Latest / The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast / #33: Blake Boldon-Franklin P. Johnson Director of the Drake Relays

Transcript

#33: Blake Boldon-Franklin P. Johnson Director of the Drake Relays · The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast

• 0:00
  Hey gang, welcome to the Gila buttocks, connections podcast,
• 0:04
  the show that brings you the men and women of track and field and
• 0:07
  explores their unique Stories. The show is brought to you by
• 0:10
  Goliath Lennox head on over to Gila fedex.com to find all your
• 0:14
  track and field equipment needs. I'm your host, Mike Cunningham,
• 0:17
  national sales manager for Gil and this episode Our Guest is
• 0:20
  none other than the director of Drake Relays Blake.
• 0:25
  Bolden, you're really going to enjoy this.
• 0:27
  We discuss Blake's career as a Say athlete in college but also
• 0:32
  is a very successful post collegiate career as well being
• 0:36
  one of the first 200 of these number 228, sub 4 minute mile ER
• 0:41
  for America. That's a that's a big deal.
• 0:44
  You'll really kind of understand what's it like to be a
• 0:46
  post-collegiate and even though he was a sub 4 minute mile ER
• 0:49
  just the struggles that he went through and went through
• 0:53
  together with a lot of great athletes.
• 0:54
  You're going to really enjoy that part.
• 0:56
  We then discuss Blake getting into college coaching and then
• 1:00
  Jean over to the director of the Indianapolis Monumental Marathon
• 1:05
  and well, then we stop right there.
• 1:07
  The next stage of his career. The Drake Relays is an extremely
• 1:10
  special time. You're gonna have to wait for
• 1:12
  our part to, to get into Blake's dream job as the Director of the
• 1:17
  Drake Relays. But for now, without further
• 1:20
  Ado, please help me welcome the wise, the wonderful Blake bolded
• 1:32
  All right. Hey, thanks for joining us here.
• 1:34
  Once again, at the Gillis latex connections podcast, I'm really
• 1:38
  excited about this. What?
• 1:39
  I think I say that for all of them full disclosure, but this
• 1:42
  one is going to be a lot of fun for a couple of reasons.
• 1:45
  One is today's guest is a just a dear friend of mine personally
• 1:50
  and professionally, but also really a super interesting
• 1:55
  character here today. Today, we have with us Blake,
• 1:59
  Bolden from the Drake Relays He's the Drake, Relays director
• 2:02
  Blake. Thanks for joining us today.
• 2:04
  Hey Mike, yeah, thanks for having me on, you know, this
• 2:07
  will be Audio Only. I wish they could see you right
• 2:11
  now though. You are.
• 2:13
  You are in full quarantine mode with this whole beard and
• 2:16
  mustache and and it seems like, are you are you working from
• 2:19
  home? Yeah.
• 2:20
  Yeah. I've been working from home
• 2:22
  since essentially, I think March 19th.
• 2:26
  Maybe you know I've gone by the office, a handful of times Maybe
• 2:31
  Actually only two or three times just to pick up Ivy.
• 2:33
  The day after I started working from home, I had to go back
• 2:36
  because I realized I'd left my computer charger at the office.
• 2:40
  So I just went by and picked up the absolute Necessities on day
• 2:43
  two. And then I went back, you know,
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  actually, I think it was 24 or 25 days later to then, you know,
• 2:50
  had the had a greater realization that I would be here
• 2:54
  in a little bit longer term. So then I went back and grabbed
• 2:58
  Letterhead, you know, there's some, some more things to really
• 3:01
  create the Drake Relays home office, so to speak.
• 3:06
  Yeah, I the same thing, I just picked up my office chair
• 3:09
  yesterday. I've been here a month and just
• 3:11
  not loving my chair, my home chair at all.
• 3:14
  And finally was, like, you know what those office?
• 3:16
  Chairs are office. Chairs for a reason.
• 3:18
  I need to grab that. I love that you were all set,
• 3:22
  ready to work? And then you forgot.
• 3:24
  You were on limited time. You didn't have your charger for
• 3:26
  your parenting. Yeah.
• 3:29
  Well, that's how quickly. I mean, we worked hard to put
• 3:32
  together a thoughtful and comprehensive postponement
• 3:36
  announcement and so that process took us several days because I
• 3:42
  mean, the Drake Relays certainly, there was no choice
• 3:45
  in 2020 to do anything other than postponed.
• 3:48
  But when we have, you know, road races that 5K 10K, half marathon
• 3:54
  that include more than 4,000, participants Grand Blue Mile.
• 3:58
  That includes between three and four thousand Adult and Family.
• 4:03
  Participants, in addition to the usatf one mile championships and
• 4:09
  a mascot race, and so many more like that night.
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  Has seven or eight races, including one that includes
• 4:15
  seven thousand Elementary excuse me, 700 elementary school, kids.
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  So road races Grand Blue Mile, the vaulted Capitol Square in
• 4:21
  downtown Des Moines which I know you're familiar with and then
• 4:25
  High School College, professional elements.
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  Stu the Drake Relays and Partnerships with organizations,
• 4:31
  like u.s. Paralympics, you have Iowa,
• 4:34
  Special Olympics of Iowa. You know, number of other
• 4:37
  organizations that we partner with just for the track meet.
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  Then, on top of that, we talk needed.
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  Make sure that we were creating messaging for the students
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  because the Drake Relays is the largest student-run Festival in
• 4:50
  the state of Iowa, you know, with a concert Street painting,
• 4:53
  you know, like a week-long celebration that really
• 4:56
  functions as drink. Varsity homecoming.
• 4:59
  So then once your think of those terms, you also know we had to
• 5:01
  work with our alumni office to be sure that they were prepared
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  for alumni questions. So and that's and that's, and
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  that's not even including the beautiful Bulldog contest and
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  how we were going to address that with the director of that
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  event. So, all of those elements
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  students alumni community, and then, of course, athletes
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  coaches agents vendors all of that to have a consistent
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  messaging, and FAQ, and it took us a couple days.
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  Days after we knew that the postponed it would be necessary
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  to be sure that that messaging was Coast consistent and
• 5:36
  coherent and and addressed any possible concern.
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  So when we finish that it went out in a press statement and you
• 5:47
  know email statement and those things that about 4:00 on
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  Wednesday, the 18th of March then the local TV reached out
• 5:55
  and wanted to come by the office and did Three or four TV
• 5:59
  interviews and then I was ready to go home.
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  So, I left the office that day, I didn't necessarily leave with
• 6:05
  the intention of not coming back for seven or eight weeks.
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  I love to it. The intention of I have to get
• 6:12
  out of here and I just grabbed my my computer and my bag that I
• 6:17
  bring that I used to take to work with me every day and then
• 6:22
  I got home and I work the next day and about 5:00, I realized
• 6:26
  two things. One, I needed a computer
• 6:27
  charger. ER, and then to, oh no, I
• 6:30
  haven't been to the store in a month.
• 6:32
  I gotta go. I gotta go to the store.
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  I have nothing here. And then, I was my first real
• 6:37
  because I've been in a work bubble, not only with the
• 6:39
  postponement announcement that we just address, but leading
• 6:42
  into that on March 11th we announced the new presenting
• 6:45
  sponsorship of the Drake Relays and we announced a new status on
• 6:51
  the world Athletics. Continental tour.
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  We detained silver level status. So really changing how The Drake
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  Relays plays a role on the Olympic qualifying process and
• 7:02
  it's a new procedure and that was put in place for the 2020
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  Olympics. So we had this big press
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  conference with 100 people, that was March 11th and that was the
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  culmination of, you know, full speed work for weeks to
• 7:19
  finalize, the contract, build the pr fit, you know, figure,
• 7:22
  all that. And then once we hit that
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  announcement, the very next day is when the NCAA Say you know,
• 7:28
  began that postponement or really, maybe within 48 Hours of
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  our announcement is when you know the world turned upside
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  down. So certainly very happy that we
• 7:37
  had the opportunity to celebrate our presence on the world
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  Athletics, Continental tour, and our tremendous support from
• 7:44
  extreme power by Mediacom or new presenting sponsor.
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  But, you know, even now that kind of seems like a dream that
• 7:53
  in the span of a week. We went from probably one of the
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  biggest announcements in Drake relays Has history, which is
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  spans 11 decades to the very next week, postponing the event
• 8:03
  for the very first time in 11 decades.
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  So a pretty roller coaster week and and Still still just coming
• 8:12
  up from are our four are from that after having commemorated
• 8:15
  the originally scheduled dates last week.
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  Yeah, unfortunately, we're still on that roller coaster everyday.
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  Something a new twist, the new turn, a new dip, a new dive.
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  I do like, you know, with our sport for the companies that
• 8:28
  invest into supporting this great sport of track and field
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  to make sure we give proper shoutouts.
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  You mentioned them real briefly. They are give us the name of
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  that new sponsor for the Drake Relays.
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  We need to give them I'm a public shout-out for supporting
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  the greatest track meet in the country here.
• 8:44
  Well, thanks, Mike. Yeah, so the company is Mediacom
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  there. The fifth largest cable and
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  internet provider in the u.s. They do a lot of business here
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  in Iowa and other parts of the country.
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  But they they're committed to the communities here in Iowa.
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  They branded it with one of their products extreme which is
• 9:04
  their internet service. So when the market that, you
• 9:07
  know, this is how we started building the relationship.
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  When they Market it, they're very explicit in saying faster
• 9:14
  is better. And that's, that's like a
• 9:16
  tagline that they use in marketing.
• 9:18
  Well, of course athletes the track.
• 9:21
  That's right. Excuse me, athletes faster is
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  better, you know, maybe not so much for the throwing events in
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  but certainly if you're faster and rotation it's certainly been
• 9:34
  battling Master. Does it hurt?
• 9:36
  So faster is better and and that that sir is we have it.
• 9:40
  Really leaned into that yet but we've only right, you know.
• 9:44
  Yeah but then so they do the internet as a primary product
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  but then, of course, here in Iowa and it's a local cable
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  access Channel essentially called Mediacom 22.
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  Then I think may even extend over the Champaign-Urbana and
• 10:01
  Muhammad and kind of through a regional reach.
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  Mostly small towns doesn't doesn't extend into Chicago, but
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  certainly does grab a lot of it. Way.
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  And so long story short, I mentioned that this a the week
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  of the Drake Relays great partnership with usatf and in
• 10:18
  this regard and run our space everybody on their team.
• 10:22
  You know, Ross crumbly that their CEO just terrific partner
• 10:27
  and very generous in allowing us to take all of the 2019 content
• 10:32
  from the Drake Relays and then rebroadcast it and repackage it
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  on the local cable. So then if you lived in Iowa
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  particular, Or rural parts that were immediately adjacent to
• 10:43
  Iowa so near between where I live and where you live like the
• 10:46
  Quad Cities Swanson's, right? Yeah.
• 10:49
  So some of those areas they might have shown near Muhammad
• 10:52
  and near Champaign-Urbana. I don't think the intention was
• 10:56
  for not to go that far based on a conversation with Runner space
• 10:59
  and usatf. But for me to come 22 to have
• 11:02
  that valuable content. But then also give Iowa the
• 11:06
  chance to really recognize the event and celebrate it and are
• 11:10
  Are near the market. Where are most of our ticket
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  holders live? All right.
• 11:13
  Well that's awesome for Mediacom.
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  To step up and support the Drake Relays and God bless.
• 11:19
  We're finding out how even more important, very new internet was
• 11:23
  important but with our current stay at home area of boy, we you
• 11:29
  know how important that really is right now.
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  So just want to give a shout-out to the companies that sponsor
• 11:35
  and support the sport that we have.
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  So that's awesome for those guys.
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  That was a great. Eight update on the Drake Relays
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  and I said, you know you you you caught me there.
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  When I said the best track meet in the country, I have had a
• 11:47
  soft spot for the Drake Relays for a long time.
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  It was the first big meat that I ever went to as a coach.
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  And I still remember the how I kind of fell in love with the
• 11:59
  Drake. Relays I was over on the bend
• 12:02
  for part, just passed the start line and the mild Invitational
• 12:06
  Maya was up. And Steve Scott was trying to
• 12:09
  become I think he was trying to become the first 40 year old to
• 12:12
  break 4 minutes and you know, full disclosure here, I am not a
• 12:16
  distance guy at all, you know, I was a Sprint's hurdles jumps
• 12:20
  coach, but it became interesting me to watch this guy.
• 12:23
  Try to break four minutes for the 40.
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  Well, he ends up not make out on what he ran, but he didn't hit
• 12:29
  the goal of sub for, but the fans were so appreciative of the
• 12:35
  effort. It was a standing ovation.
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  I remember, I stood up and I started clapping and that's When
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  it came full scope to me. I was able because of where I
• 12:42
  was sitting. I was able to see the entire
• 12:44
  stands sold out, of course, because that's what Drake,
• 12:47
  Relays does on Saturdays and see, everybody standing up
• 12:51
  Standing Ovation, however, many people are in the stands at
• 12:54
  thousands and thousands of people for this.
• 12:56
  You know, this is going to sound harsh, but this failed attempt
• 12:59
  at a sub 4 and that's when it hit me like holy cow.
• 13:02
  This is a big deal, he like track is huge and I have done
• 13:08
  everything I can to make Every Drake Relays since then man just
• 13:12
  fell in love. Yeah, and I know the story.
• 13:16
  Yeah, I mean, I think what makes a drink real, a special in and
• 13:19
  maybe even all the track, but it really comes alive in Des
• 13:21
  Moines, is that the fans? Absolutely celebrate the
• 13:24
  winners. They absolutely celebrate the
• 13:26
  records, but as much as anything, they celebrate the
• 13:28
  effort. Yeah, that effort is what is
• 13:31
  burning really brings the crowd to their feet.
• 13:34
  You know, and we've got a rich history of world class
• 13:37
  announcing, you know, Jim Duncan I think if you come and visit
• 13:41
  Drake Stadium during the Drake, Relays and then you go to a lot
• 13:44
  of other meats and not naming any others by name.
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  But your typical track meet and then and you hear how curtain
• 13:52
  with modern 2020 and Beyond, and over the last 14 or 15 years.
