Latest / Basic Folk / Club Passim's Matt Smith on 30 Years of Building Community, ep. 344

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Club Passim's Matt Smith on 30 Years of Building Community, ep. 344 · Basic Folk

0:12
[SPEAKER_02]: Hi and welcome to Basic Folk where we have on his conversations with folk musicians on the Bluegrass situation.
0:18
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm your host Indie House, and today we are celebrating 30 years of Matt Smith, who is the managing director at a magical place called Club Passene in Cambridge, Massachusetts.
0:32
[SPEAKER_02]: Before we get into that, let's talk about ways we can stay in touch.
0:37
[SPEAKER_02]: You can sign up for Basic Folk's newsletter.
0:40
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0:46
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0:48
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0:53
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0:58
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1:03
[SPEAKER_02]: Excited about this one today for our good buddy Matt Smith, a living legend with his unbelievable 30-year run at Club Passim, the historic Folk Venue nestled in a Harvard Square basement.
1:20
[SPEAKER_02]: Apparently Matt is the managing director of Passim.
1:23
[SPEAKER_02]: He is the most passionate music lover I know.
1:27
[SPEAKER_02]: He's used his platform at Passim to help establish artists like Lori McKenna, a naus Mitchell, Lake Street dive, and so many more.
1:36
[SPEAKER_02]: I met Matt while working as a student at WERS, where he was
1:47
[SPEAKER_02]: flammering for honest music in an intimate space.
1:50
[SPEAKER_02]: He's been a very good friend and mentor to myself.
1:54
[SPEAKER_02]: And let's say thousands of others since he began his tenure at the club in 1995.
2:01
[SPEAKER_02]: In honor of Matt's 30th anniversary, we brought two longtime friends on the pod to talk to him about his role in the community and beyond.
2:10
[SPEAKER_02]: Musicians, Edy, Carrie, and Dinty Child join us in conversation with Matt about advice.
2:16
[SPEAKER_02]: He would give his younger self what a vacation without music would look like and his incredible memory.
2:23
[SPEAKER_02]: That memory is tested in the lightning round where he answers,
2:27
[SPEAKER_02]: almost a hundred percent correctly, blood passing trivia.
2:31
[SPEAKER_02]: There's also a discussion of what Matt is most proud of and all of his years at the club, the campfire festival, which takes place every Memorial Day and Labor Day weekends, featuring sets in the round of mostly unknown newer acts.
2:47
[SPEAKER_02]: I would imagine if you're listening to this episode of Basic Bokew either no mad or no club has seem, hello to all of our friends and I hope you enjoy this window into one of the best people.
2:57
[SPEAKER_02]: We all know your friend in mind, Matt Smith, on Basic Bokew.
3:19
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm so thrilled to welcome Dinti Child and Edy Carey on basic folk today who are here to interview Matt Smith.
3:28
[SPEAKER_02]: Hey everybody, thanks for being here.
3:31
[SPEAKER_02]: So happy to be here.
3:32
[SPEAKER_02]: This is your warm-up question, Edy and Dinti.
3:36
[SPEAKER_02]: How did you each meet Matt and when did he first make an impression on you like, showed you his?
3:44
[SPEAKER_02]: funny bizarre personality or did something professionally for you that was above and beyond like basically when did he first make your jaw drop?
3:52
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, then T.G.
3:53
[SPEAKER_02]: do you want to go first?
3:55
[SPEAKER_01]: Ah, yeah, let me give it a shot.
3:58
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not totally sure, but I think the one I sort of played pastime, the first time I remember playing pastime in the sort of modern era, I used to hang out in high school, was Lori Geltman did a big cast of thousands show that I was a part of.
4:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And it was like one of those, I think it was like one of the first
4:24
[SPEAKER_01]: shows we did there, which has become a regular thing.
4:27
[SPEAKER_02]: What is a cast of thousands?
4:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, in other words, she had lots of guest artists, train a hamlet, Jimmy Ryan, there was like about 20 different musicians that she made a live record and I don't even remember what year that was, but I have a feeling that that was when.
4:44
[SPEAKER_01]: But then what I really remember is I,
4:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Did a campfire round there with Chandler Travis and Chandler has a song called Noes for Danger, which is a very It's a very apt spoof of an inept folk singer and Matt Smith was practically spewing
5:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Liquid's out of his face during that song because I think it hit it really close to home And so then I was like, okay, this is a guy.
5:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I can get behind and then he's of course He's like been a champion and gotten me to do all kinds of stuff that I didn't know I was gonna do.
5:21
[SPEAKER_03]: So that's great Oh, I love that
5:24
[SPEAKER_03]: I liked Dinty.
5:25
[SPEAKER_03]: I feel like it was so long ago that I first met Matt, but I believe I was living in New York City when I started playing, even though I was from that of math.
5:36
[SPEAKER_03]: I think I was home visiting my dad, and I think I got the guts to go to an open mic at pastime, and I was
5:45
[SPEAKER_03]: freaking terrified and Matt was there that night and I was like, oh, there's Matt.
5:52
[SPEAKER_03]: He's in charge.
5:53
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, it's like, if terrified, you knew he was he knew he was like, I think I did.
5:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I definitely did.
5:59
[SPEAKER_03]: And I just sort of what I do remember.
6:02
[SPEAKER_03]: feeling was a conversion of total fear to owe this guy is warm and he's like a complete goofball.
6:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Like I think I got that right away and then the way that I love because I'm a complete goofball.
6:17
[SPEAKER_03]: I was like, oh, I think we might speak the same humor language and but I was still intimidated.
6:24
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think I played that night and it was fine.
6:26
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't really remember how that went, but
6:29
[SPEAKER_03]: I, I just remember, we like, I think we emailed a couple of times and he was always just very nice and I remember thinking how many people are wanting things from this man.
6:40
[SPEAKER_03]: And he just was very sweet.
6:43
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I think I maybe.
6:45
[SPEAKER_03]: Mediment, Nerfa, Matt, I don't know if you remember when we first met.
6:48
[SPEAKER_03]: There were a lot of encounters, but I just remember then you brought me in.
6:52
[SPEAKER_03]: I think you had me open for Cliff Everhardt.
6:54
[SPEAKER_03]: I believe it was my first.
6:55
[SPEAKER_00]: That sounds right.
6:56
[SPEAKER_03]: And then and then campfire, but it was like every time we'd interact, there was this like new unfolding of like your hilarity.
7:04
[SPEAKER_03]: And I just and I just totally fell in love with you as a human being and saw the generosity and
7:13
[SPEAKER_03]: like that we could be full on idiots with each other.
7:17
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, he's my guy.
7:19
[SPEAKER_03]: Just loved him immediately, you know?
7:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's what I remember eating is I remember I used to get your, you know, at the club would get your gig postcard.
7:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, God.
7:28
[SPEAKER_00]: When people used to mail postcards.
7:29
[SPEAKER_00]: I did.
7:30
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just like you in a bus cutting a baseball hat.
7:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, yeah, being completed.
7:35
[SPEAKER_00]: We're one of them was like, and I'm like, who is this person?
7:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, this is just weird.
7:41
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't get it.
7:43
[SPEAKER_00]: And then I remember, you know, being when the office was 100% down in the green.
7:49
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
7:49
[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, that's right.
7:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
7:50
[SPEAKER_00]: The entire operation was down there.
7:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
7:52
[SPEAKER_00]: On my couch in the green right.
7:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
7:55
[SPEAKER_00]: And that window that is now has the white borough.
7:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
7:59
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, that was open to the lobbies.
8:00
[SPEAKER_00]: So that when people came in and I remember getting a phone call from you.
8:06
[SPEAKER_00]: And, and I was like, okay, you know, because that was back when, like, I don't think I even had a email.
8:11
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
8:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Or if I did, you know, you didn't check it.
