Latest / Pod Save America / Trump's Top General Uses the F-Word

Transcript

Trump's Top General Uses the F-Word · Pod Save America

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Thank you.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau.
• 0:21
  Speaker 3: I'm Jon Lovett.
• 0:22
  Speaker 4: Tommy Vitor.
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: On today's show, with three weeks to go, Trump's getting crazier,
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: Kamala's getting bolder, and the polls are getting closer. We'll
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: talk about how both campaigns are approaching the final stretch
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: of the race, and later, you'll hear Tommy's interview with
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: former Congresswoman Debbie Mucursel Powell, the Democratic candidate running to
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: unseat Florida Senator Rick Scott, and keep the Senate in
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: Democratic hands. But first, there is a reason that Kamala
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: Harris keeps telling us to watch Donald Trump's rallies. The
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: old man's getting darker and more deranged with each passing day.
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: Real Mad King vibes. Over the last few days, he
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: promised to liberate the occupied state of Colorado, withhold disaster
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: aid from California just to spite Gavin Newsom, and use
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: the U.S. military to take care of Democrats. Let's listen.
• 1:04
  Speaker 5: And now America is known all throughout the world as
• 1:07
  Speaker 5: Occupied America. November 5th, 2024 will be Liberation Day in America.
• 1:14
  Speaker 5: I'm announcing today that upon taking office, We will have
• 1:18
  Speaker 5: an Operation Aurora at the federal level to expedite the
• 1:22
  Speaker 5: removals of these savage gangs.
• 1:25
  Speaker 6: And I will invoke the Alien Enemies Act of 1798.
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: Think of that.
• 1:31
  Speaker 6: We're going to take care of your water situation. And
• 1:34
  Speaker 6: we'll force it down his throat. And we'll say, Gavin,
• 1:37
  Speaker 6: if you don't do it, we're not giving you any
• 1:39
  Speaker 6: of that fire money that we send you all the
• 1:41
  Speaker 6: time for all the forest fires that you have.
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: I think the bigger problem is the enemy from within,
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: not even the people that have come in and destroying
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: our country. By the way, totally destroying our country. The towns,
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: the villages, they're being inundated. But I don't think they're
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: the problem in terms of election day. I think the
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: bigger problem are the people from within. We have some
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: very bad people. We have some sick people, radical left lunatics.
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: And I think they're the and it should be very
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: easily handled by, if necessary, by National Guard or if
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: really necessary, by the military.
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: All right. General question here. Colin Trump rallies dark, almost
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: cliche at this point, but does seem like a bit
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: of a change in tone here.
• 2:26
  Speaker 4: It's a little darker. I know we're on a sliding
• 2:28
  Speaker 4: scale here. It's like a fascist wine tasting. You know
• 2:31
  Speaker 4: what I mean? You start with a little light nativism
• 2:33
  Speaker 4: and you progress to ruby red, blood and soil nationalism
• 2:37
  Speaker 4: by the end.
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: What do you make of all that, guys? Let's start
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: with the immigration stuff and then we'll start with Migrant
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: crime and liberating occupied Colorado and occupied America. And then
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: we'll move on to having the National Guard handle radical
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: left Democrats.
• 2:54
  Speaker 7: Yeah. So I was also just trying to check myself
• 2:58
  Speaker 7: because sometimes it's like, is Trump getting darker or is
• 3:01
  Speaker 7: it just fresher in my mind?
• 3:03
  Speaker 3: And so I went back and watched one.
• 3:05
  Speaker 7: Of his biggest immigration speeches from 2016 just to get
• 3:09
  Speaker 7: a sense of what he was saying then. And It's
• 3:13
  Speaker 7: interesting because there's plenty of vague tilting at mass deportation.
• 3:20
  Speaker 7: But what you feel when you go back and watch
• 3:22
  Speaker 7: the speeches he was giving in 2016 is that they
• 3:24
  Speaker 7: didn't know how far he could go and get away
• 3:26
  Speaker 7: with it in two ways. One, they didn't know what
• 3:29
  Speaker 7: they would be able to do politically. They just didn't
• 3:31
  Speaker 7: have the same people around him. But also, two, they
• 3:33
  Speaker 7: didn't know what they could get away with in terms
• 3:36
  Speaker 7: of bringing out their supporters without alienating them. mainstream moderates, independents,
• 3:44
  Speaker 7: and Democrats. And so if you look at what he
• 3:46
  Speaker 7: was saying in 2016, it was much more about stopping
• 3:49
  Speaker 7: illegal immigration and what Hillary Clinton would promise. He did
• 3:52
  Speaker 7: a lot of the, he did the same kind of, oh, these,
• 3:54
  Speaker 7: you know, the murderous immigrants, he did the stories, he
• 3:57
  Speaker 7: did the examples, but then he talked about targeting criminal aliens.
• 4:00
  Speaker 7: If you look at it, there's rhetoric there that could
• 4:02
  Speaker 7: obviously be used to justify a claim that he's promising
• 4:05
  Speaker 7: mass deportations, but the rhetorical excesses were just more contained
• 4:09
  Speaker 7: than And I don't think that's because Donald Trump didn't
• 4:11
  Speaker 7: believe what he's saying now. It's because I think part
• 4:16
  Speaker 7: of it is the media has gotten so much more
• 4:19
  Speaker 7: fractured and chaotic that they don't worry as much about
• 4:22
  Speaker 7: these remarks reaching the kind of people that would care
• 4:25
  Speaker 7: about them. But I also think that the people around
• 4:27
  Speaker 7: Trump has changed and their expectations of what he can
• 4:31
  Speaker 7: do once he's president have changed.
• 4:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I just think He always gets more inflammatory the
• 4:37
  Speaker 4: closer we get to an election. That's true. There was
• 4:40
  Speaker 4: a quote from right before the 2016 election where he said, quote,
• 4:43
  Speaker 4: Hillary Clinton meets in secret with international banks to plot
• 4:46
  Speaker 4: the destruction of U.S. sovereignty in order to enrich these
• 4:49
  Speaker 4: global financial powers, her special interest friends, and her donors.
• 4:52
  Speaker 4: Should not do that. Should not do that, everybody. Protocols,
• 4:56
  Speaker 4: the elders of Zion there. But 2018, it was all
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: about the Kavanaugh. I do think, though— Well, actually, in 2018,
• 5:04
  Speaker 4: it was the election of Kavanaugh, the caravan, law and order,
• 5:07
  Speaker 4: and common sense. So, yeah, it was all together. I think, though,
• 5:10
  Speaker 4: the rhetoric now has escalated to a very different place.
• 5:13
  Speaker 4: He's saying immigrants are animals. He's saying crime is in
• 5:16
  Speaker 4: their DNA. Later, he says the FBI doesn't want more
• 5:19
  Speaker 4: information about the assassination attempts on his life.
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: Like, this is really... This is like.
• 5:23
  Speaker 4: Infowars, Alex Jones, crazy conspiratorial stuff. It's also very inflammatory.
• 5:29
  Speaker 4: It leads people to take violent acts.
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: You know, I was thinking about... What Carlos Odeo, who's
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: at Eckies Research, said to Dan in the episode you
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: should all listen to from over the weekend, Dan's Polar
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: Coaster episode. And when they talked about immigration, he said, look,
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: I think these polls that show a slight majority of
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: Americans want mass deportations. He goes, I can tell you
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: from focus groups, from polling and talking to Latino voters
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: that people think mass deportations has to do with the
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: border and it has to do with illegal immigration. For
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: people who last checked in with Trump a couple years ago,
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: or at least paid a lot of attention and now
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: aren't paying a lot of attention to the news, and
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: they tend to be the persuadable voters, they're just checking in. Like,
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: you know, in 2016, Trump talked all about the border,
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: talked about the wall. Trump's four years of president, he
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: didn't do much about illegal immigration. He actually didn't really
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: take care of illegal immigration. What he did do was
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: he cut legal immigration 50%. And when you hear from
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: Stephen Miller, when you hear from some of the authors
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: of Project 2025, Stephen Miller, potential White House chief of
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: staff if Trump wins again, what they really want to
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: do is get into legal immigration. They want to get
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: rid of immigrants who are here legally. Trump has already
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: said that he wants the Haitian immigrants in Springfield who
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: are here legally, he wants to deport them. When he
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: talked about the Alien Enemies Act, that is a law
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: that has been used in the past to round up
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: and deport legal residents, not American citizens, but immigrants who
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: are here legally, who have legal status, deport them. He
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: wants to deport the dreamers who are also here legally.
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: So this is all about, I mean, he's saying migrant crime,
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: but like, if you want to go after migrant crime,
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: police will do that in Aurora. The mayor was like, yeah,
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: we have police here.
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: The Republican mayor.
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: The Republican mayor was like, we had one gang in
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: one building. And the police went after them and arrested
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: most of the gang. And that's what you do all
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: over the country. You send law enforcement out to get
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: people who are breaking the law, whether they're undocumented migrants
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: or legal citizens.
• 7:31
  Speaker 4: I think there are 10 Tren de Aragua Venezuelan gang
• 7:34
  Speaker 4: members in the building and they arrested nine of them.
• 7:35
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 7:36
  Speaker 4: That was the sort of discreet this problem was. I'm
• 7:38
  Speaker 4: not surprised by the shifts in tone because I think
• 7:41
  Speaker 4: this is the thing he genuinely is most angry and
• 7:44
  Speaker 4: passionate about. It like genuinely seems to animate him. And
• 7:48
  Speaker 4: I think He makes it ostensibly this is a conversation
• 7:51
  Speaker 4: about immigration, but it allows him to channel his deeply
• 7:56
  Speaker 4: felt and rooted racist feelings into campaign rhetoric that is
• 8:00
  Speaker 4: shocking and inflammatory, but I think has been deemed acceptable
• 8:03
  Speaker 4: by a lot of people in the Republican Party. And
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: I'm sure there are people in the campaign that want
• 8:07
  Speaker 4: him to talk about other things, but there's also the
• 8:09
  Speaker 4: Stephen Millers of the world who do believe this is
• 8:11
  Speaker 4: a project about deporting people, limiting immigration rights. But, you know,
• 8:17
  Speaker 4: they kind of make it an economic argument by saying, oh,
• 8:19
  Speaker 4: migrants are taking jobs or taking black jobs or overwhelming
• 8:22
  Speaker 4: social services. He tries to backdoor it into an economic
• 8:26
  Speaker 4: argument or a national security argument by there's terrorists coming
• 8:28
  Speaker 4: over the border. There's Chinese nationals, et cetera, because I
• 8:31
  Speaker 4: think it's the thing he cares about. And it's also
• 8:34
  Speaker 4: the thing that animates the kind of hardcore base that
• 8:38
  Speaker 4: actually goes to these rallies. Yeah.
• 8:40
  Speaker 7: I think it's also worth pointing out what it's required
• 8:43
  Speaker 7: for this argument to be politically salient at all. This
• 8:46
  Speaker 7: is a myth, right? Aurora is safer than it's ever been.
• 8:50
  Speaker 7: Colorado is safer than it's ever been.
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: Not occupied.
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: It's not occupied. The sun is shining, right?
• 8:56
  Speaker 4: By Jared Polis.
• 8:58
  Speaker 7: It is occupied by Jared Polis. The gays are taking
• 9:00
  Speaker 7: over Colorado for sure. But what is required for this
• 9:04
  Speaker 7: is that all the people getting in their pickup trucks
• 9:07
  Speaker 7: from the suburbs around Denver and Colorado driving in to
• 9:09
  Speaker 7: go to this rally, they either know this isn't true
• 9:12
  Speaker 7: or don't care, or they don't know it's not true
• 9:14
  Speaker 7: because of the media they consume, whether it's Elon's internet
• 9:18
  Speaker 7: or Fox News or its satellites.
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: Or by the way, we should say local news will
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: cover an undocumented immigrant committing a crime, which has happened, right?
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: Of course. The cases he's talking about are Lake and
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: Riley and Georgia, wherever else, like they're real cases and
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: they do get blown up by not only Fox, but
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: sometimes the local news. So he's like pushing on an
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: open door here, but yeah.
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: Your point is well taken.
• 9:41
  Speaker 7: Of course. And, and it also, I think like they
• 9:44
  Speaker 7: are relying on the fact that the kind of way
• 9:47
  Speaker 7: the information is going to be disseminated by the time
• 9:50
  Speaker 7: it reaches people for whom the actual details would be offensive.