• 13:57
  I think it is, Mike J and how he brings it to life.
• 14:02
  That passion that very recognizable voice.
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  He got his start at Drake Stadium prior to that.
• 14:07
  It was Tom Crow shell who is Knowledgeable works at Iowa,
• 14:11
  State and did a wonderful job after Jim Duncan the legendary
• 14:17
  public address announcer that. Did it for many.
• 14:19
  Many years. Brilliant guy.
• 14:21
  That knew so much in an era where research was a lot harder,
• 14:25
  you know, in the 70s and hey, 60s, 70s 80s.
• 14:29
  And so that's part of it. And then, that really brings the
• 14:32
  crowd to life and they feel intimate relationship with those
• 14:35
  athletes. And then reciprocally those
• 14:38
  athletes feel and into, Mint relationship with their fan
• 14:41
  base. Now, if you're listening so far,
• 14:44
  it's clear. You can hear the passion from
• 14:46
  Blake about the Drake Relays. But, you know, you may be saying
• 14:49
  to yourself. Well, of course, he has passion.
• 14:51
  He's the director of Drake Relays, interestingly enough,
• 14:55
  and we're going to get in our way back machine Here.
• 14:57
  Blake and back to high school, which, you know, we're not going
• 15:01
  to talk about age, but it was a while ago, so you actually
• 15:06
  Drake, Relays is not a job for you.
• 15:10
  It's a culture for you. And what I mean by that is you
• 15:13
  actually grew up in the state of Iowa, running track and
• 15:16
  competing at the Drake Relays. Well, to some degree trying to
• 15:22
  compete at the Drake. Relays, let's go with your high
• 15:25
  school career when he first started getting into track and
• 15:31
  why did you even choose track over?
• 15:33
  Yeah, I mean, so we have when I was in 7th and 8th grade, I just
• 15:36
  did all the sports, like, just was this Sports kid, you know?
• 15:39
  I mean when I was 8 or 10 years old, I probably thought I was
• 15:42
  going to be a professional baseball player, you know,
• 15:44
  loving the Cub. Yeah, just love sports.
• 15:46
  So, you know, I was on the football.
• 15:48
  Ball team, which, you know, probably weighed 288 pounds or
• 15:52
  something. I did not know that.
• 15:56
  Yeah. So, you know, and that in the
• 15:58
  school, it's like we have four seasons.
• 16:00
  You do football in the summer and the fall basketball in the
• 16:03
  winter, and then track in the spring and then baseball in the
• 16:07
  summer. So I did that.
• 16:09
  And in track, I definitely didn't in seventh and eighth
• 16:12
  grade. I was not on my own.
• 16:14
  I was a 400 meter Runner because I wasn't, I didn't really see
• 16:17
  myself on and farther than that. And I wasn't fast enough to run
• 16:21
  anything shorter than that, you know, 400 when you're 88 pounds
• 16:25
  and 13 years old or whatever it was, but that's might as well
• 16:30
  have been distance from a distance and at that point, you
• 16:32
  know, I don't even there's no chance it was under 60.
• 16:35
  I mean just no chance. Yeah.
• 16:37
  And, and when I don't know, maybe 65 could have been 75.
• 16:41
  Remember now, but the main thing I remember, is when I was in 8th
• 16:44
  grade, I still wasn't traveling, you know?
• 16:47
  Like, I didn't get to travel to the Big meats in eighth grade.
• 16:50
  Instead I was going with like, essentially the B team with the
• 16:54
  seventh graders and they're not the best stuff is better because
• 16:57
  the best some skaters got to go with the Educators.
• 17:00
  So that's that's my track and field story of like man I
• 17:02
  started and then by the time I finished eighth grade it you
• 17:07
  know I was I had thought maybe I would be a picture or something
• 17:10
  in baseball but I just wasn't strong enough.
• 17:12
  Like I couldn't, I couldn't throw the ball from second base
• 17:15
  to home plate on a High School, baseball field, you know just a
• 17:18
  kid. Little kid, like little scrawny.
• 17:20
  We kid that puberty hadn't hit and hadn't developed into
• 17:23
  anything. So then I was like, well what
• 17:26
  was I going to do in high school?
• 17:28
  I was not going to play football.
• 17:29
  What I got destroyed. So I was a football manager and
• 17:34
  ran cross-country because it's like, wow, I want to do
• 17:36
  something I did when I was in eighth.
• 17:38
  Grade twice, the high school cross-country team, had two boys
• 17:43
  at my high school, two boys, on the whole team.
• 17:46
  So I looked at it as is that because track wasn't Popular or
• 17:49
  did you go to like a school of 20 kids?
• 17:53
  No I graduate of like a hundred kids.
• 17:55
  Like there's just not a we're not not from an athletic Town
• 17:58
  necessarily and and distance running and track and field or
• 18:01
  certainly not our. It's not part of our culture
• 18:04
  necessarily like yeah. I mean I could tell a lot of
• 18:08
  stories about that little town like there were then I started
• 18:11
  running I became a runner over time and they're like two
• 18:14
  runners in the whole town. You know, people would actually
• 18:16
  go out put on running shoes and go for a run.
• 18:18
  When I was in 8th grade, I looked at our high school roster
• 18:21
  and I knew that there was only two kids, I'm going to get a
• 18:25
  varsity letter of desist, letter, r City, baby, like, but
• 18:29
  I know that there's five new make it to the varsity, at least
• 18:33
  I'm going to be varsity as a freshman.
• 18:34
  So I started running a little bit and my sister was on that my
• 18:38
  older sister was on the girls team and the girls team was a
• 18:41
  little bit better and you know, and she graduated.
• 18:44
  So it wasn't like I was going to have to be on the same team as
• 18:46
  my sister. So I went in and Started running
• 18:50
  and then you know I ran 1911 45k my freshman year.
• 18:55
  I don't know, I was remember because there's a problem,
• 18:56
  that's pretty good, you know, like that's pretty good the
• 19:00
  which that's not really that great for a varsity level.
• 19:06
  Girl let me to be honest but I was a varsity level boy as a
• 19:10
  freshman right 1911 thought. Maybe I'm a runner now you know,
• 19:13
  maybe maybe I'm a runner and then started working hard and
• 19:18
  just trained a lot. And then by the end, you know,
• 19:20
  my senior year, I ran 1606 and certainly had grown a few inches
• 19:25
  and got, you know, trained a lot which Trina up by my standard
• 19:30
  was 20 miles a week. I thought I was killed.
• 19:33
  Yeah. I thought I was killing myself.
• 19:34
  I mean, you know, in the weight room and doing some Cloud Matrix
• 19:37
  and you know, doing what I thought was a lot of hard work,
• 19:41
  but kids these days, they have the advantage of certainly
• 19:43
  podcasts really smart and educated coaches.
• 19:47
  Not to say my coaches were wonderful.
• 19:48
  I'm just saying that their access to people like you or to
• 19:53
  you know coach Holloway from Florida or whoever it wasn't the
• 19:58
  same in the nineties as it is now.
• 20:00
  And I remember you you share these memories.
• 20:02
  I'm sure of what you're a coach or an athlete in the 90s and you
• 20:06
  wanted to find out what your competition was doing.
• 20:10
  Not in terms of training like how many miles they were running
• 20:13
  or what kind of Waits there lifting or what kind of drills,
• 20:15
  they're doing. Just even the results you had to
• 20:18
  open up. Paper and flip to the very back
• 20:21
  to the sports Roundup. That's like tiny tiny fine print
• 20:25
  just to find the Winner's name and the winners.
• 20:27
  Just the winner. Yeah, you can get 1, 2, 3.
• 20:30
  You only got winners it. If you got anything you only got
• 20:33
  one or yeah. Right.
• 20:34
  And so there was just this absence of awareness, so I
• 20:38
  thought I was good, you know, my senior year I was never good
• 20:42
  enough to get into the Drake. Relays you know, I just didn't
• 20:44
  qualify. I just wasn't especially a good
• 20:47
  athlete. It just There's not a like a
• 20:49
  known natural talent that anyone would have looked at the said,
• 20:52
  wow, that guy is going to be an athlete.
• 20:55
  Somebody I'm shocked that you did not qualify for the Drake
• 20:58
  Relays. So if you didn't call because I
• 21:00
  thought you had done, you'd have going to school because every
• 21:03
  state a really good program and got real good there.
• 21:06
  But so did you not qualify for State either?
• 21:11
  My junior year I qualified about the 1600 and 3200 and finish
• 21:16
  like 9th, maybe it And so I was not fast but I'd say I was like
• 21:25
  hyper-competitive no no not even steady because like if I was in
• 21:31
  a race I was racing to win or I was racing in the front like and
• 21:35
  so where my time is weren't great.
• 21:38
  By senior year, I want 20 straight races but just didn't
• 21:42
  have that higher level of competition, we didn't travel
• 21:45
  much. They're all super local and like
• 21:49
  I remember my High School athletic director always joked
• 21:51
  with me, wasn't the track coach? But he followed it and he just
• 21:54
  like to see me at school the next day.
• 21:55
  And Pat me on the back, all our 30-point man right here, because
• 21:58
  you run the 3200, the 1600 in the 800 and you know, you go
• 22:03
  scored 30 points every every Tuesday and every Friday, every
• 22:07
  Tuesday and every Thursday, through Thursday Saturday?
• 22:09
  Yeah, yeah. And we didn't have a lot of big,
• 22:12
  Saturday invitationals at least not on my school.
• 22:14
  So not a lot of that next level competition.
• 22:18
  I mean, I remember, Number when, you know, we would go to one or
• 22:20
  two big meats and I might see someone who'd run at the state
• 22:23
  meet the year before I was a big thing like to see somebody that
• 22:26
  was one of the other people. I knew that was in the top in
• 22:29
  the state. That was, that was a big deal to
• 22:31
  see somebody like that, but I was wondering if the Drake
• 22:34
  Relays in high school but the state meet is held in Drake
• 22:37
  stadium. So, that was really special, I
• 22:39
  finished, I ran twice twice as a junior, meaning the 1600 and
• 22:44
  3200 and then as a senior in the 3216, Oh, oh, oh hey.
• 22:49
  This is the story that I used to tell a lot like in especially
• 22:53
  when I was recruiting like and talk with high school kids
• 22:56
  because in the 3200 I was in second place with like 100
• 23:01
  meters to go. I thought I was having this big
• 23:03
  break through my senior year and then two guys just went right
• 23:07
  past me. And, and I remember in the, in
• 23:09
  the end I have this article still, my mom has it in a frame,
• 23:14
  actually went and got the original print when newspapers
• 23:17
  actually used to keep the metal, Print, you know?
• 23:20
  So it's got that and its frame. That's really thoughtful gift
• 23:22
  that she got for me. But that article, I did an
• 23:26
  interview with the local sports writer about man, you know, I
• 23:30
  don't know. I just got out kicked and 3200.
• 23:32
  These guys are all really fast. I don't know how I'm going to
• 23:34
  kick with them tomorrow in the 1600 a more because I thought it
• 23:38
  was more of a distance. Runner, not a Miler, and I just
• 23:41
  got a now kicked. Well, then the next day,
• 23:44
  However, it happened well and actually here's I do, remember
• 23:47
  it clearly standing there at the start, you know, you're there
• 23:51
  and it's a packed Stadium. It's, you know, like the heist
• 23:54
  biggest race of my life at that point, you know, the nerves that
• 23:57
  come with it being. And I remember that anxiety and
• 24:00
  the stress of like that moment and I heard the public address
• 24:03
  announcer, who is Tom Tom Crow Shell.
• 24:06
  At the time, I ended up becoming friends dumbwaiter he said, and
• 24:10
  he said me by name and school and said that.
• 24:14
  On the top return. I like well at least one guy
• 24:17
  thinks I can win this and then I ended up winning the race.
• 24:20
  Like just pulling it out, like had a big, big kid.
• 24:23
  Yeah, we really like a breakthrough race actually that
• 24:25
  day and that race, I ran a seven-second PR to win the race
• 24:29
  when rooms in the mile. Holy cow.
• 24:31
  Yeah, 434 2427 in that one race. So you know, and then that gave
• 24:37
  me increased confidence, you know, called up the coach of
• 24:41
  Missouri State at that point, still really hadn't committed.
• 24:44
  Because, I mean, let's be honest.
• 24:46
  Even in the 90s, there's nobody that's winding up to recruit a
• 24:49
  for 34 mph. Like, let's go ahead.
• 24:51
  There's a lot of those and, and, and Drake had recruited me
• 24:55
  Sterling, Martin who, I'm still good friends with, he recruited
• 24:59
  me to Drake, Larry was orac at Iowa, had called me more because
• 25:04
  he's a good man. And a nice person, not because I
• 25:07
  really belong in the Big 10 at that point time and and he knew
• 25:13
  he knew that's where I wanted. Wanted to go like that's he you
• 25:17
  know, I wanted to go to Iowa, grew up a hot guy, and it was
• 25:19
  what I wanted to do, but it wasn't going to be right for me,
• 25:21
  not not at that point in time because I just was I would've
• 25:25
  been running to the ground as a 434 mile or that was running. 20
• 25:29
  miles a week. It's just too much so I was
• 25:32
  really fortunate that my first freshman year at Missouri State,
• 25:35
  there's my dogs in the title bar here.
• 25:38
  There for no good reason. That it's going to hear
• 25:40
  something. They they just want to make sure
• 25:42
  that they were on the podcast. Their whole goal.
• 25:46
  So I'm sorry. Mike if you hear a squeaker
• 25:49
  because I keep one by my computer and then I squeak it.
• 25:52
  And then they come running in and calm down.
• 25:55
  It's like some some pavlovian cycling training.
• 25:58
  They have long. Yeah.
• 25:59
  So we've got some dog training since I had to work from home
• 26:02
  because they've interrupted, not just this call, but every call
• 26:06
  every single. Yeah, we're going home, you have
• 26:08
  to take in account everything. Yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah, from
• 26:12
  home. I'm not, I'm not Having to teach
• 26:14
  any homeschool kids, you know, being a single person.
