Latest / Pit Talk / Norris wins his first title + what we learnt from 2025: Abu Dhabi GP Review

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Norris wins his first title + what we learnt from 2025: Abu Dhabi GP Review · Pit Talk

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Pit Talk, brought to you by Shannons.
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: On today's episode, Lando Norris is the new World Champion
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: after finishing third in Abu Dhabi to clinch the title
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: by two points. Oscar Piastre meanwhile, takes third in the
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: title race thirteen points, a drift of his teammate after
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: finishing runner up to Max Verstappan in the final Grand
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Prix of the season. My name's Michael Lamanato. It's great
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: to have your company and the company of my co
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: host Abu Dhabi. Doo, it's Matt Clayton.
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: That's the funniest thing that's happened in Abu Dhabi ever, Michael,
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: because as we know, with this particular Grand Prix, basically
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: nothing happens after qualifying, and it's been a full decade
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: of nothing happening after qualifying except for a bit of
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: Nicholas Lativ and Michael Massey and other things in various
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: other years. But Abu Dhabi was as we predicted. But yeah,
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, as an end to a pretty compelling season,
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: it was a bit lame. But we do finally have
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: an answer to who's going to win this World Championship,
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: which was not something we expected to go to the
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: final round, was it.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: No, it wasn't. And yes, some people were also reminded
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: over the week that as much as everyone had the
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty one finale in their minds, people forget that.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: I think fifty of the fifty eight laps were extremely boring,
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: so it's not a surprise standard Abdi, Yes, absolutely standard.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: Abu Dhabi mon't talk about the track. A little bit
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: later on that we should start doing about the man
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: who did eventually clinch the championship at the very last
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: opportunity with the bare minimum result third place, Lando Norris.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: He's the thirty fifth Formula one World champion in the
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: sport's seventy six year history. I know they were saying
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: it was seventy five, but that it's the seventy sixty
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: year correct, and a race that that allowed him while
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: he clearly looked, I think it's fair to say pretty tense,
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: pretty pale before the race. In fact, I read I
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: think ESPN reported that it wasn't just him that was tense,
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: but someone among his group vomited in front of his
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: car on the grid. Remarkable scenes. Didn't say that on
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: the television, but clearly there's a lot of tension in
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: the air, but he got it done with a third place.
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: Was never really a too much risk, but did have
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: to pass some cars after making a slightly earlier then
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: expected pit stop, including Yuki Sonoda, which was off track.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: Or was it maebe you can decide. But he is
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: the world champion. He said he will run the number
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: one on his car next year. Here's the one who
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: got it over the line, as we said, two points
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: ahead of Max. For Stappen, I don't know about you,
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: but I really enjoyed his post race reaction, you know,
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: because I was sort of thinking a lot of us
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: in the media, the great story would have been Max
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: with Stappen winning. I mean, any of them were worthy
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: world champions, but Max with Stappin's comeback was huge. But
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: I couldn't help but think afterwards you I had Max
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: won the title, there would have been a lot of
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: whooping on radio, and then there would have been a
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: lot of well, it hasn't changed my life. Afterwards, I
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: like that we got a world championship outcome, with the
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: driver saying afterwards that it is changing his life, that
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: he's extremely proud that he was emotional that he talked
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: about his parents. I really enjoyed that we got this
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: sort of outcome.
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, agreed. I mean, these World Championship post races are
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: funny in some respects because you know, everyone's so uptight
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: leading into these finales like this, and then you have
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: the combination of you get over the line the greatest
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: thing of your sporting career again in the case of
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: multiple world champions or for a first time with some
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: of these guys, and you have the combination of you've
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: been wound tight like a spring all weekend, you can
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: finally let that go. You've done a million media commitments
• 3:13
  Speaker 2: to Champagne's probably got to your head a little bit,
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: as Hosh all these things, and the mask of caution
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: that a lot of these guys have does tend to
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: drop a little bit, and you know you've been at
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: these I've been at these. These final race deciders are
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: really revealing because you get to find out what's really
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: going on behind the visor with some of these guys.
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: And Norris's press commitments which apparently went for double the
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: actual duration of the actual race, which I thought was
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: really interesting. He had a lot to say to a
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: lot of people that wanted to do a lot of talking,
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: but you really find out a bit about these guys
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: in these moments like this, And I remember it was
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: referencing a piece that I've had over the weekend and
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: it triggered me. But the twenty ten Championship finale that
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: Sebastian Vase one, there was this fantastic scene where he
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: hadn't seen his dad for quite a while after that race,
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: and it was one of those moments where when they
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: finally saw each other, it was with a whole audience
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: of media type standing ground watching it, and there was
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: this fantastic sort of nonverbal nod towards one another, and
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: then the emotion that played out through that, which was
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: really really interesting. And I think with Norris, he's someone
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: who will wear his heart on his sleeve more than
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: most drivers, for good or bad, and it has been
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: for bad at various points during his career. He has
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: left himself vulnerable to criticism about the way he goes
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: about things, but there's some authenticity there. And you and
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: I have laughed about that word in Formula one because
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: it's not something that happens all that often with a
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: lot with a lot of drivers and TEA personnel and
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: other people within the sport. But it was raw and
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: it was genuine. It was actually quite nice to watch
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: because this was unfiltered. I've just achieved something amazing. I'm
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: not going to play it down. I'm not going to
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: put this mask up to hide how I really feel.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: I'm going to let it fly. And you look at
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: the way he drove over the course of the weekend.
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: It's interesting that Martin Brundle picked up on it in
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: commentary as a former driver and someone that should know
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: these things. There was a tension. He looked stiff in
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: the car, if that makes sense, the way he drove
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: all weekend, because you can't help but drive unnaturally in
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: that situation where you are defending a lead that, to
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: all intents and purposes, is kind of unbeatable. You would
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: have to be the architect of your own demise here,
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: and as wide as competitive as these guys are, you
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: can't help but have that in your mind somewhere. You
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: can't completely push it to the back. So when he won,
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: there was that outpouring of relief too, because you know,
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: you think of the alternate universe where he doesn't win it,
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: and what would have happened. After that, there's a sense
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: of relief that didn't happen. But yeah, like you, I
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: enjoyed the post race because it felt quite authentic, really yeah.
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: And I like as well that not that so many
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: drivers win the title and then go on a ram
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: page of how great they are, but that Lando Norris
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: is very reflective, not just on the journey of the championship,
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: but on his own flaws. Even in winning the championship,
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: he had a great, big answer and he answered every
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: question that extensive length about how many mistakes he made
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: this year and how he starts to improve next year,
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: and how he can't be compared to Max with Staffan
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: or even Lewis Hamilton before him as world champions because
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: he's just not in their league at the moment. He
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: still has a lot to prove. It almost did our
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: work for us in setting up the twenty twenty six
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: season really as he's defending championship a year. So I
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: really enjoyed that element of him as well. And you know, yeah,
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: you use the word authentic, I think that is very
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: authentically Lando Norris. I think he spoke as well, and
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: several drivers it Corloor Science in particular, being a former
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: teammate of vis At mclarenen about how Norris proved he
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: could win it his way. He didn't have to change
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: himself as a person. He didn't have to become like Max,
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: he didn't have to become that ruthless driver. I think
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: back to an interview I think he gave to the
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: Guardian way back at the start of the year, saying
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: that he didn't think he had a killer instinct, but
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: that he thought he could win the title without one,
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: and the evidence is that he can. He did. He's
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: proven it to himself. He won it by two points,
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: but two points is old enough. In fact, it's double
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: the points required to win the world champion, so you
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: could say he dominated in that respect. I want to
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: turn our attention very briefly to his celebrations afterwards. Was
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: wrapped up at six am. I just really enjoyed this line.
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: Maybe it's not funny on its own. After six am
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: and I quote then a little McDonald's. I really wanted
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: some chicken nuggets, but it was the morning, so they
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: didn't have any left. I had a sausage McMuffin. Was
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: it the breakfast of champions? Certainly not I regretted it
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: straight away, So.
