Latest / The Thriving School Podcast with Jenni Awesome / Human Trafficking Survivor Misti Spencer: Grooming, Prevention & the Journey to Advocacy
Transcript
- Jenni Awesome: All right, and welcome back to the Jennifer Awesome Podcast, where we have real conversations about the experiences that shape us, the adversity that changes us, and the possibility that exists when we decide our story isn't finished yet. Today's guest has a story that is inspiring, courageous, complicated, and incredibly important. Misti Spencer: The Jennifer Awesome Podcast, where we have real conversations about the experiences that shape us, the adversity that changes us, and the possibility that exists when we decide our story isn't finished yet. Today's guest has a story that is inspiring, courageous, complicated, and incredibly important. Jenni Awesome: Misty Spencer is an author, speaker, Misti Spencer: Misty Spencer is an author. Speaker, coach, advocate, and a survivor whose work explores trauma, healing, identity, resilience, relationships, addiction, belonging, and the long journey of finding your way back to yourself. Jenni Awesome: coach, advocate, and a survivor whose work explores trauma, healing, identity, resilience, relationships, addiction, belonging, and the long journey of finding your way back to yourself. She also serves on the advisory board for the University of Central Florida Center for the Study of Human Trafficking and Modern Slavery, helping bring survivor-informed perspectives into education prevention recovery work. So, Misty, welcome to the Jennifer Awesome Podcast. Misti Spencer: She also serves on the advisory board for the University of Central Florida Center for the Study of Human Trafficking and Modern Slavery, helping bring Fiber-informed perspectives into education prevention recovery work. So, Mitsu, welcome to the Jennifer Awesome Podcast. Hi, thank you for having me. Yeah, so you have experienced some of the most awful, deepest, darkest things in our world. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. So you have experienced some of the most awful, deepest, darkest things in our world. And to be able to be there and shine as that light for others, I just I I'm incredibly in awe of you and the way that you have persevered through this and being on the other side, sharing it with others. I'm I'm so honored to be able to speak with you today. Misti Spencer: And to be able to be there and shine as that light for others, I just I I'm incredibly in awe of you and the way that you have persevered through this and being on the other side, sharing it with others. I'm I'm so honored to with you today. Thank you so much. And and it I think it is so much bigger than just my story. Like you said, it is there's so many survivors whose stories are amplified. They're way beyond the ones that I tell. Mine are a starting point so that we can understand what's happening before we're rescuing, before we're getting to the point that we're survivors. Jenni Awesome: Absolutely. So Misty, where are you today? Like tell us a bit about where you're at today before we dive into how you got here. Misti Spencer: Day. Like, tell us a bit about where you're at today before we dive into how you back here. Sure. I well, I'm fifty-one and so I feel like I'm celebrating a different part of my life. I have two children. They're grown ups and a husband. I've been married almost well, married twenty-three years now, and I worked for decades. I got to this place. In my mid 40s, late 40s, where I knew that what I had been through was still going on in the world, everywhere, with my research, with the board, it's all over the place. And so where I am today is talking to everyone I can. The notion that the suffering can take over is very real. And I found that when I started serving. That suffering went away. And I dove into working with other marginalized groups and different groups throughout my life. And I did not make it to the human trafficking sector until about three and a half years ago because of my history. And once I did that, it propelled me forward into this mission. And I avoided it. I really did. I tried not to come into this sector so many times in my life. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: And it is very painful to have to keep doing it, but it's still happening. And so my everyday is waking up and seeing how can I get the message out? it's part of my my DNA now. I can't get away from it. And I don't want people to be afraid of what living like a survivor looks like where we are open about what happened to us, but persevere. find ways to work and be in the community without embarrassment. So that is what I do every day right now. Just role model what this life looks like. I work full time in advocacy. I don't even coach anymore. I'm really just out speaking on big platforms, conventions, and different ways that I can reach a larger audience and see where it takes me now. Jenni Awesome: And that's that is beautiful. And and for you to be up there sharing your story and working in advocacy, you know, getting that information out there. I'm sure that there's so many people that you have helped them to recognize that, hey, what I've been through, I I don't need to feel the shame of it anymore. I can move past that, I can heal it. And thank you so much for being that role model to others out there. Misti Spencer: you to be up there sharing your story and working in advocacy, you know, getting that information out there. I'm sure that there's so many people that you have helped them to recognize that hey, what I've been through, I I don't need to feel the shame of it anymore. I can move past that, I can heal it. And thank you so much for being that role model to others out there. I hope we get there. I I meet A lot of survivors in my travels that their message is a little different. I'm not in a position to ever talk about it. I'm not in a position with my familial status or my spouse or my children. Most survivors can't talk out because it has ramifications. It changes your life once you start this path. That's the truth. I don't, Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: I don't want to make it feel like, it's a fame track. you know, that you get to claim this new identity and speak about it and it paves away. It's the opposite. Most of them won't ever speak out about it because of the stereotypes that come with this. And I knew that when I chose to write a book and release my stories in detail and raw, that and I basically become unemployable in the normal natural world. because you become known as something. You can't pave both ways sometimes. And that's the hardest part. So if I can take, because I'm not even I wasn't even at the level so many of our survivors are, where it takes them years. I've talked to some 26 years. They're my age. And they've lived their entire adult life in human trafficking and they are still working A corner job at a department or CVS or somewhere trying to have dual lives and find themselves still wrapped up in that world. But it goes beyond that. You know, it's beyond the human trafficking. It's the child Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: exploitation that's the root cause of that. It's not that one day a woman wakes up and goes, you know, sex work is for me. Or you know, I'd really like to take off my clothes, and that's how I make money, and that's our perception, or that somebody's taken and kidnapped and forced into a situation. And although there's elements of that and it surrounds that, it's so much deeper and more complex because it starts from our childhood and our teachings and the fear of talking about sex and sex education with young people. Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: especially adolescents and that's the root of my story is not having the education young and having people around me that avoid those subjects and then you have predators who know that they figure that out real quick by the questions they ask and what they ask you to do. And now we have this online Jenni Awesome: yeah. Misti Spencer: element which burns my soul. It's not that I'm anti-online, it's that there's little regulation. with children and they're alone a lot. And although we can't prevent all of that, we can certainly have conversations about who they're actually talking to. and then up into the teens and young adults, they're also a target for predators right now. absolutely. My one of my daughters, she turned eighteen. Jenni Awesome: absolutely. My one of my daughters, she turned 18, went and got a cell phone, decided she wanted to go live out on the streets. And, you know, she's 18. There wasn't much we could do about it. But from the trauma we she went through as a child with her bio mom, we lost track of her for a couple of weeks. And then I got a call from the train station in Seattle. Misti Spencer: went and got a cell phone, decided she wanted to go live out on the streets, you know, she's eighteen, there wasn't much we could do about it. But from the trauma we she went through as a child with her bio mom, we lost track of her for a couple of weeks and then I got a call from the train station in Seattle. Jenni Awesome: And they're like, Hey, your daughter's here. She's trying to get a ticket to go across the state. And it's like, Where are you going? I d there's some some boy. She made it as far as down to the bottom of the state. She didn't make it across the state line and she's like, Mom, you gotta come and get me. So it's it is out there. It is Misti Spencer: And they're like, Hey, your daughter's here. She's trying to get a ticket to go across the state. It's like, Where are you going? Yeah. I there's some some boy. Yeah. She made it as far as down to the bottom of the state. She didn't make it across the state line and she's like, Mom, you gotta come and get it is out there, it is happen. Jenni Awesome: happening. Misti Spencer: It's constant. We were out in LA over the spring, and we were traveling with our daughter. She is a performer, and so we were traveling out on the West Coast. I'll I'll say it now. My daughter is on American Idol. That's part of the other side, by the way. Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: I didn't say it earlier. What I do now, I support my children. Both of them are successful for what they want to do. And we live Jenni Awesome: That's wonderful. Misti Spencer: our lives supporting them and hopefully guiding them. But we went out to LA and when we were not with her, she was on the American Idol set and all of that. we weren't with her, I went out underground on the subway, on the buses, did not rent a car for the first week we were there, and just traveled the streets wearing plain clothes, hair up, just like a normal woman or girl, and you throw your sunglasses on. They don't know how old you are from afar, right? And the amount of solicitation that is happening on the streets, not just LA I made a point to make the take the buses out to the outskirts of LA into where Burbank and all of these other spaces around that area. It was incredible the amount of solicitation that is going on outside, right on the s edges of Beverly Hills and the suburbs, and they're in beautiful cars and they're wearing beautiful clothes. And they have certain ways that they talk to people walking on the streets and they see how you respond. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: And so that's part of the work that I do in the research is I'm not part of operations or anything like that. I'm literally just walking around because I'm comfortable in the streets, just walking around observing, watching who's talking to who and what's happening and reporting back. So we have Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: our, you know, our hand on the pulse, so to speak. And see what's happening, but that's that's what's in our every single backyard. It isn't exclusive. It was in Nashville, it's in Florida. Florida, we're number Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: three or four right now. The numbers are teetering. We were three, them four. It's incredible the amount of trafficking that's happening, and that's just what's reported. The adult Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: stuff is not reported. It's so underreported, where they say it's between ten and twenty percent is coming from online. We know that's way more, but adults Jenni Awesome: yeah. Misti Spencer: aren't going to report it. What do you say when somebody abuses you in that fashion? What do you say? Jenni Awesome: No, that that is a tough question. And Misti Spencer: It's your boyfriend, it's your girlfriend, it's somebody you love, you've been in a relationship with, right? Think of your daughter and making it to that person. And then they get you to take pictures, and then they get you to do a video, and then they threaten to tell your family and everyone else you know, and and and and it starts the process. But good for you Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. I've Misti Spencer: for staying close. Jenni Awesome: Yeah, I've I appreciate that. I've been sharing that also when my kids were much younger and they played Roblox, there would I noticed a huge shift in the demeanor of one of our daughters. She became very like secluded, really wanted to be on her tablet and started talking about her friends and come to find out somebody was Misti Spencer: That I've been sharing that also when my kids were much younger and they played Roblox there would I noticed a huge shift in the demeanor of one of our daughters. She became very like secluded, really wanted to be on a tablet and started talking about her friends and come to find out somebody was rooming her through the Roblox Plus. Jenni Awesome: grooming her through the Roblox platform. So even though parents aren't aware of it, like a lot of these games where you can have that chat option or the voice option, like there are people trying to groom your children in your own home and and parents aren't aware of it. Misti Spencer: So even though parents aren't aware of it, like a lot of these games where you can have that chat option or the voice option, like there are people trying to groom your children in your own home. It it is extraordinary. It even beyond the internet, we'll get into the in home thing because your neighborhood and everywhere your kids hanging out is a space. I was abused when I was an adolescent. by somebody close to my family, trusted, and nobody knew, and there was no way for me to tell or articulate it because of the relationship that's built in. But beyond Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: that, in in today, because that's years ago, that still happens exactly that way today, with the internet, it's not just those video games and the things that we try to protect them from. It's Amazon. Those wish lists that people put public for Children to get gifts, people tap into those wish lists. They will private Jenni Awesome: wow. Misti Spencer: message. There's a lot of ways that the signs that people put up saying, My kids in 10th grade, they just started school. This is their right, this is where they go. People writing, send me money. I just graduated high school at their Instagram handle. All of those things are way predators get to our children. It isn't just the obvious, you were playing video games and that's where the guys pretend they're adult or children and they're really adults. It's Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: because we are so public now. We weren't it wasn't easy to be a public figure 30 years ago when you were 13. Now, Jenni Awesome: Right. Misti Spencer: if you just have a good shtick or whatever your influence is, if you have a good show. And you can keep producing that show, you can be influential and in some way make large amounts of money. It's not always about just being poor. Sometimes it's just about attention. And so they will target those those children that are very out and boisterous. They girlfriend and boyfriend them and massage them and groom them. And then it becomes the child's fault. And a lot Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: of times they wait for us to become adults. The grooming starts very young and they wait until you're an adult and they don't get in trouble for it. That's a lot. Jenni Awesome: And I wanna ask you really quickly, because if if someone in our audience doesn't know what the process of grooming looks like, can I have you just touch on like what what is that process? Misti Spencer: That process. Absolutely. So if we're talking about somebody that is in their life or close to their family, and when we were training our kids, I say it like this: it can be your mom, your dad, your sister, your brother, your uncle, your aunt, grandmother, grandfather, your neighbor, your friend's dad, your church, your not church, your underground. It it is not exclusive to any one person or It has to do with the child and the high risk that they are, their vulnerabilities. If they need money, if they don't have clothes, if they don't have food. But beyond that, attention, loneliness, abandonment, parentification, all of those things are the risk factors that are vulnerabilities predators look at and can dive into. Once they find what that vulnerability is, they work on it and massage it a little bit. You know, I I saw your parents, they got on you about that. Man, that must have been tough. They yelled at you when you're out on the ball field. I didn't like when my dad did that either, right? They find ways that you communicate back and they play down their age. They can be close to your age as well. I was 11 years old and I was raped by a 17-year-old. I had no idea what was happening. I didn't understand sex. I didn't I saw it. I'd been exposed to pornography from five, six years old, but I didn't understand it as being a sexual act of what this person was doing until much later. it it's that significant. They look for somebody that isn't aware of what is happening. That's part of that vulnerability too. I was diagnosed with autism later in life, but I believe that's part of that factor, a kid that has some naivete. And that comes with no sex education. Doesn't have to do with neurodiversity, right? So when they are grooming a child, when you become an adult, all of those things stay with you. The way somebody grooms you. So I want it to be relative to even being groomed as an adult. It starts young, somewhere Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: in their life. And then they find ways to make you complicit, whether it's by lying, by getting caught doing something you shouldn't, by getting you to do something you otherwise wouldn't do. When I was an adult, alcohol and drugs were a big part of my life. I'm a recovering alcoholic. And That is part of the com how they make you compliant and also complicit and get you to lie. And once they have blackmail, pictures, videos, a lie, a way into your life, they can pull and tug on that tether and it pulls you back in. plus the love, man, the love bombing that comes with the initial grooming, you're the most beautiful they've ever seen. You're the smartest. Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: The clothes you wear, the clothes they would wear, right? They start mirroring and bringing themselves into your world. But as soon as you get comfortable, they yank it out from under you. That's the narcissist part. I don't like to label all of it as narcissism, but it's where that person goes into their own survival mode. They're gonna lose their their a victim or they're gonna lose this person. And so they lay in with the gaslighting, taking things away, telling you what they've done for you, the obligations. a lot of us get into where we are basically in debt bondage. And what they give you, they they keep you so in so dependent on their resources. You don't need to work. I'll take care of you. You don't need to worry about a dress for that gala that I know you can't afford, but I'm gonna take you to that gala and you're gonna look so pretty. Think pretty woman. Think of our pop culture, how we are trained that you Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: get what you want, especially as a woman, but men do it, all of us do it. Some of us are trained that. The way we get ahead is by using our looks, because that's all we're worth. So the tactics are across the board. The process is pretty much the same. I love you, I need you, I want you, you're amazing. Here's all the ways you're not amazing, and people don't see you the way I see you. And here's how I can help you. Here's what I can do for you to make your life better. But also, you better do what I say. Better provide for what I want. It's that supply and demand. And you're in this constant Jenni Awesome: Yeah, hello. Misti Spencer: negotiation with them. And it's hard to fall out of love once you are in love. It has nothing to do with romantic love, by the way. My first person, it wasn't about a romantic love. It was about somebody that I trusted decades older than me that is supposed to be a an authority figure in my life. and take care of me, not damage me and hide it, you know, hide me from my parents and take me to places and slowly introduce sexuality. That is that's all part of that grooming process. Figuring out what your crevices are and seeping into them. And they do. They get into them. Jenni Awesome: Wow, there were there are some parts of that conversation that I I hadn't even realized the the depth of it. And so if you're someone listening to this and all of a sudden they're having like, wow, I didn't recognize it. Like if if they're getting that feeling of like, hey, I have some red flags going off of some relationship I'm in or some relationship I've been in, what what should someone do at that point if this is kind of hitting them? Misti Spencer: There were there are some parts of that conversation that I I hadn't even realized the the depth of it. And so if you're someone listening to this and all of a sudden they're having like, Wow, I didn't recognize it, like if if they're getting that feeling of like, hey, I have some red flags going off of some relationship I'm in or some relationship I've been in, what what should someone do at that point if this is kinda them? I think if it's something that's in your past It is appropriate and good to start your own memoir. The best thing I ever did for myself, even when I was still not feeling well, I was still drinking an alcoholic. It was COVID times and before that, trying to write a book drinking. And the when I quit drinking, quit using, and just wrote my story. Not for anybody to see, not in a journal perspective, in a timeline way. First this happened. I say it's like chunk on Goonies, you know, and then they did this, and then they did that. I say you do that for yourself. You sit in the corner of your room, you take parts of your life, don't do it all at once. You carve out that time and you memoir for yourself. It doesn't have to end up in a store or in a bookshelf. It literally can be for you and you can burn it one day, whatever you ritualize with it. Getting it out, I believe, is key. The other part of that is if you feel