• 26:17
  I can't imagine parents that are dealing with that right now, but
• 26:20
  it with these two dogs, I've learned to cope.
• 26:23
  That's right. Yeah, you go to Missouri State.
• 26:27
  What was your goal going to Missouri State professionally,
• 26:31
  and academically meaning? What did you choose to major in?
• 26:33
  Did you think about being a coach at that time?
• 26:36
  Or were you thinking something completely opposite?
• 26:39
  Yeah, I study math. Education and then even before I
• 26:41
  graduated I had picked up Minor and coaching.
• 26:45
  And that, actually, we have a Missouri State.
• 26:48
  There's a lab school on campus called Greenwood laboratory
• 26:52
  school. And and like, schools across the
• 26:55
  country. Maybe it's Eastern, Michigan and
• 26:57
  Northern Iowa, Missouri State. They started in the early 20th,
• 27:01
  centuries as a normal school intended, to teach like
• 27:04
  education. So the teach teachers and so
• 27:08
  that was what Missouri State started as and then I know and
• 27:13
  that's not Why I chose Missouri State?
• 27:15
  But my parents were both teachers and it was more To me,
• 27:20
  it was like the natural progression of life.
• 27:21
  Like, you go to high school, you go to college and then you teach
• 27:23
  it, I don't know. You just seem natural.
• 27:25
  So I got a degree in mathematics and education and then coaching
• 27:29
  as a minor and at that lab school, I had done coaching, I'm
• 27:34
  Jerry Masterson. Who was a wonderful like a
• 27:38
  world-class middle distance runner in the early 80s.
• 27:42
  He was the head track coach and he, I was fortunate that he gave
• 27:45
  me an opportunity to be an assistant one semester, Wild
• 27:47
  redshirting. You know, end had the
• 27:50
  flexibility, my college coach at that time Houston.
• 27:53
  Frank's was very generous and saying, yeah, since you're
• 27:56
  redshirting and I was a walk-on, so it was some additional
• 28:00
  flexibility there, but he gave me that flexibility that on the
• 28:02
  days that weren't our workouts. I can do my mileage on my own
• 28:06
  and go to practice. Found that balance just for one
• 28:09
  season, to kind of get some of that experience.
• 28:11
  And I knew that coaching would be something I'd want to be
• 28:13
  involved in death road. So shout out to Houston francs,
• 28:17
  by the way, who has his Zone episode.
• 28:19
  He beat you to the punch like he was on the he tends to do hot.
• 28:24
  Yes, seniority. He was your coach.
• 28:26
  He deserves that right. In fact, you know, owe a lot to
• 28:29
  Houston for you and I that's how you and I got plugged in
• 28:32
  together many, many years ago. Now, it's kind of amazing.
• 28:35
  Yeah, that would have been probably.
• 28:37
  Yeah, maybe fifteen years ago or more, but, you know, something
• 28:40
  like that. Well yeah, very little bit more
• 28:42
  is before I came to Gil and I've been here for almost 14 years.
• 28:46
  So yeah. Yeah.
• 28:47
  It just means we're getting old is all that.
• 28:49
  Leaving now. So you obviously progress that
• 28:52
  Missouri State because you end up going into a post collegiate
• 28:56
  career as well and I try and I hope this embarrasses you a
• 29:01
  little bit, you shouldn't be but your humble enough that this
• 29:03
  will embarrass you. You were the 287th American to
• 29:09
  run sub for. That's what track and field
• 29:11
  news. That cam tells me, huh?
• 29:13
  That is there's probably been 287 since then.
• 29:20
  Math, major, that was really good.
• 29:22
  I looked that up to I was like, well how many has there been as
• 29:25
  of took? Well, I say today.
• 29:26
  There hasn't been any lately unfortunately, but we have now
• 29:30
  for for American citizens, we have had 558 so that was really
• 29:35
  good. That was pretty close to double
• 29:37
  their but you are 200. He said that's, that is a
• 29:40
  phenomenal number. When you think about in the aiee
• 29:45
  eons of time, you were the American.
• 29:49
  I could not find the World list. I wanted to know.
• 29:52
  Where did you sit on the all-time World list?
• 29:54
  I couldn't find that anywhere on the, the wide world webs there,
• 29:58
  but that just impresses the everliving snot out of me that
• 30:03
  that only 286 people before you was able to do this Monumental
• 30:07
  thing, that's amazing. So that was after that was in
• 30:10
  2007, that was after you had graduate that was during your
• 30:12
  post-collegiate. Yeah.
• 30:14
  What kind of marks were you coming out of Missouri State?
• 30:18
  No, you're many Time conference Champion fast forward.
• 30:22
  Now, you've now been inducted into the Missouri State Hall of
• 30:25
  Fame. Congratulations.
• 30:26
  By the way, that's a big deal. Thank you.
• 30:29
  And I'd like to think that that your introduction to the Hall of
• 30:31
  Fame. There was not just athletically
• 30:33
  but what you have done for the sport of track and field.
• 30:37
  But also as you've represented Missouri State, as your alma
• 30:39
  mater, I mean it's a kind of a package combination there for
• 30:43
  your induction to that's Hall of Fame.
• 30:46
  Thanks. Well, yeah, I, it took me awhile
• 30:49
  for for it. Took a while for me to actually
• 30:52
  believe it to be true that they went.
• 30:54
  When I first got the notification actually, was that
• 30:58
  the Coaches convention down in Orlando?
• 31:00
  Last December, are we have a renal?
• 31:02
  And, oh, yeah, us tfcc a convention.
• 31:05
  And I got this text from my mom that she had received a voice
• 31:12
  mail from someone at Missouri State about.
• 31:16
  Hall of Fame induction. And of course, my first thought
• 31:18
  was, I know exactly which one of my college teammates is pulling
• 31:21
  a prank on me like, oh, for sure. 100%.
• 31:26
  And so I started texting around just hey, how did you know?
• 31:30
  I probably first question. I asked them.
• 31:32
  Hey, how'd you get my mom's number?
• 31:33
  You know, and he then of course think of it in a different
• 31:36
  direction you know something but my 72 year old poor sweet mom
• 31:40
  has to like you know so he I found I asked enough questions
• 31:45
  that is Certain that it really wasn't him and then as I know,
• 31:48
  this must this might be real and then it was fun.
• 31:51
  It was really nice because Houston was there Houston
• 31:55
  Frank's he referenced so he had called one of my dear friends
• 31:58
  and teammates and a guy that I've stayed in touch with and
• 32:02
  share the news with him and then like, literally I was on the
• 32:05
  phone with my friend and as I was on the phone with my friend,
• 32:08
  in the lobby of the hotel there Houston, got off the elevator
• 32:12
  and I texted him, hey, I'm in the lobby.
• 32:15
  Would love to see I've got Share with you and so Houston.
• 32:17
  Was that second person. I guess, just by matter of a few
• 32:20
  seconds, I got to share it with and then he and Megan and the
• 32:24
  kids we went they had dinner while I just kind of enjoyed it.
• 32:27
  You know, he had some family time and I crashed family time
• 32:30
  and just we shot the breeze and caught up.
• 32:32
  And, you know, that's, that's probably, you know, the
• 32:35
  induction ceremony was really terrific.
• 32:37
  My high school coach went drove all the way from Iowa down to
• 32:39
  Missouri. My mom.
• 32:41
  It's just one of my sisters, went my younger sister, and
• 32:44
  then, and it was made. Be all told probably 80 people
• 32:48
  that went at one point or another for the weekend.
• 32:52
  Yeah, people from man couple from Texas one from Colorado one
• 32:56
  for Memphis a group from Indianapolis.
• 32:59
  Yeah in part because I encourage them and you know, invited them
• 33:06
  and ask them. But also we haven't had a reason
• 33:10
  to get together because our Men's Track and Field program
• 33:12
  was cut man a decade ago more Ten years ago, you know, 2006
• 33:17
  ish. It's a little fuzzy on my mind
• 33:20
  but exactly which year it was but not long after I graduated
• 33:24
  and left and and so we don't have a reason to get back
• 33:27
  together and, you know, they down at Missouri State, Building
• 33:30
  basketball arena and poured into a new track for their women's
• 33:34
  team, and I've done a lot of nice things on campus.
• 33:37
  And so I just really was suggesting to some friends like
• 33:42
  if you're not going to go back now.
• 33:43
  When are you ever going to right?
• 33:45
  Yeah. And we do.
• 33:45
  When you know, when are we there?
• 33:49
  Most of them, but me or marry and it's like, we don't have any
• 33:51
  more weddings to get together for.
• 33:52
  So, what are we waiting on? Are we waiting on funerals to
• 33:55
  start getting together? You know?
• 33:57
  And and so some people brought families but it was mostly just
• 34:00
  the guys, and kind of a guy's weekend.
• 34:03
  Yeah, it was, it was, it was a lot of fun.
• 34:05
  Well, I love it. So this is one of the many many
• 34:07
  reasons that I love being in your circle of good friends.
• 34:11
  Is when someone called to tell the news that you were being,
• 34:15
  This is the Hall of Fame. You thought it was a prank.
• 34:18
  Your humbleness was so much like this can't be real me.
• 34:21
  On the other hand, I call Troy University every year and ask
• 34:25
  where I'm going to be in. This is the difference between,
• 34:28
  you know. But I know it's more.
• 34:32
  Just a matter of I know I've Got Friends that can be real jerks
• 34:34
  first, maybe that's it. Mike, you know, however you want
• 34:41
  to explain it. That's good.
• 34:44
  So we got obviously to be in reduced to be inducted into the
• 34:47
  Hall of Fame. You were a pretty good athlete.
• 34:49
  So what kind of marks where you run in your senior year in
• 34:52
  college that you thought, well, man, I shouldn't hang it up just
• 34:55
  yet. I should try post collegially.
• 34:57
  What were you running, where you might assume your Miler.
• 34:59
  You're one of our few sub for milers in this country.
• 35:02
  So I assume you're the mild did become your main event in
• 35:06
  college. Yeah, you know it was I probably
• 35:09
  should have been more of a 3K Runner or a 5k Runner much
• 35:12
  earlier my life or my career but I was 1500 meter Runner,
• 35:17
  primarily a mile, and a 3K indoors, but I hadn't any
• 35:21
  Conference titles until my senior year and entering my
• 35:24
  senior year, my PRS were 4411 in the mile.
• 35:29
  And let's see, Outdoors for 1500 probably 353, you know that that
• 35:37
  rains are pretty equivalent, you know, 353 and 411, I'm pretty
• 35:40
  sure those are the with one year to go and I remember very
• 35:43
  clearly like, having a conversation with With RGA
• 35:46
  Michael Jewels, who's, from the Caribbean and he was partying
• 35:49
  like he was leaving. And, and this is before I had
• 35:52
  one year of Eligibility left and was my fifth year.
• 35:54
  So I'd done some redshirting. So, I've already spent four
• 35:56
  years of college and really, to go from 427 for 1609, 48 for
• 36:02
  3,200 down to 4. 11. And 353 is pretty good.
• 36:06
  I mean, absolutely. And I remember sharing with
• 36:10
  Michael jewels and and others I'm sure that if my, if my last
• 36:14
  go round in this, Year I was able to go to 345 for 1500 that
• 36:20
  I would then pursue like take a shot at like maybe try make the
• 36:25
  Olympic trials in 2004. I try to continue going if I
• 36:28
  could go from 353. 2345 that 8. Second jump would keep me
• 36:34
  engaged. Well then indoors.
• 36:38
  I caught fire. And I started running pretty
• 36:40
  well and I think it was probably my first mile race I had lost.
• 36:45
  Lost the race. I want I want a couple of rate
• 36:47
  smaller races and 800 i3k and then Houston took me down to
• 36:51
  Kentucky and ran on that big old track and Robert Gary was pacing
• 36:56
  the race for Ron Meyers who ended up running at the World
• 37:00
  Championships here in some for that day was his first sub for.
• 37:04
  I was second in 403. I went from 411 2403 in one,
• 37:12
  right? Yeah.
• 37:13
  That's a breakthrough. That's, that's a big day.
• 37:15
  And I mean, there's a lot of memories from that day,
• 37:18
  certainly related, primarily to my personal relationship with
• 37:22
  Houston and some wisdom. He shared with me before the
• 37:24
  race. And, you know, the relationship,
• 37:26
  we built over the four years leading up to it but also the
• 37:30
  school record at Missouri State at the time was 407 and his name
• 37:36
  was Matt with Gingka. And Matt, Matt was at that
• 37:38
  point, a really good Masters level that we can cause a really
• 37:42
  the best guy in Springfield and he trained with us on a regular
• 37:45
  Our basis. And he made sure we knew he was
• 37:47
  the best guy in Springfield if you understand what I'm saying.
• 37:50
  So, before I even was out of my spikes, one of my teammates out
• 37:56
  and maybe maybe as my teammates have convinced Houston to call
• 37:59
  with Gingka on his cell phone, hands me, the phone to leave
• 38:04
  him, a voicemail about who has the New School record.
• 38:07
  So you can you, you like to call pretend that I'm humble, but,
• 38:11
  you know, not awesome. Really always, you know, there
• 38:14
  was certainly Me. Go behind it.
• 38:16
  But it was primarily spite. I think that was just calling to
• 38:19
  remind him, or to make sure he heard it directly from me.
• 38:22
  That he no longer had that School record.
• 38:24
  That's also tell me you have the, you still have the school
• 38:27
  record. Well, it's easy to drop staff to
• 38:31
  them, but no one came up in the year or two after you and broke
• 38:34
  it. There were actually in Houston's
• 38:36
  last year and then Greg hip took over the program.
• 38:40
  There were some really talented kids on that team but before
• 38:43
  they could get to That level the program is cupped.
• 38:47
  I think there were some guys on that bike and then, you know,
• 38:49
  once you get your program, cut wherever you are in your career
• 38:52
  freshman sophomore, it's not me. So it doesn't happen at Missouri
• 38:56
  State obviously but then nobody really reach that level at their
• 38:59
  next stop because it just really takes your whole life.
