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A Political Family Black Sheep Tells All (with Rosebud Baker) · Reasonably Happy with Paul Ollinger

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Hello, everybody.
• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome back to Reasonably Happy.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: My guest today is Rosebud Baker.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_00: Rosebud is one of the sharpest and most honest voices in comedy today.
• 0:10
  She's an Emmy-nominated and Writers Guild Award-winning writer
• 0:14
  whose credits
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: include Saturday Night Live
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_00: Inside Amy Schumer and That Damn Michael Che In her new autobiography,
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_00: Fully Baked,
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: A Messy Memoir,
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  SPEAKER_00: Rosebud shares the story of being the granddaughter of James Baker,
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  the former White House Chief of Staff for Presidents Reagan and
• 0:31
  the first George
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: Bush.
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  SPEAKER_00: He was also Secretary of State and Secretary of the Treasury.
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  SPEAKER_00: She also relates unfiltered observations on her parents' divorce,
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  SPEAKER_00: her struggle with drugs and alcohol,
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: her multiple miscarriages,
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_00: and the death of her younger sister Graham.
• 0:46
  You're never going to be perfectly happy all the time The best
• 0:49
  you can hope for is
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: to be reasonably happy Reasonably
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: Most of the time.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: So how's your daughter?
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: She's great.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: How old is she now?
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_01: She's two and a half.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah?
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: I just dropped her off at school late.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: Like two hours late.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_01: Because when we're on the road and we get back,
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: I'll...
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like the day after we get back from like a travel day,
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  SPEAKER_01: she's just like not feeling it.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: She'll just be like, I don't want to go to school.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, I don't want to take you.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
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  SPEAKER_01: You know?
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  SPEAKER_01: And so we'll just like...
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_01: I think we watched Tarzan...
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  We watched all of Tarzan and then we watched like the beginning
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  of Tarzan again and
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  then I fell asleep and woke up to her like dumping my purse on
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  the floor so I was
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  SPEAKER_01: like okay it's time to go to school Which Tarzan?
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  The one from the Disney one the Phil Collins Oh okay Oh going
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  back Yeah I like that
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  SPEAKER_01: I like to give her stuff that's like pre 2015 Why?
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  SPEAKER_01: I don't know I just feel like
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  SPEAKER_00: You're more comfortable with it?
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  2015 was like when my attention span started to go down the
• 2:16
  tubes,
• 2:17
  you know?
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: When did you get sober?
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: I got sober in 2006?
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: So those things are not correlated.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: Not at all.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: Why did you start losing your attention in 2015?
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: I think because of social media.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, right.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, sure.
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  SPEAKER_01: And I think everything is connected to that.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: So I kind of was just like,
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_01: if we keep it to like pre-2015,
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  SPEAKER_01: it won't be like designed in a lab to like turn off her brain.
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  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know?
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  SPEAKER_00: Or to spark certain areas of it.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
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  SPEAKER_01: Where it's like Coco Melon is like, like that's, I refuse.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: Cause it's just like, and she was like, can we watch Coco Melon?
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  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, absolutely not.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like everyone in that town is on LSD.
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  That's not You can't watch that show And that's like the reason
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  that I give her And
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  SPEAKER_00: I don't Does she know what LSD is?
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  No I don't explain it any further You know LSD Acid Yeah I'm
• 3:13
  like I don't explain
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  it any further But it's like she doesn't understand it So she
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  just goes alright You
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  know Yeah It's funny My kids are teenagers now And it's just
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  funny at that age How
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  quickly they go through phases Of what they're into Yes And you
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  know one day
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  They'll be addicted to Caillou And then a month later
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  Gratefully they'll be on to
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  SPEAKER_00: Blues Clues Yeah Or something else You know Yeah
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  Right now I'm in this hell Where I wake up every morning And
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  I'm like Ryder from
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  Paw Patrol Or I'm like Mama She called me the mama gorilla this
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  morning And I was
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  like I don't even know where that's coming from I don't
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  remember that reference I
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  don't know what that is I don't even know what that reference
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  is But then she was
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  like can we watch the gorilla movie And I was like oh Tarzan So
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  okay So maybe she
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  SPEAKER_01: wants me to be like Tarzan's mom And she wants to be Tarzan
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  Or I'm bluey and she's bingo and it's just like and she'll just
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  switch characters
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  like in the middle well the only way for me to like carry on a
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  conversation with
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  her is to address her as Elmo or bingo or like and and she'll
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  switch it she'll go
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  no I'm not that anymore I'm like okay well do you want a snack
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  or not right yeah
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  SPEAKER_01: that's kind of where I'm at right now there you go yeah there you go um
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  You talk a lot about in your specials and in your book how
• 4:31
  motherhood really kind
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  SPEAKER_00: of threw you for a loop from an identity perspective.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: Have you adjusted to that?
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  SPEAKER_01: I think I'm constantly adjusting to it.
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  SPEAKER_01: I do think that it's,
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  SPEAKER_01: it is,
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  SPEAKER_01: it does throw you for,
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  SPEAKER_01: it messes with your identity and it should,
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  SPEAKER_01: you know,
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  SPEAKER_01: but
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  I also,
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  like,
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  what I didn't realize is that your identity as a mom shifts,
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  too.
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  SPEAKER_01: You know?
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  SPEAKER_01: How so?
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  SPEAKER_01: You know,
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  SPEAKER_01: like,
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  SPEAKER_01: the mother I was when she was,
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  SPEAKER_01: like,
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  SPEAKER_01: a newborn is different from the mother that I am now.
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  And,
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  you know,
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  it's like a person changes,
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  so you change the way that you show up for them.
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  SPEAKER_01: So that's kind of what I mean.
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm one of six, you're one of five, right?
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  SPEAKER_01: Uh-huh.
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  So what's interesting is that the parents that my oldest
• 5:29
  siblings had were not the
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  SPEAKER_00: parents that I had.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: But I'm number five.
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  SPEAKER_00: And so by the time I came around,
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  SPEAKER_00: my parents didn't,
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  SPEAKER_00: they weren't like hands off,
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  SPEAKER_00: but they had mellowed a lot since before.
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  SPEAKER_00: And you're at the height.
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  SPEAKER_00: I'm the first one.
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  SPEAKER_00: You're the first.
