Latest / How to Faith a Life Podcast with Faith Womack / JAIL FOR JESUS: The Prisoner Who Memorized Scripture

Transcript

JAIL FOR JESUS: The Prisoner Who Memorized Scripture · How to Faith a Life Podcast with Faith Womack

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: If you're listening to the How to Faith a Life podcast, where we wrestle with questions on how to live a life of faith, from everything from books to Bible studies, even Bible study tips.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: This is your place to wrestle with the hard questions and dive deep into what scripture really says for the Christian law.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: Make sure you've subscribed to this podcast and your favorite podcast streaming services.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: Review this podcast so other people can find it and share with other believers who want to ask the hard questions.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: Now, with all that said, let's begin.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: Hey friends, welcome back to the How to Faith a Life Podcast, a ministry of Bible Nerd Ministries.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: Today I'm so excited to have our guest and friend Josh Summers.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: Josh is the founder of Bible Memory Goal, a ministry and online community devoted to inspiring Christians to internalize scripture rather than merely skim it.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: He and his family live in Thailand, where he balances roles as an author, podcaster, entrepreneur, father, husband, and aspiring memory athlete.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: Over at Bible Memory Goal, Josh shares his journey of memorizing the entire New Testament and the skills and tools he learns along the way.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_01: You guys probably recognize his name because I reviewed his book, Memorize What Matters, last year or so, depending on when you're listening to this, and really loved it.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_01: Really love his testimony.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_01: So, Josh, welcome to the podcast.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much, Faith.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's such a joy to be here with you.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_01: I wanted to open up this podcast and give you the opportunity to share your testimony of how this really became so important to you, how that Bible memory really got on your radar and you became so impassioned to it.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: So can you share that story?
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: So I grew up in the church, and you know, like anybody that went to Sunday school, I memorized you know verses during Sunday school class.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so I was aware of scripture memorization.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't something that I'd never done before.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_00: But things came to a head.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: My wife and I, my actually my whole family, I've got two boys.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: We were living out in China, and I'll never forget the day.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: It was April 19th, 2018, my wife's birthday.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_00: We were about to go travel and we got a knock on the door, and it was 17 police that entered into our apartment building and proceeded to take everything that was electronic.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_00: They were convinced that I was something more than just an expatriate living overseas.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: They were convinced that I was doing something with a government that was wrong, which I wasn't.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: From that point, they detained us, both my wife and I, and they interrogated us for a number of weeks.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: And it was through that time I remember specifically the first day that they took me in, threatening me with 10 years in prison.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: It was like it was by far the scariest moment of my life.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: And they took everything from me and they put me in a little cell.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: And this is just a concrete cell with nothing around.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I don't I think in the US prisons, you know, it feels like they give you a TV and they give you all this stuff, but but in in the Chinese prison, it's literally just a concrete cell.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: And especially when you don't know how long it's gonna be, hours stretch on forever.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: It feels like it never ends.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: And you just sit there and and like your mind starts to go to places that you really don't want to go.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what if what if this is my life for the next few years?
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: What if I don't get to see my kids?
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like they've taken everything.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: They've taken my Bible, they've taken my phone.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: So if all I'm left with is literally the clothes on my back and whatever I've got in my head, what do I have?
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: And and so I started to take inventory, you know, and I've got memories of my kids, I got memories with my wife.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: And then as far as my faith was concerned, I was like, okay, well, what what can I draw from in this situation?
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_00: And despite having grown up in the church, faith, and and I think like there's there's a little bit of shame that I've had to work through in this, but I I actually think that many of us are like this.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: Even if we've grown up in the church, if we were to have be put in a situation, we were we were forced to come up with what we could have memorized.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_00: I could maybe come up with 20 verses.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe some more if you had prompted me, but like on the spot, it was about 20 verses.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I knew in that moment I I don't know if I could survive on this.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: God help me.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: This is this is not good.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: And by God's grace, you know, this whole ordeal only lasted two weeks, which was still a very long time for us.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: But at the end of that, if I really believe this is God's word, I think it's really important for me to know it more than just what I realized I don't know as much as I want.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so that was kind of the start of a journey for me.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I do emphasize it's a journey, uh in part because in your intro you talked about me memorizing the whole New Testament.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: I have not finished the whole New Testament.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_00: I am not even close to finishing the New Testament, but it's a journey, and I sometimes I feel like setting that goal allows us to at least have something to continue walking towards.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's what I've been doing.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I love that you emphasize that it's a journey.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_01: So many of us think about our goals as like the end game, and it's really the blessing isn't reaching your goal.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: The blessing is the journey to your goal and that being a worshipful exercise and lifestyle, really.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: So what was your perception of Bible memorization before you began and when you started to begin, and how has that changed as you've gone through memorizing the Bible?