• 39:02
  Throws it up in the air and and, you know, some guys try to
• 39:05
  continue others, just didn't work for him.
• 39:07
  But yeah. So I still have that record and
• 39:10
  then I went outdoors and had a be even bigger breakthrough,
• 39:14
  real. Lee went to Syria relays and
• 39:20
  first 1500 of the year. And actually I remember this one
• 39:21
  very clearly because early in the week I couldn't finish a
• 39:24
  workout for whatever reason. I just didn't hit it, didn't
• 39:27
  happen. I'm like man, I gotta I can put
• 39:31
  the spikes away for a couple days.
• 39:32
  Then we drove like Missouri, State, knock knock.
• 39:35
  Not a, not a cash cow for the sport of track and field.
• 39:38
  Obviously, so we're in Vans and actually I know, I was late to
• 39:42
  the van by 5 or 10 minutes and Probably Houston.
• 39:46
  Houston was not the kind of guy to lead to wait for someone if
• 39:49
  you hear what I'm saying. He to this day.
• 39:52
  I'm grateful that he didn't leave me and I think he's
• 39:54
  probably happy he didn't because we got there and I really didn't
• 39:57
  have an expectation that I have a good performance.
• 40:01
  So because I had missed what I felt like I missed the workout
• 40:06
  on Tuesday, the race was on whatever the days were Monday,
• 40:09
  Wednesday, Friday Tuesday, when Thursday, Saturday, but I missed
• 40:11
  the first one of the week. So I got there and I went and I
• 40:15
  ran to hundreds like the day before I was supposed to race,
• 40:18
  he with Houston's approval, but it was my idea because I'm like
• 40:21
  it. I feel like I'm going to be way
• 40:22
  too tapered and way to down. If I don't do some volume and
• 40:28
  intensity here, even though I'm racing tomorrow because I'm not
• 40:31
  going to do it after the race so much, I probably should have
• 40:34
  planned on that. But then I went from in the
• 40:37
  field was stacked, it was by far the best rates best competitors
• 40:40
  I've ever raced. Two guys including Gee Dan
• 40:44
  Wilson, who is just a force up four minute, mile or a really
• 40:47
  stud level athlete. But he and a teammate from zap
• 40:49
  business and run at World Championships in Cross Country
• 40:54
  six weeks earlier a month earlier.
• 40:56
  So I'm like this is my first chance my first time since I've
• 40:59
  had this breakthrough in like running at an elite level that I
• 41:02
  was going to get to run against world-class guys, or at least
• 41:05
  guys that are worn the Team USA Jersey and you know, Ryan Hayden
• 41:09
  from Villanova. Who's a K in got in, there was a
• 41:12
  good feel. And we went to the 1200 and I
• 41:16
  was kind of sitting in the packet like three flat and I
• 41:19
  just remember thinking like this is way too easy.
• 41:21
  I just took off and won by a lot and ran 342 and it entered the
• 41:26
  race with the pr that I'd set a PR.
• 41:29
  So is my second 1,500 year because in a debut, I'd ran 351
• 41:33
  or 352 two weeks prior a week prior.
• 41:37
  So a 10-second PR or more, maybe 11-second people.
• 41:41
  I mean, I know what a span of like eight days.
• 41:42
  I lowered the ER, maybe 11 seconds.
• 41:46
  So, right and then night that, I did that in Tennessee, was I
• 41:49
  guess. I do remember as a Friday night
• 41:51
  because that Friday night, it was the fastest time in the NCAA
• 41:55
  and the fastest time that year for America, that which is, I
• 42:00
  mean, it was early season April and 342 73 at that point in time
• 42:04
  in 2003. That's pretty good time.
• 42:06
  You know, pretty ended up. I think being the eighth fastest
• 42:09
  time in NCAA on the season, so you, but you made it to
• 42:12
  Nationals. Yeah, and the Nationals you
• 42:15
  really sick. Good job.
• 42:19
  We want to ask about that racist.
• 42:21
  Yeah, didn't make the finals. This ain't fun.
• 42:24
  What's it like? When you make the decision of,
• 42:26
  okay, I'm going to graduate from college, but I'm not gonna stop
• 42:29
  doing track. You know, a lot of those support
• 42:32
  goes away. When you go post-collegiate, you
• 42:35
  know, someone, when you're a college athlete, you know,
• 42:38
  someone's always set in your bus schedule, your training
• 42:41
  schedule, your Works, get, you know, everything is really
• 42:45
  regiment doing your entry fees, Etc.
• 42:47
  When you're post-collegiate, well, that all now falls on you.
• 42:51
  So what was it? Like, now trying to earn a
• 42:54
  living. Now running.
• 42:56
  And what else did you, did you get a part-time job that you go
• 42:59
  into coaching? What were you doing at the same
• 43:00
  time as post-collegiate running? Yeah, right.
• 43:03
  And so the the there was maybe a time where I consider myself a
• 43:07
  professional Runner but even then it was not because I made
• 43:13
  it. It was a professional wage.
• 43:16
  It was I just didn't have an odd job, but most of the time II
• 43:21
  would just consider myself a post-collegiate.
• 43:22
  You know, I can and I went into grad school and then was a ga in
• 43:26
  the academic Department, the academic Services office of our
• 43:31
  athletic department. So the achievement Center for
• 43:33
  Intercollegiate Athletics and I was an academic advisor and then
• 43:38
  pursued master's degree but then Houston left to return to his
• 43:42
  alma mater, Mississippi State, Eight that next year.
• 43:45
  So I was one year of grad school there when he left, I knew that
• 43:48
  my time in Springfield was done, but then I really miss August
• 43:52
  2004, and I'd missed the Olympic trials hadn't run especially
• 43:56
  well because of all the things you just identified.
• 43:58
  The first year is tough because as much as Houston showed me
• 44:02
  love and support and coaching and mentorship.
• 44:06
  It's not a job anymore. And, you know, he certainly
• 44:10
  poured into me more than I deserved and Very generously
• 44:14
  that he gave of his expertise and time and energy to help
• 44:18
  support my dream. But, you know, in the end it is
• 44:22
  like, I'm responsible for making sure I find to meet to get to
• 44:25
  that. I, that I am a nerd.
• 44:29
  Can get in, you know, all of those things.
• 44:30
  You kind of serves your own agent, your own, you know, I
• 44:33
  mean, I remember spending hours of like just trying to figure
• 44:36
  out, What, how am I getting massaged?
• 44:39
  What am I doing for a sprained, ankle.
• 44:41
  I don't have open access to the trainer of you do as a student
• 44:43
  athlete as a it's always a ga in the academic department but also
• 44:47
  volunteer coach. So I could be around the team
• 44:49
  and Coach help and that was as much just You know, so I think I
• 44:55
  probably got a pair of shoes, not that we had a surplus at
• 44:58
  Missouri State, but then could also train with the team and get
• 45:02
  ice and use the locker rooms like those very, very, very,
• 45:04
  very basic things that you have to have be in the whirlpool that
• 45:09
  kind of stuff. So after that, when Houston
• 45:14
  left, I floated a little bit and a good friend of mine, his dad
• 45:17
  called me up and said, hey, why don't you come be a teacher here
• 45:21
  and it's a long story, but that it at the department chair at
• 45:27
  this high school, he was a friend of mine, my good friend,
• 45:30
  but horny referenced here, then Clark Cafferty after I spoke
• 45:32
  with him he was the first one I told about the Hall of Fame, it
• 45:35
  was his dad who was a math teacher and a track coach and it
• 45:39
  kind of became a friend and mentor to me as an undergrad
• 45:43
  called me up and said hey the the department chair here at the
• 45:46
  high school where I retired from just passed away in this is
• 45:49
  Labor Day weekend, would you, would you come and help us
• 45:52
  finish the semester? Well, at that exact moment in
• 45:55
  time, I had planned to move to Canada for three months because
• 46:00
  one of my college buddies Calvin, Staples was up there
• 46:03
  training with the track club, same track club that Nate
• 46:07
  Brennan and, you know curse. Yeah, yeah.
• 46:12
  Some really good Canadians up in Kitchener-Waterloo.
• 46:15
  And then also, to already already been connected into the
• 46:17
  speed River, guys. So you know, read cool set and
• 46:24
  just the crew up there. So it's going to go just be an
• 46:26
  illegal immigrant in Canada and hang out for three months, and
• 46:29
  train. And just be up there for the
• 46:32
  fall until I figured out what I was going to do.
• 46:34
  Like my next training destination and spent some time,
• 46:36
  trying to decipher who my next coach would be like, what I
• 46:39
  would really do. And then instead of moving to
• 46:42
  Canada, I mean, I was literally packing my car.
• 46:43
  When I got to call, I moved to Kansas City and was a high
• 46:47
  school math teacher with my friend.
• 46:49
  Through the fall semester and then that gave me the
• 46:52
  opportunity to really look and figure out what the next step
• 46:55
  was for me. Who what I wanted to do in terms
• 46:58
  of how I wanted to answer the question.
• 46:59
  You asked me like how am I going to pay my bills?
• 47:02
  What I do outside or running I knew it wasn't full time
• 47:05
  teaching yet at that point, my life, even in the interview with
• 47:07
  that principle, I said I always looked at teaching is kind of my
• 47:10
  retirement job mean, tired, men from whatever dream I was trying
• 47:14
  to chase. Not, you know, this the silly,
• 47:17
  you know, Peter Pan stuff that I was And to do as an athlete to
• 47:21
  avoid growing up. I looked at like what I was
• 47:23
  ready to be a grown-up, hope settle down, I would be a high
• 47:26
  school teacher and coach and then I took that time and it
• 47:32
  talks with Greg Harder in the Indiana Invaders.
• 47:35
  And you know, that's just a name.
• 47:38
  I have not thought of her while. I got to know Greg a little bit
• 47:42
  through the Invaders guy that really was trying to push the
• 47:45
  envelope and do things differently and track and feel
• 47:47
  them. I'm glad you brought that name
• 47:48
  of me, I've not thought of Got a long time at school.
• 47:50
  Yeah, yeah. And then years later when I was
• 47:52
  in Indianapolis, we reconnected and he's still doing a lot of
• 47:55
  like youth cross country and help try to help the city.
• 47:57
  But yeah, so I was a name from the past there.
• 48:01
  Yeah. So I talked to I talked to him
• 48:04
  and it got a friend of mine that was guiding me to kind of help
• 48:06
  me. Identify options was more kamesh
• 48:10
  at the time. He was coaching at Southwest
• 48:13
  Baptist in ball of her misery. He now coaches, it University of
• 48:16
  Colorado, Colorado Springs. So, He was giving me some
• 48:20
  advice. And so I talk to Parker and the
• 48:22
  Invaders I reached out to Pete, re-adopt Fitness, but it just
• 48:28
  wasn't going to be a good fit in North Carolina basically because
• 48:31
  I wasn't good enough to really get any support and it was going
• 48:35
  to be an up road or uphill battle for me just to make it
• 48:38
  work. Not the Pete's not a great guy,
• 48:40
  just wasn't a good fit for them, probably more than me.
• 48:45
  And then it's, you know, talked to Corey almost at Iowa State as
• 48:48
  much because II knew of him. Had never actually interacted
• 48:52
  with him. Didn't know him?
• 48:53
  Personally, I knew of him, but it was home.
• 48:56
  I'm from Iowa and I was like, if I can move home and if it was
• 48:58
  going to work is 80 miles from where I grew up was that,
• 49:01
  wouldn't ya? And then I talked to Bob Raymond
• 49:04
  at Florida State, he had, you know, Andrew lemoncello, and Tom
• 49:08
  Lancashire were running for Bob, who both were ultimately
• 49:11
  Olympians in 08 and then, you know, really try to explore
• 49:15
  basically emailed anybody that had a professional group, or
• 49:18
  post-collegiate group, Like begging for them to consider me
• 49:21
  and of everybody, Corey animals, Greg, Horner and and Bob,
• 49:26
  Raymond, were the three that expressed the most interest or
• 49:29
  most. And they're probably interest is
• 49:31
  a strong word. Most willingness to tolerate me
• 49:34
  and their training group, willingness to help your right,
• 49:38
  yes? Right.
• 49:38
  Really this to support my fantasy of being an elite level
• 49:42
  afford to repay in Principle, as you put it like that.
• 49:45
  Yeah. So yeah, they were, there were
• 49:47
  willing to like, do that for me. And I remember it very clearly.
• 49:52
  I was home over Christmas maybe and I was like down to 42 State
• 49:59
  and volunteer coaching for Bob or volunteer coaching for Corey
• 50:04
  at Iowa State and I. But again, I knew I wanted to be
• 50:08
  in coaching, but I really wanted to run like I wanted to try and
• 50:11
  run and so that's where it was. Like they were willing to help
• 50:13
  support that fantasy while allowing me to train with the
• 50:16
  team and have access to the training room and do some of
• 50:19
  that. That because I was a volunteer
• 50:20
  coach, and I went for it, some he'll work, and I was out and it
• 50:25
  was like - 20 and brutal in Iowa and December.
• 50:29
  And I remember it was really, really cold.
• 50:31
  I remember the hill. And I remember like, thinking to
• 50:35
  myself, you know what, I'm going to call Bob Graham and I'm gonna
• 50:38
  go to Florida. They did not have that weather
• 50:40
  until I hastily right then. And there.
• 50:42
  That's right. That's right, that's right.
• 50:45
  And so I moved to, I moved to Florida, like the next month A
• 50:50
  week later. And and not because Corey wasn't
• 50:53
  great or that, I didn't have a love for Iowa, but Bob, Marley,
• 50:57
  Bob is energetic salesman, good, man.
• 51:00
  And he still is a good friend of mine and I moved down there and
• 51:06
  I'll take what I get to be close, friends of can Harden
• 51:09
  who's at Tennessee now. True.
• 51:10
  He, you know, I don't want to speak to personally for the what
• 51:15
  can't and I can share it with me but he let me stay at his house
• 51:19
  for months. I mean weeks turned into two
• 51:22
  months, probably while I try to figure out how the heck, I'm
• 51:25
  going to pay some rent and what I'm going to do, where am I
• 51:28
  going to live? How was I was not, I was not a
• 51:30
  professional Runner, I was not getting paid anything by anybody
• 51:33
  and I was trying to figure that out.
• 51:36
  Okay. So forever indebted to people
• 51:38
  like can but Ken especially because not only, we knew I was
• 51:42
  like sleeping every bed, every night by 9 and like getting up
• 51:46
  at 6:00 for multiple runs. Very serious about the
• 51:49
  nutrition. No drinking.
• 51:50
  You know, none of that ain't can lives a pretty disciplined life,
• 51:55
  too. And where we have a major
• 51:57
  intersection is an undying, love for track and field.
• 52:00
  So we would just sit around every night after dinner, you
• 52:05
  know, he loved me, just Make myself at home, literally, like,
• 52:07
  cook some dinner at his house, do whatever I'm doing, and we'd
• 52:10
  sit either at the dining table, earn his living room.
• 52:13
  And just if he wasn't recruiting Because that guy works where he,
• 52:16
  at least at that time, I don't know.
• 52:18
  I'm sure he and the team at Tennessee, still do it, but he
• 52:21
  was just on the ground. And I learned so much from just
• 52:27
  conversations that we're having right now with Kent and just how
• 52:30
  he went about building his training group, you know, Walter
• 52:32
  Dix was there at the time and like tremendous success SS and
• 52:37
  the relationship he had with other coaches on staff.
• 52:39
  You know, Dennis Noble Harless matters, the people that were
• 52:42
  there at the time, you know, certainly button already
• 52:45
  mentioned bomb just to be around them and see how they coach and
• 52:48
  see what they do. I left and then they won those
• 52:52
  three national titles in a row. And it's like, well then at Iowa
• 52:55
  State laws and Iowa State, everyone's like, you need to
• 52:56
  leave here to get out of here. We'll start with it.
• 53:01
  You know, I was kind of a joke but but, you know, and being
• 53:05
  around those guys Seen what they were doing and how they did just
• 53:09
  conducted themselves and conducted, the business of
• 53:13
  Florida state, track and field, but open my eyes and, you know,
• 53:16
  Bob Bremen hustles. You know, he certainly did then
• 53:19
  and I know he still does. I'm sure because it's in his
• 53:23
  DNA. It's not, it's not like it was
• 53:24
  something he was trying for the first time as a hustler.
• 53:28
  You know, it's a lot of like catching lightning in a bottle,
• 53:31
  they say of this, you know, when you have special times together,
• 53:35
  a lot of things have to come um together for that we talked
• 53:37
  about that with Harry Mara and past episodes about this this
• 53:41
  time with Ashton and his you know his at the time girlfriend
• 53:45
  and fiance breed now wife at organ with Harry, you know, it's
• 53:51
  just this real special time, same thing that time that you're
• 53:54
  talking about their Florida state with Bob and Harless and
• 53:58
  can etcetera, you know? They just had, they had a real
• 54:02
  special time. It's hard to keep that window
• 54:04
  open to be real honest to you, but they An extended time of a
• 54:07
  lot of championships and a lot of Records there.
• 54:10
  And I've got to know, Blake are Blake.
• 54:12
  I've gotten to know Bob over the past few years.
• 54:14
  Now, I've been doing some business.
• 54:16
  Choosing Gila buttocks down there that he is.
• 54:19
  He's a go-getter man. Let me tell you what his do not
• 54:22
  do not mistake that they are. Not right now, winning
• 54:26
  championships like they were back.
• 54:27
  Then don't mistake that for Bob for taking us foot, off the gas.
• 54:32
  Let me tell you, what, they will get back up there real soon.
• 54:35
  No, A doubt. Yeah he really what I learned
• 54:39
  from Bob. Probably more than anything but
• 54:43
  a lot of stuff. I mean for and he's just fine,
• 54:44
  he's a goofball. I mean at a he's motivated and a
• 54:47
  hustler, he's a goofball. But what I learned from him was
• 54:52
  how good coaches think like entrepreneurs, you know, you're
• 54:58
  always inventing. And and certainly talking about
• 55:01
  like training techniques, I don't need it.
• 55:04
  But I mean, that's, that's when you think of coaching.
• 55:06
  You go to the convert Coaches convention and you here, that's
• 55:09
  that's what most of those talks seem to be about.
• 55:12
  And people, you know, talk a lot about like their technical
• 55:16
  knowledge and how they're an expert on you know, body
• 55:19
  positions should angles. So on and on and on you hear all
• 55:21
  these catchphrases that that are very important Bob, I'm talking
• 55:25
  about hosting a meet and like us on t-shirts up the side to fund
• 55:28
  the program or something that isn't inside his budget and, you
• 55:31
  know, like doing doing things that are Innovative.
• 55:35
  I mean, when he started It at South Florida, like a cross
• 55:37
  state relay that, raise some money for some charity, raise
• 55:40
  some money for the program, raised awareness, just things
• 55:43
  that you don't think of when you are, you know, focusing on
• 55:46
  training and coaching and recruiting, which are all
• 55:49
  viable. But then that's always there for
• 55:52
  long enough to know. And I guess this is the best way
• 55:55
  to say it long enough to know that it wasn't the best fit for
• 55:58
  me. And just personally, I think
• 56:01
  there's there's something that everybody will find when you are
• 56:05
  on your own for the first. First time in life certainly I
• 56:08
  would not have made it six months.
• 56:09
  If it hadn't been for can Harden about Braman and their
• 56:12
  generosity Bob, very regularly taking me out to lunch and
• 56:16
  supporting me and connecting me to others in town and networking
• 56:19
  me a mean he offered some very generous things to me very
• 56:23
  personally that I'll never forget that I tried pay forward,
• 56:27
  you know, as best as I can. But then I knew it.
• 56:31
  You know, it's a first time when you're away from everybody
• 56:33
  you've ever known like I showed up in Tallahassee with Mike Car,
• 56:36
  full of my junk. You know, my things I thought
• 56:39
  were important books mostly and then my dog and that was it.
• 56:44
  I didn't know anybody else in all of Tallahassee and you're
• 56:46
  there and then you don't have any money and you're like trying
• 56:49
  to figure out how to take things to the next level.
• 56:53
  And I was the only person doing it, the way I was doing it and I
• 56:56
  trying to travel to those meats after the ACC championships.
• 56:59
  It's like I'm almost entirely on my own trying to figure that out
• 57:03
  and it was tough to go. And then I In have that ability
• 57:07
  to see friends family or others that I knew, you know.
• 57:09
  So at the end of that, I knew one thing is like alright called
• 57:13
  Cory, almost back. Hey man, would you would you
• 57:15
  still be interested like tolerating me in Ames and he's
• 57:21
  still to this day, a close friend and Mentor, someone that
• 57:26
  isn't the most outgoing person in the coaching world to like
• 57:29
  Network and build that. But to me, personally, he's
• 57:32
  invested countless hours and shared so much with me.
• 57:35
  And then then, you know, he's the reason why I had big
• 57:39
  breakthroughs as a post-collegiate because my first
• 57:41
  year with Houston as a g, a and then the next year of Florida
• 57:44
  State running for Bob, and with, with Tom and Andrew, and the
• 57:47
  crew, not just those guys meant, you know, and it's some of those
• 57:51
  guys that I got to know them. Chris McCann said that was at
• 57:54
  Florida State. Then he wrote he one of the the
• 57:58
  HotShots at Runner space now. So we stay in touch.
• 58:01
  I think I see him at US championships and everywhere all
• 58:03
  the time and so it's like we don't talk much R4 to State time
• 58:07
  together, but we're kind of maintained a friendship for 15
• 58:09
  years based on that. But then in Iowa state is really
• 58:12
  where I spent three years there and it felt at home, you know?
• 58:15
  And it was I came in at the exact time that that Cory and
• 58:20
  his previous volunteer meant Helbig, had brought in a really
• 58:23
  strong freshman class. So, you know, Kyle, you'll
• 58:27
  stands out as a guy who is fresh his freshman year.
• 58:30
  He was a US champion. And on the women's side, his
• 58:34
  girlfriend at the time. We said Cole, Well, it's like
• 58:37
  not great then, but me, and I remember, I'll tell you the
• 58:41
  story that where I knew, Lisa, Cole was just going to be
• 58:44
  absolutely ferocious. She was doing some drills at
• 58:48
  regionals her freshman year. Kyle, as a true freshman was
• 58:53
  second in the Midwest region, like an incredible performance
• 58:56
  by just a kid from Des Moines, Roosevelt to just go out and
• 58:59
  like finish second in the Midwest region, as a true
• 59:02
  freshman is like. Wow, that's what I knew.
• 59:04
  That kid had was something special.
• 59:06
  He had something I did not have but that same day Lisa, she
• 59:11
  sprained her ankle doing drills so much so that when I saw her
• 59:16
  like before the race, so much, so that afterwards she's having
• 59:19
  trouble getting her shoe. Off because it's like, swollen
• 59:22
  up overshoot, but she ran the race and finished all region as
• 59:26
  a true freshman, with basically a foot that she wasn't gonna be
• 59:30
  able to run on for a month. Because of, you know, you talked
• 59:33
  about the definition of tough and grit, that's it right there.
• 59:38
  Only those two, you know, lovering lovingly, but very
• 59:41
  competitively, brought it out of each other because they were
• 59:43
  both that same. She's from Fort Dodge, Iowa
• 59:46
  super great people. And I just watched it happen
• 59:48
  where like, you know, if he was upset, And after a race she knew
• 59:54
  she needed to do better to does. This just wonderful like growth
• 59:57
  that then all of a sudden by the time they graduated he's still
• 1:00:01
  on all-big 12 guy and a national level distance Runner.
• 1:00:04
  Well she's the Collegiate record holder.
• 1:00:06
  You know, she she turned into something even more special
• 1:00:10
  that's like you could have ever been projected.
• 1:00:12
  So to be around that my second year at Iowa State, the team,
• 1:00:16
  the men's team qualified for Nationals for the first time
• 1:00:19
  and, you know, 11 years Ears or something like that.
• 1:00:22
  So it was like this big big really success and growth to
• 1:00:25
  that program and it's a time I got to you know, certainly spend
• 1:00:29
  holidays with family but you know, be around and and once and
• 1:00:35
  so during that time, while is volunteer coaching for two years
• 1:00:38
  and then in the third year, I was full time recruiting
• 1:00:41
  coordinator and Coach, I was also an athlete and so training
• 1:00:45
  with the team, but then running the Drake Relays, you know, I
• 1:00:48
  went to Europe one of those seasons.
• 1:00:51
  Baby. Yeah.
• 1:00:52
  Well, I'm yeah, just got a chance to run and ran well
• 1:00:55
  enough, that's when I ran sub 4 and I had to finish Iowa State.
• 1:01:02
  And or yeah, that's honesty, right track?
• 1:01:05
  Yeah, it is. Yeah.
• 1:01:06
  And that was back when the NCAA strata Last Chance meat and it
• 1:01:11
  was like a week after I'd finished fourth at the u.s.
• 1:01:14
  indoor championships and I just knew I was so ready.
• 1:01:17
  Yeah. I mean the three guys that beat
• 1:01:19
  me their names at most people will know teaching, MADtv Camp
• 1:01:23
  one Crystal - Crystal and ski with second.
• 1:01:26
  Yeah, then third was Sean Graham, the coaches up Liberty
• 1:01:30
  now. And at the time at the time,
• 1:01:33
  he'd run. I think already drawn like, 1316
• 1:01:35
  or 1321. I mean, he was 1320 type guy and
• 1:01:39
  I was probably at the time, I was probably a Never run her 14
• 1:01:43
  flat maybe you know, so you get to compete at Drake as a elite
• 1:01:49
  Runner post-collegiate as well together.
• 1:01:52
  Did you win any drink titles? Or I want it, I want to college.
• 1:01:56
  I want to 2000 in the University 1500 race with the Drake flag
• 1:02:03
  but I love that tradition of just celebrating the win.
• 1:02:11
  And actually, In the fans to the track in that sense that, you
• 1:02:15
  know you get the high five and the pictures and stuff sides.
• 1:02:17
  That's just such an iconic portion of track and field.
• 1:02:21
  That's awesome. You did race one of your races,
• 1:02:25
  I believe, if I have my history of you correctly, you did lose
• 1:02:29
  two pretty famous runner. You were second maybe to some
• 1:02:33
  guy named Alan web. Yeah.
• 1:02:35
  To say that I lost to Alan would probably be an insult to him.
• 1:02:39
  Yeah. No.
• 1:02:40
  I was living up to that because I said law.
• 1:02:42
  Lost. What would you do in that race?
• 1:02:44
  He ran the fastest mile ever run in the month of April in the
• 1:02:50
  world. I'm pretty sure that's what he
• 1:02:52
  did, and I think it was something I'd have to look back.
• 1:02:57
  I should know it. I should know it because I'm the
• 1:02:59
  director of the meat now, and it's like this.
• 1:03:01
  It's one of the favorite memories that people remember
• 1:03:03
  because he was such a huge star. You, he had not yet set, the
• 1:03:07
  American record, he did later that summer of 347, the here in
• 1:03:12
  I would say 353. Maybe 350.
• 1:03:15
  Well, let me think he beat me by 11 seconds.
• 1:03:17
  I think and Irene 402. So maybe he ran 351, you know,
• 1:03:21
  like I said that's where it was just so hard to hear.
• 1:03:25
  You run 402 and a guy still beats You by 11 like holy cow,
• 1:03:30
  man, that's amazing, that's amazing.
• 1:03:32
  It was just one of those weird things because Brian Brown, the
• 1:03:34
  director at the time and set it up with Pacers, you know, Moises
• 1:03:37
  Joseph, who was a Haitian? That was a stud Runner like a
• 1:03:40
  probably, 145 146. Seven, 800, meter Runner, huge,
• 1:03:43
  big. When I was coaching Joseph was
• 1:03:46
  in high school and I'd go to the state meet in Florida for
• 1:03:49
  recruiting. And let me tell you what, when
• 1:03:51
  that kid ran, the fans were in it, there's a lot of cultural
• 1:03:55
  and the drums, and the bells and stuff like that.