• 9:53
  Speaker 7: It is boiled down to Trump takes strong stance on
• 9:57
  Speaker 7: border and immigrant crime at a fiery rally in Colorado.
• 10:02
  Speaker 7: Like they are counting on that every day, because if
• 10:04
  Speaker 7: the words that this is why Kamala Harris says, watch
• 10:06
  Speaker 7: the rallies. If people were seeing what was in the rallies,
• 10:09
  Speaker 7: it would be extremely unpopular. It's also this is I
• 10:11
  Speaker 7: went back and I looked at. his Central Park Five
• 10:15
  Speaker 7: ad from the 80s when he put this, I think
• 10:18
  Speaker 7: it was a full page ad in Newsday or one
• 10:21
  Speaker 7: of those kind of like tabloid papers.
• 10:23
  Speaker 4: Tough hit on Newsday. Here's some of the language in it.
• 10:27
  Speaker 4: I recently watched a newscast trying to explain the anger
• 10:29
  Speaker 4: in these young men. I no longer want to understand
• 10:31
  Speaker 4: their anger. I want them to understand our anger. I
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: want them to be afraid. Criminals must be told that
• 10:36
  Speaker 4: their civil liberties end when an attack on our safety begins.
• 10:40
  Speaker 4: This is like, the longest running thread in the kind
• 10:43
  Speaker 4: of Trump narrative that he is a racist and he
• 10:47
  Speaker 4: wants to punish people that don't look like him or
• 10:51
  Speaker 4: curtail civil liberties when he thinks a crime was committed.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: I think politically, he needs huge turnout among his base.
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: Voters cite immigration as one of their top issues, maybe
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: the third or fourth, depending on the poll. And they
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: trust him over Kamala by a wider margin on immigration
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: than any other top issue. It's almost like It's comparable
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: to Democrats focusing a lot on abortion, right? Maybe the
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: second top issue after the economy, but up there. But
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: I also think Trump, to your point, Tommy, not only
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: is it what he really believes, he also knows that
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: it's more of an emotional appeal to people than an
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: economic argument because it makes people feel threatened. And that's
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: what he wants to do. He wants to go to
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: all these places. And he wants for the people who
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: are in the suburbs who might go to the city.
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: You don't want to go to the city. There's migrant
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: crime there. And now it's coming to the suburbs. It's
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: coming to Aurora. It's coming everywhere. And that's why you've
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: got to elect me to stop the border. And if
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: you're upset with how your suburbs look and your city's looking,
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: it's the migrants and it's crap. This is what he
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: wants to do. And he thinks this is his best close,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: better than the economy, even though the economy is the
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: top issue for most voters in every poll. But I
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: don't know.
• 11:59
  Speaker 4: This is also where the paid and the earned is
• 12:01
  Speaker 4: very different. His speeches focus on immigration. His paid advertising
• 12:05
  Speaker 4: is focused on the economy. The Wesleyan Media Project, they
• 12:08
  Speaker 4: track TV ads and spending. They said that most of
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: Trump's ads in the last week or two have been
• 12:13
  Speaker 4: focused on economic issues like taxes and jobs. The campaign
• 12:16
  Speaker 4: has also made a big push into paid advertising, attacking
• 12:20
  Speaker 4: Kamala Harris on transgender rights. It's that transgender criminal ad
• 12:24
  Speaker 4: that we've all been seeing on like football games and stuff.
• 12:26
  Speaker 4: But it's just interesting that what he wants to talk
• 12:28
  Speaker 4: about is this immigration stuff and the campaign is focused
• 12:30
  Speaker 4: a different way. Well, that brings up a question. Do
• 12:32
  Speaker 4: we think he's making a political mistake closing on immigration?
• 12:36
  Speaker 4: Because like Tommy said, if the campaign's thinking, all right,
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: the most effective way we can close is on the economy,
• 12:43
  Speaker 4: but he's out there yelling about migrant crime. You know,
• 12:47
  Speaker 4: I've been wondering if Kamala Harris has been doing a
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: great job talking about the border, Donald Trump killing the
• 12:53
  Speaker 4: border bill. She's going to sign the border bill. She
• 12:56
  Speaker 4: has not, and I'm guessing it's because of some of
• 12:58
  Speaker 4: this polling around deportation, she has not talked as much
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: about Trump's sort of extreme stance on deportations, building camps,
• 13:07
  Speaker 4: deportation camps, which, by the way, is like, it's just a,
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: he is more extreme on immigration than where the median
• 13:13
  Speaker 4: voter is. It just is.
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: And maybe part of it, the polling is, they don't
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: know what his stance on immigration is right now, because
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: it has, it's in these rallies and we don't talk
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: about them everywhere.
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, there are two questions in there.
• 13:25
  Speaker 7: Like, I don't know about the wisdom, if there's any
• 13:27
  Speaker 7: wisdom in his focus on immigration at the rallies. I
• 13:30
  Speaker 7: think the rallies are maybe about turnout. The people coming
• 13:34
  Speaker 7: out to a rally to see Trump have already decided
• 13:37
  Speaker 7: they love him. They believe he's better on the economy.
• 13:39
  Speaker 7: This is about driving his most enthusiastic people to show up.
• 13:44
  Speaker 7: And maybe they rely on ads to reach the less
• 13:47
  Speaker 7: engaged people who just remember him as being better for
• 13:49
  Speaker 7: the economy. I also wonder too, if part of this
• 13:51
  Speaker 7: is The Kamala Harris campaign has done an amazing job
• 13:55
  Speaker 7: fighting back on the economy, and it's not as clear
• 13:58
  Speaker 7: a winning issue for him, but immigration really is. I
• 14:02
  Speaker 7: also think it's still, and we'll get to the strength
• 14:04
  Speaker 7: weakness thing, it is still a stand-in, I think, from
• 14:07
  Speaker 7: the kind of connection between chaos at the border and
• 14:10
  Speaker 7: Biden being older as a kind of connection with that
• 14:13
  Speaker 7: kind of overall failure and chaos from the Biden administration.
• 14:16
  Speaker 7: And maybe they're trying to hope that that holds them
• 14:18
  Speaker 7: all the way to election day. I don't know.
• 14:20
  Speaker 4: They really are. He really is trying to craft the
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: campaign he was running against Joe Biden to Kamala Harris.
• 14:25
  Speaker 4: You see he demanded she take a cognitive test today.
• 14:27
  Speaker 4: He just can't let go of these talking points.
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: I would if I were them think about hitting Trump
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: on this because I think she can very easily say, look,
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: I want to be very tough on the border. I
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: want to sign this border bill that was with the
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: conservative Republican senator. But also the idea that he's going
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: to run around deporting people who are here legally, who
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: are legal residents, who have done everything right just because
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: they're immigrants. Like that is, you know, there's a lot
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: of talk about trouble with Latino vote. Forget about just
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: Latino vote, white vote. Like people don't want that.
• 14:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 14:58
  Speaker 7: I also think like when you talk about mass deportation,
• 15:00
  Speaker 7: you're talking about deporting millions of people who are the
• 15:03
  Speaker 7: parent of or married to an American citizen. So you
• 15:06
  Speaker 7: are talking about the largest family separation in American history.
• 15:09
  Speaker 7: That's what the largest mass deportation in American history would be.
• 15:12
  Speaker 7: The largest family separation.
• 15:13
  Speaker 4: Or kids who moved here when they were two years
• 15:15
  Speaker 4: old and have been here for 37 years. You know,
• 15:18
  Speaker 4: we don't even talk about the dreamers anymore. Trump claimed
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: at one point that he wanted to do something legislatively
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: or by executive order to protect the dreamers. And now
• 15:25
  Speaker 4: he's saying that a kid who moved to the U.S.
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: when they were one years old will be sent back to,
• 15:30
  Speaker 4: I don't know, pick a country that they've never been to.
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: They don't know the language. They don't have any connection.
• 15:35
  Speaker 4: I mean, it's. Completely inhumane.
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: And by the way, if you think he's just bluffing,
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: he has, any president has wide latitude when it comes
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: to immigration enforcement. So Stephen Miller's, a lot of this
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: can very easily get done.
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 15:48
  Speaker 7: Like you mentioned the 1798 law he wants to evoke.
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: You think that the.
• 15:55
  Speaker 7: Conservative Supreme Court is going to stop Trump from using
• 15:57
  Speaker 7: this law any way he'd like? They don't think that,
• 16:00
  Speaker 7: they're not worried about that.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, I was looking into this just because
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: I was a little frightened by it. And all of
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: the even liberal-leaning legal scholars are like, there's no way.
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: The court has shut down people trying to use Alien
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: Enemies Act in many instances. But either this court doesn't or, again,
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: there is the scenario where the Supreme Court issues a
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: ruling and Donald Trump is just like, why would I
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: listen to that?
• 16:27
  Speaker 6: J.D.
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: Vance said on a podcast when he wanted to gut
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: the bureaucracy and said he would advise Trump to gut
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: the bureaucracy, he said, oh, and then the Supreme Court
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: can say no, and then Trump can say, all right,
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: enforce your order. Like, J.D. Vance said that. Yeah.
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: You and, yeah, send your battalions.
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: Right. All right, let's talk about the other crazy shit
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: Trump said. His comments to Maria Bartiromo about deploying the
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: military against, quote, the enemy from within, a.k.a.
• 16:52
  Speaker 5: U.S.
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: Citizens, came after the news that the Trump administration's top general,
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: former chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Mark Milley, told journalist
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: Bob Woodward that Trump is, quote, fascist to the core.
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: and that, quote, no one has ever been as dangerous
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: to this country as Donald Trump. This is the chairman
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: of the Joint Chiefs under Donald Trump, his hand-picked general.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: Kamala Harris picked up on the news and mentioned it
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: at her rally in North Carolina this weekend. Let's listen.
• 17:19
  Speaker 8: Or just listen most recently to what we heard General
• 17:23
  Speaker 8: Milley said. General Milley, former chairman of the Joint Chiefs
• 17:27
  Speaker 8: under Donald Trump. It was just reported he said, quote,
• 17:32
  Speaker 8: No one has ever been as dangerous to this country
• 17:37
  Speaker 8: in referring to Donald Trump. Think about that.
• 17:42
  Speaker 9: Think about that.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: I'm thinking about it. Yeah. So Tim Walz also jumped
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: on Trump's comments on Monday. Just before we started recording,
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: CNN said that the Harris-Walz campaign is going to run
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: a 30-second ad about this. Kamala Harris will hit this
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: in her rally. uh, Monday night. It certainly seems like
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: the arguments that Trump might actually deploy the military against
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: American citizens, uh, and that his, uh, former general chairman
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: of the joint chiefs thinks he's a fascist should be
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: compelling to persuadable voters. I don't know. What do you
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: guys think?
• 18:16
  Speaker 7: Mark Milley has said these sorts of things to Jeffrey
• 18:18
  Speaker 7: Goldberg at the Atlantic. He's saying it to Bob Woodward
• 18:21
  Speaker 7: in print form, uh, hey man, it is 2024. We
• 18:24
  Speaker 7: got to see your face on video. You're saying it,
• 18:28
  Speaker 7: say it on video. My hope is that he's going
• 18:31
  Speaker 7: to do it at some point, but I don't know.
• 18:35
  Speaker 7: It's less meaningful, it's less impactful to say it in print,
• 18:38
  Speaker 7: but it's no less true of your view. You're not
• 18:40
  Speaker 7: avoiding telling people what you think. So why not do
• 18:42
  Speaker 7: it in a way that actually has a chance to
• 18:44
  Speaker 7: reach people who might care about it?
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: He did do that oblique reference in a commencement right
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: after he left where he said, we don't take an
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: oath to dictators or want to be dictators.
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: And because there's a little too oblique.
• 18:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: Oh, this is the 2024 is all about subtlety.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: Like, and by the way, Donald Trump's like the migrants
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: are slitting our throats.
• 19:04
  Speaker 7: He used like, like he referred, like there's such a
• 19:06
  Speaker 7: lack of video of Milley saying these sorts of things
• 19:09
  Speaker 7: that they use that in an ad just the same,
• 19:11
  Speaker 7: even though he's saying far more direct things.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: In other forms.
• 19:13
  Speaker 7: And I don't understand that.
