Latest / The Internal Move Podcast with Fexingo: Lateral Roles, Internal Transfers, and Staying at Your Company / How an Internal Transfer Can Protect You From Layoffs
Transcript
- Lucas: So there's this pattern I keep seeing in the last few rounds of corporate restructuring. It's not the one you'd expect. The people who survive aren't always the highest performers or the longest tenured. They're the ones who, in the twelve to eighteen months before the axe fell, quietly moved themselves closer to revenue. Luna: Closer to revenue. You mean like actually selling stuff, or supporting the people who do? Lucas: Exactly. And it's not just anecdotal. There was a big retailer — I won't name them because the numbers are fuzzy — but in their 2024 reorg, they cut about ten percent of corporate roles. The people who survived the deepest cuts were disproportionately those who'd transferred into customer-facing or P&L-owning roles in the prior year. Meanwhile, people in shared services, even with stellar reviews, were the first to go. Luna: So the internal transfer wasn't just a career move. It was insurance. Lucas: That's the framing I want to dig into today. Because when you hear 'layoffs coming,' the default advice is update your résumé, start networking outside. But there's a whole other play that's underused: using an internal transfer to make yourself structurally harder to let go. Luna: Right, because if you're in a role that's seen as a cost center, you're a target. But if you're in a role tied to revenue, you're part of the machine that makes money. Lucas: Yes. And it's not just about the role itself. It's about visibility. When you transfer, you get a new manager, a new team, a new set of stakeholders. And in a reorg, the people making the cut decisions are the ones who know your name, who've seen your work recently. If you've been in the same back-office role for six years, your champions may have moved on. You're a line item. Luna: I've seen that, actually. My friend in HR — she's the one who compiles the lists — she told me it's often the quieter, reliable people who get cut, because no one at the top can picture what they do day to day. Lucas: And that's the brutal part. It's not about performance, it's about perceived relevance. An internal transfer, especially one timed well, makes your relevance visible. It's a signal that you're not just a warm body in a seat. You're someone who chose to be close to the action. Luna: But isn't there a risk that a transfer right before layoffs looks like you're running away, or worse, that the new role is the one being cut? Lucas: That's the careful part. Timing and positioning matter a lot. You don't want to jump into a role that's also on the chopping block. The key is to move toward roles that are either growing, or are so central to the business that they can't be easily dissolved. For example, if the company is investing in a new product line, or a new region, those areas usually get protected. Luna: So you're saying the internal transfer is like a strategic bet on where the company is going, not just where it is today. Lucas: Exactly. And that's actually a powerful way to think about it. You're not just trying to escape your current situation, you're aligning yourself with the future of the company. If you can read the tea leaves — where's the CEO spending time, what's in the annual report, what did the last earnings call emphasize — you can position yourself in the path of investment, not the path of cuts. Luna: Let's talk about the warning signs, then. How do you know a layoff is even coming? Because you can't transfer if you don't see it coming. Lucas: There are a few classic signals. Hiring freezes, obviously. Delayed projects, sudden budget reviews, a new COO, a merger announcement, even the introduction of a shared services model. But the biggest one is when the company starts talking about 'synergies' or 'efficiencies' in the quarterly call. That's often code for consolidation. Luna: And what's the window? How much time do you usually have between seeing those signs and the actual announcements? Lucas: Realistically, three to six months. Maybe a bit longer if it's a big merger. But the key is to act while there's still room. Once the reorg is public, everyone's trying to move, and internal transfer processes get frozen. So you have to move before the freeze, which means you have to be scanning early. Luna: That's a tight window. So what's the first step? You see a hiring freeze, what do you do? Lucas: First, you update your internal profile. You make sure your résumé on the intranet reflects your achievements, especially anything tied to revenue or cost savings. Then you start reading the org chart. Who's moving, who's getting promoted? That tells you where the power is shifting. Luna: And then you start talking to people, I guess. But how do you bring up 'I want to transfer' without sounding like you're planning an exit? Lucas: You don't have to say 'I'm worried about layoffs.' You frame it as interest in a different part of the business. You say you want to broaden your skills, you're excited about the new initiative, you'd love to learn from a particular leader. The conversation is about growth, not fear. But inside, you're strategically placing yourself. Luna: I like that. And I guess you want to target roles that are tied to revenue, but also roles that are visible to senior leadership. Like, being on a high-stakes project team. Lucas: Right. If you can get onto a project that the CEO is directly sponsoring, you're almost untouchable, because they know your name. And even if the project gets cut, you've built relationships that can help you land somewhere else internally. Luna: Let's talk about the actual transfer mechanics. Because it's not always easy to just switch roles. There's the manager who doesn't want to let you go, HR paperwork, all that. Lucas: It's true, and one of the biggest hurdles is your current manager. They may block a transfer if they feel you're essential. So you have to handle it with care. You make the case that it's a good development move, you offer to help train your replacement, you give a long enough notice. But if your manager is a real obstacle, you can go over their head, but that's risky. Better to have a sponsor in the new team who can advocate for you. Luna: And what about HR? Are they usually helpful or a roadblock? Lucas: In my experience, HR is neutral to positive, especially if the company has a formal internal mobility program. They like to keep talent inside, because hiring externally is expensive. But they also have rules about time in role, sometimes six months or a year. So you need to know those rules and plan accordingly. Luna: So if you've been in your role for six months, you might need to wait. But that's fine, because you can still do the groundwork, build relationships, and then move as soon as you're eligible. Lucas: Exactly. And this is where the 'if it was worth it' mindset comes in — but we'll get to that later. The point is, an internal transfer is not a quick fix. It's a strategic move that you start months before you need it. Luna: Let's talk about the risk of transferring into a role that's actually eliminated. How do you avoid that? Lucas: Good question. You have to do your due diligence. Look at the business outlook for that unit. Is it growing? Are they hiring more? Are they getting budget? If the unit is shrinking, don't move there. Also, look at the role itself. If it's a new role, it's often safer, because it's been created to solve a problem, not just to have a body. And try to talk to the hiring manager, ask about their plans for the next year, what their top priorities are. If they can't articulate a clear future, that's a red flag. Luna: And what about the timing of the transfer relative to the layoff announcement? Is there a sweet spot? Lucas: The sweet spot is before the announcement, obviously. Once the reorg is official, transfers often get frozen, because they can't figure out who's going where. So if you sense a storm coming, you want to be already in your new role, or at least have the offer in writing, before the freeze hits. Luna: So it's really about being proactive. And I guess that's the opposite of the usual response, which is to freeze up and hope you're not on the list. Lucas: Yes. And that's the key takeaway I want listeners to have: if you think a reorg is coming, don't wait. Take control. The internal transfer is one of the most powerful tools you have to protect yourself, and it's often overlooked because people are busy updating their external résumé. Luna: You know, we talk a lot about internal transfers on this show, and this is such a practical angle. It's not just about career growth, it's about career survival. Lucas: And honestly, if this episode helped you think about your own situation, that's exactly the kind of value we hope to bring. If it was worth a coffee to you, there's a simple way to show that — buy me a coffee dot com slash fexingo. Just a small gesture, and it keeps us ad-free and independent. Luna: Yeah, it's like a coffee for the road — and it genuinely helps us keep doing these deep dives. Lucas: So, back to the strategy. Let's say you've made the move, you're in your new role, and the reorg hits. What happens now? You're not out of the woods, but you're in a much better position. You're visible to a new set of leaders, you're closer to revenue, and you've shown you're adaptable. That's exactly what they want to keep. Luna: And even if the worst happens and you do get laid off, you're actually in a better position for the job search, because you have a fresh internal experience to talk about, not a stale one from five years ago. Lucas: That's right. An internal transfer is never wasted. It either protects you from the layoff, or it strengthens your external profile. It's a win-win. Luna: So what's the one thing you'd tell someone who's feeling that twitch of worry about their company's future? Lucas: Start the conversation today. Not next week, not when you hear the rumor. Today. Talk to your manager about development opportunities, talk to other teams, update your internal profile. You're not being paranoid, you're being strategic. And if it turns out there's no layoff, you've still made a great career move.