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: No McDonald's goes on that car next year then, But
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: and it is quite funny that you go through all
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: of this. There's so much to do with the aftermath
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: of any end of season, let alone when you've won
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: the World Championship. And at the end he's just a
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: hungry young bloke looking for a fleet at six am,
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: like so many of us have been so many times
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: in our lives, yet resorting to the thing that was
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: open and then instantly regretting it. We've all been there, Land,
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: we just have less money on the credit card than
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: you do.
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: Well, could get back a little bit to Lando Norris,
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: and I suppose the historical aspect or the future looking
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: aspect of this time. A little bit later on, I
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: want to touch on Maxis Staffen as well, who won
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: the Grand Prix, came very close two points away from
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: winning the title. This is a year in which, because
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: it's so close, you can come up with any number
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: of hypotheticals in which any of the top three win
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: the championship. I mean, had andre Kimi Antonelli not slither
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: it off the road in Kata and held fifth place
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: or fourth places, there was ahead of Lando Norris, then
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: this might have been enough to win the title for
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: Maxis Staffen. Just don't mention the Spanish Grand Prix, because
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: you get quite the snarky response from Max, who wasn't
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: appreciative at all being asked whether or not he regretted
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: crashing into George Russell deliberately and being penalized for it,
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: costing many more than the two points that ended up
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: deciding the title. He pointed out that, well, you probably
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: didn't deserve all the mistakes McLaren made late in the
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: year to keep him in contention. I suppose that's true too,
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: But Matt I really thought this race felt like a
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: little bit of almost a microcosm of the second half
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: of the season overall, from the start of practice where
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: Red Bull Racing looked a little bit out of it,
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: not out of the ballpark completely, but not on McLaren's pace.
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: Then Saturday they turned up and they were thereabouts in practice,
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: and then in qualifying with Staffan puts in two laps
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: good enough for poland Q three. Thinking about the way
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: that Lando Norris looked a little bit stiff, I thought
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: that was really reflective of the sense he must have
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: had that Red Bull Racing was inevitable this weekend, a
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: weekend and McLaren thought would suit its card good enough
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: that they could just grind out the result in the
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: end adjusted that but without being able to win the race.
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: This felt like and Vestapen suggested this as well, despite
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: it not being a title winning campaign, a really complete
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: and impressive performance from him. It almost feels like, to
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: use I guess an English sporting term, the moral victory
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: for Max with Staffan.
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: You won't be hearing that on the sky coverage. We no.
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: I've just been simultaneously amazed yet not at the same
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: time of the amount of times this year they've turned
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: up at a race weekend Red Bull and Friday has
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: just been like, oh, what are these guys doing? Like
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: they're supposed to be better than this, and they're constantly
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: chasing their tail. This is not the way to win
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: a world championship. And then by the time you get
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: to Q three twenty four hours later, it's all sorted
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: because you've got the combination of them being able to
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: I mean, I guess you could say they're very good
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: at engineering their way out of black holes because they've
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: done it so many times. This year. But you combine
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: that relentlessness and then the whole thing with Verstapan is
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: it's never give me the easiest car to drive, give
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: me the theoretically fastest car to drive, and I'll just
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: make it work. And it's part of the problem why
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: they're just going through so many other drivers in the
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: other car, because that's not really a sustainable way for
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: ninety five percent of Formula One drivers to go racing.
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: But he is the great difference maker at the moment.
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: And yes, you know, he just failed to become the
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: first driver to win five consecutive championships since Michael Schumacher
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: and only the second driver ever to do that. If
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: you're wondering where Max the Stapan sits in the all
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: time record books, that probably gives you a bit of
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: a hint. But I just think this is the absolute
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: best version of him we've seen, because I mean, how
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: many times this year did he and Red Bull right
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: off their championship chances. And we've said this on previous
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: podcasts in that I can't think of another driver in
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: the field that would have been able to have even
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: got this to the last round, let alone, you know,
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: finished two points away from winning it and we can
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: debate who the second, third, fifth, our best driver is
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: in Formula one at the moment. To my mind, the
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: gap between one and two and whatever follows after that
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: has not been bigger in the Vestapan era than it
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: is this year. What's really interesting to me is that
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: the red Bull that we see for the Australian Grand
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: Prix next March when everyone gets back down to Albert Park,
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: is so so different from a team and organization that
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: has had quite a lot for F one term's stability
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: over the course of their journey. And they were the
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: same team principle until midway through this year. A lot
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: of the same faces in the same roles. You go
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: into a new rule set, new engine partner, everything is
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: changed except for the one difference maker that they have.
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: And so the interesting part for me is are we
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: going to look back at twenty twenty five wistfully and think, oh,
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: how good was Max Verstappen that year he didn't win
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: the world title? But look at what's happened to them
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: since I think that's the interesting subject for me. But
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: in terms of the fact this even got to the
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: last round, given they won the constructors in was it
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: Singapore they won the Constructor. I think it was six
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: six rounds to go. This should have been dead and
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: buried well before avid Dhabi. The fact that it came
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: down to the last racers season, it was great for
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: the TV spectacle until we remembered that we were in Avidhabi.
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: It was great in prospect for the TV spectacle and
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: the worldwide audience that we got a final round of
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: the season. But a testament to how good he's been
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: this year. I don't know about you. There's not another
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: driver that could have taken this to the last round?
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: Is there no more wins than both well either Piastri
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: and Norris. Eight victories ends the season with which is remarkable,
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: almost all of them coming since the mid season break,
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: during which time he's been clearly the best driver in
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: the field. I just want to breathe, very briefly, detour
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: to Yuki Sonoda, who had his last race for every racing,
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: perhaps the last race of his career, and detO or
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: even a step backwards to Sergio Peris, because we want
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: to compare twenty twenty one and twenty twenty five. Maybe
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: you don't, but Sergio Peis does, who are tweeted just
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: a single word added emoji lackning, invoking comparisons between Sonoda's
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: defense of Lando Norris early in the race in his
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: defense of Lewis Halmter. It did have a pivotal role
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: in Maxwistappen when he his first world title. This for
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: me probably wasn't the victory lap Peis thought it was
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: because I mean, last year he retired with crash damage
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: from the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix. So that's maybe a
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: more accurate direct comparison and qualified I think at exactly
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: the same place as Sonoda in fact, with a very
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: similar margin. But it shows that in painting that picture
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: of where Red Bull Racing is actually out with or
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: without the stapan, there are some pretty significant questions to answer.
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: You know, Isaac Hadg is going to be promoted to
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: that seat next year. Good luck to him in his
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: final year in Formula one, I suppose, but there's a
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: big question there.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And look the fact that Vastapen was really sort
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: of plowing alone Farr for so much of this season.
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: If there was ever a race weekend where you needed
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: the guy and the sister car to actually be available
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: to deploy strategically for more than three hundred meters over
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: the course of a y eight lap Grand Prix. This
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: was it, and this was the problem that Verstappen faced
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: towards the end of the season then that he had
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: to do it all by himself because there was no
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: help coming from the other side. And it's amazing to think.
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: And I've just written this somewhere else today, so it's
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: front of mine. But Hajar is going to be Verstapan's
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: sixth different teammate since Daniel Ricardo left Red Bull. That
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: is absolutely wild and given the way that they've got
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: about it. Look, I wish Isaac haja are all the
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: good luck in the world, and he's had a much
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: better rookie season than probably all of us were expecting.
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: But evidence suggests that you're not there for a long
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: time or a good time if you're in the second
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: seat next to mix for Stappen.
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: Good all right, we've got to talk about Oscar Pastri.
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: Of course we do. Australia's World Championship hope. His championship
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: hopes came to a close by margin of thirteen points
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: at the end of the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix. A
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: season of many elements for him, a very strong start
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: after he got past his Australian Grand Prix, what looked
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: like consolidation after the mid season break when he won
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: the Dutch Grand Prix. Some reasonable races after that, of course,
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: barring Azerbaijan where he had a bizarre crash prone twenty
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: four hours, and then a form slump through the Americas
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: which left him behind Lando Norris and the title chase
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: and only with a mathematical chance really of winning it
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: in Abu Dhabi. A lot of elements to dissect you,
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: but let's just start with the big one. What do
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: you think we take away from Piastre season overall? Here
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: came very close for a time, looked like the guy
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: who would just win it by virtue of his lead,
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: falls just short. But this is only his third season
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: in Formula one.
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's the thing we've got. As much as
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: you can talk about the thirty four point lead after
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: Zandvoort and the wins and everything else, if you had
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: told us that this was going to be the outcome
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: for Oscar Piastre at the start of the season, even
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: before Melbourne, and then particularly afterwards, given that what happened
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: in that race and those twenty three points that he
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: shipped to his teammate. This is a massive pass mark
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: for him considering how young he is in his Formula
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: One journey. But and you know, it's a big caveat here.
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: You can't help but look at this as being the
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: one that got away simply because McLaren was so much
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: better than everybody else for the majority of the year
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: that they turned the tap off on the development of
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: that car mid season because they figured it was just
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: going to be an intro team fight for the title,
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: not counting god backs for staff and Exzuombi givebiself from
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: the grave that Red Buller put him into player factor
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: in this. And you know, when you're up against a
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: guy who you know, someone like Norris, who you know,
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: he's been pretty public and the way that he beats
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: himself up when things go don't go particularly well. He
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: never won a championship before either, it was all new
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: to him. It was all new to McLaren. This felt
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: like an amazing opportunity for Piastre to do something ahead
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: of schedule. Simply was the way that circumstances conspire. And
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: so yeah, when you've had a lead of that much
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: and you've gone down by thirteen points. You know, in
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: totality you finished third in the World Championship and your
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: thirteen points off the world champion. That's a very very
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: good season. But you can't help just think, oh, man,
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: you know there's still there's still some weaknesses in the
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: physical game, I guess, and we saw that on the
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: low grip tracks when F one goes through the Americas
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: and there's a couple of things there that he needs
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: to clean up. But his career so far has been this.
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: You know, you win around the margins in Formula one
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: and the speed's not in question, the temperament and all
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: of that. But you know, a couple of seasons ago
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: it was tire management and it was qualifying pace, and
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: there's all these little deficiencies that he has cleaned up.
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: So there's a track record there to think that some
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: of his form on these lower grip tracks he will
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: find a way to mitigate that and they will never
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: be a massive strength. But they're also not going to
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: be a huge weakness either. The curious part for me,
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: and look, he's not likely to say, at least not now.
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: It might be something that comes up in the future.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: You know, you talk about small margins with these things,
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: but psychologically what the Monza swap order did for him mentally,
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: and the fact that yes, it was a three point
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: swig and not Zoo Boyds. He could say it was
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: pretty critical, but it was more what it did in
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: the moment and maybe some of the doubts that a
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: simple instruction might have placed in his head that I'm
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: sure he wasn't thinking about it every single day of
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: the week, and it's very, very hard to It's like
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: that itchy can't scratch, isn't it. It's there, You know
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: it's there, and it affects you more on some days
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: more than others. It'd be really interesting one day if
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: he actually ever opens up about that. He did a
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: little bit on the Beyond the Group podcast where he
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: kind of alluded to it but didn't go too far
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: with that. But we've discussed it on this podcast ad
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: nauseum this year. It was a bit of an overreach,
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: and I guess you could say for McLaren that, you know,
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: the end did justify the memes, but you also wonder
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: about what damage that did between Oscars years, between Monza
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: and the end of the season, because coincidentally or not
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: he wasn't the same driver after that, and you know
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: we talked about Zanfort and that thirty four point lead.
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: That was the last time he won a Grand Prix
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: and so all of the former momentum he had in
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: the first two thirds of the year just completely dissipated. Now,
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: whether these things are what's the same correlational causation, I
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: guess we'll never know. But one of these days I
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: m I actually say something about it. But on the whole,
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: I mean for him and his team and the people
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: around him, and also Australian Formula one fans to have
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: someone that close to winning the world title and being
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: a legitimate shot for it in the way that Daniel
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: Ricardo never felt like he was, or Mark Webber ever
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: felt like he was. It's a new experience for us
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: here as Australian media, Australian fans, the Australian Grand Prix
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: in the event here and what Formula One is now
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: in twenty twenty five. You'd have to say it's a
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: massive success of a season, but one with a little
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: bit of a bitter after taste. I guess yeah.
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: And I think the question now is to encompass a
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: little bit of all of that is, he goes into
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: next season not just as the driver who came close
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: to the world title, who led more rounds than any
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: other driver this season, but as the teammate of the
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: reigning drivers champion. There'll be a number one in the
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: garage next to him, no longer the number four. And
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: I wonder how that changes or not the dynamic because
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: you're thinking back to some of the flash points this year,
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: and you're right, because the Italian Grand Prix team all
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: does not happen, max Verstaffn would have won the title.
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: So whether or not you want to draw a direct
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: link between those points in the title, there's some at
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: least subtle reinforcement to McLaren that everything it did this
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: year was right, that it's gut instinct was correct, because
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: it ended up winning both titles as the culmination of
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: all of it decisions. So on the one hand, you'd
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: be tempted to think not much changes, but then you
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: consider the fact that they have a driver's title to
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: defend next year. The team does because driver's title also
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: belongs to the team in a way, How does that
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: change the dynamic inside the team? Does it change even
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: if Pastri emerges and has taken another massive step forward
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: like he did between twenty four and twenty five, and
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: Norris takes a more incremental step. What will the confidence
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: effects be Orlando Norris by running that number one, by
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: having proven to himself he can win the world title?
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: Does he change the game? While everything is evolutionary in
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: formula one, putting the break changes to one side, And
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: whether or McLaren's going to be good we don't know.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: But all the principles set up this year, you know,
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: you'd like to think they apply all the time, but
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: internally I think things do shift significantly because the status
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: of these drivers has changed now and the status of
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: what the team is going out to try and prove
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: has changed. Whether or not those rules can stand up
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: to those changes, I think is a really interesting question.
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: And you do wonder too that if McLaren had its
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: time over and where they public, will you would admit
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: this or not? To my mind, the whole Papyah rules thing,
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: because it's been done to death and I'm kind of
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: sick of just Papius generally at this point. But it's
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: one of those ones that you do wonder if they
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: wish they'd try to keep that internal, because it's just
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: become this whole saying of Papyah rules has just become
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: this lightning rod for criticism and debate and questioning and
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: everything else. You can still have the same set of
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: rules and still adhere to them, but maybe keep it
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: something more internal, or just don't name it after a fruit.
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: I don't know. It's something that's been concocted in some
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: sort of marketing meeting where a lot of people nod
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: to each other, and it plays really badly in the
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: outside world. But you can still have the same rules
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: and principles, and goodness knows, we've known teams that have
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: had that over the years. It's just that it became
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: so public and became such a lightning rod for criticism
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: that you know, they probably like their time over. And yeah,
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: you can say that the end justifies the means, but
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: there was far too much angst, quite frankly, for a
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: team that had the best car by an absolute mile
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: for the majority of twenty twenty five made a very
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: very hard for themselves. Yes, got the result, they were
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: onto it, but yeah, maybe if they had their time over,
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: keep that one internal.
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: Perhaps at least just keep the name internal. I think
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: that'll be the number one thing they'd go back and change.
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: Just not use that word correct, just use the color
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: of the car's orange. Yes, I know that's also our fruit,
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: and it's not. It doesn't need to be named papaya anyone.
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: It's surely not the same exact color. Beside the point,
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: let's move on. Map to Move of the Week, brought
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: to you by Shannon's. This is the end of the
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: motorsports seat International motorsports, most international motorsports season. There's some
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: racing over the off season, okay, but just the Formula
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: One Grand Prix on at the weekend. What moves at
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: Abu Dhabi caught your eye?
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: That's the toughest question you've asked me all year, apparently,
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: So I had to look at that went and had
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: to look at the stats. Apparently there was sixty overtakes
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: in Abu Dhabi. Yes, right, I reckon, We saw I reckon.
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: We saw about six of those. Because the entire TV
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: coverage there was all sorts going on down the field
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: in Abu Dhabi. By the way, you had to read
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: about it in retrospects twenty four to forty eight hour later.
