however, are part of our daily struggles and disappointments
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and under the prism of polyhedron, because every ecosystem is composed of different faces
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or sides, with its vertices and particularities. Unity in diversity, where the
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whole is superior to the parties, the agreement superior to the conflict, reality
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is imposed on the idea and time space. This will allow us to build
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a sustainable world in an environment full of humanity, in harmony with the unique
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nature of our existence and the generations to come welcome. There are ecosystems under
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the prism of polyhedron. When I want to tell you a story, I
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always have to appeal to a narrative. That' s why, always,
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when children' s tales begin, you start with abía once and from that
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there was once that hilito that we started to defuse it, opening it.
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No. The story that I want to tell today clearly has to do with
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something that maybe we all know hits us head- on. But the narrative
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we have about that particular story is as camouflaged, as hidden, as it
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often disorients us a lot clearly, climate change is something that is among us.
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It is enough to see some news and some extraordinary images that frighten us
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by their violence, because of course it is the struggle of the foolishness of
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man against nature, which understands nothing, nothing of the human, but does
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its task madly many times from our eyes. Living with nature involves this process
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of climate change that we are in and we must take our time to think
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and talk about these things that are really important, because we are all in
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the same boat, we are all in this same finite world and we all
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depend in some way on this climate change as well. However, storytellers sometimes
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make us some play, sometimes out of ignorance, sometimes out of carelessness,
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but sometimes also out of the interests involved in the idea of this climate change
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that we are somehow all facing. We always have a bell, the bell
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of industries, the bell of the media banking those industries, but very rarely
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we can come to the concrete idea of knowing humanly what is happening to us.
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That' s why, in this program today, in this ecosystem of
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climate change, I wanted to invite someone who can somehow lead us through the
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most accurate and concrete narrative of what' s happening to us. That'
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s why we always choose the best and in this case I want to thank
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Marina al Isen for being with us. Hello, Marina, how are you?
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Hello, how are you going to welcome this ecosystem of climate change.
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Well, let' s get you some ideas. Sure, yeah, I
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' d love to. Yes Marina is a journalist specializing in climate change.
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You were this chronicler or you were in New York during was the clothes to
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remember New York for clarín for many years, also in the United Nations and
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in the United Nations for the agency to interpret. Yeah, well, you
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' re the co- founder of journalists on the planet. Yeah, it
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' s a good g a civil organization. I imagine many journalists, not
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so many journalists, but with a lot of concerns. We are three journalists
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and we are dedicated to spreading the narratives that have to do with the planetary
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crisis. And you' re the director of this project that I loved called
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Eco Eco. The project is a very interesting project that has to do with
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this narrative that we talked about before where are you Marina, Acá, Buenos
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Aires, Buenos Aires? Yes, he told me that you wrote a book
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about treachuelo saying that a person passionate about the environment, because of the situations
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of the fame of life, let' s create one thing. We inhabit
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a world. Our bodies occupy a physical place in this world and what happens
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to the world happens to us, because there is a symbiotic relationship between us
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and the place where we are. So when we talk about the environment,
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we' re not talking about birds flying elsewhere, we' re talking about
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us. And when we talk about the climate that has changed because of the
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effect of gas burning, they capture the heat of the sun and make the
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atmosphere a size of heat. We' re talking about us, too.
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We never stopped talking about ourselves and human rights. We didn' t divorce
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both. This is very important to clarify. There is no man' s
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war against nature, forgive me for telling you and well there is also jus
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te, but there is a war of oil companies, who and they get
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a product under the earth or under the sea to burn it. And in
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that burning, when that combustion occurs, the climate warms up because the atmosphere
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begins to receive carbon dioxide particles that trap the heat of the sun. It
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' s not the only molecule that traps the sun' s heat, but
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it' s the main one. And because I say it' s the
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oil war against the rest of humanity, including the world, because they knew
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perfectly well since the fifties, at least, that this phenomenon was happening.
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First they studied it and then systematically dedicated themselves to hiding, to confusing.
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So it' s not like we' re confused about what' s going
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on. It' s very clear that what you use science says loudly.
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Every year there is a United Nations meeting devoted to this issue. There is
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no ambiguity about what is happening, but there are really interests at stake that
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are giants. And never before have oil companies made as much money as now,
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and never before has the weather been as hot as it is now.