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_00: I think before I began, it was probably similar to, well, I don't know, I it many people out there where it it seems like it's a something that kids do, you know.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_00: We've got a wanas in my church at least, it wasn't something that was emphasized for adults.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like at some point, once you either graduate high school or college, it's like, well, you're you're done memorizing.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: Now you can just study or, you know, listen to sermons.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of the way that I had seen it up to that point.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, once I like decided to get into it, honestly saw it in the beginning more as just like this exercise.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's like a spiritual discipline that I'm just gonna be, I wanna make this a priority.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm gonna sit down and make sure that I do my 30 minutes a day, just like I would with Bible reading, you know, and just be disciplined about it and and all that.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: And as time has gone even further, I think that I've begun to really just appreciate, like like I was just mentioning earlier, the journey of it all.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, there are there are days that I don't spend memorizing, I just spend reciting to myself.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: There are days where I decide, you know, I'm I'm not gonna continue on with First Peter right now.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna move into Psalms and I'm gonna memorize the Psalm because I need a psalm right now in my life.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so seeing it less as this, you know, this race where I'm I'm trying to get to that finish line and more that opportunity to be able to really dig deep into God's word and and allow that to be something that I can meditate on because it's hard to meditate on something that you haven't committed to memory unless you have it straight in front of you.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: And as I go throughout my day, I don't have the Bible always at my side, but I do have my mind, and that allows me to be able to meditate at any point during the day.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: If we really believe the Bible is God's alive and active word, then having it memorized in our brain to review whether we're at a stoplight or doing the dishes or having a really tough conversation with somebody that we do not have to have the conversation with them, it just is going to change everything because it's alive and active, because it's so incredibly powerful.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: It's our sword for battle.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: So I love your passion.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_01: I love your drive.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_01: But what would you say to the Christian that doesn't feel motivated?
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: It sounds like a lot of work, it sounds really boring.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_00: How would you encourage them?
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: I think there's a couple things.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_00: First of all, I would say that our idea of memorization is boring and it doesn't necessarily have to be.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like we we think of memorization as just like, okay, I've got to repeat it over and over and over and over again.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: And that is a method, and that is one that I know a lot of people choose, but there are a lot of creative ways to be able to go about it and a lot of ways that that allow you to keep it front of mind.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: Whether it's I know you've done you know cards before and and being very creative about it.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: One of the things I love is the first letter method where I'm just writing out the first letter and allowing that.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: Let me see.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I'm pretty sure I've got it with me.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: I sure hope I do.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: I've got the entire book of 2 Timothy in my backpack.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: And so I want to be able to review it, but maybe I forget a couple words here and there.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: Having the first letter allows me to be able to just review it and know, okay, it was a a where and not a there or something like that because of the T or the W.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_00: Just encouraging people to know that there are other methods.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_00: I'll probably go share a little bit more about this later, but I love like a memory palace method.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_00: I love visualizations, I love being creative about it all.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that makes it a lot more fun.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_00: But the second thing I would say is this most of the time you don't recognize the value of something until you've actually done it, until you've actually put in the work.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that, you know, you don't even have to do it for like commit to a year.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_00: Don't don't even don't give yourself something that feels too big.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: Just say, okay, what if I were to spend five minutes a day for one month only just memorizing?