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: There's an admirable thing. thing you hear a lot from
• 19:18
  Speaker 4: like former three stars and four star generals that they
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: don't want to be involved in politics and they believe
• 19:22
  Speaker 4: strongly in the military's apolitical role in our society and
• 19:27
  Speaker 4: their commitment is to the constitution. But once you blur
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: that line and you say it on the record to
• 19:32
  Speaker 4: Bob Woodward, like what are we doing here? You have
• 19:35
  Speaker 4: to sit down and do this on camera. It doesn't
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: have to be a campaign ad. Do it in an
• 19:40
  Speaker 4: interview with a friendly reporter and then the campaign will
• 19:43
  Speaker 4: cut that and put it in a TV ad. You
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: know what I mean? It doesn't have to be like
• 19:46
  Speaker 4: overtly partisan necessarily. Also, where's John Kelly? his former chief
• 19:51
  Speaker 4: of staff, who has said in a number of interviews,
• 19:54
  Speaker 4: he's dangerous, he's unfit, he's crazy. Or Mattis, Jim Mattis,
• 19:59
  Speaker 4: the former Secretary of Defense. Like, there's a lot of people.
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: And I also think this helps with, like, one of
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: the big challenges for the Harris-Walls campaign is, is reaching
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: people who are like, you know what? We survived a
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: first term of Donald Trump and everyone said he was
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: going to be a dictator and stuff like that. And,
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: you know, January 6th was horrendous and he tried to
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: return the election. But like, you know, we survived. Things
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: are OK. And it's like, oh, everyone's got Trump amnesia. Well,
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: Milley says to Woodward, you know, I glimpsed this when
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: I talked to you a few years ago. This was
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: like right before he left the Trump administration, before everything
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: really went crazy. He goes, but now I know it.
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: No one has ever been as dangerous. Now I realize
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: he's a total fascist. And I do think that the
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: part of the message in the final weeks is the
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: Trump you think you know, who you don't like and
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: you think is a little crazy, has deteriorated so much
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: more and is so much more unstable and more dangerous
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: than he was before. And all of the guardrails are
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: gone this time. All the only people that are left
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: are like the most at best grifters and at worst fascists.
• 21:05
  Speaker 7: Yeah, the The the insiders have become detractors and the passionate, zealous,
• 21:11
  Speaker 7: extreme outsiders have become the insiders. Like the other part
• 21:14
  Speaker 7: of this, too, like it's not the most important point,
• 21:17
  Speaker 7: but all these people saying like, guys, Trump was president
• 21:20
  Speaker 7: and he said all this stuff, but he actually didn't
• 21:22
  Speaker 7: do it. It's like, what kind of point do you
• 21:23
  Speaker 7: think you're making? Like, he's the worst person in the
• 21:26
  Speaker 7: world saying he wants to do terrible things because he
• 21:28
  Speaker 7: believes the American people really want it, but he doesn't
• 21:30
  Speaker 7: really mean it.
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: Like, why?
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: What kind of defense is that?
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: It's a character thing. I mean, the John Kelly stuff
• 21:35
  Speaker 4: that you mentioned earlier, who is his chief of staff.
• 21:38
  Speaker 4: This is a quote he sent to Jake Tapper. A
• 21:41
  Speaker 4: person that did not, he's talking about Trump, a person
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: that did not want to be seen in the presence
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: of military amputees because, quote, it does not look good
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: for me. I mean, you're talking about a person who
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: is so narcissistic and self-absorbed that he wouldn't be photographed
• 21:53
  Speaker 4: with military amputees when he's the commander in chief. That's
• 21:56
  Speaker 4: not like a, you know, endorsement thing. That's not a,
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: it's not partisan. It's just like, you're a bad person.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: That's just like the guy in 2020, Donald Trump had
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: peaceful protesters in Lafayette park tear gassed. And he asked
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: if he could have them shot. And then he was
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: told no by some of the same people who are
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: now telling us that he is a fascist. He says repeatedly,
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: he wants to use the federal government to punish people
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: who don't support him. He says he wants to use
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: the National Guard and the military against people who protest him.
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: His advisors say that too. They wrote it down in
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: Project 2025. And it's like, yeah, maybe he's just bluffing.
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: Maybe there's a chance. Maybe the military will refuse, even
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: though he's going to replace the leadership of the military
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: with his people, with loyalists. Maybe the Supreme Court will
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: stop him. Maybe he'll obey their ruling. Maybe it'll all
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: be fine. But it's like, do you want to take
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: that risk? Do you want to take that risk for what?
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: Because you think that his economic policy of taxing imported goods...
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: And drilling for oil and repealing Obamacare is going to
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: put more money in your pocket? That's the risk you
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: want to take?
• 22:51
  Speaker 4: Roll the dice.
• 22:51
  Speaker 7: You want a lower top marginal rate and fewer environmental regulations.
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: Maybe he's just bluffing. Yeah, maybe.
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: But, like, why?
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: Are you playing Russian roulette now?
• 22:59
  Speaker 7: Well, there was a piece in The Times about Trump
• 23:03
  Speaker 7: supporters don't really believe what he says. And this sentence
• 23:06
  Speaker 7: really jumped out at me, which was... There were rough
• 23:08
  Speaker 7: edges in his remarks and some talk of a stolen election,
• 23:11
  Speaker 7: but mostly he made them feel content in their choice
• 23:13
  Speaker 7: to vote for him. Some rough edges about stealing the election.
• 23:18
  Speaker 7: And you look at what these kind of economic elites
• 23:22
  Speaker 7: that want to support Trump say, and you can describe
• 23:24
  Speaker 7: it as not really believing him, but really it's about
• 23:26
  Speaker 7: pretending he's not saying what he's saying or hearing what
• 23:29
  Speaker 7: he's saying and saying he's not going to do it
• 23:31
  Speaker 7: because they don't really care. They want their tax cuts.
• 23:35
  Speaker 7: They want their deregulation. And they will soothe their own
• 23:39
  Speaker 7: psychology about their morally depraved choice any way they can.
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I read that Times piece. I think that sentiment
• 23:46
  Speaker 4: is true for like a subset of the kind of
• 23:49
  Speaker 4: donor class of supporters because this was a speech to
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: the Detroit Economic Club. So it doesn't surprise me that
• 23:54
  Speaker 4: those people don't think that Trump will lock up his
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: political enemies or maybe that they just won't kind of
• 24:00
  Speaker 4: entertain the thought because it's inconvenient for them to think
• 24:03
  Speaker 4: about it. The people who go to your standard Trump rally,
• 24:06
  Speaker 4: Absolutely want him to punish his enemies. They want it.
• 24:10
  Speaker 4: They've been chanting, lock her up for like a decade now. They're,
• 24:13
  Speaker 4: they're waiting for it to happen. They all saw what
• 24:15
  Speaker 4: happened on January 6th and they're like, yeah, more of that.
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: The question is the persuadable voters that are left, the
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: people who haven't made up their minds, whether they're voting
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: for Trump or that they're voting at all. and don't
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: consume that much news, do they even know? And I
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: think that they don't.
• 24:31
  Speaker 4: Do they care, I think, is a fair question.
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: Do they care is a fair question.
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: Do they believe it? Do they care? Do they know?
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: Do they believe it?
• 24:37
  Speaker 4: Do they care?
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: I was going to say, and before we get to
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: do they believe it and do they care, we first
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: have to find out if they know. And I think
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: there has been no concerted effort to make sure they know.
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: And I don't blame the Harris-Walls campaign for this. I
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: don't even necessarily blame the media for this because we're
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: just inundated with bullshit all the time. And again, Trump
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: is hiding. We're going to talk about this in a second,
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: but he's hiding from the press. And so what you
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: get is supporters sort of just either saying they like
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: it or ignoring it. Or you get supporters like Virginia
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: Governor Glenn Youngkin trying to pretend that Trump never said
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: it in this interview with Jake Tapper. Let's play a clip.
• 25:12
  Speaker 4: I don't think that he's referring to elected people in America.
• 25:16
  Speaker 10: But I'm literally reading his quotes. I'm literally reading his
• 25:19
  Speaker 10: quotes to you. And I played them earlier so you
• 25:22
  Speaker 10: could hear that they were not. made up by me.
• 25:24
  Speaker 10: He's literally talking about, quote, radical left lunatics. And then
• 25:27
  Speaker 10: one of those lunatics he addressed, he mentioned, was Congressman
• 25:31
  Speaker 10: Adam Schiff.
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: Criminals should be locked up.
• 25:35
  Speaker 10: Migrants who are in this country illegally, who are violent,
• 25:40
  Speaker 10: should be locked up and deported. I grant you all
• 25:42
  Speaker 10: of that, and I am not denying that it's happening
• 25:44
  Speaker 10: at all. But I'm talking about Donald Trump saying that
• 25:48
  Speaker 10: he wants to use the National Guard and the military
• 25:50
  Speaker 10: to go after The left.
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: That's what he's saying.
• 25:53
  Speaker 7: I don't believe that's what he's saying.
• 25:55
  Speaker 4: But listen, you and I are going to argue about that.
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: But I would suggest if you would also... I played
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: the quote and I read it to you. If you
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: would also balance that.
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: I mean, you can wish.
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: That he weren't saying that, but that's what he's saying.
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: I can't... All the.
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: Time, it's happening everywhere. People are taking people's... They're taking words.
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: They're playing the words for people.
• 26:11
  Speaker 7: They're taking Trump out of context at the thing he
• 26:13
  Speaker 7: is saying repeatedly at multiple campaign stops as part of
• 26:17
  Speaker 7: his closing message. I really don't think I've seen... like
• 26:20
  Speaker 7: a better encapsulation of what like, quote, establishment and quote,
• 26:24
  Speaker 7: Republicans have done to get behind Trump in this interview.
• 26:27
  Speaker 7: It's pretending he's not saying the shit he's saying every day.
• 26:30
  Speaker 7: It's doing the intellectual Zamboni work to say, like, actually,
• 26:34
  Speaker 7: it's about immigration when he's talking about putting Adam Schiff
• 26:39
  Speaker 7: in prison.
• 26:39
  Speaker 4: He's like, send the military after Adam Schiff. He couldn't
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: be more clear.
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: Also, I didn't realize this because it wasn't covered. In
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: the Aurora rally, he says the same thing about enemy
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: from within and the National Guard.
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: It's in the remarks. It's part of his prepared text.
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: And I guess, like, if you played a clip of
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: that interview for Donald Trump and then asked him, what
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: do you think about what Glenn Young can say? He'd
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: be like, Glenn Young can's wrong. I meant to go
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: after Americans.
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he called Glenn Young a fag. That's what he
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: would do.
• 27:07
  Speaker 4: He literally says to Maria Bartiromo, there's the outside enemy
• 27:10
  Speaker 4: and then the enemy within. And he's talking about Democrats.
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he's specifically saying it's very clear.
• 27:14
  Speaker 4: It's it's yes.
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: I just, you know, I'm glad they're making an ad.
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: Put it in front of voters. Put it in a speech.
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: Put it in front.
• 27:21
  Speaker 4: I guess the question is, like, have they put this
• 27:23
  Speaker 4: in an ad before and have they tested it? And
• 27:25
  Speaker 4: people are like, if you're a low information voter, maybe
• 27:28
  Speaker 4: there's a version where you're like, I don't care what
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: these kind of partisans do to each other. I don't
• 27:32
  Speaker 4: know what they're talking about. I'm trying to pay my bills.
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: I'm not saying like I know that to be true.
• 27:36
  Speaker 4: I'm just like thinking aloud. These people running the campaign
• 27:39
  Speaker 4: are not idiots, right? They're going to do whatever test best.
• 27:42
  Speaker 4: And we're not suggesting that. It's just I'm wondering, I
• 27:44
  Speaker 4: don't know, you have to wonder how it plays. And
• 27:46
  Speaker 4: maybe this new ad they're going to do today is
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: to drive media coverage of this.
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: So I think that it is well known that a
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: lot of January 6th themed ads, for lack of a
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: better description. have not moved people as much because everyone's
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: like it's in the past.
• 28:03
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: It's, or, you know, Joe Biden was out there, you know,
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: John Meacham writing a speeches talking about democracy and the
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: threat to democracy. And it's very like up here and
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: it's not really grounded for people. I think this is
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: two things about this that I think could make it persuadable,
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: could make it effective. One, it's new information. When you
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: put new information in front of voters, that is more
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: likely to get them to move. They have not heard
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: this exact comment from Donald Trump before. It is new.