that this is any part of your story yesterday or today, serve others. I can't tell you what going and talking with other survivors over the last few years has done for me in my life. That's what gives me strength. Nothing else on this planet gives me strength, but talking to others that their stories are so deep-rooted and beyond the ones I could ever write. And I feel their stories in my soul and go, my gosh, what you have done to live today is extraordinary in of itself. So I tell Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: everyone: if you're suffering, serve. It doesn't have to be. The community that you're traumatized. It doesn't have to be how you identify. Don't think of serving as, well, somebody abused me, domestic violence, so I'm gonna go be an advocate for domestic violence. I don't recommend that in the service piece. I recommend serving a population that hurts your heart in some way, pulls and tugs on you, whether it be animals, whether it be disabilities, whether it be another survivor group. Complex PTSD, autism. Pick one. Go spend time with them and get out of your Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: story. If you can spend time out of your story while you're doing that, that's where you'll learn and grow. Because you'll realize you are not the only one. If anything, you're a statistic. And if anything more, your story might be even better than what you thought. Because there's somebody out there that has a story way beyond yours. And so I I recommend serving. Of course, there's tons of therapies. I have them all in my book. Healing, I mean meditation. And I had medical interventions. one of them's called the SGB shot, and I talk on that. there's so many interventions and ways to survive. Now we need Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: to learn how to prevent. And that's what you Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: and I are doing right here. Right now. And we do that when we go out and serve because we can talk about other populations to others and advocate and say, Do you know what autism is really like for someone? I work with though, I work with individuals that have autism or are artist autistic. And this is my experience with them. You don't have to be autistic to do that, right? So serve. Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: Give yourself and you won't suffer as much. It's the isolation that in which we suffer. Jenni Awesome: Yeah, you you bring up a good point with, you know, that idea of isolation and whatever you've you've been through, we we get stuck in our stories. Sometimes we replay it again and again and again in our heads. And that that causes that negative spiral and that causes more of that isolation. So a huge part of healing is breaking out of that thought process, Misti Spencer: Yeah, you you bring up a good point with, you know, that idea of isolation and w whatever you've you've been through, we we get stuck in our stories. Sometimes we replay it again and again and again in our heads, and that that causes that negative spiral and that causes more of that isolation. So a huge part of healing is breaking out of that thought. Jenni Awesome: breaking out of that isolation and Being able to reconnect with others and like you said, being able to serve them, having that spirit of generosity, there really truly is no better way to heal than to go out and say, I'm broken, I'm hurt, I've experienced something, and I still care for you. I'm going to serve you, I am going to provide and care and share. Misti Spencer: Like you said, being able to serve them, having that spirit of generosity. There really truly is no better way to heal than to go out and say, I'm broken, I'm hurt, I've experienced something, and I still care for you. I'm going to serve you. I am going to provide and care and share for whatever it is. It could be as small as helping someone carry their groceries out to the car. It could be Jenni Awesome: For whatever it is. It could be as small as helping someone carry their groceries out to the car. It could be Misti Spencer: one of the things I get a lot in education was I made sure sure I said hi to every kid I saw in the hallway. Because you never know, you you may be the only person who says hi to them. So I've been going on walks lately, and anytime I come across someone I make sure I say hi to them you never know on with that person. Jenni Awesome: one of the things I did a lot in education was I made sure sure I said hi to every kid I saw in the hallway. Because you never know. You you may be the only person who says hi to them. So I've been going on walks lately and anytime I come across someone I make sure I say hi to them because you never know what's going on with that person. Misti Spencer: Ever, especially with children, the funniest thing that I observe about children is that they actually really want to say hi. But because of our training and how adults are in general, it's part of that the child-rooted stuff that's happening now where they say our millennials and different generations don't know how to communicate. A Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: lot of that is that adults didn't communicate with them to have their language develop from childhood up to adulthood. We communicate with them like adults. We don't say simple things in passing like hi. There's always conversation associated, and that overwhelms children. And we were walking the other day, and a little girl we caught eyes, and I could tell we were at a a park and walking. We had s this is one of the other things I do. I go out into nature a lot to heal. I'm alone Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: with animals a lot. They taught me more in life than almost anything ever has. So we were excited. There's manatees and all these things, and she's excited and We caught eyes and I could tell she wanted to say hi. You know, it was just that moment. And I looked at her and I said hi and I waved my hand and she said it back and it was so exciting. And it happened to me another day, a group of children, they want to engage, but adults don't know how to engage on children level, to just say, Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: Hi, I like your bathing suit. I like your hair. It's that simple language that if we can talk to them simply, Then we can simply talk about the sex education component. and here I go on the tangents, but that's how the the talking to the children makes a difference from the Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: ground up, the saying hello in passing, and then being able to have deeper conversations. Imagine a child not being able to say hi to an adult. How are they supposed to talk about somebody hurting them? Jenni Awesome: Yeah, it's it's impossible. Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: And that's where we live right now, 'cause it's not safe to talk out and talk about it. Jenni Awesome: Well, and so much of our communication now is is through phones, through social media. And last year at the school I was at, I spent more time dealing with what would have just been a basic conversation between people, but it escalated ten times more than it needed to because of our phones and social media and everyone else jumping in and like it we are not Misti Spencer: last year at the school I was at, I spent more time dealing with what would have just been a basic conversation between people, but it escalated ten times more than it needed to because of our phones and social media and everyone else jumping in and like it we not serving the next generation Jenni Awesome: serving the next generation. with these cellphones because they're not they're like they're so disconnected from their bodies, from the earth. Like you said, being out in nature, they're they're stuck on these phones. Misti Spencer: with these cell phones because they're not they're like they're so disconnected from their bodies from the earth like you said being out in nature they're that's on the parents though because there's a way to have both I believe there's balance I believe that we're out of balance there's a way to have the tools that help our lives and I will I I'm not a tech Person. I have an aversion to tech. My husband is a techie. So we have a fun household. And it is hard for me because I didn't grow up with technology to adopt new things. That's part of my challenges, the new adopting new things into my toolbox. And when you look at it as a tool and we can teach our young people, and then also be the ones that break them away, how can you tell a child? You spend, and I mean up to 18, you spend too much time on the phone when you yourself are right next to them swiping and scrolling, not making eye contact, having a conversation while they're trying to tell you about their bad day or good day or friend that had something happen in their life. It starts with the adult. We're putting too much ownership on children's behavior. Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: When they are surrounded by adults behaving, we have to change. It is showing them I don't use my phone that way. What makes me different? Discipline. Children don't come built with built-in discipline. That's their job is to push us to show us where our holes are. And we don't like to do that. We have an aversion to filling our own holes, so we focus on what's wrong with them. instead of showing Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: them that you shouldn't know. Children should not know how to use phones. Jenni Awesome: No. Misti Spencer: That's not a built-in skill. Jenni Awesome: No. Misti Spencer: We have to show them, which means you put your phone down and say, this is our time to engage. And I need you to do that as well. They will adopt that into their own lives. So you can't be a disconnected caretaker and then blame the child for being disconnected. It's the one soapbox I stand on is the children. Because I believe Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: we do put so much ownership. When I was precocious as a child, I was hit with paddles and rulers on my hands and threatened with belts being snapped in my face and books and corners in my hands because Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: I was precocious. I said what I saw, what I observed, I told the truth, and I got in trouble for it. As a child, What kind of space or room does that give me into adulthood to ever be able to vocalize what I want, need, or feel? Why would I ever want to have a a conversation with somebody on a phone or in person? It would stunt a person's social skills. And we're telling Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: eight-year-olds to have adult style social skills. You should know better. You should have known that that was right. We use those words. I hear them in theme parks. I tour theme parks just to see. I do observation just to see Jenni Awesome: Uh-huh. Misti Spencer: what's going on in America with children and adults. If you really want to see how children behave and how adults parent, stay at a theme park for 10 hours. And you Jenni Awesome: man. Misti Spencer: will see the truth about, and it's not exclusive to a country. It is not exclusive to a culture. It is not exclusive to a color, a creed, a religion. It is none of them. It is all of us. As adults, we've kind of lost our temper a little bit. Would we say? Just a little bit. And we don't have the patience for our young ones. We want them to grow up and grow up fast and get out of my house. And then when you fall. I'm going tell you what's wrong with that. Well, I'm the Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: one. When my kids fall as adults, I run to them and go, I may be responsible for some of this. Let's have a conversation. How you're feeling right now financially or with a girlfriend or boyfriend or whatever they're going through. The very Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: first thing I do, talk to my husband and say, is this something we have to take responsibility for? And we evaluate it. Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: And we go to our children and say, this might be something we need to work on. Rather than say, What are you doing? What do you mean? You failed a class. What do you mean you let them abuse you and didn't tell me? What do you mean? Right? Because we're Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: in shock as adults, as parents or caretakers. It shocks us when our kids are hurting. And I don't think we have the skill set built in. For generations. This is an ongoing generational problem. It's not just one. So we can prevent that by doing what you and I are doing right now. And then going to our young people who will then have other children and then tell Jenni Awesome: Yes. Misti Spencer: them. And in generations from now, five, six generations from now, we will see improvement and maybe eradication. And people said we'll never get rid of certain things in society. And we do. And we can. Jenni Awesome: All the time. Misti Spencer: We can. Does it mean it'll go away forever, always? No. But we could save a lot of love a lot of children and love on a lot of people, adults. Because children that turn in they turn into abusers, not just victims. yeah. Abusers are Jenni Awesome: yeah. I had a Misti Spencer: a child's problem, not an adult problem. I had a student who I believe it was Jenni Awesome: I had I had a student who I believe it was his Misti Spencer: his Jenni Awesome: th there was someone in his family who was an abuser. And then a few years later that student turned into an abuser to his sister. And so you're you're right. I mean, it it it is what we're teaching as the adults or what they see in in social media, on TV. And Misti Spencer: Th there was someone in his family who was an abuser and then a few years later that student turned into an abuser to his sister. Yeah. And so you're you're right. I mean it it it is what we're teaching as the adults or what they see in in social media, on T V Jenni Awesome: you brought up a really big point. Misti Spencer: And you brought up a really big point when you were saying that we model for the kids, okay, I'm putting my phone down. This is time for us. We're going to look at each other, connect with eye contact, have those conversations. So much of what I've learned about grooming and trafficking can even be that kids don't feel like they can come to their parents, and they automatically trust whoever gives Jenni Awesome: When you were saying that we model for the kids, okay, I'm putting my phone down. This is time for us. We're going to look at each other, connect with eye contact, have those conversations. So much of what I've learned about grooming and trafficking can even be that kids don't feel like they can come to their parents and they automatically trust whoever gives them any form of interest. Misti Spencer: Them any form of interest over their parents. Jenni Awesome: over their parents. Misti Spencer: Yes. And this is not just now. It's just every generation we attach it to whatever is the new development of the age. But this is from music, movies. We could go through eons of parent-child history, and this is always a problem in some fashion. So it's not exclusive to our times, right? I want to say that because I don't want to blame. Anyone. I'm Gen X. I don't blame my whole generation for what's happening with our kids, but I do say this we can change our grandkids, our great grandkids, and beyond. and so with the the generational thing, if our language changes with the kids, with each other, and we can start saying this is what this looks like, it will be the children that are able to come to. Their parents, their caretaker, trusted people, and go, somebody said something to me and it is off. It made me feel bad. In history, someone would say, they're just hitting you because, right? We have the old thing, boys hit the girls because they like you. All of that's all different language. We say it. And Jenni Awesome: yeah. Misti Spencer: no, I don't think that's what he was really saying, honey. No, I don't think that's what he was really doing. And then it turns into a hand in it on the knee. And she or he comes to you and says, hey, Uncle Bob. Sorry, all the Bobs in the world will take Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: whoever, no Bob. Uncle somebody's, they put their hand on my knee and had their arm around my back. And I didn't like that. Like it made me feel, ugh. And a normal response of a parent of generations is, he would never honey, come on. That we've known he's old, he doesn't even think about those things anymore. Those are the conversations being had in every home, every day, right now today, in the world. It's not Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: what you think. So we're teaching young people that their instincts aren't even what they think they are. So it's confusing from out the gate. If we could Jenni Awesome: Right. Misti Spencer: focus on their voice. I hear you. What was the situation when you sat with your uncle? And I'm gonna stay with this as uncomfortable as it is to talk about the familial thing for people. We're gonna do it anyway. Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: Your uncle, how where were you? well, we were in the room by the computer, and he was showing me how to use this math program for my studies. And and then he like put his arm. okay, he put his arm and then. Cause they might get stuck telling you. And then he he put his hand on my leg and he started moving it around. And then he like got close to my ear. And I just didn't like the way it felt. Well, you know what? You don't ever have to do that again. And we're gonna make sure that your uncle's not in your room with you anymore. Would that make you feel safer? We're not getting rid of uncle. We're not calling the cops today. But your kid has told you something important. And the instinct is to run. We flight, we fly, we move, we fawn, we freeze, Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: we get scared. And how many of us have abuse? So it triggers us too, and it makes us go, I haven't done my job. I haven't been a good parent. no, my kid is hurting. Well, that that no, no, no, that it can't be what they think it is. And we pull back because we're afraid of the conversation. But if that one conversation separated Unc Uncle So and so from your kid and they Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: never got touched that way again, when your daughter's eighteen and nineteen and a boy in the frat house and she goes to the party and she's living the best time of her life and they're doing flaming doctor pepper shots and teaching her all the ways of the world and somebody does that to her, she's not gonna accept it. She's gonna listen Jenni Awesome: Yes. Misti Spencer: to her instincts and she's gonna go, I need to call my mom, or I need to call my dad, or my auntie, or my niece, or my niece, not your niece, no. I need to call my auntie or my friend. And they're gonna say, This made me feel bad. This guy did this, and she will prevent it. It's our Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: language that starts from very little, and that's what I preach. That's why I'm telling the stories, so that we can. Have the conversation that talks about the details. Cause the devil's Jenni Awesome: Right. Misti Spencer: in the details, isn't it? It is. So what I hear you saying is that as parents, if we have our kids come to us really with anything, let's take the time to have that conversation with them so that they build up that stronger sense of intuition and self confidence within themselves of Jenni Awesome: It is. So what I hear you saying is that as parents, if we have our kids come to us really with anything, let's take the time to have that conversation with them so that they build up that stronger sense of intuition and self confidence within themselves of their own feelings. Because you're right, our kids have their own boundaries, even from a young age, they just don't know how to articulate it always. Misti Spencer: their own feelings because you're right. Our kids have their own boundaries. Even from a young age, they just don't know how articulate it always. I believe that we do. I believe that a little child, I was a behavioral therapist with autistic littles for several years. And I believe that we do. It's just that it parents have low bandwidth. We are working a lot. I know. I know when I say the things I say, because I hear it in my own head, but I work a lot, but I'm trying to put food on the table, but I'm trying to pay the rent. I'm trying to pay my car payment. I'm trying to just get them to school on time. I'm trying to brush my hair every day. What do you mean every time their red flag goes up? Yep. I'm sorry, but we chose them. They did not choose us. They didn't choose to be born. We chose to go through with the process of having them. It is our jobs at that point that everything else goes by the wayside. And it's our job to get healthy through the process. If it triggers, my children triggered me. I love especially adolescents and teens, I did not know how to communicate with them because that's when I was abused. I was raising Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: children like an 11-year-old raises children. And then their emotional intelligence surpassed mine. And I went, When you're triggered, whoo, that's your job. Not your kids' job to be less rebellious. I mean, we don't want them getting in trouble. I don't mean, but they're rebelling because they're just figuring out their path. It's our job to go, Jenni Awesome: Yeah, they're they're pushing boundaries. Misti Spencer: why are you feeling the way you do? Well, I just want to be an a writer. I understand. Let's talk about what the road to being a writer looks like. Not, Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: you know, writers don't make any money. You know you're never, do you know how competitive you know how hard it is to get a bestseller? New York Times, that's never gonna be you. Stay focused. You're a great football player, right? Jenni Awesome: Ray. Misti Spencer: We shape them because it's easy for us. Instead of you wanna be a writer, then let's talk about the truth about being a writer. You're gonna be broke a long time. You're gonna have to do this a long time and build that, right? That's Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: the conversation instead of going head to head. And they will go head to head, but we are not their friends. I know we like to say that. I'm my they're my friend. My daughter says it today, and I taught her I'm your best mom friend, because Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: I cannot have certain conversations with you at the moment I think I should, because you're not ready. Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: Peers have conversations with each other whether we're ready or not. That's the difference. My friends and I, when we have very sincere, hard conversations, it's it has to happen now. With children, we have to be more delicate. Therefore, I'm not your peer. Because in friendships, we can't be that delicate. We'll run each other Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: over. So that's the message with the children component. If we can start now. We're the grandparents now in these age groups. I'm coming into the age of potentially being grandparent age, if they ever did it. But nieces and nephews will have children. Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: It's our time. And we get to pave the way for them now, literally and figuratively. Yeah, I I've heard you mention about, you know, the way that we were raised or that, you know, a lot of these things have come from intergenerational of of the way we talk. Jenni Awesome: Yeah, I I've heard you mention about, you know, the way that we were raised or that, you know, a lot of these things have come from intergenerational of of the way we talk, the way that we treat our kids, because that's how we were treated. And it only takes one of us to decide that we're not gonna talk like that. We're not gonna treat our kids like that. And that's where we start that trickle effect. The the waves will happen of we are now changing Misti Spencer: way we treat our kids because that's how we were treated. And it only takes one of us to decide that we're not gonna talk like that, we're not gonna treat our kids like that. And that's where we start that trickle effect. The the waves will happen of we are now Jenni Awesome: the way that we raise our kids. Misti Spencer: changing the way that we raise our kids and that changes the way that the kids speak to their kids and so on and so forth and and we can choose to make that change to heal our families. Jenni Awesome: And that changes the way that the kids speak to their kids and so on and so forth. And and we can choose to make that change to heal our families. Misti Spencer: Definitely and get rid of the pleasing component. We want to please each other all the time, including our children. My children aren't happy all the time. They're not happy with me all the time. I I love that we have a loving relationship, but sometimes I say things they're like mom and I say, but it's the truth, honey. I know you don't want to hear what I'm saying right now, but this certain path has certain things you should know about. Here Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: is the plan, the path. Do you want to walk through mud or do you want to step on stepping stones? Your choice, your choice. It has to be their choice ultimately. Or when they get older, it is your fault because they will blame you. Right? Jenni Awesome: Yeah. yeah, yeah. Misti Spencer: So it's the prevention of if we talk about it now and I just tell you the truth and you're pissed off, I'm not gonna make you happy all the time, but I'm gonna tell you I have a certain amount of wisdom and I've been around the block a little bit. I'm not telling you what to do, but I'm telling you what to prepare for. And if we can have more of those preparation conversations, we can curb these numbers and we can get these numbers down. You know, one in four trafficking victims is a child. Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: And Of those children, 80% of them, and now they're saying eighty to ninety percent is somebody that they know, trust, and love. They Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: never tell, and when they become an adult, they get involved in activities that they're not proud of and they get reabused and trafficked later in life. And that's my story. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. So, Misti Spencer: So what aspects of your story would you like to share a little more in depth while we, you know, have some time? Jenni Awesome: what aspects of your story would you like to share a little more in depth while we, you know, still have some time? Misti Spencer: Well, as a young person, I I had mentioned that I was subjected to porn and things like that. It wasn't that somebody was taking me into a room, I'm gonna stick with the grooming component and how this Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: happens. I I talk a lot about the details of the story and the Torah details are written, you know, you can go read them, right? As a young person, it was about exposure without education. And I was able to see pornography that was laid out. I it was under counters, magazines, videos that played when they thought, you know, I was sleeping in a living room. And then from there, behaviors, sexuality behaviors that oftentimes are little girls a lot. We dance, we play, we mimic, we do motion, and that is a lot of times applauded and with young people. And that's the message that I want to talk about now as far as it pertains to my personal story. Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: Because I didn't have a lot of boundaries built in around me and my family, just like most families of that time, they played together, they partied together, drank together, and the kids ran around like we were feral and ran around while everyone carried on being adults Jenni Awesome: Right. Misti Spencer: and didn't involve us very much. And I believe because of that, the culture of that, by the time I got to be 10 and 11 years old. My behaviors were more adult-like. I did act older than I was. I did behave Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: in ways that maybe I shouldn't. I didn't know that at the time. But we had moved. I grew up in poverty and low resources, and we had moved to a town that I didn't know anybody, and I didn't have friends. I didn't have friends growing up. We moved a lot. And I was riding my bike. around the neighborhood. I'm eleven years old. Like a lot of kids who are eleven do when they get a break from sibling watch or Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: studies or whatever. What do you get to do? You'd get to go ride your bike around the neighborhood. And that's Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: your fun time. And one of the neighborhood kids, I'd seen kids out and stuff, but it not a lot of kids were out on the streets. And it was summertime and he flagged me down. Said, do you want to play? You want to hang out? And he's an older kid. I had already received a lot of attention, ample attention from older men throughout my adolescence and primary years. I was abused when I was younger by a peer and a father was around kind of situation. There's a lot of it. There's too many stories. I'm sorry. But this I'm Jenni Awesome: Hm. Yeah. No, you're Misti Spencer: gonna stay on this one. I'm 11 years old and I'm riding my bike around and he says, You want to hang out? And I thought this was wow. Man, an older kid. I'm new to town. I get to reinvent myself. And yes, 11-year-olds think these things. Read Judy Jenni Awesome: yeah. Misti Spencer: Bloom books, right? We have very big kid thoughts because we have access to very adult material, young. Back then it was a lot of magazines and videos, VHS videos and stores and wiggly lines and showtime, right? Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: And so he says, come in. And not conversation. It wasn't I like you. Do you want to play Mario Kart? There's no conversation between us. It's let's, you know, go into there, go into the room. I did. He said, get on, take off my pants. And I had been told that before in peer play and in different ways that I was abused earlier. And I did. I didn't understand what we were doing, but it was kind of what I've done before. Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: And I'm a people pleaser. And I did what he said. And then that is when he held me. And I describe it, the world flipped, you know. It I just flipped on my end. I had no idea what was happening. But he Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: had put all of his weight into me. And that he raped me. And I didn't understand what was happening though, because my brain was literally blowing up. I knew This wasn't what I wanted, needed. It it all of it was crashing down around me and somebody I didn't know. but I felt like I did this. I got myself here and I need to get myself out, but I didn't know how to stop it. I froze and and he stopped and there was blood everywhere and I didn't understand that either. Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: I was embarrassed because I did have my cycle already. I believed that that was me. And so I and he was disgusted by me and told me to clean myself up and get out. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: and he lived in the neighborhood, so I saw him all the time. And I just walked my bike home and washed off in a hose and sat outside, you know, back then in summer. You played outside all day, nobody really knew where you were ever. And Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: I just washed off with the hose because it's summer and I'm hot. And I sat outside till I dried and I just sat with it. It stayed with me. I didn't even know I was raped until I was a teenager. I didn't even know what sex really was. until later. And that carried with me. I didn't know what to say. That's what no sex education. Does because Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: I didn't understand red flags. When I was younger, nobody put those boundaries around me that maybe I don't dance in a certain way to certain music. Just because adults can listen to music, I use the song, If you want my body and you think I'm sexy, that was my anthem when I was two and three years old and up. It was a family it is a family joke w when my mom was alive. It was a family joke. Misty used to do this when she was little in my panties. I used to sing Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: all the words to if you want my body and you think I'm sexy, let me know. Well, by the time you're eleven, by the time I was eleven, where are boundaries sexually? And that's the discussion. It has nothing to do with liberalism and conservatism and being conservative. It has Nothing to do with religious beliefs or not. It has to do with telling children the truth. These Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: are the things that can happen. This is Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: what is out there, not for fear, prevention, if somebody talks to you. And I know we talk about the strangers. that's just the rape. That's not the trafficking. I still saw that person up until I was 18 and decided to move out of the town. And he Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: winked and smite wink. And he would smile at me. I knew where he worked. everything. That person was a part of my life, but not directly. That's what happens in little cities, in little towns, on the back streets every day to day. Peers abusing peers Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: and peers not being able to tell anyone. And that's what that's what's part of my story. Jenni Awesome: Yeah, that is a awful thing that you have been through. And thank you for being brave enough to share your story and all of your stories. I have a a similar story. I I was raped when I was eighteen, seventeen, eighteen, I don't remember the age at this point. And it was years later that I had a conversation with my mom and found out that she had been raped as like a fourteen or fifteen year old. Misti Spencer: awful thing that you have been through, and thank you for being brave enough to share your story and all of your stories. I have a a similar story. I I was raped when I was 18, 17, 18, I don't remember the age at this point. And it was years later that I had a