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  SPEAKER_00: So you got like the most intense parents of.
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  SPEAKER_01: I did, but they were both, I mean, luckily they both kind of were...
• 5:52
  I think they got increasingly overwhelmed and so they weren't
• 5:56
  really as hands-on as
• 5:59
  like they would have been you know what I mean like they were
• 6:02
  kind of my parents
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  were there's this thing online about like the eldest daughter
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  syndrome where it's
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  like you do it yourself you take care of yourself that's and
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  that's kind of I
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  SPEAKER_01: relate to like all of that in a scary way you know
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  Where they were kind of like Rosebud's got it Yeah She'll
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  figure it out You know
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  Which was crazy Cause like I definitely didn't Like I
• 6:30
  definitely did not have it
• 6:32
  Together But I figured it out So Were you always assertive As a
• 6:39
  child Assertive
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: Well you seem to be Sort of Unwilling to Play the game Um Yeah Yeah
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  I don't like to I don't want to do anything I don't want to do
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  Yeah Headstrong
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  Which is I feel like not that unique You know nobody wants to
• 6:59
  do something they
• 7:00
  don't want to do Certainly not in the comedy industry Right It
• 7:03
  doesn't attract
• 7:04
  people looking for stability And or like cooperation Yes Yeah
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  But it was good for
• 7:09
  me to like Any corporate job I've ever had Has been such a
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  shock to my system Yeah
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  SPEAKER_01: That I've walked away from it going like I really needed that On like a
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  To remind you of why you don't do it Well no just to make me a
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  better person To
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  like make me To learn how to like cooperate with other people
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  Is a valuable skill
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  in life And I As somebody who's always been kind of Reticent to
• 7:38
  do that I need to
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  learn how to do it You know if you're trying to become like the
• 7:44
  best version of
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  SPEAKER_01: yourself You got to work on the parts that really need help Yeah You know
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  SPEAKER_00: So you said something about honesty in the book.
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  SPEAKER_00: You know, you were always going to say what you feel.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I struggled with this in the past too.
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  It's that being honest doesn't mean you have to say everything
• 8:01
  that's on your mind.
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  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: How do you draw?
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  SPEAKER_00: Have you had trouble drawing that line?
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  SPEAKER_00: And have you learned where to draw it better?
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  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_01: I've learned...
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  SPEAKER_01: I've definitely learned that I am like...
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  I've learned the hard way let's put it that way that I've I'm
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  like oh I don't I
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  didn't need to say that and generally speaking I only learn it
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  after someone after
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  I see someone's reaction to what I've said you've touched the
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  hot stove of
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  interpersonal relationships exactly I'm like oh you know what I
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  mean like I crossed
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  SPEAKER_01: the line um but you know I
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  I guess it's you gotta figure that out like as you go you know
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  cause I'm somebody
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  that when I say like oh I really want it I would prefer a hard
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  truth over an easy
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  SPEAKER_00: lie everyday From others or from yourself?
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  SPEAKER_00: From others Is that true?
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  I say I think that but I wonder if I really live if I live that
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  I know that most
• 9:03
  people don't actually mean that when they say it but I f***ing
• 9:07
  mean it So if
• 9:07
  somebody told you one of your specials was like pointed out
• 9:10
  some flaws in your
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: specials
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  SPEAKER_00: How would you react to that?
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  SPEAKER_01: I don't have any to point out, by the way.
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  SPEAKER_01: I'd be like, thank you for pointing that out.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like, there's nothing that... You bitch.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I wouldn't be happy to hear it, but it's not like...
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  SPEAKER_01: I don't see myself as a flawless person.
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  SPEAKER_01: I want to know what it is that I have to work on.
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  SPEAKER_01: And so when somebody tells me, hey, there's a blind spot here.
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  like I want to know I want to know what it is because I would
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  rather work on that
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  than look like a fool right not knowing about it you know so to
• 9:49
  me the person that
• 9:50
  is like hey you've got like food stuck in your personality is
• 9:54
  like you know like
• 9:56
  that's a helpful person right even if they don't say it like if
• 10:00
  you have a huge
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_00: booger hanging out of your nose yeah
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  SPEAKER_00: I'd like to know about it.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
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  SPEAKER_00: Even if you have to embarrass me temporarily.
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  SPEAKER_00: I saw a guy on the subway the other day with his zipper down.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  And not like in the traditional way that people have their
• 10:12
  zippers down on the subway.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like he was unaware that a zipper was down.
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  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_00: I was a total stranger and I'm like,
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  SPEAKER_00: I'd really like to tell this guy what's happening,
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  SPEAKER_00: but I didn't do.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: I couldn't bring myself to do it.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: For fear of just
• 10:25
  I mean that's really weird Interaction to approach some
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  stranger with I was
• 10:30
  checking out your dick I was looking at your dick and your
• 10:33
  zipper's down That's one
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  of those where you're like I get that I get avoiding that But
• 10:40
  who knows he might
• 10:41
  have been grateful I think most people don't really want to
• 10:45
  know Most people are
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: like At least in my experience Have
• 10:53
  Ask Me For Like An Honest Answer And Then When I Give Them That
• 10:58
  And Obviously I Can
• 10:59
  Work On My Delivery But Right When I Give It To Them They're
• 11:03
  Like Disappointed With
• 11:04
  The Way That I've Delivered The Information Well I Think If You
• 11:08
  If Most People If
• 11:10
  You Give Them A List Of 99 Things That Are Great About Them And
• 11:13
  One Thing They Can
• 11:14
  Improve On And Myself Very Much Included In This I'd Be Like
• 11:18
  Why You Said I'm Fat
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: Or Whatever Or Whatever It Is
• 11:22
  Well especially I think in our line of work like comics can be
• 11:28
  in a room full of
• 11:29
  people killing and if there's one person with their arms
• 11:33
  crossed like you're just
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: thinking about that one person
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: And you don't know what that person's been through that day.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_00: They could have had just the worst day in the world at work.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: Or maybe that's just the way they've got.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_01: Now they're in hell.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: Now they're at a comedy show in hell.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_00: Where they don't want to be.
• 11:48
  Yeah,
• 11:49
  like there's nowhere worse to be after like a terrible day than
• 11:53
  a comedy show,
• 11:54
  you know?