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: You can put it in front of voters. And it
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: also is about it's it's not like an idea, like
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: saving democracy, like it's an idea. It's Donald Trump. If
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: you don't support him, wants to or if you go
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: protest him or whatever, wants to send the National Guard
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: and military into the streets. Like, I just I don't
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: sometimes you mean we can pull it for sure. And
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: I'm sure that the campaign will pull it. But in
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: the final three weeks, who knows if they have tended
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: to test it? It's like, you know what? You got
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: to go with your gut on this one.
• 28:53
  Speaker 7: We'll get to the Trump strategy in a second about
• 28:55
  Speaker 7: whether and how they're hiding something. Trump from the public.
• 28:58
  Speaker 7: But I do think this is not just about persuading
• 29:01
  Speaker 7: people to vote for Kamala Harris or to not vote
• 29:04
  Speaker 7: for Trump or stay home. I also think that there
• 29:07
  Speaker 7: are millions of Democrats who need to be reminded of
• 29:09
  Speaker 7: the stakes and the people that are going to be
• 29:11
  Speaker 7: most outraged and may hear about this. They're going to
• 29:13
  Speaker 7: make calls. They're going to knock on doors. They're going
• 29:15
  Speaker 7: to care about this. They're going to get their friends
• 29:17
  Speaker 7: to vote. Like part of this is like this is
• 29:20
  Speaker 7: this needs to kind of remind everybody that paying attention
• 29:24
  Speaker 7: just to how dangerous Donald Trump will be in the
• 29:26
  Speaker 7: second term to try to get everybody out to do
• 29:27
  Speaker 7: their part.
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: If I was talking to someone I knew who was
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: wavering or I was on a door, I'd bring this up.
• 29:32
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: And if it was like a couple of days before
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: the election, I'd talk about abortion bans. I'd talk about
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: repealing healthcare and I'd be like, oh yeah. And by
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: the way, did you hear him say he wants to
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: send out the military?
• 29:41
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 29:42
  Speaker 4: I guess there's just, there's a bunch of people who
• 29:43
  Speaker 4: think he's not really going to do that. I mean,
• 29:45
  Speaker 4: we just heard some of them. They don't think, they
• 29:46
  Speaker 4: don't believe it. They don't think it's real. The response
• 29:49
  Speaker 4: is always what about ism. Actually, they're going after me.
• 29:51
  Speaker 4: I have four criminal cases. They're trying to lock me up.
• 29:54
  Speaker 4: They're going after my business. So you guys could be right.
• 29:57
  Speaker 4: I'm just trying to straw man the other side of it,
• 29:58
  Speaker 4: which is There's a constant, you know, endless stream of
• 30:03
  Speaker 4: rhetoric about how dangerous Donald Trump is or will be
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: for the last nine or 10 years. And I think
• 30:08
  Speaker 4: people tune out some of it, even when it's quotes
• 30:10
  Speaker 4: from him. And maybe that's the case here and maybe
• 30:13
  Speaker 4: why we aren't seeing it more. Or maybe this is
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: really compelling and we're going to see a lot of this.
• 30:17
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: I just, I think it's not, I get it. I
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: have the feeling it's not getting in front of voters.
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: So we just, we haven't tested it yet. So let's
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: talk about Kamala Harris. She is currently in the middle
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: of a campaign swing that's taking her to Pennsylvania, Michigan,
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: back to Pennsylvania, then to Wisconsin, then back to Michigan,
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: on to Georgia. Several stops in most places. She's going
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: all over the place. She's also doing a lot more interviews.
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: She did The Shade Room. She did Roland Martin. And
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: then on Wednesday, she is doing an interview with Bret
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: Baier of Fox News.
• 30:57
  Speaker 4: Weird.
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: One big theme of hers over the last couple days,
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: that Trump is weak and scared. Let's take a listen.
• 31:04
  Speaker 8: But here's the thing, North Carolina, and he's not being
• 31:06
  Speaker 8: transparent with the voters. He's not being transparent. So check
• 31:10
  Speaker 8: this out. He refuses to.
• 31:13
  Speaker 9: Release his medical records.
• 31:16
  Speaker 8: I've done it. Every other presidential camp, every other presidential
• 31:23
  Speaker 8: candidate in modern era has done it. He is unwilling
• 31:28
  Speaker 8: to do a 60 Minutes interview. like every other major
• 31:36
  Speaker 8: party candidate has done for more than half a century.
• 31:41
  Speaker 9: He is unwilling to meet.
• 31:44
  Speaker 8: For a second debate.
• 31:50
  Speaker 11: And here's the thing, here's the thing, it makes you wonder,
• 31:55
  Speaker 11: it makes you wonder, why does his staff want him
• 32:00
  Speaker 11: to hide away?
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: One must question.
• 32:07
  Speaker 8: One must question. Are they afraid that people will see
• 32:11
  Speaker 8: that he is too weak and unstable.
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: To lead America?
• 32:19
  Speaker 4: One must answer.
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: One must answer.
• 32:20
  Speaker 7: If you're afraid of Leslie Stahl, how can you deal
• 32:24
  Speaker 7: with Vladimir Putin?
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: So, again, Plouffe talked about this with Dan on Sunday's PSA.
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: He was teasing that the strong leader question is something
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: that's popping with voters in their data. He also talked
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: to New York Magazine, and he said, the thing to
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: think about is his increasing instability, Project 2025, the notion
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: of a Trump with no guardrails, with a desire for
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: unchecked power. We've talked about that. We've run ads on that.
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: We're going to continue to emphasize that in the end
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: because that worries all the voters who are remaining out
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: there who haven't decided yet who to vote for. And
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: he said, really raising the risk profile of the Trump
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: second term is a very important piece of business for
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: us to execute well on. Here's the question. How... It
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: seems that this could be in tension, right, with Trump
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: is weak. He is an unserious person. He is like, whatever,
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: the weak stuff. But then also the risk is great. Like,
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: I don't know how you do both of those.
• 33:18
  Speaker 7: Yeah, I think that's where the unstable piece comes in.
• 33:21
  Speaker 7: And I think they have to do both, right? Like,
• 33:23
  Speaker 7: Trump is a real threat.
• 33:24
  Speaker 3: He's unstable.
• 33:24
  Speaker 7: He's promising chaos. He's promising all these evil policies. But
• 33:28
  Speaker 7: you don't want that to lean into he's a strong man, right?
• 33:30
  Speaker 7: it's because he's weak, because he's depraved, because he's unstable.
• 33:33
  Speaker 7: He's going to pursue this extreme and radical and dangerous agenda.
• 33:38
  Speaker 7: I also like, you know, it's just true. Like it's
• 33:41
  Speaker 7: just a very true argument. And like the fact that
• 33:43
  Speaker 7: he's gotten away with being pulling ahead of Democrats, whether
• 33:47
  Speaker 7: it was Biden or Kamala on being strong for so long,
• 33:50
  Speaker 7: it is just a place to attack because it's so
• 33:52
  Speaker 7: obviously false on its face. Once you think about it
• 33:56
  Speaker 7: and engage with it for even one second. And like
• 33:58
  Speaker 7: they have, They're beating him on abortion. They're fighting to
• 34:03
  Speaker 7: a draw on the economy. As Plouffe pointed out, they're
• 34:08
  Speaker 7: doing better on those questions about who fights for you
• 34:10
  Speaker 7: and who fights for the middle class. Immigration is a
• 34:13
  Speaker 7: tough issue. Character, leadership, strength, that's the last place where
• 34:18
  Speaker 7: they need to fight this kind of battle and win
• 34:20
  Speaker 7: that battle.
• 34:21
  Speaker 4: She's calling him a wimp. Plouffe is saying he might
• 34:24
  Speaker 4: be too strong.
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: What?
• 34:26
  Speaker 4: Maybe the strong man you don't like kind of leader.
• 34:28
  Speaker 4: It is a very different argument. What I heard in
• 34:32
  Speaker 4: her lines there was, I know you're going to hear this.
• 34:36
  Speaker 4: I think you're a fucking wimp. And I'm going to
• 34:38
  Speaker 4: try to bait you into doing some things that is
• 34:40
  Speaker 4: stupid for you to do.
• 34:41
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: Plouffe's broader point, though, about like strength in politics. I mean,
• 34:44
  Speaker 4: this is a perennial thing. It's a cliche. It's like
• 34:46
  Speaker 4: we need a president who can face down Putin or
• 34:48
  Speaker 4: Xi Jinping or some autocrat. Understanding what that means manifests
• 34:52
  Speaker 4: in a lot of ways. You know, he's talking about height.
• 34:55
  Speaker 4: He used to talk about military experience. There's obviously like
• 34:59
  Speaker 4: gendered overtones to the whole thing. So I don't know.
• 35:03
  Speaker 4: I mean, I like her argument there. I like her saying,
• 35:07
  Speaker 4: come out of your safe space, you fucking loser. I'm
• 35:09
  Speaker 4: sitting here waiting for you. Let's do a debate. Let's
• 35:11
  Speaker 4: do 60 minutes. Let's do whatever. I don't know if
• 35:14
  Speaker 4: it's a message that's designed to move voters or just
• 35:17
  Speaker 4: to get him to react like the line she had
• 35:19
  Speaker 4: in the debate.
• 35:20
  Speaker 8: Yeah.
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: And you know what? These things aren't necessarily neat. It's
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: a campaign like you could be trying to bait him
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: and then you do that. But you still got to
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: raise the risk profile of a Trump second term with
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: persuadable voters, because I do think telling a persuadable voter, oh,
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: you think Trump's strong? Actually, he's weak.
• 35:38
  Speaker 4: It's not like when they saw the bloody face fist
• 35:41
  Speaker 4: pump photo. Right.
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: I just think it's you're just you can try to
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: redefine strength and weakness. Real strength is that you can
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: do all that. But, you know, it seems a little complicated.
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: You might as well just tell people, oh, he's going
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: to send out the guard to shoot people. Yeah. And
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: also he's hiding. I also think that like both are true.
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: The other part of.
• 36:00
  Speaker 7: The he's a wimp, he's hiding thing is it's just
• 36:02
  Speaker 7: catnip for reporters. And I do think that like I
• 36:06
  Speaker 7: think one place where the Trump campaign and the Harris
• 36:08
  Speaker 7: campaign have a kind of similar theory about how the
• 36:11
  Speaker 7: media works right now is that it's very hard to
• 36:12
  Speaker 7: break through in a bunch of ways. But like the
• 36:15
  Speaker 7: overall kind of mood music does matter.
• 36:17
  Speaker 4: It does. Right.
• 36:18
  Speaker 7: And like, I think like the Trump people are counting
• 36:20
  Speaker 7: on that. I think the Harris campaign in this case,
• 36:22
  Speaker 7: it's like a bunch of stories about how Trump's not
• 36:24
  Speaker 7: doing press. He's not out there, kind of sets a
• 36:27
  Speaker 7: narrative that I think is really unhelpful for him.
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: I mean, when it was Biden and Trump, we would
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: always say that when the news is about Biden, Biden's
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: a little down. When the news is about Trump, Trump's
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: a little down. It was different when Kamala took over
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: because she is a new candidate who was largely undefined.
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: So When it was about her, it was good because
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: we had to define her. I think at this stage
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: in the campaign, we are back to, if we're going
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: to get a week about Kamala news like we did
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: last week, it was like, is she going to do
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: the interviews? Then she did the interviews. Did she have
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: a gaffe in one of the interviews, right? And I
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: think now it's a question in the final three weeks
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: of like, what are we talking about in the last
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: week of the election? Is it something that Trump did wrong,
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: something that Trump said, or is it some mistake that
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: Kamala made? And I think that we need it to
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: be about Trump in the final weeks.
• 37:12
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: What do you guys think?
• 37:13
  Speaker 7: Yeah, no, I think that's right. I also think that anytime... Look, sure,
• 37:19
  Speaker 7: they're in conflict. She's saying he's a wimp, promising this
• 37:24
  Speaker 7: extreme and dangerous authoritarianism. But at the same time, to
• 37:29
  Speaker 7: Donald Trump's base, his rambling nonsense on the stump is
• 37:34
  Speaker 7: his kind of defiant persona. But the more people seeing
• 37:38
  Speaker 7: those clips on television... think less like, oh, there's that
• 37:41
  Speaker 7: kind of guy that took on the system and more
• 37:43
  Speaker 7: like there's that rambling old man again. I think the
• 37:46
  Speaker 7: more his strengths look like weaknesses. And I think there
• 37:49
  Speaker 7: is like real value to that.