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: Because the TV coverage caught absolutely none of it. You
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: had positions in the top ten being changed after the
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: race for people breaching track limits and blocking and weaving
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: and doing all sorts of nonsense. But to my mind,
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: the move of the week is, yes, that little period
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: of the race where Norris was pitched into some traffic
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: and he had to do some overtaking sort of lap
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: eighteen nineteen. I think he was ninth after that pit stop,
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: and given what was at stake and the sort of
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: the stiffness that he's driving that we were talking about,
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: had to pass him out Nelly. He passed Ley and
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: lost it in last strolling one move before heading off
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: towards Yuki Sonoda, and that was its own story. But
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: when you give someone you can so easily tag a
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: front wing there, or hit a curb too hard, or
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: just get it slightly wrong. And given that he was
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: driving a little bit stiff over the course of the weekend,
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: you can imagine Norris coming out of that pit stop
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: and that said, all right, you've got to overtake a
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: B and C here and you take the big intake
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: of breathless like if I get one of these wrong.
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: The ramifications of this massive so the fact that yes,
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: in a fastup car, but executed them cleanly. I did
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: like the double pass of Lawson and Stroll, which I
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: thought was quite fun. So yeah, given a difficult situation,
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: Authorughty passed it with flying colors, and given the absence
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: of other options, Michael, I'm going with that as a
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: movement the week.
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: Very good. You've taken all the overtakes as so as I.
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: There's five in that group, but that's quite okay. I
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: give it to you.
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: Well, there's fifty five to go.
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, that's exactly right. Yes, I'll choose Oliver bem
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: and passing. Yuki said, I don't know, I'm going to choose.
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: I know there's a little last risk of this after
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: the fact, but I'm going to put Piastre overtaking Norris
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: on the first lap at turn nine. Yeah. It was
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: very impressive at the time or dats at the time.
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: Afterwards we learned that Norris probably and well probably knew
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: at the time anyway, but sort of let it go
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: a little bit because he knew that that was going
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: to work for him, having Piastre between him and Bestap
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: and Piastre on the hard attire pressuring Bestap and nonetheless
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: he had to pull it off, but also impressive for
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: I think a couple of different reasons that just speak
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: to all of the factors going into that last race.
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: One is that, as we saw, Norris was willing to
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: play the numbers game and hopeful that he wouldn't drop
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: a fourth because that did put him on the bubble
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: even if he had Team Orders in his pocket at
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: the end, still a risk there. But the other is
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: that I think it did speak to the number one
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: question into the weekend was Team Orders. Would McLaren just
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: back Norris would at some point it just understand that
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: Piastre is such a long shot they'd throw him, throw
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: him away essentially, but Piastre was allowed to run an
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: alternative strategy. It had the double benefit of helping Norris,
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: but it was the only strategy he really had to
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: maybe capitalize on something silly happening late in the race
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: and then maybe put himself in a position to win
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: by starting on the hard tire, running really deep, hoping
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: for a safety car or red flag or something to
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: battle with their stap and put some pressure on early on.
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: So Piastre going forward as well, taking that strategy, taking
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: the hard tire with less grip on the first lap,
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: making that move, applying that pressure, I just thought was
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: a good way for him to end his season. It
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: was a little bit muted, as I think we were
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: saying earlier. We're talking before the podcast cut, remember a
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: somewhat muted end to Piastre's season, notwithstanding that he absolutely
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: dominated the cut our week end with everything except victory.
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: For obvious reasons, I thought that was just still a
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: good way to end season. I also thought it was
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: a little bit of a nice bookmark, passing Norris around
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: the outside of turn nine, casting our minds back to
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: Australia where the move that got him ninth place. Who
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: knows could have been important in the points tally on
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: Lewis Hamilton through the Chicane. I just thought a nice
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: way to remind us going into the break that YESPS
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: three is still there. He's still the driver we saw
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: in three quarters of the season. It just wasn't in
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: a position to claim the title at the end.
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: I agreed it was nice to have him back for
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: Guitar and Abu Dhabi because what happened between what from
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: Azerbaijan onwards was a bit of a pay limitation for
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: what he was for the majority of the year, which
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: was very good. As we discussed earlier.
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: Let's wrap up the season now with a couple of
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: questions I think heading into twenty six, still reflecting on
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: twenty five, you know we've got one more episode of
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: the podcast to go as well, so let's not call
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: it final. But this season has left us with some
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: questions to ponder, both retrospectively thinking about where this season
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: stands for the careers of drivers, but also looking forward
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: to twenty twenty six when there is going to be
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: a significant change with the cars, perhaps with the pecking order.
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: That's the hope for some teams at least, unless so
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: for others. But let's start again with Lando Norris. He's
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: thirty fifth world champion. Now you'll have heard repeatedly also
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: the eleventh British world champion. Not really relevant for our purposes,
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: but it's certainly become one of the talking points that
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: ten British drivers have preceded him. What kind of champion, though,
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: do you think he is? Because to my mind, as
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: we've spoken about, Matt has cut himself from a different
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: clot certainly of a recent world champions of well they've
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: really only been Max with stapp and Lewis Hamilton Nico
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: Rosburg in the last decade, but feels like a change
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: of pace. I think some people haven't liked that. Some
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: people have felt like that that's somehow detracts from greatness.
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: I suppose maybe they've got used to having all time clear,
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: all time great swinning book. What do you think this
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: stands him up in the history of Formula One acknowledging
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: of course that he's not done.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it is interesting that you think back as far
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: as the last time we had a multi driver Abu
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: Dhabi Finale was twenty ten. You look at the guys
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: that have won championship since then, there's not many of
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: them because they aastually in Vettel won for in a
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: row and Lewis Hamilton won six and seven years of
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: Max Vstappen one for in a row, so there's actually
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: not many names to choose from here. But it's interesting,
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: like do I see Norris as being some sort of
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: just winning machine now that he's got the first one,
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: and then you know we're about to enter the Norris
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: era like we had the vattal Era and the Vastapan Era.
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: I don't see that. But I also, to me, I
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: think he's he's more in the Jensen button jacques Ville
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: Nerve perhaps mold in that I can't see. You know,
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: we're going to go into this era of world championship
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: winning here he's more like that. But I also don't
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: think he's going to be one of these guys that
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: will just be happy with getting one and then just
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: that's fine. The startling thing with Norris, and it's because
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: he's been around for so long and they will start
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: so young these days. He's still only twenty six, and
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: so there's a lot of headroom there to grow. And
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: then you look at the psychological makeup and the way
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: he goes about his racing. You do wonder what actually
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: having the pressure of winning one off your shoulder is
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: going to mean for where his potential ceiling might get to. Now,
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: did he need to win this first one to put
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: some of those doubts that he's admitted to having in
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: the cupboard and just getting him behind him? And then
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: do you maybe find a different level now that you've
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: got the pressure of well, at least I've done this.
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: You do wonder where it goes age wise? And profile
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: was he's got time to do that. But I don't
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: think we're going to eat. We're not going to look
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: back in six or seven years and go I remember
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: that five year period where Lando Norris won four world championships.
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: I think the depth, the depth is too great. The
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: twenty twenty six rule changes are too much of an
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: unknown and I'm just not sure that he's that driver. Now.
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: That's not to say that he's not worthy of being
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: a world champion, because he's just proved that he is.
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: But I don't know about you, but I just don't
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: see this sort of sustained era of Lando Norris winning
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: championships just for fun coming up. But maybe you have
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: a different view than me.
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think what I've been saying this week or
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: in the twenty four hours of hours since the race
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: is while Norris the star has risen and he has
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: achieved what a lot of people have thought he would
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: be capable of, what his raw speed has certainly made
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: him capable of, I don't feel like the vestapan era
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: has ended. No, perhaps he'll be a driver, and perhaps
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: here'll be other drivers as well, because if a stapan
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: Era could go, although well, he suggested it could be
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: limited to a few more years, but could go for
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: longer that he could be in that category of drivers
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: who had the misfortune of having their best years coincide
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: with verstaff and being on the grid. Now, luckily for him,
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: I mean, he's got one, because it could so easily
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: have been him not winning this one and the next
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: year the rules changed. Who knows, maybe red balls engines
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: really good. We just get another four years of a
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: staff and then where's everyone left? But I don't see this,
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: I think would it would be a remarkable turn of events.