• 11:54
  Have you ever tried to address that and found yourself in a
• 11:58
  really embarrassing situation?
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like somebody says something horrible just happened and you're like,
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: oh,
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: why'd I just leave that person alone?
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, but I tend to just double, I try to just double down.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: I try to be like, how selfish of you to tell us.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: Why couldn't you have lied?
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right, yeah.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: Make it about you, why don't you?
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_00: So I mentioned in your introduction your family of origin,
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: the prominent political nature of your grandfather,
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_00: Jim Baker,
• 12:31
  and you go into depth as to how that affected the environment
• 12:35
  in which you grew up.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: Can you touch on that for a second?
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: so,
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_01: political families are basically just a,
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: if you've watched Succession,
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 12:49
  I don't think a lot of people watched that show and went like,
• 12:52
  oh my God.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_01: That's exactly like, yeah.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like I watched that show and was like,
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_01: oh my God,
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_01: that's exactly the dynamic between like my,
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_01: my dad and his brothers and,
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: and my granddad and like that.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: They're always trying to please him.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_00: It was crazy to watch.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, this is like, I'd never seen my family on TV, you know?
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: And, um,
• 13:16
  I watched it and was like oh this is this explains a lot about
• 13:21
  just the ways that
• 13:22
  you know because they passed on you know you pass on certain
• 13:26
  things about the way
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_01: you were parented and
• 13:30
  I really kind of understood myself better after watching that
• 13:33
  because my granddad
• 13:34
  was just a powerful guy and like no he's still alive right yeah
• 13:37
  he is which he will
• 13:38
  never die like he won't die this man has fallen down the stairs
• 13:43
  twice in the last
• 13:44
  year I do that sometimes yeah he's like 96 or 98 and he's
• 13:50
  fallen down the stairs
• 13:51
  like and he won't take the elevator in his home like he's like
• 13:56
  honestly believes I
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: think that it could turn him gay like he's like really
• 14:01
  Like Luna bars Yeah he's like I will take the stairs every god
• 14:04
  damn day Rather than
• 14:05
  getting that like gay machine And I'm like They installed it
• 14:10
  for you Cause you fell
• 14:11
  down the stairs and broke your spine Like you know But he won't
• 14:14
  do it He's like
• 14:16
  He's just that kind of guy and um and so there's a stubbornness
• 14:22
  and a just um a
• 14:26
  refusal to listen to anyone that sort of is in my blood you
• 14:31
  know but I I disagree
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: with my grandfather on almost every single level politically so
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_01: I just learned after a while,
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_01: I was like,
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_01: okay,
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just not gonna,
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_01: I can't talk to him about that because I can't.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: What do you agree with him on?
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I don't know.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_01: I don't, I don't know.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_01: I think he's funny.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's really what it came down to is like,
• 15:02
  I learned that the things about my grandfather and my dad and
• 15:07
  his brothers that I
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: really
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_01: Have a hard time with on a personal level, I do find very funny.
• 15:16
  Like if I remove myself and my emotional needs from the room,
• 15:21
  then I can find it very funny.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_01: But I just don't go there for that.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like I don't, it's like going to the hardware store for milk.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's, you just don't, that's not where I go to get hugs.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_01: You know?
• 15:37
  I get that from somewhere else that's so funny yeah did
• 15:41
  watching succession give
• 15:42
  you any empathy for your father yeah yeah definitely and also
• 15:51
  reading that um there
• 15:53
  was this book called the man who ran Washington oh yeah you
• 15:56
  mentioned that I read
• 15:57
  that book because I was like it's about your grandfather yeah
• 16:00
  it was about my
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_01: grandfather and
• 16:03
  There was a lot of information in there about my dad's
• 16:05
  childhood that I never got
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_01: out of my dad.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I really felt for him.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: I really, really felt for him.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, oh, this explains almost everything.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_00: Both your parents were distant.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: You said your dad retreated into work and your mom retreated to vodka.
• 16:31
  My mom was not distant She was like Joni Mitchell on a
• 16:36
  microdose Yeah my mom was My
• 16:40
  mom is very emotional And was very very present Even while
• 16:46
  drinking Like I would
• 16:47
  see her sort of like She would like You know when things got
• 16:53
  bad Then she sort of
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: Retreated but I wasn't Quite old enough to notice Um
• 17:01
  but she was always very emotional like almost an over listener
• 17:06
  you know we're like
• 17:07
  if you tell me that tell me that you're having a bad day I'm
• 17:10
  having a pretty bad
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: day yeah that's
• 17:15
  You know like it was like I was like okay you know like I'm the
• 17:19
  one having a bad
• 17:20
  day like it was a little bit like that you know so I had this
• 17:24
  like Fort Knox and
• 17:26
  then I just had this like squishy gummy bear Was she trying to
• 17:30
  overcompensate for
• 17:31
  your dad do you think I don't know I don't think so I think
• 17:34
  she's just like that my
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_01: mom's just like that she's really like a golden retriever
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_01: And,
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_01: I truly sometimes when we're hanging out,
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like I'm like the angel of death.
• 17:45
  It's because I just feel like I I feel like I say things that I
• 17:53
  would find like
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_01: funny or that are just my honest reaction to something.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_01: And she acts like she's been bitten by a dog.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like I truly feel like the things that I say sometimes like.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_01: Hurt her sensibility and her understanding of the world.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's, um, what's an example of that?
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_01: I don't even know.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we were in Italy.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_01: I was pregnant and I took my mom to Italy and
• 18:21
  we were we like went through all these museums my mom's a
• 18:26
  painter so she stopped at
• 18:27
  every she loves to like read all the plaques sure like making
• 18:31
  fun of her for like
• 18:31
  stopping and reading every single plaque and then crying like
• 18:34
  we had to cry at
• 18:36
  every painting so it was like by the end of the day I was like
• 18:39
  look I was like
• 18:41
  there's not there are not enough hours in the day for the
• 18:44
  amount of crying that you
• 18:45
  have to do as a person like you gotta like she was like what do
• 18:48
  you want me to not
• 18:50
  feel my feeling you know she starts crying at the restaurant I
• 18:53
  was like yes I want
• 18:54
  you to shut it down like shut it down I'm pregnant you know
• 18:58
  what I mean like and so
• 19:00
  we got into it a little bit about that but it's like she is
• 19:03
  just this sensitive
• 19:05
  person that I think without her presence in my life I genuinely
• 19:09
  would be like a
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_01: sociopath like I I
• 19:14
  I am so grateful for her because she balanced out whatever it
• 19:19
  was that I was
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_01: getting from,
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_01: my dad's side of the family.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: one of the things you said in your first special,
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: or the Whiskey Fist special,
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: that was the first,
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: you've got two,
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: right?