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_00: And you don't even have to set a goal.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_00: You don't have to say I have to do one verse a day because sometimes that can get discouraging if you get behind or something.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's just spend five minutes a day memorizing for a month and see where that leads you.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_00: You might be surprised at how much you can get done and how like beneficial it is.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: Quick pause.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: This podcast isn't sponsored by a brand or a company.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's actually just a ministry of Bible Nerd Ministries.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: And the reason we get to have conversations like this one is because of our Patreon community.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_01: They're the ones who fund and sustain this work.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: If you want to support the ministry, you can join Patreon for weekly in-depth Bible studies and access to so many years of past studies.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: And if a monthly membership isn't your thing, you can also support us by checking out our merch and studies and courses all at Bible Nerd Ministries.com.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_01: All right, let's get back to the conversation.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: Now, one thing we talked about, and I'm sure some of people are wondering this, when I came on your podcast like two years ago, we talked about how it's so much harder to memorize like a random verse here or there versus big passages of scripture.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_01: But I can imagine someone listening in going, why is he memorizing a whole chapter when he could just get the good verses out of the chapter and memorize those?
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_01: So will you share a little bit about your systems of memorizing big passages of scripture and how helpful that can be?
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it is, it's it's easier to memorize 10 verses in a single passage than it is to memorize 10 individual verses in different parts.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it in part because you're usually in a single thought, right?
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: You're you're uh or a single story, if you were to do one of the parables, for example.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: You can do 10 verses that all relate to each other, and that can be a little bit easier than if you were to just try to stick around.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_00: And plus, there's always this pressure of do I memorize the reference or not?
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: And and that adds a whole different level of complexity if that's something that's really important to you.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_00: But more than anything else, the reasons why I I really enjoy doing extended passages is one, I love, and you and I have talked about this faith before.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: The the context of a passage when you are memorizing more than just a single verse can be so enriching.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I like to use this as an example, it's a popular example of a verse taken out of context, but when you do something like Philippians 4.13, when you just memorize that single verse by itself, you can use that in a lot of different ways.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: But when you have gone through all three previous chapters in Philippians and really begun to understand, like I can one after I've recited the book of Philippians literally hundreds of times, you begin to feel the the tone of the author.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: You begin to feel kind of his passion.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: Like what was like when you're seeing the thing as a whole, it's not just this one moment in time, you're getting to see what was he building towards?
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_00: Why was he talking about this in the first place?
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: And you get to see all of those verses coming up before it.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_00: And then along those same lines, I would say that when you're memorizing extended portions of scripture, you tend to memorize verses that you would have never memorized otherwise.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: And that, believe it or not, can be some of the biggest blessing.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: Faith, I was telling you about this.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: We we just did a Psalms project with our community where we memorized the entire book of Psalms.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_00: Now, not one person memorizing all 152 chapters, but we each took a chapter or two and we did it all together, right?
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I one of my favorite responses from people was they said, you know, I just chose this chapter.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't even know what this psalm was.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: And God used this to speak to me in a moment that I really needed to hear this psalm of lament or this psalm of praise that I hadn't read over before.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_00: We all know 23, Psalm 1, maybe Psalm 46, Psalm 88, you know, like these more not necessarily obscure, but the ones that we wouldn't naturally gravitate to when it comes to memorizing.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: And that is one of the things, that's another one of those reasons that I love kind of extended passages because you're gonna find yourself memorizing something that that God can use that you're gonna go, I I never would have done that otherwise.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: I I love that obviously that it went to context, like having the whole context especially memorize, is just going to take your study of that passage so much deeper.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: I find oftentimes, and this is coming from the other end, when I've spent a week in a passage or tens of hours in that passage, I start to memorize the outline.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: And it's because I've memorized the outline, or even some of the most important words, that words in seven and fourteen and whatever, you know, that impacts the way that I understand verse 18 or 20.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_01: So if I have every single word memorized like you, it's it would take my biblical understanding, my understanding of the context, just so much deeper.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_01: It's almost like we haven't truly studied the passage until we do have it a little bit memorized and we can mull over it.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's just so powerful.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_01: Will you give us an example of one of those random verses or middle verses, those kind of not important verses that you kind of had to memorize and then it really hit you that that was so powerful?