• 1:03:59
  You knew when he was running because his family and support
• 1:04:02
  base was front and center, baby, it was awesome to watch him.
• 1:04:05
  He was a huge debt. Where did he go to?
• 1:04:08
  Did you go to University of Miami or to go to Florida?
• 1:04:11
  I would have said Florida, but could be My Enemy.
• 1:04:13
  I think it was from Miami area and then went to school in
• 1:04:17
  Gainesville. Yeah.
• 1:04:18
  Maybe that's what it was. And then at that point in time I
• 1:04:20
  think there were training together up by Virginia or in
• 1:04:23
  Virginia like kind of in Alan's Hometown, I think that's right.
• 1:04:28
  And I think that's what they were doing.
• 1:04:29
  But even if they were training together it was kind of his
• 1:04:32
  preferred rabbit. And so he took he took them
• 1:04:35
  through like 1,000 meters way faster than my PR was unsure
• 1:04:39
  like no doubt and and What way ahead of me in the trouble was
• 1:04:43
  from the very beginning, they were gone and then the trouble
• 1:04:47
  was even from the first 150 meters, there was nobody else
• 1:04:51
  that wanted to be in second like nobody else even wanted to run.
• 1:04:54
  Just the way the field kind of broke.
• 1:04:56
  So I found myself on him basically a 402 time trial.
• 1:05:01
  Why am I like an island there? Yeah.
• 1:05:04
  And nobody care because everybody was watching Allen and
• 1:05:07
  it was like kind of this weird anticlimax.
• 1:05:10
  I'm like, Well, how about up there?
• 1:05:12
  And I'm back here and you know, everybody has asked me to do
• 1:05:16
  since I moved back and I'm the director here.
• 1:05:18
  People have asked me for that story.
• 1:05:20
  It's always like, well, you know, hey, what was it like to
• 1:05:23
  race or, you know, it's race down web or what you remember
• 1:05:25
  that day, and I'm like everybody in the crowd.
• 1:05:27
  Got a much better view of the race than I did because I was
• 1:05:29
  still too far back. You're just sewing, that's
• 1:05:33
  funny. Well, let's move a little bit
• 1:05:35
  forward you. That was at Iowa State and then
• 1:05:38
  I believe. Did you go from Iowa State to
• 1:05:40
  UAB? Indirectly.
• 1:05:43
  So at the end of that 2008, I missed the Olympic trials for
• 1:05:46
  the second time, you know, it's just, this kind of like
• 1:05:50
  frustrating gut-wrenching like 28 years old, put a lot of time
• 1:05:54
  and energy into the coaching side of it.
• 1:05:58
  And and I was I kind of moved up to the not kind of a head moving
• 1:06:02
  up to the 5,000, which I probably should have done a lot
• 1:06:04
  earlier in my career and although I kind of had a sense
• 1:06:08
  that I was in that 1335 or 1340 shape, I only ran 13:46.
• 1:06:13
  And so, I missed the trials, but then I look down the list of the
• 1:06:16
  people that ran, and I love the people that qualified.
• 1:06:19
  I think, at that point in time in 2008, only Ryan Kirkpatrick
• 1:06:23
  had a full-time job. Like everyone else is like just
• 1:06:26
  running the most by and large there with one of those groups
• 1:06:29
  that already mentioned or they had a deal.
• 1:06:31
  And so they were in a situation that they weren't forced to like
• 1:06:35
  being an office for 40 hours or like work.
• 1:06:37
  And when I was in Iowa, State, Cory can tell your Travis Hartke
• 1:06:41
  huh? They're with me or any of the
• 1:06:43
  coaches John to God or Ronnie Williams Pete, Herbert any of
• 1:06:46
  those people I worked with there.
• 1:06:47
  It could tell you it was like I'm pretty competitive and I was
• 1:06:51
  all in like hours and hours and hour.
• 1:06:53
  And by the time I got to the end of 2008, I just as like, well,
• 1:06:56
  I'm really only going to have my shelf life as an athlete that
• 1:07:01
  Windows closing. And is this the job that I'm
• 1:07:04
  going to give this up for right now?
• 1:07:07
  So, I had a heart-to-heart with Corey and, you know, it's
• 1:07:11
  probably It damaged our friendship and roll professional
• 1:07:14
  relationship in the short term just because it's like man I'm
• 1:07:16
  leaving, you know, and not for another job like I'm just
• 1:07:20
  leaving to go be Peter Pan like the guy showed up here as and
• 1:07:25
  you know this kind of foolish I moved to Colorado Springs which
• 1:07:29
  is wonderful. I don't, I don't regret that
• 1:07:31
  coach, some high school got into some online coaching just to
• 1:07:34
  pay. Rent was living with friends.
• 1:07:36
  Tummy Neil and Nate Jenkins the three of us in a two-bedroom
• 1:07:41
  apartment. That probably was four or five
• 1:07:43
  hundred dollars a month total, you can cardboard for furniture
• 1:07:48
  and lawn chairs, like, cardboard of the blanket over was the
• 1:07:50
  table. I mean love.
• 1:07:52
  Yeah, that's what we did. Yeah, I really truly and just
• 1:07:56
  all in all three of us. Yeah, it was making any money.
• 1:08:01
  I had had a deal with Saucony but they dropped me after 2008.
• 1:08:07
  So I was kind of on my own trying to make this make this go
• 1:08:10
  Scott Simmons was Generous and coaching me not charging me.
• 1:08:13
  He was at Queen's in Charlotte and I would fly down for for
• 1:08:18
  altitude from altitude to sea level Stitch, and stay with
• 1:08:20
  Jeff, got it. And I trained with Michael
• 1:08:23
  crowd. She was just a stud athlete.
• 1:08:27
  Yeah, good, great. Great group of people there.
• 1:08:30
  But the way I dove into it is just there was there was only
• 1:08:35
  two possible outcomes, massive breakthrough and I feel like I
• 1:08:39
  was on the verge of that. Injury.
• 1:08:43
  I currently testing breakdown. Yes.
• 1:08:46
  Yeah. And I, I was on the cusp of the
• 1:08:50
  Breakthrough heart but I found the break down first.
• 1:08:56
  So then so then I knew I needed surgery.
• 1:09:00
  I'd been identified that I needed to repair an athletic
• 1:09:02
  balls are like a sports hernia and had to have an adductor
• 1:09:06
  release done, but I didn't have any money.
• 1:09:09
  No, health insurance, like broke, I mean, I've already
• 1:09:12
  gotten the picture like volunteerism cardboard, so Kurt
• 1:09:19
  Thomas, another ritual friend of ours called me up.
• 1:09:22
  And and I remember his 2009 and I was in Eugene for US
• 1:09:29
  championships for some reason, I was not running, but I was in
• 1:09:34
  there and I remember having to come phone conversation with
• 1:09:36
  Kurt about it and I was just very blunt up front.
• 1:09:40
  I like, I just don't think Birmingham, Alabama's, where I
• 1:09:42
  want to be, you know, like, I already tried Tallahassee.
• 1:09:45
  I knew that it was like far enough from home.
• 1:09:48
  I wasn't going to be home but then I actually did some
• 1:09:51
  research on it, it's like wow, my place could be pretty good.
• 1:09:54
  Great, thank you, cool City love, I still love, not just
• 1:09:57
  visiting but I'm not. I owned a home there.
• 1:10:00
  I mean I got there. What I did that homework enough
• 1:10:02
  to realize like you could be pretty good but there's some
• 1:10:05
  good opportunity for a Stanfield.
• 1:10:07
  The my predecessor there and won some Conference USA titles and
• 1:10:11
  you start looking at it go. This is, you know, while I was
• 1:10:15
  there we had one season where we had three three different
• 1:10:18
  women's teams. Maybe was four different,
• 1:10:20
  women's teams, all ranked in the top 25 in the country.
• 1:10:22
  It was, you know, rice SMU, Tulsa were all really good.
• 1:10:28
  I was there and we were pretty good, you know, we've been at,
• 1:10:31
  you know, the women there that did a great job, Kurt great guy,
• 1:10:35
  but still close friends with him and he gave me the autonomy to
• 1:10:38
  do what I wanted to coach the way I wanted to go to the meats
• 1:10:41
  on wanted. So we really it was a special
• 1:10:42
  time and you know sorry always going to give a shout out.
• 1:10:46
  Shout out to Kurt Thomas. He was one of the First podcast
• 1:10:50
  episodes. We had here is one of my first
• 1:10:51
  guinea pigs. I think he was episode number
• 1:10:54
  six. I got to go check him out and
• 1:10:56
  you'll know more about curtain eyes story of how he.
• 1:10:59
  And I know each other from Mississippi State days long time
• 1:11:03
  ago which I was going to ask you.
• 1:11:05
  So how did how did Kurt know you is that through Houston as well
• 1:11:08
  we met at Houston's wedding when Houston and Megan got married we
• 1:11:12
  were there hung out and I think that maybe when I first met Jill
• 1:11:17
  and so Joe Joe and Kurt, you know, Kurt's now wife.
• 1:11:20
  And they're just cool people, really great.
• 1:11:24
  And yeah, and I think she was hopeful that Kurt would find
• 1:11:28
  some friends. Kurt probably got my name again,
• 1:11:52
  kind of came to the front of his mind but he probably just ask
• 1:11:54
  Houston. Hey who would you, who would you
• 1:11:56
  call? And he's like well I don't
• 1:11:58
  Blake's are unemployed, it takes place, not doing anything.
• 1:12:02
  Call him. Let's keep moving forward here.
• 1:12:06
  We're starting on borrowed time here a little bit because yeah,
• 1:12:09
  I'm sorry. But, you know, it's all good.
• 1:12:11
  These are great stories and, you know, very much like I still
• 1:12:15
  have a part to In one day with cave at over, we only got an
• 1:12:19
  hour when I first did cave on the podcast a few months ago,
• 1:12:24
  this may be something we do with you as well.
• 1:12:26
  Because I don't want to rush the story and these stories because
• 1:12:30
  they are fascinating and that's exactly what we want to bring
• 1:12:34
  with the Gila FedEx, connections, podcast is the
• 1:12:36
  stores. We want to be able to capture
• 1:12:37
  and kind of archive, these things.
• 1:12:39
  So that they kind of live in posterity, if you will.
• 1:12:42
  So love where we're going with this Direction with the with
• 1:12:46
  your story and your time. I'm here.
• 1:12:48
  So obviously you are you a be for a couple of years and did
• 1:12:52
  real well and you're right that comfort for their conference is
• 1:12:54
  tough and it was tough back then as well with Steve goalies.
• 1:12:58
  Teams are at Ulta, it's really actually quite amazing.
• 1:13:01
  Did you go from there to pin? Yep.
• 1:13:04
  Yeah. And when you went to pin up in
• 1:13:06
  the ivy league, did you go there to because you work with the
• 1:13:10
  Penn relays and coaching? Correct.
• 1:13:13
  Did you go there for one? Or the other or how did that
• 1:13:15
  work out? Yeah.
• 1:13:15
  Just just coaching but then what You know, pain and we're getting
• 1:13:21
  back to that point a little bit more Drake.
• 1:13:23
  But certainly when Brian and Natasha the head coach is
• 1:13:27
  married to the director of the Drake Relays here at Drake, the
• 1:13:30
  track staff worked very closely with the Drake Relays staff and
• 1:13:33
  it pain, it wasn't that level of closeness.
• 1:13:35
  Nobody was married to Dave Johnson, obviously, but Dave
• 1:13:40
  empowered us to to be involved. And then also did have key roles
• 1:13:44
  that he did Count On Track staff to help out with us.
• 1:13:48
  Tony Tony. See, the longtime throws coach
• 1:13:50
  was involved heavily down to the throwing area in part because
• 1:13:53
  they're that throws venue is outside of the stadium.
• 1:13:56
  So they can't be two places at the same time and then I got the
• 1:14:02
  Glamorous job of being in charge of hurdle crew for a couple
• 1:14:05
  years. So you know just fun because I
• 1:14:08
  love track and I don't mind work and it's like finding kids on
• 1:14:11
  the team that want to have credentials to be right down the
• 1:14:14
  infield during during the USA versus the world.
• 1:14:17
  Old. Yes, you I'll let you come down
• 1:14:19
  there with me and have the credential then, but you're
• 1:14:21
  gonna have to be there Friday from 8 a.m. to 10 a.m. while
• 1:14:24
  we're doing the high school foreigners or whatever, you
• 1:14:27
  know, like all of the, the root Charles hurdles and all this.
• 1:14:30
  And so, I had that job. And then the job of identifying
• 1:14:37
  like, when, and how that used to be, where they had that rail
• 1:14:39
  down the middle between length, four and five down the back
• 1:14:42
  stretch. When you have the blades one
• 1:14:44
  through four, move out to five and then Lanes.
• 1:14:46
  Five through eight. Down to five.
• 1:14:49
  So you kind of have a dual merge, there's a rail that you
• 1:14:52
  have to have for ratification purposes and sanctioning
• 1:14:56
  purposes. Well, that Grail was mobile so
• 1:14:59
  that as soon as that athletes went by, we put it down.
• 1:15:03
  So it's like that little do on stuff, you have somebody that
• 1:15:05
  pays attention and that you can count on.
• 1:15:08
  So, I just did some of that stuff.
• 1:15:09
  And then in my second year, I got to help assemble or I did
• 1:15:13
  assemble the field for the invite mile, which is my first
• 1:15:15
  time of, like, kind of doing the elite athlete or kind of on that
• 1:15:18
  side of it. It's so, you know, I got, I got
• 1:15:22
  to wear a blue hat, which that's where I kind of learned that the
• 1:15:25
  structure, the hierarchy of officials at Penn fascinating.
• 1:15:29
  It's something I've kind of replicated and duplicated or
• 1:15:34
  ripoff, and copy it. Place the brake a little bit.
• 1:15:37
  So that then, you know, your entry level officials at 10:00,
• 1:15:40
  they would all wear red hats. Well, you got updated to a blue
• 1:15:43
  hat. Difficu reported to you.
• 1:15:45
  So I got to wear a blue hat. It's a pain relase, you know,
• 1:15:48
  You're one red hat, your 2 blue hat, got together.
• 1:15:51
  There was a secret society to hat-wearing at Penn.
• 1:15:55
  Interesting, you wouldn't school and reason actually what I saw
• 1:15:58
  what I learned there is that hierarchy allows you don't even
• 1:16:01
  need to know people's names, you can walk up, you don't have to
• 1:16:04
  know them in person prior to that day but if you walk up to
• 1:16:08
  the long jump you don't ask a red hat.
• 1:16:11
  A question. Go to a blue hat because they're
• 1:16:13
  running the crew and you don't even need know who that is.
• 1:16:16
  You don't have to ask for hey who's run?
• 1:16:17
  Who do I need to know about x? What flight are you on, you
• 1:16:20
  know? Like so it's it builds an event
• 1:16:24
  to event or area to area. Familiarity that you just kind
• 1:16:27
  of know who's running the area to get the question.
• 1:16:29
  You need answered help speed up communication and therefore
• 1:16:32
  speeds up the event, which leads every help it can get because
• 1:16:35
  it's just so big. That that kind of goes with My
• 1:16:37
  Philosophy that I think everybody should wear name tags
• 1:16:40
  in this world. It would just help it
• 1:16:42
  automatically. Just walk up to a stranger like
• 1:16:44
  oh hey Bob. Yeah, that's interesting.
• 1:16:47
  So, How did the transition from pin to Indianapolis occurred?
• 1:16:53
  And the reason I ask is because it Hindi, you were the, I don't
• 1:16:59
  know what the official title was.
• 1:17:00
  Imma call IT director, but either director of the
• 1:17:01
  Indianapolis Monumental Marathon.
• 1:17:04
  That's a much more business type job inside of our world of track
• 1:17:10
  and field versus like a coaching.
• 1:17:12
  You know it's strictly but you weren't coaching when you're an
• 1:17:14
  Indianapolis as you were in pain.
• 1:17:16
  What made that? Transition.
• 1:17:18
  Why was that interesting to you to get out of coaching in that
• 1:17:20
  respect? Well, so in part, the
• 1:17:23
  circumstances that change we have certain the circumstance
• 1:17:26
  depend change. Very quickly from the time I
• 1:17:28
  arrived to a year later. In fact.
• 1:17:32
  So my first, I think is probably six months.
• 1:17:34
  I was hired by three, people are senior woman administrator,
• 1:17:37
  married to stay in a slow William Roth, who was associate
• 1:17:41
  athletic director in charge of development, but had been a
• 1:17:45
  track coach, he coached at Virginia At Tulane.
• 1:17:49
  So he knew track and he was a smart guy and he helped raise a
• 1:17:52
  lot of money. And they were transitioning
• 1:17:54
  Sports supervision from married to William.
• 1:17:57
  And, and then also Charlie Powell, who had been a longtime
• 1:18:00
  coach within three months or semen in six months of my
• 1:18:04
  arrival or maybe eight months, I don't know the exact timeline
• 1:18:07
  but within my first year, for sure, Charlie left to go take on
• 1:18:12
  the challenge of spire Mary left for a huge opportunity.
• 1:18:17
  Marquette and was in Wisconsin, and William Roth left to become
• 1:18:23
  the head ad at Oberlin, which were Vin had a stop, you know.
• 1:18:26
  So, three people three people that brought me in and had
• 1:18:30
  promised his kind of New Vision with me at the center of it
• 1:18:35
  because pain at that point or that still now is the oldest
• 1:18:39
  division one track and field program in the country.
• 1:18:41
  You know, Collegiate track and field in the United States
• 1:18:44
  started with a dual meet between NYU and pain and it's like,
• 1:18:47
  That's College Prof. Not just the Drake they're not
• 1:18:50
  just a Penn relays that are the oldest Eagle large Meat like
• 1:18:53
  that and so it's like at the core of this history.
• 1:18:56
  Well the ad and women's track and field later in the game and
• 1:19:01
  until I was there men and women track and field had never had
• 1:19:07
  well, maybe the best way to say it is the head coaches are
• 1:19:09
  always been separate positions. There's never been a unified
• 1:19:11
  program so that was the intention of me going there.
• 1:19:14
  So my first year I went from an assistant coach Coach for both
• 1:19:18
  the men and the women to being the head tracker.
• 1:19:20
  Head cross country, coach for both men and women.
• 1:19:23
  So as a big step and then I have my own admission spots and some
• 1:19:29
  portion of my side, then I was reporting to Administration and
• 1:19:32
  then it was intended that then, you know, both Gwen and Charlie
• 1:19:36
  Gwen Harrison Charlie Powell that they were not in their
• 1:19:39
  early days of their career, that as they both transitioned on on
• 1:19:43
  that, my role would be elevated to something more juror.
• 1:19:46
  That would be like, what? What Dolan is in that Steve
• 1:19:49
  going has done a warm wonderful job and truly be right person.
• 1:19:53
  But then with all of that transition, with Charlie
• 1:19:56
  leaving, Mary leaving William Roth leaving the entire Vision
• 1:20:01
  changed as a department and to be very Frank, I got there and
• 1:20:05
  did a wonderful job of changing culture and I really stay true
• 1:20:08
  to that and poured myself into that time and the athletes and
• 1:20:12
  in recruiting But we weren't very good, you know, no fault of
• 1:20:16
  the athletes. No 5.
• 1:20:17
  And and I don't think there was much or more I could have done
• 1:20:20
  to change it both on the men and women side but I was the head
• 1:20:23
  coach for the men and women at the University of Pennsylvania.
• 1:20:26
  We were eight in the ivy league out of eight teams on both sides
• 1:20:30
  like so they were not in a situation that when Charlie
• 1:20:34
  left, you know, Gwen was leaving that and then, Mary and William
• 1:20:40
  who had both. I'd helped identify me and bring
• 1:20:42
  me in, for the Meaning, they were not in a situation that
• 1:20:46
  they were in a position to name me, interim, director or
• 1:20:49
  anything. It was just like, hey,
• 1:20:52
  concurrent really a friend of mine who had been asking me for
• 1:20:57
  18 months to consider this job. In Indianapolis.
• 1:21:02
  His name is John little terrific, passionate supporter
• 1:21:06
  of track and field, I got to know him.
• 1:21:08
  We met at us championship and we were both running post,
• 1:21:10
  collegiately and New York. He had qualified for Olympic
• 1:21:14
  Marathon trials and in New York. So the 2007 USA championships.
• 1:21:19
  We hit it off and then had, and we ran for the same club for a
• 1:21:22
  while. Kansas City smoke.
• 1:21:24
  So this sustained relationship and friendship and do what I
• 1:21:28
  used to go. Run meets in Indianapolis.
• 1:21:29
  I would say with his family that I don't have money for a hotel,
• 1:21:32
  and they were always very generous.
• 1:21:33
  So I brought to be close with John and they were looking for
• 1:21:36
  an executive director for this new event and that they the
• 1:21:40
  first time he hired anyone, he called me up and asked if I'd be
• 1:21:43
  interested. Stood and I was like, you know
• 1:21:45
  what, it's I'm a pain, this is where I'm at.
• 1:21:48
  Well, then my predecessor in Indianapolis left after some
• 1:21:51
  short number of months, six months or a year and then they
• 1:21:56
  were having a hard time finding the right replacement so that
• 1:21:58
  position has been vacant for some number of months while this
• 1:22:02
  less than ideal. Transition was taking place in
• 1:22:04
  Pennsylvania and Philadelphia. So he kept pursuing it.
• 1:22:08
  And what I later found out was he went to the rest of the
• 1:22:11
  board. He was on the board of directors
• 1:22:12
  of the, you know. Funny little marathon and said,
• 1:22:15
  Hey, listen, and they needed a new board president, so they
• 1:22:19
  need a new leadership. Even on the board of directors
• 1:22:21
  side, he went to the rest of the board and said, Hey, listen.
• 1:22:23
  If you hire Blake, Bolden, I'll be the president of the board.
• 1:22:27
  So like, he went over above. Put his name on me, what he did
• 1:22:30
  tell them was I had never done marketing, I never done
• 1:22:34
  nonprofit leadership. I've never sold sponsorships.
• 1:22:37
  I had, you know, never done anything outside of college
• 1:22:41
  coaching or just running myself. He just knew I love this.
• 1:22:43
  Port and he believed in me and he put his name on, it took a
• 1:22:46
  huge chance and gave me an opportunity.
• 1:22:48
  So I went after it and you know, name some conditions that I
• 1:22:53
  didn't feel like they would me saying I had an assistant and
• 1:22:56
  Indian out there in Pennsylvania and said, hey if I depend he's
• 1:23:01
  not he what is he gonna do? He's a volunteer coach for me,
• 1:23:04
  he moved here. He'd been the coach at Dakota
• 1:23:06
  Wesleyan in South Dakota and had come to Philadelphia from
• 1:23:11
  Mitchell South Dakota. Casey Collins wonderful man and
• 1:23:15
  I didn't know what his job would be.
• 1:23:18
  But I said, I'll only come if I can hire him as the second
• 1:23:22
  employee and even know what the job was.
• 1:23:23
  But I knew he would do it. Were you trying not to get
• 1:23:25
  hired. I didn't necessarily want to
• 1:23:29
  leave College coaching, and I felt good about even though it
• 1:23:31
  was Bustin certain where I was at pan, I was like, what's the
• 1:23:36
  pain? It's still all of that and I
• 1:23:38
  just want a lot of time and energy into it, but then when
• 1:23:41
  John and the board of directors in the gap, Oh said, yeah, we'll
• 1:23:44
  meet your meat. All of the financial terms
• 1:23:47
  Loops, which are higher this. Let's go shows how desperate
• 1:23:52
  they were, I guess, you know, because it was June, I started
• 1:23:57
  June 18th and we were way behind and the event was November, we
• 1:24:01
  had your 20% behind year-over-year on registration
• 1:24:05
  numbers. Some sponsorship stuff was left
• 1:24:09
  pending we hadn't ordered some metals you No, it was just it
• 1:24:14
  was time and they needed somebody to come in and just
• 1:24:16
  pour themselves into it. And I had no idea what I was
• 1:24:19
  doing. No clue, but it was the best way
• 1:24:23
  to learn. Now, you learn on the job
• 1:24:25
  really. Well, because you took that
• 1:24:28
  Marathon series and it was a series, right?
• 1:24:30
  Like you guys did a 5k 10K and team.
• 1:24:33
  You are thought you added that. Yeah, so when I got there was a
• 1:24:37
  5k half marathon and Marathon the first Saturday in November
• 1:24:42
  Within two years, we created a Monumental mile which is in
• 1:24:45
  June. Then we at we merged with and
• 1:24:49
  acquired the Indianapolis Marathon which we were never
• 1:24:52
  direct competitors. But The name, the brand
• 1:24:56
  confusion can't really have two marathons.
• 1:24:58
  You know, we've talked about it, a bunch over the years.
• 1:25:00
  So that was a natural move. So I learned mergers and
• 1:25:02
  Acquisitions. Learn marketing.
• 1:25:04
  You know, we grew from the 60th largest marathon in the u.s. in
• 1:25:08
  2011 or 12. But by the time I left four and
• 1:25:12
  a half years later to be a number 15.
• 1:25:14
  So really, what kind of numbers does that translate to from 60th
• 1:25:18
  largest to almost top 10. Yeah, in terms of and that's
• 1:25:23
  only by Marathon finishers. Hers was probably from a couple
• 1:25:26
  thousand to five or six thousand.
• 1:25:28
  So pretty pretty significant growth.
• 1:25:30
  I mean, you you working in business and, you know, like our
• 1:25:34
  annual revenue. My first year was lost answer,
• 1:25:39
  just around. 600,000 my final year, we were projecting for the
• 1:25:43
  next budget year, 2.1 million. So we had done a lot of growth.
• 1:25:49
  New events, big significant, you know, signed a title sponsor CNO
• 1:25:53
  Financial Group there in India. Plus which, you know, you kind
• 1:25:58
  of talk I talked earlier about Bob Raymond and his
• 1:26:00
  entrepreneurial Spirit, but to learn sponsorship sales, well
• 1:26:04
  enough, to get a company to come on and use a non consumer-facing
• 1:26:09
  brand in the title sponsorship, it was, it was a big success for
• 1:26:15
  us. And it was a really, a
• 1:26:16
  Monumental. It was Monumental teach you to
• 1:26:21
  learn to how to use these words a little better.
• 1:26:23
  These breakthrough to Breakdown. And now that what you did was
• 1:26:26
  not invented, it was good. That's how many, how many years
• 1:26:30
  were you there from June of 2012 until November of 16?
• 1:26:36
  So, four and a half for half going a push in five years and
• 1:26:40
  again, learning on the job. So, you learned everything from
• 1:26:43
  the marketing side to Promotions to how to order and design
• 1:26:49
  Metals. All you mean everything from the
• 1:26:51
  nuts and bolts all the way to urges and Acquisitions taken to
• 1:26:55
  Successful marathons and bringing them together in
• 1:26:58
  running that as a series as well.
• 1:27:01
  So what at that point you were again, you said you were top 15
• 1:27:06
  for marathon in the country and there's a lot of marathons out
• 1:27:10
  there, that's no small feat, but then something special opened up
• 1:27:16
  our friend mr. Brian.
• 1:27:18
  Brown left, the Drake Relays to go to the University of
• 1:27:22
  Missouri. Which means Jake needed a
• 1:27:25
  director of Drake Relays what was that?
• 1:27:29
  Like, I know we've you and I have talked a lot in the past.
• 1:27:33
  This was a dream job scenario for you.