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: Mm-hmm.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: So Whiskey Fist 2021 and then Motherlode.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: Whiskey Fist was 2020.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: Was it?
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it says 2021 on Spotify.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: Oh.
• 19:41
  Get it right Spotify Yeah so you said you thrive on neglect
• 19:48
  like a succulent or I'm
• 19:50
  getting it wrong but it's like I love those sort of just like
• 19:53
  what you just said
• 19:54
  about shopping for milk at the hardware store like it's just
• 19:56
  the succinct lines
• 19:58
  about capturing the essence of your personality or your
• 20:01
  experience and it's like oh
• 20:02
  that's a that's a that's a show don't tell moment right there
• 20:06
  yeah when did you
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_00: start
• 20:09
  Understanding that comedy was a way for you to express your
• 20:13
  feelings It was really
• 20:15
  an accident like I I really didn't I really didn't respect
• 20:21
  comedy for a long time
• 20:23
  and I know a lot of comics that still don't respect yeah yeah I
• 20:26
  mean I don't know
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: that I do but um I
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: My dad was like, oh, you should be a comic for a long time.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: Was he?
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: but he didn't mean it as like,
• 20:35
  like I was an actor and I was like a serious actor is what I
• 20:38
  wanted to be.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: And so every time he was like,
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: you should maybe just pivot to like clowning,
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_01: which was felt like,
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_01: okay,
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 20:45
  like he would come to see a play and he'd like fall asleep and
• 20:49
  he'd be like,
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_01: well,
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_01: nobody wants to go see a play.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like that was like what his reaction to it was.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: And again, like
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_01: Comedy allowed me to see that from a different, from like a funny light.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: But, because it's true, like, people don't want to see a play.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like, plays bum people out.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, what was Hamilton all about?
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody wanted to see that.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that was a musical.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_01: Right, yeah.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_01: That's different.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: That's a f***ing party.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: You know?
• 21:14
  So a play is just like somebody dies and then you're in the
• 21:16
  dark just thinking
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: about it in the middle of the day,
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_01: on like a Sunday.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_01: So I get where he's coming from, but...
• 21:25
  I was like I wanted to be an actor and then I just it just like
• 21:29
  wasn't working and
• 21:30
  I went through this breakup with this horrible actor and then
• 21:36
  was like I don't know
• 21:37
  what I'm gonna do with my life and somebody told me to try
• 21:41
  comedy and so I
• 21:42
  reluctantly did try it and eventually just kept going but it
• 21:48
  was it was truly like
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_01: a
• 21:51
  A quarter life crisis moment Like starting comedy for me
• 21:56
  Because you had no other
• 21:59
  Outlets that seemed to make sense Yeah I mean I'd spent I'd
• 22:03
  spent earning years A
• 22:04
  significant amount of earning years Just trying to be an actor
• 22:07
  in New York So I had
• 22:09
  no resume I had no I had no goal I didn't know what I wanted to
• 22:13
  do The only thing
• 22:14
  that I ever wanted to do Was be a performer of some kind And
• 22:20
  comedy just seemed
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_01: like
• 22:22
  it was like next to giving up you know like truly I have I have
• 22:29
  no professional
• 22:30
  options yeah so comedy yeah exactly I was like it just seems
• 22:35
  like to anyone that I
• 22:36
  went to acting school with or anybody that I like worked with
• 22:39
  in the past they're
• 22:40
  all gonna be like yeah she did you hear what happened she's I
• 22:43
  have there have been
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: actors who have tried to pivot into comedy as sort of and it's sort of
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they're like, well, clearly it's not working for him or her.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: And so they've got to try this new track.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's where serious artists go to die.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's like comedy.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: Well, if I could play guitar, I wouldn't bother with comedy.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_01: If I could look cool.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:10
  Doing something else Not to say that actors look cool I mean
• 23:13
  they think they do But
• 23:14
  they don't You know Like which is kind of more humiliating If
• 23:17
  you think about it
• 23:18
  Yeah But You had this interesting Assessment of yourself As a
• 23:23
  teenager When I was
• 23:24
  15 Smoking weed Doing mushrooms I thought of myself As some
• 23:28
  kind of suburban mystic
• 23:30
  Floating through adolescence With the carefree nihilism That
• 23:33
  only a teenager Who
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_00: comes from money Can afford to enjoy Do you have guilt
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_00: for being raised in an affluent environment?
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: Not at all.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's awesome.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_01: It was awesome.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_01: I look at my life growing up and I'm like, holy shit.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_01: She didn't have any clue how good she had it.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: But I didn't have guilt about it because I wouldn't have known.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_01: That was part of
• 24:05
  Being Raised Like That Is You Don't Know Anything About
• 24:08
  Anything So You Just Sort
• 24:10
  Of Get To Like Imagine Yourself As Like Whoever You Want You
• 24:16
  Know And Then I Like
• 24:17
  Because You're Separated From The Fundamental Needs Of Most Of
• 24:22
  America Paying Rent
• 24:23
  And Eating Yeah And Also Just Like You're So Far Removed From
• 24:28
  Any Sort Of Like
• 24:29
  Poverty Like You Know When I Moved To New York Was Like The
• 24:33
  First Time That I Like
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_01: Saw
• 24:35
  Homelessness or like or to move to Boston I didn't really see
• 24:41
  that where I was
• 24:41
  growing up the over air-conditioned environment of McLean
• 24:45
  Virginia yeah yeah so it
• 24:47
  was so it was private schools or or public school private
• 24:50
  community type stuff yeah
• 24:53
  yeah what was what was the most what what was awesome about it
• 24:56
  that you were
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_00: actually conscious of during that time um
• 25:04
  Like the fact that everybody got cars You know Like there were
• 25:09
  friends of mine that
• 25:10
  like got cars for their birthday For 16th birthday For their
• 25:14
  16th birthday Yeah And
• 25:15
  probably pretty nice cars Yeah And that was awesome Yeah I
• 25:18
  remember being like
• 25:19
  that's f***ing awesome I'm getting a car You know for my
• 25:23
  birthday Yeah And then my
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_00: dad did this But you appreciated it You actually were conscious enough to
• 25:29
  appreciate it Yeah I was like this is f***ing cool Like not
• 25:32
  everybody gets this
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_00: What kind of car did you get?