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you want to know one of my favorites now after like talking with you.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, you actually caught me off guard.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_00: No, you really did in a in a powerful way.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: Because so I told you, Second Timothy, right?
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_00: Second Timothy, you had memorized portion.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: Do you know where I'm going with this?
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_02: First Timothy, yeah.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_02: I remember that conversation because I felt like I was too spicy.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_00: No, no, you weren't.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: You weren't.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: So in 2 Timothy uh chapter one, it talks about Lois and Eunice.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: This is in the introduction of 2 Timothy.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: He's, you know, Paul's just talking about Timothy's mom and grandma.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: And honestly, I wasn't really invested in 2 Timothy chapter 1 until about verse 6.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: That's when Paul really gets into the meat of it.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: I remember asking you, you had a card that was like you had specifically memorized that verse, which is, I believe it's four, is that right?
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: 1 Timothy chapter 1, verse 4.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: I'll have to go back and remember exactly where that was.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: But it was you talking about how valuable that was to you, that these women had been called out and that these women had been honored.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_00: And like I remember you getting emotional about that.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: And that that hit me.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: It was like, I just memorized these words.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: I wouldn't have thought about it from that perspective.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: But now that you have said that to me, every time I recite that verse, I think about that.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, yeah, that that is kind of powerful.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: That is kind of interesting that he pulled that out.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: And again, that's not a verse that I would have naturally gravitated to.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: You did.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: I wouldn't have, but I'm glad that I memorized it.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's oddly encouraging for me because I remember looking back at the podcast and going, I should have been a little less like that.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_01: But that encourages me that it encouraged you, if that makes sense.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_01: Guys, Josh in real life is a good person.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_01: And so we are in real life friends, and we're gonna get our families together and get dinner.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we're kind of from similar areas in DFW, but the more I've gotten to know you, the more I've seen just what a humble student and teacher you are.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_01: You're really good at by your example, teaching other people in humility.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: And it changed my life hearing you at your last.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: Do you call it a summit?
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: Uh yeah, it's the first time I've ever done it.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: We called it scripture sync.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_00: It was just a gather gathering.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but he stood up and recited a chapter of scripture.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_01: Was it Peter?
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: First Peter?
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: What was it?
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, that was in Philippians.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: I did Philippians, yeah, like one and two.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_01: And it rocked my world hearing that real life in not like in a theatrical dorky way, but you just genuinely had learned the passion of the text and was able to deliver it like you truly were the author itself.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like because you had just spent so many hours in it.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I it made me view scripture in a totally different way, just as a student of you learning and seeing and experiencing and hearing it.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: Quick pause before we get further into the conversation.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: Last year I flew to Kaungwari, Kenya, and saw firsthand one of the most thoughtful mission models I have ever encountered.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: Us Bible nerds are working together to fund 2,000 water filters through the Bucket Ministry.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: They don't just bring clean water, they come back three times for discipleship, sharing the gospel and helping new believers get connected to the local church.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_01: And they do it by hiring local missionaries, discipling neighbor to neighbor in the local language.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: If you want to be part of that work and join us Bible nerds, we'd love for you to join us in support of the Bucket Ministry.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_01: All the information and all the links are in the show notes.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: All right, now let's get back to the conversation.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: So, will you talk a little bit about things like the theatrical aspect of it or the memory palace?
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: Walk us through, like your book does, some of the most helpful um practices that you've used for your memory.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: Well, let me first, you know, about the theatrics, because I honestly I I'm not a theater student, and I definitely don't want any time that I do something like that to for it to feel like I'm performing or acting.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: But I I think you've said it well, where, you know, when when you feel the emotion.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_00: So I was in the middle, I think I ended in the chapter two where the name of Jesus, every knee should bow in heaven on earth, and under the earth, and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like you cannot say that, recite that without there being emotion, right?