• 1:27:37
  Right? What was it like when you first
• 1:27:39
  heard the news that the opportunity was available that
• 1:27:42
  Brian had had left. Yeah, so I, you know, I know,
• 1:27:45
  I've taken more time than we had discussed, but it's a long story
• 1:27:49
  because years, prior two years prior when I was really enjoying
• 1:27:53
  a success Indianapolis. It allowed me to find other
• 1:27:55
  passions like not to say I was particularly good at it but I
• 1:27:59
  got in that time Lonnie Green and Purdue gave me the chance to
• 1:28:02
  get into a public address announcing and really found that
• 1:28:06
  I got to just if I did a fall Marathon, I got to just hang
• 1:28:09
  around the track a little bit and be a track meet and do fun
• 1:28:12
  things in the sport. And and so I was really feeling
• 1:28:16
  at home there and so are already referenced.
• 1:28:19
  Cory animals, friend, Mentor, someone who I've stayed in touch
• 1:28:22
  with over the years and he still does a lot for me in terms.
• 1:28:24
  Terms of offering advice and counsel we were just catching
• 1:28:28
  up. He was in Indianapolis, staying
• 1:28:31
  up by the airport because he had brought some athletes from Boise
• 1:28:34
  State to race high-performance meet in a tie, you down in
• 1:28:39
  Bloomington. So, great, great chance for us
• 1:28:42
  to get some dinner, a beer, catch up.
• 1:28:45
  We were just hanging out and he said, you know what you going to
• 1:28:47
  do? Is this, is this what you want
• 1:28:49
  to do? Yeah, you know that this is, you
• 1:28:52
  know, the home had Can really grounded myself was on the board
• 1:28:56
  of my neighborhood association like felt home in Indianapolis
• 1:29:00
  and and with usatf in Indy CA in Indy.
• 1:29:05
  It's like well I don't know where else I'd ordered want to
• 1:29:07
  live to feel connected at the highest level to support Ian's
• 1:29:13
  in Indianapolis. We went from one employee
• 1:29:16
  working from home to a staff of six working in the heart of
• 1:29:19
  downtown. We found his office space and
• 1:29:22
  how did I hire those people other my friends?
• 1:29:24
  I just gotta when do you ever get to just hire people that you
• 1:29:27
  know, and trust and know to their core?
• 1:29:30
  Someone that you don't even know what necessarily the job is
• 1:29:32
  going to be but, you know, they're a good person and, you
• 1:29:34
  know, they're going to be really great and then you move the
• 1:29:36
  teeth. Yes, it's so much fun and truly
• 1:29:40
  like, we actually the whole, the group of the four core people
• 1:29:43
  that really started like that kind of team.
• 1:29:45
  We had a zoom the other day. During that time, my life every
• 1:29:49
  day. I would walk in, I'm not, I like
• 1:29:51
  to work late, like, I'll start at 9:30, and then go to 70.
• 1:29:54
  So, by the time I would get there as the executive director,
• 1:29:57
  the host, the other three staff, people are already in the office
• 1:29:59
  working and so I would just walk in every day and like try and
• 1:30:03
  scare them or just goof around like have fun like it, Michael
• 1:30:06
  Scott, bad boss kind of stuff. But every day I would say you
• 1:30:09
  know, slap a desk and say like best team in the marathon
• 1:30:12
  business and that's how we would start every single day at 9:30.
• 1:30:17
  Whatever. Whatever was, maybe it was.
• 1:30:18
  Ten. Mike, why do you care?
• 1:30:21
  Just wanted to make sure that was the right time. 30-day.
• 1:30:25
  Okay, so that that, that was the spirit of what we were doing and
• 1:30:30
  we, you know, we still joke around like best team in the
• 1:30:32
  marathon business even though we don't work together anymore
• 1:30:36
  because it kind of spoke, it was the culture we were creating and
• 1:30:38
  we were all just all mine and you know, it's really fun and
• 1:30:40
  then so Corey asked me, what are you gonna do?
• 1:30:42
  Is just sit for you and like, maybe, you know, there's two
• 1:30:45
  jobs that I would consider like, a similar role to what I have at
• 1:30:50
  Chicago marathon because I really admire carry pankowski.
• 1:30:52
  My knee she made it's a world map.
• 1:30:54
  I'm a German. Come on, it's amazing.
• 1:30:56
  I don't know if I have that same passion for that.
• 1:30:58
  Now, I mean, just seeing those guys, and Chicago is a big city
• 1:31:03
  and it's a lot, but the other opportunity is director of the
• 1:31:07
  Drake. Relays if Brian Brown were to
• 1:31:09
  ever have left, I was like, man. That's the thing that I would
• 1:31:12
  really be interested in finding out more like really see myself
• 1:31:15
  and be the one chance I could get to move home.
• 1:31:17
  You know, I already mentioned my mom's 72, she lives here and
• 1:31:21
  it's like chance to all my family lives here, you know, so
• 1:31:24
  chance Be back. Well, then fast forward, your to
• 1:31:28
  go by, and I'm sitting at dinner with, you know, with my
• 1:31:32
  girlfriend at the time and we're just enjoying having a
• 1:31:34
  conversation and I get a text. It says your job is about to
• 1:31:38
  open up and I'm like, what is he heard something from the board
• 1:31:42
  of directors have been fired? What do you mean?
• 1:31:47
  He's like, well tomorrow and I don't know how he knew, but you
• 1:31:50
  know, sometimes he's coaching jobs.
• 1:31:52
  Like I think it was widely known and I just wasn't All I just
• 1:31:55
  wasn't even into with anything in college coaching round of the
• 1:31:58
  NCAA essential. Yeah, and what, except for the
• 1:32:01
  people of Lonnie Green, who'd call me to announce attract me
• 1:32:04
  kick. You know, if you if you know
• 1:32:05
  what I went down and Steve Keith Vanderbilt I got to announce you
• 1:32:10
  know, and you know and I some other not just at Purdue but
• 1:32:13
  some other people in brought me down and I got a chance to learn
• 1:32:15
  and do that. So anyway, well, I didn't sleep
• 1:32:20
  that night because I spent the rest of the night writing a
• 1:32:23
  cover letter, updating our in touch.
• 1:32:24
  My resume in four years you know so updated resume right the
• 1:32:28
  cover letter like then brainstorm like neurotically,
• 1:32:32
  every single person that I might reach out to that would call the
• 1:32:36
  FBI director of Drake, on my behalf, including my Cunningham,
• 1:32:40
  including actually the then lieutenant governor of the state
• 1:32:44
  of Iowa who I knew. Had a relationship with Drake.
• 1:32:48
  She's from, she's from my hometown like we went to church
• 1:32:50
  together all the time growing up.
• 1:32:52
  So she's now a governor, I I texted her.
• 1:32:55
  Hey Kim. Would you would you mind being a
• 1:32:58
  reference for me? She's like, yeah, what can I do?
• 1:32:59
  What would you call on my behalf?
• 1:33:01
  So I can be that's how committed I was like if I knew somebody
• 1:33:04
  that had a connection to Drake because I wanted it and it was
• 1:33:09
  the thing that I want favors every favor I had I called them
• 1:33:13
  in to put myself in a position to interview.
• 1:33:15
  Well, I tell you what, Blake this story that we're getting
• 1:33:20
  into here is really special for you, of course.
• 1:33:24
  Yes, but also for me you did involve me in the process which
• 1:33:28
  I'm so grateful for. And it also then leads to your
• 1:33:32
  leadership over the past. Is this year for that for Drake?
• 1:33:36
  Relays director? Yes.
• 1:33:38
  Yep. So for years and obviously this
• 1:33:41
  year was different than most years and you guys did some
• 1:33:45
  really cool Innovative interesting creative things this
• 1:33:49
  year. And of course, there's going to
• 1:33:51
  be Drake Relays next year and the next year, next year, next
• 1:33:54
  year I want to make sure that we honor that and give it enough
• 1:33:58
  time. So I'm actually going to we're
• 1:34:00
  going to pause here. I know you've got, you know,
• 1:34:03
  you're big time. Drake Relays work, right?
• 1:34:05
  We already got other meetings lined up.
• 1:34:08
  So I want to respect that but I do want to make sure that we
• 1:34:11
  give the time necessary to talk about this passion of Drake.
• 1:34:16
  Relays begin to say, it's special for both of us because I
• 1:34:21
  do I giving you some stories. I have a Big part of my heart
• 1:34:25
  for Drake. Relays I, when the 100th
• 1:34:27
  anniversary went down, it was it 11 years ago?
• 1:34:29
  Now, is this supposed to be? Yeah.
• 1:34:31
  Yeah. As the equipment vendor and
• 1:34:34
  sponsor for the Drake Relays, I had a couple of extra.
• 1:34:38
  We do the bibs every year, I had a couple extra of the 100 bib
• 1:34:42
  done up, and then had them framed in a kind of an artsy
• 1:34:45
  thing and it's so, you know, I think everybody, a guild knows
• 1:34:50
  this. So obviously I gave one to Drake
• 1:34:52
  relays. It should be somewhere in your
• 1:34:53
  office. It's in my office.
• 1:34:55
  Yeah, good good, good. The other one is that guilt on
• 1:34:58
  our wall there and then I had an extra one made up for me, it's
• 1:35:01
  actually yeah, basements. But my wife created, she put
• 1:35:06
  three things up in our basement to kind of symbolize my life.
• 1:35:11
  The first one is a Troy state emblem head that she cross
• 1:35:15
  stitch because that's huge to my life.
• 1:35:18
  The middle frame is the poker chips for when I play poker and
• 1:35:23
  things like that. That's a big.
• 1:35:24
  Big part of my life. And then to represent track and
• 1:35:27
  field. In general, the third frame is
• 1:35:30
  the Drake 100 frame. So in our house yeah.
• 1:35:34
  It's a big deal for a guy who didn't grow up in Iowa,
• 1:35:38
  certainly didn't run and I will but did get to coach at the
• 1:35:42
  Drake Relays and then have done some great USA championships and
• 1:35:46
  instead of Live Events and of course the great Drake Relays of
• 1:35:50
  year. It is special to me.
• 1:35:51
  So we're going to pause only if you will agree to come back.
• 1:35:54
  One day and let's do a part 2 and pick up right here about how
• 1:35:58
  you got to Drake. And then really I want to spend
• 1:36:01
  a lot of time on what's next for Drake's.
• 1:36:03
  I know you are always thinking about the next thing of how to
• 1:36:07
  enhance and Elevate this great event that we have.
• 1:36:11
  I will agree to return. If you can provide evidence,
• 1:36:15
  that more than just Kurt Thomas and Houston Frank's download
• 1:36:19
  this episode. All right, well I'll put a
• 1:36:21
  challenge out there The Listener.
• 1:36:22
  So if you're listening is you're already in the That means you've
• 1:36:25
  got to share this episode. Let's make this one of our top
• 1:36:29
  10 episode. That's a, that's a hard thing to
• 1:36:31
  do now will be yeah. Hairy Mary.
• 1:36:34
  Mary did a three part series, by the way.
• 1:36:36
  So I'm not asking much of you to do two parts if he's.
• 1:36:39
  So, he's got episodes of 123 and Mike Holloway's for or Mike.
• 1:36:44
  Mike may be in the top three there.
• 1:36:46
  I don't like a lot of people listen to my it was just
• 1:36:48
  released. So he's kind of his top 10 for
• 1:36:51
  sure. But but yeah, Harry Mara is
• 1:36:53
  actually 12 and like, Five for him for part 3.
• 1:36:59
  But you know, again 1 & 2, he's just did and it's by, it's like
• 1:37:02
  one and two and like, it's a little bit like your race with
• 1:37:05
  Alan web. It's like, you know, it's a
• 1:37:07
  little solo race back there in 3 to 10, which is should be though
• 1:37:11
  because Harry Mara is just absolutely legit.
• 1:37:13
  So Blake, thank you so much for your time today.
• 1:37:16
  Thank you to your dogs who were minimal distractions.
• 1:37:20
  Do you might want to check, they make sure they're still in the
• 1:37:23
  house anywhere, right? They're still all accounted for,
• 1:37:26
  but I can't say thank you enough for being here with us today but
• 1:37:30
  also all the things that you do for the Drake.
• 1:37:33
  Relays one of the things that we want to make sure we're bringing
• 1:37:36
  to the audience through these. This podcast is not just our
• 1:37:40
  great track. And field coach has that we have
• 1:37:42
  out there. The Harry mirror is Mike
• 1:37:44
  Holloway's Houston Frank's we mentioned Kurt Thomas certainly
• 1:37:48
  we want to and will continue to bring those stories but we
• 1:37:52
  certainly want to make sure we're bringing the people.
• 1:37:54
  Come on behind the scenes, they don't maybe necessarily get the
• 1:37:57
  Press because you're not at NCAA championships winning titles,
• 1:38:00
  but you're putting on as the relays director.
• 1:38:03
  One of the most important meets in the country.
• 1:38:05
  So definitely appreciate you sharing your growth story up to
• 1:38:10
  this point. Can't wait for part 2.
• 1:38:12
  Now let's talk about the a how you got to Drake Relays.
• 1:38:16
  But also, what's it take? What is a Drake?
• 1:38:18
  Relays director? Do what's it take to put on a
• 1:38:21
  meat of this caliber and then again, And would love to talk
• 1:38:25
  about what's in the future. Because I know you guys are
• 1:38:28
  always evolving in the positive. So thank you so much again for
• 1:38:31
  being here today. Thanks, Mike.
• 1:38:33
  Thanks for having me, great. Great to catch up with you
• 1:38:35
  absolutely.i. For that challenge of making
• 1:38:38
  this one of the top episodes. I'm going to rely on you to make
• 1:38:41
  sure Cory and curtain. Those guys all know that you
• 1:38:44
  were on the on the podcast, you know it.
• 1:38:47
  All right man. Well look, forward to part to,
• 1:38:48
  thank you so much. Yeah absolutely well guys that's
• 1:38:53
  it for today. Certainly hope.
• 1:38:54
  You received as much value from this episode as we did making
• 1:38:58
  it. If you've made it this far,
• 1:39:00
  really appreciate you joining us, your time and attention are
• 1:39:03
  super valuable and we certainly don't take that lightly and we
• 1:39:06
  also don't take lightly your feedback.
• 1:39:09
  Would you consider leaving us a rating or a comment and the app
• 1:39:12
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• 1:39:15
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• 1:39:18
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• 1:39:21
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• 1:39:24
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• 1:39:27
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