• 25:34
  Well my dad did this bullshit where he was like you know it's
• 25:38
  not a car for you
• 25:39
  he's like I'm buying your mom a car and then but I'm like you
• 25:43
  both have your own
• 25:44
  cars and he's like well this is for your mom and I was like but
• 25:47
  it's around my
• 25:47
  birthday and you're not alright fine whatever you bought me a
• 25:52
  car you don't want to
• 25:53
  say that you bought me a car but that's what you did and um and
• 25:58
  I was like this is
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_01: great but it was like a Honda Accord it was like a
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_00: I would have killed for a Honda Accord.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_01: I loved it.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: I loved it.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: It was awesome.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: But my friends were all like, oh, you got a Honda.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, you.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_01: I got a car.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: And it was like a V6, which I was really excited about.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't even know what that fucking meant, honestly.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_01: But I just heard guys around me being like, oh, it's a V6.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know what that means still.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_00: Why do you think your dad positioned it like that?
• 26:30
  Because he didn't want us to,
• 26:34
  he didn't want the rest of his kids to expect to get a car.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_01: That's why.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_01: I think about it,
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like,
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_01: maybe he didn't want us to be spoiled or it's like,
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: no,
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: I think what it comes down to is like,
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: he didn't want to spend money on like,
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: multiple cars for his kids,
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_01: which makes sense.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: Win Yeah,
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 26:56
  I'm trying to figure out how much you can give a kid without
• 26:59
  spoiling a kid,
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_00: you know?
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: Like,
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: and I think it's a balance and it's,
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 27:05
  we're going to the World Cup because it's a once in a 20 year
• 27:10
  event for us in the
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: United States or whatever.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I can go to the World Cup.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: We're not sitting up front.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_00: We're not going to the sexy match, but I want to do that.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and it's sort of like, well, are you
• 27:22
  Are you setting your kid up for disappointment later in life
• 27:25
  when they can't swing
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_00: those tickets?
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: Or, you know, how do you successfully cut a kid off, I guess?
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I just did it myself, like with alcoholism and mistakes.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_01: That's how you cut yourself off.
• 27:44
  Your grandpa wrote you a note saying you weren't in a good
• 27:47
  place to get the check
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_00: for Christmas that year?
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_01: it was like,
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_01: we all got these,
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_01: checks for Christmas,
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_01: and I got,
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_01: this is so,
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: embarrassing,
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_01: because it,
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_01: it,
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_01: it,
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_01: even telling a story suggests that I felt some sort of,
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_01: sorrow over this,
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_01: but,
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_01: it really wasn't,
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_01: it was just like a,
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: it was their way of saying that they were disappointed,
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_01: which is even more of a bummer than just being like,
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: hey,
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: I'm really disappointed in you,
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_01: but,
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_01: to speak through money was like,
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_01: that's the way that wealthy parents and grandparents,
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_01: that's how they do it.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_01: Like love is currency and there's no delineation between the two.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: And so when all the grandkids got like checks for Christmas,
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't get one because it was like,
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_01: but I got a note that was like,
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_01: we don't think that you have earned this this year.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, well, nobody earned it.
• 28:44
  Nobody Earned This You Know This Is A This Is A Punishment For
• 28:48
  The For The Choices
• 28:49
  That I Made But I Honestly You Were Making Some Pretty Bad
• 28:52
  Choices At That Time I
• 28:52
  Was Making Some Pretty Bad Choices But They Weren't Aware Of
• 28:54
  Those Like Nobody Knew
• 28:55
  About That They Knew About Your Worst Choices Yeah They Knew
• 28:58
  About The Worst Ones
• 28:59
  But But Actually Not Even You Know So It Was Just This Kind Of
• 29:03
  Like Oh Damn If They
• 29:04
  Knew What Was Actually Going On Like Yeah You Know What Was
• 29:10
  Your Drug Of Choice
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_01: Booze.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_01: I like drinking.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_01: Drinking is awesome.
• 29:17
  The first time I drank,
• 29:18
  I was like,
• 29:19
  oh,
• 29:19
  I want to do this for the rest of my life.
• 29:22
  I have found the thing that makes me feel like the way
• 29:27
  everybody's supposed to feel
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_01: is how I thought of it.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_00: I went to the dentist.
• 29:34
  I've told this story before,
• 29:35
  so apologies to my loyal listeners who may have heard it.
• 29:38
  But I went to the dentist one time and had some dental work
• 29:39
  done and she gave me
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_00: Vicodin for treatment or for the pain or whatever.
• 29:45
  And I gave a talk the next day at UCLA and I was like,
• 29:49
  this is the way I'm supposed to feel.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_00: Why'd she only give me four capsules?
• 29:54
  Yeah I was like holy shit Can you like Yeah I can see how
• 29:58
  people get Addicted to
• 30:00
  that stuff Because it just makes you feel like normal Yeah Like
• 30:04
  at the top of
• 30:05
  normal Yes And that's kind of a dangerous feeling If you're not
• 30:08
  walking around
• 30:08
  thinking There's something a little bit wrong with you Then
• 30:11
  maybe Yeah Maybe you
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_01: shouldn't take drugs I know it's tricky I'm like
• 30:17
  It's tricky I just recently went on like peptides and I think I
• 30:20
  went on the wrong
• 30:21
  ones or something because I'm just like there's all these
• 30:24
  people doing peptides now
• 30:26
  and I'm like well I guess I should get on peptides and I gave
• 30:29
  myself like too hot
• 30:30
  of a dose of peptides and I was like it's vitamins who gives a
• 30:33
  shit and by day
• 30:33
  three I was like sick in bed and like I was like oh I think I
• 30:38
  should be more
• 30:38
  careful about this you know it's just like as a as an addict as
• 30:42
  like a drinker and
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_01: a drug addict I
• 30:46
  I was like I don't I'm not gonna be afraid of vitamins right
• 30:51
  you know gives a shit
• 30:53
  and then the next thing I know I have like a giant welt on my
• 30:56
  stomach and I'm like
• 30:58
  what did I take and I had to message the guy I was like what
• 31:02
  did I take and he was
• 31:03
  like oh I was like I thought this is for like muscle building
• 31:07
  you know and he was
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_01: like no you that's a GLP
• 31:11
  And I accidentally took a GLP-1 like earlier this week Like an
• 31:15
  Ozempic or a Zeptide
• 31:16
  or whatever Yeah And I'm starving and I can't eat And I've been
• 31:22
  up all week Because
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: I accidentally took a GLP-1 Because my friend who looks good I was like,
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_01: well,
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_01: you look good I was like,
• 31:30
  just give me the list of the shit that you take And I sent it
• 31:32
  to this guy in
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_01: Arizona And then I'm mixing up peptides in my kitchen
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, you probably took way worse stuff 20 years ago than.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 31:43
  I mean,
• 31:43
  listen,
• 31:44
  I worse shit has happened,
• 31:46
  but I was still like,
• 31:48
  oh,
• 31:49
  I don't need a GLP one.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's not I need to eat.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_01: I need to be eating.