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: You could potentially read it and just read it, but if you've if you've really lived with that passage, you can't get to that part without getting a little bit emotional.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's one of the reasons why I love this idea of recitation over just reading, not in like personal, but like even in a corporate setting where if all we have the ability to do right now is is to read the passage, great.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: But if there's somebody who's willing to memorize and then recite that passage, I think there's a lot of value in that because, like you saw with me, like you are impacted by the emotion of having somebody actually recite it as opposed to I could have just stood there and read it.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: And it and it and the word of God can be powerful no matter how it is consumed.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: I do not want to minimize that, but I do believe that that there's there is power in having that memorized and internalized and and like seeing that in somebody else.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: So sorry, there was a long kind of sidetrack there.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um you explain it much better than I did.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um yeah, so I was talking in the earlier about creative ways to memorize, and um, and I think there are a lot of fun ways.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: I really love one one of the things that got me into this was watching a documentary on these world champion memorizers that just memorize a thousand digits of pie, or you know, they hear, you know, a hundred names for the first time and they can, you know, mark out who all these people are.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, how are they doing this?
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: And they're not doing it by repeating it over and over in their head.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_00: They have mnemonic techniques, and one of the most popular is known as the memory palace or the mind palace.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_00: You might have heard it as that.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: And essentially what the mind palace is, in like the simplest form, is just it's taking advantage of our the way that God designed our brains to be very spatially aware.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: So, Faith, do you remember your childhood bedroom?
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, could you like walk me through?
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, and my bed's right here, my window's right here.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: And that I don't know, that room may or may not exist to this day, but it will never leave your mind.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: You will always be able to walk through.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: So a mind palace is just taking something that you are intimately familiar with, a location, and then basically breaking it up into different spots and then placing information on those spots.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: Most of what you could boil down memory techniques is just taking something familiar, something you know, something we would call like a peg that you can't forget.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_00: It's almost impossible for you to forget.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_00: And then attaching something that you want to remember onto that in some creative way, right?
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm trying to think if I can come up with an example off the spot.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_00: Let me see here.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_00: Philippians is actually a book that I put in my kids' international school.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: There's an elementary, there's an administrative office, there's a high school, and then there's a sports complex.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's where I've put each chapter.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: Chapter one is in the elementary, chapter two is in the administrative, three is in high school, four.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_00: And mind you, this is maybe a little complex.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_00: So don't go diving in and trying to memorize an entire book using a mind palace.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: Like I would start with something small, like a psalm or something like that, just to see how it works.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: But you just see like this is how I would do it.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_00: And I can literally walk through my kids' school and recite the book of Philippians.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so one of them, you know, a very popular, well-known verse would be Philippians 1, 21.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, for to me to live is Christ and to die is game.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: And like for me, when I want to go into that, like that location is actually a room in my kids' school.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_00: Within that room, there's actually a game of blackjack happening.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: Because blackjack, if you know it's like a game to 21.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like the first card that is flipped over is a four, and the second card that's flipped over is a two.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_00: And that to me, Helps me remember, and not everybody has to do this, but that helps me remember that okay, this is verse 21.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: 4-2 gets me started.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_00: For two, me to live is Christ and to die is Jane.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_00: So one of the things that I always recognized is that if I can just get started, if you can if I can just put an image that helps me get those first couple words, then you know the repetition kind of kicks in and I can remember the rest of the verse.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: That's one example of a creative way of just trying to use images or mnemonics in order to remember something.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_00: And for me, it I like being able to attach verse numbers and chapters and knowing where things are, even though I don't I the chapter numbers and the verse numbers are not inspired in my opinion.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so I don't think that's super important.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's just good to know approximately where it's at.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_01: Wait, so that was really helpful for me because I don't think I've ever realized that with a memory palace, you can just like fluff it up with things that are helpful tools like the 4-2.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_01: I thought it had to be literally what you remember to be there, but you could just add in, let's pretend that there's a poster there.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: You can totally create whatever you want in any of those places.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I know people that use video game worlds for their mind palaces, and so that's just like that's a whole nother level.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, you could do that.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_01: That's so smart.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_01: My boys love uh building things in their little private Minecraft world, they would love that.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, that's so cool.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_00: So, I mean, just being creative.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: So, like the beginning of uh Second Timothy chapter two is you then my son be strong in the grace.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so I actually have my son, like there's a door that's at the beginning of chapter two, and I have my son getting really thin and screwed, like like literally like paper thin.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_00: He squeezes in and then he squeezes through that door and then flexes for me, right?