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: It actually this becomes the Lando Norris era. And again
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: that isn't to talk down his abilities, because I think
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: we've been blessed and or cursed depending on how you
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: want to look at it, to have lived now through
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: decades of all time f one greats. Maybe that's always
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: been the case, but certainly we've had these great, long
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: spells of domination color really the last two decades, I
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: mean from Schumacher. Then we had a Fernando or Lonso interlude.
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: We've got a couple of fun years where we had
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: some variety, but then, like you say, we vedel Hamilton Staffen.
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: May we maybe, but maybe this will be the beginning
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: of not the Norris era, but of the era of
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: more open competition. Maybe that's what the new rules will
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: usher in. I think that'll be interesting. Into question for
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: me is if we compare him to Verstaffen Verstapan after
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: winning his first Wall title did change, but I think
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: it actually was more about rounding out some rough edges.
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: You know, we've seen him actually dial his aggression back
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: as a result, maybe by one percent to one hundred
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: percent instead of one hundred and one. That compare some
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: of the moves he pulled in twenty twenty one, and
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: although clearly that's still a little bit in there, if
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: we think that Spain this year, Norris though for me,
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: feels much more like a confidence driving over Staffan has
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: never lacked confidence, but Norris clearly has. I'm really interested
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: to know whether there is another greater and unexpected level
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: for him to find going into a season being able
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: to call him the defending world champion an achnology, He's
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: still got gaps in his game, to feel how much
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: does confidence account for in that because of all the
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: drivers on the grid, at the front of the pack
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: and you ate the moment. I feel like for him
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: confidence is the factor for him that is the biggest
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: compared to the rest.
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, agreed, And the decision to run the number one,
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: which you don't have to do it firus Lewis Hamilton
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: never did I do like that For what that symbolizes.
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: And if you are having one of those weekends when
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: you're a bit lost or things are a bit bad,
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: or these external factors or whatever it is, every time
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: you walk into that garage and you see that number
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: one on the nose cone of your car, that's that
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: little reminder. It's like, oh, yeah, I've done that already.
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: And as much as I don't think that's going to
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: make maxistappen any better or not, whether he has a
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: one or a thirty three on his car, is he's
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: going to have next year, which we haven't seen for
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: quite some time for someone of Norris's sort of probably
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: more open psychological profile. I think that is actually an
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: important thing. I'm glad that he's running it. I just
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: think that if you ever win the World Championship, why
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: the hell would you not if you don't want to
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: change social media hashtag or something like what are we
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: actually doing here? The number one is something that is
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: so precious because you are the best in the world
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: in a truly global sport, and you have achieved that.
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: Your whole life's been about doing that. The choice to
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: not run it for other reasons seems a little bit
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: silly to me. I'm glad that he's decided to embrace that.
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: And yeah, every time you see the front of the
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: orange slash Papa McLaren next year with a one on it,
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: that'll certainly make you walk a little bit taller.
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: I'd say, all right, let's flip this question on its
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: ted now and reflect on Oscar Piastree's season a little
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: bit more. Obviously didn't win the title, as you said,
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: though this would have been an early victory. I think
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: if you've gone back to before Australia, no one would
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: have expected him to have certainly led the championship, but
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: even potentially be in title contention. No one gave him
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: the credit that now seems so obvious to have given
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: him after the season he had. But do you think
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: he needed to lose this championship to understand what it's
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: going to take to win one in the future. Acknowledging
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: though not to preface out to preview our next question,
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: but it's pretty rare to come back and beat a
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: teammate to the title in F one history.
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: It is, Yeah, that's that's something we need to think
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: about for sure. But look, to my mind, does he
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: need to learn to lose one to know how to win? Will? Clearly,
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: because there's still things that he will acknowledge it he
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: needs to get better at and he has acknowledged that.
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: And so my takeaway for him this season is the
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: ceiling's high enough, but there's a need to raise this
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: floor and that we've seen how good he can be
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: when he's absolutely at his apex, but the rope raises,
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: all the bad weekends are still dragging him down a
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: bit too much. But the one thing anticipating this, I
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: wanted to look at the first three after the first
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: three seasons for Norris and for Stappan, the two other
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: guys in the championship mix this year, you know, because
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: it does feel like Piastre has skipped a few steps,
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: the fact that he's already here in season number three.
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: So after three seasons, Landa Norris had five total podiums
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: and Maxis Stappan had three total wins. After his first
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: three seasons in Formula one, Oscar Piastre is tied for
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: third for the most wins Byustralian driver in Formula One
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: ever with Mark Webber with nine wins after three seasons.
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: So you look at the first three seasons of those
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: three drivers that were in the mix this year, you
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: would have to say, well, Oscar Piastri's on a very
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: very good path of the potential greatness based on what
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: the others did in their first three seasons. Now, he
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: is a little bit older than Vastappen was or Norris
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: was because they both started so young. But three seasons
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: is three seasons and being in this level of championship
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: fight and with some very obvious and it wouldn't say easy,
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: but certainly evident things that you can clean up. Being
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: in this position, he's probably ahead of schedule and the
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: lessons that you learn from losing one. He doesn't strike
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: me as a guy who's going to be continually making
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: the same mistakes and we've seen that over the course
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: of his career so far. If that continues to track,
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: then yeah, why not. I think ahead of schedule and
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: has skipped steps. But it does feel that he needing
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: to lose a championships a strange term, because no one
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: really wants to do this, but sometimes longer term it's
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: in your benefit. But I know, does any of that
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: make sense? Because you know, for him to have come
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: through and won this year would feel incredibly ahead of
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: schedule as good as it would have been.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, And I think I just reflecting or thinking
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: while you were talking that there are only so many
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: drivers you could put into this scenario so early and
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: expect them to get better rather than struggle, Like there's
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: several drivers you'd put in the car who you know
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: the first year I was pretty ropy with McLaren are
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: still sort of at a low level that have improved
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: a lot in the second half of the season, and
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: then last year to be content for the results to
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: matter for the Constructors' Championship big pressure, and then this
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: year to be contending for the title massive pressure. There
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: are a lot of other drivers who are talent and
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: who are fast, who maybe would have been as fast
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: in their first year as Piastre was, who I just
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: couldn't see kicking on in the same way that he,
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: who would have struggled under the pressure of suddenly leading
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: the championship this year and then perhaps collapse because Norris
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: would have been able to redouble his game a bit better,
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: there would have been more gaps in it or whatever.
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: I think that's also testament to him, you know that
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: thinking about the trajectory moving forward, the fact that it's
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: largely unbent by the pressure of this year is very impressive.
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: And you know, we talk about raising his floor and
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: that is ultimately that's I think the case for most
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: drivers at the point end of the fielding. It's the
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: case with Norris as well. For Stappen I suppose as well.
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: The floor is pretty small though. You know, there were
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: a couple of races that were extremely costly, but really
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: they were a couple of races. You know, after Italy
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: he had some quiet rounds but nothing dire. You know,
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: Singapore was he had podium pace, he qualified higher up.
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: It was the bump at the start, and then nothing
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: happened in that Grand Prix. Even as a vaiant he
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: had pace, but it was obviously just a dreadful weekend
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: for me. It really just comes down to Austin and
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: Mexico City, maybe to a lesser extent Brazil, but again
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: should have finished second there where it not for the penalty.
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: That's not a lot of improvements required, you know and
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: have had if we had our can total repeat next
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: year of this season, and you said all you had
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: to do is score a little bit better in Austin
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: and Mexico City. That seems very achievable considering everything we
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: know about how he improves race to race and year
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: to year. So I think you will be better off
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: for the lessons this year, but not necessarily because it
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: cost him the title, simply because it was another year.
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: And the other thing too that we need to factor
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: in where these seasons just get longer and longer. There
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: are twenty four rounds, which means there are more chances
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: to make mistakes or to have rope weekends than there's
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: ever been because trying to sustain that level over so
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: many stops over a I mean, you look at the
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: last three rounds of this season and where we've been
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: in the past three weeks. It still defies any sort
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: of sense or logic that we've gone Vegas, Qatar, Abi
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: Dhabi in three weeks. And there's a human element to
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: all of this. So yeah, you get to the end
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: of a twenty four round season, you are probably going
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: to have one or two that are not so great
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: because there's so many of them.
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: Yes, and we had a good old fashioned sixteen round season,
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: he would have won the championship. So just think about it,
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: all right, Yes, let's think about a question that's been
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: kicked around a lot in the last week. I think
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: they're just quietly as well. Been a lot of hyperbole
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: in the last week, but that's understandable considering the title
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: decided brings out a lot of emotion. But the question
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: I've been asked a lot that's being asked a lot.
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: Does Piastre need to leave McLaren, we should add here
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: to win the world title. I don't think he needs
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: to leave McLaren full stop. That's not much of a question.
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: But we said it's very rare historically for drivers to
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: beat their defending either the defending World championship teammates or
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: the teamates who have won a championship with that team
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: in subsequent season, So he'd be doing something that would
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: be unusual if you were to win or to beat
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: Norris to a title while they both raced for McLaren.
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: Does that mean he needs to seek his first world
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: championship elsewhere?
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: As you're reading that question, I'm trying to think of
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: the last one, and you'll probably have a better You
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: can at least jump on Fox while I'm talking here
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: and try and find it. But I'm trying to think
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: who was who was the last driver to do that? Anyway,
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: that's another discussion. N okay, Yeah, sure, and then promptly retired.
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: Is Oscar Piastre this decade's Nico rospin if they're very
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: cruel if for his post race appearance fee, I certainly
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: hope so. But the way you framed that was interesting.
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: Does he need to leave McLaren? No? Does he need
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: to leave McLaren to win a world title, even if
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: that's longer term? Maybe? And I'd be less adamant about
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: this if the twenty twenty five rules carried over to
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: next year, because you know, if you look at where
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: McLaren was at the end of twenty twenty four, they
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: won the constructors Championship, it was no surprise that they
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: were going to be good this year because you were
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: at the end of a mature rule set and they
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: had the high ground, and that's the way it played
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: out over the course of the year. Twenty six is
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: such a reset here and your point of you know,
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: once momentum in a team shifts behind one driver simply
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: by dint of the success that they've had Norris in
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: this situation, it becomes super hard to redress that. So
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: I guess if I'm going to answer my own question
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: here Orlando Norris style like he did in the press conference,
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: if he's not at McLaren, then where does he go?
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: And we know that he's contracted until twenty twenty eight.
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: I don't trust Formula one drive contracts. There are only
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: a starting point for negotiations, as you know with these things.
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: But you think how different the sport could be in
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: twenty twenty eight when he's theoretically out of contract. Bernado
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: a lot. So I'll probably still be driving somewhere. But
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: as for some of the others, Lewis Hamilton won't be
• 41:08
  Speaker 2: driving in twenty twenty eight. I wouldn't have thought Max
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: with Stappa might not be driving in twenty twenty eight.
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: That seems possible. And given that we don't really know
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: where this rule set is going to take us at
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: this point, and what happens in the first third of
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: next season, maybe the beginning of a trend or just
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: a massive outlivee by the time we get to the
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: end of the twenty four rounds next season, I would
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: argue that, yeah, he might need to, and that's no
• 41:30
  Speaker 2: slight on McLaren or no Dickett, Norris or anything else,
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: but your point of it's really really hard historically to
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: come back and win within the same team when someone
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: has beaten you. You look at the car advantage that
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: Mercedes had for so much of the start of that
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: V six turbo hybrid era. They are in their own
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: category for a lot of the time. So just by
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: being the second driver in that team, you were and
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: nailed on runner up in the World Championship before the
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: caesar started, let's be perfectly honest, and so you can
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: then benefit off the misfortune. You have to remember Rosberg
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: won that title in twenty six primarily because Lewis Hamilton's
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: engine blew up in Malaysia and opened the door, and
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: it was it was an open goal that he took
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: and then promptly retired because he probably didn't think he
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: was going to do it again. So does he need
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: to leave McLaren to win a World Championship? I would
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: suggest yes. Don't ask me where it needs to go,
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: because that's something we need to see what happens in
• 42:18
  Speaker 2: twenty twenty six. He's going to have no shortage of
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: suitors if he wants to get out. That's the good news,
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: because he's of the age profile and he's clearly a
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: guy for the future. Where that addresses. I guess we're
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: going to find out in twenty twenty six. But I
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: judging by the look on your face here, which is
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: useless at an audio podcast, I realized you may not
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: be you may not be completely in agreeance here.
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: I think. And something I was thinking about the start
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: of the year, because it seemed obvious one of these
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: drivers is going to end up with the world title,
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: is it's not so much the first one, it's the
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: second one. I think if Norris wins another title, okay, yeah,
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: regardless of the Papaya rules, the orange rules, poor poor rules,
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: I think that fundamentally changes the dynamic, especially if it's
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: back to back. Rris goes and out out and wins
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: the title again next year, even if it's close. I
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: think that does change something more than a single world
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: title does. Particularly given this single world title was. I mean,
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: it's no disrespect to Norris, but it was very closely fought.
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: Anyone could have won it. Yep, Norris was the one
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: who won it. I think that does change something. And
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: the other thing I was thinking about is you're speaking
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: well I haven't. I mean, I know Nico Rospect. He's
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: the one driver who's beaten his teammate. He's defending title
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: teammate to a championship. I don't know how many have
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: done it before, or if it's happened before that. I
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: also don't know how many drivers have left a team
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: at which the defending world championships raced and then beaten
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: them in another team. So I'm also not sure that
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: statistically it makes much difference. Alan Prost I guess because
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: then he went to Williams and like I guess, technically,
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: but he came by Ferrara, isn't he So that sort
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: of I don't know if that counts.
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: And also had a season where he sat out to remember.
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: Yes exactly, so this sort of you know, maybe we
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: can consistically that maybe that's something will wrighte up Fox
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: Sports at some point. I don't want to jinx it
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: by necessarily saying we'll do it this year. Maybe it's
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: something for the end of next year. But I think
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: there isn't any interesting question there. But then what's interesting
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: about the rules changing next year is we assume that
• 44:06
  Speaker 1: regardless of who's going to be in the front, we
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: assume McCain's going to be roughly in the mix, even
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: if they may not be a title contender. We kind
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: of assume the sport will look similar like you'll probably
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: have one or two teams that can contend for the title.
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: For all we know, the way these rules are going,
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: we could have a really open field, in which case
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: there are many more options, potentially many more drivers on
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: the market. The sport could just look a lot more different,
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: putting the competitive elements aside. So I think it's a
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: little bit too early to say. And I do also
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: think while contracts are and I love the phrase the
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: starting point for negotiations, when it comes to time to
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: leave Piastre, we shouldn't forget. And it's probably a stute
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: from McLaren was signed up at the start of this
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: year when we didn't think he'd probably be contending for
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: the title this year. So I think that would probably
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: be a more McLaren favored contract than, for example, of
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: a staff in one where it seems like he can
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: just leave whenever he feels like it. Let's begond to
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: a Stappin speaking of him for question number four, we've
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: talked a little bit about this already. Is this the
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: best for staff and we've seen? And as a supplementary
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: question to that, could there be a better for staff
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: and still.
• 45:07
  Speaker 2: Than about the last part? Is it the best we've seen?
• 45:09
  Speaker 2: I mean we said this on a previous episode where
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: we discovered this year quite bizirely that not only is
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: he the best champion in the field, he's also the
• 45:15
  Speaker 2: best underdog simply because of the way he engineered this
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: comeback from absolutely nowhere. Was that one hundred and four
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: points down at one point, which is quite crazy. So
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: short answer to a long question, is it the best
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: we've seen? Yes, I mean you think of the absolute
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: turmoil and everything that's been going on there. You know
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: what Red Bull might look like when they turn up
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: in Melbourne for March twenty twenty six. You know, you
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: think in the past twelve months Liam Lawson was Max
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: for Stappenstee twenty twenty five, Australian Rob Prie. Christian Horner
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: is no longer the tea principal. There's stuff that came
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: out over the weekend. You know that perhaps helmet Marcos
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: on the way out. They're going to have a new
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: engine pro There's so much change within that organization and
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: he's been the one constant, and so yeah, best we've seen,
• 45:59
  Speaker 2: I would say absolutely. Is there another level? I guess
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: it comes down to, does all of that turmoil manifest
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: itself in perhaps a less winning package that even someone
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: of his talent and determination in CV is only able
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: to drag so far. They've got to play their part
• 46:19
  Speaker 2: to an extent. Maybe there is another level in there.
• 46:22
  Speaker 2: He surprised me this year with what he was able
• 46:23
  Speaker 2: to do with a car that quite frankly should not
• 46:25
  Speaker 2: have bet in the championship mix. But best we've seen,
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: I'm saying one hundred percent absolutely, I think so.
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: I think as well, without saying that, I think there's
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: a better level of Max because it's hard to see
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: how he improves on the performance in the second half
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: of this year, and integral to that performance. I think
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: he's always been a leader inside the team, but that
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: leadership role counted for more. Is the sense I get
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: in the post Christian Hornet era. Yep, I think we
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: may even in appreciating how great this comeback was, may
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: not have appreciated what that would mean starting with all
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: scores at zero. If Requll Racing has even a ballpark
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: car next to year, like it had a ballpark for
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: a lot of the second half of this season, that
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: maybe means even a team with a consistent a consistent
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: car that is consistently first or second can't catch him.
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: So I think maybe we're yet to appreciate the level
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: he's found this year, even as we appreciate how good
• 47:15
  Speaker 1: that's been, If that makes sense. On a ram up
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: with a couple of quick fire ones, we've just had
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: the aquadaphy for Nale. I don't think I was alone
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: in not being especially impressed with the performance, or not
• 47:27
  Speaker 1: the performance, rather the result or the excitement on track
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: that we got. Certainly visually spectacular as a location, there's
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: no doubt about that, but I couldn't help but think, Wow,
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: even though the time zone would have been absolutely diabolical
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: for Australia, wouldn't have this been fun in Brazil?
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Absolutely? What's the old saying you can put lipstick
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: on a pig, but it's still a pig, Michael, It's
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: a very expensive and attractive one, but just that turquoise
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: color Abu Dhabi just sort of grinds my gears at
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: this point. But maybe that's just watching eleven straight races there,
• 47:54
  Speaker 2: one from the pole position. But look, Interlagos is always
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: a winner, and you're thinking last the championship, but you
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: think two thousand and seven, two and eight, twenty twelve
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: or absolute classics. There's something about that particular track and
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: the corner profile and the weather and the fans and
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: everything about it feels a little bit on the unhinged side,
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: which is how we like Formula One title deciders. But
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: other places that could host a finale, I mean, time
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: of year is going to be tricky, but I don't know.
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: Austin for the spectacle would be interesting if we get
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: great races there. Yeah, often spread out a bit, but
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: it'd be good for the spectacle. And the weather's clearly
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: going to scupper this one. But to imagine if season
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: finale in Baku, oh, like you to my mind, for
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: the season finale, you have to has to be at
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: a circuit that's got some peril or a layout that's
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: conducive to overtaking, and Abu Dhabi has neither of those things.
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: That's really good goal.
• 48:48
  Speaker 2: If we swapped Bahrain and Abu Dhabi around in the calendar,
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: and you open the season with Abudhabi and finished it
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: with Bahrain or Barrains always right at the very front.
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: Even Bahrain would be a better option to end this
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: season because there is a layout there that does invite
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: some overtaking points, and we generally have more interesting races
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: there than we tend to at Abu Derby. But yeah,
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: to me my mind has to be a circuit with
• 49:08
  Speaker 2: some sort of trip wire in or peril, or at
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: least a layout that's conducive to overtaking. And the worst
• 49:13
  Speaker 2: part about Abu Dhabi is you know going into the
• 49:16
  Speaker 2: race weekend that neither of those things is probably going
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: to happen, and we persist in going back there for
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: should we say commercial rather than racing res Yes?
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: I like that. You do want some jeopardy in the
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: circuit layout, don't you, as much as you want the
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: jeopardy of the potential title decide it because it just
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: adds to it. I think Bahrain is actually probably your
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: most realistic option, Isn't it like that happening one day?
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: Not just WEATHERWI it's just money wise.
• 49:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, cool.
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: Look, will you stand the season in Adelaide? Everyone enjoyed that.
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: Obviously that's not on the cards anymore, but I think
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: that was a great that's a great illustration because Adelaide
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: has had atmosphere, didn't it, And that's something that neither
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: Barrain nor Abu Dhabi has or Baku really to be.
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: Honest and inte like ors. That's why that's the correct
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: answer to the question, because you know whether it's the
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: last round or the first round or somewhere in between.
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: And Brazil has been all over the calendar in the
• 49:59
  Speaker 2: past recent history of Formula One. The fans turn up,
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: they show up, they show out, it's an amazing atmosphere.
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: You add a title decider in there, it's pretty compelling.
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that would be a good one if
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: someone was willing to pay the money to make that
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: the last race. Finally, let's have a good forward throwing question,
• 50:17
  Speaker 1: considering at the end of the twenty twenty five season,
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: which team most intrigues you for twenty twenty six. Acknowledging
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: we don't know anything about anything next year. Really, we're
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: looking forward to all perhaps not looking forward to if
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: it would be perverse seeing next year.
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: It's actually a really hard question this because you can
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: find reasons to place most teams in this category. So
• 50:37
  Speaker 2: I'm going to go for a team that very very
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: rarely gets mentioned on this podcast for anything good. I
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: reckon Aston Martin is the team that intrigues me because
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: they just should be so much better than this. And
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: you look at some of the other big automotive brands
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: and names coming into Formula One next year, with Audi
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: the rebadge sour and Cadillac coming in. Aston Martin is
• 50:59
  Speaker 2: not a name it should be scrapping to finish seventh
• 51:02
  Speaker 2: in the Constructors' Championship, right, So this is the interesting
• 51:05
  Speaker 2: part for me, say the twenty twenty six as to
• 51:06
  Speaker 2: Martin's a good car, right potential for it to be there,
• 51:09
  Speaker 2: the Adrian new fact or so on and so forth,
• 51:11
  Speaker 2: what that does to the driver mask market. There'll be
• 51:15
  Speaker 2: some genuine a lister who will try and shake themselves
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: loose to get on board with the early sort of
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: green shoots of growth with that particular team if it's
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: going in the right direction, because you look at their
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: drivers right now, Fernando Alonso, for all the will in
• 51:29
  Speaker 2: the world is still you know what, if you're sixth
• 51:31
  Speaker 2: on the weekend and just this typically devilish Alonso race,
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: he's not the long term solution and lancetroll's never been
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: the solution long or short term. Let's be perfectly honest here.
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: So we know that the drivers aren't the answer to
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: them getting better, but we've not really asked the correct
• 51:45
  Speaker 2: question yet because the car has been sort of it's
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: been a bit blast so for that Alonso run at
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: the beginning of twenty three or whenever it was. But
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: they intrigue me because if they get it right, what
• 51:54
  Speaker 2: that does for that name being higher up in the
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: Formula one standings and what that might do to the
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: driver in that someone's going to look at that and say,
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: I want to get on board now, because you don't
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: want to wait for someone else to get in there
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: and get their feet under the table, and they repull
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: the benefits of a potential Aston Martin surge. So a
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: lot of candidates for that question. I do like the
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: intrigue questions always a good one at this time of year.
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: But I'm going to say Aston Martin and that's definitely
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: the most positive thing I've ever said about Aston Martin
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: in several years of this podcast, so I'd be surprised
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: if you went down that road. But which of the
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: other ten and I'm going to say ten, because there
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: are ten, Which of the other team ten teams intrigues
• 52:33
  Speaker 2: you in this particular question.