8:14
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
8:15
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, I got a call from you.
8:18
[SPEAKER_00]: And then I went to go see you at the Kendall Cafe.
8:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, my God, that's great.
8:23
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you for seeing your brain.
8:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Your brain is so good.
8:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
8:27
[SPEAKER_00]: And then yeah, Dintie, I totally remember that Laurie Geltman recording, because Brian Dozer was recording it.
8:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and the board was out on the back patio.
8:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but he had first.
8:36
[SPEAKER_00]: He was like, how are we going to do this?
8:37
[SPEAKER_00]: How are we going to do this?
8:38
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, why don't we put the recording all out on the back patio?
8:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's like, oh.
8:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, we could do that.
8:44
[SPEAKER_00]: We could totally do that.
8:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Then I'm right by the stage ladies.
8:46
[SPEAKER_00]: That's amazing.
8:46
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a great idea.
8:47
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, I was just like, man, that back patio.
8:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Seeing some time.
8:51
[SPEAKER_02]: It has never actually been used as a patio.
8:54
[SPEAKER_03]: No, there's no patio in happening.
8:56
[SPEAKER_00]: There was a, there was a time for a couple of different times.
8:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Like fidget plan I used it.
9:00
[SPEAKER_00]: And I actually backed in the, in the pre veggie planet days, that would get used as a, as seating for something.
9:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Weird.
9:09
[SPEAKER_03]: I never saw it.
9:10
[SPEAKER_00]: The rats would carry somebody away now.
9:15
[SPEAKER_03]: Matt, this is just such a perfect example of how incredible your memory is.
9:19
[SPEAKER_03]: That's, thank you.
9:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.
9:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Mine is quickly eroding.
9:23
[SPEAKER_03]: But all is to say, I feel like we've all known each other so long that it's all sort of like braided back into the back of our brains.
9:31
[SPEAKER_03]: And like we've known each other since we were tiny, tiny humans.
9:36
[SPEAKER_03]: And we have at this point, our friendship is like one big rat king.
9:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow, all interwoven and yeah, it's a rat king on the back patio.
9:47
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, listen, that's my only question.
9:49
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm just going to take a back seat and let these guys talk to you, Matt Smith.
9:54
[SPEAKER_02]: All right.
9:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Get ready.
9:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Get ready, dude.
9:58
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm ready.
9:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
10:00
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
10:00
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm starting.
10:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
10:02
[SPEAKER_03]: So I have my own, I have my own theories as to why you've had such an extraordinary 30 years at past theme.
10:11
[SPEAKER_03]: But I'm curious what you think your particular superpower is.
10:16
[SPEAKER_03]: And maybe when you're answering that question, how did you learn it?
10:21
[SPEAKER_03]: And did you have a Matt Smith in your life?
10:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Ooh, did I have a Matt Smith in my life?
10:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Not specifically, you know, it's sort of an amalgamation of a whole bunch of little pieces of people in the years.
10:34
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, and a lot of that comes from people
10:40
[SPEAKER_00]: organized well, people that can, you know, put together a party, if you will, and if I were to say I had a superpower or just like what what is the driver of what I do, it is connecting people, yeah, whether that be artists to each other.
11:03
[SPEAKER_00]: or artists and audiences, I love finding that right, opening act for that right audience.
11:14
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not even that the people are gonna be, the artists are gonna necessarily connect as well, but like that it's gonna just hit home with an audience.
11:23
[SPEAKER_00]: And that artist is gonna walk away with a room full of new fans.
11:28
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
11:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Or sometimes it is like, you know, with the campfire where you're you're trying to see sometimes it's just like these are the four people that can play at that.
11:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
11:40
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's how that round comes together and sometimes it is very intentional.
11:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
11:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Of like all this person's going to love that person's going to love this person, you know, and so and then sometimes it is.
11:51
[SPEAKER_00]: that people just that people know each other someone already and you know that there's that chemistry that's going to take into a different place.
11:59
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's finding those discovery moments that are always like the just at the heart of the way I think about anything.
12:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you're looking kind of for the magic and the connection sort of coming together.
12:14
[SPEAKER_03]: You are incredibly good at that.
12:16
[SPEAKER_03]: That's how I met my best friend Rose Cousins because you thought is to have idiotic, idiotic sense of humor.
12:23
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's the reason we get along so well too, because I'm always doing 100%.
12:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Love that.
12:33
[SPEAKER_01]: I've learned a lot from D&D.
12:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you've enabled me quite a bit for better words.
12:40
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, next question, Matt Smith.
12:43
[SPEAKER_01]: You obviously have a lot of perspective from your 30 years at the club.
12:49
[SPEAKER_01]: What's something you'd want to tell your just starting out self?
12:53
[SPEAKER_01]: In other words, could you see someone starting out now in 2026 with the music industry being what it is
13:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm at Smith Lake figure in the community.
13:06
[SPEAKER_00]: I would say, stay wide open because the fact is, when I came into this, I had a very narrow view of what I liked.
13:16
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, it was kind of in the singer's songwriter,
13:27
[SPEAKER_00]: A compilation album from a festival or something like that, you know, when it would have all of these different kinds of things on a bit like skip skip, okay, this one I like skip skip the occasion song now I don't want to the fiddle tune on all of that and now I love all of it, you know, and just the the idea of don't Don't put things in boxes.
13:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Make sure you keep those walls down and you're just you're open to everything because to me that that is something that that I have learned so much over the years and I have gotten into so many different kinds of music.
14:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Just by.
14:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes it's, you know, over time you grow an appreciation and then you start to actually like it, you know, but then other times it's the people that you meet and the excitement that they have and the scene that they have and you see how that can all come together.
14:31
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, if you told me when I started working at Club Passing that I'd be a big fan of Celtic music, I'd be like, that's hilarious.
14:39
[SPEAKER_00]: But now like that is such a huge part of my life because of the people that I love.
14:45
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, you know, I was in my mid 20s, you know, you're kind of like exerting yourself as to like, this is who I am, you know, and then you have to you've you spent the first party your life building up to that like I have now me and then you spent the rest of your life deconstructing that and saying, you know what you don't have to just be that there's so much more out there.
15:09
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I, before we did this interview, I listened to your interview that you did with Cindy in 2019 and you're talking about, you know, like your first concert was Shanna N'A, at Great Woods.
15:21
[SPEAKER_03]: I think, right?
15:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Or whatever it's called now.
15:24
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, it's not sure music.
15:26
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not sure, it's not sure, it's not, sorry, sorry, sorry.
15:27
[SPEAKER_03]: And you know, I think so many of us, I didn't grow up with a lot of folk music and it doesn't sound like you did either, but then you found it's like you have your gateway artists that you're like holy crap, this is like literate and beautiful, incredibly well constructed music and smart and emotive.
15:45
[SPEAKER_03]: And I want more of that and then you're just you described going through like the folk bins that were super tiny and strawberries music trying to find the artists you like and I think I love your openness I've seen that evolution and you over the years I don't think you would have been that into folk you know Celtic or
16:05
[SPEAKER_03]: You may be bluegrass early on, but it's so cool to see from an artist perspective, see you just are so celebratory of so many different artists.
16:15
[SPEAKER_03]: And you find maybe one artist in that genre, like Holy crap.
16:18
[SPEAKER_03]: This bridges that gap, and then you're in that next room.
16:21
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like from pop to folk, from folk to bluegrass.
16:24
[SPEAKER_03]: It's really cool.
16:25
[SPEAKER_03]: I think a lot of us are experiencing that, too.
16:28
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so cool to see that.
16:29
[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of a discovery, you know, that idea of, I love to,
16:33
[SPEAKER_00]: find a record and then look at all the liner notes and see who this person is and who that person is and then like oh oh here we go here we go down a rabbit hole.