• 31:54
  I have a toddler and I need to run after this toddler and I
• 31:57
  need to be like fueling
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: myself to do that.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, how bad did things get with the booze?
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, bad, like bad enough for me to quit.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um,
• 32:10
  I remember one night and this was not even like when I quit but
• 32:14
  uh one night like I
• 32:16
  was running towards I I used to get in these fights and I would
• 32:21
  just run off like I
• 32:22
  would get in these arguments with people and then I would just
• 32:24
  like disappear into
• 32:26
  that's called avoidance yeah no but like literally running like
• 32:29
  people would be
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: like where is she going like just running down the street
• 32:33
  to nowhere or like running into the woods or like or running
• 32:37
  after someone and them
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: being like,
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_01: what are you doing?
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I'll be like, why are you running away from me?
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like because you're chasing them.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: You know,
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: like I was a psychotic person and I have friends now that are like,
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: oh,
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_01: I wish I knew you when you were drinking.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, we would not be friends like you would.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_01: I take all the friendship we've built up over the years.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_01: I would ruin it in a night like it was.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: You gave some pretty good examples in the book.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I like.
• 33:03
  this one I lived in this one apartment in Greenpoint and for
• 33:07
  some reason I would
• 33:08
  get to a level of drunk where I would scale the side of the
• 33:11
  building okay so every
• 33:13
  night I would climb out the kitchen window at some point and in
• 33:18
  a rage and would
• 33:19
  like climb up to the top of the roof and would just threaten to
• 33:22
  kill myself I would
• 33:23
  just every night I would just get so drunk that I would go up
• 33:29
  there and start
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_01: running and
• 33:32
  one night I came into a black I came out of a blackout like
• 33:35
  right at the edge and
• 33:36
  was I thought that somebody was like pushing me or maybe I
• 33:43
  blamed somebody for
• 33:44
  pushing me it's hard to tell these stories because I genuinely
• 33:46
  wasn't there for
• 33:47
  them you know like I was like not present and a lot of them I
• 33:53
  had to call like exes
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_01: and be like can you clarify for me like what happened here and
• 34:02
  and yeah he basically I turned around and was like threatening
• 34:07
  I was just like oh
• 34:09
  you pushed me but he was on the other end of the roof so he was
• 34:13
  like clearly I
• 34:14
  didn't um and the next morning he was like you gotta you really
• 34:18
  gotta like quit
• 34:19
  drinking and then I was like you're so right and then I just
• 34:24
  walked out and I moved
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_01: into a new apartment right like the same day yeah um
• 34:29
  So anybody that came between Anybody that threatened to come
• 34:33
  between me and alcohol
• 34:34
  Was like Like you gotta go You know And Yeah I really loved it
• 34:44
  It did save my life
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_01: in a way For a long time Drinking did Yeah Like it allowed me to feel
• 34:55
  confident and normal during a time when I I needed that you
• 35:01
  know or it allowed me
• 35:02
  to just at least get away from my feelings you know when I was
• 35:07
  like going through
• 35:08
  some really tough stuff you know I I think about it now and I'm
• 35:18
  like I don't miss
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_01: drinking I never do but I am
• 35:23
  Grateful for like what drinking did for me during the time that
• 35:27
  it worked before it
• 35:29
  turned on me yeah you said something like it works until it
• 35:32
  doesn't yeah in
• 35:34
  retrospect I mean we can all live our lives in retrospect but I
• 35:38
  mean if you saw
• 35:40
  your daughter having the same problems in whatever 19 years or
• 35:43
  something how would
• 35:45
  you try to help her besides cutting her off from her Christmas
• 35:48
  money right um um
• 35:56
  Well that's a tricky answer because a lot of what I've learned
• 36:01
  through alcohol both
• 36:04
  having alcoholism and dealing with it is that there's nothing
• 36:07
  that you can do to
• 36:08
  change somebody's behavior like you have to get out of the way
• 36:12
  you have to allow
• 36:13
  them to face the consequences of their own actions so but I
• 36:18
  don't know how easy
• 36:19
  that I don't know that I would be able to do that with my own
• 36:22
  daughter you weren't
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_00: a great listener when you were drinking
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_01: No, nobody is.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody would be able to, you don't see it.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like denial is part of the disease.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_01: So you can't,
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_01: you can't see,
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_01: I mean people would come up to me and they'd be like,
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_01: do you know what you did last night?
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, no, you take that up with drunk Rosebud.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like I don't, I'm not the person that you are talking to right now.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_01: And there would be,
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_01: like I remember the first night that I,
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_01: that alcohol like stopped working for me.
• 36:55
  It was Like I swear to God I I remember I was having a great
• 37:01
  time and then somebody
• 37:02
  said something and I I just punched a wall like I punched
• 37:06
  through a wall and
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody was like What the like it?