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_00: So you then my son be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus, right?
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: Like those are the kind of images that they're silly enough that they kind of stick in the brain.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's the silly, the absurd, the funny that really kind of sticks with us.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so trying to find or create those images is what really helps us.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_01: That's so cool.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_01: Will you give us another example of memory tools that you use?
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I'll I'll give you practical ones that don't necessarily require you to, you know, for some people the idea of a memory palace is just that that's that's for you know memory gurus or whatnot.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_00: But something we can all do, something we all have access to, is our phones.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the things that I think is super powerful for us is if I'm memorizing, let's say, a psalm, okay, one of the first things that I'm gonna do is I'm gonna go into my phone and I'm going to open my Bible and I'm going to read that psalm using my own voice into the voice recorder.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a, you know, there's a couple of reasons I do that.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: One, I know that there are, you know, audio Bibles available, but there's a way that I say things that's a little bit different than what they would say it.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to, and especially if you're like Faith, you are memorizing, you know, verses from different parts of the Bible, you could string those together in your own recording, whereas that would be a whole lot harder to skip through on an audio Bible.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_00: But now you've got an audio version that you can listen to while you're in the car.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: You can just put it on repeat if you want to.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like having if you can use as many of your senses as possible, whether that's hand motions or you know, listening to it or writing it out.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: Some people really love doing that.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_00: Those are different hooks for our brain to be able to attach to that particular verse and makes it easier to remember as you go along.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_01: I think the silly, the absurd, honestly so relatable for me, but then also the way that you are not afraid to use like technology or your giftings or your interests.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_01: I think I've talked to you about this previously.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like my son has to memorize a Bible verse every week during the school year for school, and they actually like grade him on it.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_01: They actually like it's kind of a serious thing.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_01: And that was really stressful for me as a mom originally, because I'm like, he's like six, and by Friday we need to have this long Bible verse memorized.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_01: And the only thing I knew as an ex-cheerleader was let me use like chants and hand motions, and maybe, just maybe, if I'm desperate enough, I'll do it to like one of their favorite songs or a Disney movie song or whatever that they know and already have kind of low-key memorized.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_01: Sad as it is, but it's true.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the theme song to Paw Patrol was used multiple times.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_01: Let's be real.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_01: What's funny is he also memorizes so much quicker when it's to a melody with some hand motions and there's some kind of inside joke that we make up.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: Like maybe we shake our booty at this word.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry, I just said that to any kids that are listening in with their mommies, but that's what we would do because it made him have a little bit more fun and his brain lit up at the possibility of mommy says it's okay to shake my booty right now, um, at this little funny word because I'm celebrating I got the Bible verse right or whatever.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then he goes to school, and I'm kidding you not, Josh.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_01: He has to record it at school on like a video format on their little iPads, send it in, and he says it so serious, he will not sing it, but I can see his little hands doing the motions.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_01: But he doesn't want his friends to see him kind of singing it, so he'll sing it in the melodic pattern, just word he's too cool for it.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: But it's it's it just shows it's such a testimony to me of like that's that's me.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'm the same exact way, and we are just children before the Lord, being fed by his word.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_01: And if we need to shake our booty, uh, we can, or if we need to, you know, sing it to the Paw Patrol theme song, we should, because it's worth fighting for.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_01: So, um, what are some like surprisingly funny or weird things you've done to memorize scripture?
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_01: And then how did that enhance your spiritual life?
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's not just brute memorization for like some kind of legalistic academic exercise.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like this is life-giving.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_01: So, can you give us an example of kind of a silly but life-giving thing?
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_00: The silly things for me is that you know, I'm creating images in my head that if you search on Google, don't exist, right?
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: I want an egg to be opened on my head while I'm riding a bicycle, right?
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like, like there's some image like that that I'm I'm creating that's like it makes sense to me.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: It would make sense to nobody else, but that's part of the joy of it, is just it makes sense to me.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: And everybody has their own opinions on AI that's watching or listening to this.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: And some people are vehemently opposed.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so if you are, I apologize in advance.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_00: But I do think this is an incredible tool that if I've got an image in my head and I can just explain it, now I can actually get it printed out, you know, and there are so many different ways.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: We've got like one of my favorite things to do is to memorize outlines of books.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: So there's different types of memorization, right?
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_00: So memorize outlines of books, and one of my favorite images is an image of an 11 that is it's actually wrapped in burial cloth.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's wrapped in burial cloth and it's like rising from the dead, right?
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_00: Two ones, if you can imagine rising from the dead, wrapped in burial cloth.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_00: Imagine that as clearly as you can right now.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: And when I tell you that John chapter 11 is where Lazarus was raised, it's gonna be hard for you to forget that John chapter 11 is is that that's where that story is.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: Or if you can imagine the number of six walking on water, holding a bread and fish.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_00: And that's how I remember like like really think about that and like watch the splashing of this number six as it's walking.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: You can go in NAI and actually create this, it's the weirdest thing.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: But that's how I remember that in John chapter six, Jesus walked on water.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_00: He also fed the five thousand with five loaves and two fish.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_00: That happened in John chapter six.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I may not have John chapter six memorized yet, but that's another thing that I think is really valuable too, is just kind of knowing the general outline and context of something.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: I think that is really cool.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: And that comes either with, you know, dedicated time spent memorizing or even just spending a lot of time with that passage.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_00: If you're studying the book of John, you'll probably know that.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: But but yeah, that's that's another example.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the reasons why I'm not totally against AI because I like I like being able to use those tools for some things.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's possibly the most redemptive use of AI I've ever heard.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: I know it's night there in Thailand, and I know I've taken a ton of your time, but will you share a little bit about where we could find you, follow your journey, learn more about these skills, and get even more inspo to memorize scripture?
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_00: I am at Bible Memory Goal, which is a YouTube channel, and we also have the Memorize What Matters podcast.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I've had you on that podcast before.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot that I don't know, and being able to learn from everybody else's ways of memorizing or reasons for memorizing, uh, has been extremely rewarding for me.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I've loved that.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so just um being able to listen to other people talk about it like yourself and others has been yeah, a blessing to me.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the Memorize What Matters podcast.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_00: And of course, we've got a community.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: You've got your own community, but for those people that love memorizing extended passages of scripture, if you go to Bible Memory Goal.com slash join, you're welcome to join us for free.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_00: It's like one of these few places I feel like where you could recite an entire book of the Bible on camera and post it, and nobody would think you're weird.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like they'd all just say, hey, really good job.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_00: We know how much time that took and how how much that means.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_00: So great job.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I love that kind of community.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_01: So cool.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_01: I love it.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for coming on the podcast and inspiring us to be more in the word with purpose and value.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_01: And oh, it's just been so encouraging.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: And Faith, just so you know, one last thing.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_00: I will, as I'm by the time this goes out, I'm gonna have a page, it's just for the Bible nerds.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: So if you go to Bible MemoryGold.com slash Bible nerds, my goal is to just get people to memorize scripture.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm I'm gonna give you the digital copy for free.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to buy a physical copy, you can.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to get the audiobook, I understand that.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: But I want to give you the tools to be able to do that.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_00: So if you just go to Bible Memory Goal.com slash Bible nerd, so it's just for your community, I'll be happy to provide that.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I'd love to hear how that works for everybody.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_01: That is amazing.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Josh.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: That is so cool.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: And y'all know I loved the book and it breaks down so many more practical tips.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I know that will be such a rich blessing in so many people's lives.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you for that.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_01: All right, guys, go check him out.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_01: Bible memory goal.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: Hit the follow and the subscribes and join his community, and I want to hear what y'all memorize.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks again.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: You're listening to the How to Faith Alive podcast, where we wrestle with questions on how to live a life of faith, from everything from books to Bible studies, even Bible study tips.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_01: This is your place to wrestle with the hard questions and dive deep into what scripture really says for the Christian walk.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: Make sure you've subscribed to this podcast and your favorite podcast streaming services.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: Review this podcast so other people can find it, and share with other believers who want to ask the hard questions.