conversation with my mom and found out that she had been raped as like a 14 or 15-year-old. Jenni Awesome: you know, had I had that Yeah, but had I had that conversation with her when I was younger and just being aware of those things, it would have made a huge difference in the way that my childhood went. Misti Spencer: It's an epidemic. Yeah. But had I had that conversation with her when I was younger and just being aware of those things, it would have made a huge difference in the way that my childhood went. Agreed. My my issues and and the things in they're generational, you know, Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: and they're they're those stories are theirs. Mo everybody in my life is mostly not alive anymore. And my abusers aren't mostly. So I am fortunate that I get to step out and I don't have a lot of fear. I don't have the tethers anymore that so many Jenni Awesome: Mm, mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: do. But if another woman our age or older or younger hears what we're talking about, they might think twice about sharing their trauma, like you said. I'm so glad I didn't tell my children everything, but I did have certain dialogue with them because I was a trauma-informed and you know mandated reporter. I've worked with children most Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: of my life in some way, volunteering or in education or as a behavioral therapist. And I always felt like if we could just tell them the truth about us, maybe we could move the needle. If I could tell my kids before I thought about releasing the book, hey, some things happened to me, and my alcoholism is a factor. It's a symptom of that. Here's the truth about my alcoholism. This is how it hunts me down every day. The ability Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: to be able, the ability to tell my children that. I suffer in these ways and I work on it every day, allows me to work on it every day. They Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: the the accountability that comes from telling the truth is there. We could have stopped this many cycles ago in so many households if one mom told her daughter or son that somebody in their family hurt them. Or that somebody said that we were gonna go to a party and instead they took me to a hotel. Or this boy who made me feel really important, who I thought was my friend, actually took me to a party and made me a party favor. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: If we could tell those stories in whatever appropriate way we can. And there are appropriate ways to tell these stories. They don't have to be raw and graphic and hurt, you know, the people in our lives, we Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: can tell stories and articulate them in ways, author them in ways that we can share them with other generations that are coming up. Because I do understand it's very difficult to talk to a 10 year old about sex, about trafficking, about Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: rape. You don't just walk up to your 10 year old and go, so mommy's going to talk to you now about how this happened, it doesn't happen that way. I know. It's it starts with smaller conversations, just like the incidents. Jenni Awesome: Right. Misti Spencer: It's the same. Think of grooming are small Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: incidents that happen over time. Shaping is the opposite. I mean, we shape and grooming. You understand what I'm saying, though. I'm trying to use like Jenni Awesome: yeah. Misti Spencer: the opposite term. In shaping someone for positivity, we can use appropriate language. And there are many foundations and nonprofits out in our communities right now. that I have worked with and that I work alongside that are in our middle schools right now teaching students with parent permission in an appropriate, age-appropriate way the the what boundaries are, what risk factors are, what abusers do, what the system Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: is. It's just that parents are so afraid of it that they're not letting it into the schools nationwide. They try to take information away. To protect Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: and that's where our kids are getting in trouble. It it's it's a thing. Yeah, and it's it's so counterproductive the idea of let's take away all this information of what's truly out there and ways that we can prevent this, handle this, win. Jenni Awesome: Yeah, and it's it's so counterproductive the idea of let's take away all this information of what's truly out there and ways that we can prevent this and handle this when we're in this information-driven society and we've gotten more and more information out there. And if kids wanna find it, they're gonna find it, but it's probably not in the productive, supportive way. Misti Spencer: we're in this information driven society and we've gotten more and more information out there and if kids want to find it, they're gonna find it, but it's probably not in the productive, supportive way that could be addressed in through these organizations that you're talking Jenni Awesome: that could be addressed in through these organizations that you're talking about. Misti Spencer: about. That's true. I one of the things that I wish I did when my children were younger was be more detailed in how things happen. rather than tell them what will happen. And that's where the fear comes in. It's like the birds and the bees chats that we've grown up having where we try to sidestep things. That's how they do it in the middle schools a lot now is sidestepping it. But if we can teach them that there's this kind of human out there and They're always going to be there. It doesn't matter where you live or what society we live in. Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: It is not that you take responsibility or ownership of what they're doing, but you can look for certain red flags and make a decision to avoid situations before you ever get further down the road. So Jenni Awesome: Ray. Misti Spencer: if you can tell a middle schooler, hey, if this, this, or this, give them three things at one time, small things. If anybody tries to show you a picture that has any content, you will never get in trouble. But I want you to know with me, but I want you to know that you can get in trouble with the law. That is Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: the truth, whether you're an adult or not. If somebody shares photos with you and we don't do something about that right away, here are the real world consequences for that action. Your child Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: will listen. Those are real world things rather than putting them down for the knowledge they should have had or should have. And if we can give them three steps, sometimes it depends on the child, you can do that once a week and have a little family sit down. You can do it where it's once a month, depending on, because sometimes with neurodiverse individuals. once a week might be too much to handle some of the other things, or maybe complex PTSD, whatever it is that your bandwidth isn't there, you're managing a lot, then you set it out month by month and you give them little bits of information and you build up into the bigger happenings. If they Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: just know that wow, my parent is taking that or my caretaker, my person at that time is taking The time and the interest to say, hey, I love you so much that I want you to know that there's a way for you to get ahead of this before you get in trouble. If somebody shows you a picture, you won't get in trouble. Come show me. You Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: won't embarrass me. I don't want you to be embarrassed about sexuality. I want you to ask me questions. As a caretaker, parent, otherwise, you should be the first point of contact and Ironically, we're the last point of contact most of the time Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: because they're afraid of us being embarrassed. So if at eight, nine, ten years old, we're teaching them that we're not embarrassed about it, we're not teaching Jenni Awesome: Ray. Misti Spencer: them how to have sex. We're not giving them the tools to go do it. We're Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: teaching them that here are ways that you can protect your body. And it's by being aware of your own system. Your nervous system's gonna react in these ways. Somebody Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: puts their hand on you and it makes your skin crawl. I wanna know. If somebody says you should read this and it's a funny joke and you don't get the joke, come tell me the joke. I'll let you know what words you don't understand. I'll even tell you the punchline and tell you why you should never tell it again. Right? Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: Be open. About hearing the information and not embarrassed yourself. And if you are not educated in today's sex education world, I I suggest you get a crash course. My kids are much older, they're in their 20s. And Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: it was overwhelming for me then. I can't even imagine for a parent today how overwhelming. I do imagine it is overwhelming for you. It doesn't matter. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: Because it's pay now or pay later. That's the truth. Dig in now, or you're gonna have adults that are losing their minds, not working real jobs, floundering, going to jail. I went to jail, had a DUI, not understanding their own life, right? Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: Pay now or pay later as a parent. And there are certain things we can can talk about openly young that are just Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: little things. Has anybody said anything to you that made you feel uncomfortable lately or at school today? They're off. They don't feel good. What's wrong? What's wrong with you? You never talk to me. That's the normal dialogue in the car. Put your phone down. Talk to me. Come on. Rather than digging into their life, who'd you talk to today? Nobody. I'm sorry. Or Well, I talked to so and so and she told me that they are never gonna let me be on the cheerleading team. I'm sorry. But if you come at them, you never put your phone down, you don't pay attention to me, you're not listening to me. It's all about you and what Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: you need from your child. You get that from your friends. You do not get that from your child. They give you attention, they put your birthday parties on, they take you out to dinner. Jenni Awesome: Yes. Misti Spencer: Your kids are your kids your whole life until they're 80 years old. Your kids are your kids. And that separation is part of that factor as well. It's what I preach. If we can can do that with our kids, let them be kids always, I believe we can change it, change the exploitation. and like you said, it takes one conversation, it might have changed your life. And it's not your mom's fault. Jenni Awesome: Hmm. Yeah. Misti Spencer: Right. We don't blame them and I don't blame anybody at this moment in my life. And if children know that they won't get in trouble and their parent won't get in trouble, the person take all the trouble out of it, Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: they'll come to us more. It's the trouble factor. Yeah. Yeah. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Yeah. One of our our daughters, she would cause herself panic attacks because she was so worried she would get in trouble because of the abuse she had dealt with earlier on in her life. And just even seeing her as an adult now still getting so stuck in her head over the the trouble aspect when it's, you know. Misti Spencer: Panic attacks because she was so worried she would get in trouble because of the abuse she had dealt with earlier on in her life. And just even seeing her as an adult now still getting so stuck in her head over the the trouble aspect when it's, you know Jenni Awesome: We can be so open and honest now as adults, but because that happens so intensely as a child, it's it takes so much more to pull the stuff out of her to be there to support her. When you're right, if we can do that as an earlier age as parents, we set up that stronger foundation for our kids to be stronger humans when they're adults. Misti Spencer: we can be so open and honest now as adults, but because that happens so intensely as a child, it's it takes so much more to pull the stuff out of her to be there to support her when you're right, if we can do that as an earlier age as parents, we set up that stronger foundation for our kids to be stronger humans. They're not afraid of us, you know, when they're afraid of us, that means they're afraid to tell us every Everything. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: They're not going to tell us all the things. And would I say, and for your daughter, you know, when they when we struggle with this amount of trauma, when there's a complex series of timeline of trauma and abuse, that does not ever go away. Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: I have been asked and told, I've been asked why why can't you just get over it? And I have been told I should just get over it by individuals in my life and a therapist that it's time. And I asked that therapist, have you been raped? And she said, No. Said, okay. Have you been sexually abused in this way by partners? No. Okay. Have you been punched in the face by somebody you love? No. Okay. Tell me what I need to move on from. Because until you walk in my shoes, and that's a song by Depeche Mode, walking in my shoes, it's in my book. My book is Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Misti Spencer: laced with soundtrack. So until you actually walk in someone's shoes, that's why I don't talk on anyone else's behalf. I don't talk on pornography and sex work and choices because I'm not in that life today. I can only study it and give research and samples. I can't judge anybody for their choices, just like you can't for me. And Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: until you really walk in someone's shoes to tell someone to move on, move beyond it, my goodness, j no thank you. Move beyond my life at that point, because that's not a good person to have in your life. Trauma victims, Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: complex PTS victims, suffers, it never goes away. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: We have moments, I there are times I forget who I am and a smell, there are certain smells specifically for me. I will smell Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: a couple smells together and they're very common. it's an alcohol and a covering alcohol smell, like a mint and thing when Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Yeah. Misti Spencer: adults try to mask alcohol. And those two things in public today remind me of an abuser. So Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: it never goes away because you never know when it's going to hit you in the face. Therefore, you're always on guard for when it hits you in the face at work, Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: at play, when you're meditating, when you're drunk, right? It doesn't matter. So it's something that I teach you live with it forever. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: Don't survive it forever. Live with it now. Understand where it came from. Get to the root of it, all of it. That's the memoir piece, right? Excavate Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: all of it. Get to the roots of the damage. Then you can start rebuilding. And not on what you were not on the damage, not on the damage foundation. You now have a brand new foundation. Because you understand it with clarity. You see it for what it is, no embarrassment, no shame. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: You let who needs to own it own it. You own your part of it. And it isn't moving forward. It's rebuilding Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: on a new foundation. That that's always going to be there. They're bones in the ground. They're going to come up sometimes. When the flood comes in. They're gonna surface. It's just the way it happens. It's human. And Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: we don't accept that in society so much. There's an expectation, I believe, of survivorship that requires survivors to just go on and live life and be okay. Why can't you work a normal job? Maybe because when somebody has a mint in their mouth, I am now being raped again. I don't know you tell me why I can't work a normal job. Jenni Awesome: I had a so I went through a a traumatic complete breakdown during a horrific custody battle. And I couldn't work. I was a teacher at the time. I went back to work as a teacher and there was this kid in the classroom that I don't I don't know exactly how it ended up happening, but Misti Spencer: breakdown during a horrific custody battle. And I couldn't work. I was a teacher at the time. I went back to work as a teacher and there was this kid in the classroom that I don't I don't know exactly how it ended up happening. Jenni Awesome: just the way that this kid came up to my desk and like the rhiz rhythmic slapping of some toy or something in his hand, like Misti Spencer: But just the way that this kid came up to my desk and like the rhiz rhythmic slapping of some toy or something in his hands, Jenni Awesome: aggressively towards me, it put me right back in that moment of when I was raped as a kid. And it Misti Spencer: like aggressively towards me, it put me right back in that moment of when I was raped as a kid. Yeah. Jenni Awesome: it we can't it it happens. And so sometimes you're right, those things just throw us right back and there's nothing I could have done to prepare myself or prevent that from happening. Misti Spencer: it it we can't it it happens and so sometimes you're right, those things just throw us right back and there's nothing I could have done to prepare or prevent that from happening. No, but you have to go home you have to go on with your day and then you get in your car and you it it stays, right? The mem the flashbacks, now that's with you for the day. That doesn't go away. Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. yeah. Misti Spencer: You negotiate it. I negotiate with it at that point. Okay, this isn't really happening. You go through your toolbox. I understand. I go through the therapies and I tap and I do all the things, but Jenni Awesome: Yep. Misti Spencer: it's still in there. And I've got to go home, cook dinner, pretend I'm happy, smile at my husband, tell my children that I love them and that I'm really happy to be there with them that day. And meanwhile, internally, My inner child is screaming at me, going, What about me? You're not talking to me. That's what triggers are. You're not talking to me. Listen. And if survivors are taught, and I have I now do this, that you carve out time for your inner children, for your victims inside, because Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: Depending on how much you got, you got a lot of ages, markers in your life. Deal with them. Carve out the time to spend with them. I when I stopped pushing away the demons, as I called them, my monsters, and I started talking to them individually and going, I understand you hurt me. I understand why you hurt me. I understand the root of abusers. I understand the root of trafficking. Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: However, this is the time for my little girl. And she gets Twizzlers and she gets popcorn and she gets to sit in the corner of the room with her blankie. And we're gonna talk about what bothers her right now. And right now, what bothers her is that this thing happened today. And Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: it smelled like this, and I felt like that. And I wanted to get out of there. And it doesn't matter if you were 50. Because your inner child, my 11-year-old is the one that's sitting there going, remember when that happened? Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: Because I do that, I'm able to go to work the next day. Because I listen to them and I don't push them away, which is what we do with alcohol, drugs, sex, healing, whatever your addiction Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: is, whatever you adopt, everybody has vices. We use them to silence. The children. And guess why our why we were abused? Because we were silenced. In some way, shape, or form, we couldn't tell someone and stop the cycle. So as long as we keep silencing those emotions in us, I cry all the time. I can't help it. It wells up in me. And there are people around me that go, no, no, no. I don't want, don't. And they're afraid, like I'm delicate and fragile. I'm like, no, I'm a warrior, but I cry. Joan of Arc. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Yeah. I'm Misti Spencer: Cried. Like let's just let's stop being so delicate, everyone, and understand Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: that I've got stuff and I'm allowed to cry and then I'll be fine. But if you keep telling me to be quiet or to move past my emotion and not give me the carved out time, then I will forever have an inner child, whatever your psyche, whatever you want to label it in psychology, how we use words. Whatever's crying inside of you, listen. There's a reason Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: they're crying. And it does get better. I will say that since I started speaking more and even this podcast journey over the past six weeks, I don't have the cries. I feel sorry for what happened. I have moments where I go, I'm so sorry. I have to apologize to them. 'Cause I have so many ages that I was abused, they pop up and I have to go, I'm sorry that happened to you. But right now we Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: have stuff we have to do. And I know you're hurting, but when we get done, we're gonna go bite Chick-fil-A and we're gonna get a cookie. I do that. I don't go to the bar. Jenni Awesome: I love that. Misti Spencer: I don't go to the bar. That's a successful day. And Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: and I can't do that every day. We can't eat a six pack of cookies every day and be healthy, right? Jenni Awesome: All right. Misti Spencer: But when it builds up and that my little girl starts screaming, I go, listen, I know we can't do that now, but I'm gonna take your hand. I'm gonna help you through the next three hours. Cause sometimes it's when I am in real serious stuff. I'm working, I'm speaking, I'm sharing my stories. Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: I've got to stay collected. I can't let somebody else's energy sway me. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: And I have to hold her hand that entire three hours and go, I hear you. And when we are done, I will talk with you. And she trusts that now. Five years ago, I didn't trust that in myself because every time I said, Don't worry, we'll handle this. We'll go to therapy. Don't worry, we'll handle this. I'll journal. Don't worry, Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: we'll handle this. I'll take the walk on the beach instead of go to bottomless mimosas. Don't worry. I would keep pushing it away. And that was the suffering. As soon as I started listening, Because nobody listened when I was a kid, or I didn't say it. I didn't feel comfortable saying it. I was silent. That's the training in our adulthood. Yeah. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: Don't silence yourself. If your partner is, if if you're upset because it's not working, we have to talk about it, not pretend it's not happening. And then people are cheating on each other. How did Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: you get there? Because I didn't feel safe telling you the first time. You didn't show up for me. And then I didn't feel safe telling you the second time you said something that my abusers said over and over again. And then I didn't tell you that I actually don't like that food. But I ate it anyway. And here we are seven years later, and we're on the brink of divorce because you just don't listen to me. Right? Jenni Awesome: Yeah. When it's really what's underneath all of that. Absolutely. Misti Spencer: How do we get there? And we're not taught how to have those really hard conversations initially and they snowball. And so it's in all the relationships, children, partners, it's all of us. If we can take responsibility for our role and not worry about making everyone else do it, we can Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: create a wave of change and change Jenni Awesome: Absolutely. Misti Spencer: our conversation together. Jenni Awesome: Absolutely. Well, Misty, we're coming close to time. So I wanna make sure do you wanna talk about your book a little bit? How do people get a hold of you? How do they find you? How do they book you for a talk? Misti Spencer: We're coming close to time. So I want to make sure. Do you want to talk about your book a little bit? How do people get a hold of you? How do they find you? How do they book you for a talk? Thank you so much again to I want to say thank you because it is hard as podcasters to also constantly be listening to stories and coaches and therapists and all the people that are in this sector trying to give us voices and Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: build these platforms of knowledge and education. Thank you. for having me and taking the time. the book is a tool. Thank you. The Jenni Awesome: You're very welcome. It's an honor. Yes. Misti Spencer: the book is a tool. I knew that I would have to have something tangible because it is difficult telling as many stories as I have over and over and over and over and over again. and in timeline form. So my book is actually not a typical memoir where it goes When I was five, this happened. And then when I was eight, this happened. my book is designed to see my life through different lenses. So the title is Drinking Beauty and the Seven Narcissists: A Musical Journey. I know it's a lot of words, but every chapter is a word in the book. So chapter one is drinking. And it is my life through the lens of alcohol and addiction and how alcohol took hold of my life. Without blame, none of my chapters go into any blaming of anything. It really is exactly how things happen through my lens. And then chapter two is beauty, and it talks about how beauty is taken. not fit, not I'm beautiful. A lot of people think drinking beauty is me. It isn't. It is more of an analogy of what we all are. When we're in our addiction, we're our most beautiful. Jenni Awesome: Yeah. Misti Spencer: it's what it teaches us. So it's how addiction, abuse, a diagnosis, an accident digs into us and takes away our beauty, and so on. Every chapter has a lens, healing, grief. I've lost both of my parents. So you learn about that. I talk about my marriage in its entirety from conception to now, from our conception of our friendship to now, and how we navigated, not we. my lens, how I navigated that, parenthood, a chapter solely on parenting and children. And a chapter is on narcissists and how we've come to label society in a very clinical black and white way rather than tackle the tactics and the things that we use to get what we want and how narcissism Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: is created and how we label it. So, with that said, my book is a myriad of stuff, a lot of stories, but also there's love and there's healing and the other side of my life. It isn't just about the trauma. And I want survivors, people who don't understand survivors, people who've never met a survivor. This is for you. It is a blueprint for. How you can help someone, how you can listen to someone, and how we can prevent this all together, all the Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: different things that I've been through. And then at the end of it, what is the purpose of this journey? Why? Why would I have to go through this? Why would anybody go through what they have, what they're given, the cards were dealt, so to speak. Why did I have to go through this overall? And it isn't to say that someone is chosen because I used to believe that I was forsaken. I was chosen to suffer. I did, very deeply believed I was chosen to suffer this world. At Jenni Awesome: Mm. Misti Spencer: the end of it, the the message that I want people to see at the end of the journey is that it isn't suffering. We have to find. Our purpose to serve. And so it helps us get to the end of that journey and what's next for my chapter. You can get it by my name. My name is Misty Spencer, Misty with an I, M-I-S-T-I Spencer. And I have my own website, Mistyspencer.com. And you can also get it in all formats on Amazon. it helps survivors, it is the way that I intend to move through the world from now on. So you help. All survivors get their messages out there. If you're not a reader, don't worry. Buy it and give it to a 21-year-old in college. Buy it and give it to your niece, your granddaughter, your grandson. It's not just girls. Or read it just so that you have more dialogue yourself. and I want to know what you think about it. How did it touch your life? So I want to hear from survivors. You don't have to read my book. I'll hear your story anyway. I want to hear about others. and build in your stories. If you can't tell it, I'll build it in. I'll tell your story and this on a podcast and media and whatever way. Cause I believe Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: that your stories matter too. So when you read, if you choose, know that there's way more purpose than just buying my book. We need to push this message much further. Thank you. Jenni Awesome: Yes, yes, we do. And and along with your book, it comes with an added experience. Is that correct? Misti Spencer: Yes, we do and and along with your book, it comes with an added experience. Is that correct? It does, it does. every chapter has a soundtrack. And all of the songs are part of my life. They in all the decades of my life, from childhood up to now, there's songs that are part of my events, memories. It's how I excavated a lot of my life and memories because there were so many songs attached. Plus my autism kicked in. I cataloged thousands and thousands of songs. And it was hard to actually pick which ones make it into this book because I'm writing different books for different subjects and lenses with all new music. But you read a passage and in some way it's important, and then you can choose. You can go and look up the song and listen to it, or you can choose to just read the book straight through and go back and listen to the music. The music's important because it does allow you to see my emotion differently. I do have rage. I do have anger about what happened. I do have sorrow, but I also have moments of clarity and becoming and awakening. And you may discover music yourself in looking at my catalog and the soundtracks of my life. You may yourself find music that helps you get through something in your life. So as much as it is about my writing, the songs in it are so important because they give their own message and those artists have their own pain. And it's a way for them to circumvent, yeah. Jenni Awesome: I love it. Well, Misty, I end my interviews with the the same question because it truly gets to the heart of the work that we're doing. So if you could change one thing for the next generation that would have the greatest positive impact, what would it be? Misti Spencer: Misty, I end my interviews with the the same question because it truly gets to the heart of the work that we're doing. So if you could change one thing for the next generation that would have the greatest positive impact, what would it be? I believe giving our children a voice is going to be the one thing that changes us forever. Silencing children is the issue. It's the core issue. Children that have voices don't get abused. We see that in statistics. It is the children that don't know how, don't have the tools, or are forcibly silenced. that are suffering as adults even. And so the one thing I would want to change in our society is that we start talking to our children like children and Jenni Awesome: Mm-hmm. Misti Spencer: listen to their voices instead of our own and trying to put our voice into their head. Jenni Awesome: I love that, Misty. It's it's so beautiful. And I wanna thank you again. Thank you for the bravery, for being bold, for persevering through everything you've been through and for being here sharing your voice, sharing the voice of your inner child with the world to be the light for others. So thank you so much for coming onto the podcast today. Misti Spencer: I love that, Misty. It's it's so beautiful. And I wanna thank you again. Thank you for the bravery, for being bold, for persevering through everything you've been through and for being here sharing your voice, sharing the voice of your inner child with the world to be the light for others. So thank you so much for coming onto the podcast today. And thank you. Thank you to your audience and thank you for what you do. It's amazing. Bless you. Thank Jenni Awesome: All right. And Misti Spencer: you. Jenni Awesome: thank you. And thank you for tuning into the Jennifer Awesome podcast. I also want to take a quick moment and say that if you have a story that you'd like to share, I have this platform, as Misty said, I would love to be the vehicle for you to share your voice, share your story, because we are a story-driven society. As humans, we originally experienced things through stories. Misti Spencer: Thank you. And thank you for tuning into the Jennifer Awesome podcast. I also want to take a quick moment and say that if you have a story that you'd like to share, I have this platform, as Misty said, I would love to be the vehicle for you to share your voice, share your story, because we are a story-driven society. As humans, we originally experienced things through stories. Jenni Awesome: So Misti Spencer: So Jenni Awesome: Come share your story and get your voice out there in the world because you never know who needs to hear your story because it could become their survival roadmap for their lives. Have a good Misti Spencer: Come share your story and get your voice out there in the world because you never know who needs to hear your story because it could become their survival roadmap for their lives. Jenni Awesome: day. Misti Spencer: Have a good day.