• 37:50
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 37:51
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 37:51
  Speaker 4: I don't know if it matters most if it's the
• 37:54
  Speaker 4: stories about him or her in the closing weeks. I
• 37:56
  Speaker 4: do think there's like a very real thing that happens
• 37:58
  Speaker 4: in the final week or two of a campaign where
• 38:00
  Speaker 4: the vibe help like leads the remaining undecideds to break
• 38:05
  Speaker 4: en masse. And in 2016, it was the Comey letter
• 38:09
  Speaker 4: And we all felt that and maybe Hillary Clinton would
• 38:11
  Speaker 4: have lost anyway. And I just, I don't know what.
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: 2020, it would have been Hunter's laptop had they not- Right.
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: Had they not silenced him.
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: Had they not done election interference.
• 38:19
  Speaker 4: The obsession about that is the funniest thing to me.
• 38:21
  Speaker 4: Like the idea that people were just sitting around wondering
• 38:24
  Speaker 4: what Joe Biden's son was up to anyway. But yeah,
• 38:27
  Speaker 4: I'm worried about that. And I think that could be,
• 38:30
  Speaker 4: you know, based on some sort of campaign tactic, it'd
• 38:32
  Speaker 4: be a gaffe that one of them does, or it
• 38:33
  Speaker 4: could be some exigent event. You know, it could be
• 38:36
  Speaker 4: the Israelis launching some massive attack on Iran. And this
• 38:40
  Speaker 4: scary war in the Middle East that's happening right now
• 38:42
  Speaker 4: gets a lot scarier. And everyone's like, oh man, this
• 38:44
  Speaker 4: didn't happen when Trump was in charge. And that narrative
• 38:46
  Speaker 4: like takes hold and works. So yeah, it's precarious.
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: Jack Smith jumps out of a bush with another. So
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: one thing that the both campaigns also seem to agree
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: on is that hiding Trump is the right strategy for Trump.
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: The Washington Post report over the weekend, Trump's team has
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: embraced bravado as it tries to keep its candidate on
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: message fail and encourage him to avoid the sort of
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: high profile national audiences that might motivate Harris's supporters. So
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: Harris wants him in the national spotlight. Trump's team doesn't
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: want him in the national spotlight. So do we think
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: more Trump worse for Trump?
• 39:28
  Speaker 7: Yeah, I think more Trump. in the form of the
• 39:31
  Speaker 7: Trump we're seeing at Trump's rallies is not good for
• 39:33
  Speaker 7: Donald Trump.
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: Or the interviews.
• 39:35
  Speaker 7: Well, I think that like the interviews that are less contentious,
• 39:38
  Speaker 7: like the kind of podcast interviews he's doing, like those
• 39:42
  Speaker 7: are the places where he is reaching a lot of people,
• 39:44
  Speaker 7: if not millions of people. In a way that is,
• 39:46
  Speaker 7: I think, not as harmful, not harmful or just out
• 39:49
  Speaker 7: and out helpful for him. So I think they're counting
• 39:52
  Speaker 7: on that and then counting on kind of negative partisanship
• 39:57
  Speaker 7: and ad blitzes.
• 39:58
  Speaker 4: To do the work for them. It's funny, he does
• 40:01
  Speaker 4: his safe space interviews and he doesn't get any tough questions,
• 40:05
  Speaker 4: but he also kind of lets his freak flag fly.
• 40:07
  Speaker 7: I know.
• 40:07
  Speaker 4: A little bit. You know, like when he's with Maria Bartiromo,
• 40:10
  Speaker 4: he seems to think it's just them talking.
• 40:11
  Speaker 6: Yep.
• 40:12
  Speaker 4: When he talks to Hugh Hewitt, his little right-wing foreign
• 40:15
  Speaker 4: policy Nixon goon, he just makes shit up like that
• 40:18
  Speaker 4: he visited the Gaza Strip or that Jews are responsible
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: for anti-Semitism on college campuses.
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: You know, so there's risks. He's best actually when it's
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: one of those podcasters who's not necessarily like the biggest
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: Trump fan, but is not going to ask tough questions like,
• 40:33
  Speaker 2: Like George Stephanopoulos or someone like that. Those people, he
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: actually is like, oh, I better be on my best
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: behavior and I'm going to tell a personal story, right?
• 40:40
  Speaker 7: He's been told before those interviews that this is not
• 40:42
  Speaker 7: a political space.
• 40:43
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 40:43
  Speaker 3: So just like shoot the shit and try to be friendly.
• 40:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Ask Theo Vaughn about cocaine. Right.
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: I do think there's a difference between voters hearing about
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: Trump and voters hearing from Trump.
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: Like, I think that's a big difference because when all
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: the polling and the research is like, oh, people are
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: sick about Trump. They've already made up their mind about Trump.
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: Part of it is they have heard people complain about Trump,
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: like us, people like us, for the last nine years.
• 41:08
  Speaker 2: And some of it has gotten a little hysterical and
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: not believable. And people are low trust anyway, especially the
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: people who are left don't trust institutions that much. So
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: I think it's much more, this is like the whole,
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: my whole theory of why the conviction and the trial
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: didn't play as well. Because it wasn't, we weren't hearing
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: from Trump. We were seeing Trump in a courtroom and
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: a bunch of people saying bad shit about Trump. When
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: you hear from Trump directly, you're like, oh yeah, that
• 41:30
  Speaker 2: guy's not, he's not all there. He's not a good
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: hit space.
• 41:34
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 41:35
  Speaker 7: There's also, like, I think that narrow sliver of people
• 41:38
  Speaker 7: who are going to make up their minds at the end, like,
• 41:41
  Speaker 7: they're not hearing... I mean, they've heard kind of whatever.
• 41:45
  Speaker 3: Through us most.
• 41:46
  Speaker 7: The kind of endless noise about Trump has, of course,
• 41:48
  Speaker 7: reached everybody. But, like, they haven't really been engaged yet,
• 41:52
  Speaker 7: and they're going to engage right at the very end.
• 41:55
  Speaker 3: And I think it's a mix. Like, I think people.
• 41:57
  Speaker 7: Like, that's why I think it matters if Mark Milley
• 41:59
  Speaker 7: doesn't add. I think that's why it matters... if people
• 42:01
  Speaker 7: are getting the worst version of Trump in front of
• 42:03
  Speaker 7: them right at the end.
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: I wouldn't be surprised if the Harris-Walls campaign does a
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: 60-second big ad everywhere possible in swing states at the
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: very end that's just Trump in his own words at rallies.
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: I mean, she said, watch the rallies. They have the
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: money to put it in front of people. So again,
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: check out Dan's episode from Sunday. One thing we just
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: wanted to play was when Plouffe gave us this piece
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: of insight about the early vote numbers?
• 42:33
  Speaker 9: We like what we're seeing in the early vote data
• 42:34
  Speaker 9: so far. We particularly like what we're not seeing on
• 42:36
  Speaker 9: the Trump data, which is there's not an army of
• 42:38
  Speaker 9: kind of incels showing up in their voting history. So,
• 42:42
  Speaker 9: you know, maybe they'll show up on election day.
• 42:43
  Speaker 4: We'll see. Army.
• 42:46
  Speaker 2: What do we do if there's an army of incels?
• 42:48
  Speaker 4: You got to fuck them.
• 42:49
  Speaker 3: Distract them.
• 42:50
  Speaker 7: One by one.
• 42:50
  Speaker 4: You just got to bang them.
• 42:52
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 42:52
  Speaker 4: Turn those frogs into princes.
• 42:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they're not incels anymore.
• 42:54
  Speaker 4: That's how we heal this country.
• 42:56
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: Put a PS5. It was the.
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: Most pluff quote because it was just like, it's like
• 43:04
  Speaker 2: in another answer. He just like slips it in there. Yeah.
• 43:07
  Speaker 4: Was he at 1.5X there? Or was that just him normal?
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: The other one is- It sounded like 1.5X.
• 43:12
  Speaker 4: Didn't it?
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: That's where I listen to all my podcasts.
• 43:14
  Speaker 4: Me too.
• 43:14
  Speaker 7: He slipped in that the reason that Trump is doing
• 43:17
  Speaker 7: Coachella in New York is that he's not getting turnout
• 43:19
  Speaker 7: at his rallies in swing states. One other point that
• 43:21
  Speaker 7: I haven't seen made about like the Trump bravado thing
• 43:23
  Speaker 7: about how they think they're winning and they're hiding them.
• 43:25
  Speaker 7: It is a little bit of signaling. that, look, they
• 43:28
  Speaker 7: don't have a big field operation. And yet they're, as
• 43:31
  Speaker 7: Plouffe pointed out, they're relying on these low information, low
• 43:34
  Speaker 7: turnout voters. Their whole strategy is around what happens after
• 43:39
  Speaker 7: the election and trying to prevent votes from being counted.
• 43:42
  Speaker 7: And I do think part of what they're signaling to
• 43:44
  Speaker 7: their millions of hardcore fans is if we lose on
• 43:47
  Speaker 7: election day, you should be surprised because it's being stolen.
• 43:50
  Speaker 7: And that sort of contributes to the challenge that comes after.
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: I mean, that if you, and I only see them
• 43:54
  Speaker 2: because the fucking algorithm on X now, now that it's X.
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just Elon landing rockets and right-wing propaganda.
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: Feeds you all these new blue-checked VC election analyst experts,
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: and they're like, the early vote's coming in, 1,000% Trump,
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: and the polls are amazing, and there's no way he
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: could possibly lose. The only way he could possibly lose
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: now is if the election's stolen again. It's the only way.
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: I was like, partner, it's Sequoia. Right. So they very
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: much believe that he is walking away with this thing.
• 44:21
  Speaker 4: Well, their message to donors and establishment people is like,
• 44:24
  Speaker 4: get on board. He's going to win. And if he
• 44:26
  Speaker 4: wins and you're not on board, we're going to punish you.
• 44:29
  Speaker 4: And the message to the rank and file is we're
• 44:31
  Speaker 4: going to win. And if we don't win, we won.
• 44:34
  Speaker 4: So let's go charge Pelosi's office.
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: Yep.
• 44:37
  Speaker 4: And for Democrats, it's just like terror.
• 44:39
  Speaker 7: Well, for Democrats, it's like, hi, do you care about
• 44:41
  Speaker 7: your democracy? We're here from the Democratic Party.
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: Please, please help us.
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: Well, everyone's worried. And I get why everyone's worried because
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: it's like, why are Democrats so neurotic? I don't know
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: because Donald Trump is the possibility of, you know, a
• 44:57
  Speaker 2: more crazy Trump than we've ever seen before. So that's
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: why we're nervous.
• 45:01
  Speaker 4: And also this is a man whose like instinct has
• 45:03
  Speaker 4: always been to punish his enemies. Right. And now he's
• 45:05
  Speaker 4: gone through this period where he feels rightly or wrongly,
• 45:09
  Speaker 4: mostly wrongly that he was unfairly targeted by the courts
• 45:12
  Speaker 4: and by lawfare and that Democrats, and he keeps saying
• 45:15
  Speaker 4: that Democrats were behind the assassination attempts. And if he
• 45:18
  Speaker 4: sincerely believed that and he, seems to, imagine what he
• 45:22
  Speaker 4: will do. Imagine what that motivates you to do.
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: And again, all I keep thinking is like, yeah, is
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: it possible that Donald Trump just watches his TiVo and
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: drinks his Diet Coke for the next four years?
• 45:31
  Speaker 4: Loves TiVo.
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: Possibly, but like, J.D. Vance, Laura Loomer, Stephen Miller, fucking
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: Mike Flynn. We didn't even talk about Mike Flynn. Mike
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: Flynn over the weekend, someone asked him if he was
• 45:41
  Speaker 2: going to.
• 45:42
  Speaker 4: Lead the military tribunal to execute political enemies of Donald Trump, essentially.
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: Execute. And he was like, You know what Mike Flynn
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: said in response? Oh, first we got to win.
• 45:52
  Speaker 4: He was like, I admire your passion.
• 45:54
  Speaker 3: Let's leave it all out on the field.
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: First, we got to win.
• 45:56
  Speaker 4: First, we got to win. Then we'll get to that
• 45:58
  Speaker 4: other stuff later.
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: And Donald Trump has said he wants Mike Flynn back
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: in another administration. Joe Arpaio, 92. I don't know how
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: well he'd serve. Wants him back too.
• 46:06
  Speaker 3: Is he on trial?
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: But these are like, Donald Trump is one man. And yes,
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: he'd be the president with like a lot of power,
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: but like, just don't it. Tell your friends who are
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: not worried about Donald Trump again. The fucking cast of
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: characters around him are just the worst of the worst.
• 46:19
  Speaker 3: And like, is it?
• 46:20
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 46:21
  Speaker 7: Is it possible all this is wrong? That he doesn't
• 46:24
  Speaker 7: ever actually deliver on all this? Sure. By the way,
• 46:27
  Speaker 7: you want to roll the dice that Adam Schiff is
• 46:30
  Speaker 7: requesting vegan meals at some fucking federal institution?
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: Because you think those fucking tariffs are magic and suddenly
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: you're going to have more money in your pocket because
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: of the tariffs on imported goods? That's his only economic policy?
• 46:38
  Speaker 4: Let me reread this verbatim quote of the Mike Flynn
• 46:41
  Speaker 4: thing just because it's worth it. Thank you. He was
• 46:42
  Speaker 4: at the Rod of Iron Freedom Festival.
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: No among us.
• 46:45
  Speaker 4: I haven't gone to that.
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: He was asked if he'd, quote, sit at the head of.
• 46:48
  Speaker 4: A military tribunal to not only drain the swamp, but
• 46:50
  Speaker 4: imprison the swamp and on a few occasions execute the swamp. Oh,
• 46:53
  Speaker 4: just a few. That was the question. Flynn, it's a
• 46:56
  Speaker 4: long answer. He says, what your sentiment is about is accountability.
• 46:59
  Speaker 4: And I believe we need accountability. And then he basically
• 47:01
  Speaker 4: ends it with these people are already light up to
• 47:03
  Speaker 4: no good. So we got to win first. We win.
• 47:05
  Speaker 4: And then Katie bar the door. Believe me, the gates
• 47:08
  Speaker 4: of hell, my hell will be unleashed.
• 47:11
  Speaker 2: And the questioner was not named Katie.
• 47:13
  Speaker 4: No, it was not Katie. At no point in this
• 47:15
  Speaker 4: answer does he say to this man, sir, extrajudicial murder
• 47:19
  Speaker 4: of political enemies is a bad thing.
• 47:22
  Speaker 7: You have to go to the gates of hell. You
• 47:25
  Speaker 7: open your own gates of hell. You have a personal
• 47:27
  Speaker 7: gates of hell.
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: But he's thought that through, much like the tribunals. So anyway,
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: that's what we're facing. That's why Democrats are nervous. But
• 47:33
  Speaker 2: you know what? If you're nervous, go do something. The
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: only early vote indicator you're going to get that means something.
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: is either from John Ralston or David Plouffe and the incels.
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: That's it. Forget about the other votes. The polls at
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: this point, it's tied. Everyone's like, oh, you know, we
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: were up and now we're down. No, no.
• 47:49
  Speaker 3: It's not true.
• 47:50
  Speaker 2: When we thought we were up, we were tied. Now
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: people think we're down. We're tied. It's a tied race.
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: That's what Plouffe thinks. Basically, the Trump campaign, even when
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: they released their internals last week, it was margin of
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: error tied. Even those internals weren't like Trump having a
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: commanding lead in all those states. So like both campaigns
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: pretty much see a tide race within the margin of error,
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: depending on turnout models. And that's probably most likely that's
• 48:12
  Speaker 2: where we're going to be on election day. And early
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: vote can only tell you so much, which is not
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: much of anything. And the polls at this point can
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: only tell you so much.
• 48:20
  Speaker 7: Yeah, there will be no there will be no reassurance
• 48:23
  Speaker 7: between now and election day.
• 48:24
  Speaker 4: None.
• 48:25
  Speaker 3: Nothing.
• 48:25
  Speaker 7: By the way, there will also be likely no reason
• 48:28
  Speaker 7: to have some sudden belief that it's over.
• 48:30
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 48:30
  Speaker 7: Like either direction, like this feeling, this terrible anxiety is.
• 48:34
  Speaker 7: That's it between now and election day. And the only
• 48:35
  Speaker 7: question is whether or not you're willing to actually finally
• 48:38
  Speaker 7: do something in these last few weekends before the election,
• 48:41
  Speaker 7: because most of you haven't done a fucking thing.
• 48:43
  Speaker 4: Well, you know, we say, Katie, knock the door.
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: Hey.
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: All right. It's time for everyone listening to this to
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: sign up for volunteer shifts, knocking on doors in the
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: states that are going to decide this race. Even if
• 48:56
  Speaker 2: you live in a blue city, most common question we
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: get from people at events and At live shows.
• 49:03
  Speaker 4: Brooklyn and LA and Chicago. And the Discord.
• 49:05
  Speaker 2: What do I do if I live in a blue state?
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: We got something. Lucky for you and unlucky for your
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: lame excuses. There's now a really easy way to figure
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: out where you can go volunteer at votesaveamerica.com slash travel.
• 49:17
  Speaker 4: Huh?
• 49:17
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: Vote Save America has partnered with the Harris Walls campaign
• 49:20
  Speaker 2: and a bunch of other groups to organize buses that
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: will bring you from the city where you live to
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: the nearest battleground where you too can occupy an apartment
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: building in Aurora. Where the canvassing shifts will already be
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: arranged and then they will take you back. The bus
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: will take you back. A lot of these are one day.
• 49:38
  Speaker 7: You got to stop by, do a drag show at
• 49:40
  Speaker 7: a preschool on your way back. That was the deal
• 49:42
  Speaker 7: we made with the Harris campaign.
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: Yes, yes, right. A lot of these are one day trips,
• 49:47
  Speaker 2: like the buses from New York to Pennsylvania. Those are easy.
• 49:50
  Speaker 2: Just go right to Pennsylvania. You're there and back in
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: about 12 hours. Some of them, including some of the
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: buses from here in LA to Arizona, are two night affairs,
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: but lodging is taken care of.
• 49:59
  Speaker 4: How about that?
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: Everything's figured out.
• 50:01
  Speaker 4: No excuses.
• 50:03
  Speaker 2: Sure, apple picking's nice. Organizing your closet, yoga, self-care are nice.
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: But are they as nice as American democracy?
• 50:10
  Speaker 3: No, we could have both. We could have both if
• 50:12
  Speaker 3: we play our cards right.
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: If we lose this race, yoga is going to be illegal.
• 50:14
  Speaker 4: Depends on the orchard.
• 50:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: Apple farms are going to go out of business because
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: of the tariffs.
• 50:18
  Speaker 4: Granny Smith's. Is that how? Honeycrisp.
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: That's how it works.
• 50:21
  Speaker 3: Don't think too hard about it.
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: Don't think too hard about it. You're going to put a.
• 50:24
  Speaker 3: Tariff on this podcast.
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: Please go to votesaveamerica.com slash travel to see bus routes
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: near you and sign up. Also, hopefully you already listen
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: to Pod Save the World.
• 50:34
  Speaker 4: Like, love it.
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: Listen to every episode.
• 50:35
  Speaker 3: Every episode.
• 50:36
  Speaker 4: This is a hard pivot. What is this?
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: The foreign policy show that Tommy co-hosts with Ben Rhodes.
• 50:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: We want to let you know that Ben just launched
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: a special Saturday series.
• 50:44
  Speaker 4: Did you know this?
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, of course. That Ben's out there doing. It's great.
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: I know.
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: It's great.
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: I'm joking.
• 50:47
  Speaker 4: I did not know this. I was keeping that.
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: It's running through November 5th where he's discussing the stakes
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: for global affairs under Harris versus Trump. It's essential listening. And,
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: of course, your usual episodes of Pod Save the World
• 50:59
  Speaker 2: continue to drop every Wednesday.
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: Inessential.
• 51:01
  Speaker 4: Inessential.
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: Tune in wherever you get your podcasts. All right.
• 51:04
  Speaker 4: How about them apples? How about them apples? Sorry.
• 51:07
  Speaker 2: When we come back from the break, you're going to hear.
• 51:09
  Speaker 3: Apples are from Kazakhstan.
• 51:10
  Speaker 4: People don't know that.
• 51:11
  Speaker 7: Are they?
• 51:12
  Speaker 9: Yeah.
• 51:12
  Speaker 4: Originally?
• 51:13
  Speaker 3: I think so. Fact check that for me, but I
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: believe that's right.
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: Fucking brainy quotes over here.
• 51:17
  Speaker 2: When we come back from the break, you're going to
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: hear Tommy's conversation with Debbie Moucarcel-Powell about the big Senate
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: race in Florida and what these terrible storms have meant
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: for the campaign there right after the break.
• 51:39
  Speaker 4: Joining us now, the Democrat running to unseat America's wealthiest,
• 51:43
  Speaker 4: and some might argue creepiest, U.S. Senator Rick Scott down
• 51:47
  Speaker 4: in Florida. Debbie MacRasso-Powell, welcome to Pod Save America. Thank
• 51:51
  Speaker 4: you for joining.
• 51:52
  Speaker 9: Thank you, Tommy, for having me.
• 51:54
  Speaker 4: I'm very excited to talk about your Senate race against
• 51:57
  Speaker 4: Rick Scott, one of my least favorite people in Washington.
• 52:01
  Speaker 4: But I just did want to start by asking how
• 52:03
  Speaker 4: Florida's faring after these hurricanes. First it was Helene, then Milton.
• 52:07
  Speaker 4: How are you guys doing?
• 52:09
  Speaker 12: Tommy, it's been so heartbreaking to see the devastation all
• 52:12
  Speaker 12: across our state.
• 52:13
  Speaker 9: I had just been in the St.
• 52:16
  Speaker 12: Pete area after Hurricane Helene last week, and I had
• 52:19
  Speaker 12: visited areas where they experienced flooding that they really were
• 52:23
  Speaker 12: not expecting. And it displaced over 16,000 people that lost
• 52:27
  Speaker 12: their home after Hurricane Helene. And then we were immediately
• 52:31
  Speaker 12: preparing for another devastating storm.
• 52:34
  Speaker 9: Milton was.
• 52:36
  Speaker 12: And it wasn't just that it brought storm surge to
• 52:39
  Speaker 12: some of the areas in the West Coast of Florida,
• 52:41
  Speaker 12: but a lot of the tornadoes that hit ground on
• 52:45
  Speaker 12: the east side of our state caused so much damage.
• 52:49
  Speaker 12: I was just today visiting an area in Wellington here
• 52:52
  Speaker 12: in Florida, close to Palm Beach, where I met with
• 52:55
  Speaker 12: a woman who lost her home completely. Um, she was
• 52:59
  Speaker 12: in my arms crying. She didn't even know where to
• 53:01
  Speaker 12: begin to ask for assistance. And then the home right
• 53:05
  Speaker 12: across the street from her was cut in half by
• 53:07
  Speaker 12: a tornado. The one that she was in, they had
• 53:10
  Speaker 12: just put up the shutters. They had finished putting the
• 53:12
  Speaker 12: shutters up by three 30 in the afternoon. And a
• 53:14
  Speaker 12: few minutes later, the tornado came through their home and.
• 53:17
  Speaker 9: Ripped off trees.
• 53:18
  Speaker 12: I mean, you'll, you'll see, we'll post some footage on
• 53:21
  Speaker 12: what we, we saw because I don't think I've seen
• 53:24
  Speaker 12: anything like this since Andrew. I wasn't here for Andrew,
• 53:26
  Speaker 12: but the images that I saw after Andrew, it's exactly
• 53:29
  Speaker 12: like that.
• 53:30
  Speaker 9: And it's just.
• 53:32
  Speaker 12: Devastating to see so many families not know where to
• 53:35
  Speaker 12: get help. And that's why it's so important to coordinate
• 53:38
  Speaker 12: at the local, state, and federal level and to have
• 53:40
  Speaker 12: officials that are going to do that, that are willing
• 53:43
  Speaker 12: to work together to provide this immediate assistance for families.
• 53:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I want to ask you about that. I mean,
• 53:48
  Speaker 4: how has the federal response been so far in the
• 53:50
  Speaker 4: coordination you talked about? And Have you guys been dealing
• 53:53
  Speaker 4: with the same problems of misinformation and disinformation that were
• 53:57
  Speaker 4: plaguing North Carolina in particular?
• 53:59
  Speaker 12: Well, Tommy, first of all, I'm really glad to see
• 54:02
  Speaker 12: that the director of FEMA was here from the very
• 54:05
  Speaker 12: beginning on the ground waiting as we were preparing to
• 54:08
  Speaker 12: see what Milton was going to bring to the West
• 54:10
  Speaker 12: Coast of Florida. She was here and we had National Guard,
• 54:14
  Speaker 12: thousands of National Guard men already on the ground to assist.
• 54:18
  Speaker 12: And so Hopefully, and what I'm, what I'm encouraging is
• 54:23
  Speaker 12: for the governor's office, the state officials to coordinate with
• 54:27
  Speaker 12: the federal government, because I've seen that there have been some,
• 54:30
  Speaker 12: some missed opportunities there.
• 54:31
  Speaker 9: But you asked me about misinformation.
• 54:34
  Speaker 12: I have, I cannot believe that we have in Rick Scott,
• 54:38
  Speaker 12: a sitting Senator who has been on Fox news spreading
• 54:43
  Speaker 12: disinformation about FEMA. It's highly irresponsible, and it's putting survivors'
• 54:48
  Speaker 12: lives at risk. Here we have people that have lost everything.
• 54:51
  Speaker 12: Some people have lost their loved ones to this hurricane.
• 54:55
  Speaker 12: And he's on Fox News saying that there are not
• 54:57
  Speaker 12: enough funds for disaster relief, and yet the man voted
• 55:00
  Speaker 12: against funding for FEMA?
• 55:03
  Speaker 9: I mean, it can't get worse than that.
• 55:06
  Speaker 12: There has to be— I don't want to be this crass here, Tommy,
• 55:11
  Speaker 12: but really— There's a special place in hell for people
• 55:14
  Speaker 12: like that. I'm sorry to be so crude, but we
• 55:17
  Speaker 12: are seeing people in pain, suffering. They've lost their pets.
• 55:22
  Speaker 12: They've lost their family members. They've lost their homes and
• 55:25
  Speaker 12: their businesses. And you have Rick Scott lying to Floridians
• 55:29
  Speaker 12: about FEMA disaster relief and also voting against funding for
• 55:32
  Speaker 12: disaster relief. I can't even fight the words to describe
• 55:37
  Speaker 12: what I feel when I hear him saying that. The
• 55:39
  Speaker 12: good thing is that there are a lot of people
• 55:41
  Speaker 12: that are setting the record straight a lot of our
• 55:44
  Speaker 12: local officials, whether they're Republicans or Democrats, are making sure
• 55:48
  Speaker 12: that people understand that that's disinformation. But it's just shameful
• 55:51
  Speaker 12: to see a sitting senator here, Rick Scott, doing that.
• 55:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah, to put it to this point, I mean, he
• 55:57
  Speaker 4: just recently skipped a vote on a short-term spending bill
• 55:59
  Speaker 4: that included $ 18. 8 billion for FEMA. He is one of
• 56:03
  Speaker 4: the many Republicans who seems to want to continually deny
• 56:07
  Speaker 4: that climate change is man-made and making these storms worse.
• 56:11
  Speaker 4: It sounds like Republicans... refusing to rush back and put
• 56:15
  Speaker 4: forward an emergency spending bill before the election to provide
• 56:19
  Speaker 4: any additional relief. Is Rick Scott calling for Congress to
• 56:24
  Speaker 4: take action sooner or where is he on that?
• 56:25
  Speaker 9: Well, he did say.
• 56:26
  Speaker 12: That there should be more assistance, more funding for FEMA.
• 56:30
  Speaker 12: He did make that call and he wrote a letter,
• 56:33
  Speaker 12: of course, because he's three weeks away from an election
• 56:36
  Speaker 12: where he knows that he's extremely vulnerable. All of our
• 56:39
  Speaker 12: polling has us basically tied at this point. And so
• 56:42
  Speaker 12: He's trying to do everything to maintain power. I mean, Tommy,
• 56:46
  Speaker 12: this is a very dangerous individual. He wants to become
• 56:49
  Speaker 12: Senate majority leader. So just imagine what he would do
• 56:52
  Speaker 12: if he gets back to the Senate, become Senate majority leader,
• 56:55
  Speaker 12: and starts dismantling federal agencies like FEMA. That's part of
• 57:00
  Speaker 12: what Project 2025 has included in those points, in that
• 57:04
  Speaker 12: 900-page document.
• 57:05
  Speaker 9: It's extremely dangerous.
• 57:07
  Speaker 12: And, you know, we know that Rick Scott committed Medicare fraud.
• 57:10
  Speaker 12: The man is a thief, Tommy. I have to be
• 57:14
  Speaker 12: strong with my language because people need to understand that
• 57:17
  Speaker 12: we have this unique opportunity to stop someone that has
• 57:20
  Speaker 12: been stealing from the government to get back into the
• 57:24
  Speaker 12: Senate because he has very ambitious goals of leading the
• 57:29
  Speaker 12: Senate if he becomes Senate majority leader. And even if
• 57:32
  Speaker 12: Vice President Kamala Harris becomes the first woman president to
• 57:35
  Speaker 12: lead the nation, She won't be able to build on
• 57:38
  Speaker 12: any progress that has already been done if Rick Scott
• 57:41
  Speaker 12: gets reelected and then becomes Senate Majority Leader.
• 57:44
  Speaker 9: It's really dangerous.
• 57:44
  Speaker 12: Just imagine missing Mitch McConnell as Senate Majority Leader. I
• 57:49
  Speaker 12: just want everyone to have that view for a minute.
• 57:53
  Speaker 9: I'm not kidding.
• 57:54
  Speaker 4: It's scary. That's well said. I want to ask you
• 57:56
  Speaker 4: a little bit more about Rick Scott's plans in a second,
• 57:59
  Speaker 4: but just one last question on Milton. I've seen estimates
• 58:02
  Speaker 4: that Hurricane Milton alone could cost between $ 60 to $ 100
• 58:06
  Speaker 4: billion in insured losses. That could further increase property insurance prices,
• 58:12
  Speaker 4: drive providers out of the state. And this isn't just
• 58:15
  Speaker 4: a huge problem in Florida. Here in California, I know
• 58:17
  Speaker 4: homeowners have had similar challenges getting insurance because of fires.
• 58:20
  Speaker 4: What do you think the federal government should do to
• 58:23
  Speaker 4: help out people in Florida who are going to have
• 58:25
  Speaker 4: to be rebuilt?
• 58:26
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 58:27
  Speaker 12: And, you know, the cost of inaction is going to
• 58:29
  Speaker 12: be much greater if we don't immediately move on having
• 58:33
  Speaker 12: a federally backed program that's going to expand the risk
• 58:35
  Speaker 12: across all states. Like you said, the issues of these
• 58:38
  Speaker 12: severe natural disasters are not unique to Florida. We're seeing
• 58:42
  Speaker 12: fires in California. We're seeing flooding in Louisiana, Texas, other
• 58:46
  Speaker 12: states as well. So we have to take some action.
• 58:49
  Speaker 12: And just to give you an example, today when I
• 58:51
  Speaker 12: visited Wellington, this family that lost their home, they did
• 58:55
  Speaker 12: not have property insurance because they couldn't find an insurance
• 58:58
  Speaker 12: company that So they are devastated because they don't understand
• 59:05
  Speaker 12: what they're going to do in order to rebuild. And
• 59:06
  Speaker 12: that's why FEMA funding is so critical and it's so important.
• 59:10
  Speaker 12: but also to have a federal program that's going to
• 59:12
  Speaker 12: provide relief. But we need to be smart of how
• 59:16
  Speaker 12: we start rebuilding these communities, particularly along the coast here
• 59:21
  Speaker 12: in the state of Florida. We have to make sure
• 59:22
  Speaker 12: that we invest in resiliency, something that Rick Scott also
• 59:25
  Speaker 12: has failed to do, We need to make sure that
• 59:29
  Speaker 12: if you're living in a very low-lying area, that you understand,
• 59:32
  Speaker 12: even if you build a resilient infrastructure, it may get
• 59:36
  Speaker 12: damaged when we see another storm like Milton. And so
• 59:39
  Speaker 12: we have to have these tough conversations, but you need
• 59:42
  Speaker 12: leaders that are going to have the courage to do that.
• 59:44
  Speaker 12: Rick Scott has been in government for 14 years. We
• 59:47
  Speaker 12: have a property insurance crisis that began when he was
• 59:50
  Speaker 12: governor here in the state of Florida, when he gave
• 59:52
  Speaker 12: these sweetheart deals to a lot of insurance companies that
• 59:55
  Speaker 12: came into the market, taking away from the public option.
• 59:58
  Speaker 12: And here we are paying four times the national average.
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 12: We really need to change the direction of the state
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 12: in order to be able to provide those opportunities for
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 12: our families that are right now just looking at ways
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 12: to survive in the state of Florida.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Back to your point about Rick Scott trying to
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 4: be Senate Majority Leader. I remember Back in 2022, he
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 4: rolled out this 11-point plan to rescue America. It included
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 4: raising taxes on literally half of the country, including some
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 4: of the most low-income Americans. He talked about shutting down
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 4: the Department of Education. And the plan also said that
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 4: all federal laws should automatically sunset after five years, which
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 4: it didn't take a genius to point out that it
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 4: would mean that Social Security and Medicare would be on
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 4: the chopping block every five years. Um, I have never
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 4: seen Republicans run away from their colleague faster. But is
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 4: Rick still pushing his 11-point plan? How's that going on
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 4: the campaign trail?
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 9: He's very proud of the 11-point plan.
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 12: But after almost a year of pushback from Republicans, he
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 12: said that it would exclude Medicare and Social Security. And
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 12: the truth is that we can't trust Rick Scott.
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 9: Anything he says is just to try and hold on
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 9: to power.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 12: I mean, he has also been very vocal about repealing
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 12: the Affordable Care Act. And, Tommy, you know that here
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 12: in the state of Florida, we have some of the
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 12: largest numbers of people that get their health care through Obamacare.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 12: It's a very popular program here in the state of Florida,
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 12: but he wants to completely eliminate.
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 9: That as well.
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 12: And even Mitch McConnell, if you remember, said that's not
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 12: the Republican plan, that's Scott's plan. He has not changed
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 12: any of the propositions of raising taxes to middle class families. Even,
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 12: you know, some Republicans have said that that's crazy, that
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 12: they don't understand how he's proposing raising taxes on middle
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 12: class families.
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 9: He's on his own. And I think that that's one
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 9: of the things that people don't understand.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 12: He is the most vulnerable Republican running for reelection. People
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 12: in the state of Florida don't.
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 9: They don't want to vote for Rick Scott.
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 12: And he doesn't have any allies here within the Republican Party.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 9: I can tell you that. No one's really helping him
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 9: in the state of Florida. He's on his own.
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 12: So that's why this is a unique opportunity for us
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 12: to be able to keep the Senate majority, finally send
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 12: Rick Scott to retirement. and bring back some decency into
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 12: governance here for the state. So many Floridians deserve that.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think there was a lot of reporting at
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 4: the time that Mitch McConnell really hates Rick Scott, which is, look,
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 4: the enemy of my enemy, I guess. I don't know
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 4: what to make of that, but notable. Last week, the
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 4: New York Times had progressives like myself kind of breathing
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 4: into paper bags when they ran a poll that had
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 4: Donald Trump running 13 points ahead of Kamala Harris in Florida.
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 4: Are things really that bad? What did you make of that?
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 12: Tommy, first of all, that was one poll out of
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 12: eight polls that we've seen over the past few weeks
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 12: that was a complete outlier. They didn't do a sample
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 12: large enough here in the state of Florida. The sampling
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 12: is just not correct. It doesn't it's not aligned at
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 12: all with what I'm seeing on the ground and what
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 12: I've seen in many other polls. The reality is that
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 12: Harris and Trump are probably within four points of each
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 12: other here in the state. And that's not as that
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 12: far from what we experienced in 2020. Joe Biden lost
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 12: the state of Florida by only three points. This is
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 12: a state where Floridians, this is a swing state. We
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 12: always go from one side to the next. Obama won
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 12: Florida in 2008 and 2012.
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 9: And then.
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 12: In the last two election cycles, yes, it veered towards
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 12: the right, but it's coming right back. I've been traveling
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 12: for almost a year now all over the state of Florida.
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 12: Independents are voting for Democrats. Republicans, many Republicans, I just
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 12: met one today that said, I can't stand Rick Scott.
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 12: I am voting for you and I'm voting for Kamala Harris.
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 12: That just happened today and it happens to me everywhere
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 12: I go, almost on a daily basis. So Donald Trump
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 12: has lost support from many Republicans in the state of Florida. Remember,
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 12: Ron DeSantis ran for president in that primary. And there
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 12: is some sort of infighting between those two groups of
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 12: Republicans that are living in Florida. He has lost a
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 12: lot of support. Rick Scott is highly, highly vulnerable, very
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 12: much disliked. They know his record of overseeing Medicare fraud.
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 12: And so, no, I'm telling everyone right now, please don't
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 12: listen to that poll. Don't go by that one outlier
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 12: poll that makes absolutely no sense. It's a wrong sampling.
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 9: And it doesn't reflect what is going on in the ground.
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 9: Come down to Florida. I'll show you. It's incredible, the
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 9: energy that I'm seeing. I haven't seen this in years.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 8: All right.
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 4: That's good pushback. We needed to hear that. And you're
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 4: right that the infighting between DeSantis and Trump certainly hasn't ended.
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 4: And that primary performance chopped him down a peg or
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 4: two or a high heel or two. But the other
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 4: thing that you hear a lot from Democrats about Florida
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 4: is that the party registration is changing. There's just basically
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 4: more Republicans moving into this state. How do you think
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 4: The Democratic Party can help overcome that deficit because it
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 4: feels like, you know, these can be self-fulfilling prophecies, right?
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 4: It's like more Republicans move to Florida. So Democrats think
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 4: they have less of a shot of winning. So they
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 4: stop investing. And it's a bad cycle.
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 12: So I'm going to start with this for one moment.
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 12: I've been thinking a lot about this. And I've been
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 12: always pushing back on this issue because we know that
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 12: Republicans here have purged voters off the rolls. They don't
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 12: have a registration advantage because they've been registering more people
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 12: into their party.
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 9: No, it's because they've been purging these voters off the rolls.
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 12: And here's my message to everyone listening to us today
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 12: in this podcast. Republicans have been spreading conspiracy theories and
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 12: lies for years. Why would you believe them now when
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 12: they're saying that Florida is deeply red? What happened in
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 12: 2022 is that our voters stayed home. And that is
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 12: what the Democratic Party needs to really work on, making
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 12: sure that we're communicating with our voters, talking about the
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 12: issues and making sure that they turn out.
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 9: If they turn out.
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 12: In this election, you will see something in Florida that
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 12: no one will expect.
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 9: And I can't.
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 12: Wait to show you that people in the state care
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 12: about the issues. When we talk to them, they come
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 12: out and they vote for us. And that is the
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 12: work of the party. My job is just making sure
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 12: that people know that in the Senate race, they have
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 12: an option of voting for someone that's going to put
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 12: their priorities and their families above politics and above everything else.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 12: And we haven't had that representation in the U.S. Senate,
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 12: and we sorely need that. And I think that that's
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 12: why also when you talk to Floridians, they're done with
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 12: Rick Scott and they're ready to support me in the
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 12: Senate race.
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 4: The other big thing on the ballot this year that
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 4: is different is Amendment 4. Can you tell listeners what
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 4: that is and how you think it might impact turnout
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 4: this year?
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 12: You know, now we're living under one of the most
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 12: extreme bans on abortion. We, as of May 1st, women
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 12: in the state of Florida are facing a six-week abortion
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 12: ban with hardly any exceptions to rape and incest. And
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 12: it's a ban that Rick Scott said that he would support,
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 12: that he would have signed into law if he was governor.
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 12: The good news is that we do have an opportunity
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 12: to protect a woman's right to choose to free of
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 12: government interference if we vote to pass Amendment 4. We
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 12: gathered all the signatures even before the deadline, and those
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 12: signatures included a good portion of Republican-registered voters and independents
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 12: as well. And so this is not a partisan issue
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 12: for us in the state, and everything that I'm seeing
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 12: is that we will be able to get that 60% threshold.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 12: And just remember, I only need 50 plus 1. But
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 12: this is a decision that, as you all know, needs
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 12: to be made between a woman... her doctor, her family,
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 12: her faith, without politicians like Rick Scott telling a woman
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 12: what they can do with their own bodies. We understand
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 12: that here in the state of Florida. They've gone way
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 12: too far to the right, too extreme, attacking our fundamental
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 12: freedoms and our civil rights, because this is not only
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 12: central to our freedom for a woman, it's central to
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 12: our healthcare, it's also central to our dignity. And many
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 12: men in Florida understand that. I've had many conversations with
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 12: older men, that for them, this is a top issue.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 12: I met this older gentleman who had lost his aunt
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 12: before Roe v.
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 3: Wade.
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 12: And for him, the abortion issue is the reason why
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 12: he's coming out, voting for Amendment 4, and also voting
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 12: for Democrats up and.
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 9: Down the ballot. Because It won't mean anything, right?
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 12: If we pass Amendment 4, Rick Scott gets reelected, and
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 12: then he pushes for a national abortion ban.
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 9: That's part of their strategy.
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 12: They will be doing that, and they will be also pursuing,
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 12: following criminal lawsuits against doctors and healthcare providers that would
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 12: provide this critical healthcare. So This is a dangerous time
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 12: for this country, but I really do feel, Tommy, very
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 12: optimistic of what I'm seeing because I've seen people fighting
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 12: like I haven't seen before.
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 4: And this.
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 9: organizing, mobilizing, Four Amendment Four.
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 12: To protect education, to protect teachers, because as you know,
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 12: Rick Scott has also been attacking teachers, calling them socialists
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 12: here in the state of Florida. We've been doing that
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 12: for quite some time because they just crossed the line.
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 12: They've gone so extreme that Florida has had it.
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 9: And that's what gives me so much hope and optimism
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 9: for November.
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 4: You know, Rick Scott seems to call everybody he doesn't
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 4: like a socialist. There's a lot of people in Florida
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 4: who have left socialist countries, who have seen actual socialism,
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 4: totalitarian versions in some cases, not like the Democratic Socialists
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 4: of America, right? It's not like the Bernie Sanders version,
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 4: like countries that are authoritarian. Do those constant charges from
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 4: people like Rick Scott Do they work to scare people
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 4: or do voters who have actually experienced the socialism brush
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 4: them off?
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 12: So those attacks really dig into the trauma that so
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 12: many families like mine feel when you hear that word.
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 9: Because in Latin America.
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 12: Socialist dictatorships have really destroyed the political, the social, the
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 12: economic institutions of these countries. And we have socialist dictatorships
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 12: right now in Venezuela, in Cuba, Maduro, who stole the election,
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 12: by the way. And he's destroyed that country. That's why
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 12: you've seen millions of Venezuelans flee that country. And so
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 12: they use that fear to confuse a lot of our
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 12: communities down here who have maybe moved to the United
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 12: States from these countries. And they've only been living here
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 12: for 10, 15, 20 years. So it's a tactic that
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 12: has worked. But I think that people now realize that
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 12: they're using it to confuse our communities and they're pushing back.
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 12: When Rick Scott calls me and names me with these
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 12: false attacks, I can tell you that it's also an
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 12: insult to the legacy of my mom, who lived under
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 12: a military dictatorship, who brought us here from our home
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 12: country of Ecuador to give us freedom, to give us opportunities.
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 12: And so many Latinos that have come here to work.
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 12: So it's really shameful that he's doing that. I think
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 12: it is falling... On deaf ears, though, I think that
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 12: by now, people are realizing that they have nothing else
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 12: to attack us on.
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 9: They're trying to distract.
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 12: Because Rick Scott, the reality is he doesn't want people
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 12: to know that he stole from the government, that he's
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 12: a thief, that he's the wealthiest senator in Washington, D.C.,
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 12: and wants to take away Medicare, Social Security, push a
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 12: national abortion ban, and eliminate Obamacare. So what does he do?
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 12: He uses that money to lie about me. But we're
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 12: pushing back. And I think people are realizing what the
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 12: truth and the facts are.
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 4: Final question for you. Your staff told me that you're
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 4: a big Post Malone fan.
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 3: Is that right?
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 9: Oh, I love Post Malone. Did they tell you that?
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 3: Well, yeah.
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 2: So I don't know that I predicted that.
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 4: Are we talking like original Post Malone, the newer like
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 4: country version?
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 9: Tommy, why would you not predict that?
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 11: Come on.
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 9: He's one of the best artists.
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 4: Oh, I've been a.
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 12: Big Post Malone fan for a long, long time. And
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 12: I'm just starting to listen to his new record. Yeah,
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 12: it's a little country.
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 4: His little country.
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 12: It's a little country, you know, and I can see
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 12: like the country and the salsa and the merengue like
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 12: all kind of come together. But yeah, and of course,
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 12: Fortnite with Taylor Swift. One of my favorite songs.
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 9: I have to say.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 4: Well, you got to get them both out to maybe
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 4: do a big show, a big concert for you in
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 4: Florida near the end of the election.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 9: Yeah, that would be like the height, right? Like that
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 9: would be the height for me.
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 12: If I get Taylor Swift in the concert and then
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 12: Post Malone comes out and then they're like, OK.
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 9: Everyone, vote for Debbie Moukersell Powell. She needs to be
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 9: your next senator.
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 3: That's it.
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 9: That's all I need.
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 4: From your lips to God's ears. Congressman, thank you so
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 4: much for doing the show. We just tell folks where
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 4: they can go if they want to help out your campaign.
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 12: Please go to debbieforflorida.com. I need you to contribute. We
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 12: need the funding. I know what we need to do
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 12: to get over the line here. I'm only within a
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 12: point statistically tied with Rick Scott, but if you support
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 12: me in this race and if you do everything to
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 12: help me, text bank, phone bank, wherever you are, debbieforflorida.com,
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 12: we are going to be able to deliver the Senate
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 12: majority for Kamala Harris in November. And for anyone that
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 12: wants to help and assist the families that have lost
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 12: everything after Hurricane Milton, please go to volunteerflorida.org or projecthope.org.
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 12: You can also follow me on social media, and we're
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 12: posting always different links to different organizations that you can help.
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 12: We also do have pet shelters that need families that
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 12: are going to be able to foster some of these
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 12: pets that have been surrendered. So follow me on Debbie4FL,
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 12: and we'll continue to provide the most updated information there.
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 4: Amen. Debbie for Florida dot com. Thank you so much
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 4: for doing the show. Everyone check it out. Figure out
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 4: a way to help out. We really, really need to
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 4: keep the Senate. Obviously, we need Kamala Harris to win.
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 4: But if she doesn't have the Senate, she's not going
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 4: to be able to do anything. So think about that
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 4: as well.
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 9: Thank you, Tommy.
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 2: That's our show for today. We'll be back with a
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 2: new episode tomorrow with Tommy and guest host Rebecca Katz,
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 2: one of the smartest Democratic strategists out there. Talk to
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 2: you later.
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 3: Did we confirm the Apple thing? It's actually right.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 8: Yeah.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 3: Apple's from Kazakhstan.
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 4: Actually right.
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 2: If you want to get ad-free episodes, exclusive content, and more,
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 2: consider joining our Friends of the Pod subscription community at cricket.com
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 2: slash friends. And if you're already doom scrolling, don't forget
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 2: to follow us at Pod Save America on Instagram, Twitter,
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 2: and YouTube for access to full episodes, bonus content, and more. Plus,
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 2: if you're as opinionated as we are, consider dropping us
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 2: a review to help boost this episode. or spice up
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 2: the group chat by sharing it with friends, family, or
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 2: randos you want in on this conversation. Pod Save America
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 2: is a Crooked Media production. Our producers are David Toledo
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 2: and Saul Rubin. Our associate producer is Farrah Safari. Reid
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 2: Cherlin is our executive editor, and Adrian Hill is our
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 2: executive producer. The show is mixed and edited by Andrew Chadwick.
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: Jordan Cantor is our sound engineer, with audio support from
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 2: Kyle Seglin and Charlotte Landis. Writing support by Hallie Kiefer.
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 2: Madeline Herringer is our head of news and programming... Matt
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 2: DeGroat is our head of production. Andy Taft is our
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 2: executive assistant. Thanks to our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Haley Jones,
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 2: Phoebe Bradford, Joseph Dutra, Ben Hethcote, Mia Kelman, Molly Lobel,
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 2: Kiril Pallaviv, and David Toles.