• 52:34
  Speaker 1: Ticket used to saying that I like astone because it
• 52:36
  Speaker 1: would also theoretically, considering the resources and infrastructure, expand the
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: pool of what we consider to be the front running team.
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: Absolutely very excited. Ye I'm going to go with another
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: team we very rarely have anything positive to say about Forrari.
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: Very intrigued to see what happens at Ferrari in twenty
• 52:49
  Speaker 1: twenty six for a couple of reasons. One is this
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: year has been so bad it's there's no way to
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: dress it up but fourth, and they locked in fourth
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: in the Constructors Championship early, the only thing they managed
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: to get done earlier this year. And for podiums obviously
• 53:00
  Speaker 1: Alda Charlotte Clair, who was Hamilton's first non podium season
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: of his entire Formula One in his career. But why
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: I'm interested in next year beyond the fact they really
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: need to perform well, there are two factors. One is
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: that they've come up in the last weeks and suddenly said, well,
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: you know, we gave up on this car in April,
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: first time anyone's ever heard of. That sounded a little
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: bit disingenuous to me, but that certainly piles on pressure
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: next year because now they're telling us they've been developing
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: next year's car at one hundred percent capacity for months.
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: There's not a lot of excuses to not be good.
• 53:28
  Speaker 1: But the other is the Lewis Hamilton story. Not simply
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: the story of whether or not he can get it
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: back together for next year, but some of the things
• 53:34
  Speaker 1: he's been saying in the last couple of rounds appearing
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: to suggest that his suggestions to improve the team, and
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: some people will roll their eyes at that, we shouldn't
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: forget he's been hired because he's a seven time champion
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: and perhaps more to the point, has been with the
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: dominant team of the last decade four years. Understands how
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: it works, understands the processes, understands what it takes to
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: win the title. The thing Ferrari clearly does not at
• 53:58
  Speaker 1: this stage that some of those suggestions, or perhaps even
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: all of them, are not really being taken on board.
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: That there's internal pushback, and there's been some reports in
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: the Italian media to a similar effect next year. I
• 54:12
  Speaker 1: wonder if that comes to a head. A lot of
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: people are speculated about, you know, does Lewis Hamilton continue
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: going all that kind of thing. I think that question
• 54:20
  Speaker 1: comes to head at the end of next year if
• 54:21
  Speaker 1: actually no one's listened to anything he suggested. They've sort
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: of finished third, fourth, whatever in the championship, not much
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: going for them. Because if that's the case, if he's
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: not having any effect on Ferrari, what's the point of
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: being there Because he's sticked the box of racing for Ferrari. Now,
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: you know, that's great, it's probably good. Grand Company can't
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: but if no one's taking on board the things that
• 54:40
  Speaker 1: he knows it takes to win a championship, then what's
• 54:43
  Speaker 1: the point.
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: Well, and if they're not going to take it on them,
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: why hire him?
• 54:45
  Speaker 1: Exactly?
• 54:45
  Speaker 2: Why would you get him in there in the first
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: This is the reason you hire a forty something Lewis Hamilton,
• 54:50
  Speaker 2: because he's done the things that you have proven and
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: you have no capability of doing for quite some time.
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: This is the reason you get him in in the
• 54:58
  Speaker 2: first place. If it becomes a product of if it's
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: a failure of communication or internal politics or anything else,
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: then that's not I'm sorry, but that's not on the driver.
• 55:08
  Speaker 2: That's not on the driver at all. And if you're
• 55:10
  Speaker 2: going to go down that path, then just don't hire him,
• 55:12
  Speaker 2: just put someone else in there.
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly right. And I think then that speaks to
• 55:16
  Speaker 1: a really big question about the whole Ferrari project. Project
• 55:20
  Speaker 1: sounds like a silly thing to say for the older
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: Steve before one, but this era of Ferrari, if you like,
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: and maybe that is the vast era, because the questions
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: will be asked if his management, If next year looks
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: no better, I think that there's a lot on the
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: line for Ferrari in a way, and I think I've
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: said this before, in a way, I just didn't expect
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: when Hamilton joined, I did not expect the questions to
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: be existential as they're becoming, or somewhat reputational for Hamilton.
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: I think if even retired the in the next year,
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: having achieved not much with Ferrari a few years later,
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: we would forget about the Ferraris did to just remember
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: his great time. But nonetheless it has an effect so
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: I think there's a lot on the line. There can't
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: wrap up without going to the crystal ball by complete filtration.
• 56:00
  Speaker 1: You've got a long period to predict your Matt, What
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: are you think?
• 56:04
  Speaker 2: I'm just going to literally rinse and repeat something you
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: said about fifteen seconds ago in that I think it's
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: going to be an underwhelming season for Errari in twenty
• 56:11
  Speaker 2: twenty six, and it will be Lewis Hamilton's final season
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: in Formula One, and we'll forget that it ever happened.
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: What you said before about them being intriguing and the
• 56:19
  Speaker 2: you know, the intrigue is because there is so much
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: promise and potential there. Well, apparently they've been working on
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: this car for the twenty twenty six car. They've been
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: working on it for most of twenty twenty five, so
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: it should be fantastic, but it probably isn't going to be.
• 56:32
  Speaker 2: And yeah, maybe twenty twenty six is Lewis Hamilton's last
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: lap in Formula One, and for sake of you know,
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: we'll lament it for a short period of time and
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: then three months later we'll forget that he ever wore
• 56:44
  Speaker 2: red overalls and weren't all those years in Mercedes fantastic
• 56:47
  Speaker 2: and he's the most prolific driver in Formula One history
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: and all of that, because I frankly just don't trust
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: Ferrari to get this right for next year, and I
• 56:54
  Speaker 2: think there'll be other teams that get it more right,
• 56:57
  Speaker 2: and I can see a little bit of a repeat
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: of twenty twenty five. But Crystal Ball, look like you
• 57:02
  Speaker 2: said you bought to make this one stick because it's
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: going to have staying power because we've got no more
• 57:06
  Speaker 2: raising for them until Albert Park in March. But what's
• 57:09
  Speaker 2: your crystal ball telling you.
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: My crystal ball is telling me it's very specific prediction,
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: but the international readership of the Austrian newspaper Climbs a
• 57:17
  Speaker 1: Toong is going to decline enormously next year because old
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: Albert Marco is retiring, which means that you probably will
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: still be speaking to the paper with the be far
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: fewer microphone shoved in his face for him to give
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: opinions that the Red Bull company has told him to
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: stop giving. Unfortunately, the rule banning him speaking to the
• 57:33
  Speaker 1: media will no longer reply. But next year he won't
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: be in the paddock. He will be simultaneously voluntarily but
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: also forced into retirement and that also signals quite a
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: big shift for red Bull. It's something we talked about
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: after Christian Horner left, but it's becoming very much the
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: next era of red Bull was I think becoming clear
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: in the second half of this year that his place
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: at the team didn't make as much sense. He no
• 57:53
  Speaker 1: longer holds the reins of the Young Driver program. Though
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: he's influential there, he's a bit of an anachronism at
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: this point. And you know what, he's at retirement age.
• 58:02
  Speaker 1: When you go and enjoy your time at wherever it
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: is he lives in Austria, and soak it.
• 58:06
  Speaker 2: Up well and imagine the soundbites that are going to
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: come out of that position when he gets replaced by yours.
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: For Stappen, that's another story.
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: No, don't great prediction. That's your official prediction.
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: I'm keeping you to it.
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: But that's all the time we have for pit Talk today.
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: You can subscribe to bittalkriv you get your favorite podcasts
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: and you can leave us a rating and review as well.
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: And the Motor Sports season well it's over. Go and
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: enjoy your weekends with your loved ones and avenge Piastri's
• 58:31
  Speaker 1: title lost VI curiously if you like. By watching the ashes,
• 58:33
  Speaker 1: you can keep up to date with the latest one,
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: supercars and BURDERGP news at Fox sports dot com. Tot
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: are you from Matt Clayton and me Michael Lomonato. Thanks
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: very much for your company and we'll catch you next week.