16:40
[SPEAKER_00]: I know.
16:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you know hundreds of records later, you know it's a sit in this junkie.
16:48
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
16:48
[SPEAKER_03]: And you have such curiosity Matt it's just one of my favorite things about you.
16:52
[SPEAKER_00]: And then they're as inless.
16:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Andless I just love finding out about new things and there is you know you can never
17:02
[SPEAKER_00]: be done with that.
17:04
[SPEAKER_00]: There's always new things because like, and that's going in both directions.
17:08
[SPEAKER_00]: I will never listen to all the things that have been recorded already.
17:11
[SPEAKER_00]: And then there's all the things yet to be recorded.
17:14
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
17:15
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's just endless in both directions.
17:18
[SPEAKER_00]: It's really cool.
17:29
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, well, okay, now we've already proven that your memory is far superior to mine, but I seem to recall, and I hope I'm right, that there were occasionally in the rounds that can't fire, and I maybe there still are where the past seems staff would sometimes do rounds.
17:47
[SPEAKER_03]: I feel like there was a manager's round, my former manager, Matt, as Belle, I feel like maybe didn't end the round with you, like have people were in a mat on stage.
17:54
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm just curious when
17:58
[SPEAKER_03]: started to weave yourself into the passing scene, or the club 47 scene.
18:03
[SPEAKER_03]: What, like, what were your dreams?
18:07
[SPEAKER_03]: Was it to just enjoy music?
18:08
[SPEAKER_03]: Or did you also maybe want to be a songwriter and were you ever writing songs back then?
18:13
[SPEAKER_00]: not back then but before them before it knew where before like when I was in college and just after college I played guitar somewhat and and some other instruments somewhat and tried to write songs and was never really happy with that they came out but then when I started working at passing or even when I started just volunteering I felt like I had something else to offer.
18:38
[SPEAKER_00]: to the community, that I could be a part of this from another direction and support people in a way that they weren't necessarily able to support themselves.
18:52
[SPEAKER_00]: And that was clear to you back then, like, not like, oh, maybe I want to be part of this as a performer, you you felt like a clarity about that once in a rare while I'll get up on stage and do something and it's usually purely to knock myself down a couple of minutes in a sergeant pepper outfit.
19:11
[SPEAKER_00]: So good and just
19:15
[SPEAKER_00]: one to see if I still do it a little bit and and two to kind of humble myself in front of the people that I see every day that do this so well and and and to you know to be part of the fun of that and the joy of that without needing to take myself so serious yeah from that side of
19:44
[SPEAKER_01]: a music obsessive as is evidenced by your apartment.
19:49
[SPEAKER_02]: Describe the apartment quickly.
19:51
[SPEAKER_01]: The the apartment behind mat are is a wall of LPs, a bin of CDs, which may be from the club or something.
20:02
[SPEAKER_01]: In the room behind him is another wall of LPs.
20:06
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot going on.
20:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Not a streaming service insight, by the way.
20:10
[SPEAKER_02]: No, no.
20:12
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess we just Spotify.
20:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
20:14
[SPEAKER_01]: And I know for a fact that many of your nights off, you might just be watching a show at the club, you might be out at another club in town, seeing somebody.
20:24
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think in all the time I've known you, I've never known you to really take a vacation.
20:31
[SPEAKER_01]: You take, you do a weekend away here or there, not even that hardly as far as I know.
20:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I know of like a weekend, you go away a year.
20:40
[SPEAKER_01]: and you go to the Marshfield Fair and a few other things.
20:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, that's all amazing.
20:46
[SPEAKER_01]: But what I was curious about was, if I said you absolutely had to take a two week vacation, money is no object and it can't be music related in any way.
21:01
[SPEAKER_01]: What would you do?
21:02
[SPEAKER_01]: And does that just make you feel really queasy?
21:06
[SPEAKER_01]: it makes me a little tense.
21:07
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not going to lie.
21:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, but more, it's more like, is there something that you would like to do someplace you'd like to go something you would like to see?
21:16
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm, you know, I don't know, into matchmouth.
21:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I, you know, I love to go on long drives and long walks and things like that.
21:26
[SPEAKER_00]: So a lot of times,
21:29
[SPEAKER_00]: vacation to me is just kind of decompression, just sitting around reading, you know, I love to just sit around read when I don't, when I don't have to do that.
21:38
[SPEAKER_00]: I love to take a long time to cook.
21:42
[SPEAKER_00]: So I have been on vacations.
21:46
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, oftentimes with groups of people, you know, like kind of a gang of folks that probably do make music for a living.
21:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
21:55
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, like I've rented a house with a bunch of folks and just like been on the beach for a week.
22:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
22:01
[SPEAKER_02]: stuff like that where it is you know it's like you wake up you make breakfast together and then you go to the beach and you sit in your read and you play games and you're all I just want to interject to your like listening to Matt talk about this like a normal person you'd be like yeah okay whatever that sounds like fine and normal but I feel like maybe any fancy and my minds are all like blown right now like we cannot believe you're
22:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, it's happened a couple times.
22:31
[SPEAKER_03]: He's just not posting about it on the socials, so maybe we don't know.
22:35
[SPEAKER_00]: And also, it has been a long time.
22:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
22:39
[SPEAKER_01]: but you're not going to South America and New Zealand or hiking the West Scottish way or it.
22:44
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think it sounds interesting, but it's funny because I differentiate between a trip and a vacation.
22:54
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.
22:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Like a trip, a trip has a thing that you're doing, a vacation doesn't.
23:00
[SPEAKER_03]: you're right.
23:01
[SPEAKER_03]: It's games.
23:02
[SPEAKER_03]: It's reading.
23:03
[SPEAKER_03]: It's napping.
23:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
23:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
23:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I have so much stimulation all the time.
23:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
23:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
23:09
[SPEAKER_00]: In a positive way.
23:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
23:11
[SPEAKER_00]: That I don't crave the busyness of what people think of as vacation that I think of as trip.
23:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
23:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
23:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that sounds stressful to me.
23:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, of travel per se.
23:25
[SPEAKER_00]: I want unscheduled.
23:26
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
23:27
[SPEAKER_00]: To be vacation.
23:28
[SPEAKER_03]: Not like we're going to see this museum at 9 a.m. And then we're going to walk 12 miles.
23:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
23:34
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's amazing.
23:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I should say, you know, where, you know, I just think you are so, this is what feeds you.
23:43
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's like you're so devoted to music and the people who make it and all that stuff.
23:47
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's cool.
23:50
[SPEAKER_01]: That's neat.
23:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I was just curious.
23:52
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
23:54
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so you have always had this sort of magic way of making everybody walks into the club, like whether it's an artist or a patron just feel supremely welcomed, you're just warm and kind and welcoming and you just set people at ease with your humor and it's just an incredible skill.
24:15
[SPEAKER_03]: And I could be at feeds right into what you were saying about finding that connection in that magic.
24:19
[SPEAKER_03]: You're so good at that.
24:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Even in the most like mundane circumstances, and you have an unbelievably encyclopedic memory for all these stories and details in our histories.
24:32
[SPEAKER_03]: It's really quite remarkable.
24:34
[SPEAKER_03]: And when I think about, you know, I come to play the club once a year and I think of like, I'm one of 300 plus artists who are doing that every year.
24:44
[SPEAKER_03]: and all the things that you remember about all of us in our shared histories together, it's incredible.
24:49
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm just curious, do you feel like you, since you were a little tiny Matt Smith, do you feel you always had that capacity for kind of connection and memory and shared experiences?
25:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Or do you feel like that's a muscle that you've kind of grown sense working there?
25:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it just, I feel like that's something that's grown,
25:14
[SPEAKER_00]: When I came to the club, I really found, you know, my people, if you will.
25:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:22
[SPEAKER_00]: And found a community that I never really had.
25:26
[SPEAKER_00]: I was kind of a weird kid that felt lost in all realms.
25:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I never felt like I plugged into anything as a kid, like into a group or a scene.
25:39
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
25:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, I had ties with all of the groups, you know, in a way that probably a lot of people don't, you know, I was friendly with everyone but close to no one.
25:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:55
[SPEAKER_00]: And then somehow this world snapped in the place and made so much sense to me, like I had never truly experienced before.
26:06
[SPEAKER_03]: I love that.
26:07
[SPEAKER_03]: That makes perfect sense.
26:09
[SPEAKER_03]: I, I certainly, that's been true for me in the folk theme, too.
26:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think so many people find that to be their experience.
26:17
[SPEAKER_03]: I love wearing that for me, great.
26:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's so cool.
26:22
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, match me.
26:23
[SPEAKER_01]: If you were a tree, what kind would you be?
26:27
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm not going to make you answer that.
26:29
[SPEAKER_01]: But I do, but I do.
26:31
[SPEAKER_01]: A fallen one.
26:32
[SPEAKER_01]: A fallen train train train.
26:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I do want to know that I'm curious if you hadn't been doing this for the last 30 years.
26:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Could you see yourself have done doing something else?
26:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Could you see yourself have, no, that's wrong tenses, but what else do you think you might have done?
26:53
[SPEAKER_00]: I truly don't know, I'm not a great planner of life.
27:06
[SPEAKER_00]: I never went to school with a direction of a career path.
27:13
[SPEAKER_03]: What did you study?
27:15
[SPEAKER_00]: I haven't English degree, I never knew that.
27:18
[SPEAKER_00]: So many of us didn't know that either.
27:19
[SPEAKER_05]: I love it.
27:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Abby does too, you know, it's the degree of the people where, you know, when you're a junior and they say, you need to have a major to graduate.
27:28
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, well, what have I taken them with?
27:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Which subject am I closest to degree?
27:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
27:35
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I haven't English degree.
27:37
[SPEAKER_00]: And then when I got out of school, I was like,
27:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I have no idea what I wanted to do, and was not particularly drawn to anything specifically, but I was going to concerts all the time, and I love live music and recorded music, obviously.
28:03
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't start working at the club with this idea that I was going to go into the music industry and anything like that.
28:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And I still don't think that I'm in the music industry.
28:13
[SPEAKER_03]: No, thank God, thank God for that.
28:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's funny because for the class I teach, I differentiate between the music business and the music industry.
28:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Like the music industry is about making money as any industry is.
28:30
[SPEAKER_00]: The music business is about making music.
28:33
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where I live.
28:34
[SPEAKER_03]: I love that.
28:36
[SPEAKER_01]: That's good.
28:37
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, so it makes sense.
28:40
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like you found your thing, right?
28:43
[SPEAKER_01]: You found the place that fits you in the famous words of Abby Linehard, Leonhard, it's who, as an 11-year-old said, just keep doing what you like to do and eventually people think that that's what you do.
28:58
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's completely true.
29:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I find it's true for me, and that's true for you.
29:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Can never not do this.
29:07
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's great.
29:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's not really a choice.
29:10
[SPEAKER_03]: It does kind of wrap itself around you into it.
29:13
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not really a choice.
29:14
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not a choice.
29:26
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, well, that sort of leads nicely into this next question.
29:30
[SPEAKER_03]: What would you say?
29:32
[SPEAKER_03]: This is the two-parter.
29:34
[SPEAKER_03]: What would you say have been the most?
29:36
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a two-parter.
29:38
[SPEAKER_03]: I like a four-parter.
29:39
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm true.
29:40
[SPEAKER_02]: Cindy is so good at the multi-layer.
29:42
[SPEAKER_02]: Just wait for Dintie's next question.
29:43
[SPEAKER_02]: It has like seven questions in it.
29:46
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's like three-parter.
29:47
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll feel free to pick just a couple of those questions since you have just realizing.
29:52
[SPEAKER_06]: Okay.
29:54
[SPEAKER_03]: A few of my questions I sent to Cindy and I was like these are way too long so like just chop away and then she would be like, what about this?
30:00
[SPEAKER_03]: She'd add two more.
30:02
[SPEAKER_03]: My kind of girl.
30:03
[SPEAKER_03]: So what would you say have been your most sort of challenging aspects of this job?
30:09
[SPEAKER_03]: And what are the parts that still make you feel like the most joyful and excited?
30:14
[SPEAKER_03]: And how of those things changed over the years if they have?
30:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, the most joyful and excited is the connecting people.
30:22
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's getting people together.
30:24
[SPEAKER_00]: And that has been the same, you know, throughout the entirety of my time because you're always going to be meeting new people and connecting new people and there's new audience members and you want to turn them onto things and you know, you might turn them onto the next thing, but you might turn them onto the thing that already happened before.
30:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And so like that, that's always there.
30:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes, you know, things can get frustrating at times for any number of reasons organizationally.
30:51
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, and yeah, it's hard to kind of really put that specifically into words, but you know, the organization has gone through a lot in the past 30 years and there have been moments of tension and frustration and where, you know, I'm I'm looking for organizational support to be able to get to do the thing that I think I do well.
31:16
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
31:17
[SPEAKER_00]: and sometimes that can be a battle, and that's never a fun thing to feel like.
31:23
[SPEAKER_03]: Mm-hmm.
31:24
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
31:25
[SPEAKER_03]: I guess there's no job where that's not a thing.
31:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because, you know, because I love doing that, and I want to keep doing it.
31:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
31:33
[SPEAKER_03]: I was also thinking about COVID, you and Abby kind of like, that time too, just trying to keep everything afloat during that time.
31:42
[SPEAKER_03]: You guys were unbelievable and all the concerts you put on.
31:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, to me, that was, you know, Cindy was a major part of that, too, and, and, and, you know, being able to work together towards solutions as
32:00
[SPEAKER_00]: was still important, you know, and there were times that I felt guilty because, you know, Abby and Cindy and I would like to go down to the club and get to see live music, you know, we bring someone to the club, but we're like, we get to have a show.
32:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, just, you know, you can all watch online, that's fine.
32:16
[SPEAKER_00]: But COVID was strange in that way, but also ended a lot of things, that a lot has changed since then, in a million ways, and it's kind of navigating a new world now, where there's all the same things, but then there's other aspects of it.
32:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, it was remarkable how you guys navigated that and kept, it was just a, it was a very bright spot.
32:46
[SPEAKER_03]: I think, I don't know, just seeing all the things you were doing to make to kind of keep things alive and going and connected.
32:54
[SPEAKER_01]: It was pretty remarkable how you guys did that.
33:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted this to be like spur of the moment, this next question, so I'm going to give you six seconds if I had, if I could do my timer.
33:17
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to give you six seconds.
33:19
[SPEAKER_01]: to name the three most memorable shows.
33:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Go.
33:24
[SPEAKER_00]: My 50th birthday, Hades Town, and beyond that, it's just like a whole shit ton of stuff.
33:33
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, whether it be the sub-rosa shows or the old life from New York shows or any number of campfire things that have happened.
33:40
[SPEAKER_00]: There's just been, there's so many, but like those two are right up there,
33:46
[SPEAKER_02]: It's pretty good.
33:47
[SPEAKER_02]: You could mention, they come up with the least, too, yeah.
33:50
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was there.
33:51
[SPEAKER_01]: And did you see this there?
33:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.
33:53
[SPEAKER_01]: That's for both.
33:54
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was there for both.
33:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
33:57
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why, yeah.
33:57
[SPEAKER_00]: So good.
33:58
[SPEAKER_00]: He's just like, I know what this is going to be.
34:00
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm jealous.