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember being like whoa and it felt like my
• 37:17
  it felt like my friend had turned on me like it didn't feel
• 37:20
  like I had done that
• 37:21
  yes on the one hand it was like whoa why did she do that but
• 37:25
  but it was me it was
• 37:27
  this weird thing where I was like I know that was me but I
• 37:30
  didn't feel like me and
• 37:31
  I used to scream that I used to scream that in a drunken rage I
• 37:36
  would be like this
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_01: isn't who I am which is so crazy well it's like a parallel universe yeah
• 37:43
  where you're not responsible for the things that you've done
• 37:46
  and so that's why when
• 37:47
  somebody is struggling with alcoholism it's so important to
• 37:50
  just get the out of the
• 37:51
  way and let them let them face the consequences you know what I
• 37:57
  mean all I can do
• 37:58
  is inform her you know that that runs in our family you know
• 38:08
  that me and her dad
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_01: are both alcoholics and
• 38:13
  You know,
• 38:14
  I hope that hopefully that ruins drinking for her before it
• 38:18
  starts.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's well,
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_00: it seems to me like this is a journey of self-awareness,
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_00: and getting sober,
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_00: of course,
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_00: is a huge inflection point.
• 38:27
  The whatever end of act two or kind of point where everything
• 38:31
  starts to change.
• 38:33
  Do you do you feel like more self-aware person today than you
• 38:36
  were 20 years ago?
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_00: I guess we all are.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: Hopefully.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: That's called that's growth.
• 38:43
  yeah I certainly feel like that there's also like it's funny
• 38:52
  because the older I
• 38:53
  get the more confused I am about like the less answers I have
• 38:59
  and the more I'm like
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's called humility isn't it yeah like I yes
• 39:06
  Isn't that one of the good parts about growing up is not
• 39:09
  feeling like you have to
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_00: have all the answers?
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, for sure.
• 39:12
  But what I mean is- We're all a bunch of clowns walking around
• 39:15
  just trying to make
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: it through the day.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_01: But I think that life,
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_01: at least for me,
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_01: there's been this like,
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_01: it's sort of like a cycle of like false clarity to genuine confusion.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_01: into genuine clarity,
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: which then morphs back into false clarity,
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 39:40
  because circumstances change and you're still holding on to
• 39:42
  this understanding of
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_01: something.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_01: So like my life is kind of like that.
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm sort of in a period right now of like genuine confusion.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like I just I'm like, I don't know.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_00: But what are you not confused about?
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_00: Are there any topics that you're not confused about?
• 40:02
  no there's no no like I'm genuinely confused about every single
• 40:08
  thing in my life
• 40:08
  right now like do you do you know that you love your daughter
• 40:12
  oh yeah okay so
• 40:13
  that's a fundamental truth yes yeah okay so that's one
• 40:15
  fundamental truth right do
• 40:16
  you have any other fundamental truths in your life I know that
• 40:23
  that I'm meant to do
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_01: that I'm meant to write I know that that I'm a writer that's
• 40:34
  That's about It's a good place to start Yeah Like those are the
• 40:38
  things that I'm
• 40:38
  like that ground me is like writing and my kid and then
• 40:43
  everything else is just
• 40:44
  sort of like shifting underneath me which is I think good you
• 40:49
  know but it's it's
• 40:52
  you I think the at the end of the book I talk about this that
• 40:55
  like there's no
• 40:56
  moment where you're like well I'm done I fit look I'm all done
• 41:00
  but it's weird you
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_01: know
• 41:04
  I feel like I'm getting closer to like an age where have you
• 41:08
  ever woken up at like
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_01: 6 a.m.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_01: and then by 2 p.m.
• 41:11
  you're like I don't know what I'm gonna do with all these hours
• 41:17
  Yes when I moved to
• 41:19
  LA okay so I lived in New York when I was 1999 I was 30 I moved
• 41:25
  to LA and in 1999
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_00: the bars were open till 4 o'clock in the morning and
• 41:31
  I was hanging out I was single I was going to bars And stuff
• 41:34
  like that And I moved to L.A.
• 41:36
  and you have to drive everywhere and the bars I don't know I
• 41:40
  don't know what time
• 41:41
  they stayed open till because I had to drive back from
• 41:43
  Hollywood to Santa Monica
• 41:45
  and I'd be in bed at 11 o'clock on a Saturday and I woke up on
• 41:47
  Sunday at like 6 and
• 41:49
  I would do everything and the sun is just like pouring into
• 41:53
  your into your window
• 41:55
  and I'd wake up at like 6 and I would exercise and I'd go to
• 41:58
  Target I think I went
• 41:59
  you know I was going to church at the time I'd go to church and
• 42:01
  then I came back
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_00: and it was like noon I'm like what the f***
• 42:04
  That's where I'm at in my life That's where I'm at in my life
• 42:10
  right now That's how
• 42:11
  I feel I'm just like I don't even know I don't know what to do
• 42:16
  You know like it's
• 42:17
  and it's great It's everything is a blessing Like I don't feel
• 42:20
  it's like you said
• 42:21
  like the sun is pouring in But I'm just kind of like Alright
• 42:25
  well Let's see write
• 42:27
  your next hour Yeah I mean I'm in it right now Definitely
• 42:31
  writing it You wrote for
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_00: SNL
• 42:34
  what's the best part about working for SNL it's writing for SNL
• 42:39
  is like getting
• 42:40
  paid to go to Harvard yeah for comedy it's awesome it's a job
• 42:46
  that like every day I
• 42:48
  go like I that was a lucky break you know and people are like
• 42:52
  no you earned it I'm
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_01: like it's a lot of luck it is a lot of luck you don't
• 42:58
  There's a lot of people that could be there that aren't there
• 43:01
  that and I was you
• 43:03
  know and so I look at it as like I was very lucky and what was
• 43:11
  the time you felt
• 43:11
  like you deserve to be there I don't know that there was no I
• 43:16
  don't know that there
• 43:16
  was there's you're always earning your place there you know
• 43:20
  every every time you're
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_01: always earning your place yeah and
• 43:26
  it seems like an incredibly intimidating place to be yeah I
• 43:28
  mean especially as a
• 43:29
  stand-up like as opposed to an improv your sketch writer or an
• 43:33
  improv person like
• 43:34
  that's what you've worked towards your whole you know like
• 43:38
  that's the pinnacle um
• 43:42
  but as a stand-up you go in and you're like damn I guess I
• 43:46
  better learn how to
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_01: write a sketch like it it really is like very intimidating um
• 43:54
  but it was fun like when you let go of that and you're just in
• 43:57
  a room with your
• 43:58
  friends pitching and writing jokes and it's awesome and it's
• 44:03
  less solitary than
• 44:05
  doing comedy on the road oh way less and I really really
• 44:09
  enjoyed that part of it
• 44:10
  that was awesome like being on the road is truly very very
• 44:16
  isolating you get a
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_00: great hour whatever five to seven times yeah
• 44:22
  in a row,
• 44:23
  but then you go back to the Quality Inn or wherever you're
• 44:26
  staying.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 44:27
  And you stare at the TV guide wondering what the hell you're
• 44:31
  going to watch for the
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_00: next six hours.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_01: You're like, why can't I just get on a plane right now?