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It is in April and at the beginning of April it is doing almost thirty
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degrees. Reason and that doesn' t happen to anyone else on another side
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of the world. It happens to us. Last year we had a March
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of thirty days followed by forty degrees, even more than forty degrees, when
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in March we had the bags on and even the stove that also warmed the
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climate, not only in our bodies, that is, we live it every
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day. We have deep droughts and, suddenly, climates that we cannot explain.
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And this thing that happens here happens all over the world in some places
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in an even worse way. But Argentina has been this witness of phenomena,
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terrible, fires that cannot be extinguished very sustained heat waves in the time to
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which we were not accustomed to very long droughts And there will be places in
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our country, where it will be very difficult to continue living if this terrible
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change in the atmosphere that we are witnessing now, Marina, is accentuated There
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is a contradiction between what is sometimes taught, even from the very young people
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who have incorporated a little the idea of being able to study the environment and
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understand the respect for nature and this vision, which already implies a much more,
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say, more difficult attitude to understand if we do not stop it,
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say, because there we are colliding with interests that are multimillionaires and where one
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feels totally impotent, because there is a medium in which one is saying,
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one could say no. I can' t use the car I make anymore.
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No, I don' t learn the stove anymore. How I live
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with this situation, if it is the whole environment, it leads me to
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contaminate and generally it is good. Two things happen to me, tell you.
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The first is that the changes are systemic that I can try to walk
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to my house, stay away, can stay close to being huge homelands.
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But if in dead cow it keeps getting gas and oil in the most polluting
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way there is, this is going to be, it' s not going
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to make any difference. And the other thing I can think of, to
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tell you is that the oil wolf is very conscious, first, that it
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has to transition, but in the meantime, he wants to pull the piola
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and the piola and the piola and they have not settled in the head,
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because their communication apparatuses capture the whole society. That is why it is so
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important to have these conversations and make us believe that without oil, without gas
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there is no development. And this is not so. It is not true,
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because, moreover, if we continue to use gas and oil, not
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only in Argentina, but throughout the world, we have no choice, because
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before we have development, we need to be able to live. That'
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s as simple as that. And if in Buenos Aires we get to have
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temperatures like they had recently in Rio de Janeiro, I don' t know
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if we' re going to be able to see it is with us.
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Marina Eisen is one of the directors of the Eco Eco project, that is,
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the environmental journalists said we will change the narrative and start here. For
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now, this echo by Jorge Drexler helps us to think about what he is
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hearing no longer others. YouTube is the echo boat of the echo of the
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southern feelings lighting a distant leaf that carries and brings the wind from another time.
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I, however, feel that you agree, defying the laws of time
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and the distance from the coasts, subtle perhaps as real as a fragrance,
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a very brief lapse of state of grace peevo peeco gradually occupying the space of
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my embrace smell shoulder, your this which I sing now will continue to derive
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the tente in the ether eternally waiting for it to feel or wake up to
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its echo my centuries of it. Does echo allow gradually occupying the space of
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my hollow embrace? Or do I sin by slowly occupying the space of my
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hollow embrace? What you' re hearing is no longer I am no longer
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in the ecosystem of marine climate change asen with us others and I want you
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not to tell me a little bit from your organization journalists around the planet,
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how was this idea of creating a contest that can promote a different look about
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the situation of oil companies or the question of the exact gas blinker. Well,
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what we' re trying to do is we' re looking at a
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very powerful lobby, as I was saying before, and not just that it
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' s captured the media and all the politicians. But there has been so
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there can be no crack, not even crack. With this government they have
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captured as the national imaginary, that is, Argentina will be ipfe. Yes,
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Argentine is oil and gas is gas, Messi oil is the same.
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So, since we don' t have that much power, we said well,
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we' re gonna make it different, we' re gonna invite people
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to say what they think? We' re going to give you some tools
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and after you leave to create, make a story, a poetry, a
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rap, take the word, believe conversation, break this false consensus that development
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is our self- destruction. Then we invite them. Well, you do
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all the poetry, take a picture, write a rap, think about it
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in the form of a story, tell me what your fears are, because
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everyone perceives that something is changing for evil and that that evil doesn' t
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have much solution. As we are then, it' s like an invitation
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to think of some kind of dystopia going around clearly and we say the world
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doesn' t have to be dystopian. The world is perfectly habitable, but
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we have to change and the window of time is super small to make these
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changes. So how do you do when you don' t have the means,
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for example, good hegemonics that you' re bought by the oil industries.
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Well when you don' t have politics, because political systems also depend
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on energies to be able to develop. And then they also promote big projects
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like the gas pipeline. We all celebrate when it was made you know how
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to celebrate. Not anymore. It' s tremendous to me. And there
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' s the pichanga fool. But for that reason, to counter that hegemonic
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block of thought, not only in the Great Middle, but throughout the world,
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we say look. This is not so and from our love or destroying,
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we say, we create conversation when we create conversation, we are taking
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a different step forward in breaking that false consensus that leads us to destruction.
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What about the extractions. Let us also say with the attractive industry, because
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somehow we have to generate sustainable energy, another type of energy that does not
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involve pollution. If lithium we' re gonna need it, too. That
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' s what it' s for. Yeah, what happens is that liteo
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is definitely going to be needed until a different technology replaces it, which isn
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' t so crazy that it happens either. But the point is the scale.
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That is, we have to learn to live in another way, not
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just here, which is the part that touches us, because it is our
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country and we want it and we want it all. We want it whole
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with all its people, with the old, being old without dying of heat,
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is with their children developing having a future. I mean, we want
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this country, so we have to change. The idea that we can all
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have a car doesn' t take us anywhere and the same thing happens in
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the global north. The idea that all Yankees have to have cars and that
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we have to provide lithium for them to have two or three cars per family
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is no good to us either. There are no magic solutions either. This
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is not the simple replacement of one technology by another. This is learning to
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love us and to live in another way. Now we do, this way
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we live during you. You said from a thousand nine hundred and fifty,
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well, no, not then, from a thousand nine hundred and fifty.
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The oil companies understood that the situation was going through a degree of pollution of
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the planet that was going to be irreversible or that was going to lead to
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extreme situations like the ones we are living today. Oil was good gold from
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the beginning of the century throughout the 20th century. Let' s say humanity
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in its entirety. The 20th century lived and industrialized and grew thanks to that,
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without doubt, not great stroleum. Yeah, look at you. I
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' m going to tell an anecdote. In the year nineteen hundred and fifty
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- seven, the American Petroleum Institute, which is the nucleus of the entire
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industry in the United States, hosted a reception at Columbia University to celebrate its
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one hundred years. Then they invited a guy named Eduard Teller, who was
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the father of the hydrogen bomb, a half- crazy scientist, half-
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controversial, but good nothing. He' s a physicist to admire in his
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knowledge and he says everything well, boys, but I' m worried about
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a little thing. The Empire State is going down is the year one thousand
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nine hundred and fifty- seven and it says why. Because of the issue
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of air pollution, He was referring to the fact that it was already known,
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because in the postwar period the environment began to be studied profusely for a
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thousand reasons that I am not going to tell you now. It was known
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that the s or two was accumulating in the atmosphere and that the so two
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caught the heat of the sun. Therefore, processes were to be triggered on
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the planet of irreversible character, among others, the melting of Greenland and of
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the Antarctic that was to bury the Empire empire state in the waters And that
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is the year one thousand nine hundred and fifty- seven. That is the
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first record, as well as very thorough that the industry has come out.
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What I say, if this allowed you to grow during this time of mankind,
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would not be the time to say good. Thanks to this you made
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us grow, but now we have to change. Well, we have to
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give the logical conditions for that to go missing. Something new appears, and
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in fact, it is happening at the last COP Every year, the United
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Nations brings all countries together in a process called the COP Conference. Last year.
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This one, in December last year was ceded held in Abu Dhabi,
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just yes the number twenty- seven, yes, not the twenty- eight.
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The twenty- nine is in Azerbaijan this year and what was agreed among
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all countries, including the Argentine Ark, is that we have to make a
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transition in the document in English and it is the Transition Eway Frank Fosil fuers
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that is trans to get out of the easy fuels. There' s no
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super- exact translation. We have to give content to that, because every
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time documents are negotiated in the units they are ambiguous. Yes, Marina Isen
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and the Ecoico project are with us. I rescued the beginning of this poem
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by Daniel Hendling, called Arden. So water says all life that if the
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stars and the dust or the eternal galaxy, because coming from hearing Asia is
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the same and we come from a dark future confused water. Don' t
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forget me. We' re the same. If man is a gesture,
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water is history. If the man is a dream, he makes the course.
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If man is a people, water is the world. If the man
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recoiled and water that memory. If man is alive, water is life.
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If the man is a child, the water is Mari man steps on it.
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The salvic water, take care of it like cloth of you, jump,
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wet, fly, lava, water that you come, siva, river,
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foam, rain, fog, cloud, good, mara, brown on
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the road. Water that spits landscape, sagua that moves ground, salt water
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that you give me is namedetego, gere you can so fire, water that
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to women the stone, water you believe more in without like in the land
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brincamoja, fly to it will make you come and it will ringo foam the
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luvio. It was very nice. You will hear Joan Manuel Serrat in man
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and water. A beautiful poem. He has made a song and after having
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read some of the poems, there is a lot. There' s a
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really nice job you' ve done at Ecoico. There' s a book.
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We did a little editing around there, but two hundred people showed up.
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How good to our contest and now we open it again the Day of
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the Environment, that this is the important thing, because we want people to
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keep telling me what is happening to you, how you see the future,
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how you see it different, how we could live, do it the way
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you want, with humor, with dramatism, With this is totally open.
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What we' re looking for is more and more people joining the conversation.
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Of course, there' s nothing more this inclusive, nothing more disruptive than
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people talking and saying che. This isn' t right. This isn'
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t right. How we can work it out. At least it is good
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to be able to know ourselves not if we are on an environmental radio and
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that we have among ourselves good tools and resources so as to be able to
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enhance that message that somehow has to counter this that we said before that it
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is so hegemonic and, moreover, that we can use the strength of young
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people. I' ve been to Mar del Plata and I' ve seen
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the movement that has taken place against the prophecy of the exploitation of chor no
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and how rap came in and how the boys came in to give their speech
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and leave their mark on this situation. I read a very beautiful letter from
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Pedro Asnar, also when one of the public hearings was held. This implies
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that the culture that art manifests on the give exactly and has a place that
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is now practically empty. That' s why we open the door to this
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project so people can say count the way they want to. This year,
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the contest is going to be back to storyline, back to poetry, because
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you' ve already seen Daniel' s poetry is beautiful. We open photography
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and we are also going to make a work that is going to be called
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fracking, which I will not tell you much, because it is doing what
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it is so that people understand what is the technique that is used in dead
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cow and how destructive it is how much it affects water, air and bodies,
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not only of the people who live nearby, but of the people behind
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it There is a story that struck me very much, which speaks of when
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the houses did not move. He is not talking about a house and a
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little one that already arrives, when the house is constantly moving because it is
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on the other side of the river, where the exploitation is continuous and the
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noise and movement of the house is also continuous. Then they recall with nostalgia
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the fact that before the house did not move and that they look What a
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beautiful situation to have opened a space in echo to that tale, when in
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reality there is so no notes about a very small town that is called pretty
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sausal that remains this on the other side of the river where Tech Petrol is,
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the company that produces more gas in Vaca Muerta and that trembles every time
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you Petrol or some other oil companies. It may be Shell, it may
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be seen, it may be their hand goes, they leave mambo or the
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people tremble. It' s full of cracks, the houses are full of
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cracks. And there' s what' s worse. They don' t
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even have gas because they don' t have gas installation. Not clear,
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because that' s the way the extractive industries are. They do not prioritize
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evacuation to large urban centers in disregard of the neighbor. Someday they have gas,
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but it doesn' t matter, because the gas, anyway, has
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to stop using marine. How is it that you dedicated yourself to this,
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that you put the accent, because obviously, it is not a project that
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can professionally redeem you economically. This implies a process of very strong convictions,
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manifested for your profession. Nothing. In the year two thousand and fifteen we
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were in Paris covering the Paris Agreement that was being negotiated, the one that
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does not exceed two degrees the exact temperature of the planet. Yes, preferably
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much less than two degrees, preferably one point one together. Yeah, I
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got a thousand stories to tell you that, but it doesn' t matter.
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The important thing is that we met and I don' t know if
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more friends Laura Rocha pillar to Cefi Sho and we form lazinesses on the planet
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first make want, after wanting, because it was like automatic, the tuning
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between the three and the need to deepen this conversation at all levels. We
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are now appealing to expand audiences, incorporate them, and give words to people.
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You guys, don' t listen to the others. Tell us what
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' s wrong with him. That' s why I coeco. But we
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also do a lot of other things, including educating journalists, keeping them informed,
35:37
taking them on press trips, engaging them to meet scientists studying these issues.
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When the United Nations presents the reports with the last of the last things
35:54
that are said about climate, we put them in contact with the scientists.
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The same for biodiversity. That is to say, we have the headquarters of
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many times that in hegemonic media or those of habitual consumption we always talk about
36:12
the planet when there is a catastrophe, but it is not a constant question,
36:17
but in the face of an extraordinary phenomenon. And then there' s
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Mira Te. I' m gonna say two things. First, the three
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of us come from means that can be considered hegemonic. Yes, yes,
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and we had within our own means is some internal struggle, not a lot
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of exact struggle, even bullying from our bosses, because it seemed stupid and
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ridiculous for us to engage in this, to begin to perfect ourselves and to
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understand a conversation that is very difficult, because it is difficult, so then
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we said you know what we will eventually make them talk about. They talk
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about climate change, but they don' t attribute it and what is the
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main cause of climate change? Burning fossil fuels, oil, gas and coal.
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Coal is being stopped in use in the world. It' s used
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a lot in Asia. Unfortunately, gas has not yet returned to Europe.
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Not almost though the last crises happened your tera carbon again no yes, but
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the coal will have to stop using it and they will be the first.
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The U S also stopped using enough coal, but we need to stop using
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gas, because gas is not a transitional combustible. We' ve been on
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a dead cow, we' ve been carrying journalists or but clearly, for
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example, if we look at the case of Argentina, in Argentina it'
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s a gas power, let' s say, Argentina is good, it
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' s its greatest energy. That' s what we' re gonna argue
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about. The largest energy in Argentina is what can be produced with the wind
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and the sun. What you see is not, what is hidden, what
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is not used, what is not used, what is thrown away every day
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and what does not modify the physics or chemistry of the atmosphere. We want
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a country with all its people. Inside this we dedicated ourselves to making the
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world possible I saw beautiful. Otherwise we' ll survive. They asked how
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they lived. They asked me to survive. I said surviving. I have
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a poem written more than a thousand times in it. I repeat always that
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as long as someone pro put you to death on this land, I made
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it, it was more for war. I step on this fields surviving everyone
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lends to danger sobor living sad closing men, surviving. I survived living,
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surviving, they survived over it or long ago I didn' t laugh like
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a long time ago, and that I laughed like a jilguer. I have
40:54
a certain memory that he hurts me. I can' t forget about Iroshi.
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Bad tragedy remains this land today that I want to laugh as soon as
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I can I no longer have the laughter of the nuns and the pasta of
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the pines. In the month of January I love this world surviving, living,
41:45
surviving, living, drinking or I don' t want to be just
42:29
a survivor I want him to turn the day for my wife. I have
42:38
the face of young red, the blood, the good teeth and my urgent
42:52
waiting life my seed. I do not want per m manifesting for peace in
43:07
the world. The animals are going to laugh me crazy days ago. Those
43:17
manners will do the cedor life viras you will know just surviving, surviving,
43:37
surviving, surviving, living, surviving, about or. A special version of
44:23
Leonjico and Victor Heredia for this classic, not of someone who saw this long
44:29
before and wrote it and made it a song like Victor Heredia, who is
44:32
somehow also inside the field of heroics. No and it may have been at
44:38
the time an emblematic song that was watching what was going to happen to us
44:45
more than we have to survive. We have to be able to live well,
44:50
not survive, but we have to start doing other things, to adapt
44:53
to changes, to transition this eating in another way, to conceive the territory
45:01
in another way and you said something that has to do with the scales,
45:06
and this may have to do with the big urban centers and how the interior
45:12
has been depopulated. No. No, no, that' s what I
45:14
mean. I do not say I because economies of scale allow for a better
45:16
quality of life. Yeah, that' s right. What I mean is
45:21
that the scale for what, to exploit lithium, or something right, we
45:28
' re going to need. I don' t know if we can test
45:32
all the lithium so that the Americans, of course, live yes, yes,
45:37
no guilt with the atmosphere, that is. That seems literally unfair to
45:42
me. No, but I say because the processes of industrialization have made us
45:46
lose the scales, even of small and medium- sized food companies, also
45:52
of services that can generate a much more sustainable life and sometimes not have,
45:59
for example, to walk many paths to be able to carry a product,
46:04
when you can generate that same product in the place where people live. Yeah,
46:07
and that has to do with the weather, too. Yes, well,
46:12
we can definitely have energy, generate energy in the city of Buenos Aires
46:17
without having to transport it. Of course I don' t know if in
46:22
enough quantity, but I don' t understand why in Argentina, in Buenos
46:30
Aires, we use do calefones, when we can have solar calefones. That
46:36
' s why they don' t spend anything. Why Governments have not spread
46:39
such technology cheaply, but perhaps because it is not as efficient yet in any
46:49
way. It' s full. It is full of countries with solar heaters,
46:57
for example, in East Turkey. If Turkey can, why can'
47:01
t we, because we have gas, a gactiferous culture. We have to
47:07
break up with that culture. We have to have efficient homes for heat and
47:12
cold, not use so much energy to modify the environments and thus eight hundred
47:21
things that generate work. It is necessary to conceive differently from the world.
47:27
That' s why we need imagination, not the same formulas. Imagination.
47:34
That' s what we point to in ecoic how education plays, in ecoic,
47:38
how they get into schools. It can be a good possibility, it
47:43
can' t be perfectly, that' s how we get in with the
47:45
kids. I say no, because that' s the last big hope.
47:49
No. No. Kids aren' t the hope. The big ones have
47:53
to be the ones who take the bull by the asses. There' s
47:58
no time. There' s no time to tell a baby who' s
48:01
just starting to walk You' re gonna have to fix this kilo we left
48:06
you. It' s unfair. Besides, there' s no real time.
48:12
Just like there' s real time. I mean, the planetary temperature
48:17
increased one, two, one, point, three. Now there are others
48:24
than denialists. I do not want to bring them to the table, even
48:30
our President too, which relativises quite this idea of climate change, I say
48:38
well, great floods, tremendous fires oo in humanity. Let' s say
48:42
no, in fact, I don' t know if they used to measure
48:46
like this, if they were formerly part of our occupation, or they happened
48:50
because they happened and nobody noticed. This is different, because we know that
48:52
the atmosphere is warmer, but I' m going to put it in very
48:58
personal terms. I went to Brenlanea eleven years ago and there changed my life
49:02
really because it is not easy to see a place that is supposed to be
49:12
Christine, Christine Christine, away from any compound of ice, to enter a
49:20
state of decomposition as accelerated as the one I saw and not even the temperature
49:25
had blue so much eleven years ago. But before that I had been in
49:30
Patagonia trying to see the black blizzard next to the thunderous hill. The guide
49:37
would tell me he' s already here and I' d say where he
49:39
is. And he was telling me if twenty years ago I couldn' t
49:44
touch with my hand. Now this degradation is not good. You take it
49:52
into account. In the last thirty years the climate did not begin to change
50:00
as soon as it began to burn fuels, the first coal, then oil
50:06
and gas. So much so that in the sixty- fifth year, Lindon
50:12
Johnson, who was the President of the United States, is told that this
50:16
becomes horrible. Sixty- fifth year, which happened in the 1990s, when
50:27
the first United Nations meeting on the subject was held. The industry was clear
50:31
that regulation was coming on them. Then they said let' s lie.
50:37
But there are the documents and there he began to lie. And that'
50:44
s where the two bells started. Or perhaps physics has an alternative version to
50:50
what is manifested in reality. Why do we need two bells, but they
50:57
created it for what, to confuse and it' s the 1990s. The
51:01
temperature had risen zero five over the pre- industrial era. Now we'
51:08
re at one point two, getting closer and closer to one point five.
51:14
And compromise is not a compromise that we spend on a few fifty- fives.
51:19
Please, it' s not a compromise. It is the difference between
51:22
a vivable world and one in which one cannot be avoided. We' re
51:27
talking about us, not anyone else. Marina, thank you very much for
51:31
helping us think, for reflecting and for having a hopeful look, because you
51:38
join in trying to have another narrative about climate change in which we are all
51:45
committed. Thank you Fe Thank you very much, Marina, isen for us
51:51
in this ecosystem of climate change. If you enjoyed it, if you liked
51:53
it, if you found it interesting, pass the saint and sign this you
51:58
have to spread it, you have to promote it, you have to think
52:01
a new narrative so that they are not always talking the same ones that we
52:07
know what interests are hidden in the technical operation. I wasted the yellow,
52:08
the production of melina rebo in my name, Luis de Chovanino. Thank you
52:13
very much and until the next cha