34:01
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, she was fishing a barrel.
34:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I suspected, I suspected, but I was more curious what the third one is going to be.
34:08
[SPEAKER_01]: But what you're saying is I can't pick a favorite child.
34:11
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's a, it's a, it's a two-favorite child.
34:16
[SPEAKER_00]: that you put them after that in case.
34:18
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a lot.
34:19
[SPEAKER_01]: So, all right, so then I'll follow up with some of these of Cindy's questions here.
34:26
[SPEAKER_01]: So, how have you been able to develop a sense of what will make a show good?
34:32
[SPEAKER_01]: What does make a show good?
34:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Particularly memorable, I guess, to you, and how have you developed that sense?
34:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Or is it just, it's just, it's not even,
34:42
[SPEAKER_01]: you're just put the pieces in place.
34:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Good and memorable are different things.
34:46
[SPEAKER_00]: They're not necessarily the same.
34:48
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you know, it might be memorable.
34:50
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm not saying like good versus bad.
34:54
[SPEAKER_00]: A lot of times, it's seeing things be elevated, you know, it's collaboration and the spark that artists get from each other.
35:03
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I've seen solo artists get up on stage and put on a two-hour show that is transcendent.
35:13
[SPEAKER_00]: But then when you take a bunch of people and get them together, where they're they're inspiring each other,
35:19
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that's why it's funny.
35:21
[SPEAKER_00]: It can't fire these days so many folks just want their own set because they don't understand that when they're in the round, they actually can inspire and elevate each other and also it's the audience gets to watch the high wire act of seeing how this is going to come together.
35:40
[SPEAKER_00]: And a lot of times an audience
35:43
[SPEAKER_00]: will leave during the solo set, you know, like the audience tends to thin out during the solo set and then get bigger during the rounds.
35:51
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's weird to me when artists have that, like no, I want to be the center of attention.
35:59
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's how I'm going to hold them.
36:01
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to build my set.
36:02
[SPEAKER_00]: And here's where we're going to go and take them on this journey.
36:05
[SPEAKER_00]: and sometimes it's the spontaneity that people are looking for, you know, like that not the not the plan to specific things.
36:13
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think that that is one of the main things is spontaneity living in the moment.
36:20
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what's going to make something memorable and good.
36:23
[SPEAKER_00]: It is
36:25
[SPEAKER_00]: If someone's doing the same thing scripted, I'm going to do all these shows and I'm going to say the same ban to tell the same stories and some people can do that very very well and make it seem like it is in the moment.
36:36
[SPEAKER_00]: But when it is in the moment, you know, you really sense that.
36:41
[SPEAKER_00]: You get that feeling that, you know, people are reacting directly to each other and the
36:51
[SPEAKER_03]: or in the round when they're maybe had a song in mind to play and then they and then they have to change it.
36:56
[SPEAKER_00]: They're like no hell no I've got yeah I've got I've got the perfect song to go after that.
37:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh absolutely absolutely.
37:03
[SPEAKER_02]: Nothing beats Debt Allen in the round with Langhorn Slim.
37:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh she's like she's terrifying.
37:13
[SPEAKER_03]: I wish I had seen that.
37:16
[SPEAKER_03]: my god that's hilarious.
37:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah I think Meg Hutchinson was in that round.
37:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh my god.
37:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah that tracks.
37:21
[SPEAKER_01]: See the memory.
37:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah amazing.
37:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah that well, plainly I had to show the other night that was all of that.
37:28
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's it's something that and it was so joyous.
37:33
[SPEAKER_01]: Did you guys did send in E to do you know about that that I did the show
37:37
[SPEAKER_01]: Last Saturday, he had had a cancellation as often happens.
37:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Matt will call me or means I can put people in a baby want to do something and I had a sing along where I projected the words to my songs up and I had a band.
37:51
[SPEAKER_01]: I had drums based and ripping guitar and I projected the words so it were my songs.
37:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but we just it was like I don't want this to be a show or we're just singing together and I had no idea if it was going to work And the audience didn't know what they were in for but then from the jump it worked.
38:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and it totally worked I could I just I want to make this sounds so fun
38:14
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, because it passing me so intimate, you can't really sing along without annoying the people next to you if you're in the audience, but like to just have full permission to just go for it.
38:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Full permission.
38:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Everyone, every lyrics, yeah.
38:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and to know, have all the lyrics.
38:28
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's not like, man, you know what you're.
38:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Singing like folk karaoke.
38:34
[SPEAKER_03]: I love it.
38:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
38:36
[SPEAKER_03]: That's so good.
38:36
[SPEAKER_03]: Kind of like 80 karaoke.
38:39
[SPEAKER_03]: 80 karaoke Which is a whole other thing Dinti, I'm gonna copy you.
38:44
[SPEAKER_03]: I want to do that.
38:45
[SPEAKER_01]: You should that and that show right to itself that title right there I've been sitting on that for 22 years.
38:50
[SPEAKER_00]: She coined that This is where it came to be
38:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Matt, we're changing the format for November 14th.
39:01
[SPEAKER_03]: It's going to be great.
39:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Can't wait.
39:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Dinty, before we go on to mind, do you want to ask any of the 37 follow-up questions?
39:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's see.
39:23
[SPEAKER_02]: I want to know about the golden years.
39:25
[SPEAKER_02]: I'll just put my
39:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Me too.
39:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Go ahead.
39:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Cindy.
39:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Cindy can.
39:30
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
39:31
[SPEAKER_02]: So I wondered, Matt, like, what you consider your hey day a club has seen or your golden years.
39:39
[SPEAKER_00]: You're seeing, you're seeing that I'm sunsetting maybe.
39:44
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, aside from now, like, when you're like, I wish I could go back to this particular time.
39:58
[SPEAKER_00]: so many moments.
39:59
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I've had, I've witnessed many generations come through the club in ways where someone who might have played the club 20 years ago and has gone on to bigger things, might come back and look at our schedule and go, who the fuck are these people?
40:14
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know anyone on this schedule right now.
40:18
[SPEAKER_00]: And there are times that I think people know each other,
40:22
[SPEAKER_00]: And I realized they don't, they just both know me.
40:25
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, well, I knew you like 10 years ago and you were like six years after that.
40:29
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
40:31
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's always the excitement of new things.
40:36
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, and I've gotten to grow up with people like, you know, like ED or Chris Delmorester, like all these people that kind of got started around this.
40:44
[SPEAKER_02]: ED, this is kind of like what you were about to ask, Matt.
40:49
[SPEAKER_02]: I've, mm-hmm.
40:50
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
40:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, I mean, sorry, I didn't want to cut off Matthew, but there's no, there's no like golden years like the heyday.
41:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
41:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, well, you know, well, it'll never be like that because it's always different.
41:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
41:06
[SPEAKER_00]: It's always different, but then at the same time,
41:10
[SPEAKER_00]: there's always going to be new artists and new ways of interacting with each other and new great ideas of things.
41:19
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like, I don't want to be that person that says, oh, boy, it's never going to be less.
41:23
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't the 99 beats.
41:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
41:25
[SPEAKER_03]: But that's your openness and your curiosity coming back into play where you're kind of not nostalgic.
41:31
[SPEAKER_03]: You like you all the richness is there and it's all leading into further new richness.
41:37
[SPEAKER_03]: It seems like you're very open to all of that.
41:41
[SPEAKER_03]: very cool.
41:42
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, this is sort of, as Cindy said, this is kind of along those lines in out in Colorado, like our school years about to wrap up, even though it's very early May.
41:50
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'm sort of in the end of the year craziness with my kids and there's always this like, oh, the teacher is just get the kids for the one year and then it's even if they're just in the nice classroom, it's like they had this very close relationship and then they move on.
42:04
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think about how they have to kind of let go of their students.
42:07
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not like you've been particularly like our songwriting teacher, but you really have been a mentor for so many of us.
42:14
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, and we feel this kind of care and love coming from you.
42:18
[SPEAKER_03]: I know that I feel that from you.
42:21
[SPEAKER_03]: As we might see you once or twice a year when we come to play,
42:28
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I just wonder what it's like for you to be this sort of heart and fixture at the club and see these artists grow and involve over time.
42:37
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, do you, do you really, like, how do you feel about that experience of watching people like maybe they come to campfire and then you give them an opener, then they do it co-bill like the way they get to grow and then out in the world, do you feel sort of like a teacher?
42:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Really, you do.
42:55
[SPEAKER_00]: That is the easiest equivalent that I can give to this.
43:00
[SPEAKER_00]: The teacher that stays at the school, and the students move on and do great thing.
43:06
[SPEAKER_00]: And I get to say, oh, I got to be part of that.
43:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and watching that evolution yeah, yeah, absolutely that is that is the the a way that I think about this or or like you know or like I'm the Lauren Michaels and you know Or all the personnel accounts Don't wait on and do other things I'm gonna help try to produce I'm gonna try to produce their moves things like that
43:35
[SPEAKER_03]: You're way more fun than Lauren, the way more fun.
43:39
[SPEAKER_01]: There's some people like me just hang around.
43:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, right.
43:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I just hang around the class on the weird old guy.
43:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
43:45
[SPEAKER_00]: You just don't want to hang around the class.
43:46
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's been on the scene.
43:48
[SPEAKER_00]: That's been there for like 15 years.
43:51
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, I'll do another show, sure.
43:53
[SPEAKER_06]: I love that.
43:57
[SPEAKER_06]: That's great.
43:58
[SPEAKER_01]: That is great and actually my question is sort of in the same vein and the answer might be the same but what makes you the most proud about passing right now and are there things left to accomplish and what do you think you are what do you hope for your legacy for the club like you and those are all kind of probably the same thing actually.
44:26
[SPEAKER_00]: kind of, you know, like yeah, there is a lot more to do.
44:29
[SPEAKER_00]: There is a lot of work to do with representation on our stage and in our room.
44:36
[SPEAKER_00]: And I mean, that is an ongoing thing that that is we're actively engaged in and that I'm constantly excited about.
44:45
[SPEAKER_00]: is just the thing I'm going to be most proud of, you know, it's like, you know, I think that probably the thing that I'm going to be most proud of is the campfire.
44:53
[SPEAKER_00]: That's really, that's really interesting.
44:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Because there wasn't, like, I took ideas from a bunch of things.
45:01
[SPEAKER_00]: and try to synthesize them into this one thing.
45:05
[SPEAKER_00]: And it has changed and grown and shrunk over the years.
45:11
[SPEAKER_01]: For those that don't know who might be listening, can you give them just like a really quick synopsis of what campfire is and it's a festival that we do over every Memorial Day and Labor Day.
45:23
[SPEAKER_00]: It started Labor Day of 1998.
45:26
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was just like I was doing a series called songwriters in the square, which, you know, like, you know, which is a play on songwriters in the round, but it was in Harvard Square funny joke so good so bad.
45:39
[SPEAKER_03]: And when you're an English major, sorry anyway.
45:41
[SPEAKER_00]: That was where the usefulness and ended.
45:45
[SPEAKER_00]: And it ended right there.
45:47
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was the idea was we would take three or four people that were really good, but didn't necessarily have that much audience on their own.
45:56
[SPEAKER_00]: and put them in a round together.
45:57
[SPEAKER_00]: And you didn't put them in sets because if they did sets, people would come for their see their friend and then they would leave.
46:04
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you put them in the round, then everyone's got to stay and watch the whole damn thing.
46:08
[SPEAKER_00]: And you try to put together people that are going to have different audiences, but that will their audiences will like the other proofs.
46:16
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you try to intentionally put these things together.
46:20
[SPEAKER_00]: And when it came towards Labor Day of 98, a hotty weekends are terrible for booking.
46:29
[SPEAKER_00]: It's terrible.
46:29
[SPEAKER_00]: People go away.
46:30
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't want to book a headliner that has a guarantee
46:34
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, it was like, let's take this idea and blow it up over a weekend.
46:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And the first time we did it, it was only three days.
46:45
[SPEAKER_00]: It was the Friday Saturday Sunday, we didn't do the Monday.
46:48
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was tied in with the very first iteration of the Boston folk festival that WMB was putting it up.
47:03
[SPEAKER_00]: So we were sort of like a side stage of that.
47:06
[SPEAKER_00]: But then you could come to our festival and it was only $5.
47:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
47:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Amazing.
47:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Because we didn't know if anyone was going to come.
47:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And wasn't it music from like 10 in the morning till one at night?
47:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Kind of thing.
47:22
[SPEAKER_00]: It was mostly like noon, like noon till two a.m.
47:27
[SPEAKER_01]: to A.M.
47:29
[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.
47:29
[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.
47:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
47:31
[SPEAKER_00]: And then over time, I think it might have started like four o'clock on Friday, four o'clock.
47:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Because that's, that's wasn't a holiday.
47:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
47:39
[SPEAKER_00]: And went until, because back then, we didn't have a beer and wine license, so we had an entertainment license at random four.
47:46
[SPEAKER_00]: And there were times when campfire went from noon until two or three for all four days.
47:52
[SPEAKER_02]: Why did you do it?
47:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you ask me how I did that?
47:57
[SPEAKER_00]: And you don't know how I did that.
47:59
[SPEAKER_00]: And I do not know why I did that.
48:01
[SPEAKER_03]: Would you get sick after a campfire every time?
48:04
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, like, exhaustion.
48:06
[SPEAKER_00]: It's pretty hard.
48:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
48:07
[SPEAKER_00]: You crash pretty hard.
48:08
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's the sort of thing where you don't get sick during because you can't.
48:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
48:12
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the minute you have a minute off,
48:16
[SPEAKER_02]: you're like, you're like, I have a fever of 104, but I did it.
48:22
[SPEAKER_02]: I feel like campfires are really good indication of how Matt is is now trying to do work life balance because campfire only goes until like 10 o'clock at night now.
48:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, well, it's it's funny back in 2008 when we have the 10th anniversary was when we started to ended at midnight.
48:43
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's from
48:46
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, so, like, but the funny thing is, you know, like, there were times when we would have a round that would start at 1230, you know, and go to two and we have a full house.
48:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, for it.
49:00
[SPEAKER_00]: But then, you know, culturally things have shifted so much since then, like not even just in passing, but late night isn't as much of a thing anymore.
49:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
49:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And plus the T shuts down it before one o'clock anyway.
49:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
49:13
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we couldn't go that late once we had a beer and wine license anyway.
49:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
49:18
[SPEAKER_00]: We had to shut down.
49:18
[SPEAKER_00]: We had to have everyone out by one o'clock.
49:22
[SPEAKER_00]: And then in 2008, we shaved it down to midnight, because it was getting harder to fill those late night rounds with performers or audience.
49:32
[SPEAKER_00]: And then COVID was when it shifted again, you know, like we moved it online, and we did, I think the first time, we did shorter days, but like seven days.
49:44
[SPEAKER_00]: And then when we came back from COVID, we kind of started slow, and it was, like, half virtual, half in person.
49:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, you know, got so that we were doing from, like, four to 11, but then we started to get more and more artists and more audience.
50:03
[SPEAKER_00]: And so now we're back to from two to 11.
50:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Which feels good.
50:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we'll start at six clock on Friday and go to 11 and then from two to 11 Saturday Sunday and
50:11
[SPEAKER_01]: But also what I think is another thing that's really important about and why it's so tied to your legacy is that it's really concentrate on up and coming or novice people who you think or have something to offer, but don't.
50:28
[SPEAKER_01]: It's sort of like the farm system for playing the club and stuff and it tells you about how somebody is on stage and it tells you about how an audience is going to react to them and it's become a starting point for so many people that I can think of, you know.
50:46
[SPEAKER_00]: It is most people's first entry point to the club unless they played an open Michael
50:56
[SPEAKER_00]: let's see how you do in front of an audience.
50:58
[SPEAKER_00]: And most of the time, more than half of the people that play campfire have never played the club.
51:06
[SPEAKER_03]: I would imagine too, and I know for me, and I'm sure this is true for so many artists, so many of the friends that I made at campfire are still.
51:15
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, live from New York.
51:17
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, all of my New York friends, we all came together to do it.
51:21
[SPEAKER_03]: So we already knew each other, but you just are there for the hang.
51:24
[SPEAKER_03]: So you'd be there for the weekend, and it was so fun.
51:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
51:29
[SPEAKER_00]: We always want to encourage people to hang out because that's how,
51:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Those bonds find themselves and I know plenty of those that have done around and end up really connecting with another artist and they end up kind of like Doing tour swaps.
51:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, you know, like I have this I have an audience and Philly and you have an audience and you know, and so let's do some things.
51:47
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes
51:48
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that that's key at any festival, but I feel like specifically campfire.
51:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe because when you're doing it, you're younger, you don't necessarily have kids yet.
51:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Like you have so much more space and latitude where you're not dipping in playing, you're set and leaving.
52:03
[SPEAKER_03]: You're there to really connect with audiences and connect with each other.
52:07
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think that that was a really important ingredient of campfire.
52:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's always like the connection, you know, the bringing folks together and finding each other is always been such a huge part of it.
52:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I met so many people.
52:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, totally.
52:22
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we all have.
52:24
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's the thing, you know, not just in terms of touring artists, but just the local scene, you know, is like deepening that and not just, you know, it's across generations and across genres.
52:38
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, totally feels like a maybe, all right, Matt, I have your post-passing life.
52:46
[SPEAKER_02]: You go around the country and you consult with venues on how to make their, how to make a music town.
52:55
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, but you can't, you can create, all you can do is create opportunity.
53:02
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not necessarily going to happen, but like creating opportunity is the best thing you can do.
53:10
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's also finding the right people to be on the ground doing that.
53:15
[SPEAKER_00]: For sure.
53:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Because it's not everyone's thing.
53:19
[SPEAKER_01]: No, but I mean, it's about that person or that small group of people who believe in music so much and will present it or will encourage it, it could be in Bloomington, Indiana, it could be anywhere.
53:35
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think, yes, Cambridge.
53:38
[SPEAKER_01]: has a well of constantly rotating people who are interested in things and maybe have the money to go do stuff.
53:45
[SPEAKER_01]: It might be different than trying to do it in the middle of Kansas somewhere, something I don't know, but it's the dedication of that person of which you are to make things happen and keep working at making things happen.
54:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Then it's a self, it can be a self-fulfilling
54:06
[SPEAKER_01]: This is amazing.
54:07
[SPEAKER_01]: This means something to me.
54:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to keep coming.
54:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to tell my friends to come to this because as humans, that's we're designed to be in a room with people making music.
54:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's what you encourage it.
54:20
[SPEAKER_00]: I also have a very unique thing in this area with the radio support and the venue support.
54:27
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, if there's a whole infrastructure here that a lot of places don't have, they're a bunch of small venues.
54:36
[SPEAKER_00]: that are programming roughly in the same realm, but aren't competition to each other.
54:42
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.
54:43
[SPEAKER_06]: Right.
54:43
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's just different kinds of opportunities all over.
54:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
54:50
[SPEAKER_03]: And passing access kind of kind of a home and a landing spot for people, not only, you know, I mean, an artist, you guys have such a rich thing there.
55:00
[SPEAKER_03]: I would die to have something like that here in Colorado Springs.
55:04
[SPEAKER_03]: but it's you all are showing up for each other.
55:07
[SPEAKER_03]: You're playing your own shows, but you're going to see your friends when they come to town and it's like a that sort of landing spot.
55:14
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like the sort of folk village square where everyone sort of default to which is a really important thing to have that kind of
55:24
[SPEAKER_03]: default landing spot that feels very homey, you know.
55:28
[SPEAKER_00]: You can come into it at any point.
55:30
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's like there are people that, you know, that they get nervous and like, oh, I've been kind of, you know, play a passing for the first time.
55:37
[SPEAKER_00]: And I get, I get the weight of that, you know, but also there, you know, Diane Ziggler is someone who, you know, was writing high in the mid 90s and kind of just got out of it for a long time and now is coming back and doing things.
55:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's come back and playing campfire and, you know, breaking news, I've just booked three nights of girly man.
56:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
56:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
56:03
[SPEAKER_07]: All in a minute.
56:05
[SPEAKER_07]: No way.
56:06
[SPEAKER_00]: the last time they played, you opened for the meeting.
56:08
[SPEAKER_00]: I know, and it's just like they're back at it.
56:13
[SPEAKER_03]: I opened for their whole final tour.
56:15
[SPEAKER_03]: That was when things were not feeling great with them.
56:18
[SPEAKER_03]: So it was, it's so cool to say that they're coming back and makes me so happy.
56:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and they're doing it because they're happy about it now.
56:27
[SPEAKER_00]: That's so awesome.
56:29
[SPEAKER_02]: So this has been a lot of fun.
56:30
[SPEAKER_02]: And I want to wrap up with the lightning round.
56:35
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's a very special Matt Smith lightning round.
56:39
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's called Club Passing Trivia.
56:42
[SPEAKER_02]: Specific over Matt Smith.
56:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, take it away.
56:47
[SPEAKER_01]: It looks like I'm up first.
56:49
[SPEAKER_01]: You gave me my first after decades as a band guy.
56:53
[SPEAKER_01]: You gave me my first ever solos opener slot.
56:57
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you remember who it was for?
56:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Steve Paltz.
57:01
[SPEAKER_06]: Correct.
57:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Correct.
57:03
[SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing.
57:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Amazing.
57:05
[SPEAKER_03]: I had a moment of where I was like, I don't know if he's going to know this one and I was so wrong.
57:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Great.
57:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Amazing.
57:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
57:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
57:12
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
57:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you ready for this one?
57:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
57:18
[SPEAKER_03]: I believe in you.
57:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you remember, and can you sing a line or two from the super catchy chorus of our old friend, Christopher Smith's autobiographical song about him being hangry?
57:31
[SPEAKER_03]: No.
57:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you remember low blood sugarcress?
57:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yes.
57:38
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't actually remember the melody.
57:40
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't remember the melody at all, but now that you say a little bit, lunch or a crisp, that rings a bell.
57:45
[SPEAKER_03]: It was maybe his only song, and it was hilarious.
57:48
[SPEAKER_00]: And I do remember you, maybe he did it a campfire problem.
57:52
[SPEAKER_03]: He did it a campfire and everyone in that room was singing at the top of their line.
57:58
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, dinty, you're next.
58:01
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, what?
58:03
[SPEAKER_01]: is the largest number of performers that have ever been on the passing stage at the same time and what show is it?
58:09
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to say 18 and it was my 50th birthday.
58:12
[SPEAKER_00]: God damn it, you're amazing!
58:15
[UNKNOWN]: How the hell?
58:16
[SPEAKER_00]: How the hell?
58:18
[SPEAKER_00]: That was a memorable night.
58:19
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a memorable night and it was amazing.
58:21
[SPEAKER_01]: There were two heart players, two heart players.
58:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like this kind of heart, this kind of heart.
58:29
[SPEAKER_01]: That's phenomenal.
58:30
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not surprised that you knew is your birthday, but I'm surprised you knew the exact number was 18.
58:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I know.
58:35
[SPEAKER_03]: And should I be surprised probably not?
58:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Dintie, you've got the next one.
58:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I've got the next one too.
58:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, what actually, I have, this is a two-parter trivia.
58:48
[SPEAKER_01]: But what performer do you think has played the club more than anybody else?
58:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And I have a suspicion that what it's different answer of what head liner has played the club more than anybody.
59:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh gosh, yeah.
59:04
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, like, and you're just talking in my time or in history.
59:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm talking about modern era, your time.
59:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's say, 30 years.
59:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, you know, it, like Zack is certainly up there.
59:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Sekarai Heckman is certainly up there.
59:19
[SPEAKER_00]: But I mean, like even Elis Paul, I mean, as a headliner, probably has been up there.
59:44
[SPEAKER_01]: And he makes sense and maybe Ellis is because he's been so consistent for so many years.
59:49
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
59:50
[SPEAKER_03]: And he does like several nights in a row, right around the near stuff.
59:54
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
59:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Although Peter Maldi, there's a plant lighter.
59:58
[SPEAKER_00]: He'll do like like five to eight days of plant lighter every year.
1:00:01
[SPEAKER_02]: Can you do the math and then we'll follow up.
1:00:05
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
1:00:05
[SPEAKER_03]: If you could just send us a spreadsheet, that would be great.
1:00:08
[SPEAKER_03]: Just type it.
1:00:10
[SPEAKER_01]: A-A-A-I would probably find it for you.
1:00:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, that's not, that's not waste any A-A-I on it.
1:00:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Matt is our original A-I.
1:00:19
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
1:00:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Matt, I'm going to swap my, I'm going to put the question at the end.
1:00:24
[SPEAKER_03]: So I have sometimes played in this group called Life from New York with Teddy Goldstein.
1:00:29
[SPEAKER_03]: I actually am not going to say their names.
1:00:31
[SPEAKER_03]: With three of my very best friends in the world, and I was already friends with them in New York, but you at a Nerf-a-Conference years ago,
1:00:38
[SPEAKER_03]: put us together and then in the round at a showcase.
1:00:42
[SPEAKER_03]: And we called it live from New York.
1:00:44
[SPEAKER_03]: In fact, I think you called it live from New York.
1:00:46
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we kind of became a band.
1:00:48
[SPEAKER_03]: And we made a record currently we're in the iteration of the four of us.
1:00:53
[SPEAKER_03]: But can you name all original members of live from New York?
1:00:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Danny Harry, Teddy Goldstein, and Heaton,
1:01:07
[SPEAKER_06]: Wow, very good.
1:01:09
[SPEAKER_00]: And first time we did a show at the club, it was live from New York.
1:01:13
[SPEAKER_00]: It's Wednesday night.
1:01:16
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, my goodness.
1:01:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, well, because we probably couldn't do a weekend.
1:01:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there was who we didn't have.
1:01:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, my God, you're amazing.
1:01:23
[SPEAKER_03]: And I wanted to.
1:01:24
[SPEAKER_00]: I wanted to.
1:01:24
[SPEAKER_00]: So Ana May just came up the other day because Kenny White was at the club on Friday.
1:01:29
[SPEAKER_00]: And he said the first time he played the club, he thought it was like 1975.
1:01:33
[SPEAKER_00]: And he did it with Ana May wool.
1:01:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my God.
1:01:37
[SPEAKER_03]: That is crazy.
1:01:39
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't think that we were, well, I don't know.
1:01:41
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't think we were that different in H. That's crazy.
1:01:44
[SPEAKER_03]: I know May Wall.
1:01:45
[SPEAKER_03]: She's still out there playing in New York.
1:01:47
[SPEAKER_03]: I see her name around when I'm playing there.
1:01:51
[SPEAKER_03]: I just, I love
1:01:54
[SPEAKER_03]: I love bringing up live from New York because it's just a tiny little tiny example of all the ways that you connect so many artists and that you have, like, wittingly are unwittingly spawned so many incredible friendships and that feels like that's the heart of what you do is like,
1:02:19
[SPEAKER_03]: We all had abs of steel from laughing, hysterically, that time was the best.
1:02:25
[SPEAKER_03]: We love you, Matt.
1:02:26
[SPEAKER_03]: This is so fun.
1:02:27
[SPEAKER_00]: I love you, right, back.
1:02:30
[SPEAKER_02]: One thing that Matt and I got to do one time, I was at his house, and I had my computer, and I opened up the folk alley, music master, library, and I was like, Matt.
1:02:43
[SPEAKER_02]: I bet you know a hundred percent of all of these musicians, because I still only know like 30 percent of the folk alley library names.
1:02:54
[SPEAKER_02]: I'll open it up and I'm like, who the hell is this?
1:02:56
[SPEAKER_02]: And you were like, I feel like you like disassociated, because you're like, oh my god, I haven't heard this name since 1990.
1:03:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And they were wearing a red shirt, like a red shirt.
1:03:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I saw them that they did was, and their cat was sick that night.
1:03:19
[SPEAKER_01]: They were really just right.
1:03:21
[SPEAKER_03]: The motor was full of it.
1:03:24
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, there was one in the third room, you know.
1:03:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And it was so rainy.
1:03:31
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we are not even really exaggerating.
1:03:35
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not.
1:03:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
1:03:36
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
1:03:36
[SPEAKER_00]: It is the Abby often says, she's like, I don't understand the things that you have.
1:03:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
1:03:42
[SPEAKER_03]: So many great things.
1:03:44
[SPEAKER_03]: Gosh.
1:03:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, thank you so much, everybody, for taking the time.
1:03:49
[SPEAKER_02]: This is, like, so it just felt like, you know, it feels like what Pacine feels like.
1:03:54
[SPEAKER_02]: It feels like home.
1:03:55
[SPEAKER_02]: here in you guys talk to each other and congratulations on on three decades mad.
1:04:00
[SPEAKER_02]: You're your America's sweetheart, you're an inspiration for the wind beneath our wings.
1:04:08
[SPEAKER_03]: all the wind.
1:04:09
[SPEAKER_03]: We love you so much, Matt, congratulations.
1:04:12
[SPEAKER_00]: We're breaking the wind.
1:04:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh my God.
1:04:14
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, even better.
1:04:15
[SPEAKER_03]: There it is.
1:04:16
[SPEAKER_00]: There we go.
1:04:17
[SPEAKER_00]: There we go.
1:04:18
[SPEAKER_00]: I love you all dearly.
1:04:19
[SPEAKER_00]: You're all so such an important part of my life and to be able to be part of what you all do is a thrill to me.
1:04:29
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a huge part.
1:04:30
[SPEAKER_00]: A huge part.
1:04:32
[SPEAKER_02]: This episode of Basic Folk was produced by Anthony Cabrera, Dietrich Strauss Composes our music.
1:04:39
[SPEAKER_02]: Basic Folk is on the bluegrass situation.
1:04:41
[SPEAKER_02]: You can find all of our episodes there.
1:04:44
[SPEAKER_02]: You can check us out on folgalley.com or folgalley's mobile app.
1:04:48
[SPEAKER_02]: You can search for Basic Folk on the Series XM app or you can go to basic folk.com.
1:04:53
[SPEAKER_02]: You can also listen wherever you get your shows.
1:04:56
[SPEAKER_02]: If you enjoy this episode, we suggest sharing it with a friend.
1:05:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Perhaps that friend who is very passionate about where they volunteer and you're thinking that maybe perhaps they would like to take that volunteerism to the next level and need some in-spot, send them this episode.
1:05:15
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, thanks for listening all the way to the end.
1:05:17
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll talk to you next time.
1:05:19
[SPEAKER_02]: Bye!