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_00: Can I just do seven in a row?
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_01: And then get back on the plane.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_01: And go home.
• 44:42
  Yeah so I really really enjoyed it but also while I was there I
• 44:47
  missed the road so
• 44:48
  it's this you know constant I want everything to be I want it
• 44:52
  all at the same time
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_00: and it's infuriating Any regrets?
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_01: In my life?
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_01: No
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_01: No, not really.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, definitely a lot of mistakes, but no regrets.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_00: How'd your family react to the memoir?
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know yet.
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, wait, it came out last month?
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's coming out June 9th.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, oh, oh, okay.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_01: So you got an advance copy.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_00: I did, yeah, right, sorry.
• 45:27
  I've talked to a lot of authors,
• 45:29
  and so their release dates are all over the place.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, okay, well, they've heard your stand-up.
• 45:34
  They've been exposed to some of your honesty I don't know that
• 45:39
  they have I really
• 45:41
  don't I mean I know my dad has and I know that my mom has Have
• 45:46
  you given them any
• 45:47
  warnings or any I sent a copy to my mom What did she say She
• 45:53
  said that she wasn't
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_01: able to finish it Which I was like oh well that's rough But
• 46:04
  but why but why I don't know I didn't I didn't ask but you can
• 46:07
  understand why she
• 46:08
  wouldn't want yes including you talking at length about the
• 46:12
  death of your sister
• 46:14
  yes so I was like that's understandable yeah but I wanted to
• 46:20
  give her a chance to
• 46:21
  read it before it came out you know that was important to me
• 46:27
  and I've read parts of
• 46:28
  SPEAKER_01: it to my dad
• 46:32
  I've read like the good parts How courageous of you Here's the
• 46:37
  part that is
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_01: congratulatory Where you sound good at the end Yeah,
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_00: yeah,
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_00: yeah I was pleased that you ended it the way you did with your dad Yeah,
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_00: yeah As a dad who wants only to be loved by his children Yeah,
• 46:50
  and that's the thing is like I'm so glad that I became a parent
• 46:54
  while I was writing
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_01: the book Because writing a memoir is
• 47:00
  um your understanding of your parents changes so much when you
• 47:07
  become a parent and
• 47:08
  sometimes it's for better and sometimes it's for worse like
• 47:10
  depending on your you
• 47:12
  know but I have a it's gonna keep changing as your kids age and
• 47:15
  you'll be like
• 47:16
  you'll see something they do at nine years old be like oh my
• 47:19
  god that's exactly
• 47:20
  what or that's so different than yeah yeah there's a lot that
• 47:23
  my kid does that um
• 47:29
  you know especially when I think about like Jackie when I when
• 47:33
  I think about how
• 47:33
  Jackie was raised my youngest sister and how everybody was just
• 47:38
  like she's such a
• 47:38
  troublemaker she's such a troublemaker you know like I I always
• 47:45
  saw Jackie as like
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_01: kind of an extension of me a little bit um
• 47:51
  where I was like she's just creative you know and you see it as
• 47:54
  a problem because
• 47:55
  it doesn't really fit into like the lifestyle that you guys
• 47:58
  have chosen but she's
• 47:59
  an artist and you're you're smushing it you're making it harder
• 48:06
  for her to like see
• 48:07
  how special she is and that really like breaks my heart when I
• 48:13
  think about that and
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_01: when when my kid is doing whatever she's doing like playing
• 48:19
  You know when I have to wake up and be Ryder or I have to be
• 48:23
  somebody else from Paw
• 48:24
  Patrol like I will all do that over over being like no we're
• 48:30
  not doing that today
• 48:31
  like we'll all just be Ryder until we get to school like what's
• 48:35
  the big deal you
• 48:36
  know she feels like she's playing a game the whole way to
• 48:39
  school that's great I
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_01: mean I would have wanted that childhood so
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_01: obviously we're going to get to a point where she's like,
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_01: she hates me for something,
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_01: but I don't,
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_01: but I...
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_01: Well,
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_00: you should earn it anyway.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_00: I should earn it, yeah.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure it's worth hating you for.
• 48:58
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 48:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well,
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_00: it's better that your life has worked,
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_00: the sequence of events is probably a positive one.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_00: Before you have a kid.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's a good thing.
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_00: And it's probably going to lead to fewer things for her to hate you for.
• 49:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, for sure.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_00: Well, this is a really well written, interesting story.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's called Fully Baked, a messy memoir by my guest Rosebud Baker.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_00: Rosebud, where can people find out more about you and this fabulous book?
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_01: You can find me on the road.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_00: Where are you going to be?
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_01: Always on the road.
• 49:34
  Well it depends on when this comes out but I'll be in Atlanta
• 49:37
  I'll be in I honestly
• 49:39
  don't I gotta like That's so funny I don't know where I'm gonna
• 49:43
  be I know I was in
• 49:44
  Chicago this past weekend and I'm gonna be in Atlanta the next
• 49:46
  weekend but if you
• 49:48
  go to my website rosebudbaker.com Oh I'll also be at Gramercy
• 49:51
  Theater in New York
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_01: in September so that's like a big show Are you filming that?
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe I don't know I guess I should right?
• 50:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well at least for socials Yeah
• 50:03
  SPEAKER_01: So maybe I'll film that.
• 50:05
  Anyway,
• 50:06
  all my road dates are on my website and definitely order the
• 50:10
  book.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 50:11
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 50:11
  SPEAKER_00: We'll put a link to it in the show notes.
• 50:13
  SPEAKER_00: Awesome.
• 50:13
  SPEAKER_00: Great to meet you.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_01: Great to meet you too.
• 50:15
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks.